Seahawks make playoffs and pick no earlier than #21

The Seahawks won the NFC West title today with a 16-6 victory over St. Louis. Defeat would have ended the season and meant Seattle would own the 8th overall pick in the 2011 NFL Draft.

Instead, the Saints will visit for the start of the playoffs next Saturday.

What does it mean for the draft?

The top twenty will now look like this (confirmed):

#1 Carolina
#2 Denver
#3 Cincinnati
#4 Buffalo
#5 Arizona
#6 Cleveland
#7 San Francisco
#8 Tennessee
#9 Dallas
#10 Washington
#11 Houston
#12 Minnesota
#13 Detroit
#14 St. Louis
#15 Miami
#16 Jacksonville
#17 New England (from Oakland)
#18 San Diego
#19 New York Giants
#20 Tampa Bay

The St. Louis Rams will pick 14th overall after dropping to 7-9. Victory for the Seahawks leads to at least a 13-pick swing. Should Seattle exit the playoffs before the NFC Championship game, they will have the 21st overall selection. They can pick 29th by winning two playoff games, 31st for reaching the Super Bowl and 32nd for winning it.

It also means the Seahawks will pick 21st in every subsequent round.

I’ll discuss what this means in terms of the draft and how it may affect the Seahawks tomorrow.


  1. Matt

    And so much for getting a QB. Charlie has to start, no? Hass has done nothing this year. It wouldn’t shock me if we win 4 games next year. I just do not want Hass on the roster next year.

    • T-Town

      I agree with you 110%.

      But I have a feeling that Hasselbeck will be the starter on Saturday because he is a veteran with playoff experience and Whitehurst is not.

      The only plus is that the Saints are really banged up right now and it will be in Qwest.

    • Rob

      Whitehurst should start, he earned it. We’ll see if he does though.

    • jim

      Top 15 Draft Pick does not guarantee anything. Some say Curry#4 = Bust. Patriots #27 last year Devin McCourty = ProBowl.

      I have better faith in the current front office to find the right players. I think we need another lineman with alittle nasty to get those 1 yard runs that we cant seem to make every game.

      About 1/2 the NFL quarterbacks who are first rounders are bust. Unless you are like top 5. Most starters are like later round picks.

      • Matt

        Problem is it’s about 1/50 late round QBs that amount to anything at all. Every position is a gamble. You better your chances with a higher round QB, which is why they are higher picks.

      • Rob

        I don’t have the exact numbers Jim but the majority of succesful QB’s in the NFL are first round picks. There will be busts, stars and average starters just like every other position. There are never guarantees and a guy like Josh Freeman doesn’t last into the teens if the 2009 draft was repeated. But you make a judgement on what you see and I think this is a very good year for QB’s. The line can be improved without spending the #21 pick on a guard – and I can’t think of one worthy of the choice anyway. But the Seahawks best bet to find a long term QB is via the first round of the draft – at least until they find another way to fill the role.

  2. Shane

    Looking at that draft order, as far as getting a quarterback goes, drafting 8th would hardly have been better than 21st. You could reasonably that all teams picking 1 through 7 need a QB. If just half of those teams pick a QB then 3 or 4 QBs go before 8, and the Seahawks would be able to pick the 4th or 5th “best” QB. Even in a deep QB draft, the 4th or 5th QB taken is hardly franchise caliber. And, in my amateur opinion, I don’t think there’s any way Locker falls to Shanahan at 12.

    This game changed my opinion on Whitehurst. I love what Hass gave us, and I’d prefer if he started (if healthy) next week, but he needs to be allowed to leave. I’m intrigued at the possibility of Whitehurst starting next year, especially given the reality that there definitely won’t be a QB at 21 that will be ready to start immediately.

    As for the draft pick, late first round is the perfect spot to grab the top interior offensive lineman. That line is horrendous. Then go sign Vincent Jackson as a free agent.

    • Rob

      Hi Shane,

      Extremely valid points on the QB situation even with the #8 pick. At this early stage I would project that Luck, Newton and Gabbert would be off the board before Seattle was on the clock. Rightly or wrongly I expect this team is very high on Locker – as are the Redskins – largely due to scheme and upside. Picking 8th could’ve secured Locker comfortably in my opinion. I would be surprised if he went earlier than that. We’ll see what happens – some teams will give Locker a grade in round 3/4 and others will see him as a top ten talent. It really is that much of a contrast. If Seattle made an ambitious move up the board, there’s little Washington can do to stop it. Tough to do though without a third round pick. We’ll see what happens.

      I disagree on the interior lineman suggestion though. I only see Pouncey as a legit first rounder on the interior – and he will be a center at the next level like his brother. Seattle will re-sign Spencer I think. He can play guard, but he’s not an elite prospect at the position. They can improve the line gradually but that wouldn’t be a good spot to do it in my opinion. I like Rodney Hudson in round two.

      • Shane

        Could Hudson fall to Seattle’s spot in the 2nd? I’m pretty sure I remember him at the end of some of your earlier mocks, and I’m not sure how far he’s fallen in the second. A CB in the first would be perfectly fine by me.

        Unrelated question: how many places did the Seahawks drop in the second round by winning? It’s my understanding that tie-break orders flip in the 2nd, 4th, etc. Is that correct?

        • Blake

          I was curious about that as well so I checked last year’s draft. Cinci had the 21st pick in the 1st round, and stayed around there for the next 6 rounds: 22, 20, 22, 21, 22, 21.

          I don’t have a problem with us winning tonight as some fans may. Sure, we will embarass ourselves on national tv next saturday. We will also be “that team” in the record books. As far as draft position goes, nobody really knows who will be available. Did anyone think Griffen was a 4th rounder last year? Even Clausen that late was a surprise. Campbell was supposed to go to the Raiders in round 1 and instead ended up in round 4. Rodgers and Marino were both in the 20s. We all know of guys who were never expected to fall, but did anyways. QBs are no exception. Newton could interview terribly and fall out of the top 20. Opinions on Gabbert differ greatly, and I could see him available with our pick. If Washington doesn’t take Locker, I don’t think anybody else will. Maybe they trade for Kolb. Who knows. The point is that NE, Indy, Baltimore, and Pitt pick in the late 20s every year and still find awesome talent. We have upgraded our roster significantly from top to bottom since this time last year. If we don’t find a QB this offseason, it will be pretty discouraging, but its not like Locker, Gabbert, or Newton could win 10 games next year anyways.

          Also those of us who are thinking that this 13 pick swing is multiplied by 7 rounds are incorrect. We only hold our own 1, 2, and 5 picks by my knowledge. Does anyone know what we got in return for Josh Wilson or Seneca Wallace? I think Wilson might have been a conditional 4/5 and Wallace a conditional 6/7, but I have no way to confirm that and no idea what the conditions were.

          I believe our draft looks like:
          Den (Branch) 4
          Bal (Wilson) 4/5
          Det (Jackson) 6
          6/7 (Wallace) Cle

          Our 3, 4, 6, and 7 picks were spent on Whitehurst, Lynch, Balmer, and Andrews respectively. Lynch might have actually been conditional. Anyone care to varify?

        • Rob

          Hudson has first round talent but I can’t see him going that early just because some will be put off by the lack of size (although I wouldn’t be). It’s hard to judge right now but I think there’s a chance he could fall to Seattle in round two. We’ll see how his stock develops during senior bowl week if he attends.

          Seattle will pick 21st in every round they own their original pick. Because they are 21st overall with a 7-9 record, there’s no tiebreaker. If they had picked 8th overall I believe they would’ve chosen 12th in the second round using that method. But they are locked into 21 for every round now.

          • Matt Q.

            seahawks like big lineman

    • Matt

      No interior lineman would be worth it at 21. Too many other holes at positions that are much tougher to fill. DL and CB come to mind. Jimmy Smith, Cam Jordan, Brandon Harris, etc could be available.

      The line is not good, but I am not sure where everyone gets the idea that first round lineman is the way to a great O line. There are so many teams with great line play that have a 1st round LT and a bunch of mid to late round or even UDF OGs and RTs. Giants, Chiefs, etc haven’t spent a ton of high picks on their line and they have elite run games.

      • Rob

        I’ve said for some time now I think Seattle’s running game and offensive line will be vastly improved the day they can find greater production in the passing game. Better QB/WR play will help the run and the o-line.

        • Matt

          Amen Rob, you are the voice of reason.

        • T-Town

          One thing I think a lot of Hawks fans forget is that Max Unger has been hurt and never even played this year.

          Having him back and healthy next season will be like if we had an extra late first rounder Carrol spent on a Center.

      • Carl

        I agree with getting a CB at #21. Smith and Harris both look incredible, and fit what Carroll’s looking for. I’d be happy with either of those guys… unless of course Locker has a Aaron Rodgers-like fall.

        • Rob

          I think Smith will become a universal top ten pick after the combine. I have him there in my mock already.

      • Blake

        Exactly. Stud CBs are found strictly in the first 2 rounds. Mostly same with WRs. Offensive linemen are found late consistently. Saints starters are 4th, 5th, 5th, 4th, 2nd. Giants are 5th, 2nd, UDFA, UDFA, 3rd. Falcons are 1st, 2nd, 5th, UDFA, UDFA.

        I don’t know why a lot of people on here seem to think our defensive line needs a bunch of work. Clemons is one of the top pass rushers in the league. According to FootballOutsiders, he is 10th in hurries with 2 hurries per game. That is even more amazing with how bad our corners are. I think our four starters up front are 4 of the top 7 players on our defense. Hawthorne, Tatupu, and ET are the others IMO. Terrill and Siavi’i are also good depth up the middle and Brock is an extremely underrated pass rusher from the outside. Throw in Curry playing the line, and the eventual development Dexter Davis and that is a pretty solid rotation. Before Bryant got injured we were the #2 rush defense by YPC. We are not that bad on the d line to warrant a super high pick. If value is there, then sure, but that should definitely not be identified as a positional group of need.

        • Kyle

          Yes, agreed.. Especially on our corners. It is SOOO frustrating to watch our corners play and how many yards are given up due to missed tackles and bad coverage.. Our Corners need attention, period. Look at where seattle sits with the amount of points given up per game. Even with Matt H.’s struggles this year, points were on the board in many games, but our defense gave up way too many points.. No depth, lack of talent in positions, and injury hurt the D..

    • ChavaC

      Did it really change your opinion on Whitehurst? I saw a guy who threw 20 dink and dunk passes and in general could not hit his receivers down field. He ended with a 5.3 ypa, remove one catch and it’s a 3.6. Even on the Ruvell Martin catch, the receiver had to slow way down to come back to the ball (thank god he was wide open). For a guy who was brought in because he had a big arm, Whitehurst’s accuracy is not winning me over. Short sideline passes will work against the Rams, sure, but he’s probably going to need to orchestrate on the upwards of 30 points next week against a much better defense. As it stands right now, I don’t know if he could drop 30 on the Cardinals, let alone the SB champs.

      Locker – Luck – Mallet – Gabbert – Newton, any of them are potential franchise QBs. We’ll see who declares, but this should be the best QB draft since 2004, and thanks to today we’re on the outside looking in. Even if there was some monster run on QBs, we would have been in excellent position to snag a big time DL/WR/CB prospect who slid.

      But oh well, hopefully Pete can dig up a gem from the back end of the first. Too bad it won’t be quite as an exciting offseason last year.

      • Mr Fish

        It doesn’t really matter what any of us think about Whitehurst. If Carroll and Schneider and Bates still think he has the potential they thought he had when they signed him, it’s very possible that they’ll go with him next year. *We* think they have to take a QB at the top of this draft, but they might not agree.

        Did we really see enough from them in last year’s draft to know what their draft philosophy is? Do they draft for need? Best player available, regardless of need? Best fit for the scheme they want to run? (Do they even know yet what scheme they want to run? It seems to be still evolving…even on defense, where Carroll would seem to have had it all worked out before he came to Seattle. That’s one of the thing I like about his tenure so far. He’s not afraid to experiment.)

      • Rob

        My opinion on Whitehurst hasn’t changed. They still need to draft a quarterback. I think Whitehurst should start next week though because he did play well in a high pressure game.

        I share some of that sentiment ChavaC. This time next week we might wish we could have that #8 after all. If they beat the Saints – maybe not.

      • Shane

        It changed in that previously I wanted Whitehurst solidly on the bench, if not outright cut after this season. Cap or no cap, cutting Whitehurst wouldn’t hurt anything other than Paul Allen’s bank account (see:

        After watching Whitehurst play after a full week of #1 reps, I’m willing to get behind him getting full #1 reps this upcoming offseason and in training camp. He may flame out by week 6, but I don’t think it’s a complete lost cause like I did.

  3. Ryan

    At #8, the price for trading up to the first half-dozen for a shot at Newton/Locker/Gabbert would have been probably a 2nd-rd pick. At #21, doesn’t it become too pricey to trade up that far?

    I was really hoping for #8, and a chance at a good QB.

    • Rob

      According to the (slightly outdated) trade value chart – Seattle’s first and second round picks would be worth 1170 points. That could get them as far as the #13 pick. Adding a fourth rounder will probably get them a pick or two higher. That’s virtually an entire draft on one prospect though.

      • Ryan

        So that pretty much nixes Gabbert

  4. Cliff

    There’s always the chance a QB doesn’t impress in the combine or in interviews and falls to us in the first? But it might be another year of CBJ or we can see what the price for Kolb is. The 21st pick in the first might be more than what other teams are willing to offer.

    • Rob

      Kolb’s reputation goes before him. He was poor against Dallas yesterday and threw three picks. I wouldn’t spend a first round pick on his services.

      I expect a run on QB’s if the all declare which makes it hard to grab one at #21. I’m sure if there’s a guy they must have they’ll do what it takes to get them. It’s difficult now though.

  5. Patrick G.

    First of all… Hell yeah for the playoffs! That was an exciting game, a great statement for Coach Carroll, the defense and Charlie Whitehurst.

    I was very pleased to see your other recent post expand on our San Francisco and Cam Newton discussion yesterday, even though the Newton part is all but certainly for naught now. Ah well, it was fun to dream.

    I will be very interested to see how your next mock shakes out with the Hawks at #21.

    How far did you think CW got in making a statement for getting his shot at QB next year, when combined with our poor draft position for a top QB?

    Hasselbeck’s high-level performance against the Saints last time makes the decision of who will start next week interesting, but after seeing this game I would be extraordinarily surprised (and disappointed) if Hass returned next season. I see as not unlikely a scenario where the Hawks start Hasselbeck against the Saints given his last performance there with 300+ yards. This would provide an important secondary benefit in preserving Whitehurst’s good reputation in the offseason with the fanbase in the event of a loss to the Saints. Though I can’t imagine that ever trumping the team’s best chance for victory with “Win Forever” Pete in charge.

    I personally think Whitehurst has earned the start with his smart and clutch play today, and should start against the Saints, but who knows? I doubt Coach Carroll will tip his hand on the starter before gametime to make things harder on the Saints preparations on D (and I actually think that could be significant, given how Whitehurst’s mobility presented some pretty different looks from the Bates offense today).

    If you can’t draft a quarterback in this first round, do you instead use this draft to get CW a playmaker on offense, strengthen the D and the O-line, and take a shot with him at QB? If he builds on tonight’s performance and succeeds, you’ve found your guy. If he plays poorly, we once again would have a high pick to select a QB in 2012. Seems like the reasonable scenario, no? Especially on a “playoff” team with so many holes… I see potential defensive studs like Amukamara, Harris, and Paea lurking around there in your latest mock. Which of those guys would you like to bring a new spark to the D next year?

    • Blake

      Good in theory Patrick, but it would be beneficial to strike while the iron is hot in such a dominating QB class. As of now, it would be an upset if 5 signal callers are not taken in the first 21 picks. Devlin and (right or wrong) Ponder will also go in the next hundred picks. Even Jerrod Johnson started the year as a potential 1st rounder. After the season he put together, he may go undrafted. The point is that with such a plethora of talent at the most important position of sports, it would be most efficient to take one of these supreme quarterbacks. Next year’s class does not look average. The only great prospect is Barkley, and he may not come out with bowl sanctions being lifted for his senior season.

      I HATE the late round 1 prospects for our scheme and needs. Harris is too small, no linemen worth drafting, Julio Jones won’t be available, probably no QBs. I guess we would need to address our already above average defensive line with a smaller more prototypical 5 tech.

      Rob, what do you think Carroll will do if he comes with this dilemma? A lot of the 5 tech prospects are about 30 pounds lighter than Bryant. Would it even be worth it to draft a guy like Jordan, Clayborn, or Bailey? I guess we can hope and pray either Julio Jones, Janoris Jenkins, or a QB falls…

      • Matt Q.

        how is harris to small?? he is the same size as trufant and bigger than jennings and thurmond, and he is bigger than janoris jenkins. anyway i think i herd that harris will not declare

        • Deebo

          Just too small for Carroll. You are correct that Thurmond is smaller than Harris, but Thurmond is a mid round pick with limited upside. You do not want to “settle” for a first round pick if you think there is a deficiency with his size or speed. Carroll probably thinks Harris is less than ideal size and therefore, not worth a first round pick. I was speaking as Carroll’s likely opinion and not my own.

    • Rob

      Whitehurst had a good game but my opinion on his prospects hasn’t changed much. I need to see more. If he beats the Saints and continues to improve – that would be a start. He needs to start that game in my opinion.

      I would agree that Seattle should look at playmakers if they can’t get at a QB. Julio Jones would be enticing prospect with a small move up the board or if he even lasts to pick #21. Justin Blackmon is more of a consideration than he was previously. If we’re talking defensive talent – Paea and Harris intrigue me and so does Cam Jordan. Not a fan of Amukamara but at #21 he’s interesting. Just don’t think he’s a top ten lock like many.

      • Ralphy

        I completely agree Rob. Having no deep threat is crushing the running game. I think the focus picking at 8 would be QB but that should change at 21. That’s where teams seem to do well finding WRs, TEs, safeties and LB’s. I think there is a chance one of the QBs slides because we have seen so often before but if not I hope we go and try to get a WR. I hope it’s Julio Jones but if not I think Blackmon could be an Anquan Boldin type player. It would really help the running game getting a player that will help keep the defense honest.

        • Rob

          Would love a Dez Bryant in this draft class – shame we missed that chance to get a steal late in round one. Explosive playmakers like him needed.

  6. Mr Fish

    “It also means the Seahawks will pick 21st in every subsequent round.”

    Haven’t we traded many of our later-round picks, and the ones we have are from other teams?

    • Rob

      Yes – obviously that’s true but it has connotations for what other teams have from us now etc. It’s easier to say than to breakdown every pick.

  7. Deebo

    I think its very possible QB could be available in round 1 for us. There are five round one prospects and conceivably 9 teams who would take a shot at a first round signal caller: Carolina, Cinci, Buffalo, Arizona, San Fransisco, Washington, Minnesota, Miami, Jacksonville, and Seattle. I think I can negate a few of those teams right now. New regimes mean new quarterbacks, old ones don’t. Cincinatti, Buffalo, Arizona, Washington, Minnesota, Miami, and Jacksonville will all be the same regime as last season (Zimmer likely to step in for Lewis/Frazier likely to step in for Childress, but still same overall regime). Sparano may be fired in south beach, but judging by the Marshall trade and Dansby signing, they are not ready to wait for a young kid to mature into a QB; they want to win now. Arizona and SF may also be in win now mode. Minnesota is assuredly in that mindset and would be better off signing a veteran. Wayne Weaver (Jacksonville) may be too cheap to draft a quarterback high and ruin the chemistry of his playoff calibre team. Palmer had the game of his life without TO and Ochocinco hollering for balls. He then ruined it by having a terrible game this week against Baltimore, but I have a feeling he will be back. I can see Arizona, Frisco, Miami and Minnesota signing/trading for new quarterbacks. Donovan McNabb, Kyle Orton, Marc Bulger, and Kevin Kolb should suffice. Hasselbeck could also be an option for one of those teams. Buffalo may feel fine with Fitzpatrick; hey they’ve shown ineptness before.

    That leaves Carolina to take Luck, Washington to take Locker, and another QB for us. I don’t think it will end up like this, but it could easily happen. I think Newton will go to Cinci and Mallett will go to Frisco, leaving us with Gabbert. A combination of the aforementioned scenarios is plenty likely with the uber talented AJ Green, Da’Quan Bowers, Nick Fairley, Marcell Dareus, Robert Quinn, or Patrick Peterson on the board to distract the top 7 teams. Seattle could easily have Gabbert staring them in the face this April.

    • John_S

      I don’t think Mallett will go that high. Gabbert yes, not Mallett. If the rumors regarding Malletts character is true, he is due for a fall and could be available @ 21.

      I could see the Seahawks trading down to accumulate more picks even an additional 1st rounder for 2012.

      My preference of players @ 21 are:

      Mark Ingram
      Justin Blackmon
      Akeem Ayers
      Stephen Paea
      Michael Floyd
      Von Miller

      Second Round Guys would be
      Stefan Wisniewski
      Ryan Broyles
      Justin Houston

      Other guys I like in the later rounds are Colin Kaepernick, Demarcus Love, Steve Schilling, Austin Pettis, Stanley Havili (I think he can play RB in addition to FB), Ryan Williams, Jerrell Powe, Quan Sturdivant, Dontay Moch

      • plyka

        You absolutely NEVER take a RB anywhere in the first few rounds! I think that this should be a rule of all GMs tatooed on their back. Guys like Arian Foster are undrafted free agents sitting on practice squads. RB is the most easy position to fill without looking in the draft. There is talent lying everywhere, especially late in the draft.

        And if you take an RB, absolutely do not take one that was on a great team with a great oline since his value will be overestimated. How much of Ingram was due to him vs how much was due to his team?

        The best place to look is Jacksonville and their 2 backups, Jennings and Karim are incredible talents in my mind. I think Karim was a 6th round pick and he looks like a mini-MJD. Check out Tampa Bay and the big Oregon guy who just ran the seahawks over last week for 164 yards as a ROOKIE, Legerrate Blount was another undrafted free agent rookie. He was signed for free by Tampa.

        There is a little Oregon kid who i have always thought very high of, in fact, i thought he was on the same level as his uber talented and uber hyped backfield partner. He is even a folk hero! His name is Jeremiah Johnson and he is sitting on someone’s practice squad right now, just waiting for Pete Carroll to go and sign him for FREE! No draft picks necessary….c’mon Pete, Jeremiah Johnson will be a stud (i already have him on my dynasty fantasy football team and he isn’t even on a roster, lol).

        • john_s

          Your thinking of not drafting a RB in the first few rounds is flawed. Adrian Peterson, Chris Johnson, Rashad Mendenhall, Steven Jackson, Shaun Alexander, MJD, Ray Rice, Matt Forte, Ladainian Tomlinson, Jonathon Stewart and Deangelo Williams were all drafted 1st rd with MJD and Ray Rice drafted in the second round. These are/were great RB.

          Lagerrette Blount would have been picked in the first three rounds if not for the punching incident.

          Are RB easier to find as undrafted free agents? Yes but when there’s a workhorse back who has a top round grade, you take them if they fit into what you are doing.

          • Blake

            A 1st round running back is a proven no-no (or soon will be) but I don’t mind a round 2 running back or 3 if you believe they will be stars.

            The shelf life for a runningback is shorter than any other position. They are done by 30 with few exceptions. The usage % is also very low. Most teams only run the ball about 25 times per game compared to about 35 dropbacks. Of those 25 carries, most teams split them between 2 and sometimes 3 runningbacks. Also runningbacks are found everywhere. Every team in the league-every single team- feels they have something at runningback. We may have the single worst runningback tandem in the NFL, and a lot of us blame their inefficiency on the offensive line and lack of passing game.

            Now if a runningback were a guarantee or at least higher hit % in round 1 than other positions then sure take the layup. But the fact is that a TON of round 1 backs bust while late round guys seem to flourish. Laurence Maroney, Felix Jones, Ronnie Brown, Cadillac Williams, Felix Jones, Marshawn Lynch, Reggie Bush, Cedric Benson, Chris Perry, Kevin Jones, Willis McGahee, Willy Green, TJ Duckett. The list goes on and on. CJ Spiller, Beanie Wells, and Donald Brown are extremely underwhelming, while even “hits” such as DeAngelo Williams and Jonathon Stewart are oft injured. That is the nature of the position. They don’t last, so why spend such a high pick on them? That list is comprimised of first rounders alone. On the other hand, mid to late round guys have a good enough hit percentage to warrant picking them. Legarette Blount, NFL rushing title winner Arian Foster, Ahmad Bradshaw, Danny Woodhead, Chris Ivory, Peyton Hillis, Justin Forsett, and Ryan Grant are all 7th rounders or UDFAs.

            That is all opinion. Who knows you may think Donald Brown is better than Peyton Hillis. The only true thing I can show is a stat. Of the top 32 back in YPC with at least 50 carries, 23 were NOT first rounders. Only 9 of the NFLs top 32 backs are first rounders? That’s not a confidence builder. Also all of the listed guys above are in that group with the exception of Ryan Grant, who was averaging 5.4 YPC before he went down. I don’t know how much more obvious it can be, that a first round RB is almost never worth the investment.

      • Matt Q.

        broyles could go in round 1. i really like him alot

        • John_S

          I really like Broyles as well, the problem with him is that he’s going to measure 5’10 to a shade under 5’11 and run a 4.5.

          He doesn’t have that top gear that you would like as evidenced by the strip by the UConn player on his long gain, but he catches the ball and just makes plays. The TD catch towards the end of the game was something else.

        • Rob

          He’s not got elite size or speed. Production is great but it always is at Oklahoma. I’m cautious about him – I don’t touch him in round one. Cocky personality.

      • Rob

        Hi John,

        We’ll learn more about Mallett when attentions turn to the draft and the likes of Adam Schefter look at the top prospects. It will only take one team to believe in Mallett to keep him high even if the other 31 are put off. He could be a top-15 pick (Miami?) or he could be a round two pick.

        I’m not a fan of Michael Floyd in round one. I think he’s had a very disappointing year – round three at best now unfortunately for him.

    • Kyle

      A good, and I do mean good, QB will not be sitting at a 21st pick this year. Too many teams w/ needs.. Now, I would love to see it, but I do not see it happening. Wish I was wrong. The teams I see taking the QB’s in the top 10-15 picks include Carolina-they have a shot at Luck if he opts to go in the draft and they won’t not take him; Arizona-they have a shot at a good QB at their pick and despite Fitz saying they need another Wideout, they will probably draft a QB-scrap and start over; San Fran-we all know their QB issues-they will probably grab Newton if Az doesn’t; Washington has proclaimed a desire for Locker since last year-they are dropping McNabb and they aren’t sticking w/ Grossman-if they don’t take Locker Minn. will; Miami needs a QB, and bad, but will there be a QB for them to take at their position??-if so consider Mallet, Gab, Locker gone at this point-even if Gab will come into the draft….Now, I would think Minn would be the team that would go w/ a Vet, but I won’t be surprised if it comes down to who is left-they will make a grab… And to discuss Buffalo-well Fitz is liked by the coach, he will be there next year more than likely, and Cinci may not draft a QB w/ Palmer playing better at the end of the season-but he is highly paid-so who knows.. So w/ 4 or so good QB options, Seattle has will have no meat left on the bone at that position.. I just cannot see it…. I want to be the first to say, NO to Mcnabb-he is not an upgrade from Matt, practically same stats this year. Orton I would feel more comforatable w/, he started off w/ a MONSTER year w/ yardage, but is he a SB caliber QB- I have more doubt and he has less promise. To get to Kolb-I am not sold, are other teams in need? I wonder, I also wonder who would give up what Philly will want for him.. They will want too much for how much unknown there is; plus it makes sense to keep him as Vick has such a high probability to get injured w/ his style of play….Man it would be nice to see Vick… So, I would like you to be right, and your other talent at the end of your comments would be great p/ups.. John S has a good list of what may be there for us…

  8. plyka

    I think Minni has found their QB of the future in Webb. I highly doubt the Seahawks would ever think outside the box enough to get this guy on the super cheap, but I think if Minni sees enough of him they will really start to love him and develop him next year.

    • Rob

      He’s interesting. If they like him enough I see a veteran coming in to give him time. Leslie Frazier may want his own QB. We’ll see what happens there. They should look at solid veterans like Kyle Orton who can manage all that talent on offense.

  9. Kyle

    I agree on some comments and disagree on others.. The hope for a rare talent at QB in this draft is unlikely. We all know Luck is gone in first pick…rare talent that no single team would pass on. Then Newton, Mallet, Locker, Gabbert all gone way before Seattle’s pick.. Newton would be my choice but he has so much upswing and so many teams have this position at a need that all the talent will be picked early this year. However; Seattle has sooo many needs.. Need more depth in every position. We need some break out playmakers, period.. We need some more big guys on defensive line to stop the run, we need a DE that can give Seattle sacks and can cover well-we hurt here. We also hurt on our receivers and running backs. Yes, the offensive line has improved to give more time for the pass, but lanes are not opened up often, but that can be fixed outside of the draft. Getting an elite WR, RB, DE, CB are tough to come by…anyone care to disagree feel free. But Seattle ranks LAST in the running game, Rank at the bottom at Sacks and stopping the run on defense, and Our WR are either not quick enough-route issues, and the combination at QB has had the pass struggle all year as well. I am a season ticket holder that felt a sixth, seventh pick could have helped this team in the long term much more than a 21st or later pick.
    I hope these issues can be fixed in the off season-free agency, and the draft. I hope Williams is given a contract-he has the height Pete likes, NOT FAST but his height and his hands, man this guy has great hands, makes him a good option. Our TE-Carlson, will not develop into anything beyond what he is know.. We all see that, an upgrade in the offseason would be nice. With a 21st pick it is possible Ingram is available-I would be pleased with that (but other teams will need the upgrade at that position too that pick before seattle-Dolphins), it is too bad we will miss out on other rare talent like DaQuan Bowers-DE and Peterson at CB, and of course AJ Green/Julio Jones at WR. They will be gone. Prince at CB may be gone as well, but that will be a huge upgrade. But I have felt all season that the QB needs to be addressed sooner than later. GET an awesome talent at that position and fill in the blanks around him. I would love to see Pete trade up in this draft-how he could get it done is beyond possible, but we can dream. However what Seattle would have to give up probably more than they would get…and it is a risk. But you cannot pass on Newton and Luck… You do what you can to get those QB’s in my opinion. You can bet other teams will be doing just that.

    • Rob

      Great post Kyle – agree with a lot of it.

      • Meat

        Thanks… I have been looking for a place to talk Hawks that don’t include a bunch of people that post nonsense, put down teams/players, and just talk football.

        • Rob

          The reason this blog ‘works’ in my opinion is completely down to the fact that since it started in 2008 the quality of contributors has been first class. I can’t remember one heated argument in that time – or a conversation that has strayed off topic. A group of fans (not just Seahawks fans btw) have made this blog a pleasure to write and the reason why I’ve kept it independant so we don’t clog it up with adverts and such. The cost of running SDB is worth it because it gives me the chance every day to talk to football fans about the draft and the Seahawks. So this is my opportunity to say thanks to you all and please keep visiting.

    • Blake

      There’s good and bad with this post. First of all there are factual errors. We are not bottom of the league in sacks, we are dead in the middle with 36. This is extremely impressive due to the fact that our corner tandem might be the worst in the league. This is not talk on my part, I can prove it. Our pass d ranks 29th in DVOA (the only real way to measure stats) while we are getting average pressure. I do not have the time to show a bigger difference between pass rush and pass defense, but obviously the reason we are 29th is not because of the pass rush. In fact, one could make the case that our pass rush would be significantly better if our corners could hold coverage for another half a second. Clemons is top 10 in hurries. Our pressure is fine. It is also blatantly incorrect that “we rank at the bottom in stopping the run”. We currently rank 17th in DVOA, and ranked 2nd before losing Red Bryant. There is a definite foundation there. Also, once we get him back next year, opposing offenses will be forced into more 3rd and longs (after getting stuffed on first down), and Clemons will be able to scoot out to the 9 tech and focus only on the QB. I can’t believe you said we need some more big bodies to stop the run. Our starting defensive line weighs more than any other line in the league. Factually. We also have tons of big bodies off the bench in Siavii, Terrill, and the underwhelming Balmer. Curry and Raheem Brock are awesome rushers in our bandit package. Dexter Davis showed a ton of preseason promise as a edge rusher and looks like a potential Leo replacement in a few years. I just wrote this very long post for no other reason than to nitpick at your errors.

      • Meat

        I see what you are saying Blake, and I agree to disagree. What you are explaining very well I might add is what the Hawks looked like in the very beginning of the season, Red and the rest are HUGE, I loved seeing it at the first game. But, if you read my post again, the team lacks depth, w/ Red out you can see statistically the change in stopping the run. Any team can run on the Hawks because when injury comes, as they do, the depth shows this. The corner tandem is soo poor. Huge upgrade needed. The defense in the beginning of the season was a different team than the middle and end. It is the lack of depth. Not to nitpick, but I said near the bottom in sacks-whether that is near the middle or not, that is something that needs improvement.

  10. Frankfrog

    Perfect win Whitehurst fits the Bates system like a glove. Funny Locker finally puts it together and makes you believe he’s a top ten guy then Whitehurst blows that opportunity away. I still think Mallet has the best skill set for the pro’s why not develop him behind Whitehurst for a year or two. Love to see him and Whitehurst battle for the job. Hasselbacks done not that he can’t play when healthy, he just is to old to stay healthy through a NFL season and a poor fit for Bates.
    Robs right, Whitehurst has earned the right to start. Hasselback would have lost that game.
    Whitehurst is kinda old and only has a year or two left himself, before being on the down hill side. QBs need replaced by 32 he’s 29 next season not much of a window to groom a team in. He pretty much has to win the Superbowl to get a chance. RB need replaced at 28 years old TE at 29 and WR at 30. Football outsiders has some really insightful stats to check out.
    Whitehurst is a baller just to old to build around.

  11. Matt

    Gabbert announces. If Luck declares, I think we have a great shot at a QB @ 21 or at least have the ability to trade up. The nice thing is that outside of Luck, I can see teams being scared off by the other QBs despite their immense talent/upside.

    On another note, I want no part of Kevin kolb. Not sure how someone could Give up a first round pick for him. He’s like the Prince Amukamara of available QBs.

  12. Matt

    Rob, have you heard this non sense that the Seahawks were really high on Jimmy Clausen last year and could potentially trade for him this year? Uhhh what!?

    I thought word was that he wasn’t ever in consideration with the Hawks. You hear any of this non sense.

    • Matt Q.

      where did you get this????????????????????

      • Matt

        Espn, Kiper, etc.

        • Matt Q.

          just today?

    • Blake

      I have heard both that we were high on him and that he was not on our board at all. I remember we held a private 4 hour workout for him last year as soon as his toe was healed, but that’s not really a surprise given our QB situation. Buffalo held a workout for him as well and they also passed on him twice. Carroll has known the guy since he was 13 so I would imagine if Carroll liked him, he would’ve taken him or traded up for him once he fell so far in the 2nd round.

    • Rob

      I know for a fact he wasn’t even on the Seahawks draft board. Never even a consideration. Really limited QB who doesn’t fit the scheme are the reasons. Seattle will not trade for Clausen.

      • Matt

        Thank GD.

  13. Matt Q.

    the hawks just signed Mike Williams to a 3 year contract extension

    • Blake

      Next up Brandon Mebane.

      • Rob

        I’m not that convinced Mebane re-signs. We’ll see what happens.

        • Charlie

          How come rob?

          • Rob

            I’m not totally convinced he’s a great fit for the scheme. He’s not as effective as a three technique as he is in the old one-technique position. This hasn’t been the best year for him despite what a lot of people say. Part of me thinks a lack of depth/quality makes it an almost certainty they try to get him signed, but if the price isn’t right who knows? It also depends what’s available in free agency or if they decide to go in that direction in round one of the draft. We’ll see what happens – I don’t think it’s a lock he’s in Seattle next year though.

  14. Matt

    You all may disagree, but I can totally see the Cards and 49ers not going QB in round 1 and instead going after Kolb and/or McNabb. I only say this because of the past failures of there Leinart and Alex Smith picks. Not to mention, I don’t see Whisenhunt starting over with a rookie QB, while the 49ers have a lot of pieces entering their prime.

    Many will not agree, but living in Phoenix myself, it was clear that Whis hated Leinart and the non blue collar mentality. I see him going the safe/conservative route over making a splash on draft day.

    • Blake

      Completely agree. I see Cards and Minnesota signing veterans for sure. Possibly trading for Orton. 49ers I could see a draft pick and a signing. They are ready to win now, but also have a new regime. I listed all this in a semi retarded rant above.

    • Rob

      Arizona won’t sign McNabb. I think they may consider trading for a guy like Orton or Kolb. Kyle Orton would be a brilliant move for Arizona – Kolb not so much.

  15. fountaindale

    I agree with Patrick G. I don’t believe you can afford to take a flier on franchise Quarterback. First round Quarterbacks are not just QBs. They are the heartbeat of a franchise. They are the personification of the competence of an entire organization and hence are difficult to give up on when they fail. It can take years for a franchise to recover from a botched first round QB pick. Round one is for difference makers. You take the highest impact talent… if that happens to be a QB you’re damn lucky.

    • Rob

      I agree and disagree. You’re right that a franchise QB defines the entire team – and a bust can be costly. However, you cant be risk averse at that position more than others especially because the benefits of hitting on a QB are so great. Aaron Curry was considered a high impact talent after all. There are no sure things.

      • fountaindale

        Rob… Curry’s first year was under Mora which was obviously a failed regime. Carroll seems to be better at putting people in a position to succeed. I haven’t given up on Curry just yet. I’m just saying you don’t pick Tim Tebow in the first round just because you really, really want a quarterback when Devin McCourty, Roger Saffold, and Dexter McCluster are still on the board.

        • Rob

          I don’t think it’s a case of giving up on Curry. The problem is – the level that he is playing now is pretty much what we’ll only ever get. There’s no room to grow now. He isn’t suddenly going to become a huge playmaker. He’s an average NFL linebacker being paid star money. It was a bad decision to draft him fourth overall. Someone spending a mid/late first rounder on Curry would probably be happy with that investment.

      • Meat

        Yeah, Curry was supposed to be that high impact talent….I am dissappointed to say the least

  16. Alex

    I know Rob disagrees, but I still can’t imagine 5 QBs off in the first 21 picks. I know 2006 showed 3 QBs (Young, Leinart, Cutler) off in the first 11 picks, but still.

    For 5 QBs to be off, there has to be that match of a fit, character, system, and whatever the teams picking are looking for. Further, there are teams that will go the veteran route and choose a Palmer or McNabb. Then there are teams that will pass on a QB for the BPA.

    Finally consider this, the QB position has always been the most important position and less than half of the league is satisfied with their QB. This isn’t anything new, it has always been like this, yet for one reason or another, Aaron Rodgers or Joe Flacco fell to to the lower half of the 1st round. I assume the fall occurred due to a mismatch with teams and I don’t see how that can’t occur in this draft either. Some QB and teams just don’t match up and for 5 to be off in the first 20, there has to be a lot of matching, no veteran QB signing, and assuming that all QB needy teams actually do choose a QB (Seahawks two years ago is an example. They needed a QB and were in position for Mark Sanchez, but passed for the safer, BPA they considered at the time who was Aaron Curry.)

    Overall, just saying. A lot needs to happen for 5 QBs in the top 20 and projecting 5 QBs in the top 20 might be a overhype that I always see during draft time where everyone says this player will not be here and this player will not be here.


    • Rob

      Five is only a possibility in my opinion. I think four is almost a certainty (Luck, Newton, Gabbert and Locker).

  17. T-Town

    Gabbert declared as per ESPN.

    They have him going #5 to Arizona.

  18. Matt

    Rob Rang with a new mock draft…awful. Not sure how he gets paid to do this. Apparently we pass on Jimmy Smith, Cam Jordan,and Julio Jones to take Gabe Carimi. That’s just embarassing.

    • Matt

      Oh and Jake Locker. Then again, Rang is one of those “Hass has 3 good years left,” despite being terrible for the last 3.

    • Matt

      And the other clown has us drafting RB Mikel Leshoure in Round 1 . Yes, the guy who is a clone of Marshawn Lynch and is only 2 years younger. Brilliant. Don’t people get fired for being terrible at their job?

      • T-Town

        haha LeShoure in round 1.

        To be fair some of these other draft sites are done by people who have little knowledge of others teams outside their respective divisions.

        I cringe when I see sites that have us taking a RB or TE in rounds 1 and 2.

        • Matt

          This is the CBS sports guys. I’m just appalled how retarded these picks are.

          • Meat

            Yeah, Corner at 21st…. A tight end, maybe in round 2 or 3, Carlson was a bust

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