— Earl Thomas (@Earl_Thomas) March 24, 2018
“I want to be a Seahawk. I want my jersey retired in the ring of honor with the other greats that came before me. The winning culture we have established, I want to be a part of it for life.“
The Seahawks are clearly open to trading Earl Thomas.
Let’s not pretend that isn’t true. It is.
They’re reshaping the team in an attempt to create a new competitive environment. They’re dumping many of the big contracts.
This will be a much younger team in 2018.
Thomas wants a new contract. He’s made that clear. It’s understandable because he’s the best safety in the NFL and like all players, he seeks long term security.
It’s also understandable that the Seahawks have some trepidation over a new deal. They’ve avoided paying anyone big money so far in free agency. They’ve let a number of established names depart.
Based on the current plan, giving a new contract to Thomas is a non-starter. So seeing what you can get in a trade makes sense. Who knows what a team would be willing to pay? You’d be silly to ignore a great offer.
Yet here we are on March 24th and so far, that offer hasn’t arrived. In total, 24 players have been traded this month. Big names like Marcus Peters, Jason Pierre-Paul and Jarvis Landry have switched teams for mid-round compensation only.
No big trades. No first or second round picks exchanged.
It’s still possible a big offer is forthcoming but as every day passes, it seems less likely.
Increasingly it feels like teams are waiting out the Seahawks to see if they lower their demands (reportedly at least a first round pick).
Mike Fisher, a well sourced Cowboys reporter for Cowboys HQ wrote this piece titled: ‘Patience Right Play On Thomas’
The Seahawks are counting on someone panicking. They’re counting on that someone being the Cowboys. Because, if you look around at other reporting, there doesn’t seem to be another team connected to these trade rumors. The Cowboys are the only team I can find. So while there can or maybe will be others, this feels to me like the Seahawks are trying to drum up interest in a player that know is not interested in coming back. The belief is that the Cowboys are moving Byron Jones to corner, which opens up a spot at safety and there’s pressure on the Cowboys to make a move, which is the worst time to make a move.
So the Cowboys are playing this right. Let the price come down, because a first-round pick for Thomas is not worth it. If the Raiders could only extract a fourth-round pick from the Patriots for Randy Moss a decade ago, well, the price has not gone up for a veteran safety. If the Seahawks become willing to part with Thomas for a third, then we’re talking. If you’re worried about the money, don’t worry. Fish has explained in multiple ways the levers the Cowboys can to flip to create more cap space.
We’ll ignore Fisher describing himself a.) as ‘Fish’ and b.) in the third person and concentrate on the point he makes. The Seahawks want a team like the Cowboys to make a move. The Cowboys are inclined to wait for the price to come down.
You end up in a metaphorical staring contest waiting to see who blinks first. The Seahawks can’t be the ones to blink.
So we continue to wait. The owners meeting this week could be a turning point. Everyone will be in Orlando at the same time. If a deal’s going to happen it’ll probably be off the back of conversations taking place over the next few days.
A deal on draft day would seem improbable purely because any prospective buyer would want to agree terms on a new contract. It’s why you never see big-name players traded during the first two rounds of the draft.
Uncertainty about the situation isn’t going to do anyone any good. The Seahawks need to be able to make plans. Earl Thomas deserves to know what’s happening. And so do the fans.
Setting a deadline and making it clear this is the week to get it done — at the owners meeting — would be best for all concerned. Don’t let this drag on any more.
If nobody matches your demands — commit to keeping Earl Thomas.
He said it above: “I want to be a Seahawk”
Prove it then. No more talk of holding out. Play on the contract you agreed to this year. In 12 months time you’ll either be a free agent or playing on the franchise tag. Considering the frozen nature of the safety market currently, a contract of $11-12m guaranteed for the 2019 season might be an attractive proposition, albeit short term.
Thomas wants to be in the Ring of Honor — this is the chance to prove it.
That’s the commitment he needs to make.
In turn, the Seahawks should set a deadline on a trade and then make their own commitment to Thomas if no acceptable offer comes in. Otherwise teams will wait… and wait… and wait… in the hopes of getting a bargain trade.
A third round pick? If the Cowboys think that’s going to happen, tell them to get stuffed.
Now or never. Or more accurately — this week or never. Pony up.
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Wish Earl had more of a filter – his holdout comments didn’t help anyone. Then again, maybe that lack of hesitation is what allows him to play so fast on the field.
Side note, how do you place a picture in your profile pic box?
“A third round pick? If the Cowboys think that’s going to happen, tell them to get stuffed.”
Couldn’t have said t better myself. They just cut Dez. It seems like they know they are expected to make a move. Hey, I would be headstand to trade a first as well. How about this curveball: Say that they can’t get any traction with Demarcus Lawrence on a long term deal. Hey franchised him, but that’s hardly ideal. Trade them almost straight up, maybe toss in a late round lick or swap later round picks. We would have he and Frank at the ends and clearly that defense wouldn’t be terrible with the amount of pressure they’d be able to get. I don’t think they actually want to part with Lawrence, but stranger things have happened. If anything it’s just something new to talk about. Other than that, how about 3 second round picks? Or get creative, say we swap our second for their first for two years? There has to be a way to get this done. Of course… we can always keep him.
da boyz cut Dez?? when?
not seen it anywhere
would not take Lawrence for Thomas. Would have to pay him more money than Thomas, has only had one good year and has lots of baggage
then can pay Thomas this year and franchise 2 years in a row. What is he going to do? not play and not get paid? Walter Jones got franchised a few times, he understood it was a business, worse things in life than be guaranteed $10-12 million for a year.
Dez Bryant has not been cut.
“Expected to be cut” usually means it’s a foregone conclusion. Sorry for jumping the gun.
To be fair, a lot of the messaging out of Dallas (including from Mike Fisher, quoted in this piece) is Dallas has no intention of cutting Bryant.
Taking a younger player who has shown the ability to be a pro bowl pass rusher isn’t he worst thing in the world. Are you going to get a draft pick who can produce that? Maybe yes, probably not. It’s just another option. He would also be entering his prime instead of being on the back 9. Pass rushers make money. They also aren’t available too often. We will have the cap room.
Forget IT!!!!!!
Dude settle down.
It’s a bad trade. The whole point is to shed salary in exchange for youth, not another large contract. Plus Lawrence isn’t worthy of the Tag imo.
Not really a bad trade if the alternative is a crappy puck. It’s all hypothetical anyway. You get? He’s 25. But hey, people keep talking about Sean Sweat. He said young and cheap and most likely he won’t become anything worth having to pay for become he’s a mediocre football player. You have to pay someone eventually again. Very sorry I threw that out there. Just an alternative to the typical draft pick speculation.
Pick*
This is the reason why I love ET…. he tells it straight. No BS or the like. He might be out there in space sometimes when he is in-front of a microphone….. but this is a very nice twitter post. I dare say, he might end up in the ring of honor, even if he never played another down for Seattle again.
I think the ultimate sticking point is that ET wants 14M a year… which up until this season seemed reasonable… but for whatever reasons, the safety market has collapsed back to 10M/year or even less.
I’m not clear as to how much money it would take to get it done. Are we talking 5 years and 75M range or more than likely 4 for 54M range or maybe 3 for 44M roughly. Seattle more or less has to figure this out right now, otherwise there is too much uncertainty who they should draft and where the team needs truly are at this point. You lose an all-pro safety, it will hurt. Perhaps they would pull the trigger on Eric Reid then…..
Sidenote, perhaps Pocic could be a draft day trade for a 3rd round pick….
if Seattle went for Hernandez/Wynn in the 1st 2 rounds of the draft……
just food for thought.
If you were a GM – would you offer a 3rd round pick for Pocic after what you saw from him last year? I would not.
Maybe you pass on all available talent for a guard or center and then you do one of those player swaps to flip flop the positioning of a late pick but not straight up for a pick. People have me drinking the hopeful Kool-Aid about pocic so I hope he hacks it next year it can take a moment to get your bearings.
I think Pocic has the potential to be Chris Gray in his prime. Potentially solid starter, but nobody who will ever sniff a Pro Bowl. That’s not a bad thing if it happens, but – remember – that seems to be his ceiling. Not all players hit their ceiling or meet their potential.
As a rookie did he really look that terrible? While playing two different positions? He was available and competed which is a lot more than I can say for the rest of that OL. I will say that Ray Roberts likes him a lot and thinks he was a very good selection. I will add, he knows a lot more about OL talent than you or I put together. Don’t want to seem harsh but the trashing get’s tiresome….
A 2nd round OL prospect coming off a rookie season where he made 2nd team all rookie honors? Pocic wasn’t great, but he flashed potential. And with the state of OL in the league, you could do much much worse. I think a lot of team’s would jump at that actually. I’ll go one step further and see that the Seahawks shouldn’t do that because it’s not a good deal for them.
Can’t see it personally.
Is there anyone besides Britt and Brown who grade out
Well on the current O-line?
Do we need a RT and move Ifedi to RG?
I think you give Ifedi more time.
Yea, hold your water on Ifedi. Two years at two different positions. Trust in Solari.
I say trust in competition. If he doesn’t beat all comers for a starting job, he should sit, not start so he can gain more experience.
For those of you who are impatient with Ifedi this is an article that statistically tracks his development. Hint: He’s doing okay.
https://www.fieldgulls.com/2018/3/23/17155224/behind-development-curve-offensive-tackles-germain-ifedi-seattle-seahawks-penalties-pbe-pff
What’s the old saying, “there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.” He’s not passing the eye test. I’m not giving up on him just yet. Many of his mistakes are from not knowing his assignments. You can see it in plays where he flat out goes the wrong way at the snap. Some of his bad play is not being able to detect blitzes, twists, and stunts, and when he does, reacting correctly and understanding his role in thwarting them. I also don’t know if he’s quick enough to handle a speed rusher one on one. We’ll learn that as soon as he can stop thinking out there, and just know his role and react correctly to changes the defenses throw at him on the fly – if that ever happens.
That’s lies, more lies, and unsubstantiated statistics. Its what every politician says when they are looking to get re-elected.
They don’t even need to discuss a deal. If Earl Thomas wants to stay, stay. Play on your contract. Possibly get franchised. If not, you’re a free agent and can negotiate a new deal on the open market.
+12
There are three players I would not get rid of: Russell Wilson, Bobby Wagner, Earl Thomas. ET is not going to be too expensive. We will have plenty of cap space.
Did he ever say he wanted 14 million a year????
He has said or at least strongly implied he wants Eric Berry money or better. That would take $13-14 mil per year, as I understand it…
Is like to see Seattle wrap this up this week. I was future casting into next season and the safety market is also pretty weak. I think Seattle lays it out and tells earl that they ‘re going to play out the year and then see where they are all at next year.
Also for those who are not into sweat this year.I rewatched more games of duke eijiofor. Gotta be honest bennet was a tactician of the highest order and there may be no player who I enjoy watching the variety of skills they at possess than eijiofor.
It’s a shame we didn’t get to see Eijiofor work out at the combine because I really like his tape. It’s hard to project where he goes too since I’ve seen a lot of variance in sites that grade him between rounds 2-4. I wouldn’t mind spending a late second on him honestly. Any idea where he lands Rob? Or anyone else have thoughts?
Watch the Texas A&M game. He had maybe one bad play but the rest was SO impressive. He lacks a consistent get-off and isn’t a speed guy, but uses his hands well, has a variety of moves and has a knack for angles and leverage. Plus, he’s relentless. I love seeing a big dude running sideline to sideline and he does it. I think he’ll struggle against linemen that know what they are doing, but he’ll go thru bad linemen like wet toilet paper. Hat tip to I think it was Volume 12 for pointing him out to me when I was looking for someone with technique.
This was also a really good game to watch Jessie Bates at S.
the one thing that I think he does against good linemen better than most but makes it seem likened moving slowly is he seems to have a good eye, not ever play…no does, for reading where the ball is really going and not getting stuck engaging linemen pointlessly.
I don’t know for a gunsmith minimal love on the site and for seattle to give a away Bennett for a song I think if he’s there in the fourth that’s awesome value.
Oh I concur. If he was there in the 4th and we passed on him I think that’d be a huge mistake.
A third round pick would be terrible for the Seahawks. Cowboy fans obviously want a good deal, but even they would know they’d be fleecing us in that trade. Lowest we should go is a first or equivalent of one. I think jaguars have to be in the mix too, which puts pressure on other teams to get a deal first.
I saw someone suggest Earl Thomas and 1 to the Giants for Odell Beckham and their 1. Obviously the Seahawks are not getting the 2nd overall pick. But I like the idea of adding one of the best WRs in the game to go with Russell. He’s only 25 and you know he’s got some spectacular catches ahead of him. You would have to pay him, but honestly it would be hard to turn that deal down, for me.
One thing I can be certain about, there is absolutely no way Seattle is going to trade Earl Thomas for a mere third round pick. If Dallas holds true to what Mike Fisher is suggesting, Dallas can enjoy a Cowboys team sans Earl Thomas.
Great write up, Rob. I think you hit it right on the head on all points. For Seattle, either deal or commit, and for Earl, honor your contract if the team doesn’t deal. And for Mike Fisher, enjoy dem Cowboys without an all pro free safety.
Fisher is a Cowboys homer, what do you expect lol most Cowboys fans are delusional, so it stands to reason that their local media probably is too. Perhaps that is too harsh, but it is obvious he is looking at this through a star shaped lens.
I want ET in Seattle if he’s part of the cultural solution in the locker room. If he’s a problem, yes – they need to deal him. I don’t know the answer. Nobody who isn’t in the locker room does (we can guess, but that’s exactly what we’d be doing – guessing).
I think he and his agent realize that this safety market is not what they expected after Berry signed that contract last year. This makes a holdout less likely, imo.
I think this defense has a chance to be top 5-10 if ET comes back and they take a pass rusher who contributes in the first two rounds.
If Fluker is the road grader, Dickson can be functional blocking, and the kids can grow (Pocic, Britt, Ifedi)… adding a legit RB to the stable might make this a decent offense, too.
I don’t want to look at stats because there’s so many times this offense would go 3-and-out continually early in games, only to get down and light it up towards the end of games that it actually made them look okay – even though we know they were relatively terrible when it was early in games and the tone had been set.
I love sherman, the tip, the you mad bro, the taunting at Washington , getting almost killed by Trent williams..all great stuff….But too me in have bonuses about who earl is or isnt, I do have a pretty form grasp on the kind of person sherman is.
He talks junk. He’s been saying for two seasons that Pete’s messaging sucks. He leaves Seattle and pens a dear diary about his feelings. He reinds me of the kind of guy who plays up to the room. Which is fine.
I’m straight rewarm up to Earl in Seattle forever. The safety market is ice cold. Next year’s free agents might be less interesting than this years. I know we (me) want draft picks but Seattle is going to have to take the medicine after jacking up trading draft picks mid season.
A late first and a mid third this year after a trade down. Or an early second early third and then the second into a mid second extra fourth. That’s about it.
Edit….I’m starting to rewarm up to Earl in Seattle forever.
Here’s the problem with wanting a first from Dallas, they are hosting the draft this year. No way Jerry is going to host the party and turn down trotting to the podium on Day 1. The best we might see is a second and a third, or a second this year, and a first next year when the draft is held in another city.
A second this year, plus a first next year? I’d take that.
I doubt he is a locker room problem. I think that stuff between him and Bobby was a little weird, but I also bet that if you polled the locker room most of these guys, if not all, would say that they want him to remain in Seattle.
I actually loved what Earl said yesterday when asked about the LOB. He said in that it will always exist so long as he is in Seattle. Love that confidence.
I hope they can work a deal out with him. I’m not sure how much the team wants to get locked into long term guarantees and he is probably their best option to trade and get value, assuming they don’t want to trade RW or Bobby. Everything JLC seems to say and write, it feels like they are looking to deal, but maybe he is over analyzing.
Either way, I’d just love for this not be a thing that hangs around.
Agreed on all points. I just can’t see a third rounder like the “fish,” in Dallas seems to think.
I mean maybe if it’s this years 2nd a 4th and next year’s first…..okay soften the blow a bit but earl is still light years ahead of what Dallas thinks is their secondary.
That Fish dude is outwardly expressing his own flimsy wishful thinking. He doesn’t want to see Dallas deal a first for Earl. Well, I can certainly tell the dude Seattle definitely does not, and will not deal Earl to Dallas for a third. They can keep him in Seattle for at least one more season and get a third round comp pick if he leaves. It’s an absurd suggestion.
He is a reporter after-all. Create mystic….
I’ve advocated trading Earl on the premise they are going to lose him in a year anyway because he doesn’t want to be here. If he truly wants to be here, even with all the changes, then I’d be perfectly happy to have the, sign him to an extension. Yes, they are going younger, and for good reason, but having a veteran to lead the defense, especially when that veteran is Earl Thomas, is worth having. Having that one premier high-dollar guy back there doesn’t invalidate th strategy, imo, it’s having 6-7 of them that’s a problem.
Who knows what he wants or what his message is meant to accomplish. Is it what he truly feels? Then why did he ask Jason Garrett to come get him? Is he know trying to mend fences with the 12th Man after realizing he may be staying? Or are his feelings mercurial, one day wanting to be in Dallas, and then wanting to remain a Hawk the next? Who really knows?
I agree with all of this Bobby. We are all making guesses for nformed only by a few public statements/incidents. That doesn’t mean it’s not worth talking about, but it’s important to remember how little we know. Our defense can be top 5 – 10 with Earl (and Maxwell) back, but we do need that pass rush. I’m pretty happy with the DT depth, but not a lot of interior rush there. They need more edge rush depth. If Clark got hurt, they’d be relying on Jordan and Smith. That’s worrisome.
I really don’t think he has ever been a problem in the locker room. Fans/media overreacted to the Dallas bit IMO. Plain and simple, Earl is a strange cat. He has always been sort of an enigma, but I truly believe that he loves Pete and loves this team. What’s more, he goes out and leaves EVERYTHING out on the field. You never see him being a part of sideline scuffles or stuff like that. Quite the contrary. He is all business on the gridiron and he busts tail for his teammates. I think he just does and says a lot of strange things because he is a strange guy – but in the best way IMO. I dunno, I just think fans were a bit too put off by the whole ordeal. I get not liking it, but beyond that I chalked it up to Earl being Earl.
Jerry needs to realize ANYONE they pick at 19 is not gonna be as good as Earl and that alone would make sense for them to make the trade. And the Hawks should be OK with a first this year and a 3rd next year.
Robs made good sense from an optics stand point however that jerruh isn’t going to want to host the draft without a first round pick.
But it’s not just about that. It’s committing all that money to a player, too. In addition, not a young player. Teams generally get better by building through the draft. The biggest screw ups we’ve made is trading first round picks (and more) for individual star players (Harvin/Graham). Usually, those trades don’t work as well.
Sure, ET is better than anyone the Cowboys could draft… but they’d also be losing almost $10 million to spend on others (look what we’ve done with the Sherman money they saved – the Cowboys would be giving up that ability to add others in the $10 million range). Staying young and having players on decent contracts is usually the best approach.
I wouldn’t give up the 19th pick for ET if I was Dallas, fully knowing they won’t draft anyone who would be as good as him for 2018. You’ve gotta factor age, salary cap, etc. to come to a more concrete and realistic conclusion.
Don’t get me going on Gerryatric…
There are 30 other teams besides Dallas, and a lot of them could use a player like Thomas.
The Fisher article, and a lot of comments here, seem to be under the impression that its a staring contest between Seattle and Dallas. I don’t think that’s a safe assumption at all. Dallas might be involved, but they almost certainly aren’t our only option.
I think sometimes it is underestimated how important the cap space/talent level ratio is. Earl Thomas is probably better than anyone they could get at 19, yes. But you’re also getting that player for like, what, sub-$3m apy? This gives you so much more flexibility with the cap to add other players. So instead of an elite player that hamstrings you to do anything else personnel-wise, you get a really good player who allows you to do the opposite.
Feels to me like JSPC didn’t find any team willing to play in their ballpark, and have maybe started an extension discussion with Earl. Or at least indicated he is staying.
Obviously just speculation on my part, but Earl’s 180 of a response smells like a face-saving move to regain the good graces of the Seattle community.
don’t see how/where Earl had a 180.
He said he would be rich and happy no matter where he was,
never said he wanted to leave, but he understands some things are out of his control.
Call it what you want, but Earl took a lot of heat for threatening to hold out, and chasing down the Cowboys head coach, while in Seahawks uniform, beseaching him to “come get me.” I’d say his tune has shifted
Personally I dont see the problem in a long term deal as long as there is no guarantees after the first year. If you did make him the highest paid safety at say 3 year $40 million that would really be a 4 year $48.4 million contract if you include the $8.5 he is due this year. You could even guarantee him $15 million his first year and give him a $10 million signing bonus and a $5 million salary and his cap hit would go from $10.4 this year down to $9.4. Then you could back load the deal. It “could” be a win win for both sides. If he wants guarantees beyond 2019 that is a different story. It all “could” look like this:
Current:
Year——–Base——-SB Pro—–Roster Bonus——-Cap Hit
2018——–$8.5m——-$1.9m————-$0——————-$10.4m
Possible: $10 signing bonus with $16 million guaranteed (signing bonus plus first year base)
Year———Base——SB Pro—–Roster Bonus——-Cap Hit
2018———$6m———$4.4m——–$0—————–$10.4m
2019———$7.5m——$2.5m——–$1m————–$11m
2020———$9m———$2.5m——–$1m————–$12.5m
2021———$13m——-$2.5m——–$1m————–$14.5
The roster bonus would be $31,250 every game he is on the active roster.
He gets his “highest paid safety in the league” title and we get decent cap hits for the next three years for the best safety in the league.
Sorry $16 million guaranteed and a $6 million base keeping his cap hit this year the same. I made some changes.
sorry, $62, 500 per game.
Revised version below…
Funny how “Fish” used Randy Moss going to the Pats as an example. It seems like the guy completely disregarded the fact that Oakland had traded for Moss just two years prior in a deal that cost them a Top 10 pick, were horrible and in turn desperate to get something in return, and that Moss had just come off his worst season of his career and had zero desire of playing in Oakland whatsoever. Talk about brilliant sports writing.
Seriously. His comparison of choice is a WR trade from a decade ago with absolutely no context? Why didn’t he just mention Peters and Talib as examples of great players not getting a huge draft pick return this offseason…
I was waiting for someone to point that out!
This guy is an idiot and a half…
Rob makes excellent points regarding how Seattle should approach ET. I’d hate to see them trade him, but if they do it’s a direct result of making bad desperation trades for LT and Richardson, and those were made due to earlier errors like letting Mebane go and keeping Rubin (look who’s still going strong…it ain’t Rubin.), and not firing Tom Cable soon enough. Now they are paying the piper, for those mistakes and five straight years of bad Drafts.
Yeah, that was my thought as well. Why Moss?
Beyond that, I think its really interesting to think about what goes on in someone’s head that makes them think its cool to start talking about themselves in the third person. I think the universal reaction to hearing that is ‘what a douchebag.;’ I’m sure ‘Fish’ has had that reaction after hearing some other dumbass do so. What has to happen in your brain to make people forget that universal reaction? Just….no!
“If you want to stay prove it” Something about that rubs me the wrong way. Prove it by letting the front office screw you for less than you are worth? Prove it by paying for all the injuries to other paid vets? Prove it by playing out your contract and still we may not reward that loyalty with long term security? It’s such a one sided view of loyalty. It’s why I never blame a player for leaving. I feel like with all the digging through the bargain bin FA, we are looking to be cheap everywhere. Sometimes you have to pay for quality. Just with like Russ. Like Bobby. My guess is we won’t hesitate one second on Russ third contract. Probably Bobby either. We have a lot of money next year. A lot to work with. The youth movement is under way. It doesn’t change that. I trust JS to do right by Earl if they want to keep him. Speaking of quality, NEVER trade him for a 3rd. Screw those guys.
How on earth is the front office screwing Earl Thomas by asking him to honour a contract he signed and agreed to? Did the Seahawks hold a gun to his head and make him sign a contract until the end of 2018?
The Seahawks have paid Earl Thomas about $60m. How can we question their loyalty simply because they might want him to play out his contract instead of a long extension? They’re not obliged to just keep paying him until he decides he’s had enough.
He says he wants to stay in Seattle and be in the Ring of Honor. Prove it means no more threats to hold out and honouring the contract he agreed to.
He will be in the ring of honor regardless. Screwing meaning he can do all they ask and play out his deal and still get tagged, not giving him the long term security he wants. That’s my opinion of course but it’s business for both sides. The hold out is the only card he has to play. It’s the same as the front office putting a player on the trade block. They are both playing the game. Im asking why loyalty and prove it are always set at the feet of the player? Does anyone question JS or PC’s loyalty? If JS interviewed at GB would.it be different? We all want to win and keep this thing rolling. Im on board with the new direction of this team. But I also had an uncle play in the league. Sometimes the expectations of players from the team or fans is too much
Come on. It’s nothing to do with ‘loyalty’. He signed a contract. There’s nothing saying the Seahawks have a duty to give him a massive extension. And if they want to franchise him in a years time — he’ll get $11m for one season at a time several high profile safeties remain unemployed.
This idea that’s it’s unreasonable to expect a player to honour their multi-million dollar contract is a stretch.
I believe he should finish his contract. I was speaking to the after. Taking loyalty out of it, his prove it is to accept less than his asking price and give Seattle a sweetheart deal or leave? His only way to the ring of honor is to take their do exactly what they want? I believe he wants to stay so I would hope this is not the only way that could happen. I actually have a good amount of faith JS gets something done that’s good for everyone as he seems to do. And you may be right that 11million is that number with the market it is. Like I said the first time, sometimes you got to pay for quality though. And just because we got burnt by a few deals doesn’t mean we should be scared to make this one. What’s to say Russ’ luck runs out and he gets hurt after his 3rd contract? Can’t predict everything. Hope im not annoying you boss. Don’t kick me off the blog. It’s a big part of my work day haha.
Honestly, if the Seahawks did not take into account the contract extensions that they gave Bennett, Avril and Chancellor, they would be foolish.
The sanctity of a contract has to run both ways, doesn’t it? The NFL/labor union allow teams to decline to pay what they owe under a contract. We “owed” Sherm $11 million this year, and declined to pay it. If Sherm had been an NBA player, that would not have been an option.
Earl, too, has every right not to perform under his contract. He won’t get paid, of course, if he so chooses. But that’s only fair.
Yes, they didn’t cave when Kam held out. That’s a pretty good indicator of their mindset IMO.
I really think if they are not going to trade him they should extend him. That’s best for both parties. The Seahawks have shown they don’t really use the franchise tag out of respect for the players. Because a franchise tag offers very little future security.
Also, if Earl plays next year on his one year deal and gets a severe/career-ending injury (knock on wood), are the Seahawks going to pay his insurance bills? No. They don’t have to give him an extension, and they have every right not to so if they so choose, but not paying him would be bad business and dare I say unethical because of who ET is and what he means to the franchise.
Also, not trading Earl and not extending him, allowing him to become a free agent, is the worst possible scenario for the Seahawks. That is the lowest amount of compensation.
I don’t agree here. Firstly, what if they sign him to a massive new contract and he gets injured? That’s just as much of an issue.
The franchise tag would pay him a handsome $11m guaranteed for one season. He might not get that in free agency, approaching age 30, given the current safety market. They might be doing him a favor.
And listen — nobody wants to watch him walk and only get a R4 comp pick in return. But what are teams even offering? If Dallas is only offering a R3 anyway, and that’s it, you’re not exactly losing much from letting him walk. And letting a player become a free agent is not a sign of disrespect.
I hear what you’re saying – he’s going to get money either way and that’s good for him. But I just think we’re talking about a different animal here. Earl Thomas is not 34 years old. He’s 28. He has at least 3 potentially-elite years left in him. I can totally see trading him, but letting him walk would be a significant blow, for me. I would rather keep him at $13-$14m a year then let him walk and get a 4th + a couple of average-to-good players in return. That’s only because he’s a HOF worthy player who when it’s all said and done could be debated to be one of the best safeties to ever play. Ideally, I’d give him a 3-year deal with most of the guaranteed money coming in 2019.
You’re not going to get better production from anybody and our defense will most likely drop to sub-standard without Earl in it.
Next years cap is workable. Say they sign him to a 11 mil/yr deal for 3 years. I don’t think that’s the issue really with everyone so much as the injury worry. Kam, Avril, and Bennett getting hurt has given everyone trauma. BUt Earl had never missed a game until his OWN teammate broke his leg. That is the freaky nature of this game. He missed a couple of games this season with a hammy but no more than Shaq or Reed and way less than Naz who are all younger. There are no guarantees for any player. I have less worry of it than most i guess.
Also my original post was more of a comment on the structure of contracts and the one sided nature of the un-guaranteed nature of NFL contracts. Great comment about NBA contracts Hawkdawg!
Thy have to be cheap right now if they want a 53 man roster.
Can still cut Ryan and Avril right?
They could. Although I’m not a cap guy so IDK how much $ that would leave them with or if there’s dead $ and all that good stuff that comes with it.
Also there’s really no one out there to break the bank for.
Cutting Ryan saves $2M and cutting Avril saves $7,125,000. They would likely roll a whole ton of money into summer extensions and picking up players on cut down day.
Is that really true about Avril $7.1m? Seems like cutting him would be a no-brainer then. Unless they actually think he has a shot at getting back.
Personally I dont see the problem in a long term deal as long as there is no guarantees after the first year. If you did make him the highest paid safety at say 3 year $40 million that would really be a 4 year $48.4 million contract if you include the $8.5 he is due this year. You could even guarantee him $16 million his first year and give him a $10 million signing bonus and a $6 million salary and his cap hit would stay the same. Then you could back load the deal. It “could” be a win win for both sides. If he wants guarantees beyond 2019 that is a different story. It all “could” look like this:
Current:
Year——–Base——-SB Pro—–Roster Bonus——-Cap Hit
2018——–$8.5m——-$1.9m————-$0——————-$10.4m
Possible: $10 signing bonus with $16 million guaranteed (signing bonus plus first year base)
Year———Base——SB Pro—–Roster Bonus——-Cap Hit
2018———$6m———$4.4m——–$0—————–$10.4m
2019———$7.5m——$2.5m——–$1m————–$11m
2020———$9m———$2.5m——–$1m————–$12.5m
2021———$13m——-$2.5m——–$1m————–$16.5
The roster bonus would be $62,500 every game he is on the active roster.
He gets his “highest paid safety in the league” title and we get decent cap hits for the next three years for the best safety in the league.
Revised version as I butchered the first one. Maybe you can delete the first one Rob…lol
Looks reasonable for Earl and the team. Hope an extension like this happens soon. I’d even go up to 3/$42m-$14apy. This situation can’t linger through the season, and I don’t think we’ll get the draft compensation in line with Earls all pro FS value.
Yep, it’s all about structure – which I appreciate you always noting. If we can get out of the deal cheaply after year two or three, I’d love to re-sign him.
I very much doubt the sticking point in any Seahawks/Earl negotiations is APY, it will be guarantees.
No way in hell Earl would go with only the first year and his signing bonus being guaranteed. He’d want a whole lot more than that guaranteed.
Nice write up Rob. Ya got the feisty goin there!
Some personal thoughts on ET & the LOB:
Back in 2012-13 I was the one who said that ET & Kam were overrated. Consequently quiet a few of the SDB nation jumped on me for those comments. Perhaps you all were so pissed off by what I said that you missed the next sentence. “Because ET can’t tackle in the open field and Kam can’t cover TE’s.”
Look I love my Hawks and I love the LOB. But I was raised in a different generation where you were taught that nobody is above the team, or the family. (Because of this I have never owned a jersey. And when my friend bought me a Thomas jersey after SB48 I gave it away.)
Having said that, I could see the day, nationally televised night game against a “hated” rival, where all three are inducted into the Ring of Honor together! And I would love it.
Sherman will be a HoF lock. ET is borderline. I can’t see Kam making it in. (Unless he is able to play meaningful games for another 3-4 years.)
Lastly, as I said before, I don’t see the Hawks getting more than a 2 & 4 for ET. Let’s hope that at least one of the LOB members retires a Hawk.
If you don’t like jerseys that single out certain players, why not get one of the no.12 ‘Fan’ ones? It seems to be purpose built for this kind of thing. (Though I also understand not wanting to invest $100 into a piece of clothing)
I hate the whole 12 thing. It’s terrible and annoying. I’m a lifelong Seahawks fan, have been since 1987. I’m not a 12.
Can we just extend the man lets make him a Seahawks forever. God knows we can afford it! Over 80 million in cap space in 2019. Resign/extend for 13.5 APY that’s whats going to give a sense of urgency for other teams to pony up draft picks! If no one doesn’t offer a first round or better…so what we still have a top 5 free safety on our roster. What gives?
He said it himself…the spirit remains the same as long as I’m back there…DROPS THE MIC!
What gives is the two deals they’re left rueing right now because they did exactly what you just said for Kam and Bennett. And I speak as someone who backed both deals at the time.
I think Bennett earned every dime Seattle paid him. He’s been horrifically underpaid his entire career. He played through injuries and left it all on the field, too. Watching guys like Suh and C Campbell make so much more than Bennett has been frustrating to me. He’s been one of the three most disruptive linemen in the game, yet hasn’t been paid like it.
Seattle saw his injury risk rising, and whether they took his side in his Vegas thing or not, he’s been a magnet for problems–and those problems hurt the team, causing major distraction.
Sherm was cut not due to his injury, but because of his insubordinate, selfish behavior. And Bennett’s distractions were a big part of Seattle trading him too, not just his salary and age and injuries. Carroll will never admit it, but they are dumping anyone they fear isn’t buying in.
I agree. They may have tired of his leadership style, but he earned every cent on the field. I’m not sure you should regret that deal.
The Micheal Bennett extention i agree…But if not for a freak neck injury we would still be okay with Kam on the roster. End of day there is no one better at what Earl does for our defense.
I fully backed both Bennett and Kam extensions at the time. I appreciate now, however, why the Seahawks are wary of repeating what happened with both deals.
The Seahawks should continually learn and improve how they view contracts and paying players. Paying a player for past performance is almost always a mistake, see Shawn Alexander.
If the Seahawks did not take into account the contracts of Avril, Bennett and Chancellor, they would be foolish.
Hindsight being 20/20, sometimes the right decision can still end up poorly. That doesn’t mean it was the wrong decision at the time it was made. If the reasoning is sound, and the risk/reward properly weighted… There are always risks, and “what if’s,” butni think in any decision you have to make the best call at that moment and live with the consequences, come what may.
Agreed. I think in this scenario with Earl they’ve decided it’s best not to offer a big new contract though. And thus, he either stays on his existing deal (with either free agency or the franchise tag to follow) or they’ll trade him. And to be honest, I can see the thinking there.
Yeah, I’m beginning to think they see this downturn in the safety market as more of a market correction. Would I be correct to say that Safety is a position that has experienced some of the biggest contract gains over the last five years? With agents now saying they can’t even get a bad offer for their safeties, maybe there is a sentiment league-wide that that bubble has burst.
The question to me then, is: will Earl and his representatives be able to gauge that without first testing the open market and seeing what teams are actually willing to pay a top-flight 30 y/o FS?
It’s a difficult one. Hard to tell. The team could theoretically pass on info to ET’s people saying they won’t trade because it’d be too expensive (if that was the case).
Did anyone else read Earl’s post & not entirely believe it? He generally doesn’t have a filter but I think a couple of things could be happening. One is his post is 100% truthful. He does want to be in Seattle & all the things that go along with that. Or, second he’s been hearing all the uproar with his previous comments so he tries to get in front of it just in case a deal does go down. Then he can say “I didn’t want to be traded, I love Seattle”. I’m sure he’s noticed how some turned on Sherm & doesn’t want that to be his legacy in Seattle.
If the price is right I’m all for keeping Earl but would be down for moving him if they got a substantial return.
Agreed. Face-saving move, per my comment above
I don’t get the vibe from Earl that he is the type to be dishonest. I think he just wanted to clarify his position.
Even in his 20 minute interview in Ireland yesterday, he said a few short sentences about not knowing for sure where he would be, but he wanted to be in Seattle. I think the nfl media ran that as Earl Isn’t Sure Where He Will Be, but he actually spent more time talking about Seattle and being in Seattle in future tense. I’m sure he’s hearing the noise, and maybe now he just wants to set the record straight in more detail. His preference is to remain in Seattle, but he isn’t sure if that will happen. IMO, it’s a good move on his end. It at least ends speculation that he wants out of dodge, as some have thought. At the end of the day, the guy wants to get paid.
Earl has not stopped threatening a holdout. Not really. His words of “wanting to stay a Seahawk” are not to be taken at face value. They are really just code for “I want the Seahawks to give me the new contract I want so that I can remain a Seahawk on my terms”. That is the context Earl’s words are being given in, and that’s the context they need to be given by fans.
Many fans will be only too happy to interpret them that way. They’ve so badly misunderstood Earl’s “come get me” that they’d be happy to see Seattle dump him for a 7th rounder if it gives them their emotional catharsis. But tho they desire a trade for the wrong reasons, it may well happen. I’d give him only a 40% chance of staying a Seahawk next year.
I would love to meet the Seattle Seahawks fan that would be happy to see Earl dealt for a seventh round pick. I would find that person a potential fascinating character study.
One can only Dream for a Lucky 7th round pick for Earl! Do you really think we could become so Fortunate C-Dog? Now I’m getting anxious, big time!
The anticipation is going to get to me so Bad !!!!!
Go Awesome Trades!
In the same interview where Earl says he wants to be a Hawk for life he also is content on being a Hawk or somewhere else, whatever makes him rich and happy. He literally doesn’t want to take the field without a new deal, not play the last year of the contract, not play with Hawks saying they’ll tag him. I’d love to see him play out his contract and if he threatens a holdout you cut him…if that’s legal by NFL rules. Trade him, extend him, or cut him, that seems to be the three options now. Can’t even begin to project our draft situation without some closure on this situation.
I was thinking precisely the same thing when I read this passage: “A third round pick? If the Cowboys think that’s going to happen, tell them to get stuffed.”
This one from Fisher is a head scratcher:
‘If the Raiders could only extract a fourth-round pick from the Patriots for Randy Moss a decade ago, well, the price has not gone up for a veteran safety’
Unlike WRs, safeties typically age well past the peak of their athleticism.
Whether Seattle wants to roll the dice on that we’ll have to wait and see.
The whole piece from Fisher feels like a lawyering effort for the Cowboys to stick it to the Seahawks on a Earl Thomas trade, and it’s a weak argument.
Safeties don’t typically age any better than receivers. It’s kind of a similar skillset, with the exception that safeties take a lot more hard collisions and abuse, taking on linemen, tackling running backs and tight ends. Safeties are usually done before they reach their mid-thirties. Ronnie Lott was done at 34 – really he was done at 30 when SF let him go to Oakland, and though declining, remained in the league another 4 years. Troy Polamalu was done at 32. Many like Kenny Easley and Kam, are done sooner than that.
”Athletic prime/peak’
Athletic prime and peak for safeties is like most positions, 22 to 28.
What Fisher fails to mention and this was a HUGE factor is Moss was coming off 2 bad seasons with Oakland. 2006 he had a 43.8 catch % , 2TD’s, and only 42 receptions. He was slightly better in 2005 with a 48.8 catch %, 8TD’s, and 60 receptions. ET is still dominant at his position and holds more value.
What do you guys think of the new DT we signed?
Shamar Stephen – also from the Vikings.
IMO there’s every reason to think Stephen and Johnson will be as effective as Rubin and Tony McDaniel were with us. I believe JS did it yet again.
I wanted Bennie Logan and Xavier Williams cause they’re younger than the Vikings duo, so I think one thing I’d take out of the signings for the draft is we’re still going to look at DTs.
I think the one piece left is DE. Keep an eye on Benson Mayowa, although the value might not quite be there yet for the Hawks.
They should do this sorta thing at every game in all the sports honestly.
https://mobile.twitter.com/sbnGrizzlies/status/977723340428324866/video/1 😂😂
What Earl Thomas wants is the money. To quote a movie. “Show me the money.” That is Earl Thomas number one priority. Do I blame him? No. Earl Thomas time and time again has chosen to put the team ahead of his body. When it comes to free safety’s Earl Thomas has to be in the conversation as one of the greatest of all time. With that being said. If Seattle can come up with the right deal it’s time to move him.
What Earl Thomas wants is the money. To quote a movie. “Show me the money.” That is Earl Thomas’s number one priority. Do I blame him? No. Earl Thomas time and time again has chosen to put the team ahead of his body. He plays with a passion that every coach love. When it comes to free safety’s Earl Thomas has to be in the conversation as one of the greatest of all time. With that being said. If Seattle can come up with the right deal it’s time to move him. Earl has been fantastic. But his heart is in Dallas. Let’s hope that deal can be reached in which Seattle, Dallas and most of all Earl Thomas are happy.
It is a business.
I think that ET wrote this piece on demand of JS. Why? Because with his comment about hold out and be happy wherever he gets paid, he is killing his trade value. He and JS now are trying to show that there is real possibility that he will be seahawk next year (and i think its just smoke screen for better trade value). He will be traded this week.
I think we’re starting to try too hard to parse this off season…
^^this
Agreed!
Put yourself in Jerry Jones high price Lucchese Cowboy boots. Would you rather have a wide receiver that cannot create separation
(Dez Bryant) or would you rather have one of the two or three best free safety’s in the league? Take your pick. Jerry Jones.
Earl Thomas is the best safety in football. If Jerry doesn’t want him, happy to keep him in Seattle.
Put yourself in Jerry’s shoes and think about this. In two months the eyes of the country will be on Dallas, who will be hosting the Draft in their city this year. Do you really think he can afford not going to the podium on day one? No way they give up this year’s 1st.
The ego factor makes that statement a lock.
+1
And it’s probably why he hasn’t gone back to a Super Bowl since Switzer was HC. It’s gotta be the Jerry Show.
So what if they offer us a #1 next year, and maybe some change?
Would be something to consider. I would imagine Seattle is looking for at least one pick in 2018. 2018 R3 pick and a 2019 R1 pick might well satisfy Seattle’s asking price. Jerry gets to pick day one in 2018 and Seattle can trade back to collect multiple day two picks to address RB, DL and perhaps DB.
I sense Dallas will be the partner, and it will be a compromise of sorts; meaning the Hawks will get more than a 3, but it won’t be an outright 1…
2018 3 and 2019 2?
2018 2 and 2019 3?
–or–
Earl/#18/7RD
19/51/83
Something that serves all parties with dignity.
Drop the 7th and it could work
I don’t see why we need to move down a spot in the first. Honestly I don’t give a damn about the cowboys so if they want a player of his caliber they will have to just suck it up and pay the price. I don’t care about Jerry Jones and his pride. I actually hope they send Earl to the AFC, (not the Patriots), if at all possible.
Bc 31 other teams in the NFL help make Earl’s market value?
Bc Earl’s value therefore might dictate a move?
Bc the Cowboys get a say in the trade too?
Thats essentially no compensation for Earl, especially if you trade our first, that would Dallas’s 2019 1st rounder to pull off alondside the trade value you proposed.
If the market value isn’t equal or greater than their value on the field then why trade them?
If you are already in a situation to acquire a similar amount of picks from just trading down then why would you make either of those deals?
Lets also not forget how much cap the Seahawks have next offseason, more comes off too.
I don’t understand why there’s this presumption of no market for Earl, even if a 1st and 3rd are on the table they still might not do it, thats how important he is to their scheme, thats how much of an impact he makes on the field.
Besides that he’s not at all comparable to Talib or Peters, neither of them have ever been the best at their position the way Earl is, so their trade value isn’t exactly comparable, especially considering their off field issues which are both on T.O levels.
dang, very creative thought on the trade Andrew. And I have to say, pretty smart, Dallas does not want to lose it’s first, so to get Seattle’s and actually move up a spot, they could spin that as a win to say they got Thomas and moved up a spot! Meanwhile, Seattle with 0 2nd and 3rd round picks, would suddenly have decent picks in both rounds, and would still have the ability to trade down their 1st for even more collateral. At first I thought no way they should give up Earl for less than a 1st, but I have to say this is probably the least I would take and be happy with, as it sort of restores their draft. One of those cases where you don’t feel great but at least you don’t feel shafted either.
Then it’s basically a trade for a second and third. First round picks are completely unnecessary.
I have seen more baseless speculation being spun as fact on the reason behind his Twitter post than anything in recent memory. It is all pure speculation and posts on this subject are only opinions and not fact based. No one has any real facts about what prompted the post or its real intent.
Not in response to any one post, but just a general comment. Give the guy and guys a break. Why jump to such negative assumptions? Before long we’ll become a 12s lynch mob and string up anyone who leaves any room for interpretation in anything they say or do, which will be every player.
I get not liking ex-players talking bad about the organization, but we’re on the verge of going too far here.
Ok vent complete. . .
Good thing you don’t follow politicians on Twitter. I’d be scared of that rant (whichever way you lean). 🙂
LOL
I actually completely agree with you. So much baseless conjecture being thrown about lately. Like I understand that this fanbase is a little on edge after losing so many guys and seeing stalwarts like Sherm badmouthing the org. But I think we should be using positive messages like Earl put out as a rallying point to remember to love the Seahawks and the players that play for them. Not as an excuse to point more fingers. Earl has always been honest to us, and we the fans literally lose nothing by accepting whatever olive branch he extends no matter how ‘genuine’ ppl think it is.
Whatever course of action Earl and the Seahawks decide on in the end I will continue support them all the way. Go Hawks!
Hawk: Tell us his you really feel
Souza. You make a good point about Jerry Jones wanting to announce the Cowboys 1st round pick.
Trade senario #1. Seattle trades Earl Thomas and a 5th pick to Dallas. The Cowboys trade 2nd and 3rd round picks to Seattle.
Trade senario #2 Seattle trades Earl Thomas To Dallas.Jerry Jones sends his 2nd and 4th round picks to the Seahawks.
I could see Jerry wanting to do something like for sure if they had the framework of a deal done with Earl before the draft.
I personally feel that is way to cheap. I don’t think we need to deal Earl, yes we will get more draft picks, but we will not get another Earl in the draft, and with one of those new picks, probably the higher one, we would have to draft another safety to fill his shoes. I seriously doubt Thompson or McDougald are going to be competent enough to take Earl’s spot. So then you essentially get a fourth for Earl.
Why we can’t rebuild the team in one draft anyways, why not just resign Earl if that is all you are going to get for him, or just let him play out his contract and get a 3rd or 4th round comp pick for him. I would vote to keep him for the trade value you just offered. Unless we get at least a 2nd and 3rd for him outright, why trade him?
RW!!!, I would be happy with either of those. I think you’re right on it. The lowball offer of a 3rd is where you start negotiations to get Seattle off demanding a 1st. Eventually you meet in the middle. Dallas keeps its 1st. Seattle gets a 2nd & 3rd this year, or a 2nd this year and a 2nd next year.
Rob I think your article sums up the Earl situation perfectly and until something changes and is announced officially I for one will just assume Earl will be the Hawks FS next year simple as that.
There is no better free safety out there. ET3 is not a talker he’s a player that plays all in, every game, every snap. We have cap space and I think they can come up with a contract extension that’s a win win. Trading him for too little is far worse.
I think the weirdness that started on Christmas was negotiations and he has never been “smooth”. IMO tweet is 100 percent sincere. He’d never mention his daughter or wife if it wasn’t.
Let’s get it done put the egos aside and end the stalemate. Take some of the cap space created by not spending stupidly on
The Joekle, Lacey and Lanes and pay 29 to patrol the middle. Seattle’s scheme does rely on his rare talents.
I share your enthusiasm for Earl 100%. I don’t share the enthusiasm for a new contract extension though.
For me, they’ve made it very clear this off-season. No big money moves. They’re not paying anyone. And they’re trying to get out of bad contracts (Bennett). Earl can play under the franchise tag in 2019 if we choose to go down that road and be paid as handsomely as any safety not named Eric Berry. I don’t think that’s an unfair approach to take. And now that he’s said he’s committed to Seattle, I think you have to say to him — well let’s accept the situation for what it is and go play ball.
I agree, but I wouldn’t be opposed to giving him a year extension at the franchise rate; a little security/goodwill.
I’m fine letting him play it out too.
I want more baseless speculation on this twitter post… PLEASE CONTINUE!
😀
Just announced as fact (by someone anyway), Russ and ET traded to Dallas for conditional 2030 7th round picks. Pete was mad that ET wrote that obviously lie of a Twitter post and Russ continues to be not black enough. Unacceptable to PCJS and since they are not on rookie deals, they are gone. Let’s keep the fire burning.
Naw, moving on now….
First of all, I love ET patrolling the middle. Rare talent, instinctual, 100% effort. However, remember when Kam held out? Our secondary was very leaky, even with Earl and Sherm. The thing that made us great was the level of communication, trust and teamwork. Now with Sherman gone, and Kam likely done, will the collective effectiveness of the secondary be that much better with or without ET? Kam seemed to be the one to make sure everyone knew their assignments on each play. ET plays with great instincts, but doesn’t necessarily bring the rest of the secondary up on another plane.
I’m sure PC is well aware of that internal dynamic in the secondary. If PC/JS really want/need ET to make the secondary great, meaning someone else is capable of coordinating everything (McDougald?), I’m all in on resigning him or letting him play out his contract. Otherwise, I hope we get good trade value.
One scenario I could see playing out of the Hawks keep Earl is multiple trade backs to the mid 2nd round to acquire muliple day #2 picks then using that initial mid 2nd round pick on thier top rated DE perhaps Sweat. Day # 2 seems like the sweet spot in this draft.
For example trade #18 to NE for #31 and 63 so NE can get an OT.
Then Trade #30 to Broncos (who hired the UTEP HC as thier OL coach and want Wil Hernandez) for #40 and 71
Then Rob said Washington really wants an RB so they trade up to #40 and #159 from the Hawks to get that guy for #44 and #109
That would give us
#44 Josh Sweat (DE /FSU)
#63 Andrew Brown (DT / Virgina)
#71 Equinus St. Brown (WR / ND)
#109 John Kelly (RB/ Tenn)
#116 Leon Jacobs (LB / Wisc)
#132 Holton Hill (CB/ Tex)
#137 Shaqueem Griffin (LB / UCF)
#146 Wil Dissly (TE/ Wash)
#200 Khalil Hill (FB / Mich)
#220 Michael Dickson (P/ Tex)
All this does though is trade you out of range of the RB’s.
If you’re picking twice in round two, one of those picks has to be a runner. Has to be.
Fixing the run isn’t a priority if you’re waiting until round four to do anything about it.
I like a lot of the names but I’m super uncomfortable going into next season. With the current running backs plus Kelly as the answer.
I could see the argument if you were building the case that it’s the olines fault and you went after hernandez, smith, someone.
I get Kelly has a lot of fans in this site (me as well) but he has such a limited of amount of carries to make a decision, for me. Averaging only 9 carries a game with kamara and last year doubling that but having his yards per carry drop by kind of a bit (nearly two yards per carry)
I think where you’ve slotted him is excellent value. But if you think about the roster then you are only drafting one extra guy who is kind of in line with what Seattle has already a good, solid, though probably not tone setting every down back.
Now I have been thinking of a scenario where Seattle gets weird and goes freeman/Kelly/scarborough. Two of those three and tries to make something out of that. But for me they would need to take at least two of those names listed and be ready to cut one of davis or even prosise after a serious camp battle.
I bet PC loves Scarborough…. big bama back…. he previuosly wanted to draft Lacey. I think Freeman, Bo a last round on Coleman could be the plan if they trade back for more picks and miss Rojo Chubb etc
didn’t hurt that he was way more explosive in testing then any of us probably would have thought. I think he might make a good rotational guy and certainly as a bit of a hammer late in games to burn out clock.
I don’t think Pete comes out of this draft without Bo in tow….
They might like Bo. But I think there’s an equal chance they’ll not be interested much at all.
Completely underwhelming college career. Not remotely physical despite his size and explosive athleticism. Only shone in 3-4 college games. Looked a distant second on Alabama’s RB depth chart next to Damien Harris.
Agreed. Bo should have been a lot better than he was, overall.
But he did have games where he looked really good! LIke the game against Washington in BCS a couple years ago. Defense got tired and he just ran through them. A Late round flier on him wouldn’t be bad for him.
But I still want Coleman from Washington to get a shot, even as an UDFA.
That’s the problem though. He had maybe 3-4 good games in his college career. That’s it. He had that one run against Washington that everyone remembers. Where was the week-to-week dominance that a guy his size playing for Alabama should be capable of? Why has he looked significantly weaker than the long list of other RB’s that played with him or before him?
And more than anything, where’s the physicality? Because you just didn’t see it.
He was one of the most underwhelming players in college football in recent memory. ‘Underwhelming’ is a word I hope we avoid this year, especially after McDowell.
100% agree on Scarborough! I hate that Harris didn’t leave Bama this year. I would have been banging the table for him if he did.
I like any draft where we get Leon Jacobs but I just don’t see us getting him. He will go sooner than we think because of his numbers at the combine and lack of other athletic linebackers. I still believe we need to pick up another o-lineman as well. I have just come around to what ROB has been saying, and that’s why fight the draft, if the players are interior lineman, and running backs, why not dip into it? We have Fluker on a one year deal, that is not saying the line is set for the future, that is just giving time for someone on the team to develop, or someone they bring in to develop. I dont think we can be cute this year, take O-line and running back. Next year there will be some stud DT coming out, and some guys we just can’t leave the draft without.
But plus one on Griffen as well
Can we trade down once to acquire a 3rd round pick and then see if the Steelers are dumb enough to trade TJ Watt to us for our 1st rounder (probably mid-20s pick)?
I had a moment like this with Earl Thomas, Earl to Tenessee for Adoree and their second, they get the safety help they need, we get a burner with coverage skills to hopefully try and mold into a replacement at free safety.
Thought on a draft day trade:
I’ve seen the idea that is improbable due to the contract issue. Is Earl currently able to work on a deal to facilitate a trade? I thought that he was… in which case those parameters may already be set. Perhaps he has a deal in place that he would accept for 4-5 teams, that the Hawks already have a draft trade in place, and are simply waiting until the day of the draft to see how the boards fall. Wouldn’t that make the most sense for all parties?
The Seahawks won’t allow Earl to negotiate a deal until they receive an acceptable offer. Otherwise they just lose leverage.
I have loved watching watching Earl Thomas play all of these years. The one thing that concerns me is his health. I am amazed at how hard he can hit people for his size but unfortunately as Kam found out all of those incredible hits take a toll on the hitter as well as the “hittee” That is the reason I would hesitate on resigning him.
Yes. See Sanders, Bob…
Bob never even made it to this point Earl is at. You got to think up until his own teammate broke his leg injuries was never a concern. Isn’t the way Russ plays just as injury concerning as he hits 30? Only takes one hit though
IMO you have 2 options extend ET or trade him. I fear a repeat of when Kam Chancellor held out, Puts the whole season/locker room off track.
I’m in favor of extending, no body better at what ET does for our Defense. Just do a better job of getting out of contract based on injury(If not for a possible career ending neck injury I would still be okay with Kam extention). Also, Seattle has done enough in salary dump this season to be okay. 80 million plus in salary cap next year and over 100 million plus in 2020.
I’m in favor of trading Earl if we can get a 1st rounder and third, minimum 2nd and 3rd(gut punch). I just feel Seattle has lost its leverage. (Teams know we in rebuild/salary dump mode)
IMO if we keep ET on this contract (last year of said contract/JS has gone on the record saying he would negotiate with players in last year of contract) it does not bode well for attitude and locker room chemistry.
He can sit out a year and Seahawks not pay him. That might be best for both parties. He gets healthier, the team moves on.
The Seahawks need to have that discussion with him, it is really up to him how he acts if they don’t extend before the season begins. He can play hard and hope he gets a big contract later, or he can sit at home. I wouldn’t even field him if he is going to hold out, he would be permanently out for the season at no pay. The front office needs to grow a spine and stop compensating people because it is the right thing to do.
They can reevaluate him at the end of next season. If he is still healthy and still wants to play, either sign him to a 3 year contract or franchise him. Due to health he really should be on a year by year contract.
Rob, would it be too much to ask for you start referencing yourself as “Stat”? Definitely need to go third person as well.
Really think it will take the blog to the next level. 😉
Haha 🙂
Earl Thomas? Whatever.
What I really want to know is if you are going to start referring to yourself as, ‘The Rob.’
We’ve had a vote for ‘Stat’ and a vote for ‘the rob’ so far…
Any other suggestions 🙂
How about the “Draft Whisperer”?
I’ve practically been whispering on the last two google hangouts with my voice cracking 🙂
‘The TEFalger Square?’
Creative… I like it 🙂
Nice!
“TEF to flying things” or the “SPARQ Wrangler”!!!
The Sheffield Seahawk, Himself
Funnily enough there’s a team in Sheffield and they used to be called the ‘Sheffield SteelHawks’.
Oh that is funny.
I always thought it was funny that Sheffield is like the birthplace of association futbol
Sounds like a good hockey team name, Rob. 😉
Imagine if Seattle was able to get out of this draft with Rasheem Green and Royce Freeman. Totally doable.
Would hope for a much more physical runner than Royce to be honest.
Yep—but he’s also Mr. Dependable. It’s not a perfect solution by any means, but he is a very well rounded RB prospect that should be available to them later on if they chose to go with a DE early on.
He is a three down back. That’s a great deal to get in the late 2nd, early 3rd.
Just not seeing it for the Seahawks. Doesn’t seem to be their type of runner.
And I don’t think we should be trying too hard to come up with ways to avoid picking in the RB sweetspot (25-45). This shouldn’t be a case of being able to get a DE and RB just so we can do it. It needs to be about getting better. And the best RB’s (including Freeman IMO) will be gone by about 50-60. There aren’t really any DE’s good enough to warrant moving out of the 25-45 range if Seattle trades down.
Yeah, I understand your logic. I’m trying to think of what we do if we don’t go RB with the first pick.
The ideal pick is Chubb or RoJo, but similarly to last year (with Kevin King) it could be an instance where Seattle just feels like there are round 2 talents available in round 3—so they go with the position that doesn’t have as good of depth.
Rasheem Green is an excellent DE prospect that would 1) make the D younger 2) fill a position of drastic need while 3) allowing them to select an RB in the late 2nd, early 3rd.
Rasheem Green
Royce Freeman/John Kelly/Bo Scarborough
Dalton Schultz/Durham Smythe
The important thing to remember though when comparing to last year — the cornerback class was deep into round three. Seattle could wait into that range. This running back class is not similar to last years CB class. We will see 6-8 gone before pick #60 and then there’s a big cliff. The drop off is significant. So they won’t be able to use the same plan.
I also believe Freeman will go in round two as one of the 6-8. So waiting for him won’t work either.
I like Rasheem Green. But Seattle needs to fix the run and they’re not achieving that with John Kelly or Bo Scarborough in round four.
I will say this about Royce, he has the same thing Marshawn had that made him great, vision. Thats the single most important attribute a running back can have, its why Rawls and Lacy failed and why so many backs struggle in zone schemes.
But since you don’t see Royce as that kind of back, would you feel the same way about Penny?
Personally i think the Hawks are looking for guys that dip their shoulder ie. Chubb or Kerryon, not exactly that many bruisers in the top 5-8 backs.
Royce definitely has major positives to his game and I can see him having a very good NFL career. Just not sure he’s a Seattle runner. And I feel similarly about Penny too.
I think they want an aggressive runner or a dynamic runner. Chubb and Kerryon more akin to the aggression and Jones II the dynamic, sudden, potential superstar.
I agree completely, thinking about it, pairing Jones ii with a bruiser like Carson, who’s patience contrasts Jones’s constant movement would frustrate opposing defenses to no end.
I’m imagining how disappointed I’d be … 😉
Not really a big fan of either, honestly. They seem fine, but in my fondest imagination I’m hoping we come out with more than “fine.” Think Green has been underwhelming his whole college career and is a bit of a tweener. As Rob said, don’t think Royce is the kind of physical back they want. Being physical is about more than weight, it’s also about style.
I’d rather come out of the draft with one great player and a project than two fine players. I’m all aboard the Nick Chubb train.
Chubb I get, if you want physical, as in thrives on contact and is durable. But I don’t think Rojo can be that guy. If his pro equivalent is Charles, he is not that guy. Charles is no wimp, but he isn’t a classic physical back…
For all the talent at RB this year, it’s a shame there’s not a single bruising, punishing runner. I look at footage of all these guys and they all have skinny legs and are 2-3 inches too tall to be my preferred type of back. Doesn’t mean they aren’t great mind you, I just love the bruisers (lynch, Jones-Drew, Okoye, Bettis, etc)
Too tall for their listed weight, I mean
I would be utterly underwhelmed.
I’d say “NFL Network (or less so, ESPN), Draft analyst”, could very much be in Rob’s not too distant
future. Mel Kipper is just too darn OLD and STALE and badly needs replacing as a draft guru, along
with his hair piece. So, who could be his (sooner than later) replacement?
Maybe …. Rob Staton? This could very well happen as respect in journalism circles continues to grow
for writers that consistently provide objective player analysis of high quality that is very informative
to readers. + The NFL network (and ESPN) need new blood very badly. Go Hawks … & … Go Rob.
PS: Perhaps us blog members need to think about an e-mail campaign to get Rob’s name out to
those guys? If enough noise is made by us, it could help to get Rob where he belongs.
Thoughts?
Let’s keep him to ourselves. 🙂
Besides being a top rate journalist, Rob also has the diversity (English) and European expansion things going for him. Hopefully he remains our best kept secret for a little while longer.
Rob would be excellent on either network. Would suck if it took him away from this blog, but it would be way cooler to see him ascend to either of those gigs.
You mean you don’t think Mike Mayock saying Josh Allen can make all the throws as he overthrows his WR by a good yard is what an analyst is all about?
I might not always agree with what Mayock is saying, but I respect it.. since he was a GM and was in NFL front offices for many years. He normally gives a very nice logical argument as to why a team might or might not draft a player. It is a unique insight which I appreciate.
Kiper and to a lesser extent McShay are rumor peddlers. They are on the front line of smoke screens and deception that teams are trying to pull on each other. Information espionage and manipulation if you will.
I agree, the early season predictions for players tend to be the most accurate.
Or perhaps Mayock’s Poor draft evaluation skills are why he is no longer a GM and has now become a draft information peddler.
I don’t think Mayock has ever worked for a team in any capacity, much less as a GM. Not a scout, just a broadcaster.
He’s fine, just like anybody else you take it with a grain of salt. Nobody’s perfect, and there’s a lot about prospects that make them succeed or fail that can’t always be seen from the outside.
As for Josh Allen, you gotta admit, he *can* make all the throws. Just not consecutively. Or accurately. But if you put together a highlight reel of his 20 best, I’d bet it matches anybody’s. Therein lies the problems for GMs who want to dreamcast his future….
Or maybe it was the pay increase for shorter work weeks.
Or how about the fact that people actually pay Kiper and McShay for the highly inaccurate mock drafts when most of the time the actual draft (1st round) will look like the mocks that come out in the early fall with the exception of 8 different guys or so.
They are paid to drive views…. not for accuracy. Once fans understand this slight of hand, then you can listen to what they say with an appropriate amount of skepticism.
I however, keep thinking, Allen will go #1 to the Browns. It doesn’t make sense in many ways, but the Browns have shown a knack for taking the wrong guy high in the draft for…. the almost every year in the last 19 years.
Darnold is the safe pick, but Allen is the “upside” guy…. and we know how the NFL loves upside.
Not for accuracy. HAHAHA
I hear a lot of talk about carson on here and health concerns about him butdont see that as an issue at all with him. I actually think he’s incredibly durable, his injury wasn’t a sign of weakness to me but sign of strength. I couldn’t believe his leg wasn’t shredded the way it was twister. most players career would be question after that hit but he almost made it back. not saying we shouldn’t bank on him being injury free or that we don’t need another back. I just don’t think his injury means he’s not durable. He’s injury was one that was hard to watch and he made it through better then anyone could of expected.
He had injuries in 2015 and 2016 too.
Carson had a grand total of 49 carries during the 2016 season at Oklahoma State. In 2015 he started the season with 21 carries in week one and gradually had less and less as the season went on.
We’re talking about a player who has not shown either at Oklahoma State or in Seattle that he can carry the load for a full season. He’s not even had a season in the prolific, soft defense Big 12 where he managed that.
It would take a leap of faith to consider him durable or capable of handling a heavy workload. He needs to prove he can do it.
Rowdy, did you see it as a potential issue for Rawls? Because it was. Sometimes players come back and don’t seem to miss a beat. Sometimes they’re never the same. It’s a roll of the dice.
If Seattle did go late in running back would kalen ballage be okay. Whats his knock?
Completely underwhelming college career, more of an athlete than a RB. You’re not fixing your running game with Ballage.
Stop’s his feet and doe’s not put his foot in the ground while approaching the line of scrimmage. he is not sudden. he has good vision but not in tight spaces. To me, I think he would make a good Joker TE. I was wondering if he could be another??? Who was that Undersized TE for Denver? His brother was a WR for The Lions. Sheees his name escapes me right now… He finished up his career in Baltimore. Hall of Famer. Shannon Sharp!!!!
I think that Ballage will not even make our roster if it stays healthy. With Carson/Davis/Prosise/draft pick, there’s no way a late-round pick is going to crack the roster this year at that position. Again, barring injury.
The Seahawks already have a Ballage. His name is CJ Prosise, and he spends most of his season on the injury report.
In all seriousness, Ballage’d be an interesting 3rd down back if, you know, Seattle needed a 3rd down back. But with Prosise and McKissick, it’s not very high. I wouldn’t be surprised, though, if Seattle shows a bit of interest.
They would want to develop him. But I’d be willing to bet he wouldn’t make it to the practice squad. Would get swooped up by some Browns-ish team.
Bad feet, tentative and soft, terrible blocker. Ballage and Walton are the two backs I want nothing to do with I’m this draft.
Ok. Sums that up. lol. Totally off subject. Sheffield?! I cant believe i missed that. Awesome! Origin town of my favorite band! Def Leppard!
Yep — Def Leppard are from these parts. We’ve interviewed them a few times on our show talking about soccer.
Sweet!
Def Leppard – July 18… here!!! lol
🙂
Hey Rob:
I totally agree with you about giving Ifedi and Pocic time to develop. The same with Fant. I see that Rawls is still on the roster, but I don’t see them putting much faith in his durability either. Both he and Carson might be decent committee members, but there still needs to be “the guy” who can handle the load. Even If they trade out of round 1, I think they will take a Running Back with that first pick. That seems to be the Achilles Heal for the Seahawks (no pun intended for any new 49ers).
Jets retract offer to Suh. Oh boy! Please dont let him go to Rams. Scary
Does anyone else think it is a bit odd that Seattle would have had NO knowledge of the Micheal Bennett issue in SB 51….. which he is now charged with a felony.???
One of the highest profile players in one of the highest profile places to be for the sport….. just seems very odd. Doesn’t pass the sniff test if you will.
I also find it a bit hard to believe the Eagles didn’t know about this ahead of time as well………
FO is probably lying again. We should fire them all.
Since ‘incidents’ of this nature must be reported to the league office I think it is safe to say neither team knew about it at the time of the trade. Like with a pending suspension for PED’s, it most likely would have killed any trade. I read somewhere that even Michael Bennett was surprised by charges being filed.
there are new reports coming out that the Houston PD has greatly exaggerated the situation.
Michael Bennett’s sister has claimed to have a video of the incident which she has given to his lawyer
it does seem weird to me for a few reasons.
1. why is a 66 year old paraplegic a security guard? Also, no supposed hospital report.
2. Why does it take 14 months?
3. If a police officer witnessed this, why did he do nothing about it?
4. They said Bennett had no credentials, but there are pictures of him with his credentials around his neck.
5. Cops say they could not find him, yet he was on the podium later with his brother.
if he attacked security guards and caused this amount of damage, with police officers present, why are we just hearing about it now??
curious to see where it all goes
and before anyone calls him a liar about Vegas, the cops never produced the video of the cop who did handcuff him and he says threatened him (curiously the only cop with no body camera??), so nothing was ever proven – either way.
It can’t retroactively kill the trade, can it??
No, hes an Eagle. It all does sound fishy. Sounds like it will be thrown out very quickly.
I thought it might be the handy work of the cowboys considering it happened in texas, it is most likely just a huge smear campaign
Rob, is there anything that might prevent the Hawks from getting a back they want?
Shouldn’t be. It’s set up for them.
It looks like Hercules Mataafa’s stock has fallen perhaps into the 5-th or 6-th round. IMO, he sure looks like an “energizer bunny” on tape, but playing DT at his size is devaluing him I guess. So, he has to convert to a rush LB where he hasn’t played. Could he be a potential Seahawk with a 5-th round pick???? He would seem to have some good tools to work with & looks like he has the desired fire and grit attitude to boot. Also, he was the College Polynesian Player of the Year, that must be worth something. I wasn’t sure how he compares to other Seahawk LEO’s, so I looked up comps.
If Aaron Donald can play interior DL at his size and still be productive as hell, there might be a case to be made for an undersized DE/LEO? If nothing else, if you watch Mataafa tape you come away with the thought that that guy is really “slippery & disruptive” and often gives the opposing OL all they can handle and sometimes he’s even gets double teamed as well.
OLB/DE-Hercules Mataafa, Washington St., 6-022/254, ET-4.76/40, ET-1.64/10, ET-2.76/20.
31.5″-arms, 76-1/8″-wing,10-1/4″-hands, 26-reps, 31.5″-vert, 9′-00″-broad, 7.24/3-cone,
4.37/20-yd shuttle. Currently ranked #189-overall, projected Rd-5/6 at nfldraftscout.com
Career stats: 34-games, 121-tkls, 83-solo, 45.5-TFL, 21.0-sacks, 2-FR, 3-FF.
The original LEO: (His #’s would seem to be fairly close to Mataafa’s (whose 40 was @ 18-lbs more)
—-Chris Clemons, 6-3/236, 4.68/40, 35″-vert, 9′-8″-broad, 18-reps. Arm length unknown.
The latest & best LEO: (Unfortunately, not likely to return & the team needs a good replacement.)
—-Cliff Avril, 6-3/253, 4.51/40, (1.51-10-yd split!), 32.5″vert, 9′-9″-broad, 27-reps, 4.51/20-yd.
shuttle 6.9’s/3-cone. (Interestingly, LB-Aaron Curry was one of his comps @ mockdraftable.com)
Could Mataafa become a LEO?
I like him but I don’t think he has the length or speed to play LEO for us. The arm length and 10 yard split don’t fit. maybe 5T?
I love Mataafa! I just worry that he won’t be able to gain the requisite size to play DT and don’t have the fluidity to drop as a linebacker. I would love him as a leo, he has a wicked first step and insane burst.
So I had to go back ame Watch some prospects again after a couple of months off from watching them previously or since the season ended. I remember thinking how meh Derwin James looked this past year. I went and found some highlights of his freshman year. That’s a different player. He was so athletic and explosive and most of all, impactful. The question is, can he return to form? Just a random thought. I don’t think we are targeting him, at least not with our current draft capital. That kid looked like Kam. That’s where the comparisons come from. Also, that Duke Eijiofor kid is a technician on the edge. He’s got a slippery way of shedding blocks. I question is upper body strength and ability to “POP” someone, but he seems like he’s not a brute. Still, he’s got a natural ability to use his hands and get past his man. That was a surprise.
Duke is one of my favorite sleepers in this draft. He will go a lot higher than he is projected. He reminds me of a more more powerful Avril.
Getting clarity from a confusing situation can definitely be challenging, but I think Rob has done a great job with the ET situation here. As I reread the article and gave it more thought, where the Hawks go next probably depends on how the FO values ET. That will probably be determined by comparing the contract they are willing to give him (EXAMPLE, something like 10-12 a year for a reasonable contract term or the cost of a franchise tag versus the minimum amount of draft stock they would need in trade for him.
It’s hard to imagine that I’d they didn’t get the minimum draft pick trade offer they would accept that they would just let him play out his last year and then let him walk. That would be a waste of a valuable player asset.
So . . . Next question, what is the maximum they are willing to pay him, via contract or franchise tag? Is franchise tagging him even an option to the FO? We may never know the answer to that question.
Paying him so hint to play in 2019 needs to be their plan “B” if they don’t get the trade picks they want to move him in 2018 and avoid addressing the issue of another expensive contract that it appears they don’t want to pay for.
Next, what is the minimum pick offer they would accept? This may be the hardest question as it appears their plan “A” is definitely to trade him and get younger and cheaper, the same tactic we are seeing with the release of other older players. But what is their draft pick minimum offer.
Too bad we can’t know for sure. We all want to move past this one way or another. I sure do. Even though I love how ET plays and want him to stay, I now believe this is not the solution the FO would prefer and if that is true, I’d rather get all we can for him today (something reasonable as a minimum of course) and make the trade and move forward to start building toward this year’s team and the future.
Even without Earl, could be exciting landing a really good RB, another high end OL and safety and fill in the rest of the draft spots with some of the exciting players we have been mocking over the last few weeks. Part of says, let’s just do that now and start building our future hard this year.
Go Hawks.
I don’t see that trading Earl is Plan A. Why do you think that?
How is letting Earl play the last year of his contract and letting him walk a waste of a valuable asset? What have you lost? You paid the player through his peak years and he performed at his peak.
To me that HAS to be Plan A: no extension, no trade. Play this year under his current deal, then you decide to tag or not depending on his performance. No risk of the long-term extension at market value, still the reward of peak-age Earl.
I don’t see Earl in the same light I see Sherman, Kam,PRich, Avril and Bennett. Those guys are/were all INJURED or injury risks, and most at an age where that becomes an increasing issue. Earl is not. Pete isn’t just blowing this thing up. He’s transitioning to younger guys to compete for spots. We aren’t going to suck. We are a healthy RB and a #2/3 WR away from having a very good team. Earl should be a big part of that.
I don’t think there’s a Plan A or B. Just an acceptance of the situation.
Thoughts?
https://www.fieldgulls.com/2018/3/25/15219958/seahawks-sign-bradley-mcdougald-pete-carroll-gill-mangino-weis-reid-schiano-smith-koetter-resume
An attempt to find humor where there is none.
There are times I really get tired of the other crap that is written over there.
Why publish or republish such garbage.
Starting to remind me of 24/7 dumpster fire misleading and inaccurate Clickbait.
Reading all the quality and well thought out and thought through stuff here is such an appreciated “sanity oasis”.
Terrible writer…. Sad
It’s satire but I truly believe that Gilbert is a garbage writer. He is frequently writing ‘filler’ articles! It’s mostly garbage!
The one he did on ASJ addiction and how often people relapse. All of his articles are FieldGull ‘fluff’ and clickbait.
Frankly im tired of the fieldgull bashing. Do i agree with everything they write hell no. But crap i dont agree with everything written on espn or nfl,or here either. What you have is a group of unpaid seahawks fans. Writing because they love the game and they love the seahawks. This kenneth arthur bashing must stop. I remember when danny kelly took over and all the whiney little complainers could talk about was how john morgan was so awesome and danny kelly sucked blah blah blah blah.
Its not bashing if the content has actually gotten horrible and lazy.
Saying something like that about this site would be bashing, saying it about fieldgulls is pretty much just an honest assessment at this point.
Just because it’s free doesn’t mean we have to enjoy it.
Also no one ever mentioned Kenneth on this thread, just Gilbert, that seems to be the main point of contention.
Can’t say i really care though, i would rather hang on here, better mods better discussion, better articles, freedom of thought/opinion, if they want their usual readership back they should make better content. They were considerably better last season.
First of all Kenneth hasn’t been mentioned in this thread but he sure has in many others. My point is this. If you don’t write: you criticize. Mac and others have no room to criticize the writing at Fieldgulls, because they themselves do not cover the Seahawks for a blog or any other publication. Further if they did publish an article on Fieldgulls or some other such site how would they feel if when looking at other blog people were talking trash about them, or even in their *gasp* own comments section. Whatever happened to treat others how you want to be treated. Or walking a mile in someone’s else shoes or a thousand other cliches. Nobody forced you to read Gilbert’s article but you did, so you don’t like his writing, guess how you get better at writing? You write. He’s doing that and improving his craft. You think they are horrible and lazy, really? you try kicking out an article a day, and see how EASY it is. All you are is a bunch of whiney blog snobs, who think somehow because they found this awesome blog that somehow makes them awesomer than those silly fieldgull readers. But guess what? Fieldgull readers are here and there and everywhere they can find an article any article about their hawks. And I for one appreciate the labor of love required to give me my seahawk fix everyday.
Rob cranks out an article everyday, fieldgulls also has a writing staff, meaning several people who actively participate in writing, which means they have time to write their pieces.
If I’m a teacher and i assign a paper everyday, a C is still a C and an F is still an F. Its a reasonable amount of content to write in a short time. Maybe 3 pages on a word document double spaced for most articles, thats very little, they can do better and have as i said above, and when they did better last year Kelly was not there, Gilbert was still writing articles.
And check out how you twisted my words
“You think they are horrible and lazy, really?”
Nope.
“The content has actually gotten horrible and lazy.”
And as I’ve pointed out multiples times i have a reason for thinking that, as their content has deteriorated, not since kelly left, but within the past year. You can take steps back as a writer, even if you write everyday.
This doesn’t preclude them from quality analysis all together either, SamIRGold is awesome and puts out great content, Kenneth Arthur has put out some solid pieces and so has Gilbert, but they should be able to talk about it being bad or good content without you calling them,
“a bunch of whiney blog snobs.”
And no one ever criticized Fieldgulls readers so saying we are snobs, “who think somehow because they found this awesome blog that somehow makes them awesomer than those silly fieldgull readers” is both unfair and inaccurate.
Have a good day, i really don’t have anything more to say on the matter
First of all comparing anybody to Rob is just plain silly. Rob is a professional. Maybe not on the NFL but as I recall he does radio work, and possibly?? tv work on the other futball, and other things as well. It would be like comparing JK Rowling and her fan fiction, reading the fan fiction and then complaining that it’s too much like fan fiction. Most of this “staff” includes peeps like you and me, people who have other jobs, and write, in their spare time if they have any. If it’s so easy for them to do better then you do it, go ahead and write an article a day, and get it posted on a blog.
They serve as some entertainment. I find the film room and O-line cut up posts really interesting.
They really still do a lot of valuable work, I miss some of the old writers’ styles.
Christian is right, they don’t deserve to hear a lot of the criticism. But to be fair, many commentors complain about virtually every other publication.
Not many can match the quality in draft coverage to which SDB readers are accustomed
It’s pretty easy to pick the good contributors on FG and skip the bad ones.
Youngest players that attended the Combine in this class:
1. Tremaine Edmunds: 19.8 years old
2. Deontay Burnett: 20.4 years old
3. James Daniels: 20.5 years old
4. Ola Adeniyi: 20.5 years old
5. Ronald Jones: 20.6 years old
Alrhough, I dont remember USC WR Burnett performing at the combine.
The Jets have pulled their offer to Suh. He is back on the market. Apparently they realized he is just all about the money and did not really want to play for them.
I mean… Suh is probably dying for the Hawks to make a competitive offer. If John really is super GM he can find a way to structure a deal that won’t put the the team in cap Hell if they sign him. But yeah, they are trying to clean house without saying the word “rebuild”. I would love to be a fly on the wall in those offices.
I think, with hindsight, it’s clear they were never really interested in Suh. Carroll made a couple of calls seemingly but they always say they want to be in on every deal. This team is trying to be young, poor and hungry and Suh would’ve contradicted that. A big name, multi, multi millionaire at the back end of his career. Not known for great leadership. Not a bad character but not necessarily a leader either.
Yeah, I get it. I guess I just don’t want to see that they have an aggressive and intelligent plan one way or the other. The waiting is the hardest part. If they are going young, how do they get the players they need, and how long does it take, realistically. They caught lightning in a bottle the first time with several improbable draft coups. They haven’t showed sustained scouting excellence since, although ya not all bad by any means, (Shaq, Naz, Reed, Frank, Lockett). Capnspace is great, but what do they do with it when they have it?
I think we are already seeing that aggressive and intelligent plan in action. Aggressive is cutting aging, expensive star players because you realistically acknowledge that hanging on for one more year for old times’ sake is not smart. Aggressive is turning over half your coaching staff because they weren’t getting players to execute and perform at the expected level. Intelligent is not turning around and blowing through more cap and more draft picks signing the kind of expensive, aging players you just cut, but instead filling enough holes with lower-priced signings that you don’t have huge holes in the draft that make you reach. We got a starting RG, starting SAM, young, big WR to compete for that 3rd spot, good rotational DTs that are particularly good vs. the run, just like we had when the D was rolling, some safety depth, etc.
Just want to see*
Im having night-terrors over the prospect of Suh being a Ram!
You’re not alone!
The Titans have the most cap space so you hope they step up. The Suh to the Rams talkl seems like it might need to be a one year deal. The Saints have no money so I dont see them signing him. Go Titans!
🙁
I cannot think of a worse case scenario than Suh to the Rams. Him and Donald with constant pressure up the middle then two ball hawk CBs in Peters and Talib.
Scary!
That would be another reason to take Wynn with our first pick. If we are facing those two for the next 3yrs I want the best interior OL possible.
All of those players sound difficult to deal with in the locker room to me, talented or not Talib is 32, and talented or not Peters has always struggled with really player friendly coaching staffs, pair that with Suh’s bad attitude and it seems like a bad lockerroom, Wade Phillips or not.
there’s zero chance of this happening but what sort of package do you think it would take to have a trade centered around ETIII and OBJ? Obviously Earl is older and I’m not sure if OBJ’s baggage is worth it but man would that be fun to have prime Russ throwing to him and doug
probably a similar package to Percy Harvin.
Feels like the exact wrong kind of move for the Hawks. A high-cost, temperamental headache that would divert attention and resources from their entire team strategy. And coming off a serious injury to boot.
I would not exactly endorse this trade, but I really think the “locker room cancer” narrative is overblown. Plenty of players show the competitive fire that is pointed out in other athletes, but it’s viewed differently for Odell Beckham. I think NYG has created an environment that disavows Odell’s outward behavior, and it would be the exact opposite in Seattle. A welcoming place where the players would be in charge of the culture and not the coaches and owners who have zero knowledge about a modern-day locker room.
Please don’t even answer a call from the Giants about that guy. He’s a headache.
I would want nothing to do with OBJ. Talented obviously, but he is a culture torpedo.
The closer the draft gets the more i think Sam Hubbard could be the Seahawks pick. I could be a million miles off but its just my gut.
and there second pick after a good trade back will be a RB. (New England for 31 and 63)
Not sure he’s twitchy enough. They’ve not drafted a player like Hubbard early previously.
Plus, running game.
You may be right but he does have good short area quickness w/ a good motor. I would prefer a mock of RB first and a guy like Josh Sweat (even though he is lackadaisical sometimes) but for whatever reason I dont see them drafting a RB with there first pick. I hope Im wrong as it would be nice to have your choice. The draft is now exactly 1 month away so we will find out soon enough.
It’s not my choice TBF — I have no horse in this race. I just judge need + draft class + what PCJS have been saying and everything says they will take a RB early. Fixing the run is a priority. They’ve brought in Fluker, now they need ammunition at RB. Not necessarily the first pick but probably if they don’t trade Earl.
Just saw that OTC has Fluker with a $1.3m cap hit, too. That’s a stead of a deal.
https://twitter.com/EvanonHB/status/978316506911031298
That sure beats the heck out of Joeckel for $8mil guaranteed which was the worst contract JS has ever done.
Doesn’t qualify as early but they took Marsh who has some athletic similarities to Hubbard. Maybe in the same range (rd 3-4) that they took him.
Rob I know you are convinced the Hawks are going RB with the first pick and you usually have great insight into these things. It does not seem like the Hawks have expressed any interest in the top RBs via interviews or visits so far at least. Do you think this is just a smoke screen?
No I don’t think it’s a smokescreen. I know they’ve had at least one meeting with a RB. It just hasn’t been made public knowledge.
Akrum Waddley? or was their another one?
I think they just had a chat with Wadley at the Senior Bowl (or someone in Seahawks apparel spoke to him). I’m talking about a proper meeting.
You can’t reveal your source here because you found out confidentially? Or you don’t want to blow it for the Hawks?
Confidential
Man, you are really getting tied into the inner workings of the Seahawks my friend. You may just fall into a new job at the VMAC!
I wish it was as glamorous as that! Just something someone I trust told me.
🤐
you can’t do this to me!!
Maybe you can answer this w/o revealing anything. If such information were to be disseminated to the masses of 12th Fans would they get a collective chubby?
I don’t know… different strokes for different folks, as they say 😉
Thanks Rob, due to the timing of this proclamation and your double entendre, like mishima I will read it as Jones. I imagine if it is not, your tune on what RB the hawks could be targeting will change
Will read the tea leaves as Jones.
Interesting comment by JC today on 710 regarding Guice. Says they may not be able to trade down past the Steelers if they want him. seems to think that’s who they are targeting. ” fit’s their profile”
In fairness I think Clayton isn’t wrong in saying he fits their running style. But there are several reasons why he also won’t be a fit in Seattle. Explosive traits are one thing — and he isn’t at the level that other drafted Seattle runners were. He was banged up all throughout 2017. They don’t need any more of that. He is practically Thomas Rawls on and off the field. And there are some character concerns here.
The Steelers apparently are having dinner with Guice soon. That’s the connection there. I’m not going to read too much into any of this. I’m not as high on Guice as others. I think it’s a limited upside, high risk pick. I still wouldn’t rule it out. But I think it’s quite unlikely.
So it’s not Guice then? 😉
K thanks I was just curious.
http://draftanalyst.com/pro-day-march-26-sam-houston-state-northern-iowa
DT P. J. Hall
6004/308
40 yd under 4.7s
38″ vert
9’8″ broad
36 bench
What a freak.
Hmm. Numbers look freakish, but his play does not. That athleticism doesn’t show up on the field. Check out this video. He’s playing against UIW. Who the hell is that – never heard of them? If he was an NFL quality player playing against such an obscure school, he should dominate the game. He doesn’t. He practically disappears. He’s very raw. Doesn’t seem to know how to disengage from blockers, doesn’t seem to be very instinctive or constantly around the ball, and certainly isn’t someone you’d describe as having a non-stop motor. This is why workout numbers can be very deceiving. Take a gander.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juUhl9jqqzI
He finished with 86.5 tackles for loss and 42 sacks for his college career so the production was definitely there. Maybe that was just a bad game for him. He’s raw for sure but I’d love to see what he could do with NFL coaching.
Take a look at the practice tape for the Senior Bowl….. he absolutely dominated.
He is a guy who I think could really have a solid / borderline pro bowl type career.
The tape at the Senior Bowl sold me on him. He looked like a man amongst boys.
Yes he did. Really stood out to me. Some sites have him going in the 2nd and 3rd rd. Others don’t even have him in their top 150. I would be surprised if he lasted to our 4th rounder.
Think our next Leo is already on the roster:
Chris Clemons-6’3″-236lb-4.68 40-18 Reps-35″ Vert-116″ Broad-7.48 3Cone
Bruce Irvin-6’3″-33.375″ Arm Length- 245lb- 9.625 hands-4.5 40-23 Reps-33.5″ Vert-123″ Broad-6.7 3cone-4.03 20shutt
Cliff Avril-6’3″-253lb-4.51 40-27 reps-32.5″ Vert-117″ Broad- 6.9 3Cone
On roster currently 3 former 1st round picks
Dion Jordan-6’6″-33.875″ Arm Length-248lb-10″ hands-4.6 40-32.5″ Vert-122″ Broad-7.02 3cone-4.35 20shutt
Barkevious Mingo-6’4″-33.75″ Arm Length-241lb-9.625″ Hands-4.58 40-37″ Vert-128″ Broad-6.84 3Cone-4.39 20shutt
Marcus Smith-6’3″-34″ Arm Length-251lb-10″ Hands-4.68 40-23 reps-35″ Vert-121″ Broad-7.48 3Cone-4.47 20 shutt
I don’t have the 10 yard split numbers. However it seems to me that the Hawks have 3 guys all former 1st rounders that have great athletic traits in compete-ition to be the LEO I honestly don’t see the need to expend a high draft choice for LEO or DE
Agree completely. It is pretty clear they have a specific profile and I think at least one of these guys will have a big impact this year.
I personally think Mingo plays the role of Bruce Irvin and Jordan the role of Avril. I could see 15+ sacks between the two of them easily if Jordan stays healthy.
Mingo’s greatest strength will probably be at SAM, and Smith and Jordan are both on one year deals. Assuming we extend Frank Clark that means we really only have one DE that is part of the longer term plan. I guess it all depends on who PCJS like and where they see the talent “cliffs” at the DE position. DE will likely still be a big need come draft day but might not be their priority with their first pick.
I imagine we draft at least one DE and bring in a few more to round out the 90 man roster.
They are only on one year prove it deals for now, if they prove itthen we will undoubtedly lock them up for longer term
Perhaps. But they might also try to test FA and not sign an extension during the season. They both flashed at times last year but both have a lot yet to prove.
Ideally we get a rookie worth putting into the rotation so we can have someone with cheap club control for 4 years – but I think that goes for most of our position groups right now.
JAYLEN SAMUELS, NC State. A TE? Or more like Golden Tate as a YAC WR.
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/jaylen-samuels?id=2559930
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1HGHiaNsl4
A little slower in the 40, but bigger and faster in the other stats.
TATE:
Height 5′ 10″
Weight 199 lbs
Arm Length 30½”
Hand Size 9¼” 42
40 Yard Dash 4.42s
Vertical Jump 35″
Broad Jump 120″
3-Cone Drill 7.12s
20 Yard Shuttle 4.34s
Bench Press 17 reps
SAMUELS:
Height 5′ 11½”
Weight 225 lbs
Wingspan 76″
Arm Length 31⅜”
Hand Size 9¼”
40 Yard Dash 4.54s
Vertical Jump 34½”
Broad Jump 121″ 85
3-Cone Drill 6.93s
20 Yard Shuttle 4.28s
Bench Press 18 reps
He seems really seahawky, where is he projected to go?
I have seen anywhere from 3 to 5.
More likely there in the 5th because he seems like a man without a set position yet.
He will be a FB / HB tye in the NFL, but for whatever reason they lump him into the TE category. If you are looking for a guy with some scheme flexibility, he might be worth a 5th (which Seattle has plenty of at this time).
I’ve seen him early 3rd, and moving up.
I like him a lot. Hope the Hawks are able to acquire him somehow.
Reports are saying that Fluker’s contract is only $1.4 million against the cap.
I think that’s an amazing deal.
Absolutely! At that price I wish it was a 3 year deal. Guess he wanted to play for Solari.
Great deal and value. Compare that to what they gave Joeckel and what he gave them.
Exactly! Joeckel was coming off an ACL injury and they gave him $8mil guaranteed. I will never understand that deal. It was like JS had a brain cramp and decided to throw $8 mil out the window.
Fluker is the opposite basically no risk and the potential to be the big mailing RG this team has lacked for a long time.
Could also indicate that he is not an automatic lock to make the team and Seattle could still go OL early.
The Giants are shopping Odell?
Just say no to trading a first and signing a big contract.
The youth movement in on in Seattle again, and Earl is sitting right on the fence of being worth another three year deal at the numbers he wants. He is an amazing player, but entering the part of his career it’s far harder to stay healthy for. Given how his game is so built on playing recklessly I doubt he ages we’ll for a player. I’d love to see Seattle cash out if there is any chance of seeing a first round pick, just to give us the ability to liquidate one for later picks and still address running back. I see RB as the top priority to leave the draft with and PC more than capable of developing another corner and safety. If I had two first round pick, I might trade them both to get Barkley and give the online a year with Solari.
DJ Flukers contract details. one year $1.5 max value with $300k guaranteed.
Year—–Base——-SB—–Roster Bonus—–Cap Hit
2018—-$800k—$300k—-$400k————-$1.368
If his contract is that low this isnt starter money which puts drafting a guard as a potential high pick again.
WOW. That is a bargain basement deal. Very good value.
I guess I’m totally confused. When it came out weren’t they saying it was a 1 year 7 million dollar contract, how in the world did we get from that too here? Not that I’m complaining but sheesh
I think some people were joking around that it was for one year $8 million with $7 million guaranteed making fun of the Joeckel deal last year.
Update on the cap space these signings have taken up with Flukers numbers:
Mingo $2.4
McDougald $3.33
Dickson $1.87
Brown $1.78
Alexander $720k
Fluker $1.37
T Johnson $2.1
Stephen???
M Smith???
M Davis???
Total is $13.57 million in cap space for 2018 between 7 players.
If you add in the tenders for Jordan and Coleman it would be $18.37 million for 9 players.
About $2 million per player. Great value.
Just saw that while the Rams are in the lead for Suh, they may also be interested in a move for OBJ. They are definitely in WIN now mode. Can’t afford to keep all those guys in the next 2 years
If they did sihn Suh you would have to think it would be a one year deal. They could give him high dollars this year to be off the books next year as Gurley, Donald, and Goff are about to get bank.
I understand Suh. Trading for OBJ and paying him BIG $$$ is a completely different story
Guys linked to the Seahawks 1 way or another so far
Tony Brown, CB, Alabama (PRO)
Will Dissly, TE, Washington (COM)
Shaquem Griffin, OLB, Central Florida (COM)
Khalid Hill, FB, Michigan (PRI)
Natrell Jamerson, S, Wisconsin (PRO)
Keith Kirkwood, WR, Temple (PRI)
Kolton Miller, OT, UCLA (PRO)
Nick Nelson, CB, Wisconsin (PRO)
Dante Pettis, WR, Washington (PRO)
Justin Reid, S, Stanford (PRI)
Josh Sweat, DE/3-4OLB, Florida State (PRO)
Akrum Wadley, RB, Iowa (SR)
The Seahawks have also said if they LOVED a guy, they would show no interest in him to tip off their hand. I’m blanking on the player this recently happened to, but they eventually drafted the guy (POCIC I think).
that’s walterfootball visit tracker right?
https://twitter.com/PLeonardNYDN/status/978360437086486529
Rams trying to add OBJ.
Now that’s a good way for McVeigh to lose control of the Rams. DO IT!!! I guess Sue is out, hoping….
Jets maybe???
It appears Suh has signing with Rams 1 year 14 million dollars. The NFC West just got tougher.