Where’s the money gone?

June 20th, 2022 | Written by Rob Staton

Quandre Diggs has an $18.1m cap hit next year

I was recently doing a bit of research for an article and went to check on Seattle’s salary cap situation. While perusing ‘Over the Cap‘ I thought I’d have a look at how much was left to spend in 2023.

A quick reminder. In the immediate aftermath of the Russell Wilson trade, the Seahawks had a projected $120m to spend in 2023.

One of the few plus points of the Wilson divorce was the financial boost Seattle would gain once his dead cap hit came off the books. Without needing to pay a franchise signal caller major money, they should have plenty to spend in the future.

Yet checking in this week I noticed the projection is down to a far more modest $53m.

As far as I can tell, the following cap hits have contributed in reducing the amount:

Quandre Diggs — $18.1m
Uchenna Nwosu — $12.8m
Will Dissly — $9.25m
Noah Fant — $6.8m
Quinton Jefferson — $6.0m
Charles Cross — $4.9m
Bryan Mone — $3.79m

Total: $61.7m

There’s also the rest of the rookie class, with some players still unsigned (thus, the $53m amount will drop further).

Let’s take out Cross’ cap hit because it’s irrelevant in this conversation.

Minus Cross, the Seahawks have committed $56.74m to the names in the list above.

How do you feel about that?

You could make an argument that if Fant delivers on his potential, his fifth year salary as a first round pick could provide excellent value. But that wasn’t a negotiated salary, it’s an executed process by the Seahawks based on the structure of rookie deals.

The rest, just under $50m, feels like an extraordinary amount of spending for not a lot in the way of returns.

You have a blocking tight end, a 29-year-old rotational defensive lineman, a fairly run-of-the-mill nose tackle who offers no pass rush, a rotational edge rusher who will, hopefully, play second fiddle to Darrell Taylor and Boye Mafe if they can produce as hoped, and Quandre Diggs — an admittedly talented and productive player albeit one coming off a serious injury who will cost slightly less in 2023 as the average of Minkah Fitzpatrick’s record-breaking $18.4m extension.

Is this really a good use of resources?

Or is it another example of what we saw two years ago when the Seahawks managed to fritter away $60m and not improve?

Is the Dissly cap-hit simply another puzzling decision reminiscent of giving Bruce Irvin a 32% pay rise from his 2019 salary in Carolina, despite his age, desire to return to Seattle and seemingly lukewarm market?

They saw something in Cedric Ogbuehi’s 155 total snaps for the Jaguars in 2019 to warrant a pay increase from $895,000 to $2.237m. Have we really seen enough from Bryan Mone to think in June, months before he reaches the market, he warrants a fairly sizeable extension?

Is paying what they are for Fant and Dissly going to be another case of expensive investment in two tight ends, just like when they paid Jacob Hollister $3.259m as a restricted free agent having already committed $6.9m to Greg Olsen?

Why is Quinton Jefferson set to earn $6m next year? And why will it cost the Seahawks $2m to move on if they decide he’s a one-and-done?

To be perfectly honest, this looks like history repeating.

So is it again time to ask some questions about how they spend their money?

After all — we’re all marvelling and wondering how the Rams manage to pay everyone over and over again (while managing to keep adding big names). It’s possible they’ll fall flat on their faces in the future as a consequence. Or maybe they won’t.

It’s hard not to look at what the Seahawks are doing though and think — aren’t they just wasting money? Overpaying for players. Spending too much for guys they have familiarity with. Paying second tier salaries to third or fourth tier players.

They should be going into next off-season with an absolute fortune to spend.

The Chicago Bears, currently, are slated to have $96m in cap space. They’re intending, a bit like Seattle, to make a big move next off-season to build around a new era. They aren’t paying a big quarterback salary and have shifted Khalil Mack and others to create a fresh start.

The Seahawks have only $53m and yet are not paying big money to:

— A franchise quarterback
— An experienced, quality offensive lineman
— An experienced, quality pass rusher
— A top cornerback

You’re not spending at any of the premium positions other than receiver (if you consider it a ‘premium’ position). They should have millions more.

And here’s the kicker — that $53m is going to take a significant hit when they eventually pay D.K. Metcalf a new contract.

A.J. Brown’s cap-hit next year is only $8.5m in Philadelphia. That’s a best case scenario for the Seahawks. If Metcalf signs for that — Seattle would be left with a similar amount to spend in 2023 than they had carrying the dead-cap hit for Wilson.

How is that so?

Meanwhile it’s not just Metcalf you’d have to pay or replace. Poona Ford is a free agent. Sidney Jones might start at cornerback this year — he’s on a one-year deal. What if he plays well? Both quarterbacks are free agents. Your starting centre is a free agent. Ryan Neal is a free agent. You might want to keep Rashaad Penny if he continues to play well.

It’s not a ton of holes but there could be some tricky decisions forthcoming.

There are also ways of creating extra money too, of course. The Seahawks can roll-over unspent cap. They have about $16m left at the moment and might need a fair old chunk of that next year (although how they’ve put themselves in a position to ‘need’ to do that is a wondrous thing).

They can also make savings now. Trading Gabe Jackson for a bag of footballs would be a start — clearing $6.5m for 2023.

They can also cut the following next year to make savings:

Shelby Harris — $9m
Quinton Jefferson — $4m
Will Dissly — $3m
Al Woods — $3.8m
Bryan Mone — $2.8m

All would need replacing, of course.

They can also save $11m by designating Jamal Adams as a post-June 1st cut.

In every instance though you’re collecting dead cap money — something the Seahawks have become experts at over the years.

If you are a fan who was looking forward to a spending spree in the future, you’re going to be disappointed. I’m not sure it would’ve happened anyway because, as we know, they have ‘their way’ of doing things (regardless of the track record of this ‘way’).

Yet as the Bengals have shown — if you’re not paying a quarterback, you can do some damage in the market. They rebuilt their O-line this year. Last year, they added a pass rusher in his mid-20’s who recorded 14 sacks in 2021 and added 3.5 more in the playoffs.

The Seahawks won’t be able to do anything like this with their cap space rapidly diminishing. For me, that warrants a proper discussion and challenge as to why.

One of the few benefits of the Wilson trade should’ve been the freedom to make some moves if possible. Heck — even Bill Belichick and the Patriots enjoyed a splurge a year ago, 12 months after parting with Tom Brady. They won 10 games with a rookie QB, having only won seven the year before.

The Seahawks appear to have ended any chances of doing the same only three months after moving on from their star player.

Maybe it’s time for a few questions to be asked of the people keeping an eye on the cap space?

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88 Responses to “Where’s the money gone?”

  1. cha says:

    Can I pile on?

    They’ll need a kicker and a veteran QB to backup/mentor the rookie QB as well.

    • Rob Staton says:

      The topic of how they spend their money hasn’t been discussed anywhere near enough

      Wastage for a long time — and yet when they talk about ‘their way’ in terms of contracts and free agency — that ‘way’ is never challenged

      • cha says:

        What they’re doing now only works if they absolutely strike gold with a few of these guys.

        Will Dissly can’t just be fun Uncle Will the local folk hero anymore. If he’s not plowing people in the run game and catching 5-8 targets per game, his contract is a disaster.

        Same with Noah Fant.

        If the Seahawks offense isn’t running 12 personnel for a good chunk of their time, they’re failing.

        Quandre Diggs and Jamal Adams have yet to play well at the same time. Diggs was a revelation in his very first game, the MNF game against the Niners. The next season, he was practically invisible while Adams was blitzing 10x a game. Adams didn’t do a darn thing last year when Diggs was picking off passes. It’s entirely possible there is only one play they both splashed on – that massive hit Diggs laid that left a soft pillow of a tip for Adams to pick in the Washington game.

        Nwosu needs to have an impactful year. None of this ‘he has 3 sacks at the halfway point because he’s still learning the defense’ stuff.

        And don’t even get me started on the young players they’ve completed flopped in developing. Alton Robinson, D’Wayne Eskridge and Colby Parkinson can’t get snaps to save their lives.

        They’ve hashed Damien Lewis and Marquise Blair with position changes because of unnecessary veteran acquisitions.

        Even Cody Barton and BBK, they were acquired with a heavy nod to Wagner and KJ were playing too many snaps. Well guess what. Those two guys were fried due to taking high 90’s of snaps and the two youngsters have spent their rookie contracts on the bench and in special teams.

        There is tens of millions of dollars that shouldn’t be spent because they’ve developed their draft picks.

        • TomLPDX says:

          THIS!

        • Rob Staton says:

          They’ve hashed Damien Lewis and Marquise Blair with position changes because of unnecessary veteran acquisitions.

          This is an underrated absolute clusterf**k.

          You spend a R2 pick on Blair, talk him up but never play him.

          And before you even get a chance to see what he can do… Jamal Adams trade. Because you’re desperate right before camp, knowing you’ve done naff all to improve the defense.

          Thus, move him to nickel. Of course.

          And then Lewis. Great season at right guard as a rookie. Future building block on the line. But oh wait, we’ve whiffed in free agency getting the big name lineman Wilson wants. So let’s trade for this guy Las Vegas has announced they’re cutting, then let him start at right guard and move Lewis. Only to watch both play poorly.

          That’s simply not acceptable.

          • Rob Staton says:

            There’s a lot that could be discussed and written about during this ‘quiet period’ during the summer.

            It’s all be a lot more important than whether they should trade for or sign Baker or Jimmy G. Or whether Geno Smith or Drew Lock starts instead.

        • Big Mike says:

          Outstanding summarization cha. Just further proof that it is unlikely this regime ever gets us back to the promised land….imo of course.
          The Rams pay big dough to stars and draft exceedingly well to fill the rest of the roster. We pay 3rd and 4th tier guys 2nd tier money (as Rob put it so well) and thus we have Rob writing articles like this and you (cha) and him laying out the poor roster and cap mgmt in black and white.

          • cha says:

            And don’t even get me started on the 2022 class.

            I absolutely can see Penny getting hurt and Homer getting major snaps. “Walker needs to work on his blitz pickup” while Homer gets 3 yards per carry.

            Abe Lucas sat on the bench while the team gives Forsythe or Curhan all the snaps at RT.

            Boye Mafe getting assigned to cover George Kittle because ‘he’s really great at coverage’

            Tyreke Smith a healthy scratch so LJ Collier can get reps.

            The rookie CBs limited to special teams while Artie Burns and Justin Coleman (who will not be resigned and available in June 2023 in the 4th wave of free agency) are playing because ‘they have veteran experience’

  2. Jackson says:

    I am so tired of everyone making excuses for every one of these signings.

    “It’s only a few million overpay.”

    “It’s only 1 or 2 years.”

    Sure, but when you keep doing it over and over (and at, charitably, less than premium positions), those few millions erase cap space pretty darn fast as you’ve outlined above.

    Pete and John have become masters at assembling a pu pu platter roster rather than just forking over a bit of extra cash for true difference makers. Who cares about roster “depth” when that depth is just stacked with guys who are all equally mediocre. Blue chip players win championships, not a “deep” bench of replaceable talent.

    It’s beyond maddening and presents a real roster building issue. The fact that we’re doing things like extending Mone rather than just getting a DK deal done makes it all the more frustrating.

    • Rob Staton says:

      The Jack Conklin example is a good one here.

      They spent the same amount that Cleveland did on his 2020 cap hit that they used on BJ Finney and Brandon Shell.

      They also signed Mike Iupati and Cedric Ogbuehi.

      If you sign a big name offensive or defensive linemen and they get hurt or don’t deliver — to me that’s more palatable than simply signing four replacement level players and every single one of them performing at… a replacement level.

      Conklin was an all-pro in 2020 and injured in 2021. He’s back this year. Give me that over what Seattle got out of that quartet.

      • ScottyDawg says:

        I think the constant use of Conklin is a poor choice, he was never leaving the upper Midwest and constantly through his free agent signing said so.
        I agree on principle with Rob’s other observations, however, it must be noted:
        1. Player by player, if you cut them, then who do you replace them with that’s cheaper and/or better.
        2. There’s a very important part of having enough core players to keep from huge turnover every year. I can’t define what the number is, but the top organizations in sports and business don’t routinely replace their core members every year.

        • Rob Staton says:

          Can you provide some quotes where he said he wasn’t willing to play anywhere other than the Midwest?

          • ScottyDawg says:

            Rob,
            A quick search got me this quote from the Browns media. I’m a Browns fan after the Hawks and followed this closely. His desire was to stay close to home, if at all possible. I definitely think money is the main choice for most free agents, but sometimes similar offers come down to intangibles.
            “I could not be more excited to be in Cleveland playing for the Browns. One of the biggest things for me is just being back in the Midwest, being back home and close to home in Michigan.

            • Rob Staton says:

              Sure but there’s a big difference between stating your pleasure to be somewhere and ruling out other parts of the country

              And in fairness if you’re going to criticise a point and claim Conklin said something, you’ve got to be accurate

          • Paul says:

            “I could not be more excited to be in Cleveland playing for the Browns. One of the biggest things for me is just being back in the Midwest, being back home and close to home in Michigan.”

            • Rob Staton says:

              That’s the same quote.

              And he didn’t say “I was only going to play in the MidWest” as suggested. He just said he was excited to be back home.

              • ElroyNumbers says:

                “One of the biggest things for me is being in the Midwest”

                Conklin wouldn’t come out and just say I am only going to play in the Midwest. As each year there is limited amount of Midwest teams that are willing to pay up for a top end tackle. That comment to me seems like he wasn’t going to the West, South or East. Sounds like he is a Midwest guy.

                • Rob Staton says:

                  I have absolutely no idea why people are still arguing the toss over this.

                  The bloke expressed excitement about being home

                  He didn’t say, as claimed, ‘I was only going to the Midwest’

                  That’s the start and end of it. He never did what was claimed.

                  • cha says:

                    This is the “Calais Campbell only wanted to play in Baltimore so the Seahawks didn’t have a chance at him” all over again.

        • cha says:

          It’s not a poor choice at all. It’s a great representation of the overall problem.

          Conklin did say he wanted to stay in the midwest but who knows what he’d say if he signed with Seattle?

          If you prefer, how about the Seahawks desperately needing pass rush and interior help in 2020, but signing part-timers Bruce Irvin and Benson Mayowa instead of trading for Calais Campbell, or signing Everson Griffen, Clowney, Robert Quinn or Dante Fowler?

          Or going and getting Stefon Diggs instead of tendering Hollister and signing Greg Olsen and then ignoring them all year?

    • Big Mike says:

      “Blue chip players win championships, not a “deep” bench of replaceable talent.”

      Yep. Exhibit A, the Los Angeles Rams.
      Loved your post Jackson.

  3. Chuck says:

    I thought Dissly had a lot of potential after his first couple of injury shortened seasons, but thought that was an overpay. Maybe Nwosu was too, I’m undecided. I felt like we needed to resign Quandre. Where do you think they went wrong with these/which players would you have let walk?

    Appreciate your blog and really hoping for another podcast soon!

    • Rob Staton says:

      I wouldn’t be committing to an 18.1m cap hit for Diggs. I wouldn’t have traded for or paid Adams either.

      For too long they’ve paid enormous money to non premium positions

      • 12th chuck says:

        “For too long they’ve paid enormous money to non-premium positions”
        and still not getting what they paid for, not even by a long shot, can’t whiff in the draft and overpay in f/a to be a contending team

      • Alex says:

        No, you’d be paying 20 million for clowney to get injured and ride the pine every year. Running a franchise is hard, and no single person has all the answers even if you do consider yourself a cut above.

        • cha says:

          Not this again.

          Spending big legitimately addressing your biggest need >>>> spending big for lesser needs and leaving your biggest need a big black hole

          This isn’t rocket surgery.

        • Rob Staton says:

          You’ve got to love the passive aggressive weirdos who come on here to post stuff like this

          You’d think they just wouldn’t visit the site any more

  4. Mac says:

    It always frustrates me on how low our ROI is at many positions. Tight end being a perennial frustration of mine, some “Hawk’Tubers” referred to Dissly as a top 5 blocking tight end. I don’t think he has been on the field enough to justify being a top 30 blocking tight end. Given our usage at the position, it’s hard to justify not using an extra offensive linemen.

  5. DarrellDownUnder says:

    Are they having to pay as Cha states in previous thread a “bad team premium” to attract players?
    Are there other reasons for seemingly over paying and or pissing the cap?

  6. Troy says:

    This is deeply upsetting for the simple fact that it is 100% in the control of the FO how much they pay for each contract. They love over paying for what are essentially JAGS, how and why do they think that is the BEST strategy to build a contender???

    The goal should be too draft good players, then pay market to keep the true difference makers you draft, then either use draft or free agent to fill holes.

    Overpaying for JAGS just makes it so that you can’t afford blue chip guys and locks you in the 7-11 / 11-7 mediocrity that shouldn’t be goal.

  7. Gross MaToast says:

    Remember how Andy had to crawl through the sewage pipe to freedom? We’re currently in the first few feet of the sewage pipe and it’s only going to get worse.

    New ownership is the only way out.

    (I’ll bet you’re all proud of me for not ranting again about how idiotic it was to retain Pete/JS and letting the best Seahawk QB most of us will see in our lifetimes walk away, but I’m not going to do that anymore. But, yeah, big mistake. Oops. Sorry. Apologies.)

    Welcome to The Lost Decade…or More.

    • Big Mike says:

      100% agree on all accounts, sadly.
      It’s going to be a tough ride.

    • Ashish says:

      Yes and No on Russ trade. Some of the comments Russ made not sure how to rate Russ vs Carroll who is worst but totally agree trading QB at his prime tells us PC/JS screwed up more times to start all over. Current draft is only positive but for final verdicts you have to wait for 3 years.

  8. Strategicdust says:

    Teams in decline often seem to overvalue their own players and pay over market rates for average to below average players. Seattle unfortunately embodies this philosophy but tries to justify with “they know to play the way we like” “great locker room guys” and “always competing”. It strikes me a team reluctant to make necessary changes surrounding themselves with players like Luke Wilson who really didn’t do much beyond being a personality and someone Pete like having around. Of course these players are excited to be offered this kind of money as they really wouldn’t be seeing this from other teams.
    When you have a coach and front office that portray themselves as always being close to winning a championship and just needing a few pieces to win, you lock yourself into a .500 or worse team for a long time. There’s little to no accountability for Pete and John and they know it. They’ve locked into a philosophy and “happy” mentality that will hurt this team and it’s prospects for me a long time.

  9. SeaTown says:

    Yea but PC is excited about the Lock / Smith QB competition. He’s jacked!

  10. Mark Dewees says:

    There really has not been enough heat on John Schneider in general. Everyone tends to focus on Pete and I do agree with most of that as well but I really think John has made a lot mistakes himself. Percy Harvin, Jimmy Graham and Jamal Adam’s and so many free agency misses. People talk about the “miracle” trades like Dunlap, Brown or Diggs but forget the reason those generally needed is because screwed up the off-season to begin with

    • Rob Staton says:

      But here lies the problem. Who actually makes these decisions?

      Pete heavily recruited Percy Harvin at USC and longed for him. Graham was traded for immediately after ‘that’ red zone play. Adams was a desperation trade made right before camp. They all feel like overly emotional moves made by the Head Coach.

      I can well imagine a situation where Seattle’s best cheap deals are thanks to Schneider and his staff working behind the scenes, seeking opportunities. And the failed big splashes are Pete calling for something to happen as the ultimate decision maker.

      Or PC could be responsible for some, Schneider others.

      Or they could be completely in agreement on everything.

      But we just don’t know. Which is why it’s hard to apportion blame.

      Carroll has ultimate say though. It’s been his show. So in a way, even if Schneider cooked up every single one of these deals — Carroll would have to green-light them. It’s his project.

      • cha says:

        And yet, given Schneider had a chance recently to pursue a pretty juicy option to run his own show at Detroit and elected to stay in Seattle, that is a pretty strong tacit sign-off on what Pete has done and will continue to do.

        • Big Mike says:

          Or maybe a major condemnation on the ownership in Detroit? Or maybe he thinks he can tread water in Seattle long enough tom get the dream job in Green Bay eventually (using “those decisions were Pete’s, but I’m the one that wanted Wilson”, etc.)?

        • JimN says:

          Would anyone of us want to go to Detroit? Doubt it.

          • cha says:

            Lots of reasons. But the destination matters less than the decision he made. By staying he signed off on everything that’s been done and will continue to be done.

      • Big Mike says:

        “Carroll has ultimate say though. It’s been his show.”

        Yep, and he made it abundantly clear it was this way during his introductory presser right after he was hired.

      • Tomas says:

        The foggy process of “who does what” serves the interests of both Pete and John, by making it more difficult to apportion blame (or praise.) That’s why it will be necessary to flush them both — so to speak — when the time comes … and the sooner the better.

  11. Old but Slow says:

    What a depressing post.

    The truth hurts.

  12. Hawkdawg says:

    Fair points here. But it is also true that they just turned the corner on the draft–from what we can tell–for the first time in quite a bit. If they do it again next year, they might actually succeed in spite of themselves at some point.

    • Big Mike says:

      But the question remains, will they play these young guys and take their lumps while they develop or will they do as cha mentioned is possible in his post above? Will Tyreke sit so LJ can get snaps (in yet another desperate attempt to justify the pick), will Walker sit while Homer runs at a 3 YPC clip, will Cobe sit for Artie Burns, etc., etc.?

      Look, we’ll know if they’re committed to a ground up build if most of the young guys play and take some lumps. Frankly, I don’t think it’ll happen. If they intended to fully commit to a rebuild, they wouldn’t have signed Diggs and Dissly to the contracts they gave them. I believe Pete’s ego is such that he thinks he can win with the assembled roster based on being “close” with Geno at QB last year in the stealers game and the Saints game.

    • Rob Staton says:

      True — but it would be nice to combine good drafting with sound decision making in FA

      • Big Mike says:

        It absolutely would. And hopefully when she sells in 2 years and a new owner(ship group) brings in his/her GM and HC of choice, the new regime will do that. Until then, I don’t see it based on the Dissly/Diggs contractual evidence, giving up on Blair, etc.
        Jack Conklin was again an outstanding example of their flawed process in FA Rob. Same with Bruce Irvin. You’ve been taking about this for the last 3 years and here we are still talking about it. Do they ever, and I mean EVER self-evaluate or because they answer to no one since Paul died, do they just barge through every offseason with blinders on?

  13. David Stacey says:

    Good article Rob a worrying reminder about this FO.

    2023 according to Over the Cap

    Rams:
    Donald $26
    Ramsey $25.2
    Kupp $27.8
    $79
    Arguably the 3 best players in the league at absolute premium positions.

    Seahawks:
    Diggs $18.1
    Adams $18.1
    Lockett $16.75
    Nwosu $12,7
    Dissly $9.25
    Q Jeff $6
    $80

    If the Rams get a stud through their door, they get on with it and pay them – they would have paid Metcalf months ago.
    If the Seahawks had Donald and Kupp, as crazy as it seems I don’t think it’s impossible that they get cute penny pinching end and end up looking for a trade partner- as opposed to being adults and paying their game changing superstars.

    Granted some cuts and restructures can be made to the Seahawks (Adams) but the Rams are showing everyone in the PNW how to allocate resources properly and lessons are not being learned.

  14. Forrest says:

    Rob and Cha,

    Love all your points, as always. My question is at QB. Even if you got Mayfield of Jimmy G – are you prepared to pay them $30M+ on a long-term deal? If they become your starter this year, they’ll want starter money next year and neither of them are worth it (and you again miss on seeing what you have in Lock – like Blair, Etc.). You moved on from Russ because you didn’t want to pay him. I’m fine with that if your philosophy is to always have five years of a cheap rookie QB. But, my fear is they hope to pay $20M/yr. instead of $40M/yr. I have the same fear at WR and DE (where they have done the same with several DEs).

    • cha says:

      I think those are valid concerns.

      The Seahawks appear completely comfortable with their ‘Lock or Geno’ option and they had a terrific draft. Particularly avoiding the QBs who didn’t really rate much this year.

      It seems logical/obvious that they would cash in a lot of their draft capital in 2023 by taking a QB with the perfect marriage of need+availability+cap concerns.

      But as Rob’s article pointed out, they consistently seem content with mediocre depth options as opposed to swinging for top talent. Will they go that route with QB? Hard to say.

      The QB market is very volatile. There are tiers.

      You’ve got franchise-level guys, you’ve got above average to average starters (like Ryan, Tannehill, Jimmy G, Cousins), guys that are vastly overpaid and just playing out their 2nd contracts after having been dumped (Goff, Wentz), and then there’s a big no-mans-land between those salaries and what rookie QBs are pulling down.

      You’ve got Jameis Winston at $14m APY and Marcus Mariota at $9+m APY and that’s about it there.

      It’s hard to say what Baker and Darnold will get on the open market. I think they have worked through their rookie deals and reality might slap them in the face next offseason. Hard. Particularly if the QB talent in the draft is as advertised.

      Jimmy has the best case but I truly cannot see someone paying him his current APY of $27m. And how much of a factor is the Niners awesome defense and Shanahan’s near-perfect molding of the offense to Jimmy’s success? I think teams would get a really good test balloon on that in 2022 if Jimmy ends up starting for another franchise.

      My best guess would be the Hawks get a top rookie and sign a Geno or Lock type to a $4-7m contract based on how they played this year to provide some bridge help. If they pick up one of Jimmy/Baker/Darnold in 2022 and they do anything other than play lights out, I could see the Seahawks biding their time like this year and seeing if any of them has a market and then making an offer with heavy playtime incentives.

      • Cha etal... says:

        Cha, I say we go for a “starter” at QB this next draft – and worse case scenario – we spend two to four years with a “guy” who at least we had good reason to believe “may become The Guy.” Watching a potential “guy” who can learn on the job will be more interesting than watching retreads who never were, and never are going to be: a “guy.”

        I’d rather get a higher draft spot to get “The Guy,” than win just enough to lose the year and the “guy.”

        Two rookie tackles, are just going to be a recipe for pain, suffering and anguish. If we’re lucky their year of gettin’ schemed out of their minds will set them up the year after when they have a real QB and they can actually get some paybacks for rookie pain.

        At that point the real adventure begins. I do like adventure!

    • Rob Staton says:

      Even if you got Mayfield of Jimmy G – are you prepared to pay them $30M+ on a long-term deal?

      No. Absolutely not.

      But then I doubt anyone else will offer that. Even if they play well.

      And if that situation did happen — you just be prepared to move on and turn to the draft. Maybe get a comp pick.

      • Forrest says:

        I completely agree, Rob. I’d rather see what we have in Lock this year than pay for a one year rental of either Mayfield or Jimmy G and hope for a 2024 comp pick. I’d also rather roll over the extra cap from NOT signing one of them this year, so we have that available next year. And, as you mentioned, be prepared to lose a game or two more this year (if that happens) to better set up for a top QB in the next draft class.

  15. Roy Batty says:

    Until this franchise is sold and the new owner cleans house, this is the crap sandwich we are stuck with.

    And I am imediately changing the TV channel as soon as any pundits start spewing the “Schneider is a genius” mantra.

    The Carroll/Schneider era cannot end soon enough.

  16. Sneekes says:

    As old Mama Sneekes used to say “Look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves”.

  17. Ashish says:

    Saw on Twitter about DK signing for 110mil for 4 years 70 millions guaranteed. I assume it’s fake news …

  18. Gaux Hawks says:

    ouch, way too soon… wish you didn’t uncover these numbers until after our week one victory tour.

  19. cha says:

    More post-divorce garbage: Corbin Smith cites a team source that RW had a big hand in getting Schottenheimer fired.

    • Big Mike says:

      Guaranteed that was fed to Corbin by Pete and/or John via a go between. Could it be true? Yep but it’s over, move on.

      Yo Pete and John, playing games like this is not going to change a thing as it concerns the present. Your late career legacy (Pete) and hopes of continuing a career (John) is going to depend on the results in the W column, not whether Russ got Schotty fired. If you don’t succeed in this rebuild, you will be forever known as the duo that ran the HOF QB out of town or made him want to leave. Whichever it was will be irrelevant.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I don’t really understand why that is being sourced, offered from a source and reported now.

      It’s ancient history.

      And if RW had more of a part to play than he let on, well… 🤷‍♂️

      • cha says:

        Only makes yourself look bad.

        “See! All that time we spent insulting and haranguing the press about how everything with Russ was fine right up until the minute we traded him? Hold onto your butts…you’ll be shocked to hear this….Things weren’t fine!”

  20. SpennyDunks says:

    The Rams showed us the formula:

    1. Pay your studs
    2. Don’t overpay jags
    3. Draft well

    So far, we’ve done the opposite on all 3.

    • Troy says:

      What is funny about this, is that we essentially were doing this from 2010-2014/2015. We kept Sherman, we kept Baldwin, we kept Kam, we kept Wagner, and obviously Russel. Hindsight is 20/20 but also we shoulda kept Tate instead of trading for Harvin but really we had the formula down. But after the terrible 2013 draft we lost our mojo with drafting, didn’t really draft a lot of guys worth paying a big contract, and as a result got used to paying JAGS more than they are worth.

      It always comes down to drafting well but they seem to double whammy themselves by over paying for lesser talent instead of just sitting on that cap space. Overvaluing “their” guys and not grabbing premium talent in FA because that’s what “the smartest guys in the room do”

  21. The Rams are interesting the really don’t pay anything for the safety position and the offense line position you may say Andre whitworth and who else? And big Andre retired does anyone know who the starting left tackle for next season? The Rams aren’t that concerned The 49ers beat the Rams 6 straight times before the NFC championship game and drop pick by 49ers could have sealed the game.both the 49ers and Rams invest a lot of money on guys who can rush the quarterback.

  22. Ukhawk says:

    Hopefully as we restock with draft picks and some free agents, the cap can shift to paying more to concentrating pay for premium players.

    Was always a tricky balance between marquee players and balanced, quality depth.

    • Rob Staton says:

      I’d agree with you if they hadn’t wasted $60m two years ago and already spent $60-70m of next years cap space on what is the current roster.

      That’s not finding a happy medium. That’s just spending money badly.

      • Ukhawk says:

        Did say I hoped…😩. Evidence supports not! Thought they weren’t bad during the peak years after rosterbation

    • cha says:

      Right. Meanwhile, the one guy on the roster who fits that description is unsigned.

    • Ashish says:

      Is it so hard to see what they have done? How the money is spread in team? Now they even don’t have a Top QB to justify the crunch. I mean come on do some retrospective and be honest.

  23. 10to80 says:

    We’ll see how they do without Wilson and Wagner. It’s easy to criticize money spent, draft picks taken/wasted, but if it was easy, every team would follow that formula. And yet, Seattle has been very good under this leadership.

    I didn’t see included in the money needed for next year maybe one of the most important players on their roster, R Penny. He’s on a one year deal, and it’s a good deal if he performs similar to how he closed out the season. I don’t think it was a small thing resigning him; he wanted to be in Seattle, and he wants to see his career continue on this trajectory. He will need to be resigned, and I think Seattle might have the inside track based on this contract.

    Pete has a philosophy that every guy on the roster matters. It’s not some strange socialism, rather, brotherhood. He wants his guys to get paid, and I don’t think he wants the QB1 getting the whole bag. It’s a different model than convention, and if he goes down with that ship, maybe that’s okay to him. But he hasn’t ‘gone down,’ per se. He’s not been as successful as he could/should be, but they haven’t been a second tier team. And they found, gave opportunity to, and developed Wilson and Wagner so I’m sure they feel they have a little stake in the game even there. Duplicate the pattern, look for similar results.

    Maybe it works and he cements his HoF career. Maybe it fizzles while Russ and/or Bobby have continued high level success and Pete takes it on the chin. But I still think he values the brotherhood above everything. And even how bad they sent Bobby packing, I think most are like KJ that they know the Hawks experience is good and even unique in professional sports.

    • Rob Staton says:

      We’ll see how they do without Wilson and Wagner. It’s easy to criticize money spent, draft picks taken/wasted, but if it was easy, every team would follow that formula. And yet, Seattle has been very good under this leadership.

      Sorry, but this is just a complete cop out. It’s perfectly reasonable to break down how they’ve spent their money and ask questions. A viable counter is not, ‘well if it was easy everyone would get it right’. Whether you intend it or not, it reads as an attempt to shut down discussion and/or try to deflect criticism.

      This leadership have made a string of errors over the last few years and quite rightly are receiving scrutiny. You can’t live off successes a decade ago forever.

      I didn’t see included in the money needed for next year maybe one of the most important players on their roster, R Penny. He’s on a one year deal, and it’s a good deal if he performs similar to how he closed out the season. I don’t think it was a small thing resigning him; he wanted to be in Seattle, and he wants to see his career continue on this trajectory. He will need to be resigned, and I think Seattle might have the inside track based on this contract.

      He is literally mentioned in the article.

      Pete has a philosophy that every guy on the roster matters. It’s not some strange socialism, rather, brotherhood. He wants his guys to get paid, and I don’t think he wants the QB1 getting the whole bag. It’s a different model than convention, and if he goes down with that ship, maybe that’s okay to him. But he hasn’t ‘gone down,’ per se.

      With respect, this feels a bit word salad. Wasting money is wasting money. It doesn’t matter how you justify it.

      I think the points in this article warrant discussing.

      He’s not been as successful as he could/should be, but they haven’t been a second tier team.

      That’s exactly what they’ve been. A second tier team. Without Wilson they’re going to be worse in 2022. So they are on the hotspot now to show they can build a new team.

      And they found, gave opportunity to, and developed Wilson and Wagner so I’m sure they feel they have a little stake in the game even there. Duplicate the pattern, look for similar results.

      They’ve also got a lot wrong recently which they must learn from. This article suggests they are not learning when it comes to free agency.

      And we all know they need to ‘do it again’ in finding a young, good QB. I hope they do it. But that doesn’t stop us talking about how they’re spending their money, which is important.

      Maybe it works and he cements his HoF career. Maybe it fizzles while Russ and/or Bobby have continued high level success and Pete takes it on the chin. But I still think he values the brotherhood above everything. And even how bad they sent Bobby packing, I think most are like KJ that they know the Hawks experience is good and even unique in professional sports.

      Plenty of ex players have also been very critical. Some started calling the team ‘the Titanic’ when they were still on the roster.

      There is no benefit of the doubt for me. They’ve got to deliver over the next couple of years. And they know that.

    • Tomas says:

      The Rams are playing chess, while Pete and John dabble at … tic tac toe? Very heavy weather ahead, I fear … until 2026?

  24. 10to80 says:

    Thanks Rob, good response. Sorry about missing Penny–went back and found it. For me, it’s possibly one of their biggest signings because of their run emphasis.

    No way I’m trying to squelch conversation, that’s what we do here. I don’t think it’s a cop out because an era ended of sorts (Wilson/Wagner), and Pete’s philosophy plays into it. Don’t think he wanted to pay his QB a bulk of the salary; he wants to pay throughout and get buy-in from all. So when a guy like Dissly looks like throw away money on a blocking TE with minimal catches, they see his locker room buy in, what he means to bringing it together, and they pay him based on their philosophy.

    They haven’t been second tier. They haven’t fallen off like the 9ers and Cards so having 3 win seasons and such. They’ve competed every year mostly making the playoffs, and even some games in there. Now as fans it’s not enough. The SB win was amazing, and what all of us want. Doesn’t look soon coming, quite frankly, but Pete’s leaning into his way, and how he’ll pay for that.

    Yes, they’ve missed bad on many FAs, as you well pointed out, but somehow they’ve stayed mostly +.500.

    And despite the Geno ahead talk, I think they feel pretty good about Lock’s chances coming into camp. Again, they want their QB to part of the team, not the whole team. As you well said, you went off of Geno vs Lock talk for awhile, and that’s refreshing. It’s a dead horse till camp starts.

    It’s a valuable article showing the money and its implications–well researched—I just see Pete’s philosophy as an underrated part of why it happens, and that was my angle.

    • Troy says:

      Not gonna speak for Rob but in my mind 1st tier team is one that is a legit super bowl contender. Hawks haven’t been that since about 2015.

      Take a look at current NFL teams and I come up with about 5-6 true first tier teams at the moment, chiefs, bills, rams, bucs (with Brady) packers. On the verge are bengals/chargers/ravens but they need to step up/be consistent.

      Making it to the playoffs each year is not in any way 1st tier. About 12-14 teams make it to the playoffs each year, so by your definition all of those teams are first tier? No.

      • Rob Staton says:

        Not gonna speak for Rob but in my mind 1st tier team is one that is a legit super bowl contender. Hawks haven’t been that since about 2015.

        💯

        You’re not a first tier team unless you are a true contender. Seattle hasn’t been a tier 1 for a few years

      • Big Mike says:

        I think you’ll move Cincy into that first tier after this coming season Troy. They’ve greatly improved their biggest area of weakness, the o-line, this offseason. They did it through free agency. Something the Seahawks should’ve done with their pass rush before the desperation trade for the peacock……even if it meant overspending!

    • Olyhawksfan says:

      With a good o-line, great rb, legendary D, and Russ they were a tier 1.

      With a crap o-line, a ghost rb room, mediocre D, and Russ they were not a tier 1 team.

      I have high hopes for a Walt Disney ending to Pete’s career, but I’m not holding my breath.

  25. line_hawk says:

    They pay players who are mild mannered, unquestionably faithful and toe the line. Wagner, Carson/Penny, Lockett, Ford/Mone/Dissly are prime examples. The Rams are a ruthless corporation in who they keep and let go; the Seahawks are mired in bureaucracy.

  26. V says:

    Josina Anderson: I’m told the #Seahawks still have a high-level of interest in acquiring QB Baker Mayfield and behind-the-scenes are open to contractually extending him, per league source. I also know that the process of collecting information and insights into Mayfield is still ongoing.

    https://twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1539734992900820993

  27. Troy says:

    Ya I agree with you, Cinci has a very impressive team going. I just want to see them be more than a 1 year flash in the pan before giving them legit tier 1 status.

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