The 2012 NFL Draft is in the books. Seattle came away with ten new players, including five additions who play in the defensive front seven. Only three of the picks were spent on offensive prospects – a new quarterback, running back and a defensive tackle who will convert to guard.
It’s an intriguing draft class, but also one that raises a number of questions. The one I’m wrestling with the most is the choice of Russell Wilson in the third round. When a quarterback is drafted in round one, you fully expect that player to start quickly if not right away. In round two, you’d recognise it in a similar way – just with a little less hype. Quarterbacks drafted in rounds 4-7 come with barely any expectation. Round three is the middle ground, the dividing line between expected starter and late round flier.
Pete Carroll has spoken so glowingly about Wilson, it’s raising expectations. At one point yesterday he went on the record stating, “More than anybody else that was alive in the draft, this guy gives you a chance to have a great player.” What exactly does that mean? That Wilson gives Seattle a better chance to have a great player than Andrew Luck? Even if this is a typically Carroll-esque piece of raw enthusiasm, it doesn’t half raise expectations within a fan-base that has been starved of a freshly drafted quarterback to root for.
Language like that makes you believe Wilson could be, realistically, considered the quarterback of the future for this team. Then you wonder, what if he’s the quarterback for now? You look a little closer and notice the way he quickly transitioned to Wisconsin after leaving NC State. The Seahawks passed on other potential immediate starters in round three at different positions. They wanted Wilson, badly.
There’s been no attempt to mask excitement about this guy. Carroll: “It’s going to be really exciting to see what he can bring. All he’s ever done is be great. This is such an incredible athlete that has had extraordinary, historic success. He has done things that people had never thought of before. The fact that he was also such an extraordinary kid, he can handle all of the pressure that he’s going to be under, and all the scrutiny that he already has.”
Wilson was the keynote addition on offense in this draft class. The decision to switch JR Sweezy to guard is merely a hopeful punt. Robert Turbin was an expected target for the Seahawks as a speedy, muscular back who will take some of the strain away from Marshawn Lynch. Wilson was the star attraction here.
Some of the prospects Seattle passed on in the process of spending that third round pick? Mohamed Sanu, a talented receiver from Rutgers. Michael Egnew, a thoroughly modern-day athletic tight end from Missouri. Lamar Miller, a potential X-factor running back who slipped due to health concerns before Miami traded up to grab him at the top of round four. Brandon Brooks, a highly rated offensive guard with huge size from Miami Ohio. All four could’ve had some kind of impact in 2012.
Yet despite investing in Matt Flynn and somewhat backing Tarvaris Jackson to compete to try and remain the starter, Seattle added another quarterback to the equation. It’s as if Carroll and co. have decided improved QB play is the key to moving the offense forward. A review, perhaps, of the frustrating play from Jackson at times last year. So rather than try to add that skill player or the big offensive lineman, the Seahawks open up the quarterback position and try to find an improvement.
This is the highest draft pick Seattle has spent on a quarterback for 19 years. If this isn’t with the intention of at least allowing Wilson to compete to start as a rookie, I’d be almost surprised. People expect Flynn to get the nod, but his contract isn’t so huge that he’s locked into the role. Jackson could find himself on the outside looking in if he doesn’t win out, given his deal is expendable. Josh Portis remains part of the roster but is he rated highly enough to stick around if the team only runs with three quarterbacks?
The Seahawks want a quarterback who can facilitate a running game, which is exactly what Wilson did at Wisconsin. They want someone who won’t turn the ball over but can still make plays, and in four years as a starter in college Wilson threw 109 touchdowns compared to just 30 interceptions. Carroll has talked about young quarterbacks being ready to start earlier these days and appears willing to consider rolling with a rookie.
At the same time, Seattle may feel like Matt Flynn deserves to have the edge in a tight competition this off-season. He’s started in the NFL, albeit only twice, and if the Seahawks only planned to use him as a back-up they may well have avoided some difficult questions a few weeks ago by choosing not to sign the former Packer. I come back to the grey area that is round three. If Wilson had been a second round pick, people would be asking ‘will he start’? If he’d been a fourth round pick, nobody would be expecting an early impact. The third round sits directly between those two extremes.
Interesting times ahead.
Turbin pick will be seen as crucial
We talked a lot on this blog about Seattle’s desire to add a running back early in the draft. A lot of people presumed the Seahawks were set having signed Marshawn Lynch to a new deal, while adding a couple of other guys to go alongside Leon Washington. However, this is a team being built around the run on offense. Lynch is the centrepiece, the MVP, the heart and soul of the unit. He also runs with a physical style that will provoke injury and he’s going to miss time in the future. It’s inevitable. When he didn’t feature against Cleveland in 2011, it had a major impact. The Seahawks want to avoid that in the future.
Rather than look for a change of pace back or someone different to Lynch, the ideal was to find someone who could logically become a starter in their own right. Doug Martin and David Wilson left the board at the back end of round one, making it unlikely the team would find their answer in the second round. Lamar Miller and Chris Polk – two players who many thought could go in that region – both fell due to injury. Ronnie Hillman and Bernard Pierce both disappeared in round three and options were starting to run out. Enter the Turbinator.
At around 5-10 and 220lbs he has the necessary size to deal with a workload. He ran a 4.50 at the combine and looked pretty ripped for a player running that kind of time. It’s that combination of size and power that will interest Seattle – he can run inside and pound or find the edge. He’s shown some ability in space and in the passing game and has suffered due to the low-profile nature of the Utah State team he played for. He’s not good in pass protection, that has to be mentioned, but it’s something he can work on.
Seattle ensured they have a younger version of the Beast in the stable, and it could be a crucial draft pick. The Seahawks need to be able to run the football, but also keep Lynch from injury-risk with too many carries. This was a smart pick and part of the plan in this draft all along.
Focus on defense
A year removed from spending two early picks on the offensive line and making some key offensive free agent signings (Sidney Rice, Zach Miller), this year the Seahawks went big on defense. Bruce Irvin will be expected to have an impact as the #15 pick in the draft. When you draft a specialist pass rusher in the top half of the draft, ahead of every other pass rusher in the class, he needs to be productive almost immediately. While the Seahawks have earned a reputation for intelligent picks late in the draft, they need to make sure they keep hitting in round one. Seattle’s can’t expect to keep finding fast starters with late round picks (such is the nature of the league) so to improve they’ll need an impact from the early rounds.
It’s not a big surprise that defense was the focus this year. The Seahawks needed a pass rusher, whether you agree with the Irvin pick or not. That was the #1 priority – always was. There’s a reason why we paired the Seahawks with a pass rusher in every single one of our mock drafts from January to April. Clearly we didn’t focus in on the right players (although nobody pegged Bruce Irvin) but a pass rusher was key nonetheless. Linebacker was also an obvious need and it was no surprise to see that position addressed in round two.
The rest of the picks come with a degree of the unknown. Korey Toomer may prove to be special teams fodder, alongside Winston Guy. Expect Guy to get the chance to fill the Atari Bigby vacancy. Jeremy Lane received rave reviews for a performance against LSU last season and could be another one of Seattle’s late round sleepers. I like 7th round pick Greg Scruggs as a physical specimen and watched footage of his pro-day where he looked the part and moved well. Jaye Howard is an underrated pass rusher from the interior who will knife through one-on-one blocks and could end up being the one guy who really has an impact from the R4-7 group.
People are already asking why the offensive line and wide receiver positions weren’t addressed. The Seahawks made some moves last year at receiver and people shouldn’t write of an improved season for all with improved health and better quarterback play. If Sidney Rice and Zach Miller play at anything like their peak in 2012, you’re talking about two potential stars. Doug Baldwin continues to develop, while Golden Tate is facing a make-or-break season. Mike Williams deserves a chance to re-emerge after a disappointing 2011.
As for the offensive line, don’t underestimate Seattle’s depth and appreciation for what they have already. The line didn’t miss a beat last year when James Carpenter and John Moffitt suffered injury and were then joined by Russell Okung. The players who stepped in were not big names or high profile draft picks, but they all thrived. Whether it’s Lemuel Jeanpierre, Paul McQuistan or Breno Giacomini – those guys deserve the chance to compete to start. Seattle has also added Deuce Lutui and Frank Omiyale, so will feel good about their chances of filling the hole left by Robert Gallery. A lot of people like to think you need five first round picks to make a good offensive line, but that simply isn’t the case.
Overall it’s a draft class that will do well to provide Seattle with as many key starters as 2010 and 2011. The Bruce Irvin pick shocked the NFL and will be similarly lauded or hammered depending on the performance of ‘Brucemode’ this year. He’s an explosive pass rusher off the edge and the Seahawks haven’t taken this move lightly. A lot of teams react to the draft, but nobody can fault Seattle for being pro-active. They know what they want, they identify roles and they attack. Irvin isn’t the type of guy you draft on a whim because he’s BPA, you draft him with a vision. Other teams like the Jets drafted Quinton Coples because he was there, and now they have to work him into the system. Irvin was probably in Seattle’s thoughts in January.
They’ll know exactly what they want from their latest first round pick and if he can provide an impact in the Raheem Brock-role, then he could end up being one of the most popular players on this team in a generation (his press conference shows why). An improved pass rush and better quarterback play were Seattle’s two defining needs coming into this draft. Irvin and Russell Wilson may well be the answer.
UDFA signings
Rishaw Johnson (OG, Cal. PA), Carson Wiggs (K, Purdue), Jon Opperud (OT, Montana), DeShawn Shead (S, Portland State), Monte Taylor (DE, Cincinnati), Phil Bates (WR/QB, Ohio), Sean McGrath (TE, Henderson State), Jermaine Kearse (WR, Washington), London Durham (CB, McNeese State), Lavasier Tuinei (WR, Oregon), Chris Hart (QB, Weber), Addison Lawrence (OT, Mississippi State)
Game tape on Kearse below:
Tauren Poole didnt sign with us, heard hes signing with Carolina
I think when Carroll said “More than anybody else that was alive in the draft…” he meant that of the reamining draftable players (Luck and RGIII were no longer in play), Wilson had the best chance of becoming a great player. He wasn’t placing him above Luck. At least, that was my interpretation
I’m hearing that Poole did not sign with us after all, maybe CAR.
Great write up Rob…
On Wilson: I’m less convinced the team sees Wilson as a day 1 starter. Almost no 3rd round QB would be expected to start day 1. Almost any other position, absolutely. Having said that, I bet the team would LOVE for Wilson to blow them away and for Flynn to barely win the job. They might be able to move TJax later for a pick or player.
On the LBs: Boy, did this team attack the position and re-make it. Would anyone be shocked if the starters on day 1 are: Wright, Wilson, and Toomer in some arrangement?
Saturday picks: I think Guy, Sweezy, and Scruggs are as much about special teams as anything. That’s another area where they want competition.
Dave crockett- who is Wilson? im not trying to sound like an ass, I’m wondering if you meant Wagner when referring to the LB’s (least i think you were, if not i appologize), but I like that scenario with Wilson.
I’d be pretty shocked personally if Wilson starts at LB 🙂
My bad.
Meant Wagner but wrote Wilson.
I think he meant Wagner, it was confusing because ‘Wilson’ is written with the other LB’s so i think he meant Wagner.
Did someone confirm the Tauren Poole signing? I had heard he reversed field and signed with the Panthers.
The best part of the R. Wilson pick was where he was taken. In all honesty it is a weird spot to be taken in, regarding expectations, and that is the beauty of the whole thing.
What is the expectation for any of the QB’s on the Seahawks roster?
Flynn is a perennial backup, but showed a ton of poise in live competition.
Jackson has never lived up to expectation despite showing flashes of greatness, (goodness)?
Wilson is the little QB that could. He has an odd body: short, long wingspan, and huge hands. He has learned 2 different systems in a short amount of time, and played a completely different sport. He has been lauded for being a tremendous leader, and quality teammate.
Portis is the athletic, raw guy that might be able to be extraordinary one day. Time will tell.
All are going to have reasonable contracts, with none have a long term detriment or benefit to the team(especially Jackson and Portis). So who is the clear cut front runner? Carroll took heat last year because Jackson was the starter, no competition. Understandable, and the right decision in light of the odd circumstances. But that isn’t the case this year. If anything it seems like the guy that learns the playbook the fastest, and gains the trust of his teammates’ the quickest will be the front runner. Thing is I don’t know if anyone knows who that is. To me this will prove to be the ultimate competition. I have read that both Flynn and Wilson have the subjective “it” factor, while Jackson gained a ton of respect from his squad for playing through injury. The guy the team, not the coaches, believe in to me will ultimately be a better, and successful, quarterback because of the competition.
I grade this draft as a B/B- with the potential to be much higher.
I like the Irvin pick, (albeit it was “high” and totally shocking haha) and the fact that PC has scouted him for so long makes me think he’s been waiting for this moment for a long time. Even if Irvin isn’t a double digit sacker, if he can force earlier/bad throws with our secondary, it will be a total win.
Love the Wagner pick, and while i don’t expect him to be a total standout, I do think he’ll be a solid starter going into next year.
I (and I’m sorry Kip D:) HATE the Russell Wilson pick. I just… don’t see it. I can’t get passed how short he is, and I think it was a wasted pick. (Though, I would LOVE to be proven wrong. I WANT it to happen… just don’t see it.)
Now I LOVE the Turbin pick. He’s a total bruiser and I love that. He’s going to get playing time, and he’ll get feared soon enough. I love the guy. I’ve loved him since I first saw tape on him. Loved this pick.
The swing pick, that I really, and I mean REALLY, hope something comes from, is Toomer. I really hope he can become our WLB. He’s a total unknown for me and the fact that he only played one year of football (Not counting Junior College) makes me hope Carroll can make him into something. He’s got all the physical tools, and if coaching is all he needs, then PC/JS may have found another 5th round gem (though I’m not expecting it).
The DL picks made me happy. You can never have too much depth, and there are possible specialists in there.
If everything works out, I will happily eat crow and raise my grade, but I think the realistic expectation, personally, is that of a B/B-. The Irvin pick soured the experts towards Seattle, (which is frustrating… because had NYG, NE, BAL, or other teams drafted him, it’d be praised). Irvin I think will develop… PC has avoided players he’s spent too much time around, and yet he pulled the trigger here. It makes me trust the pick.
I really want to see what is to come though 😀 Excited about the trek to next season!
If we did get Tauren Poole then that is a great signing. And I love the Jermaine Kearse and Tuinei signings. A couple of slot possession receivers who could prove very valuable if Williams and Obamanu don’t improve. I have never liked Fylnn even one bit so I have love the Wilson selection
Here is the TNT’s release: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2012/04/28/uw-receiver-jermaine-kearse-headlines-hawks-urfa-list/
Here’s the full list. (as of 6:27pm PST)
Phil Bates, WR, Ohio U
London Durham, CB, McNeese State
Rishaw Johnson, OG, California (PA)
Jermaine Kearse, WR, Washington
Sean McGrath, TE, Henderson State
Jon Opperud, OT, Montana
DeShawn Shead, DB, Portland State
Monte Taylor, LEO, Cincinnati
Lavasier Tuinei, WR, Oregon
Carson Wiggs, K, Purdue
Read more here: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2012/04/28/uw-receiver-jermaine-kearse-headlines-hawks-urfa-list/#storylink=cpy
I’ve removed Poole. Was announced, but it seems it’s true that he has signed for Carolina.
By the way – tomorrow we’re hosting a Live Chat at 2pm PST. Reflect on the draft, ask questions, we can talk about the top players to look for in 2013. Anything you want.
According to this Chris Polk signed with the Eagles
http://www.sbnation.com/2012-nfl-draft/2012/4/28/2984937/undrafted-free-agent-signings-2012
John,
I’m not as flat out infatuated with the Wilson signing as PC/JS, but even if he’s just a long-term backup a high-quality backup is probably worth a 3rd rounder. It’s not that you can’t find a quality backup later in the draft. It’s that in the vast majority of cases the later the pick the less certain the projection. It is very difficult to project when late round guys will actually be ready to play. Maybe you get T.J. Yates. Maybe you get Caleb Hanne.
In the 3rd round you’re not necessarily saying “He’s a starter.” You’re saying, “(a) He’ll make the team, and (b) I *expect* to at least get what Houston got from Yates.” You pick a guy in the 6th or 7th you are saying, “I expect practice squad, but I’m hoping for more.”
Hey Rob,
Remember when I randomly brought up Bruce Irvin like two/three months ago?
You had said you liked him a lot.
Good call on both our parts I guess.
Dave,
I get your logic, but there were other guys available (like Rob pointed out) that could’ve been contributors this year. We already have signed a great back up in Flynn for three years. TJ and Flynn are both solid/good back ups. Why draft another back up? The pick feels like they expect a starter. I don’t see it. That was my point.
I also think Wilson would’ve fallen to us in the 4th, but that’s neither here nor there. It’s only a few hours after the draft, so I can’t judge. It’s just in my eyes, as of now, I predict we drafted a back up QB when we could have gotten a possible starter.
But we’ll see how this all turns out 🙂
I’ve been listening to alot of people talk about how bad we drafted especially the Bruce Irving pick and I got to say they just don’t understand the defense Seattle plays. He was picked to come in and if Clemons doesnt resign next year he will take his place. The leo spot on the the Line does nothing else but rush the passer 3 downs, no run stoping necessary. Thats not the LEOs job. If clemons comes back I see him sliding into the backup slot due to age. I think this is a great pick.
Turbin’s first run of the season will be like the Beast-Quake. I just know it. Dude is gonna be an animal on offense the same way Bruce Irvin will be a total savage on defense. Very happy with this draft probably more than anything else because I feel I understand it.
There are a bunch of guys I’m sad to have missed out on, especially Rueben Randle. I’d trade Bobby Wagner for him any day and draft a LB later but that’s just me. Randle was such a good value where the Giants got him (and they had him as a first-rounder on their board along with me). You win some and you lose some. Nothing against Wagner: I love him and he’s a perfect fit for what we want to do.
Understanding more about how our FO operates and seeing glimpses of the vision for this team in 2011 makes me respect our draft that much more. Can’t wait to see these guys in Training Camp.
Rob and KIp
Thanks for all the hard work you put into this draft season. Although we didn’t always agree I appreciated your insight and great writing. I am very happy with this draft class and as I said this morning it seems our teams mantra is “underated, overlooked with something to prove” as Pete says “with a chip on his shoulder” it’s a good mantra for the city of Seattle, the Seahawks and fans. We have had to endure so many years of sports meidocrity and being overlooked I am hopefull these “inglorios bastards” will bring long deserved recognition to our home. I don’t think we are very far away from fielding a championship team here in Seattle.
Thanks again for working hard in doing your part to make that happen. Until next draft season.
SeaHawk Steve
Rob,
About Wilson, I think he gets a chance to compete to start, but I don’t expect he will. While I belive Wilson’s upside far higher than Flynn’s, Flynn is much closer to it at the moment. He has been through the most critical stage of an NFL QBs career, has been through his apprenticeship, so to speak, and is ready to play.
I don’t think it will take long before Wilson overtakes him, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a close thing. Wilson is the most pro-ready QB in this draft after Luck (and I don’t include RGIII because nobody knows how well/soon he will master an offense so different than the one he ran in college).
Wilson is the real deal. Seattle got a first round NFL QB in the third. The steal of the draft.
And the funniest thing about it: two picks prior the Jags drafted a KICKER!
One more thing about Wilson: JS and PC are obviously thrilled with the guy and will give him every opportunity to excel in an offense that will be Wilson-friendly. He will play if/when he is the best QB on the team. Had another team drafted him, he might have been pigeonholed behind an entrenched starter, but not in Seattle. If he beats Flynn/TJack/Portis in camp, he will start. WHEN he beats the starter out, he will start. Probably a lot sooner than most people think.
I could see people hammering the Seahawks first two picks, that is to say, if they hadn’t traded back each time and accumulated more resources. I mean, at least recognize the fact that JS/PC clearly got what they were looking for (positive for Irvin/may have wanted Kendricks) and yet still managed to significantly add to their draft haul. That can’t be understated.
Everyone will have their let downs- I was really hoping the ‘Hawks would take Ron Brooks where they took Howard, but Lane may be just as effective. Overall, the class represents an exciting direction for the Seahawks roster and I can only imagine the intensity Carroll’s practices are going to have this August. Pete always talks about having the rookies run some snaps with the 1s at some point and I can’t wait to see Irvin & Wagner flying around behind Mebane and Red.
mj,
Agreed. Most of the commentators simply don’t know the team that well, or what would constitute a good draft.
A couple years from now (if not sooner) those lambasting the Seahawks now will be praising the results.
Great write up. Was a fun year. I am ridiculously geeked.
Hawks signed WR UDFA Jermaine Kearse from the dub
Poole signing with the Panthers would have to be location or family driven. Panthers are loaded at RB. It would seem rather stupid to sign. Perhaps a guarantee given?
I’m glad they found a few wide receivers in UDFA. I was getting worried about the unbalanced drafting. With all these shiny new quarterbacks we need some new receivers to step up and prove themselves. Here is hoping for a great season.
JS said he felt this was a very average WR class… probably why we didn’t see any drafted
This sounds more crazy the more I think about it, but is there any chance the Hawks signed Flynn so that they could draft Wilson?
If they had gone into the draft without signing him, I think it would have been hard to sneak Wilson to the third round pick. Someone would likely have traded ahead of them to take him if they wanted him. So could the Hawks have paid Flynn’s guaranteed bonus in order to assure they’d get a shot at Wilson? I know it sounds crazy, but if they love him that much, a few million would be a small price to pay.
posted this responce in the wrong thread:
You said: “More than anybody else that was alive in the draft, this guy gives you a chance to have a great player.” What exactly does that mean? That Wilson gives Seattle a better chance to have a great player than Andrew Luck?
My answer is that No, this isn’t what he means. He said that of the players still alive in the draft (ie available at the 75th pick) he had the most upside.
Quarterbacks starting year 1 is more of a recent phenomenon that used to fail miserably but has been more successful of late, probably due to the number of college schools using pro offenses or techniques. I think coaches would prefer to transition more gradually with the younger guys getting a chance to learn without the stress of wins/losses hanging on their developmental choices. Seattle has the benefit of several veterans being in the hunt to start, Portis is said to have developed to where a third rounder would be coming out this year so that would put him next to Wilson.
Rather than run down the handicaps, I’m going to just predict that Flynn starts this year, TJack is an end of camp cut, and Wilson outperforms Portis similarly to the way Baldwin outperformed Tate last year to win the backup role. Even if Wilson never rises above backup status, he will provide a great change-of-direction alternative to come in and do some quick damage. However, he strikes me as a guy that given the opportunity to start if Flynn gets injured, he may not give it back. Why keep Portis over TJack? because Portis has trade value right now, let alone after he shows his poise and abilities in the preseason. TJack is a decent backup quarterback and would be picked up but I don’t think anyone would trade for him. He just doesn’t have the ability to quickly work through his progressions while reading defenses, especially when it’s critical in the 4th quarter. This is where Flynn and Wilson shine and Portis has enough upside to keep around and not risk losing. If Flynn went down with an injury, everyone would be calling for Wilson to start anyway, so why keep a guy ahead of him who lacks some of the most critical tools to succeed at QB, especially at $4million.
Sweezy is the kind of upside development project they take on every year, this year’s Jarriel King. It is not accurate to describe this move as a punt (they are not giving up and trying to move the opponent back 40 yards). More of a roll of the dice hoping to be fortunate in the longer term with an athletic guy with upside. Sweezy is very fast for a lineman and had the highest vertical jump in his position.
Turbin is another in a growing line of brilliant 3rd-5th rounders that this regime continues to deliver. They have an excellent staff of scout/evaluators who should be able to continue to find these guys as they are there to be found every year.
@AgentJ
Good point. The FO are going against the grain. Smokescreens and all. Every DE was available. Yet they take Irvin like F Kipers board. He caught feelings too, lol. U gotta respect that. The real QB competition is between Flynn and Wilson. TJack has been demoted.
I really am happy with the draft and pretty excited about all of the udfa’s we’re bringing in. Glad that we bringing in some oline and wr competition.
To those upset about us not drafting a wr i would just say we invested a fair amount in that posiiton last year in both fa and the draft. I think if some of the projects that have been around for a few years (Obo, BMW, Butler) don’t show up ready for camp they will be hitting the street. Regardless, pc/js have stated how excited they are to see durham back on the field and try to work him in. would love to see him start across from rice. rice is said to be his healthiest since entering the league. tate was coming on a little bit towards the end of the year and of course we all love baldwin. i would expect if we have major injury or performance problems this season that we will see another bigger investment in the position. in fact, i would say the same for the oline as well.
I really love the wilson pick. i was hoping for the first 4th rd pick but pc said he got two calls that assured him wilson would have been picked before the end of rd 3. of course it is a risk but when i watch the tape and look at the mind bogling stats at both schools i can’t help but think he has a decent shot of making it as the point guard qb that pc wants. pc/js also said in that press conference the other day that 4 qb’s is their ideal going into camp. we know wilson is making the team as a rd3 pick so i think it’s either tjack or portis getting cut before the start of the season. my vote is tjack. portis is just too promising. we need to see flynn get a real shot and continue to groom the youngin’s…
If on Thursday morning I had told you that Seattle would get the first DE off the board, the second LB in the 2nd round, and a QB and RB in round 3 and 4, all while adding 4 extra picks, very few of you would believe me, and everyone would be jacked.
What happened to Dwight Jones? I can’t even find any info about him being picked up by anyone as a UDFA. What is the knock on him?
Hawkspur – he landed in Houston as an UDFA. Major character issues. Shame, because the guy has first round physical tools.
Just heard an interview, said that the sent Tom Cable to work out Sweezy and he came back really wrapped and said we have to draft this guy. With Cable’s coaching ability we’ll look back soon and think what a steal.
When watching youtube clips of pass rushers this year I thought three guys really stood out- Irvin, Shea McClellin, and Miles Burris. I want to say that I fully credit this blog and Field Gulls for providing names, links to clips, and thoughts on all the players I watched. When I first encountered these three they were considered lower round picks. Irvin was rated 3rd, McClellin 3rd, and Burris 5th. Then Irvin went to Jimmy John’s and I thought he might slide to the 4th. In the last month McClellin rose the the 2nd and in the last week to the first. The last few days I saw Irvin discussed as a 2nd. Burris never moved.
The clips of Ingram, Perry, Coples, Mercilus, and Branch didn’t impress me. Upshaw looked better, but I still preferred my three. When Irvin was picked at 15 I was a little surprised, but it fell into place. PC/JS had grabbed the guy I thought was the best pass rusher. Why wait until the 3rd to do that? It now sounds like teams were ready to take Irvin later in the 1st. I am happy with Irvin.
Wagner was equal with Kendricks and David in my estimation and I am happy with his selection. Turbin looks like exactly the RB we need to spell Mode. I would have preferred Miles Burris to some of our later picks. Chris Polk could become a valuable back for the Eagles and I wish we had grabbed him.
Wilson has jaw-dropping footage, but I was surprised we selected him after signing Matt Flynn. I won’t cry if Wilson never plays a down and I like taking high-upside quarterbacks as part of the Win Forever formula. My biggest hope is that having Flynn and Wilson doesn’t eliminate the possibility of taking Matt Barkley next year.
Belgaron,
I think you are exactly right in your assessment of the QB situation. Just to add to your Portis/TJack comment, we already know that Tjack is not the future, and Portis might be.
I think the final 53 has the depth chart for QB as Flynn/Wilson/Portis. Just a matter of time (perhaps when/if Flynn is injured) that Wilson steps in for good.
I watched all of gruden’s QB Camp shows…I recall Wilson and Gruden talking about how Wisconsin had the biggest OLine in the country last year averaging like 6-4 306. The kid threw 33 and 4 and is super smart, composed, and an incredible leader. He may not pan out to be a pro-bowler, but a great back-up with excellent feet, poise, and attitude. If he’s the best back-up we ever have, he’s worth every bit of a 3rd round pick. Which is what I expect from Wilson.
Hey Rob I was wondering why the so called experts when ripping the Irvin pick the main reason is he wont play every down….Yet Aldon Smith who was picked 7th overall was used as a third down player and not a word is said but that it was a great pick…..This was the 15th pick and people act like its top 5, go look at the players over the years chosen at 15. People are way to focused on if he starts… Our D does not need a starter we need a guy to get pressure and that is it and that is what he will do… GREAT PICK…Also I am tired of good picks being called John picks and the bad or questioned picks being Pete’s……
Jason – It’s a fair point. And in reality, I think a few people are involved in the process of the draft. Cable clearly had input last year in going OL/OL with the first two picks, through the vision of Pete to build the line and improve a run game that never got going in 2010. Gibbs had a big say on the team drafting a LT with the #6 pick prior to that season. Carroll wanted a FS in that first round and probably led the call for Earl Thomas. And there are guys that Pete knows from his USC days – Sherman, Irvin, Smith, Tate, Thurmond etc. There’s also guys that Schneider and the scouts will bang the table for. It’s a collective movement I think and we should recognise that it’s not Schneider making great moves and Carroll making the duff ones. They’re working together, and with the other members of staff. Although I would suggest Bruce Irvin is all on PC – the ideal LEO, a guy he recruited, who fits Pete’s defensive vision.
As for the pick itself, you’re right about Smith. I think the difference is that Smith is more your prototype NFL pass rusher – he looks the part physically. He could be a starter down the line. He had no character red flags and people expected him to go in round one. Seattle is taking a guy who hasn’t been a successful every down lineman like Smith was for Missouri. But then it comes down to scheme and a lot of outsiders don’t appreciate the LEO role or what they’ve looked for here. A lot of the guys the ‘experts’ wanted Seattle to take weren’t obvious scheme fits. We’re all still learning here – national media ‘experts’ included – as to what Carroll’s specific vision is. There wasn’t really much point taking a Quinton Coples or Melvin Ingram, because Seattle would probably have them running a role similar to the one they signed Jason Jones for. The only pass rusher on the board when Seattle picked in round two was Vinny Curry – who was liked and was a fit – but they could not risk missing out on an entire class of pass rushers.
At this time of year, one can either stress out about the negative “what ifs” or one can rejoice with hope and excitement of “what might be”. It’s strictly a choice one makes. All of us can justify either position, but those who choose to see a glass mostly full will have a smile on our face until something happens to make us reconsider.
I am stoked. I am really really excited. I do not consider every draftee I did not see coming as an insult to my intelligence or potential to be a great GM like some do. I feel smarter for having been shown that I missed these guys. I wish I had seen the Wagner pick. When compared to Kuechley he looks like he could be every bit as good if not better. Turbin looks a lot like the guy I really coveted: Doug Martin. They are very similar, and could easily have similar results. I kick myself for not seeing them. I did not see Howard coming because when I look through the DraftScout lists I rarely go past the second page of prospects, but if I did, I would have seen how Howard stands out with much more speed than those around him. The same is true for Scruggs and Sweezey. Fast. There is always something missing from late round picks or they would be early round picks. What this FO is willing to overlook is power and strength. They seem willing to give that up in favor of athleticism and speed. Fortunately, strength is the one measurable that can be relatively easily improved with some work in the weight room.
And QB. Wow. We are following the GB model. Is there a better model? Especially when it comes to QB? I think not. Draft em. Coach em up. Give em a bit of playing time. Stack em up like cord wood. Keem em for a rainy day or trade them for draft picks or players we need. Four is not too many. Maybe we can hide one on the practice squad. Let em compete. May the best QB win. And play. SF had Joe Montana with Steve Young in the wings for many years. I expect dynasty is not out of the question. That is the goal.
My glass is overflowing right now. Until they prove me wrong, I think this draft was awesome.
The thing that makes me laugh about what the experts say is how we made a bad decision with Irvin, yet they don’t realize how our defense is run. We in no way were looking for a 3 down player ever. We have our 4 starters on the d-line. If we didn’t resign Big Red i could have seen a coples like player or chandler jones, but the thing is that nobody ever understood we were looking for a pure pass rusher, and personally i like the Irvin pick. Silly experts will never understand PCs defense. Go hawks.
I actually like the Russell Wilson pick. As Pete said you can never have too many good quarterbacks and I agree. Think about it like this, if Flynn ends up the starter day 1 and he gets hurt do you want Tavaris to be the quarterback the rest of the year? Tavaris isn’t horrible, but the rest of the year would be around .500 and a likely loss in first round in the playoffs if we made it that far.
Plus what would happen if Wilson turns out to be the best quarterback on the roster regardless of size. Obviously Pete and John liked the guy and felt he can tilt the room of they wouldn’t have crafted him. I tend to think he is a Drew Brees type of QB and could be really special. In the mean time he could be a wildcat option and learn the offense. Better than David Greene and sounds like a good round 3 pick to me.
The Hawks quarterback situation for the most part is pathetic. Wilson was a horrible pick in the third round. I wonder how much input Bevell had in this pick? All their other picks make some sense, but this one is bad. Perhaps Carroll thinks he’s still coaching in college where short qb’s are the norm. It does not matter how athletic or smart Wilson is, i doubt he surpasses Seneca Wallace in anything. They seem like they are almost identical…but Wallace was like a 5th? Flynn imo will struggle with a team defending a 7-9 record and not a Superbowl…he will have to work ten times harder with the hawks. Our best bet will be more of the same with T.Jackson which is par in the NFC West. I suspect that they wanted to draft Oswieler…before the Broncos snagged him. The Wilson pick seemed like a panic move, one that may cost Carroll at some point if he lives out the delusion that Wilson can lead them to a championship.
Calm down Adam…Have you actually watched any tape on Wilson or seen the Gruden QB camp?
Many think if he were two inches taller, he’d be the #3 overall pick. This could be a steal.
I think we did well in this draft. People are questioning Wilson in the 3rd, but when you pick up Turbin in the 4th how can you be un-happy!? Nice job of picking up 4 extra picks while getting quality picks at the positions they wanted to get.
Not surprised by the lack of drafting a WR as Rice/Williams/Baldwin/Tate, with developing players such as Durham and Lockette behind them is solid. Perhaps not the stars that some teams have, but more depth. The lack of a TE is a bit of a surprise, as the roster looks numerically very light and the UDFA. Perhaps all this talk of 2 TE sets is another smokescreen.