Instant reaction: Seahawks beat Raiders, improve to 5-3

This was a relatively comfortable yet strangely unsatisfying 30-23 victory. Seattle sputtered on offense and had a day to forget on special teams. A banged up defense again generated some pass rush and flashed some 2013 form in the secondary — even it was far from a flawless display.

The injury situation is incredible right now. Kam Chancellor, Russell Okung, Max Unger, Byron Maxwell, Bobby Wagner, Zach Miller and Jeremy Lane are all missing. Seattle fielded its fourth choice center. Valuable backups like Jeron Johnson are also out. This team is decimated and any kind of win was going to be valuable today.

With no depth remaining its no surprise the special teams play is suffering. Seattle uncharacteristically gave up some big gains, they had a punt blocked for a touchdown and Steven Hauschka missed a field goal. They nearly gave up an onside kick at the end when Cooper Helfet let the ball slip through his grasp. Without the quick thinking of Jermaine Kearse the Raiders would’ve had the ball at midfield with a chance to drive for the win.

Seattle must get healthy to restore some order. They can ill afford special teams play like this and against St. Louis.

Offensively it was just a sluggish day from start to finish. Russell Wilson never got into a rhythm. For every good play he seemed to have 2-3 bad ones. He dodged two major bullets — a dropped interception by D.J. Hayden and a near pick-six by the same player. The Raiders did a great job containing the bootleg right with Khalil Mack. It’s no shock the pass protection suffered at times missing the starting left tackle and center. James Carpenter also left the game with a bad ankle.

The Seahawks can’t revert to a conventional passing offense for situations like this because everything about them is so unconventional. It’s a great dilemma. Wilson needs movement — he needs to get out of the pocket. It also puts a great strain on the offensive line — half the time they don’t know what he’s going to do. Sometimes he encourages pressure because he’s so mobile and quick to bolt. When he’s not having a great day the passing game just suffers. There’s not really a solution other than feeding Marshawn Lynch, which in fairness they did today.

Justin Britt is not playing well recently. Today he just looked lost. On one key pressure he allowed two rushers off the edge a free run to Wilson. Luke Willson chipped and went downfield, Britt clearly didn’t have a grasp on his assignment and it was costly. Just one example, there were several. They might need to consider adding extra protection to his side next week with the continued absence of Zach Miller.

Luke Willson, for all his great athleticism and ability to find the right spot, has hands of stone. I counted four catchable drops today. It’s hard to criticize him too much a week after he scored the game winning touchdown. But those big plays are too sporadic — his general play more hindrance than help. The Seahawks are crying out for a big target in the passing game and the player with the most potential to provide it can’t make consistent, basic grabs.

Whatever happens the rest of the way it’s stating the obvious to say Seattle absolutely must prioritize getting a tall receiver or tight end who can act as a go-to target. Attacking the perimeter all the time with shorter receivers isn’t always effective. Wilson needs an outlet he can deliberately over throw or challenge to high point a tough catch and work the middle.

This could be the most important addition next year. Seattle does not have enough difference making size at receiver. They have two big stars on offense — Lynch (who is reportedly on the way out) and Wilson. You cannot pay Wilson $100m and then expect miracles minus Beast Mode. Even if they draft Todd Gurley next April they need to make sure the investment at quarterback is not a total waste. Lynch was the best player on the field today and more specifically the best receiving target. If the focus is drifting towards the QB he’s going to need an equally effective running back and better weapons. I like Kearse but he had one catch on seven targets today for a grand total of four yards.

On a positive note I thought Alvin Bailey had a decent game at left tackle. If they weren’t so intent on pushing Britt at right tackle you could probably make a case for starting Okung and Bailey at the two spots.

On defense it was good to see Cliff Avril and Michael Bennett continue their recent upturn in form. Richard Sherman finally got a catchable ball for his first interception of the year and Bruce Irvin made an outstanding play on the pick six.

The Seahawks will get a tough game against the Giants next week. Eli Manning is running the type of offense that has started to hurt Seattle. They better hope for some good news on the injury front this week.


  1. Glor

    Agree about Luke, I would also add that Coyle played like he had money on the Raiders on ST, total liability

    • CD

      What was he doing on the play near the 2 min warning, the one where KPL should have had a pick 6? In my 30 years of watch pro ball I have never seen a player (Coyle) so lost. Would love to hear what was going on.

    • John_S

      Yeah on that punt block, I understand that he’s supposed to chip the guy and let him go, but he barely even touched him!

    • AlaskaHawk

      Since Coyle was in the right guard spot, he needed to make a solid block for a couple seconds and then run upfield with the rest of the pack.

  2. JeffC

    Just happy for the win, considering the injuries.

    It’s hard to evaluate this team with this many injuries. This is like college tryouts sprinkled with good players. Individually, I think Luke Willson has had his chances. The game winning catch last week was also a good throw he has to routinely catch. It’s what he’s paid to do. What he did this game is getting to the point of being inexcusable. At some point, you have to cut bait. With Miller out, he’s had his chance(s). He’s just not the long term answer at TE.

    I don’t know how this team moves forward without Lynch, regardless of his cap hit. He is so heads and shoulders above ever other player on offense it is depressing.

    RW really needs consistency. Is it the injuries? Who knows. But he misses too many opportunities. One example is the pass to the sideline he overthrew, forcing the receiver to adjust, and allowing the defense the split second to get a 3 yard loss. Right now RW is a bargain at his contract. When he gets 20-25 million per year, the gloves need to come off and he’ll have to face criticism of his overall game. Hall of fame player one week followed by Matt Schaubism is going to get talked up unless he gets it together. I’m hoping a healthier team does that.

    • Glor

      I agree about Wilson, what I want to know is what is with this new jump pass of his… Leaving your feet to throw a pass is just terrible fundamentals, and his passes have been consistently erratic every time he has done it

      • neil

        I admire RW greatly. How can you not. Being told all his life he wouldn,t make it in the nfl because of his height. But I have said for two years his height will eventually catch up to him, and I fear it has. Defensive coordenators in the nfl are not stupid, I knew they would find ways to take advantage of his height. They use a controled rush to basiclly keep him in the pocket so he can’t see, and pressure up the middle. If he does break contain they keep him running as fast as they can not letting him slow up or set his feet to throw.No body can throw the ball accuratly downfield 30 yards while running full bore. I am glad we got the super bowl last year, it may be quite awhile before we see another one.

  3. Arias

    even in a win this team looks lost. Getting back to the Super Bowl is a pipedream at this point it seems like.

    Winning next week against the Giants is going to be challenging at this point and this is a team that we destroyed last year.

  4. chris

    in my opinion you let russell play out his contract next year and franchise tag him if need be. i want to see if he is capable of carrying a team with a few more weapons before i commit huge money to him over several years. also i think that richardson should be starting over kearse at this point.

    • CC

      I love Kearse, but he isn’t getting open. He and Russell got bailed out by Hayden’t PI call. If Hayden had turned his head around and been a better defender, it would have been a pick I am encouraged that Norwood and PRich are the guys in there regularly now – much better than Lockette and Walters. But goodness, Russell looks bad! Is he getting happy feet because he knows his line sucks? Many a good QB has had a bad line and started bailing out early.

      Also – please send the bubble screen with Harvin to the Jets! Every team we have played since opening week is completely ready for it.

      • JeffC

        I think Kearse is better as the third receiver. I’d actually like to see Norwood have more time. That dude has HANDS.

      • Jacob

        I think Lockette needs more touches. I can’t recall him dropping any passes recently and he has the lone deep ball touchdown we have. I can’t really say that no receiver is getting open since Russell hasn’t had much time to throw but what I’d like to see happen is some shorter patterns to help against the blitzes that have been coming. We hardly throw slants or quick outs. I’d like to see that happen and get 5 yards a pop on them. It’d make 2nd down much easier. Yesterday it seemed like Bevell really wanted to throw on 1st down which resulted in an in-completion, then run the ball on 2nd down resulting in 3rd & 8. Way too many 3 and outs lately. I guess I shouldn’t be so critical since we’ve managed to get to 5-3 so far and when you look at the losses, we had the ball to go down and tie or win the game on the last possession two of the three losses. Last year we had some close calls too but we were on the better side of those. Getting everyone healthy is a must and for the love of all that is holy, can we please stop throwing the WR bubble screen?!?!?!

    • John_S

      I’ve seen enough where he’s already had to carry this team. He’s deserving of a huge contract. There’s no need to play any games with his contract. Get him signed and move forward.

      He carried you in Chicago, he brought you back against Atlanta in the playoffs, he led you to a superbowl, he carried you in OT against Denver this year. I’m not sure what else he’s supposed to prove in your eyes.

      Also, if you deem him not capable of carrying this team, who are you going to get to replace him? You spend all these years trying to find a franchise QB and when you finally have him you want to play games and risk losing him?

      • AlaskaHawk

        Last year Wilson carried the team at times. Marshawn Lynch was an even bigger factor, he was able to make good runs even when the blocking was subpar. But both were backed up by an incredible defense last year. In fact I think it is fair to say the defense carried the team last year through the regular season and playoffs. Wilson was at his best during the playoffs and superbowl game. Other times he has looked off, which is one reason the offense looked so raggedy last year.

        Fast forward to this year. Offense still looks raggedy but has a couple legitimate excuses including having to make a transition from their most gifted athlete Percy Harvin, and a bucket load of injuries. Sadly some of the injuries like Okung and Carpenter are predictable. Wilson has been inconsistent but also not helped by dropped passes.

        Is Wilson elite? When he is on his game and the receivers catch the ball he is elite. When he isn’t on his game – don’t expect much. He just looks Jay Cutler or Joe Flacco ordinary. Now that isn’t bad. Flacco won a superbowl behind a great defense and Boldin receiving. The Ravens will not win another unless he gets the team that came together for the playoffs the year that they won.

        Lets face it, Dynasties are hard to come by. You have to have a good team, a great QB, great coaching, and lots of luck. The Seahawks coaching has been okay, QB elite to okay, team anywhere from elite to okay. Most of all, the Seahawks had a couple early drafts that were great, but haven’t had a great draft in the last two years.

        • glor

          I would contend that they have had miserable drafts for the last couple years.. Do we have any impact players from the last couple drafts?

          • hawkmeat

            This. I haven’t read many criticism on the past couple drafts. They have yielded poor results. Impact players, not that we have seen.

          • Arias

            Last year’s draft wasn’t a total loss. Tharold Simon is looking like a legitimate starter opposite Sherman after Maxwell leaves in FA at the end of the year. Actually, his play so far even warrants him possibly keeping the job even when Maxwell is back to health if Max continues to have passes completed on him at will like before he was injured, though I’m not sure PC would be willing to demote him given Simon’s short game day pedigree so far.

            Willson has been a serviceable 2nd TE, even though his recent spate of drops has us souring on him he make key contributions for us there last year in the SB run.

            Even if current trends continue with Michael turning bust and Jordan Hill only becoming a mediocre DT in the ‘serviceable starter’ mold it can’t quite be determined as a ‘miserable’ draft even if it’s not up to previous standards. If either turn out to be anything more than that I think the 2013 draft could start to be considered a success.

            And I think it’s fair to say that 2014 is still way too early to judge and at this point hinges a lot on how the two wide receivers and starting right tackle turn out.

  5. Mylegacy

    This is not our 2014 Hawks – far from it…yet…there is some remarkable talent on it.

    I’m getting goose pimples just thinking about Richardson and Norwood. I love those two guys. Irvin is growing into his man strength. Not once on TV did the commentators mention that our OLine stinks. They should have – but – at least it has an excuse. A forth string C, a back-up LT, a LT playing guard, a guard injured, a rookie RT who (perhaps because of the chaos around him) is looking every bit the rookie and less and less the RT. No Miller time.

    What did Lynch do? Nothing much – just rambled off 140 yards – give or take. On a couple of those runs down the sidelines i could swear he was possessed by the ghost of Harvin – is it just me – or is Lynch freakin fast?

    I’ve given up on the team as a favorite. I’m falling in love with a team with as gutsy a group of loveable Palookas as I’ve ever seen. Overcoming adversity and rising to who knows what heights. last year we were an alien killing machine – this year we’re human – and oddly enough – I’m enjoying these games as much as I enjoyed watching last year’s assassins.

    There is still a part of me – deep in my scared torso that thinks they just might do it again.

    GLORY TWO – but driven there in a very different vehicle and down an altogether different road. Let the force be with us!

  6. CC

    We need Miller back as soon as possible – he is an amazing player and we need to resign him next year. Willson is just okay.

    I’m happy with a win under lots of injuries, but some of these guys that are supposed to “replace” players next year do not look good.

    The fact that Lynch keeps playing and running hard play after play – flag after flag – shows again to everyone what an amazing football player this guy is! I’m sick and tired of people taking him for granted and thinking that we can just draft another RB to take his place. We have done that already – CMike, Turbin, Ware, Small, and several other guys who have made little impact. Without Marshawn today, we might have lost.

    I’m also tired of Russell being asked about Marshawn and after saying a few nice things decides that we need to hear what a great job Robert Turbin did. Russell, I know Turb is your roommate, but he is a very average running back. Quit hyping him! For every 5 yard play he has 3 no gains.

    Sherman Smith said this week that CMike is fundamentally unsound – UNSOUND. If we let Marshawn walk after this year, we will regret it.

    • Bryan C

      Marshawn isn’t leaving next year. The money saved from Harvin is almost exactly the amount that is needed to pay Beastmode.

      • Rob Staton

        I think it’s been fairly established in the national media that the main issue with Lynch is not trying to make a cost saving.

    • Rob Staton

      They certainly will regret it if they don’t replace him sufficiently.

  7. connor

    You hit the nail on the head Rob, we need bigger targets for Russell. When he is in the pocket its tough for him to throw quicker short, and intermediate passes (particularly over the middle) without throwing lanes. When he has to throw over a D-linemans outstretched arm on a line, he can’t get a downward trajectory to get it down to a 5’10 or 5’11 target’s chest which is why I think you see so many high misses on some of those throws. But if you have a 6’4 or 6’5 target the ball is going to be perfectly in his catch radius.

    Obviously Russell has shown he can be effective without big receivers. But realistically with a shorter QB I think we’re seeing its important to get him bigger targets to help him out, because there are probably plays he’s not able to hit on, that he could with a bigger WR/TE. Kinda scary/exciting to think what Russell could do with that type of playmaker, when he’s already been this good without one.

    • JeffC

      RW misses so badly sometimes that even a bigger target won’t help. Again, hard to criticize a guy who has an SB ring making third round money, but when he gets paid, the criticism will come.

      This is not a hate RW post. I love RW and think he’s our best qb in our history, and I’ll be relieved when they lock him up long term. But he does have issues with his game that he needs to work on, because right now, if he were forced into the Brees/Manning/Rodgers mode for whatever reason I don’t think he could do it every game. I think it was his poor play that kept the score closer at halftime than it needed to be. With so many injuries, the team needs him to be on his game. We were lucky we were playing the piss poor Raiders or we would have lost.

      • CC

        Agree with you – RW hasn’t looked good. I really wonder if all that “talk” from the locker room has affected him. He’s a confident guy, but maybe hearing that guys were allegedly making comments against him has affected him. He’s human – being criticized could make a guy like that maybe get too much in his head. I hope he can figure it out and sharpen up his passing.

        • Amar

          C’mon guys…Luke Wilson by himself had 3-4 drops; Kearse had about 2 drops. Two big Lynch screens getting called back due to penalties (35 yards on first screen and about 20 on the second) and a pass to Norwood (about 12 yards) get called back due to a penalty. A big Pass Interference call on the first drive where Kearse could have caught the ball. Did Wilson miss a few throws? Yes, he did. But, look what he is working with – a 5’11” receiver who is quick but not fast (Baldwin); a 6 ft receiver who can’t get any separation (Kearse), a TE who drops more balls than he catches (Willson), and two rookie WRs (who 4 games ago were both healthy inactives). And on top of all this, the two most important guys on the OL were missing (LT and center). And the rook playing RT looked every bit a rook.

          Yes, it wasn’t the best game from Wilson. But, the receivers didn’t really help him at all today.

          • CC

            You are right – the receivers didn’t help at all. The offense as a whole isn’t looking very good. Will they look better when the o line gets healthy, I sure hope so. We could use Zach healthy too.

            • Amar

              Well, the pass O didn’t look good because of the receivers, the Oline, penalties at wrong time, and of course Wilson didn’t have his best game. The run game looked great.

              But, really, Wilson is the guy who we can really rely on. He just led to a game winning drive a week ago on the road. And played lights out against a division opponent on the road and if he had got another shot would have driven the team to a win (against a team who we usually struggle against).

          • JeffC

            No one is saying Wilson is the only one having a bad game. Reread the posts. What we’re saying is he needs to be better for this team to move forward, and he’s not immune to criticism. A lot of people in these parts get angry when analysts say he isn’t as good as the elite. If that is the case, then we have to measure him against the elite and when he becomes the franchise, he’ll have to lift this club with his performance.

            • Amar

              I agree. Like I said, he didn’t have his best game. But, him missing high on some throws is him making sure that only his receiver has a chance to catch the ball. He did miss on some throws high in this particular game. But, that’s not his “usual” problem. You can say that Cam Newton has that “usual” problem of missing high.

              Overall, Wilson can play better than he did today – but his stats today are misleading. He could easily have had 80-100 more yards passing if the receivers had just caught some catchable balls and if those penalties were not committed on three big pass plays.

              • JeffC

                Yes, agreed. They will need to find him a go to receiver. The effort to get Julius Thomas points to them focusing on the TE position – I think they go the FA route, perhaps even make a big pitch to get Jordan.

                I think they look into drafting a bigger wideout, but Norwood looks like one of those guys who has a vacuum for hands. I’m hoping he gets more and more PT. I like him even more than PRich.

                Really hard to evaluate this team right now. When our injured guys start coming back in bunches…

                • Amar

                  Yep, one silver lining from the whole Harvin fiasco is that now the two rookies will get to play significant snaps and from the first looks both look to be decent. How this team misses Golden Tate and Sidney Rice…we easily forget that both led the team in TDs with 7 each in 2012. Both brought variety to the team – Sidney with his size and golden with his shiftiness (not to mention punt returns). Hopefully with time, Richardson and Norwood will close the gap on the contribution we are missing from Rice and Tate. They will have to if we still have hopes for big things this year.

                  Wilson will be fine. Lynch will be fine. Baldwin will be fine. The rest of the guys will have to step their game up. Willson and Kearse in particular.

                  • Amar

                    And as bad as the pass O looked today (due to whatever reasons), it’s still a W. Just ask how the 49ers feel today – ha!

                    Oakland isn’t as bad as their record shows. They played NE in NE very tough and almost forced overtime if not for a horrendous call on a raiders TD with less than a minute to go. And they were leading vs. SD (maybe even in SD…not sure) late in 4Q when SD was playing as the best team in football.

                  • Rob Staton

                    You’re spot on. Tate and Rice both big misses this year.

                • Kelly Orr

                  Been pleading for it all season. Our 3 WR set should consist of Prich and Norwood on the Outside and Baldwin back to the slot. I think Norwood would be great on that inside out pick route going over the middle. The game today was the first time all year that I honestly felt Russell didn’t play as well as I thought he should have. Even taking the 6 drops into account. These guys will be ok. The offense looked shaky last year as well. Just hopefully like last year they can hit their stride going into the playoffs and get back to the SB again. Was telling my Uncle yesterday that it just seems like no matter who we play it is always a close game. I am starting to think that perhaps Cooper Helfet should be in there instead of Luke Willson. I think this team will be alright. They just need to weather this storm of injuries.

      • John_S

        I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s hurt.

        Remember at the end of the year last year, he was off too and he started wearing sleeves which covered up a brace on his left arm. After the season the team noted that he did have an issue but didn’t say the severity.

        With the amount of hits he’s taken this year already, I would not be surprised at all to hear he’s got an injury.

        • CC

          Aren’t they supposed to disclose that stuff? Obviously, the Hawks didn’t last year, but I’m surprised that the NFL didn’t get after them for that. NFPLA seems to be all over that stuff.

          • John_s

            Don’t know the rules but if he’s a full participant don’t know if you have to disclose

        • Drew

          I’ve already noticed he had a wrap on his left/arm shoulder under his sleeves in the Carolina game. Would not be surprised to see some kind of ongoing issue with how many hits he takes.

          • John_s

            After reading this I re-watched the Raiders game and I definitely notice it being bandaged up.

  8. Darnell

    Is there a benefit to doing Wilson this upcoming offseason as opposed to franchising him after the last year of his rookie deal? I see so much saying Wilson is getting a new deal this offseason, why?

    If he bets on himself and wins that means something very very good has happened.

    • JeffC

      Normally when you franchise a qb the cap hit is crippling.

    • Rob Staton

      He’ll get a new deal because he’s a franchise QB with a ring who’s been earning a pittance for three years. There won’t be any betting. He’ll get a shiny new contract at the earliest possible moment in the same way Sherman and Thomas did last year.

  9. David M

    The thing I don’t get about wilson, is he isn’t looking for his no.1 reciever first. Remember those plays last year where Baldwin was in slot, tate out wide next to him, tate would run slant inside to clear out the dbs, while baldin would hesitate for a second then run the wheel type route outside for a nice 20-30 yd easy reception? That play was like bread and butter. Well they ran it today, ran it to perfection as Baldwin beat his corner and had great separation, but where was Russ looking? Oh of course, up the damn seem for Willson aka brick hands. Why is wilson not looking for his no.1 wr??

    Secondly, I’m tired of him scrambling out of a perfectly good pocket. He doesn’t know when to step up, he just bails and teams have that figured out

    This offense has two weak points 1) the offensive line, is really not good at pass pro at all. Run blocking sure there above average, but pass pro is just no good. 2) a big “true no.1” WR or TE. Wilson either needs the time in the pocket, or someone he can have full trust in to huck the ball to. Because what we have now is not working. I could ramble on about bevell but it’s always the same….

    • Arias

      scrambling out of a perfectly good pocket is to be expected sometimes when you have a really shitty offensive line. it’s hard to blame him too much for it, consider it his finely tuned self preservation instinct. Bad offensive lines have ruined many once promising quarterbacks and its on the front office as to why they can’t seem to get their offensive line out of their woes year to year to year.

      • Rob Staton

        I think people just automatically blame the offensive line these days. I didn’t see too many pass-pro issues versus Oakland — and that’s with the starting left tackle out and the 4th choice center starting. Not to mention a rookie right tackle. They did a decent job overall, particularly in the run game. Some of the blocking on Lynch’s best runs was exceptional, especially on his second TD.

  10. Adog

    I would have liked to see them use the no huddle/hurry up offense in this game. It has been the only part of their offense that has looked efficient this year. It will help the offensive line out in that incapacitates defensive scheming…ie…zone blitzing and snap anticipation…both of which is causing the o-line problems. It will also erase pre snap errors as it simplifies pre snap gibberish. It is a good fit for both lynch and Wilson…and that is key since it will make this offense two dimensional. Maybe they are keeping their cards against their chest until that crucial stretch in the schedule where they play five out of six games against the NFC west. It seems plausible when they sat some key players today who perhaps could have played. I think there trying to squek their way to 6-3 before unveiling this no huddle offense …at least I hope.

    • MIchael

      Don’t hold your breath.

      I think the coaches are aware that the offense is more efficient when they are running the two-minute drill. They aren’t changing the game plan. They want the offense to run the ball and spend significant time with the ball to keep the D fresh throughout the game and season. It’s sometimes hard to watch, but it’s an approach that’s proven to be effective.

    • redzone086

      The no huddle puts a lot of pressure on the defense even if they score. With all the injured players out the hawks defense hasno depth. You can’t put the defense out there for fourth minutes and expect them not to get gassed.

  11. mj

    I’m growing very concerned about RW. I think all the “cuteness” on offense is plainly showing that RW has some serious limitations, that many of us don’t/won’t admit. He no longer seems to actually make reads. The middle of the field seems to be avoided like the plague. The once poetic nature of his broken plays are now just broken. Lastly, he simply can’t play in the pocket. He gets out of there even when there’s no pressure.

    Now, the OL stinks to high heaven, but this year, RW should be taking a lot of blame for such a horrendous offense. It needs a major overhaul and I think it would behoove us to take a midround flier on a QB. I really have serious long term concern about the viability of RW as a QB.

    • Rob Staton

      I wouldn’t be overly concerned. They know what they need and that’s why they asked about Julius Thomas/Jordan Cameron/Vincent Jackson. The O-line and Wilson will be fine. They’ll have highs and lows this year.

      • MJ

        Hypothetically speaking…

        Hawks let go of Unger and sign Wisniewski as an FA.
        Hawks sign Suh as an FA.
        R1: RB Gurley or Melvin Gordon
        R2: WR Devante Parker or big WR/TE


        Unger is seemingly always hurt and seems to have a much better reputation than his play. Wisniewski seems like a nice upgrade whilst getting younger.

        Suh would be a lynchpin on the DL for years and I think it’s becoming clear that PC doesn’t necessarily like really young DL having prominent roles. Call it grown man strength if you will and it makes sense IMO, unless you draft a stud in the top 10 picks (ie Donald, McCoy, etc).

        Gordon or Gurley…no brainer if Marshawn is gone. I think both these guys have a chance to be defining talents at RB for the next few years. Heck, I might even put Tevin Coleman in that regard (though to a lesser degree and in R2). Coleman is vastly underrated.

        Devante Parker looks like the missing ingredient and he seems to be a guy who is still not getting the hype he deserves. Great high pointer.

        Thoughts on this type of plan? Realistic or no? I know the Unger thing might be a stretch, but I believe he’s close to 30 and really is always nicked up. One of the most underrated skills for any athlete, in any sport, is the ability to stay on the field.

        • MIchael

          I’m not so sure about the young DL. Who do you think they should have played over the years that they didn’t? They just haven’t been able to hit on too many DL in the draft, period. Granted, they haven’t used such high selections, with the exception of Bruce.

          • MJ

            It’s just my opinion, but it “seems” as if they prefer more experienced guys in the heart of the DL. Yes, they have been awful at drafting DL, but I seriously wonder whether or not they just think that position takes maturity to play well and consistently.

        • Rob Staton

          I think Unger for Wisniewski is a bit of a sideways move. I know Unger has been banged up but I have to confess to being a stickler for consistency on the line. I’d be willing to persevere given he’s under contract. I think it’ll be extremely difficult to get Suh to Seattle. He will have a hot market and the Gerald McCoy deal doesn’t help the situation. Seattle has to pay Wilson and Wagner at least this off-season. They’ll have to consider others too. I think a more likely situation are several choice additions on the DL — I’d look at Jabaal Sheard and Henry Melton if he’s a forced release by Dallas. If they lose or move on from Avril a LEO is a must.

          On the draft — no complaints from me at all. I think Gurley is a terrific player and Seattle, if they move on from Lynch, need a star to replace him. Gurley has massive potential. I think Gordon has a ton of potential but right now is too much of a bounce outside runner. Can he pound it inside? I’d hate to lose that aspect we have with Lynch. I think Gurley can do Lynch’s work load, Gordon would be more rotational. If they lose Lynch they have to add at least one star at WR, RB or TE — possibly two.

          I like Parker and it was good to see him bounce back form the injury with a big game against FSU. He’d be a nice option in R2.

          • glor

            Don’t we also need to be looking for a new Left Tackle? I’m sorry but has Okung even played half his games since he was drafted?

            • Rob Staton

              A starting left tackle isn’t an easy thing to find unless you pick in the top ten. Okung’s cap hit is friendly next year. They’ll probably let that contract run out and then make a decision.

          • MJ

            Thanks for the input. I totally admit to being completely overwhelmed by Unger, which definitely effects my opinion on his value.

            Great call on Sheard and Melton. I’d love to see us load up on some Tier 2 DL pass rushers and continue the trend of rotational DL.

            What do you think of Tevin Coleman?

            • Rob Staton

              Tevin Coleman is really, really good. Will be a fun battle to see who goes first between Coleman and T.J. Yeldon. I think Coleman could even add a bit more muscle and turn into a really effective starting RB. One to watch.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Concerned about the current world champion QB because he’s had some rough games this season playing behind what is arguably one of the worst o-lines in the league, without the WR corps that he took to the SB last year?

      If RW had played like this last season, all the pundits would be calling it a sophomore slump.

      Also, do you think RW draws up and calls those “cute” plays? If you don’t like the play calling, don’t blame the QB. Blame the OC.

      Speaking of OCs, yesterday, Marty Mornhinweg was able to scheme Harvin into the Jets offense to the tune of 129 yds on 11 receptions. Bevell, who coached Harvin at MINN and SEA, couldn’t get that kind of production from him. In fact, Harvin already has 20 more receiving yards as a Jet in only 2 games this season than he did in 6 games with SEA.

      • CC

        In Bevell’s defense – as much as I loathe to do so – Harvin is the only offensive weapon the Jets have. We have several more options and they start with Marshawn. Harvin will be the 1-3rd options for the Jets. Harvin was going to be the 2nd option. Also, Harvin is behaving because he’s getting the ball. Remember, if you’re not in the game, you can’t catch the ball.

        • AlaskaHawk

          Why didn’t we ever use Harvin as a downfield receiver? Was he really that bad at running routes and catching the ball? Because the only other players I would trust are Baldwin and Lynch, and they drop the ball sometimes too.

          • David M

            He’s obvisouly not that bad if he’s went 11-129 he also went up and won a very contested jump ball. I still miss him. I would have to liked him with a different OC

      • glor

        whose fault is it that the WR corps are what they are? People also said the same thing about the WR corps last year quite frankly, and look at the numbers GT is putting up now. Hell, look at the numbers Percy just put up yesterday, 11 catches, over 100 yards..

        • MJ

          Very good point. In my opinion, it’s on the Scheme, OC, QB (who is in turn adversely affected by the OL).

      • MJ

        No animosity here man! Just laying out my opinion. Didn’t proclaim it to be Gospel.

        Didn’t say RW draws up the cute plays. I meant that perhaps we see all these “cute” plays to compensate for his limitations. It’s a legitimate question, in my opinion.

        I’m not solely blaming RW. He has a terrible OL and not very good WRs.

        The problem is, outside of a handful of Quarters, he’s been pretty below average this year (again, my opinion). My concern is that he was able to overcome that last year and this year, he clearly hasn’t been able to.

        In my opinion, he has seriously regressed in multiple areas, even if the Stat Sheet doesn’t explicitly show it. I think his ability to read things has gotten worse, and he seems to be making worse decisions, and a few different bounces and his INT total is much higher (including 2 yesterday that were dropped).

        Again, his teammates have been doing him very little favors, but that still doesn’t totally excuse the fact that he has been below average for “most” of the year.

  12. Dumbquestions

    Reasons for optimism:

    The distortion of injuries makes it very hard to evaluate the team at this point. Our fanboy expectations (me included) mask the fact that this team is 7-1 with better breaks against St. Louis and Dallas, which PC mentioned (obliquely) in the press conference today.

    No team (not even San Diego, in brutal conditions) has dominated the Hawks. They’ve preserved chances to win, even in the worst circumstances. They’ve seemingly weathered the Harvin storm. It is hard to understand how they’re 5-3, given the adversity.

    Like everyone else, I’m tired of watching RW run for his life. I’m tired of the limited passing game. I’m tired of pre-snap penalties and Lynch runs called back. I’m tired of the less-than-adequate pressure from the D. I’m frustrated by the losses of Tate and Rice. I want blowouts like last year – but my memory is faulty, because I remember blowouts that didn’t occur. I forget how close they came to losing last year in Houston and at home against Tampa. I forget how lucky they were in 2013.

    What we’re seeing, as my dad pointed out to me today in a text message, is parity rearing its ugly head. There are no dominant teams in the NFC, and the latest Brady-Manning duel demonstrated that there aren’t any in the AFC, either.

    Bring on the Giants.

  13. Frank

    I think the “win forever” mantra is well served by rebuilding your reciving core in a QB contact year. Wilson and the entire offensive roster are built for zone running and play action. I don’t see a shift to a passing team being as easy as handing the ball and the Franchise to Russell. Beast mode is the most fun back to watch since Barry Sanders and I personally loathe the day he isn’t our Identity on offense. He might be a head case but he did what he came to do, and I for one am grateful for some awesome memories.
    I love RW and the power run combined with play action bombs to keep the defense honest. He needs throwing lanes more than most QB and you have to game plan around that. The Saints have done a great job scheming room for Brees for years now. RW personality is a little grating in that Tim Tebow let me buy the Franchises loyalty with the overly good guy act. I understand a little why other players feel a disconnect but He is a Baller and a great guy to go to battle with. I hope when he is resigned we remember he is a system guy and not Rodgers or Brady.

    • John_S

      System guys are guys like Alex Smith and Andy Dalton. Guys with limited arm talent who are great in the regular season, but will not get you anywhere in the playoffs.

      KC and Cincy have better receiving talent than Seattle does and look at how far those teams have gone. Imagine Dwayne Bowe and Travis Kelce or AJ Green and Mohammad Sanu on the Seahawks and see how much better the passing game would look.

      • Arias

        Yeah but good luck trying to lure those caliber of receivers to Siberian desert for wide receivers that is Seattle. They’d have to break the bank and I don’t think they’ll be in any position to do that.

        • John_S

          I am not saying you sign the guys as free agents, these guys are available through the draft, Sanu and Kelce are both 3rd round picks.

          Look at the receivers drafted this year who are non-first rounders who are contributing Jordan Matthews (2nd), Davante Adams (Late 2nd) Allen Robinson (Late 2nd), Jarvis Landry (3rd), John Brown (3rd), Martavis Bryant (4th). Donte Moncrief also had a big game and is getting more snaps

          Hopefully Richardson and Norwood will develop into key contributors

          • Arias

            Yeah I agree that the draft is the only real way to add gems like that and I’m hopeful of what we have. I really hope PRich can somehow make not selecting Bitonio a lot less painful.

  14. CC

    Hey, where is everyone on Cable?

    I understand that yesterday he had to field lineman that weren’t ready for prime time, but I am concerned that the guys he is telling the FO to draft are not the best players or even the best players for his system.

    Britt looked lost yesterday – Sweezy is average and sometimes shines – Carp is inconsistent. Bailey, Gilliam, random other UDFA/7th rounders are projects.

    The O-line has gotten worse under his watch not better. I think RW is getting happy feet – he’s bailing out so fast, and I can’t blame him.

    • John_s

      I’ve been saying it for a while. The oline issues are on cable. In the words of Parcells. Cable was able to go shop for the grocieries. These are his guys and either he is picking guys who incapable of performing or he is not coaching the guys up either way it’s on him

    • mrpeapants

      agreed!! so tired of all the project olineman. it would be sooooo nice if we had starters on the line instead of projects. cable has a great reputation as a line coach, but if he really does have input on which ones they draft, then this needs to stop! maybe he doesnt know talent. holmgren was the same way, great coach bad talent evalutator. its time for the line to make a difference in a positive way. go hawks

    • AlaskaHawk

      Last year they drafted two offensive linemen. One was released due to medical conditions and the other Britt is playing at RT.

      I would like to see them continue with the drafting and pick a LT, LG and possibly backup center. They need to refresh the positions with constant injury concerns. This has been going on for two years now, so hopefully the GM will keep picking. Likewise for interior defensive line and linebackers.

      • Rob Staton

        If you draft a LT, LG and C there’s every chance you drafted three backups — two at least. Seattle needs depth but there are also a lot of other areas of the team that require starters.

        • AlaskaHawk

          They showed last year that they are willing to draft two offensive linemen. Usually only one becomes a starter. Considering our needs and huge number of picks another 2-3 next year is perfectly reasonable. You don’t really expect all our offensive linemen to be on the team two years from now do you? When I played fantasy football I learned that the average player does not have a long happy career. Sad but it’s a physical game and the way they performed to date does not suggest they are capable of a long career.

          • Rob Staton

            If we’re talking 2-3 picks and a couple of those being late rounder fliers then sure. But I don’t see early round investment again.

          • AlaskaHawk

            Considering all our other needs, like a big wide receiver, a great running back, an awesome defensive tackle, etc. They probably won’t pick an offensive lineman until 4th pick or later. Just too many holes to fill, and we won’t be able to fill them with free agents if Wilson gets 20 million /year.

      • Kelly Orr

        Team has much bigger needs than LT and LG and a backup Center. Okung when healthy and on his game is pretty damn good. Unger i am not all that high on but Schilling played well when he was in there. Being down to the 3rd string center sucks but shit happens. LG Carpenter has just been somewhat streaky this year but I would not be apposed to starting Gilliam or giving one of our other back up tackles a shot at LG next year. This line does need to get better at pass pro but I think they will be just fine. What we really really need desperately in my opinion from next years draft is a Pass Rushing DT. I for one would not be heart broken to see Mebane let go and bringing Suh in. But if we dont do that then we need an heir apparent to Mebane(Jesse Williams hasn’t played at all yet). We definitely need at least a 6’3″-6’5″ WR. I hate to say this but hard decisions are going to be made. Kearse, Baldwin, KJ, Malcom Smith, Avril, Maxwell (although he has not played well this year and I like Simon better),Carpenter, and very sadly Lynch probably will not be on this team in the future. Marshawn and KJ would be the two I would hate to see go the most. But RW3 and Wagner need to be resigned.

        • Arias

          “Okung when healthy and on his game is pretty damn good.”


          Last time that happened was in 2012. It’s hard to be confident that we’ll ever see anywhere close to a 2012 Okung ever again as it never happened before that and hasn’t happened since. I think a good case can be made that he’s already peaked and is in decline. He was never totally healthy last year and it affected his play, and it’s the same old story this year.

          Meanwhile, when he doesn’t play and we’re left to playing guys like Gilliam last Sunday to plug his hole we get the expected results. Gilliam was awful, but at this point I think a good case could be made to just keep him there and develop him at LT as opposed to keeping a constant subpar injury risk there instead.

    • Rob Staton

      In fairness the line was a total shambles before he arrived and it’s a unit that has enabled Seattle to run the ball better than nearly any other team since his arrival.

      • CC

        Although, if you look at the sack stats starting in 2011 – we had less sacks in 2011 with Tjack… more in 2012 and even more in 2013 even with RW – a guy who has avoided sacks – scrambling. To me, that is a concern

        • Rob Staton

          I think that makes sense to be fair. PC said he wants to be the best scrambling team in the NFL. If you’re going to scramble a lot you will pick up extra sacks. For example, Wilson had three sacks against the Saints in the playoffs last season. Two of those we’re scrambles for a gain of -1 yard. Seattle with Wilson will always accumulate a high number of sacks.

    • JeffC

      I wonder if the team missed the chance with Bitonio. Is anyone in this year’s draft approach Bitonio’s ability who will fall into the bottom of the first round? I think they missed their chance.

      • Rob Staton

        I’ve not seen a tackle I liked as much as Bitonio last year in this possible 2015 class so far.

      • Jarhead

        I was just thinking that today. Possibly the best rookie in the league at any position. He could be a force at LG all year, learning how to play LT, then when we are able, we could’ve cut ties with Okung and had a mauler to spearhead our run game. But at least we traded our 1st round pick and have Richardson! :I

  15. David Moore


    What do you think about RW’s fatigue level? Speculation at best, but he’s a self-described “grinder” who tweets #notimetosleep frequently. He’s been deep in the playoffs two years in a row after doing draft prep after college. He won the SB. He’s going through (or has just completed) a divorce to his college sweetheart. The Seahawks have asked him to limit his endorsements, so it seems that even they are wondering.

    That’s a massive amount of stress for a lengthy amount of time, and I wonder if it is affecting his play. I would be reduced to tears at this point.

  16. JeffC

    Wow, looking at the injury list, you might be able to take just those players, fit in some free agents, and might be able to field a playoff team.

    Never seen anything like that in my years of watching this game.

  17. JeffC

    Looking at Arizona’s receivers, you wonder how any team in the NFL can match up when all four of their targets plus Ellington are on the field. But the way Simon is playing – was he even thrown at much yesterday? – when you get Bmax and Lane back, that might be a better secondary than last year. If only they can get healthy.

  18. CC

    Just listened to Pete – sounds like we could get 4 or 5 key/starters back from injury. BWags and Zach getting better. We really need to be full go or as close to it in 2 weeks or at least by Nov 23 against the Cards.

    I haven’t looked at all the possibilities – and not trying to be clever or obvious, but basically we have to beat AZ and SF twice to have a chance to win the division. If you split with either or both, wild card at best. If you beat both those guys twice, you maybe able to lose the Chiefs game or Philly and still be in it. And I’m not overlooking the Rams – it is just by that last game, if we have to win it to have a chance to be in, I’m guessing we’re not deciding our own fate.

    • JeffC

      We basically have to root for SF to beat Arizona when they meet. Makes my stomach hurl.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m not sure we’ll need to win four games against Arizona and San Fran. The Cardinals have to have a rough patch somewhere.

    • AlaskaHawk

      To win our division we need to win both games against Arizona, that will drop them down to our level. Then we have to do really well with all the other games, we probably need 7 wins in the back half. Tough but do-able.

  19. Tomahawk

    Needing a big receiver, it sure stings watching Martavis Bryant tear it up for Pittsburgh when we had numerous rounds to take him.

    • JeffC

      I remember he had only one year of stellar play, and so he wasn’t high on too many lists. He may become the next Dez Bryant.

    • spokane seahawk

      I strongly agree! Rob was all over him too. They should hire Rob!

  20. Ed

    Just get wins. We are starting to get healthy and our D is starting to get their swagger back.

    Start throwing some slants to Norwood, that dude is big and take some shots with Richardson. Bevell needs to stop being cute.

    Let Irvin rotate at DE. Coyle/Wagner inside, Wright weakside and Pierre at strong. Speed.

    As for next year roster Rob.

    A. Peterson, V. Jackson probably get cut next year.

    FA: Fairley, Suh, Pierre-Paul, Iupati, Houston, (can Den keep both Thomas’?), Gresham. A lot of talent. I think trade, cut Okung and Unger. Alot of talent, but too injury prone. Can maybe get some good picks (2nd and 3rd).

    • JeffC

      The adrian Peterson thing is an interesting thing to talk about at some point, considering that most analysts believe Lynch is gone after the sb this year. If all his charges get reduced to misdemeanors, what punishment will the NFL levy? What type of contract would he be expecting? Will their be a bidding war or will teams be hands off? Considering his age, is his body holding up? Would the seahawks consider him with the child abuse charges on him? How would the fanbase react? How would PC and JS explain it in the first press conference after signing him?

      Would they consider him despite all this baggage if they can’t find an answer in the draft and because of cap constraints can’t get Wilson any more passing weapons? Really really interesting offseason coming up.

  21. Radman

    I think the Percy Harvin fiasco is proving incredibly costly. There’s presently no threat that makes a defense take their eyes off the backfield. P-Rich and Norwood are nice prospects but they need time to develop. The cost of Percy was the cost of letting other talent leave, and now there’s nothing left to show for it.

    They put a lot of eggs in the Percy basket, and the bottom fell out.

    I don’t think it should be a surprise why Russell is jittery back there. He should have zero confidence in the circus show O line they put in front of him this past week. You can’t expect a QB, let alone a young one who can scramble, to be calm and collected when he’s surrounded by guys he has almost zero familiarity with. I also worry about the long-term effects of having poor pass blocking around Russell. It can breed bad habits. If he’s rushed often, it should be no surprise when he feels rushed often. They’ve put a lot on Russell in terms of dealing with sub par pass protection- it’s simply not an emphasis of Cable’s. We might be seeing the long term effects of that.

    • AlaskaHawk

      A lot of us thought the Harvin trade was a bad deal because it was expensive and cost us a lot of draft picks. What we didn’t know (but the Seahawks should have known) was that he was disruptive to the team and that he wouldn’t be used as a downfield threat.

      I like Rich and Norwoods chances of success. I’m not a big proponent of redshirting rookies. We need to find out how they will do a lot sooner then year 2. In fact they should have been on the field by game 2 or 3. Now they have some catching up to do, but I think you will be pleasantly surprised at how good they look by the end of the season. And if they don’t look good, cut them in the offseason and move on.

      • JeffC

        I think considering how badly the depth has been gutted, this redshirt thing that PC does has to be shelved. For good.

  22. AlaskaHawk

    I just watched the 30 min highlight reel on NFL Game Rewind. I have to say that Seattle looked extremely good. Every throw was caught. Marshawn knocked off some great runs and awesome touchdowns. Our defense looked superb. I don’t know what you guys are all whining about!!!!
    ha hah hah (Rain and darkness driving me crazy in Alaska)

  23. David

    Rob the score was 30-24 not 30-23..little late but thought id say something.

  24. Hay stacker509

    Super excited about TE Tony moeaki signing with us! If his injuries are out of the way him and miller could be exciting pair

    • CC

      Me too – if only for the simple fact that it puts the young TEs on notice – you’re not playing well enough – and if you don’t play better, we’ll find someone else. Willson may have been getting a little comfortable or maybe they are just too young.

      Saunders is an interesting practice squad guy – I wonder if he’s more to give the DBs someone to practice against who is really quick, makes quick cuts – and to push Walters.

  25. Hay stacker509

    Off topic but a question I’d like to pose to people,
    What would the chances of us signing ray rice to a 3 yr deal to replace lynch? Obviously he’s not the type of runner lynch is but he’s shifty around the line and can block and catch pretty good. He would also help our scheme of run the ball. Would him signing and then working with Russell on his pass the peace program turn his outlook to everyone?

    • Rob Staton

      I wouldn’t want to go there. Aside from the obvious, his play dropped off big time last year.

    • Arias

      It’ll never happen. The Seattle cognescenti would literally go apeshit over the DV issue and the backlash would be enormous. I’m reminded of when the Mariners traded for convicted rapist Josh Lueke and the subsequent uproar. It’d be like that times 1000. The PR shitstorm itself would make it not worth the headache.

      Add in what Rob just mentioned about his play dropping off a cliff last year, indicating he’s a RB that’s already hit his wall and is now in steep decline and it makes it not even worthy of a moment’s consideration.

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