Breaking down the draft class: Jamarco Jones

PFF really liked Jamarco Jones (click here). So much so, according to this video they graded him as a second round talent:

So why didn’t he go in the second round?

I think there are two reasons.

Firstly, it’s his combine performance. TEF has helped us quantify the number of truly explosive offensive vs defensive linemen entering the league in recent years:

Explosive offensive linemen at the combine:

2016 — 6
2017 — 3
2018 — 7

Explosive defensive linemen at the combine:

2016 — 26
2017 — 30
2018 — 22

This is an era of football where the best college athletes are playing defense. John Schneider references this all the time. It’s a problem that exists, it’s hurting the league and they need a solution.

Offensive tackles with fantastic physical profiles are going to be over-drafted for the foreseeable future as teams look for that solution. Kolton Miller is a fine example. He had a Lane Johnson-esque combine. He didn’t play like Johnson at UCLA but found a home in the top-20 because his combination of size, length, agility and explosive traits is all too uncommon at his position these days.

Jamarco Jones is a lot more Orlando Brown than Kolton Miller as an athlete.

Here’s his combine performance:

Height: 6-4
Weight: 299lbs
Forty: 5.50
Bench: DNP
Vertical: 24 inches
Broad: 8-6
Three-cone: 8.32
Short shuttle: 4.92

At least Orlando Brown had the excuse of being 345lbs. Incredibly, he comprehensively beat Jones in the three-cone (7.87).

Jones had the third worst vertical, third worst forty, third worst short shuttle and third worst three cone among offensive linemen.

Seattle’s starting left tackle in 2018 (Duane Brown) ran a 4.52 short shuttle, a 7.58 three cone and a 5.08 forty (despite carrying an extra 16lbs).

That’s the main reason why Jones dropped to round five. This is a league crying out for an athletic counter punch to the extreme athleticism playing defense. His combine performance likely took him off a number of draft boards.

In his bio, an anonymous NFC Executive is quoted as saying:

“His Combine was awful. He athletic testing was reject level. It’s hard to trust a tackle to start if he has reject level testing.”

What’s the other reason he dropped?

I’ll come back to it. I want to talk about the positives first.

When Jones connects, he usually wins. There are numerous examples I could show you where he engages the block and finishes. His hand placement, power and toughness are all commendable. If he gets his hands on you, it’s very difficult to disengage or counter.

I watched three games (Iowa, USC, Michigan) and never saw an instance where he overextended and lost balance. It’s impressive at the level he played and the opponents he played against. In the BIG-10 you don’t see many elite speed rushers but you see a lot of power and physicality. He matched up perfectly well and didn’t lose many hand battles. He often deals the first blow, delivers a jacked-up punch and finishes. He’s precise with his hand placement and the punch carries precision and power. He won nearly every battle I saw where he connected with the defender.

I didn’t see him beaten by a bull rush either. There were a couple of occasions against Michigan where he was jolted back. Against Iowa I noted a snap where he was moderately pushed back into the pocket. He simply dropped the anchor and held the defender at bay long enough for the quarterback to make a clean throw.

You see a lot of snaps like this vs Rasheem Green. He connects, finishes and it’s job done:

For the most part he handles his business. I could show you multiple videos of standard pass sets where he connects and finishes. If you were wondering why he started for Ohio State despite such a poor combine, clips like this will shed some light:

He is also able to move people in the running game. He had one nice snap against Iowa where he engaged the defender at the LOS and drove him back five yards on 2nd and 3, paving the way for the running back to get a first down. He’s not a tone setting mauler per se but he was reasonable in the short yardage game and his ability to connect and finish is a positive here too.

There are examples of second-level willingness and effectiveness:

There’s also evidence of handy double team work and there were examples where he passed off one defender inside to cover a stunting pass-rusher attacking the edge. His awareness and level of comfort were impressive.

Yet he has one maddening major technical flaw I can’t get my head around.

Play inside out. Don’t get beat inside. Make sure the DE has to get you outside. Especially when you have 35 1/8 inch arms.

Too often Jones was beaten inside. I don’t know why Ohio State didn’t fix this. They didn’t come up against many great speed rushers. In the three games I watched there were multiple examples where Jones dropped too deep in his kick slide and got beat inside. He left the gate wide open. He was susceptible to a counter (spin move) or simple invited the DE to pressure the quarterback:

Was he concerned about the edge rush too much, anticipating problems against speed and overcompensating? If so, someone really needed to address this and make it clear — let that guy beat you with speed. You have the length. Make his route to the quarterback as long as possible. Trust the QB to make the throw. You’re Ohio State. You have an experienced QB and numerous playmakers.

I can’t think of any other reason why he kept leaving the B gap open to be exploited. But it’s where he was beaten. And sadly, he doesn’t have the athletic profile to recover and counter.

He needs to eliminate this from his game. He has fantastic, ideal length for the position. There are examples where he just shoves a DE to protect the arc. Use their speed to their disadvantage, use your length to run them out of the play. Don’t leave yourself open to get beat inside.

Jones was a good blocker in college with a technical flaw. That’s fixable. His athletic profile is more of a concern. A pro-training program should help. It might take time though. And he’ll need to show improvement.

His athletic limitations could be a death knell to any future starting potential. However, if he can learn to play inside out and with his ability to lock on and finish — there’s at least something to work with. It was worth a fifth round pick to find out and if he ends up being no more than a reasonable backup tackle — that’s worth a day three flier any year.

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  1. Dawgma

    They’ve drafted more than their share of hyper athletic tackles who couldn’t block to save their damn lives. I couldn’t be happier to see the draft strategy that has *utterly failed them* kicked out on its ass.

    That’s not to say I expect an unathletic plodder picked in the 5th round to amount to much of anything. But I’ll take it as a positive that they seem to have figured out that it might a good idea if the guys they drafted to play on the offensive line had actually shown they were, you know, any good at playing on the offensive line.

    • Tyler Jorgensen

      And yet, they did this last year with Pocic too. And now many are clamoring to move on from him after a single year. Strange, considering many of the same are looking at Jones with hope.

      I get you. Skill is important. But you can’t take a jackass to the derby, and you can’t win in the NFL with fundamentals if your athleticism is too lacking.

    • Rob Staton

      I don’t think this is an accurate portrayal of the situation though Dawgma (and a misconception Seahawks fans and critics have too often taken to referencing).

      Seattle didn’t have a ‘draft strategy’ to ignore competent blocking linemen in favour of ultra athletic, raw players. That simply was not the case. They were faced, like the rest of the league, with a Sahara desert of O-line talent. Unless you were picking in the top-15, good luck finding a good O-liner. We did the analysis either in 2017 or 2016 (I can’t recall which). About four offensive linemen made the Pro Bowl after Seattle’s first pick in the space of 6-7 years.

      Faced with such a terrible situation, they did what made the most sense. Added players with the potential for greatness and tried to coach them up. Having enjoyed initial success here with JR Sweezy, they clearly acted from a position of confidence. Unfortunately it didn’t work out and that’s why Tom Cable isn’t here any more.

      But it’s wrong to suggest they were foolish to use this plan or that they’ve now, ‘worked out’ that all along they just needed to draft terrible athletes who just didn’t embarrass themselves against weak college opponents. That’s not what is going on at all.

      • Pedestrian

        I’ve gotta agree here with Rob. As shown in this article the # of explosive linemen heavily favors defense. The disparity has just been too much over the years, and now we’ve seen it catch up with most teams in the league now. Maybe the Seahawks were foolish to not see it coming sooner (when they traded unger away).

        I actually think Pocic is going to be a star on this team. Think about how long it’s taken these “projects” to learn how to block correctly. Pocic came in the league already being technically sound, and an off-season in the weight room will be night and day. I’m hoping for the same with jones, though it sounds like he may be closer to his ceiling physically.

        • McZ

          The misconception here is, that explosiveness is a required trait for a O-lineman. It clearly is not; it has to be good enough, that’s all. Last years draft and the following season showed us, that ‘sub-par athletes’ like Ramczyk actually did a much, much better job than the Cam Robinsons and Germain Ifedis of the world.

          The Jones pick is an indication, that Solari seems to cherish this reality, where Cable clearly did not.

          Btw, Unger had the most crap season of his life in 2017.

      • Pedestrian

        All good points, Rob

      • ramatsu

        Although someone pointed out that Cable never did this draft-defensive-talent-and-convert thing before coming to Seattle, and doesn’t appear to be doing it since leaving, so maybe that strategy has been unfairly hung on him.

      • McZ

        While the stats are right, I guess ‘explosiveness’ is not the premier trait you want an OL to have.

        Picking Ryan Ramczyk late first round in 2017 would not have been a fate of luck, but one of solid research.
        IMO, the Lions quietly had the best draft in the league, and Ragnow and Crosby will play better coming season than Ifedi can ever hope for.

        Let’s assume, they do, what does this tell us?

        • Rad_man

          I would not use pro bowls to rate the o line players taken after the Seahawks first pick.

        • Rob Staton

          Explosiveness is the premier trait you want, along with size and length.

          That is indisputable.

          It doesn’t guarantee you will succeed in the NFL, but it’s the trait you want.

          • McZ

            So, why do so many O-linemen get better, when they loose a fair amount of their explosiveness by getting older? Why are there certain types of lineman making it in the early years, that are just average in this regard?

            I’m asking this to myself since the headscratching Ifedi-pick, too much to bear for my poor brain.

            I think, Pocic and Jones are departures from a explosiveness-first agenda, if by force (which I dispute) or by decision isn’t important.

            • Rob Staton

              Pocic was one of the most explosive OL’s in the 2017 draft.

              Jamarco Jones is a day three flier.

              I feel like I’ve been over this so many times to be honest but to answer your questions

              1. There’s nothing to suggest players ‘lose’ their explosiveness as they get older. Some will some won’t. They aren’t doing the combine after five years in the league. So it’s an assumption to think explosiveness dramatically decreases. Is Lane Johnson any less explosive today five years into his pro career? Nope.

              2. There are barely any young linemen succeeding and the best generally have explosive traits (eg Johnson). But it’d be a mistake anyway to see my argument as “explosive traits are the best traits to have” = “you can only succeed with great explosive traits”. Nobody has made that argument. There are always exceptions.

    • Madmark

      Honestly I believe they drafted this guy to take the Paul McQuiston slot for the next 4 years that would be a winfor 5th round pick. He comes from Ohio St. the NFL isn’t going to big for him with his record. I honestly believe he will take Rees Odhiambo spot. his problem is his health and knowing its been going on 4 year I just don’t think he has the durability anymore.
      We need to take a look at what we have and play it out with the new coaches and scheme. No matter what you think it’s going to take a year. I guess we can only hope it starts slow and ends with the team starting to click together towards the end of the year. If we get a wild card anything is possible.

  2. Elmer

    And you can’t make chicken salad out of chicken s**t.

    Maybe the new offensive coaches are looking for different attributes, particularly to help with run blocking. I really hope that it works out for Jones and that he can add serviceable depth to the O-line. We all know that injuries are a fact of life.

    • GerryG

      I’m not really sure we say anything about their Oline strategy based off this single selection. The pick may just represent what they felt was value. The guy was rated well by PFF (presumably elsewhere then too) and fell due to a terrible combine. It’s the 5th round, take a shot.

  3. cha

    Is there any NFL comp for an OL/OT who had that bad of a combine and yet turned into a serviceable NFL player?

    • Rob Staton

      None spring to mind but I’m sure there’ll be some.

    • Madmark

      If he could fulfill a backup roll at OT and G then he is a good pick I think. He could just become another Chris Gray who they keep trying to replace and just couldn’t until he retired hehe.

    • Dregur

      Cam Robinson was a tad better, but not that much better.

    • Dregur

      Cam Robinson was a tad better, especially in the 40, but he was not that much better.

      Height: 6-6
      Weight: 320lbs
      Forty: 5.14
      Bench: DNP
      Vertical: 26 inches
      Broad: 8-8
      Three-cone: 7.82
      Short shuttle: 4.82

    • WALL UP

      He reminds me a lot of Ray Roberts. He wasn’t the most athletic. But, had a serviceable career.

    • FresnoHawk

      I’m sure there’s a boat load

  4. Old but Slow

    I see that the guys from PFF are of the persuasion that we should have drafted OL first. Maybe they should visit here more often.

    • McZ

      Well, wasn’t it Mike Renner who called JJ “already NFL ready”?

  5. DC

    Maybe young players will see the NFL UFA O linemen earning $5M plus per season just for fogging a mirror and decide that the glory of sacks isn’t everything. Hopefully the pedulum will swing back some. It’s gotten hard to watch.

  6. j hawk

    Thank you Rob, I really enjoy these write ups on our new players. I enjoy and learn from everyone’s comments. Go Hawks !

  7. jeff stufft

    Thank you Rob, I really enjoy these write ups on our new players. I enjoy and learn from everyone’s comments. Go Hawks !

  8. DJ 1/2 Way (Sea/PDX)

    I think it sounds so much better to say the Seahawks drafted Jones with their fourth fifth round pick, or even with their 7th of nine picks. Also, in the fifth round, the Seahawks drafted a one handed linebacker, a punter and a safety they will convert to a cornerback. Then they drafted a tackle. He is a long term starter at Ohio State who got better every year. He is not a wrestler, power forward or a defensive lineman.

    I like how the PFF guys just dismissed Will Dissly as a blocking tight end. He looked like one of those “better in the NFL” kind of guys. I am betting that half the first six picks make big contributions in their first year and that all six will be long term starters with a couple all pros.

  9. LouieLouie

    Hey Rob.
    Maybe Jamarko will be a decent guard. Playing inside would limit his exposure and to the athletic attributes that he lacks. He seems stout as a blocker. On the right side he may have a tackle and a blocking TE, so he may not need to be all athletic, just hold his ground or make holes for the running backs. With Penny he may not even need to hold the block that long.

  10. Jeff M.

    The athletic limitations could be responsible for the technique flaw. If he can’t get outside to speed rushers without cheating that direction he may be forced to do so (and then if the rusher goes inside instead he’s already moving the wrong way and can’t get back).

    • Mark Souza

      Bing-bing-bing. Winner. That’s exactly what’s going on.

      • Rob Staton

        This was already touched on in the piece.

    • hawkdawg

      Isn’t Ifedi another example of this? He not only cheats to the outside, he jumps early to the outside! Although I think his counter is better…

      • EBurgz

        Watching Jones cheat the outside shoulder made me immediately think of Ifedi. Thing is, Ifedi is a stud athlete for his size and doesn’t need to and it still hasn’t been fixed yet. Hoping it’s a mental thing (lack of confidence?) with Ifedi that Duane Brown (Ifedi’s mentor) can help him fix. No need to false start every time bro.

        Jones looks way more natural in his pass blocking than Ifedi but isn’t nearly as athletic. Hopefully they both learn to be decent blockers. Also, watching fluker reminds me of ifedi. Fix them all Solari!

  11. Sea Mode

    Thanks for the write-up. I think he’s just fine for a day 3 flier pick. And what gives me some hope are the intangibles, how his coach and trainer really vouched for him (beyond the typical, half-obligatory “he contributed a lot to our program” comments).

  12. Largent80

    I thought it was a good pick. Dude played better in games than his combine obviously. He can’t be much worse than the Joke was last year.

    Hopefully Solari is getting together with the linemen and getting a repport going before mini-camp. It would be awful nice to have a good idea of who is playing where other than center and LT.

    NFL d-linemen are even faster so Jones needs to work on sealing off that inside, it isn’t going to be easy but he has workable attributes.

    • Rob Staton

      It should be a fairly straight forward fix. Just play inside out. Use your length to protect the EDGE. He will always struggle against elite EDGE speed but at least get beat that way rather than giving up a simple B-gap pressure.

      The other thing he needs to do is really hammer a pro-training program. He should be able to make major athletic improvements in the next 12 months.

      • Trevor

        Agree completely Rob. They have a starting LT and hopefully Ifedi or Fant really step up and solidify the RT spot this year so Jones was drafted as a depth Swing OT IMO. He will have a year to work on any technique issues and focus on training to improve his athleticism.

        He has great length and good natural instincts for the position both of which cannot be taught. I also like that he seems like a solid competitor who battles.

        I think it was a great 5th round pick. If they can get a quality swing OT in the 5th round then it might not be a home run but is certainly a solid single.

  13. Mark Souza

    He might make a decent guard, but he doesn’t have the attributes to be a tackle in the NFL. He never plays with his hand on the ground because he’s not quick enough starting from that position to defend the edge, even in college. To help him, to give him a head start, Ohio St. had him in a two point stance on every play. He probably doesn’t need to start in an up position on run plays, but unless you want to constantly tip your hand as to which plays are going to be runs, and which are passes, then you need to start him in the up position even on running plays.

    Unless Seattle wants to run the same blocking scheme as Ohio St. with the line up in a two point stance on every play, then Jamarco doesn’t stand a chance at tackle (and maybe not even then). But the kid is strong, mauls people and is relentless finishing his blocks. If moved inside, he’s a force and is somebody you’d be glad to have around. He will provide healthy competition and may eventually win a starting guard slot.

    • seanmatt

      I wonder if Rob would comment on this. Does Jones profile as a potentially starter level guard? Maybe a right guard? I might be stuck in the past here(or just wrong) but I’ve always felt like right guard is where you can stick your least athletic lineman (I’m thinking Chris Gray of the Holmgren era Hawks).

      • Rob Staton

        It’s always possible that a player not physically able to start at tackle will be tried inside.

        But his size and arm length lends itself to tackle.

        • Largent80

          Yes, It would be wise for Seattle to develop him at tackle. Seems we have guards up to our double chins.

          A year or so in the system and watching may do wonders for him and Brown will probably be gone in 2 years. If you can get a 5th rounder as a starter after 2 years it’s gold.

  14. Tecmo Bowl

    “I watched three games (Iowa, USC, Michigan) and never saw an instance where he overextended and lost balance. It’s impressive at the level he played and the opponents he played against.” Rob

    Good balance is crucial and often overlooked. Think Jones has a good chance of sticking around- like him a lot more than Justin Senior. Agree with posters above that his best position is likely G, where his glaring lack of athleticism is somewhat mitigated.

  15. Nick

    Remember how Shaquill Griffin got lit up by Amara Darboh in college? And yet Griffin went on to become the better (first year) player.

    Watching Rasheem Green get stonewalled by Jamarco Jones reminded me of that. And again, I’d bet on the player who got “beat” in college to be the better (first year) player.

    • FresnoHawk

      1st year better I agree and I don’t blame Darboh for his lack of production last year, folks are underestimating how good our WR corp is, I thinks it’s really really good and super super fast.

    • Largent80

      It took Golden Tate 3 years to become a decent WR. Darboh had minimal plays last year, he’s going to need more than that to go forward and that is on HIM in a competition based team system.

  16. Trevor

    Jones obviously had a terrible combine but I don’t see that glaring lack of athleticism everyone is referring to on tape. For certain he tends to overplay outside shoulder which leaves him exposed to the inside move but with his incredible arm length this should be an easy fix as his length is a great equalizer.

    We all think Rasheem Green is a great athlete with incredible upside and Jones stones him. It certainly does not look like an athletic mismatch.

    He obviously is not a Day #1 starter but if he can improve his explosiveness even just a bit and focus on playing inside out letting his 35 ” + arms do the work for him I see no reason why he cannot be the quality swing OT we have lacked since Mcquistan.

    I am probably in the minority I think but I think he should absolutely stay at OT as he has the length and instincts you can’t teach. A legit developmental OT is much harder to find than a developmental G.

    • FresnoHawk

      What about Isiah Battle & Willie Beavers? Especially Battle he’s got to be able to beat out a rookie by now?

  17. Dave Ashton

    Where do you see Penny v the other backs that went late first early second guys? We get the cream?

  18. Gohawks5151

    Hype video of the first day back at Seahawks practice has been up. Seen a lot of people talk about Griffin moving to left corner. What i saw was David Moore beating him on a fade. I have had a feeling about him since last years preseason. And when they cut Freeney in order to keep him i was more sold. I can see him leap frogging Darboh and Brown. He plays tough and sure, caught balls over the middle and looks like Tate after the catch. Can’t wait for these preseason games!

    • FresnoHawk

      Glad to hear Moore is making plays I’m a big fan of Moore watch out for Marcus Johnson before he left Philly he was dominating Philly secondary.

  19. cha

    Eagles just cut Mychal Kendricks, aka the one that got away.

    Wonder if the Hawks would see if he would be interested in a 1 year deal for depth.

    • Mr. Offseason

      It would be nice but I think he’d like to go to a team where he’s a day 1 starter. It would be cool to see him play SLB but we already have Barkevious Mingo who could be a good fit there. You’d essentially have to bench Mingo for Kendricks if you signed him, and that would send bad vibes.

      • cha

        You’re probably right but every year we see players in his situation. Starter quality, get released and the right offer doesn’t come in. Guy chooses to take a one year deal on a contender and re-establish value in a role. I thought that was implied with what I said about a 1 year deal.

        You need to think more about the roster overall than who the starters are. It doesn’t matter if Mingo is already there or is minted the starter. Kendricks would get lots of snaps, probably at all 3 LB positions if he fits the scheme. Wagner and Wright played an insane % of the defensive snaps last year and Kenricks is injury protection. Probably could be a hell raiser on special teams too.

        • Mr. Offseason

          I’d sure be excited if they did, just not sure they’re willing to shell out the dollars for it. How many significant deals have they made in this part of the off-season? I honestly don’t remember. What I think they’ll do is save their cap for just in case a player becomes available via trade that they really like ala Sheldon Richardson (without the high draft capital this time).

  20. Coleslaw

    I love the new kickoff rules. I think it’s going to make it more fun. Its 1v1 for all 22 players.
    Pete is going to run with this, no question. While teams may struggle to adjust to the new rules I have no doubt Seattle will be well prepared and maybe even ahead of the game again. Special teams has always been a key group for PC, JS gave him the tools, now Pete can get creative.

  21. Kenny Sloth

    NFL and the PA finalized their 90$ mil social justice agreement

  22. Coach

    I see Incognito is an available free agent now. I’d feel a lot better with Fluker and Incognito as our guards – then we’d be able to run the ball!

    I see that as the best way to improve our team with the remaining cap money that we have available.


    Go Hawks!!

    • Mr. Offseason

      I think he’s retiring and going into broadcasting. Also he’s a jackass.

    • madmark

      Not only NO but hell NO. Completely against what this team stands for. So NO!

    • Elmer

      When, deep down in your soul, you’re a jerk, I’m not sure that’s fixable. (e.g., LaVar Ball).


    • Group Captain Mandrake

      Sine he’s under involuntary psychiatric hold for possible mental issues, I doubt anyone takes a flyer on him.

  23. Coleslaw

    He’s still retired

    • Coach

      Oh, I heard that he was a free agent now because the Bills released him and that he wants to play again.

      • Smitty1547

        I was one of the few that thought we should have given him a try the year he sat out while he was cheap. Now that hes expensive i still feel he’s better than anything else we got.

      • Rob Staton

        Yep, he now wants to play again

        • Hawk Eye

          he wants to get paid. That was why he retired. He signed a contract for less money this year, then regretted it, retired, asked to be released so he can play for more money.

          probably better than the guards they have, but a 1 year solution at best, and he will bring some drama to the room. His play was slipping last year and he is getting old.
          I don’t see it happening for the hawks

  24. CharlieTheUnicorn

    I think the Seahawks have to kick the tires on recently cut Mychal Kendricks.
    Could be a solid back-up for Wagner…. and could provide some proven depth in the LB room.

    • Hawk Eye

      he was making big money, won’t come cheap

    • lil'stink

      LB depth isn’t perfect but with Mingo and Griffin it’s certainly looks to be better than the last few years… really all we need is for someone else to step up in training camp and I think we’re pretty good. Not sure it’s worth spending $$ on a backup.

      • Mr. Offseason

        It would be nice to have him as a backup but he’d have to come cheap. And these days guys that good just don’t end up settling for cheap deals. There’s almost always someone who’s willing to pony up to some degree.

  25. Mr. Offseason

    If the Seahawks are going to spend any more money this off-season it should be on a deal with Eric Reid. Dude is a pro bowl safety and would be awesome next to Earl Thomas. I think he’s filing for collusion so that may keep him off a team, but I would spend the rest of our available cap on him right now for a 1 year deal.

    • Rob Staton

      They already re-signed McDougald and only drafted Hill and Thompson a year ago.

      • Del tre

        Plus good odds he is a free agent into the season. So if nothing seems to be working we can al2ays snag him

      • Mr. Offseason

        But you don’t often have opportunities to sign pro bowl players this late in the offseason. I’m all for seeing what Hill and Thompson can do but they are complete unknowns at this point. Plus if they sign him to a one-year deal and he signs somewhere else next year, you get a comp pick.

        • Rob Staton

          It doesn’t really matter that Hill and Thompson are unknowns. The Seahawks already re-signed Bradley McDougald for three more years. Earl + McDougald + Hill + Thompson is a perfectly fine quartet. Reid, if signed, would likely be the #3 anyway. And there’s just no real need to have a veteran third wheel at safety. Hill and Thompson were third and fourth round picks. Time to give them a chance to compete and step up, not bury them on the depth chart.

          Had they traded Earl, or if they trade him in the future, I think it’s something to contemplate. But for now, Earl remains on the team. As does Kam Chancellor, for what it’s worth.

          • FresnoHawk

            Last thing we need is Reid & Chancelor button heads besides it looks like nobody wants to sign Reid why would Hawks want that baggage? What’s the point of drafting players Hill if your not going to play them?

            • Greg Haugsven

              If they decided to trade Earl (which is very very unlikely at this point) I would be up for Reid. Other than that there kind of is a log jam already. Chancellor is still there as well even though we dont expect him to ever play again.

            • Mr. Offseason

              First of all, I don’t think it’s Reid who has the baggage. I think the baggage lies with those who don’t want him because of his activism.

              Second of all, I don’t really see what’s wrong with letting Hill and Thompson duke it out for a roster spot. And I don’t think it hurts either one of them to be on special teams one more year, either. Most likely, we won’t have the both of them flourish as starters. By sacrificing a little bit of long-term depth, you make it a competition to see which one earns a spot in preseason and give the other spot to Reid, who is a proven pro bowl safety. Even though McDougald has been a solid player for us, he’s not that.

              I get that McDougald has more experience in the system, but why pass up an opportunity to sign a pro bowl player who could make your defense that much better?

              • Rob Staton

                Because it’s a waste of resources and Reid isn’t even that good.

                For all the fuss about him remaining unsigned, nobody ever mentions that the league doesn’t want Kenny Vacarro either.

  26. Hawk Eye

    Avril confirming that the SB 49 had a lot to do with some of the players tuning out Pete.
    In hindsight, probably should have started the purge 2 years ago, but Pete probably thought he could get the team to buy back in if things went well. Things did not go well…….
    If they would have started the purge 2 years ago, we would all be complaining that they broke up a dynasty.
    onwards and upwards……….

    • FresnoHawk

      How did they expect to win by tuning out their own coach? Not to mention it has cost all of them $$$ winning = $$$. It’s childish & irrational behavior they will never get those years back. The moment Avril got on the bandwagon he got hurt. It’s just bad JU JU that spread thru the team! Complete self destruction please let it be over I’m sick of players bad mouthing Pete, shows how MEAN those players are they have zero credibility let see how they do in the real world just watch they all end up broke!

      • Hawk Eye

        Avril was not on that bandwagon, he was talking that there were guys who were. Easy to figure out who.
        if you are going to hold your breath until Marshawn, Sherm and Bennett are broke, good luck.
        53 guys on a team. There are always guys who don’t listen to the coach. The secret i to fin out who and git rid of them sooner rather than later

        and you want athletes in their 20’s to be mature?
        Take a look at all the politicians, etc. How many are immature? The difference is their actions cause more harm. Football is just a game.


        • FresnoHawk

          I agree football is just a game, also go back to Avrils comments week before he got hurt. Veteran football players should be mature Isn’t it obvious that the only complainers are the guys who signed big contracts. Why don’t Hawk players who have 1, 2 year contracts complain? These guys say the cause which none of them including Baldwin cannot rationally articulate is bigger than $$$. I’m glad I don’t have to listen to Bennett claiming we all have to do more like he does, Lynch accusing Carroll & Schneider of screwing him, and Sherman who thinks he’s smarter than everyone cause he got into Standford and because a retarded sports pundit agreed Sherman was more successfull in life than him. Hawk eye sorry if my venting bothers you I’m just frustrated and I know we share the dream of a Hawk dynasty Im scared its not gonna happen. Finally Politics is a “Blood Sport” Football is just a sport. If we mix the 2, politics will devour football, football will not exists anymore

          • Gohawks5151

            Money changes people. I actually don’t question any of these players will to win. They played hard, played hurt and executed Pete’s vision. The play did break the trust between the management and players. I think Avril said that it was that the coaches abandoned their identity with the title on the line that was the big issue. Run the ball. Play D for under a minute. Dynasty started. It can happen anywhere. I work steel mill with a Union. A few years ago we started making a new product that ultimately flopped and we bailed out of the market at a loss. It affected bonuses for employees and soured an already tentative relationship. As consumers we want a good team. That means trusting the managements plan. Skilled workers who put in max effort have a right to be be angry over things they can’t control. If the culture sours it’s on the management to address it. They have this year. But could they have approached it better after 2014 that could have saved the team rather than soldiering along? Guess we’ll never know. I guess the only solice we have is that we got a ring. Many good teams never do. However the what if situation stings bad.

  27. CharlieTheUnicorn

    I have found it very intriguing that the punter the Seahawks drafted has been called:
    Unique, different, special, 3rd/4th round talent, a weapon…. among other things since he was drafted. I thought it was a glowing endorsement when his caoch at Texas said he was one of the best defenders on the team…. pinning the opposition within the 20 on numerous occasions… inside the 10 a decent amount and inside the 5 more than a hand full of times. When JS said he was the highest rated ST player they have ever graded…… intriguing indeed.

    • Group captain mandrake

      I don’t think I’ve ever been this excited about a punter. I really like Jon Ryan, but this kid could be outstanding.

      • FresnoHawk


        • Hawk Eye

          me too.
          Now i won’t have to get punter envy when we play the Rams!

          • CharlieTheUnicorn

            When you hear a guy could come in… at any position… and be a top 10 guy at that position during the rookie campaign…… YOU HAVE TO BE EXCITED

  28. Greg Haugsven

    It would be nice to see a healthy CJ Prosise out there wreaking havoc.

    • cha

      Nice but I don’t quite get it. If I’m an NFL draft pick, my signing bonus goes to take care of my family and set up my place to live. Next thing after that I’m hiring a nutritionist and personal trainer. How he went 2 full seasons without hiring a trainer is mind-boggling.

      • FresnoHawk

        I believe him! Luke said last year he could finally afford hire a nutritionist at 1.2 million. Don’t forget Tom Brady nutritionist vs Team nutritionist.

      • j

        He didn’t have a full time trainer. That shit can be expensive.

        • Sea Mode

          Seems like the team would pay for it. Isn’t it in their best interest, or are they not allowed to?

      • j

        I’m reading that as he didn’t have a full time trainer. He had a guy, but would pay him by the hour or day or something. Now he hash is own personal trainer who works with him 24/7. That can be expensive, I can see why he didn’t do that at first.

  29. Logan Lynch

    Nice little breakdown from Gregg Bell about yesterday’s OTA.

    Two things that stuck out to me. Swoopes caught a TD during a red zone drill. Russ brought up working with him in the offseason. He may be a dark horse as a pass catching “move” TE. The second was David Moore getting looks with the first team offense. I’ve talked about him already on here and I know others have too. Not sure what it is, but I’ve got a feeling about him. I think he could be WR3 this year.

    • FresnoHawk

      I’ve had that feeling about Moore the moment we drafted him, even a sick feeling when Moore didn’t make the original 53 last year. High hopes for Swoopes!

      • Jacob M

        There is a reason why we moved him to our active roster before anyone could sign him off the practice squad.

    • Gohawks5151

      Moore is my guy!! Cut Freeney to keep him. Draft status doesn’t matter. COMPETITION! Glad to hear about Swoopes and the red zone. He’s pretty good at short yardage and red zone keepers as well.

    • Gohawks5151

      Moore is my guy! Impressive preseason. Cut Freeney to keep him. Draft status doesn’t matter. 6th round, UDFA. COMPETITION! Glad to hear about Swoopes as a red zone threat. He can be a short yardage, red zone threat under center too you know…

  30. Hawk Eye

    if those 2 can make the team and make an impact that would make a big difference.
    The success (or not) of the Hawks will probably be determined by which 2nd and 3rd year players step up and make a statement. If none of them do, looking at a better draft pick.
    Since we have not started the season yet, i am penciling us in at 32 before we trade back

  31. Thy Hawk is Howling

    Yeah Hawk Eye that’s what I want to hear, Fanatic Optimism!
    Of Course we’re going to win the Super Bowl, then trade down as we do. 19-0 all the way!

    Go Hawks N Stuff!

  32. Gohawks5151

    Money changes people. I actually don’t question any of these players will to win. They played hard, played hurt and executed Pete’s vision. The play did break the trust between the management and players. I think Avril said that it was that the coaches abandoned their identity with the title on the line that was the big issue. Run the ball. Play D for under a minute. Dynasty started. It can happen anywhere. I work steel mill with a Union. A few years ago we started making a new product that ultimately flopped and we bailed out of the market at a loss. It affected bonuses for employees and soured an already tentative relationship. As consumers we want a good team. That means trusting the managements plan. Skilled workers who put in max effort have a right to be be angry over things they can’t control. If the culture sours it’s on the management to address it. They have this year. But could they have approached it better after 2014 that could have saved the team rather than soldiering along? Guess we’ll never know. I guess the only solice we have is that we got a ring. Many good teams never do. However the what if situation stings bad.

    • Gohawks5151

      Jeeze. In and out of reception this weekend. Sorry for the double posts

    • Old but Slow

      Nice story. Be interesting to watch his progress.

  33. Coleslaw

    I think a theme for this upcoming off season in PCJS’s plans is to build depth. And a lot of it. Depth was a hugely underrated part of our superbowl teams. We should target holes but for the most part we may be going BPA to just get as much talent as possible on the roster again.

  34. CharlieTheUnicorn

    Mingo was his name-o

    • Shadow

      Mingo only pawn in game of life.

  35. GhostofGhosts

    Hey everyone, I’ve been a SDB viewer since the beginning yet have never commented or contributed to the enthusiasm of this forum. I’d just like to say thank you to Rob and to all of you for having such a great community and providing hours of entertainment and philosophies to consume. I know some people are really down on the hawks this year as we’ve lost a lot of talent and or heroes to the team, but I for one am excited.

    This team might be more like the team that lost to the Falcons before our superbowl year, fresh and hungry with a lot of doubters in the media. A group of no names, with nowhere to go but up. The heroes journey is strong. Love you all and have a great holiday!

    • Rob Staton

      Thanks man 👍🏻

    • Hawktalker#1

      I don’t know about everybody else, but I always find it encouraging to see posts from first time, long time readers . . .

      It would be interesting to know how many people actually read this blog. With no intention of trying to sound elitist, I’m not sure how a true Seahawks fan could resist it and not get hooked on it.

  36. Travis

    Check this site nightly, but rarely comment. It is a gem ~ thank you

    • Rob Staton

      Thanks Travis — new podcast on the way today.

  37. cha

    Does anyone have any thoughts on Caleb Scott?

    All I know is he had a great 3 cone time for someone his size. Not Doug Baldwin elite 3-cone, but looks like a good combo of size & shiftiness.

  38. Rowlandice

    Hmmmm. Brandon Marshall to the WR mix? Interesting. At the very least he could be a mentor to the youngsters along with DB.

  39. H

    Hawks sign Brandon Marshall.
    Have to say im surprised and a little against the move.
    Any different takes?

    • Kenny Sloth

      A signing 7 years in the making

    • Gohawks5151

      Red zone threat. Skills were never speed based. Still strong and can box out a man like he did Sherm. Russ becomes the best QB he has ever had. May have a chance if healthy.

  40. Rockyroad

    Longtime SDB viewer for years now. Like everyone else, 1st place I go to for Seahawk information. Always admired your dedication and knowledge, Rob. Thank you!

    • Rob Staton

      Thank you 👍🏻

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