Instant reaction: Seahawks struggle to unimpressive win

September 17th, 2017 | Written by Rob Staton

Let’s start with the positives.

The Seahawks, on an off day, got their first win of the season. With the game on the line they pulled out two drives to come from behind and get a win.

The penultimate drive, leading to Seattle’s first touchdown of the season, suggested Russell Wilson is finally settling down albeit in an up-tempo setting. The final drive took over four minutes off the clock to ice the game with a series of punishing runs.

Chris Carson continues to shine. That final drive is what the Seahawks want to be. It’s not exactly how they want to get there, with a jumbled-up mess preceding the run-onslaught. Nevertheless, it was what good teams do — put away opponents by running the ball to win the game.

The defense, despite some sloppy run defense at times, conceded just nine points and forced a crucial three-and-out on San Francisco’s final drive.

Carlos Hyde, thanks to his effort last season, was one of only four players to record a 100-yard game in Seattle in the last five years. The fact that he repeated the achievement today might be more indicative of his talent than any major concern for the Seahawks. It’s not a big worry.

The defense is playing well enough to believe this team can have a great year. And if the offense can grow, this can be the season people hoped for.

Despite a disappointing start, the Seahawks haven’t lost any ground in the NFC West and are tied with the Cardinals and Rams at 1-1. Making sure they didn’t drop this game in the division and the conference was crucial with tougher games coming up.

Now onto the negatives and the concerns, which I’ll highlight in bullet points because there are many:

— Why did it take seven quarters for the offense to score a touchdown this season?

— When things go awry, what are Seattle’s go-to plays to get some momentum? Any ideas? Is it just the no-huddle now?

— In these situations, why are they not able to punctuate their best players on offense (such as Jimmy Graham and Doug Baldwin)?

— The Seahawks are getting very little or nothing from several key additions. Eddie Lacy (inactive), Ethan Pocic (bench), Oday Aboushi (inactive), Malik McDowell (injured). Free agent signings and high draft picks that aren’t contributing.

— The big roster decisions are not paying dividends. J.D. McKissic has been inactive and appears to just be C.J. Prosise’s injury insurance. David Bass and Marcus Smith are making no noticeable impact. Tanner McEvoy dropped two key passes, including a red zone target.

— Russell Wilson, until the penultimate drive, was off form and again struggled in wet conditions. We saw the best and worst of him today encapsulated in two tweets:

— Wilson was lucky not to have turnovers against his name. The Niners will be kicking themselves they didn’t complete one of the relatively straight forward interceptions they missed.

— Was Jimmy Graham hurt today? Did his injury impact his ability to be heavily involved? If not, he is again becoming a white elephant on this offense. By not using him remotely effectively the Seahawks encourage all the noise that is already circulating. ‘Trade him’ will be the call this week. Who to? Which team is going to give you sufficient value after two clunkers to start the year? The more pertinent question is — what exactly were they hoping for when they traded for him? This can’t be it surely? It’s not just Bevell and Cable deciding his role and they didn’t make the trade — so what was Pete Carroll’s plan for Graham?

— It wasn’t a great day for special teams. Needless penalties, average kick-off coverage, Neiko Thorpe was injured and Blair Walsh botched an important extra point. We’ll see how he deals with that.

— Thomas Rawls started the game, looked rusty, dropped the ball on one occasion (possibly two) and didn’t take another hand-off after the 2:14 mark in the first quarter. Is it unfair to wonder if he’ll ever deliver on his clear potential? Or was this a tune-up?

— The O-line didn’t have a horrendous game but there were still mistakes. Fortunately those individual errors seemed to come one at a time and not all at once to truly destroy a play. Mark Glowinski in particular was beaten twice in exactly the same way on the touchdown drive and was bailed out by some Wilson magic.

Overall the offense will be talked about until the cows come home this week. This was very, very poor — with two good drives at the end adding gloss to the overall muddled picture. The run game remains impotent at key moments, the passing game is full of mistakes. They seem unable to exploit a weakness in the opponent (e.g. San Francisco were missing a key linebacker and top safety Eric Reid was hurt) and the offensive line is providing more questions than answers.

The blame will inevitably fall on Darrell Bevell and Tom Cable. This also has to go to the top though. Seattle’s offense doesn’t look any better than it did last season when Wilson was hurt. Blame the coordinators exclusively if you want. The identity of the offense — and the way it flirts with spoiling this team — warrants at least a look in the direction of the Head Coach and front office.

Pete Carroll, with Darrell Bevell and Tom Cable, will need to work together to get this right. The Titans, Rams and Giants are on the horizon.

Not easy.

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273 Responses to “Instant reaction: Seahawks struggle to unimpressive win”

  1. Volume12 says:

    I guess Seattle is in 1st place due to a tie breaker.

    Gonna have to win ugly or not at all this year.

    I agree about trading Jimmy, but re-signing him seems like a waste right now. Says a lot that they sinyt trust him on ur 2 most important drives. What happened to TE Nick Vannett?

    Only bright spots offensively were Lockett, Carson, and RW on that last drive. Need more of that.

    Still think they’re missing another big run stuffing DT, but the D looks great.

    Side note: KC’s Chris Jones today? 3 sacks, 2 FF’s, 1 INT. SMH.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I suspect after the Jimmy Graham experiment there won’t be any high price TE’s on the offense after 2017. It’ll be role players. Unless of course Graham goes on a major run of form in the next 14 games. The thing is, it’s so unusual to just let a player of his standing walk away for nothing as a free agent (or a comp pick). And with Lynch gone — I think they saw Graham as a guy who could fill the ‘star’ void. If Graham goes, who do they turn to then? Who provides that?

      • Volume12 says:

        Its a good question to ask. Seattle has made a 6’7, 260 TE disappear though. He’s not working as that 6th O-lineman. Harder to find now, but a Zach Miller type would fit better unless like u said, Jimmy takes off or they can straighten out this O-line.

        Or go with the 2 headed monster at RB that are taking the league by storm.

        • ddd says:

          For whatever its worth I think I saw them try to run at least 1 iso play with him in the endzone but the other team doubled him.

        • Lewis says:

          He’s a liability *in this offense*. His blocking is still poor. He doesn’t get separation.

          Now, part of that is probably how he’s being used, but even at his best since he’s been here, he hasn’t made the offense significantly better in the way they had hoped (I.e. In the red zone). Certainly not enough to justify the salary. That’s why I was so incredulous when people kept talking about resigning him. Why in the world would you do that?

          Don’t get me wrong, I loved it when Graham was signed, but it hasn’t worked and all indications are it never will. I laughed when Rosen said during the broadcast that Graham was a big part of this offense when it looked like he might be nicked. What a joke.

      • Mike B. says:

        The most direct solution for proper Jimmy G usage would be to just convert him to a WR. He’s in his 8th NFL season; stop it with this square-peg-in-round-hole nonsense. Just stop it. Stop forcing him to be something he’s not. It hasn’t worked and it was probably a mistake from the beginning. Admit it, make the adjustment, move on. This team needs to do a better job of adapting to circumstances/reality.

        Next, find the best blocking TE who’s still on the street and sign him for cheap. Luke Willson is an okay blocker but isn’t great as a traditional blocking TE; Nick Vannett might eventually be that.

        On a related note, how about drafting (or more likely picking up as UDFA) UW TE Will Dissly next year? Now there’s a big ol’ TE who can really block, and has pretty good hands. And if they want to convert him to an OT, great. Why not try that with a TE who already knows how to flippin’ block.

        • Rob Staton says:

          Brock Huard made a fair counter to the suggestion of playing Graham as a WR. As a route runner he is the opposite of sudden. If the intention is just to throw jump balls and have every catch contested — fine. But we know Wilson is risk averse to those situations. He isn’t beating any CB’s consistently off the snap and creating separation at WR will be a major issue for him. That’s why he’s a TE.

          He needs to play TE but they have to find ways to punctuate his ability and size.

          • Rad_man says:

            The future star is tyler Lockett.

            • Rob Staton says:

              He’s an excellent player. Future star though, with the difference making physicality to being a huge mismatch? Not sure about that. Lynch and Graham were freaks of nature physically.

              • Mark Souza says:

                The problem with Graham is the same one we had with Zach Miller. Both are great pass catching tight ends. But both don’t see the ball because Seattle can’t keep its quarterback off his fanny. Miller was a great blocker, so we kept him in to help out and at least other people saw the ball. Graham is a near zero as a blocker so he’s no help whether he goes out or stays in. Graham will never be what he was with this O-line.

                • Rob Staton says:

                  That’s not how I see it to be honest Mark. The reason Miller and now Graham don’t see a ton of production like they did in Oakland and New Orleans respectively is because this offense is set up, as orchestrated by Pete Carroll, to be different. This is a run-centric offense where the TE’s are expected to block and accent the passing game. Miller was adept at the blocking side of things and excelled albeit with much less production. They’ve tried and are trying to mould Graham into their ideal TE. I don’t think this a max-protect problem. I think it’s an identity thing. And I suspect, after 2017, they won’t be going after big money TE’s any more with the pressure to feed targets.

                  • Mark Souza says:

                    It used to be a run-centric offense. It isn’t anymore. The first game, we ran 16 out of 48 plays, and not because we were out of the game. We were within a score throughout the game. It’s been a choice by the man calling the plays. In Green Bay we ran 18 times out of 48 plays, but that’s not accurate. Two of those runs were scrambles by Wilson, so were in actuality called pass plays that broke down. So the real breakdown is we ran 33% of the time in a close game.

                    Against the 49ers, the stats say we ran 37 times out of 79 plays, less than 50%. But in reality, those included 9 rushes by Wilson that were called pass plays that broke down, and 3 kneel-downs to run out the clock that weren’t really rushing attempts. The adjusted total is 25 rushing plays called out of 79 plays, or 31.6% in another close game. Per the calls coming into the huddle these days, we are no where near a run-centric team. We are barely trying to run.

                    And as the 9 QB scrambles and 3 sacks against the niners show, there is definitely a pass protection problem.

                    As for Jimmy Graham, until the line is fixed, he has no role here. There’s no time to allow him to go down field on routes, and he doesn’t block. And you’re right, he’s an albatross. We can’t feed him the ball enough to improve his stats to where he’d be attractive to another team in a trade, and he blocks so poorly he’s a liability to have in the game. If it were me (and it’s not) I’d sit him and would be playing Willson and Vanette. Willson isn’t as big a target but can more than hold his own and is far more dynamic with the ball in his hands. And both are very capable blockers who can help out a struggling O-line.

    • Trevor says:

      Posted this earlier Vol. I know you liked him a lot too.

      Still bummed we never took Chris Jones last year. Exactly what we needed. If we take him not Ifedi neither Mcdowell or the Richardson trade would have been necessary.

      Jones has the talent to be a pro-bowler for a long time.

      • Volume12 says:

        He’s a special talent. Creates havoc.

        The early returns on this draft class are very good right now with Shaq, Carson, and Naz. But if they could get Pocic in there? Wow. Its one reason why I wanted them to leave Ifedi at RG.

        • drewdawg11 says:

          The real issue is hat they won’t trust him to be who he is and the limited route tree they allow him to run is hurting him. How many two yard out routes does he need to run? Trust the man to go and get it. How about some deep crossers? He was more effective in New Orleans because Brees and Payton were far superior to Russell and Bevell. He didn’t forget how to play football.

          • hawkdawg says:

            While we are on this topic, why does Russell throw on a rollout to crossing receivers (including Jimmy) in the wide flat, one yard past the LOS, on 3rd down, when he needs 7+ yards for a 1st down and he is in an excellent position to see that there is a linebacker bearing down on the receiver to stop him immediately after the catch?

    • Overtime says:

      I have never been a fan of Jimmy Graham’s game. His best season was 2013 when he caught 85 balls for 1200 yards. NO went 11-5 that season. They faced the SB champion Seahawks in the playoffs and lost 23-15. Jimmy Graham was targeted 6 times and caught only 1 for 8 yards. Why was that? The drop in production was due to a Seahawk defense featuring Bobby Wagner, KJ Wright, Bruce Irvin and Kam Chancellor. NO used Graham like a WR that season. He even negotiated for WR money. Seattle shut him down with LB rather than match-up a DB on him. He was never a TE. I doubt he still runs a 4.5 forty. He lacks the change of direction to get open and in Seattle is not used as an outside receiver. That job went to Jermaine Kearse. So, he never really fit the TE mold we were looking for when the team tried to replace Zack Miller who was an excellent blocker.

  2. Aaron says:

    Three takeaways for me…

    1. Lean on Carson, he will help complete the circle
    2. Gotta think about swapping Glowinski for Aboushi
    3. Graham has talent, but another team will soon have him via trade

    • Trevor says:

      Agree on all points but wish they could figure out how to use Graham because he has no trade value.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I’ve read the Graham trade suggestions. But what are you trading him for? You might get a R3 comp pick if he leaves as a free agent. Can’t see anyone giving up a R3 pick at the moment. If it’s a player-for-player trade, who are you getting for him? You’re not getting Joe Thomas or Brown in Houston. You won’t get a good left tackle period. It’s hard to imagine a deal that would be worth your while moving him.

      • Trevor says:

        Agree 100% lets start using him as the big mismatch WR he is. Leave the blocking to Willson and Vannet.

      • Aaron says:

        I just see a guy in Graham who isn’t physical in blocking (not surprising) and catching (also not surprising). He’s always been a guy who has to get his touches to play more physical and with passion. Baldwin never needs to get touches to be physical and passionate. Lynch was the same way. Graham isn’t being used and when he gets his chances he drops passes and doesn’t run through contact. He has a place in the NFL, but it isn’t with us. Trade him for a 3rd or 4th, I’m ready to part ways with him.

      • Brandon says:

        Or something more outside-the-box, as far a trade partner’s and options go. Whether its Graham or the team or Russell’s lack of ability to climb into the trust tree on his throws to Graham or Graham just not being the player he was, it kind of starts to come down to value options. A 3rd round compensatory means someone will have to give Graham a top flight contract(for that off season of free agents) and with his age and injuries, that’s a dubious prediction. Could easily become a 5th round comp instead.

        Value now, we pick up an actual asset for this season, at a position lacking. Our front office has never shied from cutting bait when they deemed it needed. Outside of a few flashes of brilliance, in this offense Graham hasn’t been clutch, nor sure handed, nor deadly in the red zone, nor even a chain-mover.

        • Rob Staton says:

          So which player are you getting at a lacking position? This is the problem with the Graham trade suggestions. People tout names like Joe Thomas etc. Not happening. People say just settle for a reliable LT. Who? Which team is giving up a reliable LT for a pass-catching TE? There isn’t one.

          I suspect the best offer you might get is a R5 type given he’s out of contract in the off-season. And you’re better off having Graham than a day three pick in 2018.

          • Brandon Cain says:

            Rob, I’m not saying it has to be an LT. There’s other positions on this roster that could be upgraded from nickel corner, to guard, wouldn’t mind looking for a competent big receiver on the outside, since they are unwilling to have Graham be that guy.

            But let me stick my neck out there since you asked for an example. The patriots are getting real thin at Receiver. Gronk just popped a groin. Could there be a deal where you move Graham for a Malcolm Butler type deal. Again, I’m spitballing here, but it seems like to the right team Graham could get us something in return that we could use this year, and that team could have the franchise tag option for Jimmy this off season(TE franchise tags are reasonable). Could be off my rocker, but I’m getting tired of our inexplicable lack of ability to feature the guy, and I don’t think that golden time is coming. If you’re getting pretty much nothing from him on the field and as mentioned above his compensatory value will be limited, why not explore any options that may be out there?

  3. Trevor says:

    Great write up Rob I think you nailed almost every point.

    Jimmy Grahams body language is one of a player who is either hurt or really unhappy. I have been a huge Graham supporter since the trade but unless things change quick hard to envision him in a Hawks uni next year.

    You are also right about PC/JS they need to shoulder almost all responsibility for this mess on offense.

    1)Poor drafting of OL and RB talent

    2) Not firing Cable and Bevell this off season. They should have brought in a new run focused OC and handed him the reigns if that is the offense Pete wants. Too many hands in the kitchen.

    • joel says:

      JG’s body language matches mine: this offense is utter shit right now. Russell Wilson is not playing well, receivers can’t catch the damn ball, and the running game was non-existent for 7 quarters. Carson got the benefit of Wilson running the ball repeatedly on a fast-paced drive followed by a quick 3-and-out from the defense. I love Carson but I don’t think he would be breaking those big runs to end the game if the Niners defense wasn’t winded and having to respect Wilson’s running.

      The Seahawks can’t run a no-huddle, fast-paced offense the entire game. Our defense won’t hold up to that pace vs good teams. They’re going to have to figure this out very quickly. The Titans shouldn’t be a match-up that is scary but right now, I’m pretty worried about next Sunday morning. I hope they can turn it around.

  4. Volume12 says:

    RIP Bobby ‘The Brain’ Heenan. Greatest manager and play by play announcer of all time. Lost a piece of my childhood. 😢

    • Mike B. says:

      RIP indeed. About 30 years ago, when I was 11 years old, I was on a flight from Atlanta to Miami and Bobby Heenan was on that flight just a few rows from me. I was huge into pro wrestling at that time and was awestruck by his presence. I didn’t get the courage to talk to him, but I wish I had. He was great.

    • Group Captain Mandrake says:

      I used to love his exchanges with Gorilla Monsoon that always ended with Monsoon’s exasperated “will you stop it?!” One of the greats at getting heat, whether it was calling the fans humanoids or referring to nobodies as “ham n’ eggers.” One of the greats.

      • Volume12 says:

        My favorite moment ever, there’s so many to choose from, was the when Shawn Michaels turned heel on Marty Jannetty during the Barbershop segment.

        Bobby said, ‘ Oh I just knew he was gonna do that!’ And then proceeded to call Jannettty such a coward that he tried escsaping by diving through the window that HBK had just thrown him through. 😂

    • Logan Lynch says:

      One of the best to ever do it. His health was really poor the last few years so hopefully he’s in a better place.

  5. ddd says:

    To my untrained eye it looked like we had an unusual amount of role-outs and play action passes? I thought I saw the defense in man a few times? did other people see what I saw or am I crazy? and if they did happen during the game what are people’s thoughts on them?

    • lil'stink says:

      You’re not crazy. Gotta find ways to give the QB time when the OL is struggling. I thought all the play action and role outs worked well for the most part.

  6. neil says:

    I can’t leave a reply because I have been cut off simply because I am not a Homer.

    • Rob Staton says:

      No, actually wordpress doesn’t recognise your log in and I need to clear that you aren’t spam. I don’t believe a ‘not a homer’ filter exists.

  7. The Duckster says:


    …I know that in part, the O-line’s effect on him, past and present, has to a degree rattled him, but this game was very disconcerting. *Yes*, the weather was inclement and not helping–*but* Russell does play in Seattle, and this was the best potential “confidence booster” match for this first quarter of the season, perhaps outside of the Colts. Titans and the Rams on the road still remain in that first quarter of the season…

    It doesn’t bode well. Russell needs to step up.

    Over-throws (for the most part uncharacteristic) and running into sacks (let’s be real, Russ has a problem with this, horrible O-line notwithstanding) are all things that help kill drives and threaten to turn TOP into a tilted affair quickly. What’s more, despite the offense reversing the TOP trend from Week 1, it ends up with…12 points.

    This Week 2 match-up is a Chris Carson away from fielding a joke of an offensive output (and even then, not far from it).

    YES, there were some *atrocious* drops today–Graham, Procise, McEvoy (the most egregious offender of the lot) all put up weak performances and should all buy Richardson steak dinners for the rest of the week for catching the game winning TD with a “dislocated”(broken…something bad) finger.

    There are some serious under-performers on the offense right now, and it took Carson, Baldwin, and Lockett to drag that offense kicking and screaming to 12 points.

    I’m not one to just go, “Oh, just fire Bevell! Oh, just fire Cable!” But there’s some serious blame to lay at the feet of Carroll. This team for *seasons* now has not been able to get it’s stuff together for the first quarter of the season. It took a massive, lopsided TOP advantage and Carson pounding the ball against a wearied, wet 49ers defense to generate the running numbers so desired by Carroll. Does any of us have confidence that this will bode well against the likes of the Titans and Rams?

    This team has talent in spades, and might have the most talented roster in the whole of the league–Yet it is nowhere near close to generating the results it’s capable of. This coaching staff, firings or not, needs some serious retooling, “Come-to-Jesus” efforts.

  8. Austin Slater says:

    The line was terrible and I can’t figure out why Glowinksi is starting over Pocic or Aboushi both who looked much better in the preseason. Banking on “athleticism” is beyond stupid when we just need avg. line play.

    I’m not usually a fire Bevell play but reading plenty of people who understand offense it seems almost universally accepted that he isn’t scheming guys open like other teams do, doesn’t exploit opposing teams weaknesses, and just looks lost. Pete needs to fix it

    • FAN Person says:

      EXACTLY! With Baldwin, Lockett, P/rich and Jimmy on the field, Jimmy should either draw a mismatch at LB, or the 4th DB…! Should be GOLD!

      But STUBBORN Pete refuses to just win!!! He says “Win Forever”, then doesn’t scheme like the Pats for MISMATCHES to use over and OVER!!!

      If they had literally run 3-4 plays all day and won 31-6!!! I’d be happy!!

      Do what WORKS and do it again and again! Forget this, “get to the 4th quarter GARBAGE!” PETE!!!!

  9. Smitty1547 says:

    Good thing this is Robs blog and not mine, because my write up would have said. We can’t block, catch or throw! Yes this is grahams last year here it would be foolish fore both us and himself if he stayed. He’s been beaveled where good TE come to die.

  10. cha says:

    “— The Seahawks are getting very little or nothing from several key additions. Eddie Lacy (inactive), Ethan Pocic (bench), Oday Aboushi (inactive), Malik McDowell (injured). Free agent signings and high draft picks that aren’t contributing.”

    I wonder if Lacy is one of those “timing signings” – the Hawks have Rawls and Prosise with shaky injury histories and are targeting a RB in the draft but don’t want to be left in the cold like last year with all the injuries. Lacy signing is a hedge and he competes with draft pick (Carson) and so far Carson is winning.

    Aboushi and Pocic completely agree.

    On balance though, it feels like they’re ahead in this category at week 2. Richardson is worth the price of admission, Carson, Griffin haven stepped into prominent roles, Garvin has had his moments and Darboh seems to be justifying his roster spot.

    • dylanlep says:

      Imagine if they didn’t sign lacy. His money and joeckels money goes to tj Lang. Sound nice huh?

      • Rob Staton says:

        Lang signed in Detroit for a reason. You couldn’t just keep throwing more and more money at him. He had a value, Seattle went big. He chose to go home.

        • dylanlep says:

          Rob, respectfully, you don’t know that if seattle offered him two more annually, that he wouldn’t have signed here. Certainly they had to pay a premium, I would agree with that.

          • Rob Staton says:

            I think you’ve missed my point. They couldn’t just keep offering more and more to Lang. His average salary is $9.5m and he’s 30 on Wednesday. Even if they offered him $11m a year — who’s to say Detroit wouldn’t have matched that too? Seattle went big to sign Lang but they had to set a limit. They set theirs and he chose Detroit.

            He and his wife are both from Michigan. It’s not worth dwelling on IMO.

      • mishima says:

        By now, the Seahawks should have better talent at better value than TJ Lang. That they have to overpay and/or over commit to players like Lang and Joeckel indicates their talent evaluation and player development have failed.

        On the positive tip, extending Britt and drafting Pocic might mean they are now prioritizing low floor over high ceiling. Look for Pocic to replace Glow next week.

    • Brseahawks says:

      Didn’t catch the game, how did Griffin go?

      • Greg Haugsven says:

        Griffin was good, I think they had less than 100 yards passing. He had a very silly block in the back penalty on a punt return though.

  11. Smitty1547 says:

    Oh and Glowinski stinks should not be benched but cut there are other free agents that could come in and in a week would be better. Also don’t know how much of lacy money is guaranteed but it does not look like he’s here very long either. Was never a fan of signing that fat bastard anyway unless they were going to convert him to a Guard.

  12. Steele says:

    Bevell, Cable. Rinse, repeat.

    Russ running for his life as usual, saved it almost singlehandedly. Porous OL as usual. One decent clock killing drive at the end. Carson is the workhorse, but he is not Beast Mode (who again looked good for Oakland, and it makes me sick to see that) .

    Time to end the Jimmy G gambit. A good teammate who has never fit, and has underperformed/injured on top of that.

    D gave up huge plays again. A D is not shutdown if it gives up the big play, and it doesn’t matter if “they only gave up 9 points”. Against a better team and good QB, what would that total have been?

    Hyde’s performance was not just Hyde. The SF OL played decently.

    Very unimpressive vs. the worst team in the NFL. And the near-dumpster fire 49ers almost did enough on both sides of the ball to earn a W on this bad day. (This game felt as sick/inconclusive as GGG vs. Canelo, with Hawks in GGG role). Two sure INTs dropped by SF. A mediocrity in Hoyer. Etc. The Niners will come away with some confidence after this.

    Bottom line, I expected a Hawks blowout over a zero team, that would have proven little. Instead, we get a near-draw over a zero team, that proves the Seattle is a long way from being good.

    • Aaron says:

      Carson isn’t Lynch but he is the best RB we have to complete the circle. Agree, we need to move on from Graham. Disagree about the defense. We saw them give up essentially 10 to Rodgers and Co. at Lambeau. Of course, if the offense keeps playing so ineptly the defense will run out of gas by the end of the season again. Hate to see such an all time great defense wasted because the offense is so inept.

    • vrtkolman says:

      Lynch 3.4 ypc, Carson 4.7 ypc with a much worse o line. Sorry but Lynch isn’t the answer.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I think this is a bit OTT. Seattle were not good today but they weren’t good in STL in 2013 either, or at home in the rain vs Arizona. The Seahawks are not ‘a long way from being good’. They just need to get right.

      Highlighting the issues is the right thing to do. Claiming that the sky is falling is not.

      • Greg Haugsven says:

        I’m going to have to respectively disagree Rob. There not Cincinnati bad on offense but it’s pretty close. I hope I’m wrong but I don’t see this thing turning around anytime soon.

        • All I see is 12's says:

          Respectfully, the o dominated time of possession fwiw. Step in the right direction. This game would have been very different Sabre for a couple plays. Give them some time. I like match-up vs ten. Let’s see what they can do after we take away their run.

        • Rob Staton says:

          Nobody would argue the offense is playing well but the ‘woah is me — the Seahawks are trash, it’s like the Canelo vs Golovkin decision’.

        • mishima says:


          Move Ifedi back to RG, start Pocic at RT. Commit to Carson, Prosise, Darboh, Vannett. Move on from Glow, Rawls and JFG. Instead of a RB/TE offense, get creative/dynamic/quick. Turn RW loose.

          If you can get a 2nd from an AFC bubble team for Graham, do it and don’t look back.

          I don’t blame Bevill/Cable, but we will prob lose 2 of our next 3 and heads will roll. Looking at a 9-7 season.

  13. Nathan says:

    Ok question for everyone.

    Wind back the clock a year.

    Do you go harder at Kelechi Osemele when he’s on the market? 11.7 mil per year average.

    He tore the Jets d Line to pieces today.

  14. lil'stink says:

    I completely agree with Rob that it all starts and stops with the head coach and, to a lesser extent, the front office.

    I think Bevell called a good game today. Dropped passes, poor QB play, no push in the run game for 3+ quarters, and they were still able to move the ball for decent stretches.

    Watching Glow get manhandled and Ifedi almost false start on every play is getting stressful. Although Ifedi isn’t the complete dumpster fire at RT right now that I thought he would be, so I suppose that’s nice. I guess I still don’t understand why Tom Cable has such a good reputation. The proof is in the pudding.

    And finally, Russell Wilson looks like a QB who has no confidence in himself. Holding on to the ball too long, double clutching, inaccurate throws, no pocket presence at all. I really don’t get it. I don’t see how people can say with a straight face that it’s all because of the OL, or the playcalling, or whatever.

    • Smitty1547 says:

      Russell played against a Defense that he see everyday at practice and it felt like he was lost. i honestly don’t think he’s watched any film since he went Hollywood with new wife. He only plays well when he act’s like he’s on the playground and winging it.

    • David says:

      Russell Wilson looks like Jared Stidham (who was sacked 11x in the first 2 games), hesitant, double clutching, holding ball too long and could only put up 24 points vs MERCER!

  15. nichansen01 says:

    Paul Richardson is tough as hell.

    Always has been. Had a dislocated finger in this game, bone broke skin… got it stitched up and caught game winning touchdown. Previously battled back from two ACLs.

    The man is Thomas Davis level tough.

  16. nichansen01 says:

    Seems both the packers and the 49ers always completely shut down Jimmy Graham.

  17. nichansen01 says:

    It feels like we could go 8-8 this year and still win the division. The NFC west suddenly looks like one of the worst in football.

  18. Brseahawks says:

    Didn’t catch the game, how did Griffin go?

    • nichansen01 says:

      I’m not sure that he played. Didn’t hear his name called, save for when he got penalized on a Lockett punt return.

      • Smitty1547 says:

        Yes was a non factor as was Kam, for 2 games only heard his name on a special teams tackle.

        • Rob Staton says:

          I’m not sure what people expect from the CB’s and strong safety. They’re not going to be constantly around the ball. Kam a non factor? I bet if you study the all-22 you’ll see he was a big factor (and nearly always is).

        • Brseahawks says:

          Did he see meaningful snaps? It’s generally a good thing when CBs names doesn’t get called a ton.

    • David says:

      Don’t have the snap count but I believe Lane was getting all the snaps in base. Did not see Griffin playing much at all (except for that horrendous, unnecessary block in the back on STs).

  19. Forrest says:

    The next three games will be very interesting. I think next week will be a bigger challenge for the defense than offense. If the defense can shut down the run, then it’s a win. The Colts will be a punching bag game for both the offense and defense. The Rams may be the biggest challenge for the Hawks this year in terms of the West. Going into the bye week 3-2 would be okay, but 4-1 would be ideal. My one wish is that Glowinski gets replaced. The OL is hot garbage, but he seems to be the biggest issue; even a slight improvement would be great. I think the offense “found” its rythem in the last two drives today; hopefully it carries over. Go Hawks!!

  20. Elliott Atkinson says:

    Always compete unless you’re Tom Cable or Darrel Bevell.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I’m not a big fan of the way fans use ‘always compete’ as a way to hammer players and staff. ‘Always compete’ does not mean ‘always being really fantastic’. This is a problem that starts at the top and needs to be addressed as much by the HC and GM as the two people put forward by the fan base to blame.

      • NicotineJones says:

        “always compete” is exactly what the team did on a day when the offense played poorly and gutted out a win anyway. You want to tell that D that they weren’t competing?

    • ddd says:

      I actually thought the game plan was decent. We went up tempo when we needed to and we seemed to use a bunch of quick passes and roll outs. What specifically would you change other than execution (which is more of a player/positional coach issue to my understanding than an oc issue).

  21. FAN Person says:

    Jimmy Graham doesn’t ‘fit’ only because Pete Carroll is STUBBORN!

    Pete has this rigid belief that “we come to play, and just beat us…”

    That works well on the defensive side of the ball. But suffers tremendously on offense like today!

    Offense is built on misdirection, timing, coherence and using talent efficiently!

    Jimmy Graham being used as a ‘blocker’ is like using a Ferrari to try and Tow your boat.
    It doesn’t work, and it Kills the Ferrari’s transmission…thus the body language…

    Pete is STUBBORN and needs to bring in fresh blood…all I can see this year is, let Russell CALL HIS OWN PLAYS!

    Why not??????????????

  22. troy says:

    So despite how hard that game was to watch and how disgusted I felt at points, how different does EVERYONE feel about it if Procise and McEvoy manage to haul in those catches for TDs? That is an extra 8 points, and leaves the score at a decent 20-9 instead of 12-9. Still not great but at least functioning.

    Lets be real with our defense, we don’t need a great offense or even a good one, if we have a decent offense that can keep TOP 1:1 and can score a few TDs a game that could take us deep in the playoffs.

    I’m hopeful that the Hawks get this right, the offense did seem to make some progress from last week so hopefully that continues.

    And ya Graham, it always felt as though he was never fully properly utilized in Seattle. Whether that is Wilson, Bevell, Pete, the O line, I think we have a large enough sample size to see that it hasn’t worked. Try to trade him for an avg to above average OG/OT and call it a day, imo.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn says:

      This is a valid point. When there were several big plays to be had, the ball got dropped. WRs have to do a better job of securing the ball….RW was a little bit off on a few throws… but when he puts it right on the guys hands, you have to catch it.

      As for Graham. I think they need to get him either in the slot or on the perimeter more. Get him away from the OL…. ie, not inline with them sitting off LT or RT. Sidenote, I thought Luke Willson made some nice plays today. I do not agree with trading him…. you would not get sufficient value in return.

      • Lewis says:

        It’s like all these guys are competing for the Kearse award now. Don’t blame Graham so much because he was hit awfully hard, but the Prosise and McEvoy drops were ugly. To me, the bright spot was definitely how they managed to sustain drives even when so many things didn’t go well. Now if they could just score in the red zone…those two catches would have given this game a very different feel.

    • seanmatt says:

      Yes, if the game went differently than it actually did I would feel differently. But we judge the game on what happened not what COULD have happened. For example, if the goal line pass in Super Bowl 49 would have worked we all would feel very differently about that game. Maybe it’s easier as a fan to be all “hey, if we would have caught some passes than we would have won by more so I think the Seahawks are going great!” but will base my evaluation on what actually happened instead of twisting and contorting things to feel good about this team.

  23. Trevor says:

    That GB defense that looked kike juggernaut against our offense getting lit up by Matt Ryan and the Falcons.

    The two best teams in the NFC are Atl and TB IMO.

    • peter says:

      Tampa Bay? I’ve been hearing noise about this and then I looked and reminded myself they beat the woebegone Bears and not say, played the packers in their house.

      I’ll believe Tampa we’re eight games into the season.

    • Logan Lynch says:

      It’s like I said last week, the GB defense was in for a rude awakening in ATL. Yes, they suffered some injuries both before and during the game, but they seem to be the same team from the last 6 seasons. Talented offensively, but an average to below average defense.

  24. dumbquestions says:

    A win is a win, OK?

    The 49ers are *not* the worst team in the league. Maybe the worst in the NFC West – I’ll give you that – but they’re not Cleveland or the Jets or the Colts or the Bears. Their D is stouter than I realized. Hoyer is a journeyman, but he’s not Scott Tolzien. He has no receivers. I can’t even name the 49er receivers, and I just watched them play for three hours.

    The defense through two games has been outstanding. They held Aaron Rodgers to one TD in his own house. They held Hoyer to 99 yards through the air. Apart from two big Carlos Hyde runs, they gave up nothing.

    This game was closer than it should have been for some obvious reasons:

    1) RW was off. He played too fast and scared in the first half. He pressed and overthrew. Seattle dominated ToP in the first half – they just didn’t score when they should have.

    2) Key drops by McEvoy and Prosise killed drives.

    3) Bevell’s penchant for first-down pass calls put the offense in a hole in Q3 after Carson began to establish himself.

    Fix that stuff (especially the drops), and you’ve got a comfortable win instead of another nail-biter. As Rob said, once Carson started bulling through and eating up the clock, Seattle looked like Seattle.

    The basis for these arguments is always the same: Why can’t we see a comfortable win while we smile and destroy the chips and wings? We’re spoiled. We are. RW is the same QB who tore the league apart in the second half of 2015 without Lynch and Graham. We griped about the o-line that year, too.

    The Seahawk offense is rhythm-based. That is Bevell’s style. When it works, it’s a thing of beauty. When it doesn’t, it’s dreadful. It was dreadful today, but I don’t think firing him is the answer. It is frustrating to watch him make fast-action calls that lead to 3-and-outs after a good defensive stop. I want him to work on holding the ball. That is my chief gripe. Instead of giving the defense a break, he puts more pressure on them.

    However, putting the accountability at Carroll’s feet is a better answer. He should be asked how to fix the offense. He should be asked what he’s doing to make it better. He should be asked why the team has such a long history of slow starts. I am equally confident that he’s aware of those things, but it’s the stuff he has to answer.

    As for Jimmy Graham…

    …if I try to react fairly, with the sort of optimism that assumes everyone is trying to do the right thing and not screw up (including Graham), this is where I land: Is it the player or the scheme? Is it the team or the man? Was Graham a stud in New Orleans because of a system or because of his unique ability? Would he thrive anywhere but here? Would he thrive (for instance) in New England? Atlanta? Conversely, would he be ordinary anywhere but New Orleans?

    To me, answering those questions goes a long way toward figuring out the problem. My impression was that Graham was supposed to be the unstoppable red-zone answer – yet they never seem to use him there. Is that a Bevell issue or a Graham issue? Drew Brees is short. Russell is short. Brees made Graham a star. Russell hasn’t made Graham a star, or so it seems. What is the difference? Is he being used solely as a high-priced decoy? Are teams blanketing him in key situations? I don’t have all-22, so I can’t see that stuff.

    Maybe it’s naive to think that Graham is supposed to be a Tony Gonzales type who can clog the zone and body defenders away. I see people above watching his body language and deducing something about his attitude and effort, and I don’t quite get it. Either you use this weapon the way it’s supposed to be used, or you misuse it, and criticism follows.

    Trading him doesn’t seem feasible. Using him in a more effective way makes more sense. Can the Seahawks do it?

    Calling for Cable’s head is ridiculous. I can’t even name another O-line coach in this league. I don’t know how to measure OL coaches, because no metric exists. I defy anyone else to do it. Go ahead, name the best OL coach in the league and tell me why. I only know the way his peers speak of him. That’s all we’ve got, and that’s got to be good enough.

    A win is a win. I’ll take it. I’m happy with Carson, and I’m guessing RW will iron out the kinks.

    • Trevor says:

      The best OL coach in the NFL is Bill Callahan he has had incredible OLs wherevere he has been and developed All Pros wherever he has been (Oak, Jets, Dallas, Wash). Google his name and check the results of his OL units and the players he has developed.

      On the flip side check out Cables OL stats and name even one All Pro he has developed or coached. I think Okung and Unger may have each been alternate pro-bowlers once each. That’s it! Cable reutation is like Jeff Fischer based on nothing but average to awful results and lots of excuses.

      Pete and JS should be on the hot seat for not firing him two years ago.

      You can see Wilsons development has regressed playing behind this garbage OL for going on 6 years now. The continued incompetence of our OL is almost laughable.

      • Alex H says:

        Callahan is clearly the best. Another really good one is Mike Solari.

      • dumbquestions says:

        OK – that’s one OL coach. I accept the answer. But Cable didn’t drop two TD passes today. And if the front office philosophy is to use a low-rent OL, I don’t see how that’s his fault.

        • dumbquestions says:

          Didn’t see Alex’s answer when I replied. Acknowledged.

        • hawkdawg says:

          When they go “high rent”, like with Ifedi and Joeckel, the line still sucks. At some point, the coaches have to be held accountable for this. I was at the game, and too many linemen were getting beaten like a drum, over and over again. Backs were being met in the hole, when there was a hole at all.

        • GerryG says:

          The front office has spent quite a bit of draft capital on OL. The spent $ on Joekel, tried to pay Lang. We know they are in discussions about trades constantly; if there was an OL available via trade they would have pulled the trigger.

          There isnt any talent available.

      • Ishmael says:

        When’s Callahan’s contract run out?

      • Rob Staton says:

        The Cable rhetoric is so off and it feels like we’ve been over this too often to keep recycling it. But I bet Bill Callahan has never had to replace an entire starting front five in a short space of time with ex-Basketball players needing to start at LT. Cable’s a scapegoat. Doesn’t mean he can’t do a better job but perspective is nearly constantly lost when discussing his role. Nobody ever talks about the people who actually make the decisions in Seattle. Cable and Bevell are the easy targets.

        And FWIW — the line didn’t have a flawless game against San Fran but they weren’t the problem either.

        • Trevor says:

          Rob if you can name one player Cable has developed into an elite player or one time in his entire coaching career that he has had an OL that was even league average pass blocking I will never bring up his name again.

          It is not rhetoric the stats and facts are what they are.

          • Rob Staton says:

            The rhetoric and ‘stats’ constantly lack perspective.

            This idea that an O-line coach should be judged on how many ‘elite’ players they develop. How many elite O-liners are in the league? Tyron Smith? Joe Thomas? You mean guys like that? The number of truly ‘elite’ O-liners in the NFL is minuscule. Cable hasn’t been given a bunch of top-10 picks to work with. In many cases he’s been forced to cobble together a line from the bargain bin.

            What has he achieved? Turned a defensive lineman into a very useful guard who was paid big money by Tampa Bay. Has turned Justin Britt into one of the best center’s in the league (who saw that coming?). Made Breno Giacomini better than anyone was willing to accept at the time. Rescued Max Unger’s career when he was just sat on the bench. Stopped the team collapsing when Paul McQuistan had to start half a season at left tackle in 2013 with Michael Bowie on the other side. Was on track to turn a basketball player into a promising left tackle. Helped the team post record setting numbers in 2015 and be among the best offenses in the league per DVOA despite not having a storied O-line.

            All of this constantly gets glossed over because it’s easier just to point at Cable and not the people who forced him to try and work with guys like Drew Nowak when they traded the starting center or George Fant when they didn’t re-sign Okung etc etc.

            • Trevor says:

              Rob 9 years total for Cable as OL coach and not one OL even league average cannot all be lack of talent and bad circumstance. Lets get real. He had the highest paid OL in the league when we won the SB and they were still in the bottom 1/3.

              • Rob Staton says:

                Your point on the OL at the Super Bowl. They were the #1 rushing team in the league by a mile and won a Championship. His line had McQuistan at LT for 8 games and Bowie at RT for several too. Perspective.

                With respect, it seems like you’ve made your mind up and that’s that. Which is fine — but it is not conducive to a discussion on the subject.

                • Trevor says:

                  Yes Rob I have made up my mind because every stat validates my belief TC cannot coach an OL to protect the QB .

                  Our pass pro was 28th the SB year and that was Ok because we had a great run game with the best RB in the league and a young incredibly mobile QB.

                  What has happened to the great run blocking and scheme without Beast Mode and Russ running less zone read? It is awful. So now have an OL that cant pass or run block.

                  I wont argue about it anymore as my mind is made up till I see this OL improve by blocking someone and opening up some running lanes.

                  • Rob Staton says:

                    You can’t judge O-lines using stats Trevor! If a team has a terrible quarterback and teams tee off on the O-line every week and give up sacks because the opponent doesn’t respect the passing game, are you then going to come back and say the O-line coach sucks and is at fault for the offense? Was the Dallas O-line coach responsible for the Cowboys’ offense when Matt Cassel struggled in 2015?

                    Dallas’ offensive ranking per DVOA in 2015 — 31st

                    Seattle’s offensive ranking per DVOA in 2015 — 2nd

                    The Cowboys with their much vaunted O-line were ranked 19th for pass protection by Football Outsiders in 2015. Is that statistic an accurate portrayal of what Dallas’ O-line is?

                    The Seahawks, minus Marshawn Lynch, had the #4 run blocking O-line in the NFL in 2015. That doesn’t sound so awful does it?

                    This is why you can’t use stats in this way. I’ve countered the stats and your assertion that he hasn’t coached anyone up with a pretty emphatic response to be fair. If people want to rag on Cable every week, go ahead. I’m not here to suggest he’s doing a fantastic job. But it misses the point in so many ways when you just focus on one individual when it’s clearly not a black and white issue.

  25. Alex H says:

    Best O-Line coach today- Bill Callahan.

  26. Derek Baker says:

    Rob – was at the game so need to rewatch to get better view but it feels like our line really struggles to sustain blocks. We are terrible at pass protection but even when we try to run the ball and put hat on hat we get no push or spacing for the backs. We are supposedly getting explosive athletes and at home we should have the ability to get some kind of surge off the ball but we are getting killed in the trenches. Also I know we covet flexibility on the line but is there something to be said about leaving a player at a position to develop? Ifedi doesn’t look fast enough at tackle. Why wouldn’t we leave him at guard to really learn his position and let him use his size and strength to his advantage against explosive DTs? This performance isn’t solely on the O-line but felt like we were once again overmatched. I can’t believe that the SF O-line is that much better skill or explosiveness- wise yet they looked SO much better VS our D-line which in theory should be more dominant than their D-line.

  27. Ground_Hawk says:

    There was a particular moment in the game where the camera was showing PC and Bevell on the sidelines. The offense was stalling and on the screen viewer’s could see PC looking around like, “WTF is going on?!”, and past him was Bevell studiously looking at his play chart trying to find a solution, for San Francisco’s defense. I realized at that moment, perhaps naively, that even though PC is the head coach he doesn’t have all the answers, and I was humbled by the nature of football, because it is one of the ultimate displays of teamwork that people can witness in the world of sports. The blame for Seattle’s poor performance doesn’t rest with one person, and tonight’s show demonstrated that. Errors were made by many actors tonight, but they still managed to win. Things need to be cleaned up, and fast, because even though they won it was a butt-crack nasty effort, and other teams are hungry, so they can’t become complacent, or these other hungry teams will make them pay.

    • dumbquestions says:


      • hawkdawg says:

        My seats are behind the Hawk sideline, and it is not entirely clear what Pete does during a game, with a few exceptions. One exception, which occurs too frequently, is that he intervenes to call a timeout with only a little time to go in the half (like less than a minute) and the other team with the ball, facing a third and long in their own territory (maybe the 37 yard line, for example). They show little sign of wanting to do anything but run the clock out. But Pete gets “hormonal” and calls the timeout. The opponent then converts the third down, and goes down the field to score with only a few seconds left. Drives me nuts.

  28. Ishmael says:

    Something else to think about, things in the conference are actually playing out reasonably well for us.

    The three NFCS teams are 2-0, and they’ll have to eat each other at some point. The Saints are 0-2.
    Entire NFCE is 1-1, save the Giants who move to 1-1 with a win over Detroit tomorrow night
    NFCN I had Green Bay and the Vikings at 1-1, the Lions at 1-0 yet to play, and the Bears are 0-2
    NFCW has us, the Cards, and the Rams at 1-1, the Niners at 0-2. We’ve got a division win.

    The NFC South is clearly the class of the conference, which is fantastic because they’ll all take games from each other. This has been a rough start, but there’s still plenty of time, haven’t dug too deep a whole just yet.

    • C-Dog says:

      Yup. It’s most definitely still out there for us. IMO, while this was most definitely an unimpressive win against the 49ers, a few caught passes, and a couple more secure tackles, and this game could have been closer to another blow out win against the division rival.

      Plenty of football left to be played.

  29. peter says:

    Rob you’ve talked me off the fire Cable wagon. What I saw today was an Oline and an offense as a whole that could very well be ranked quite high by the end of the season.

    Sure Glowinksi is a non factor and the jury is going back out on Graham, but the whole game I thought about the Outkast lyric “you can plan a pretty picnic, but you can’t predict the weather.” How does Bevell scheme against easy drops and Glo just standing there looking lost.

    To that end if Tanner pulls in two catches one being right in his paws and Russell isn’t throwing passes like he’s trying to cut off a runner rounding third (sorry for the baseball reference, Rob,) meaning high and fast line drives to his WR’s the whole timbre of this game is changed.

    Next draft I would like to see them target someone with Tate like open field YAC. I love the chunk plays but if Wilson presses and they don’t connect it just looks like failed attempts whereas someone with some field speed and creativity could really open things up for the team.

    • Ishmael says:

      Such a good line. Andre three stacks still doesn’t get the love he deserves.

      I think Pete and Schneider need more criticism than they’re getting fwiw. A lot of their projects not working out quite as planned.

    • MSL says:

      Wilson got rid of the ball in 2.6 seconds on average yesterday (0.6 seconds faster than last week) and was pressured on 47% of his drop backs (30 something % last week). There was no push in the running game until late in the 4th when the 49ers were gassed. That was not an improved OL performance.

  30. C-Dog says:

    Was at the game today. A few thoughts.

    1. The opening drive showed a lot of promise. Yes, Russell Wilson was kinda hit and miss today, some passes sailed on him as the rain came down, but he wasn’t helped much by the initial run game, and he certainly was not helped out by bad drops from Cj Prosise and Tanner McEvoy where the ball was placed right where you’d want them. If those were catches, especially the two by McEvoy, I think we are talking about a different ball game.

    2. IMO, Chris Carson has got to be the featured back sooner than later. The dude runs hards and determined, he pass blocks, and catches. I would start with him, mix in a little Rawls, Prosise, whomever, and to end things out with a finish, give the rock to Carson. What a find.

    3. Where’s Jimmy? I don’t know. He gave cr@p effort against the Packers last week that, frankly, still haunts, and today he flat out disappeared. Maybe he’s hurt, maybe he’s in the doghouse a bit. Luke Willson made a couple really nice athletic plays. I’m actually starting to entertain the idea in my head that Graham could be dealt, and if not, likely will not be extended beyond this season. Maybe it’s me, but I’m starting to wonder if there is something going on with him.

    4. I agree with Rob that the offensive line wasn’t near as bad as it was against Green Bay. I thought they particularly had troubles on the right side. I will say, though, that the 49er front seven looks like a really solid collection of players. There are some big athletic men on that DL of theirs. I wouldn’t be shocked if they end up being one of the better units in the league once the season is done.

    5. Another great effort by the defense, but I kinda agree with Sherman, they should have done better. There was some bad tackling going on second half against Hyde. IMO, Seattle is dangerously thin at the DT spot. As solid as Richardson, Reed, and Jones has been, they need one more big bodied war daddy inside.

    6. I’ve seen it discussed a lot that minus Lynch, this offense is missing a tone setter, and someone that defenses have to respect, and fear. It’s been talked about the perhaps they envisioned Graham to be that guy. I want to throw out the idea that a mobile Russell Wilson is perhaps their best chance at that. There was a play early in the game where Wilson rolled left and tossed it for an incompletion against coverage. If he would have kept it, it looked like he could have gone about forty yards down the sideline from where I was at in the nose bleeders. If he had done that early, imagine how that 49er defense could have been placed on their heals. I would almost expect that to show up in Tell the Truth Monday. When the 49ers went up by 3 in the fourth, I turned to my wife and said that the maybe only way Seattle is going to win is if they get Wilson running, and to expect that to happen, and then, well, that all happened.

    There is nothing, not a single thing wrong with having a running quarterback, especially one who is arguably the best quarterback in the league throwing on the run. Call it his instincts, baseball short stop traits, his Jedi zone, whatever, but from my cheap seats, if Seattle goes back to that well a bit more through the course of games, mixed in with some promising running talents of Carson, that could open up the offense more. The storyline last year was that defenses didn’t fear Seattle’s offense as much because Wilson was limited. He’s not limited this year. I don’t know if it’s because he wants to stay in the pocket and prove himself there, or what, but if I’m Coach Pete, I’m telling Bevel that I want it see him more on the move.

    7. Mock Draft After Game 2; 49ers Edition.

    28: R1P28

    Seattle needs left tackle help.

    R2 SHELDON RICHARDSON contract extended.

    92: R3P28

    Graham gone. Gesicki in.

    130: R4P28

    Eddie Lacy gone. Ballage in.

    164: R5P26

    Seattle looks for help at outside corner. Richard Sherman is in a contract year.

    168: R5P30

    Helps fill depth at SAM/edge

    238: R7P16
    DL B.J. HILL

    Another lengthly DT to factor against the run and give some push.

    247: R7P25

    Behold; Seattle drafts a QB.

    250: R7P28

    I would like this pick.

    • Awsi Dooger says:

      Surprised to see Dee Delaney’s name on that list. He was very poor in the only game the Canes have played so far. I concede I don’t know much about him but in that Bethune Cookman game you didn’t have to pay close attention to notice all the errors he made. Eventually Bethune Cookman targeted him time and again.

      • C-Dog says:

        I could be wrong on this but isn’t there some athletic hype to Delaney coupled with the length they covet? I think Seattle tends to take mid round flyers on corners that have that potential since they are going to likely have to teach them a whole new method anyways.

    • Volume12 says:

      I really like W. Virginia QB Will Grier as a backup type. Was away from the game for a year and half, but the kid just wins. Agile as hell, huge arm and boy can he thread a needle.

      Leads all FBS QBs with 365 yards on deep passes. Through 3 games he’s got over 1,000 yards, 11 TDs, 1 INT.

    • John_s says:

      Knock on Gesicki is that he can’t block. Hopefully that improved during the year but if not, not sure you want to draft another TE who cant block.

      • C-Dog says:

        That’s a pretty fair point. It will be interesting to see how Vannnett emerges this season. They could simply choose to extend Luke Willson and see how 18 Wheeler Swoopes comes along on the PS. Personally, I think there’s some interesting stuff going on with Swoopes.

    • dingbatman says:

      ” If he would have kept it, it looked like he could have gone about forty yards down the sideline from where I was at in the nose bleeders. If he had done that early, imagine how that 49er defense could have been placed on their heals.”

      Completely agree with this C-dog! I was also at the game. The offense looked ill timed and out of sync the entire game right up until the final scoring drive. Russell made quick decisions to run, took what they gave him and marched downfield for the score. The SF defense (now having to be aware that Russell is a legit running threat) gave up large runs to Chris Carson on the very next drive.

      Marshawn gets a ton of well deserved love but Russell Wilson’s ability to make the defense respect him as a runner was a perfect complement.

      We may never know how good of a “pure pocket passer” Russell Wilson is simply due to the very real possibility that he may never see a perfect pocket while he is here. We do know when he is healthy that he can run, and when he is running effectively, good things happen.

      Defensive line get gassed chasing him around
      Offensive line gain confidence
      Defensive focus on Russell creates opportunities for other running backs
      Play action becomes more effective creating opportunities for our recievers

      Release Russell!!!!

  31. Ehurd1021 says:

    Jimmy Graham should be traded. His skill-set doesn’t fit with this team and he’s been a square peg in a round hole since he was traded here. That is the simple reality of this situation. I understand we’re not receiving an all-pro LT (i.e. Joe Thomas) via trade for Jimmy Graham, but at this point, I’d readily take a severable and consistent LT or RG for Graham – as opposed to a non-existent Graham who is being misused; skill-set doesn’t fit; and is losing trade value every single game/week.

    Let’s be honest: Graham is walking in FA after this year. The body language of Graham shows this. I understand he’s worth a 3rd-4th round comp, but at some point when does the very real reality of the Seahawks (defense) championship window closing become more than rhetoric, but instead a reality? This defense can’t sustain another year like last year due to the offense not being able to manufacture points and sustain drives. The defense was absolutely gassed last year by the end of the regular season last year – which is once again happening this year. The FO (PC/JS) are going to have to have to choose, either they part ways and trade Graham for talent on the OL – who is leaving next year anyway – or they fire Bevell/Cable and completely overhaul the offensive system. The latter seems extremely unlikely and that is the reason I’m calling for them to trade Graham.

    • Volume12 says:

      Letting him go after the year is one thing. Trading him now though? Who are you left with at TE for the rest of the season?

      Seems to me Seattle has a dilemma. What do u do with Jimmy and Chris Carson taking the reigns at RB. What does Seattle want to be in other words.

      • Ehurd1021 says:

        Luke Wilson and Vennette are left at TE. Wilson gives you some production within the passing game and Vennette allows you to develop a true block first H-back moving forward. Graham is walking after this season in FA – so you either value that 3rd round comp pick OR you trade Graham NOW and try to maximize his value in acquiring reliable and KNOWN OL depth. We’re not receiving ANY production out of the TE position as it is – which is okay if Seattle is attempting to regain their offensive mentality pre-Graham.

        1. Trade Graham for a reliable LT – move Odhiambo back to OG where he NATURALLY belongs.
        2. Sign a blocking TE.

        • Volume12 says:

          They don’t even use Vannett now. They took him because JS thought he was a ‘cool guy?’ Says a lot about him when they didn’t even trust him to be their #2 this off-season.

          I agree about Odhiambo. He’s the best LG on the roster.

          What LT are u trading him for? How many player for player trades happen in the NFL, especially during the season?

          • Ground_Hawk says:

            Trading Graham to the Bucs, for rookie TE O.J. Howard seems more realistic than Seattle’s FO being able to find a trading partner willing to deal a starting LT, which is to say that it would be pretty amazing, and also unlikely.

          • Ehurd1021 says:

            Would a team be willing to trade their starting LT for Graham and picks? I agree, the Seahawks being able to find a team willing to trade their starting LT is highly unlikely; unless Seattle is prepared to make the deal more enticing and package Graham and picks – which sounds more realistic, honestly.

        • Rob Staton says:

          It is not realistic to expect any team to trade a reliable LT. There are barely any in the league!

    • Rob Staton says:

      You won’t get a serviceable LT either. Teams are not trading good LT’s. There is a major shortage in the league.

      It’s OK calling for a trade but if teams are only offering R5 picks or worse — there’s absolutely no point doing the deal.

      • FuzzyLOgic says:

        How about a Guard then.

        • Rob Staton says:

          Same situation I’m afraid. The league is suffering with a lack of good offensive linemen. If you have a good guard or tackle, you’re not going to deal them for a soon to be 31-year-old tight end who’s out of contract in the off-season.

  32. Mark Hubenthal says:

    It’s very frustrating to see that Seattle has a serious problem with creating running lanes. Almost every running play it just seems like it doesn’t matter who the running back is because they’re just running into a wall of 7 or 8 bodies. How can we expect Thomas Rawls to do anything on the ground with such piss poor blocking? Seriously, it’s pathetic how ineffective our run game has been thus far. And maybe that’s reason enough to just focus more on going to a pass-heavy offense with more designed run plays and exploiting matchups. Whatever it is though, something has to change fast or else we’re going to be sitting at 4-4 mid-season with meager playoff hopes.

    In terms of the Jimmy Graham situation, part of me feels like it’s the fault of the coaches for not utilizing him effectively. If he was in New England, I can only imagine he’d be doing just fine. However, he has dropped a few key passes the past 2 weeks, so at least that part of it is on him.

  33. CharlieTheUnicorn says:

    “I don’t know if I’m allowed to tell you guys this but he dislocated his finger,” Baldwin said. “It came out of his skin and he’s sitting there bleeding, his bone is out of the skin. He goes into the locker room, sews it up and tapes it up, comes back out and scores the game-winning touchdown. That’s the mentality that we have here and I couldn’t be more proud of these guys.”

    “Baller” I think it is called by the youngsters.

  34. Ehurd1021 says:

    Rob… I wanted to know your personal evaluation on Jarran Reed so far. He looks extremely average to me personally and I think Nazir Jones has outperformed him on limited snaps.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I’d need to study him. I don’t think he’s a problem, just don’t think he’s a difference maker.

      • Ehurd1021 says:

        I haven’t gone back and completely broke down all his snaps but from the plays I remember yesterday he struggled to maintain his gap and created absolutely zero inside pressure. I understand he’s a 3-tec/1-tec and his main objective is to have sound gap control and stop the run, but when I see you get completely WASHED out of your hole and/or create absolutely no penetration in a 1-gap system, that is an area of concern; especially when you think back to years past and remember who we’ve had there before (i.e. Mebane, McDonald, McDaniel, etc.) I know noticed the 49ers LB’s were able to reach out LB’s easier than I can remember in years past.

        Now, when you compare Reed’s inability to maintain his gap and create inside pressure to Naz Jones (who has been on limited snaps) the comparison is undeniable. Something to keep an eye out for when your re-watching the tape from the game. Maybe I’m reaching but it was something I noticed yesterday and was a concern.

    • C-Dog says:

      Reed had a really nice solo run stuff yesterday. I love me some Naz but I think Reed is going to have a solid year two.

  35. GerryG says:

    Russ looks like a guy expecting to get hit every snap

  36. D-OZ says:

    Reed does his job. Not sure what you expect him to be?

  37. Hawk Eye says:

    just throwing this out there for debate. Not saying it is true, but this seems to be ignored as part of the problem compared to Cable, Bevel, OL.

    what if Russell is a bigger part of the problem?
    I did not see the game, had a family event to attend.
    But I watched a bit of the NE game before we went out and caught most of the Atl-GB game.
    maybe Prisco is right, that Wilson is good, but not elite.
    other than the 8 or 9 games at the end of 2015, when has he been lights out as a pocket passer?
    I have just noticed too many games over the past few years where Russell gets overwhelmed and then I see Brady and Rodgers make so many good, fast decisions.
    I would have to rate Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Ryan way above Russell at the moment.
    You can argue the Rivers, Big Ben, Carr are better QB’s. Maybe missing a few more.
    But if he is the 8th or 9th best QB in the league, then he is not elite and you have to address other weaknesses. They can win a SB with him, but he can’t win a SB for them.

    Is he shell shocked because of the OL problems?
    Dak looks like a real good QB, but he can have all day to find someone to throw to and he usually has a great running game. He looked average when Denver took away his run game

    I am still not going to panic, have to wait for 8 to 10 games before the OLine plays better or is doomed. We will see what the record is at 10 games. At 4-6 it would be a good time to panic. 6-4 or better with the O line improving will feel good.

    • lil'stink says:

      There’s no question in my mind that RW isn’t an elite QB. Not all franchise QB’s are elite. I think he has plateued in several key areas that he needs to get better at. That isn’t to say that he can’t become elite one day.

      Wilson definitely seems to be hearing footsteps. Certainly understandable, but something he needs to get over if the offense is to improve. And, on first watch it least, it seemed that a good chunk of his pressures were brought on by himself.

      The offense always seems to start off poorly, so hopefully things pick up in the coming weeks. But in recent years the offense has struggled in the preseason as well. This year – gangbusters in preseason, then a hot mess in the first 2 weeks. Not panic time yet, but it might be before the month is over.

  38. Ed says:

    1 . If the Hawks keep JG, they won’t get a 3rd comp. I don’t think he will get a deal like that.

    Trade him for a pick
    Package him with Lane and a pick

    2. PC needs to realize he is at fault with the bad offense/offensive line. He has held on to a terrible philosophy and terrible coaches for too long. Don’t wait for the media to start the “team mutiny” forced them to fire guys like in Cincy. Be a man. At the press conference, say “It hasn’t been good enough, starting with me, but we need to make a change and that starts with new OC and OL coach.”

    • Rob Staton says:

      But all you’ve done here Ed is find a new way to essentially blame Bevell and Cable. The blame that lies with Carroll isn’t just retaining his coaches. For all of the hand wringing on personnel and lack of identity — what if he and JS are the key players here? This is what people seem unwilling to consider. Carroll possibly KNOWS Cable and Bevell have been given difficult tasks and possibly KNOWS swapping them won’t provide the automatic quick fix everyone thinks will magically happen.

      As we’ve discussed many times on here — when there’s a popular Head Coach in charge the easiest thing to do is blame everything on the coordinators. It’s highly convenient. Yet this is Carroll’s vision, his offense as well as his defense. It’s up to him as much as anyone to get this righted. And he probably knows that.

      • GerryG says:

        ^Agree with all of this.

        There is a major ID crisis right now, regarding the tempo and the run game. We all know Pete wants to control the clock, and pound the ball. Yet the offense really only has a rhythm when it is up tempo. The run game (aside from the end) has been ineffective because there are guys in the backfield right at the snap.

      • Trevor says:

        Have to agree Rob the HC sets the tone and vision for both offense and defense. The lack of identity on offense definitely falls at his feet.

        One question though with the talent the Hawks have on offense how is Bevel and Cable’s job more difficult than any other coordinator in the league?

        Also agree there are likely no quick fix with an in season coaching change. That is what is so frustrating as a fan to see the insanity from PC / JS this off season “keeping the same coaches and scheme then expecting different results.”

        • Rob Staton says:

          How many other offensive coordinators have basically another guy heavily involved in the play calling? How many teams have an offense-by-committee? How many offensive coaches have a defensive minded Head Coach influencing the game plan and what the identity of the team should be? Is Vance Joseph telling Mike McCoy what to do in Denver? Unlikely. It’s a unique set up in Seattle. I doubt Bevell, for example, would be so committed to a run-first identity if he was a Head Coach.

          • Trevor says:

            I would agree with that. That is why I wish this off season Pete just picked a run focused OC and handed him the reigns including letting him pick his position coaches on that side of the ball.

            The current setup has always felt dysfunctional.

            • vrtkolman says:

              I totally agree. The recent coaching hires for the Rams and Broncos were pretty brilliant in retrospect. McVay can do his thing with the offense while Wade Phillips handles the defense, and vice versa for Joseph and McCoy.

            • Rob Staton says:

              The problem isn’t a ‘run focused OC’ though. This isn’t Bevell fighting Carroll’s vision and creating a problem. It’s more that Carroll’s preferred vision doesn’t fit the personnel on the offense.

              If anything they need a pass focused OC (which they have) — and they need to let him do what he wants.

              But that would mean people stepping down from blaming Bevell and Cable for everything and actually looking at the HC.

              • Ed says:

                Totally agree, but PC is the head coach and he won’t unwind the noose on RW or DB. So let go of the scapegoats. I personally think DB and TC are a big reason for the lack of deveopment and ingenuity, but as I said above, PC is responsible for not adjusting a few years ago. Him being ok with 12-9 victories is the problem. It’s unacceptable to have such a great defense and such a poor offense. But I guess he will just get fired when they start losing a majority of the close games and can’t rely on the superb defense.

      • MSL says:

        The “what if” is key here Rob. Your guess that it’s not on Bevell/Cable is not any more valid than other’s view that it is on them. We’re just guessing here. Same goes for splitting the blame for the terrible OL year after year…is it Cable being a bad talent evaluator and coach, or is it PCJS at fault for giving him a bunch of chumps? Obviously the real answer is a bit of all of it, but I believe that Bevell and Cable are problems either way, and I would love to see them gone ASAP. Along with that change I want to see Pete eat some humble pie and realize he’s not an offensive genius, and let a good OC come in here an design a winning offense that fits Pete’s base philosophies, but with modern flare.

        • Rob Staton says:

          The ‘what if?’ wasn’t me asking a question, it was asserting a point with the use of that particular phrase. It’s well established what the Seahawks offensive breakdown is. There is a unique structure to the offensive setup in Seattle. Usually when you have a defensive minded Head Coach, they appoint an experienced OC/play caller who has control over virtually everything. In Seattle they have an OC who focuses on the passing game, a run-game coordinator slash Assistant Head Coach and the defensive minded HC sets out the vision and this is Pete’s offense. It’s a committee approach.

          The only part where I’d be guessing is where I assert if Bevell was in control of everything, he might possibly tailor the offense differently to suit the personnel rather than stick to the strict identity set out by the HC and man ultimately in charge of everything (even the GM). I think that is a fair guess though.

          • MSL says:

            You literally typed “what if he and JS are the key players here?” followed by a bunch of possibly statements. Seems like a question, and I don’t believe any of us have the real answer. Even if you assume Pete is micromanaging the offense, what if he does it because Bevell isn’t good enough or confident enough to assert his own? What if Bevel and Cable have the same beliefs so there’s been no one to challenge Pete’s? What if we had a good OC who was able to convince Pete of the benefits of trying something new? What if DB and TC just aren’t good enough to convince Pete to adjust his views?

            • Rob Staton says:

              As I stated, a question can take the form of an answer. I wasn’t ‘assuming’ anything. I was using that question to challenge. We know the deal here. We know how this offense operates. Suggesting otherwise seems like a bit of a misdirection to get us back on the tedious ‘let’s hammer TC or DB’ train.

              • MSL says:

                Agree to disagree then. I do not think “we know the deal here,” and I’m not satisfied with the idea that we have the best coaching staff possible in place already. But it’s your blog, so if you’d rather us stick our head in the sand and talk around a possible big problem with the team, then fine.

                They don’t have the offensive line to show up and impart their will (with a bland predictable offense) on a team with a good defense. We aren’t Dallas and we don’t have Lynch anymore. I think they need someone in the coaching staff who can get this through Pete’s head, and it’s clear that Bevell and Cable are not those people.

                • Kenny Sloth says:


                  Your point is ‘change to an OC that will take control of the offense’

                  But it’s Pete’s offense. Bevell can only do so much to coordinate the passing game

  39. Mancunian Dave says:

    Regarding the whole JG thing. I don’t expect him to get traded at all. But while he was off the field yesterday, Luke Willson put in a productive little cameo. It was like “oh there’s a seahawks tight end! That’s what they are supposed to do”. I think JG is a great player, but it’s baffling that they don’t seem to know how to use him.

    On another matter I hope they drop Glowinski for the next game, that’s two games in a row that he has just been waving defensive lineman through…

    • Rob Staton says:

      Graham’s body language is poor at the moment. He’s not only struggling for impact, he just gives off a disinterested vibe. That has to change and fast.

      • Mancunian Dave says:

        That’s a good point Rob. Disinterested is the right word. You often see this with an individual in a team sport when its time for them to move on and they need a new team. I don’t think he believes in the environment and the team he is working with right now. That’s not saying anything bad about the Hawks who have such a brilliant team spirit overall (see Richardson playing through a broken hand), but I think JG has moved on in his mind. He does need to snap out of it.

      • C-Dog says:

        This leads to the one scenario where I could see Graham dealt within the season; if he becomes a team distraction a la Percy Harvin, and Carroll decides that he just wants him gone. Not sure it would get that far, or if that is even going on, but things do feel off.

        Wilson didn’t even mention him when he was rattling off a long series of names of pass catchers to complement in his post game presser like he robotically usually does. He only complemented him after a reporter brought him up. Thought that might have been a bit telling.

        • Volume12 says:

          I just don’t think Jimmy fits. Doesn’t have chemistry. Its OK. It happens. QB Dak Prescott and WR Dez Bryant don’t work together either. These things occur all the time.

          These teams have pre-draft meetings, FA vetting and the works for a reason.

          • Ishmael says:

            Yeah what’s happened there? Dez has gone from an absolute animal, top 5 WR, to just a guy. A good guy, sure, but he’s not tearing teams apart.

            It’s weird, Graham and Wilson get on super well outside football but they just don’t seem to be a good fit on the park. A guy like Graham, you just have to put it up on the top shelf and trust him to go get it. When’s Wilson ever done that?

          • C-Dog says:

            Yup. We are thinking the same thoughts.

            I was actually thinking during the game how much Seattle’s offense has relied on scramble drills and the receivers who have shown through have been fairly quick agile players, not something Graham is. Back in the day, Zach Miller was young RW’s bail out binky, and Graham’s status has been more of a showcase weapon. Shoot, RW’s best stretch of games came in 2015 when Graham was shelved.I just wonder if RW isn’t a better, more productive QB, when there’s not some big name weapon that he needs to feed the ball to simply to appease fans and reporters.

          • JimQ says:

            Jimmy Graham is “soft”, as he was called by Sherman before Graham was traded for. Being “soft” is a direct opposite of the majority of Seahawk players. I think he’s afraid of getting hurt again, and maybe pouting that he doesn’t get more targets, thus the I don’t give a crap body language.

            IMO-The slow starts of the season are directly related to the very limited number of actual practices (with hitting) that was negotiated by the players union. The preseason isn’t enough action to get (the OL especially) ready for a 16+ game season. The end result, for most teams is the first 4-6 games of the regular season, they are still getting their act together and slowly improving. I think the Seahawks OL will improve with each game, then they only have to worry about the OL injury bug, which the Hawks can hopefully avoid, for a change.

            • C-Dog says:

              The remarks from Bennett and other Seattle defenders made about him prior to the trade are definitely starting to echo much louder these days. I was remarkable watching him come back from that knee injury last knee. Through two games of 2017 it’s made it all the more disappointing about his absence. He needs a breakout performance, ASAP.

  40. Cysco says:

    I’m not overly concerned. (yet) This just feels like the same old story from the last few years. Have we forgotten the dumpster fire of 2016’s week 2 03-09 loss to the Rams or week 1’s near loss to the Dolphins? How about 2015’s back to back losses to start the season? What about 2014’s week 2 destruction at the hands of the Chargers?

    Point is, this team has a well documented history of struggling early on. If we go back and read the comments on here from exactly 1/2/3 years ago from today, we’d probably find threads very similar to this one. This is nothing new for us. We’ve had these same threads/comments about poor offensive line play or bad coaching/play calling every year for at least the last three years yet every year they put it together.

    Historically, week 3 has been a really good week for the team. this week’s game should be a really good indicator of whether this is a typical slow start or if we should be legitimately concerned.

    • AlaskaHawk says:

      I’ve been bitching about it for five years. The Seahawks offensive has historically looked awful during the first quarter of the season. Then they have gradually improved. Is it lack of practice? Lack of personnel? Awful play calling, who know?

      Unfortunately last year was the first year where they also ended looking average at best. So some people are concerned about the slow slide to offensive oblivion.

    • Ehurd1021 says:

      However, the difference between those years and this year is the age of the team is rising. While offensive line/play calling has always been heavily scrutinized in years past the level of talent was never a question IMO. The feeling is different when you have a young team (2013, 14, 15, etc.) that is coming off successful seasons struggling to find rhythm early, as opposed to an older team with the same issues that has hindered us (e.g. not being able to get off the field on 3rd downs and having horrid offensive line issues.)

      I understand the perspective, but I think when you add a little more context and nuance into this season you can see why these early concerns are more of an issue than in years past, in my opinion.

  41. Trevor says:

    Watched the game again this AM and Chris Carson really does look like a legit option to be the lead RB going forward. Love how decisively he makes that one read/cut and hits the whole without hesitation.

    Hope they give him a couple of games in a row with 20+ carries to see what they have in him.

    • C-Dog says:

      Yes please.

    • AlaskaHawk says:

      I’m hoping Rawls will get back to form so the Seahawks have at least two running backs that can carry the ball. I’m gradually losing faith in the rest of the running backs. Catching the ball would help restore that faith.

      • vrtkolman says:

        To me Rawls doesn’t have any explosion anymore. He lunges forward into a defender and stops. Maybe he’s not fully healthy or maybe he’s lacking confidence? Either way, Carson is much better at this point.

  42. AlaskaHawk says:

    I was thinking about Robs comment that the big roster decisions aren’t working. It seems like a tale of two teams. Defensively the roster decisions are working. Picking up Sheldon Richardson is working brilliantly. Reed continues to play solid. I didn’t hear Griffith or that LB name called == which is a good thing. Lane recovered and had some good plays. Aside from Hydes big run, which I suspect had something to do with the linebackers being in the wrong place, SF didn’t generate a lot of offense. What I see is an elite defensive line, elite linebackers, and a secondary which has a couple elite players though still having troubles making a stop on third downs.

    Offensively it is a different story. The line is still coming together. The pass plays still take too long to develop. Over half the receivers have caught a contagious drop the ball virus. And the running game only opens up a hole half the time. Still the emergence of Carson shows what a good running back can do when there is an opening. So what to do?? More practice I suppose.

    My main point being that a lot of the free agent and draft moves have worked for the defense. But not so well with the offense.

    • C-Dog says:

      I think we might see Darboh factor in more. I wouldn’t be surprised if we see either Pocic or Aboushi inserted into the lineup at some point if things don’t improve.

      For me, it was really, really hard watching the McEvoy drops knowing he was kept over Kasen Williams, and with McKissic, I can see why he was inactive with Lockett returning, and Prosise being used on third downs.

      • Volume12 says:

        Oh TC will shuffle this line at some point it’s inevitable. There’s not 1 guy on this line that has remained at 1 spot other than Fant. No continuity at all.

        Now TC gets the lion’s share of the blame. But are some fans realizing that he’s here for a reason? PC & JS have asked him to try and work miracles. Ya give him basketball players, UDFAs, former D-line man, guys from spread attacks, etc. They do this to try and save $ elsewhere and PC seems to adhere more to Alex Gibbs than TC. I mean Gibbs saved his coaching career.

        If Seattle didn’t have a TC or someone of that ilk, RW’s career would’ve been over already. And he’s in trouble now.

        In other words, someone needs to step in here. ‘Pete, we don’t need Sheldon Richardson. We need to protect our pricey QB.’

        • Volume12 says:

          PC & JS fall in love with prospects. And ya know what happens when u fall in love in football? U get ur heart broken.

          • Volume12 says:

            ‘Stop taking the guys froj the list that TC gives them to draft.’ And so they take an O-lineman this year who TC never met in the 2nd round and… he’s on the bench.

        • Trevor says:

          +1 agree completely.

        • C-Dog says:

          Yeah, honestly, I’m not as bent up against Tom Cable as much as other fans. I do wonder if sometimes players have been chosen as starters based on potential over present ability, and those whether those where decisions made by Cable or the HC. Drew Nowak over Lem, Glowinski over Aboushi, etc. That’s where I’d like to be a fly on the wall.

        • MSL says:

          That’s one guess. The other is that Cable is in their office saying, “Check out this really cool basketball player. He has a great brain and I’ll have to retrain anyone we draft anyways, so lets get this kid.” We’re just guessing what the truth is, but there is zero actual proof that we’ve been better off with him than without him.

          • Rob Staton says:

            The Seahawks have talked often about how they discovered George Fant. Some of JS’s scouts found tape of his pro-day. They added him as an ‘athlete’ as an UDFA. Cable wasn’t in the office championing to bring him in.

            • MSL says:

              That’s just one example, but it doesn’t change the point that Cable likely has plenty of say in who he’s getting.

              • Rob Staton says:

                Like all coaches, he will have input. But way too much is made of his influence on their decisions, like PCJS just cede to him. They don’t.

                • MSL says:

                  Do you really think JS saw a guy like Sweezy and was like, “well I didn’t like any of the OL in the draft, so here is this DL player. Have fun and good luck.” ? Seems unlikely. In my mind Cable is clearly overestimating his abilities and saying “Just get me a guy with these measurables and I’ll coach them up.” Even if the scouts are out looking for these “athletes” now, that’s only because they think Cable wants or can do something with them. I just don’t like them wasting seasons (of RW and this D’s prime) to find out if they can play.

                  • Rob Staton says:

                    I think Cable was asked to check out Sweezy, he did, and then said he could work with him (and made a success of it). That doesn’t mean he scoured college football looking for converts does it? I think people try too hard to find ways to criticise TC.

                  • MSL says:

                    Tom Cable: “You see these big bodies and think, ‘He’s 6-5, 300, and his arm is (this long),’ and you watch him, and he’s not a finisher, he doesn’t strain, he can’t stay balanced, he can’t play with leverage. You see all these negatives and think, I can get a (defensive) guy who runs a little faster, jumps a little higher, that’s got an aggressive streak in him. At least I can see that on defense. I’m going to have to re-train an offensive lineman that’s coming out of college right now anyway.”

                    The scouts wouldn’t be looking at defensive lineman to play OL unless the OL coach is telling them to. I think you try to hard to defend TC.

                  • Rob Staton says:

                    None of this counters what I’ve said. Cable, clearly asked here about converting D-liners, talks about why it can work. And? It doesn’t mean he spends the off-season looking for potential converts. That’s an absurd suggestion. John Schneider and Tom Cable have constantly talked about this process in public. Cable is given a list of guys to check out (like any other position scout) and he gives his feedback. Sometimes that involves public workouts. We even know what his physical ideals are as he’s gone through that. There’s very little we don’t know about the process.

                    Also, I’m not defending Cable. I’ve criticised the offense like everyone else since week one. The difference is I don’t just shout ‘fire Cable’ or ‘fire Bevell’. I try and look for what’s not working, look for discussion points and reasons to be optimistic or disappointed. And most importantly, judge everything with sufficient perspective and context, which sadly is so lacking when these talking points come up.

      • Mancunian Dave says:

        I do believe we will see a lot more of Darboh from here on in. He couldn’t show a lot in training camp because of an injury. I think we should suspend too much judgement on Procise and McEvoy for their drops. Everyone can have the one off game. If they do it in the next game however…it’s like looking at JG, two games of indifferent play and a pattern forms. Meanwhile has Kasen Williams actually been active for the Browns yet?

  43. Totem_Hawk says:

    Wish we had TJ Lang at RG instead “tough guy, grinder” Glowinski. Hindsight is a great thing…looking like passing on Kevin King twice and trading down for McDowell was a straight bust of a move…hope they can overcome whiffing on half their draft picks this year and dud FA’s like Eddie Lacy…time will tell

    • Ishmael says:

      Come on dude, Lang and his wife are both from Michigan. He was going to come to Seattle before they made him an offer he couldn’t turn down. And if Seattle had matched that they might have gone up again.

      Griffin has been totally fine so far, just as good as King from what I’ve seen. How are you going to know McDowell would potto himself on an ATV?

  44. neil says:

    After this game the question has to be asked, ” did pc screw up in keeping McEvoy over Williams? ” also it would be nice to hear RW say ” yeah I played a lousey game ” once in a while. I fined his forced optimism all the time annoying.

    • Volume12 says:

      His mechanics seem off to me.

      • C-Dog says:

        I thought he started out well, but got frazzled after a while. I’ve seen some takes that have been pretty critical, but on one first half pass competition from the pocket, Ifedi didn’t hardly move his feet at all and the left end hit Wilson in full sprint. I think it was ghosts for a good while after that play.

      • MSL says:

        Left overs from the injuries last season? Seems reasonable that he had to adjust his mechanics to play last year, and might be struggling to get them back now. I’ve been surprised though after he looked so sharp in the preseason.

    • Rob Staton says:

      Focusing on the positives is one of the things elite athletes do consistently — and it helps keep them mentally stable during a long season.

  45. Volume12 says:

    4 of the top 7 rushers in the NFL are rookies.

    1st Kareem Hunt
    3rd Dalvin Cook
    5th Leonard Fournette
    7th Chris Carson

    PC also said their RBs are missing reads.

    Said Carson reminds him of another 32 but I can’t figure out who.

  46. Ishmael says:

    Kasen Williams can’t even make the Browns match day squad.

    Like Wilson would have been throwing contested balls at him in a real game anyway. It’s not what he does.

  47. vrtkolman says:

    Anything else still think Prosise runs way too upright? That checkdown 3rd and 9 conversion he made was pretty nice, but then he got trucked by little Jimmy Ward. I hope he stays healthy this year but he doesn’t seem to defend his body at all.

  48. Kyle says:

    I was disgusted like all of us at this performance… But now looking at it, i’m just upset.
    DB called a much better game. Rolling Russ out a lot more and have him run the rock a bit over the long 5-7 step plays helped. Russ wasn’t on fire, but two easy TDs were dropped when he hit them right where they needed it. I counted at least three 3rd down drops that looked like easy chain movers happen. That is not on bevell or on TC or on Russ. The run game needs Russ to run to be effective. Think back to 24, Russ was doing the read option a lot with him. It opened up holes for 24 and kept the defense on its heels. Yes, Lynch created his own a lot, but don’t think his success wasn’t helped by the read option as well. We get back to that and roll outs we will start seeing our explosive pass plays come back.

    I have repeatedly been upset with TC and still am. Id like him to stop calling the run plays and hand that over to DB. But thats not his choice, nor is it DB. Pete needs to release a bit. I still wouldn’t mind finding a new OL coach at seasons end. One who does more smashmouth like the titans. More Man on man blocking vs this zone read, but thats because i believe pete wants to keep his OL young and cheap. I think zone read is the best blocking scheme but extremely hard to master, so with that move to a mano e mano style blocking scheme to lessen the learning curve for these guys.

    My 2 cents right there. I think we will get better, and the whole OL coach removal OC removal need to be shelved for the season. I have the right to change my mind, but who would we bring in to change anything at this point in the season? Give me a name of a guy who is out there right now that can be brought in and teach these guys his style before our next game? Cant be done.

    • Logan Lynch says:

      Agree with your last paragraph especially. At this point, we’re “stuck” with Cable and Bevell for better or worse. They committed to them again last offseason and that’s when the lion’s share of installation of the offense/scheme happens. There is absolutely no way another OC could come in and install a new offense right now and be effective.
      They would just use what Bevell has already cooked up with a varied playcalling style which may or may not work.

      I wasn’t able to watch the game yesterday, but it sounds like Bevell did try to call the game differently. It also sounds like the OL was slightly less terrible. I’ve read Rees got beaten a few times and Glow looked pretty bad overall, but I didn’t see the other 3 mentioned specifically for anything egregious. Britt playing better is expected. Joeckel should hopefully improve as he begins to trust his knee. And is Ifedi starting to play consistently better? Not saying he’s great, but anything consistently positive is a step in the right direction.

      To me it seems that the biggest problems were the drops and RW’s inaccurate throws on a few occasions. Hate to say it, but sometimes those things just happen. They persevered and won. I’d rather have an “ugly win” than a “pretty loss” any day.

    • Smitty1547 says:

      Remember when C2K Chris Johnson was running wild for Tennessee, that was when Vince Young was there QB, not the best QB but he was a running threat that kept the D honest. Once they benched Young, Johnson was just another good back but definitely not great. Wilson and the read option for sure helped Lynch go from good to great.

    • AlaskaHawk says:

      Of course we are stuck with the offensive staff that is in place now. The question is – if they have a crappy ending to the season, will the change finally get made? Because many teams (Denver) would have changed offensive coaches after the superbowl loss. Instead we fans are forced to watch the slow torture of the offense becoming worse and worse.

      At this point = I don’t have faith that the offensive coaches can draw up good pass plays. Or use existing players in ways that are beneficial to their abilities. Especially in the tight end category, which appears to be mostly an extra blocker who can sometimes catch the ball. How about getting an offensive coordinator from a team that actually passes first and runs second??

  49. Trevor says:

    You can question some of the things Sherm says but his toughness mentally and physically is second to none! He always shows up and you have to respect that.

    • Old but Slow says:

      And he is probably the most secure tackling CB in the league. He is unerring (nobody is perfect, but he’s close) in breaking down and making clean hits. And that is while being a great coverage back. He is not a speedy CB, but he anticipates well, so he does not get beat deep very often.

      Nearly all of the criticism he gets is about his persona. He comes off as brash and righteous. But, to me, he is thoughtful and intelligent, and most of what he says has merit. He can be an irritant, mostly because he says publicly what he thinks. In my opinion he would make a great congressman.

      And, he is not even my favorite player. Not that I have one. How could I?

  50. EP says:

    It’s very easy after a few disappointing results to turn around and call for a change. Being a fan of Arsenal (anyone who follows the premier league will understand) my immediate reactions to the start of this season where very similar to the start of this NFL season. Poor results turn fans against the manger, the organisation and even some of the players. After such a long offseason filled with hope we are immediately brought back to reality with the realisation that we are not perfect and that other teams actually happen to be good as well. However, a season is not defined in the first two games, especially in this case as we have actually won a game. Changing coordinators and coaches this early on is a ludicrous idea in my opinion. It’s fair to criticise them and seriously question them but to replace them this early would be a mistake, 2 games is not entirely representative of the potential of our offence this season, something that they have been working together on and learning all offseason. To bring in another coordinator with a completely new playbook would be disastrous and as some people have previously mentioned the onus for the bad play may lie on the players shoulders or on Pete Carroll and his commitment to his philosophy. It’s very normal for teams to start off slow and come flying out the gates by the midpoint of the season, look at Green Bay last year. Our season is just beginning, let’s be honest it can’t exactly get worse from here on in.

    • EP says:

      Not a huge arsenal fan btw, they’re my English team. Big fan of Celtic up here in Scotland. Would be lovely if the Seahawks could replicate the seasons they’ve been having up here recently.

  51. Hi Rob great article my first thought there is a lot of bad offensive lines in the NFL these days in fact green bay looked pretty crappy last night they had no tackle’s and A R is mobile QB.but my thoughts are the seahawks spend their money on the defense side of the ball we am have to win a lot of ugly games this year

    • GerryG says:

      Seattle spends $$ on the D side of the ball because they have generational talent there.

      They spend big $ on RW, 89 & 88, and spent big $ previously on Harvin, Lynch, Rice. They just extended Britt, they extended Unger years back. What O-Lineman has left via FA that was worth them keeping for big $?

  52. Adog says:

    When there is poor execution at the quarterback position…and that has been the case for the first two games…it magnifies the o-line and running back positions where inexperience is glaring. Perhaps when Carrol and schneider put together this team this year…they did so under the assumption that Wilson would play much better. Although I came to despise the read option run game as of late when it has been ineffective…i admired it when it was effective. At that point during the super bowl years the read option looked innovative and hard to stop. It also made an average o-line look above average…along with every other player on the offense besides the tight end. Well the inflation has come back to reality. Carroll and Schneider were prescient to see that the read option would be countered by hybrid safety/linebackers. So how do they move their offense forward? With physical players that tilt the field…ala lynch and Graham. Jimmy made sense in a lynch centric offense…does he make sense in a offense that can barely hold itself upright against the defensive line? Look….it’s time to face the music…wilson is a great athlete that translates into an average quarterback. The offense should be operated accordingly. Throw half the play book out and let the defense win the game.

  53. Stephen Pitell says:

    Wow, what tough job monitoring all of these negative Nelly’s, but you do it well, and eventually you turn this crowd into something worth reading.

    Bevel adjusted and gave us what we asked for after last week. Though drops killed off our TD’s, I was encouraged by the offensive output and control of the clock. Wilson could be better, but he will have bad games once in a while.

    For me, what I learned from this week is that our offensive IDENTITY is founded on the threat of Wilson running. Perhaps we should run a few more read-option runs in the first quarter just to set the tone.

    I do remember last year when Wilson was unable to run and passed from the pocket like Manning. I’m not sure if that was an outlier or what, but for now, as long as Wilson is able, I believe he needs to threaten opponents defense with some early running to allow CC something other than 8 and 9 men in the box.

    • Rob Staton says:

      The read option, IMO, has to be a focal point of the offense. Maybe not every week, but it’s what they should be leaning on when things get ugly.

      • Trevor says:

        +1 particularly if we play GB again in playoffs

      • C-Dog says:

        Yes, yes, yes.

      • MSL says:

        Agree. Not utilizing one of Russ’ biggest strengths (hi legs) is just as sickening as not utilizing Graham correctly. Once again, I think this leads back to Bevell. Maybe it’s Pete acting as the puppet master, but I don’t see it in these cases.

      • AlaskaHawk says:

        Agree with the read option but the check down back needs to be further down the field. Russ’s choices seem to be either run the ball, throw to the short receiver who is near the original line, or throw a long pass on the run. Should be some more short to intermediate options.

    • Ukhawk says:

      I’m more bullish than most & think this was a step in the right direction

      It’s going to take some time: Many guys coming back from injury, FAs being integrated, some starting in new spots, rookies etc. 4 new OL positions, 1 not expected to start, 1 recovering from knee surgery & 2 moving spots.

      I’m happy some things are working out: Lots of players back healthy, rookies starting esp Griffen/Carson. Richardson looks disruptive. These 2 new additions could truly take the defense back to its heyday. Depth is way better. Defense looks awesome.

      Never felt nervous on Sunday. Felt Hawks were in control for the entire game albeit not scorewise. Only now need some momentum, consistency, & time together. Loved the TOP advantage.

      Also think the O is going to get a bit mad. Baldwin looks furious they are not performing & im just waiting for someone to blow up & call for all to step up. You know they play best with their backs against the wall.

  54. Mark Souza says:

    Rob, I’m glad you see improvement in the O-line. I don’t, not that they can’t get there, and by there, I mean passable, middling, pedestrian. One of the biggest problems I see is Darrel Bevel and his asinine play calling. If we want improvement in the line, we need to dedicate the offense to the run. Let the O-line impose their will, push on the opponent.

    Instead we focus our offense on their weakness, pass protection in a pass happy offense. Pass protection is passive in nature, it’s the act of reacting to your opponent and trying to stop them from getting by you. If we want them to grow together and experience small victories as a unit, run the ball. Let them charge ahead and take it to the defense for a change. I will gladly suffer three and outs if those three plays were all runs. They may lose some of the initial battles, but late in the game after they’ve been hammering on the defense for a while, that’s when the dividends come. Control the ball, control the clock, control the game.

    One other thing, I know you weren’t high on Ethan Pocic in the preseason, but I was. What I saw was a man who didn’t miss his assignment, who didn’t lose his match-up, who didn’t stop until after the whistle blew. He reminds me of Brenno Giaccomini after Brenno learned to reign it in enough to not draw flags. Pocic has that same ability to win and get under the opponent’s skin. Surely there are people on that line that aren’t irreplaceable. I want to see the kid get his shot. It’s too bad that it’ll probably take an injury for it to happen.

    • C-Dog says:

      I thought Pocic showed up well in pass pro, but wasn’t a mauler in run blocking. An offseason getting stronger might turn him into a really good player somewhere on the line.

  55. Coleslaw says:

    Hey Rob, I’m wondering if there’s anybody that’s really surprised you so far ether good or bad. Also, how long till Pocic forces his way into the starting lineup?

    • Rob Staton says:

      I wasn’t overly impressed with Pocic in pre-season to be honest.

      I think the biggest surprise so far is that, despite Wilson’s return to health, the offense has looked so disjointed and lacking cohesion. It needs to improve, fast.

      • Coleslaw says:

        I hadn’t thought of it like that..

        I think Graham looks like he belongs next to a fire hydrant with some dirt kicked on him.. is he even trying? I can’t believe this is the guy they hyped up all off-season.

  56. Trevor says:

    If you want to see the impact of a co-coordinator look no further than Mike Mccoy in Denver. Same players and weapons but very different looking offense.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I’ve addressed this in another comment. McCoy is running the offense. His rookie (defensive minded) Head Coach isn’t telling him what the identity is and oh by the way here’s an Assistant Head Coach who gets to run the running game.

      Totally different situations.

      Put Bevell in charge of an offense somewhere, I think he’d do things very differently. He’s running Pete’s offense.

  57. Trevor says:

    I love Russ but with his inconsistency, JS must be having sleepless nights already think about having to pay him 200 mil in a year or two.

    • Matt B. says:

      Trevor, a little counterpoint here, did you see Brady’s stats/plays from week 1 or watch Aaron Rodgers in both week 1/2? Russ is inconsistent and made some bad plays certainly, some of it was on his supporting cast (drops, O-Line issues) and some was on him, but I think it’s not fair to hold him to such a high standard using only two games as benchmarks. If we don’t see improvement in the next few weeks I can get onboard your statement but at this point I prefer to look at the larger sample size of games he’s played and give him the benefit of the doubt for a couple of rough performances.

  58. Ishmael says:

    Think there’s a disconnect between philosophy (PC) – ball control, run dominant, win in the fourth quarter; personnel (JS) – who even knows, some athletes, some brawlers, some finnesse guys, some superstar trade-ins; and scheme (DB) – West Coastish, rhythm based, some spread and read option concepts.

    When it clicks it really clicks. Consistent chunk running yards, explosive plays that take the top off, couple of QB runs to spread them out, defences that are trying to plug holes as fast as they appear. But when it doesn’t click it becomes the scrubby chaotic mess that we’ve seen these last couple of weeks. Run game going nowhere, skittish QB play, reactionary playcalling, and sloppy mistakes.

    It’s a team walking a tightrope. Just have to hope they get the balance figured out sooner rather than later.

  59. Volume12 says:

    Couple stats on some of the ‘rooks.’

    Chris Carson is #2 in the league behind Derrick Henry (3.6) in YAC at 2.6. Ahead of Hunt & Lynch. Damn impressive.

    Shaq Griffin played 14 snaps yesterday, in the slot, gave up 0 catches and wasn’t targeted once.

  60. Volume12 says:

    I don’t know if he’ll fit Seattle’s parameters, but UTEP LG Will Hernandez (6’3, 330) is absolutely nasty! Good lord. Great explosion too. He’s Gabe Jackson with Garrett Holmes mean streak.

    Cool story too. Almost quit football in the 10th grade. His dad wanted him to join the family construction business. Former shotput, discus thrower, and standout wrestler. Was recruited by USC and Arizona as well but they didn’t want to wait for him to qualify academically. UTEP did. Their HC is a former O-line coach for the Steelers.

    He also trains with a World’s Strongest Man competitor. Could’ve turned pro last year but promised his grandma as a SO in HS that he’d get a college degree.

  61. Ceasar says:

    Not the best performance but….if receivers catch the CATCHABLE balls then they likely win by 2TDs. The drops are not characteristic of this team. If it continues into next game then I may start worrying but not yet. This poor offensive performance I place on the receivers with a distant second the OL. They weren’t great but they are young and will continue to give inconsistent play until mid season. Go Carson!

  62. GerryG says:

    I still find it hard to believe they are going to face the Titans with only 3 DTs