Combine Sunday review: thoughts on the receivers

February 23rd, 2014 | Written by Rob Staton

Seahawks offensive coordinator Darrell Bevell worked out the QB's and WR's today

Today provided more questions than answers.

First of all — how good is this receiver class? I mean, really?

There’s a heck of a lot of depth — enough to extend into the second round before a considerable drop in talent. That’s one major positive to come out of the day.

The other was Odell Beckham Jr — who put on a clinic during the Group 1 receiver drills.

He ran an official 4.43 and looked impressive in every session. He’s always been a top-20 talent. Go and watch the Mississippi State tape from 2013 if you have any doubts.

Yet his performance today provided a rare moment of clarity.

Here’s what we can say with some certainty. Sammy Watkins, Mike Evans and Beckham Jr all deserve to be top-20 picks.

Can we agree on that?

In terms of the rest — well, we could see 8-9 receivers go in the first round. That’d be a new record.

Or we could see as little as four — an underwhelming suggestion given how many people are praising this receiver class.

In many cases, there are plenty of question marks.

Let’s start with the three we can feel confident about…

Sammy Watkins
Didn’t run as fast as expected (official 4.43) but didn’t harm his stock after a superb on-field work out. He was silky smooth throughout — running crisp, effortless routes and catching the ball with natural ease. You have to assume he’ll be the first receiver taken.

Mike Evans
He ran a 4.53 which is perfectly acceptable for a 231lbs receiver. It isn’t the 4.41 Vincent Jackson managed at 241lbs however, probably ending any chance he usurps Watkins to be the first receiver taken. Here’s the major positive though — he has 35 1/8 inch arms and recorded a 37 inch vertical jump. That’s some catching radius.

Odell Beckham Jr.
He’s a superb football player who’ll be able to start very quickly. It’s not just the physical qualities either, he’s technically a gifted receiver. There’s a little Golden Tate to his game — he’ll be able to work the sideline despite a lack of size (5-11, 198lbs). He has 10-inch hands that absorb the football. He’s a fantastic competitor, an explosive return man and he high points the ball better than anyone in this class.

And here’s the rest…

Kelvin Benjamin
He ran a 4.61 at 240lbs. Which is fine. But we mentioned Vincent Jackson with Mike Evans — and he managed a 4.41 at a similar height/weight to Benjamin. Jackson was the 61st pick in 2005. I’m not suggesting Benjamin will fall that far, because he won’t. But can we really say with any confidence he’ll be the top-20 lock we’d started to predict? He’ll be a 23-year-old rookie, he had some ugly drops in college. He had the worst three-cone drill along with Brandon Coleman (7.33). And yet he’s the prototype size for a #1 receiver and has almost no body fat at 240lbs. I could see him going in the top-15, I could see him going in the 20′s or 30′s.

Marqise Lee
The NFL Network had a camera on Pete Carroll during Lee’s forty yard dash (see the video here). When the timer showed a 4.5, Carroll mouthed “wow”. Everyone expected him to run faster, especially the guy who recruited him to USC. He’s only 5-11 and 196lbs and with an official 4.52 he isn’t going to go as early as expected. Lee didn’t have a great 2013 season — he was injury-hit, the Trojans imploded and he had a high drop percentage. We all saw Robert Woods as a top-15 guy at one time. He ran a 4.42 at 6-0, 201lbs and was pick #41 last year. Lee might suffer a similar fate, but he is better than Woods. Would you be shocked if the Jets took him at #18? I wouldn’t be.

Brandon Coleman
I noted earlier in the live blog that this was ‘job done’ for Coleman. He had his knee cleared. He had 21 reps on the bench press and looked in fantastic shape at 6-6 and 225lbs. He ran an official 4.56 which is only 0.03 slower than Mike Evans. But he also had the joint worst three cone at 7.33 (with Kelvin Benjamin). That’s a big deal for teams like Seattle, who DO take combine drills very seriously. How do you balance out a nice forty with a disappointing three cone? We’re talking about a guy with mountains of potential, an insane ceiling. There aren’t many players capable of doing what he does. But he’s a complex mix of extreme highs (size, forty, upside) and lows (inconsistency even in a crappy offense, lousy three cone, technical flaws). He could go anywhere — round one, round two, lower. Who knows?

Martavis Bryant
Bob McGinn reported today that Bryant could slip into the first round mix. Athletically, it’s not impossible. He’s 6-4 and 211lbs running a 4.42. He completely looks the part of at least a high second rounder. And yet McGinn’s report also labels him a “knucklehead” and someone you wouldn’t want to grab in the first round. Despite his good showing in the forty, his three cone time of 7.18 is lower tier and worse than Mike Evans. He has shorter arms than Odell Beckham Jr. He did post a 39 inch vertical jump — third best for receivers. The tape isn’t great. Another guy who really could be anything to anyone.

Brandin Cooks
He ran a 4.33 and with his massive production in 2013, it won’t be a shock if he goes in round one. He’s also in-between 5-9 and 5-10 and only 189lbs. With guys like this, you have to create a gameplan around them. Brian Schottenheimer in St. Louis refused to do that for Tavon Austin, and the results were a mediocre rookie year with only flashes of brilliance. A creative coach picking in the early 20′s might fancy a shot here. But what if Odell Beckham Jr is still on the board? His floor will be round two, he could go in the first — but nothing’s certain.

Jordan Matthews
I don’t think anyone expected him to run a 4.46. He followed it up with a 35.5 inch vertical and a 6.95 three cone. Very few players did more to help themselves than Matthews today. Understandably, it’s kicked off the first round talk again. I don’t think you can rule it out. But I’m still not sure the tape indicates much more than a solid #2 receiver. He just looks pretty good. He isn’t overly physical, contesting (and winning) passes down the sideline. He’s a crisp route runner with a ton of savvy working the middle of the field. That has some value, but I’m not sure anyone bangs the table for him in round one. He is a hard worker though, with the right attitude. You can’t help but like him, but it’s hard to get too excited at the same time.

Davante Adams
I think he got a bit too much hype during the season. He lacks size at 6-0 and 212lbs. Watch the San Jose State game and tell me he didn’t benefit from a serious lack of quality opposition last year. Fresno State were found out by a pretty average USC team, the one opponent of any quality they faced. And yet despite the lack of speed for his size (4.56) he pulls out a 39.5 inch vertical jump — third best among receivers. His three cone was in the top-15. It’s probably not enough to get him in the top-50, but he has a weird blend of fantastic jumping ability and middling speed.

Allen Robinson
He just isn’t an explosive player, and nobody should’ve expected more than a 4.60 forty today. He’s a shifty open field runner, a tremendous competitor and a really level headed prospect. The big question is — can he continue to be elusive and a YAC threat at the next level? Can he get downfield to take the top off a defense? I’m not convinced. Everything is faster in the NFL. And watching the Penn State tape, you can’t help but wonder if he can remain effective. There’s only one nagging thing in the back of my mind. I didn’t really like Keenan Allen, and he wasn’t a burner either. Allen’s a former 5-star recruit, so he was still a vastly superior athlete to Robinson. But still, fool me once –shame on you etc.

Donte Moncrief
He’s not quite as big as expected (6-2, 221lbs) but he promised a decent forty time and he delivered a 4.40. His 39.5 inch vertical is equal to Davante Adams’ — tied-third best among receivers. He had a 7.02 three cone. And yet during the drills he looked exactly like he does on tape — kind of cumbersome, going through the motions. There’s a really good player in this guy waiting to break free. Someone needs to light a rocket up his ass and he might actually deliver on his potential. Nobody in this class has more self-confidence than Moncrief. That can be a good and a bad thing, I think in his case he needs to realise what is he right now — and what he could potentially become if he just worked that bit harder.

So yeah, we could see 8-9 receivers in the first round. It wouldn’t be a major shock. It’s a good group.

But it also wouldn’t be a big surprise if by the end of day one — most of these names were still on the board, with a rush on the position commencing shortly after round two begins.

I’ll also add — after yesterday’s underwhelming performance by the tight ends, we might only see one Eric Ebron drafted in the first frame.

How the Seahawks might approach this receiver class

Assuming they retain Golden Tate (increasingly likely with the cap set to be extended to $130-132m), they simply don’t need another sub-6-0 receiver. Neither do they need a relatively well sized, technically gifted 6-1/6-2 type.

What they need is a beast. A guy with the size to develop into a true #1. Someone who can win jump balls downfield, dominate the red-line and be a much needed force in the red zone.

Seattle doesn’t have that right now.

Mike Evans will be gone. Kelvin Benjamin could be gone. They both look like classic #1 receivers, the type Pete Carroll admires.

So it could come down to how they view the remaining options. Do they see Coleman as a player worthy of the first round? They’ve shown they’re not afraid to draft for athletic potential early in the draft. And it was reported earlier today that Seattle has shown genuine interest in Coleman.

Do they like Bryant enough, with all of his scary athleticism, to take a major chance on him at #32?

If they don’t see a big receiver worthy of a first round pick left on the board, I think they’ll simply look at other positions. I doubt they’ll take another receiver just for the sake of this being a good class.

The way they judge needs is to grade where they can get the biggest on-field improvement. With Percy Harvin, Golden Tate, Doug Baldwin and Jermaine Kearse — they don’t need to add to the group for the sake of it. They need what they don’t have — a 6-4/6-5, +225lbs monster.

If that guy isn’t there, I think they’ll simply look at other positions.

Time for the defense to shine

With a lack of great front seven depth beyond the first round or two, we might see teams prioritise the defensive talent early.

Unlike at receiver, where you can get a good one in round two — that probably won’t be the case up front on defense.

Here are the players I’m particularly keen to see work out.

Demarcus Lawrence (DE, Boise State)
Ideal length for a LEO, 6-3 and 250lbs. Long arms. On tape he has speed to burn, a relentless attitude and he gets to the quarterback. He needs to prove he has top-end speed with a solid 10-yard split. I touted him for Seattle in my pre-combine mock draft and he’s someone we should be taking very seriously. I just wonder if he could be set for a Chandler Jones-style rise — respected within war rooms for some time, but doesn’t get any media attention until late in the process.

Brent Urban (DT, Virginia)
Another player with the kind of length Seattle loves on the defensive line — 6-7, 295lbs and 34 1/4 inch arms. Looks the part on tape. Had to leave the Senior Bowl with an injury, so this is a good chance to get some momentum going as a potential first round pick. I’ve said many times he could be the steal of the draft. Get him in the weight room and try to turn him into J.J. Watt-lite. He has a ton of potential.

Ra’Shede Hageman (DT, Minnesota)
A former basketball player, Hageman has the odd moment where he looks unstoppable on tape. Can he prove he’s worthy of a top-25 grade tomorrow? Another player with ‘Seattle length’. You could see him going to Arizona or Green Bay. He could be another Mohammed Wilkerson. I thought he’d blow up the Senior Bowl, but he left that to Aaron Donald. Now this is Hageman’s time to make a statement.

Stephon Tuitt (DE, Notre Dame)
He’s lost weight for the combine. Some pundits rank him in the third round, others say he’s too athletic for the size not to be a day one pick. I’m leaning towards him being in the round 2-3 range, but if he runs a 4.8 tomorrow at 6-5, 304lbs — I have to reconsider. Big guys who can run don’t last long. So let’s see if he can run.

Kony Ealy (DE, Missouri)
I’ve not seen anything on tape to get really excited about. I’m not sure what he is — a 4-3 end? A poor man’s version of Michael Bennett? Does he need to play inside as a nickel pass rusher? Some people think he could play outside linebacker. The fact is, however, that if he performs well at the combine at 6-4 and 273lbs — someone will take him early. You can work with a guy like that.

Aaron Donald (DT, Pittsburgh)
For me, you could take him as early as you wanted. Terrific football player, without doubt one of the best in the draft. He has nothing to prove tomorrow. But can he be the star of the show? Tony Pauline has been reporting all week he could run in the 4.6/4.7 range. If he manages it, he’ll be a top-15 pick. He should be anyway.

Louis Nix (DT, Notre Dame)
Apparently he dropped 20lbs for the combine. How on earth did he get up to 350lbs? And why? He won’t run like Dontari Poe, but it’s not that long ago people considered him a top-15 pick as a rare 3-4 nose tackle. Let’s see if he can give his dwindling stock a boost.

Closing notes

Tony Pauline has the latest on Austin Seferian-Jenkins’ foot injury:

Doctors x-rayed Seferian-Jenkins left foot with the sole intention of examining the ankle which he sprained a year ago and kept him on the sidelines during a small portion of the 2012 season. In reviewing the x-rays doctors noticed what seemed to be a potential small fracture in the foot and ordered more tests. I’m told Seferian-Jenkins was getting ready to take the field for his workout when he was pulled from the line and told additional tests were needed. The big tight end was as surprised as anyone as he’d never experienced pain in his left foot to that point. Seferian-Jenkins combine weight of 262-pounds is a number significantly lower than his playing weight of 2013. I’m told Seferian-Jenkins had been timing in the 4.6’s during recent training.

– Blake Bortles looked good today throwing the ball, but is he really #1 pick material? Johnny Manziel won’t suit every team — and might not fit the club picking first overall. But he’s the only quarterback in this draft I’d really want to build around.

I sympathise with those saying they’re not sure Bortles or Bridgewater are top-ten locks. I know the QB position is important, but there’s a ton of value at offensive tackle (Robinson, Lewan, Matthews), defensive end (Clowney) and receiver (Watkins, Evans). If I’m Houston or Cleveland, I consider taking Manziel. If I’m Jacksonville or Oakland, I’m not sure I force a quarterback pick. Keep building. Draft smart.

– This could be the end for Big Red…

“We all we got, we all we need”

This would save $5.5m, to go with the $7.3m saved when they officially release Sidney Rice. There could be more painful cuts to come. Keeping Michael Bennett is a priority, and so it should be. Re-signing Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman is a priority. There’s a handful of other free agents you’d ideally keep. Any why not at least have the option to look at the open market?

– And what a strange story this is…

Tomorrow we’ll be live blogging all throughout the drills, starting at 6AM PST.

See you then.

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63 Responses to “Combine Sunday review: thoughts on the receivers”

  1. CC says:

    Great work as always Rob!

    Ah, the WRs… every year, more than any other group, I am reminded of the scene from the Indiana Jones movie where they are trying to figure out which one is the holy grail – and the knight says “choose wisely.” Of course we know what happens to the bad guy – the knight says “He chose poorly.”

    So here we are with the WR class of not quite the top level – Benjamin, Coleman, Robinson, Moncrief, Bryant? Can they be really good NFL WRs? Maybe or they could be AJ Jenkins; Reggie Williams; JR Soward, or Peter Warrick (I realize some of you are not old enough to remember some of these guys).

    I wonder if the FO think that the Chris Matthews signing is a better option than overreaching for a WR. Maybe they wait a few rounds and pick up a guy who they know needs work and redshirt.

    At this point, I’m leaning toward an OL since there seems to be a good crop of them in this draft. We haven’t done well drafting high OL really, but maybe this is the year. Either that or DT/DE – but I’ll wait to see what these guys do tomorrow.

    • cade says:

      Im not convinced that Matthews is anything more than competition. A guy who could be great or could be nothing.

      He seems big but not terribly fast or agile. In Canada receivers get a running start. Really helps the big guys get up a head of steam at the snap.

      I would be really surprised if the Seahawks alter their draft strategy at all because of this guy. Of course they will give him every chance to succeed and I damn well hope he turns out to be special.

  2. David Mast says:

    That last story on Muema is starnge.. He is not a bad RB though. Look at his tape for the famous Idaho Potato bowl and he had a great game. If we trade Turbo maybe he will come to Seattle haha

  3. Chris says:

    Rob,

    I noticed Jeff Janis tested pretty well minus the smaller hands. I’m interested in your thoughts on him. BTW, great commentary as always.

    • Rob Staton says:

      His forty run was one of those moments where you sit up in your chair. Explosive run for such a big guy. In the drills, he looked like a body catcher. Didn’t look fluid. For me he’s an attractive flier type — late round or UDFA. See if you can turn him into something. The athletic potential is there, but he could just be another Konz.

      • Morgan says:

        I could see him as Rocket competition. There is a 45-minute tape out there of every one of his targets from last year, and there is a lot of good stuff on it when you can see through the murk.

        I could also see us drafting a small guy too, though, if there is someone intriguing later or to catch a faller, as Doug Baldwin insurance for next year.

      • KyleT says:

        He had the fastest 10 yard split of anyone on the 40…1.47, that was Percy Harvin’s 10 yard split time

  4. Rob Staton says:

    Just added a note on the breaking report that Red Bryant appears set to be cut.

    Sad news, but not a total shock.

  5. kevin mullen says:

    I think Red could come back, if he’s willing take significantly less. I really can’t see Red in any other role than what he has (had) in Seattle, he wasn’t very productive playing inside in prior schemes, he was more effective in that DE role in our 4-3 Under base.

    Was very interested in the Coleman/Benjamin drills, though a couple of kids stood out: Richardson from Colorado and Cooks from OSU. Watkins put on a show on the gauntlet drills, solidifying his hold on #1 receiver to go first.

    By the way, found this via fieldgulls: http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/

    Fun way to mock out our ‘Hawks draft, I selected Coleman, Demarcus Lawrence, and Brent Urban in our first 3 picks.

  6. Nate says:

    Rob you don’t think the Jags should jump all over Bridgwater? I sure the heck would if I was a team with major QB needs.

    • Rob Staton says:

      Just my take, but if I’m Jacksonville I’m doing all the homework I need to do on Manziel. If I don’t feel like I can trust him to lead the franchise, then I’m not taking a quarterback at #3. This is a major building job for the Jags and they just need talent right now. They have the luxury of having an owner/GM who knows it’s a process. So they don’t need to force anything. There are several players I would take ahead of Bridgewater in that spot.

      • Attyla the Hawk says:

        Agreed. They should look to trade down multiple times and get picks. They have a franchise LT, so truthfully, they can go all the way down into the 20s or more.

        This is a great deep draft. They need to roll over probably a dozen starting positions. This draft could get about 8 of them locked up if they trade down a bunch.

    • Emperor_MA says:

      I am not Rob, but I think there is a very real chance Bridgewater slides a bit on draft day.

      I’ve heard the Jags were very impressed with Derek Carr during Senior Bowl week, and it wouldn’t surprise me in the least if they grabbed him at the top of round two.

      I agree that the Jags have a ton of holes to fill. I just don’t see them going QB at #3 unless they are sold on Johnny Football. There will be many impact players available when they go on the clock …. better to select a more “can’t miss” prospect at a different position at that juncture rather than reach for a QB from a class that has no “can’t miss” prospect.

  7. KyleT says:

    I just think the only reason to get Coleman is to have another home run hitter. We were great at big plays last year. Where we struggled was 3rd down and red zone. I’m not sure how he helps with that. From what I have seen on tape and confirmed by the drill timings, Allen Robinson is the guy I want for those situations assuming Evans is off the board, if he’s available in the 2nd. I definitely take him over Coleman if that’s what I’m looking for. Did you realize we only have Harvin tied up beyond 2014? We may draft a guy like Coleman just to marinate for later. He adds next to nothing for 2014.

    • Rob Staton says:

      It’s a bit of a sweeping statement to say he’d add next to nothing in 2014. He might be a Christine Michael redshirt. He might be a red zone demon and get 7-8 touchdowns for all we know.

      He’d help in the red zone because 6-6 receivers are very difficult to contend with. We barely used a single fade last year. That comes back into play with a guy like Coleman, who was a big red zone threat in 2012 when Rutgers were partly competent on offense instead of the shambles that was 2013.

      I’m not sure what you’ve seen Kyle to suggest Robinson would be a better fit as a red line/red zone threat. He’s a player whose greatest quality is shifty running in the open field and shorter routes. Coleman has the frame and potential to be a dominating threat on short range throws, be a major force in the red zone and contest jump balls downfield (key part of Seattle’s passing game). The fact he’s also capable of big plays is just a bonus.

      • KyleT says:

        I’ve seen tape of Robinson catching balls in traffic with defenders draped on him the way Boldin does. I see Coleman not even coming back to fight for 50/50 balls, basically just catching balls with his body if he gets hit in stride. I see Coleman as a big upside play, because there isn’t much in his game right now that takes advantage of his 6’6 stature. I would prefer Doug Baldwin over Coleman to be honest and for the exact same purpose I think ADB does better even on the outside or in the red zone despite being 8 inches shorter.

        Point me to any tape of Coleman winning contested balls in traffic and I will change my opinion. The way he runs and isn’t flexible enough or fast enough to get separation he better be physical and have aggressiveness enough to come down with those balls.

        • Rock says:

          I agree. Coleman’s size looks good on paper but he lacks the agility to adjust to the ball in the air. He also rounds off his cuts. It shows up in the Combine tape drills. He has turned his eyes and torso in the direction of his break two steps before the cone, then he rounds it off without any fake. NFL DB’s will see this on the tape and undercut his route every time for a pick six. He also body catches and drops far too many easy ones. The ball clangs off his chest or hands. Pete Carroll will not put up with the turnovers this will create. The height is negated because he does not high point the ball or have much catch radius. The throw has to be perfect. Colelman has not improved in college.

          A far better option is Jordan Matthews. Matthews is faster (4.4) , has better body control, catches everything and has 10 5/8″ hands. He is also a student of the game like Russell Wilson. He wants it and puts in the time in the video room to get better.

          • KyleT says:

            I do think Matthews made an incredible case for him in the first round with his combine. I would love it if we took Matthews in the first

    • Attyla the Hawk says:

      I would expect Harvin/Tate/Baldwin and Willson to be the chain mover candidates on a situational/route basis.

      Robinson, with his pedestrian speed, is not going to threaten vertically. That reduces the area that a defense has to defend. That reduces Harvin’s opportunities to operate in space underneath.

      Coleman maintains a big play threat while opening opportunities to move the chains for our slot receivers (Harvin/Baldwin). We don’t have that take the top off the defense threat. Even despite his production, Rice provided that. He was very effective in the 15+ yard range downfield. That threat manifests itself in many other forms not directly related to the production of the X receiver.

      • KyleT says:

        You do realize that all of our current roster WR’s run 4.4 40′s right? That we were great at big passing plays? Sounds like we need the underneath guy that can win a contested ball…

      • Mattk says:

        Allen Robinson: 4.6 = pedestrian speed
        Brandon Coleman: 4.56 = big play deep threat

        Does .004 really make that big of a difference?

        • Mattk says:

          Oops, meant .04. Too many numbers in my head lol

        • Kyle N says:

          Part of that is just overall size. Coleman is 6’6 and carries a lot of weight. He’s a deep threat not just because he’s fast (he’s not really that fast), but because he’s just a huge target. I personally think he plays much smaller than his size (tape shows him trying as hard as possible to never hands catch and high point a ball but instead chest catch it), but you can’t teach size. If the Seahawks can teach him up, he’s definitely got a much higher ceiling than Robinson.

          • KyleT says:

            I agree that this is a fair characterization of what each brings to the table.

          • Mattk says:

            I agree. He’s got a higher ceiling then AR, but I wish he showed a bit better in the other drills. His 3-cone & 20 yard shuttle was disappointing for a player who struggles using his best attribute; his size.

    • David Mast says:

      You do realize our passing game really took a shot when Rice went out, it goes to show what a big WR can do, even if he isn’t catching the ball. A guy like Sidney usually requires a guy over the top, look at our offense in the end of the 12 season, that is what we should look like ALL next season if they choose the right WR

      • cade says:

        End of last season was because of the read option.

        I don’t disagree that we will be quite explosive next season. I think it will have more to do with Harvin, another year of development by RW and the rest of the group.

        Also expecting CMike to be a big part of the offense and he provides a quite explosive element.
        If we get a great WR in the draft it will be great but if we don’t we will still be very strong offensively next year as long as the OL holdsup/improves

    • Kenny Sloth says:

      Did you watch 2012 tape? He ripped the ball away from defenders several times and displayed great awareness and body control.

  8. Stuart says:

    A team like Jacksonville should take the very best talent available. With the 3rd pick in the entire draft you just cant force it on a QB whose upside is average. A mistake like that would set a franchise back a long ways.

    Ultimately the GM will be tied to the success of the failed/successful QB and all the other players they passed on will always be mentioned, and should be.

    Loved that Indiana Jones line! He chose poorly.

    Remember the semi-hype on WR Stephen Williams last off season? Is Chris Matthews a guy to get excited about? Help me out, I have no idea.

  9. Ben2 says:

    Yeah, I’ve kind of thought that about Coleman or Benjamin- worst case scenario they never get last the Joe Juerevicius role…but that’s not the worst thing in the world. I like Russel’s drop ball he throws. It look good throwing a corner fade to a guy with that size. But maybe they develop into more….

  10. Ray says:

    The depth of the receiver position makes me think that the hawks will address that need in the 2nd-4th round area. I can see them going dt or Leo in round one cause as coach Carroll loves to say ” you can never have enough pass rushers”. One guy I’m really interested in is Trent Murphy of Stanford. Tall, lean and country strong, with outstanding production for a big time school. This guy has Leo written all over him yet you hardly hear his name. Am I missing something ?

    • Kenny Sloth says:

      He’s not a Leo at all. Doesn’t have the get-off or bend. Really just not a Leo in any way.

      Chris Smith of Arkansas is a Leo. I like him way more than Demarcus Lawrence. I like Lawrence as a Leo in the late second. Marcus Smith of Louisville, too. Chris Smith could be an option at 32.

      Both of the Smiths are far more explosive than Lawrence, from what I’ve seen. Chris Smith is outstanding.

  11. red says:

    Loucheiz Purifoy, CB from Florida 6’0 190 arms 32 7/8 very seahawkish maybe there at 64.

    • Kyle N says:

      Just doesn’t make sense to me. I don’t think the Seahawks take a corner before 5th round unless it’s just an absolutely high ranked guy that has a huge slip.

  12. House says:

    The release of Bryant could solidify drafting DL early. Avril will be a FA next season and grabbing a LEO would make sense. With guys like Mayowa, Scruggs, Williams and Hill, the depth is there. Finding an impact DL could be the brdt bet for us at #32.

    I think we can get our hands on a good WR in the 2nd or later that will pay dividends in the long run. Coleman could still be our guy…

    • dtrain says:

      I think you are on to it with regard to drafting a LEO. They seem to be drafting in advance of some big contract turnover. The big money coming off the books this year (Clem, Red, Sid) were seemingly planned

      • dtrain says:

        planned for. Next year its Lynch, Miller, and an LB that must be planned for. Lots of good 2nd round LEO types that fit right now.

      • cade says:

        Astute observation.

        Like the CMike move, they are likely making their roster moves one year in advance. As fans we look at this years needs when its draft time. Quite possibly JS/PC are looking two years from now.

        • Kyle N says:

          Excellent point. I think it’s so easy to look at what needs the team has right now, but this front office is just so ahead of the game they are drafting for current and future needs. They forecast future needs (based on expiring/overpriced contracts and talent decline) and jump on a guy if it fits their needs. Perfect mix of being able to take the best player available and shoring up a need (even if it’s not a RIGHT NOW) need.

          • David Mast says:

            The great thing about this is that there all pretty much red shirts, look at hill, mayoya, Michael, etc… They all got a years worth of pro training with the best players around them making them even better next year when they play, they should be even better. PC/JS are a very smart/dangerous couple when working together

  13. me says:

    I hate the idea of drafting a middling receiver just because he’s 6’5. 2 inches in gum shorts doesn’t win you 50/50 balls – fantastic body awareness, strong hands, and solid high point technique do. Coleman is a bust waiting to happen; he’s just not any good, and that’s been against terrible competition.

    I just can’t see us going WR first round, unless Benjamin slides. Honestly it scares me a lot more not having any elite speed if (sorry, make that when) Harvin misses half the season a lot more than not having a glorified TE to line up outside.

    • cade says:

      Hate to see what would happen if a guy wears gum shorts around PC. That PC is an animal when it comes to his chewing gum

      I want to know what brand he was chewing when he decided to take kickoffs and got smacked by Coleman (earning him a scar on his cheek)

    • Kenny Sloth says:

      The late first is a game of potential. Well, the whole draft really. What CAN the player be. Especially with coaching disparity between college and the nfl.

  14. Kory says:

    Great work.

    One note… I don’t know why your not projecting Mathews as a Keenan Allen 2.0. I think Mathews game compares to Allens, better then Robinsons. Keenan Allen is more athletic than Mathews, but I think Mathews will translate to the NFL every bit as well as Allen has.

    IMHO seattle doesn’t need a 6’4-6-5 monster. All the tall guys besides Evans need lots of work. Even Benjamin is underwhelming. Our offense is built on receivers who capitalize on their opportunities. We don’t want to be developing talent at WR next year. We want a guy who can step in and run a good route and catch whats thrown to him. Harvin and Wilson make everyone around them better. We don’t need some monster WR to carry the team down field by himself. We definitely don’t need a work in progress dropping every third pass thrown to him. We’re trying to get back to the dance. We’re thin at wide receiver. Mathews looks like he could step in and give us something like Sidney Rice gave us. A sure handed, dependable, tall WR that can play the outside. Mathews also comes across as a whole lot tougher and hopefully healthier then Rice.

    If a guy can’t catch, he can’t play WR at the pro level. It don’t matter how tall or fast he is. Martavis Bryant looks like fools gold to me. The Rutgers kid is way to raw as well.

    I know we want to be good for a long time but next year is such a great opportunity to make another deep run… we don’t want to start plugging our team needs with a bunch of guys that need a year or two to “find themselves”.

    • cade says:

      I agree to a point.

      Few things to consider.
      It is rumored that this coaching staff views a group like a basketball team. They are missing a big target post up type guy.

      That said..

      I think they care about a few other things more.

      Competitive fire, passion, grit!
      Ability to make the most of opportunities

      I also think we haven’t put enough focus on RedLine skills in our WR analysis. I don’t give a crap about how big or tall a guy is if doesn’t fight for the ball, go up and make the catch at its highest point. If a guys highlight tape is of him wide open catching the ball in his breadbasket for long touchdowns over and over it really bores me. Yeah its great he could get open vs college guys but we need more skills than that at the Pro level.

      The guy also needs to have a little moxy. When he plays he should get “locked in”. Competitive fire lit and blazing.

      • KyleT says:

        Right, they don’t prefer big post up guy for the sake of what he looks like in a team photo. They want him to play big and bring the missing element to their game in the red zone and on third-down. How many third and 6 slant routes did we watch thrown to Tate or Baldwin in traffic that they could not come down with? Or third and goal from the five?

        I would love an analysis of this receiver class based on answering that question not based on their size and speed combination, and this idea that we are looking for a prototypical number one receiver. A number one receiver is a guy that makes 10+ million… we already found him he’s locked up for the next five years.

        • Kory says:

          A 6’5 guy can play like a 6’1 guy and visa verse. jumping ability, high pointing the ball, timing, body control, the willingness to fight for a contested ball.

          All those things can be lacking in a 6’5 guy and present in a a smaller receiver. I think Mathews is the best of both worlds. He’s a tall guy that is very well rounded. No need to look any further IMHO.

          I think it’s human nature to look at the “freakish” players and say “what if”. What if a speed demon could learn to catch. What if a 6’6 guy could learn to maximize his height. The fact is they have been playing football for years, if they aint doing those things coming out of college, don’t expect to be the guy who can change their bad habits. I mean, if you’re at the bottom that’s one thing. You might be projecting winning the division in 2 or 3 years so you have that time to develop a player… I don’t think we really want to be doing that in our current situation.

  15. LantermanC says:

    I’ve been thinking about it a lot, and as much as I would like one of these 6’5″ giants at wideout, we already have 3 or 4 good WRs on a team that professes to want to run more than most do. I know you don’t draft for need, but I think at least 3 of the 4 wrs will be around for a few years. A better use of a 1st round pick would be picking D-line or O-line or Leo. Since I agree with Rob that we can probably get O-line later on in the draft because that’s what Cable does (and last time they drafted high, they got Carp and Moffit), my money/hope is on D-line (Hagemen, Donald) or Leo (BSU guy or Ford).

    • Kyle N says:

      I think DL is going to be hugely addressed in the draft. We spend more money on DE than any other team in the league and it’s not even close. Want to know why we (can) do that? Because of massive budget deals from Wilson, Thomas, and Sherman. Those guys are up in the next few years, thus we cannot pay like crazy on the DL again. Only way you can fix that without a big dropoff in talent is to hope you get a good young guy in the draft on a cheap rookie deal. The time to do that is right now. Clemons will be gone (or coming back at a reduced deal), Bennett might be gone, but if we sign him then you can definitely say goodbye to Avril after 2015. Hill is pretty unknown (as with other guys like Boatwright, Scruggs) and who knows if Irvin will move back to Leo. I think DL needs to be massively addressed.

      This doesn’t mean that we don’t need a WR though. We actually spend a ton of money at the position as well (or at least will starting March 11th). When it’s all said and done we will not keep Harvin/Tate/Baldwin/Kearse all at the position a year from now. It’ll cost us too much. We need to draft young talent (or UDFA), so that we can keep the expensive guys and hopefully have some younger talents on cheaper contracts who can contribute a year down the line. Obviously a tall guy would make most sense because it fits a need the most, but I think if we sign Tate, that means Baldwin will be gone in 2015 and having a replacement for him would make some sense (maybe not this year, but next).

      So I think it’s highly probably we see DL and WR focus this draft. I also expect to see some OL depth added, especially if some good talents fall. Then maybe some LB (lots of our current guys contracts will be up soon), CB (Thurmond replacement, or future Maxwell replacement). Any other position would just be grabbing a guy for the future to groom, mostly because he was just such a good talent they felt like they couldn’t pass him up.

    • Kenny Sloth says:

      Moffit and Carpenter were both picks taken on Cables recommendation.

  16. Kenny Sloth says:

    I’m hoping at this point that we double dip at DL in the first two rounds. There is some great talent there. I want Chris Smith with our first and Calvin Barnett with our second. I’m not sure how either is rated, but that’s where I rank them.

    On Barnett; ROB have you watched him yet? Such a get-off. Could be coached into something great. Really really high on this guy’s potential. Played through a concussion, I guess. Either means he’s tough or dumb. Gotta get an eyeful of this fella.

  17. Jake says:

    Kevin Norwood in the 4th… No reason to go early in this draft – it’s so deep. He was McCarron’s security blanket on 3rd down and scramble drills in the run-heavy Alabama offense, good blocker, great on the sideline grabs, good size (6’2, 10-in hands), solid jump numbers, great speed (4.39), good route runner.

  18. Matt says:

    Regarding Nix’s weight – he was always playing at 350 or so, just listed at 330. not like he ballooned up to 350 after the season and then dropped it. Brian Kelly said that he showed up as a freshman a few cheeseburgers away from 400.

  19. Emperor_MA says:

    Not a fan of Coleman at all. He just doesn’t show #3 receiver skills, let alone #1. I am not swayed by numbers on a chart …. I want to see a football player with grit and fire and a will to beat the other guy at all cost. I don’t see any of that out of Coleman.

    I think DL is the way to go in the first round if the draft comes to us favorably for it. I could see DT, DE or LEO being in play.

    I like WR in round two. I don’t really care who or what they get as long as it isn’t some raw guy selected just because he is tall. Thankfully, we avoided such thinking with Russell Wilson and took him based on his body of work and demonstrated success/production in college rather than on the measurables. May we never forget the “Golden 4.71/40 yard dash Rule.”

    I don’t care if we re-sign Tate. I’d just as soon draft his replacement (in round two!)and leave some of the cash for Mike Bennett this year and Angry Doug next year.

    • Rock says:

      Coleman had a big game against Fresno State with 9 catches for 94 yards. Unfortunately, during the game he had more than 9 dropped targets, as well. The last one was in the red zone where he dropped the game winning pass at the goal line on the last play of the game. This is the very play everyone thinks he can make for the Hawks. After the Fresno game he had only two more games where he had more than two receptions. His coaches used him mostly on the red line. If he missed it, they wanted the ball to go out of bounds where it would do no harm.