2016 combine day one open thread

I’m busy with the day job today but will have a review post up later. I’ll update what I can in the meantime. My schedule is cleared for Saturday-Monday.

For now feel free to use this as an open thread.

They’ve switched it around this year with the running backs working out today with the offensive linemen. The tight ends will work out tomorrow with the receivers and quarterbacks.

Group 1 OL unofficial forty yard dash times

Vadal Alexander — 5.56 & 5.59
Jack Allen — 5.32 & 5.27
Willie Beavers — 5.26 & 5.31
Caleb Benenoch — 4.97 (1.68 10-yard split) & 5.05
Evan Boehm — 5.31 & 5.32
Le’Raven Clark — 5.14 & DNP
Jack Conklin — 4.98 (1.75 10-yard split) & 5.03
Fahn Cooper — 5.20 & 5.16
Joe Dahl — 5.17 & 5.20
Taylor Decker — 5.21 & 5.22
Joshua Garnett — 5.30 & 5.32
Graham Glasgow — 5.11 & 5.14

Laremy Tunsil has decided not to run at the last minute.

Conklin is more athletic than people thought based on his performance in the forty. He isn’t going to last long in round one. Graham Glasgow looked good too.

Some have suggested Vadal Alexander could be an early round tackle or guard. Along with team mate Jerald Hawkins, he’s one of the most overrated players in the class. Running an unofficial 5.56 and 5.59 pretty much confirms that. And he actually dropped weight for the combine. He labored in the initial movement drills. Fahn Cooper and Jack Conklin both looked very agile for their size. Taylor Decker looked incredibly stiff which was a surprise.

Graham Glasgow looks terrific in drills. Quick, mobile. Jack Allen labored a bit and stumbled on one run. The difference between the two in terms of athleticism and size is palpable. Joshua Garnett also looked really athletic in the drills.

In the kick slide drills, Fahn Cooper again looked good. Joe Dahl and Jack Conklin were a little more labored. Taylor Decker was a lot better here. Joshua Garnett again looked great and is having a great combine so far. Graham Glasgow didn’t look like a natural slider and appeared awkward. He’s very much an interior lineman.

The defensive linemen have been weighing in. Andrew Billings was listed at 6-2 and 300lbs by Baylor. He’s actually 6-0 and 311lbs with 33 inch arms.

Appalachian State’s Ronald Blair is 6-2, 281lbs and has 34 inch arms. Nice. He’s one to keep an eye on this weekend. Joey Bosa is 6-5, 269lbs and has 33.5 inch arms.

Here are some other highlights:

Jonathan Bullard — 6-3, 285lbs 33.5 inch arms
DeForest Buckner — 6-7, 291lbs 34.5 inch arms
Vernon Butler — 6-4, 323lbs, 35 inch arms
Shilique Calhoun — 6-4. 251lbs, 34 inch arms
Kenny Clark — 6-3, 314lbs, 32 inch arms
Maliek Collins — 6-2, 311lbs, 33 inch arms
Kamalei Correa — 6-3, 243lbs, 31.5 inch arms
Sheldon Day — 6-0, 293lbs, 32.5 inch arms
Kevin Dodd — 6-5, 277lbs, 34 inch arms
Javon Hargrave — 6-1, 309lbs, 32 inch arms
Willie Henry — 6-3, 303lbs, 33.5 inch arms
Austin Johnson — 6-4, 314lbs, 33 inch arms
Chris Jones — 6-6, 310lbs, 34.5 inch arms
Darius Latham — 6-4, 311lbs, 35 inch arms
Shaq Lawson — 6-3, 269lbs, 33 inch arms
Dadi Nicolas — 6-3, 235lbs, 35 inch arms
Robert Nkemdiche — 6-3, 294lbs, 34 inch arms
Shawn Oakman — 6-8, 287lbs, 36 inch arms
Emmanuel Ogbah — 6-4, 273lbs, 35.5 inch arms
Sheldon Rankins — 6-1, 299lbs, 33.5 inch arms
D.J. Reader — 6-3, 327lbs, 33 inch arms
Jarran Reed — 6-3, 307lbs, 33.5 inch arms
Hassan Ridgeway — 6-3, 303lbs, 33 inch arms
A’Shawn Robinson — 6-4, 307lbs, 34.5 inch arms
Noah Spence — 6-2, 251lbs, 33 inch arms
Charles Tapper — 6-3, 271lbs, 34.5 inch arms
Lawrence Thomas — 6-3, 286lbs, 33 inch arms
Jihad Ward — 6-5, 297lbs, 34 inch arms
Adolphus Washington — 6-3, 301lbs, 34.5 inch arms
Anthony Zettel — 6-4, 277lbs, 31 inch arms

Some nice length among the DL’s. Ogbah, Calhoun, Dodd off the edge. Let’s see if they’re able to run a 1.5 10-yard split. Darius Latham, William Henry, Jihad Ward, Vernon Butler, A’Shawn Robinson, Adolphus Washington and Chris Jones have vines for arms and great size. It’s no surprise that Shawn Oakman has incredible, stunning size. Ogbah’s 35.5 inch arms were not quite as expected.

The length and size of the D-line class is the greatest characteristic of the group. Now we need to see who has the kind of agility and speed to develop into a NFL pass rusher.

It’s been revealed Clemson cornerback Mackensie Alexander will sit out the combine. He has a hamstring injury. Receiver Pharoh Cooper also won’t run the forty yard dash.

If you want to have nightmare tonight…

I’m heading to work now and will do some updates later, plus a review post. Use this as an open thread.


  1. Drew

    I really wanted to see Alexander at the combine and see what kind of numbers he has. He shows great agility and hip movement on tape, curious to see what his 40 would be and measurements.

    Hopefully sitting out, just means the drills, I think he’d be stupid to not show up and do interviews and measurements.

    • Rob Staton

      Yeah he’s just not working out.

      • Ty the Guy

        Alexander, Apple, and Hargreaves should all get looks from the Hawks in the 1st round.

        Not saying that CB is the biggest need, but these guys look good enough on tape.

        I think the only way we go OLine early is if one of the top tackles drops. I see interior line depth in the middle rounds and tackle projects as well.

        • HI Hawk

          I want to see William Jackson III’s workout. I think he’s the best fit, highest upside CB not named Jalen Ramsey in the draft. If it all adds up, I wouldn’t have any problem at all with the Seahawks locking down the RCB position for the next 4-5 years with Jackson at 26. For some reason everyone has him projected late 2nd/early 3rd – I don’t get it. On tape he’s dominant and exceptionally physical.

          • Volume12

            Agree. Him and Xavien Howard are the 2 best CB’s outside of Jalen Ramsey IMO.

  2. CHawk Talker Eric

    Josh Garnett looks pissed off while he performs every drill. Like a man who ‘seeks to run through men’s souls.’

    You want SEA to bring back the tough and nasty?

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      He’s 100% effort. Every practice, every play.

    • Trevor

      I really hope he is our 2nd round pick.

      • Volume12

        Love this kid. He’s ‘Sehawky’ to the core. Pissed off for greatness.

        • Volume12

          I know someone that doesn’t like Garnett because of his 40 time.

          But, he claims to be a guru.

          • Attyla the Hawk

            To be fair though, he’s going to have to kill the agility drills.

            To put in perspective, James Carpenter ran a 5.28 and 1.81 in 2011. Garnett didn’t make either (although basically the same). Still, Carpenter is not an ideal that I think we strive for.

            Love demeanor. Wonder if there’s something to his moving left issue that’s been bounced around since Mobile. Hope he’s not the OL version of Rick Mirer.

    • bigDhawk

      I’ve brought his name up a few times. Nothing to dislike with him. Most of us probably have him pegged as a LG but I think he is athletic and nasty enough to be the type of RG we like, which would free us up to get a real monster at LG.

    • Attyla the Hawk

      Just found this tidbit from Schneider that may apply:

      when it comes to evaluating linemen this week and beyond, the Seahawks will be looking for more than just big, athletic guys.

      “You can’t just go with the most athletic, best-looking dude with the longest arms,” Schneider said. “There has to be an aspect of his mental quickness, his awareness, his ability to pick up stunts and blitzes, study his opponent, be ready to play the game, and that cohesion to be able to work with the guy next to him.”

      This may be this year’s change to how we grade prospects. We’ve seen it before the last two years. Seems intelligence/mental acuity may be a core value Seattle is grading on this class.

      I would take that to mean that when we look at athletic metrics — that we broaden the scope to include ‘good enough’ athleticism. Smarter players (I’d put Nick Martin in that firmly) are going to rate significantly higher in our grading than it has in years past. Don’t presume the draft tendencies of the last few years will apply as strictly.

      • Miles

        That’s one thing I love about Schneider and Carroll. They definitely have niches and styles they prefer. But they are so ready and willing to tweak their philosophy when new evidence presents itself. They are constantly questioning themselves in an effort to be “The best to have ever done it.” I think that is so atypical of most coaches and GMs in sports.

        I don’t know anything about Josh Garnett. But I do know this: If he ends up being the most successful guy named Garnett to ever play sports, he will be really good amirite?

  3. Rik

    At this point I’d be pretty excited about Washington in the 1st round and Glasgow in the 2nd. Or some combo of Garnett/Johnson in the 1st/2nd. So many good options this year for DL/OL. And Westerman in the 3rd.

  4. CHawk Talker Eric

    Graham Glasgow looks sold. I like this kid.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Actually so does Fahn Cooper

      • HI Hawk

        Cooper looked awful in the Shrine game. I want to like him because he’s a good size, late round flier, but I was very unimpressed by his actual play.

    • CHawk Talker Eric


  5. GeoffU

    At 270ish it’s hard to see Ogbah or Dodd running in the 1.5’s. If they do that would be elite.

    Also, where does the 10-yard split numbers come from? The NFL.com combine site doesn’t list 10 yard split numbers. Is it an unofficial thing?

    • GeoffU

      Yeah I see it’s off the 40. Damnit NFL.com why don’t they list these? Would be so helpful.

      • datrain

        Go to Mike Loyko’s spreadsheet. He punches them in immediately.

        • GeoffU

          Whoa…awesome. Thank you.

      • rowdy

        It’s timed of the 40 and most don’t list them

  6. Sam Jaffe

    Taylor Decker’s relatively slow times are good enough for a right tackle and he’ll now probably be available at #26 (if not well into the second round). I thought he was going to pull a Taylor Lewan and prove to be very fast.

    Fahn Cooper (or is it Cooper Fahn?) is really growing on me as true Seahawk candidate. Willed himself into the SEC. Now willing himself into the NFL. If Tunsil turns into an Eric Fisher or Lane Johnson type of disappointment, Cooper might end up being the best Ole Miss tackle in the NFL.

  7. Sam Jaffe

    The NFL is going to be really flummoxed by Zettel. His size fits nowhere in the modern game. He’ll either turn into a late-round steal if given the perfect niche role, or he’ll prove to be another Mike Mamula.

    • Darnell

      Mamula was a 4 year starter with 30-plus sacks. I’d take that from Zettel.

  8. Sam Jaffe

    We can nix Corea as a potential Irvin replacement. Arms are way too small.

    • Volume12

      His arms looked really short on tape.

      I thought thid might be the case.

  9. CHawk Talker Eric

    @JFowlerESPN: Remember Kelechi Osemele bought mom a house? He can buy dozens soon. Buzz in Indy is he’s looking at $10+M per year

    Thus ends any hope of signing Osemele in FA.

    • Miles

      We could sign him at that price. Just wouldn’t be able to sign anyone else.

  10. CHawk Talker Eric

    Looks like the ghost of Jim Harbaugh has a little Chip on his shoulder

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      BTW thank you for not posting another pic of Conklin.

  11. CHawk Talker Eric

    Alex McAlister 6’6″ 239lbs 36″ arms

  12. Sam Jaffe

    Of all the mighty-mite linebackers being proposed (isn’t that a more gentle name than “Deathbacker”?), my vote is for Cravens. He’s the smallest, but if height doesn’t matter anymore, than who cares? He’s got a knack for blitzing and he’s a better pure football player than Deion Jones, Terrence Smith or Travis Feeney. His arm length will be extremely important, as well as his timed speed.

    Nevertheless, my expectation based on past drafts is that the Seahawks will stick with their tendency of 6’3″, 250 lb. extreme wingspan athlete for OLB. That means Jordan Jenkins, Josh Parry, Leonard Floyd, Curt Maggit or one of the DE’s slimmed down a little bit. Please, please not Floyd. The UGA defense was designed around him, but he was mediocre on the field. Jenkins is the most likely choice–as he has lots of snaps and the Seahawks will need a day one starter at a spot on the defense where mistakes really matter.

    • GeoffU

      The 6’3″ 250 is more for DE/LEO (but should include 1.5 10-yd split). For OLB I don’t think they’re so strict. Mike Morgan and Pinkin are 6-3 but only 230. Malcolm Smith was only 6′. KPL is only 6′. They just can’t be slow.

      I think speed and athleticism is really the most important, but size helps at DE when you have to go head to head against lineman nearly every down.

      • Volume12

        Let’s see if Jenkins is quic twitch though. I kinda think he isn’t.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Leonard Floyd measured at 6’5 5/8″ and 244lbs

      • Volume12

        I like Floyd’s game and athleticism, but I’m not convinced he’s rugged enough or has the swag for this defense. Seems really meek.

        • CHawk Talker Eric

          Yeah, I’m not very high on him either. Just surprised he measured so much taller than his listed height at UGA

        • Steele

          I think it would depend on his role. He can toughen up and add bulk in an NFL camp.

  13. lil'stink

    Jatavis Brown for money-backer or whatever it’s being called. It will be interesting to see how high he goes.

  14. Sam Jaffe

    Connor McGovern just landed in the second round with a sub-5.1 40.

    • Madmark

      I think Connor McGovern would be a steal. He could possible play right tackle but a move to inside I think he would be a killer pro for years to come.

  15. Volume12

    Wow! Jack Conklin is a much better athlete than I thought.

    Caleb Benenoch looks like an athlete man.

    And all that length on the D-line. Jeezuz!

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Remember asking me about Benenoch? And I told you he’s got the tools but is wildly inconsistent?

      Well, he has the tools.

      • Volume12

        I do. Could be a nice developmental type.

  16. Volume12

    Westerman and Whitehair putting up some good numbers.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Good 10-split for Whitehair.

      Brandon Shell (South Carolina) ran a 5.2 with a 1.75 10-split at 6’5” 324lbs with 34 3/4″ arms and 10 3/4″ hands!

      • Volume12

        Former basketball player, nephew of Art Shell. It’s in his blood.

        But Josh Garnett’s daddy was an NFL player too. Never knew that.

        • CHawk Talker Eric

          Didn’t know that either.

          Garnett is moving up my Seahawks board.

          • Volume12

            Yeah- I’m crushing hard on this cat.

            Alright my man, I’m off to the diner to get some B-fast. Keep me updated, and we’ll continue to burn up the reply chain, when I return. Deal? Haha.

            • Volume12

              Hey, what do ya think of Florida’s Keanu Neal? Great name BTW.

              • CHawk Talker Eric

                He’s the Grim Reaper.

                And the best tackling CFB prospect I’ve seen in a while.

              • Attyla the Hawk

                Really stands out as a physical player.

                Schneider did stress how they wanted to add bullies to the team again. That we’d lost a lot of our edge.

                Neal would fill that void well. It seems every year we get a bit of tunnel vision with what we think Seattle wants. Especially early.

                Neal should be on our board. How high probably depends on both where he fits with us, as well as how comfortable we think the day 3 options will be for need.

      • j

        One of my favs. Kiper said he could go as high as the late second with a good pre-draft season – he is doing is part.

  17. Volume12

    Holy ish! I just saw that Shawn Oakmn did indeed bulk up. He’s up 17-18 pounds from the Senior bowl IIRC. He’s listeningggg.

    • bigDhawk

      I brought up Oakman as an alternative in that Derrick Henry at 26 thread a while back. I have a feeling Oakman is going to own the combine.

      • Steele

        Rob doesn’t like him. Don’t disagree.

        • dawgma

          Indeed. Cmike 2.0 – otherwordly athlete, totally ordinary football player. If they learned the lesson the first time they won’t touch him in the fourth round.

          • Miles

            Totally different skill sets. I don’t think the position Oakman plays will require as much mental sharpness as the one Michael plays. Seattle runningbacks are asked to do a lot behind the line of scrimmage. Seattle DEs are asked to rush the passer and set edges.

  18. CHawk Talker Eric

    @MarkDulgerianOS: Myles Jack checking in at 6’1″ 245 with 33 5/8 arms is great for him. Checks off measurables boxes

    • Volume12

      If he was healthy, I’d take him 1st overall.

      • CHawk Talker Eric

        Agreed. In fact, as long as his knee checks out I might take him 1st anyway.

        • Coleslaw

          Injuries aside I think I’d take Jaylon Smith #1 overall, or Tunsil, his 0 sacks or qb hits just reminds me of somone (everyone should know who lol)

  19. Volume12

    Mizzou’s Conor McGovern is killing this thang!

    NC St’s Joe Thuney is a sleeper. Like him.

    • Attyla the Hawk

      Have said for weeks now that the R3/R4 options for the OL and DL are going to be superb.

      Seattle can get day 1 starters at 90 and 98.

  20. Dylan

    Cable caught nodding off on camera, lol.

    • HI Hawk

      That’s worrisome. The run-game coordinator, offensive line coach, and assistant head coach would hopefully at least make it through the running back and offensive linemen workouts. He can sleep right through the QBs, receivers, specialist and defense for all I care – but come on Tom, just ONE day is all you’re needed for.

      • manthony

        I agree, worrisome/bothersome, whatever you want to call it, this I prolly how we ended up with Justin britt

        • smitty1547

          i was thinking same thing, this explain Britt

        • matt

          Don’t think it’s a big deal. He’s probably on west coast time and got up before 5AM. Could use a coffee break! haha

    • Robert

      He will wake up when the DTs take the field!

      • Nick

        Brilliant comment.

    • Darth 12er

      To be fair to Cable, it looked more like he was about to sneeze – at least I’d prefer it that way

      • Coleslaw

        What worries me the most is that after Pete leaves/retires Tom Cable is likely to be the new head coach…

        • smitty1547

          Rocky Seto is what I hear

      • Jeremy

        Thats exactly what I thought, he was about to yawn. Well, actually first I thought…is that really Tom Cable?? He looks so old!!

        • Jeremy


  21. KingRajesh

    Tyler Ervin with 39″ inch vert?
    Henry with 37″ inch vert?

    • Trevor

      Henry really is a physical freak isnt he.

      • GeoffU

        6’3, 247, just ran a 4.54. 4.51 according to nfl.com.

        • GeoffU

          Kieth Marshall just ran a 4.29

          • Steele

            I expected a lights out 40 from Keith Marshall, and there it is. He’s moving up the board.

            Great ability. He is going to be dangerous wherever he winds up.

            • Spireite Seahawk

              It seems it’s all about how healthy he can stay.

  22. JC

    Numbers wise, Spriggs won the combine with athleticism. 4.94 and broad jumped 9’7″, 31x on the bench. 34 1/8 arms an eighth inch below consensus #1 pick Tunsil

    • nichansen01

      I beleive that Spriggs is going to shoot into the top ten.

      • Sam Jaffe

        The only reason I disagree with you is the much publicized failure of similar athletic freaks that suddenly shot into the top ten after the combine (Lane Johnson, Eric Fisher, Lewan). All are good NFL players, but they turned out to be not worth top ten picks. Spriggs has some serious flaws in his game and needs a lot of coaching to become a Pro-Bowl level player. I think he still goes in the 15-25 range.

        • TannerM

          Now, now, Lane Johnson and Eric Fisher were both victims of that horrible 2013 draft. I mean, the only player that ended up picked in the Top 10 and still probably would be in a re-draft was Ezekiel Ansah.

          • HI Hawk

            You don’t think Lane Johnson is still a top-10 pick? I do. Fisher and Joekel are disappointments, but I don’t think Johnson deserves to be lumped into that pile.

            • TannerM

              True. Johnson’s been pretty good. I was just pointing out the ugliness of the 2013 draft. Honestly, I wouldn’t be surprised if players in the 20-30 range this year would have had a chance to break the Top 10 that year.

    • matt

      Spriggs made a boat load of money today! He’s bound to go in the top half of the first round now.

    • MisterNeutron

      Spriggs will probably either go to Philly at #13 or Indy at #18. If he falls to #26, that’d be just dandy.

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        Indy would be a good fit, they need OL help BAD.

  23. Trevor

    When it is all said and done I bet Buckner gets drafted ahead of Bosa and should IMO. He has almost 11 5/8 ” hands that is crazy?

    • RealRhino2

      Crazy. Still think Bosa goes before Buckner, but they should both be top 10, so it comes down to what a particular team likes more.

      Think the Cowboys take Bosa if Ramsey is off the board.

      Starting to come around to Rob’s way of thinking that Wentz will not be 1st or 2nd QB drafted.

      Think Titans should take Ramsey or Ezekiel Elliott #1. One way to keep a QB upright is to give him a guy to hand the ball off to half the time, especially if it’s also a guy with good hands and good blocking ability.

  24. RealRhino2

    Rob, did you see the times for the guy you mentioned in the last 3000 mock draft podcast, Keith Marshall from Georgia? Something like 4.29 with the fastest 10-yard split? At 5-11, 219, not bad.

    • GoHawks5151

      Followed it up with a 4.31. Legit.

      • HI Hawk

        Marshall also did the most reps on the bench – beat multiple offensive linemen. Can’t wait to see the vertical and final SPARQ numbers. Two years ago, he was considered the equal of Todd Gurley – they split time in the UGA backfield until Marshall was injured. Interesting results, I didn’t expect that power in the bench press (or weighing in at 219), but am not surprised by his speed.

        • nichansen01

          Keith Marshall, Connor Mcgovern and Caleb Benenoch are going to shoot up the boards.

          • RealRhino2

            Not how it works, IMO.

            • Miles

              Keith Marshall would be a nice pick for us.

              4.29 40. I believe a 1.52 10 yd split. By the way, he’s 219 at that speed. To reiterate, he’s 219 pounds and he is one of the top 5 fastest runningbacks at the combine in the last 5 years if not more.

              The knocks are injuries and not playing a lot. Sounds a lot like CMike.

              His highlight tape is how you would imagine it given his 40. He just blows by defenders, especially when it looks like he’s well within reach. You get Marshall a clear lane and he’s very dangerous. It also looks like he’s an adept pass catcher, too.

              I would like the pick a lot. Could see it with one of our thirds.


            • HI Hawk

              Byron Jones literally jumped from a middle round CB/S prospect to a 1st round draft pick last year. It only takes one team to invest in these tangible physical qualities. Coaches have HUGE egos, they all believe they can be the one to get that potential out of these guys. One single jump was enough for Dallas last year, Marshall could be looking at an equally meteoric rise. In this case, GMs and coaches aren’t going to find bad tape on Marshall, he’s not an Oakman or A’Shawn Robinson – he plays hard. When healthy and not stuck behind Todd Gurley or Nick Chubb, he produced. The speed is real, the tape backs up his workout, we’ll see what this does – but there aren’t many reasons not to draft Marshall high.

              • Volume12

                Byron Jones had production. Marshall might rise up the board, but he’s not a 1st rounder.

                • HI Hawk

                  I’m not saying 1st round, but there’s a long history of UGA running back success in the NFL. Marshall was an equally celebrated recruit to Gurley, the competition to start went into the season and was still unsettled until Marshall was injured. Then Chubb was the top RB recruit, Marshall came back from injury too late as Chubb was tearing up the SEC filling in for the injured Gurley. Marshall carved out a little 3rd down role and has some impressive tape from his early years at UGA and in spot duty. If he’s fully healthy, there’s no reason to hold lack of production against him because other 1st round backs were in front of him on depth chart.

                  • David

                    Would be a great change of pace, 3rd down/2-minute guy for the Hawks if they could nab him in 3 or 4. Could be the gadget play guy, jet sweep and potentially returner as well. I just don’t see Lockett as the returner for much longer. He’s too important as a WR and he took some brutal hits last year, especially on punts.

                  • Robert

                    Excellent post! Context is everything and that sounds like a legit story to explain the lack of production. Love this kid’s special skills!

              • j

                Jones jumped from a mid-round media prospect to a first round draft pick. We have limited information on what the actual teams thought of him pre-draft. We know that his combine created a lot of media hype, and that its really all the 40 is good for.

                Most teams already know which guys are phenomenal athletes – by watching tape and talking with coaches/other sources. It’s really only a revelation for John Q. Public that lacks the resources the NFL teams have.

                Most important parts of the combine are interviews> measurements>>>>>>>>>>work-outs.

              • j

                It’s not like teams were saying “Boy I like Byron Jones but he is too slow and nonathletic to draft in the first”.Maybe he would have been a early second guy sans combine but it isn’t anything orders of magnitude earlier.

              • RealRhino2

                I also think we just don’t know. Media types say a lot of things about where guys are going to go, but they don’t know jack a lot of times. For every Byron Jones I could find you five other guys that didn’t get picked within THREE rounds of where media gurus had them going.

                To put any discrepancy on the combine performance is still just guessing.

                Having said that, I do think it can make a big difference for small school guys or guys for whom there just isn’t a lot of tape. Everybody else, I think teams don’t change much based on athletic testing.

  25. KingRajesh

    NFL.com reporting Derrick Henry ran a 4.45 unofficial!

    • Coleslaw

      No. I saw a video of him and Elliot running together and elliot was at least .3 seconds ahead, and Elliot ran a 4.45

  26. Cysco

    “not bad”

    That’s the understatement of the year. That dude was truck’n.

    He destroyed christian michael’s performance. Basically the same size (one in taller. same weight.) two fewer reps on the bench, but lit that track on fire.

    Guaranteed that got PCJS’s attention.

  27. HI Hawk

    And the Gold medal in the underwear Olympics is awarded to Keith Marshall, Running Back, Georgia! We’ll be seeing that dude running, jumping, and lifting weights for the next couple of months. He earned some publicity, no doubt about that.

  28. Cysco

    OK, just spent some time watching video of Keith Marshall.

    Take the injury history out of the equations and he’s the best RB in the draft IMO. I’ve watched tape of all the big name RBs and none of them got me excited the way the Gurley did last year. I watch tape of Marshall and I see the same caliber of RB that I saw when watching Gurley tape. Explosive, great hands, good vision blistering speed.

    He’s the most impressive RB prospect I’ve seen this year


    • Miles

      I don’t know if I’m willing to go there yet. You’re saying he’s better than Zeke Elliott? I will say that he looks like a starting runningback. I could see him even being the third runningback off the board.

      • Cysco

        better than Zeke Elliott? For my money at the next level? yep.

        If you knew nothing about the two players and watched highlights of the two of them back to back, Marshall would be the one the jumped out at you as the rare talent.

        Elliott is a good back, but I’m not sure he has that special spark that will make him a true field flipping weapon at the next level.

        Watching Gurley tape, you saw something special. A combination of crazy athleticism and ability. I see that same game changing ability in Marshall.

        C-Mike size with speed in the neighborhood of Chris Johnson. That’s scary.

        The seahawks had C-mike towards the top of their board. If that’s the case, Marshall should be even higher, because he’s destroying C-mike numbers.

      • RealRhino2

        I wouldn’t either. He looks like Derrick Henry, to me. A bit upright, one cut and upfield, slow to cut, but super fast. Don’t think he’s the guy for us, but he could certainly be useful to somebody.

        • Miles

          The thing is, all that leverage stuff with RBs is coachable. You can get guys to run with leverage. You cannot get them to be that fast. They just have to be born like that.

          Normally I would say take it with a grain of salt. But the fact that he can come out of the backfield and catch passes makes me look twice for sure.

          This isn’t like that one small-school WR who reportedly ran a 4.19 then never did anything. Forgot his name …

          • Volume12

            This made me laugh. Sorry.

            Keith Marshall is not better than Zeke Elliott. Not on tape, and not based off his combine meadurables.

            • Steele

              When healthy, Keith Marshall is one of the absolute top handful of RBs. The total package. Speed, explosivenes, cuts, ability to take it to the house on any given play. Georgia just has these with their backs. Gurley, Sony Michel, Marshall.

              You laugh. If he stays healthy, Marshall is the one who will laugh, when he lands a starting gig and becomes a star. He is capable of it.

              • Volume12

                I’m sorry, I see speed that’s it.

                He’s not better than ‘Zeke’ Elliott.

                He wasn’t replaced by Gurley, Chubb, and Michel for only injuries,

                • Steele

                  I wasn’t comparing him to Elliott.

                  • Volume12

                    You weren’t comparing him to Elliott, but I responded to somepne who was.

                    He’s a decent speed back late in the draft.

          • RealRhino2

            Agree with V12. I did watch tape back to back, and Elliott was better.

            I don’t think the difference between the two (or between Marshall and Collins, or even Dixon, def. Perkins) is coachable. Some guys can simply get their hips low and cut faster than others. For what we do, I think that’s valuable.

            If I’m running toss sweeps, Marshall’s my guy. But we generally don’t.

            • Volume12

              Thank you.

              Marshall is really good at bouncing it to the outside, but I quetion if he can get tough NFL yardage between the tackles.

              He hits the hole to fast. ‘Slow to the hole, explode through it.’ Your wasting speed when you hit your 2nd gear behind the LOS.

              • Makal

                Marshall does the window washer move with his hands when cuts. This is a big sign he lacks lower body balance. I don’t see good vision or jump cuts from him. He just flashes speed when he gets a seam.

                • Volume12

                  Runs with no patience or control.

                  He’s a one cut and go back. I like him as a back that’s extremely raw with a ton of upside, but he’s gonna need time. Not dissimilar to C-mike.

  29. Trail Hawk

    Any thoughts on Killebrew teammate James Cowser Southern Utah? All he seems to do is produce. The guy intrigues me as a later round pick. Convert him to OLB and use him on special teams? Possible major upside. Any response would be appropriated. Thanks for this site Rob and all you do. My NFL IQ has jumped the last few years from reading you and all the contributors here.

  30. Miles

    So Derrick Henry broad jumped a full foot farther than Ezekiel Elliott at 10’10”. And, had a 37″ vert, and 4.45-4.5 40?

    Dude is going in the first frame.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      A future Panther waiting to happen.

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        it would be fun to see him in GB however, team him up with Lacy…. the offense could be called
        “2 tons of fun”.

  31. Volume12

    Watch out for Clemson’s Shaq Lawson. I’m telling ya’ll this dude is extremely ‘Seahawky.’

    • Coleslaw

      He’s already interviewed with Seattle, Atlanta and 2 or 3 others, they mighy be looking to replace Marsh with more production, or maybe Lawson would be the Bennett type and Clark is the 2nd string LEO.

      • Volume12


        I had a hunch they’d like him.

        He can take over games, and his personality and grit fit this team to a ‘T.’

        You can never have enough guys that can play inside and out, and IMO Seattle is starting to go away from the under-sized DE’s.

        • rowdy

          The guys motor never stops either, he’d be perfect in the marsh role and would allow us a better rotation

          • Volume12

            He could be a hedge for Bennett in a worse case scenario, only weighs 4 more pounds than Bruce Irvin, is the same size as FA Chris Long, he could always drop weight, same with Frank Clark, and speaking of Clark, he’s athletic enough to play LEO or LDE.

            • rowdy

              Very true I haven’t even seen his measurables just going film and he look long and big

    • rowdy

      I thought I was alone liking lawson. I think with Clark and Bennett though we can’t spend a 1st on him and I always thought he goes in the first

      • Volume12

        Why can’t you spend a 1st on him?

        • rowdy

          I’m all for it personally just figured pc/js wouldn’t pull the trigger in the first with Clark and Bennett on the roster.

          • Volume12

            Yeah- his measurables are gonna have to match/line up what thet look for, but if they do, he’s who I’m mocking to them in the 1st.

            • rowdy

              Everyone seems to like dobb more them lawson on here but I love his film. Plays pissed off and has plenty of impact plays that don’t show up on state sheets

              • Volume12

                That’s a great point. Some of what he does can’t be found in a box score.

                I’m pretty high on him too.

          • GeoffU

            Never hurts to have more pass rushers. Pretty sure pc/js feel the same.

            • GeoffU

              In fact this is what I expect at #26. Either a pass rusher (DE) or pass protector (OT). Only other area I could see is a high upside skill position player, like WR or RB.

            • rowdy

              Absolutely that’s why I would do it but I also think some impact players will fall in a more pressing position like linebacker if Irvin leaves. What if jaylon Smith falls?

              • Volume12

                He’s gonna fall outta round one,

                There’s a report, to be beleived or not IDK, that says he failed his medical exams and might not be ready to play this year.

                • rowdy

                  Haven’t read that yet, I’d figured he’d start on pup but be ready at the midpoint

              • GeoffU

                I don’t consider that a position worth a 1st. Wagner was a 2nd and that’s as high as we’ve drafted a non-rush linebacker and he was a MLB. Just don’t see it. Jaylon Smith will fall, it’s looking like, and that’s because he’ll be sitting out the 2016 season and perhaps beyond. Really really bad news for him, if the reports are correct. Still probably wouldn’t pick him with our 1st though, even if healthy…

                • Coleslaw

                  Jaylon smith in the second would be a steal even if he misses all of 2016, that dude is going to be great.

                • rowdy

                  Ouch just read the story. Nerve damage in both ankles, horrible news. There’s a chance he goes undrafted depending on how bad it is.

    • Steele

      Shaq Lawson would be a Frank Clark type of outside inside disruptor. I question his pass rush get off, which is worse than Dodd’s. But he makes up for that with LOS power stuff.

      If “Seahawky” in this case means splash plays minus pure speed around the edge, sure.

      • Volume12

        ‘Seahawky’ means a lot of things my man.

        He’s got speed and a fantastic bull rush,

        Yes, splash plays. The ability to take over games.

  32. Volume12

    Joe Dahl and Connor McGovern are really good looking O-lineman.

  33. Volume12

    In a pretty weak CB class, I wonder what team could’ve asked Georgia WR Malcom Mitchell to try out at CB.

  34. Volume12

    I actully think that Cal RB Daniel Lasco is a better RB than Keith Marshall,

    • Volume12

      11’3 foot broad and a 41.5″ inch vert. He was hurt this year and only got 88 carries, but in 2014-

      210 att, 1115 yds., 5.31 YPC, 12 TDs
      33 rec., 356 yds., 2 TDs.

      That’s a 3rd down back.

  35. Coleslaw

    What’s up with Alex Collins?

    • Volume12

      Him and Kenneth Dixon look slow man.

      This Daniel Lasco is a freak. Tied Marshall’s 10 yd split, and had a better broad and vert, why isn’t he being discussed?

      Watch Lasco’s pass protection. Superb.

      • Coleslaw

        I haven’t seen any of the RB stuff yet, but from what I’ve read in this thread, I think there will be some very good 3rd down backs available for both of our 3rd round picks.

        • Volume12

          I posted up above what Lasco did. Best broad jump from a RB in 6 years, half an inch under C-Mike’s vert, and look at that production when healthy.

          Ran a 4.44 and 4.53 40, which should even out to a 4.48 40.

          • Volume12

            I’m beginning to wonder if Lasco or Lawler is who Seattle was looking at when they scouted them 3 times this year.

          • Coleslaw

            I could dig it, 10 yards per reception, I’m gonna have to watch his tape for sure.

            • Coleslaw

              Just caught the drill where they catch 3 balls and run, Collins looked very quick to me, his plant foot wasn’t in the ground for more than a half second, gets to speed very fast. But, that’s the only drill I saw.

              • Volume12

                Looked slow in the 40 yd dash. But, these numbers will change come pro days.

                I still Derrick Henry is in play. What this guy is doing at his size, is unreal!

                • Coleslaw

                  Henry looks slow to me honestly, his change of direction is not very good, heavy feet. He’s a sprinter.

                  • Volume12

                    He’s different, yes. That’s ok.


                  • Volume12

                    Ya know who else ran a slow 40, but looks good in these drils? Auburn’s Peyton Barber. He’s 228 lbs.

                  • GeoffU

                    Maybe I just watched the wrong tapes, but I kind of agree. Not so sure it’s his lack of change of direction then it is picking the wrong hole. Against Florida he sure seemed to be doing a lot of running into the back of his own guys. Good thing about picking him is though his physique and combine numbers are almost identical to Von Miller, so we could always turn him into a LEO 🙂

                  • Steele

                    Derrick Henry has not lateral quickness, no moves, and poor short area quickness. He needs yards of buildup before he hits stride, and even then, he doesn’t change direction well. Runs high. Goes down easy. Not a power player. Just a big dude who wants to run like a halfback and can’t.

                    Won’t matter what he does in these drills.

                    • Rob Staton

                      “Derrick Henry has not lateral quickness, no moves, and poor short area quickness. He needs yards of buildup before he hits stride, and even then, he doesn’t change direction well. Runs high. Goes down easy. Not a power player. Just a big dude who wants to run like a halfback and can’t.”

                      Most of this isn’t true.

                  • GeoffU

                    Mediocre 3 cone and short shuttle seem to confirm this: 7.2, 4.38

              • HI Hawk

                Lasco looked great at the shrine game too. If we’re looking for a 3rd down specialist, I’m all aboard. Marshall has better size though and could project to a full time role for some teams. It all depends on what the teams are looking for.

      • Steele

        Are you rooting for guys you like to do better than expected? Because that is what shoots them up the board and out of consideration.

        Like stocks, you want a prospect to meet expectations but not get too much attention. In fact, take the ones who do less well, but you know based on other information that the workouts can be discounted.

        • Volume12

          That’s right, because every guy that has a fantastic combine are 1st round picks.

          You do realize what Seattle’s 1st picks consist of right?

          • Volume12

            Why would root for a guy to struggle?

            • Steele

              So you can get them cheaper. Best reason of all.

              • Volume12

                That’s ridiculous.

                A great combine doesn’t mean a prospect is all of a sudden out of reach for Seattle. If anything, it makes them sit up and take notice.

                Good players fall through the cracks all the time.

  36. J Boy

    One of my favorite prospects in this entire draft is Eric Striker. I love almost everything about him- his relentless motor, knack for making the splash play, decent bulk, quick feet, big hands, dynamic personality- I could go on and on. However, I say I like ALMOST everything about him because he has only 31 1/4 in arms. Do you guys see this as a deal breaker for the Seahawks? His arm length doesn’t seem like a major weakness on tape, but you just don’t see many great LB’s with arms shorter than 32 in.

    • Steele

      The Seahawks have passed on a good number of great prospects because of measurements. I’m against that. Give or take a bit, fine, but a quarter inch, a half inch, so what.

      Jared Goff is going to drop because fools think his hands are too small. They’re the same size as Derek Carr’s.

      Striker is a nice compromise between the Deion Jones fans in here who want a fast LB playing in space, and those who want a guy who can get to the QB.

  37. Volume12

    Connor McGovern might just be the best Seahawk O-lineman to emerge from the combine. NC St s Joe Thuney too. We know how much TC loves his Mizzou OL.

    He checks off what Seattle said they’re looking for in O-lineman this year. SRT aka Smart-Reliable-Tough.

    I’m a little cautious about Garnett and Dahls 10 yd split’s. 1.8 is not good.

    • Volume12

      Everything else looks good about Dahl though.

      Westerman, Whitehair, Spriggs, and Ryan Kelly look ‘Seahawky’ too though.


        Pete said in interview with nfl radio that they want the ball more.and some guys can knock that ball out better then others.he is correct does anybody think we got enough turnover s.this year.does anybody in this draft stand out in that

      • GeoffU

        Is it just me or does there seem to be a lot of talent in this draft? Not so much on the top end, but that’s good for Seattle since we never pick there anyway.

        • Volume12

          End of 2nd-end of 5th is where the talent is.

          But, I do like Derrick Henry, Shaq Lawson, Keanu Neal, Jason Spriggs, Cody Whitehair, Xavien Howard, William Jackson at the end of round one.

          • Volume12

            And of course some of the DTs. Jones, Rankins, Washington, Johnson, etc.

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        Dahl would look good as a value pick in the 3rd day portion of the draft.
        I’m also thinking, Whitehair and Spriggs will be gone by #26, due to having solid (expected) combine numbers.

        • Volume12

          You could be right.

          Dahl and McGovern are who I got my eye on. And UCLA’s Caleb Benenoch as a developmental/backup OT later in the draft.

          There’s also gonna be some guys that emerge from the pro days too.

          And Garnett might have everything they look for but some of the numbers.

  38. Volume12

    Now, I know why TC was ‘dozing off.’ Only 7 O-lineman meet their criteria for the broad jump and 10 yd split’s so far. And maybe 6, because one of them had awful agility drills.

    K-St’s Cody Whitehair
    Mizzou’s Connor McGovern
    TCU’s Hal Vaitai- awful agility numbers
    NC St’s Joe Thuney
    Indiana’s Jason Spriggs
    UCLA’s Jake Brendel
    ND St’s Joe Haeg

    Wazzu’s Joe Dahl matched everything but the 10 yd. split.

    • Nick

      Have they never drafted anyone that doesn’t fit these criteria on OL? Will our analysis now be limited to these six guys as a result?

      • Volume12

        Oh IDK about that.

        But, if they do place a premium on the 10 yd splits and broad jumps, these are the guys. Honestly, I’m disappointed in this O-line class.

        • Nick

          It’s looking more and more like they use Rd 2 and Rd 3 to address their O-line. Rd 1 looks like they could focus on a defensive playmaker (Lawson, Neal, Jones, Rankins etc.).

        • lil'stink

          Why would you be disappointed? Just because a player doesn’t check all the boxes at the combine doesn’t mean he won’t go on to be a very successful NFL player. It just means Tom Cable won’t want to draft him 😉

          • Volume12

            A lot of guys struggled to move. Almost labored.

            I don’t think an O-lineman has to check all the boxes, but Seattle does place a premium on 10 yd splits, broad jumps, and guys that are tough, gritty, nasty, play with an edge.

    • GeoffU

      Is there some place you’re getting the 10-yd split numbers? Or is it from watching NFL Network?

      • Volume12

        The network and Josh Norris from Rotoworld.

        • Volume12

          And if they are in fact looking for Strength-Reliability-Toughness or SRT, which JS speifically mentioned, in their O-lineman this year, perhaps they shift and place a premium on other things.

          But then we hear, ‘they aren’t changing in how they do things.’

          Stanford’s Josh Garnett could be the Tyler Lockett of this O-line class.

          • HI Hawk

            SRT = Westerman. I really like that kid after watching the combine workouts and then his draft breakdown videos. Such a nasty, competitive, exceedingly strong man. He is my favorite offensive lineman.

    • RealRhino2

      If this is what got us John Moffitt, Justin Britt and Terry Poole, then we need new criteria….

  39. Volume12

    Is NC St’s QB Jacoby Brissett gonna be our backup?

    • MisterNeutron

      Brissett is one of 3 QBs I have as a potential late-round/FA Tarvaris replacement, the others being Trevone Boykin and Jeff Driskel. Boykin has had some serious off-field issues, but I really like his play and his raw talent. Driskel was awful at Florida but looked great at Louisiana Tech. Driskel is pretty mobile for a guy his size–in 2015, he had 323 yds rushing and 5 TDs, including a 37 yd run.

      • Volume12

        Both of those guys are nice options too.

        Driskel really stepped up this year.

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        I’ll throw a name out there as a mid/late rounder…. Prescott

        • Trevor

          He is going in the top 3 rounds. I could see him being a big riser. Nice pick.

          • MisterNeutron

            Yeah, Prescott is in that 2nd tier of QBs. I’d be shocked if he makes it past the 3rd round, provided he has at least a good showing on Saturday.

            • Miles

              So far I would say no thanks on Brissett. He takes a lot of sacks and worst of all he only really makes one read on tape for nearly every play. Definitely a developmental guy.

              • MisterNeutron

                But if he can be had in the 7th round or as an undrated free agent? Keep Tarvaris for another year if possible and develop Brissett.

  40. MisterNeutron

    I’d be happy with either Tyler Ervin or DeAndre Washington as a later-round pick. Both are smart, productive guys with great athleticism who tested well, both could share KR/PR duties with Lockett, and both could be a fast, elusive, pass-catching 3rd down back. Not sure about Ervin as a blocker due to his slight frame, but he has “lesser Percy Harvin” written all over him (but with a better attitude). Kenyan Drake is another intriguing 3rd down/pass-catching back possibility; he looks more like a wide-out than a running back.

    On the flip side, a bit disappointed with Alex Collins’ performance today, but I still like him–perhaps in a later round. Same with Paul Perkins, who did test well in a few areas not as well as I had expected. The big surprises today were Keith Marshall and Daniel Lasco–Lasco came out of nowhere to kick butt in some of the drills. Even so, Lasco’s draft stock probably won’t rise that much due to his injury and performance struggles in 2015.

    • Volume12

      Collins is gonna be one of these backs that run a faster 40 time at his pro day. Which is fine. He’s still a really good back.

      Mike Davis from S. Carolina last year comes to mind.

      • Trevor

        That 28″ vertical is little worrisome though.

        • Volume12

          He’s gonna jump again on his pro day.

          They liked Mike Davis last year, and his combine was worse than Collins IIRC. But that pro day changed it.

          • Volume12

            Couple other backs had really nice combines.

            Kenyan Drake and CJ Prosise.

            • Trevor

              I really like Prosise. Great receiver out of the backfield and would be an awesome compliment with Rawls. Would like to see him as our 3d round comp pick maybe.

        • MisterNeutron

          Yeah, I was less concerned about Collins’ 40 time and more worried about his vertical and the pass-catching drills. He didn’t fare so well in the broad jump either, and he didn’t participate in the 3-cone or in either shuttle drill. All that said, after watching Collins in 4 games I’m still a big fan and think he’s a smart, tough player who should have a good NFL career.

          • Volume12

            If he didn’t participate, maybe he’s hurt?

            Or if he felt like ‘nah, screw it.’ Then I wouldn’t touch dude with a 10 foot pole.

            • MisterNeutron

              I don’t think Collins chose to skip those drills–it looks like all the same RBs missed those three drills. Not sure what happened there.

      • matt

        Collins’ weak performance surprised me a great deal. He looks really explosive on tape, but just didn’t bring it today.

    • J

      Like Jonothan Williams better than Collins personally.

  41. Greg haugsven

    Salary cap set at $155.27 million.

  42. CharlieTheUnicorn

    I’m still trying to get over the OT that has officially measured 11.75″ hands.

    • Volume12

      Who was that Charlie?

      • Trevor

        It was actually a DL Deforest Buckner. He and Ramsey are going to be the first two defenders off the board IMO. Buckner is a beast.

        • MisterNeutron

          I’d rather have Buckner than Bosa. I think Buckner has a higher ceiling. A shame Seattle has no shot at him in the draft.

          • Volume12

            I’m concerned about Bosa’s character.

            He could be another Clowney.

    • matt

      Westerman and Le’Raven Clark both measured 11 7/8″ hands.

      • HI Hawk

        Westerman! No mention of him during the primetime replay, but watching drills, he was awesome. If he interviewed like he played, I’m guessing JS enjoyed the interview.

  43. smitty1547

    I it possible to have an attitude worse than Harvin?

  44. Ed

    Rob will probably start a new article and not answer this, but here it is. Reports say Jaylon Smith has nerve damage and will miss the entire 2016 draft. That says no 1st round at all, but if the Hawks trade back, is it something to think about?

    • Volume12

      No. Nerve damage is scary. It’s killed careers, before they even got off the ground.

    • Greg haugsven

      He might have gone from a first rounder to a third day draft pick.

    • Rob Staton

      Unfortunately not. Jaylon Smith’s injury is probably going to push him down quite a lot — and I can’t imagine Seattle pulling the trigger.

  45. Nathan

    Keanu Neal may be off the board if the reports about Pittsburgh and Arizona are true.

    • Nate

      What reports are you referring to?

    • nichansen01

      What are the reports?

    • Nate

      Reports are that Pittsburgh may be targeting him in the second or third round. At least thats what the article I found said.

    • Nathan

      The Cardinals and Steelers are suitors for Keanu Neal in the first round. – Tony Pauline, WalterFootball.com
      Read more at http://walterfootball.com/nflrumors#POQBHSKSMUPMvvGZ.99

  46. Michael M.

    What the hell Alex Collins? Seriously gonna jump a 28.5″ vert? Guess I can say goodbye to the idea of you as a Seahawk.

  47. HI Hawk

    Sold on Westerman! Stud, nasty, competitive, alpha, aggressive, athletic. I’ve seen enough to want him blocking for Russ. On non contact drills he can’t seem to help himself.

    Late round guy, Seumalu. Might need to add strength, but exquisite footwork and balance.

    • matt

      Same here. Westerman is a stud!

  48. matt

    Out of all the great performances today, Dan Vitale surprised me the most. Didn’t run a great 40-4.60, but tested fantastically in every other drill:
    T1(out of RB class) BP-30 reps
    3 VJ-38.5″
    T5 BJ- 10’3″
    9 3C-7.12
    1 SS-4.12

    At 6’1″ 239 lbs Vitale is a sparq monster! Higher score than Henry I’d bet. He had a real good Senior bowl week, showing versatility to play some TE to boot.

    • HI Hawk

      Henry is damn near 6’3, 247 lbs, so significantly bigger and more athletic than Vitale. No chance his Sparq score is higher.

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