Tyree Wilson is a common pick for the Seahawks among the many mocks on the internet.
It makes some sense. Defensive line is a big need. Wilson has incredible size and length and we know the Seahawks put a lot of emphasis on length when it comes to defensive linemen.
However, it feels like every mock is making the same pick for Seattle and several refuse to seriously consider the possibility that the Seahawks will draft a quarterback.
You usually see a reference to Seattle retaining Geno Smith and therefore, the position will be addressed. Job done. Nothing to see here.
That to me is an error. Even if Smith signs a new deal, it’s still very plausible that the Seahawks will draft a quarterback too.
A few days ago we highlighted an article by Bob Condotta in the Seattle Times, discussing this possibility:
As noted, the Seahawks may not want too much of a long-term commitment (with Smith) and will want to assure they can structure the deal in a way to allow them to address their other issues.
And a two- or three-year deal — especially if there is a void year at the end — doesn’t mean the Seahawks can’t draft a QB in the first round. Seattle drafted Russell Wilson in the third round in 2012 after signing Matt Flynn to a three-year, $20.5 million deal.
In other words, the Seahawks can take care of the present while also looking to the future. And that may well be the way they go.
In many cases it almost feels like a moot point that Smith will stay in Seattle. Some articles don’t even reference quarterback as a need — despite the fact that currently there isn’t a contracted QB on the roster.
Yes — the language surrounding a Smith extension is positive. Both player and team are making the right noises publicly. Let’s not forget, though, that similar things were said about Frank Clark (“He’s not going anywhere, Frankie’s a Seahawk”) and Jadeveon Clowney (“it’s our priority to keep him”).
In both cases there was a real desire to retain both players, right up until the point the price became too high. Then the Seahawks moved on, without hesitation.
This is the same team that labelled the Russell Wilson trade talks ‘a media creation’ (they said what they needed to say). They also cut franchise-favourite Bobby Wagner the moment his salary became unaffordable. This was despite the continued public praise for Wagner during press conferences and the undoubted respect they had for him as a player and person.
So really, we can take any public comments with a pinch of salt. The reality is Geno Smith will have a price just like Clark, Clowney and Wagner. If the price is too high, they’ll move on.
For the last few years it’s been a difficult negotiation just to get Smith back as the backup. He has had a tendency to only sign deals weeks after the market opens.
Here are the dates when he re-signed year-to-year:
2019 — May 15th
2020 — May 20th
2021 — April 22nd
2022 — April 19th
Take last year for example — free agency officially began March 16th. It took over a month for him to agree terms with Seattle, provoking a slightly irked Carroll to make a public nudge to Smith about signing a contract, when the Seahawks were his only realistic shot to start.
Unless they make a terrific offer — or Smith senses his best offer is in Seattle and doesn’t want to squander it — this could be a tricky deal to negotiate and it could take some time.
A layer of intrigue has been added with Tampa Bay appointing Seattle’s QB coach Dave Canales as their new offensive coordinator. Canales hasn’t been a hot candidate for coordinator jobs in the past. He was touted for Seattle two years ago, before they hired Shane Waldron. As far as I’m aware, he has no serious experience in play-calling.
It’s very easy to imagine the Buccs going after Smith to lead their team. Unlike the Seahawks, they don’t have a top-five pick. Todd Bowles coached Geno in New York. They also need a veteran replacement for Tom Brady. Despite being in cap-hell, they have a veteran, expensive roster. They’ll either need to painfully blow everything up or go the same route as New Orleans by restructuring contracts.
In a winnable NFC South and having committed so many of their players to new deals, they feel like a prime candidate to try and stay competitive. Least of all because the Head Coach is on the hot-seat this season and the GM is unlikely going to be able to pitch a major rebuild and a terrible losing season, by getting rid of so many franchise-favourites in their prime years.
Now they’ve appointed Smith’s positional coach to lead their offense and will presumably be tapping into Seattle’s scheme and system, it’s a no-brainer they’ll make a run at Smith.
They are a slightly desperate franchise and might be more inclined to tempt him away from Seattle with a better financial package. It’ll be interesting to see if the Seahawks get into a bidding war.
As noted a few days ago — last summer they claimed they had ‘two number one quarterbacks’ in Smith and Drew Lock. It might be time to prove that wasn’t a fib and commit to Lock as your bridge.
There’s also this from ESPN’s Brady Henderson recently, discussing how the Seahawks might approach their negotiation with Smith:
The Seahawks, meanwhile, no doubt want to re-sign their Pro Bowl quarterback, but they have an offensive system they believe to be QB-friendly. They also believe there are potentially viable alternatives on more affordable contracts should Smith’s asking price get too high for their liking.
I think it’s clear nobody should be assuming Smith is definitely going to be back.
Back to the point on mock drafts — you can at least see why it should be more of a consideration that the Seahawks might draft a quarterback. The only prominent mock draft to do this recently is Mel Kiper’s. He gave Seattle Will Levis at #5.
This might’ve been Seattle’s intention all along.
The Geno Smith story has been interesting for a lot of reasons. Yet it’s highly unlikely the Seahawks dealt Russell Wilson without a clear plan for the future at QB. They didn’t do much of anything to address the position in 2022. They acquired Lock in the Denver deal. They re-signed Smith to a cheap one-year contract. They didn’t get involved in the Baker Mayfield trade stuff and they didn’t draft a quarterback, despite a number of options being available in the middle rounds.
Speak to anyone before the 2022 season began and the consensus belief was the Seahawks were biding their time and waiting on the 2023 quarterback class.
If they were in position to draft a QB — great. If not, they had sufficient stock to trade up and get one.
Are we really saying one season of Geno Smith was enough to completely change their plan, assuming they had one? That they’re now convinced the best thing to do is ignore the QB position in the draft, despite the rarity of being able to pick in the top-five? That Smith, who turns 33 this year, is good enough to build around for the long term? Even despite the fact his form took a turn for the worse towards the end of the season?
I think a more realistic scenario is the one Condotta mentioned in his article this week. Smith simply provides the Seahawks with a bonus option. If you re-sign him, there’s no pressure to start a rookie immediately. Yet you still plan to draft someone for the future, essentially getting the best of both worlds at the most important position in football.
You re-create the situation you had in 2012. You paid Matt Flynn, brought back Tarvaris Jackson then drafted Russell Wilson. You open up the competition and let the best man win.
It’s hardly far-fetched to believe they might do that again — with Smith, Lock and a rookie.
In this situation you’re not deviating away from any plan you might’ve had when you dealt Russell Wilson. You’re simply adapting the plan to include Geno Smith as a viable starter beyond 2022.
The idea would need Smith to be prepared to sign a contract matching Seattle’s budget. That would mean a low cap-hit in 2023 and an out for the team after this season. This is vital anyway because the Seahawks only have $19m in effective cap space and have a lot to get done to fill out their roster.
It could also mean major financial benefits to Smith if he excels under the new deal. This could come partly through incentives. The greatest incentive could be a bigger cap-hit in 2024 that he would earn through playing well in 2023. Thus, even if the Seahawks decide to move on, he could be dealt to a new team who would pay the handsome amount.
That would seem to be a realistic plan for both parties. Yet amid talk of Smith wanting $40m, revealed last week by Dave Wyman (who starts a weekly hit with John Schneider on his radio show today — just saying) — it could be that Smith wants jam today. That would open the door for a team like Tampa Bay to offer a bigger commitment, meaning the Seahawks would have a decision to make.
These things aren’t even considered with most mocks. This kind of conversation isn’t really being had at all. It’s mostly assumed Smith will be back and there’s not much discussion to the contrary. Someone might raise concern at a specific price-tag for Smith. Typically, it doesn’t go much further than that.
It’s not just Smith’s future that needs to be considered, though.
Tyree Wilson needs to prove he warrants a top-five placing. He has great length and size and we know the Seahawks really like those traits. However, his play is inconsistent and there is a degree of stiffness to his game. You can’t just draft a player in the top-five because he has an amazing frame. He needs to run a good 10-yard split, show he has explosive qualities in the vertical and broad jumps and it’d be nice to see strong agility testing through the short-shuttle and three-cone.
Do we even know if Wilson will test at the combine? He suffered a serious injury at the end of the season. He might not be healthy enough to test at 100%.
You can’t just draft a defensive lineman because you need one. Wilson has to show he warrants the pick.
We can take this a step further. I think there’s a very realistic chance Jalen Carter lasts to #5. Two days ago I highlighted the character concerns around Carter. Let’s just say there’s no smoke without fire. While it’s not the case that Carter is a bad person or anything like that — there are legitimate concerns in the league about his maturity, attitude, reliability and punctuality. Unquestionably he’s a very talented player. I would recommend people don’t dismiss what is being said by Todd McShay and Lance Zierlein, however.
This not only increases the chances of Carter lasting to #5 — it means the Seahawks would have a big call to make if one of the most talented defensive linemen to enter the league in recent years is available, yet they — like others — have serious concerns about whether he has the attitude and application to make the most of his god-given physical gifts.
The idea of simply taking a D-liner at #5 is not as straight forward as people think. If Will Anderson lasted, it might be an easier discussion to have. There are no character concerns there and he could be viewed as a rare safe, dynamic pick. With Carter and Wilson — I’d say there are a lot more question marks.
The other thing that makes me think Schneider always intended to draft a quarterback early this year is the players available. It’s a quarterback class that screams ‘Schneider’. As we keep mentioning — he loves traits. History suggests he’s willing to take a chance on physical talent — choosing to focus on what a player can become, not the flaws he has shown in college.
We all know Patrick Mahomes to be one of the greatest players to ever play the game. In his final year at Texas Tech he had a run of six straight games with an interception. He lost seven games in 2016. He had 25 interceptions in his final two seasons in college.
Schneider saw through all this and, reportedly, really liked Mahomes.
Josh Allen had 21 interceptions in his final two years in college. He had a completion percentage of just 56.3%. He had three games in 2017 with sub-100 passing yards and he started his final season with six picks in his first seven games.
Schneider saw through all this and, reportedly, really liked Allen.
Russell Wilson had 25 interceptions in his final two years at NC State. He never had a completion percentage above 60% with the Wolfpack. He had 11 games at Wisconsin where he threw 255 yards or fewer — including six sub-200 yard games. He also lost three games in his final season at Wisconsin. He lacked prototypical height.
Schneider saw through all this and drafted Wilson.
Do you see the trend here? We all think of these three players as quality NFL passers. In college, they had significant flaws.
You know, just like C.J. Stroud, Will Levis and Anthony Richardson — who all happen to have exactly the kind of physical traits Schneider has previously loved.
I also think there’s every chance he’ll also really like Bryce Young despite his lack of size — potentially meaning there are four quarterbacks he would take, while owning the #5 pick.
My prediction is there’s probably only one player right now — Will Anderson — who would push the Seahawks away from the four quarterbacks expected to go early in round one.
They might do more homework on Carter than any other player between now and April, to discover whether he joins Anderson in that bracket. If he’s too much of a character risk (a very real possibility, given how much emphasis they placed on character a year ago), I’m not convinced they simply pivot to Tyree Wilson unless he tests well. I think quarterback will very much be in the reckoning — even if they bring back Geno Smith and/or Drew Lock.
Just before the 2022 draft I spoke to someone ‘in the league’ who told me teams were smitten with Stroud and Young. The belief was this would impact decision making over the 2022 quarterbacks, who were mostly viewed as mid-round talents anyway.
That proved to be true — with only Kenny Pickett being selected before round three.
If Stroud and Young are the first two picks — or at least the first two quarterbacks off the board — that leaves two more spots before Seattle’s on the clock. Anderson will almost certainly be the first defender selected, due to his exceptional character/talent and the concerns surrounding Carter.
Then it comes down to who the fourth player is. It could be Levis. It could be Richardson. If the concerns are strong enough on Carter and Tyree Wilson tests well, he could even usurp the Georgia player.
I would urge anyone reading this, though, to be open-minded about the Seahawks potentially drafting Levis or Richardson (or Stroud or Young if they last — with Young more likely to last due to his size).
Levis is everything Schneider looks for in a quarterback. Great size, elite arm strength, fantastic athlete, obsessive about the game, loved by everyone at Kentucky. I can vouch for this because I’ve spoken to people about him and personally interviewed Levis myself:
Adding to that is his experience playing in Seattle’s offense in 2021 under Liam Coen and the likelihood he understands the terminology and concepts already. The year under Coen is likely to be the basis for most evaluations of Levis across the league, rather than the car-crash he had to experience in 2022 where his offensive line couldn’t block anything, he lost his top receiver, his running back served a suspension and he played most of the season with a broken toe.
Richardson also has the traits and tools dreams are made of. He might need time and seasoning — but if you re-sign Geno Smith he would get time and seasoning. It’s not unfair to say Richardson has superstar potential and while he’s far from perfect after just one season starting in college, he has the tools and potential to be one of the faces of the NFL. You can’t say that about many players.
The other thing to note is there’s enough depth defensively to improve that side of the ball with your other picks at #20, #38, #53 and #84.
Will McDonald looks like the definition of a Seahawks edge rusher. From the 35-inch arms to the expected 42/43-inch vertical and the dynamic ability to bend-and-straighten to the quarterback — it’s like he was made to play for Pete Carroll’s defense.
Frankly it won’t be a surprise if he’s rated as Seattle’s #2 EDGE prospect behind only Will Anderson. He could be available at #20 and I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a big ring around his name on Seattle’s draft board.
From Keion White to Adetomiwa Adebawore and Keeanu Benton — there are likely to be players in the top-40 with talent and impact potential available.
There are also attractive, underrated players such as Cameron Young and Alabama’s Byron Young who can bolster the defensive front.
Plus if they don’t re-sign Geno Smith, there will be more money to spend on defensive players in free agency.
So please — if you are writing a mock draft in the future, at least give greater consideration to putting a quarterback at #5. It’s more likely than you think.
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I wanted to ask this in response to your last post on FA targets… but, Rob, what do you make of half of the league being in the red, salary cap wise, this coming year?? More than half if you consider effective salary cap. Seems like a trend. Moreover, seems like teams magically get out of the red every damn year. Are other teams playing an accounting game that the Hawks aren’t?? Is there going to be a moment when the past catches up with the league, and suddenly great players are available for good salaries, and/or good players are available for substandard salaries? Maybe wishful thinking, but I am just freaking confused how half the league is going to add talent not subtract it.
I think a bunch of teams have been aggressive and now they’re having to live with the consequences
More teams than ever are over the cap due to the COVID effect on the cap in 2021. None of the major extensions demonstrated a hit due to that reduced cap season. Teams leveraged future cap space to maintain competitiveness and now the bills are coming due.
As for how teams get out of the red and then dive right back in to spend, it’s a float game based on the cap rising.
$10m in 2023 is 4.44% of the cap
$10m in 2024 is 3.06% of the cap
They can push money out and the increase in the cap in following years covers it. TV revenue – the biggest factor in income towards the cap – is fixed, providing stability. It is almost better than an interest-free loan.
You just have to have an owner willing to open their checkbook and write a check today instead of a check next year.
Why don’t the Seahawks participate in this? A couple reasons:
1-once you start it’s hard to stop
2-you have to sign/extend young talent to spread the cap hit out. The Seahawks the last few years haven’t had that. They have failed to routinely stike gold in the draft and have foundational players to extend.
3-Instead of making big free-agent splashes or trades for top players, they’ve stacked their team with aging players on middle-class 2 year contracts that eat up all their space. You can’t aggressively structure a 2-year contract to majorly impact your cap, and moving cap out is how they have the 32-yo Shelby Harris with a $12.2m cap hit this year.
4-they’ve tried playing the game, with terrible results. Diggs and Adams had very low first-year cap hits in their deals that pushed the burden down the road (if you recall the Seahawks even lowered their cap hit in 2020 by acquiring Adams, offloading Bradley McDougald’s contract). That’s how we have a disgusting $36 million on the cap for the two safeties.
Any idea how this will effect free agency?? Are tons of players about to get cut? Is a soft market possible? Fingers crossed this creates some opportunities.
If it wasn’t soft for a COVID-suppressed market two years ago, it’s likely not ever going to be soft.
That doesn’t mean there won’t be bargains to be had and players cut.
It would not shock me one bit if many NFL GMs and owners now or in the near future individually thought “what is the point of paying a middling QB $35 million when we can get 90% of their effectiveness for $10million?” and there was a big market correction for non-premium QBs.
100% on the middling QB salary issue!
My crystal ball is dimmer than most but mid-rank QB salaries going down seems inevitable to me. There’s really no other way to get to the SB unless you have Mahomes-type QB play. Even Brady was noted for not demanding the max from the Patriots and in my mind that played a critical role in their ability to stay at the top for so many years.
‘It took over a month for him to agree terms with Seattle, provoking a slightly irked Carroll to make a public nudge to Smith about signing a contract, when the Seahawks were his only realistic shot to start.’
I didn’t know this; for me, this adds another layer to whether or not he re-signs. At the moment in my mind – and despite everything he has said – he will sign elsewhere as the FO won’t offer him the bag he is looking for.
I think the FO would like him back on a decent deal but I also think they go QB in R1 in one shape or form (trade up/down). If Geno walks, then Carroll’s comment about the QB system that they have in place in Seattle makes me think he will be ok starting Lock (unless the rookie QB balls out in camp like Wilson).
The opportunity to draft a QBOTF doesn’t come about often, and there are no guarantees. But you got to believe the FO wouldn’t pass this chance up.
As Rob and the blog have expertly discussed there is PLENTY of value on the D line in R2/R3 to be had, but i think when the FA market opens the first wave will help map out their intentions a bit more.
So glad that Superbowl thing is over now so we can concentrate on the best part of the year!
This quote certainly makes him moving residence a possibility.
It is also possible that the kind of season Geno enjoyed last year will change a man. It is assured that Geno will view his opportunity with the Hawks differently than he did at this time last year.
>Now this may have molded him into a better man or a worse man. He surely has more confidence. But confidence can bring out different goals, attitudes, & approaches: good or bad, merciful or ruthless, urgency or patience, appreciation or entitlement, etc….
>>We don’t know what kind of man will be negotiating this off season, but it’s likely that he is a somewhat different one.
Geno Smith signing with Tampa Bay would be the best thing that could happen to Seahawks. We’d get a bridge QB on the cheap, draft a rookie at 5 or higher and spend the money on fixing the D.
I completely agree. I’m rooting for TB to sign him to save us from ourselves.
💯 %
Canales might just bring Lock with him… makes more sense if I’m TB..cost wise and possibly see if lock can be a QB 1…I feel like Seattle is most likely stuck with Geno…
They are a veteran roster and everyone — HC, GM, OC — is under pressure
They need a QB who has done something
I agree completely that’s what they ought to do. I’m just not sure that’s what they would do. They might sign Lock and not draft a QB early. That scenario would tell us a lot about what they think of Lock, if they are willing to hand him the job and focus on other needs in the draft.
Another aweome writeup Rob and a must read for all Hawks fans as they head into the off-season to gain a little perspective on the draft and QB postion.
Good stuff as always Rob. You got me fired up!
As you and many others have said, I just don’t see them passing up an opportunity like this to get a potential franchise QB.
A thing I’ve been thinking about in regards to John.
If and when this team is sold if he nails this and Seattle is sitting well he can easily be viewed as the GM moving forward. In that aspect he may even get his dream of securing the coach, thus being the true GM as opposed to whatever he is or is not with Carrol.
If on the other hand they choose wrong (this cuts both ways for qb as well as dline) when the team is sold its most likely he’s gone.
Not sure if many are aware but the return rate for fired or released GM’s back to a GM role is nearly non existent.
Additionally I’ve been thinking lately a lot about how everyone from hawkville to the likes of eisen, cowherd, etc, both never talk about Geno as a prospect for another team as well as tell fans: do not worry if Tampa comes with a ton of money Seattle can franchise him. If Seattle uses the franchise tag I can well and truly see Seattle pay 40 million. Once the franchise tag is applied all leverage goes to Geno.
Finally for fans with blinders. There’s no universe where you trade Russel and have zero idea of a plan moving forward.
I was not aware that the GM rehire rate was almost zero. Good info my friend . Hopefully that makes John even more committed to swinging for the fences at QB. If he hits he possibly sets himself up for another decade as the true GM as you alluded to. If he misses he won’t get that chance, BUT if he passes on one of the big 4 QBs and the guy becomes even top 10 in the league he could well be done anyway.
Florio and Dimitroff talk about that during SB week – GM’s know coaches, but owners don’t know GMs. Also hard to sell a GM hire to the media if he’s been fired.
https://youtu.be/uyPLDQHk7EI
The Seahawks understand as well as any team in the league the challenge of building a quality roster around a high-priced QB. They just got themselves out of a QB contract that significantly ate into their salary cap and hamstrung their ability to add much-needed talent to their roster. I don’t see them going down that road again. I wouldn’t be surprised if Geno quickly prices himself out of Seattle. My gut tells me it will be Lock serving as the bridge to Richardson. I only see Geno coming back if his market is cooler than expected. As Rob has written, Richardson’s combination of size, speed, arm talent, and athleticism probably has JS’s attention. If Levis lasts until pick 5, it could be him. I also wouldn’t be surprised to see Seattle move up from #5 to get their guy.
Good point about the difficulty in roster construction with an expensive QB and the likelihood that shapes their approach to this offseason.
Aga8n someone gives me hope they’ll draft QB.
They were hamstrung by bad drafting from 2013-2019.
Absolutely true, but once RW got paid on his 2nd/3rd contracts, Seattle was in the same boat as Green Bay; excellent/expensive QBs leading average to poor rosters. Not a formula for championships for any team outside of New England.
Jim Irsay says the Alabama kid is pretty good referencing the draft.
This feels like misdirection. Why would you announce your intentions?
Gotta love this time of year when owners, GMs, coaches etc are all talking out of both sides of their mouths…
I wouldn’t be surprised if this is not misdirection. Itsay can’t stop himself and has spoke about his connections to Chicago. Maybe he’s bull bleeping about young but it is widely assumed they are going up to #1 for a qb.
Irsay is a loose cannon — he probably just blerted it out
But I think Indy are clear favourites to pick first. The bigger question for me is whether Carolina can get into the top three
They might aggressively pursue Derek Carr as a hedge
Early thoughts:
Indy is a lock to go number one.
Carolina to three.
Darkhorse:
Jets. One of the most mismanaged teams going. What could almost be considered a great roster. Need in the worse way a QB.
For me this is not a reach:
Seattle moves up to two. The “plan,” could not be pay Geno very little and know he will ball out so you have to pay him near 40 million. I still think the plan was burn picks to get a qb. Now with the fifth overall it’s easier than if both picks were in the teens or thereabouts. I’d love to hold fast and get Brock Huards least favorite qb at five.
Wasn’t it reported that his GM, sitting next to him, did a whiplash head move after Irsay let that sentence slip?
I’m led to believe so, yes!
God help that man in negotiations with Chicago, then.
If Carolina or any other team has Young targeted, too, Chicago now has all the ammo they need to squeeze.
I believe they have no choice but to treat it like a deflection and focus on Stroud or Levis.
I also believe JS intends to draft a QB #5 is real and now you highlight Geno’s previous signing dates and with the Tampa situation Geno is defo going to try and play each team for more money. With all this in mind I reckon the front office has already moved on from Geno and is just playing a safe media game allowing Geno a full hit at the market and if others teams still think Seattle want to keep Geno this will result in a better payday.
I’m going to predict a QB at 5 and best available (according to need ie not a WR1) player all other picks – build a great roster. I also believe this will help PC legacy if he builds a great roster over the coming year for future success this will show a complete dedication to The Hawks.
Another thought provoking article, kudos. Most mocks are simply click bait anyway. Take the top 35 – 40 players on “ the list” and shuffle and deal them out. Very little thought goes into scheme or tendencies it seems. I see so many of them mocking WRs or small CBS to Seattle when there’s virtually zero chance that will ever happen. Only recently have I begun to see outliers like Cancey or Dieon White beginning to show up in the 1rst in the odd mock. I completely agree with you that JS/PC consistently draft projection over production. The combine will have a profound effect on this draft, elevating Richardson onto equal footing with the “ big 3” QBs on the board. He’s the one I believe has the best chance of landing in Seattle. I can see the Flynn/Wilson scenario playing out with Lock and someone like Jacoby Brissett but it seems unlikely to happen with Geno on a 35-40 million dollar cap hit, unless it’s structured very favourably to the Seahawks. Personally, if the QB they covet doesn’t fall to them and Anderson is gone, I see a trade back and Kalija Cancey being the pick. Keep up the great work Rob.
Agreed. The only reasoning they wouldn’t is if they really feel a QBOTF is available later. Hooker or Haener eg,
Hooker if they just love one of the top two defenders — and they’re available — makes sense later on
I cannot imagine any scenario where the Seahawks view Haener as the guy
He’s not a Schneider type
Rob,
Two great articles the past two days! To add on, I was surprised the Seahawks didn’t sign Geno to a two or three year deal before the season or extend him after his fast start. They had multiple chances to keep him at lower costs and chose not to do so. I agree that this draft was probably always looked to as the one where they grabbed their QBOTF.
After his fast start, why would Geno want anything other than top 5 money for his performance?
Also, I don’t think he was interested in locking himself into a contract when he finally had an opportunity to start. So, it may not have been possible that the choice never existed.
He can want it as much as he…well…wants. it’s what teams will actually pay him that matters.
If we get into a bidding war with Bucs, and the price goes above 32 mill, does this open the door for a tag and trade situation then?
There can’t be a bidding war resulting in a tag and trade. Not legally anyway.
Tampa can’t talk to Geno until March 13. The deadline to tag is March 7.
Tag with the intent to trade is a dangerous option. It immediately occupies nearly all of their cap money. It immediately gives Geno veto power over any trade. He just has to not sign the tag and be patient (like Clowney did, refusing to go to Miami, then he negotiated with Seattle a contractual promise not to be tagged again).
No
People need to forget the idea of tag and trade he will sign the tender in five seconds
It may well match his total guarantees for the entirety of an extension, or close to it, for just ones year of work.
I still don’t know why this idea gets thrown around. It’s been debunked multiple times now.
Because it’s fun to talk about and it gets fans absolved of their need for security.
Fans thinking they can get a major haul for Geno in trade (and a big contract with the new team) can easily point to that and say ‘sure, let Geno walk for that return.’
It’s much, much harder to say ‘I understand the Seahawks drew the line in the sand and had to let Geno go in free agency’ because of the fear of the unknown.
The fear of the unknown
So strange that many were at peace with that last year but this year we’re clinging to it like our favorite blankie.
I think many were at peace with it last year because they were expecting us to stink and get a top draft pick for a QB. Now, despite not completely sucking and lucking into that pick anyway, suddenly they’ve thrown that whole plan out the window for…Geno frickin Smith? lol
I give John a ton of grief but I hope since it all worked out in the end that’s still the plan.
I think one element of negotiating with Geno that is oft ignored is what other teams can or would be able to afford. Despite Seattles cap space not looking as healthy as the raw numbers give the impression of, they are still a lot healthier than the majority of teams out there, many of whom are also in the market for a QB.
Now could Seattle be patient and let Geno test the market, letting him know they’d match up to a certain point any offers? I think it’s a real possibility as the 30m market that people seem to think he’s worth in the media/fansites realistically could be half that for what teams could actually afford to offer.
Telling Geno you’ll match some other teams offer up to a certain point just gives Geno the absolute ceiling that they will go to, right out the gate. It gives ALL the power to Geno. He can go straight to another team and tell them “Here’s YOUR starting point.”
All Seattle has to do is just tell Geno to get back to them after he talks with other teams and they’ll see what they can do.
No more, no less.
I’m guessing they’ll make a take it or leave it final offer for Geno, then let him test the market and re-sign if it’s the best offer (and still available).
(Read: Steve Hutchinson.)
Rob,
This is the best article that I’ve read all off season (both here and everywhere else) regarding considerations for the Hawks at #5.
Bravo! Bravo! Bravo! And I believe every point and argument that you made are quite merited.
>Note: You didn’t write about what you WANT to happen necessarily, but you gave measured and wise reasons for why SCHNEIDER may be considering a QB at #5.
>>A QB has absolutely been a possibility all along. Prognosticators would be served well by reading this piece.
As Phil said above, this is great stuff Rob: you are challenging the fanbase to really think about the terrain of this year’s draft (certainly a crucial year for the franchise) rather than fall into the knee-jerk mainstream media takes.
You are like a fine wine that just keeps getting better. I look forward to each new development in this off-season and your interpretations thereof with great eagerness!
My 5 favorite defensive players in the draft are
1)Brian Branch
2)Will McDonald
3)Keliajah Kancey
4) Drew Sanders
5)Keion White
Dream scenario is QB at # 5 then 2 feon this group at 20 and 38 it would be a massive upgrade via the draft.
Rob, if both Levis and Richardson are available at #5, who would you prefer?
Not Rob and I might regret my answer but Levis, cause he is ready to start.
Levis just slightly so.
I like both
Trade down to #6…add a pick
Hahah.. Nice one Zorn! Let’s Madden trade these fools 🤣
If the Seahawks re-sign Geno Smith in any capacity, be it as a bridge QB, the “starter” for the next few years or anything else, then I as a fan will be left to conclude that Geno was their “plan” all along. And if that was their plan, I’m going to be pissed that they didn’t sign him to a cheap 3-4 year contract last year. They sure won’t get anything nearly as team-friendly this year, that’s for sure.
Where I come from, we call this, “bad management.”
I will only accept letting Geno walk because of the above scenario.
Forgot to add that if they do indeed let Geno walk, I would hope their plan would have been to draft a QBOF this year using draft capital. The added (and unexpected) bonus of landing the #5 pick is just icing on the cake.
The fact they only signed him to a cheap one-year deal proves he wasn’t their plan
“Two #1’s”
Or Geno believed in his ability that he wouldn’t sign a longer-term contract given he had a chance to play himself into a much better one after finally starting games again.
It’s not a sure thing that Seattle didn’t already try to sign him for 2-3 years last season.
He may not have wanted a second year, sure
But I also doubt the Seahawks were pushing heavily for it either
If the Seahawks were dead keen on getting him, enough to want a second season, they wouldn’t have let him sit on the market for over a month — they would’ve got it done
I feel like I’ve been in denial about this but im finally coming around. QB at 5, should be the priority. Theres a lot of defensive talents available in the following 3 picks. So for me its Will Anderson or one of the 4 qb’s at 5.
If one of this QB hits for Seattle, they’ll have a real chance to take back NFC West and contend during his rookie year contract. That’s the only feasible path that may lead to a ring.
Kyler seems like a head case, Stafford is close to being done and they have no picks, 9er’s might have found a serviceable kid (as literally the last pick in the draft, not the one that they mortgaged the future for).
We have a REAL shot at having the best quarterback situation within 2 years. 9er’s are the only ones who have a good team to put around a quarterback.
Just piling on as regards Levis’ character:
FB: QB1 – The Will Levis Story
https://youtu.be/DFmnYpm_ZYw
SDB one of the few places to grade him that high pre-Senior Bowl
This year may well be one of your finest when it comes to prognostication.
Rob IMO The longer you’ve been doing this, the further ahead of the curve SDB gets on an increasingly larger amount of players. Kudos, hats off
I’d love to see our running game if we take Richardson at 5, Jones at 20, Lucas to guard, and adding a RB in this draft(there are many talent rb’s). Maybe take a te in the 2nd too. Other fans might hate it because of defensive needs, but I’d be excited.
I think if Seattle do select a QB this year, they are pushing their Conference Championship goal another year down the road, which could well be the correct course to take, with a 70 year old head coach or not.
Is it realistic, therefore, that skill players in their 30s are going to be able to contribute significantly to the next incarnation of the team? We should look at this group now, because it might be the best moment to act in the cycle of contracts and availability.
I would cut Quandre Diggs (has to be done today) and trade Tyler Lockett, both with June 1st designations. Though they’ve added enormously to the team, especially in Tyler’s case, now is the moment that acting on their positions on the team, will have the most positive effect going forward.
Cutting Quandre will give the team $14 million, to allocate into areas that need work (the Defensive Line, Linebacker), at more of a cost and more urgently than the secondary. Perhaps he’ll come back on a cheaper deal.
For Tyler Lockett, he’ll be 31 at the start of this next season and I think this year will be the last year the Seahawks can hope to get a Day 2, maybe even a 2nd round pick for him. He’s been proving really durable, which whilst helping his draft stock, may also be too good to last. Obviously a fan favourite and it’s not a trade that needs to happen until the draft, but it’ got to be a consideration for the long term benefit?
There’s no justifiable reason to trade Lockett
I like the player, it’s just I don’t think he’ll be part of the team when they’re next ready for a Championship push. He might be most valuable to the team in the long term as a Trading asset now?
It would cost you $21m in dead cap
And you wouldn’t get much in return
And you’d lose a great player
There’s no benefit
Trade a top WR with huge production for a gambling bet on a rookie. For me no thanks.
No on trading Lockett. You need to add more talent on offense. The game now requires at least 3 good to great receivers. Unless you have Mahomes at qb.
The seahawk’s offense next year needs to carry the defense. Getting rid of Lockett will make them worst. DK will be doubled and will be ineffective.
A guaranteed 1,000 yard receiver.
An insane catch rate.
The soul of that locker room.
One of the nicest, caring, most likeable people to EVER step inside the VMAC.
And I believe the mood of this team would turn very, very sour if they even floated the idea.
Extend him, if anything. Lower his cap and push non-guaranteed money down the line.
There are only two other top WR who have a higher catch rate: Kupp and St. Brown. It might be a stat to take a closer look at for players coming out of college.
I agree with most of the points made here, but I think most are missing my point.
Teams which have consistent success over many years, in most team sports I’m aware of, are so because they know how to move from one generation of players to the next, without losing the knack of winning things. Teams that create a Dynasty through the longevity of one or two players, such as the Chicago Bulls with Michael Jordon amongst others and the Patriots with Tom Brady amongst others, is not a recipe for success that most teams can count on. Managers who have continued success and I think Sir Alec Ferguson is probably the best example of those I know, were really good at identifying the ‘Bell Curve’ of players, playing career. Ferguson wouldn’t see the value of paying a player on the downside of his Bell Curve, especially for sentimental reasons. He’d very clearly see the need for regenerating the team with new talent, by selling a player often whilst they were still being productive on the field, but his instinct would tell him they’d were at the top of the downside in their playing evolution, and selling said player at that point, would still develop a reasonable return to reinvest in the team for its next cycle of success. Whilst we sell players under contract in the Premier League, you can look at that as Trading them, with their income in the NFL.
Now I agree in Tyler Lockett’s case, if it’s not possible to move his trade to a Post June designation where his cap hit changes from a negative $4.4 million to a positive $9.7 million, I agree you can’t do it, because the point is to reinvest that income into making the Defensive Line younger and stronger.
If it’s because it’s not ethical to Trade such a nice guy, creating an upheaval in his life and so on, why then we’re getting into an ethics question around ‘trading’ people all together.
Everything about Tyler Lockett, screams Seahawks legend, but what a legacy to leave, if from your own Cap and Draft compensation return, the new team as a whole comes out stronger in a few seasons than it was before!
PS, Trading Tyler Lockett is not a hill I’m going to die on, he’s a great player and if he retires in Seattle I’d be delighted.
But even then you don’t HAVE to get rid of every player once they get a bit older and a bit more expensive
You are allowed to keep some key, core players
Replacing Lockett will be a pain in the arse on and off the field — you don’t just give up on people like that for the sake of it to save a few million.
Yeh, I’m convinced, trading Tyler Lockett probably not a good idea. Even a newly evolving team needs mentors and Tyler seems like a good one. I recognise that.
Also you wont get much in return for Lockett. He is a wide receiver in his early 30’s. The nfl draft provide plenty of solid receivers every year.
He is more valuable to the seahawks than trading him.
I was sort of ok with trading away DK last year before the draft. Cause he would of fetched a first round pick plus. Also you would of have to pay him $17-20mill/year. And i thought the seahawks were in a rebuilding phase.
You can’t get rid the guy that draws fans to the seats and He’s still producing.
Tampa may like Geno. They may want to sign him, and hired his QB coach to lure him down there. I just have no idea how they could possibly afford him. They have the worst cap situation in the NFL. All of their highest paid guys have huge dead cap hits, so no way to free up money. And even if they could cut their best guys to free up space, would Geno Smith be worth that?
I just don’t see a realistic way for them to make it work.
Teams do it every year. They restructure contracts and create room. Look at the Saints. They’ve been able to go from $100m in the red to having money to spend.
Tampa can easily open up a ton of space. They have a bunch of guys with big base salaries. All they need to do is convert most of it to a signing bonus and there you go. The negative is it gets pushed to the following years.
Not sure how you’d call that easy. They have to eat the extended portions of Brady’s last two contracts. They have their middle linebacker and both DEs as free agents. They have $200,000,000 on the books for 2024 already. How much cap wrangling are you willing to do for Geno Smith?
They probably can fit it if they really want it.
The division sort of sucks without any starting caliber QBs. Maybe they want to take a shot at it in the next 2 years before blowing it to smithereens. Maybe Geno wants to stay closer to home or something.
Recent article in The Athletic on Richardson:
https://theathletic.com/4205676/2023/02/16/nfl-draft-2023-anthony-richardson-film/?smtyp=cur&smid=fb-nytimes&source=pulsenewsletter&access_token=11528562
Thanks for the link , very interesting article. I’m sure he’s gonna do great in interviews , especially with John and Pete. I’m prepared to be excited if we draft him and be ready to get made fun of by the people online saying we made a horrible pick .
I’m not sure what to make of them not already getting Lock re-signed on the cheap. With Canales going to Tampa, with their lack of QB and salary cap mess, I could see him making a play for Lock.
All this talk in the media about contract negotiations with Geno ‘going very well’ and the team having no qualms about using the non-exclusive tag of $34M guranteed if they have to, has me more than a bit concerned.
Regardless, you have to take a QB at #5 given the situation. Possibly even move up to secure one. If you hamstring the franchise for several years with a 30M+ QB investment, hedging with a top QB on a rookie deal seems like an automatic, particularly if you haven’t been able to re-sign Lock.
What’s the point in signing Lock if they end up signing Geno and drafting Levis? Sounds like wasted money.
Plus, Lock might not even be better than available players they’d look at if they don’t sign Geno.
There isn’t a reason with a re-signed Geno and the drafting of a top QB prospect, but that hasn’t happened yet.
It seems Lock could’ve been given a cheap 1 or 2 year deal as a hedge and that would provide some leverage in negotiating with Geno. I’m not a big fan of Lock, but he’s spent a year in the system and for that reason alone is probably preferrable to whatever cast-off QB they would need to plug in as a bridge if they let Geno walk.
Well if you end up trading Geno away because the rookie excels — you have a backup
Well if I had a vote I would draft a QB at 5. I would hope for it to be Levis if we dont resign Geno and Richardson if we do.
“Here are the dates when he re-signed year-to-year:
2019 — May 15th
2020 — May 20th
2021 — April 22nd
2022 — April 19th”
Hadn’t considered this and when you do, I think it’s Geno who wants to hit FA and see what he can get. I mean, he’s done it all the other years when he had zero interest from other teams, why wouldn’t he be chomping at the bit to do it now?
To add to this, did the team only offer 1 year deals (we typically do 2 year, right?) or did Geno only want 1 year deals so he could try again the next year to find a place he could start? Geno is certainly sure of himself and for this reason I expect him to want to hit FA. Which would really be the best for the team and him. Go see what you can get, Geno, and if it’s not there come back on a reasonable deal.
It’s been funny seeing seemingly everyone mock the Seahawks to take anyone but a QB in the first round. Almost reminds me of last year when people thought picking a RB would be dumb, and then ridiculing them when they did, all because they had signed an oft-injured Penny to a 1-year contract. There’s just an assumption that Geno is back, and that means they don’t need to draft a QB…ridiculous on so many levels.
Anyway, early mocks need to be seen pure entertainment with maybe some hints about how some fan bases and maybe front office might be thinking.
Rob, this is antithetical to the nature of this post, and it’s not going to happen, but I finished listening to your most recent mock breakdown (of the Reddit mock) and wanted to ask as a thought experiment – how would you feel if the Seahawks took Bijan Robinson at #5?
If JS says, in so many words, “We are focused on drafting for BPA > need, and we felt like Robinson was far and away the most talented player in this draft, so we had to take him.”
JS seems to recognize that they drafted so much better last year because they focused on BPA. You’ve talked about how Robinson is as talented as Barkley and McCaffrey, and they went a few spots higher and lower, respectively. You’ve discussed – in that video, as well as in lots of podcasts/posts – how drafting BPA is what’s going to help them most at this stage of their roster construction. You did recently suggest going QB at #5 and then BPA, so I’m not wanting to disregard that.
If John really want to draft Bijon, he would just trade back from #5. Get some more draft capital. There is no way Bijon will be picked #5. Especially if one or two qbs, and Jalen Carter are available.
I love Bijan as a player but I don’t want to spend the fifth pick on a RB
Considering Seattle drafted the best RB in the draft last year, who was a ROY candidate, and who seems to have the look of a future star, this would be a poor use of draft capital, especially with all the other team needs.
Rob,
I would love to hear your thoughts on trading up. You mentioned that QB in this draft was likely the plan all along. I’m sure they weren’t expecting to have the 5th pick so perhaps a trade up has always been one of the plans? I know thats a rare move from JS but maybe they have been prepared for that since the RW trade?
Which team do you think they would match up with best and what would it take? I feel like it would need to be a draft day trade when a team like AZ knows that two QBs have already been taken and they would know they are likely getting Anderson or Carter at 5.
If John likes a QB enough to trade up, I’m cool with it
But AZ trading back to #5 likely gives the Bears the first choice of the defenders in the draft assuming they trade back to #4. If AZ determines they have to have Will Anderson over Jalen Carter or vice versa, then they’d likely stick with the pick and not leave it up to chance what the Bears will do.
Then, why trade up to #3 when #3 and #4 are likely to be defense? I have a hard time seeing the Cards and Bears wanting to drop out of the top 4 with the uncertainty it brings to their draft and what seems like a large drop off in talent that Seems to be discussed.
I think most mock drafts just don’t consider Seattle, so they put in whatever leftover highest ranking, boring, default non-quarterback player. I think they start by looking at the top quarterbacks and then fantasizing about where they’d like them to end up, thus you see Levis and Stroud falling to places like Carolina and Vegas. It’s what they want to see, not what it most realistic.
On a related note (mock drafts and simulators), I noticed within the last few days that PFF has made some big changes in their Big Board. They now have Michael Mayer as fringe 1st round with Dalton Kincaid ranked higher. Daiyan Henley tops LB’s at #38, and Drew Sanders drops all the way to #95. Calijah Kancey is now 2nd rated interior D-line behind only Jalen Carter. Lukas Van Ness is now 3rd Edge behind only Anderson and Tyree Wilson, and Will McDonald IV is up to #31. I find it interesting there is so much movement in some players who didn’t participate in either Shrine or Senior bowls, and without combine or pro-days as some justification. What could their justification possibly be? What did Drew Sanders do to drop from #40 to #95? Is it possible that even PFF could be adjusting based on feedback or intel from NFL teams?
Rob, have your view of the talent at the top of the draft changed at all? I know previously you stated that there were only 5-8 real high end guys, and then the draft drops off a bit. If that number changes (combine testing, etc) and we end up with say 10-15 really quality top guys before the fall off starts, could you see the hawks trading up into that range? Personally I’m at this point more interested in what we do After the #5 pick. IE, maybe we take D at 5 because we think Richardson might be available later and are able to trade up to get him for example. Of course, I just saw a mock on CBS that had Richardson going #1 overall.
Fantastic stuff Rob.
I couldn’t agree more, and further, I think Will McDonald at 20 makes it much less likely Seattle would draft Anderson at 5 (assuming he’s available).
There aren’t any clear Nick Bosa or Myles Garrett types in this draft (maybe Tyree Wilson but it’s all projection with him even if he tests through the roof at the Combine), which would be nice to pair with the Von Miller type EDGE we already have in Taylor and Mafe. So what. Give me a new NASCAR package of Will McDonald on one side, Mafe on the other, and Ade Ade at 3T next to Da’Ron Payne.
Given it feels like Geno may be in demand elsewhere, it may be a case of taking a QB as a necessity rather than just considering one. I hope they take one irrespective of whether Geno resigns or not
I think Geno being in demand elsewhere is complete conjecture (and hope) from us. I haven’t seen a single article that even mentions him as a QB free agent prospect.
Tampa Bay appointing his QB coach will change that
Here’s hoping that Dave Canales already had discussions with Tampa’s brass on signing Geno. Offer Drew Lock the same contract Geno just had that’s heavily incentive based the first day they can. Draft a QB at 5 and compete!
If Drew was really our 1A guy, maybe Tampa is looking to sign him as the more sensible option…
Here is Todd McShay saying the bears should trade Fields and draft Young. This just feels like it could happen.
https://twitter.com/clayharbs82/status/1626275362358325249
Comments that I am seeing a lot of today: why draft a quarterback when we can just sign Lock. He’s literally the same player as Levis and Richardson.
My head hurts…
The really scary part is that they are utterly clueless how it dismantles their “Pay Geno” case.
I would hope that the negotiations with Smith would be stalled off until at least after the draft. Even if they have an agreement in principle on a contract, the Seahawks most likely want to hold off on the signing and announcement to the public until the day after the draft. This tactic would hopefully keep #5 pick available for a QB by not tipping their hand about their QB needs. It could only help-IMO.
My two hot takes heading into draft season.
#1 the Bears will trade Justin Feilds to the Panthers for #9 and an early pick next year. Then they use the #1 pick on a QB.
#2 Anothy Richardson will blow up the combine and his Pro Day and be the #1 QB on the Hawks and many other teams boards. His combination of size, speed and arm talent makes him a true unicorn.
Wouldn’t Reich like a more prototypical qb Ala Levis, Stroud?
I wonder if McDaniels and the raiders might be in in Fields? Redo that old Tebow razzle dazzle.
I do think they go qb. Fields has no ties to this regime. But what’s he worth? A third maybe.
There will be a needy team that would have no issues mortgaging the draft farm for him but I’d say 2nd tops personally.
If the Bears try and trade Fields — I think they’ll end up very surprised by what teams are willing to offer
Not sure anyone will be rushing to give them a high R1
I don’t see that happening. Why would the Panthers trade their top pick for a guy who has shown little ability as a passer and is already 2 years closer to his second contract when they could just make a play to trade up for a rookie QB? Why would Chicago even be willing to trade Fields if he was worth a #9 overall pick? If they trade Fields I can’t imagine they’ll get anything better than a high 2nd rounder. Josh Rosen (an admittedly dreadful QB) was traded for the 62nd pick only 1 year after being drafted at #10. This would be a similar situation as Chicago loses all leverage with other teams knowing they’re not going to keep both Fields and the rookie.
Rob touched on an interesting point to follow. All the media is going to jump on the “Canales to Tampa May mean Geno to Tampa” story because it generates interest. But, the truth may be Lick to Tampa because nobody know him better than Canales and if he really was close to Geno, he would be much cheaper than Geno for a cap-starved team.
I agree. I think they are not interested in Geno. esp with what he is asking. Lock will be much cheaper.
To me it seems like tampa bay is gonna go on a full rebuild. They are like $50 mill under the cap. They are not gonna be able to compete in a trade to move up and get the top qbs.
Its a perfect time since they just won a superbowl in 2020. Fans wont mind a terrible year. Especially if they get the top 2 pick next year. Their star players are getting older. Prob a good time to trade them when they still have some value.
I know Rob said Todd Bowles need to win to save his job. But I think he is dead man walking. Gonna be a Lovie Smith situation. Fired at the end of the season.
I’m not sure about this
Tampa Bay’s coach, the GM and now the offensive coordinator are under pressure to deliver
They need someone who’s actually done something in the league
Or, put in a much easier way to follow…
I agree that John Schneider likely knew which quarterbacks would be available in 2023. As such, he was happy to load up on capital for this draft.
With two firsts and two seconds, do you think there is any likelihood in Seattle trying to trade up? Of course Arizona would not want to swap with us, but Chicago could still get a top-five pick (with potential to trade down further if one of the four quarterbacks remains unclaimed when its the Bears’ turn to pick) and get further ammunition to rebuild its roster. JS would be guaranteed to a shot at his preferred quarterback, whether that be Levis, Stroud, or other. Or would trading for the top overall spot be too expensive a move?
Just commented about this below. I don’t think it would be too expensive at all. The question will be whether JS has a strong preference for one of the top QBs or whether he is equally fine with any of them, in which case he can obviously wait it out and see who’s left at #5.
Is there friction between Schneider and Pete Carroll? Do they have differing team-building philosophies?
I’m asking because from the tone of some of the blog comments they are practically enemies. Why are people implying that all the good decisions are Schneider’s and all the bad ones Carroll’s? Sincere question, I’m more than capable of having missed something
Because people perceive – and I’m one of them – that pete has had total control for almost a decade and that what Pete wants he gets and John just does as he’s told. Example, jamal friggin adams. So for the better part of a decade most of the Personnel decisions have been head scratching, and I think that’s being generous.
I don’t get that sense from the community
I think people do, however, acknowledge as an educated guess that JS gained more control a year ago (I think this is true) and they had a great 2022 draft
And I think people would rather the scouts scout and the coaches coach
And I want to say it was reported somewhere that Carroll didn’t listen to the scouts at times on draft day and drafted people he wanted rather than follow their recommendations. I don’t have a link and maybe I am misremembering so take it with a grain of salt. But it is in the back of my admittedly aging mind.
I read this as well and I think it came about after Russell complained about his offensive line and wanting more decision making in the offense.
Based on my humble opinion i think we are just guessing which decision is from whom.
But, we know for a fact, the Russ pick is from John. Prob the late round success from 2010-2012 is from Pete because he knows them from recruiting/coaching at USC.
Certain trades I feel is from Pete. John values draft picks. I dont think its John’s idea to trade for Jamal Adams.
Percy Harvin trade i think is from Pete. Since he tried to recruit him to USC and loved his style of play.
Also Pete said no to trading Russ to Chicago in 2021.
I guess what I’m saying is what’s the evidence behind any of those thoughts? The Seahawks are a disciplined organization as far as their public face, so when Carroll is speaking it doesn’t mean Schneider doesn’t agree or vice versa. For instance, do we know that Pete doesn’t value draft picks?
And do we know Schneider wanted to trade Russ to Chicago? He’s doing due diligence, seeing what’s out their, listening. That’s different from trying to move on. They brought in a whole new offensive scheme to try to create longevity for Russ’ talent set and they wanted to see if it would work. They tested the market to see what Russ might be worth if it didn’t. They they decided not to trade and re-evaluated when Russ didn’t really change his style for the new scheme. Doesn’t that fit what’s publicly known just as well?
It doesn’t take a Seahawks staffer to know John was sick of dealing with Mark Rodgers and was ready to move on from Wilson as a consequence
He was ready to move on well before Wilson was dealt
The Rodgers/Seahawks relationship broke a long time ago
I agree that John was spearheading the Wilson trade. We also have to hold him accountable for his mistakes along with Carroll. There’s some who give John 100% of the credit for all the good things the Hawks did while Pete gets more blame for the mistakes.
I think that’s fair
To be honest I don’t think people have given John a pass on some of these trades/picks
Yes. It was reported the deal for Russ to Chicago was gonna happen. But Pete nixed it. He has final say.
No one here is giving John a pass for the mistakes the seahawks made.
We all blame both John and Pete for the terrible 2017 draft picks, including the trade backs to get Malik Mcdowell.
We blame both for the failure of Frank Clark trade to result with LJ Collier and Marquis Blair.
And blame John for wasted $50mill cap space to sign Greg Olsen, Benson Mayowa, etc.
But the Jamal Adams trade is most likely a Pete decision
💯
True, Mother Teresa would have gotten sick of dealing with Mark Rodgers.
Still, the Seahawks wouldn’t have gone for anything like the Broncos contract for Russ because they gave him so many opportunities to become what they knew he wasn’t, a QB that might be worth that kind of money. I don’t see there is much indication that they disagreed about anything but the timing of when to move on from the Wilson situation, and they still did it when Wilson’s value was high, so does this example illuminate that much in assigning relative responsibility/power/authority?
Mostly a rhetorical question, I’m not that great at reading between the lines. Rob, I admire how well you do that so I’m mostly here to listen.
Schneider met with the Bears in North Dakota and negotiated a deal which he took to PC
Carroll kiboshed the Chicago deal
That was reported
If this intel gathered is anywhere close to what will happen, we may be thinking the cost would be much higher than it will be to move up to the #1 pick. Might not even take #20. That would be amazing to get it done with one of our extra R2 picks and maybe a R4 pick or a R3 next year.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/draft2023/insider/story/_/id/35659968/will-chicago-bears-trade-no-1-pick-2023-nfl-draft-three-potential-offers-make-sense
I’m really liking CJ Stroud at the moment. The arm talent is off the charts and you can work with the athleticism. If JS likes him, I say go get him.
Predictions for 2023 QBs – FA and Draft: Ravens, frustrated, cut Lamar Jackson, then trade for the closest thing – Chicago’s Justin Fields. Bears stay at #1 to select another Ohio State QB – CJ Stroud. The re-building Texans sign JimmyG as a bridge-QB, trading the #2 pick to Seattle who selects Will Levis. Arizona trades #3 to Colts who select Byron Young. At #4 Cardinals select Will Anderson. With #5 the Texans pick their QBOTF – Anthony Richardson. Meanwhile: Lamar Jackson goes to Tennessee, joining Derrick Henry for an amazing running-attack. Derek Carr goes to Carolina; Rodgers sleepwalks into a new deal with Las Vegas. Geno follows Canales to Tampa and Lock resigns with Seattle. Daniel Jones stays in NY. Tannehill ends up in Washington. Finally, SF49ers offer Jets a conditional 4th-round pick for Zach Wilson. Shanahan works his magic and turns ZW into their starting QB for the 2024 NFC Championship game.
I like it.
It’s an extremely amazing scenario to have 4 QBs at the top of the draft that all offer something potentially great. I’d be happy with any of the 4 which means I’ll be upset if we don’t end up with 1.
Young – I just think he’s a QB savant. The size scares me.
Stroud – Intangibles machine with some of the best accuracy/ball placement I’ve seen. Good arm too.
AR – the ultimate create a player. He’s underrated, IMO. Does a lot of great QB things well (pocket movement is incredible).
Levis – all the tools and intangibles.
It’d be a damn shame to not get one of these guys. I’m guessing Schneider probably feels the same. The anti-QB crowd needs to understand this is a once in a career scenario for Schneider. GMs live for this. Would he pass on these guys to accommodate Geno? I highly, highly doubt it.
The great thing is the Seahawks are guaranteed one of the top-four quarterbacks or Will Anderson
A good place to be
Absolutely. Just can’t see JS not walking away with a player he thinks is a truly elite talent.
It’s why I don’t think Wilson is an option unless he blows up the combine. Nice player…but again, I bet JA swings for the fences here (as he should).
I do wonder how far SEA can move back from #5 & still get one of the top four QBs. #7 with LV? #8 with ATL? #9 with CAR?
If the Hawks can move down a few spots, gain some pretty significant draft capital & still get the #4 QB on the board, that could be huge.
Not worth trading down at all. If John likes the fourth qb and available at #5, just pick him.
Dont gamble just to get a extra 2nd or 3rd.
Anyone trading up is probably doing so to take a QB.
FYI my next player interview is with center Juice Scruggs who had a really good Shrine Bowl practise week — I thought he was the top performer in Vegas
Any relation to Greg?
Not sure, I’ll ask
Just now listening to the first Schneider weekly interview on Dave and Bob.
The best line so far when asked about how it’s going with Geno’s negotiations was, “We’ll do what’s right.”
I’m listening in the gym
Enjoyed it so far
I also loved that he was so open about the interest in Mahomes and Allen. It tells me that his desire for a QB has never wavered. He now has the draft capital to make the pick he always wanted.
And as for his interview style, Schneider’s the guy you BS with at the bar. Carroll’s the guy you talk with at the coffee shop. Night and day.
I wouldn’t say “interest in a quarterback.” Maybe “interest in a GREAT quarterback.” If those were the two guys he wanted out of the last 6 years, we’d have to trust his judgement.
I thought it was telling that he named dropped those two QB’s very quickly
It was almost a… “trust me”
Exactly. Let’s make it happen.
Hell yes!
“Well do what’s right” is very encouraging.
It’s the first time, in any interview that I can recall, that he has talked so casually about the attempt to have workouts with Mahomes and Allen.
His story about Endleman was hilarious, too.
Rob,
Just based on reading all your articles and watching way more football than I am sure my wife appreciates, how do you see Schneider having the QBs ranked on his board?
My thinking i:
1. Will Levi’s – Has all the physical tools, played in the Hawks system in college and might be the most ready to take snaps next season due
2a and 2b – Stroud and Richardson, Richardson has more upside and has some reps in a more pro-style system, but Stroud has shown consistency over two years and then in the Georgia game showed what he can be when allowed to run the offense.
4. Bryce Young – biggest knock on him is his size, has played in a more pro-based system, but also is his upside as high as the other 4.
Just curious as how you see it, or am I spoiling a future article, lol.
Great write up as always Rob! I’ve been wondering if it would be worth/possible for the Hawks to offer either #20 or 37 to Indy for DeForest Buckner. Fills one of our needs and gives them more ammo to move up, thereby decreasing the chance another team might leapfrog us
I’m pretty sure that if the Colts are prepared to move on from Buckner they’ll want to use him in leverage to get up the draft board first and any of those teams above them would be crazy to turn him down as part of a trade package.
As a result I’m not sure the Seahawks are in a strong position to Trade for him. I think at this point in his career a 1st round pick is a bit much.
Rob layed out some pretty logical reasons why we might be able to get Buckner for pick #51.
No doubt Buckner would make a great acquisition for the Seahawks, I’d love it for a late 2nd or 3rd round pick, it’s just I don’t think Seattle are in Pole Position to make this trade unfortunately. Not when considering what the Colts trading priorities are.
Rob answered this in an article:
https://seahawksdraftblog.com/should-the-seahawks-consider-another-big-trade
Who are the players that could combine their way into the Top 5?
Tyree, Bijan? Anyone else? Quarterbacks get all the talk outside of Carter/Anderson, but I’m not discounting that a few others could stand out and cause a team to consider or trade up for.
Maybe Devon Witherspoon if he tests better than expected? I think a lot of people think he’s the corner with the best tape but there are concerns about how he’ll test, so if he does well at the combine that could maybe push up his stock to that range.
Hey Rob nice report, how is the 2024 QB Class is it better then this year? Is there anyone worth waiting for like Williams?
Nope
Even if the qb class was better next year , we’d have to give up significant draft capital to move up unless we really suck next year. Like Rob said , there’s 4 good quarterback prospects this year. Let’s take advantage of the gift from the Broncos and get our QBOTF.
Amen!
Honestly, after reading GoGo’s comment, I was waiting for a Husky Homer to chime in about Penix. That narrative is thriving on other sites, right up there with trading for Vea.
Whenever i read about this QB class i always hear that next year is way better . Rob if Caleb Williams was eligble this year where will he be in your QB rankings?
Well ignore anyone who parrots that
Another reason to draft a QB is the obvious intention to be a team in the Championship conversation for the next 10 years potentially. All this “Go for a QB next year” (which was all the talk last year) makes me believe that some seahawk fans don´t know that you need to win like 3 games to get a top QB next year, all the while they are talking Superbowl with a Carter pick.
Watching him during the Senior Bowl he just looks like a Hawks CB and the idea of him opposite Woolen is pretty intriguing.
I’m definitely interested in seeing more.
Whoa! Now that is coverage.
Brents is exceptional covering on the outside — it’s over the middle where you see issues and on shorter routes where he has to change direction and he can be a split second late and doesn’t have the recovery ability on tape
Well, that might be perfect since those defects could keep his stock low. Maybe he could be molded into another Sherman for us, just erase 1/3 of the field on his side and let Woolen and the safeties deal with the other 2/3 of the field…
What range do you see him going in?
3/4 in this draft
Perfect. Corner after the third round? Glaring weakness? It’s all coming together for a Seattle pick…
Brents was getting a lot of buzz during Senior Bowl because it was fun/easy to compare him to Tariq Woolen. Brents does not have anywhere close to Tariq’s athletic ability but he did show that he could possibly run 4.45 at the combine. If that happens, he could be a worthy project CB pick.
I don’t know if any of you have been around long enough to remember the draft after Richard Sherman when the Saints drafted a lengthy raw converted WR in the 2nd round (Stanley Jean-Baptiste). I have a feeling Brents could get over-drafted this year.
The CB that I am hoping lasts until Rd 3 is Darius Rush. He could be a perfect corner to pair with Woolen like Shead was with Sherman.
Yes on the highlights it looked like Darius Rush was making loads of plays. I’m more hoping he might last until Day 3.
Just did a mock draft at PFF:
#5 QB C.J. Stroud, Ohio State
#30 RB Bijan Robinson, Texas (traded pick #20 with the Eagles for picks #62 and #94
#37 DT Mazi Smith, Michigan
#51 C John M. Schmitz, Minnesota
#62 S JL Skinner, Boise State
#83 T/G Cody Mauch, North Dakota State
#94 DE Moro Ojomo, Texas
#122 DT Byron Young, Alabama
#153 WR Xavier Hutchinson, Iowa State
#156 LB Henry To’oTo’o, Alabama
#197 DE DJ Johnson, Oregon
I think something that doesn’t get enough consideration is Carroll himself in this. Barring all 4 QBs being taken before 5, I think its almost a guarantee he is for taking one should he like them. I think when it comes to Carter or Anderson they will have to be tremendous in the combine, interviews etc, to convince them to not take a QB.
Here is why.
I think at this point in Carroll’s career, he is really concerned about his legacy. If you have read Win Forever, there is a part, and I am summarizing, where he talks about the winning organization. I think he is the one talking about the Giants, but I don’t have the book handy to check. In it, he refers to all the division banners they have and the success they had and how that is the kind of coach he wants to be bringing that kind of contribution to an organization.
At this point, I think Carroll probably wants to win another Super Bowl, but I also think he is thinking about the legacy he leaves behind in Seattle. I don’t think he is pleased with the mark on his name with his tenure at USC. I also don’t think he wants to be known as just the Legion of Boom. At his core, Carroll is a competitor, and the greatest coaches either have long-sustained success with the same QB or are able to do it with multiple guys. I don’t think he wants people to think about him as only being able to be successful with a homerun defense and early Russell.
This brings us to Geno. If Carroll is going for the most wins possible and wants to achieve their highest level of success before he sails off into the sunset or is kicked out, I don’t think he is gonna look at Geno and like his odds there. I am sure he is thinking he can get another young QB, rebuild his defense into something great like head has for his SB run and go for it again.
I don’t think he looks at Geno and sees someone who is gonna steal the division away from the 49ers right now. If we could guarantee 2 more seasons of Geno’s 22′ season, is that enough to even accomplish that with an improved defense? I don’t think so.
Like Rob mentioned, I think the plan has always been and still is to go get a QB and try to make magic happen on defense again. I think his best odds of winning a few more divisions, conference championships, and maybe a Superbowl is gonna be through a young QB and not rolling the dice on Geno at 30 million a year plus hoping Jalen Carter and a couple draft picks can launch them to superbowl heights.
The thing with Geno and all this sort of comes down for me is the tribalization of the post Russel trade.
This fanatical “he’s our guy,”-ness of it all is fairly preposterous. When you have a whole fan base prepared to groan it out for a year and go and get a qb only to have that same fanbase switch gears and talk about Geno in fervent tones like he’s on the level with I don’t know take your pick: ichiro, Griffey jr., etc in what he means going forward it is absurd.
I’ve got Stacy and bump doing segments like “now I’m NOT saying Geno is mahomes….but you could pay him a ton of money.”
No you got it right guys. Geno is not now nor ever mahomes.
Going back to your take on Pete and win forever. Since Geno is not mahomes, The choice is pretty damn easy to make.
If one of the qbs certainly one of the bigger of the four gets to our pick you strike because this team never gets that chance.
For Geno I’m not sure why there’s a discussion of his value. He’s in my eyes neck and neck with Carr to see who is the first qb for some new mid tier market.
They already tried to win with an expensive qb and that didn’t work. For years. Why would we do it all over again? It’s not even Geno’s fault. This team needs his money to go to other areas.
Wow, not even “if”, but “when” he goes R1… 🤔
Round one?
Five position versatility? Are teams not named Seahawks drafting players that way? I’m sure it’s a consideration for some teams. I guess I’m old fashioned because I’ve never seen it work effectively I’d rather just draft players to play their position.
Mauch I’m not sure he’s getting into round one. He’s a dark horse puck in my mind for a pick in the second frame of the second round. Centers, guards, and right tackles rarely go as high as Nagy is talking. I think in the pros sure he could probably fill in at LT in a spot role but center seems to be his destiny.
Maybe the Vikings, he’d look great in a helmet with 2 horns.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35679247/aaron-jones-reworking-deal-stay-packers-agents-say
You seeing this, Seahawks? Get Jamal Adams’ agent on the phone.
They are totally committed to Adams for $24m.
If they do nothing and Week One comes, his full salary comes guaranteed and their commitment goes up to $32m.
Enough is enough.
100% THIS!!
He’s obviously not as impactful as he was his first couple years in the league, and was not worth the trade cost. But he is also not a miserable player. He is a miserable player… at the current cost. Restructure that deal, keep him on the team, and accept that there are times that rotating Neal onto the field is not such a big hit to anybody’s ego. It is simply getting players, at the right price, to play to their strengths.
I assume they’re already working on it
Also appears Diggs is hear to stay this year. Let’s hope he plays his best season ever.
“Enough is enough”
It’s past that point Curtis.
Just heard Mike Tannebaum on the Dan Patrick show make some points of interest:
* If he was GM of the Bears and had the # 1 pick he wuld trade J Fields ( nice QB) and draft B Young who he has interviewed and watched and thinks he is clearly the best QB in the draft
* Said there are 24 teams needing a QB and only 3 realistic impact QB’s in the draft: Young, Stroud & Levis
* Said should go hard after Arod but only if they can get him to stay 2 years: $30m 1st year and $90m 2nd year = $120m if not go hard at Lamar Jackson
* Said he thinks if J McDaniels and the Raiders offered Brady a 1 year deal – only practice on Wed/Thurs/Fri – play 17 games might get him there. Said he would take 1 year with Brady over 4 years w Jimmy G
* Said that the AFCis a murders row with Burrow, Mahomes, Allen, Herbert, and L Jackson and any AFC team needing a QB better be swinging for the fences,
* Also said that with the new Amazon tv deal and You-Tube Sunday Tocket deal the cap is going up to $275m and that Hurts who has all the leverage since he was a 2nd round pick is going to start negotiations at $50m and if he signs first before Burrow, Herbert, or Jackson that will be a bargain!
“* Said should go hard after Arod but only if they can get him to stay 2 years: $30m 1st year and $90m 2nd year = $120m if not go hard at Lamar Jackson”
lol – if someone pays him 60mil a year – haha – as long as its not the hawks I suppose! That would be completely insane. He is not the same player he was 5 years ago, didn’t think he looked great this year.
oops meant 14 teams in the NFL needing a QB not 24. My bad
Speaking of Frank Clark, he’s apparently a likely cut candidate, so would you guys take him back? Is he a fit here anymore?
On the JS show Schneider had this to say regarding contract talks with Geno:
Where do things currently stand between Seattle and Smith?
“Good talks so far,” Schneider said. “We’re in it. We’re just trying to figure out what’s best, and we’ll do what’s right.”
What’s best, and what’s right. I’m sure they won’t conclude $40mm a year is what’s best, or what’s right. I think Rob is spot on with his whole assessment of the situation. They’ll resign Geno on their terms, if they can.
The sad thing is our local sports media thinks “doing the right thing” is paying Geno because apparently he’s some helpless sob story not the victim of his own actions/behaviors for the previous decade.
Finally came across good article on draft.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/10-most-intriguing-prospects-2023-122930047.html
Agreed that one was well done.
I get this. I did two trade downs to 10, and took Anthony Richardson. My problem is that ever draft I do, is Bijan is there at 20 and I get too excited and snag him.
Rob when I watch Kelee Ringo he almost looks too big and little stiff to be a CB. If he lasted till the 2nd round what do you think of him as a FS convert. Would definitely have the speed to cover the back end and seems to have good ball skills.
Not sure. I think he’s a corner but the stiffness is a legit concern
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/02/17/scouting-combine-tampering-will-determine-ezekiel-elliotts-future/
Florio makes a good point. Schefter is literally reporting that tampering WILL happen at the Combine, and nothing will happen.
If Geno and the Seahawks do not come out of the combine with a solid idea of his market, that’s their own fault.
Talk about a fun wide receiver to watch. His Senior Bowl had to increase his stock a bit.
https://twitter.com/JimNagy_SB/status/1626021412350599168?t=xQX81c6lXK1NU4RTLB7FJA&s=19
Not on this topic, but here’s an interesting article featuring an “analytical study” of DL run defense stats for draft eligible defensive linemen.
https://steelersdepot.com/2023/02/2023-nfl-draft-prospects-dl-run-defense-stat-study/
Really cool and interesting. Think it needs to be adjusted for level if competition?!
Great at highlighting prospects we should be focusing on – Thanks!!
Far be it from me to suggest that I’m the greatest GM of all time, but this small sampling of my results-oriented approach speaks for itself.
I began with some trades:
Dee Eskridge to the Chargers for #158.
Gabe Jackson to the Commandments for #152, a 2024 6th, and a 2025 7th.
Jordan Brooks to the Panthers for #114, a 2024 2nd, and a 2025 6th.
Quandre Diggs to the Raiders for #109, 2024 4 & 5.
Jamaal Adams to the Bears for #103, a 2024 4 & 5, and a 2025 5th.
Some may say, “this could never happen!!” to which I say, “so what? It’s make believe.”
The Picks:
1-5. WILL LEVIS. QB
1-20. TRADE w the Vikings for 1-23, 3-92, 4-131, and a 2024 5th.
1-23. TRADE with the Bengals for 1-28, 3-92, 4-131, 5-165
1-28. TRADE with the Raiders for 2-38, 3-70
2-37. JOSH DOWNS WR
2-38. DAWAND JONES BMF
2-51 JOHN JACOB JINGLEHEIMER SCMITZ C
3-70. JORDAN BATTLE. S
3-83. JL SKINNER S
3-87 DREW SANDERS. LB
3-92. NOAH SEWELL. LB
4-103 ED HARRISON EDGE
4-109 KEONDRE COBURN DI
4-114. BYRON YOUNG DI
4-122. KJ HENRY. EDGE
4-131 ANDREW VORHEES G
4-152 JAXSON KIRKLAND. G
5-153 JUICE NEWTON SCRUGGS. C
5-156. JONATHON MINGO. WR
5-158 KENNY BMF MCINTOSH. RB
5-165 STETSON BENNETT. QB
6-197. SIRVOCEA DENNIS. LB
I know, I know, freaking genius. Call me, Jody. I’m cheap.
Your posts never fail to entertain Gross:
“DAWAND JONES BMF”
“JOHN JACOB JINGLEHEIMER SCMITZ C”
😀
Logical? Makes some sense to me.
(1) JS really wanted Russell Wilson who a “great QB” but was “under-height” & they drafted him, overlooking his height. RW went on to success in his first year & beyond. I think JS will like Young’s tilt the field ability.
(2) Brice Young is “under-weight” but otherwise a “great QB” selection & they will perhaps draft him, especially if Levis/Stroud are selected PRIOR TO THEIR pick as may be expected. Richardson scares me a little being so damn raw, he’s a late 1-st rounder IMO. Stroud worries me a bit due to his seemingly lack of mobility. I rank the QB’s that the Seahawks might pick if available = (1) Levis (2) Young (3) & (4) Stroud -or- Richardson.
For me they want AR or Levis.
The Athletic is reporting that Derek Carr is visiting the Jets today. I think he’s the first QB domino to fall and then some other things will be clearer…
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/02/17/report-eagles-request-interview-with-sean-desai/
He’s had a lot of interviews…
I’d be curious to know what Desai’s ultimate short-term goal is (money, easiest path to a head coaching role, location of the job, etc.).
Big picture-wise, at least SEA has some coaches (Desai, Canales) that other teams are interested in. That’s a good sign. It’s been a while.
Such good analysis. Thanks, Rob.
Remember that pre-draft press conference a couple years after the Malik McDowell pick? They didn’t name any names, but Schneider basically said, “oops?” Your memory is better with details than mine, mine is conceptual. But the take-away was that Seattle had rules about player character and psyche. traits, but they “moved from their spot” (ignored rules they had previously suck to) in order to take Malik.
I say this because I really believe that if Jalen Carter reminds John even slightly of Malik McDowell, they won’t draft him. Not at #5. Not even at #20. Maybe not even at #38.
I really think QB is where they’ll go. Unless four go in the top-5 picks. But if they think they found the guy, they shouldn’t dick around. Trade up a few spots to get him.
Several Seahawks had salary guarantees vest today. The new guarantees make it virtually certain all will be on the roster on 2023. Three of these players were hypothesized as potential cuts
FS Quandre Diggs
SS Jamal Adams
TE Will Dissly
Can Dissly or Adams even be released given that they are on IR?
Yes they can, but their salary guarantees stay in place.
Thanks
Now that’s some serious vertical
Dude basically jumped his height
https://twitter.com/NFL_Memes/status/1626676002968461349?s=20
as impressive as that is, they still can’t throw the ball up high for him to catch.
DK would be the GOAT WR with 10k yards a season if this was real
I don’t know about that. Imagine the powerful hits he might take with too many of those coming his way.
Lol no way that’s real
Checkout his highlight reel from tonight’s NBA ASG- dude is a monster
Assuming we go QB at 5, if Robinson does end up available at 20.. do we take him?
Yes, I take him.
Fill needs through free agency. Pick the BPA in the draft.
Most Hawks fans would meltdown if JS went QB at #5 then RB at #20, but I’d like it.
New QB School episode on the 2021 Levis vs. Georgia game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFcqN38ATTE
I struggle with his videos to be honest
Here’s a video where Levis is making NFL throws against the elite college defense of the last two years, leading an overmatched offense
And his assessment at the end is, ‘well I need to see a lot more than this’
OK — so when you review Hendon Hooker playing against the same defense and not making any of these throws and not playing anywhere near as well — yet with a better supporting cast — why does his video end with a positive note?
It makes no sense
I watched the Hendon Hooker video out of curiosity.
The number of times he correctly points out that the plays he’s analyzing have no use in the NFL is stunning.
But he still cannot seemingly connect that Hooker will need to unlearn them and relearn the NFL basics and that would adversely hinder his transition.
But the biggest problem I see is he’s looking at one game and putting that out there like it’s a complete analysis. If you’re going to call yourself QB School, it might be wise to watch more than one game. Don’t you think?
His Hooker analysis was basically negative throughout then ended with a positive comment, he did the opposite for Levis.
Bizarre.
It is a small point but I thought I remembered reading that Seattle still has their 7th-round pick because the conditions of the trade failed to vest. But, it is missing from Seattle on most “draft order” lists. Does anyone else remember reading something conclusive about this one way or another?
Brady Henderson tweeted it in January.
https://twitter.com/BradyHenderson/status/1617639483566063617?s=20&t=TEn4dQQa2zWe2n4m20cvjg
Thank you!
Given Schneider’s vague recent comments regarding Geno, how much more likely does a trade up scenario seem now? I just get the sense from his recent comments on Wyman and Bob that he really wants to go QB with that first pick but can’t show his hand for obvious reasons.
I did wonder if casually dropping the names of Mahomes and Allen, two players we know he liked, was almost a hint to say, “trust me on this one”
I say next year they invite Miles Garrett back to take on DK in the celebrity basketball game! 🍿🍿🍿
DK highlights
https://mobile.twitter.com/NBAAllStar/status/1626786274165112832
So with Diggs salary being guarenteed yesterday the Hawks are basically locked into him playing next year on an $18 mil cap hit. That makes no sense to me.
@trevor
It makes no sense to you…because it does not make any sense! I was hopeful they were going to cut Diggs LAST year.
I am most likely being too gloomy, but moves like the Diggs contract, the JA contract, all we need next is to sign Geno to an albatross deal, play .500 ish ball and wait for the team to get sold.
https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/seattle-seahawks
Checked over the cap.com, and now that Diggs 2023 contract is guaranteed, 17.59 mil. would be dead money even with a post June 1 cut, and only $510k cap savings. Adams would have just under 8.5 mil. cap savings with a post June 1 cut, but almost 9.7 mil. in dead cap hit. Dissly’s $ situation is similar to Diggs, with a 8.74 mil. dead cap hit even after June 1, and only a 450k cap savings.
https://overthecap.com/salary-cap-space
And according to this page, we only have just over 19 mil. in effective cap space now. Not sure how we could sign Geno to a big deal and any other FAs with that, unless 2023 is very light with 2024 & 2025 huge 40+ mil. years for him, and no one here wants that.
We’ve been talking about this here for months now.
In the previous few months we had over 31 mil. in effective cap space, now after Jason Myers’ contract and the guaranteed contracts that went into effect Friday, we have less than 2/3 of that at 19 mil. It was discussed here for months that we could cut Diggs after June 1 and save most of his contract, which it was showing on this same over the cap site before Friday. Just disappointed that now we can’t cut or trade Diggs post June 1st like had been planned or theorized here repeatedly and draft a rookie to replace him because of the way his contract was structured and these lock-in dates. Same with Dissly.
As far as Geno, it’s fine with me if we let him go to another team, TB or wherever. He had a few good or great games in the first half of the season, but after the bye he was the same old Geno, with a few good plays or a good half like the playoff game, but lots of turnovers and ineffective play. Draft a rookie QB and sign Lock or Minshew to a cheap 2021 or 2022 Geno sized contract, but make it for 2 years in case they look great consistently all year, unlike Geno.
I think that a $14-16M year one cap hit for Geno is about the best that can be done on a 3-year deal that would also give Seattle a reasonable out after year 2.
The guarantees for Dissly, Adams and Diggs limit what Seattle can do for Geno and also probably put to rest any hopes for a “splash” FA signing this year. There are likely to be some FA bargains at off-ball LB and interior OL and those are positions of need.
Rob I agree with QB at 5 my reason is while watching the super bowl bowl how much defense did you see I didn’t see a lot did anyone see a lot of defense in the game? Patrick mahomes was releasing the ball in 2.5 in the second half.good luck sacking him on that release time.tom Brady was incredible at that.we need some guys on defense I get that.kansas City has a great QB a great tight end and a great offense line.i know Chris Jones is phenomenal and frank Clark is really good. Who else on Kansas City defense is really that exceptional.i could be 100 percent wrong
The LBs, especially Nick Bolton looked very good. Bolton had over 100 tackles for KC and had the scoop and score on Hurts’ fumble that helped win the game. He was another player like C Humphrey we could’ve had instead of Eskridge and KC got a few picks later.
Another big part of their team and full time starter while our 2nd round WR has barely played in the last 2 years. All so the Rams couldn’t get him. Sure LA is happy now they didn’t get a chance to pick him.
Unfortunately Dee looks like another 2nd or early round bust for the Seahawks, like Blair, Barton and Collier. How about we hire the Utah DC if they can make a top D out of average players every year? Must be a miracle worker and sure fooled PC/JS into thinking they were exceptional or draftable players doing that instead of the scheme. We need that scheme to get the most out of our players or put them in the position to excel and not flounder.
Chiefs also took my lb crush last year, Chenal, who played well for them his rookie season. We took Lucas, so I’m not mad. Just jealous
https://youtu.be/up0cMY6_pv4
Here you go….punctuation….they help a sentence make more sense.
Thanks to all here for at least considering qb.
I rarely argue on social media cause what is the point.
But I’m slowly going insane with people on other hawks sites that think I’m a big doo doo brain idiot for suggesting Geno is just okay.
So I thought why not just look at the evidence.
Remember when poor broken down russ sucked in 2021? Remember when Geno ruled last year? Remember we couldn’t win with russ making a zillion dollars? But now it’s time to “reward,” Geno?
Let’s look at the numbers:
Wilson 2021: 3113 yards. 25 tds. 6 ints.
Geno 2020: 4282 yards. 30 tds. 11 ints.
Looks good. Oh wait let’s do some math magic.
Wilson stats adjusted for 17 games: (total games geno played last year)
3780 yards. 30 tds. 7.25 ints.
Geno adjusted for 14 games: (total games Wildon played)
3526 yards. 24.75 tds. 9 ints
Can anyone explain to me how Geno with the first rb to break 1000 yards and nine tds in years, two new good tackles, Lewis being good instead of a liability, and a first round TE added to the mix throws by adjusted numbers 400-500 yards more than Wilson but the same tds yet more interceptions is somehow worth near Wilson money when a case could be made Wilson was no longer worth Wilson money?
Help me out folks…..
First of all my friend, why do you bother at those other sites?
Secondly, my theory is simple: Wilson hate.
Thirdly, since you do go to those sites I presume you drop these stats and the fact that Geno had a better team around him for the most part BEACAUSE OF THE DRAFT. What do the clones say when you state these FACTS?
Actually I usually try to keep it mellow. Like he sure had a great year…but is he really the future?
That’s usually followed by me being called a dumbest.
I just watch a lot of videos to kind of get a pulse of what is going on. And it’s not pretty😀
*dumb ass*
It stinks, instead of this being the most exciting draft preparation that we’ve gotten to enjoy, I’m ready to get it over with.
I’m stil stoked but yeah at times I want it to be over
It is getting bad, in some cases it can be almost worse with our own fans. Too many casual fans want the easy solution: don’t want to critical think, don’t want risks, can’t see big picture. Critical thinking is honestly a rare commodity anymore.
Geno was an pro bowler and “was just as good as Russ” so problem solved. Pay him. Nice and easy.
Why sign a quarterback when we can just bring Lock back? He’s just as good. Easy
Draft all defense and then our dynasty starts. It’s that simple.
Pete deserves zero criticism and can stay as long as he wants. “I don’t have to think about a new coach and make my head hurt.”
You can’t have discussions, They don’t want to hear anything that doesn’t agree with them. It stinks because we want to read and watch all that we can, and there is really only this page.
I’m just glad that there is Pete and John making these decision and not “Chad in his mom’s basement.”
You make some strong points.
Going into next season with Adams and Diggs having a $36 million cap hit has to be one of the dumbest uses of cap space in the entire NFL.
What happened contractwise yesterday and Pete’s insisting on improving the trenches points to Geno not getting 30 mil in Seattle?
Cha mentioned: “More teams than ever are over the cap due to the COVID effect on the cap in 2021. None of the major extensions demonstrated a hit due to that reduced cap season. Teams leveraged future cap space to maintain competitiveness and now the bills are coming due.”
This could work in the Seahawks favor. For the simple reason that teams will NOT have money to spend on free agents. Like they have had in past seasons. Also as more and more teams are paying big bucks on their QB position this will limit their ability to spent in other areas. Of coarse their will be teams that have cap room. So it will make an interesting off season for sure.
If you want an answer to that, read that post thread. My next comment down.
I don’t think you can count on the market being flush just because teams are over the cap currently.
I enjoyed the JS show on Thursday. Here are some ideas for questions to ask in the future.
The success in the 2021 draft with 2 starting tackles, a star RB and a potential all-pro CB will create some challenges to sign all those guys in 3 years. Do you think that far ahead? Are you already planning for that?
There is always talk about drafting for need versus drafting best player available but do you also consider the positional value that comes from having a QB, WR, OT or CB on a rookie contract?
The Geno contract gets all the fan attention but are their other contracts you are working on now like a possible extension for Nwosu?
There are no centers currently on the roster and if Gabe Jackson is released, there will be no right guards on the roster. Do you see anyone in house competing for either of those spots?
FA for G,C?
I don’t think he would answer any questions about FA other than “always exploring all options to get better”
Steve: ” “always exploring all options to get better”. That is a line he will probably use over and over.
We have heard Pete say it about John every year. I get it that they don’t want to tip their hand so better to ask questions they will answer.
This is my mock with a QB today and I don’t use a mock simulator.
5 Will Levis Kentucky
20 Siaki Ika DT1 Baylor
37 J.L. Skinner S Boise St.
52 Drew Sanders ILB Arkansas
83 Byron Young DT5 Alabama
123 Ricky Stromberg OC Arkansas
153 Nick Broeker OG Ole Miss
156 Chris Rodriguez Jr. RB Kentucky
198 A WR or CB I really dug this deep this late in the draft.
Will be trade I just don’t what they will and you can’t get everyone you want and there’s a lot of space from 52 to 123 with a pick in the middle at 83.
What makes a soccer fan in England more qualified than a school teacher in Seattle to evaluate Schmitz? At least Rob Rang has connections to actual evaluators who work for the Seahawks. By the way, Rang lists Schmitz as the #23 prospect in the draft.
Hey everyone, a real life wanker
No photos though, please
Me or Rob Rang? The state of education in England must be quite poor. Regardless, the logical fallacy of ad hominem applies. Try to answer the question as to your qualifications to evaluate any player. Have you ever played football? Coached it?
I’ll leave this in the trusted hands of the community
Quoting the Rev. Jim Jones, eh mate?
Imagine simping for Rob Rang and going to another site to troll about it. Leave some Ws for the rest of us.
WOW! REALLY! Your the reason I come this website to escape the trolls on line. We discuss football here, please leave.
I’ll leave but not until to evaluate my mock draft…
5: Tyree Wilson ED
20: John Michael Schmitz OC
37: Daiyan Henley LB
52: Mike Morris DE
83: Jayden Reed WR
121: Jarrod Clark NT
152: Stetson Bennett QB
155: Evan Hull RB
197: Darrell Luter CB
238: TJ Bass OG
Thanks!
Ok. I like Tyree Wilson as a matter of fact he’s exactly what Seattle looks for but I just don’t see them passing on a talented QB for the future. Schmitz we never drafted center in the 1st round especially one that weighs 306lbs. Henley, I’m a Husky fan because I live in Washington so I watch this he guy. He will go somewhere in the 3rd round. Morris Is a DE I don’t see being a second round talent. Reed we already have enough WR that fit his mold and they game play experience. The rest of your I have no idea who they because they just haven’t caught my eye. I’m not attacking you. I am simply giving you my opinion. I’ve been coming to this website since 2010 and I have learn a lot from Rob. I don’t always agree with what say here but I always respect their opinion.
I like to think that what said about your was good but it is of course my opinion. My point is that I’m was willing to discuss it. I expect my mock will change again after free agency and especially the combine, hell it’s already from my last mock. If you want continue this discussion here’s my mock now I love hear what you.
5 Will Levis QB Kentucky
27 Drew Sanders ILB Arkansas
37 J.L. Skinner S Boise St
52 Keion White Georgia Tech
65 Keanu Benton DT Wisconsin
83 Chris Rodriguez jr RB Kentucky
104 Jordan McFadden OG Clemson
123 Rick Stomberg C/G Arkansas
153 Karl Brooks DT Bowling Green
198 Nikki Remigio WR Fresno St
The defense this year needs the most help especially the front 7 in the 3-4 defense.
You won’t have to worry about him after today, MadMark
It’s the respect factor and the hard work and time you put into this website.
Rob Rang also talks about Geno’s sterling off field leadership.
Clearly he knows all