It’s spring forward tonight, meaning that we all lose an hour of sleep. I was going to do my Tyler Eifert writeup tonight, but in the interest of getting some sleep I’ll just link this offseason plan– rife with rosterbation- that I just completed on the Seahawks.net forums. It’s a long read but if you are into this kind of thing you might enjoy it. I think it’s extremely doubtful that Seattle will draft a tight end in round 1, but if they did, I think Eifert would be the perfect match for our offense.
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Rob and Kip, you have been simply delightful this offseason! Keep up the all the good work you guys do!
Loved the plan!
I could very well see JS/PC identify Armonty Bryant as a player they simply could not leave the draft without in wrap up interviews, similar to how JS gushed about Wilson. I feel strongly enough about this that I could see them very well making him a 3rd or even 2nd round pick, followed by the pundits blasting it, then followed later by a few scattered reports about how “X” team was also on the verge of taking Armonty. Based on what I’ve read, the “character concerns” (how I hate typing that phrase) have been overblown and I could see him benefiting from the Seahawks strong defensive group. Seattle’s locker room atmosphere is intriguing because while it appears players are given free reign to be expressive individuals, there remains an intense focus to show up and buy in. At this point in the maturation of the roster, particularly the defensive side of the ball, any “character concerns” do not worry me.
Furthermore, I agree with much of your offseason plan, however I see the possible courtship of Osi being a big factor as the front office could view him as a 2-3 year contributor rather then just a veteran rental. With Clemons’ career possibl being in jeopardy, bringing in Osi to join Bruce and then a pass rusher or two in the draft would have the chance to form an effective trio up to 2015. Osi could take a prominent role this year and slowly recede based on either the development of a player like Bryant or the progress of Chris.
I think if Seattle does sign a DE, whether it’s Umenyiora, Abraham, or Freeney, it will be on a 1 year deal ala Raheem Brock. I strongly prefer Abraham. I think he’ll be the best player of the three in 2013, and he might be the cheapest to acquire because of his age.
I am crossing my fingers that we sign Abraham. He will bring consistent contribution and veteran leadership to our DL. This acquisition also takes some pressure off of draft day, putting us in good position to take the player of best value for our team instead of possibly “reaching” for some DL help when our guy is not available.
Though I am no expert at computing how Division II domination translates to the NFL, Armonty Bryant”s strength, footwork and hand techniques appear to be extraordinary!
Swope and Simon are guys I want to see in Seahawks blue!
Simon had great games vs Nebraska and Wisconsin (RW at QB), which are 2 teams that feature near pro quality offensive lines. On one play, he rag dolls RW in the open field!
This would be a great off-season, I think you might have underestimated what Bryant’s worth on the open market though. Even coming off the DUI, with Melton and Starks both tagged he’s the premier rush tackle in FA. I can see someone paying him 7 – 8 million a year, and doubt that’ll be us. If you’re right and his demands level out though, we should be major players.
Also, judging by the compensation payed for Smith, and even our previous trade for Clipboard Jesus, surely Flynn’s worth a 4th rounder?
Great article though, if we put ourselves in a position defensively through FA and gave Wilson targets like Eifert and Swopes we’ll be very tough to stop
Really hard to gauge value on those guys. Those were my best guesses. I could see Bryant getting more than 5/25, but I could also see him getting less. He’s not a big name free agent and he was just arrested. I don’t think we’ll see a 4th for Flynn. I’d be ecstatic, but Peter King and Adam Schefter have reported already that the market for Flynn is very weak.
Love Swopes think he is day 1 impact player. Couldn’t like Eifert any less. I think he’s really slow and a very finesse player. He high points the ball really well, but will really struggle to separate. He might have run in the 4.6s but plays much slower IMO. To me, not worth a top 50 pick at all. I don’t think he scares anyone.
He was the 4th fastest TE. Most TE’s won’t run away from coverage anyway. Eifert’s jump ball ability and strong hands will make him a force to be reckoned with on 3rd downs and red zone plays. I was also impressed with his overall game- he’s easily better than any TE in last year’s draft or this years in terms of catching + blocking. But what really impressed me was his talent for the jump ball. It’s pretty close to undefendable.
1st time I watched film on Eifert and came away salivating at the possibilities. We would finally be able to destroy some teams with the 2 TE sets that PC has aspired to run. Eifert is a great blocker, route runner and high point catcher. He is open on virtually every play, especially with RW’s accuracy! With Eifert and Zach blocking and the continued improvement of our young OL, our Beast game will be unstoppable for some teams. Other teams might be able to slow Beast down, but only after sucking in their LB’s and Safeties. But watch out! It’s a play action fake and the TE’s are chip blocking and busting moves on flailing LB’s…all day long!!!
I enjoyed reading about your free agent picks. They would all be good additions. Especially like Bryant from Oakland. That would take pressure off our first draft pick, though I would also be okay with doubling up and choosing Datone Jones or Short in the first round.
Not sure we need Young as a backup QB, especially when you have us picking Robinson in the draft. I wish you would reprint instead of link. It’s hard to remember all your picks.
So two thoughts: I don’t think the Hawks will be that active in free agency.
A lot of cap space hinges on dealing Flynn. You haven’t addressed the right side of the offensive line, love them or hate them, we need competition and quality backups for our line.
I don’t think Robinson’s a QB. He’s the same height as Wilson but without Wilson’s short QB skillset. He’s also not a good QB. If he was our backup QB that would mean a lot of learning, and I don’t think it’s really feasible to ask him to learn QB/RB/WR all at the same time. I think he’s an emergency QB at best.
Also, I’m not wild on Vince Young but he is the best of a really bad list of options. Ideally, he’s a 1 year stopgap and Seattle can look to the 2014 draft for a late rounder with ZR ability. I am a big fan of Matt Scott, but it sounds like Scott will be a late 2nd or early 3rd right now. Seattle won’t take a QB that early, even if Scott is a highly intriguing prospect.
Robinson pick in mid rounds is genius! He could be our new return specialist. And we could install a few plays that would create match up nightmares and/or get him the ball in space. We could also tell him to just bust a move and run. He will either be open or force the safety to help the CB, which opens up the whole field for our other play makers. A lot of intriguing possibilities!
Honestly I would keep Flynn, regardless of the cap implications. If Wilson goes down, with Flynn in we at least have a capable game manager to keep an elite defense competitive. Young is polar opposite to what Carroll wants in the locker room, and hasn’t contributed anything to his last two teams. I think Carroll wants a QB who can protect the football above all else, and Young is definitely not that.
Besides, a sixth round pick really isn’t worth losing the security blanket we have as backup QB. It was hard enough last year for rookies to crack the roster, and there will be even less roster spots for the taking next year.
I agree with your general sentiment, but I disagree about our defense being elite. Despite the numbers, the defense stumbled when we needed them most. ATL leaves a bad taste, but theybhad too many late let downs to be elite in my book. They are damn good though.
The need to get rid of the prevent defense, this defense is to aggressive to sit back and let plays develop. They have that attack metality.
We blitzed on the last two plays of the Atlanta game. Carroll rarely ever plays prevent defense, especially with the game on the line.
Simple fact is, our front four got zero pressure the entire game and that’s what killed us, that’s what necessitated the blitzing, and that’s why we lost.
Ya but the CB did run with the WR from the line they was lined up 20 yds deep
I think the odds of Wilson going down with injury are very low. He’s bulky for his size and knows how to take a hit, and knows how to avoid taking hits altogether. Despite playing read option he didn’t have even the slightest injury last season in 22 total games, and outside of a minor concussion in 2009 his college resume is spotless on the injury front.
I don’t think the Matt Flynn insurance policy is worth $7.25 million. It might be tougher to trade Flynn next season, too. I’m not anti-Flynn, I just don’t think such a low level of risk (very few proven durable QBs miss significant time with injury) is worth that kind of money.
Does anyone have a link? I couldnt see on that site, thanks guys.
I’m a bit conflicted with our 1st round pick. I know I’m going to draft defense but who do i draft to replace who. If its Jason Jones spot then i see Datone Jones if its Alan Branchs spot then i could see a trade back into high 2nd round and getting Kawann Short. The depth of this draft in certain areas like CB,WR, and OL i wouldn’t mind picking up an extra 4th or 5th round pick. Its an opportunity to get someone with above normal talent that could possible make this team. Its kindia funny cause I don’t hear anyone talking about this guy. He’s the guy that people don’t pick 1st but throw in as an alternative. He’s a guy that is marked as late 1st or early 2nd. I’ve heard lack of motivation or taking plays as some of the excuses for not being a 1st round pick. In his defense he probably played heavy in college but when he showed up at the Senior bowl to play that wasn’t the case. He weighed in at 302lbs and he showed he could play. Then he shows up to the combine at a lean 299lbs. I really think this guy gives us an Alan Branch type tech 3 with a little more pass rush and slightly less run support.
I’m asking ya Rob if youwould do a piece on Kawann Short who appears be the 2nd pick for everyones draft in round 1 except for me.
agree on the first round discussion
Desmond Bryant replaces Jason Jones. I think Desmond Bryant could be a star in the making. John Simon is brought in also as a DE/DT tweener. Also added Abry Jones at the end, and kept Branch. So pretty stacked at DT, actually.
FWIW, I am 70% sure we’ll draft a DT in round one in the real draft. I think Datone Jones probably tops their wishlist.
Good stuff. Loved the read.
I have a few issues with this
I think if the hawks pick up a reciever at 3 mil a year in FA, then they will be releasing Obomanu. Trade out for an upgrade but they would not keep him and his 2.5 contract.
If we sign Bryant (and I think you are about right on his contract) we will be drafting another DT (not resigning Branch)
All of the other FA signings/Flynn trade look about right to me. This would leave us with over 10 mil heading into the draft. I think a 10 mil carry over into next year is a likely target for this team.
I could also see some restructuring for both Miller and Rice. I would like to see them both drop 2-3 mil against the cap. This would be huge for future signings given the ability to carry over another 4-6 mil into next year.
The draft looks brilliant accept Eifert, I would rather take a later round TE and move up or drafting of a WILL/DT/LEO. I think it will be D in round one this year unless it is big time WR (Patterson, or other)
I don’t see Ben Obamanu coming back. To much money and with WR depth in this draft its to easy to find his replacement. Ryan Swope would be perfect for his replacement in the 2nd round.
Bryant could take Branches spot and Datone Jones in the 1st round could take Jason Jones spot.
Flynn, I get a feeling we pay him off and release him and let him try for a spot with someone else. If someone made us an offer i’d be all for a trade but his window of opportunity is quickly closing as he gets older.
I just can’t go 1st round TE. Travis Kelce knows how to block and Miller was brought in mostly cause he knew the ZBS of tom Cable. Kelce fits the Tom Cable mold of a blocking TE and with RW help he should see more action in passing game. He did lead Cincinnati in recptions last year. He has a Marshawn Lynch metality at the TE spot and I like that.
Plus we just signed a basketball player on a 3 year deal to play tight end. He is a project but at least he played tight end in high school. Let’s give him a chance.
yes, I can see a late round TE for competition, but to just draft a TE that would be in competition for #1/#2 TE shared role with Zach Miller would automatically eliminate that new signing IMO.
Duly noted about Obomanu. I would leave that up to August competition before I released him though.
Desmond Bryant replaces Jason Jones. He’s an excellent penetrator and pass rusher.
Eifert is one of my favorite players. Big time weapon for Wilson’s style of play, IMO.
Does anyone have a link? I couldnt see on that site, thanks guys
http://www.seahawks.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=66281
Is the cap savings for trading Flynn different than cutting him? You have the cap savings at 7.25m but i thought it was only like 1.25m?
I think you are correct RJ, but the savings in 2014 moves up to around 7 m. Your realy have to take both into account with the way the roll over works. Cut him this year and the savings is over 8 m in total, cut him next year and you only save around 4 m.
Cutting him saves $1.25m against the cap in 2013 and $2.25m in 2014… plus nearly $6m in cash.
You don’t save much more trading him.
We paid T.J. Housz 6 million and let him go. Think he played for Baltimore 1 year and was gone the next.
Six million dead money versus zero if you trade.
Not exactly. He received a $6 million signing bonus last season. If they trade him the Hawks have to take the prorated portion of the signing bonus ($4 million) against their cap this year. The $2 million in guaranteed base salary for 2013 goes to the team that buys his contract unless he is cut. In any case, any analysis needs to include the cost of signing an equivalent replacement if you can find one. Trading him makes sense if you can get a couple draft picks to replace him. Cutting him would be foolish.
Cutting him saves $1.25m this year in cap space, $2.25m in cap space next year plus over $5m in pure cash. Given the minimal cost of draft picks these days, the Seahawks could easily replace him with a mid or late round rookie while making a good saving. Cutting him would not be foolish. It’s a viable plan that they may or may not opt to go with.
Rob or Kip,
The hype around swope has been picking up around the seahawks community. A quick summary that I have been receiving is, Fast, good hands, willing blocker, good routes, gets separation, improvises well.
Why is he not a 1st rounder type? Why did he start as a 3-4th to maybe 2nd? What am I missing or what was everyone else missing until recently? Is this a case of stereotype?
I think people assumed he was a short slot receiver type, when in reality he runs a 4.3 and is 6-0 tall. I always liked him but thought low value ‘see if he can do it’ type player. I underestimated his athletic quality for sure. And I wouldn’t rule out Swope going in the late first.
At 25?
Maybe.
Wouldn’t shock me.
I must admit I’ve been adamant that taking a receiver at 25 was a bad move….. But, there is something about Swope that screams “special” player. I would not be upset to see the hawks grab him in the first if it meant making sure he’s donning the “wolf grey” next season!!
I don’t think we care about grades, so much as we care about when we think players will actually go. I would think that there is a fair bit of concern that Ryan wouldn’t last to 56, despite the group think grade.
“Why is he not a 1st rounder type? Why did he start as a 3-4th to maybe 2nd? What am I missing or what was everyone else missing until recently? Is this a case of stereotype?”
At this time every year, players move around at the amateur level. There are many reasons for this.
1. We aren’t privy to how personnel scouts see talents. Often times, what we see as a ‘big jump up the boards’ is just a case where draftniks start to see/hear that talent scouts have always had a guy ranked higher. Floyd this year. Fletcher Cox last year. Bruce Irvin last year. Sometimes — oftentimes even — we’re just late to the party.
2. Translation. Some prospects’ games translate better to the pros. It’s undeniable that there are some things that players will be asked to do at the pro level that they are not in college. Some talents may be less impactful at the collegiate level, but more desirable at the pro level. And as it very often the case — sometimes a skilled player in college is asked to fill a role that minimizes their visibility in the eyes of amateur draftniks. Some take one for the team and don’t get a chance to display their full talents on tape.
3. Flash v. Cash. Let’s face it. We love splashy guys. Cordarrelle Patterson guys. Guys with ceilings that shoot for the moon. We don’t value reliability. For draftniks, Two in the bush is always better than one in the hand. We extoll what guys could be and really don’t appreciate what they are.
We could say it’s stereotype. And that wouldn’t be out of the question. Not just draftniks, but national draft pundits, ‘experts’, often just don’t have the time or inclination to really delve into the players they are mocking. And even more of them don’t really look deeply at what teams need. I mean we’re still getting mocks where Seattle needs a receiver or needs a RT in round 1. Even though from the boots on the ground level, there isn’t the dire need at WR evident. And taking a RT after all the investment in the line and how productive it was — seems beyond the realm of probability.
Swope’s reliability and lack of eye popping physical stats (and to varied degrees, his race) all contribute to seeing him as a productive slot receiver — not unlike a handful of white NFL productive slot receivers. But to watch him on tape, it’s easy to see he’s more than that. But it takes effort and time and an open mind, and I don’t think pundits have all three elements necessary to get beyond that cursory pigeonholing.
His combine numbers undoubtedly has prompted some to take that time and look and tape. And they probably are seeing him as more than a slot guy too. So his value is rising because the combine numbers forced people to take a good look. I suspect that it’s another case where pundits are late to the party. He’s probably always had a better grade than we’ve applied.
RJ, thanks buddy!
I think the most seahawky pick would be Denard Robinson. Fabulous potential, little experience to back it up, a la sherman and irvin. Also, he interviews like a John Schneider wet dream. And he is multidimensional -> trick plays, punt/kick return, read option, end-around and on and on. PC and JS have clearly demonstrated an evolving willingness to try to confuse defenses. Also, in his interviews, he expressed a willingness to try out corner. Bring him on.
A Seahawks scout was seen talking to Robinson at the Senior Bowl. So there’s that.
Loved it Kip! It would sure be nice to get a 2nd or 3rd rounder out of Flynn. In order for that to happen the Hawks will likely have to sweeten the deal. Let’s say Flynn was only worth a 6th rounder, I would no trade him for that but let’s say we did. That would be sad it that’s all we could get but it is what is.
Going back to trading Flynn for a 6th rounder, how about this, we trade them Flynn and our 2014 4th rounder for their 2013 3rd round pick? Some how some way I want to see the Hawks acquire an extra 2nd and 3rd in this draft.
If a player that the Hawks just loved feel to the 2nd round, would any of you be on board for trading our 2014 1st round pick for that? Did I mention we will be selecting at #32 next year?
At the absolute minimum, I think we are the favorites for next year’s #32 pick. Best team in the NFL and I think it’s very likely that we haven’t seen the end of this roster’s improvement.
New scenario, and I am looking for some feed back. Why not bring in some veteran FA’s at OLB, DL, S and a QB. Possibly Darryl Smith, James Harrison, or Phillip Wheeler at OLB. Desmond Bryant, John Abraham or Dwight Freeny at DL. Charles Woodson, Laron Landry or Adrian Wilson S in FA. Jason Campbell, Vince Young, or Brady Quinn… as backup QB.
Then, in the draft. Trade Matt Flynn and two 7th round picks swap 2nd and 3rd round picks and acquire 4th and a 5th round picks.
1st Margus Hunt DT/DE
2nd Ryan Swope WR
3rd Vance McDonald TE
4th Xavier Gooden OLB
4th Tyrann Mathieu CB
5th Mark Harrison WR
5th Christine Michael, Knile Davis or Marcus Lattimore HB
5th or 6th Cornelius Washington DE or Jon Bostic OLB
6th Devin Taylor DE
7th Quinton Dial DT
7th Denard Robinson ATH
Lots of risk, MORE reward! GO HAWKS!
Margus Hunt is going to be an All-Pro within 2 years in my personal opinion. Possibly, as soon as year 1. I see him as a 3 down player for the Hawks, who can move around the DL to create pressure on QB’s inside and out. Watch his tape, later in the 2012 season, or the bowl game from this past year. If he can come in the league, and just keep putting in the same effort and competing, as he was on those tapes for an entire season, 60+ tackles and 15+ sacks a season will be expected of him. A bigger, faster, and stronger JJ Watt? Possible.
Margus Is quick around the edge, especially at his size. Extends his arms well to create separation. Plenty strong enough to engage and shed blocks. Can set the edge in the run game. Incredible length and versatility. I feel at 6’8″ 277 has room to put 10 -15 lbs on his frame without much hinderance. He is a special athlete who translates speed to power, well. 4.60 forty and benched 225 lbs 38 times at the combine. Only been playing football for 4 years. Shows good technique, and the ability to be a fast learner. Humble yet confident. Has the flexibility to bend at the knees.
Interviewed well in my opinion, based on his post- combine interview. Pointed out that he should have gotten lower in the drills. You can sense his desire to improve. He has worked hard in the gym and it shows. Hunt initially moved to the United States from his native Estonia to further his amateur track career. He was the 2006 World Junior Champion in the shot put and discus. Hunt at 25 years old, uses his elite size/athleticism combination to make an impact on defense. He had three sacks in the BVAA Compass Bowl against Pittsburgh to finish off 2011, a sack and two forced fumbles against Fresno in the Hawaii Bowl, and on special teams, blocked 17 kicks in his 1st four years of Div 1college football!
Can you imagine Big Red and Margus Hunt on FG and extra point attempts? That’s what I call icing a kicker. How about, Irvin, Mebane, Hunt, and Clemons on passing downs? Is the risk worth the reward? IMO, the answer at #25 this year is adding another 25 year old, in the first round.
Really hope he isn’t in a 49ers jersey come draft day.
I tried to reply to your post…see below…
I agree with everything except, “Shows good technique…” I thought his hands and arms technique looked terribly under-developed. But I saw that as a huge positive. When he starts swimming with those long arms and chopping down on OL arms, he will destroy blockers like very few others can ever aspire to. Critics say he plays stiff and consequently whiffs instead of finishing. Yeah, maybe sometimes. But all our D needs is someone to disrupt the pocket by either collapsing or penetrating. This will either hurry QB’s or flush them. If they hurry, our DB’s will destroy; if they scramble, Bruce Irvin will destroy. The way Margus Hunt so consistently and completely annihilates blockers with physical superiority is stunning. I think he’s our guy!
harvin to hawks! That will change things up a bit