Oklahoma’s Kyler Murray is the best draft eligible quarterback
I’m going to keep updating the tier list. It’ll change if players decide not to declare. It’ll change if I study a player and decide they need to be included. That happened this week with a pair of Oklahoma prospects.
Tier 1 — the top of the class
Nick Bosa (DE, Ohio State)
There’s still no challenge to Bosa for #1 overall and he deserves a tier to himself. He’s the complete defensive end — with the quickness and rare agility to be a dominant speed rusher, the power to manhandle offensive linemen and the size/toughness to work against the run. In a year without a top quarterback prospect or offensive tackle, Bosa goes #1.
Tier 2 — likely top-10 picks
Quinnen Williams (DT, Alabama)
Clelin Ferrell (DE, Clemson)
Ed Oliver (DT, Houston)
Rashan Gary (DE, Michigan)
Dexter Lawrence (DT, Clemson)
Christian Wilkins (DT, Clemson)
Raekwon Davis (DT, Alabama)
Quinnen Williams has been a dominant force for Alabama but there will be some mild concerns about his age (19) and the fact he’s a one-year wonder. Clelin Ferrell has ideal size and length and would be a top-five pick in any class. Ed Oliver is extremely dynamic but there will be some questions asked about his fit at the next level due to his lack of length and size. Rashan Gary and Dexter Lawrence wowed High School recruiters and were the #1 and #2 top prospects in the country. One scout for Rivals called them the best defensive tackle duo he’d ever seen in one single class. They’ve long been destined for the pro’s and NFL scouts will love this pair. They will go early. Christian Wilkins is a phenomenal player with fantastic athleticism, prototype three-tech size, excellent character and technique. Ignore the critics. Raekwon Davis is a monster built like Calais Campbell.
Tier 3 — possible top-15 picks
Devin White (LB, LSU)
Jachai Polite (EDGE, Florida)
Derrick Brown (DT, Auburn)
Kyler Murray (QB, Oklahoma)
I’ve added Kyler Murray to this tier. As I noted on Wednesday, I think he’s the best eligible quarterback prospect and a possible first round pick. At least one NFL GM agrees. He’s accurate, exceptionally athletic and simply a fantastic playmaker. If I needed a quarterback in this draft, I’m going to take Murray and roll the dice. Devin White was once considered the next Leonard Fournette. He was projected as a running back in High School, then he added a lot of bulk and lost some speed. Recruiters started to project him to full back, believe it or not. Then he slimmed down at LSU and became an elite college linebacker. Jachai Polite’s motor never stops. His effort is incredible. He lacks length and size but he’s extremely quick and aggressive as a pass rusher and has been productive despite facing a number of double teams in 2018. Derrick Brown is a complete defensive tackle. He controls the LOS, shows excellent discipline in the run game and makes an impact as a pass rusher too.
Tier 4 — possible top-20 picks
Zach Allen (DE, Boston College)
Josh Allen (EDGE, Kentucky)
David Edwards (T, Wisconsin)
Zach Allen has been a force all season. He’s big and looks like an interior rusher but still wins with get-off, speed and his hand use and technique is on-point. The combine will be big for him but he has a legitimate chance to secure a place in the top-20. Josh Allen has been a consistently effective pass rusher all season. He’s probably best suited to playing as a pure 3-4 OLB in a scheme like Pittsburgh’s. Georgia had success running right at him and Vanderbilt’s tight end also handled him. Even so, he gets to the QB and makes plays. David Edwards is a pure right tackle but teams will like his attitude, consistency and toughness.
Tier 5 — Top-40 talent
D’Andre Walker (LB, Georgia)
Byron Murphy (CB, Washington)
Jerry Tillery (DT, Notre Dame)
Damien Harris (RB, Alabama)
Brian Burns (EDGE, Florida State)
Rodney Anderson (RB, Oklahoma)
We’ve been saying all season that D’Andre Walker is underrated and it took a big performance against Alabama to finally gain some recognition. Walker is very strong against the run despite his linebacker size. He’s capable of rushing the passer as a defensive end, dropping into space and he always plays with a high intensity. Byron Murphy flies to the ball-carrier and looks like a naturally gifted defensive back. He plays cornerback for Washington but I’d love to see him tried at free safety. Jerry Tillery was recruited as a left tackle before switching to defense. He’s as big as Raekwon Davis and provides an alternative later in the top-40. Damien Harris is highly explosive and the complete running back. Brian Burns had a terrific year and could be listed higher but there are legitimate concerns about his weight (is he really playing in the 220’s?). Rodney Anderson will not go early due to injury concerns but in terms of pure talent — he’s right up there. Explosive, great size, tough. An excellent prospect who just needs to stay healthy.
Tier 6 — best of the rest
Marquise Brown (WR, Oklahoma)
Kaden Smith (TE, Stanford)
Drew Lock (QB, Missouri)
Chauncey Gardner-Johnson (CB/S, Florida)
Jaylor Ferguson (EDGE, Louisiana Tech)
Austin Bryant (EDGE, Clemson)
Taylor Rapp (S, Washington)
Marquise Brown is sudden and a fantastic playmaker. He was a little inconsistent against Texas in the Big-12 Championship game and then got hurt. He’s Antonio Brown’s cousin. Kaden Smith is the most rounded draft-eligible tight end. Drew Lock could easily be the first quarterback taken and could’ve been a first rounder this year. Chauncey Gardner-Johnson switched to nickel corner from safety in 2018. He’s extremely physical and plays with personality and attitude. He can be boom-or-bust. Jaylon Ferguson had major production in 2018 but plays with raw technique. With a good combine, some teams will believe he’s worth selecting early to develop. Austin Bryant is a pure pass rusher who will make plays in a rotation. Taylor Rapp is athletic with the ability to leave an impression and could be the first safety off the board.
Still intriguing
Gerald Willis II (DT, Miami)
Johnathan Abram (S, Mississippi State)
Christian Miller (LB, Alabama)
Steven Montez (QB, Colorado)
Gerald Willis will need to explain to teams a bizarre college career that started at Florida, appeared to be going way off the tracks and then ended with a fantastic year of production in Miami. He’s undersized and might be a specialist rusher but he plays with supreme agility and will test well in the short shuttle. Johnathan Abram is a playmaking safety but there are concerns about his athletic upside. A big combine performance could push him into the top-40. Christian Miller will test well and has developed into a more complete player in 2018. Steven Montez isn’t expected to declare for the draft but if he changes his mind could still provide an intriguing alternative to the big name quarterbacks.
Overrated players (or players who might go earlier than they should)
Greedy Williams (CB, LSU)
Dre’Mont Jones (DT, Ohio State)
Jonah Williams (G, Alabama)
Greg Little (T, Ole Miss)
Deionte Thompson (S, Alabama)
Deandre Baker (CB, Georgia)
Montez Sweat (EDGE, Mississippi State)
A.J. Brown (WR, Ole Miss)
N’Keal Harry (WR, Arizona State)
J.J. Arcega-Whiteside (WR, Stanford)
D.K. Metcalf (WR, Ole Miss)
Dwayne Haskins (QB, Ohio State)
Greedy Williams will likely be the first cornerback off the board, possibly in the top-15. However, he still needs a lot of work and shares some of the same issues as Deandre Baker when tracking the ball in the air. Williams has the size and looks the part but might underwhelm at the next level. I think he’s overrated and generally projected too early. Dre’Mont Jones looks great at times as an interior pass rusher. He’s quick and fluid and gets into the backfield to make plays. He also disappears from games (an issue stretching back to High School) and is a liability against the run. Jonah Williams plays left tackle at Alabama but is a pure guard, lacking the length and foot-speed to play outside. He’s best blocking head-on 1v1 and has limitations. I wouldn’t consider him a round one prospect, especially at tackle. Greg Little similarly looks a bit stiff handling the edge and might need to kick inside to guard.
Deionte Thompson is a long, lean safety. He isn’t rangy or particularly fast. He might run in the late 4.5’s or 4.6’s. He’s physical but I don’t understand the first round hype. The Seahawks could look at him as a day-three corner convert based on his frame. Deandre Baker lacks size, struggles to track the ball and might not test particularly well at the combine. There are character flags lingering over Montez Sweat according to Tony Pauline and while he’s a capable college pass rusher, he’s very lean and his success might not translate to the next level. A.J. Brown competes for the ball in the air but how athletic is he? Is he just another Laquon Treadwell? N’Keal Harry wins plenty of contested catches and has YAC ability but struggles to separate. J.J. Arcega-Whiteside is merely a useful redzone target and jump-ball specialist. He might be a day-three pick. D.K. Metcalf has a ton of potential. However, he has a serious neck injury. He’s declared to set the wheels in motion for a pro-career, rather than spend 2019 sitting out at Ole Miss. His long-term future is still a question mark. He likely just wants to get into the league. I doubt he’s expecting to be drafted early. Dwayne Haskins has talent and production. There were also too many ‘off’ throws. Personally, I think he’s a mid-rounder with some potential to work with over time.
Players I’m still unsure about
Jeffrey Simmons (DT, Mississppi State)
Daniel Jones (QB, Duke)
Cody Ford (T, Oklahoma)
Devin Bush (LB, Michigan)
Jeffrey Simmons is a good player. He was also filmed beating up a defenceless woman. Many teams won’t have him on their board. I’ve listed him here simply to avoid having to answer questions in the comments section about where he fits. Someone will draft him. I can live without it being the Seahawks. Daniel Jones has shown flashes of quality at Duke and could slip into the 20’s. I need to do more study before confirming that thought. I’ve not studied Cody Ford enough to pass judgement but Tony Pauline believes he could rise into the first frame. Devin Bush is not bad player at all. However, there are some concerns and I don’t see a first round prospect. Bush was asked to be very aggressive by Michigan. He had two key roles — attack the LOS to try and make plays in the backfield and cover passes to the flat. That’s not his fault but it makes for a difficult evaluation. There wasn’t too much in the way of read-and-react, discipline vs the run and zone coverage. In one game I saw him attack the LOS leaving a simple outside cut for the running back to break off a big gain. He needed to be less aggressive and simply force the runner back inside. He has energy and speed but it’s hard to get a sense for how his game translates to the next level watching Michigan play.
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Nice write up Rob and I think you have nailed the tiers of players. I do think Burns could move up quite a bit if he can come in at 245lbs+ at the combine. His bend around the edge and length are elite and physical traits hard to find.
If Murray agrees to play football I think he could go in top 10. Think about an offense with Murray and Barkley in the backfield throwing the ball to Beckham, Shepard and Engram. That would be a dream for any OC.
Burns certainly can rise if he weighs in that bracket. But I suspect there is virtually zero chance of that happening. He is so lean. I thought he’d be about 230 ish but when people started talking about the 220’s — that’s a major flag. His legs are like that of a DB or receiver. And this is the problem with college pass rushers. It’s OK being able to get your head down and win with speed off the edge at this level. You’re quicker than the O-liners, you’re a better athlete. At the next level you aren’t. And you will be easily handled if you’re simply a light rusher dependant on speed.
His traits are not that difficult to find — you see them most years. There’s usually a lighter, fast speed rusher or five. I don’t see anything unique about his game. His draft stock and ultimately his ability to win at the next level will totally come down to his ability to prove to NFL teams that he’s not going to be an overmatched liability at the next level who can only play wide of the LOS in space in obvious passing downs trying to avoid offensive tackles rather than take them on. And at the moment — that’s the big concern. I actually wouldn’t be shocked if he sank like a stone if he’s in the 220’s and ended up going in the mid-rounds at best. He has to turn up at the combine carrying more weight and he still has to test with great speed and explosion. I’m dubious.
I was originally thinking that Murray was a comp for Russ but after watching him a ton I think he is a much more dynamic runner and Russ is a lot more durable with slightly more arm strength. The comp is still not bad but he reminds me more of Doug Flutie who I think would have been absolutely sick in today’s spread offenses.
My only concern with Murray is not his height but more his frame. Will he be durable enough? The talent is legit.
He’s so elusive and being small makes him a harder target to bring down. Taller QB’s offer a bigger target. Murray isn’t often going to be exposed to big hits. He might be crushed under the weight of bigger linemen but I actually think a more diminutive frame helps him. I’m not sure how you bring him down and he’s possibly the most dynamic and elusive QB I’ve seen in the pocket. The big concern will always be whether his size can work. There are so few QB’s like Wilson and Flutie. But for me, I’d roll the dice on Murray if I needed a QB. And I’d happily see him selected by Seattle as a long term potential heir apparent to Wilson. I just think he’ll go a bit too early for that to happen. Unless, of course, the Seahawks work their way out of range for the top D-liners. I think Murray has special talent. You take him in R1, you get five years to make the transition or trade him. By that point Wilson is 35 and you might be thinking about the next step. Planning ahead makes sense at QB. Green Bay have shown that with Favre/Rodgers. New England didn’t lose anything by selecting Jimmy G early.
Great write up. The one player I see missing is Devin Bush.
What concerns you about him other than his small frame?
He looks like a heat seeking missile.
I struggle with Devin Bush. Michigan essentially had him charge at the LOS every down. It worked sometimes, being ultra-aggressive. There are times when he gets into the backfield and makes a play, a sack or a TFL. But he essentially had two roles. Aggressively attack the LOS and cover the pass into the flat. That’s all I saw. That’s not a next level gig. You have to read-and-react a lot more, you have to be physical and fill gaps in the run, make sure you don’t lose contain, drop into zone and play various coverages. I found Bush’s run defense to be a liability. In one game he gave up two huge runs by sprinting head first into the mass of bodies at the LOS allowing a pretty easy outside cut. Just read the play and take that away. You’ve got to force the run inside to the bodies, not make that move yourself and leave outside open for a big gain.
So while I appreciate his speed and solid attitude and NFL bloodlines — I just see a guy almost needing to learn a full set of NFL responsibilities and at his size — you’re never quite sure how he’ll settle into that. If Jarrad Davis is only the #21 pick in his class, I can’t put Devin Bush in that range.
I probably should include him in this piece though so I will edit. I’ll put him in the ‘unsure’ category.
I was high on Davis too but his ability in man coverage has proved his undoing so far at the next level. There is still time for him to put it together though, sure.
I wouldn’t say it’s been his undoing. He’s a terrific player.
I would looking at his game from the eyes of an elite 3 down linebacker. So far. I get that it’s early days yet still. My best friend is a lions fan, so I watch more lions games than most in addition to his broader opinion. His opinion and one I share is that he often gets flat footed and gives up big chunks of yardage in the pass game. Opposing oc’s kinda pick on it and use it as a mismatch frequently. Often Paul Pasquialoni will switch him out in obvious passing downs, they had Teez Tabor playing that spot quite a bit last year for instance.
It sounds like I haven’t seen as many Lions games as you have — but in the games I have seen this isn’t anything I’ve noticed. If anything I’ve seen a few botched tackles he should make. But for a second year LB with a ton of potential — I think he’s doing very well.
Also re Kyler, his agent seems to think that his contractual situation with his baseball team means he doesn’t have a choice. Just agent “pushy pushy” talk or some merit to it?
Kyler says he’d like to play both.
That’s his ‘baseball’ agent. He has a vested interest in Murray playing baseball. I sense momentum is moving away from that and he’s trying to put a little pressure on. Let’s see if the tide changes when Murray consults or hires a NFL agent.
I agree with your thoughts on JJAW, who many in the draft media jumped on in early September.
From my notes:
Jose Joaquin “JJ” Arcega-Whiteside, WR, Stanford
Born in Zaragoza, Spain, both parents played basketball professionally overseas. JJAW’s basketball background is obvious, as his signature move is boxing out his man in the end zone. In fact, other than that, he really does not display many other skills and/or traits. I have my doubts that he is fast enough for an outside receiver. I have concerns his game translates to the pros, and wonder if he might have to transition to move-TE in the NFL.
I cannot believe people have projected Arcega-Whiteside in R1. That’s nothing against the player either. He’s good at what he does. But first round!?! Madness. The draft coverage on the internet this year has been shocking.
Rob. For the 2019 NFL Draft class, which LB do you think is the best in coverage that you have watched so far?
Mack Wilson if he declares. They drop him as the deep man on pass plays.
Accepted invites for the Senior Bowl (so far):
https://www.seniorbowl.com/accepted-invites.php
And for the East-West Shrine Game:
https://www.shrinegame.com/acceptances
Lastly, I am curious about your thoughts on Dalton Risner.
PFF charts Riser with some pretty amazing “stats” and claims he has not given up a sack over the past two seasons. As a freshman, he replaced B.J. Finney, who was an all-conference center, then Riser was moved to RT as a sophomore. I kept expecting K State to move him back inside, but I I guess Kansas State had a need at OT.
Riser did not make it into your tiers, and I don’t think he is as athletic as someone like Braden Smith.
Have you watched him? Do you feel he is more of an Ethan Pocic, interior only prospect, or feel he is functional enough to remain outside?
I have watched him. Didn’t see anything remotely special. Not an early pick. Guard who just falls into the middle of the pack.
I think that Dane Brugler also has Cody Ford as a first round pick in his first mock this year.
Great write up Rob, I appreciate how well you write these blogs. Just one question, do you think if the Seahawks draft D’Andre Walker they will still draft another linebacker? Oh and another prospect to keep an eye on is Rashard Lawrence out of LSU. Really nice at playing against the run.
It all depends on what happens with K.J. Wright and Mychal Kendricks.
After watching a lot (too many according to my wife) of college football games this year, I’m much higher on QB Haskins than you are. I think he will be the 2nd QB chosen in round 1 after Murray. And he may be the 1st if GMs of early-round teams are concerned about Murray’s height or frame. Haskins broke Drew Brees single season Big 10 passing yards and TD records. Those numbers have stood for a long time.
They have, but a string of Ohio State quarterback have been incredibly productive now with this coaching staff. It’s a high-volume attack.
I haven’t done a breakdown piece yet and I’m not sure I will — but I’ve watched multiple Ohio State games and it’s very easy to pick out passes or decisions that are problematic. Haskins is a highlight reel QB. No doubt. Big plays, big production. But in offenses like this, you do have to consider the bad moments too and try to work out what translates. I think Murray has a legitimate shot to make it at the next level even with his lack of size. I am not sold on Haskins. That doesn’t mean I think he’s bad. I just think he’s more of a R2-3 type that you work on over time. Not a year-one starter round one type.
Haskins had a Russell Wilson-like game against Michigan, the number 1 defense in the nation. 20 of 31 for over 300 yards, 6 TDs, and 0 interceptions. But I definitely agree that he benefits from the OSU receivers (but the Buckeye run game was nothing to write home about this season). The passing game, though, is a world of difference from what is was with J.T. Barrett. So much better this year.
It’s better for sure — and Haskins is better than Barrett for sure.
I have reservations though. I haven’t done a detailed breakdown and not sure I will — but there are some issues I have. Again, to me he’s not necessarily a R1 type. More someone I’d wish to develop. And while Michigan might’ve been statistically ranked #1 on defense — they no way have the #1 defense in CFB.
Superb breakdown of Seattle’s running game from the Vikings announce team. https://youtu.be/jnS6bgPMKDA
love it thanks
Man. Folks on twitter comparing Cam Newton’s character to Jameis Winston’s.
Either you’re misinformed or your biased is showing.
“They were seperated at birth”
This most definitely aint it chief
WTF?
My reaction too. I can understand disliking Cam Newton even tho you never met him, but that disingenuous narrative is just sick.
Rob, who do you think might drop into the second round allowing us to trade down for more draft capital? A guy who might fit that scenario is Jerry Tillery. Any thoughts on his fit for Seattle? Two more names I’m curious about are Jaquan Johnson and TJ Edwards.
Tillery might be there in round two. It’s possible. I think he’s a difficult player to project. Definitely some athletic potential that is very intriguing. Not sure he always makes the most of his physical talent. Has lot of interests outside of football that teams will ask about — is he in for the long haul? So some things that could see him last a bit. I think he’s a top-45 for sure though.
Jaquan Johnson — very physical. Makes plays. Not sure he’s athletic enough to play FS. Can’t imagine Seattle taking him early. TJ Edwards I like a LOT but as more of a R3 type.
It’s still way too early to say who might be there in R2 after a trade down. Miami’s Gerald Willis II could be someone who goes in that range though.
I remember after four weeks of the season when people were hammering the 2018 RB draft class.
Saquon looks like a superstar.
Chubb, Kerryon, Penny etc looking pretty good now. Lindsay in Denver is a revelation.
Can’t judge rookies a handful of games into their careers.
That always has to be remembered.
That would me.
Other than the #2 overall pick, the 5’8, 190 lb UDFA has outperformed them all.
Well that’s a negative way of looking at it.
I’d prefer to see it like this. Phillip Lindsay has been a fantastic find for Denver. The rest of the class is also looking excellent.
Lindsay asked to do much different things from even Royce Freeman in the same system there
Barkley is the real deal.
I remember early in the season some Seahawks twitteratti saying the Giants were stupid to take Barkley instead of Rosen. Yeah, about that… Barkley is a game changer. Rosen has thrown more INTs than TDs.
It’s pretty funny how quiet that particular bunch of Seahawks tweeters are these days.
Saquon was legit. Is legit. And is destined to be a star.
I still dream of Nick Chubb in a Hawks uniform.
God I hope the Giants go on a winning streak to close out the year so they think, ‘Eli’s got enough left. Let’s roll with him for 2019.’
I certainly hope not. I’d much rather the Giants have an enjoyable young qb to play with Odell and Saquan. Eli is a tough watch these days.
Off topic, but just watched end of Chiefs-Ravens and RG III looks like he’d be a splendid back up to Russell. Much preferable to Huntley. If he’d agree to slightly over minimum salary, I think Hawks should look hard at the option.
Not trying to be funny… but what was it about RGIII’s two incomplete passes right at the end of the game that sold you on his fit in Seattle?!?
He literally threw two passes. Two incomplete passes. One was nearly picked.
?? Huh
But they were brilliant incompletions!
Point well taken. My interest is more based on his likely availability (3rd string in Baltimore), his athleticism & experience, and the sense that if Russell got hurt for a few games that he’s a backup who would give you a solid chance to win a game or two. I think he’d be one of the better value backups in the league and should come cheap. Seems worth exploring, that’s all.
I hear you. I just think he’s a spent force personally. I think I’d rather have Hundley purely for the familiarity. That or go out and draft a rookie.
Don’t forget Alex McGough on the practice squad. Despite not making the team, the Seahawks are paying his rookie salary in full, just to keep him in the building. If that’s not a sign they like him, I’m not sure what is.
They also cut him
Like…how? My man has got off-speed throws in the NFL?
https://mobile.twitter.com/Football_Guys/status/1071847212408295425
No look!
I just saw he’s in the SR bowl to play some FB. Hes already a very good TE and is pretty unique. Seattle’s gonna like Trevon Wesco huh?
Yup. I’ve already got him penned in my first Seattle mock. Screams Seahawks.
I feel ya.
Even though I think they’ll probably go with a DE first overall, kind of feeling the same way about Jerry Tillery. Would be perfect next to Jarran Reed. Not the complete player like a Raekwon Davis, but let him be a penetrating 3-tech and watch him shine.
Well, they did try to get a somewhat similar athletic profile in McDowell, so some precedent might be on your side there. Naz Jones is also the same frame, just not even close as an athlete.
I also feel they’ll pick out a DE first unless a beast of a DT falls into their lap. History also suggests DT should be easier to cover in FA, especially with all these teams who will be drafting DL early this year, they will look to save some $$ at the spot and move on from some vets.
On Tillery specifically, I still don’t know. How well does he hold up vs the run? That’s great that he can freelance and shoot gaps and make the off and on splash play, but if he gets pushed around/lacks discipline in the run game, it’s not going to work. Of course, coaching could change that as well.
Tillery’s a question mark for me too.
IMO — go out and get Terrell Suggs. That guy is still busting his ass and having a big impact on games. Pair him with Frank. Go and get a bit more meat for the middle of your D-line. Then let the draft come to you. EDGE, DE or DT. But get a guy like Suggs first.
That was sick!
The AFC finally has some QBs other than the big 3(now 2) who dominated the conference for 17 years. Very refreshing. I would much prefer Mahomes, Watson, Jackson, Rivers or even Luck in their first SB over Brady, Burger or the ghost of PM.
Is father time catching up to Aaron Rodgers a little bit? I hope so. He made some uncharacteristic throws with the game on the line vs Seattle. In the age of immortal QBs like Brady & Brees it’s easy to forget that historically, most QBs decline in their mid 30s.
ps. Nice play Miami! Haha
I think Rodgers was just having a titanic season-long sulk. Played better today now he’s got his own way and taken over as the teams new Head Coach.
Maybe he will take over as GM too and draft himself RB Damien Harris with one of those two 1st round picks. Learn the lesson John Elway learned in his later playing days.
what a bunch of great games today.
Pats lose on last second play
Raiders beat Steelers
I hate the Cowboys, but better for hawks to get rid of eagles
Chiefs barely beat Baltimore
Carolina beat by Cleveland
SF beats Denver. I hate SF, but don’t want them with #1 pick
and the Bears beating the Rams – so far. Goff looks like crap today. And Rams getting a few injuries on oline
and what has happened to Matt Stafford? 101 yds today? He was never great, but always dangerous
Now that Trubisky is back, the Bears are looking like contenders. Decent offense and crazy good defense. Hats off to them, it’s the first team I’ve seen shut down the Rams offense.
Green Bay’s Rogers in the news with longest string of passes without an interception. That is a surprising stat to me.
Cowboys pulled another win out of their ten gallon hats.
Cowboys are dangerous. Like Seattle, a much different team than when they met earlier this year. That would be such a great playoff game.
Lockett depositing $16 in the Salvation Army kettle.
Eddie Jackson, best free safety in football and taken a pick after Tedric
Tom Brady was taken in the sixth round, Russell Wilson the third round, and Richard Sherman the fifth. If it was a pure science we wouldn’t need talent evaluators and the league wouldn’t be any fun at all. Besides, this is year one. We don’t know what the future holds for either player. As of right now I agree that Eddie Jackson is a legit reason the Bears are a big surprise this year.
Jackson was also coming off a broken leg IIRC.
Didn’t perform at combine because if it. Who knows. Had he performed- it might have raised his stock.
Too many coulda, woulda, shoulda.
We got what we got, focus on the present and future.
Hindsight is always 20/20
Da Bears!
De-Fence!!
The Bears today on SNF showed what you need to do against the modern NFL offenses…..
Strong DL play and very active LBs. Relentless pass rush. They absolutely shut down Gurley in the rushing attack and the LBs were able to limit his damage in the passing attack. Some very fine tackling was also displayed throughout the game.
Seattle is actually pretty close, they just need 1-2 DL(DE) and 1 LB to step in and return to a top 5 defense.
agreed but the leaky Run D has me concerned it might be more. Hopefully Green turns out great and we can get a LEO / egde type.
I really hope Penny is the real deal but he reminds me a lot of Shawn Alexander in the way he goes down on first contact. Good speed, good vision but where are the yards after contact? Tell me I’m missing something.
Give him an NFL off-season conditioning program. He had squared up some people this year.
You saw the run against Green Bay, right?
Give him time. Here’s a great pre-draft article on Penny. Whether you like PFF or not, the stats seem pretty concrete. 80 broken tackles his last college season. 31 runs of 15 yards or more. I hope he plays tonight because he’s a home run threat.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/draft-san-diego-state-rb-rashaad-penny-a-first-round-talent
Breaking tackles was what he was known for in college so not sure i agree
Rob. What are thoughts of moving in this year’s draft to snag one of the premier defensive lineman.
I might not be Rob, but I’ll say this: that won’t happen. Or more like can’t happen – Seattle just doesn’t have the draft capital to move up the board. Heck, with only four picks, they’re practically guaranteed to trade back, even if you disregarded their recent history.
Not Rob, but I think it’s pretty probable that with only 4 picks, the only way we will be considering moving is down. The good news is that there should still be plenty of very good DL options available, even if we don’t the cream of the crop.
And no, I’m not going down the rabbit hole of dipping into next year’s draft capital this time. Don’t think this draft is deep enough all around to warrant it.
They don’t have the stock
That is some talented group of weapons in Arizona. Trent Sherfield. Josh Rosen’s go to guy.
Not a Cardinals fan.
But Larry Fitzgerald deserves to go out with something other than this dumpster fire that is Arizona now.
One of my all time Favorite players.
Do any of you guys/gals have a list of places Seattle has kicked the tires scouting this CFB year?
I just rewatched highlights of the Rams-Seahawks game in SEA, and oh my goodness, Tedric Thompson played awful in that game. Didn’t realize it at the time. He missed around 3-4 key tackles that game in the open field. Almost all led to huge gains.
Now, I understand it’s his first year and he’s the next FS after Earl which isn’t fair…but PC would hate seeing that. And knowing that we have LAR to face twice a year, open field tackling will be a must for their next crop. I wonder if they go S in rounds 2-4.
I think we need to cut Thompson some slack. I fear he’s taking Ifedi’s place on the scapegoat list simply because he isn’t Earl Thomas. That was TT’s first start in the NFL, against the most prolific offense in the league. He also wasn’t the only one to miss a few tackles in that game. Seattle’s tackling was poor across the board. Thompson also had an incredible hit on Robert Woods and a pick on the hail mary.
The other thing to note here — it’s fine for us to consider a potential high-ish pick at safety in the draft. But who? There’s little point drafting another free safety with 4.6 speed and nowhere near Thompson’s college production. If they can find dynamic playmaking and speed — great. Otherwise they’re going to have to make-do like 95% of the league. There aren’t many great safeties in the NFL. You don’t need an outstanding safety to be great either. It’s a bonus — but not a requisite. And if they improve their pass rush, an absolute must, it will take a lot of pressure away from the secondary.
I think TT will get better with an off season knowing he is the starter. If they had any intentions of taking a Safeyy early last years class was much stronger than this year.
I suspect we’re witnessing a second coming of the Walter Jones/Steve Hutchinson effect.
After Walt & Hutch — Seattle’s O-line was overly scrutinised for years and held to an impossible standard (IMO). Over the last couple of years the criticism was fair and warranted. The 2016 and 2017 O-line was terrible. However, the line played mostly well in 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014 and 2015. Even with all the injuries they had. And yet the criticism was always there. I think having the best LT/LG combo possibly ever in football impacted how people viewed a non-elite but productive line in the 2011-15 years.
Now I think any free safety might get the same treatment because of Earl. When you’ve had one of the best ever, anyone else is never good enough. And the Seahawks won’t get another Earl. They’re going to have to do things differently going forward. The safety play will never be the same standard. So it’s up to PCJS to make the pass rush a focal point instead.
Any love around here for Ohio St. WR Parris Campbell? Insane athlete (40″ vert, 11-3 broad, 4.26 hand-timed 40yd, 208 lbs.), improved production each year (992 rec. yds, 11 TD in 2018) shows he has worked his WR craft. At worst you maybe get another Curtis Samuel, at best maybe another Percy Harvin?
2017 highlights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGCTu2IJVug
Is this a profile that would interest Seattle still? In one word: electric. Can be your Swiss army guy and field stretcher opposite Lockett, plus alternate KR. Or do we just keep on collecting the scrappy little guys that create separation with route running?
I like him a lot and think he would be a great fit for the Hawks. Needs to work on his route running but is dynamic and seems to get great separation.
What round do you think he would go in? Maybe a round #3 or 4 option?
I like him but I like all of the Ohio State receivers. All great athletes. McLaurin’s an even better athlete than Campbell. All likely to last a bit longer but provide some excellent value.
I’m afraid that the Washington Huskies are in trouble for the Rose Bowl. This being Urban Meyer’s last game, plus all the talent that Ohio State has, does not bode well.
Give coach Peterson a month to prepare and he will do a very good job, but it probably won’t be enough. I did hear that Burr-Kirven is a first team All American.
Watching Bennett have a fantastic game against Dallas yesterday, I wonder if PC miscalculated trading him. I get that this is supposed to be a rebuilding year and that the Hawks are close to playoffs because of the awful NFC competition. But, if Bennett was here to bolster the d-line, this team would be so much more dangerous come playoffs.
The decision to trade Bennett was absolutely necessary.
The reason? The culture in the locker room was being badly impacted. They got virtually no cap relief for dealing him which speaks volumes. They wanted him gone. Period. And the positive atmosphere around the team these days is clearly as a result of certain individuals moving on.
The only complaint I think we can levy at PCJS is — could they have got a better deal? Probably. Possibly. But for me, it’s old news now. A turning of the page was required.
I love Bennett the football player, love his passion for his off field stuff.
But he is very difficult to manage, like Sherman, it was time to move on for both guys.
Football decision
If we could bring 1 of the big 6 defensive departures back healthy this season it would be Avril for me. Amazing person and player.
Lets not forget that the Bennett pick essentially turned out to be one of the best punters the league has seen in a long time. The field position he’s help this team get has been invaluable. Bennett wasn’t that hungry player anymore (good, yes, hungry – not like he was). And all those off-sides penalties are not missed. Sometimes addition is subtraction.
Inactives tonight: Tre Madden, Kalan Reed, KJ Wright, Joey Hunt, DJ FLuker, Doug Baldwin, Branden Jackson
I’m not feeling it tonight. Hope I’m wrong.
Most fans are over confident and underrating one of the best defenses in the NFL.
We’ll need a lot of luck to keep this game in front of us.
Agreed. I’ve sensed a blossoming overconfidence this week. Especially with the rest of the NFC having a crappy week.
The Seahawks are not playing good defense and are missing two key starters on offense tonight (Fluker, Baldwin). They’re taking on a desperate opponent seeking validation, with a QB who won in Seattle with a horrendous supporting cast a year ago. They have dynamic weapons at WR, TE and RB. And they’re loaded on defense.
This is an extremely difficult game against an opponent who made the NFC Championship game a year ago.
I’m glad this take of mine has aged poorly.
A true sign of professionalism…. self scouting. 😀
Quality win for Seattle, dare to dream for a 11-5 season now? 😉
It’s possible. Even a 10-win season would be an excellent achievement.
I’m excited about the game tonight. I see Penny isn’t listed as inactive but I’m not expecting to see him either. Time to take care of business and give the Vikings a beat down! Final score 31 to 24 Seahawks.
Pretty classic Seahawks first half. Haven’t minded it at all, that run game is going to start wearing down the Vikings in the second. Unbelievably awful play from Wilson right there at the end, has to be close to the worst interception he’s ever thrown. Absolute shocker.
A stunning decision by Wilson. That play wasn’t on. As soon as he saw it covered up, throw it out the back of the end zone and move to second down. The scramble, the slip, the attempted heave. Disaster. A truly horrendous piece of play.
Seahawks better watch out here. Dominating like that and having a 3-0 lead to show for it at half can lead to losing a game you have no business losing based on the first half.
It was incredible. As soon as he started dancing around I was getting nervous, that was beyond my imagination though. Not so much a brain-fade as it was a complete meltdown.
I’m with you in it being a frustrating game. Seahawks have been well on top with nothing to show for it, but Carroll has always been about winning the game in the fourth. Just have to keep grinding and the points should come.
Really hope that three points isn’t costly.
This has been an incredibly frustrating game so far.
I’ve loved it personally
Really!?!?
It was nil nil until that blocked fg imo
Agreed. What a defensive performance though.
Shaquill Griffin’s sophomore slump
His best game of the season
Great defensive battle. Guess it pays to be lucky too. Both QBs looked rattled all game
Night football for us from europe is tough sometimes…but for wins like this one… No sleep no problem. Go Hawks.
If David Moore gets his feet down and Russ doesn’t throw the pick you can probably tack at least another ten on that scoreline
Was it my imagination or the addition of Kendricks picked the defensive effort UP on screen passes and sweep plays…. flat out blew some of the them up or prevented some big chunk plays.
The OL held up slightly better than I was expecting….. Penny showed some nice burst and had a few very nice plays. Imagine, RW throwing for less than 100 yards and winning by 14 points…. wowza.
There was a big improvement on screen passes today for sure.