Podcast: Deep dive into the 2017 draft class

January 18th, 2017 | Written by Rob Staton

100 minutes of draft talk to get you into the off-season.

181 Responses to “Podcast: Deep dive into the 2017 draft class”

  1. Redhawk87 says:

    Thanks so much for all your work doing the podcasts and writing all your extensive articles!
    I was wondering, if you were JS, and you saw that not only Budda Baker and Kevin King were available, but also Garrett Bolles, who would you snag (assuming they didn’t grab a starting OT or excellent safety/CB in free agency)?
    For me, I would honestly bet that if Bolles is available at 26, they’d grab him then turn to the defense in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, regardless of defensive talent still on the board. This would give them more security along the line, giving greater confidence in the starting offense having success. If not, I definitely see them turning to the defense to get the “Boom” back with young explosive CB/S talent, someone that can do some combination of: replace Shead (at least during injury), backup Kam and Earl, push Lane’s starting slot, and then grab another CB/S in the third to provide additional talent and cover what needs the first does not. But I feel that it all hinges on if Bolles, who sounds like a really good starting tackle talent, is still on the board.
    Looking at some mock drafts on the major sites, I don’t see Bolles getting picked until late 1st, well after Robinson and Ramczyck. Do you think this will hold and give us a legitimate shot to grab him to start at RT?
    Also, if the Seahawks were to make one big splash in FA (grabbing a single difference-maker FA), who would you grab?

  2. jujus says:

    Love the podcast happy to hear it again!

    PLEASE CORRECT HIS PRONOUNCING OF CASSIUS

    Cash-is is how you pronounce it.

  3. Jorel says:

    Re-reading your post on Mixon from October you never outright said whether or not you would draft him. Would you Rob? I’m having a hard time coming to terms with it and I can’t decide whether or not the Hawks would draft him or not because of the Clark situation. Tyreek Hill is flourishing and I can only see the NFL is not having an issue with it is because of how well he is doing. Is this one where they would take the media frenzy surrounding it for that brief time after drafting him knowing that it will eventually be swept under the rug if he does do well. Sorry to drum up old stuff was just trying to figure it out because of the dynamism of his play would suit our team well, I just cant’ figure whether I would be okay with it or not.

    • Ishmael says:

      Fortunately for the NFL and the Chiefs, no video of Hill choking and battering his pregnant girlfriend exists. If it did, I doubt anyone would have touched him.

      But as I just mentioned below, the Hawks don’t seem to have much of an issue with violence against women so there’s a decent chance they’ll sign Mixon and drum up some spiel about believing in second chances and the strength of the team culture. Pretty much exactly what they did with Frank Clark.

      • lil'stink says:

        Hate to say it but I think John Schneider has been somewhat hypocritical on this topic. He’s splitting hairs and walking a fine line ala “I did not have sexual relations with that woman.” That said there’s no way we draft Mixon.

        • jujus says:

          I hope we do draft Mixon. He is a Legit 1st round talent that would make our running game with a bit of quality run blocking UNSTOPPABLE!

          IMO both parties are guilty, and both deserve counseling.

          In Tyreek’s case she was pregnant and the account makes it sound like he targeted the unborn.

          Either way I think its wrong to allow double standards of all kinds, both women and men are equally responsible for violence. Athletes, politicians, celebs all should be held to the same standards of law as me and you.

          • Ishmael says:

            That’s such a cop-out, there aren’t any double standards at play. Go watch the video. She pushes him, he fakes a punch than causes her to throw a little slap at his neck/face. He then throws a right that takes her off her feet and puts her in hospital with multiple broken bones in her face. She was eating through a straw for weeks FFS.

            If you think there’s equal responsibility in that situation, I really don’t know what to tell you. We don’t have the audio, and there are conflicting reports about who said what. The victim and her friends are saying a friend of theirs was targeted with homophobic language, Mixon and his friends are saying they were targeted with racist language. He reacted in a wildly, wildly, disproportionate manner.

            Anyway, my point is that the Hawks aren’t any different to any other team. As long as they get the best players they can, they really don’t care about violence against women. We should all stop pretending they do.

    • All I see is 12s says:

      I think it is a mistake to lump Clark in with Mixon, hill, hardy, or rice. Without going into too many details, Clark did not actually hit his girlfriend . Granted it was an argument that got out of hand, but all parties have agreed that be didn’t actually hit her. The police report is available on line. That said, he was involved in a physical argument with someone not even half his size and it was unacceptable. John Schneider has publicly stated the he would not draft someone who hit a woman. So unless something has changed, Mixon is off the table.
      With that said , I am not sure that blackballing mixon is the way to go. If he goes to therapy and admits his wrongdoing and makes efforts to write what was wrong I don’t think it’s inconceivable to give these guys a second chance. People who commit to Domestic violence arer fathers husbands brothers and members of the community. Each incident, unless it is a chronic problem, needs to be viewed in specific an individual terms.
      it is a privilege to play football in the NFL and to make a living that way. I just get really annoyed that just because there’s a video, a guy like Ray Rice who did everything to make up for his wrongdoing was blackballed while Greg Hardy does not have a video(though his crime was reportedly worse and he died everything) and was given a chance to make millions with the Cowboys. What a surprise he blew it.

      • Ishmael says:

        https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/2072008-frank-clark-police-report.html Page 20 and 21.

        And you can have a look at this piece as well: http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/seahawks/witnesses-describe-ugly-hotel-incident-involving-seahawks-draft-pick/

        This from Schneider gets to the heart of things : ‘Like I said, talking to the other teams, and making sure that everybody’s had the same research from all the attorneys and the counselors and the D.A. and everybody involved. We knew there weren’t going to be any pass-rushers left, and we needed to grab one as soon as we could.’

        Anyway, there’s no point going over all this again. It’s done. They didn’t care about Clark’s domestic abuse, so they’re likely not going to care about Mixon hospitalising a woman either – unless the optics are so bad that it becomes a genuine distraction to the team.

      • RealRhino2 says:

        1. I would like us to draft him because it might lead to an important conversation about DV, violence issues, etc. The hope would be that we could get to a serious and enlightened discussion about rehabilitation, the dynamics of relationships that lead to these problems, the difference between DV and the Mixon case, etc.

        2. I would like us to not draft him, because it’s tiring just thinking that we wouldn’t get any of that; just the same knee-jerk nonsense we got with Frank Clark.

    • Kenny Sloth says:

      He’s going undrafted.

      • Wall up says:

        I agee. That’s the best thing for him anyway. Then he can choose what’s best for him, without outside distractions, just football. I sure hate to see him @ GB, which would be a nightmare to defend with ARod’s play action. They would be scary good, too good. For that reason alone, I would draft him. We’ll see.

      • peter says:

        Doubt it. In no game i saw of his did anyone speak of it. At all. So two years removed after , there’s going to be some sort of uproar?

        • Kenny Sloth says:

          Because now someone is looking to invest potentially millions in resources on someone that has shown such poor decision making abilities.

          Let me send that video of someone in before their next job interview- no matter their age/race/gender-

          It would make the employer pause.

          That being said, it only takes one team. I think most teams will pass on him several times for other prospects.

          It’s not like he’s a flawless prospect either. He’s not scheme transcendent, by any means, he’s had some nicks, he’s not a natural blocker.

          • peter says:

            So in the end it’s the video? Nothing more. I just re-read what tyreek hill and Perrish cox did and both cases are brutal. But in the end there is no video so Seattle can resign Cox and Hill can be a first team All pro.

            I don’t think Mixon is scheme transcendent but I think after Fournette and Cook this year’s running back class is pretty meh….I’ve struggled to watch virtually every DBD video from bottom to top for RB’s and literally no one excites me. Not hood, not hunt, not Perrine. And so I bring up Mixon as more of a point/counterpoint.

            He has skills, size, speed, hands. He played in a Power 5 conference. he had good production splitting carries. And now I’m mostly trying to see in this hyper-analyzed world where anyone could have seen that video by now how important will it really be?

            As per RB’s realistically I think Seattle should consider McNichols and/or Kamara and then they’d get all the skill and production of Mixon and none of the BS.

  4. Ishmael says:

    Ugh. Why have the Hawks signed Perrish Cox?

    Probably about time to stop pretending this team cares about violence against women. Puts Mixon squarely in the frame.

    • JT says:

      I didn’t know Cox had a history until I saw this and read about it just now… I’d say what he was accused of is worse than the actions of Mixon or Ray Rice, if true.

      Strictly from a football sense, Cox had a couple decent seasons with San Fran and Tennessee before repeatedly getting torched this season and ultimately getting cut. I’m not surprised the Hawks were looking for veteran insurance heading into the draft after Shead’s injury.

      • All I see is 12s says:

        I’m not aware of cox’s domestic issues. Looking it up now…sigh

        • Volume12 says:

          He’s a hedge IMO.

          • Volume12 says:

            UW’s Kevin King, Ohio St’s Gareon Conley, Clemson’s Cordrea Tankersley are the best fits IMO from a purely CB standpoint. Day 1, E-day 2 that is.

            • Ishmael says:

              Something to think about with CBs is that it does seem to take a decent amount of time to teach the kick-slide. It’s a technique that requires a lot of mental toughness and discipline.

              Even if we took, say, King with our first pick there’s no guarantee he’d be ready to start week one.

      • C-Dog says:

        He spent time on the roster before in 2013. There’s familiarity with him and the team. He’s probably nothing more than a hedge.

    • nichansen01 says:

      Webb, Sowell and Williams. Now pox. We need to stop signing these low quality Fas. Losing faith in the FO.

    • John_s says:

      One thing we know about the Seahawks is that they do not like having a glaring need going in to the draft. They like to fill those needs in FA and look at taking the BPA.

      This is just Seattle filling the roster to help the depth so they do not have to reach in the draft of they don’t have to.

  5. Volume12 says:

    Trev, you’ll like this. Seattle met with Laval TE Anthony Auclair (Canadian prospect). Huge kid.

    And Seahawks met with mid round LB Javancy Jones. He is passionate man. Out there talking trash, hollering, screaming, just infectious. Very cool prospect.

    • Volume12 says:

      Auclair- 6’5, 254 lbs., 34″ arms, 10 7/8″ hands.

      • Volume12 says:

        Jones- 6’1, 245 lbs., 32″ arms. Tons of energy. Teammates were said to loved playing with him this week.

        • Volume12 says:

          Wow. Jones mom has a rare autoimmune disease that affects her spinal cord and optic nerve. She’s paralyzed from the neck down and blind, but still listens to all her sons games. He chose Jackson St. so he could stay close to her.

          This is uh, hitting on a personal note here and tugging at my heart strings. Miss u Ma. ?

        • C-Dog says:

          Some really interesting stuff coming out about Jones. Thought to transition to the NFL best as an OLB, notoriously competitive nature that he claims is driven to take care of his two year old daughter, but here’s the interesting thing I read that caught my eye;

          “Jones recorded 82 total tackles as a senior, including 19.5 for a loss and four sacks. He participated in every unit of JSU’s special teams, and lined up as a tight end and caught a pair of touchdown passes.”

          Hm. Not going to have a problem doing whatever they ask him to do. I think he’s one to watch.

          • Wall up says:

            I was thinking MLB/FB/HB. Like Tukuafu, except @ LB instead of DL.

          • Volume12 says:

            He’s a good pass rusher too. Lined up at DE, DT, 2 point stance. As you said, the more you can do, the more attractive you become, and your odds of making a roster increase.

            • WALL UP says:

              I noticed that too, as a inside blitzer. He’s fearless.

            • Redhawk87 says:

              This would make the Seahawks very interested in him; with his multiple defensive aptitudes, I would say this screams a special team lock until he fills in for an injury or (hopefully) develops enough to take over a starting role. Seahawks love grabbing people who are athletic and tenacious to play special teams immediately while they show what they can contribute to offense or defense.

    • Trevor says:

      That is awesome! Laval is the Alabama of Canadian College football actually. He was a big time player here in Canada but the guys who play skill positions usually don’t tanslate that well when they go to US because of the competition level here.

      Hope some team gives him a shot as PS guy even. When these guys get elite coaching and competition they are often diamonds in the rough.

      Wonder how he will test?

  6. Volume12 says:

    *Keep in mind, they’ll meet with almost everyone, but the guys they spend a good 15 minutes or so talking too? More interest than others.

  7. CharlieTheUnicorn says:

    Rob and the SDB gang

    1) Does anyone know which all star type games (shrine, east west, north south or w/e) the Seahawks have coaches at participating in drills or actually coaching the games?

    2) What does everyone think about the recent coaching influx into the NFCW? Good, bad or ugly for Seattle in 2017 and beyond ?

    Cheers

    • Hawk Eye says:

      bad news for Hawks with Wade Phillips as DC in LA. I think he is much better than Williams, and the Rams have some real talent on D that has never played as a cohesive unit
      Head coach in LA? Who knows, total wild card.
      SF gets Shanahan? He does not have much to work with, so no big deal at the moment. Maybe the best thing is to take him out of Atl, and maybe they take a step back.

    • vrtkolman says:

      Bad for us. Shannahan and McVay are new age offensive minds who are going to throw a lot of tough concepts at our base D. Richard is going to have to level up really fast.

      Wade Phillips is bad bad bad for our offense. Although maybe McVay won’t spend 365 days a year gameplanning against the Seahawks like Fisher did.

    • Volume12 says:

      SF is in a rebuild. It’ll be a few years before they’re ready to compete. They got a few nice, not great, pieces on offense. Nothing on offense.

      Arizona will probably be the same team.

      LA? Who knows.

      • Volume12 says:

        *pierces on defense.

      • All I see is 12s says:

        McKay is stuck with goff and no draft capital, plus Les “pick waster” snead is still his gmail.
        San Fran has no talent…

      • icb12 says:

        Deforest Buckner might not be “great”, but he had a great year.

        I know you were down on him a bit going into the draft. But he had a very productive rookie season

  8. East Side Stevie says:

    Does any body have any thoughts on USC”s Zach Banner?

    • vrtkolman says:

      I looked at a few of his games after USC’s O line dominated Penn State. His height might actually be a problem and he has motivation issues. He could be a mauling right tackle though. He has great bloodlines.

    • Kenny Sloth says:

      He will always have weight issues. Height is a problem.

      High character would be interesting to see his weighted TEF.

      Local guy id love as a free agent

    • DC says:

      Banner moves like a slug. Teammates Mama and Wheeler are much better prospects imo.

  9. Vista says:

    So it sounds like Kyle Shanahan is the new 49ers coach. This division is just getting harder since this past season.

    • nichansen01 says:

      Well this season is was the worst division in the league. Arizona will probably only be worse next year with everyone only getting older or leaving. LA is a dumpster fire, and has no draft picks and has to basically put everything on gift… who has only proven to be far below average so far. 49ers are a dumpster fire.

      Still gonna be easy next season.

  10. Kelly says:

    Well after some of the recent post season news, press conferences and radio shows I think the best way for Seattle to improve this team quickly would be first in Free Agency.

    Since Ifedi is staying at RG for continuity sake this leaves LT and RT as the areas needing immediate improvement. What would people think of Seattle taking a stab at getting Sebastian Vollmer from NE? 2 years at 16 million(more than he made last year) would be nice. He will be 33 this next year and is coming off season ending shoulder surgery so perhaps Seattle could get him for a low price? Matt Kalil probably won’t make it to the market from the Vikings and most everyone seems to think Ricky Wagner is not that good of a player. Maybe Seattle takes a shot at a cheaper and proven veteran presence that could be the leadership voice the OL room needs. Couple the addition of Bolles perhaps in the first round to patch up the left side I think that would hugely improve this team in both pass pro and the running game.

    For the defense with CB and Interior Pass Rusher being the biggest needs I think you can rule out Stephen Gilmore and Dre Kirkpatrick from Cincinnati due to the overpriced CB market. They probably will not be allowed to hit the market either. So your chances for improving the secondary will more than likely come from the draft itself.

    I have to say Rob the breakdown you did of breaking down the CB class was great. I could see Kevin King with that size and athleticism and is used to having the pressure of being thrown at could really set Seattle up opposite of Sherman. The only negative I see with King is for the one being thrown at a lot he doesn’t seem to take the ball away much. That is the only thing I could see holding him back. I think Seattle may need someone who can create turnovers. Out of everyone in this class Rob who have you seen get their hands on the ball the most with interceptions and PBUs that would warrant a first round pick?

    I know everyone on here is salivating over Calais Campbell being available in free agency. But will he be available from Arizona and will he be willing to take less than the 15 million he just made this season to come to Seattle to try to win?

    Someone I have had my eye on is Dominique Easley from the Rams hitting FA. He is only 24 and perhaps if he is over his injury issues could be a FA steal. The Patriots though enough of him to take him in the 1st Rnd before Seattle. The talent is there but is the motivation and durability.

    My ideal offseason would be Seattle signing Vollmer and drafting Bolles to fix our holes on the offensive line.

    Signing Easley and having Quinton Jefferson come back to hopefully give us a boost to our Interior pass rush.

    Using our second pick on Reddick and our 3rd rounder on Luani. Then use our second 3rd rounder and another later pick to add CB depth.

    Anyone thought of this scenario and what are your thoughts?

    • Kelly says:

      Looks like Akhello Witherspoon and Rasul Douglas may be two guys Seattle should look at targeting. What rounds do you think these two would be projected to go in currently Rob?

    • C-Dog says:

      I could see them perhaps taking a look at Easley if he’s out there in FA.

      I think CB would probably more likely come from the draft than FA. I think the Cary Williams debacle might have them shy away from paying a veteran a lot of $ to learn their method.

      My hunch is that Seattle won’t make a big signing for a veteran OL, but look for value to add to the competition. I think they also probably use the draft there too. I think if they do any bigger FA signing, it would probably be for the DL, just because history has shown them to do that.

      • Volume12 says:

        The CB FA market is awful. They got a familiar face who will add competition.

      • Redhawk87 says:

        Every time they’ve tried to add CB depth through FA, even minor signings, I only see one has managed to carve out any sort of role. Each one has either ended up on IR (Babtiste, Siesay) or been removed from the team by the end of the year (Williams). I only see Thorpe as a consistent player, and that’s on ST.
        I have to assume they will go with their own developed prior draft talent combined with new quality draft picks for CB depth. CBs from other systems never work well here, and our DBs don’t fare as well elsewhere as they do here.
        The Seahawks have had great success in FA for D-line (Avril, Bennett, Rubin all becoming starters) and that’s about it. True, the Seahawks haven’t been very active in FA, but even when they do, most of their acquisitions turn into busts for all positions but D-line. Thus, I have a hard time seeing them add a CB.
        I do see them aggressively going after a strong pocket collapser (ie Campbell), then if they have money left over after extensions to minor players and Britt (Kam and JG extensions shouldn’t cause any extra cap, may even relieve cap), I would see them seeking a high-quality starting O-linemen in FA, if they can afford it. If not, they’ll just grab another cheap RT for competition and run with training up Fant and Odhiambo and going to the draft to get more quality talent if available.

    • CHawk Talker Eric says:

      Campbell’s 2016 salary was $9.5M, not $15M. He did take home $15M total, but $5.5 of that was bonus money (his last contract contained a $15M signing bonus spread over 5 years and a separate $10M option bonus spread over 4 years).

      If you want to estimate what Campbell is likely to earn in 2017, it’s more informative to look at the average yearly salary from his last contract, which was $11M/year. Considering he’ll be 31 when next season starts, he’s not going to get a pay raise. He might find a team willing to pay him the same $11M/year, but considering he’ll be in his mid 30’s by the time his next contract expires, I doubt it. And the only way he takes home $15M next year is if a team is willing to front load his contract. Regardless, he’s probably looking at an average salary between $9M-10M/year. The $9.5M/year Michael Bennett just agreed to is a good barometer of what he’ll be offered in FA.

      • Volume12 says:

        I wonder if Denver will make a run at him. They desperately need D-line help, and he’s a perfect fit for new HC Vance Joseph.

        • CHawk Talker Eric says:

          Wouldn’t surprise me. He’d replace what they lost in Malik Jackson and then some.

          • DC says:

            If he is ring shopping then you probably choose a team with a great QB and one that is only a few choice moves away from greatness. Oh wait, hey, that’s us!
            If he’s purely chasing max loot then all bets are off.
            If CC hits the open market and comes in for a visit we ought to make sure he doesn’t leave without getting inked.

            • All I see is 12s says:

              I think he really respects the hawks, but he may have an issue about going to a division rival. He was with AZ a while. Doubt he will want to stick it to them. That said, pay him damn near whatever he wants!!!! It would make us even more scary

    • Rob Staton says:

      Rasul Douglas was the best at taking the ball away that I watched.

  11. JimQ says:

    CB-Kevin King;
    2016: 14-games, 44-tkls, 26-solo, 2-INT, 3.5-TFL, 13-PBU
    2015: 11-games, 39-tkls, 24-solo, 3-INT, 4.5-TFL, 5-PBU, 1-FF
    2014: 13-games, 65-tkls, 43-solo, 1-INT, 0.5-TFL, 3-PBU, 1-FF
    CB-Sidney Jones;
    2016: 14-games, 39-tkls, 37-solo, 3-INT, 2.5-TFL, 6-PBU, 2-FF
    2015: 13-games, 46-tkls, 31-solo, 4-INT (1 for TD), 3.5-TFL, 10-PBU, 4-FF, 2-FR (1 for TD)
    2014: 13-games, 61-tkls, 48-solo, 2-INT, 2.5-TFL, 5-PBU, 1-FF
    Per: cfbstats.com

    In terms of total passes defensed, King totals 15 in 2016 & Jones totals 9, however, considering the 2015 season of Jones, teams stopped throwing much to his side. King indeed stepped up as a result.
    Maybe King could have had more INT’s, but 13-PBU is nothing to shake a stick at. IMO either one would make a great Seahawk DB. If the Seahawks can manage to draft EITHER + get Baker, and in the mid rounds draft Launi for SS, the LOB would be in great shape for at least several years – IMO.

    • Volume12 says:

      Personally, I like King more. Bigger, longer, probably more athletic. Jones is a great fit in a zone scheme like Seattle’s, and is more of an outside/nickel back than King is. Maybe they grab a guy like Jones early, and when Shead returns, use Lane as they did 3 years ago. Great gunner, 1st corner off the bench.

      And then on day 3, grab the CB with great size and length.

      Having said that, I just think King’s athleticism is really going to appeal to them.

      • CHawk Talker Eric says:

        The more I ponder it, the more I like King over Baker.

        • Volume12 says:

          I do too. Huge fan of Budda though. Tough not to be. I wanna see how tall he really is and how much he weighs.

          • CHawk Talker Eric says:

            Would be fun to see them double dip the UW squad, take Baker in R1, then either get lucky and take King @58 or move up to snag him.

            Adding both would give the D backfield a serious infusion on young talent and set them up to carry on with business as usual post ET3/Kam.

            • Redhawk87 says:

              I would honestly be surprised if we could grab both unless we traded up in round 2 (like we did for Reed). That would get two high quality players who already know how to play with each other. However, that would be a total dedication to only one need, and the Seahawks try to balance their picks with their assorted needs (ie once they grab one player for DB, the need for DB is less than other areas).
              They might be interested in looking at trading one of their players for draft picks. They could look into offloading Kearse for a 4th/5th, or perhaps Lane for a 3rd (if they trade Lane, then they are sure to go all in on DBs in early draft). They’re not going to trade anyone who is good enough to warrant a 1st or 2nd rounder though, which is what they’d need to grab known starting level talent to replace the outbound starters.

              • AlaskaHawk says:

                I’m already resigned to the idea that they go defense on first two picks – mostly because that is where the strength of the draft is. So the question is what positions do you pick? I could make arguments for corners, hybrid safety, linebacker or defensive line. Seahawks have too many needs going into this season. For some reason it seems even worse than last year.

    • Rob Staton says:

      King’s PBU’s are among the best in the country. Right up there with guys like Tre’Davious White.

  12. Volume12 says:

    Rob, have you checked out ND DT Jarron Jones? That Miami game of his is incredible. Not sure how much of a need DT is if they grab one in FA, but he’s appealing. Another guy that’s battled through injuries. Seems like a Seattle 3-tech.

  13. Vista says:

    The Hawks are going to be signing CB Perrish Cox for 2017

    • Vista says:

      I just realized that people above me posted this same thing

      • CHawk Talker Eric says:

        At best (from SEA’s perspective), he’s good camp competition for the DB group. At worst, he’s cheap insurance against Shead’s unavailability to start next season.

        But what it really tells me is that Shead’s injury is severe enough that he’s likely to start next year on the PUP list.

        • CharlieTheUnicorn says:

          The local sport-radio said his time table is an October return at best. It might even be longer depending on the severity and how fast he heals / recovers.

  14. Greg Haugsven says:

    Hey Rob, off topic but what do you know about flying into Gatwick airport vs Heathrow?

  15. GoHawks5151 says:

    Quick note on Bevel and the staff. Maybe its me but though many criticize him for the play calling i feel there is a bit of an underlying distaste for the lack of “competition” in the coaching ranks. Its been talked about even during the Atlanta game that Quinn put together a staff of the best coaching talent regardless of position (Raheem Morris switching from defense to WR coach). No need for a complete overhaul but adding new coaches and ideas can really spur creativity within a scheme without compromising its identity. Look no further than Alabama. After playing against Cam Newton, Saban sought out Lane Kiffin (yea i know..) to add wrinkles to the offense. They added more spread elements and Run-pass options to the offense but still maintained the Run First identity they have always had. The Seahawks have always preached that simplicity of scheme helps them to play fast. However, that was when the core players were younger. They are now vets and most certainly would be able to sustain their level of play while learning new things.Coaching staffs are some of the tightest knit groups to break into but Pete would do well to add competition to his staff this off-season as well.

  16. Ed says:

    What a joke the 49ers have become. If I was MS, I would pass on this one and wait for possible openings next year (Redskins/Jets/Colts/Bears/Lions/Vikings/Saints/Cardinals/Bengals/Browns).

    They should have gone with the entire Seattle crew (GM and Coach) and moved on.

    As for the draft, still on the same path of skill positions that can tilt the field early and maybe OL middle rounds. Time and chemistry will help more than constantly moving and adding different players. Get some ballers with 1st three picks.

    2nd Foreman
    2nd King
    3rd Wormley
    3rd Melifonwu

  17. LordSnow says:

    Chris Mortensen saying we may lose our second rounder this year in the Sherman non injury disclosure fiasco.

    • LordSnow says:

      If this is true, I don’t see how you can’t at least dip a little into free agency.

      • C-Dog says:

        Just heard that on the John Clayton show. Massive f### up from the organization, if this turns out to be true. Nope it’s not.

    • Blueshawk says:

      I just heard that… WOW what a disaster that would be..

    • Totem_Hawk says:

      WTH was Pete Carroll thinking? Seahawks are repeat rules violators. This give Goodell total open season. The Seahawks were totally wrong to conceal his injury and should be harshly punished.

      • LordSnow says:

        This is just my opinion, but it is an opinion. I think the NFL has a preference “away” from seattle. I’ve thought this since the 2005 sb. Does it mean grande collusion? No. But a simple attitude that pervades the front office. ie “Well they’re not our preferred choice to represent the NFL…very remote, not as big a market as New York, etc…” And I’ve always thought it to influence thru the levels of the thought process. I think the NFL front office despised Marshawn Lynch and Pete’s open attitude. I think to varying degrees it has disapproved of Sherman, the whole LOB and Baldwin.

        For this reason, they have the microscope on this org and always will, and Pete can’t slip up even a little. And he has it appears.

        • Ed says:

          Don’t see it from a league perspective. Were the refs terrible at the 2005 SB. Yes. But collusion. Had Ken Hamlin not been an idiot, new ballgame. Had Holmgren made some better adjustments, new ballgame.

          As for the microscope, no. I think teams that push the limits of fairness (NE), they eventually get caught. Play by the rules and you won’t get caught. Hide and be sneaky, you eventually will have a problem.

          • LordSnow says:

            That’s fair, but it doesn’t change my opinion.

            • CHawk Talker Eric says:

              Outside of illegality (or immorality) I think the NFL likes anything that drives up ratings. SEA have several personalities who attract attention and get people tuned in and talking.

        • C-Dog says:

          Here’s my hot take speculation, since we’re going there; Sherman wasn’t really significantly injured. Carroll saw his star pupil loosing sympathy from the media and fan base, and impulsively embellished an injury story on a local radio show to gain sympathy for the player, not thinking things out. And now we have this, almost the perfect cherry on top for what was a pretty weird season of Seahawks football.

          • Attyla the Hawk says:

            Hope so.

            Either way, it’ll be pretty cut and dried if this was the case. Seattle won’t get dinged in the draft based on what Pete said. It’ll come down to the medical records which will affirm or not.

  18. Ed says:

    If they do lost a second, they will definitely be trading down in the 1st. Get some FA money ready. PC better start pointing a straighter arrow. Dude has been shady since USC and all the little things can add up to a big thing.

    • C-Dog says:

      Ah, yes. Let the Sneaky Pete rhetoric begin.

    • LordSnow says:

      If JS trades down just to recover a pick that PC lost from a mistake he should be called on the carpet for that. He should only trade down to collect an extra pick if they feel the player(s) they are targeting would be available at the spot they’d trade down to.

      • STTBM says:

        JS HAD to have been aware of what was going on. He’s equally guilty as Carrol.

        • LordSnow says:

          I’m talking about if JS trades down to recover a pick just to recover a pick, not whether he was part of the Sherman fiasco or not.

          To trade down just to recover picks would be stupid.

        • Attyla the Hawk says:

          I’m not so sure JS was aware. Although I don’t know the process of how the reports are compiled.

          Pete has since suggested that he didn’t even know the injury wasn’t divulged. Which implies that he’s not responsible for putting it together. May be an organizational thing where there isn’t a vehicle for communicating these things between principal parties.

          Seems unlikely that a GM would have this kind of responsibility on his immediate plate. I’d assume this function is handled by others on the staff.

          • lil'stink says:

            “Pete has since suggested that he didn’t even know the injury wasn’t divulged” – If true, that would be an incredibly incompetent attention to detail on Carroll’s part. I always felt like Carroll was a good big picture guy and not a micromanager but this takes it to a new level (or low).

            There’s no way JS wasn’t aware. Any competent GM is going to see the injury report every day. If Sherm had a “legit” MCL injury I can’t imagine JS wasn’t aware of it.

          • STTBM says:

            Pete is the Head Honcho: if he wasnt aware, then he’s incompetent–but that still doesn absolve him from guilt. He’s ultimately responsible.

  19. STTBM says:

    I cant stand cheating. It appears Pete Carrol and JS deliberately cheated. I’d flat out fire Carrol for this, plain and simple, if I were ALlen. Probably a good thing for us fans I’m not.

    Still, I think it sinks they are planning on taking such a high pick from Seattle. Other teams have done as bad or worse, and got caught, and were punished far less. The practice violation we got busted for last year was ridiculous and I don’t care if we did get nailed more than once for that type of violation, I didn’t think the last one was fair, nor the punishment, and upping the ante so much for this Sherm deal is just totally unfair.

    Sheesh, its as bad as what they did to the Pats, and those guys ALWAYS flout the injury report rules.

    I am not happy with Goodell, nor am I happy with JS and PC. They are both culpable in this, and should be harshly punished. I’m not buying Carrols BS statement–he did this deliberately and was fully aware of what he was doing. I don’t know which is dumber, doing what he did, admitting it, or trying to half-ass his way out of it. Beyond asinine.

    That second round pick is far more important than even losing 4 games we won this year. Had it cost us the playoffs, being honest would have resulted in less wear and tear on players and higher draft pick slotting. NOt that I would want to suck for year, but my point is we gained nothing overall by lying and now we just handed ammo to Hawk Haters the world over.

    Really sickened by this, all the way around. And we are not the Pats, so no, winning doesn’t cure all ills, even if we were going to the SB this year I’d be disgusted.

  20. Trevor says:

    So Pete try to cover Sherms ass for all his ridiculous behaviour this year and it could cost us a 2nd round pick? Wow!

    This year was almost as bad as the last 4 have been good. Terrible behaviour and poor sportsmanship from players. Poor coaching and lack of oversight from coaching / front office staff.

    I love Hawks to the point of it being an obsession but this year really was a mess. Only the extreme talent level of the core group of players and a poor division allowed it not to be a loosing season. Hopefully this off season they can get things back on track because it seems like an awfully leaky boat right now.

    • Trevor says:

      If they really do loose a 2nd round pick over this. Then is text book “How NOT to Win Forever”.

      So disappointing as a fan of this team that has even become a talking point this off season.

    • LordSnow says:

      There’s two lines of thinking from posters on this board. One group thinks all this sideline stuff is part of normal football, it’s all taken out of context, blown out of proportion, and there’s going to be sideline love in the air when the games are played.

      Another line thinks there’s internal problems that are being hid and it’s effecting the play on the field, it’s weird and getting out of control.

      Color me into the second category.

      • Trevor says:

        I have been in the 2nd group all year but keep getting told how sill that line of thinking is. Happy player and team mates do not behave the way Sherm in particular did this year. Not sure if something is up in his personal life but something is up with this team. I just want them to get back to being they culture and team we have all grown to love because the 2016 team was really hard to like.

        • LordSnow says:

          You see it in any work place. A person with a bad attitude starts infecting everyone and it spreads and can’t be stopped. Soon, the whole work place is intolerable and people beg to find other jobs. The organization loses it’s ability to function. Is that going to happen here? I hope not.

          They cut Percy loose when he was the cancer. They aren’t going to do that with Sherman. But they better get control of it.

    • Trevor says:

      So in a less than one week the Seahawks do the following

      -Get Blown out of the NFC semi

      -Display awful sportsmanship and post game behaviour after the loss.

      -Retain the OL coach who in his 11 year NFL career with 3 organizations has not had an OL ranked higher than #20 in the league and 8 of the 10 years has been one of the five worst pass protecting OLs in the League.

      -Sign one of the worst CBs in the league with a well documented history of DV

      -Screw up by not accurately reporting an injury potentially loosing a 2nd round pick

      Definitely my least favourite week ever as a Seahawks Fan. PC /JS need to get this ship back on course and fast. This whole week should be the whole segment for “Come ON Man”

      • CHawk Talker Eric says:

        Chris Mortensen reports that, if SEA do lose a R2 pick, it’s an elevation of the R5 pick they lost in September for OTA violations. In other words, they still lose only one pick in the 2017 Draft, but it’s a much higher one than previous.

        • Volume12 says:

          I think Sherm was legitimately hurt and they didn’t want to list him as such because teams would see it and take advantage of it. But, if they just list it as ‘knee’ or ‘ankle’ whatever the case may be, opposing teams won’t know the severity of it.

          PC made a mistake.

          More press conferences. Pleasel

          • C-Dog says:

            The more this settles in, I think you could be right about that. It makes sense.

          • STTBM says:

            I dont believe it was a mistake. I believe it was coldly calculated. A bad decision, which is made worse by Pete lying about his motives. If you did it on purpose, its not a mistake. Its failure.

            • Volume12 says:

              He made a mistake or f**k up by even mentioning it.

              You beleive it was calculated, I beleive he let it slip. Speculation both ways. Worse things happen then covering up an injury.

            • CHawk Talker Eric says:

              The only way it truly could be a team “mistake” is if Sherm intentionally hid the injury from everyone else – trainers, doctors, coaches. If anyone else in the organization knew about it, it was a deliberate coverup.

        • Trevor says:

          I really hope not that seems really harsh. Maybe they take one of the Comp Picks. That would be bad but a 2nd rounder seems really extreme. Pete obviously was not really trying to cover it up. If he was then he is the worst cheater ever telling everyone 🙂

  21. CHawk Talker Eric says:

    Seems pretty arbitrary to punish SEA for failing to report Sherm’s injury when IND wasn’t punished last year for failing to report Luck played 5 weeks with broken ribs.

    • Volume12 says:

      Yeah, its absolutely an insane punishment. However, the NFL has to do something and Seattle, like the great flawless, let’s become them, NE Patriots have a track record of this.

      As if every team doesn’t try and get the upper hand or look for every loophole imaginable.

      Football is not a nice guy, clean cutz, bubblegum and puppy dog sport.

    • C-Dog says:

      That’s a strong point. Something they might think to use in a repeal argument, if it comes down to that.

      • Volume12 says:

        JS gonna be working them phones come draft day if this is the punishment.

        As someone said above. Sucks that you might have to resort to that, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do. Good thing you can trade comp picks now.

        Trade back into the 2nd, pick up another 3rd rounder. Move up into the 4th with one of the 5ths.

        Hopefully though, it doesn’t have to be something like that.

        • C-Dog says:

          Yeah, her’s to hoping. If this is what comes out of it, I would kind of expect them to maybe be a little more aggressive in FA and then drop back for more picks. This looks like a draft where they are coming to want more picks, not less.

  22. LordSnow says:

    Groz was just saying that the counter argument is that Sherm didn’t miss practice, nor missed a game, so no more than the usual bump and grind of the season.

    • C-Dog says:

      Clayton mentioned that a decision could be weeks away. I would expect Seattle to look to repeal if the punishment is this harsh.

      • Volume12 says:

        Oh god. The shield loves its drama doesn’t it? Soap opera league. Drag it out like ‘deflate gate?’

    • STTBM says:

      The NFL rules clearly state you have to list the injury and the estimated extent to which the player is impacted. They clearly disregarded the rules. It doesnt matter that Sherm never missed a game, they were still required to list the injury and his status each week, and they did not.

      The thing that pisses me off about Goodell is the huge escalation of the punishment. To me, worse violations have occurred for far less punishment (110k fine for Jets for not disclosing Favres injury, Reid talking to Maclin while he was till an Eagle, etc). Not to mention the vagueness employed by the Pats saying “Leg”, or “Torso” and then calling everyone “Questionable” or whatever instead of really doing what they are supposed to.

      Regardless, Seattle is going to get whomped on for this, and Allen should be livid with PC and JS.

      • rowdy says:

        That the thing though, it was never at risk of not playing or limited in practice. If you have to list a designation of the chances of playing. How do list him as questionable if there’s no question he plays?

        • AlaskaHawk says:

          And how does this work with all the other teams that report injuries after the season is over? How many times do I hear that a QB was injured and not reported?

      • cha says:

        Between the OTA violations they’ve had and now this, I don’t understand. Don’t the Hawks have some kind of compliance officer to cover just these things and make sure they’re within bounds? How do they not, especially since they’ve been caught on the OTA’s more than once?

  23. Ground_Hawk says:

    This papercut story about the Seahawks possibly having their already lost 5th round pick elevated to a higher pick just stings annoyingly, and it’s going to be bothersome until it’s resolved. Really frustrating as a draft fan to now have to wait in limbo, for this matter to be resolved. The medical reports are going to be crucial. Did Sherman have a serious injury, or was it just regular pains associated with playing football? Did Pete over exaggerate the situation? Really unfortunate though, because it’s not the kind of attention an organization wants when they are trying to maintain balance, so that they can push to another SB run. I hope that it works out in Seattle’s favor, we all know how important the draft is to a winning team.

    • C-Dog says:

      Very annoying way to start 2017. I can see to possible scenarios;

      1. Pete exaggerated to gain sympathy for one of his angels that was falling some with the fanbase and media.

      2. There was a significant injury that they were hiding so that teams wouldn’t take advantage of Sherman, and Pete had a MASSIVE brain fart on Monday even bringing it up.

  24. Volume12 says:

    I think Clemson CB Cordrea Tankersley would be a great fit for Seattle. Very physical and aggressive, can play inside and out, great ball skills. Very hands on at the LOS. Former QB.

    • C-Dog says:

      I like him a lot.

      • Volume12 says:

        I’m curious it they’ll take a slot corner first and their typical corner with size later or vice versa. Kind of have a feeling this is the position they’ll double down on this year.

        • C-Dog says:

          Yeah, me too. I think it’s possible we could see as many as 3 DBs taken. We know they need outside corner, and Carroll didn’t exactly give a ringing endorsement of Jeremy Lane. Plus you’d have to feel that there is a number of safeties that could appeal. Throw in the fact that they want to add possibly a couple of LBs, not a lot picks left to go OL, RB, DL.

          Kinda why the risk of losing that R2 pick massively sucks. I could see them wanting to drop back from 26 to get more picks even with having that second rounder. IMO, this is where Rob’s idea of Budda makes a wealth of sense. You can be knocking out two birds with one stone on a player like him in a critical draft.

  25. Dan says:

    Rob,

    You made the challenge in the podcast for an alternative plan for the Hawks OL this year… How about this:

    1. Trade #26, #56, #124 to Browns for #15 and take Taylor Decker to play LT
    2. Trade #247 to Bears before they released Matt Slauson to play LG (Slauson’s 3.2m cap number covered by not signing Kearse and Sowell)
    3. Play Britt at OC
    4. Play Glowinski at RG
    5. Sign Mitchell Schwartz to play RT (Schwart’s 2.4m 1st year cap number covered by not signing Lane)

    Thoughts?

  26. Volume12 says:

    A lot of names declining the SR bowl invite.

    EDGE Tim Williams, EDGE Takk McKinley, D-line Jonathan Allen, D-line Taco Charlton, D-line DeMarcus Walker, WR Cory Davis, WR Dede Westbrook, WR Mike Williams, LB Reuben Foster, LB Jarrad Davis, CB Kevin King, S Marcus Maye, HB Wayne Gallman, TE Jordan Leggett, and QB DeShaun Watson.

    That’s some great talent there, but can’t blame ’em.

  27. C-Dog says:

    Something to keep in mind about the Sherman-Injury-Gate; if Richard Sherman plays in the pro bowl next, it probably strengthens the argument Seattle might take that the injury was never serious.

  28. Misfit74 says:

    Great podcast. Rob has a good a handle on the Seahawks and related prospect info as anyone. I can’t wait for the Combine measurements and other critical info.

  29. CHawk Talker Eric says:

    @Bradley60Sowell: I knew something was different when I got 3 holding calls in a game and only had gotten 3 total in the previous 4 years

    @JacsonBevens: Seahawks 2nd most penalized team in NFL over last three years. Their opponents have been least penalized by far. Something to it.

  30. CHawk Talker Eric says:

    The 4 teams remaining in the NFL playoffs rank in the top 10 in most cap spent on starting OL.

    #3 PIT ($22.8M)
    #6 ATL ($19.0M)
    #7 GBP ($18.6M)
    #10 NEP ($16.9M)

    FWIW, 9 of the top 10 teams in most cap spent on starting OL made the playoffs. Only CIN failed to make the postseason (#8, $17.8M)