Why did Pete and John look so fed up?
Social media has been blowing up with people trying to work out why Pete Carroll and John Schneider looked so dejected during their first round press conference.
Too often people overreact to these things but here’s my theory.
I don’t think it’s anything to do with missing out on anyone. I don’t think they were targeting Jerry Tillery in round one. Montez Sweat possibly wasn’t even on their board given the concerns about his enlarged heart.
If they even were dejected, here’s my best guess as to why — it’s all about draft strategy.
I think they were quite keen to move down and accumulate day two picks. That’s the strength of the draft this year. They only managed to trade down into the top of round two and didn’t add any new stock.
They used up all 20 minutes of their allotted time at #29 and #30. They made one deal — with the Giants — to drop from #30 to #37. I suspect they were negotiating hard to deal #29 too. Otherwise why not just make the pick after the initial ten minutes?
They selected L.J. Collier.
Almost immediately after picks #29 and #30 were announced, what happened? The Falcons traded up from #45 and made a deal with the Rams for #31. The compensation? A third round pick (#79).
Los Angeles, within the division, dropped down 14 spots and got a precious third round pick in this class. The Seahawks traded down from #21 to #37 and collected fourth round picks.
That had to be frustrating and possibly could be a reason why they looked relatively frustrated afterwards. If the aim was to turn #21 and #29 into multiple day two picks, they only have two.
So it might not be about the players they missed out on in round one. Instead, it might be about the players they know they’re going to miss out on today because they don’t have the stock.
Another possibility is they were torn on whether to take N’Keal Harry at #30 or trade down and then the Patriots took him at #32. I’m not convinced by this. If they loved him so much, they would’ve drafted him. They didn’t exactly get a haul from the Giants to move down to #37. There was plenty of buzz about Arizona wanting Harry at #33. They knew what they were doing.
And that’s what you’ve got to remember here. They chose to trade down. They do it every year. Do you honestly think if there was a player they ‘had to have’ they’d be moving back for round four picks then sulking in the press conference?
No — I think there was some mild dejection that their aims for trading down didn’t pay off. They have fourth round picks and wanted third round picks.
Will they trade up in round three?
In 2015 they gave up fourth, fifth and sixth round picks to move up from #95 to #69 to select Tyler Lockett.
Could the same happen again this year? Very possible.
It all depends on who’s available of course. Yet with 12 picks in 2020 and now nine in total this year, they have the ammunition to be aggressive if a ‘must have’ player rests at the top of round three.
A statement on the rest of this draft for Seattle
They’ve got their Michael Bennett. Now it’s time to find Cliff Avril.
Avril famously ran a 1.50 10-yard split. Of the remaining players in the draft, Ben Banogu (1.56), Chase Winovich (1.57) and Jamal Davis (1.58) ran 1.5 splits. D’Andre Walker and Christian Miller didn’t run. Maxx Crosby ran a 1.60.
Here are the pressure percentages for some of the remaining players:
Anthony Nelson — 23.5%
Oshane Ximines — 23.5%
Jaylon Ferguson — 23.4%
Joe Jackson — 21.7%
Chase Winovich — 21.7%
Jachai Polite — 18.4%
Sutton Smith — 17.6%
Zach Allen — 17.1%
Justin Hollins — 16.8%
Ben Banogu — 15.5%
Jalen Jelks — 12.3%
Greg Gaines — 12.2%
Dre’Mont Jones — 11.4%
Reviewing the tier list
I was very happy with the structure of the three tier target list posted before round one. I wanted to streamline the groups and zone in on specific prospects.
Let’s review what happened…
Tier one
Possible targets at #21 if they remain:
Rashan Gary (DE, Michigan) — drafted by Green Bay at #12
Brian Burns (EDGE, Florida State) — drafted by Carolina at #16
Montez Sweat (EDGE, Mississippi State) — drafted by Washington at #26
Gary and Burns didn’t last into range and while Sweat did — clearly teams were spooked by the medical concerns regarding his enlarged heart. It’s possible he wasn’t even on Seattle’s board as a consequence.
Tier two
Possible targets at #29:
N’Keal Harry (WR, Arizona State) — drafted by New England at #32
Terry McLaurin (WR, Ohio State)
Parris Campbell (WR, Ohio State)
Darnell Savage (S, Maryland) — drafted by Green Bay at #21
Jaylon Ferguson (DE, Louisiana Tech)
L.J. Collier (DE, TCU) — drafted by Seattle at #29
Byron Murphy (CB, Washington) — reportedly set to be taken by Arizona at #33
The Seahawks drafted one of the players we considered at the end of round one (L.J. Collier) while Savage and Harry also left the board between Seattle’s pick at #21 and the end of day one. The two remaining receivers are strong options at #37. Jaylon Ferguson might be too similar to Collier to consider but we’ll see. His pressure percentage (23.4%) was fantastic and he was a sack machine at Louisiana Tech.
Players remaining from tier three
Possible targets if they trade down into round two:
Ben Banogu (EDGE, TCU)
Trysten Hill (DT, UCF)
Jerry Tillery (DT, Notre Dame) — drafted by LA Chargers at #28
Chase Winovich (EDGE, Michigan)
Juan Thornhill (S, Virginia)
Chauncey Gardner-Johnson (S, Florida)
Lonnie Johnson (CB, Kentucky)
Sean Bunting (CB, Central Michigan)
Justin Layne (CB, Michigan State)
Isaiah Johnson (CB, Houston)
Dawson Knox (TE, Ole Miss)
Oshane Ximines (EDGE, Old Dominion)
I didn’t think the Seahawks would consider Jerry Tillery in round one. Second round? Possibly. I don’t buy into the theories that Seattle wanted Tillery at #29. The rest of the names here could have some appeal. The cornerbacks won’t last to round three so how badly do the Seahawks want to add competition to the secondary? Will they look for a dynamic nickel hybrid? Do they want to compliment L.J. Collier with some speed? Chase Winovich and Ben Banogu would provide that. Plus Trysten Hill can be a game-wrecker at defensive tackle.
Other names to consider
Cody Ford (T, Oklahoma)
It was bizarre to see Ford dropping out of round one. Is there an injury concern? He has the size and attitude to fit at left guard for Seattle. I’m not sure they want to replace Mike Iupati with a high pick but Ford has value.
D.K. Metcalf (WR, Ole Miss)
I deliberately left Metcalf about of my initial tier list. I think he’s a one-trick pony (go routes) and his neck injury has to be a concern. However, at some point someone is going to take a shot on 4.33 speed at 6-3 and 228lbs and I can’t rule out Seattle.
D’Andre Walker (EDGE, Georgia)
It’s a tantalising prospect to pair one BAMF at defensive end in Collier with another. Walker’s tough and physical and mixes things up. Let’s see how long he lasts on day two. He took a VMAC visit to Seattle.
Erik McCoy (C, Texas A&M)
This is about pure value rather than need. McCoy is the only center who had a good game against Quinnen Williams in 2018. He also performed well against Clemson’s top-20 front. I have no idea whether the Seahawks would make a left-field pick like this but for me, McCoy is destined for a long career in the NFL.
Possible round three targets
Drew Sample (TE, Washington)
Jace Sternberger (TE, Texas A&M)
Kahale Warring (TE, San Diego State)
Josh Oliver (TE, San Diego State)
Mecole Hardman (WR, Georgia)
Emmanuel Hall (WR, Missouri)
Christian Miller (EDGE, Alabama)
Amani Hooker (S, Iowa)
Yodny Cajuste (T, West Virginia)
Dru Samia (G, Oklahoma)
Marvell Tell (S, USC)
Lamont Gaillard (OL, Georgia)
Final thoughts ahead of day two
The strongest looking positions at the top of round two appear to be receiver, cornerback and offensive line.
It’s going to be very tempting to continue drafting for defense. Trysten Hill would be the kind of interior rusher to compliment L.J. Collier working the edge. They might want to double down on EDGE rushers by taking Jaylon Ferguson or Chase Winovich (although they might be prepared to wait on this position with some athletic prospects set to last beyond round two). It seems very likely that at some point they’ll add a quicker, faster EDGE.
They might not take cornerbacks early but there are some fine options here — highlighted by Lonnie Johnson, Justin Layne, Isaiah Johnson and Sean Bunting. They could also seek to add a hybrid like Chauncey Gardner-Johnson or Juan Thornhill. The wildcard could be Dawson Knox the tight end.
Don’t rule out a situation where the Seahawks move down from #37 and then up from #92 today.
Draft board
#29 (R1) L.J. Collier (DE, TCU)
#37 (R2)
#92 (R3)
#114 (R4)
#118 (R4)
#124 (R4)
#132 (R4)
#142 (R5)
#159 (R5)
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We have absolutely, 100% same opinion on why they looked how.theyblooked on presser.
They weren’t sulking. People are dejected because we didn’t pick a big name player, or we didn’t pick “their” player so they are “transfering” their feelings on to Pete and John.
To me, Pete and John looked tired, as if they have been working long hours, and now the day is over.
And I think you have it correct about their feelings on the Falcons/Rams trade Rob. Did Dan Quinn do this out of spite? He had to have. You don’t just make a lucrative trade with your former boss’s main division rival unless you’re doing it on purpose.
Why trade down for a higher pick in Round 1 when you could get a BETTER pick for the same compensation?
I wonder whether the Falcons were in/out/in/out on a trade… then time expired… then they immediately decide they do want to do the deal with the Rams.
That’d be enough to piss you off if you’re Pete and John and wanted that trade. Especially because the Rams are involved.
That could be it too Rob. Maybe it wasn’t intentional.
But the more I think about it, more I’m SURE, that if there was any “dejection,” it was because of the Atlanta/LA trade
I went back and looked at past first round drafts, and the players that I would have selected in place of the ones that they did select, Lo and Behold! JS and PC did a much better job than I would have.
So this year I was smarter than in years past, and I was ready for them to pick a “relative unknown.” And I didn’t over react like I usually do. And, after researching Collier, I really really like him! If Baldy likes him, that’s enough for me. Well, that and if he gets teh Seahawksdraftblog Seal of Approval.
That wouldn’t surprise me. The fact that Schneider mentioned during the presser something along the lines of taking time “in case this deal or that deal fell through”.
I’m inclined to think that they were going to take Collier anyway and then do the Falcons trade. The Giants one was a fallback option that they had to go to last minute when ATL pulled out.
I was thinking teams could have been driving a harder bargain with the Seahawks because of Seattle’s lack of picks and need to trade back. With four 4th’s, 2 5th’s and 12 2020 picks the Seahawks have the flexibility to do move up and down the draft board without restrictions. Can’t wait!
I would prefer a move down from 37 to mid 40s adding a 5th, then using a 4th and 5th from this year along with a 5th next year to move up…
Could end up with a combo of two of the 2nd tier guys while paying the minimal cost
Correction: tier 3
Excited for today! Here’s hoping we get Zach Allen and Jalen Hurd (WR that was a former RB).
I think they will move down to the 47 range. There are a lot of good player’s left on the board @ position’s of need for team’s picking behind us @37. IMO. GO HAWKS!!! LET’s GO!!! 🙂
The more I watch and listen to Collier the more I love the pick.
I would be pumped if the could add Walker and Hill to that DL today.
The DL could develop into a strength of the team with Reed, Ford and Hill at DT / Martin, Green, Collier and Walker at DE.
Would be a young, diverse and aggressive group.
Rob I agree…
Those pesky rams…
I would be shocked if the Hawks don’t make 4 picks today. The strength of this draft is in Rds 2-3 and I fully expect JS to take advantage of that.
Great coverage yesterday Rob. Love getting the instant commentary on the picks it was awesome.
For the DLine it is. +1/2
The rest of the positions, there is lots of depth all the way into round 5!
I thought Banogu ran a 1.47 10 yard split?
Wow! You’re correct!
Daniel Jeremiah
Verified account @MoveTheSticks
Top 3 10 yard splits for DL
1) Ben Banogu 1.47
2) Montez Sweat 1.50
t 3) Nick Bosa 1.55
t 3) Chase Winovich 1.55
I have no idea where Jeremiah is getting that info from.
These are the ‘official’ top 10-yard split times from the combine:
1.48 — DK Metcalf
1.51 — Sean Bunting, Greedy Williams, Zedrick Woods
1.52 — Parris Campbell, Darius West
1.53 — Andy Isabella, Devin Bush, Jamel Dean, Derrek Thomas
1.54 — Brian Burns, Montez Sweat, Miles Boykin, Emmanuel Hall, Mecole Hardman
I’d be absolutely stunned if Banogu ran a 1.47 and that seems like a load of rubbish to be honest.
Banogu could be cool to team up with Collier again, but not in the second. Please, John, not in the second!
You know what that means, right? 🙂
Even IF it were true, great speed doesn’t mean great NFL performance. Remember how many last year wanted OBI M? Look how that turned out . . .
JS also mentioned in the video that the board was falling “as expected” and that “names were coming off the board in order” and that it was a bad thing for them. Lack of perceived value at other positions did not allow for a run on other positions to happen and didn’t allow Seattle to be advantageous for a team scrambling to move up. I think they still take a slight move back and use the 4ths to move around.
Rob, i saw your answer on my question from.previous article. I agree that falcons picks are.much better. What do.you think, what happened why they didnt make that deal (because I also.think they wanted that trade much more than Giant’s).
Probably just the Falcons being indecisive.
Still hoping for Cody Ford with our pick. Or Jawaan Taylor. If his knees hold up, would be a low cost replacement for Ifedi next year, Brown in a couple of years.
Cody Ford is overrated and we don’t need him. Please no.
Taylor was always overrated.
Rather have Ford, doubt he makes it to 37. If he does you can bet team’s are gona come knocking…
You do realise they could keep Ifedi? Or Fant? Or start Jamarco Jones?
Why are they drafting someone at #37 who won’t play?
At least Ford could play guard.
I honestly feel like they’ll go DB.
I can just see Pete being “fired up” about CGJ.
The “out of left field” pick would be Ford. I look at the current roster and try to determine where someone they could pick could be better than what we currently have. Ford could be that guy and some of those DB’s as well. However, it’s pretty clear we need a DT. My guess for round 2 is Hill after another trade down. Then try to package our 3rd and a 4th/5th to move up in the third for Walker. Get your DB’s in the 4th along with a TE.
I think the Cardinals will take Ford…
Two things stood out to me from the PC/JS presser yesterday. Usually they’re careful about not mentioning player comps. Yet, Pete immediately brought up the Bennett comp for Collier without prompting.
The other thing was JS talking about Banogu, calling he and Collier a “really cool” tandem I believe. I can’t ever remember him bringing up a player that’s still on the board. Smokescreen?
Pete was responding to a comparison on NFLN between Bennett and Collier.
Interesting that John would say that about Banogu, I would think that he would be on the board. He has the same name as Schneider’s son 🙂
True, he was responding to the NFLN comp, but nobody asked him about it. He brought it up himself, which is the part that I find interesting.
I’d be ok with Banogu later on, but I would be a little leery of him in the 2nd which has been the recent speculation of where they’d take him.
Other interesting thing I just remembered is Pete bringing up Jacob Martin’s pressure % of about 15%. I wonder if that was in regards to his NFL season or his last year in college… Is 15% the threshold they look for?
Him mentioning Banogu jumped out at me too.
As I. Hopefully he was just trying to praise someone else on the TCU line to make it seem like a better pick.
BTW, I can’t believe I didn’t watch more than a few highlights of Collier during this process. I should have known better.
Gotta respectfully disagree with you here. The simplest explanation for their “look” is that they were disappointed how Round 1 played out. The simplest explanation is usually the correct one. There was no enthusiasm for Collier, like I’ve seen with other picks in the past.
I know this place is becoming an echo chamber of “PC/JS are infallible,” but I continue to be underwhelmed with their top picks. They seem to get way too cute with it. Here’s to hoping they can re-discover the mid-late round magic because this team desperately needs high end talent, not just average starters.
I really like Collier, but not at this price. I think he will be a solid 6 sack guy that is nothing more than an average 5T (in a 4-3 no less). That’s a nice pick at the end of R2/R3 – I’d argue that’s a terrible pick in R1. Again, I like his style of play, but I think the Bull Rush will not be nearly as effective at the next level.
Regarding #37 – Really torn what to do here…the unfortunate reality is that we have a massive hole at WR and NCB/FS. It’s going to be a tough pill to swallow to pass on CGJ or Thornhill for a WR. Likewise, it’ll be hard to pass on a WR for the other. Also, we still need a pure pass rusher. Too many critical holes, not enough good picks to fill them. Hoping they get aggressive with trading up.
Thanks Rob. Despite my disagreements about the pick and other things – I do sincerely appreciate your work.
Respectfully disagree with your evaluation Mark. I think Pete and John were looking for a hard nosed DE/DT that could play the run. Something we did not do very well last year.
I don’t think they are trying to replace Frank, that’s impossible, and there’s no one like him in this draft that was within reach.
And the simplest answer could also be that they were tired. I didn’t see any “dejectedness or depression,” just fatigue. The only thing they mentioned was the way OL didn’t come off the way they expected, which I think is what made it difficult to get more picks when trading back. I didn’t see anything that would indicate that they missed out on a player. But they brought up trading back several times.
Pretty sure they were just tired, and disappointed that they couldn’t get more action out of trading back.
+1
+1. Didn’t someone ask JS if he was worried about missing out on Collier by moving back? I believe that was genuine when he said yes.
You can only please some of the people some of the time, not all of the people all of the time. PC/JS are not in this to satisfy the pundits. They do a pretty damn good job of maxing out the draft year in and year out. Day 2 and 3 are where they really excel. Looking forward to another fun day today and tomorrow!!! More wheeling and dealing…
I find it staggering that people think the Seahawks were disappointed to take Collier or had no enthusiasm for him.
They just drafted him in round one!
John Schneider called this the best D-line draft in 27 years and you think they had no enthusiasm for… the D-liner they take in R1?
This place isn’t an echo chamber for anything. That’s nonsense.
We don’t just have shouty, screechy hissy fits on here, unlike other people/places.
Agree. If they didn’t really like Collier, why would they even take him in the first place? No one was forcing them to pick him.
I love how everyone with a Twitter account nowadays somehow has intimate knowledge of the inner workings and thought processes in the VMAC.
+1 on this article Rob. Excellent analysis. I too agree with the possible trade scenario at 37 and a move up from 92 as a very strong possibility. We’ve got the firepower to do it.
My top 5 right now for Seahawks picks are
1. Winovich
2. Ferguson
3. Campbell
4. Hill
5. Banogu
If take Winovich/Ferguson with our next pick, then be aggressive with the board and go up and get T. Hill. That still leaves us with 4-5 picks to get a TE, OL, WR, DB, and RB if we need too.
That would be nice but we’d be risking missing out on the DBs. I think I’d prefer Marvell Tell at 92 and Khalen Saunders or Renell Wren in the 4th.
But man, if we could actually get Tell in the 4th….
L.J. Collier
Chase Winovich
Trysten Hill
Marvell Tell
5 more picks
Cant argue with that!
Lets say Gary Jennings, Trevon Wesco, Dru Samia, Alec Ingold and Derrek Thomas. I’d love it
High fives all around. I’m gonna go rewatch some DB tapes to see why yall are so fired up about these dudes as well as McLaurins tape(rolls eyes) for a 3rd time!!! Maybe I’m missing something here. Anyone other than:
McLaurin
Thornhill
Gardner-Johnson
Tell
that people are fired up about. I’ve seen everyone’s at LEAST once.
Nassir Adderley, Deebo Samuel to name a couple
Awesome thank you! I’ll go watch them right now. Just spoke to a close friend of mine who is an Ohio St. alum as well as former coworker with Jim Mora Jr. This is his analysis of McLaurin and Campbell.
Ron: “Mclaurin is solid, runs great routes and catches everything. Good #2 WR. Campbell is a freak. Track guy with track speed that over the years developed into a true WR by learning how to run routes, use his speed to get separation and can track the deep ball really well. My comp for Campbell would be a young Desean Jackson. He’s gonna be a steal for somebody.”
Ben: “If you had to pick just 1 guy, who would it be?”
Ron: “Campbell for me”
+1 on Adderly
Pass on Deebo.
I felt like I was watching JD McKissic with speed when I had Campbell’s reel on. Goddamn! And Adderly just bumped Banogu off my top 5 board. I thought the draft was at 1pm E today. You can imagine my disappointment when I found out I had 7 more hours to go. Fuck you NFL for dragging it out!
Is there any concern about Trysten Hill’s maturity? I know he didn’t get along with his new coaches very well and lost playing time because of it.
I’ve been curious about this as well. If John takes him, then I would say that there shouldn’t be an issue, GOING FORWARD, hopefully(fingers crossed)!
There is no issue.
Maturity? It didn’t stop them from drafting Frank Clark when he slapped a girl and got kick out of team.
“I’m more motivated than ever, there’s a bigger chip on my shoulder, the league done messed up…” ~ Haskins
I’m not wowed by Haskins.
Had the best wideouts and best Oline at his disposal, of course he put up numbers.
I didn’t really see him making special plays.
Can’t believe I’m saying this, but Dan Snyder crushed round 1 last night.
I really like Banogu. I think he’s best fit as a 3-4 OLB though. Hes really good on the edge, but if you play him at DE in a 4-3 he might get eaten up. Hes a major project as a pass rusher also.
In the 3rd though, I’d like to get him and move to linebacker. Hes got the range they like, and would be familiar with blitzing. I like him as a KJ replacement.
Not sure if I’m doing hindsight here, but a week or two ago JS might have given a hint that is reflected in how the trades worked out last night. He cautioned one of the news conference questioners to not take the “ease” of trade downs too much for granted. Uttered something along the lines of “you have to have dance partners”. Could be that the pre-draft activity/feel out process was more subdued this year compared to prior years. Perhaps the depth/breadth of this year’s talent pool relative to each team’s perceived needs caused that.
As for tonight, my personal hope is McLaurin in there somewhere. He has so much versatility and a great, non-diva attitude………….team guy. In a similar vein, though not as “must have” for me, is Winovich. He looks like a productive Tazmanian devil out there……….maybe it the hair…LOL. That kind of energy is infectious. As a bonus, he looks like a guy designed for some special packages at fullback…..I know, crazy thought.
PC/JS have done some things this year that are just a smidge off historical behavior. Maybe they will flex their choices tonight to work some more magic. Fingers crossed……….
Schneider mentioned in the interview that defensive linemen came off the board more rapidly than they anticipated.
He also mentioned something happening that he would come out and talk about “10 years later”
Someone, or multiple someone’s, they really wanted went earlier than they thought.
They missed out on (not counting the obvious ones like Allen Bosa and Williams )
Clelin Ferrell
Christian Wilkins
Rashan Gary
Dexter Lawrence
Brian Burns
Justin Simmons
Jerry Tillery
Montez Sweat
They really wanted one of these guys.
My guess is Gary.
As a counter point, all of those guys outside of Tillery were expected to be gone by #21 at some point in the leadup to the draft. And just watching that little story on Tillery, he did not seem like a Seahawk at all personality-wise. They were probably hopeful that there would be a few surprises that would allow one of those guys to fall, hence them talking about the draft going as-expected which isn’t good for them. I don’t think they were surprised that all those guys were gone.
I was watching the live feed.
JS was frantically fiddling a card waving it rapidly. The air was thick. Jerry Tillery was selected, everyone kept looking up at the TVs. Hands of PC, JS and scouts were thrown into the air. They were obviously frustrated, or deflated. Certainly feeling some type of way. PC seemed to be pitching his guy to everyone. Guessing Collier. He didnt seem thrilled about it though.
I dont necessarily think Tillery was their guy, but they might’ve taken him. Sure seemed like it. I think they wanted someone who went earlier and the Tillery pick just added to their frustration.
A couple things:
Being disapointed with the trade back returns and missing out on someone who was already picked are not mutually exclusive at all.
John Schneider said something along the lines of “the draft went how it should, which we hate” indicating to me they were hoping a spectacular talent would fall because of various reasons.
In conclusion, I think they wanted Gary at 21, then they wanted Tiller later on, then they had to settle for Collier.
On top of this, they were probably bummed by the paltry returns on their trade backs.
To clarify, they wanted Tillery as a fallback option for Gary.
Said this last night, but I’ll do it again, b/c I love my own voice. I want three picks today, and I don’t think it’s too complicated.
It starts with one more move down from 37…
Option A: include their 5th to get a 3rd…
37/142
44/76
[Day 2 Picks: 44/76/92]
Option B:
– 37 for 44/~112
After picking @44, they’d own 92/112/114/118/124/132/142/159… That’s plenty of power to get back into the 3rd. Admittedly, this one is a bit more complicated, b/c it might involve moving up from 92 first, then the combo for that second 3rd RDer). So, let’s say…
[Day 2 picks: 44/75/86]
Both options will leave the team with 8+ total picks (The Schneider minimum) and some power on Day 3.
I can’t imagine a package of 4’s or 5’s is appealing in THIS draft to move in to late 2 or 3. Are there any pick hungry teams to bite?
I’m 100% onboard with trading a 2020 2nd for 2019 early-mid 3rd. Then package our late picks to move up our 3rd and perhaps grab a 6 or 7.
If we are looking for a slot cb i kind of like rock ya sin only started one year at temple but real physical and handsy with WRs. I believe we go edge or DL in second but if sin is there i would consider taking him at 37 or trade down.
Rob, you’ve written several times about the lack of explosive offensive linemen and how difficult it is for the Seahawks to draft a true blue-chipper at offensive tackle when they lack early first round picks. Could Jawaan Taylor represent a non-conventional means to acquiring that caliber of tackle? Or is the knee injury enough to make it a moot point?
Jawaan Taylor is ok, but he’s fat and has a bum back.
He’s not particularly athletic and he doesn’t fit a need for us.
There are some significant medicals causing his slide.
Not just the knee, but other things are lurking.
Given he fell this far I’d pass.
Are Cody Ford and Greedy Williams the only 2 invited who are still there?
Can someone explain the Cody Ford hype to me? He always seemed like a day 2 kind of guy.
Byron Murphy I believe
Drew Lock, DK Metcalf, Cody Ford, Jawaan Taylor, and Greedy Williams all attended the draft yesterday. Whether or not they went home I’m not sure.
It’s been said on the NFL draft account that’s those 5 players will be in the green room and Joejaun Williams and Darrell Henderson will join them in the green room
Is Pete dared to say Banogu’s name he either made a giant mistake or he’s essentially not on our board.
hopefully not on the board.
I want Miller and Hill
I think people are reading wayyyy too much into the fact they mentioned LJ Collier’s team mate.
Any chance they like AJ Brown if he’s still there?
God I hope not!!
Very doubtful IMO
Really? I thought A.J. Brown looked like a natural catching the ball and running routes
Is there something wrong with Greedy Williams? I thought he was supposed to be a first rounder?
Can’t tackle for shit and I don’t think he’s very Seahawky. Someone will take a flier on him though.
Yeah, he’s not a first round talent.
He was a projected first rounder by the draft media, but there are always differing opinions as far as what the league actually thinks of him. He also seems to have a weird personality – the whole zero predraft visits thing is just odd to me.
I see a lot of calls for Seattle to draft him, I am not sure why though. After a decade of evidence that PC/JS don’t draft CBs early, I can’t see why they would deviate now.
If I remember right he didn’t take any visits and teams were turned off by his lack of competitiveness, and he is a terrible/unwilling tackler.
Hugh Millen always brings him up when talking about D.K. Metcalf and how Williams didn’t even try to tackle him.
On top of all that he doesn’t have 32” arms, just not seeing him as a guy the Hawks would be interested in.
Rob… chapeau.
You’ve been spot on for a few months (not sure what the other guys are doing).
Day 2 Wishlist: 3 Picks
NCB/FS
Walker & Hill
I believe this is a more accurate portrayal of our picks as of now:
#29 (R1) L.J. Collier (DE, TCU)
#37 (R2)
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🙁
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#92 (R3)
#114 (R4)
#118 (R4)
#124 (R4)
#132 (R4)
#142 (R5)
#159 (R5)
That long and sad stretch between 37 and 92 is why I’m hoping they trade down again.
Top WR’s left stats in no particular order:
Catch % / Yards per catch / 40 yard dash / Height & Weight
Gary Jennings jr. 73% 13.7 4.42 6-1 214
Terry McLaurin 65.2% 16.7 4.35 6-0 208
A.J. Brown 74.1% 15.8 4.49 6-0 226
Parris Campbell 74.5% 12.4 4.31 6-0 205
Arcega-Whiteside 64.9% 16.4 4.49 6-2 225
Riley Ridley 60.9% 14.7 4.58 6-1 199
Catch % is pretty striking to me.
It looks to me like these 3 should be a target just based off of stats.
Gary Jennings jr.
A.J. Brown
Parris Campbell
If you throw in personality and special teams you include Terry McLaurin.
Anybody have any thoughts on these players and they’re stats?
I would rate them 1) McLaurin 2) Campbell 3) Jennings. Would be happy with either of those 3 or Debbo Samuel.
Deebo drops too many balls for me to get excited over.
I know that Gary Jennings and David Sills V WR from WV caught 33 TDS for the year together. I like them both Jennys has better speed 4.42 and Sills has better hand fighting skills to gain separation. Sills average a TD catch every 3.7 catches. He’s a goal line specialist with height and he has deceptive speed with 4.57. I actually took both these guys in my draft.
Here’s a thought, John was “annoyed” that more offensive linemen weren’t picked in the first. That would have left more Defensive Linemen available late in the 1st, including Collier.
That also would have allowed Schneider to trade back one more time, and still have LJ available. But because so many DLinemen were taken already, John and Pete couldn’t risk trading back anymore or they might lose Collier.
I don’t know. They kind of looked like me after a 14 hours work day.
Good suggestion
I didn’t see anything wrong with PCJS at the presser. JS always cool calm and collected, PC sometimes a little puppy dog but in the pressers he’s more calm usually. They seemed a little bit tired but that’s all. They had a reallyreallyreally long process with the RW and FC contract and trade things and now mixing up trades and boards with the draft.
I think they really hoped for Gary to fall further but I also sure that Collier was their second choice. He has the backstory, the motor, the attitude, he visited VMAC, he has good pressure%. It’s pretty clear he had on their board high.
As for today, I have no idea. Could be another rusher, or secondary most likely. Also WR is a possiblity, but I doubt. Maybe even OL as OTs need some time to adjust and Brown not getting any younger and Ifedi’s contract soon over and he might ask too much. And OGs are always a need with this inside run heavy offense and Iupati and Fluker both have some injury history. I think the likelyness for the second round pick:
DL/EDGE – 45%
Secondary – 30%
WR – 13%
OL – 7%
TE- 5%
Not sure I agree with the percentages you listed considering we never take a secondary player early….unless his name is Earl Thomas.
+1
I’m still underwhelmed by the five 4th round picks.
Seahawks already have 13 cornerbacks and safeties, but they will pick more of similar caliber in the 4th. Seahawks already have offensive linemen but they don’t have a starting guard. Pretty sure they will pick up another guard in the 4th.
Seahawks need wide receivers. That was a very interesting list that ZB posted:
Top WR’s left stats in no particular order:
Catch % / Yards per catch / 40 yard dash / Height & Weight
Gary Jennings jr. 73% 13.7 4.42 6-1 214
Terry McLaurin 65.2% 16.7 4.35 6-0 208
A.J. Brown 74.1% 15.8 4.49 6-0 226
Parris Campbell 74.5% 12.4 4.31 6-0 205
Arcega-Whiteside 64.9% 16.4 4.49 6-2 225
Riley Ridley 60.9% 14.7 4.58 6-1 199
There won’t be any receivers like them in the 4th. I just find it frustrating that the sole goal of many is to trade back and gather more quantity. Half of whom won’t even make the team. Even if they did make the team, what will you do with the 12 picks next year? Trade back some more?
Anyway – I’m done venting. Please use those 4th rounders to trade back up to more talented players.
You know it is possible to use those 5 4th rd picks to move up and down the draft board right?
Yes that’s what I just said. Use the 4th rounders to move back up the board.
In other news Rosen is being sent to Miami for a second rounder from Miami. But Miami wants a draft pick back from Arizona, as they think the second rounder is too costly.
KJ Wright — R4
Richard Sherman — R5
Kam — R5
Not sure why you’re so against picks they haven’t even spent yet. There wasn’t anyone worth having at 21 and 29.
You can find a few successes in late rounds. Baldwin was UDFA, and wasn’t Poona Ford UDFA?
But look at those wide receivers available in the second round. None of them will be there in the 4th round. And how many 4th round wide receiver busts have they had? They almost have to go wide receiver with their next pick.
David Moore could potentially take another big step forward.
No they don’t. They could take a wide out but it’s not a big deal. Draft Garry Jennings later. It’s what they do. No panic, no stress here.
How many 4th round busts has any team had? After the first round and after the Top 40 players clears out, its anyone’s guess as to who is gonna become what. That’s the mystery and the thrill of the draft.
The way I see it is the best way to go into is with as much draft capital as possible – what difference does it make if we have 2 3rds and 3 4ths or 1 3rd and 4 4ths? We’re getting 5 players in both scenarios and all of them are players that are going to have flaws and need to be coached up. The more shots you take, overall, the better chance you have of hitting. Enjoy the ride for what it is
Really think the Hawks picks tonight will two or three of the following five guys
Trysten Hill
Terry McLaurin
Deandre Walker
Ben Banogu
Juan Thornhill
+1
Rewatched tape on McLaurin and Campbell and spoke with an Ohio St. Die hard alum, give me Campbell over McLaurin. You can’t coach speed and he’s a freak. And Adderley over Thornhill. Lemme just say, Holy Batshit “Batman”
But I’d take Winovich, Ferguson, or Hill over any of those guys!
Can’t say I disagree. I also have a gut feeling they really like CGJ.
Trading to get another pick in the 2nd is going to be expensive, especially since they only have one 3R pick.
I’m skeptical that’s going to happen, as much as I’d love to see them with an additional 2nd (and not lose the third).
If they are willing to deal a 2020 pick, then it might happen.
Most likely they will trade back to mid 40s… get a few picks late and then call it good acquiring picks.
Jets looking to trade up to 37 all the way from 68?! Too far to drop. Even for another 3rd rounder at 93.
For me, yes.
They aren’t going to drop that far
I personally could see something like this but not for the two 3s. Perhaps 67, 105 and a 2020 2nd. This type of move is accurate to the trade chart. I would then want to see an aggressive move up toward the top 15 picks of round three with 3 4th rounders. 3 picks in the third, two in the fourth and two in the fifth might be just right. And we would completely own the draft next year to boot!
37 for 68+93 is a bad trade. But if the Jets sweetened the pot with say a 2020 2nd round pick that would be very attractive.
Hawks could use some ammo to move up from 68 into the 50’s.
And in 2020 would have 3 second round picks.
Toni Softli brought up a valid point.
Seattle drafts for specific fits within the scheme.
Collier fits a specific type of player they want…. a guy who can play inside and outside.
• Rounds 2-3: Friday, April 26, 7 p.m. ET
• Rounds 4-7: Saturday, April 27, Noon ET
Thanks Corn.
Rob
Re: Jaylon Ferguson
We’ve had a lot of discussion about him recently that has included some good stats and good production. However, should we be discounting that to at least some degree due to him playing against a lower level of competition?
My view on him has been consistent. He’s very raw. You see him have rough moments in games but then bang — he makes a huge play and gets a sack. He did that against good teams too — namely LSU and Mississippi State.
If you draft him you need to be ready to develop him. But he has some skills.
Thanks much.
Please…https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dawgnation.com/football/dandre-walker-2019-nfl-draft-georgia-football/amp
IMO. Drafting this guy would again validate Rob as one of the best analysts out there as he spotted him early in the process !!
This dude is a baller and I would LOVE it if Seattle drafted him. Would be great value too.
Not sure he’s the right fit for us, but I would love to have them on the team.
I’m all in on them drafting D’Andre Walker
I’m actually thinking more like Rob every year since 2010. You catch the mood of the interview of JS/PC perfectly. They did not get a 3rd round pick and you could see they was disappointed. They was looking to drop and get Collins with their first pick and got stumped for a trade at 29 so they reach and got there guy.
They missed on getting the draft capital they hoped for but they definitely got there guy and he might be one you take that 5th year option so it may not be as bad as people think. I think they trade down 37 into 40 and then they get a Hill to Rotate with Reed. I just feel Jones and Jefferson are not long for this team. I could see trade down 37 use a pick and take 92 up into 80’s for a pick that slips into Seattle wheelhouse. I guess the Saturday will be Seattle’s day with 4-7 round of the draft. If you look at 4th and 5th there has been much success. Thanks Rob! This the site I go to ALL year long and read when it come to Seattle Seahawks. lets cement another player to defense this pick and when it’s all done there is May 7 where signing someone does not affect the comp pick. Next year we have 12 picks what is not to get excited about next year with 1st,2-2nd,2-3rd, 2-4th,1-5th,2-6th,2-7th.
I like the idea of a of a David Sills V the tall receiver and TD guy they’ve been looking for and I love Gary Jennings to replace Baldwin. Together they had 18 and 15 for a total of 33 TDs with Will Grier throwing to them. I have no doubt that both could be had after pick 100. I’m sorry rob but I’m done with Ohio receivers. Amari, David, and Jarran are all same type of receivers and I think with russels new contract and a 5 year window 2 will be going down the road. Drew Sample TE I believe we can get him. He the typical husky TE that brings his lunch pail to work. He not an exceptional athlete but he not bad. When I went over him he was my blue collar lunch pail kid. I like to thank ya again for website without it I wouldn’t be the GURU in GRAHAM, WA.
What a cool post. I think Jones is still TBD, we didn’t see him last year so too soon to write him off. Everyone keeps talking about a receiver but I think a pass-cathching TE will fill the bill as well. My gut says that Doug isn’t done and we have 1 more year, 2 at the most, and then he calls it a day. I love Doug and hope he gets through his injuries this year and is THE MAN one more time.
Jesus christ!
This says more to be about the executive than Kaleb McGary.
Executive: The tackle has been socially awkward. It’s going to be a stretch for him coming in because he’s not a bad kid, he’s just socially awkward. He’s from a small country town. He just struggles… he’s going to struggle being in a big city for awhile.
Reporter: No stuff out on social media stuff like Nick Bosa?
Executive: No. He’s done some stuff that’s socially awkward. You know one day the play country music and one day they play R&B in the weight room.
It was country day and one of the blacks turned on R&B. He (McGary) got missed off and cut the cord to the whole speaker system in the weight room. All the whites and blacks were passed off at him because they couldn’t listen to (any) music. Socially awkward stuff. Not racist. Just has to grow up.
LOL. Dumba** autocorrect.
Executive: He’s not racist, but I might be
Ok that’s one way to start a post.
Uhhhhh, he is from Tacoma. Which is not a small country town at all.
Struggle in a big city – did the executive forget McGary has lived in Seattle for the past 4 years? And who says stuff like “and one of the blacks”?
Great insight/assessment of the Hawks war room, Rob. This is great fun as always you you’re killing once again.
We need to do a go fund me of some sorts for you and the fam on a vacation during this time of year just so you are in the time zone and we can get a proper YouTube draft party going 😀
I was going to ask what do you see being so valuable for all the picks in round four but perhaps they are wanting to trade up? We may lose a few picks next year in some trades?
He does have a Patreon up there.
Haha that would be most welcome 🙂
I think there’s a good chance they trade up. If not — I’ll see what’s left after round three and do a write-up ahead of round four. Could be some good DL depth there despite what JS said the other day. Maybe some receivers and tight ends left too. Plus OL.
Paris Cambell is my crush for #37
Percy Harvin without the bad attitude or injury problems? Sounds good to me!
I don’t think they will pick at 37, but at around (let’s say) 45.. absolute target to pick for Seattle.
QB Will Grier, will he last until round #4?
I’d rather take Minshew as a UDFA.
I hope we get at least some of these guys:
Defense:
D’Andre Walker
Trysten Hill
Khalen Saunders
Renell Wren
Charles Omenihu
Jachai Polite unless his interview took him off the board entirely
Dre’Mont Jones
One of the fast S to nickel CB guys
Offense:
Dru Samia
Chuma Edoga
Terry McLaurin
Parris Campbell
David Edwards
Cody Ford
Deebo Samuel
CJ Collier said he was going to use shoulder pads 2 sizes too small in the NFL 😉
*sarcasm*
There was a report earlier suggesting the Jets were willing to move WAY up to the top of round two.
This suggests they’ve talked to the Seahawks: https://twitter.com/MMehtaNYDN/status/1121867641797394433
Something to monitor. I’d do it for New York’s third and 2020 first.
NO WAY the Jets give up a 1st round pick in 2020……. if they do….. YIKES
The Jets are desperate. If they want to jump an entire round and get an early R2 — it’s going to be VERY costly.
Who on earth would they be targeting?
Some have suggested they were really after a cornerback. And given the way the CB’s fell, it could easily be someone like Greedy Williams.
Can you imagine the Seahawks getting a 1st next year and a 3rd this year for Greedy Williams?!
I bet Seattle would have to throw in a 4th or 5th this year to make this happen.
What about trading our 2nd for the Jets’ two 3rd rounders, their 4th rounder (which is early–the 4th pick of the round) and a 2020 pick. We could probably trade the Jets’ 4th plus one of the 4ths we have currently for another 3rd rounder–to give us four 3rd rounders. And result in us picking 5 times total in the top 100.
I would consider it. Maybe Schneider would too.
One can hope…fingers crossed
This could really change the next 5 years for Seattle .
Next years draft would be insane if we had 14 picks AND 2 firsts lol. PCJS would be able to build their dream team.
I’m down for some of that.
Plus I think the Jets will be a sorry mess again next season so it could even be a top ten pick.
Ironically, the Hawks traded #37 to Denver for their future first rounder in 2009. Became #14 overall ET.
You could easily use some draft capital to trade up from #68 to #50 and look for Winovich!
Here’s a point too.
For those who don’t like Seattle trading down all the time. In the last few years the Jets have drafted:
Quinnen Williams
Sam Darnold
Jamal Adams
Leonard Williams
At least three of those players were considered ‘best in the draft’ prospects. Each time the Jets ‘took the best player on the board’. They added the kind of blue chip talent, didn’t trade down. Stuck to the board.
They’ve been rubbish.
There’s no one way to do things in this league.
I totally agree that there’s no one way, and that picking big flashy names doesn’t always turn out well.
I do think the Jets are about to turn the corner though.They have so much talent now, it’s going to be a real indictment of their FO if they don’t do well this season.
They’re still a hot mess organisation though. According to Tony Pauline the GM and HC have been at each others throats for weeks. They might fire the GM after the draft apparently. And Adam Gase is an…. interesting…. individual.
Plus there’s good old Dr. Sack chewing everyone out. That can always go one way or the other.
I’d do a deal with them for a 2020 first in a heart beat.
The ONLY reason we’re not a “hot mess” is because of the 2012 Draft. That is a long long long time ago.
Take Russ off this squad and we win, what 4 games? Bobby is a HOF LB. That was 7 years ago.
2010-2012 were INCREDIBLE drafts. Since 2013 and that trade that I knew would haunt us, just not as obvious to others as I, Percy Harvin, and drafts have been average at best.
That worthless trade cost us the opportunity to draft my boy, DeAndre Hopkins and it didn’t allow us to re-sign Golden Tate.
PC/JS are living off of 2010-2012 drafts. It’s time to realize their techniques and wizardry are overrated but as fans, we don’t want to see it or accept it. This is a bad team w/ out Russ & Wags. Our 2 stars were 2012 draftees. Ancient history. Ancient.
You could take the starting franchise quarterback off every team and they would win 4 games.. You can’t argue with the results, Seahawks have contented almost every single year. And yes you are going to need your franchise quarterback to do that.
True. It’s just hard for me to fathom all that talent on that team not doing anything. If Adam “Putin” Gase really can’t win with all those guys you listed AND Le’veon Bell, he deserves to be exiled to the Russian Football league. Would gladly take a high pick from them though.
MacCagnon is 10, 5, 5,4 in his 4 seasons there…………………….smells like death.
Jets – #68, #93 and a 2020 Second Rounder
Seahawks – #37
DEAL or NO DEAL?
Deal.
I’d take #68 and a 2020 first too.
Isn’t that how we gn or Earl Thomas from Denver for the Alphonso 2nd rd pick?!
Great work, Rob. I’m disappointed because our drafts haven’t been stellar since 2012 and PC/JS keep getting the benefit of the doubt. How many garbage 3rd and 4th rdrs or even just meh players will they keep drafting in trade downs before we finally have had enough?
http://www.drafthistory.com/index.php/teams/seahawks <——- hawk history link
I'm so invested as a fan and feel like their whole game plan strategies are so conservative on O & D but then their drafting strategies are so wildly, wheeling and dealing that hasn't benefited us at all.
We traded up for Lockett. We traded up for JReed. I've only wanted the Hawks to draft 2 WR's in 10 drafts. DeAndre Hopkins at #25 in the 2013 draft and N'Keal Harry that you don't like at #29 or #30 this season.
I like teams like Atlanta that target guys they want at NEED/BPA and go for them. We've never invested in an OL or traded up like PHilly did or Atlanta did for a OT in Rd1. Who knows who will be available at #37 or in the 4th rds. If PC/JS couldn't figure out who would be there in Rd1, you actually believe you can figure out Rd4 where we have typically been extremely poor?
all those trades for 4th and 5th rdrs? Pats played it cool and stole Harry, who was a stud in HS and stud since his Frosh yr under trash QB's. I'll take the kid from Stanford. JJA-W. The 2 guys from OSU are overrated and duplicate Lockett = not smart.
I'll take the pass rusher from MIchigan. I'll take the WR from Stanford and flip a coin on the available 4th or 5th rd secondary players we need and Guard.
I'm just disappointed and need to have no expectations for our drafts because each year Im more disappointed. I've actually out drafted those 2 the past 5 years. That's not good. That is all they do.
I think some perspective is needed.
Seattle had a LOADED roster. It made it difficult for players to come in and ‘compete’. It also sounds like the atmosphere was kind of toxic and it’d be easy to get eaten alive.
In 2015 they landed Frank Clark and Tyler Lockett in rounds 2-3. That’s awesome. Ifedi is turning the corner and Jarran Reed has been awesome. I’m not writing Shaquill off yet and Delano is making steps forward. Chris Carson is a BAMF. Will Dissly, Michael Dickson.
I don’t think it’s all bad at all really. Not legendary like 2011-12 but still good with room for more to come.
Hindsight is always a wonderful thing.
Flowers?
(Just giving ya sh**t)
charlieunicorn.
Your new nickname is corn. Thems the rules.
only if I can go to candy mountain
only if ya found Elmore
Does anyone have a fair idea what the 2 or 3 positions will be strengths next year in the draft?
It has been mentioned that QB and WR are deep next year, but what other positions are looking like they will have good depth?
DE/EDGE don’t look to bad first glance.
Its obviously really early but RB might be surprisingly strong – D’Andre Swift, Jonathan Taylor, Travis Etienne, Cam Akers, J.K. Dobbins, A.J. Dillon, Najee Harris, Trey Sermon, Eno Benjamin… the list goes on. Not saying they’ll all be top picks but they at least have the accolades to make them worth monitoring. Not too much a position of need for us either
*Pull up the draft value chart, for inevitable Seahawks trade of 2nd round pick.*
Cards love those Husky db’s!!
Huskys keep getting picked up by NFC West rivals. This sucks lol.
Looks like a run on DBs is happening. Maybe we go nickle/safety first?
From Seahawk cam looks like they might be trading down
It’s interesting how often we make trades with teams that I consider big rivals. New England & Green Bay seem to be regular partners.
From Beastmode:
“DK Metcalf. After going through his highlight reel again, I give no f**k$ if he suffers an occasional concentration drop. His ability to make tough, contested catches, the fact that he looks like a man amongst boys, and his acceleration + top end speed have me salivating. This kid made some Randy Moss-esque catches. I hear the boom or bust talk and we shall see, but I’m all in on the BOOM! This offense might just get really damn entertaining. Go Hawks!”
Bestmode. This is the deal. If teams want to put eight men in box. Russell Wilson says: “okay” I will call an audible and go deep.
There is no doubt that these players were taken with stopping the Rams. Bill Belichick handed Pete Carroll a blue print for defending against the Rams offense. Now let me say this. In all fairness to the Rams. Todd Gurley was far from being 100%. But at least Seattle will be better able to defend against the Rams. It becomes a game of cat/mouse. But at least Carroll will be ready for Rams next go around.
The question was asked. Who is your favorite pick. I could make case for almost everyone. However, let say a few words on behalf of Phil Haynes. You have got to love this pick. Love both D.J.Fluker/Mike Iupati. But we can’t depend on them last 16 games. With Phil Haynes you will not miss a beat if he us forced to play . The Hawks also have Jordan Simmons so unless they have a rash of injuries they will be ok at guard. Also now that Tom Cable is gone John Schneider can go out and pick his (big, strong, tough, mean and nasty) offensive linemen.
The way the N.FL. is played today you have to have plenty of DBs. Safeties are becoming more and valuable. Teams are throwing the ball over 50% of the time. Safety play was HUGE for New England against the Rams in the Super Bowl.