This is supposed to be a 20-30 minute preview podcast. However, the Seahawks defense is forcing us to do much more. We get into so many topics below so please have a listen…
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Theme by Anders Noren — Up ↑
Upon reflection, I think we’re being too hard on the Seahawks defense for being on track to give up the most passing yards of all-time by 1,000 yards. It’s not like they’re going to shatter the NFL record by giving up 2,000 or 3,000 yards, so it’s really not that bad. No?
It’s not an emergency until they’re on track to give up 10,000 passing yards. That’s five digits. Right now, they’re only scheduled to give up four digits and every team in the NFL does that. Let’s give Pete a break.
This is just sad.
Giving up more yards in 8 games played, then previously high water mark for 9 games …. yikes
Danny? Danny O’Neil is that you?
Really? I
After reading the last 2 posts and listening to this podcast, I have found them to be extremely cathartic.
Reading your comment reminded me of a movie from several years back. I can’t remember the title. All I remember is the final scene where John Lithgow, after being finally found out, is driving his car and his worried look turns to one of peace. He lights up a cigarette and proceeds to drive his car off a cliff.
I agree Robbie. They’re not trading Bobby Wagner.
And if they tried to they would not get the value that he provides to the Seahawks.
Welp, them Titans…… crapping the bed tonight.
and the Colts defense has lived up to the hype
What is this “defense” you speak of
How bad has Jonathan Taylor been? He started the year and the #2 RB behind Marlon Mack. An injury to Mack made him a defacto #1. He’s since been passed by Nyheim Hines and Jordan Wilkins it appears. He looks slow and indecisive.
I was kind of hoping we would take him, but he’s shown almost nothing.
Same with Joshua Kelly. I know a lot of people liked him, but the Chargers don’t seem to trust him a bit. He ran behind Kalen Ballage last week and Troymane Pope the week before, and that’s because Eckler and Justin Jackson were hurt.
Same with AJ Dillon. He can’t even get on the field when Aaron Jones sits for multiple weeks.
CEH has flashed, but KC signed Lev Bell and don’t seem to want to give CEH more than a handful of looks since.
Really surprised at how little impact the rookie RB’s have had this season. Everyone above had a golden opportunity to run with the job and no one did.
Clyde Edwards Helaire has been superb.
He’s on pace for a 1600 total yards season.
4.7 YPC.
I agree he’s been the best of the bunch, but he’s really had two great games and 2 decent games. The rest have been quite poor. I paid up big for him in fantasy and have been watching him closely.
KC doesn’t trust him near the goal line and the last 3 weeks he’s had carry totals of 8, 6, 5. He has 81 rush yards over the last three games total, along with 7 catches.
I’m probably a little jaded because I was hoping for more, but he’s been reduced to a bit player recently.
I will say, his issue is lack of volume, as he’s looked great when given the opportunities. The rest of the class has looked very pedestrian.
Define ‘poor’.
In some games they’ve barely run. In two games they had to chase the game.
If the objective is week to week brilliance as a rookie then everyone will be poor. 1600 total yards pace and 4.7 YPC deserves more credit than you are offering.
CEH was given the uncontested feature back role in the most explosive offense in the NFL too. As I said, he’s been the best of the bunch, but my overall point was more to how uninspiring the rookie RB class has been as a whole.
Swift, Taylor, Akers, Dobbins, Dillon, Gibson, Vaughn, Bowden, Moss, Evans
All were taken in the 2nd or 3rd round and no one has really splashed. I’m just surprised at the minimal impact of what we viewed as a really strong rookie RB class.
No one has really splashed???
Clyde — on pace for 1600 yards, just under 5YPC.
JK Dobbins — considered by many to be a breakout candidate for the second half of the season, currently on 5.7YPC, had a big game recently.
Gibson — leading the way for a bad Washington team. Currently on 4.3YPC and set to reach 1000 total yards despite playing on a totally hopeless offense.
D’Andre Swift has looked fantastic at times, is pushing 5YPC and it’s confounding why Detroit doesn’t just make him the feature back.
AJ Dillon was never going to burst onto the scene and usurp the backs right away there. K’Shawn Vaughn is sitting out the season due to Covid complications.
I just don’t recognise what you’re arguing here.
Clyde is not on pace for 1600 yards. He may be technically, but I’ll set a bar for you at 1200 and still take the under. If he makes that it will be off of receiving numbers, because he won’t hit 1000 rushing.
Dobbins has had one good game. ‘Considered by many to be a breakout candidate’ isn’t even an argument.
Gibson got outsnapped by JD McKissick 25 – 45. When they cut AP, I thought he could be the breakout rookie of the bunch. I like him, but he has the same rushing yards as Frank Gore.
Swift can’t beat out AP and Kerryon Johnson. I agree he should get more run, but he’s not.
Vaughn – that’s just wrong. He came off the Covid list 3 months ago. He’s playing, but exclusively on special teams weeks 7 & 8 and was a healthy inactive last week.
What about J Taylor? The fact that he’s 3rd fiddle to a career backup and a scat back? Josh Kelly had Eckler go down for multiple weeks and is getting outplayed by Pope and Ballage.
The WR’s (also a strength of the draft) have been much more impressive to me. Claypool, Jefferson, Lamb, Higgins, Aiyuk, Jeudy have all had big impacts. Even Hamler, Raegor and Ruggs have flashed despite dealing with injuries.
All I’m saying is the rookie RB class has been disappointing in my eyes so far . It’s an opinion. If yours is that they are doing well, that’s fine. Many of them may end up being great, I just thought a few would pop earlier.
He’s either on pace for it or he isn’t. He is currently on a trajectory to reach 1600 yards. He has just shy of 600 rushing yards and has 1000 well within his sights. I’m not sure why you’re competing against these statistical facts.
Yes it is an argument. The people who watch him regularly have been impressed and believe he is very capable of becoming a breakout candidate for Baltimore. Which is perfectly understandable with his 5.7YPC which you seem to have ignored in favour of a ‘he’s had one good game’ counter.
And in the previous game he had 20 carries for 128 yards. I suspect McKissick had more snaps in this game because their QB suffered a horrific broken leg and they were chasing the game. They ran the ball NINE times and six of the carries went to Gibson. So come on, argue honestly here.
As for the statement that he has the same number of yards as Frank Gore — that’s hardly surprising given they are featuring on the 31st and 32nd ranked offenses in the league per DVOA.
Your language is all over the place here. He should get more carries because he’s playing well. It’s nothing to do with ‘can’t beat out’ AP and Kerryon Johnson. For some reason the Lions coaching staff, who are clearly not very good, are insisting on a timeshare. That’s no review of Swift’s talent which has been evident.
Yes I was mistaken. So let me reassess my argument on Vaughan. He’s a third round pick who at one point appeared destined to miss the season due to Covid complications, the Buccs signed Leonard Fournette in the meantime to go with Ronald Jones and as a consequence he’s basically going through a redshirt season. Which is understandable.
I have no reason to bring up Taylor. The claim which I countered was that ‘nobody has really splashed’ — and I’ve proven that isn’t true despite your attempt to carry this on. I have no burden to prove ‘every’ running back has excelled or that Jonathan Taylor or Joshua Kelley in particular have excelled. And for what it’s worth, Joshua Kelley was a day three pick. So what if he’s getting ‘outplayed’ (he isn’t)? It’s no review of a positional class if a player drafted in round four is off to a slow start.
My opinion is merely that they are doing better than you have suggested. Faced with an assertion that nobody has really flashed, I’ve simply sought to prove that to be wrong, because I believe it to be incorrect.
Sheesh, that reads as really combative. Not really my intention.
Hope you take that post as robust, but good-natured disagreement, which was my intent.
I never read any message as combative. I am happy to be challenged.
He’s either on pace for it or he isn’t. He is currently on a trajectory to reach 1600 yards.
I can run 400M in a minute flat. That doesn’t mean I’ll run an 800 at 2 minutes. It means I’ll be gasping for air and barely able to move.
His last 3 games he’s totaled 19 carries for 81 yards. Why? Lev Bell getting 16 carries himself.
Look at Dobbins’ box scores. He’s topped 50 yards once and it was with Mark Ingram out. Ingram is back this week or next, and I would expect him to resume his lead back role. A 3-way timeshare with Gus Edwards in tow has me thinking that a 2nd half breakout is unlikely.
Gibson – You pointed out how dreadful WFT offense was. I compared him to an ancient RB on an equally awful team.
You’re carrying this on for the sake of it it now.
I proved my point. Time to move on.
CEH has definitely flashed. CEH was not supposed to be the starter when they drafted him. Damien Williams was the projected starter, but opted out of the season under the COVID policy in mid August, thrusting CEH into the starting role. They brought in Bell because a rookie scat back should never touch the ball 300 times in his rookie season, and that was the pace CEH was on. Since they’ve acquired Bell, they’ve won the last 3 games by multiple scores, and they’ve dropped usage of CEH, which could be seen as a bad sign, or as protecting their valuable rookie asset from overuse.
CEH has his weaknesses – he isn’t really going to be moving the pile, and he still has to work on pass protection. But Helaire has been fantastic, and the team is smart to consider load management for all of their players as it becomes clear that they are the prohibitive AFC favorite for the Super Bowl.
They added Bell simply because they could. His addition wasn’t anything to do with CEH just as Antonio Brown’s wouldn’t have had anything to do with DK or Tyler.
Watched about half that game. Most of what i saw was jadeveon clowney disrupting plays.
Why can’t we have Matt Eburflus? Colts’s D is legit!
Okay, my advice to you guys is………………………..hide the razor blades, cuz Sunday night will be painful enough. A couple weeks ago I said I wouldn’t be surprised if the Seahawks went 0-6 in the Division, well, the most injured team in the entire league let them off the hook on that one, but I’m stickin’ bye losing the games left with LA and AZ. Vance Joseph laid out the template for defeat, pressure, pressure, pressure to hamper any challenge from Wilson and his O mates, and let the defense crap the bed as they seemingly want. It worked for Buffalo, and it won’t be lost on McVay, and no reason for Az to change their plan come next Thursday night.
You guys had it right when you made reference to an expansion team. Forty plus years back when we started to enjoy our own team, finally, we had low expectations with a team made up largely of cast offs. They didn’t win much, but they were fun to watch anyway, partly because our expectations were low. People look/think back at the King Dome as a miserable stadium, but for those of us who went there it was better than we’d had before, and that place rocked with noise and excitement. Imagine the Clink, but all closed in with nowhere for the noise to escape. When Knox took over the ascension began and the progress was added joy. Then there was the lost time through the ’90s, and with the new century the gradual ascension began again. New owner, then new stadium, a winning attitude with a high level coaching staff, and a stolen Super Bowl experience. Finally, another coaching change that brought positive results and that elusive Super Bowl victory. And now……………………sigh.
For all that the Seahawks seem unworthy of optimism I have some balance around me. It could be worse believe it or not. I now live in Central Texas, roughly halfway between Dallas and Houston…………oy. My neighbors are split in their fandom, some Boys fans, others Texans. Once BoB was fired awhile ago we were able to take some of them off suicide watch, but now we might have to put the Cowboy fans there. For all that the Seahawks suck so much, these poor guys have it just a bit worse. At least, as Seahawk fans we can hope to get some individual enjoyment from watching Russ try to rally some dignity, and revel in the occasional superior play of Lockett and DK……………yeah, small solace, but enjoy what you can. I was sort of looking forward to the Rams game because DK showed he could almost own the big mouthed Ramsey if he just didn’t let him get into his head. With his growth and maturity this season I was hoping for Ramsey’s day to be a beat down……………..and maybe it still will be, even in a Seahawk defeat. We’ll see.
Other than hoping to see some spectacular individual play by a few of the players, they’ve worn me out. I think the team could be made respectable, though not champions, with some better coaching/game preparation, but there’s no realistic evidence that supports that happening. Eight more subpar games to go. Cheers.
No, this is part of the problem.
‘It could be worse’ is not a mentality. ‘The Seahawks used to be rubbish’ isn’t a mentality.
This is a team with Super Bowl ambitions and when they field a defense as bad as this, it needs to be talked about without any fluff about the Cowboys being awful.
I get this is your blog Rob, we’re just guests. Your take away is pretty narrowly focused, the last paragraph is the summation, not that the Cowboy reference is the most important point. Talking about the issues at hand is what we do here, but this is no longer a Super Bowl team at this point in the season with the tools at hand and the staff that works those tools………………………and we’re powerless to affect that in any way other than talk.
Some of us say “never say die”, to see this bewildering defense is difficult. Some of us are super passionate, and yet real enough to see what’s coming. So then those passions up against the reality of a piss poor established defense and best friends as coaches while nothing can change because of decades long loyalties and relationships, is frustrating to say the least…
What has his being my blog got to do with anything Bob? You’ve written a huge post and I challenged the bit I felt was appropriate (or the bit I disagreed with).
I’m sad that Jim Moore is leaving 710 ESPN.
A true everyman character who was completely relatable. Fantastic dry sense of humour and great chemistry with Dave Wyman.
Couldn’t agree more. In a way he was kind of the Luke Willson of the crew – willing to be the butt of the joke and didn’t claim to know it all but he was a welcome addition that glued everything together by being ‘that’ guy along with all the qualities you stated. A loss.
He was my perfect contrarian indicator. I will miss his weird sense of humor.
Did he Coug it?
A Jim Moore memory: He predicted that Gary Jennings would flame out quickly and never contribute anything to the Seahawks. He was right. His opinions will be missed.
Ron liked your thought on daring the other team to run on us by putting out an all pass rush d-line. Give everybody else a chance to find their place and hold to their assignments – just play some sound defense and try to focus the other team away from our ghastly weakness a bit, especially while we have so many hurting cb’s. Like you said you could’nt run it the whole game necessarily but to give a different look and perhaps help the back end of our defense to find a little bit of rhythm/continuity.
Rams 38 – Hawks 27.
I think the o-line has a bit tougher time like last week against Buffalo and the Rams corners are able to make Russ’s reads difficult and again with no real running back I see another game where the offense has some struggles.
The defense is a mess in so many ways, just broken and it will certainly show again against a fast offense headed by a great offense minded coach who even had an extra week to prepare for us. It is what it is-
If teams are going to pass every down you might as well line up to rush the passer.
And if you want teams to run, you have to dare them to with the way this pass defense is playing.
Seahawks can’t just keep rolling up and getting hammered vs the pass. They’ve got to start calling a few bluffs.
I’m telling you I typed Rob above lol. My apologies. I’ll try to proof read a bit in the future-
Has there been a more demoralizing loss for us in the last decade? Even in 2010 and 2011 we were seeing the emergence a young core of players. We were shit but the future seemed bright. Now we have ageing stars, no draft capital, not much cap and no plan seemingly. Things could get ugly before the end of the season, you can definitely feel the fanbase turning.
Agreed.
The stark reality was highlighted in that Buffalo game. The next two games are huge, make or break games. Will the season spiral out of control or can they can prove a point?
“Now we have ageing stars, no draft capital, not much cap and no plan seemingly”
Sadly, that seems to cover it in succinct fashion
I miss this
https://youtu.be/n8XQRGAerak
And this
https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/18647785930982345/
And this
https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/2019/12/24/USAT/ec33bd8e-12c9-4579-90cb-015b0c3b1299-USP_NFL__Arizona_Cardinals_at_Seattle_Seahawks.JPG?crop=4333,2779,x0,y68
I think they are trying to bring that bamf mentality back… And think they are trending good way with Adams, Blair, Brooks, Reed(hope Taylor has it) …
For example when you look at Greens instagram you could easily see he doesnt have that…
On offense Chris and DK and Lewis are real example of BAMF…
Really hope it will be in next few years like it was with LOB…
But its only mentality…
Biggest question mark are coverage, pass rush, coaching etc…
People mistake what BAMF means.
Kam and Marshawn were BAMF’s.
It’s not just ‘the best players on the team’.
Adams isn’t a BAMF. Brooks isn’t a BAMF. Reed isn’t a BAMF. Carson is extremely talented and tough to stop but he isn’t a BAMF.
The Seahawks are a million miles away from bringing back a BAMF mentality. They aren’t even remotely close. And if they’re trying to do that, they are failing badly. They are soft, flat and weak and you can get after them. There is no intensity.
The only player close to being a true BAMF on this team is Duane Brown. DK has that potential but he’s more of a superhuman physical marvel than a BAMF.
I think Carson is a BAMF he’s vicious and try to destroy everyone. DK might be on the way to BAMFness lately (he’s a lot more in ya face physical, talked some trash and stood up to defenders even when the play was over a couple of times). But apart from them and Duane I don’t feel BAMFs on this team at all.
But depends on who we call BAMF. For me those are the big, physical, tone setter, high energy, high intensity, agressive guys who go into your faces, run over you, hit you hard, take no shit from anyone.
Adams might be one of these but I didn’t watch Jets at all and didn’t show much physicality yet
Hard to be a BAMF when you’re missing as many games as he is.
Carson is immensely talented and physical. But if you’re going to be a BAMF — you’ve actually got to be out there as the soul of the team.
DK is a BAMF for what he does. Damien Lewis is turning into one. Duane Brown is close. They have noone else though. That’s it.
They have an injury prone RB who could be but he’s always hurt every year so he’s not someone you can count on.
Bobby Wagner used to be a BAMF. He was in ’18. That guy was one of the best ever that season. Unfortunately, he got paid and father time is catching up with him. Not a good combination. Therefore, the defense is left with ZERO BAMF’s.
They have a chance because they have a superstar QB in his prime, not because the coach/GM are outsmarting people in FA or the draft.
– Adams is a schematic mismatch
– Blair has yet to make a serious impact
– Taylor is injured and has yet to play a down
– “Mr Stiff-armed-by-Charlie-Brewer-twice” Brooks… nothing that impresses
No BAMF.
IMO, BAMF guys are pissed for greatness, reacting with the team, forcing everybody to play 140%. Not settling for “that was a tough game, we couldn’t do more’, but “that was a tough game, we were shit, next time we gettem”.
A BAMF has to scare an opponent.
I mean really scare an opponent.
They are terrifying, violent football players.
A BAMF isn’t just someone with a great physical profile, or someone who hits, or someone who plays linebacker.
It’s Kam Chancellor talking jovially with the media about delivering hits, smiling and saying it’s a ‘nasty scene’, and then suddenly he stops smiling. And he looks straight ahead with an expression that says it all. And if you were stood interviewing Kam in that moment, you might just take a step back.
It’s Marshawn personified. No explanation necessary.
If you had to fight 10 men and you could only select one person to join you, there’s a chance you’d pick Kam or Marshawn over any amount of pro fighters.
It’s playing with a style and an attitude that registers with every single member of the team, to the point where as a team mate you have to constantly strive to reach their level of intensity because anything less is unacceptable. You don’t want to let them down.
It’s not… Jordyn Brooks made a lot of tackles in the BIG 12. It’s not… Darrell Taylor swore a few times on the way out of the tunnel before a Tennessee game.
Rob I agree completely with your definition of a BAMF and using Kam and Marshawn as the perfect examples.
The thing is I don’t think it is even possible to be a BAMF in todays NFL. take a look league wide and try to identify 10 truly BAMF. I really don’t think anyone could.
The point is you don’t need 10 BAMFs. You just need one. Finding 10…that’s the wrong way of going about it. Look at the best teams in the NFL and tell me they don’t have one. One person that can alter the outcome of a game through sheer will like a damn anime/cartoon character. They can energize and inspire whole teams to elevate their play.
Teams used to come into centurylink and leave so physically brutalized; regardless of the scoreboard they took an L the next week. Guys were just playing their hearts out. If you go back through the interviews, time and time again…it was the attitude. Just pure punch em in the mouth attitude.
TLDR
Marshawn was gonna run through a mutha-&%@*@ face. You fed off that.
Great tape. He was a BAMF. A tone setter. His hit in the SB set the tone against the Broncos. And the poor Vernon Davis was never the same after he got tattooed by Bam Bam. I also liked the one that he pancaked a 300 lb. Tackle on his way to tackle the RB. Once in a life time player.
There is a reason that in over 40+ years of following this team I have only bought 4 jerseys… and Chancellor’s is my all-time favorite. That dude would just destroy people. I’ll never ever forget his soul-stealing hit on Vernon Davis! Had me jumping out of my seat screaming on that one! Sadly, we have no BAMFs on this team…
And this on Earl and Sherm too. Man those were the days. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciZkMeNuipQ&ab_channel=SeahawksHighlights
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRB5SkWr2L0&ab_channel=NFLNEWS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IBz8zHTbPU&ab_channel=SeahawksHighlights
Slo-mo of that Vernon Davis hit by Kam – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78qF72JwJwA&ab_channel=felipesixshooter
They got so lucky drafting and having all these fantastic players together several years ago, and you can’t run the same predictable vanilla scheme with sub-par, lousy to avg. players now. They have Diggs trying to cover a huge amount of sideline to sideline space like a young ET but he’s much slower, and Adams doesn’t even have Kam’s coverage ability. Still don’t understand how we knew pre-game or very early Dunbar was hobbled and limping and kept playing him instead of a healthy Clark, Stephens, or someone else.
I’ve heard John Clayton mention bringing in Kam as a DB coach or consultant at least, or Kris Richard back as either DB coach or co-DC. Almost anything is worth a try and better than what they’re doing now. I doubt we can beat the Rams with this D and 3rd stringer Fuller playing Center for a concussed Pocic against Aaron Donald. But at least we need to take steps very soon to improve the D coaching and personnel with Kam/Richard at coaches or consultants, and possibly Matthews at DE and/or Eric Reid at safety/DB the last few weeks.
If i had to pick one dude to join me against 10 guys, I’m taking Michael Dickson. This guy is a BAMF.
Or you could say BAMP… Bad A$$ Mother Punter!
“I’m not going to apologize for our record over the last 20 years. I’ve seen a lot worse…” – Bill Belichick when asked about the lack of draft success in recent years. #Patriots @nflnetwork @AroundTheNFL
I only wish PC would get some hard questions like these
https://twitter.com/MikeGiardi/status/1327252161932255233?s=19
There’s no room for a challenging question like this. There are vital questions to be asked about the coin-toss, Pete’s throwing arm, whether Bobby and four others can win a basketball game against the Seattle media, what sauce Brian Schottenheimer has on his hot dog and let’s not forget the weekly gushing session on a Monday morning.
Don`t forget about your weekly Covid-19 question (sometimes 2 in a row), about politics and election (glad this is over) and the obvious one: how good is DK metcalf and RW3 and their special relation?
I have started to respond some twites from corbin, greg bell, joe fann, art asking them to ask some questions but i`m pretty sure some of them already blocked me, but thats the way for me, start to pressuring those guys to do their jobs
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/11/13/bill-belichick-addresses-new-englands-recent-failure-to-fully-develop-draft-picks/
There’s the transcript. A journalist pushed Belichick with two follow up questions. Fancy that.
The guy who fleeced PC and JS, ladies and gentlemen
https://mobile.twitter.com/lt4kicks/status/1325991782669291526
In terms of roster construction moving forward, the position I’m most concerned about is CB.
Having Griffin and Dunbar as free agents, Tre Flowers is the only outside corner currently on the roster for next year.
There is the risk of overpaying either Griffin or Dunbar based on their subpar play this year.
With limited draft capital, relying on drafting a starting corner is difficult. It’s also been proven with Cary Williams and Quinton Dunbar that signing and trading for CB’s hasn’t worked well.
PC’s quotes this weeks about getting used to Dunbar’s play has been honestly the most puzzling thing I’ve heard recently. Allowing that much room on the outside, plus playing injured seems quite ridiculous to me. What is the point? At least get a healthy body out there.
I don’t know what’s best for the team. Flowers playing better the last 3 games is helpful but not anything that inspires a ton of confidence. The best thing for me to see the last 8 games is Flowers steps up in a big way (long shot I realize) and then we are able to sign one of Dunbar/Griffin to a team friendly deal due to injuries and down play that will result in a value contract moving forward. I do not want to see Griffin or Dunbar back for anything more than $6-8M/year.
The realistic side of this scenario in my opinion says that Flowers is not a starting caliber CB and that we will overpay for one of Griffin/Dunbar which scares me.
Rather than watch Dunbar get toasted because of a bum knee, I’d like to see what we have in Jayson Stanley, Gavin Heslop, Demarkus Acy and let Dunbar get healthy. How much worse could it be honestly?
The options for next year at CB don’t seem good. Does anyone see it differently and potentially more optimistic?
You are right to be concerned about the cornerback position.
It’s a massive black hole next season for a team that is suddenly incapable of developing a CB and has shown, consistently, an inability to plug in existing veterans.
Shaquill Griffin isn’t as good as many people think and isn’t worth re-signing for anything beyond a modest salary. Flowers and Dunbar aren’t options.
It’s a massive problem.
But I’m afraid it’s simply part of a huge, unit-wide problem. Let’s say they add two good corners. They still won’t be able to function if the pass rush remains useless. They’ll still have an elephant in the room if they can’t work out a role for Jamal Adams. They’re going to have to replace Quandre Diggs based on his 2020 play.
And they have no draft stock and little money to spend.
Three years after a re-set they are staring at a total defensive rebuild again. That’s the reality few want to embrace.
Cut Diggs. Spend the 5.5M on a CB if you have to. Blair was playing at FS anyway
It really is a massive problem. They’ve avoided drafting actual CB’s for years.
Since 2013, we’ve only spent one legitimate draft pick (first 5 rounds) on a corner – Shaq. That was 4 classes ago and prior to that it was Tharold Simon in 2013 in the 5th.
Blair and Amadi were safeties that they are trying to move to nickel. Flowers was a safety.
No one that I can think of in memory would be called a ‘cover corner’, but we’re forcing them to play that role when we blitz.
As Rob has pointed out: it was all so predictable. The only surprise is HOW bad they’ve shown to be at coverage.
Eli Apple as a resurrection project for Pete? I understand he is recovering from a hamstring injury but when healthy he can’t be any worse than many of the options we have on our current roster.
This offseason was definitely the offseason to address their problems. 50M+ and the draft picks. Instead they totally failed to address the pass rush. To make it worse, they mortgaged the farm on an unnecessary Safety. Now we will enter this offseason with even more questions, but with very limited resources to fix it. 2020 should go down as one of the worst offseasons of the Pete Carroll Era for fixing stated concerns and needs.
Correct
well – I think we should manage expectations for sunday – b/c I think it’s going to be a loss.
my opinions only of course – – but I think shaq is more important than he gets credit for by many on here, and dunbar, when he was healthy gave us glimpses of competent CB play. I’m willing to be surprised, but I’ve seen literally nothing from Flowers that makes me think he still isn’t an easy completion whenever the opposing teams need it. Being down our two starting CB’s against talented/precise receivers like Kupp and Woods is going to absolutely kill us.
And then on offense, of all the games this year that we need our starting center, this is the biggest . . .Donald is going to ruin so many plays. And with Carson out, we will be one-dimensional, as the healthy RB’s we have left are all limited.
So – you never know w this team – but I just don’t see it the weekend.
But…I also think this – after all the articles about the overrated seahawks are written around the internet on Monday, we bounceback the following weekend against AZ (assuming no further injuries and that we get Shaq and hopefully Carson back) and stand at 7-3, going into what should be the lighter stretch of the schedule. Maybe we can find some defensive rhythm going against those weaker offenses. That would be the hope at least.
Dunbar has been a disaster.
He can’t stay healthy and Sunday wasn’t his only bad performance. He is currently ranked 98th out of 116 cornerbacks per PFF with a truly horrendous grade. People wanted to promote Dunbar’s ability based on PFF grades a year ago. Live by the sword, die by the sword. He has been rubbish.
Dunbar has played six games so far and given up 491 yards — sixth most in the league, despite playing 2-3 fewer games. He’s given up four touchdowns, among the leagues most.
Onto Shaquill Griffin. Before his injury, he led the league in yards conceded, touchdowns conceded and times targeted. He remains second in the league for touchdowns conceded. He has given up ONE fewer yard than Tre Flowers this season, despite featuring in two fewer games.
Here’s the reality — Dunbar, Griffin and Flowers are all inadequate.
You may be right about this:
But this would merely be a false dawn. Playing well against Joe Flacco won’t make this defense right.
Disagree w you re Shaq, I think he’s a legit starting CB on a good defense. And like i said, it was glimpses of Dunbar – you’re right that he cant stay healthy.
The yards against stats are relevant, but not the whole story to me – as we’ve all noted, pass rush has a huge impact on passing yards allowed. I find PFF grades interesting talking points, but ultimately full of exceptions. If a CB gives up much fewer yards b/c he plays for a team w the best pass pressure rate in football, is he necessarily a better corner than someone who plays on a team w no pass rush?
What I would say to this is — I’ve handed you a load of stats and grades arguing why these guys aren’t as good as you think.
I’m not sure a retort of simply disagreeing is adequate.
When you’re leading the league in targets, touchdowns given up and yards — you can’t blame that all on an admittedly useless pass rush.
Case in point — Atlanta’s pass rush is rubbish too. They’ve given up a ton of yards.
Rookie AJ Terrell is grading very well despite giving up a similar number of yards. So the graders seem to be taking into account how he’s playing within a struggling defense.
Griffin and Dunbar are grading very poorly and they’re statistically awful.
Griffin & Dunbar are a complete mess & if they don’t improve Seattle will be lucky to win 1 playoff game, if they make the playoffs. They’re so bad it’s baffling, so bad that if they don’t improve they’re out of the league. That being said we’re tossing them in the water if they learn how to swim great if they drown “oh well that’s that!” Flowers is still learning the position & he never showed up to the draft saying “I’m an NFL CB” obviously Pete was dreaming to think Flowers was good enough to get us where we needed to go but that’s not Flowers fault. We should give Flowers the full 4 years to develop.
Let me preface this by saying that dunbar and griffin have both been terrible this year. I think it would be impossible to prove otherwise.
But let’s not discount the fact that they are both young players who just a season ago, were among the league’s best and brightest. That kind of talent doesn’t simply disappear in a season without something more at play in here. Whether that comes down to a lack of chemistry, injuries or the terrible pass rush (or some combination) – remains to be seen.
Take Shaq for example. In his first season as a somewhat developed NFL CB (b/c it’s really the third season when cbs start putting it together), he posted a coverage grade of 77.0 that ranked 14th among qualifying cornerbacks, and forcing incompletions on 14 of his 66 targets this season for a forced incompletion rate of 21.2% that ranked second among all cornerbacks with 50 or more targets to the bottom of the league in these categories. Is Shaq a CB1 who can go toe to toe with the nfl’s best? No, I think we would have seen some level of consistency that would suggest that by now. But simply pointing to this year’s stats and saying he’s not a starting CB seems like a bit of an overreaction.
In Dunbar’s case, I don’t think it’s a stretch to say that he’s still trying to find his footing within the system. He’s been injured, had basically two weeks of practice since he spent the summer dealing with those charges and it does take time to adjust to a new system when healthy, let alone when playing through injury. Obviously, he was among the better CBs in the league last year and is still young. Admittedly, I’m much more skeptical of Dunbar just because he’s had his fair share of injury concerns and it feels like that might just be who he is at this point – defined by injury. So I have no issues with letting him walk, although I do believe he could be a starting CB when healthy.
I’m not suggesting backing out the Brinks truck for either of these guys. But I’m not sure that we’ve seen what they’re truly capable of either.
Check out the meme I came across this morning, how spot on!!
https://twitter.com/NFL_Memes/status/1325546314470469634
I first remember seeing that meme about the latter seasons of Game of Thrones.
It was fitting then and it’s fitting now.
It’s interesting the reaction from your post “Breaking, coach Carrol signs extension” just one week ago until now. Not just you but the community as a whole.
Personally I’ve thought this tenure has under achieved for years including the LOB years. Think about it, how many teams in history have had a top 5 legendary defense coupled with 5 Pro Bowl players on offense? Maybe the Steelers of the 70’s? As much as I didn’t like the way Sherman exited I can see why he was frustrated.
While they certainly have been fun to watch I am under no illusion the last couple years were they Super Bowl winning capable. Nor do I feel confident this group of coaches will bring them back. If it were me…..I would promote Pete to President and get him off the sidelines. Love Pete Monday-Saturday but tired of poor clock management, slow adjustments, etc.
Just my opinion. Thanks for writing Rob
I don’t know why it would be that interesting. What I said upon his extension — that the franchise is in an ownership holding pattern and is in no fit shape to initiate a huge overhaul of the football operations — remains correct.
Let’s not conflate that with legitimate criticisms about the coaching, development and performance we are seeing.
Carroll is the right man for the time to continue. But that doesn’t he’s immune from severe criticism for the way 2020 has been completely botched. They need to be honest at the end of this season, make major changes to the staff, Carroll needs to become a figurehead leader, they need to make some difficult decisions in terms of personnel and they need to be brutal if necessary.
I said all of this before and after the contract news.
Don’t disagree with your take about ownership not in place for overhaul. But at the same time under no illusion the Super Bowl is in our near future. My hunch is More of Same as long as Pete patrols the sideline. Exciting football as long as he has Russ to bail him out. But how soon before Russ is tired of this?
The Super Bowl isn’t in our near future this year with the current defense and coaching setup. But there’s no need for us to act like this isn’t fixable with a proper and ruthless off-season rather than the mess experienced this year.
The Niners went from #2 overall to the SB in a year.
We’ve been saying that for 5 years. I will gladly eat crow if this staff of PC/JS wins another SB.
The only thing that gives me pause in saying the SB isn’t in our near future is more about other teams than ours. With the salary cap every team has flaws. It will take a major/ruthless overhaul on defense with a team devoid of draft picks and a current run of poorly drafting and developing.
“We’ve been saying that for 5 years.”
We haven’t been saying they’re a piece or two away for five years, once Cam and Cliff got hurt, Lynch retired, Sherman left, we knew a reset was the next chapter for this team. However, we were a few pieces away at the end of last season. Had our running backs not turned to glass in the last couple weeks of the season we arguably would have been facing the Niners in the NFCCG. All that was needed was to resign J-reed and add a couple of pass rushers, and maybe some rotational OLine players and you were sitting pretty for a draft loaded with talent. Could have added another weapon for Russ, maybe drafted the Rb of the future, while still adding Lewis and others. The icing on the cake would have been keeping your 2 first rounders while still being more competitive than they are now.
“It will take a major/ruthless overhaul on defense with a team devoid of draft picks and a current run of poorly drafting and developing.”
Now it will take exactly that. But after last seasons playoff loss that simply was not the case.
Had they nailed the offseason as you suggest I’m skeptical they would win the SB against KC or the Steelers. Like Russell says, the goal is to win the SB.
I will agree this offseason was the closest they had to getting back to the SB though. But since it was so unproductive it’s probably set them back 2-3 years again. Everyone agrees this defense needs a major overhaul. With limited draft picks that leaves trades and free agency. Do they address the defensive coaching especially Petes influence? How much longer does your best Olineman have? The RB room has potential issues as well.
Like I said earlier, I will gladly admit I’m wrong if they are able to win the SB in the next year or two.
“Like I said earlier, I will gladly admit I’m wrong if they are able to win the SB in the next year or two.”
I agree with you on this point, specifically for the reasons you highlighted. My point was all of those issues were feasibly solvable during during this offseason. Had they nailed the offseason I would bet my car that they would have been an NFC powerhouse and could have competed for a SB, as well as have draft capital to make the necessary moves to stay competing during Wilson’s prime.
Nothing is guaranteed in the NFL but if we had even a top 20 defense right now would we be 8-0? 7-1? Whatever the case may be the Hawks would still be frontrunners. It’s frustrating when you go back and look at how the offseason acquisitions have panned out.
Greg Olsen – 19 for 171 and 1. – 7 mil
Philip Dorsett – 0 snaps – 1 mil
BJ Finney – signed for 2 years and was traded
Chance Warmack – Opted out
Bruce Irvin – Aging and injured for season – 5.5 mil
Jacob Hollister – 11 for 98 and 1 – 3 mil
Dunbar – Injured and not playing well – 5th rounder and 3 mil
Jamal Adams – hurt for half season and no one knows if he even fits the scheme – 2 1st rounders and a 3rd and Mcdougald
There were simple options available to solve last seasons issues, leaving you time to fill out your roster with talent in the draft, and they didn’t get it done. I don’t even know where I’m going with this. Not arguing but more venting.
Agree with everything you just said Chase (I would include the last 3 drafts and development). Most of the people on this site echo your sentiments of what could have been.
But come Sunday we will be rooting for the hawks, hope the defense pulls their collective heads out, and marvel at Russ, DK and Tyler.
If they cannot win a SB, how is PC the right coach going forward?
We are playing this out since 2016. And there is no hope, since we shopped our future for a positional mismatch player, whose next contract will outgrow any sane numbers for a fringe position.
How can we keep defending this crap, when Adams is outperformed by most second year safety week by week?
The NFC West consists of a Cards team that gets better and better, the Rams have rebuild around a young core and won’t go anywhere as long as Donal is around, and the Niners will come back once they settled their injuries.
Any of those teams have young, excellent coaches, able to adapt their game to the talent available. Any of those teams can survive crappy QB play.
We need a rebuild. I think, developmental and seasoned veteran players underperforming or showing no signs of improvement has to fall on the head coach. So, IMO, PC isn’t the right person to do it.
And finally, a winning culture starts with ownership. The lack of desire is humiliating.
They can win a Super Bowl with Carroll. Of course they can.
But it won’t happen if they have an off season like they had this year.
I’m not under the impression, that the next few offseasons will get any better.
(With a tip pf the hat to Don Henley):
How the mighty have fallen, or so that statistics said…….
2013 Seahawks FULL season stats: 2752 pass yds allowed
2020 Seahawks HALF season stats: 2897 pass yds allowed
You got it Big guy, pretty telling numbers.
But … but … Pete’s a defensive coach! He’s a DB whisperer!
Oh screw it, I’m depressed.
This game reminds me so much of a game the 49ers played last year. They had just recieved their 2nd loss to an AFC team in Baltimore and were going to New Orleans the following week and won. Can we complete the same feat.
They were highly competitive in Baltimore and only just lost and had an elite defense.
That’s a pretty bizarre comp.
Defense has nothing to do with it. The point is they were playing two tough back to back road games. They lost the first one and ended up winning the second one they were supposed to lose. Great teams find ways to not lose back to back games. Are we one of them? We will find out on Sunday.
Defense has everything to do with it really. They played a tough, competitive, nip and tuck road game in Baltimore. They didn’t have the arses tanned like Seattle in Buffalo, losing in shambolic fashion.
The Niners were a complete team, playing the kind of games complete teams play. The Seahawks are scrambling to work out how to field an actual functioning defense.
I don’t think the team has given enough consideration to conditioning. This year especially. I’m not a trainer, but I have participated in sports classes. My observation during training camp was that they did some stretching, trotted around or walked between drills, and had soft practices (because of league rules against hard contact). Even with that light a practice, linemen like Christmas were getting hurt. Just from trotting around and bending over into position.
It obviously wasn’t enough to avoid the injuries that have occurred. Would it be too much to ask for players in speed positions to run 5 miles a day and lift weights over the summer? Also to avoid driving 4 wheelers and motor bikes?
I’ve never understood the rational that next year’s 1st rounder was less valuable if college football hadn’t been played this season.
Wouldnt that have been a great opportunity to potentially get an impact player (that you normally wouldn’t have been in position to get) late in round one?
It just seems like in a year where team’s rankings of college players are more variable, and there is less of a consensus of who the best players are, the better chance for a blue chip player to fall to where the Seahawks would be picking.
Excellent point. But remember we are talking about the Seahawks brain trust for drafting and they tend to think and operate in strange ways that result in a lot of over valuing(ie reaching & trading back for) players compared to the rest of the league. We have been seeing the fruits of thier, shall we say off center philosophies for some years now – and too often not in a good way.
A slice of this drafting issue : The Hawks have spent 12 draft picks on their historically wretched secondary going back 3 years.
Two – 1st rounders
One – 2nd rounder
Three – 3rd rounders
Two – 4th rounders
Three – 5th rounders
One – 6th rounder
Jamal Adams 1st,1st,3rd
Marquis Blair 2nd
Lano Hill 3rd
Shaquill Griffen 3rd
Tedrick Thompson 4th
Ugo Amadi 4th
Tre Flowers 5th
Queintin Dunbar 5th
Quandre Diggs 5th
Mike Tyson 6th
And that’s not getting into the massive failures on the d-line like Sheldon Richardson and Malik McDowell among others(say our 2nd and 3rd rounder Darell Taylor who was supposed to be ‘the’ Leo this year…). Or using a 1st rounder on an outside linebacker who so far hasn’t shown any wow factor what do ever, huh – sadly we could go on like this for a long time the deeper we dig and the farther back we go. Poor drafting/trading/free agency decisions have in my book been the runaway biggest cause of the Hawks decline.
Wow, seeing that in black and white along with the failures you mentioned and the one at least that you didn’t, LJ Collier, really hits home. That’s why when I said earlier this week that it wasn’t Wilson’s contract that was the reason for the decline, this is what I meant. Thanks for putting it all in one post.
Yeah not fun when you step back and look at it all. Collier for sure and so many more – I personally think you have to include a bunch of the trade back and comp pick failures in those 3rd through 6 rounds as well because they represent players that took away from our ability to stay higher in earlier rounds and get a better quality player and/or with higher upside. Costly poor trades (Graham, Harvin, and now Adams?. Draft wise as another poster noted there’s been some big hits and a ton of below average to crummy players, not many good to nice and solid vets being plugged in anywhere and over time that will show out in a tangibly negative way. We’ve just been blessed with an all word quarterback that has carried the team and masked an ever growing talent drain on the roster. He and the fans suffer the most for the years of largely poor/misguided roster fabrication and team mismanagement.
Where’s the forward thinking vision and planning? Where’s the rational thought processes to make the necessary (and often difficult/unpopular) decisions and consequent actions? As has been said as naseum where’s the accountability? Where’s the adaptive/creative input and/or willingness to make some change?
The more you look at things you wonder if this offense is’nt more a product of Russ’s smarts and will than anyone or anything else(looking at any and all coaching) and that the defense is indeed lost and rudderless without leadership nor cohesion between players. Does Wagner see it all and has he resigned himself to just playing things out and stat padding for the hall of fame. At what point does taking on so so many one to two year contracts just fill your roster with too many guys selfishly looking for the next payday versus going all in on team play and also how do those rental type guys really build any type of real bonding in brotherhood and team overall?
So many questions that could be asked of this franchise, especially Pete and John because it all starts and flows down from them. My views on drafting/free agency/roster construction have led me to have big concerns for many years now often to the ridicule and ire of football friends around me but it was’nt until the last few years that I’m seeing that it may be Pete behind so much of it all and now we are stuck with him for the foreseeable future. Rough years ahead unless some seriously big changes are embraced imo.
Prior to the season, on paper, the Hawks looked thin on the D-LINE. There was a lot of hope for the secondary. Some even throwing out silly things like “LOB 2.0”
At Week 10, the pass rush still is not great, but 7 sacks shows a glimpse of hope. Obviously it meant nothing vs. BUF because Josh Allen still threw for over 400 yards. The Bills clearly had ZERO respect for the Hawks pass rush/coverage abilities with 31 pass plays and only 19 rushes.
There are comments above talking about CBs. IMO the secondary HAS NOT had the opportunity to build any continuity. Adams and Dunbar were brought in late to an abbreviated offseason. Blair went out for the season. Griffin’s been hurt, as has Ugo Amadi. Throw in an athletic, but inexperienced Brooks at Will, move KJ closer to the line, and you have a lot of moving pieces and no time to gel.
Our Cover 3/Cover 1 scheme is simplistic. The reason the LOB worked so well, was that the players knew their role and could count on others to be where they were supposed to be. They don’t have that right now. PC spoke about how Dunbar “plays on feel.” I think Adams and Diggs may fall into that category as well. It’s great to have instinctive players on defense and Adams is one of the best. But it HAS to be within the system. Kam, Sherm, and Earl were masters at that. I wish it was as easy as telling the current guys to put on the old LOB film and recapture that. There is also the fact that OCs understand our scheme much better now.
I am tired of our CBs playing 10 yards off, I am tired of seemingly little or no change of gameplan for different opponents, and I am tired of wasting Russ’s prime years. On paper, this is a defense you can work with. So get to it coaches!!!
Thoughts on the scheme Rob?
*Our scheme is simplistic WITH MAJOR NUIANCES.
If you can’t rush with four this scheme doesn’t work.
And they can’t rush with four.
Spending a season trying to work around that has just shattered everything about the unit. They’re constantly flipping between blitzing (which is unnatural for this scheme) and sitting in coverage. The results have been devastating and it’s a mess.
The scheme works because San Fran had it a year ago and dominated the NFC. It won’t work if you’re banking on Mayowa as your primary rusher though.
Just thinking. Dropping Mayowa into coverage(68.1 pff on 16 attempts) and letting Adams be the 4th rusher at those attempts.
This is exactly why none of us should get our hopes up for significant improvement to the pass rush this year. The only addition to the worst defense in history is Dunlap and he’s not likely to make this a serviceable unit all by himself.
The other issue is that teams can’t just change their scheme mid-season like this. How would they change to a 3-4 team right now? And would it even make any difference if you have the same personnel?
I fear they are what they are at this point, but still think they need to let KN go and send a message that coaching needs to improve, not just the play on the field!
So basically, we don’t have the personnel to rush with 4 and we don’t have the personnel to cover for long enough to allow our current pass rush to create pressure.
I understand this is the point you’ve been making the entirety of 2020 Rob.
When Pete first showed up, we were in a similar situation, but with a worse roster. I remember our CBs pressing A LOT! Now, I see the CBs giving a 7-10 yard cushion. Is this coaching or preference? In 2011, Chris Clemons was the only one over 4 sacks, Kam and Sherm were rookies, there was no Bobby yet. AND THE DEFENSE STILL RANKED 9th IN THE NFL FOR POINTS ALLOWED!!! What is the difference??? Is it the elevated level of the passing game in the league?
What I really want to say is that there is talent on this defense. It can get better. But I am with Rob as he says these tough questions need to be taken to the coaches. Russ doesn’t need the LOB backing him up to get to the SB. But he needs them to hold their opponent under 24 pts. We are running out of time to figure things out.
Here is another name that came into my head today when it comes to a potential defensive coordinator: Eric Mangini. Thoughts?
big nooooooooo!!
The only thing that gives me hope is that I’m still not sure how good the Rams are. Seattle’s early wins have been criticized in hindsight but 4 of Rams wins are vs the NFC east with a close one vs the Giants. The fifth was vs the impotent Bears offense. The blew it vs Buffalo, but looked physically beat vs SF and Miami. Obviously its a division game so the familiarity is there, but if Seattle can just find any type of footing on D they will be OK.
They’re not very good. The problem is Sean McVay basically owns Pete Carroll. He’s beaten Pete 5 of 6 since taking over the Rams and it would be 6 for 6 if not for Greg the Leg missing an easy, 44 yd FG. I’ll be shocked if we don’t see more of the same Sunday.
I’m really worried about Sunday because of the health of the defense. It almost reminds me of the second Cardinals game last year when everyone was hurt.
Our defense sucks when everyone is healthy, but now I have no clue how how they stop the Rams. The top 3 CBs are essentially out and the 2 starting CBs suck even when they’re healthy (suck might be harsh for Griffin, but he’s far from good). It’s a MASH unit and Sunday could get ugly.
Thankfully, they have a franchise QB to keep them from getting blown out by a 40-10 type score. Instead, they’ll lose like last week and people will be like, “Golly Gee. They only lost by 10 and had a chance at the end. I love life – lets go eat ice cream.”
Another big concern this week is Pocic with a concussion and some guy named Donald.
yeah – at full strength vs full strength, I feel ok about this game. missing our starting CB’s against two really good pattern-runner receivers and the Rams offense – i feel like they are going to carve us up.
Terrible timing for Pocic, and of course, looks like Carson will be out again.
You never know w this team – but I do not feel good about Sunday either.
If the Seahawks were to go to a 3-4 defense next year, they could always try signing former blog favorite Jarrad Davis to play next to Bobby at ILB (or be a much cheaper replacement).
Friday Press Conf PC
[francis] Carlos & Hyde? “Waiting as long as we can to see on Sunday. Carlos ran today. Miss their style.”
[tim parker] Better LA Profile? [cha ed- I skipped this]
[corbin] Phi Haynes close ? “Been battling, done a good job getting back. Finally getting weeks back to back, important. Big physical guy, decisions in the next week.”
[joe fann] Dunbar’s knee? “Quieted down. Rehab work with him right now. In mode of getting back, gonna be a bit. Time to take adv of rehab, good progress, probably not making trip to LA.”
Snacks? “Style of play fits us well.”
[Gregg] Fuller vs Donald? “Kyle good athlete, strong, physical kid played a lot in the league. Ready to go. First time going, had first time guys play well in the past – Jordan Simmons. Kyle will be ready to go.”
[Gregg] Show enough to part w finney? “Yes”
[bob condotta] Pocic concussion? “Made it through game. Reported symptoms after game. Looked at him, something happened. Took great care of him. Get him back, take whatever time it takes. Didn’t report game so we didn’t know.”
[bob] Neko Thorpe? “Ready to go, excited about getting him back. Really good contributor.”
[brady] KJ Wright? “Looked very good today, looked fine. Really good chance he’ll play.”
[brady] Hyde/Carson? “Chris chance if we don’t overdo it early. Hyde chance show and he looked pretty good, we’ll see how it goes. Just different tactic.”
[tim booth] Iupati? “Ready to play.”
[tim] Mayowa? “Not quite all the way back, see tomorrow. Longshot”
[AJ] Recognize Buffalo performance? Practice this week? “Outcome, turned ball over didn’t fit. Gonna have to wait and see until game time. Terrific week of planning, excited. Gotta go out and do it. Dunlap in better shape, clearer brain. Anxious to see KJ back, almost getting everyone together.”
[Curtis crab] Ugo Amadi back? “Good contributor, good on ST, played well on field. Makes things happen. Also DJ ready to go too, 2 good FB players.”
I’m glad you guys brought up Brooks. I think he has been thoroughly underwhelming from what I’ve seen. Taylor looking like he won’t see the field this year…I mean how long can they get little to nothing out of top picks?
I mean…they really are getting almost nothing out of their recent top picks. The last 6 years has given them 22 top 3 round picks. Let’s break them into tiers w/ some commentary:
Superstar:
DK Metcalf (2019) – Bonafide star. Franchise player.
Great:
Damien Lewis (2020) – Amazing start to his career. Could move to superstar category in the future.
Frank Clark (2015) – Great Pass Rusher & we dumped him for picks when we needed pass rush help.
Tyler Lockett (2015) – As solid as can be. Really great player.
Average Starter:
Jarran Reed (2016) – One huge season mixed among a lot of “meh.”
Ethan Pocic (2017) – On the bench for 3 years but looks like a serviceable starter.
Below Average Starter:
Germain Ifedi (2016) – Terrible player. At least he played a lot of games.
Shaquill Griffin (2017) – Perhaps the most overrated Seahawk. Not a difference maker. Regressing.
Marquise Blair (2019) – Had to switch positions due to Jamal trade. Could have a bright future but the JA trade gives me pause.
Spot Starter:
LJ Collier (2019) – Terrible pick/process. Can be written off as a bust at this point.
Jordyn Brooks (2020) – Great athlete. Has not shown up at all minus a play or two. 1st Round LBer who can’t force his way onto the field is a bad sign.
Rasheem Green (2018) – Intriguing prospect that hasn’t been able to be a consistent contributor.
Rashad Penny (2018) – Another terrible pick. Not a good fit for the team. Chronically injured.
Worthless:
Cody Barton (2019) – Head scratching pick. Truly a bad player.
Malik McDowell (2017) – I actually liked the pick. Made a horrible mistake & never played.
Delano Hill (2017) – Member of the most dreadful draft in recent history.
Nazair Jones (2017) – Complete non-factor.
Amarah Darboh (2017) – “Grit” couldn’t overcome the fact he just was never a good player, even on a loaded Michigan program.
CJ Prosise (2016) – Still hurt probably.
Nick Vannett (2016) – Incredible to see a 3rd round TE do almost nothing. That’s high investment.
Rees Odhiambo (2016) – Another “great story” who couldn’t overcome his lack of football ability.
TBD:
Darrel Taylor (2020) – I am going to be honest; it wouldn’t shock me if he is a guy that never gets healthy. We seem to find those types every other year.
So there we have it. I chose the top 3 rounds because those represent “Top 100” picks. Is it any mystery why this team is in the shape it’s in? There are absolutely some great hits on this list. The problem that I’m seeing is that outside of some big hits – we are barely finding league average players. What also sticks out to me is the amount of investment into the Secondary and they have drafted exactly ZERO difference makers. Some of you may think Blair has a bright future, but the reality is that they traded two 1st and a 3rd to find another Safety. That is a massive indictment, IMO.
Anyways – this is a rather depressing post. Outside of RW and the offense (in recent years) – we can pretty much say JS has not found very good talent on the defensive side of the ball and PC has put those players in poor positions. It’s incredibly to me how poorly this team has drafted. The problem with the “but we got DK in the draft” is that it glosses over MASSIVE misses in the high rounds. You simply can’t get nothing out of those picks. And unfortunately – they have a plethora of them that have literally done nothing except provide a body on the roster.
Great work, Rob. It’s nice to find constructive pushback on this organization. I’m simply in disbelief that they have the most valued commodity in all of sports (elite QB) and have managed to piss it away for years and years.
Another succinct post as to why this team is where it is. Great post man. I’ll say it again. Wilson’s contract is not the reason for the decline of this team especially on the defensive side of the ball. People say this often and imo it’s a lazy narrative. When you get a future HOF QB, you pay him. Period. You must draft reasonably well to contend, with or without a franchise QB. The Seahawks have for the most part, not done so as you illustrated. And that doesn’t count botched trades (Graham, Percy, maybe Adams) or shit FA signings (Lacy, Joekel, etc.).
Boggles my mind how they took Collier and Blaire over DK. In Seahawks defense, nobody took him through 63 picks. What a BUST by every other NFL team, too. Thank goodness we got lucky for once.
“CJ Prosise (2016) – Still hurt probably.” I laughed at that one! Nice!
They even traded up to get Cody Barton. Imagine giving up extra picks for him! So sad.
it’s revisionist history, which is easy to do, but imagine if they’d taken Patrick Queen as their WILL of the future. He was taken a pick after the Seahawks took Brooks.
Through the first half of the season, Brooks hasn’t done much of anything. He has 6 tackles (from a frickin’ first-round pick!).
Through the first half of the season, the next pick (Queen) has 38 solo tackles and 2 sacks. That really sucks.
I can understand missing out on players because you don’t pick high enough or your drafting for “need.” Not that any of us here thought WILL of the future was a need going into the draft. But if you’re going to take that position, maybe actually think about taking the best player there if you’re going to take that position anyways. So frustrating.
It’s gotten to the point where the draft announcers are always amazed and surprised by the Seahawks first round picks. That’s not a good thing when the entire football world has estimated the best players in the draft = and the Seahawks pick someone that isn’t on anyone’s first round board. Not a good thing at all.
Even the whole trade down and get more picks strategy doesn’t work when you can’t pick an average to great player to save the team.
In some ways the team has gotten to this point by an over picking of defensive linemen who just haven’t worked out. People like Taylor and Collier, like McDowell. Meanwhile the Poona Fords of the league provide the only dependable defensive line play.
This revisionist history thing is not easy. With half a season in and the draft class still clearly present, how can we not point to Willie Gay, Jeremy Chinn, CEH, and all the other guys on Robs radar?
How many times do we need to endure the constant overdrafting on fringe day 3 talent as top picks? What exactly are they looking at when identifying “talent”? Is it really a thing to play for some crappy Texas team?
The plan just didn’t make sense in the draft.
I know I’ll get accused of “thinking I know better than John Schneider” but look at the players we talked about. And look at their top two picks. With the exception of Isaiah Wilson, who seems a bit unhinged (how could we know?) —- it’s very very frustrating.
But thank goodness we didn’t trade a fourth for Calais and confound the issue. Or make sure to come away with a couple of viable edge rushers so we can actually run the scheme.
They’ve become a front office of overthinkers. They’re too clever by half. And they’ve built one of the worst defensive units in NFL history.
“They’ve become a front office of overthinkers. They’re too clever by half. And they’ve built one of the worst defensive units in NFL history.”
This is true and the worst part about it is that it gives me little hope for improvement going forward.
The decline of the defense hasn’t been sudden or shocking. We’ve been seeing it get worse every season for the past five years.
We’re now at the point where there have been just as many “bad” defensive years as “great” ones, under this regime… and all the bad ones are the most recent.
To be optimistic in the midst of a trend like that is resorting to nothing but hope.
Throw in the lack of resources to fill needs over the next couple of years, and it doesn’t take a genius to anticipate the current trend continuing.
How in the hell does this situation get turned around?
I think that’s a very fair analysis.
Well said Matt
I agree almost entirely with this, I would just move Blair from Below Average Starter to TBD as he looked promising before the injury. Really highlights how poor our defensive drafting has been these past 6 years.
👏
And what are those star and great players having in common?
They were not overdrafted. They were the just the best player available.
Long time reader, first time commenter, but doesn’t it seem if the D-line is the weakness and the LB corp is a strength we should be running a 3-4 with Adams as a hybrid safety/linebacker and Brooks on the field despite it not being Carroll’s preferred scheme? Then you can still get Neal or a nickel corner on the field as well and at least tempt teams to run more. Barton might even have value with this plan.
The Seahawks don’t have the 3-4 OLB’s to play that scheme plus none of the players they’d have to shift to ILB have played that too.
Switching to a 3-4 is an extreme change, not a tweak. There’s no way they could do it now. If they wanted to go that way it’d have to be an off-season move and look at what’s happened to the Cowboys going from a 4-3 to a 3-4. Their defense has collapsed because they’ve spent years drafting for a 4-3.
The best thing to do is simply do a better job building your roster to fit your scheme.
Nor do they have a nose tackle.
Thanks for your answer, it totally makes sense. I guess like most of us I’m just grasping at straws on how to “fix” this D for the second half. I like your idea of getting our passrushers in on early downs. I was mostly basing a 3-4 on having slow as molasses linemen not having to be the passrushers and focusing on the run, and envisioning Brooks as the Sam, Bobby as the Mike, KJ as the Jack, and Adams as the Will. Like I said grasping at straws.
Pocic ruled out. This is the worst game he could have missed going up against AD.
AD and backup centers, name a better combo
🙁
Rams Friday practice: 2 did not participate
Seahawks Friday practice: 10 did not participate
Might be another tough week.
Okay, the top two CBs are out (for the already historically worst passing defense in NFL history), Benson Mayowa is likely out and and Alton Robinson is questionable. We’re getting our nickel back and adding a run stuffer in “Snacks”. Any high school coach would tell you they’re going to pass and attack the outside corners. Ken Norton Jr., we know what they’re going to do. We know we can’t get pressure with 4. So, how are you going to scheme up a mix of blitz and drops into coverage? This is your chance to show us what you can do!
Halfway.
We are at 6-2 and leading the most difficult division in football.
Offense.
They performed emergency surgery on the o-line in the offseason. That worked far above expectation. This is the best seahawks o-line since 2014? Top ten in the league? With real depth?
They went for depth at the skill positions. That was a wise decision, given the amount of injuries in the league. At tight end it looks like an overspend -but that is a mirage, effect of the prevention paradox.
They used all of that firepower and constructed one of the top three offenses in football -outscoring the chiefs! (That offense has still room to get better!)
Call me satisfied.
Defense.
They failed to retain clowney. In the end that was not about money (in the beginning it was) but about the personal preference of clowney. That put a wrench into their roster building at defensive end. As we formulated many times in this community: there is not enough pash rush -this could derail the season. We were right that there was not enough pash rush -but because they build such a great offense -it did not derail the season.
They traded for/brought in diggs, dunbar, adams, reed, randall neal for the secondary. They clearly where aware of the importance of the secondary for their defense scheme (especially the safeties). They went out and tried to build a very good one. That has not worked out -yet. As many have pointed out the first choice unit (dunbar, griffin, (blair) amadi, diggs,adams) has not been able to play together at all -or more then one game out of eight? I still think that this is potentially a great secondary -hopefully we will see that at some point this season.
A specific note on adams. Of course the trade for him is key for the evaluation of their rebuild of the secondary. As i noted in earlier posts this year it will take time to create a good fit between his capabilities and playing style and the rest of the defense -the whole defense, not just the secondary. I see him as a dynasty player -a player pete wants to build his next great defense around. I also think that he has been chosen as such because he (and the defense build around him) have the potential to destroy the offenses in the NFC west. Adams greatest asset is his capability to read the offense -and then to react very very fast. That means that he could beat the misdirection and then the outside zone running game and then the screens to running backs and receivers and then the sweeps and then the tight end dump offs that make up the offense of sf and the rams. He will also stop the running of Murray. His pass rushing capacity should be seen and treated as a bonus.
The seahawks are rebuilding their linebackers unit through the draft -because they can, even as a perennial play off team (linebackers are undervalued). This is an unfinished project. Barton is still developing, but will he become good enough? Brooks seems very good. I expect them to keep working on this. I expect Wagner, Wright and Brooks to show themselves a very good line for now -if at any time this year the defense as a whole begins to play good.
Lets turn back to the defensive line. They were clearly aware of the need to bring in new players -even with clowney the unit was not good enough last year. They did so and kept doing so. The (brilliant) trade for dunlap looks like the finishing touch. Where does that leave us? If i look at the depth chart i would say that we finally have the personnel we need. If bullard is third in your depth chart at de, if harrison is fourth on the inside, if robinson is third on leo, there is good depth and that means good rotation. If the first unit of the line reads collier, reed, ford and dunlap…this could be actually good against the run and the pass. Would anybody be surprised if the sack numbers in the second half are much better then in the first? (Double?)
But what about the scheme? The way we play defense? Is that not outdated, fundamentally flawed, badly coached?
I do not think so.
There are/were three issues here.
The personnel problems including lack of talent, injuries, lack of preparation and playing time.
Integrating the great talent of jamal adams.
Finding a way to compliment this great passing offense.
The lack of talent has finally been adressed. We need to become more healthy. Depth helps. Corner back is obviously the weakest link re depth. Preparation and playing time take care of itself.
Integrating jamal adams will still take time. It could be that it will take more then a season.
The issue of complimentary football is the most fundamental issue. We should be talking and thinking more about that as a community. What is the model for a complimentary defense that fits this type of passing defense? And what would be the Pete Carrol version of that?
What we can hope for i think is that this defense becomes a good top ten defense in the last quarter of the season -and the post-season. If that happens we have super bowl potential. I suspect that such a defense will be close to our traditional cover 1 cover 3 defense -with some blitzing wrinkles.
Call me unsatisfied but intrigued.
There’s a fair amount of rose tinted specs perspective there
Since the defense is set, the Seahawks can just draft offensive players next year. A new guard or center seems easy enough to draft. They could add a running back in the second round. Lots of possibilities. Let’s stop wasting picks on the defense.
Sign AB!!
They will need a LT sooner than later
They will need a LG sooner than later
They might need a C soon
They have a piece at LG
They might need a RT, if they do not resign Shell.
Just the OL looks like it might need some work via FA and draft.
Oddly enough, I always thought Ifedi would be better at LG than what he showed at RT.
Perhaps they bring him back in to play that spot.
RG…. oh well…. Lewis is the man.
I’m curious as to why now with Pocic out the Hawks have not reached out to Britt? Even if only for depth, its a bit of a head scratcher to me especially since we’re slotted to serve up Kyle Fuller to Aaron Donald on a platter…
What makes you think he’d want to come and play for the minimum?
Touché
I suppose its wishful thinking that playing for the vet minimum is better than to have never played at all?…
Rob, on a side note, do you think that with restructure and extensions is it possible to clear cap space and possibly revamp this Defense next offseason?
On top of my mind i would extend/restructure tyler, duane brown, J reed (maybe diggs and Adams if they improve and the FO like what they see of course) also Dunlap if he continues to play good
We could save some money and extend some of our FA, and shake this D up with new players
The only bad thing for me are the picks in the draft, they have so few
I think it will be very difficult.
You have to do most of the ground work in the draft. The Seahawks haven’t drafted well enough for that. None of their recent defensive picks have come off.
The big decision for me revolves around having too much invested in Adams and Wagner. If you have $40m invested in that pair and no picks then it’s goodnight Vienna. They have eight games to show this defense can succeed with these two as the focal point or they need a different plan.
I agree with you that the draft is key to run a sucessfull franchise and they havent done a good job drafting, specially on Defense. But i dont think its just players. They have a lot of talent.
I think our 4 DBs are good (griffin and diggs regressed, dunbar has one knee in the moment and Adams was a superstar safety on the NYJ)
LBS are also good (bobby took a step back, age could be a factor, but also the D-line could be, i like brooks, he has not show a 1 round grade player yet, but he flashes, KJ is playing his best footbal in SAM)
The D-line is not good, but Dunlap is, and he`s also consistent, JReed i think wont repeat 10,5 sacks season, but with help can get to 6, 8
My point is, they have good players, but something is wrong in this D and all points to the coaches and the scheme, not being able to prepare a game plan to explore the opponents weakness and slow down their strenghts. I think they have something of a core, some veterans and young players that they can build upon, but something need to be done with these coaching staff and gameplaning, add in a good pass rush and other pieces, maybe they can ascend like the GB defense last year with the Smiths
I think we overestimate the players they’ve got to be honest.
And the DL is a mess, still.
This. Big time. Both as fans, and as an organization, the current players seem to be over valued.
Dunbar has never really been a full time player, so maybe the idea was always to platoon he and Flowers. Coach Pete’s odd/cryptic speak around Dunbar….something is up. The talk about his play, his brain….someone else in here said it, and I agree, we may have seen the last of him here. Which would be bad for this season, but none of Griffin or Dunbar, or Diggs should be extended. Sucks, but….can’t go broke paying that type of player. I hope the younger, less experienced players get some run at corner, they can’t do much worse.
There was a good article on field gulls about how slow the defensive line is. So slow. And Rob really put it out there, so accurately in the video: why has the plan been to prepare for a running attack, that doesn’t materialize??!? Better to dare them to run. Much better. To expect the run at this point, is really bizarre. Maybe the ‘heavy package’ aka slow d line will pay off when the weather turns. Maybe. Till then, put Collier at NT for all I care, he’s not going to get to the qb, from the edge. Ever.
Isn’t Eli Apple still available? couldn’t be much worse than Flowers
He was released by the Panthers (Oct 2020) due to multiple leg injuries.
thanks
This article explains a few of the changes on 710 ESPN and the “why” they are happening.
https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/layoffs-lead-to-another-programming-shake-up-at-710-espn-seattle/
Radio has always been a fickle fellow. It is really hard to break into radio, hard to stay on the air from week to week and to have any type of long term success (10+) you have to have some lucky stars.
It’s a difficult balancing act when you have to cut costs.
But if you don’t give people a reason to listen, the situation isn’t going to get any better.
One of the top shows ever on the Seattle airwaves used to be Groz with Gas.
Dave Grozby and Mike Gastineau were a really nice mix of the man on the street (Gas) and “hot takes” (Groz) before they were popular. Dave was diagnosed with a significant health issue and Mike “retired” to write a book and pursue other things. They were on the ground floor of saving the Seahawks and Mariners in the town. They tried to keep the Sonics in town, with their sheer will and power conveyed across the airwaves. They were very entertaining to listen to….
Frankly, as you stated, most the Seattle radio “talk” is less than compelling to listen to… and if it isn’t compelling, the ship will sink. Radio has been crunched for a number of years, but 710 and 950 have so far survived in the Seattle market.
Groz with Gas – you forgot to add the “yeeeoow” at the end 🙂
I liked the Daily Schnoz with Mitch. It was unique. There’d be a national sports story breaking, and he’d arrange a call with a beat reporter or radio host in the city it was happening in to get their perspective. Get a real “man on the scene” look at things.
He’d also do it either on Thursdays or Fridays with the upcoming Seahawks opponent’s beat media to get a look at what the Hawks are facing on Sunday.
It escaped the local fishbowl media and there always one good nugget of insight that dropped below the obvious media narrative that was surrounding the situation.
I was never a mitch in the morning fan personally. In the beginning it was way too much about sexual connotations with the Bigger Dance. I never thought he was a great interviewer, but he did keep people on their toes in the morning. I still believe the personal stuff, which is why he got canned, was more an excuse than actually the sole reason he got fired.
I’ve always liked softy. He can be really great, but I rarely listen to him in the last 5 years. Which is the reason why radio continues to decline, you have to have something want to listen to… and most of the radio shows are more or less the same.
I also don’t like how 710 does their shows as of late. They have a set “segment” each day at the same time…. so the show feels the same with no life. Some banter back and forth, but nothing that moves the needle. They also are so focused on the Seahawks, pretty much any other sports news gets drowned out. At least when the Soncis were around, they had something else timely to talk about….. because the fricking Mariners area horrible sports talk listen, even though I think Staci Rost is actually pretty good at reporting on them and the MLB in general.
Maybe that explains some of Danny O’s behavior this week. Some raw feelings.
If the station is having a few issues, going after listeners, or potential listeners, isn’t a great idea.
Calling out dissenting twitter voices by name on the air was a bad, bad, look. I sure hope someone in management sat him down. Disagree if you like but that was ugly and clearly over the line unprofessional.
Completely agree.
Danny O’neill is one of the worst radio personalities I’ve ever heard.
He literally has difficulty finishing his sentences and/or thoughts.
He’ll start a sentence and then break it off, and digress into a tangetial point.
Throw in his annoying voice and pompous “are you *sure*?” when he disagrees with someone, and he becomes unlistenable.
I was shocked when Mike Salk called him a “rising superstar” in sports radio, a few years back.
Apparantely Salk still thinks he’s got something to offer, since O’neill still has a job here despite moving to New York, and the station needing to cut payroll.
Mornings sports talk used to be so great around here, with Brock/Salk on one station, and Mitch Levy on the other.
Now on my morning commute, I listen to music.
How bad would this team be right now without Russ, seriously? To avoid a jinx let’s say he sat out for a personal matter and Geno started the rest of the season. How many wins does he get? The overall talent on this team is starkly lacking.
I think there is talent on this team. Maybe not top 5 NFL talent, but there’s more than enough to work with.
There seems to be a real lack of coaching talent. I don’t think I need to re-hash what is happening on the defense. But that Buffalo game was a true disaster. They were clearly outcoached.
But what of the offense? This season is obviously going to come down to what they do. This last quarter of games has shown some oddly worrying trends.
I think Schottenheimer is getting a pass because RW, Lockett and DK are so stinking brilliant they cover up a lot of warts.
I see an extreme lack of creativity in this offense the last few games. Schottenheimer has an ability to uncork a beauty of a play that just catches the defense completely unaware – I’m thinking particularly of the Swain TD vs New England. Line up Lockett as a RB and get the defense going ???, then send Lockett out, clear the middle field and Swain has a TD he could’ve jogged in.
The Seahawks have the talent, coordination and ability to run 2 or 3 of those per game. But they seem stuck in one dimension:
1) getting 3 yards from their RB, 2) running a crossing pattern with a WR, 3) Backyard FB where RW makes something happen deep.
Where is the power set with 2 TE’s? You can run 10 variations off that set.
Where is the RW designed roll to the right with a near, middle, and deep option?
Why in the world with two of the fastest WRs in the game aren’t you trying some kind of fly sweep stuff?
Why are we calling inside runs with Homer?
Why don’t we have 2 or 3 “in the bag” easy 3rd and 4th conversion plays ready to go at any time?
Why is RW choosing throws with a high degree of difficulty? The first couple games the scheme was so good he was playing pitch and catch with his guys.
The defense needs to be sorted out and decide who/what they are for sure. But the offense faces some similar questions and should not be given a pass because they pull off a dazzling deep ball a couple times a game.
I hear ya on all that Cha, and I don’t disagree with the coaching criticisms. I suspect the O would be schemed much different without Russ in the picture.
But I don’t give the players a pass because of poor scheming either. I think there are some nice names and talented players, but I just don’t see enough to suggest this team could win many, if any games without Russ.
When I look at other contenders, I think the Saints, Chiefs, Bucs, Ravens, Bills, and Steelers could win more games without their star QBs. You might argue thats because they are all better coached, but I also see more talent across the board.
Hey Rob, have you had a chance to take a look at jaelen Phillips from Miami?
I haven’t, sorry
He seems to really have stepped up in rousseau‘s absence!
Just turned it on and saw him get that sack.
Obviously testing matters with an EDGE but he obviously has the big five star background. Will watch more.
12 total tackle, 2.5 sacks and 4 tackles for a loss today.
https://twitter.com/ParkerLewisJR/status/1327697951200722944?s=19
If only we had corners, or a D line, or a defensive gameplan
When Goff is pressured 10x the last 2 seasons, the Rams are 0-5.
Carson & Hyde confirmed as out again tomorrow.
Meaning a third straight game without a running game.
It’s going to be a horror show.
31 carries for $2.75m
Another crack free agent signing.
What a frigging off season.
My incredible powers of prediction are telling me we’re going to get another Cowherd rant about the Seahawks not helping RW enough. And that they’re going to have to make some tough calls in 2021 to get it right.
Why do I have little faith that somehow this next offseason they’ll suddenly get it right?
Answer: Pete is accountable to no one
Pretty sure you’re correct. Anyone think Donald is licking his chops at the prospect of going up against a 2nd team center with no threat of a running game to slow him down?
Hey Schotty, if you don’t call a bunch of quick hitter pass plays, particularly to DK, you’re as dumb as Norton.
As concerning as Aaron Donald is twice every year — I’m more concerned about teams essentially discovering they can tee off against Wilson from minute one.
They haven’t got a plan for that. It slows the Seahawks down and gets them off rhythm. And while Wilson will always make his plays and get his points, it’s shown to be an effective way to slow him down.
Meanwhile, the defense couldn’t stop Ryan Lindley at the moment which equally forces further pressure onto Wilson’s shoulders.
The plan imo should be quick hitting stuff to the TEs and DK, wide screens, slants, whatever. Don’t give them the chance to tee off.
When you have little to no running game
Wilson’s height is a problem is you want quick hitting stuff to the TE’s.
I want to see them flood receivers to one side, force coverage and try to make teams go away from the blitz. If they’re bringing seven and you’ve got four guys stacked on one side — you should have easy yards.
I also want to see them attack the perimeter run.
Sure, and get the ball out of his hand quickly. Negate the rush cuz play action won’t do it with no run game.
I don’t mind using PA without a good running game. It can still impact opponents.
It can also help with misdirection and getting the QB out of the pocket, drawing eyes to the RB.
That’s also important tomorrow.
I watched the Rams loss to the Niners a couple of weeks ago and Aaron Donald was a total non-factor in that game. Jimmy got the ball out so quickly in the short passing game that AD never had a chance to get near him and they consistently ran away from him. It was the perfect game plan and the least effective I’ve ever seen AD in terms of wrecking the offence. Any chance Schotty was paying attention?
The beauty of this is that some folks will be able to say “well without the injuries it would’ve been different” conveniently ignoring the fact that Pete is a missed 44 yd FG away from being 0-6 vs. McVay.
Someone on YouTube just quoted ‘6-2’ as a counter to the arguments made in the broadcast.
There will always be someone willing to fight for the team, unwilling to listen to any criticism — however valid.
Like a “this is fine” meme. Just because you aren’t burning yet doesn’t mean you should ignore the fire. I’m still hoping it miraculously comes together, as crazy as that sounds.
Correct
I do think the injuries are especially ill-placed for tomorrow. I’ll be really pleasantly surprised if they win. But I also don’t think a loss is the end of things, as long as we start getting players back and keeping them on the field.
I really don’t know what to do about Carson – I’m such a fan of the guy, love the way he plays, think he has always been a little underrated nationally, and such a good fit for us. But the ‘can’t stay on the field’ aspect is starting to sink in w me.
Alex Collins time🤷♂️
Bo Scarbrough Time 😉
Wouldn’t that be something, if Bo came out and had a Monster game? He was fun to watch in college.
Not this week he’s not been called up
Then belay that order, then. Perhaps Thursday? Rough having this many injuries and a quick turn game. Seems doubtful we will get many more back in four days. Hopefully, new injuries are at a minimum today.
It’s possible PC held Carson and Hyde out with an eye towards the short week.
That had crossed my mind and I certainly hope at least one is back.
Man, shout to freshman Hawaii boy Jayden de Laura killing it for WSU. Giving it to the Ducks right now. For all the talk about Borghi, McIntosh looks super explosive and shifty at RB. The WR Johnson for UO should be on the list for Seattle. Kid makes plays
Was he recruited by the current Cougars HC prior to taking the job at WSU?
I swear that is what I heard on one the radio shows Friday… while driving around.
True Freshman. Very impressive.
Yeah I think he was a Leach commit but knew Rolo from playing in Hawaii
He looks good for a true frosh. Nice arm strength. Unfortunately the Ducks just utterly wearing Wazzu down. 🙁
OOOO
O O
O O
O O
O O
OOOO
Enjoyed watching the Thundering Herd yesterday. Some great open-field tackling on display. Such a contrast to what we have been seeing from the ‘hawks recently.
Great podcast guys. Hit on about everything. By all rights this should be a loss, while we all hope they somehow pull out a victory.
Rob I 100% agree we almost need to dare teams to run. I would also like to see Dunlap and Robinson start together; unfortunately I think Pete to fixated on Collier starting. Maybe try him inside with Carlos & Alton. Like u said put your 4 best pass rushing lineman in. Dunlap, Reed, (Collier/Green),Robinson. I like Poona, but they really need to try something, after all it can’t get much worse. I just hope they come out with a solid game plan. Try to make Donald less of a game wrecker and more creativity on offense. I definitely don’t want to hear Carroll say they expected to see the Rams run more, we weren’t expecting this again. Carroll needs to prepare better both pre game and in game. Last week was a pure failure on all counts. Coaches and players.
Could this years team beat last year’s teams?
I don’t think so. Good question you ask there.
No carson and Hyde means no running game. Backup center against Aaron Donald. Banged up cornerbacks that have been getting toasted when healthy. A historically awful defense against an offensive mastermind. Sean mcvay owns Pete Carroll. This could be a bloodbath
Thought Miami’s Jaelen Phillip’s was the best player on the field yesterday against VA-Tech.
Florida QB Kyle Trask has some exciting traits man. My goodness. Could we see 6 QBs go in R1?
You could make a case for the best RBs in the country, other than Najee & maybe Javonte Williams, not even being draft eligible. IMO it goes A&M’s Isaiah Spiller, S. Carolina’s Kevin Harris (love his game), and Auburn’s Tank Bigsby.
Not breaking news or anything, Oregon’s Kayvon Thibodaux is special.
Really like Ole Miss TE Kenny Yeboah. NFL written all over him.
Ronald jones is good
I can’t figure this Tampa team out.
So was the o-line blocking.
Dline Zion Tupuola-Fetui provided some good pass rush off the edge for Washington last night. 6’3 and 280 lbs. Rest of the Washington team looked dreadful.
Inactives
Pocic
Shaq Griffin
Dunbar
Carson
Hyde
Parkinson
Mayowa
Pocic out could be a death sentence for the offense. Very worried.
Dunbar and Shaquill Griffin on the sidelines could be addition by subtraction…
How so? CB depth looks really troubling for this afternoon.
I suspect his point is that Griffin and Dunbar haven’t played well at all.
Exactly. Griffin and Dunbar have been historically terrible. The backups would have to actively try to be worse.
Hawks 36 lambs 24. Russel opens up a food truck so he can cook on the run. The running game returns from a few weeks of irrelevance and keeps Donald somewhat honest. Dissly gets a td and not much more. And that defense… everyone gets back on the Jamal wagon…he forces three turnovers! Ciao.
Yeah
Man, Green Bay’s defensive front 7 being bad is one of the surprises of the season so far.
Definitely isn’t much fun watching Ronald Jones and Nick Chubb playing brilliantly today…
Also certainly no point having D’Andre Swift today (and for cheap for the next four years) when we’ve got Jordyn Brooks instead.
Ho hum.
Brooks does not deserve that yet, he ain’t Cody Barton. And Swift is no special back. Last year we complained about the lack of speed at the perimeter, which is necessary to stop 49ers and Rams, and when it was addressed, we are complaining that we did not pick a RB in RD1, or WR which we are pretty set? It’s not that SEA went into the season unprepared at RB position, injuries suck, but they happen, it does not make Brooks a bad pick.
Let’s see if Brooks delivers today, I am confident he will.
Why would you want to put this defense on the field first. Why not set the tempo with Russ? Why do we keep doing that when we win coin tosses…
Agree 100%
There’s our all world strong safety getting blocked out of a play by a TE.
*In my best Heath Ledger joker voice*
“Here. We. Go.”
Poona Ford’s long arms paying some dividends there.
Way to make a play, young man.
Well there you go – the run defense is better than the pass defense. But that doesn’t really say very much.
That cushion on the completion on Flowers tho… 😬
Field goal is a huge win there.
Worst defense of all time. Let me repeat that, WORST DEFENSE OF ALL TIME.
It’s incredible, the sense of relief I feel when teams decide not to go for it, and settle for a FG
*against us
Not a disaster of a series. Tackle well and those 7 yrd runs are only 2
Jamal Adams injured again.
What a waste.
Beat me to it. PLEASE just trade him for whatever you can get. Instead Pete will keep him, pay him stubbornly trying to prove the trade was good.
Percy, Graham and now Adams spent their first year injured or seriously injured.
sucks
Oh look, Adams hurt. Color me shocked……not
Good play by RW. The clock in his head is better so far.
Great start.
That’s what the Hawks need, keep it going guys.
RW 4/4 58 yards
Collins 3/20 1 TD
Swain with 2 catches, Olsen 1, Moore 1
No throws to DK or Lockett.
Great blocking on that TD run
Beautiful design, beautiful execution.
Well, we know they can play offense!
Some good play calling, and russ getting the ball out quickly. That’s gotta continue.
Duane Brown demolished his guy.
That’s an encouraging start. Need Russ to have a good game. But using Collins for runs should help take pressure off Russ.
Love seeing big duane out in front driving defenders into the end zone
Giving Russ easy throws!!!
Adams “questionable to return”. Translated: will miss the rest of this game and at least the next one after this.
I was wrong. Let’s see how he plays….
Wet tissue paper
Hot knife
Why does anyone even bother running the football against this D?
Oh wait Buffalo didn’t.
That’s way way easy.. Just leave Ken back there to go back to USC.
Was it just me, or was brooks just walking on these last 2 plays, no effort at all
How awful is this defense? Pathetic.
I can’t watch this defense any more.
It’s killing the enjoyment stone dead.
It’s legitimately the worst defense I have ever seen. It’s comical.
I just said the same to my wife.
Can’t recall a defense worse.
Not just bad… the worst.
That’s not hyperbole, either. It’s like watching a kid in the Glee Club guarding LeBron James. Just nothing.
It’s unacceptable.
All the resources we’ve invested in it, and this is the result?
Yet Pete is a “defensive genius”.
Something doesnt add up.
First Quarter throws conceded:
39 yards
31
16
14
Goff on pace for 496 yards passing
Truly the worst defense I’ve ever seen with my own eyes. It’s astonishing how people are paid to produce this product. What a joke.
Russ better have a career day each week. Cause this D is stopping nobody.
Im more interested to see if this D can step up vs the jets.
Loneliest job in the world used to be Maytag repairman, now it’s punter for whatever team is playing the Seattle Seahawks.
At least Collins is a workhorse instead of Dallas.
That’s a horrible throw on a free play.. Russ isn’t settled.
Sooner or later they are going to break him because he is getting impatient .
Pls involve DK.. what to lose
Thinking ramsey playing dk. Lockett should go off.
Still need to get him involved. Find a way Schotty.
Hyde has missed 5 of 9 games. Good Lord
Drive dead
It didn’t take long to get away from running the ball. And Wilson is throwing high, making his receivers go up for the ball.
Stop with the long developing plays playing donald.
Agree we need to stick with the short quick passes and not get greedy
So much time and yet end up taking a penalty.. bad execution. what’s with these long developing plays. Where are TEs.
Playing from behind and pressure to score every time does not help. This game is going predictably.
I see that we’re playing one of those games where we don’t involve our best offensive skill player.
Good plan.
Better to throw into triple coverage downfield to Tyler Lockett. Can’t imagine anyone else had a favourable matchup.
I’m just happy we went away from what was clearly working.
First drive was way too efficient. Glad we went the opposite on that drive. Sarcasm off.
Pre scripted plays are over. Time for sandlot play
Here comes a 93 yard touchdown drive.
So then, 17-7 after this drive or 13-7?
17-7
Are they not going to even challenge Ramsey? This Arizona all over. They’re letting them take DK out of the game without even trying.
If so, it’s pussy shit
Infuriating
95 yard drive coming up?
Our great run defense just gives up a huge play when we pin them deep.
“This defense for all their issues, has been REALLY good against the run.” -Troy Aikman
LOL
HAHAHAHAHA
LOL
Hey can you remember 3-4 weeks in when we spent time having to talk about the run defense?
Can we fire Norton at halftime?
No way. Cuz pete will fix this. Everythings fine. Lol
Fire mid drive now.. no one will notice.
He looks like he knows it coming!!
He knows he’d had been fired in any other situation on any other team nfl or college. At this point, not firing him is ruining his career more so.
Clueless defence again..
Elite run defense is on point today
I’ve seen better high school defenses.
Told my buddy the same thing
They have no fire, no passion, no confidence! Everything teams try to do against them works, and pretty easily!
So that 5 yd false start just gave Goff 5 more yds passing
Our secondary is horrible. They are slow, soft and don’t tackle.
Another blitz on 3rd and long!
Pete is just trolling us now!
Well the alternative is 6 or 7 seconds for Goff to sit back and try to decide which wide open WR to throw to.
Please for the love of god take Norton’s play calling away we just went through this last week with huge blitz on 3rd and give up an easy screen what are we doing
Is it against the rules to disguise your blitz or even show blitz but drop back.
Why are you biting on play action Adams? You’re in a perfect spot to break that fly sweep throw up if you don’t bite.
C’mon man
Yep, threw right where he vacated
Jamal Adams has mastered the ‘look at the opponent with surprise after they make a play’.
I’ve been keying him each play- he is afraid to hit someone, looks slow, and if I didn’t know any better, I’d believe he doesn’t want to be on the field. Could be injured still, but I see him doing more harm than good.
Well, now Troy noticed it too.
I wonder what the record is for most 90+ yard drives allowed in a season.
The most wasted fantastic season by a Seahawk player: Michael Dickson
I bet Danny O’Neil is inspired watching this.
omg, that’s hilarious.
Only Whiskey can inspire to some degree at this point.
After his Pete love fest he had the audacity to write an article about how fair or not Russ doesn’t get any room for error. So Pete puts together the worst D in history gets nothing but love, puts his franchise QB in a position where there he has to be perfect, suck it up buttercup.
With a normal schedule – we are not a playoff team. This is just an embarrassment.
How can this mess of a defense be so predictable to a bloke in Rotherham in March/April and not to the Seahawks?
You’re just a hater Rob
Daring them to run and they’re happy to oblige.
The difference between each teams last drive is absolutely shocking
There we go. There’s the problem right there.
Running right at Poona. Our NT run plugger type.
Blocking Wright, Wagner and Adams out of the play.
Adams didn’t even get in on that tackle. If you’re well enough to play, you get in there. He just conceded the TD.
So what happen when you team don’t believe in you anymore?
They are playing flag football out there man!
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Why bother to punt? Its just more yards and time to the rams
I’ve lost faith in Pete Carroll.
He’s lost me.
Sorry.
Welcome to the club.
I said this after last week – what exactly is the point of him as head coach? What does he bring anymore?
You mean “we’ll get better because we just will” didn’t win you over?
🙁
Me to.
Just empty words and befuddled looks at this point
Ehhh
This is the same rams game we’ve seen the past four years.
Neither improves or worsens my opinion of Carroll
insult to injury, K.N.JR is going to cost us a draft pick by not wearing a mask
I’m switching back to red zone.
Can’t watch anymore.
so much for having a good run d
Pathetic.
Bottom line: it’s just not fun to watch anymore because of the defense.
I couldnt agree more. If I was a team going against the Seahawks I wouldnt even activate my punter.
this is hard to watch.
soft on every level of defense. and they are a step ahead of us on the play calling too.
Russ is off again. He doesn’t usually miss that throw to the end zone
This whole give up 7 points every drive and settling for field goals could come back to bite us.
😀
The entire team looks flat without energy.
3 Targets for Swain
1 Target for Homer
6 runs by Collins
0 touches or targets to DK
DK needs to start acting a little more like a diva.
Start demanding the ball.
This is just stupid
norton does need to go. change has to happen.
adams looks completely lost and out of sorts.
this is just depressing.
He might get more fun just playing for Jets defense.
Greg Williams is right about Adams. We should have brought him too along with Adams
Absolutely no point in kicking field goals you have to go for it
This offense has become all or nothing sorta. It’s all on a big playz
Did anyone else notice adams absolutely not give any effort on browns touchdown run
Russell needs to score every drive just to keep us in the game..grrrrhhh
Norton has to go ….
Here comes another TD drive. 24-10 Rams at the half.
Norton playbook is from madden just blitzing Adams every play
..
its true. makes us sooo predictable
Look at that top 10 run defense Ken Norton & Pete are so proud about.
Adams makes an actual play??!!
He’s made plenty of plays, he’s been massively disappointing.
But let’s be fair
Great play. Need to score here.
Wow! Adams finally gets in the game!
Alright offense. Strike.
Holy FUCK a POSITIVE JAMAL ADAMS SIGHTING
Russ could’ve run for 20, Horrible decision
Yup, RW is almost broken.
Wow Russ
thats a great play by adams
Shitty Russs shows up. Trade him before he is completely broken apart.
Wow that’s the worst throw I’ve ever seen from RW. MVP is long gone.
Ok wtf was that?!?!
Russ playing worse then the defense
Run for the 1st down…..grrrrhhh why..
I’m out great blog gonna miss it but I’m out
Don’t blame Russ. It was probably the defense fault right??
That is one of the worst Int’s I have ever seen.
RW is not an MVP. He’s just not. That was rookie level awful.
Sure was
Also this obsession with him winning MVP is mind boggling. It doesn’t mean a thing imo. The only MVP I’m concerned about a Seahawk winning is super bowl mvp.
Sigh… why can’t we have nice things this year?
momentum right back
how many red zone INTs this year?
dammit
Is russ putting the mvp stuff to much in his head. Cause thats a throw russ doesnt do 2 years ago.
No — he’s feeling the pressure of having to score 40 a game and making dumb ass mistakes.
This
Only pressure that hurts him is scoreboard pressure
Take away the first 3 games and Russell has been a good player with significant highs and lows.
Russ got greedy, like all good QBs sometimes get. Still a mind boggling throw.
Wow. Russ doesn’t deserve MVP playing like that. That was Gardner Minshew level right there
No, worse. More like Blake Bortles
sigh… -_-
I wonder what the record for most interceptions thrown in the endzone is
Russ looks worse and worse every week
Yes he does
I dont get it – decision-making usuallly hos strength. this is his worst stretch of not taking care of the ball that i can remember
Not really worried. This game feels like a win right now. Disappointed in Russ.
It’s time to make Russ accountable. simply unacceptable to pay top $ and get this shit week after week. Bench him for a series
Hate see Whitworth down. Seen him interviewed several times. Seems like a good dude.
For F’s sake Wilson Counld of almost just run for a touchdown. Horrible play
3rd and 15.
Do we blitz?
From the blindside while the play goes to the right. Probably.
we’re gonna blitz
finally we cover a blitz and make a tackle
Jamal is starting to feel it. I loved seeing the energy and attitude- anyone see if sway the ball after the whistle?
I’d like to see Norton gone and give the keys to Adams.
Real cool of Troy to go over the play call on the INT. They had Dissly open, Russ was just late to the read, and when you’re a beat late in the NFL, you’re gonna pay. Shoulda just taken the yards and the slide, especially with the clock situation, but again, Russ is getting greedy and not playing within himself. This team isn’t making it easy on Russ, that’s what great offensive.
Terrible to see Whitworth go out.
The Let Russ Cook and Russ for MVP is getting to his head I think. Forcing more throws and making bad decisions.
the real sad part is, they were already in f.g. range, and Russ could have ran for 10+ yards and he decides to force a pass
OMG, we forced a punt!!! Record this for posterity.
Hope is the not the last one of the game. Go Hawks, I hate Rams.
Ramsey not following DK in the slot. That’s the shot you got to take
God Russ looks so bad right now.
The weight of having to carry 11 others.
Just an excuse
The defense has finally figured out Goff.
Wilson needs to play marginally better in the second half and we win.
DK doesn’t record a single target in the half.
Mind boggling.
Unacceptable.
It is unacceptable.
You HAVE to have a plan to get him involved.
This is piss poor. A joke.
The rams aren’t impressive at all either. Wilson plays better second half and it’s a win.
Yeah, if he plays 95% better.
Agreed he had a crap half. Awful football from him. I’ll be surprised if he doesn’t play better.
coaching matters . . .they need to find some rhythm throws. we’ve seen russ have bad first halfs and great seconds, many times before. needs to find that rhythm. game is right there in reach.
Apparently Russ isn’t even looking at him. It appears their game plan is to not ever throw it to him–not even in single coverage with Ramsey on the opposite side. Dumb. Ass. Game plan.
Why did we extend Carrol? He’s hit Tom Landry level outdated….
Russell is so worried throwing a pick to Jalen Ramsey 1v1 vs his best receiver but apparently will throw across his body to, was it Swain? For a lousy pick when a first down and maybe rushing TD was on a plate.
Yeah, I think it was a TE. Horrid decision and worse throw. Really, Russ looks totally out of sync. And ignoring DK is just dumb. Damn, throw the man a slant or Bevell Special Bubble Screen…
Problem is now we are worried anytime Russ throws. Better throw a pick targeting DK than a 3rd TE or 4th RB/WR
The pick was to Dissly
Russ isnt even looking at him.
I cant understand not targeting your best playmaker…at all!
It’s just pure idocy.
No excuse, none. If Russ isn’t looking at him, coaches need to get a couple plays called for him.
There are ways to get him the ball…even if he is covered.
At the least, the *threat* of him getting the , needs to be there.
He’s a scary, difference maker.
If I was the other team, I’d be sighing with relief every time we dont throw to him.
even when they motion him to the other side of the field, Wilson doesn’t even look at him. Sad.
Jesus christ! That is some kinda kick
We cut this guy for sea bass right?
Lets take a moment to say, myers has been great this yr
no jinx
Jason Myers is a pimp
He wasn’t giving up his FG streak for that… 😏
Wow. Down only 4 with Wilson playing like Bad Day Dave Kreig, and Carrol Schotty and Norton all suffering from Der-Itis….is this Halloween?!
The problem is I have no faith in the offense.
This will still be a day when they need 35 to win.
I have no faith left in any coach or player on this team barring the kicker and punter. Am I wrong?
?
Its really not that bad yo
It’s cascading. In a few weeks, you’ll be here too.
Maybe if we miss the playoffs I’ll have some serious questions.
The Seahawks are who we thought they were. I’m just not sure why people seem to feel so betrayed or surprised by what we see on the field.
Russ has looked awful so far. If he plays better in the second half we win. Rams aren’t a great team.
Defense has figured out Goff finally.
If we lose this game, I’ll be pissed and on the doom and gloom bandwagon. But we shouldn’t lose this game and we won’t.
Russ’ favorite target is being completely covered out of the game. It can be very stifling when a lockdown corner takes away a good chunk of the field.
My guess is we talk it over at the half and find a way to get him involved.
I just cant ever see me on the doom and gloom, yo. Shit aint no fun
Seahawks ARE who we thought they were but that’s not a comforting or positive realization.
They had DK across the field from Ramsay, one on one vs backup, and Russ never even looked at him and threw an ugly incompletion. Crap game plan and execution today…
DK, Lockett, Dickson and Myers. Rest all can take pay cut so at least have some cap space to bring fresh blood.
61 yard field goal…that means we win right?
I can’t stop thinking about that Wilson INT, that has to be one of the worst plays of his life. Easy 1st down running, risks a throw to the end zone…just uncharacteristic and not good enough from Rus.
Wilson seems pretty complacent turning the ball over.
Russ is so off maybe they should start running on first and second down, then throw a four yard pass to the TE on third and 6 and punt….
Might as well since DK can’t get a ball and he’s open…
Cant run like that when you got replacement level tailbacks.
Resign Carson
we miss him so much.
such a talent drop when down to the guys we have today.
Need more penetration from the DL. Jamal Adams needs to continue to step up and bring some consistency that he’s not shown yet.
Need to protect the football and need to not go into another game with three replacement level tailbacks.
Call Marshawn.
Where the fuck is Josh Gordon’s reinstatement???
NFL cares more about weed than women gettin beat on. Disgusting.
Special Teams has been phenomenal this year. Larry Izzo has our kicking room absolutely on point as well.
No jinx
They’ve literally had one bad play all year, a long KO return by Buffalo last week.
Is Kyler Murray hurt?
Gonna lose to Brett Huntley two years in a row?
lol if that happens I know where to place my fake outrage
Mighta just been out for a series
too funny but sadly possible
They have to take the kickoff down for a TD right out of the gate.
Get ahead of this Rams offense and let the rushers work on that backup LT.
Keep the pressure on Goff.
Bullcrsp spot!
Agreed
Go for it!
Why not since they can’t stop anybody anyway?
Shoulda
Wilson now is shook. Not trusting his arm and running last two downs…Rob is right. He can’t carry the entire offense and defense by himself. He just can’t. He is one of the best QBs in the league but you can’t compensate for this defense.
he’s our star and is paid as such. he doesnt get off the hook for everything because our defense is crap.
well his horrible INT was not on the defense…why press like that on 2nd and 10 when you can easy have a 1st down.
Blindfold him when D is on field and do not let him see score
This is exactly right, serious pressure on Russ to score every time they have the ball. He’s pressing and taking more chances than normal trying to make up for the defense’s deficiencies. And he has no running game with Carson out!
The coddling of the american quarterback continues
That is what we came up with out of the half?
Rams have only given up 2 TDs in the 2nd half this season. Allowing only a 60 passer rating in the 2nd half this year.
Typical 3 and out to start the 2nd half. Makes it frustrating why they defer EVERY SINGLE TIME.
thet was just sad
Well, that was honestly pathetic and flat out embarrassing to watch
It was 2nd and 5 with an easy 8 yards of running room. Instead throw across field to a int.
Jamal Adams is S O F T
1st and 18. No problem
Absolutel coward call by Pete. We live or die by our offense, if you can’t trust your offense to get a few inches just fucking forfeit already. Pathetic
Completely
Its pete not embracing what his team is. He still prefers a style and wont change or adapt to his team. Which is the difference between the bill belicheks and the rest.
This team is embarrassing.
There is no one on our team that other teams fear.
Well…except the WR that we haven’t targeted yet this game.
Had us right where they wanted us, 3rd and long.
3rd and 13, here comes the screen pass for sure…
DJ Reed isn’t very good either.
Maybe is the scheme and coaching?
Two defenders standing like statues in their zone, with no Rams anywhere near them. This team needs a competent DC, and Norton and Carrol both are not even competent at this point.
4th and inches with this defense. Go for it. If you can’t get 3inches you don’t deserve to win.
100% agree
+1
on top of everything else – the D looks slow. need new blood.
Whitworth is hurt, yet it’s as if nothing has changed, pass rush-wise.
I just thought the exact same thing. Get Dunlap on the backup and see if he can make something happen.
Yeah.
When Brown is out for us…everything stalls.
Yet its business as usual for the rams without their pro bowl LT.
https://twitter.com/dannyoneil/status/1328113820678688769
“Pete you’re so cool and inspiring so I won’t ask about this tomorrow don’t worry”
“I’m so in awe of you Pete.”
I love homer journalism haha
“Looked like there was some real improvement in the defense Pete.”
“What did you see from Freddie Swain?”
It’s the same issues with this team week after week.
COACHING!
+1
Starting the second half with a three and out may have been the death sentence
Without a turnover, likely.
youre not wrong- that was an important moment.
Every. Single. Time.
Adams blitzes, screen pass to the opposite side.
its so telegraphed
Its almost like were predictable.
If we as fans can see this just imagine how obvious this is to the coaches and players. I have no clue how Ken Norton has a job. Being Petes friend shouldnt be the top criteria for defensive coordinator.
So predictable. This D is so bad scheme-wise, even the 2013 personnel would suck in it. And our personnel is far worse than that years…equals All Time worst D. Carrol is incompetent and ultimately responsible for this mess.
+1
Nice Telegraphed blitzes. So much creativity.
Clueless coaching ….major changes needed. Pete needs challenging for this def at the press conference . But none have any balls to do so.
Laàate flag…
Mone was much better than snacks
never really understood any hype about Snacks. He makes a pass defense worse, and teams do not bother to run up the gut against SEA. Not much value to be had in this case.
pathetic. It’s been already years already when we had any confidence in stopping opposing teams on 3rd down.
This season is over. It only remains to be seen how many picks Wilson will throw, and whether or not a qb breaks the single game passing yards in a game vs us…
I definitely want to see the other angle of that PI call…
Clamped on his arm. Pretty legit call imo, sadly
Was the ball even catchable? Oh well…
Very weak call there, he really had no chance to catch that ball.
thats a very light call in a crucial spot
That flag was dumb. But this defense deserves no help or excuses. Screw this teams decision making across the board this year
Whoooeee! Let’s extend Carrol for 10 years!
why can’t we get ever get sacks like that?
Meltdown ensuing…..
Please just blow up petes press conference. I want answers for this crap.
Lets be real, the soft PNW media won’t ask any tough questions. Probably ask them what they think of covid wave going on right now, positives Pete sees with the defense and probably something about social justice
At some point the product will force a change in thinking amongst fans and media. When you start dropping in standings and losses mount, the ignoring will end. Just how deep of a hole in the season before it begins is the question. Cuz its not changing. Since game 1 this team has shown the D is beyond bad.
I really hope so 🤞. The defense is literally on pace to break an NFL record!! Its just pathetic if they dont ask any real questions.
End of this game
It’s a ballgame.
russell’s instincts all off today.
these last exchanges is where we just lost our chance today.
Russ’s kitchen going up in flames
Pete is just in denial about the state if his own team.
He’s making decisions as if he stubbornly thinks things arent as bad as they are.
well – this is not much fun
Its like torture. This offense is so good when clicking. Yet the last 5 games have forced me to watch this defense 75% of the games.
Carrol not going for it on 4th down looks like it was the turning point of the whole game as of now.
embarrassing
Here. Have another free 1st down. Just take it. Please.
Got us right where they want us, 3rd and long.
So here’s my only hope:
maybe… just maybe, they’ll fire Ken Norton … if not in this, maybe in a parallel universe..
this is just saddening
The sooner we fire Norton, and the defense is still awful, and we can stop the narrative that Norton is the problem…the better.
Did you watch his D with the Raiders?! It looked similar. And he had Mack. He’s a big part of this mess, but not the only responsible party.
To be fair PC has stood in front of Norton a few times and said it was on him. It’s just that no one will challenge PC’s assertion that he believes the defense will get better.
I’m no Norton defender, but these problems run deeper than Norton.
I’m serious when I say it’ll be good when he’s gone so the team can start looking itself in the mirror.
They know. Now it’s getting the press to ask the question.
Oh wow… didn’t expect my comment to take off like this.
I don’t know.. I just feel like that we kinda have the personal to have at least a mediocre defense and not one that’s on a historically bad pace.
Obviously this can’t be all Norton’s fault, but maybe they could send out a signal, if he’s the first domino to fall… I’m just so clueless when it comes to this defense
Norton isn’t the only coach who deserves firing. Secondary coach and passing game coordinator on defense also suck. LB coach, and possibly Clint Hurt as well.
Throw in some players on that list as well.
Time for another 3 and out complete with a sack or two?
come on hawks …. i am still willing to believe….give me something here…..
Maybe a good time to start getting the ball to DK METCALF. The Packers never throw to Davante Adams, either.
I can’t believe we’re only down by 10. Feels like this game is looong gone.
Not 1 target for DK in 3 quarters. It’s like they’re punishing him because you have to intentionally go out of your way to not throw him the ball once.
Mayne he slept with someone he shouldnt have
Run, pass, pass
Russ can’t hit a barn door today…
How many different ways can one team find to suck? We’re about to find out…
Hey there’s the low snap, take your eyes off it special
I jinxed em! Aaaagh!
thats an absolute killer
If it wasn’t over already, it is now.
This game would be less painful if the Rams could just pull away, but we keep getting opportunities to get back into it and blowing it.
Bench him. Seriously.
WARM UP THE BUS
Just lay on the ball Wilson. Don’t try to pick it up and run. This offense is struggling today. Most all of it self inflicted.
Since they constructed the roster that bad in the offseason, that I almost wanted for them to get the 5-11 kind of punishment. Until they traded for Adams.
Just like Bono sings it, stuck in a moment, and you can’t get out of it.
Ugh Amani & DJ Reed showing well
I was right.
We win the game if Russ plays better.
Still looking like that would have been true. Russ looks awful still. That’s the difference
But Russell is playing like crap because it’s him vs the world.
Oh poor Russ. He asked to cook. He got his wish. He’s making 35 mil and is considered one of the best qbs in the game. Yes he’s hung out to dry by the D but he has been poor for a few games. It should be expected that he plays better than he has been.
Always defended Russ but hes really messing up. The loss will be 100% on him. Looks like the mvp and let Russell cook talk got to his head.
He wouldn’t look so bad if he threw to Metcalf once in awhile. If I were Metcalf I would throw a fit after this game.
Where are all those plonkers who sent me abuse during the off-season?
Come on let’s hear from you now.
Screw it. We’re still going to win
But Rob won’t be any less right even if they magically pull this out. This was a ruinous off-season, and a feable coaching staff on D Carrol constructed.
We can’t say our defensive hasn’t given our offense opportunities. We just need to actually do something with them
All 3 phases go hand in hand. They effect each other in games. What weve seen this year is 1 phase being so inept that its truely effected other phases. This is petes own wording on constructing teams. Which he simply ignored this year.
Snap from the third string C a big part too…
12 minutes left. Only down 10. Screw it. Go and win the game. No excuses
I would love to see it happen and be proven wrong about us losing this game.
Come on, stripes. Cut us a break already…
That play was why you don’t run on first down in the fourth quarter down 10.
Jalen Ramsey gets away with illegal contact on every play.
100%
DK getting frustrated, as he should.
Imagine that. Iupati hurt again…
offense needs to do its part
one dimensional thougj w a guy off the street as your lead back
Danny O’Neil currently arguing with Seahawks fans again.
Whos worse? The defense or media reporting like Danny who wont dare say anything that makes Daddy Pete upset.
This is inept
Our QB has been worse than our Defense today.
No excuses for Russ. You lost the game for your team. You failed. Own it.
wtf is up w russell
but hes too scared to give DK a chance… what the hell man
Russ playing like a bone head for weeks now. His head is completely pit of the game. Carson being put really stumps our team.
Russ Did this last season when everyone was talking MVP.
Russ doesnt deserve a mvp vote like this…
Clear regression to the mean. Early season “let Russ Cook” looks like an outlier.
Terrible decision. Even worse throw. Wilson is simply awful today. Put the backup in and hand off every play…this is just pitiful.
I swear when people start talking about Russ winning MVP, he does this crap. Apparently he doesn’t want to win MVP…
and if russell isnt great ….well, we’re just done this year
The Rams let go of Wade Phillips in the off-season to get better n defense. Meanwhile Pete and Ken are still reminiscing about their USC days. Buddy system.
i love him too – but our star qb has shit the bid in all 3 of these losses
The defence has shit the bed every game this season though.
Yet, ironically, this is our best defensive game of the season
They don’t have to do much as Rams played safe the entire game.
This team is imploding.
Yes it is. Another loss Thursday puts them at 6-4. They’ll lose to the Rams again, one of either Giants or Eagles and maybe Frisco since we make their backup QB look like Dan Fouts. WFT will pressure RW all day
Easily one of his worst games ever
Russ double clutched and stared Olsen down.
Super easy for any corner (other than our corners, of course), to jump that route.
8-8 here we come…..
Sweeping changes.
1-3 in last 4. 2 losses vs division opponents. This is a team falling off a ciff. I want to see big time changes. Top down. Own it pete. Own the ineptitude.
did schotty pass out after the first 2 drives? he ran out of designed plays really early this week
Other than get DK involved idk what more he can do when RW plays this bad. Plays have been there
Better offensive line blocking would help. The Rams have been in the Seahawks backfield all day, and a lot of it is coming from the edges.
Nice to see a really good play by Brooks
Who fields a punt at the 5? Geez
Rob logic:
If SEahawks had signed pass rushers, Russell throws for 3 touchdowns and 400 yards. He is just under too much mental stress. Poor guy, only makes 35 million a year.
Example A of the messages I’m getting tonight.
Face it this team isn’t very good the reality is that they suck. No accountability from the coaches to the GM and the media in the PSW is just pathetic. It’s time for the real fans who want to win another Super Bowl to really raise their voices about everything that is wrong with this real and Franchise. Time to grow a pair Rob has been spot on since day one.
Diggs just beat Patrick Peterson for a TD to put Buffalo ahead with :34 to play.
Throwing it to your star WR. Even when he’s being covered by their star CB.
Novel.
Kyler Murray just drove the Cardinals the length of the field in :30 and found Hopkins in the end zone to win it.
Why slide? WTH is going on?
Let’s see Danny O’Neill sugar coats this stinker. In a game where the defense plays a qualified ‘OK’ Wilson just stinks. That run by Wilson and not going out of bounds is an example…
Are we down 3 or 10 cause this clock maintenance is just amazing lol
Wow, what a throw there by Josh Allen.
Why have we already NOT kicked a FG???
PC (again): “We need to be better. We will be better.”
Well, the kicking game has been amazing.
Now just got to fix everything else.
Most lopsided 7 point game ever, you knew we had no chance in this game after the first three minutes, totally outclassed.
Rob I have a question, Is there any other GM in the game that barely talks to the media Like John does or not held accountable for anything?
This is Pete Carroll’s team, not John Schneider’s. It doesn’t matter
Cardinals won against Buffalo, a real shoot out in the last minute.
They came back after the bills td with 34 seconds left.
Amazing.
Pete Carroll is just garbage and running this franchise right into the ground just like he did with USC it’s absolutely pathetic
too much, let’s see if you will think the same way tomorrow.
He may or may not but I promise you I will.
Hahaha that’s great
I have been saying this for years nothing is changing
All old coaches stop innovating and double down on outdated schemes. Bill, Landry, Shula, Knox, even Holmgren. Better coaches than Carrol ended that way. It’s usually compounded by hiring old cronies over young up and comers as assistant coaches, stagnating scheme, poor adjustments in game, and excuses rather than accountability in press conferences. Sound familiar?
Chuck Noll, not Bill, stupid freaking autocorrect!
Lost a winnable, and critical game off of an awful Wilson performance. 9-7.
Well, I’m usually optimistic, but I’m just about ready to put this season to bed. The defense is garbage, and Wilson has lost most of his confidence/mojo (probably temporary, but it has been gone through multiple weeks now).
I still think they can still be competitive this year, and am fairly optimistic for improvements next season, but big changes need to happen in the defensive coaching and obviously on the D-Line.
Either way, Go Hawks!!!
All this praise for Schottenheimer was way too soon and now you see it. This team will only make the playoffs thanks to the NFC East now that’s the truth
Did you see the PR the Seahawks Twitter account put out not that is ultimately pathetic and proves my point about how bad this franchise has gotten since we lost the Super Bowl
What’s their point? Most nfl games have close final scores