Calais Campbell was traded to the Ravens for a fifth round pick
What could’ve been? If I’m going to ask questions and critique Seattle’s off-season, it’s only fair I lay out an alternative.
I’m going to start from the position of no additions. Let’s include the Justin Britt and D.J. Fluker money and run with the amount they’ve spent so far on re-signing and adding players — just over $58m.
Trade for Calais Campbell
The Seahawks have talked about adding a Campbell type for years yet when he was actually available, albeit at age 33, he ended up going to Baltimore for a pittance (a single fifth round pick).
It’s possible Jacksonville worked with Campbell to move him to the team of his choice. If that’s the case, it might’ve been a non-starter. It’s equally possible he had little interest joining a NFC West rival to the Cardinals after nine successful seasons in Arizona.
Yet with two fourth round picks, the Seahawks had the capital to outbid Baltimore. Campbell’s cap hit in 2020 is only $10m this year and $15m next year. Or to put it another way, he costs about the same as Benson Mayowa, Jacob Hollister and Cedric Ogbuehi combined.
Pairing Campbell with Jarran Reed would’ve created a formidable interior presence. He had 33 pressures last season on a bad Jacksonville team to go with 6.5 sacks, 10 hurries and 16 quarterback knockdowns.
The Seahawks have badly needed a player like this for years.
His addition would’ve solved a huge need before the new league year had even started. And if you think his age is a problem — just remember they’re paying Greg Olsen, who turned 35 this year, $7m.
Just get it done with Jadeveon Clowney
It’s easy to forget but in the build-up to free agency all the talk was about Seattle being unable to afford Clowney’s inevitable +$22m a year contract. Everyone in the media was saying it was increasingly unlikely he’d be back in Seattle because he was going to get paid by another team.
Had you said to a lot of fans you could get him for $20m a year — they would’ve accepted that without hesitation.
It’s pretty clear that Clowney overestimated his market and that’s played a big part in the stalemate that has followed. The fact nobody stepped up to sign him has also led people to start questioning why. Is he an injury worry? Is he going to mail it in? Is he even that good?
A quick reminder — this is a player who played through a sports hernia weeks before he reached the open market. His pass rush win percentage (25%) was fifth best in the league in 2019 and only 1% less than Myles Garrett’s. It was equal to Joey Bosa’s.
He had twice as many pressures as Benson Mayowa.
He also did all of this with virtually no help in 2019. Clowney was a one-man show on Seattle’s D-line. He faced double teams more often than any other defensive lineman in the league.
Pete Carroll emphasised on multiple occasions how vital it was the Seahawks re-sign Clowney:
If you think $30m sounds like a lot for Clowney and Campbell, remember they’re using $25m of their cap space on Wagner and Wright despite using a first round pick on a linebacker.
Find the compromise — even if that’s $20m or $21m. If you also bring back Jarran Reed for his $9.35m cap hit, you’ve got three defensive linemen to build around. Yes it’s expensive — but you can structure the year-one cap hit for Clowney to work into your budget. DeMarcus Lawrence’s cap hit last season was $11.1m after signing his big extension. The Cowboys have an ‘out’ as early as 2022.
Even those who are fearful of paying Clowney a big salary have to acknowledge being committed to only two expensive seasons is hardly a massive issue.
By adding Clowney, Campbell and Reed you’d be making a major commitment to fix your D-line. That was the key to the whole off-season.
Even if you took on a full $20m cap hit for Clowney in 2020 then added Campbell and Reed — you’d still have $20m of the near $60m to spend with a clear ability to add more.
Still don’t want Clowney? That’s fine. Dante Fowler’s 2020 cap hit is $6.6m in Atlanta. It’s $18.6m in 2021. He’s easily cuttable in 2022. Robert Quinn’s 2020 cap hit is $6.1m in Chicago and $14.7m in 2021. He’s easily cuttable in 2022.
The Seahawks had multiple cost-effective options and the available cap space to do a lot more than they did to improve their pass rush.
Fill out the roster
The Seahawks have been in this position before — having about $20-30m to spend and needing to fill out their roster. The fact is they could easily fit in Phillip Dorsett, Chance Warmack and Geno Smith. That’s less than $3m for the trio.
You could trade for Quinton Dunbar at a cost of $3.4m. You’d still have about $24m to play with if you limit Clowney’s year-one hit to $11.1m.
Let’s say they sign B.J. Finney and Brandon Shell. They cost $7m combined. You have $17m left and you’ve now brought in the offensive linemen John Schneider prioritised at the start of free agency.
With the remaining money you could sign Greg Olsen or Bruce Irvin. You could sign Benson Mayowa and Jacob Hollister.
You choose how they spend $17m…
Greg Olsen $6.9m
Bruce Irvin $5.9m
Carlos Hyde $4m
Jacob Hollister $3.259m
Benson Mayowa $3.018m
Mike Iupati $2.5m
Cedric Obuehi $2.237m
Joey Hunt $2.1m
Branden Jackson $2.1m
David Moore $2.1m
Neiko Thorpe $887,500
Luke Willson $887,500
You could even see if Everson Griffen is willing to bookend Clowney. Either way, by spending big on Clowney and Campbell you clearly haven’t limited your ability to add depth or fill talent at other positions.
Greater flexibility in the draft
In this scenario the Seahawks have bolstered their defense with Campbell, Clowney, Reed and Dunbar. That takes some of the pressure off needing to go defense early and often.
If they still wanted to spend their first two picks on Jordyn Brooks and Darrell Taylor, it wouldn’t be an issue at all. Keep building that defense. How optimistic would you feel about the defense taking a step forward in 2020 if the front seven was as follows:
DL — Clowney, Reed, Campbell, Taylor
LB — Wagner, Brooks, Wright/Barton/Irvin
Plus if you’re determined to draft Brooks or another linebacker in round one — cut K.J. Wright early in the process and add another $7.5m to the available cap. That’s even more money that could go towards Olsen, Irvin or Hyde or the various depth players Seattle claimed.
They wouldn’t be obliged to draft for defense, however. If they wanted to add to the skill positions in a strong range for receivers and running backs or invest in someone like Isaiah Wilson at offensive tackle, that would’ve been a stronger alternative after spending money on the defense.
By addressing the defense on the open market, you’re keeping so many more options open. That in itself can create more cap room. If you draft an offensive tackle with your first pick, you don’t need Brandon Shell and Cedric Ogbuehi. If you take a running back early, you don’t need Carlos Hyde.
What is strange is they used their first round pick on a position where they were already investing $25m on two players — but didn’t create any room as a consequence.
Reality vs alternative
You decide which is better. The numbers listed are 2020 cap hits.
What actually happened…
Jarran Reed $9.35m
Greg Olsen $6.9m
Bruce Irvin $5.9m
Carlos Hyde $4m
B.J. Finney $3.5m
Brandon Shell $3.475m
Quinton Dunbar $3.421m
Jacob Hollister $3.259m
Benson Mayowa $3.018m
Mike Iupati $2.5m
Cedric Obuehi $2.237m
Joey Hunt $2.1m
Branden Jackson $2.1m
David Moore $2.1m
Geno Smith $887,500
Neiko Thorpe $887,500
Luke Willson $887,500
Phillip Dorsett $887,500
Chance Warmack $887,500
Total spent: $58.25m
What I’ve proposed in this article…
Jadeveon Clowney $11.1m
Calais Campbell $10m
Jarran Reed $9.35m
Greg Olsen $6.9m
B.J. Finney $3.5m
Brandon Shell $3.475m
Quinton Dunbar $3.421m
Benson Mayowa $3.018m
Cedric Obuehi $2.237m
Joey Hunt $2.1m
Geno Smith $887,500
Phillip Dorsett $887,500
Chance Warmack $887,500
Total spent: $57.7m
In my proposal, you haven’t signed the following players:
Bruce Irvin $5.9m
Carlos Hyde $4m
Jacob Hollister $3.259m
Mike Iupati $2.5m
Branden Jackson $2.1m
David Moore $2.1m
Neiko Thorpe $887,500
Luke Willson $887,500
You’d have the draft to fill some of your remaining needs too.
Some of the unsigned players could still be brought in by creating $7.5m in cap space by cutting K.J. Wright. They also have some cap space still available in 2020 but not much. So it’s not improbable they could keep several of the names above.
They could’ve also negotiated harder with some of these players to drive down their cost. Bruce Irvin’s salary, as mentioned a few times now, is 32% higher than it was in Carolina last year and it’s not obvious why.
Even if you swap Clowney for Fowler or Quinn — or even if you combine two of those players or throw Everson Griffen into the mix — Seattle could’ve easily done more to fix its pass rush, setting up the rest of free agency and the draft. Instead, they’ve spent nearly $60m and it’s not clear how much they’ve improved — if at all. They still have serious holes to fill at defensive tackle and they can’t rely on rookies, Mayowa, Irvin, Green and Collier to provide a consistent pass rush.
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Rob, your alternate reality is much preferred to the current situation. One thing I’m unsure of is how much of the current $58M is guaranteed? If they do move around $s to sign Clowney or Griffen then the offseason looks a lot better.
Free Agency has been an unmitigated disaster, bordering on embarrassing. This is not the (mostly) deft hand I expect from this front office. I understand the importance of dipping into the bargain bin to fill out a roster but c’mon, just how many career resurgences are we to expect?
I know he’d never day it, but I imagine Russ is not very pleased given his post-season pleas for talent.
What I wish they’d also done on defense is matched the offers Quinton Jefferson and Al Woods got in free agency. They weren’t all that expensive and along with Rasheem Green formed the core of a good future defensive line that could ably back up the starters.
Jefferson, Woods and Green are NOT providing a core.
The signing that Russ should like is Shell. He costs less than Ifedi. Pundits keep saying they are clones but they ignore one key statistic:
Last year Ifedi had 13 penalties in 18 games. Shell did the same job but only got 2 penalties in 16 games.
It will help his offense when big plays don’t get whistled back because of holding
It’ll also probably be reassuring to Russell that Shell is well rested after his benching by the Jets. He’ll be nice and fresh…
There’s the glass-half-full Rob we know and love!
Wow Rob…I don’t always agree with you, but you nailed it here!
I truly believe Calais was never an option; the jags did him a solid. So, let’s leave the one DT position open. I support bringing back Reed
Trade for Dunbar; excellent value and answer to Nickel back IMHO ( hopefully is not was).
Should’ve figured out something Clowney early; just pay the man, and allow us to compete next year. Leave all the other DE acquisions until after draft.
On online, sign depth, not starters early in FA. Low/no guaranteed money. Exception is Finney, which is replacement for Britt.
Now, get Davis in the draft on the Dline in the second and a RT in Rnd 1. If you truly loved Brookes, find a way to get back into the early 2nd to get him and a RT. I don’t care if it cost a 2021 1st rounder; get it done. Coincide that with cutting Wright. Draft Lewis in the position as they did. Unfortunately, Taylor falls off the table here.
Now, after draft, go get Mayowa, Irvin, etc. Hell, maybe screw around with restructures and get Griffen here. Spend the rest of the pennies on fillers and depth.
So… We could of had all of our major holes addressed for roughly same $$, and only costing an extra 2021 1st, but with young guys at positions.
Oh well…back to the Clowney watch😳
If the priority was to retain Clowney and Reed and first priority outside signings were Finney, Shell, and Ogbuehi, then that says that they weren’t really interested in the other edge rushers. The only reason Irvin and Mayowa were signed was for familiarity. I agree that Campbell was an option, but didn’t want to return to the NFL west. Also I heard a rumor, that Russ might have more control of the offense and wants better o line and a upgrade for pass catching te. JS technically done that and Russ will want Gordon and AB if possible.
If Clowney was the priority (and they said he was) they should’ve had a better plan B than Mayowa and Irvin.
You’re right, but I think they didn’t like the other options in free agency.
Then your plan B was Clowney also. Just sign the man
Well the ball is in Clowney’s court, with facilities starting to open up soon, he should be get his visits in and hopefully make a decision soon.
Yep! Hopefully that has been the plan, and the visits will soon create the offer for us to match
Yeah, I can’t argue that this offseason has made me really question Schneider for the first time. Can’t believe I’m saying that, but it’s hard to justify the mountain of decisions that dont seem either strategic or well informed.
His one “good” move in getting Dunbar for a 5th, unravels and shows that he didn’t know why the low trade cost was low..goodbye 5th round pick. AKA we got hoodwinked.
He clearly wasn’t in on the Calais trade. THE guy they have raved about and tried to find a carbon copy of for years.
We overstocked on guards, just to have a good one drop to us in the 3rd round, and then have to cut our quality starter who immediately gets signed elsewhere. Value picks at guard were pretty predictable. Everyone was investing early and often on Tackles (the more valued linemen), so guards would predictably fall later. Not surprisingly, this happened, yet “we didn’t expect a player like him would be there in the 3rd”. They really should have expected that.
Jadeveon clowney. Nuff said. Shoulda accepted that players of his pedigree want the respect. Playing the cheap bargain hunting game in hopes he is desperate wasn’t gonna be a winning formula. Luckily, no one invested, so he still here to tease us into thinking the “plan” could still work. At this point, even if he signs, he isn’t gonna feel like we really valued him, prioritized him, and really when push comes to shove wanted him on our team. Its gonna be all business, no loyalty.
We tender multiple average TEs (Willson / Hollister) just to get Olsen and then 2 rookies and now are overloaded. Which one of these signings will get cut? How much money will that burn?
Draft 0 WRs in a historic WR draft class.
Draft 0 OTs in a historic OT draft class.
Another year, another out-of-left-field first round pick. Maybe he’s “a genius”, but more likely it was just a reach. We will see if this is Rashad Penny or LJ Collier 3.0. I get that Penny may not be a true bust, but he is still #2 to a former 7th round pick. Many better RBs have been drafted later. Id take jonathan taylor or edwards helaire over him any day.
Pass Rush was addressed by signing 2 rotational piece level DEs, and watching almost every starter from last year walk. Unless you are hoping the rookies have immediate game changing impact on a shortened offseason. Have yet to see that happen. Even Clark, arguably our best drafted lineman, still only had flashes in his first year.
The plan was supposed to be sign multiple every down level DEs and a vet DT. Draft a DT, OT, and a WR. Make the D line at least sound like it has a chance to possibly be effective and intimidating. Refill on OT for the future. Then add vet OL help as you can. THEN go bargain shopping for redemption projects and depth signings.
That’s an easier argument to accept when they haven’t frittered away $60m on average players.
Again, I agree, but they did. I’ll be more focus on player development this year because it won’t be a super bowl, maybe nfc championship if injuries and luck happen.
And that’s part of the frustration. The Seahawks have chosen the conservative route again. They favored veterans over young players last season, and all the spending they did on vets points to them doing it again.
I’m not there yet. Clowney is still available, and a few vet DTs are lurking around.
Is it the perfect Offseason, no way! I do think it is salvageable, we need to act now.
Cut Wright (😢), sign a 2-3mill DT, sign Clowney, figure out Dunbar ( I don’t know what to do at nickel, unless Ryan can be had for <5m; not likely), not sign/cut Moore/Jackson/Hollister/hunt, fill depth with league minimums or rookies.
TBH, if we did the above, biggest thing that scares me is RT. If Shell flames out, Jones and Wheeler are not adequate.
Besides Shell flaming out they’re also screwed if Brown at LT gets injured. Who’s the swing tackle?
It’s Ogbuehi.
Logan Ryan is garbage… not to mention he’s asking for over $10 million a year. He was in the top 5 in allowed catches and yards. “But he intercepted Brady” big deal!
Great article, Rob! This is exactly what I wanted the Hawks to do this offseason. I think the big question is why didn’t they? Was it really their paralysis over Clowney? If so, that’s terrible decision making. One question I’ve been thinking about is how much of this decision making is done by Pete rather than John? Does Pete determine their choices/decision making and John works with that? That would explain a lot of the “waiting for/sticking with our guys” mentality. We hear a lot about them working as a team but the decisions made this off season just don’t make sense.
Well done Rob. My name is cha and I endorse this alternate reality plan.
It really is fascinating how this plan gives the Seahawks so much more flexibility in the draft.
At #27 you have all kinds of options
-Isaiah Wilson and let him compete to start at RT
-CEH or Taylor and give RW an insanely talented weapon (and then punt on the veteran RB thing)
-stay with Brooks and fill out the Defense
At #59
-trade up for Taylor, or consider Alton Robinson in the 5th your young DE prospect
-Denzel Mims
-Julian Okwara
-Damien Lewis
At #64
-Josh Jones
-Jabari Zuniga
-Zack Moss
At #101 (if not traded up)
-Anthony McFarland
-Saadhiq Charles
-Leki Fotu
Ok I’m going to fantasy draft off of the alternate plan
#27 Isaiah Wilson
#59 Willie Gay
#64 Josh Jones
#101 Anthony McFarland
Bookend tackles, the LB to replace KJ and a firecracker mighty mite at RB
#27 CEH
#59 Jabari Zuniga or Julian Okwara
#64 Denzel Mims
#101 Saadhiq Charles
An injection of electricity in the offense, a WR to pair with DK, a pass rush specialist and a project tackle
27 – Jonathan Taylor
59 – Josh Uche
64 – Logan Wilson
101 – Solomon Kindley
Good article about what could have been. But – are the Seahawks a desirable place for defensive guys to play?
I think many of our defensive guys would jump at an offer from Baltimore or Kansas City. Does Clowney want to play for a champion ship team – or will he consider Seahawks another year? That’s a year of grinding it out for a playoff slot. He may have had enough – unless he can get the high price he wants.
At least San Francisco isn’t poaching our defensive guys anymore.
Seattle is no more or less desirable than any of the other teams with good reputations.
Yes; Seattle’s culture is the icing not the cake. Money talks
We don’t have any good ones to poach anymore. Wagner is the only good defender we have. Diggs and Reed are good players, but they’re not Pro Bowl types.
Your article was sorta/kinda how I was thinking about the off season. Nail FA positional priorities first, even if you have to pay up *somewhat* for the talent. I remember the great GM Jerry West once saying, to paraphrase, don’t worry about “losing” on a trade (signing) IF you get the player that you really want/need. First things first. Everything else then becomes easier to cope with.
Wouldn’t it have been nice to have entered the draft with the draft capital we had and been able to go after potential star-like talent regardless of whether or not such a player’s position was a screaming need or not?
Anyway…nice thought experiment.
So if I understand the difference as laid out at the end correctly. The functional eal diffeence in these two offseasons is Clwoney and Campbell? So if they still get Clowney the diffeence is Campbell vs all those playes and Campbell may well have had no inteest in all in coming here and a possible specific interest in being in Baltimore? Sounds like they get Clowney and this is very much a “best case” offseason, if we admit that campbell was in fact master of his own fate, which at this stage of his career, he effectively is.
You could have gone after Griffen if not Campbell then or someone else. Point being, when you nail your first order of priorities first, things can become a lot clearer then.
We don’t have to admit anything. You can propose that scenario as I did. You can even assume it if you want to. But admit it? No.
And it’s not just the difference of adding those two players. It’s the way it sets up the rest of your off-season. You can do the draft differently if you wish. You know where you’re at with the rest of your roster build and can try to negotiate with different players (eg Everson Griffen). It changes everything.
Those feet!
https://twitter.com/JimNagy_SB/status/1264238356889833476
There’s no doubt that the roster as it stands is deeper than last year. The issue is that the top talent just isn’t there in enough abundance. This was THE offseason to really propel this team from a 9 to 11 win “good, not great” team to a 12+ win “great team.” They’ve padded the depth and have lost out on the stars. I see a repeat of last year’s good not great result. A team capable of going to the playoffs but not capable of winning a Super Bowl.
PC and JS are coasting to the end of their tenure in Seattle.
It’s a head-scratcher to me that PC and JS would be coasting if they do see an end to their tenure. In my mind it would be the time to really ‘go for it’. Just getting Clowney and say, Dante Fowler, on board would be a sign they were going for it and then getting a stud receiver and/or RB in the draft would really kick it in. With the improvements that the Cardinals and 9ers have managed this off-season and through the draft and the Rams still strong, this team even with RW might not make it to the playoffs.
I think some of the plan is wishful thinking – – of course we’d trade a 5th round pick for Campbell; the same way we’d trade a 5th and a ’21 3rd for Trent Williams, or a 2nd round pick for Deandre Hopkins. I don’t think all of these trades are presented to every team in every instance. And if the argument is that we’re not out there sniffing around enough – maybe – but it doesnt seem like Schneider is a passive GM in general.
But I’ll state one big agreement – esp w the hindsight of how things have played out – we should absolutely have paid Clowney what it took. To start, I completely agree w your POV on how well he played last year – he’s a blue chipper in his prime, and we don’t have many of those. And of course, second, having his signing/non-signing hanging over the entire off-season cast an uncertainty on things, that has negatively impacted everything.
Wish we had just signed him early, and then did the hole-filling moves strategically thereafter.
It’s hardly wishful thinking to see a trade for a fifth round pick and point out you have the picks to outbid that offer.
It’s a completely realistic proposition.
but then your premise has to be that all 30 other teams (assuming they all had 4th round picks) – had the option to trade a 4th for Campbell and passed.
I guess I don’t know w certainty – but I don’t think that’s how things like that trade play out.
I don’t know why you’re challenging this.
You’re absolutely right. All the other teams passed too. And Russell Wilson was passed over 74 times. Lamar Jackson lasted to the end of round one. Mahomes was taken after Trubisky.
Teams get it wrong all the time.
why? because I’m bored and stuck at home during Covid, interested in conversing, and don’t totally agree with you.
Draft picks not the same – because everyone literally has an equal chance to draft any college player.
I guess what I’m saying, to pick another example, is that not every team knew that Hopkins could be had for a 2nd round pick. That sometimes the trading team (and maybe the player has a say, maybe he doesn’t) – seeks out its trading partners and it’s not automatically a Hawks screw-up that they didn’t know they could get Campbell for a 5th rounder.
Maybe I’m crazy but I remember a report where the Jacksonville front office was quoted saying, out of respect for Calais, they allowed him to pick his team and then they negotiated compensation to facilitate the trade. Calais is the girl that picked your buddy, and then she picked the pizza boy, but you still think you have a chance with her.
There was no such report.
We’ve considered that as a possible scenario but that’s it.
Okay, but he did say that 4 or 5 teams were interested in trading for him and he got to greenlight the trade. “I was more confident in going to Baltimore even if I had to take less,” Campbell said. Maybe the Seahawks were one of the teams, maybe they weren’t. Maybe we could have tried to up our offer to force the team’s hand, but it sounds like it wouldn’t have mattered. Calais is one of the most respected men in the NFL and I think a team with a pretty bad player reputation did him a solid.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/03/26/calais-campbell-said-he-took-less-money-to-go-to-ravens/
So basically I was right.
If that’s what you need to believe then by all means go ahead.
I don’t need to believe anything.
I was right.
You were right that the team did not publicly say they gave Campbell the choice, but Campbell did say the team gave him the choice…
Nope that’s not true.
https://twitter.com/jeffzrebiec/status/1243258983974084615?s=20
Calais said he renegotiated his contract to facilitate the trade to the ravens instead of getting traded elsewhere. Therefore the team gave him at least some choice about where he was traded.
But none of this matters. The fact is any team had the opportunity to try and sell themselves to Calais. For all we know the Seahawks didn’t even TRY to get him.
The whole point is he didn’t ‘hand pick’ his team and then the Jaguars made it happen.
Anything else is completely moot.
Being bored doesn’t mean you have to argue the toss for the sake of it.
Yes, every team knew Hopkins was available. Do you think the Texans kept it quiet for a dare or something? They’ll have been putting out the feelers for weeks, at the latest from the combine onwards. And they picked the deal that they wanted.
It’s perfectly plausible to say the Seahawks could’ve outbid Baltimore and got that trade done. Let’s leave it at that.
Rob i have a quick question for the tight end position.Its been unusual off season you can make valid point that the biggest acquisition was Greg Olsen. Then you draft two more tight ends then you sign a bunch of more guys who weren’t drafted.I have no idea on how many tight ends are currently on the roster.yet it seems like a lot. Do the Seahawks plan on carrying ? I like Will Dissley but unfortunately Will has played a grand total of 10 games in the last 2 years .Its a huge year for Will. Rob i would be interested in your thoughts on the tight ends this off-season for the Seahawks
I think they’ll carry four, unless they move Hollister.
Robert,
I agree with Rob that we will probably carry 4. That being said (and to answer your question of how many we currently have) we have:
W. Dissly
G. Olsen
C. Parkinson
S. Sullivan
L. Willson
J. Hollister
T. Mabry
D. W-Anderson
Dissly, Olsen and Parkinson are LOCKS in my book and I think the 4th comes down to Sullivan and Hollister. I think that the rookies (Parkinson and Sullivan) do completely different things, but combined would bump Hollister off the roster and save the team $3M.
I will say that I think Tyler Mabry could make the roster as a FB. He did a lot of lead blocking in college and played a bunch of special teams (Nick Bellore excels at ST).
You could sneak an extra guy on the roster by making him a FB/TE type… and there are now 55 total slots, so 4 is not unreasonable to expect on the roster. WR or TE could have an extra body.
Dissly could be PUP
Olsen starting the season as #1
Hollister proved his worth, so he could sneak on the roster
Parkinson might get the dreaded 4th round pass catcher Seahawks curse 😉
Sullivan is a TE/WR type I thought
You mentioned Mabry, something to monitor… a guy who is nails at lead blocking.
Not arguing one side or the other but its possible to add to your team to make it better by adding small amounts to get a big amount. Yes its sexier to add big names to get better buy adding big chunks but its also another way to bet better by adding small chunks. You did mention that Campbell might not want to come here so yes it would have been great to have him but if it was not an option then its not an option. Once again not disagreeing with you but just looking at another side.
1. Depth is never a replacement for a lack of talent.
2. I did look at the other side. I was the one who mentioned it. Doesn’t mean it’s true.
When you’re starting with something to build around, maybe. But when your DL is bottom 5 and you lose the one player teams feared, you’re not going to move the needle with volume.
The Hawk defense is based on pressuring with the front 4. So that means someone is regularly getting doubled.
There’s no one on the roster offenses have to plan to double. So teams can scheme as they like and put their doubles in the spots they want to go. They can double Reed on one play, Green on the next, and Bruce on the next and blow them off the ball. How often are those guys realistically going to beat a double team? And can the other guys can regularly win one on one? Very tough to honestly say yes.
You could say that about most teams in the league on defense. I know what your saying though as it’s nice to have a player on the DLine that teams have to game plan for.
The bad ones, yes, you can say that about them. They’re watching the SB from their couch.
Which means 30 teams in the NFL are “bad” every year?
Of course not.
Hey Rob, I had a random idea while reading and wondered what your take would be.
If the entire league had to be redrafted, where every player on every team was available to be picked how do you think that would go?
I imagine that QB would be the first priority, but then it gets interesting, does the GM go for the elite Dline player or rather the elite Olineman? What position/player would go first second third, at what point do you switch positions from player to player. Maybe the NFL top 100 would be something of a big board for this but positional importance would play a role while roster building.
The top QB’s would go first but then it’d be a real mix of OL/DL/CB and skill positions.
Just like in Madden Ultimate drafts, the likes of Aaron Donald, Khalil Mack and Von Millers are typically in the Top-15
Excellent article, as always, Rob. Just came across this…
https://www.si.com/nfl/seahawks/news/seahawks-expected-to-target-veteran-dt-damon-harrison
As you’ve mentioned, we need to replace Al Woods. If this is true, can only imagine the raise we’ll inevitably be giving him… because welcome to the Seahawks 2020 Offseason.
(Walks in to car dealership)
“Huh… the sticker price seems a little low to me. I’ll give you 32% higher! Oh it’s not going to be my primary car, it’s just in case my own car breaks down.”
Ugh.
I would be a HUGE fan of this signing. The dude wanted out of DET bad. That place is a dumpster fire… A few days ago, my thoughts were: Sign Hyde over Freeman, sign Harrison and maybe Dareus and re-sign Josh Gordon.
Let’s get it done!!!
I’ve liked Snacks’ play but he’s been on the fence about retiring. I’d wonder about the motivation of a DT you have to convince not to retire and play one more season.
He even said it himself Detroit sucked and he wanted out of there bad. Mentally worn down from living on the field.
At least Seattle gives him a shot at the playoffs.
Sure… but when soon-to-be 32-year-old 350lbs defensive linemen start talking about retirement… it’s not often a recipe for them flying back to their best form.
That is true too… 350lbs has gotta be bad for EVERY joint.
I’m looking at the UDFA DTs we brought in and while I’m not banking on a UDFA coming in and saving the day, Josh Avery (6’4″ / 322lbs) seems to physically match Al Woods better than Cedrick Lattimore: (6’3″ / 295lbs). We also still have Bryan Mone (6’3″ / 366lbs).
What would be a better signing right now: Snacks Harrison or Everson Griffen?
Griffen is a better player but they badly need a defensive tackle.
It’s frankly unacceptable that they haven’t added a DT by this stage.
Their backup DTs at this moment are Mone and Christmas who… *checks notes*… have a grand total of 4 games and 89 snaps of NFL experience between them.
Last year they signed Al Woods in May. Kevin Williams was signed in June. Tony McDaniel’s second stint happened in August. We know they will add to this position. If they rate the available DTs similarly it makes sense to be patient and get the price/value they want. I’m not disagreeing with you, it’s a hole in the roster.
Maybe they should start addressing key positions earlier.
That Tony McDaniel’s is one of my favorites.
He flew into Seattle…to go camping. His agent heard where he was and called the Seahawks. He cut his trip short and signed a deal.
Good thing he didn’t want to go white water rafting on the Colorado River. The Broncos would have scooped him up.
Some great points in article. But how about if Campbel wants to go to Ravens and not interested in Seattle? There are some subtle things which we don’t know. I hope hawks do things before season starts which cover up few mistakes. They can still cut list of players as part of competition. I like Hyde signing for sure, we needed backup at running back.
Here you go. Posted on the Raven’s official site, out of Calais’ own mouth.
https://www.baltimoreravens.com/video/calais-campbell-sees-ravens-as-perfect-fit
The reporter specifically asks him if he got to choose his team to get traded to. Campbell says no, the choice he had was to work out an extension or not.
Then he explains 4 or 5 teams were interested in him. Didn’t know the who others were. But the Jags and Ravens had come to an agreement to trade him. But the Ravens wouldn’t pay him the amount he wanted in an extension, it would have to be less. He prayed, talked to his advisors, and decided to agree to less and play in Baltimore.
So clearly, liking Baltimore and deciding to take less money than he wanted occurred only after the Ravens and Jags had agreed to a deal.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28943711/saying-ravens-legitimate-chance-win-championship-calais-campbell-content-deal
In this article he says he was surprised by the trade.
“I didn’t expect to get traded or anything, so I didn’t expect this to happen,” Campbell said.
Pretty clear from the interview that he accepted the best offer that Baltimore received. If Seattle wanted him they could have have him.
1. You now know that wasn’t the case.
2. Why do people keep saying to me, ‘he might’ve picked Baltimore’? I literally raised that point myself in the piece!!!!
Even if they couldn’t get Campbell due to him expediting his trade to the Ravens, they could have also tried to get Jurrell Casey for one of those 4ths as well. Casey would have been a great 5T / 3T on passing downs.
https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/05/22/quest-to-beat-tecmo-bowl-with-help-from-expert
This dude is a chump. Does anybody know how to play my namesake online? Please and thank you.
Reading the reddit reaction to this article was illuminating.
— Clearly some people don’t understand average salary vs year-one cap hit. It’s full of people saying Clowney’s $11.1m cap hit is unrealistic without realising that nearly all contracts have a lower year-one hit than APY. The structure I used was Demarcus Lawrence’s contract, which had a higher year-one cap hit than Frank Clark and even Khalil Mack.
— This is a ‘bitchy’ article apparently, plus I’m a cry baby.
— Ben Baldwin and I are apparently two of the worst ‘analysts’ and apparently have opposing philosophies. Although I’m not an ‘analyst’. I’m a bloke with a blog. And I don’t have a ‘philosophy’ either. I have opinions on what the Seahawks could’ve done better this off-season. I don’t have any ‘philosophy’. If you have a ‘philosophy’ as a writer or fan you’re being pretentious.
I’m just trying to find my ‘scheme fit’ as a commenter.
😂
Never mind the ‘Reddit-Rats Rob; it’s just a case of Gulliver amongst the Lilliputians!
The latest comment is that this place makes Field Gulls look good.
Which is really pushing the boundaries of absurdity…
Field Gulls is utter trash.
It’s now known as IndianHawkFan’s Diary.
“Former NFL quarterback Ryan Leaf arrested in California”
Sad. Sometimes the demons get a person in the end. This was an apparent DV.
He showed so much promise in CFB, but got derailed early in his NFL career.
I think he was on the local radio station a few months or maybe a year ago talking about what he overcame to get sober. He sounded like he was actually growing as a person and was glad for any opportunities that came his way.. ESPN analyst etc. Just depressing to think about this outcome.
Here is something regarding the Hyde signing article:
“‘Why?’ is the word to define Seattle’s off-season. There are so many questions. This is merely the latest…Hyde clearly didn’t have much of a market at all. Was there any competition for his signature? There’s been no talk, no reported interest.”
Texans reporter McClain:
“(Houston) tried to sign him to a new deal. They offered him at the combine two years for $10 million, the same deal Mark Ingram got from Baltimore, he turned it down and they moved on,”
And?????
The key point being he turned down the deal, they moved on… and TWO MONTHS later he still hadn’t signed with anyone.
Just because he turned down $10m from the Texans doesn’t automatically mean he has a market. That just means he overestimated his own market and it backfired.
Rob, you do outstanding work and your site is top notch…..but I 100% disagree on this. Hyde is worth 2.8 and is a bargain at that. Just because in theory it sounds logical on paper to only offer him the vet minimum, it doesn’t mean you are going to get his best effort in 2020 on and off the field. He is like DK Metcalf to the RB position, 1B or #2. He will probably have as many yards rushing as Metcalf has receiving and be vital to Carsons health and factor in as a starting RB at some point during the season.
The issue isn’t Hyde specifically. It’s that the Seahawks can apparently show infinite patience and take a tough negotiating stance with their absolute primary #1 need, and yet in other areas spend like a drunken sailor to pad depth.
And who said they show infinite patience with Clowney? They offered him contract at the beginning of tampering period, he refused it and they moved on.
Come on. We know that’s not what happened.
And after he rejected them, they signed Irvin, they signed Mayowa, they drafted two Edges with 2nd and 5th round pick and they spent all of their cap space. Zero, but zero evidence they are still waiting him, negotiate with him or “paying games ” with him.
Come on
Who says they are playing hardball with Clowney? In order for you to be correct, you’d have to be privy to Clowney’s demands.
Don’t get me wrong: you could be correct. But we don’t know what Clowney’s been asking re term and amount. What we do know is that no team has signed him and it’s almost June.
Really enjoyed this article Rob and it made a ton of sense. I think your take on the Hawks off season has been realistic and fair. You have always been the first to give PC/JS the benefit of the doubt so please don’t let some random feedback on places like Reddit and Fieldgulls bother you.
You are a journalist and just look at the source LT that negative feedback of late. That’s says it all IMO. Your research, writing skill level and knowledge of the Hawks is second to none and I think your increased positive exposure on a national level this past off season has some people jealous perhaps.
I find it interesting how allergic some fans are to any kind of criticism of the team.
It is quite shocking. I have always felt it is important for a fan base to always be at least somewhat critical of their team front offices in order to keep that expectation of a winning team top of mind.
I really think part of it is the quarantine and isolation as well. People are hyper sensitive with too much time on their hands and that is never a good combination.
The thing that I find most frustrating is the implication that I’m writing these articles deliberately. That I have some kind of axe to grind.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
All of the regular readers of this blog know I would’ve celebrated a strong off-season. But they haven’t had one, in my opinion. So I’m not going to lie or pretend otherwise. That would make this blog dishonest, unreliable and not worth reading. You wouldn’t be able to trust anything I say ever again.
Agree 100% the reason I come to this blog is it read some well thought out and honest content with a focus on the Hawks then have a reasonable debate with other fans. I think that is what you have always provided and why this blog is so popular and such a great place for Hawks fans to express their opinions. Please never change that.
Rob,
If you don’t have an axe to grind, why don’t you wrote the article that contradicts this one, finding all the reasons to support what they’ve done. It doesn’t mean you have to agree with it…
One of your greatest strengths as a Seahawks blogger has been your approach to interpreting why they’ve made the moves they’ve made. This year it seems like you’re spending a lot more time explaining why you think their moves have been wrong. Be creative and analytical in finding all the good/valid reasons the Seahawks didn’t sign Clowney at any cost, why they didn’t trade for Campbell or Hopkins, and why they didn’t draft a tackle . What are the opportunity costs of those moves, not only this year but in terms of resigning players who are up for free agency after the 2020 season or after the 2021 season? and what’s the difference in cost cutting KJ Wright before or after he passes a physical, and could that money have something to do with the delay in signing the pass-rusher you think they need?
You’re certainly entitled to your well founded opinion, and to write your blog the way you want. But it’s pretty clear that you’re getting sick of criticism from readers. I believe most of that stems from a fairly one-sided approach you take here. It’s the same reason a lot of people have become turned off to the majority of Seahawks Twitter, because it’s very one-sided. Showing that you can make a valid argument for the other side, specifically explaining all of the reasons for the moves the Seahawks made without dismissing them in the next sentence, doing something like that would be appreciated by many readers who have been turned off by the negativity this off-season. It also might make for a deeper community here.
You know what?
I’m getting pretty sick of people telling me how to run a blog I’ve run for 12 years.
Fair enough.
I hope you treat yourself to a cold one,
Cheers.
I don’t blame you.
Can’t speak for you Rob but as loyal reader and member of what has been an amazing community of Hawks fans for almost 10 years I would just like to pass on a message.
To those newcomers who seem to be doing a lot of complaining. This is a blog Rob does as a passion not a career. His love and knowledge of both the Hawks and the draft is incredible and only exceeded by the quality of his writing and the time commitment he puts into this.
If you don’t like the commentary or appreciate his work then don’t read it and go post on Feild Gulls or Reddit. No one is forcing you to read or comment and you are making m the experience less enjoyable for the rest of us who do appreciate all Rob does.
First, for betaparticle, I think Rob did post a “How did the Hawks this off-season turn out this way” post a few weeks back – speculating on the possibility that Campbell wasn’t interested in coming to Seattle, and that Clowney’s decision to wait caught them flat-footed. That may not be exactly what you wanted to see, but maybe Rob can’t actually see a real justification for the way it’s gone beyond that.
Second, Rob, I find it humorous that you’re being painted as some kind of reactionary doom-sayer about the Hawks. Just a few months ago, there was a significant contingent at Field Gulls who dismissed your views because you were too much of a homer. Funny how things change.
To add on Trevor’s post, I’m a huge Seahawks/NFL fan but college ball doesn’t do much for me so I hardly ever watch it. And yet, because I’ve been a faithful reader of this blog for the past 5 or 6 years, I find myself much more informed during the NFL draft as far as what players may have been reaches as well as understanding why the Hawks picked a certain player even though I disagreed with the selection. Rob does a great job of researching and laying out the strengths and weaknesses of a particular player to justify why he thinks why a certain player should be slotted at a certain range as opposed to what we might see n the national rankings. His detailed and factual analysis extend to his opinion of how the Seahawks are constructed as well as their strengths & weaknesses. I’ve never felt that Rob had a certain agenda when he writes his articles so it’s surprising for me to see that there are people who think that he does. If you disagree with his opinion, feel free to provide a factual rebuttal and please also do the same if you feel like accusing him of being biased towards a certain viewpoint. IMO, I’ll be shocked if anyone can actually provide a fact based argument that Rob’s blog postings have been based on any type of an agenda.
Thank you Tien 👍🏻
Don’t let Reddit get you down Rob, I think because of upvoting/downvoting it forces a single opinion to become the de facto truth, especially on team subs. Either the team is awful, and you can’t praise any moves they make, or the team is going 13-3, and you can’t say they did anything wrong.
I really appreciate that you call it like you see it, and that differing opinions aren’t downvoted to oblivion in these comment sections.
Don’t worry I’m not down. I find it funny.
Is BB one of those guys who claim the running game doesn’t matter?
Yes
I wonder how many of those same people were upset that Lynch didn’t get the ball at the 1 yd line?
I like your list much better. Although, Campbell was not an option (since he had his own preference) and I like Hyde’s signing since Penny is far away from being healthy and we haven’t heard much news from Carson. Which is concerning. Also, Hyde gives us options if Carson looks for a bigger contract next year. Having said all that, I feel like we left chips on the table after spending near $60M and still have serious issues with our #1 priority in the off season, DL.
Not true. Campbell didn’t get to hand pick where he went. He has stated that explicitly in his own words.
And Hyde provides no security against Carson. He’ll just be a free agent too, approaching age 31.
Campbell was a steal for a 5th round pick and if he was open to coming here, shame on us for not trying. He was a perfect fit for our D.
I realize Hyde is a FA next year. But he is a good addition for 2 reasons. One, he will give time for Carson to ease into the season as opposed to feeling pressure to carry the load immediately. And two, for next year, if Carson’s demand for extension are too high we can offer Hyde a reasonable extension. He’s not a young back but can still produce and doesn’t have the mileage of the other starting backs his age.
Hyde doesn’t give the Hawks any options in the negotiation with Carson above any other FA RB. He’s a FA next year too.
See my response above. I see this as a similar situation to Griffin and Dunbar (well before his recent fiasco). Can’t afford to pay both but we’ll see both in action, which will project a better future and will have reasonable demands. And sign the one who is a better fit.
And like I said, All of which can be said of any other free agent RB.
You don’t pay a guy $2.8m to “see both in action, which will project a better future “. If your scouting and personnel dept can’t do the exact same projection when a guy is playing for another NFL team they’re not doing their job very well.
“can be said of any other free agent RB”
Not being argumentative, but which other RB would you consider that would be lower cost?
Honestly I haven’t looked at next year’s FA RBs yet. But there are always a few out there.
Or there’s a third option we don’t discuss – that Carson won’t be ready for the start of the season so they’ll need a feature back until he is.
It’s all so dramatic to freak out about the Hyde signing but how much would you have given to have had Hyde in the final game of last season? Or in the playoffs? Our RBs were decimated, depth was non-existent and there were no solutions. Is that how we want to start the 2021 season too? At some point, there are practical matters that need to be addressed. And as much as I enjoy Rob’s work, it’s opinion and speculation. Without an inside source telling us exactly how healthy our rehabbing RBs are, we simply don’t know enough to have a fully informed opinion.
Who’s freaking out about Hyde? I personally like him. But as Rob (correctly) pointed out, his market had bottomed. He’d overplayed his hand and if the Hawks were as shrewd and tough with him as they appear to be with Clowney they could have him for much less.
As for Carson, I think we can agree that JS is as inside as it gets
I haven’t speculated on anything
couple thoughts…
1) like the hyde signing (and price range)
2) think snacks would be a great addition if he fits the culture
3) love the idea of signing gordon!
4) cut the extra fat and sing clowney to a two-year deal…
only three more dominoes need to fall…
Yeah I’m sure Clowney will be more than happy to sign that deal for $5m this year.
I think we should wait and not sign him yet. IF we can wait him out, maybe we can sign him for $4M, regardless we’re pretty much set now anyway (heavy sarcasm).
$5M? what’s the veteran minimum again?
https://twitter.com/JaredStanger/status/1264590574511767554?s=19
Hope Blair will learn something. ☺
I am still not sure how good SS he can be with his weight…look at him and look at Kam…
Kam is a different breed! Expecting Blair to be Kam is not realistic. He can be a great SS with his size, would like to see him bulk up a little but there aren’t too many with Kam’s size out there.
You have to keep in mind that there have not been many 6’4″/230lbs SSs ever. Kam was the build of a LB, a good sized one. If you look at some of these new 6’1″/220lb LBs, they are hybrid guys so they can cover in the slot.
#thereaintevergonnabeanotherbambamkam
Ummm. He is the exact same size as our current SS. And that’s without a full year of NFL training
Really? Blair is 196,McDougal is 215, Lano is 216. He is 20lbs lighter than almost all of NFL’s SS. No need to compare him with Kam to say his weight could be a potential problem.
Everything in college said he worked hard. I hope that remains the case. He has always had a knack for the big hits. If he can clean his play up and be more consistent, Blair & Diggs could be really exciting to watch
that’s a good sight to see. he could be an important guy for us next year. one of the few we have that looks to have playmaking ability if he can figure the game out.
Honestly nothing about this off-season really makes any sense. Overspending in some areas why not spending enough in others. Only bright side I can really see is none of them are really long term investments that will hurt the club later. Sure would like to see them make some more aggressive moves to put us over the top. I don’t fully understand why they are making some of the decisions they are or what the driving force behind it is. Regardless, I do hope that at the end of next year we look back and say, wow that did work out better than I expected. That’s a lot of hope though.
Seeing those first year cap hits for Fowler and Quinn make me sick to my stomach. The road map was fixing the pass rush via FA or creative trades and then draft offensive linemen, a receiver and a defensive tackle or two. The cap space, the draft picks everything was set up to execute this plan perfectly. Rob was talking about this in freaking January (or so). I was fantasizing about moves we could make on defense by halftime of the Packers game. They could have had the exact same draft class and it wouldn’t have mattered, because they would have addressed the elephant holding this team down. Instead we have a bunch of tight ends and another exciting replacement level online competition on our hands. I’m also going to keep telling myself Campbell was never an option, because I can’t stomach us passing on what he could have brought to the defense.
Now we have three months of chicken with a player who has the luxury of waiting and the entire world knowing how screwed our team will be without his services. And Arizona is circling Griffen.
Despite what many in the comments here argued, they easily could’ve added Clowney and one of Fowler or Quinn. Easily. And still retained Jarran Reed. And they could’ve got out of all of those contracts by 2022.
But they chose not to in favour of what they did instead.
And that to me is staggering.
This is one of my favorite one’s of these so far, for obvious reasons…
https://mobile.twitter.com/Camorooni/status/1264606411939475461
Thrilling.
One of the sad things how they’ve run this off-season is the amazing amount of millions they have spent on players who aren’t very good. That just baffles me.
But does John and Pete think they are good? That’s what matters the most.
No. It’s not. What matters most is that they’re actually good on the football field.
Anyone:
After spending almost $60 million in free agency, which signing excites you and why?
I’m going with BJ Finney and that makes me sad.
I’ll take Dorsett for the fact that he was inexpensive, can take the top off a D, and we punted on WR in the draft.
Olsen and Hyde are probably the most “exciting’ adds in terms of name recognition, but certainly no great value there and likely one-year-rentals. I could see them both having decent rolls this year though.
I think David Moore will have the 2020 he should have had in 2019 before he fractured his upper arm/shoulder. Probably should have gone on IR. Before the season there was lots of talk that he’d spent the offseason learning all the WR spots and that PC felt comfortable with him lining up in different areas.
He’s averaged 17 yards per catch the last two seasons. He has RW’s trust and he’s a quiet guy that can sneak behind the defense when safeties are spying DK and Lockett.
In 2018 he had 26-445-5. I can see him getting 35-650-7 this year.
Tbh, I’m not excited about any…and while I waiting for the season, I’m not pumped about Hawks’ games 🙁
I’m most exctied to see how DK will improve, hope that Taylor can be good. Probably that’s all.
And Lewis…hope that he’ll dominate at OG and start on day1.
As for DL, I think Green will be better, and curious what could Irvin and Mayowa bring
Same. No juice from free agency.
Wanted more, expected less. Hoped for 2-3 talents in free agency. Would have settled for ‘just’ Reed + 1, instead got Reed + .5, .5 and .5. Too bad talent is not cumulative.
Looking forward to Brooks, Taylor, Lewis once the retreads are out of the way.
Dunbar better call Saul.
Wow Rob, I commented that I was done posting, but I must have really gotten under your skin for you to stoop as low as calling out someone that was trying to engage in a discussion, and YOU ONCE AGAIN bring up this situation. But that seems to be your MO as of lately, someone sure has your panties in a bunch. I was never arguing for the guy personally, and any objective reading of my comments could have seen that, but not understanding the argument that “he should lose his representation” simply due to another attorney getting butt hurt that he tweeted something to hurt THAT ATTORNEY’S case and help dunbars. I’m just so curious, and have been, with your infatuation with him. You are generally so objective to things, yet hard and fast towards this situation as a whole. But the way others have been treated in the comment section by you lately, and this blatant ignorance and childish post against myself, is beyond what I would have expected from you. Not that it matters, as this is your blog and I surely will not be missed on here, but the lack of response after this post will be due to not visiting the comment section on here again. I have always praised for the content, and thoroughly enjoy it typically, but this comment section has become Twitter with a tyrannical dictator. And like a true dictator, who has already censored comments, this post will most likely not make it to the comment section anyways.
Bigten,
What is your deal? You act like you’re the only one that is entitled to an opinion. If you hate it here so much that you gotta piss and moan elsewhere, then stay elsewhere. You CLEARLY have made nothing but a reputation as a whiner and you’re the one with your panties in a bunch.
P.S. Your grammar sucks too
Dunbar’s attorney is an assclown.
If someone calls you out for once defending him, so what? Own it, have a laugh, move on.
No need to take it personal.
If I were you I’d probably wish this was deleted.
You’ve embarrassed yourself.
There’s nothing worse than an internet flounce saying you’re never coming back, while throwing a bit of mud.
It’s the kind of thing you’d expect from a teenager.
I would go Dunbar if a trade counts as a signing? Not sure if he will even play.
Rob I’m not sure I understand why everyone is saying they should have done x by now. They have signed a ton of free agents, even very big name free agents that ended up being very important, in may, and some even as late as July. In fact we signed Al Woods himself in May of last year. It’s not like any of the players they sign are missing anything by being signed later considering no one can even go to the team facilities yet.
Who are these big name, important free agents they’ve signed in May or beyond?
Al Woods? Is that it? A player who was on the cards to sign from early in the off-season a year ago?
People keep saying things like this. How many other so called contenders have gaping voids to fill?
I was just using him as an example because he is the guy you were upset they haven’t replaced yet, but we signed him two weeks ago last year. In July of 2011 they signed both Sidney Rice and T Jack, they signed Zach Miller in August of 2011. They signed Ziggy Ansah in May of last year.
I’m not ‘upset’ about anything. I don’t get upset about football off-seasons. As the writer of a Seahawks blog I suggested they needed to dramatically fix their pass rush and provided damning 2019 statistics to back up my argument. And then when I see that they’ve tried to fix their DL by signing Mayowa and Irvin, I am asserting that it’s not good enough.
It didn’t have to be Clowney. It could’ve been other players. They needed to fix the DL and they haven’t.
And the reason we talk about Clowney so much is because he’s still available.
I mean Clowney himself was traded for on August 31st of last year. I’m still holding out hope is all. Which I guess you have not said you are not doing as well.
Exactly. I retain hope other moves will occur. But I can also fairly judge what they’ve done so far. People act like May, June and July is a hotbed of football activity rich in opportunity. It isn’t. The Clowney trade was a complete gift. Without Houston’s generosity they would’ve had a 2019 pass rush of Ansah, Mingo, Marsh and Martin. They were let off the hook a year ago and they’re banking on it happening again. That’s not how you run a supposed NFL contender.
I guess expecting them to catch lightning in a bottle twice isn’t exactly the smartest outlook. And looking it up it looks like most of the people I found that they had signed in July were only signed that late because of the 2011 lockout.
Exactly. And for every Clowney there’s a desperation Sheldon Richardson where you end up blowing a pick.
Furthermore look at the Chiefs, Niners, Saints, Packers etc… even teams like the Cardinals. How many gaping holes do they have like Seattle?
People can tell themselves it’s smart if they want. The fact is Seattle is the only so-called contender in this situation. And they run the very serious risk now of failing to address their off-season priority sufficiently, meaning next year will be the THIRD off-season in a row where they’ve got to try and solve the DL issue.
That’s not good enough. We have to be honest about this.
DESPERATION
GAPING HOLES
SO-CALLED CONTENDER
THIRD OFF-SEASON IN A ROW
These gaping holes did not happen overnight. Now that they have so many, desperation is setting in. Short term I think they are feeling more desperate about the offensive line.
Desperation is an emotion. Emotion and logic do not mix. This will continue to the point where they will no longer be considered even a so-called contender. Russell Wilson will only be able to mask the inadequacies of management for so long. Just an opinion.
Agree with almost everything except the Spock vibe. 🙂
Bungling drafts.
Losing Sherman, Thomas, Bennett, Wright without compensation.
Needing to trade picks for Harvin and JFG, then Brown and Richardson.
Trading your best defender for cap space and draft picks to improve depth!
Now / optics: Keep your icons (Carroll, Wilson, Wagner), stay competitive with short term commits, build depth through draft.
Not sure I believe my own bullshit.
🤣😂
And worst of it for me is Seattle has consciously put themselves in this situation. They had both significant cap space and draft capital and that’s all gone. And now it appears they are still in need of a major windfall to round out the off season? It’s just so weird!
I just watched 2019 Seahawks versus 49ers game in SF when Seahawks won in OT. This was the game when clowney was a game wrecker.
If Seahawks don’t end up signing Clowney and he signs elsewhere, this offseason will seem like a huge lost opportunity. A Big WTF.
My hope is that once Clowney gets visits with others teams who have interest and passes medical tests we offer more than any top offer and he returns. I have wanted Seahawks to sign both Clowney and Griffen.
In SF/Seahawk game, Hollister had a big impact and glad he is back to complete. I also like the Hyde signing and Irvin signing. I understand the Iupati signing with history of injuries with Phil Haynes and Jordan Simmons.
The visits thing has always been a massive red herring.
He doesn’t need a visit to have a medical.
This is all about teams not meeting his demands and he, therefore, deciding to wait this out to make a point.
I think Clowney enjoys his off season free time and not being contractually obligated to attend anything until August. Yeah, if someone met his number he would have signed but, why bother signing until preseason if he’s taking a pay cut anyways.
I don’t think it’s that at all. He wouldn’t be doing anything anyway this year.
This is 100% about him getting offered way less than he expected so he’s decided no… not signing a contract that I don’t agree with on your terms. That’s it. He’ll be costing himself money but he won’t care. He’s proving a point.
Agreed. And I suspect if he’d signalled this level of stubbornness two months ago, the FO would’ve done things very differently.
Now it looks like the ‘Hawks need him and he needs us, given how few other serious suitors there are.*
* as opposed to teams kicking the tires
I don’t see it as stubbornness though.
I see a bloke who has earned enough money for future generations of his family to never have to worry about finances. He has tens of millions in the bank. He has an idea of his worth and he’s sticking to his principles. And that’s his choice. I actually respect him for it. His position is — if you want me here’s the price. He doesn’t have to accept what he constitutes as a bad deal just because it happens to be the biggest offer on the table. If nobody meets his price, he’ll bide his time.
The problem for the Seahawks is probably that they didn’t anticipate him doing that. They probably knew they had the best offer and expected him, after some consideration to accept it.
But he didn’t. And they didn’t really have a plan B. They put all of their eggs in the Clowney basket. If they don’t land him after all of this, they’ll have blown the off-season. Having frittered away so much money, it’s increasingly less likely they’ll land him.
Clowney’s net worth, after doing a bit of research, is about 13 million. That’s damn good money, but certainly not filthy rich. A few bad/dumb investments, some frivolous lifestyle spending, and one serious injury and he could be well off that current mark.
Just because some website says that’s what his net worth means absolutely nothing.
No website you have googled has any idea what his net worth. None of them are reliable. One of the sites ‘claiming’ this information was full of spelling mistakes. Another suggested, as of 2019, he was making $5m a year playing football.
So no, none of these websites are reliable.
He’s made $50m in football salary alone. There have never been any reports of any kind of ‘lavish’ lifestyle or any business activity that has seen him lose tens of millions of dollars.
So let’s stop saying his net worth is $13m please. I’ve pointed all this out before and don’t want to keep doing it.
Banging on about JD, he and John played the negotiating game with each other and both have lost. Seattle doesn’t have the money to pay the big bucks and JD doesn’t want to come down on his potential salary. It’s over for both parties let’s move on. JD next season mind and heart will be with the bank and not on the field of play.
Injury riddled two seasons average first draft picks and Pete still makes the play offs – I’m sticking with The Team and not any over hyped, under performing, high wage demand injury prone professional
You don’t have to pick a side between Clowney and Carroll. It’s a bit strange that you see it this way. And there’s no moving on until he’s signed somewhere else.
And I couldn’t care less whether it was Clowney or someone else. They needed to fix the DL and Mayowa + Irvin is not fixing the DL.
I’m with you, Rob, as far as feeling the ‘blame ‘game’ thing. So okay, they don’t see eye to eye-no great shock as their interests lie in different quadrants financially/strategically. And it has been a bit of a drag, no doubt magnified a bit by circumstance. And they may yet pull it together.
But there is no way the disappointed I might feel in the team brass for not yet having ‘brought the ship to harbor (one way or another-whether via a plan A, or some plan B option) is anywhere near the feeling of being a paled by the dark old days of Mora jr. and fin de siecle Ruskell. Nor do I feel the irritation I did with the manner ET comport ed himself, or some of the loose talk and vitriol that came from MB or RS (though I get what may have fed into some of that).
So, I would never hold you to your answers here, but say you were a handicapper taking bets; what % would you currently affix to:
-a late signing of Clowney.
-a ‘plan b’-type signing.
-standing pat? (Hard for me to get my head around this option-just can’t see it).
I know I’về plied you with similar questions before, but the handicapping shifts with times passage, eh? I still go with #1.
Open to one and all
I like it. I’d do this draft then (obviously if I pick a different player it might blow up totally the rest of how the draft would look like, but still):
We need TE
We need WR
We need RB
We need OL
We need EDGE/LEO
We need CB
R1 – Robert Hunt (because he can play RT and RG too)
R2 – Cam Akers RB (hard to pass up on Claypool as I think he’s a great talent and we could really use someone like him. But we need RB more. Almost picked Taylor because they love him, but the value would be better this way)
R3 – Jabari Zuniga EDGE (also a hard pass for Duvernay, Edwards, Moss, but we could use another outside presence)
R4 – Amik Robertson CB (the mad dog. He’s purely a nickel imo, but he’s vicious. Help in the run D, can blitz, attack the ball and A+ attitude)
R4 second – Bryce Hall CB (he has injury concern, but he could be an outside CB. Really nice highlight reel, and he could compete and hopefully win the starting job in front of Flowers)
R5 – Joe Reed WR (A+ returner and upside as a WR)
R6 – Tried not to move around much and keep the same as the Hawks did, but I’d have to move up like 8-10-12 spots when I’d see that Prince Tega is still available mid R6. Give someone a next year’s R6, move up and get Prince Tega Wanogho. He has starting potential in year2/3.
R7 – Hunter Bryant TE (he has limitations but this was a weak class and didn’t wanna reach earlier)
I’d love that offseason moves and this draft.
We’d have a pretty strong DL: Clowney-Reed-Campbell-Zuniga
Awesome RBs: Carson, Penny, Akers
OL with crazy high potential: Brown – Fluker/Jones – Finney/Hunt – R.Hunt/Jones/no idea which new guy plays OG – R.Hunt/Tega Wanogho
Secondary to cry for: Griffin – Flowes/Hall – Robertson/Dunbar/Amadi and Diggs + McDougald/Blair
And a solid WR and TE group
I’d be pumped to see those guys playing
This is a fun offseason exercise, but I would rather have our current signings. We fell apart late last year because of losses at RB, TE, WR, OL, and DL and because we lacked speed and strength on the edges all year which hurt the pass and run defense. In a shortened offseason signing productive vets who fit your scheme and doubling down in the draft at many of the same positions makes sense to me. Unlike some of the moves above we will also have the ability to reload and extend guys if need be in 2021 (and if the cap goes down be ready for that). We can still cut/restructure/trade many of the guys listed above (we have already done this with Tedric/Turner/Britt/Fluker) to improve the team including signing Clowney. I don’t fault or want the Hawks to just overpay Clowney like the Jets, etc do with big name players year after year. And even the bad teams have not decided to pay Clowney what he wanted so that should tell us something about his true value or what the Hawks should/could have done.
They also fell apart because the pass rush was highly inadequate and wholly reliant on a man playing through a sports hernia.
And they haven’t even brought the one guy back who they were reliant on.
But that was the problem. Our pass rush came from one guy is who is good but not great at it (3 sacks). I think we have much better balance this year in terms true LEOs and SAMs (Brooks is also a good blitzer even if he lines up at Will) v last year where we had essentially 4 5Ts and Ansah (who was broken) and a couple of 225 pound LBs rushing off the edge. Add in a full year of Reed (and a year of growth from recent 1st and 3rd round picks who can also reduce inside) and the pass rush actually fits together better where I think it is at least as good as last year right now. And there is still room to add Clowney, Griffen and/or someone on the inside.
No, they replaced a quality DE with mediocre journeymen and rookies.
Not good enough.
I really cant believe that people think Schneider drafted bad since 2012… since 2015 seahawks are in top 5 with their drafts imo…draft isnt only first round…
Dissly, Carson, Moore makes up for consistently missing with their top picks?
Late-round luck doesn’t make up for Collier, Blair, Penny, Green, McDowell, Pocic, etc, plus the draft capital needed to trade for LT and DT.
Ifedi, Reed, Metcalf, Griffin is a low bar, IMO.
Maybe they’re not ‘going for it’ in free agency because there is not enough depth for it to make a difference. FWIW, I don’t agree with that approach. I would churn the roster and add talent by any means necessary.
They take solid players late in the first.
McDowell only major bust (Penny incoming imo)
Solid but not special.
Need early contributions from Brooks, Taylor, Lewis.
Still have hope for Collier, Blair, Penny, but doubt they get much run, this year. If nothing by year 3 or 4, I consider the early pick a disappointment.
Since 2015 John drafted:
3 blue chip players [Clark, Locket and DK(yes I think we can allredy count him as blue chip)]
3 good starters in Reed, Shaquill and Carson…
He traded for 4 years of great LT…
Solid players in Glowinski and QJeff…
And injury destroyed first two season of Disley and Penny but if they can stay healthy they could.go in that good starters group…
And i see lot of potential in Green (who is still really young) , Blair.and Barton…
Too early on DK imho wasn’t even the best rookie WR. Flashiest perhaps.
Might buy his own hype. Great role model in humility w Russ so close to him
Here i used only picks they got at the end of season without comp picks. Because all.others are result of John doing job his way. (Trades, FA signing whis results in comp picks etc)…
https://imgur.com/a/jXNcpxa
I agree w/ all of this.
Clark and Lockett were 2015.
Metcalf dropped because of injuries and they valued Blair 17 picks higher.
Reed and Griffin have been good, not great. Both benefit (play & cash) from having no one behind them.
They didn’t trade for 4 years of Duane Brown. They signed him to a 3-year extension in 2018.
Everything else is up to health, potential, development, etc.
I also think getting QB Anthony Gordon in UDFA is a steal.
That game against Colorado is incredible. Just slingin’ it in a downpour.
And Poona too.
Agree. Gordon was a steal, but they’ll keep Geno Smith, lose him off practice squad.
(And sincere thanks for calling me out on my takes on development and drafts. Keeping me honest. Respect your opinion.)
All good. Thank you.
Good chance of that happening, yes. He’s gotta fix his feet even though he doesn’t always need them to make throws if that makes sense. He’s perfect to develop behind RW if they get to do that.
Arm strength underrated decently accurate. Immense learning curve but no excuses when you’re staying in-state
Your mention of Glowinski attacks my brain.
Get excited for Parkinson. Truth…maybe.
He’s been rock solid if not more for Indy.
As the 5th wheel in an otherwise excellent line. He kinda sucked for us though.
He started all 16 games last year IIRC.
Earned a 3/18 extension.
Always a good player, took some time and/or different team/scheme.
Wasn’t he under Cable the whole time he was in Seattle?
The comment thread today was salty and uncomfortable to read. It felt very heated. In my opinion, especially currently, we should try to de-escalate. That doesn’t mean not having debate. Debate is good and some pertinent points for discussion!
Times are tense at the minute overall. I certainly feel that tension, day to day, in my life and what I do. I know I’m not always a big member of the community here but for love of the Hawks and generally when I comment its with a specific reason in mind.
Thanks all, Rob and posters.
I didn’t find anything salty about it. I found it rational and well thought out. I think most can see we have still yet to address our biggest need. As it currently stands we are not improved on the DL from last season. Sure things could change. I enjoyed seeing a perspective of a more aggressive start to free-agency and how there were quite a few available options to do so. Sometimes reality can be uncomfortable; and Rob presented the Seahawks current pass rush reality quite well.
Nothing compared to last season of GoT.
That discussion, straight bloodbath.
That discussion was the reason I skipped the final season of GoT and glad I did.
Even if they traded Russell Wilson for a bag of magic beans… this off-season wouldn’t have been as bad as the last season of Game of Thrones.
Lol. Sad, but true
Westworld 3 gave it a run.
So I’ve heard.
(Well, I watched the critical drinker on YouTube talk about it. I’ve never watched Westworld).
WWS1 is the only season I’ve liked. I’m a big fan of dystopian/cyberpunk and WWS1 was basically like Ghost in the Shell but in a western setting. It’s a great self contained story that may set up other things by the end but it’s not necessary to delve in deeper. WWS2 was beyond frustrating and I won’t bother with WWS3.
My folks were rewatching the whole series and I can’t be bothered because i know how it ends 😷
I agree 💯 David, it was a bit odd considering the long history of polite discussions that is sometimes taken for granted.
I definitely prefer the offseason that you laid out there Rob, although I really do think there is something to Campbell not wanting to go to an NFC west rival. Not having another good DT it’s hard to imagine there plan, Green and LJ kicking inside more often isn’t reassuring. I like Hyde coming to the Hawks with their RB health situation. I have way more of a problem with spending to adding Greg Olson to a packed TE room, I’m good with that 4m as a hedge against Carson getting injured before Penny gets back.
If Taylor, or Robinson are instant superstars I guess what might have been won’t matter much, but it feels like we really need this years draft picks to pop, or have serious defensive issues. I don’t remember a draft in a long time that so mattered to nail as much as this years, or see the team drop off a bit.
definitely feeling the tension too, david. john and pete could probably solve a lot of this potential displaced anger with a big splash signing (or two)… hopefully before the holly house burns down… just do something before the mobs storm the gates (scares me when i see people calling for their jobs).
Rob, thanks for your thoughtful alternative off-season, food for thought, and what else is there to do without OTA’s? If John could have done those deals, he would have. Let me suggest two reasons why John did not take this route:
1) John’s chessboard is not for 2020, but for 2020-2025. If Prof Clayton is correct, there is a better than 50% chance that the cap for 2021 will be significantly reduced, perhaps by $40M or more! John could not prudently take on contracts for Clowney and Campbell that would have cap hits over $35M for 2021, otherwise, he would be forced to make ruinous cuts to the rest of the roster, since those two contracts would carry massive dead money in 2021.
2) We can spend all the monopoly money we want on Jadeveon, but it is real money for John. He knows better than to bid against himself, a constraint we armchair guys don’t have. You never, ever pay a player what he wants to be paid. You pay him the market rate plus a few dollars more to clinch the deal. To pay a player what he demands to be paid will lead you right off the cliff. John offered Clowney a market contract, and he refused it. You do not bid against yourself and overpay him, no matter how much you want him back. To sign Clowney would have taken a multi-year deal north of $20M/yr, with a modest 2020 cap hit, and explosive cap hits thereafter. Jadeveon closed the door, not John.
1. The Seahawks have tens of millions in available cap space for 2021. They could’ve easily carried both players, even if the cap comes down next year. They are literally only paying Wilson and Wagner.
2. I’d rather pay a good player good money than waste $60m on average or below average players and have a team incapable of competing for the Super Bowl.
I don’t see it as all a waste, not all of it. They needed to make moves to fill in the gaps and add some depth. Maybe they went overboard on the OL, but their thoughts are sound and I have a feeling that was their plan all along (as far as the OL is concerned) but the missed on Clowney and the tact he took. There was no real plan B to deal with what transpired.
Coulda-woulda-shoulda
Yeah…
What are you implying with this comment?
I feel if they sign Clowney that the offseason will have been slightly positive but we were all expecting it to be more than that, and rightfully so. If they don’t sign him, then the offseason has been a loss and we’ll have to wait for a trade to fall out of the sky and hope RW continues with his magic tricks.
Good Memorial Day Everyone- remember those who served. On both sides of the pond.
Per Breer (MMQB and MAQB):
*Clyde Edwards-Helaire*
Oh, sorry, did I say that out loud?
Unfortunately the Chiefs heard you and not the Seahawks
What a roller coaster of a draft season. I went from hating the idea of another early-round RB, to being extremely disappointed that we didn’t grab CEH or Taylor.
That’s a question I asked myself a lot.
If we would have a REAL dual threat like cmcm kamara oder maybe like CEH will be, wouldn’t that make our offense much more unpredictable?
Well of course we would be more unpredictable, but sometimes I feel like a dual threat RB would elevate this offense to even higher levels
My draft crush! He would have changed the game here with Wilson. I would have never passed on Barry Sanders 2020
Rapsheet reporting Freeman may now have to decide between lowering his contract demands or not playing in 2020.
Florio earlier today floated the idea that Freeman could chose to retire.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/05/25/retirement-an-option-for-devonta-freeman/
Dude has delusions of grandeur. Hasn’t played well in three years, is near 30, and has injury history. Taking the position he has that he won’t play unless someone pays his price is not helping him no one likely to offer what Seattle reportedly did now that he appears wishy-washy in his desire to play. He might as well retire, he’s as good as done.
I keep hearing about this and have had quite a bit of people text me regarding Antonio Brown. I know Russ was lobbying for him last season and that apparently hasn’t changed. While most of this chatter is probably just conjecture, I’m curious on thoughts if there is a spot on the roster for him? I know he still hasn’t been cleared by the league to return. I think I’d personally take back Josh Gordon first…
Thoughts???
I’d much rather Gordon and avoid the Brown headache. A chain-moving 3rd down Bobby Engram-type like Gordon (at this point in his career) would compliment Lockett, Metcalf and the TEs so well.
Maybe Clowney is just waiting to see if – in his eyes – a team that is better equipped to make a run comes in further down the line. He’s in what, his 8th year? Maybe it’s got nothing to do with the money. Maybe he just wants to maximize his changes to win a ring.
I think there’s likely quite a bit of truth in what you’ve suggested here. He’s definitely making a point holding out for his terms, and he obviously has the ability to do so. But if he’s not going to get the the big contract for 5 yrs and $100m, why not sign a short deal with the team that gives you the best shot at a title?
What if the Ravens trade Judon and offer Clowney? Or the Saints? These are teams with significantly stronger DL’s than the Hawks, and Clowney could really show out on one of these teams.
I’m personally not feeling very optimistic that he comes back now, unless the Hawks offer is much better than any others!
At this point, that’s where I think I would be if I were him. If you’re going to take a one year deal to either:
1. Put up a great season (numbers) to get that big contract next year, or
2. Give you your best shot at a ring.
If it’s #1, there are a lot of teams that have a better supporting cast on DL that would make his job easier than eating double and triple teams with us. If it’s #2, there’s a pretty decent chance we don’t even win our division. The clearest path to the SB, seems to be with BAL or KC. At this point KC can’t afford even a token offer. BAL could make it work, especially if they did something with Judon (trade or multi-year deal).
Terrifyingly enough, the 9ers could clear enough room for him too, while offering better options at #1 & #2 above, not to mention the chance to “show us what we missed out on”.
Man, I feel like every time I take off for a long weekend, I come back to the Blog ready to catch up on some great articles and am never disappointed. Then I get to the Comments…
Never fails.
Keep up the work Rob, not everybody here wants to rip apart all your stuff. I am extremely frustrated with the Off Season and look at it (this far) as a massive failure and huge step back.
RW called for more stars on both sides. So they filled out with back ups and rotational pieces at over payment prices. $2.1M for David Moore? Are you kidding me? Almost $6M to Bruce? What in the world are you smoking JS?
Just incredibly baffling decisions.
Side note: A few weeks ago somebody posted thge video by Penny of him “rehabbing” and I commented at the time that if anything he was further back than he should be to meet the season start. And now we have another $4M spent on Carlos Hyde….
Thank you 👍🏻
Woke up to an email today ‘reminding’ me of what this blog is about (being positive about the Seahawks). I can’t believe how people are reacting to my honesty about the team.
My glass half empty side is not looking forward to the Instant Reaction posts this fall.
The Hawks will claw their way to a win that was way harder than it should have been due to this defensive front. RW wills the team down the field and Hyde will plunge a 1 yd TD with :90 remaining to seal the win.
Followed by lots of reaction posts. “See! This team isn’t as bad as you thought! Hyde was a great pickup! You guys were just being negative!”
That sucks man. I’ll admit that its not as fun to come and read “negative” takes on the Hawks but it is honest reality. The uncertainty of the team, the sport, the world is putting a lot of people on edge. People coming here looking for positivity and reassurance on a common love we all have, need to realize that this blog has always been a thoughtful place to analyze the team honestly and put forth possible solutions based upon their prior actions. Through this past decade much more of the content has been positive rather than negative. Sometimes this approach can be a little cold to some. I find it nice. For example, personally it put more stock into player development. I believe that Green, Flowers, Amadi and Blair will take big steps. I coach varsity at my local High School and I am admittedly a guy kind of fake it til you make it type of guy. Buy in early, believe a kid can and will grow into the best version of themselves. They don’t always though. You can that kind sobering honesty here. It makes me rethink/review my vision of a player or plan of action. I may not always agree but i like the thought exercise and multiple points of view I find here. All that’s to say, don’t worry about it Rob. This place is still the best for any Hawks fans. Many of us are lifers as long as you keep writing.
Who’s next on the 2021 draftee write ups Rob? I’m interested to see who you are looking at. It would be interested to see what you think of the 3 PAC12 kids rumored to be looked at in the supplemental draft. Granted, its not a great rumor but Penei Sewell, Walker Little and Hamilcar Rashed are great and should be looked at anyways.
Sewell can’t enter the draft. Little can and I’ve watched him a fair bit. Some athletic potential there for sure.
The question I ask is. What were the Seahawks suppose to do? Clowney made it clear that he was not going to accept the Seahawks offer. So was Seattle suppose to do? Just keep throwing more money at Clowney until he signs with the Seahawks. BTW: Campbell wanted to stay closer to Florida.
1. Find common ground with Clowney or move on and sign other players.
2. Baltimore is not near Florida and people need to stop finding excuses for not making a run at him.
Baltimore is a heck of a lot closer to Florida than Seattle. BTW: It is my understanding that Jacksonville (out of loyalty) sent Campbell to place where he wanted to go. Which is why the Ravens held most of the cards in the Campbell trade. Last year Clowney waited until training camp and did ok. So Clowney is probably doing the same strategy. Clowney might be waiting for a team to come up with an injury at the Pass Rusher position. Personally I don’t think that Clowney made the right decision. My understanding is that Clowney was offered 17mil from the Dolphins but he turned it down(I could be wrong). Don’t think Clowney is going to get anywhere near that offer now. Even if a Pass rusher comes up injured. I also think Clowney’s injury history has hurt him.
Rob: If you want to blame the Seahawks for not overpaying to sign Clowney that fine. If that makes you happy fine. But you can’t let one man hold your entire organization hostage.
Your proposal of getting both Campbell/Clowney would have been awesome. I would have LOVED to have seen that. But Campbell/Clowney would have to agree to those deals. BTW: Dave Wyman/Bob Shelton BOTH think the defense will be better this year. I do to. You now have Rasheem Green(who just turned 23) in his third year. You have Cody Barton, L.J. Collier, Ugo Amandi and Marquise Blair in their second year. You have added Bruce Irvin and Brenson Mayowa. Plus the Seahawks have added rookies Jordyn Brooks, Darrell Taylor and Alton Robinson. Also you now have both Jarren Reed and Quandre Diggs for a full season. Hopefully the Dunbar situation will get resolved. And you know that Schneider at some point is going to add a run stuffing defensive tackle. Would I love to have Clowney/Campbell? The answer is HELL YES! But I think Schneider is doing everything he can to solve the problems on defense. Can’t help it if Clowney is not worth on the market what he thinks he is worth.
Your understanding on Campbell is wrong. Read the article. Listen to the interview link.
FYI, the next person who wrongly claims Jacksonville traded Campbell to the place he wanted to go out of loyalty (despite the article clearly disputing it)… I’m just going to delete the comment.
I’m bored of having to address this same point over and over again.
The Campbell thing is fun and all, but he was under Arizona club control, seems the only thing guarenteed not to happen is for the up-and-coming Cardinals to trade him to a divisional rival. As the whole thesis seems to start with that point it strikes me as alternate reality that was never, ever on the table.
The draft is always a crap shoot, so getting a 4th or a 3rd or whatever instead of the 5th needs to be compared to the certainty of facing Calais 2x a year … or watch SEA flowder, and if I was the Cards I would give up a couple rounds of draft comp position to keep the SEA weakness, a weakness.
Moving on, they may well end up with Clowney, then that becomes a non-point.
Fowler? Yea, I would have liked to see Fowler, not sure if they were up against a regional bias from Fowler or whether they had other questions about him.
As far as the other journeyman … everybody knows you need to be able to run a full 11 on 11 scrimmage with an O-lineman at every position. It shows flexibility. But they are still 3 short so there is still work to do.
Campbell left Arizona three years ago and signed with Jacksonville. The Cardinals had no say in his destination.
If you’re going to refer to my ‘thesis’ as an alternative reality, you might want to get such a simple fact right first.
Yea, porbably wouldn’t hurt to have my facts straight first :O
FWIW, Fowler said on NFL live back near the draft that it was only a 2 horse race between LA and Atlanta. Said he chose Atlanta because Dan Quinn was the guy that recruited him to Florida and convinced him he would have a bog role in ATL. Guess he was never really an option. Personally i don’t believe Roberto Quinn was either. Seattle has had a few chances to get him and they were never close to getting him. Maybe bad fit personality wise? I don’t know. All the more they should have just got it done with Clowney. Still got time to fix that mistake.
The Seahawks could’ve easily ‘been in the race’.
They weren’t because they chose not to be.