Josh Uche’s pass rush win percentage is second only to Chase Young
Free agency to fill needs, then draft for talent. You hear that a lot.
The reality is, most teams have a key need to fill going into the draft.
Even the more active teams in free agency have needs. The Eagles badly need a wide receiver. The Bengals need their quarterback, O-line reinforcements and a linebacker. The Cardinals need more help on their O-line. The Dolphins have holes everywhere.
Ideally you address as many areas as possible and match up your remaining needs with the strength of the draft. This is why the Eagles are in a strong position. They’ve set themselves up to take a receiver with their first pick, tapping into the strength of the class. They filled other needs in the veteran market.
The problem for the Seahawks this year is they have a long-ish list of needs.
While they’ve padded their O-line depth and added a much needed cornerback, they’ve struggled to add a serious influx of talent to the defense. The pass rush remains pitifully weak. They need a defensive tackle. They don’t have any long term answers on the O-line despite all of their new additions. Russell Wilson deserves more talent at the skill positions too.
They do have an extra second round pick this year to try and fill some of these needs. Yet picking in large numbers hasn’t necessarily worked out for the Seahawks in recent drafts.
This is also the first draft in recent memory where the Seahawks haven’t matched up their biggest need (D-line) with the strength of a class.
They might not be able to let the draft come to them. That’s arguably where they’ve done their best work in recent years. Capitalising on elite athletes Frank Clark and D.K. Metcalf falling to the late second round. Correctly identifying two terrific players in Jarran Reed and Tyler Lockett who were worth trading up for. None of these players, at the time, filled ‘glaring’ needs.
That mix of opportunity and proactiveness has worked well.
Hopefully they will get a chance to do that again in 11 days time. They do have some serious holes to fill though.
They need to address the following positions as a priority:
Pass rusher
Defensive tackle
This will be the case whether they re-sign Jadeveon Clowney or not. The difference between the 2019 pass rush being terrible and the 2020 pass rush being stronger will not be Benson Mayowa and Bruce Irvin replacing Ziggy Ansah and Quinton Jefferson. They’ve not replaced Al Woods at defensive tackle and are currently only holding Jarran Reed, Poona Ford, Demarcus Christmas and Brian Mone on the roster.
They have two secondary needs:
Offensive tackle
Running back
Brandon Shell’s contract screams draft hedge. Duane Brown turns 35 this year. It’s not a bad class to try and add someone who can potentially compete with Shell to start in 2020 and eventually replace Brown. Chris Carson’s injury history and contract situation warrants monitoring — as does Rashaad Penny’s knee injury. Plus let’s not forget how Seattle requires depth at the position to function. Pete Carroll has always sought a stable of backs.
There are two other potential needs to be addressed:
Wide receiver
Linebacker
It’s a quality receiver class and it’d be pretty remarkable not to take one in the first four rounds. The addition of Phillip Dorsett takes the pressure off a bit to take one early but you also don’t want to miss out. The Seahawks need speed and quality at linebacker. Their two starters are older and expensive. Cody Barton didn’t play well as a rookie and Ben Burr-Kirven appears to have been drafted for special teams.
It’s unlikely the Seahawks are going to be able to draft all six positions in a wholly satisfactory way. Some of these areas will need to be addressed after the draft — such as a year ago when they traded for Jacob Hollister after not drafting a tight end and signed Ziggy Ansah to try and help the pass rush.
A few people have requested I put together a horizontal draft board. This is how teams actually draft. A vertical board is essentially just a long list of players in order. A horizontal board does a better job breaking down players by position and grade.
I’ve given it a go but I’m not completely satisfied with the effort. For starters — I have barely any information on players that will be targeted on day three. There are no pro-day numbers. Usually by now we have a list of players who’ve visited the VMAC too. Now teams can talk to any player on FaceTime. There are no ‘official 30’ visits. It’s a crude attempt at a horizontal board on my behalf.
So while I can project the first few rounds, the later rounds are an abomination. And this will be the case for any person who writes about the draft and tries to do this. We have even less information than we usually have. If you showed my board to someone who works for a team, they would probably laugh. But I won’t be alone.
Here’s my initial attempt (click to enlarge):
The players in red have either current injuries that they’re still recovering from, missed significant time in college with injury or have been reported to have issues teams cannot reconcile before the draft.
As you can see, I have 19 first round prospects. That feels about right for this class. I’ve been really strict with the receivers. I suspect a lot of teams won’t have Jonathan Taylor and Clyde Edwards-Helaire in round one either. But a fair projection of 15-20 genuine first round grades seems about right.
My takeaways from putting this together would be the following:
— The Seahawks could consider spending their first pick on a running back, receiver or offensive tackle. It’ll be their best chance to get a top talent from this draft. Whether they can justify it though with a glaring D-line need remains to be seen. They’ve also invested a lot of cap space in the O-line in free agency, the positional value at running back is always challenged and they do have young talent at receiver already.
— The sweet-spot for defensive linemen in this draft appears to be round two. That likely means either trading back from #27 into the 30’s or using your picks at #59 or #64 to solve those needs. They could also trade up from #59 or #64 to target a specific player — especially with an extra fourth rounder in their back-pocket.
— The board remains really thick at receiver in rounds 5-7. Recently Eric DeCosta suggested you could find a contributor in the fifth round. I’m not saying it’s definitely going to happen or should happen — but there’s at least an opportunity here for the Seahawks to wait for their favourite range (fourth round) to draft a receiver and focus on other needs. Of course, you can also make a great argument for targeting the likes of Jalen Reagor, K.J. Hamler, Brandon Aiyuk or Denzel Mims with the top pick.
— They need to add a defensive tackle badly. They could do that after the draft. Some options remain available — such as Damon Harrison, Marcell Dareus, Brandon Mebane or Caraun Reid (who they took a look at a year ago). It’s hardly a glorious list though. Players near the end of their careers, players who have flirted with retirement and journeymen. However — that’s often the market they’ve shopped in at defensive tackle. Not signing anyone prior to the draft, however, suggests they at least have some younger players in mind first and foremost. It’s one of the few positions they haven’t hedged in the build up to the draft.
— What are the DT options? As you can see on my board — there aren’t many. If they’re looking for an Al Woods replacement in the first three rounds — I’ve only got DaVon Hamilton and Leki Fotu in an acquirable range. Hamilton is a fringe second round talent who might need to be taken at #59 or #64 — or after a small trade down. Fotu is more of a third or fourth round type. At three technique the options are limited to Raekwon Davis, Justin Madubuike, Marlon Davidson and Rashard Lawrence. I listed Ross Blacklock and Jordan Elliott but they both have sub-33 inch arms (and the Seahawks have never drafted a defensive tackle with sub-33 inch arms) and are unlikely targets (the same goes for Neville Gallimore). So what do you do? If you want to address this position, it probably needs to be with one of your high picks. Otherwise you’re dipping into that veteran market.
— One of the big unknowns is also what kind of range you’ll need to take someone like Raekwon Davis or Marlon Davidson. Davis has early round talent as a defensive anchor with power and versatility plus untapped pass rush potential. Yet there are reports that some teams are worried about his maturity and lack of production. Davidson was a top-level recruit with massive physical potential and he has unnatural quality as an edge rusher despite his three-technique frame. Yet Auburn also took him out on running downs a lot — and that’s a concern for a player who should be an every-down contributor at that size.
— It’s a similar story with pass rushers. They need to take one. They need to come out of this draft with someone who can get after the QB. Yet the options are somewhat restricted and the value is best in round two. If you don’t take one with your first three picks — you might miss out. The board is not thick here. If you want the speed and quickness they lack you’re really looking at Josh Uche, Julian Okwara or K’Lavon Chaisson. If you want strength and power it’s Terrell Lewis. If you want someone really athletic and versatile it’s Jabari Zuniga. Yetur Gross-Matos is about potential really but he leaves you wanting more on tape. Curtis Weaver had an outstanding short shuttle and his pass rush win percentage is exceptional but it’s difficult to project his body type (and lack of length) to the next level.
— The linebacker position will be really thick and attractive from #27 going into round two but then it drops off a cliff. Unless Willie Gay Jr hasn’t convinced teams about his character and he lasts. It could be that this is a position they avoid because the need vs the availability range doesn’t match up. They do need youth, speed, talent and ferocity at this position though.
You always have to make compromises. I sense that will be an even bigger discussion point for the Seahawks this year.
It comes down to a few questions:
— What exactly is the plan with Chris Carson? Recent history says don’t pay big money to running backs, especially ones with an injury history. Yet they seem to love what he brings to the team. So how much do you want to target a Jonathan Taylor type early, if he’s available, knowing he’s everything you want at the position and has star potential? Yet if you do that — you’re avoiding the top offensive tackles and you’re putting a lot of pressure on #59 and #64 to find defensive solutions. How big is the drop to Cam Akers in the late second or early third? And how big is the drop to Zack Moss, James Robinson and A.J. Dillon? Or are you putting your trust in Carson/Penny, knowing you have the likes of Isaiah Crowell or Marshawn Lynch to potentially add down the line?
— Do you have to go defensive line first up and address that need? You might run the risk of reaching. Or if you trade down into a more comfortable range you might pass on better players just to fill a need. It’s the one position capable of pulling the Seahawks down so you need to get this right. If you wait too long — you could end up in the same position as a year ago, missing out on the best options and having to settle.
— How motivated are you to draft an offensive tackle first up that might be a redshirt? For example — if you take Austin Jackson or Ezra Cleveland, are you comfortable investing a first round pick in a player to simply be the future? It sounds great on paper. Securing an important position for the long term. Yet the Seahawks are a team trying to win now. Spending your first pick on a player who doesn’t play in year one can be problematic. With early picks you typically want a return.
— How much belief do they have in Brandon Shell? Or is he simply a physical fit that they took a low cost gamble on? They could target someone like Isaiah Wilson to be the long term future at right tackle. Yet he’s a pure right-sided blocker. And if training camp is delayed, shortened or there’s less time for a rookie to learn the ropes — do you again run the risk of spending a high pick on a redshirt if Shell is in pole position to start? It might be better finding out where Robert Hunt is slated to go and focusing on a player like that who also has great positional versatility.
— There’s also been a different O-line approach recently. They’ve signed a lot of veterans, not just this year but for the last three off-seasons now. They seem to prefer experience on the offensive line and then drafting to develop in the mid-to-late rounds. Will that continue to be the case in this draft? It’s not a thick board at offensive tackle after round one but it’s very thick in the interior.
Tony Pauline recently reported the Seahawks would focus on the lines early and often. I suspect that will end up proving to be the case. Whether it’s an offensive tackle first and then a focus on the defense line — or an acknowledgement that they need to sort the pass rush out first before turning to other needs.
In my latest video mock draft (see below) I had the Seahawks taking Josh Uche (pass rusher), Robert Hunt (OL) and DaVon Hamilton (DL) with their first three picks. It’s equally possible they go OL-PR-DL first up. And if they’re willing to draft to develop for the O-line later on, we could see a focus on DL and one or both of the skill positions (RB/WR).
The key is going to be solving as many of these needs as possible, rather than necessarily selecting the best players. That’s where the current Seahawks are.
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Rob. Just curious. Do you considère Josh Uche an outside linebacker or a pass rusher?
A situational pass rusher who could develop into a SAM/DE.
Currently, Green and Collier (young and unproven) are the 5Ts and Irvin and Mayowa (band-aid solutions) are the Leos. Uche would slot in as young depth at Leo who can also rush the passer as a SLB like Irvin did early in his career, who can move over to Leo full time when Irvin and Mayowa move on. He’s the guy I want the most if Clowney comes back.
I am so sorry I left my exel format table on computer at office so couldnt send it you in this two days…I am so glad you did this because i really respect your opinion about prospect evaluation and i dont start watching draft without horisontal board. Thank you for everything you doing.
Rob I am trying but cant find did.you write.something about Madubuike…can you post link if you wrote about him…I see you have second round grade on him…
Not a full article just bits and pieces in some and plenty in the comments section. He’s the player I think I’ve talked about the most in comments over the last three weeks.
Ok tnx…I now that but its hard to find it from phone so i thought that maybe earlier in the season (october-december) you wrote about him…
Millhouse, here’s something:
Millhouse, here’s something:
Let’s see if this attempted link works better https://sports.mynorthwest.com/837863/wyman-breaking-down-projected-seahawks-pick-dt-justin-madubuike/
Seems to be a lot of talent for DL in the second but with two late seconds, its quite worrisome that their targets wont be there.
Still hoping to come out of this draft with Isaiah Wilson, Madubuike and Okwara/Uche.
That would be a really awesome start to the draft if they could pull it off.
If they can somehow land Cesar Ruiz with first pick (wherever that may be), then they can cut Britt, use that cap space to lock up Clowney plus the rest of their draft class. Maybe still enough cap for a veteran FA for more DL depth.
Hmmm, I think the Center we got from the Steelers will be just fine.
We should move Britt back to RT where he went to the Super Bowl his rookie year and let him play out his contract. Britt is a good football player and all America wrestler.
Rare at 6’6″ and 325.
He is now bigger, stronger and smarter than he was as a rookie.
We also should look at the tackle from the UW late in the draft.
Invest on defense and skill positions, the OL will be better this year by default..It can’t get worse.
Be well,
Gunny
Rob you always do amazing work during the draft season but this year you are absolutely knocking it out of the park. Incredible really.
I think the Hawks need to focus on the OL / DL despite the quality at WR and RB.
In a perfect world
#1 Isiah WIlson
#2 Julian Okwara
#3 R Davis
#4 Best WR, LB or RB on your board.
If the Hawks could ass those 3 guys (Wilson, Okwara and Davis) they would really solidify the OL and DL going forward.
Great post.
Agreed. I am concerned about the value of those top 3 prospects continuing to rise and our ability to have enough draft capital to get them all. Right now many of our mock drafts are pretty much a joke (many self confessed) and we’re not gonna get everyone we think we are.
I was thinking recently – we keep saying that there are no way these guys will be there because we love them due to them being highlighted by Rob and us looking into them extensively. But other rankings have consistently placed them in an area that we can realistically get them. I’m fearful we won’t be able to get them but if they’re way better than these rankings indicate then why haven’t the rankings changed to reflect that?
True rankings are reflective on draft day. Teams are hiding their true draft rankings. It’s all speculative right now.
Because every year the rankings of ‘pundits’ in the media are way off base.
The track record on this site is there. We don’t get everything right but we get a lot right.
And let’s not forget the rankings that DO change and HAVE changed this year and previous years. Best recent example is Kyler Murray. Took months for the narrative to catch us up. And there have been loads of example like that over the years — where we’ve gone against the grain on players and been proven right down the line.
I’d be pretty happy with that, all things considered. Especially if that WR was Edwards.
This is excellent Rob, thank you.
Something you said last year in your wrapup occurred to me while I was reading this piece. It was about how the Hawks took 2 LBs and it wasn’t forecasted as a need since KJ and Wagner were extended. But the LBs tested well in the exercises the Seahawks like to focus on. So your message was to not get tunnel-visioned into focusing on just needs at the expense of not exploring players in “lesser” need areas that have traits and skills the Seahawks would find useful and rare.
I think you’ve balanced your viewpoint well with this piece. The pass rush is a big, big need. But there are plenty of players to focus on that the Seahawks could find very attractive in this draft, and we shouldn’t be shocked if they target a position we might not see an immediate need for on the roster.
With the way this FO has conducted their offseason so far in regards to the pass rush, I’ve been mentally prepping myself for them to take the same tack in the draft so I won’t yell and scream and pound my fist on the table. Perhaps a weapon like a RB or one of the top WR is then a projectable player at OT is their preferred way to play the board. They can explore all the pass rush options after.
Thank you!
There are so many players who ‘fit’ what they love early. That’s the challenge as you pointed out — acknowledging that plus the massive pass rush need.
At this very moment I’m leaning towards taking players that can help them immediately.
That means taking a RB who can really be a weapon, maybe in the passing game (like CEH), and/or a WR who can return punts and be a 4th WR that rotates in and takes the top off the defense (like Reagor). Maybe a pass rusher they can employ just rotationally like Bruce was his rookie year. “You have one job, rush the passer. Just do that.”
Those 3 positions they can probably rotate in better than say OT or DT if all the offseason work is limited or eliminated as the way things seem to be going.
We can “address” the defensive line early but if John and Pete really don’t believe that those guys would be contributors then what’s the point? I’ve really grown to love a lot of the defensive line options but they might be content with going with their guys early rather than forcing the issue.
I think it worth mentioning in the article’s RB section that we need a replacement for Prosise.
We do but it’s implied we need to add a RB it’s just whether you do it in the draft (and when) or whether you do it after in free agency.
Sure. I just think it is one more reason being the health of Penny/Carson.
We’ve needed a replacement for Prosise since the day he was drafted.
🙂
Sad but true, has anyone signed him?
“ Davis has early round talent as a defensive anchor with power and versatility plus untapped pass rush potential. Yet there are reports that some teams are worried about his maturity and lack of production.”
The dudes are built differently, but this sure reminds me of Malik McDowell’s pre-draft profile. Considering how Malik was always Seattle’s top target, and the need we have at DT, it feels certain that we’re gunning for Raekwon.
I’d be down with it if they think they can coach him into greatness. Because he has that level of potential. I want to see them shoot for the hills.
I get the same feeling. Not sure he’ll even be available at #27.
Thanks, Rob. This is fantastic. One comment though. I don’t see Tee Higgins on the WR board. Probably just an oversight.
Yeah my mistake — although I’m not high on him. I’ve added him now.
I don’t see Lynch DL Baylor – or do you think he’s not a good option for us?
Thanks for all you do Rob!
Go Hawks!!
Uf, if he is there at late 3rd early second…
Early 4th not 2nd
Nice work Rob! It’s fun to look at things from as many different angles and perspectives as possible. This could be such an awesome & fun draft for Seattle.
I wish we could find our LEO & keep all of our picks. With admittedly slim odds, would JAX consider our 2021 1st for YN? They have a boat load of 2020 picks already. It’d be risky for us. But the real reason I want it is that it would free up this years draft to be a pure blast!
Any concern about Hunt’s age (24 before the season starts)? I’m always a little concerned about overaged trench players. Collier has tainted me in this regard.
Nah — Hunt is absolutely awesome. He’ll be fine.
Forgive me if I missed the discussion on him but Kenny Robinson is all of a sudden a trending name in the draft, the XFL Safety who was dismissed from West Virginia.
Any thoughts on the player?
I guess he had offers from the likes of Clemson and Alabama after the dismissal but wanted to make some money in the XFL to support his mom asap (Cancer diagnosis).
If the sweet spot for pass rushers is the second round …then the Seahawks have played their hand well. If they can draft a combination of zuniga and uche with their first three picks … I think they should feel good about this draft. It does not solve their pass rush…but I would bet on them being more efficient in pass rush than clowney. This is a good year to find that Tony McDaniel in free agency…maybe it’s Marcel darieus or someone else on that list.
How have they played their hand well?
They would be going into next season with a pass rush that has lost Clowney and Jefferson and only added Irvin, Mayowa and rookies. That’s not solving the pass rush. It’s putting it on life support.
It does not solve their pass rush, but I believe that if they select two pass rushers in the second round (sweet spot) they will have improved their pass rush from last year….and that is assuming we let clowney go.
Well if you’re suggesting that them losing their only effective and quality pressure man on the DL and replacing him with rookies and two journeymen is an improvement — I’ll have some of whatever it is you’re drinking.
Clowney was disruptive at times…more often when healthy which is a toss up so far in his career. I question whether he fits Carroll’s defensive system? He certainly does not for 20 million plus a year. He seems to play best when he does not have gap responsibility… which is not often if at all in a Carrol scheme. It seems that the Leo position is designed for players who have the least amount of gap responsibility, and clowney does not fit into a Leo prototype. Green and Reed…these are guys that had to learn gap responsibility first…now they can rush the passer.
Clowney is the perfect fit for Carroll. He’s been looking for this type of player since forever — the dynamic disruptive big end to compliment a LEO.
The most shocking for me is Lamb as a 2nd round grade still. I thought maybe the combine helped him slightly but you are still not a huge fan it seems.
What does he lack to be a first round choice for you?
I don’t know why it’s that shocking.
He ran a 4.50 which is fine but not great. His best assets are yards after the catch and the way he contorts his body to make difficult grabs. Not a red zone guy, doesn’t create easy separation like some of the others. Media hype has always been too rich. He’s good but not as good as some would have you believe. He can make magic happen but so can Cordarrelle Patterson.
So can DeAndre Hopkins
Obviously you were very strict with that top tier because you didn’t even include Reagor and I know how much you like him. I think Lamb is a R1 WR any year though.
Gotta agree with the majority your rankings. I could see the hawks liking Jonathan Greenard enough to take him with one of the R2 picks if they go one of OT/RB/WR with the first pick.
R1 Reagor
R2 Greenard
R2 Peart
R3 Fotu
R4 Zach Moss
R4 Madre Harper
I think the DeAndre Hopkins comp is lazy. They’re nothing like each other. Hopking was someone I wrote about a lot in 2013 and I know all about his game. He was an absolute master at routes, the physical side of things and nailing the small details to work openings. When he spoke in interviews he was breaking down the defense and explaining concepts.
Just because CeeDee Lamb ran a 4.50 doesn’t mean he’s Nuk Hopkins.
IMO, after DL, OL, WR & RB picks, the Seahawks may look at a slot CB for competition with a day 3 pick. I see only 5 CB’s on the horizontal draft board, likely only the 32″ arm guys, what about SLOT?
Later round slot CB’s that may appeal to the Seahawks? There may be a few others but these seem the most likely to me. Most have some really good combine #’s & have been productive. Between these 4 guys, I’ll give a slight nod to Vildor due to his + arm length & draft position, but Robertson may be the best of the lot based on his ++ game stats, too bad he didn’t do all of the tests at the combine to fill in the blanks. However Amik Robertson may go late day 2, just based on his tape & excellent production, if he falls a little later, he could be a nice selection for PC to train up. The current day 2/3 type CB rankings seem to be all over the place.
–CB(slot)-Amik Robertson, Louisiana Tech, 5-83/187, 30-1/4“-arms, 9“-hands. no pSPARQ
4.45/40 at recent pro day. DNP at combine.
Currently ranked #158 overall @ drafttek.com, #162 @ PFN.com, #75 overall @ PFF.com
Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4M71bKDQSo0
Career: 38-games, 184-tkls, 138-solo, 2.0-TFL, 4.0-sacks, 14-INT (3 for TD’s), 34-PD, 2-FR, 2-FF
A likely round 4/5 Seahawk pick?
–CB(slot)-Kindle Vildor, Georgia So., 5-097/191, 32-1/4″-arms, 9-5/8″-hands 133.4-pSPARQ
4.44/40, 1.49-10yd split, 22-reps, 39.5-Vert, 11′-1″-broad, 4.28-20yd shuttle, 6,94-3Cone,
Currently ranked #412 overall @ drafttek.com, #143 @ PFN.com, #204 overall @ PFF,com
Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7ixuFhmdEE
Career: 39-games, 94-tkls, 72-solo, 9.0-TFL, 1.0-sack, 9-INT, 25-PD, 1-FF
A likely round 5/6 Seahawk pick?
–CB(slot)-John Reid, Penn State, 5-103/187, 30-1/8″-arms, 9-1/8″-hands. 130.7-pSPARQ
4.49/40, 1.52-10yd split, 20-reps, 36.5″-Vert, 10′-9″-broad, 3.97-20-yd short shuttle, 6.95-3Cone
Currently #213 overall @ drafttek.com, #296 @ PFN.com, #100 overall @ PFF.com
Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwbH-6WLIBA
Career: 48-games, 125-tkls, 83-solo, 9.5-TFL, 1.5-sacks, 7-INT (1 for TD), 26-PD, 2-FR, 1-FF
A likely round 6/7 Seahawk pick?
–CB(slot)-Javelin Guidry, Utah, 5-9/191, 31-1/4“-arms, 9“-hands, no pSPARQ.
4.29/40, 21-reps at combine, no other testing available but the dude is strong & has ++ wheels.
Currently ranked #269 overall @ drafttek.com, #224 @ PFN.com, NR @ PFF.com.
Highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVSDn6lKSok
Career: 38-games, 120-tkls, 82-solo, 3.5-TFL, 0.5-sack, 3-INT (1 for TD), 19-PD, 1-FF
A likely round 7/UDFA Seahawk pick?
Who do y’all like with a day 3 pick for a pure “slot” CB for competition??
Also; PFF has a new “draft simulator” here: https://www.pff.com/draft/nfl-mock-draft-simulator
It’s hard to project slot. They’ve never drafted for it. The players they’ve signed were always freak athletes. Not good athletes, freaky.
I’m not going to pretend I know what to look for there. Nobody does. It’s not a position we have intel on really. What I do know is they’ve often traded for the position or signed off the street.
Speaking of freaky athletes, I would love to see Javelin Guidry’s pro day because that 40 and those reps are mighty impressive at his size.
https://seahawksdraftblog.com/wp-content/uploads/Screen-Shot-2020-04-12-at-20.49.30.png
I counted up 19 1st round graded guys you got on your board, so now the question is who that is a second round graded guy will likely go in the 1st??? I’m pretty sure 1 or 2 of the QBs in the 2nd round grade area are going 1st round.
What I like about this chart is it shows pockets of players compared to each other more easily. WR is very deep overall, with some intriguing prospects at each level of the draft.
I do have a question… when they get a grade of 6.8 or 6.33 or 5.7 whatever on NFL.com, how do they get to that number? Does each team have a 10 point scale and grade according to 10 different factors (character, medical, etc) on a 0.0-1.0 point scale for each factor then tally up the results?
No idea how they get to those numbers
All but the last paragraph are key. The Seahawks first pick falls in no mans land. There should be no first round prospects left at 27. With Robs excellent chart, that difference will be made of mostly prospects rated second round, with a cascade effect (affect?) making each subsequent pick again falling in the second half of a round and made up of mostly prospect rated in the next round.
It is why the Seahawks tend to trade out of the second half of the first round. Also, it is clear from Robs chart that the first pick should be other than defensive line or edge rusher. I am all for Oline and RB. Everybody thinks that pressure on the QB is the answer for improved defense. I am reminding the SDB readers that the offense and defense are linked and that a better running back and right tackle could make the defense better.
A couple more first downs per game gives the defense more rest and wears down the opponents defense. Long drives deprive the opponent of scoring opportunities. If Seattle is running the ball well and making first downs in the third and fourth quarters they are likely winning the game. All that matters is the score at the end of the game. The bend do not break concept looks bad in the stats, but turn overs, fatigue and who is winning on the line in the fourth quarter is what really counts.
Also, Seattle tries to cover needs a year in advance. I think that means OT, RB and WR in addition to DE and DT.
BTW, Rob, I keep thinking that the content has peaked, that the latest post is the best one yet and you keep making it better. Well done. Thank you.
Thanks DJ
Dopest content
This would pair nicely with a final top 100 😎
I’m fully on board with this. Unless there is a big change between now and the draft I think they need to really target DL/OL with their first three picks. Watching Rob’s mock drafts and doing some myself if you take a WR or RB early you get really thin on DL.
If you want to be a tough team that runs the ball you need to take advantage of this OL class and go get Wilson or Hunt for your right side. Equally they badly need a DE and a DL as things stand (plus at least one FA on the DL).
Taylor or CEH would look brilliant in this offence, but there are just too many holes in the trenches if you do this. If Akers is there in the 3rd fine – otherwise I think you start with Carson, a vet FA, Homer, a late round or another vet. Get Penny back mid-year. 2021 you either resign Carson or you hunt RB early.
I think they settle for a Duvernay or People-Jones type pick at WR.
Ugh – this was meant to be a response to Trevor above.
Rob,
Purely speculative and I know that we can’t read their minds, but is it possible that PC/JS are looking at the challenges of the pass rush last year from a different angle? I agree that their modus operandi up to this year has been to always attack an obvious weakness aggressively but is it possible that they saw upgrading Tre Flowers on the back end as a key part of improving the pass rush? Or, are they looking at some kind of a scheme change that would improve things and maybe work better with existing personnel?
My only other thought is that they are considering next year’s first or second rounder to be in play for either Ngakoue or to ensure that they get enough of “their guys”- more than one or two of Uche, Davis, Okwara, Zuniga. Just spitballing here but the lack of activity around the pass rush is puzzling to me based on the history of this management team. Thank you for the thoughtful analysis and the incredible volume of content. It has been a welcome respite these last few weeks and a pleasure for the last 7 or 8 years for me.
No. And if this reply sounds blunt I’m sorry — it’s nothing personal. This is just how I speak online. But there is absolutely NO WAY they identified any issues in the secondary as being the cause for the absolutely horrendous pass rush. The Seahawks didn’t create any pressures, force any sacks, they couldn’t defend the perimeter run. All of this is on the front seven. Upgrading Flowers or challenging him was probably an aim all along. But it has absolutely nothing to do with the pass rush.
The reason the pass rush was terrible is because their defensive linemen are terrible. Pure and simple. They don’t have enough talent. And they know as well as we do that they needed to address that — and still need to address that.
They’ve never traded a future R1 so I don’t see that as very likely. Next year’s R2? Maybe. But I doubt they’ll trade for Ngakoue. If they won’t pay Clark or Clowney I doubt they’ll pay him.
I don’t disagree with you. I’m just puzzled that PC/JS appear to have misread the pass rush market so badly. The other issue that comes to mind is the lack of activity in terms of addressing overall speed on defense. That was clearly an issue last year and I guess we will see their regard for that part of the puzzle with the draft. Thx.
I just think they’ve flopped this off-season. They can repair the damage. There’s still time. But they need to get a move on.
Just a friendly reminder, the GM who everyone was praising last year is the same GM who is overseeing things now. Game’s not over yet – it’s barely begun. John is gonna pull something off.
Just a friendly reminder that until they ‘pull something off’ it’s also fair game to critique what they’re doing.
His injury history is a drawback, but man if you can get the Terrell Lewis from the Arkansas game? Monster.
I wouldn’t rely on him solely. Gotta grab someone else to go with him IMO. For a team in desperate need of a pass rush like Seattle that is.
He doesn’t rush the edge though. He doesn’t even try really. Everything is back inside. Alabama stunt a lot but he’ll go inside even when he’s not stunting. I’ve seen it suggested it’s because he doesn’t trust the knee and that’s the other concern — the massive injury history.
Lewis looks the part and he’s massive but I think he’s broken and incapable of fulfilling his potential. He’s now basically a power end who can control and play the run nicely. But he’ll never be a fluid pass rusher who challenges opponents off the edge.
In that Arkansas game ge absolutely does. And that first step at his size is something else. Has nice power in his hands to be able to stunt back inside.
I’m higher on him than most here, but that’s ok.
I will watch the Arkansas game again. It’s not something I recall though.
And if he does win and attack the edge, it’ll be the only one where he does it consistently.
That’s what I said though. IF you can get that guy from THAT game. And there’s a couple plays from the LSU game where he’s literally ragdolling LT Saahdiq Charles.
Just watched him vs Arkansas.
He had one speed rush to the edge where he created a pressure leading to a batted pass. Kind of leaned into the blocker round the edge. Apart from that he jabbed and bull rushed the tackle into the end zone on one play to create a pressure. He created a pressure with an inside move where the tackle just flat out gave up (they were losing 31-0 with 8 mins left in the second quarter).
Apart from that it was exactly what I’ve seen in other games. A ton of stunts because it’s Alabama. He always favours the inside move. Doesn’t trouble teams off the edge and often doesn’t even try to. No real speed move to speak of. And this was a game where Alabama were 41-0 up at half time. So yeah… not sure we can even say, ‘if he can play like this at the next level’ when he’s playing a team that had no right to be on the same field as Alabama.
It’s hard to concentrate on him vs LSU because Clyde Edwards-Helaire is always on the field at the same time and CEH draws your attention every time he touches the ball. CEH’s lateral movement is just absolutely stunning. Might be even better than Saquon’s. He just doesn’t have the same size/speed.
And I’m not saying he’s the guy or even a target for Seattle, but when ya listen to JS’s draft day presser after the Frankie, McDowell, and Collier picks it’s all…
‘Raw power’ ‘uses his hands’ ‘heavy hands’
And…
‘Positional flexibility’ ‘versatile’ ‘can play a few different spots’ ‘can play outside and inside’
In this draft? That sounds like Marlon Davidson.
Yup. That’s the guy I keep coming back to.
I do agree that DT will be a high pick this year. They might look to pair up Reed with someone and develop some edge rushers.
But this issue with Davidson is you’re taking a project. A player who made a living playing outside in college football but is 300lbs and runs a 5.04. So good luck rushing the edge with that profile. But if your aim is to kick him inside at tackle — you’ve not seen that. And as you know V12 from when we’ve discussed him before, they took him out for the running game. And Lance Zierlein has highlighted that and the scouts who Bob McGinn spoke to said he can play inside vs the pass but not the run.
If you’re taking a project interior guy first up that has to be couched. The value isn’t there early.
To me he’s far better suited to 3-4 DE where he can still do some of the stuff he did before. And creative fronts like Baltimore can put him in positions to make plays. Seattle is a conventional front.
Uche also ‘versatile’ ‘long’ ‘heavy hands’. Not an inside/outside guy on the DL but still can play different spots. Rushes from the inside as a standup guy but more as a SAM/EDGE.
Also hear JS/PC talking about guys who have a real “feel” for pass rushing (which I think Uche does). From a school they like to draft from and a senior bowl standout (which they seem to like).
I could see Davidson being the pick though. I remember awhile ago Nagy said Davidson would be his pic for the hawks.
Nagy was asked who could be a target and he suggested Davidson. Don’t think he said it was ‘his pick’.
The point about the Senior Bowl is right though. Whether it’s Collier, Blair, Penny, Lockett etc — they like the guys who played very well in Mobile. And Uche did play very well. So did Baun and DaVon Hamilton too based on win percentage in the 1v1 drills.
And he has heavy hands. But there’s also a major injury flag and when I heard someone suggest that’s why he never trusts rushing the edge it made a lot of sense to me. He just doesn’t do it. The Seahawks don’t need another hold and sit DE. They need electricity off the edge.
Well now I know what a horizontal board is. It’s what I used to create before a fantasy football draft (when I played) only I didn’t know how to use Excel so always ended up with like 20 sheets of hand written paper. LOL
In all seriousness, thank you for posting the horizontal board Rob. Even if you’re stabbing in the dark after round 2 it still gives us a few names to be on the lookout for. It also gave me an understanding of the term and how one is set up. Fantastic!
My pleasure, thanks for reading.
Just re-watched highlights of the first round of the 2019 draft because I was bored.
Daniel Jeremiah’s ‘note’ for L.J. Collier was… ‘twitched up’. He didn’t misspeak. That is what flashed up on the screen from his pre-draft note.
The one thing Collier wasn’t… was twitched up. And I liked him. But you would never, ever mistake him for being twitchy.
I wonder if these guys know who they are talking about half the time. I e seen guys called long then turn around and say length is the guys weakness. I thi k they have been in this draft thing for so long they start to lose there mind.
Yeah I regularly see guys complimented for their long arms when the opposite is true. PFF have talked a lot about ‘long cornerbacks who fit the Seahawks’ then they’ll highlight a guy with 30.5 inch arms. Chaisson still gets credited for his length… 32 inch arms. I just thought it was funny that Jeremiah complimented Collier for his ‘twitch’ as the main highlight when the complete opposite was true. On the other hand on ESPN — Louis Riddick said he had heavy hands but no juice.
So basically — listen to Louis, not so much to DJ.
Should have noted Collier’s ‘old man strength.’
🙂
Collier has all the traits you want in an NFL defensive lineman.
Short, stubby, old and slow. And easily injured.
One of LJ’s top “positive traits” in his Lance Zierlein profile is his “rough and rugged demeanor”
The problem is I have no idea how that translate to success on an NFL field as a pass rusher. I know how speed translates and I know how length translates and I know how pass-rush repertoire translates and I know how effort translates. Rough and rugged demeanor? Not so much. I have no clue what PCJS were thinking when they called his name.
I think it’s pretty clear what they were thinking.
They saw a Michael Bennett type. And on tape Collier does a great job rushing the passer at TCU. Whether he has the juice to do it at the next level ever is a big question mark. But the logic was sound.
Collier got injured during the off season and missed quit a bit a valueable time. So I am willing to give Collier a pass for 2019. So I am going to have a wait and see. My gut tells me that Collier was a reach. But I am willing to have a wait and see on Collier.
At this point I would be happy with Collier having a career we sum up with “adequate.”
After seeing your horizontal board Rob I am actually encouraged there are more options than I thought available at different positions. I am getting really excited about the draft. Just 11 more days bring it. Thanks Rob for getting us pumped up and ready for another draft where yet again I will be the smartest friend in the room because I read your blog. Well smartest friend on zoom this year:)
I really like Okwara still. Any concerns about his strength should be alleviated by his brothers ability to put strength on in the Pros. After listening to the Lombardi interview though I just think 3T is the most important position on this defense and after the McDowell pick and the desperation trade for Richardson it seems to be verified. I really think they need to come out of this draft with Davis as a top priority.
It’s weird really because they went years under PCJS without a great interior rusher. Then suddenly it was such a need they forced McDowell & Richardson. Then they’ve gone back to before — not really doing anything with the interior rush.
I remember a press conference where Carol said, “there were many moments last year that Reed almost got home, and just came up a little short.” I do think they see him as that presence, but they obviously need more. I think they keep looking for that role from a Bennett type player. Isn’t that why they keep drafting these bigger DE types that can be moved inside on passing downs? Anyways, I hope they get this figured out and Collier shows something this year.
I think they’re still very much hoping Clowney can be their future at that position, with Collier and Green fighting for snaps in relief. That inside out type. Inside I think they need an Al Woods replacement who is younger and a bit more dynamic. That’s why I think DaVon Hamilton could be a target. But I can see Raekwon Davis as a different type of interior DL, Madubuike as a more natural smaller DT or Leki Fotu if needed later.
Well thanks for your reply. I am hoping Davis can be that more dynamic player and we draft him for that role.
Hi Rob!
Awesome stuff as always. I noticed you had Antonio Gibson in the WR column, is that because you believe he will translate better at that position as opposed to RB? He seems to have an ideal physical profile (6’0 ft, 228 pounds, 4.39 40) for a Seahawks RB but haven’t really seen him discussed around here as a potential target and I’m curious as to why.
I was listening to Tony Pauline last week and he said most teams have him at receiver. And that’s where he worked out at the combine. So the league seems to have made a call there.
But he played RB in the senior bowl
Yes and then a few weeks later all the teams asked him to work out at WR.
Which is much more important.
Curious, why Trey Adams was not listed in red. Hard to believe he was once considered a first rounder by many. Also, did you use SPARQ scores for this chart?
1. It’s just a mistake on my behalf not to put him in red. I will fix that now.
2. No I did not.
As much as I’ve flipped flopped over the course of the year, Uche has been the one I want for the longest now. Maybe hell be an option for them come draft time maybe he won’t but we will soon find out.
thank you, rob… i needed this so badly. really appreciate your efforts!
…and i am sold on raekwon davis as their first pick, hopefully they can add a third on the way!
Just heard the Mike Renner/PFF interview Rob-yet another great one! Every day I wake up hoping JS/PC will have done something to provide a bit more clarity prior to the draft. I’m desperate to see them be able to tap into the OT or skill-position strengths of this draft. Yet-every day…no movement.
But having your great content to look forward to makes it all so much more bearable. I look ahead the day when the press is queueing up to interview YOU! Thank you so much!
My pleasure, thanks for reading!
Crazy trade thought that won’t happen.
While listening to one of Tony P’s latest podcasts they brought up the Trent Williams situation in Washington & how the Skins were only receiving day 3 offers at the moment in terms of draft compensation. Duane Brown is going to be 35(Aug/85) entering the 2020 season & Trent will be 32(Jul/88). A swap of those 2 with some modest compensation going to the Skins crossed my mind. It buys Seattle some time getting 3 years younger and theoretically better at LT. Of course Williams would also be seeking a lucrative contract extension. An extension could be signed that really minimizes his 2020 cap hit so that space could still be held for whichever pass rusher eventually joins the roster. I believe trading Brown incurs a $5M dead cap hit. I expect some team to up their offer to Washington during the draft. If all they have on the table is peanuts though, Duane Brown and say a 4th rd pick is way better than a sharp stick in the eye.
Shaking every tree & turning every stone.
There are four or five players they’ll not even consider trading and Duane Brown is one of them. He’s a heart and soul type. One of the few BAMF’s they have these days. They’re not going to send him packing to the Redskins to get three years younger at the position and probably more expensive.
Thank you for all this work, Rob. It’s great to see this even if you claim it’s rough. Much appreciation for all your effort and thought.
Appreciate it, thank you.
Rob,
Sports Illustrated just did a piece and listed Cesar Ruiz and Robert Hunt as the #1 and #3 interior OL prospects. You were way out in front on Hunt.
Keep the interviews coming! They are one thing I find myself looking forward to. Thank you.
Thanks Steve
Steve. Rob was also way out in front on Ruiz. Rob was talking about Ruiz before any of the so called draft gurus.
Same with Willie Gay Jr, Isaiah Wilson, CEH and im sure many others.
How many of you keep up w/yr prior draft crushes at all?
?
Rob. I don’t think that Clyde Edwards-Helaire will still be on the board at 27. But if CEH was sitting there Schneider would be going crazy. CEH has Seahawk written all over him. His senior year he averaged 6.9 per rushing attempt. CEH has been described as slippery. The guy is a tackle breaking machine. CEH is an excellent route runner. Plus he has low mileage on his tires. Only a 370 carries at L.S.U.
CEH is who I want at #27 if Jonathan Taylor isn’t available. The versatility of CEH to go along with a healthy Penny would make for a dynamic combo.
Who is the every down back though? I’m worried about Penny’s recovery and who knows how durable Carson will be from now on.
Here is a little annoying concern of mine…….the Seahawks seem to be lacking in getting good snap counts from their top picks during their rookie contracts. Penny will be on his 4th season before possibly giving us decent carries in a full season, Jackson is going into year 3 and is still a project, Collier looks to be on a similar path yet he doesn’t have the youth excuse Jackson is hiding behind. Most of last year’s draft class sat in general and with the defense being so poor….its beginning to be an issue.
The question I would ask back is how is it for other teams first picks? Especially the late first day second rounders.
Exactly. Key word “late” first rounders or early to mid 2nd round.
Sorry I am a bit confused, when you say Jackson do you mean Rasheem Green? I think you may have confused him for Branden Jackson who was a free agent signing.
@captain jack-thanks for reading my confused mind. Yes, I meant Green.
@Greg, yeah good thought, could be league wide but sure seems to be Seattle’s M.O. of late, leaving little time to get value from the utilization of 1st contract draftees.
I agree with the sentiment. It has seemed for a few years now that they have gone with the veteran over the rookie where they had a choice. That is how a lot of NFL teams operate, but it’s not necessarily how I’d expect Pete to do things. And I get it, it is hard to throw rookies in there when you are constantly playing close games and scraping to make the playoffs. A rookie mistake could be the difference between a win/loss the way they’ve played games the past couple years.
Penny was injury/conditioning his first year and they were starting to work him in well second year. Green wasn’t NFL ready year one and was always going to be a guy that took a bit to physically mature. The ones that drove me nuts last year were Blair and Ugo Amadi.
I really wish they would have played Blair more. Yeah he probably would have made a bunch of mistakes, maybe even costly ones, but he also would have brought swagger and energy to that defence. Playing “safe” with TT or Delano was a slow bleed. Given the other nickel options, I wish they would have given Ugo an opportunity to sink or swim earlier as well. His recent comment about how he played tentatively on defence last year trying not to make mistakes has really stuck with me. That’s how Cody played as well.
I get why they haven’t played young players more, but this defence has gotten old and slow. To me, you want your defence to be young and hungry. Play with swagger. Dance between plays at home. Going veteran on offence, especially offensive line, makes sense. I want my defence to be young, loose, fast and violent.
I love K.J. to death. He’s been an underrated and key piece to this defence for a long time. By all accounts he is a great mentor and man off the field. He gives some of the most thoughtful interviews on the team. I would cut him in a heartbeat. Use his $7.5M on a the DL and go young at that position.
I think it was Blair and Amadi that sent me over the edge. My thought is, Wilson is the ultimate eraser. If Pete had seasoned the rookies early to mid-season warts included and had Wilson ramp up as needed sooner to compensate, they would have had much more athleticism going into the playoffs. But I agree with your thought about being careful due to how close we play games.
I too really want to see a defense that plays loose and fast again- (seems like every season Pete logs further from his USC days he morphs more into Mike Holmgrens conservative style)
I think Schnieder and Carrol deserve a whole lot of credit for addressing the needs of the team this off season. Minus the pass rush. There are many pundits out there talking about the additions they have made to biold depth and strengthen the team. It seems likely they will do something before the draft to help the pass rush. That will set them up for the draft and an infusion of talent. If you consider how late the seahawks have drafted, of late we can only hope that the new comers of last year are ready to contribute.
They deserve a lot of credit for addressing the needs of the team???
They’ve not addressed their self-confessed enormous need at all. In fact as things stand they’ve made the pass rush worse.
They don’t deserve any credit for the off-season so far.
RB Rankings from Chris Simms
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdHVfNnWZmw
5. Swift
4. Moss
3. Dobbins
2. Taylor
1. CEH
From this list, if we miss our on Taylor or CEH, I’m really hoping we get Moss. Simms said he can be a bell cow back and he reminds him of Lev. Bell.
What are your thoughts?
Go Hawks and Happy Easter!!
I would put Swift first…but that’s just me.
Glad he shares my view on the top two RB’s.
Not the biggest Simms fan but this list was really good. The only one I disagree with is Moss. I don’t think he’s a top 5 back. I loved Moss at Utah, but man the Pac 12 is just so, so bad that I’m always worried about guys like him that physically dominated a conference that can’t produce defensive talent.
Happy to see Swift further down the list. I just think CEH, Dobbins, and Taylor are clearly a step above him. CEH finally gets the recognition at the national level that he deserves. I think he’s a top 5 RB the day he gets in the NFL. He doesn’t have any weaknesses.
Rob, this is such an awesome post. I am not a serious college fan, but your H board enabled me to have fun doing an informed 4 round PFN draft using your analysis of PCJS tendencies. I know the PFN board is not realistic, so I’m sure my results don’t track to anything that will come close to happening. But hey it’s for fun during lockup, so why not? I did a lot of trading and here’s what I got…
Final List (6 players):
46 Wilson, OT
49 Edwards-Helaire, RB
59 Zuniga, DE
71 Davis, DT
133 Harris, C
214 tbd
-2021 7th
Details:
Draft Choices-7
27, 59, 64, 101, 133, 144, 214
27
Trade 27, 101 to Colts
Get 34, 75
Colts take Eason
34
Trade 34, 75 to Chargers
Get 37, 71, 186
Chargers take Ruiz
37
Traded 37, 64, 144 to Dolphins
Get 39, 56
39
Trade 39, 56, 2021-7th to Broncos
Get 46, 49
46
Isiah Wilson, OT
49
Clyde Edwards-Helaire, RB
59
Jabari Zuniga, DE
71
Raekwon Davis, DT
101
Traded
133
Nick Harris, C
144
Traded
186
Traded
214
Draft ended
Thanks — for the comments and sharing of your mock.
I think Seattle has Griffin on speed dial before the draft starts. There just isn’t a edge rusher that I like other than Chase Young,. He is unreal! I want to get Big, Physical, and always Speed Baby! An this is my SIM draft 3 rounds and no trades. I take my RT. Isaiah Wilson the monster RT we want . Shell work perfect because Wilson will really need a year to even compete. This guy sophomore usually 2 years behind the Pro’s. Solari is just chomping on the bit for this guy. With the way this year is going it makes more since now. I like to expand. 59 I like Raekwon Davis a couple Alabama boys in the middle works for me. No we hit that spot that I think is the spot that gets me. I have the RT and DT filled out. This is the special pick where everyone goes crazy.
What I like to see from you all is your pick for 64. Defense, offensive, or a trade down. I
I have my defensive guy and he is Malik Harrison OLB Ohio St. The eye test of this guy is another K.J. Wright Prototype. He will shine under Ken Norton Jr coaching.
I have a offensive guy and he is Chase Clayborn WR NOtre Dame. This is DK Metcalf only this guy can motion Like a Tight end. He doesn’t do TE in line stuff but then Hunter Bryant doesn’t either.
My choice is Chase Clayborn this guy is big and can be physical. NO trade down this is the winner.
I have to get a running back. with Penny on pup list, I have to take A.J.Dillion. I want to see this guy give Carson a rest and then he and bring a more physical Attack.
I have my survey hope ya answer. going to call it. Tell your choices Rob?
Rob (or anyone)
Do you know if any other teams value pass rush win % highly when drafting guys?
If so, Uche might go higher than we anticipate.
I think most do.
Lynn Bowden WR/QB/ATH
Why is ESPN pumping this guy up in an article?
Make him out to be the next Lamar Jackson or NFL.com makes him out to be Randall Cobb
clone.
He has practiced/played NCB, Punt Returned, RB, WR and QB…. runs in the 4.4s apparently.
As an athlete (do everything guy), might be worth a swing later in the draft. One of his greatest assets is that he can pick up a playbook and learn it very quickly (did it 2x WR and QB) when he was with the Kentucky Wildcats.
I asked Rob yesterday about Madubuike, and now when I am at computer I saw some other peoples also asked him…here are most important things Rob said about him in last week or two…
He’s extremely interesting. He’s twitchy and agile and his size profile would suggest that he’s a pass rushing specialist but he’s actually quite adept in stopping the run. Additionally, he is certainly no slouch as a pass rusher and it’s certainly a part of his game that he can develop. Really crossing my fingers for him or Raekwon Davis, they both seem like excellent options to pair with Poona and Reed and the top of Defensive Tackle rotation will be set for quite a long time.
I’ve been re-watching Collier tape and re-reading old scouting reports. He had some incredibly impressive hands and effective counter moves. He reminded me of Clowney-lite in that he’s able to penetrate but not bring it home so much with a lack of closing speed. Legitimately surprised he had such a rough first year. His development should be interesting this year with a full hopefully healthy training camp and pre-season (which hopefully we still get).
Totally agree. I went back and rewatched some of his college stuff and got excited. I’m not sure he’s ever going to be a star, but looks like a high floor player. His hands and power should translate to the NFL. Can’t put much faith in him to be a saviour based on last year, but I’m really optimistic that if he is healthy he’ll be a useful rotation piece.
My two issues with the Collier pick were his limited ceiling/athletic profile and the fact that he wasn’t a good player until he was the oldest guy on the field. His game is totally based on power, which again, is slightly concerning when he was flat out older than everybody he played with. The physical difference between a 20 year old and 23 year old is insane – even for football players.
This is why I think Cesar Ruiz goes much higher than currently projected. The dude is 20 years old and dominated.
Anyways – if there is one thing that I’m very convicted with, in regards to the draft – is be wary of overaged prospects that play in the trenches. Doesn’t mean they can’t succeed, but I think they require extra vetting due to the massive physical advantage.
It pains me to be negative about what seems to be a great guy overall but Collier just doesn’t have the athletic build to actually enhance his quickness as he ages. The guy appears to be more suited to just allow the extra weight that he struggles to keep off and switch to being a run stuffer.
Rob, do you think that the Hawks will sign a pass rusher before the draft? How likely is it that we still end up with Griffen + Clowney? What’s your prediction?
Yes, I think they will sign a pass rusher before the draft.
I hope they can add both Clowney & Griffen because they need a rotation and they need quality. They would both provide it.
Re-watching 1v1’s and the game in Mobile — it’s amazing how many players have tried to mimic Yannick Ngakoue’s go-to move. High step then chop. So many were trying it.
Did anyone had success with that move?
Yes.
Anae and Uche did it all the time.
Lot of these Senior Bowl edge rushers though — if you can get your hands on them and clasp on they struggle to disengage.
Not interested in trading for Ngakoue. His numbers doesn’t justify trading a premium draft pick and then meeting his salary demands.
BTW: You had Calias Campbell and Malik Jackson on that defensive line. So you could not key on Ngakoue.
Dang, Tavaris Jackson died in a car accident last night.
Sad news
Tragic news! RIP T Jack.
Tragic about Tavaris Jackson. The first thing I think of when someone hits a tree and gets killed(no one in the car with him) is suicide. Was it suicide? I don’t know. Either way it is sad. Very sad.
With the draft so close now – – think it’s possible, even likely, that the Hawks will see how much draft day does or doesn’t fill the pass rush needs – and then move more decisively on Clowney, or maybe Griffen?
Or is that wishful thinking?
They’ll do something.
It’s just a matter of what and the cost.
And then whether it’s enough.
Merely re-signing Clowney and replacing Ansah/Jefferson with Mayowa/Irvin isn’t enough to transform a terrible pass rush into a good one. Replacing Griffen with Clowney is a downgrade. If there’s a way to sign both they need to do it. That’s been the story of the entire off-season.
According to Albert Breer the trade market will be active next week.
Rob,
Seahawks Draft Blog continues to be destination reading for me. I just wanted to say thanks for adding so much great content for Hawks fans.
You’ve rightly pointed out that, in the past, the Hawks have used free agency to give them lots of flexibility in the draft, and yet so far, they haven’t done that. Pass rush was a glaring need heading into free agency and it’s still a glaring need, with a terrible D-line class staring them in the face. My question is, what do you think it would take via pre-draft moves to make D-line no longer a crisis situation? The combination of both Clowney and Griffen? Griffen and Dareus?
Clowney and Griffen. Or Clowney and another. Or even Griffen and another.
A couple of key additions.
Otherwise they’re going to be taking a pass rusher with one of their first three picks.
It will be interesting to see what Griffen/Clowney sign for. And who they sign with. I still think there is a chance that Seattle can sign Clowney.
I have brought this up before. But Clowney could sign deal with another team. Then later after the phyiscal the team could reject the deal.
Question: is Everson Griffen a LEO or 5T?
More of a pass rusher. Not a natural LEO but not really a 5T either.
Rob, finally got a chance to sit down and read this article (and responses). This is so good! Thank you for all the effort you put into this “hobby” of yours and sharing it with us.
If you update your chart, will you just update the image in this article or post a new article to accompany it?
I will post a new article — and thanks for the kind words