Kirwan & Miller present intriguing mock scenario

April 7th, 2017 | Written by Rob Staton

Pat Kirwan and Jim Miller of SiriusXM NFL Radio have put together a two round mock draft that included quite an aggressive approach by the Seahawks:

Here’s a breakdown of Seattle’s moves:

— Traded Richard Sherman and pick #106 to Tennessee for the #18 pick

— Traded pick #26 to the Titans (who’d already moved down from #5 to #11), receiving picks #41, #77 and #106 in exchange

— Traded picks #58 and #77 to the New York Jets for pick #39

So after all that, they moved Richard Sherman and picked three times in the top-40.

It’s all a bit Madden ’17 but it’s still pretty fun and interesting.

Here’s how they used the picks and what they had left:

#18 — Ryan Ramcyzk (T, Wisconsin)
#39 — Adoree’ Jackson (CB, USC)
#41 — Ahkello Witherspoon (CB, Colorado)
#90 (R3)
#102 (R3 comp)
#106 (R3 comp)
#210 (R6)
#226 (R7)

There are obviously a few things to contend here. For starters, I wouldn’t expect Adoree’ Jackson to last this long. Marlon Humphrey, Kevin King, Chidobe Awuzie and Jarrad Davis also fall into round two. And if the Seahawks were being aggressive in trading up twice, going up to get Humphrey or King would appear to be the stronger play rather than trading up for Ahkello Witherspoon.

The mock overall though highlights a possible talent drop-off in the late second round — and part of John Schneider’s lukewarm review of the draft class might be in part due to this. Are they going to have to be aggressive to try and manipulate extra picks in the top-50 this year, or risk coming away with a class without impact players? Maybe.

That said, this would be quite an interesting way to possibly upgrade the roster despite losing a player of Richard Sherman’s undoubted quality. You get an addition at left or right tackle (Kirwan has Seattle taking Ramcyzk but they could’ve picked Bolles or Lamp too), you get one of the most dynamic impact players in the draft (Jackson) to play the slot and you get a tall athletic outside corner (Witherspoon).

And if you moved into position to get Humphrey or King instead of Witherspoon, even better.

If you get a talented outside corner to replace Sherman, Jackson in the slot and further bolstered your O-line — that’s a semblance of a plan to try and galvanise this team minus Sherman.

Of course it’d be quite unprecedented to see a team make this many trades. It’s something to ponder though, especially if Seattle does end up dealing their #1 cornerback.

Meanwhile, I’d highly recommend reading this piece by Jason La Canfora on the Sherman/Marshawn Lynch situation. La Canfora has a reputation for accurate reporting on the Seahawks and this article contains quotes from John Schneider.

Here’s the most interesting part:

You can only pay three of your four starting defensive backs top-of-the-market money for so long and the Seahawks could use more balance in the cap and cash spending. They still have a big need along the offensive line and redirecting resources there over the next few years to preserve franchise quarterback Russell Wilson is in order. That money has to come from somewhere.

Sherman just turned 29 and is one of the highest-paid corners in the game and thatโ€™s a position where Seattle should be best positioned to turn another mid-round pick into a potential impact starter. In the age of Moneyball, thatโ€™s an efficiency they should be able to cash-in on. They might not find another Sherman, but, for a tenth of the money, maybe they get something fairly close over the next year or two.

So if this is an educated guess instead of a mere assertion, we might see more money spent on the O-line (or at least further draft stock) and a confidence from within Seattle’s front office to find an adequate replacement for Sherman.

And if nothing else, the article does little to quell the recent talk of a potential trade.

178 Responses to “Kirwan & Miller present intriguing mock scenario”

  1. Bill says:

    I can’t see trading Sherman for an injured, short -armed OT that couldn’t work out at the combine.
    For a decent, established OT, yes. They don’t need more youth at the O-Line.

  2. Misfit74 says:

    That would be terrible. Especially considering I’d rather have a number of other players at our native pick (26) than Ramcyzk at 18.

    Adoree at 26 I’m fine with also.

    It’s a net loss and that’s not including the fact we lose one of our top defenders / our top CB / a still elite player.

  3. Trevor says:

    Change Ramzyk for Bolles and Witherspoon for King and that would set up our roster for another SB run.

    Bolles, King Jackson would be a dream draft. Add the $21 mill in cap savings from trading Sherm to extend Kam, Britt and Jimmy and it could be a great off season.

  4. Trevor says:

    I have never seen this much trade talk about a star player and then it not happen.

    Hard to believe as Sherm / Beast Mode were the face of that championship team and both will likely be playing elsewhere next year.

    • Hughz says:

      We better get used to it. These are the type of moves the patriots make to consistently be competitive.

      • Michael says:

        Sherman vs. Seymour: Let’s whip out our Richards and compare them…

        Both 3x All-Pro players
        Both Making $10+ MM a year
        Both 29 years of age
        Both teams 3 seasons removed from last SB victory
        Both named Richard…

        Ya, this might be a little something like the Pats would do.

  5. Ground_Hawk says:

    If Seattle made a move to grab the top OL prospect, it would be disappointing if they did it for Ramcyzk.

    • Trevor says:

      Agree completely! Bolles or Lamp are the only two I would want in round #1.

      Bolles really would be the dream pick if we somehow got #18 from Tenn.

      • BobbyK says:

        In looking at Lamp some more… why can’t he play LT? Is it because his arms are too short, like Joe Thomas? Is that the only justifiable reason? Why weren’t his arms too short when he played well against Alabama?

        • Jujus says:

          Well I believe that alabama doesnt have any edge rushers that fit the typical edge guy length in the NFL, the athlete like Cliff avril who can dominate with his speed and length.

  6. DLep says:

    Yeah I think Im w you Rob and the general thinking of the board – no to Ramcyzk. I do like the trade to get 18 but would take one of Lamp or King. Then at 26 take Obi or Jackson. Now that would be a home run scenario almost regardless of what happens with the rest of the draft.

  7. Trevor says:

    Interesting note Kirwan and Pete are incredibly close. If a guy like him is spending this kind of time talking about trade scenarios it is a lot more than talk.

    No matter how good our draft is however our defensive backfield next year will not be a good. No rookie can come in and play at Sherms level.

    The draft picks and cap room will improve us longer term and extend our SB window IMO

    • Nick says:

      I agree. But here’s the thing: if we can have both a top 10 defense and a top 10 offense (very conceivable) that puts us in an incredible situation to get to a Super Bowl.

      Will we be a top 3 defense? No, most probably not. But we’ve been spoiled for so long with this D.

      • Trevor says:

        Great point and I agree completely.

      • Josh says:

        Our offense has been underrated and our defense overrated for a while now. Our offense has helped the defense by controling the ball and not turning the ball over. Well, until this past year anyway. We’ve spent a ton of draft capital on offense recently. Time for defense if thats where the value is.

        • Del tre says:

          There were 3 games where the Hawks failed to score a touchdown. I would say the offense has declined more than the defense.

          • Hawk Eye says:

            Offense could be good. but o line did not allow it to be good
            as for the D, no one was afraid of it last year

  8. Bill says:

    If King last into the 2nd round like this mock shows, it would be very disappointing if Seattle does not make a move to go get him.

    Don’t know how many here have seen the interesting site: mockdraftable.com , It shows how dominant Kevin King’s measurables are in a graphical format.
    Link:

    https://www.mockdraftable.com/search?position=CB&beginYear=2017&endYear=2017&sort=DESC&page=1&measurable=height

  9. Del tre says:

    Rob i must say i think you are dead wrong on Witherspoon. He would be a great value added, I prefer him to King honestly, his coverage and press abilities are just that much better, but he may be more likely to go to a team that runs more man coverage. BUT, i respect thatyou are so devoted to finding the Seahawks pick and i trust that you just don’t think the FO is interested.
    However, Rasul Douglas is more likely to be a Seahawks than King or Witherspoon in my opinion. He is a better tackler than King (yes king made some splash plays, but Rasul had 70 in a season, thats higher than even Shermanin college), and if the Hawks need to teach both the kick step and how to press, i don’t think they will view the two prospects as that vastly different. I think the advantage may even further go to Dougls because he is working in a 3-3-5 scheme, so just like the Seahawks they are really relying on coverage sacks.
    If this trade did happen, i would think the Hawks might trade back down to 24 giving Oakland Marshawn along with 18 to get the 24th pick, and Oaklands 2nd rounder. That gets the Hawks 3 picks in the first 2 rounds. Or even better, give Oakland a 3rd and Marshawn for their second rounder.

    • Trevor says:

      I love the trade back idea with Oak if you could get thier 2nd it would be an ideal scenario

      • Del tre says:

        I figure the fair asking price for Marshawn is about a 3rd so he should be adequate value added to merit a 2nd so long as he is paired with something else

        • Jason says:

          How is he worth a 3rd?

          • Del tre says:

            To Oakland he’s worth a third. They actually have an offensive line. He’s a veteran player with damn near a hall of fame career. Oakland also really wants marshawn, more than any 3rd round running back they could get.

            • Dutchenstein12 says:

              You are dreaming if you think they will give us a 3rd. We will be lucky to get a 6th. There is only 1 team Beast wants to play for and everyone knows it. We can’t afford to have him on our roster and Oakland knows it. We will most likely get a 7th or they will wait for us to release him.

    • Bill says:

      I’m all-in on Douglas, but they might have to move up some in the 3rd to get him.

      • Del tre says:

        Yeah he is a tough one to pinpoint in terms of draft stock. He has a lot to learn but also has such impressive numbers on a difficult schedule and in a scheme that relies on coverage. Yet Worley in Carolina came from the same scheme at 6’2 running a 4.4 and lasted until the 4th round last year.

    • DLep says:

      Just one guy’s take, but there are some analytics backing it up

      https://draftcobern.wordpress.com/2017/03/07/2017-nfl-draft-analytics-profile-kevin-king/

      https://draftcobern.wordpress.com/2017/03/15/2017-nfl-draft-analytics-profile-ahkello-witherspoon/

      Witherspoon has a very solid profile, King has a potential future star profile.

      • Del tre says:

        Thats an excellent way to determine the likelihood but they both fill out a lot the criteria there.
        https://draftcobern.wordpress.com/2017/03/16/2017-nfl-draft-analytics-profile-rasul-douglas/
        Just trying to say there are other options than King at a lower price. I’d be happy to get them both, especially if Sherman is going to be traded.
        Also like i said above Witherdpoon may be better suited for a man scheme, i really think Douglas is going to be in consideration for the hawks because of his tackling and interception numbers.
        Also that is a great tool, I’ll be looking at those more often now so thank you for that. Have you found any sleeper draft picks that yhe Hawks could target with it? It seems like an excellent means to find late round guys

      • Awsi Dooger says:

        Thanks for those draftcobern links. Very interesting.

        I took a look at many of his analytic profiles. I love litmus tests, based on my Las Vegas background. My friends and I would quickly evaluate newcomers to the sports betting scene based on a handful of questions, to see if their input was likely to be worthwhile. Of course, we’s slip the questions into the conversation at various points instead of presenting it as a test.

        The player I use as litmus test this time is Jamal Adams. For the life of me I don’t understand how he is rated so highly. Good solid player but I think I’d get the shakes and turn off the television if my favorite team drafted him in the range he is projected.

        I grew up watching Dick Anderson and Jake Scott with the Dolphins. Then I went to school at USC during the Ronnie Lott/Dennis Smith era, with the incomparable Kenny Easley across town at UCLA. USC is an confident/arrogant school but Easley was so mega respected for years that nobody in the USC program was asserting Lott as superior to Easley, or even his equal. I wrote the draft articles for the Daily Trojan. I interviewed Lott the day before the draft in 1981 inside Heritage Hall. When I asked him if he thought he was as good as Easley he turned his head and looked at me like I was nuts. Younger fans don’t realize the pecking order of those two as collegians, or entering the draft. That’s why I was so thrilled that Easley finally made the Hall of Fame. BTW, Ronnie Lott thought he was going to be picked by the St. Louis Cardinals. That might have changed NFL history just a little bit. The Cardinals went with E.J. Junior instead, a linebacker from Alabama.

        I think I know safeties. That’s what I’m getting at. As a Miamian and lifelong Canes fan I still can’t believe Ed Reed slipped so deep in that first round. As the late Joel Buchsbaum properly summarized, Reed “makes big plays and bigger plays.” Yes, and that applies to Malik Hooker in this draft. It does not describe Jamal Adams. In a passing league I don’t understand how a guy with modest instincts and ball skills can be prescribed to the top 5 or 10 picks at safety. He may be a great guy and team leader. Swell. It’s being overvalued compared to his skill set.

        draftcobern has a logical analytical summary of Jamal Adams, that he projects to good free safety or good strong safety but not great. Likewise I was attracted to this site when I noticed Rob’s early season 2016 evaluation of the best prospects from last September. He listed four who stood out as elite and Jamal Adams topped his most overrated list, with a notation that he simply didn’t stand out on tape. That’s the way I see it and I always love early evaluations as opposed to obsession with the most recent opinion or bit of information. Everything tends to drift back to the beginning.

        • Ishmael says:

          Part of the thing with Adams is his character. The dude is a leader, a rare leader at that. For a team struggling to put things together, he’ll drag them there.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I didn’t say Witherspoon would be a bad pick. I just think Humphrey and King are superior.

      • Del tre says:

        Fair enough, like i said i trust your analysis as being an attempt to figure out what the Hawks are doing. I sure appreciate all the work you do providing this great content.

        • Greg Haugsven says:

          Witherspoon would be good but not at 41. Way to early.

          • Del tre says:

            I think he would be worth it at 56. But i think Rasul Douglas might fit the mold they are looming for with players who can create turnovers and help in run support. I would trade up for douglas using our comp picks.

          • BobbyK says:

            If a player is legitimately “good,” you can’t pick them “too early.”

            • Greg Haugsven says:

              I don’t get what your saying Bobby. For example Isaac Asiata is good but would you draft him at 26.

  10. Trevor says:

    Sherm for the Titans for #18 and a 4th round pick.

    #18 Kevin King

    #26 Adoree Jackson

    Rd#2 Tyus Bowser

    Rd#3 Daeshon Hall

    Rd#3 comp Issac Assiata

    Rd #3 comp Tewan Taylor

    Rd #4 from Titans George Kittle

    Rd#6 Small School DT prospect

    Rd#7 OT developmental prospect

    • STTBM says:

      I dont know Taylor, I’d like to see Luani there or later. Other than that, I like your Draft, dude! Not really sure Seattle gets 18 PLUS a fourth, or that they even want a fourth. They want a decent high pick and a player–likely OL, DT, or WR.

      I do still want Obi Melifonwu though, but King/Jackson/Bowser/Hall with Asiata AND Kittle?! That would be a haul…

      Still hate thinking of Sherm elsewhere…

    • bigten says:

      I would rather make the trade with houston that washington made in the twitter scenario. Then we pick king at 25, adore at 26

    • DLep says:

      Championship! Lol.

      • DLep says:

        In all seriousness, King and Jackson would be insanely awesome. I question whether Bowser will be available at our pick in the second though. And Assiata and Taylor (who I do love) seem to be trending towards late 2nd early 3rd. If we got those two, wow. Id throw Siragusa in there as an option.

  11. Totem_Hawk says:

    Giving up a 2nd round pick to swap spots and move up 4 places in round 1 is just totally too expensive. Maybe that is market value but too rich for my blood if i’m Cincinnati.

    • Del tre says:

      If there is a guy there that the team feels they need, and they don’t think they can get him because of one of the teams in front of them they will be desperate. Cinci just might be desperate.

      • Totem_Hawk says:

        But Cincy isn’t a playoff team. I could see if it was the Cowboys or Packers who feel they are 1 guy away, but Cincy needs a few guys..a 2nd round pick is a big pick..

        • Del tre says:

          Thats fair. I’m not too clear on what exactly went wrong with Cinci becausw they were good the year before.

  12. AndrewP says:

    As time moves on, it looks like a trade might just happen. So, Curious what the boards minimum value in a trade for Sherman would be?

    Mine:
    Top 40 pick this year
    Conditional 4th next year

    I would also not be opposed to this scenario thrown out above where they package him and a later pick to move up in the draft.

    Those that would not trade him under any circumstances need not reply to this.

    • Bigten says:

      Nothing less than a mid first or a first plus player/otherpick for me. I’m thinking patriots with get 32 for butler and they trade the 32 and future pick for sherm. And for Marshawn we will flip 1sts allowing us to jump Houston and be a trade partner for a QB needy team to getin front of houston

    • Overtime says:

      Sherm to TENN for #18 + Jack Conklin.

  13. Sea Mode says:

    @JordanRaanan

    Among those attending Giants local pro day is UNH RB Dalton Crossan. Attracted lot of interest lately. Private workouts w/Seahawks + 49ers.

    5:40 AM – 7 Apr 2017

    He’s 5-foot-11 and 204 pounds. He ran a 4.46 second 40-yard dash, 6.83 second three-cone drill, 4.06 second 20-yard shuttle and recorded a 35 inch vertical.

    First working out Brandon Wilson at RB, now checking out this guy. Seems they are looking for depth at KR postion.

    Patriots worked him out too.

    Here’s a link:
    http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/could-dalton-crossan-be-the-next-chris-hogan-021517

  14. LeoSharp says:

    If the seahawks believe Obi Melifonwu can be an outside CB then he’ll be the pick if he’s available. Missing on him they may look at Shaquill Griffin in the 3rd. Of the 2nd round corners are not long or do not have the seeminlgy prioritised athletic traits. Both of these guys have had private workouts so are likely to be players the seahawks are genuinely interested in.

  15. BobbyK says:

    My mind is a bit boggled by the thought of teams passing on Humphrey enough times for him to end up in the second round.

    Our 3 CBs last year were great (Sherm), not great (Shead), and especially not great (Lane). Teams didn’t have to throw at Sherman because the other two were so bad.

    Even if we lose Sherman, we can still improve the overall CB situation. If we lost Sherman, but added King and Humphrey (or Jackson and Obi or some combination of two studs), we could still take a step forward even if Sherman is still, by far, better than any individual CB we have for ’17.

    Ramcyzk may not be sexy, but the LT situation isn’t exactly stable. Right now they have a guy who was a failure at LT for three years before getting kicked inside to guard AND coming off major surgery. Plus, LT has been so bad that they gave that guy $7 million. I don’t think we should act so surprised if they do take an offensive tackle.

    • Donald says:

      Shead is better than you think. He is a just as good as Byron Maxwell was in 2013 when healthy. A solid #2 on this team, and a good #1 CB on most teams. I don’t understand the non- appreciation of him.

      • Jusjamn says:

        Maybe because Shead got burned more often then toast. The guy showed promise early, but then got lost a lot. Same story with Lane. He looked good before injury, then not so much when he came back.

  16. Mike says:

    King & Obi at #18 and #26 would be my preference if that Sherman trade comes true…

    • DLep says:

      This times 1000

      • nichansen01 says:

        +1

        • Sea Mode says:

          I am on board with pretty much any wheeling and dealing that land us King + Obi!

          • DLep says:

            If we traded Sherman and drafted King and Obi I think it would be one of those deals where we would take a step back for one year and then year 2 and for the next 2-3 years after we would be happy in the end that it happened.

            • Stephen H. Pitell says:

              Trade Sherman for #18 and trade that down for more draft picks. Then everything falls our way with other teams stocking up on WR’s, QB’s, and TE’s, and we get Obi, King, and Adoree Jackson. Our new all rookie CB’s. (Yes, this is mostly just a joke)

    • lil'stink says:

      We don’t keep #26, though

  17. JT says:

    Adam Schefter now reporting that “it has been (his) understanding all along” that Richard Sherman “initiated this” and asked to be traded.

    Good luck finding greener grass Sherm.

  18. KingRajesh says:

    I was doing some thinking last night, trying to get into the mind of Richard Sherman and why he would be doing this garbage now.

    Pure speculation on my part: I think that with Sherman’s ego, he probably sees the team being geared towards Russell Wilson going forward, with big money sunk into the QB position, the WR position (with probably more to come if Lockett keeps developing), the TE position, and (god willing) O-line, and probably doesn’t like that the Seahawks will be Russell Wilson’s team, much like how the Steelers’ are Big Ben’s team, the Packers are Aaron Rodgers’ team, and the Panthers are Cam Newton’s team. The Seahawks were Marshawn Lynch and the Legion of Boom, but those days are over. Soon, Sherman will just be a cog in Russell Wilson’s machine.

    Thus: His time as the face of the franchise is dwindling almost as fast as his interception numbers – to which Sherman is raging against his window of relevance closing.

    • Lord Snow says:

      Here is my guess knowing that:

      – Sherman has a monstrous ego

      – He knows he’s elite

      – Plays for a coach, no other coach, that over the years would be so open and encouraging for Sherman to express his personality

      1. He holds grudges. The Crabtree rant was a classic example of this. I think like a boss that hurts you with criticism, Sherman was deeply hurt and embarassed by Richard last year, esp when it happened in front of his peers

      2. I think him throwing McCray under the bus indicated he didn’t like that guy, or didn’t have a huge amount of respect for his game. Most of us have probably worked on well functioning teams where we didn’t like everyone on that team. It is not unusual.

      3. He is, inside, embarassed over the Jim Moore response, and then the subsequent denial, and there may be some shame there in dealing with the local media. And he knows the pressure from the media will continue to be there as long as he’s a seahawk.

      4. He’s tired of Pete’s Tony Robbins approach to coaching. He appears to be a person who doesn’t like to sweep issues under the rug (see all the BLM talk last year, and his support of Kaepernick, etc) and hit back with all the positive love and energy you can. Petespeak probably annoys him.

      All in all, just seems to boil down to a relationship that has run its course, and he, and the team, feel a change of scenery would be best for both parties.

      • DJ 1/2 Way (Sea/PDX) says:

        Well worded on #3 and #4. I think he is gone for sure, and that the team will be better off.

      • Hawks22Fun says:

        +1

        …I would add how upset it makes me that these players don’t give enough RESPECT to Pete Carroll…

        Who? Richard Sherman and Marshawn Lynch…

        And look, both want off the Seahawks… Marshawn would NEVER have become ‘BeastMode’, or won a ring with the Bills… He would NOT be a potential HOF if it wasn’t for PETE!

        Richard Sherman was a NOBODY!!! He was a 5th round pick with one year CB experience…and Pete, one of the BEST DB coaches EVER, turned him into an Elite player…Sherman on the browns is NOTHING!

        These players and their EGOS need to realize that yes, they put in hard work, but there COACH, Coach Pete Carroll, is responsible for their true success as a team…!

      • MSL says:

        Add that I don’t think he has or can get over the SB loss. Right or wrong, the team needed a scapegoat after 49 and they never got one. There’s a good chance he doesn’t believe in Bevel and/or Richard and the losing reinforces that. Pete is loyal to the players but even more loyal to his staff and Sherman may see it as them or me. Total speculation. They should have fired Bevel.

        • jujus says:

          Kearse is the scapegoat, 3rd and long he dropped a ball that would have given at least a Fg if not a TD, He failed to even block at all vs Browner and he supposedly is a good runblocker? I dont care who it is it was 0 effort.

          Cut Kearse

  19. nichansen01 says:

    Very underwhelming haul. I’m not excited about Ramcyzk or Witherspoon.

    • Lord Snow says:

      Brock annoyed me this morning. He loves Ramczyk. Wants him bad. But he thinks he would be the 5th best tackle in last year’s draft class.

      You trade Sherman for the 5th best tackle in last year’s draft class?

      Doesn’t exactly inspire with excitement.

      • DLep says:

        Yeah that kind of thinking I just dont understand. You go for elite players with elite characteristics, not the equivalent of the 5th best tackle in another draft.

      • Ukhawk says:

        +1
        Was thinking the same thing before the Kirwan mock; which players in the draft do you trade Sherman for? Basically only Garrett (who u won’t get) and Fournette (who u don’t want with Lacey there).

        Trade back, accumulate picks maybe.

      • jujus says:

        I am boycotting 710 til the season starts, im so sick of this Sherman trade narrative they are fueling because he insulted them. Brock liking Rmzyck is just the cherry ontop.

  20. EP says:

    Seattle may regard the CBs on their team very highly. Elliot/Thorpe/Desir could be potential starters in the eyes of Pete Carrol. They may be comfortable letting Sherman leave as they believe they already have a suitable replacement on the team. Any defensive backs drafted this year may have to have a specialty,be it as a big nickel/ buffalo (melifonwu) or as an ace slot corner with offensive and return potential (Jackson)

  21. East Side Stevie says:

    All right fellas Who do you prefer Justin Evans at #58 or Marcus Maye at #90

  22. Coleslaw says:

    Adam Schefter has reported that Richard Sherman indeed initiated the trade talks and wants to go to a contender. Seahawks are honoring his request.
    This is interesting to me. It says the seahawks FO doesn’t want him gone, and that a trade is less likely.Nobody is going to give up market value, and we don’t HAVE to trade him just cause he asked. If we don’t get properly compensated Sherman will not be traded.

    • Lord Snow says:

      But isn’t the question that if he wants out (rather than will accept a trade because football is a business), do you really want that player to be on this team? Esp since the “buyin” philosophy is so important to PC’s coaching style?

      • Lord Snow says:

        For the record I hope Sherm secretly meets with PC at some point, they hug, he’s on board, and he plays out the last two years of his deal, we get a third round comp pick or he resigns an extension at a win/win contract for him and the team….

      • Coleslaw says:

        I don’t think it would be a problem, Sherman knows the business side and that includes sticking out and playing a contract. He still has his brothers here, we are a contender and he’s making big bucks.

  23. lil'stink says:

    If Sherman has to go I actually like how all these trades set us up for the draft. Not sure how much I like the picks they went with, though.

  24. Shadow says:

    A reporter’s unnamed source says that Sherman asked for a trade.

    Sherman’s brother says that he doesn’t want a trade because he doesn’t want to “leave behind that brotherhood.”

    Sources can be wrong. I don’t think we can take it as gospel that Sherman requested a trade without further confirmation. (I have no doubt he’s unhappy with the situation, but that doesn’t mean he requested a trade just as it didn’t mean Michael Bennett requested a trade to Atlanta two years ago when he was unhappy with his situation, despite reports from a source that he had done just that.)

  25. Misfit74 says:

    I might be able to see something like this better if it were for a guy like Reddick, Lattimore, etc, but I think the talent at 26 will be comparable to what you find at 18. I’m totally fine with Obi, King, or Adoree at 26 vs what you lose to move up in rnd 1. I’d love OJ Howard or Corey Davis but I think a move up for either is highly unlikely.

  26. Martin says:

    Just wondering why Tr’davious White isn’t being mocked to Seattle in any drafts. He’s labeled as 1st round talent with requisite 32 inch arms, etc. Rob— I take it u don’t like him as a fit?

  27. Vista says:

    There is a distinct possibility the Browns go WR in the first round again this year. They had a 2 day workout with Corey Davis

  28. Bertelli says:

    I like the thought of picking up the #18 pick, but am hesitant about the second trade having to give up the #26. Do you think they might consider keeping the #26 pick and instead packaging #58, #90 and #102 to move up to say #36?

    Having #18, #26 and #36 should get us three stud players, though the downside is we wouldn’t have any more picks until Rounds 6 & 7.

    Just throwing some ideas out there as it was suggested there might be a steep drop-off of talent after pick #90. Thanks for another great article, Rob!

    • Rob Staton says:

      I guess you could argue the trade scenario presented by Kirwan could also land you three studs — but you also retain the three third round picks.

      • Bertelli says:

        Very true, I’m just afraid that waiting until #39 wouldn’t give us the opportunity to land two of (Obi, King, Jackson, Bolles, Lamp). Heck, I guess even keeping the #26 wouldn’t guarantee that, but my hopes would be much higher having #18, #26 and #39 versus #18, #39 and #41. I suppose with that said, it’s probably better to do it Kirwan’s way and keep the additional third round picks even though it would be agonizing to see one of those players fall to #26. Thanks for your feedback!

  29. Totem_Hawk says:

    Trade Sherman for a 1st rounder and use 6 picks to reload the team…

  30. Forty20 says:

    Matt Miller 2 Round Mock

    #26 – Forrest Lamp
    #58 – Marlon Humphrey

    #18 in the Sherman/Titan trade scenario on Miller’s admittedly unrealistic board gives us a tilt at Jarrad Davis (#24), Kevin King (#28), Ryan Ramcyzk (#29), Budda Baker (#33) and Adoree Jackson (#34). Haason Reddick is taken one pick ahead of #18 by Washington.

  31. Ed says:

    Was on the small wagon of trade Sherman last year and most thought it would never happen (not that it will for sure this year, but most thought it would never happen). I’m all for it. Maybe Eagles switch spots with Hawks and give Hendricks. That would be 3 quality LB (Hendricks/Wright/Wagner) and with that high of a pick get Obi.

  32. EranUngar says:

    We know that this draft class has deeper top talent group than 2016. We have been goping over this players for a while now.
    Rob has previously identified the “kill zone” of this draft class. There is very little drop from 15-20 to 45-50. Its easy to pick a winner at the top half of the 1st round. It’s that way every year. The type of talent you get on that next big group is rare. The Seahawks have just one pick in that range and it’s an early one. It could get them a great player but just one. I think they may want to do more.

    Trading back in the first and then up in the 2nd is an obvious move they employed last year and was mentioned here a lot. They may bundle two of their 3rd pick to move up close to that range and pick a stray. Or they can use the draft capital from a possible Sherman trade and hit that area 3-4 times.

    Whatever they do, I think JS has yet to from the overall strategy and he will keep it tight to his chest even if he did.

  33. 503Hawk says:

    What if nobody is offering a first rounder for Sherman.
    What about this as an option…

    Trade Sherman to Cleveland for their 2-33 pick (in essence a late first round & very valuable especially this year) and their 4-108 or a conditional 2018 pick. They are one of the few teams that have plenty of cap space.
    With the 2-33 we will still be able to get another playmaker and with their fourth we could package it to move up in the late second to grab another playmaker.

    • DC says:

      It would be for Cleveland’s #33 pick & Joe Thomas and that’s not going to happen.

      As boring as it sounds, we should all be prepared to go to one more Super Bowl this year with the LOB intact.

      • Ground_Hawk says:

        Poor us ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • DJ 1/2 Way (Sea/PDX) says:

        A cleveland second and third this year would do, with the added bonus of sending RS to a losing team to punish him for making the worst of the situation rather than the best.

        Why would cleveland do this? They need to add salary, and might think he could be the leader to make the defense tough. He might. He might also flounder without ET and flip out like he did in 2016.

    • Misfit74 says:

      Cleveland is rebuilding, why burn draft assets on a 29yr old who may not want to play for a non-contender?

    • Trevor says:

      I I like the Browns idea. They have the cap space and draft capital.

      The Browns 2nd and 3rd round picks + Shon Coleman and the rights to Josh Gordon

      We give up Sherm, and one of our 3rd round comp picks.

      Draft
      #26 Obi Melinowfu
      #33 Adoree Jackson
      #58 Tyus Bowser
      #65 Issac Assiata
      #90 Daeshon Hall
      #102 Rasul Douglas

      • Greg Haugsven says:

        I like the idea of getting Coleman. Just don’t think it would be in the Browns best interest.

  34. Hawksince77 says:

    Rob,

    You have made good cases for both Adoree Jackson and Obi M. Both can be special players, but do you think Seattle would favor Obi’s size over Jackson? On defense, they favor size, particularly in the secondary, and even traded the undersized, extremely fast CB Josh Wilson early in their tenure.

    Sure, Thomas is undersized, and why Budda Baker might be a decent comp as he plays safety. Yes, Obi might play safety as well, but he can also play outside (we think). Plus, Obi’s size and athletic profile has to be intriguing.

    As for Jackson on offense, certainly a plus, but not crucial given existing playmakers. Or do you think Jackson’s suddenness trumps (oh how politics has ruined a perfectly good word!) Obi’s size?

    • Rob Staton says:

      I think you could make a case for either scenario. Melifonwu could re-define the big nickel position, he could be an outside corner or someone who acts as a match-up weapon inside. He could be a strong safety. He has limitless potential. Adoree’ though is a playmaker and a threat to score any time he’s around the ball. Plus he’s a former 5-star recruit, top-10 in the country with natural suddenness and the kind of rare athleticism Seattle loved in Percy Harvin. So both will appeal.

      • Misfit74 says:

        +1

        • DJ 1/2 Way (Sea/PDX) says:

          How does former five star recruit help the Seahawks? Rob, I love you, but you have said this again and again. I want somebody good now and the next five years, not in high school.

    • DC says:

      Obi seems the most unique.
      If he’s gone though and we go DB, King, Baker, Jackson, Awuzie, Conley… No slouches there.

  35. Forty20 says:

    Unrelated to today’s post Rob but what is your rough podcast schedule from here through to the draft? Listening to Kenneth go on wild rants and tangents in contrast to your laser focused breakdowns always makes me chuckle at work.

  36. vrtkolman says:

    Let’s say the Sherman trade happens, and we start one or even two rookie CB’s. This is what Carolina did last year. They took their lumps early and looked even embarrassing at times, but they also improved a lot and and look to be a strength next year. They also don’t have near the safeties we do, nor the two best secondary coaches in the league in Carroll and Richard. We could potentially still win a weak division while the CB’s improve right before the playoffs. Next year with a greatly improved CB roster and a lot more money (maybe for pass rushing help and/or offensive line splurge), that is definitely a Superbowl contender.

    I personally don’t think we are the best team in the NFC next year with Sherman. I’m willing to retool next year for several more years of elite player afterwards.

    • Misfit74 says:

      I’m curious how the O-line may solidify with development of our young guys; additions, along with the steady presence of Britt as we move forward. I think we have a great window now with ET, Kam, Sherman, Wagner, Wright, Avril, and Bennett leading the way.

      Add the right pieces and we can contend for the title again this year.

      CB2, slot corner are the only glaring trouble spots right now on defense.

      We don’t need a rebuild as much as a reload.

      • DJ 1/2 Way (Sea/PDX) says:

        Right on, and VRT too!

        With a better O line we can control the time of possession and give our defense a rest. This is critical for the front seven as they do not have the quality depth of the past. Some of the getting off the field on third down issues are related to that, as well as the quality of play at the nickle.

        Every year recently it turns out to be all about health. Players go down against Atlanta and we are out. Nobody goes down and we win the SB. The next two years injuries reduce our chances.

        With a clear route to the NFC West championship, we need only be able to win one or two road games to make the Superbowl. Get home field and it is that much easier. With a better O line and a healthy QB, things looks good now. I want to add a good FB and another blocking TE to feel good on offense, but that can be a lower priority to the list Rob has for us. A couple OL prospects, DB, LB and Edge.

    • Forty20 says:

      I tend to agree. We have a much better supporting cast than the Panthers and this is THE draft to reload your secondary. If Sherman truly has been disruptive enough to warrant Carroll and Schneider seriously looking to trade him then I think you take a first and whatever else you can get.

      There is more than a bit of Pete’s ‘win forever’ creed to trading Sherman as well. Additionally, the NFC West allows us to take a calculated gamble to this extent as well. Take those lumps early this season, win the division and from there the playoffs are open slather.

  37. Misfit74 says:

    Maneuver how ever you have to in with our existing draft capital in order to land Obi and King both. Our defense would be lethal and reloading for the future.

    Anyone we get after that is a bonus. This may be a year to slightly discount depth and volume drafting to land two premier defenders while our window is firmly open.

    • Dlep says:

      Every time I see this scenario proposed in one of threads here I rec it and I will continue to do so until draft day!

      • Misfit74 says:

        Thanks, Dlep

        • DJ 1/2 Way (Sea/PDX) says:

          Dlep does not care about depth. I have to agree, so long as we stay healthy. As noted above, when we stayed healthy we won the superbowl. When we had injuries we did not.

          With the Seahawks getting more value out of UDFA than any other team, and this draft considered top heavy, I say for for it early, bring in good UDFA and count on the young players already on the roster.

  38. Chris in Nashville says:

    The notion of trading Sherman for a mid-first round pick is really intriguing. It’s obviously naive to assume his talent and abilities won’t be missed but to spare some cap room, and add multiple top CB talent is a really good get. Imagine drafting Kevin King, Adoree Jackson and someone else like Witherspoon or Awuzie (if he lasts to their 2nd round pick). Those players (or something like that) plus the cap space are better for the Seahawks in the long run.

  39. TCHawk says:

    While I understand Sherman would not want to be traded to a non-contender, what is that to us? If he wants out of Seattle, we should just get the best deal we can. He doesn’t have a no trade clause in his contract does he, or limited trade option?

    • Trevor says:

      Agree he goes to Afc team who offers best deal.

      • Brandon says:

        The issue could be that the acquiring team may wish to extend Sherman, especially if giving up a lot of capital. If Sherman is unhappy with the team we trade him to, he may not be willing to sign an extension.
        So, Sherman does have a bit of leverage.

      • CharlieTheUnicorn says:

        Send him to a team that can knock off the Patriots

  40. LeoSharp says:

    If the team is looking for a good player and a pick then maybe Jurrell Casey and a 2nd/3rd would be a good option. It fills a need at DT and adds a pass rusher. At less than 13 million over the next 2 years sems like a good value contact

    • Misfit74 says:

      Casey is a beast, but I’d want a more high value position barring an elite 3-tech like Gerald McCoy. A LT would be nice. Even still, trading Sherman would leave us with zero starting CBs for a defense defined by their secondary. Legion of Swoon. Legion of Bloom? Like a weak flower.

    • C-Dog says:

      I think a scenario like this is very likely what Seattle is looking for.

  41. I was wondering about Richard and a trade might not happen until the draft day how about a trade to green bay for there first round pick and Kyler fackell possibly misspelled and there first or the chargers for there second round pick and Brandon mebane.just a thought probably not either one of these possibilities just a thought.

  42. Coleslaw says:

    The Seahawks don’t want to trade Sherman to an NFC team. Just another reason it won’t happen.
    But if it did happen…. Sherman+102+106 for 10+156
    1. Marlon Humphrey
    1. Obi Melifonwu
    2. Cordrea Tankersley
    3. Nico Siragusa
    5. George Kittle
    6. Priority UDFA
    7. Priority UDFA

  43. Trevor says:

    How about Trade Sherm and get a 1st.

    Then use the cap space to extend Kam and Britt + trade one of our 3rd round picks to the Jets for Sheldon Richardson as we could afford his $8mil contract. He should be motivated in a contract year.

    • Misfit74 says:

      Depends on where the first is. Bolles + King/Obi would soothe the hurt.

    • Sea Mode says:

      Hmmm… I actually like that idea of S. Richardson, Trev. A cheap 1-year prove it scenario, and if we don’t like him, we still should get a nice comp pick next year when he signs with another team.

  44. CharlieTheUnicorn says:

    I like the idea behind the the Sherman trade, makes sense on many levels… however the guy they draft doesn’t make sense at all. If you trade Sherman, you NEED a CB (actually multiple) to fill out the depleted secondary. Having said this, I would totally take WR Ross…. since he was still available at #18. I think he is a very unique player that can tilt the field.

    I’ll be honest, many appealing blue chip type players would/might be available at #18…. but who would give the most bang for the buck….

    • Misfit74 says:

      Hard to ignore the CB need, clearly. Most bang for buck: OJ Howard, Reddick, C. Davis, Bolles as far as players who could be available around 18. Given a player like that, I’d have to be hopeful we have a good plan to find 2-3 DBs at our other picks.

  45. Nolan says:

    What about Sherman for a pick in Lenord fournett range … then take best corner available at 26 double up at corner in round 2 safety/online/lb in round 3

  46. Kendo says:

    So it looks like I may end up on the road during the first round. Anyone have recommendations for how to listen in while driving across the state?

  47. nichansen01 says:

    I’m not trading Sherman unless we get a top 20 pick and a good player for it. From the titans, I’d trade Sherman for 18 and Taylor Lewan.

    • RWIII says:

      If someone is going to trade for Richard Sherman they have to have cap space. They have to be a pretty good team. They had better be from the AFC. To me the most logical team is Oakland. With that said. I am NOT giving Richard Sherman away. Still can’t believe what Jim Mora said. Makes you wonder how this guy has a job at ESPN 710.

  48. Dingbatman says:

    Sherman and Rawls to Titans for R1(18), R5(164) and Derrick Henry.

  49. Stephen H. Pitell says:

    Rob, I am thinking about the current CB’s signed to the Hawks, and wondering if we need to draft more than one or at most two CB’s this year. Elliot started last year in place of Shead, and I’ve not read a lot of comments on his start. Good? Bad? Somewhere in between? Thorpe, Desir, and Jean-Batiste all have never really been tested for our team…..could Pete see these guys as stepping into starting jobs?

    I’d love another post by you on these guys.

  50. Frans Geraedts says:

    Been thinking about schneiders remarks.(robs excellent post yesterday) What schneider is saying is that he doesnt like the draft because it has gaps. He doesnt say that he doesnt like the quality of the draft. If we take the drift of the talk here on the website the situation could be like this. He actually thinks…like we do…that the quality of the draft is abnormally high in specific positions (CB,S,TE) -but that the real talent will be gone after pick 50? 75? 90? Which means that the value of the third round picks is lower then he would like. And trading one of those 3rd for 4th and 5th round picks would not make much sense either.
    So what he really would like to do is get more picks in the first two rounds, beginning of the third.
    That explains the kind of agressive strategy as in the mock we are discussing here.

    I love the oakland sherman lynch trade idea. But then it would make a ton of sense to trade pick 24 down and pick 26 as well. I would be very happy with an outcome that would have us starting to draft early in the second round if that means we would have more then a handfull picks in the second round, early third because it looks like that is where the value is.

    For example trade with cleveland 24 and 90 for 33 and 65; trade with jets 26 and 106 for 39 and 70. That would give us 33, 39, 58, 65, 70 and 102.

    That could mean…..george kittle (102,te), justin evans (70, s), nico siragusa (65,ol) tyus bowser (58,lb), jordan willis (39, de) kevin king (33, cb) based on walter football
    Or adam bisnowaty (102, ol), cordrea tankersley (70, cb), chris godwin (65,wr,) jordan willis (58, de), malick mcdowell, (39,dt), obi melifonwu (33, db) based on tony pauline
    Or george kittle (102,te), larry ogunjobi (70,dt), chris godwin (65,wr), cordrea tankersley (58,cb), budda baker (39, db), obi melifonwu (33,db) based on drafttek
    Or george kittle (102,te), cordrea tankersley (70cb), chris godwin (65,wr), t.j. watt (58,olb), adoree jackson (39,te), garret bolles/obi melifonwu (33,ot,db) based on mel kiper
    Or rasul douglas(102, cb), larry ogunjobi (70,cb), chris godwin (65,wr), cordrea tankersley (58,cb), t.j. watt, (39,olb), obi melifonwu (33,db) based on todd mcshay

    Conclusions: 33 seems to be a very good spot. It gives bolles, obi, or king. 39 gives watt, jackson, baker, mcdowell, willis. Not bad at all. 58 tankerley, watt, willis,bowser. Still a good haul. The three later picks give a good cb, a good wr, a good te and/or good dt. So this would create a draft with three (!) difference makers on the defence and three good players for depth.

    Even better would be a trade for sherman at 18 with tenessee. Trading that down with cleveland would then look like this: 18 and 106 for 33 and 52. If we then trade with the jets 26 and 102 for 39 and 70 that would give us 33,39,52,58, 70 and 90. That, i believe would be amazing. It would give us 4 difference makers and then two (cb,wr,te,dt) for depth.

    Walter football: king, willis, baker, bowser!
    Tony pauline: obi, mcdowell, engram, willis!
    Drafttek: obi, baker, willis, tankersley!
    Mel kiper: bolles/obi, jackson, watt, willis!
    Todd mcshay: obi, watt, awuzi, tankersley!