Pre-season week #3 thoughts (vs LA Chargers)

It’s stating the obvious but this was a vast improvement (well, they won 27-0, duh).

More importantly than any score or victory though was the fact there were legit positives to come out of the performance.

Firstly, some praise for Pete Carroll. I feared he would play key starters in this game after two sloppy, god-awful outings in the first two weeks. He hinted at it after the Denver game and it was concerning. As bad as Seattle were against the Raiders and Broncos, there was absolutely no reason to risk any stars against LA.

Just look at the JK Dobbins knee injury earlier in the day for a case in point.

It was a relief to see Carroll, who has started key players in virtually all of his pre-season games previously, resist the temptation — and be rewarded by those who did play.

The main positive for me was Darrell Taylor. He had an early speed-to-power rush that resulted in a pressure. Then he came screaming off the edge, rounding the tackle for a big sack. Later on he showed great effort to chase back to a pressured QB to share a sack with Kerry Hyder.

This is what everyone has been hoping for. Nobody could be blamed for wondering whether Taylor would ever see the field in Seattle, let alone perform if he did. In this game he looked like a player who can cause opponents problems.

Forget the SAM — they have enough money to go and get KJ Wright and still should do that. Get Taylor off the edge on key downs and let him be in attack mode.

Don’t do what you did a year ago, making Alton Robinson inactive so Luke Willson can be active for zero offensive and special teams snaps. This guy needs to play.

Taylor showed enough in this game to warrant a big role as a specialist pass rusher.

It was also good to see another recent second round pick, Dee Eskridge, looking quick and explosive. He was fluid with the ball in hand and made one typically eye-catching grab (the type he used to make in college all the time). I was a big fan of Eskridge going into the draft and there’s no doubt he can be a very exciting player for Seattle if he stays healthy.

There was actually a running game this week, which was extremely pleasing to see. Alex Collins in particular was agile, explosive and physical. For me he should’ve sealed the RB2 position with this performance, ahead of Rashaad Penny. Collins looks like a player who should be getting a sizeable role to limit the wear and tear on Chris Carson. In fact he looks very capable of leading the rushing attack if needed.

I liked the way Seattle blitzed in this game. I’ve not studied it closely but on first view the timing and variety was pleasing. One big blitz by Cody Barton obviously led to a touchdown for Marquise Blair.

There may be others I’m missing, writing immediately after a first condensed viewing, but I thought Joshua Moon played well.

Overall defensively they made the Chargers look as bad as the Seahawks did in the previous two weeks, so that was a big improvement.

There are three issues I want to discuss too.

I’m not sure why referee’s decide annually to take over pre-season games but someone needs to tell them, finally, to stop. The number of penalties was ridiculous and even watching in a 40-minute condensed replay it was painful at times.

If avoidable injuries are reason #1 to finally get rid of pre-season, then refereeing nonsense is a close #2.

It remains a big mystery why the Seahawks over the years have been unable to find a backup quarterback of even middling ability. Geno Smith, as fun as his scrambling around in this one was, isn’t good enough. Sean Mannion isn’t good enough.

John Schneider arrived in Seattle talking about drafting quarterbacks regularly and yet in the Carroll/Schneider era they’ve selected just two in twelve drafts. One of those, of course, was seventh rounder Alex McGough — cut last week because he’s even worse than Smith and Mannion.

Perhaps Russell Wilson’s consistent availability has made it a moot point? Yet it’s a little surprising that in well over a decade they haven’t drafted a solid, decent backup that you might actually be excited to see in an emergency.

If Smith or Mannion has to start for Seattle, it’ll be ugly.

I’m also not sure we learnt that much about the cornerback position in this one. It still looks like a weak area that will need to be further addressed.

Seattle has plenty of cap space. It’ll be interesting to see what strings they have to pull before week one to ensure Duane Brown and Quandre Diggs take the field.

With Brown, there’s simply no alternative other than making this right.

With Diggs, I’m not sure that’s the case. Seattle has depth at safety and they can’t have every player who is moderately displeased holding out. They don’t want to set that precedent. Calling his bluff might be best. Or even considering trading him. Especially if you can get an upgrade at corner in return.

Quick draft thought from the weekend — I only watched some of one game. UCLA vs Hawaii. If you want a name who shone in that one, check out UCLA running back Zach Charbonnet. He’s 6-1 and 220lbs and ran with explosion, power and quickness. He’s a former four-star recruit who has transferred from Michigan.

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  1. Henry Taylor

    What a welcome improvement that was! I think our RB room looks pretty deep which will be very important; Collins looked great today, Dallas has shown great stuff throughout preseason (was he injured or just rested as the now presumed 3rd down back?) plus I’ve liked what I’ve seen from Josh Johnson. Depth at this position would be a huge boost.

    LB, at least Mike and Will, also looks impressive. Cody Barton is playing his best ball and this John Ratigan guy from Army made some great plays, I was particularly impressed with the pass breakup. Oh and Belore can still play a little D as well.

  2. James P

    At last, something resembling proper football! I really hope they find a way to keep Collins. Hopefully Bellore playing both ways frees up a spot to carry 5 RBs. My concern is that he’s the odd man out and they stick with Penny. Just based on the preseason games, to my eyes Penny has been the least impressive back out of him, Collins, Dallas and Johnson. I thought Collins in particular today looked excellent, would have no problems with him as our #2.

    • Rob Staton

      Collins should be a lock for the roster

      Cut Penny or Dallas or whoever

      • James P

        100% agree – just bracing myself…

      • Ty the Guy

        Stash Homer on the practice squad or trade Penny for a late round pick. I remember I laughed when they drafted Penny. Then I got hopeful at his talent. Now I have to face it that he looks the part, but only wants to bounce things outside, cut your losses, get whatever value you can.

        Spot on Rob, Collins is the #2.

        • Rob Staton

          I know Dallas made some plays last week but he and Homer are the definition of replacement level

          Collins must be kept

          • James Cr.

            The only thing is that Homer is by far and away the best pass blocking back. If Penny wasn’t a high pick would anyone want to keep him? He looks to me like someone who doesn’t really want to be out there. Totally agree on Collins, you have to keep him.

          • cha

            I doubt Dallas is going anywhere. He ran well and consistently provided a spark in the kick return game. They’re not going to let Reed return kicks and they have to be careful with Brown and Eskridge.

            • Rob Staton

              Then that’s fine, he can be a return man.

              But he ain’t good enough at RB. They can’t cut Collins, he has to be chief backup to Carson

              • cha

                Collins has proven worthy for sure. But I definitely think Dallas has shown enough to earn a spot at RB.

                Call him whatever you like, Bellore isn’t going anywhere.

                It’s down to Penny and Homer.

                And Pete seems infatuated with Homer.

                Which leaves us with Penny.

                • Lewis

                  Homer also plays a lot on special teams, doesn’t he? There would be some dead money if we cut Penny, but I don’t see how they justify keeping him.

                  • cha

                    Yes Homer does.

                    There is dead money for cutting Penny but not enough to factor into the decision.

                  • Mike

                    I think my value of Penny just keeps falling. Collins better be #2 after the last performance. He was decisive and took every yard that was available to him, plus made a few more of his own.

                    Penny not only looked slower than in the past, but seemed to shy away from contact and go down without a fight. Frankly, I think Dallas is #3. He played with much more vision and speed than Penny, plus he has ST value.

                    Not sure between Homer and Penny who I’d keep, but Id maybe try to shop Penny to Baltimore since Dobbins is out. Penny at least has the 1st rounder pedigree, which may have some value.

          • DAVID JOAQUIN

            I disagree . Dallas has big time player written all over him. He has in traffic speed and vision is a fantastic receiver (not just catching screens) I do agree with Homer who is most likely to become our fullback

            • Rob Staton

              ‘Big time player’

              Come on

            • BobbyK

              To me Dallas has, “Could be okay and not suck” written all over him. Big time players is for someone who can possibly sniff a Pro Bowl at least once during their careers. Dallas has no chance for that, imo.

              • Rob Staton

                Dallas is a splash player. Very capable of making a nice play or a solid return.

                But the little things — pass pro, leading a rushing attack. I don’t personally have any faith. We saw a year ago when they gave him a bunch of snaps vs SF then a week later they’re getting Bo Scarborough and/or Alex Collins off the street to play instead.

                And how many snaps is he going to need to get the splash play, if he isn’t capable of a more rounded role?

                If he they can find a way to keep him as a return specialist and splash player that’s fine. But it cannot, absolutely cannot, be at the expense of Alex Collins. He looks like the clear RB2.

                • Ty the Guy

                  Correct. If Collins gets cut and Dallas, Penny, and Homer remain it’s a failure in my eyes.

                  Labeling Dallas a splash player may be correct, but if you’re going to do that AND call Collins a “sure thing” off of the one preseason game, then I question your logic. No one was clamoring for Collins to be RB2 until last night’s “splash.”

                  But don’t misunderstand me, I’ve felt Collins had more Marshawn in him than any other back since. Amazing feet, solid toughness. Was a star in the SEC on one of the worst teams. Couldn’t believe it when they cut him a few years back and he showed in BAL that he belongs in the league.

                  Dallas is a special teamer that can fill in if needed. Homer’s ability at gunner can’t be ignored completely, especially when you start projecting the 53 man roster. Which I very much look forward to seeing yours Rob. But given the choice it’s Dallas over Homer.

                  • Rob Staton

                    Labeling Dallas a splash player may be correct, but if you’re going to do that AND call Collins a “sure thing” off of the one preseason game, then I question your logic. No one was clamoring for Collins to be RB2 until last night’s “splash.”

                    Let’s be fair, when did I call Collins a ‘sure thing’?

                    I think he is a very capable back that you can lean on to lead a rushing attack. I think he is clearly the second best running back on the roster. He’s a player I wrote about a ton in college, have tracked his career in the pro’s. He’s had success in prior seasons and seems, after a spell out of the league, to have worked back to something close to his best. Perhaps even reaching a new level of fitness/shape.

                    But I never called him a ‘sure thing’. So let’s be fair here.

                    And you’re misinterpreting what I mean by ‘splash’. It’s not an overall ‘good performance’. Dallas is capable of sparking on a given play — as a returner for example, or on a screen pass. I do not think he’s explosive enough to be a lead runner. I don’t think you can hand him the ball 20 times and be a lead runner. And if his pass-pro isn’t good (it isn’t) it limits even his ability to be in on third downs.

                    Carson + Collins for me is a duo you can roll with and have success. I can’t say the same for Carson + Dallas.

                    And all I’m saying here is there’s no way on earth they should be cutting Collins to retain one or more of Penny, Dallas or Homer. I don’t care which of that group makes it as long as Collins does.

                    Homer’s ability at gunner can’t be ignored completely, especially when you start projecting the 53 man roster. Which I very much look forward to seeing yours Rob.

                    I stopped doing 53 man projections years ago so I won’t be doing one. I just don’t personally have any interest in them.

                • Lewis

                  Absolutely Collins is RB2

                  To me, Dallas isn’t a lead back right now. However, he could be very effective as a receiver out of the backfield and a returner, maybe a change of pace guy. He’s certainly earned a spot. Penny has not.

                  • Hawkdawg

                    The operative, in fact dispositive question on this issue is who would you want to be your lead back, taking most of the carries n a team that wants to emphasize the run, if Carson goes down for any significant period of time, let alone a truly extended period?

                    Penny has never shown he could do this. Neither has Dallas. Collins would clearly be the best choice for bell cow until Carson came back. You don’t risk a solid running game on Carson’s health.

          • Elmer

            Yes, Collins must be kept. It’s obvious that he can help them. But there is a nagging feeling in my gut that they won’t keep him.

      • BruceN

        Collins’ play will challenge Pete’s mantra that your game will determine you’ll play or not, not your draft position or salary. He did that by starting a better looking Wilson over the high priced FA acquisition, Matt Flynn. Let’s see he does the same about Collins and Penny.

        • neil

          I believe I read that Collins was having a problem holding on to the ball in practice. Don’t know what his fumble numbers are over his career but that is a big negative for Pete. Might be why he got so many touches in the game. But he came thru big time.

    • Mick

      It would be such a huge mistake to trade or cut Collins. He is one of the winners of this preseason (I’d add to that Dallas, Curhan, Barton, Robinson, Taylor, perhaps even Hewitt and Green), he has a way of bouncing off tackles that reminds me of what Beast Lynch used to do, and Penny is too injury-prone. I could see them go Carson, Collins, Dallas, Homes, Penny, with Homer at fullback and Bellore at LB, but for a fifth RB, Penny is too expensive.

      As much as I agree with Rob’s idea of sending a signal with Diggs, since we have depth there, Carroll said he can’t imagine not starting Diggs.

      Our 2020 draft with Brooks, Taylor, Lewis, Dallas, Parkinson, Robinson and Swain starts looking like a major hit.

    • Big Mike

      I’m also worried about Collins being the odd man out in favor of Penny. I doubled down on that concern when he came out and played in the 2nd half which made me wonder if they were showcasing him for other teams. Someone please talk me down from that ledge.

      • Mike

        Not giving Penny the 5th year option I think communicates a bit about Penny’s value to the organization. If they felt confident he was an RB1 or even and RB2 with upside, they’d have done that. I think yesterday was a competition for the RB2 role. The clear and obvious winner was shown. I don’t think i saw a single snap of Penny that went well. He didn’t make anyone miss a tackle or lay a physical hit on any defender. You know Pete values that from his RBs.

        I know that the decisions that get made can be irksome, but I dont they are that aloof. I think Penny is looking an awful lot like Cristian Michel did a few years back.

    • Sean

      I thought Penny looked like he usually looks to me: bad between the tackles, not particularly elusive, but quite fast. He seems like the kind of player that could be pretty successful in the right scheme, but we are not creative enough to get much out of him. Basically he has some talent, but not talent that we will put to good use. So time to give Collins the job and move in from Penny.

      • AlaskaHawk

        I want to see more of Johnson, he should be battling with Dallas over that third position.
        and cut or trade Penny, they have tried him long enough.

        • MikeB

          Jonson did play well with the snaps he had, but I guess its hard for me to justify him making the team, so I haven’t gotten invested in him. Maybe his performance will land him a soot on the Practice squad or another team.

  3. Bankhawk

    Great write-up Rob; I only had a chance to see the highlights, but based on your piece, we saw the same thing.
    I do have to admit, that if they let Collins go after what I’ve seen, it will wreck me-at least for a minute. Back in the season he was making hay with the Ravens, I was already regretting letting him go.
    And I felt that the O line exceeded my expectations somewhat as well. Though I admit, that sans Brown, I’d mentally set the bar low.

  4. My Time

    With Taylor finally looking like a second round pick the addition of Atkins can make us a top 15 D, hopefully cover our lack of talent at corner. Also can this Wright saga be over crazy his still a free agent.

  5. Bigsteviej

    That play where Jamarco Jones was still in his set stance when the Chargers’ RDE had already gotten to Geno was remarkable. Must’ve been confused about the snap count, but still, he should’ve seen that guy go by him. Need Duane out there.

    • Big Mike

      I mentioned this last night. Terrible utter lack of awareness.

  6. Sea Mode

    Let’s not overlook the continued greatness of our best weapon…

    • Sean

      Please, oh please, do not call him a ‘weapon’…he’ll want Jamal Adams money.

    • cha

      Amen. Dude’s a rock star.

  7. Big Mike

    One more comment as it concerns Collins………….sadly just the fact that a bunch of us have come in here expressing concern that he’ll be cut or traded tells me we all know damned good and well it’s a legit concern, even if it ends up not happening.

    • David Joaquin

      good news is he did show up last year as well …downside for him is he fumbled alot in practice but Damn he looks good!

  8. Sean

    On the failure to have a good backup QB, I used to think it mattered but not so sure any more. I thought it was fine when they had Tarvaris as a backup. But for the last few years, the roster and coaching weaknesses have made the team absolutely dependent on Wilson’s talent. It seems to me that at least for the last 3 years or so, if Russell goes down, the team will lose. Period. So a better backup QB wouldn’t change that dynamic.

    However, now with the weapons on offense and a hopefully decent O-line, and maybe even a more QB-friendly scheme from Waldron that allowed Goff to have decent performances, a backup QB would be more important.

    • bmseattle

      I always thought that the narrative about drafting a QB each year was that if they show in pre season, they have trade value.
      If you happen to hit on a Jimmy Garoppolo type, you can get huge value back, potentially.

  9. Bigsteviej

    Colts’ starting LT, Sam Tevi, apparently out with an ACL tear. His replacement, Eric Fisher, is still recovering from injury and won’t be ready for the opener. So, a second to thrid string LT starting against the Seahawks week 1.

    • Bigsteviej

      Also TY Hilton to miss the opener with a ?neck injury.

    • DancingBuddha

      Nelson may or may not play, he’s gonna miss about 2 weeks rehab now because Covid listed

    • Scot04

      I don’t believe Tevi was going to be the starting LT anyways. It says he was surpassed by others on the depth chart. Will be a good team either way. We will get to see where Seattle truly is at overall.

  10. DancingBuddha

    As someone who has long moaned over the refs taking over pre-season games, the only thing I can think of is that theyre also using them as dry runs to practice calls based on certain “looks” etc. I dunno. But the whimsical and “lets see if it sticks” nature of some of them have a lot of feel of a team trying out situations so as to be prepared for actual games that count

    • Sean

      I agree. The league changes it’s rules and enforcement of the years every year. I’m in favor of the refs getting this stuff figured out in these preseason games. It makes the regular season better.

  11. Call Me AL

    Now comes the interesting questions. First up, do they keep Alex Collin’s? (this just makes so much sense, but were talking PC here) I thought both young tackles Curhan and Forsythe looked promising, do they make the cut? Do they sign Geno Atkin’s? Bring back KJ? (how can they not do this move, he would obviously improve the defense and bolster the LB corps) Is there anything that can be done for the teams weakest link at this point, the corner back position? Can they bolster their depth after the final cuts to 53? Is Shane Waldron the answer to Russell Wilson finally getting his first MVP award??

    Stay tuned, the answers to these questions and many more will be answered in the coming weeks!

  12. Big Mike

    Most folks likely already know, but the rosters must be set at 53 on Tuesday at 1:00 PM Pacific time.

  13. cha

    Just sad seeing Collier out there with the scrubs late in the 4th quarter. And not doing much of anything.

    • Rob Staton

      Not good enough

      • cha

        Team ethos is going to get a real test in the final 53 this year.

        If they aren’t talking to Atkins and KJ, and are intent on continuing to have Darrell Taylor and Alton Robinson as occasional coverage guys, all so they can justify Green and Collier’s presence on the roster and not say, on the practice squad, that’s a real hit to competitiveness.

        • Rob Staton

          I’d have no issue with them shifting on Collier for a bag of footballs and bringing in Geno

        • Big Mike

          Same thing if they keep Penny and cut Collins. You all saw how the other players reacted to that circle back around run by AC.

        • swedenhawk

          Great points. I’d guess Collier and Penny clear waivers. Green at least is still relatively young, so he might get claimed.

  14. Olyhawksfan

    I think Taylor should get some reps at TE.

  15. drrew76

    In a pre-season where Dave Wyman spouted bad take after bad take, he finally outdid himself this game when he argued that Geno Smith was the best backup quarterback in the league.

    • cha

      Geno did a fantastic job with all those checkdowns and passes in the flat.

      Actual NFL throws a QB needs to make against starting defenses? Not so much.

      • Sean

        Dave Wyman said almost everyone is “a really good player” including guys that will be cut and others that have had many chances and never claimed a starting role. It is just useless noise.

    • MikeB

      Hey, at least he got the correct gender for the local gal (gold medalist) who raised the 12th flag. Can’t imagine she enjoyed being referred to as a “he” by Curt Menefee.

  16. Frank

    Definitely feeling like the offense doesn’t miss a beat with Collins in for Carson. For only having 3 picks in the draft, plus one player from last year have to be slightly encouraged bye what the team has looked like as far as what’s been added to the rooster. My complaint about the Hawks for along time now has been getting absolutely manhandled in the trenches. The last couple drafts haven’t been flashy, but appreciate the dedication to drafting offensive and defensive line, albeit with mixed results. It’s been a needed philosophical shift even if you want to point out LJ and Green being relatively disappointing. A lot was said about the offensive line in none to flattering of terms before preseason started but it’s been noticeable quite other than people chirping about how badly Brown needs resigned. Forsyth, Curran, and even Fuller seem to my eye to be playing better than was assumed and even though it’s preseason it’s been noticeable that our defensive line is getting to the opposing QB faster than people are getting to ours. 2nd and third stringers aren’t the best measurements for whether they can play or not but can see why the Hawks would want to test what they have before resigning Brown, and why Brown would be nervous to get a deal done before the team finds out if they can or can’t live without him. Am I miss reading this, or has it really been the Hawks have been solid in the trenches and the last couple games have been a lack of quality QB play and a very vanilla game plan been hiding improvements overall to the team?

  17. Rob Staton


    I still can’t believe the Seahawks, with their clear preference at RB in terms of running style, drafted Penny over the other players available.

    It’s incredible really.

    • cha

      Remember “Penny needs to run between the tackles more” ?


    • MychestisBeastmode

      We talk about this every year at our fantasy draft, “how the hell did we not draft Chubb!?”

    • swedenhawk

      Such a disappointment. Collins looks like a grown man by comparison.

    • J.P.

      Not that hard to believe really. I wouldn’t have put it past them to have similar thoughts when they looked at Penny:

      He also had no injury flags. It’s easy to see why they would. I don’t have to agree with the logic or assessment, I just understand why it might be so in hindsight.

      • Rob Staton

        You’ve missed the point I’m making though.

        I’m strictly talking about the type of runner they absolutely crave. It’s all about running style.

        And they went totally against it with Penny.

        Your counter is more appropriate for an argument of ‘I don’t know how X (any) team would do it’

        My point was specifically about how much Seattle has almost exclusively targeted a certain type of runner. Then when they draft one in R1, he’s the opposite of what they have gone for.

        And it’s long since been revealed how much PCJS regret that.

        • Sean

          I think Penny was drafted following the season when Russell was our leading rusher and injuries caused us to use a combination of Rawls, Davis, Prosise, etc. And Lacy. The run blocking was bad and RB injuries were bad. Given that, I don’t think it was that surprising that they went for a projected 1st round RB that had a lot of hype about how he led the country in breaking tackles, which is helpful with a bad O-line, and he had a clean injury history.

          I think the team was reacting to the previous season. I can see how they got there. Whether that is a good way of approaching the issue, I don’t know…there is obviously a trade-off between overreacting to the past and stubbornly doing what you’ve always done even when it no longer works. I generally think Pete is really poor at managing this trade-off.

          • Rob Staton

            1. Penny was not projected to go in round one

            2. As with JP’s comment, you’re missing the point I’m making. I was commenting on running style. And there were other running backs, with plenty of positives too, who had Seattle’s preferred running style. And they passed on them for Penny. This is/was surprising because there might not be another team in the NFL with as much clarity on what the chosen physical profile and running style of their RB’s is.

            • KD

              Penny was the 2nd RB off the board in that draft after Saquan Barkley. Could have picked Nick Chubb. FML 🙁

            • Sean

              1. The link above from J.P. is literally PFF calling Penny a first round talent.

              2. I’m not missing the point at all. I just do not find their choice as incredible as you do. You’ve demonstrated clearly this for years – they have a pretty narrow range of what they look for in RBs. I’m not saying they made a good choice or that they made a choice in line with their drafting history, but I can see why Penny was attractive to them given how the previous season went.

              • Rob Staton

                PFF might’ve said it but nobody else was

                And yes Sean, you literally have missed the point I was making. You are arguing something that is irrelevant to the point I made specifically about his running style. It’s nothing to do with why he was attractive to them or how others graded him or whether it was a good choice.

  18. Brik

    Disappointed because I went out to eat and the game froze after the strip sack TD. I missed a bunch of good stuff apparently. Our defense is starting to show promise, although I’m not sure if Herbert was playing for the Chargers. Seems like the Chargers have a top heavy team as well. It was nice to see we have better depth than another team though. Wish I saw Eskridge and Darrel Taylor play. I know I was all in on us drafting Kellen Mond, so seeing him show progress upset me. Seeing Eskridge be good might make me feel better. From what I hear, Darrel Taylor is starting to sound like a steal in the 2nd round. A lot of rookies spend their first year prepping to be an NFL player. No surprise that he’s showing promise now.

    • Rob Staton

      Herbert didn’t play

  19. cha

    Ian Rapoport
    Compensation update: The #Jets are sending the SF 6th to Houston for Lawson.
    Quote Tweet
    Ian Rapoport
    · 17m
    Source: The #Jets are trading for #Texans edge Shaq Lawson.

  20. cha

    Mike Golic Jr
    · 21m
    Vikings and All-Pro Safety Harrison Smith have agreed to a 4-year, $64 million extension, per source. The deal makes Smith the second highest-paid safety in the NFL at the age of 32.

  21. Paul Cook

    I’ve read most of the post game commentary from local pundits and the comments from posters here on last night’s game. I’m in agreement with a bunch of them.

    –I like what cha said about the test of team “ethos”. I was thinking the same thing a few days ago. Keep the guys with the higher ceilings and/or those who have shown the most in their desire to play and succeed.

    –It’s hard to tell exactly what’s in a man’s/player’s heart, but I just don’t see near the desire in Penny as I do in Collins or even Deejay. Penny may well be more naturally talented, but so what

    –I’m open to cutting our losses on Collier as well. Keep Green and do try to sigh Geno Atkins. I’ll risk the age and injury concerns for a chance at a solid year or two out of him

    –Revelation. Darrell Taylor actually does have some edge pass rushing skill. He has that dip-and- bend around-the-tackle move all goof edge rusher’s need, but I also saw a decent shake-off-the-tackle-and-turn-inside move a few times. I want to see more

    –I still have little confidence in any of our second tier OLmen pre 2021 becoming viable starters for us, Haynes, Jones, Simmons (I once thought he might be), Ogbuehi, Pocic…I want to see new guys given a real chance, and it would be nice to add a solid vet to the OL before we get into the season. I could be wrong about this, but show me something more. Please

    –I’m still real excited about Eskridge. Mere talent aside for the moment, opposing defenses could suffer from a real fingers-in-the-dike problem in terms of coverage with us that Eskridge could really exploit and benefit from. In other words, by mere default he might get opportunities to make big plays this year with us that he wouldn’t have with other teams

    –I truly wonder if KJ is even on the radar screen of PC/JS now? It would be great to have him back, and it would give our young DE’s a chance to better shine and employ their physical gifts

    –Cody Barton finally showing signs of life. He just hasn’t looked like the player I saw in college since he came on board

    –I have no idea about our CB situation. Talking about a work in progress. It could go in more than two different directions

    –Brown and Diggs…an effing headache. I just want it to go away

    Anyway…feeling a bit better overall by some of the things I’ve recently seen.

    • cha

      A low-key good thing about Taylor. The Seahawks gave him extensive snaps to get as much development in the preseason as possible, and he handled them without any physical problems.

      Not saying every little concern is in the past, but sometimes you have to just see what a guy can do.

      Battleships are safe in the harbor, but that’s not what they’re built for.

      • Paul Cook

        Yup. He had one of those more obscure injuries where you wondered if it was a forever-injury, something that just couldn’t be fixed near 100%, like a ACL tear can these days.

  22. Rob Staton

    Will be jumping on a live stream at 1:30pm PST

    Follow along live by watching the video at the top of the article

  23. RustyD

    Say, I haven’t heard a definitive answer to what I think is an important long term question; with Taylor out injured in his entire rookie season, did his contract toll? Do the Seahawks still have four remaining years of club control?

  24. L80

    Holy crap, Collins should be a LOCK…Goodbye Homer, I could care less about your blocking prosess when we see an RB that can actually make moves AND truck defenders PLUS catch the ball. This is a NO BRAINER.

    Maybe and hopefully Barton has finally “got it”. That being said, hire KJ Wright and do it immediately.

    CB is a glaring weakness. Not sure what the answer is a mere 2 weeks before the opener but dang, the Hawks are as thin as ever.

  25. pauldifuria .

    Collins knows how to do traditional Irish dance. Seeing a big tough dude with dreads doing it is surprising in the best way. When asked why he learned, he said he thought it would help with his footwork.

    My favorite bit of the game is when he ran up the middle and nothing was there. He raised his right leg, paused long enough for the defensive lineman to fall. Then he hopped over him on his left leg, landing on the same leg and immediately cut right for two yards.

    Not much but sometimes two yards can prove to be the difference. He literally Riverdanced through the line of scrimmage. Love it – bringing his own personality and flair to the game. I’m rooting for him.

  26. Balint

    What do you think, will Cade Johnson make the 53 roster? Cheering for him since I saw the interview you made with him, Rob. I think there is no chance for cutting him and get him back to the practice squad.

    • Rob Staton

      I think he’ll land on the practise squad

    • James P

      Really really hope so. I think it’s between him, Hart and Fuller for the final 2 spots.

      • Ashish

        I like Fuller but probably Hart is hawks favorite

    • uptop

      My money is on the Seahawks going light on the number of WRs in the initial 53, only DK, Tyler, swain, Eskridge and Hart

  27. Palatypus

    Hurricane Ida put a tree on my cousin Vicki’s roof and tore a hole in the roof of my cousin Mary. I know with only three pre-season games there is an extra week to prepare that it is unlikely the Green Bay game will be moved from New Orleans, but it is possible. Especially since there is the COVID-Delta outbreak.

    Here in Pensacola, we have been under tornado and flood watch all day. This is a big hurricane.

    For anyone who wants to know what being in a hurricane is like, imagine walking through a car wash…for ten hours.

    • Rob Staton

      Hope all is well Palatypus. Stay safe

      • Palatypus


        • BobbyK

          All our best!

          • Palatypus

            Thank you. Got hit by Sandy last year. The worst part is trying to find things at the store right before. Fuel, toilet paper, water. Had to buy a generator for our relatives in Alabama because they can’t be found anywhere right now.

            That and dealing with your family.

  28. Forrest

    I’m still sad they didn’t draft Creed Humphrey when he was available.

    • clbradley17

      Or C Josh Myers.

  29. Forrest

    As for “With Brown, there’s simply no alternative other than making this right.”

    What needs to be made right? He has a contract.

    • Rob Staton

      Give him a new one then.

      Or maybe you’re the kind of person happy to see Russell Wilson get killed in pass pro.

    • Sean

      Without Brown, the chance of a deep playoff run is near zero. The chance of Russell staying more than a year will also suffer a lot. Sure Brown has a contract, but it isn’t that simple. Teams renegotiate contracts all the time.

    • Brik

      Need to get Brown paid more. He’s definitely underpaid for how good he is. Maybe do a 1 year extension with 12.5 million this year and 16.5 million next. That’s just some random #s, but it should be close. Quandre Diggs is another story. He wasn’t great until he was brought into the Seahawks system. It’s hard for me to say since we don’t have a deep secondary, but my instinct is to trade him for another secondary guy like CJ Henderson and 4th rounder. Might backfire; Can’t pay everyone before their contracts are up though.

    • Big Mike

      Why is it that so many people say “he has a contract” when it comes to players but no one ever says the owner/mgmt should honor a contract when a player is cut with time left on his deal, usually non-guaranteed, but it’s still a damned contract that the team agreed to.

      • Sean


      • pdway

        agreed…esp w how short the average NFL career is.

      • jeff

        Because the owners do honor the contract, every time. The NFL does not guarantee contracts for good reason. As long as it remains a capped league, neither fans nor players should be asking for guaranteed contracts. Teams would face too much risk of tying up their cap space on injured players. They would offer shorter deals and less money to mitigate this risk.

        And Brown is in no danger of being cut, in any case.

        I think Seattle should have been proactive and gotten an extension that works for both parties long ago, but Brown is the only one not honoring the contract.

  30. Tecmo Bowl

    Blair really stood out yesterday. He seemed ready to hit anything that moved out there.
    Looking forward to seeing Adams, Wagner, Brooks and Blair patrol the middle of the field in nickel. They should force some business decisions for WRs and wreck havoc in the backfield.

  31. Palatypus

    Looking for something else completely, I stumbled upon Rob Rang’s video of center Kyle Fuller doing a pancake block last night.

    • Balint

      on a linebacker with 230 lbs. Fuller is around 300 I guess 🙂

  32. cha

    Def PFF

    Green and Collier, yuck

    Darrell Taylor with an 88 coverage grade

    • cha

      Off PFF

      Stone Forsythe 79

      Kyle Fuller 21.5 pass blocking grade

      • Paul Cook

        PLEASE…let some new OLman surprise and give me hope. With the exception of Lewis, we haven’t done well drafting OLmen in recent years. I think we made a mistake by not drafting some real potential there at either the C or OT position in the last few years.

    • Palatypus

      Jon Rattigan!

    • Rob Staton

      And Taylor’s run defense grade… 25.2

      Collier and Green grading as they did, playing the snaps they did, against the opponent they played, sums them both up perfectly.

      • Palatypus

        How much stock should we put in these grades?

        • Rob Staton

          Well that’s one of the big debating points in the NFL.

          But they are also the only people grading every player on every play

      • swedenhawk

        really like taylor’s speed and bend off the edge, and i’m glad that he’s in a position to contribute this year. but i hate to see him consistently getting washed out by the TE on run plays.

  33. Paul Cook

    I really like Amadi. But I have to admit it seems like he’s either leveled off or taken a small step back from what I’ve seen lately. Sometimes it’s just growing and learning pains. I don;t know. He’s an enthusiastic player who has a spot on this team whatever that may be in the end.

  34. swedenhawk

    A show about nothing? How’s this for a title: Rob Your Enthusiasm
    Send up the trolls and cement your status as the Larry David of Seahawks fandom in one fell swoop!

    • Rob Staton


    • clbradley17

      Pretty, pretty, pretty good

  35. clbradley17

    Patriots traded a 2023 5th and ’22 7th for Shaun Wade, CB from Ohio St., Ravens 5th rounder in ’21. He had 25 coverage snaps and no receptions with 1 int. in 1st 2 preseason games.

  36. UkAlex6674

    No doubt Collins should make the roster, but for me, he’s got a Christine Michael vibe about him I.e. shows enough to keep you interested but ultimately won’t be able to fully deliver.

    • DC

      Pretty sure not very long ago he had a 1k yard season with the Ravens…..much more than Michael ever did.

      • UkAlex6674

        He was just shy of 1k in 2017, still a good season though. For me, I won’t be comfortable having to trust him with the workload if/when Carson goes down. I’d love to be wrong though, because that means any Carson injury wouldn’t potentially derail the season.

        • Hawkdawg

          He is far better equipped to take on that workload than any other back currently on our roster, after Carson. So the question is how much we want to gamble that Carson won’t be out for a long stretch, or at least unavailable for several games. I wouldn’t want to make that bet, personally.

          • UkAlex6674

            Exactly Hawkdawg and that says it all about the RB group.

  37. GoHawksDani

    My first preseason game I was able to get myself to watch.
    It was a fun game, and we should celebrate and be happy, but do not get ahead of ourselves (not pointing to Rob, just as general Hawks fans).
    The team didn’t play great, just the Chargers played really bad. There were some spark and some pretty nice moments too. But it’s not because the Hawks dominated a good team on the field. They were just better than a really bad set of players.

    Taylor flashed nice, I agree he should bring the pressure and do almost only that. BUT I won’t be mad if they drop him on blitzes (much better than dropping Poona for example, lol). Just from an eye-test, he somewhat similar to Irvin for me. Probably worse in space, but he can develop. And his body seems similar.

    Collins should be RB2. He lacks inside running capabilities and dances a bit too much in the backfield, but he’s a dynamic guy, who can bust out some bigger runs and has good vision and evasion capabilities.
    I’d try to trade Penny, hopefully for maybe an R4, but I’d take an R6 for him
    Homer and Dallas could be specialists (3rd down, blocking and in the return game). I know some of the commenters here love Johnson, but I didn’t see anything special out of him in this game. We could try to stash him on PS, but I wouldn’t keep a roster spot for him

    Eskridge seemed cool, I like him. But the WR room feels a bit thin. DK, Lockett, Eskridge…is there anyone who clearly separated himself from the rest? I couldn’t tell

    As for the LBs, Bobby, Brooks are cool, but I’d be happy with a KJ re-sign. I think Barton is a good backup, but not a starter. His flashes came from bad offense and not great plays. On his sack-FF he was totally unblocked against a backup QB, so while it’s a cool moment, he wouldn’t produce that against good OL and vet QB. Tbh Bellore played pretty good LB for a guy who does a little bit of everything. And the Army player was also pretty good

    The safety group is solid. We have Adams, Neal, Blair, and some OK rotational/backup players. We might also have Diggs, but if he has big demands, and we can trade him for like a 4th or maybe a player (CB, DT?) I’m OK with that too.

    CB group sucks hands down. I don’t think we have a clear starter. Reed seemed good but only for one year, and not even a whole year if I remember correctly on the outside. Flowers is awful, cut him immediately. He’s always grabbing. The other guys didn’t seemed much impressive either.

    OL, DL played OK, but against backups so yeah, I don’t think we can get much information how would they do against starters.

    It’ll be interesting to see who’ll make the final cut, and also how this team with the starters and maybe some guys who played in this game too will handle regular season

  38. Paul Cook

    A very interesting 2-3 days forthcoming starting at 1:00pm pacific time tomorrow. Who will be our 53 chosen roster players? Who will fill out the injury lists? Who will be reclaimed from the original 80 players to our practice squad of 16? What vets will become available for signing at key positions? What players will be claimed by other teams that we cut that we might have wanted for our practice squad?

    There’s nothing quite like this that I can think of as far as mass player movement goes in sport. Crazy time to be a GM or HC. There’s always surprises.

    Also, it’s strange to have this extra week to prepare for your first game. Waldron has got some extra time to focus on this first opponent. I’m sure he doesn’t want to disappoint.

    • cha

      I think the biggest surprise for me each year is the guys who don’t make the 53 but also don’t get signed for the practice squad. They’ll start with 90 and trim down to 53, and only like 3-4 of the guys on the PS are guys who appeared on the 90.

  39. cha

    Mike Garafolo
    Sixth-round pick in 2022 back to the #Bills, team announces.
    Quote Tweet
    Ian Rapoport
    · 36m
    Source: The #Bills are trading DE Darryl Johnson to the #Panthers.

    Turning a 7th round pick into a future 6th. Not bad.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m waiting for the Seahawks to turn some money into Geno Atkins

      • cha

        That and the Seahawks to turn a 1st and 3rd into a couple 6ths (RG & LJC)

        • Paul Cook

          Watching the Seahawks pre-season telecasts, Dave Wyman’s got this this real Jones for RG. He keeps talking him up as a vital cog in our DL rotation.

          • cha

            He’s had a good preseason. He forced the sack that Hyder and Taylor shared, just couldn’t wrap up the QB.

            But it’s not the first time he’s shined against scrubs.

  40. Jordan

    Good to see Malik McDowell possibly getting his life back on track. I know that I wouldn’t want the worst of my early 20s to define the rest of my life.

    • Paul Cook

      If he makes the Browns’ roster and plays this year for them, we deserve a compensatory pick for him.

  41. Max

    Carson Wentz on COVID list.Don’t think he’ll be ready wk 1

    • Mick

      Last year taught us not to be too cheerful about playing against backup QBs. And the Colts have a pretty tough D.

    • Sea Mode

      No TY either:

      Zak Keefer
      ·Aug 29

      Frank Reich on TY Hilton’s status: “He’s been evaluated for a neck injury. He was experiencing some discomfort on the trip to Detroit, so we had some scans. It’s a disc issue.”

      “He will miss some games — we’re optimistic it’s not season-ending.”

  42. cha

    Ian Rapoport
    Trade: The #Giants are trading BJ Hill to the #Bengals and receiving former first-rounder Billy Price.

  43. Sea Mode

    Seems like he’ll never stick anywhere…

    Adam Schefter

    Patriots have released safety Adrian Colbert, per source.

  44. Denver Hawker

    I’m eager to see the 53, but it doesn’t feel as suspenseful as years past. Felt like prior teams had more depth that made this process challenging. Not necessarily a bad thing with solid starters, but wish I was more excited.

    The most anticipation I have now is wondering whether the Hawks will take dead money to cut Penny, Collier, Green. I’m sure they’ll keep them for depth, but disappointing careers this far.

  45. RyanL

    Marvin Wilson waived in Cleveland. Will be interesting to see if Seattle puts in a claim but can’t be a good sign of his offseason performance if cut a day before the deadline.

    • uptop


    • Rob Staton

      Hard pass

      Overrated throughout the draft process, was never a R1 type despite all the draft twitter types hyping him up. Showed at the combine he’s nowhere near the athlete he used to be.

      On his way in and out of the league very quickly it appears

  46. cha

    Brock makes a sound case for Collins over Penny. (bold mine)

    “I think Rashaad still has a higher ceiling, I think he has more home run capability, but I think Alex Collins is a lot more doubles, and doubles, and doubles,” said Huard, using a baseball analogy to compare the two backs. “Penny, it feels it’s either a single or a home run. There’s very little in between there.”

    That’s not the only reason Huard has for saying Collins deserves to be Seattle’s No. 2 running back to start the regular season on Sept. 12 against the Indianapolis Colts.

    “If this is about competition and ‘compete every day,’ Alex Collins has been durable and available in camp, he’s slimmer, his feet look as good as they did back in the day in college when I saw him play multiple times and rush for over 1,000 yards every season for Bret Bielema (at Arkansas),” he said. “I think going into this week, the message that sends to your team as well is you got to go out there and earn it. Don’t care that you’re a first-round pick. You’ve been out, Rashaad Penny, which has been the case for the entirety of your career as a Seahawk.

    • Rob Staton

      Brock is right

      • Nick

        Only thing I’d change is “single” to “strikeout”.

    • Big Mike

      If Collins isn’t part of the 53, they’re gong to use “fumbling in practice” as the excuse. It’ll be perfect because we didn’t see the practices. It’ll also be as Rob put it on the podcast, total shit.

  47. Sea Mode

    Center watch…

    Ian Rapoport

    A surprise: The #Dolphins have released C Matt Skura, source said.

    Has the measurements we like, but only a 49.1 PFF grade in 2020. (34 of 36 centers)

  48. cha

    If Travis Homer makes the roster I’m starting a petition to have his name plate removed from his jersey and “PASS PLAY” sewn in its place.

    • Jordan

      hahaha yep! Or PASS PRO.

      The two things that he does exceedingly well – pass protection and kick coverage – are exactly what you want from your bottom of the depth chart RBs. Far from a star, but the type of role player that every team needs.

      • James Cr.

        That is something I really hope Waldron is good at – utilize the players strengths. Lets throw some screens or sweeps with Homer, not run him up the middle…like ever please.

    • Ashish

      I thought I was odd man out for not liking Homer. Glad to see your post. Okay he is average/good (not great for sure) in pass protection that means nothing if we can’t avg runner. Special team guy and Okay pass protection should not win a roster spot over Alex.

      • DC

        I agree Homer is limited in what he can do. However I think he’s a really good 2 min offense RB and 3rd and med/long RB. I think he carries more value in that alone than Penny does, plus he’s a great special teamer.

        If there’s just a minimal dead cap hit on Penny, my RBs are Carson, Collins, Homer, Johnson and Dallas if they keep 5. Think Dallas would easily make it to the PS. Nellore reserve but makes it as LB.

  49. SebA

    Rob, thanks for all your coverage as ever. I remember you talking positively about Will Grier back during his draft year – having just been cut by the Panthers, is he someone you’d want the Seahawks to take a look at to have someone more exciting than Geno as a backup?

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