Instant reaction: Seahawks lose to Chiefs

There’s not a lot to feel about this game. Sure, the Seahawks made Kansas City uncomfortable at times in the second half with the way they ran the ball. Yet ultimately it’s another loss, their fifth in six games, and Seattle never threatened to win.

I’m sure a few moral victories will be claimed by those inclined to seek them out. We saw that after the Niners game too. ‘It wasn’t as bad as I expected‘. The Chiefs were taken to overtime last week by the hapless Texans and the week before that, were severely pushed by Denver in a 34-28 loss. They haven’t been playing that well recently.

Nevertheless, this one never got that close. In the first half, it was like watching a pre-season game played in second gear. The Chiefs sauntered to an advantage they never looked like relinquishing.

It was nice for the Seahawks to come out after half-time and show something but when the score is 17-3 — the damage is done at that point. It’s OK trying to establish a running game when you’re down by 14 points but if Seattle was ever going to win in Kansas City, that had to be something they accomplished much earlier.

To me it just feels like a predictable score. The Chiefs move on. The Seahawks lose again. They’ve taken a promising 6-3 start and gone 1-5 in the last six games. Which, frankly, is really poor.


  1. ShowMeYourHawk

    Uninspired football on all fronts. Perhaps the guys didn’t have their shirts off long enough to put any fear in their opponents’ hearts. 🙄

    Bring on the offseason, already.

    • Malc from PO

      Agreed, really poor stuff. KC are mistake prone and we brought them down to our level for a quarter and a half, which is a success of sorts, I suppose. DK was excellent but that was about it as far as positives go for me. With the grinding awfulness that is the NFC I dare say we’ll still make the playoffs and there will be those among the fan base and organization who tout that as an incredible achievement. Objectively this team is very bad.

  2. Jabroni-DC

    The only positive thing I have to say is that the Seahawks don’t stop fighting.

    The cold hard truth, as we’ve known for some time, is that we are sorely lacking in talent.

    • Jabroni-DC

      Also, this offense doesn’t function without Tyler Lockett.

      • cha

        That’s the Seahawks mantra. This (whole entire team) doesn’t work without (one single player).

        • Jabroni-DC

          That’s how ‘thin’ we are. We have soooo many needs. It’s going to take years if it’s gonna happen.

          • Peter

            Exactly. We miss one key starter for one game this whole season and with a baby soft schedule we are limping to the finish line.

    • Ben

      LOL!! Didn’t stop fighting???? I guess you cant stop fighting if you never start in the first place.

      • Malc from PO

        You’re quite right. The only plan we had today was to see if KC would make enough mistakes to allow us to hang around. We offered no attempt to force the game.

  3. Denver Hawker

    These guys are checked out, making beach plans for week 19, business decisions on the field.

    • Elmer

      Could be, but nothing like the bad karma around the Broncos.

  4. Happy Hawk

    Another Loss – train keepa rollin!

  5. Gross MaToast

    I’m looking forward to Jan 9 and the very real possibility of some team-related announcements.

    • Big Mike

      Badly, badly needed

    • Tomas

      Pete receives another contract extension.

      • Gross MaToast

        Dang it, I’m so pumped to let you guys know that we’re gonna run it back. We’re so close to being the team we want to be, just right there in every game. These guys want to be the best and are just so jacked about next season. We know what we need to do and, doggone it, I just can’t wait to get started. Also, we’ve traded both first round draft picks to the Rams for Baker Mayfield and Bobby Wagner. We couldn’t be happier.

  6. Scot04

    Minnesota wins another crazy one. Was pulling for NY, can’t believe they hit that 61 yard FG.
    In regards to the Seahawks game the only possitive I saw was when they started more of a rotation of Taylor, Mafe, & Nwosu. Irvin just showing nothing at this point; we need to see those 3 the last 2 games.
    We need to lose out & see changes. Too bad we plathe Jets & Rams.
    This defense can’t get any worse, unless they stick with this scheme; unfortunately Pete says he wants to.
    Better players don’t help this team if that’s the case.

    I’m also curious why everyone is saying we get pick #4 if Denver only wins 1 more.
    Atlanta & Carolina should move ahead of Denver based on strength of schedule.
    So wouldn’t we drop to #8?

  7. Adam B.

    The more I watch the way the Seahawks are finishing out this season, the more I want this season to be over with.

    The defense is in utter shambles, and there’s seemingly very little that I’d want to take forward in a rebuild (Tariq, Nwasu, …?)

    What’s worse, the offense has taken several obvious steps backwards, and while I still think Geno is probably the best answer for the immediate future, there are just SO MANY holes all over this roster, I can’t say I have any faith in ANY aspect of the team going forwards.

    Here’s hoping Pete Carroll and John Schneider have more of a clue about where this team is going than the on-the-field results would indicate, because while they have a veritable bounty of draft capital and are coming off a really encouraging draft, nothing about the past 5 years indicates they know how to put together a winning roster regardless of resources.

    • Scot04

      I’m fine keeping John, especially if the rumors are true that he has wanted to move on from Pete.

      • Peter

        I’m okay with John for two seasons without Pete. After that if the team isn’t in a nfc championship game I think he should get the are.

        He’s the fifth longest tenured gm and this team is a mess. Either he’s a yes man who has been getting pushed around by Pete or….and more likely he’s nor really shown he’s any better at being a gm at this juncture than Pete is a coach anymore.

        All these ideas of who does what are irrelevant to me. Pete hired him and they’ve worked hand in hand to get us to this place.

        • Gross MaToast


      • Big Mike


  8. Chris

    If I hear another local media figure that the Seahawks always play better in December im gonna puke

    • ShowMeYourHawk

      Mind the curtains….

  9. cha

    Somebody needs to change their handle to “A Guy Called Potato.”

  10. Trevor

    This team needs to hit on two more draft classes like this year to be legit contenders. They are so thin at almost every postion that when a starter like Locket goes down things fall apart. This is just another thing to support Robs idea that Pete may pack it in. He had to look at this roster and see just how far away they really are.

    Bring in a new coaching staff and use the early Denver pick to find our QB of the future if possible or draft a true difference maker on the DL and then keep adding talent. Get rid of all the old guys and bad contracts this off season with the idea of being a competitive young team next year 2023 and then a contender in 2024.

  11. Forrest

    1st half analysis:

    Big Metcalf penalty, check
    Cody Barton out of position, check
    Bruce Irvin offsides, check
    Wasted timeout X2 in first half, check
    Yards after contact & mistackles, check

    What good is it for Barton to stand behind Kelce and watch him catch 7 yard passes?
    If you double Kelce and both defenders are behind him, giving up the easy pass after a free release, that just concedes 7 yards.
    Teez, hands up when the ball’s coming
    Cross, when you know it’s a short pass on 4th down, push two hands into the belly of your DE so he can’t jump or put his arms up.
    Gabe Jackson is killing our run game in getting pushed back and standing in the RB’s way.
    Let’s skip the screens. It’s been YEARS since we’ve been able to execute them effectively.
    The gap discipline difference between these two defenses is striking.
    Lucas getting beat off the edge.
    WTF Derek Young penalty on the punt? Do you want to get benched?
    One first down in the first 5 possessions – with 2 and a half minutes to play in the half?
    Thank God for their stupid penalty on the sack at the 2 minute warning. Same drive, thank God for the face shove penalty on the pick in the endzone. That’s the ONLY reason we got 3 in the first half, which we nearly still squandered after wasting two time outs
    A lot of this is Xs and Os.
    No 1st downs until 7 minutes left in the 2nd quarter? We would only havd had 2 first downs on 6 possessions if it wasn’t for the penalty on the sack and would gave been down at least 17-0.

    Diggs played better.
    I’m so happy we have a returner. I waited over half the season screaming about that.

  12. Forrest

    Abram was awful on the screen in the first half to McKinnon. But, he’s doing better with Kelce. We should let him play man coverage on Kelce. Kelce was killing us in the zone with double coverage in the first half.
    We should stop giving free releases. We need to jam at the line like the other 3-4 Fangio defenses that have adjusted in San Diego, etc.).
    Stonewall Forsyth! I love it!
    Two nice Walker runs, is it because we’re running outside where Gabe Jackson can’t hurt us?
    Wasted timeout, check.
    Daryl Taylor in coverage on their #1 WR?
    Seahawks are 1 for 11 on 3rd down through the first 3 quarters!
    Another penalty on DK, this time on 4th down.
    Two 4th downs now where we threw for two yards less than what we needed. Ugh!
    When a RB gets a pitch back and looks like they’ll lose 6 yards with three unblocked guys coming at him, why not just throw it out of bounds and save the loss?
    8:45 in 4th, where’s the urgency to run a play?
    Now another wasted time out??? Only to lose 2 yards on a run??? We huddled and called time out for THAT?
    WTF was that pick? DK is 12 yards away.
    Brooks looks to have regressed over the past few weeks.
    OMG, take Brooks off Kelce! Stick Abram on him in man. See earlier comments about his free release into zone and needing to adjust to press like Sand Diego.
    Finally a QB sneak with 4 min to go.
    Penny Hart curls when Geno goes deep?
    Two third down

    I liked the quick to the line 4th down QB sneak. Green Bay does that so well. Can’t remember us doing that in recent memory.
    Better run defense today. But, is that the result of the KC offense? It looked like Mahones was off on a number of throws and they had several drops.
    Good crowd support on the road from Hawks travelers.
    Native draft position is improving
    Giants, Lions lose.
    Nice poise and heart by Geno and TEs to keep playing their best through the final whistle.
    The Fangio 3-4 does look like it was build to play against Mahomes.

    The NFL has to come up with a better onside kick alternative (without being able to get a head of steam since that change).

    • Forrest

      Sorry, this was for the 2nd half.

      • Tomas

        Some interesting stuff in there, appreciate it, Forrest.

  13. Trevor

    My goodness Bosa is good.

  14. Palatypus

    Shambullocks !!!

  15. Zxvo3

    The only thing I can get excited for is Rob’s next mock draft 👀

  16. pdway

    It’s like someone else said on here – we just can never seem to get both sides of the ball playing well in the same game. I’m pretty baffled at the regression by the offense.

    and unfortunately, Geno’s play complicates things. When he was rolling, it was getting pretty exciting to think about focusing all those high picks on the defense – which so obviously needs a talent influx. But now, it’s trickier. I suppose if there is a QB you really believe in when we’re up – you have to take him. All things considered though, I think I’d still be fine going: D-Line; LB; Guard/Center, Safety with those picks – and run it again w Geno.

    After all that fun earlier – these past few weeks have been one rough watch….

  17. Trevor

    Shanahan’s offense is so QB friendly and looks fairly simplistic. Why can’t more teams replicate it?

  18. cha

    NFL Memes
    It’s time for Geno Smith to write back.
    12:34 PM · Dec 24, 2022

    • Big Mike

      My buddy texted me the exact same thing at the end of the game 😀

    • Elmer

      I like it! So should RW.

  19. Rob4q

    Anyone else read the ESPN article about Sean Payton wanting to coach next season and have Vic Fangio to be his DC? That could be very appealing in Seattle since they’ve already started down the 3/4 defense path.

    What teams are going to be looking for a new HC in the offseason?

    Houston – they won today and I think Lovie Smith was always going to get more than 1 year to try and get better there

    Carolina – they won again today and still have an outside shot at the NFC south and Steve Wilks has done a really nice job coaching that team. I think he gets an opportunity to stay on.

    Raiders – Mark Davis has already said that Josh McDaniels will get more time

    Broncos – Nate Hackett could be one and done in Denver, but I wonder if he doesn’t get a second season with all that’s gone wrong there.

    Cardinals – Maybe, I could see them firing Kingsbury now that they have announced that the GM Keim is not returning.

    Colts – I read that Jeff Saturday is Jim Irsay’s drinking buddy and will get a long term contract at the end of the season to stay on as HC…that’s just insane!

    Saints – Maybe, but they won again today and also still have a shot at the NFC south. Plus, I don’t think Payton would go back there anyway.

    So I think that’s it barring a big surprise coach stepping down. Most of the other teams that weren’t very good this year all have fairly new coaches that should get more time. So there realistically could be only 3-4 HC openings. If Pete does decide to retire, I wonder if Seattle would be on Payton’s list…

    • Big Mike

      You left out the Chargers. He’d love to have Herbert who in turn would flourish under Payton. However, Spanos is notoriously cheap so doubt he would eat Staley’s contract.
      Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe any team that hires him will owe the Saints compensation in the form of draft picks.

      • DJ 1/2 way

        I think Payton wants to pick his QB. The Chargers may work for him, but he would be expected to win today, while the Seahawks, with a top five pick, might be more of a three year plan, if not longer.

    • Forrest

      I completely agree! What better way would there be for Jody Allen to maximize the value of this franchise, prior to a sale. Let the Commanders’ sale set the market. Then bring in Payton & Fangio, with Schneider’s GM talent and all our picks and package the whole thing up for a sale! Brilliant!!!

      • Big Mike

        She’d only do it if Pete retired imo.

        Also, do you want to give up a draft pick fir him, maybe even our native 1st?

        • DJ 1/2 way

          If not retired then kicked upstairs. Special assitant to the owner or some such.

          • Rob4q

            I guess it depends on what the draft pick is right? But getting Payton & Fangio as coaches would be pretty awesome. And they could draft a new QB while keeping either Geno or Lock to run the offense for a year.

    • cha

      I think you are optimistic about Houston, Carolina and Indy not making moves.

      Other options could include


      A Payton-Fangio team would be a splashy hire. Would also likely need a foundation of good players to attract them.

      I’d guess these teams are in the running:

      LA Chargers
      LA Rams

      • Trevor

        Chargers seem like the most obvious spot.

        Fangio just got let go by Denver and is not going back as a DC. Also why would Payton want to go to that mess.

      • Rob4q

        I doubt Fangio would go back to Denver and I don’t think Payton see’s that as a good position either.

        Chargers are 8-6 right now with a good shot at the playoffs so I’m guessing Staley gets at least another year there.

        Has McVay said anything about stepping down? Same with McCarthy in Dallas – I doubt either one of them walks away after this season.

        So potentially that leaves Arizona, Indy, Carolina, Houston and Seattle…which it’s either Arizona or Seattle out of that group I would think!

        • cha

          McVay considered retiring/taking a sabbatical after the SB.

          McCarthy could be so much chum to get the Girl That Got Away.

          • Hoggs41

            The Saints are probably going to ask for draft pick compensation since he quit and wasnt fired. Not sure the Seahawks would be willing to give anything.

  20. Scott

    My old coach used to always say, “it always comes down to who is tougher and meaner in the trenches”, I know two things stand out to me; this team is top to bottom the softest bunch of pro athletes I’ve watched in a while, and they don’t have anyone to say enough is enough, and start to take it out on people. Talent is sorely lacking, but toughness, aggression, and want to are the biggest missing pieces, in my humble opinion.

    • pdway

      completely agree here. feels like every other nfl game I watch – the players on the good teams are more decision and just more aggressive in general. it starts w the defense in my opinion. we need some energy guys.

  21. Robert Las Vegas

    I think I can make i can make a valid argument that Pete Carroll, Bill Belichick and Mike Tomlin should not be coaching there respect teams next year they should all be gone

    • Rob Staton

      Those two teams definitely in a similar place to us

      • Jabroni-DC

        And they each had HOF QBs in their primes for long stretches of time. All since departed.

  22. Forrest

    How can Pete Carrol say in today’s press conference that DK’s mentality is great if he has the second most penalty yards among all offensive players in the league?

    • pdway

      I know he has some dumb penalties this year – but I also sometimes think DK is the only guy on the whole team who plays with any aggression.

      • cha

        He completely blew the block on that wide receiver screen to Treadwell. Zero effort on it.

        I think he does so many things well, but there’s always something keeping him from joining the most upper crust of WRs.

        • 12th chuck

          missed out on a td, why he has to jump up for a chest high catch is puzzling.

          • DJ 1/2 way

            Love DK, but would like to see him traded at his peak. This team is rebuilding and he is a luxury that might bring two or three players more on the timeline with the team.

        • Big Mike

          100% agree cha. And I don’t think he’ll ever take that last step.

        • Fudwamper

          Saw so many poor blocking attempts by the wr’s.. it’s embarrassing.

      • Hawk Brewerd

        I agree with all these points.
        I think the incomplete in the back of the end zone is a catch if it’s Lockett, 98.9% of the time.
        Seeing Treadwell break out with two defenders and DK in front of him, then just the defenders as DK excused himself from the play, was disheartening.
        But I also agree that, while frequently drifting into boneheaded territory, he plays with a visible aggression and passion not seen elsewhere on this team. Lockett seems more of the quiet technician, lead by example type. I think Bobby, Russell, and to a weird degree ET3 also had that leadership style. It’s a great asset, but you need more on a team. I think Sherm, Bennett, and Baldwin had that fire that held guys accountable and kept everyone honest. I think Lynch and Kam had both traits available, but transcended to the realm where they could communicate everything necessary with just hard, meaningful eye contact. We don’t have any of that anymore, but I think DK is trying to be that fiery young leader in the Sherm/Baldwin vein. When you’re winning, that passion energizes the team and demoralizes your opponents. When you start consistently underperforming, and you see the (lack of) effort from some guys on the team, that fire can end burning yourself, but you’ve gotta try, right?While he’s still in the great-not-greatest category, at the very least I think DK is showing a desire to add more dimension to his game each year while doing his best to also be a fiery, vocal leader of a team that desperately needs those figures.

  23. Robert Las Vegas

    My comment on this game is how the heck do you have the ball for over 35 minutes and only score 10 points that’s horrible

    • Rob4q

      Maybe going 0-3 on 4th down inside KC territory has something to do with it? And yeah, DK jumping in the end zone when all he has to do is catch the ball with his feet on the ground and it’s a TD there…

    • Rob Staton

      Please let’s not share NFL Rums

      A crap account that made up nonsense for ages and now is trying to be another Dov Kleiman or Ari Meirov leaching off reports by other people to grow their status

  24. L80

    Gabe Jackson is a friggin DUMP TRUCK, and right behind him is Blythe. Couple that with the best RG out of position playing left guard and the whole middle of the line is like a Cadbury Easter Egg.

  25. Tony

    Yawnfest of a game. If we win next 2, can’t wait to hear pete at presser.
    We really found our stride at the end. Lol.

    • Jabroni-DC

      Yep. It’s like making the playoffs now equates to winning a Super Bowl for Pete. I really suspect that he is delusional regarding the state of the team talent wise. People who don’t see themselves as accountable to anyone can rationalize anything. I liked the question that Rob & Adam brought up in the video about giving Pete truth serum & asking how far we are from winning a championship. It would be so telling.

      I’ve been ready for a HC change for many years. If Pete stays, of course I’ll root for us to be winners & recreate some glory. But I’d like for Pete to sail off into the sunset before he becomes a villain.

  26. Sam

    Failure of the HC with fundamentals.

    1 bad tackling.
    2. No pass rush (for last 4 years)
    3. Run defense miserable(d line looks like badly coached)
    4. Bad run blocking.
    5. Penalties
    6. Bad clock management and wastage of challenges.
    7. Regular blown coverages (for last 3 years)

  27. cha

    Why is there so much resistance to moving on from Pete Carroll?

    He put Seattle on the map as a professional championship town.

    Granted the Sonics won a championship in the 70’s, but the Mariners and Seahawks have never had a championship to call their own.

    Fans of the Seattle teams in the 80’s and 90’s pretty much knew nothing but failure.

    2000 was a whole new era. The Mariners built a new stadium and had a rising young roster that was deeply competitive.

    The Mariners in 2001 had the greatest season in MLB history, with 116 wins. National attention had been garnered. A World Series title seemed like fait accompli.

    The Mariners faltered in the ALCS – to the Yankees of all teams – and the MLB world was allowed to scoff at them as an anomaly, a feel-good story that was fun for that little backwater berg, but when it came time to play with the big kids, they couldn’t pass muster.

    About that time Mike Holmgren came and revived broad interest in the Seahawks, and that raised hopes that the team could be legitimate. It happened to coincide with the time the NFL was absolutely exploding in popularity. They built an exciting team with a devastating offensive line and in 2005 they won the #1 seed with a Seahawks player winning the NFL MVP on the back of a brilliant season, shining a bright light on the area once again.

    Another chance to bring a championship to a city starving for one.

    That team got 95% of the way to finally getting that elusive championship, only to have it snatched away in heartbreaking fashion in Detroit.

    Steve Hutchinson poison-pilled his way to Minnesota, Shawn Alexander turned into a pumpkin, and after two division titles and losses in the divisional rounds, the Seahawks bottomed out at 4-12. Jim Mora took over and delivered a 5-11 season.

    Hope had been extinguished. The national narrative about the lack of legitimacy of Seattle returned. The town was back to its losing ways, and that Super Bowl appearance was waived off as just the laws of the universe granting the Seahawks a successful season that every team in the NFL stumbles into eventually.

    Pete Carroll busted through all that. The Beast Quake announced that this team was serious about competing. Players like Marshawn Lynch, Chris Clemons, Breno Giacomini and Brandon Browner that had been shoved aside by the NFL as of no account joined late or not-drafted guys like Kam Chancellor, Doug Baldwin, Richard Sherman and Jermaine Kearse and put together one of the toughest, most skilled teams the NFL had seen.

    Once again, the media kicked up surprise about a team from ‘South Alaska’ that was making noise. They weren’t doing things the right way. They were tough and loud-mouthed. Every team that played them, win or lose, spent the week in the cold tub and the following week were too beat up to face their latest challenge successfully.

    The Seahawks took on all challengers and never backed down. The media could get stuffed for all they cared.

    They stood at the precipice after an all-time classic NFCCG against the beloved San Francisco 49ers. How would they handle the Denver Broncos, who had best offense in the NFL? Surely Peyton Manning and the NFL’s best offense would mow through them.

    You know what happened. It was a slaughter. The game was over by halftime. And if there were any doubts, Percy Harvin slammed the door shut with the 2nd half kickoff.

    Legitimate glory had finally been brought to the city. The generation born too late to remember the Sonics’ championship finally had something to call their own. After years of futility followed by extreme frustration when they finally did have successful teams, they would have something to call their own forever. Something no sniggering East Coast elite broadcaster could dismiss out of hand, nor could the NFL ignore them on their prime time programming schedule any longer.

    Pete Carroll brought that to Seattle.

    The goodwill he has bought himself is immeasurable. For the casual fan, he has punched his ticket and can stay as long as he likes. The short leash rules for most NFL teams do not apply in many Seattle fans’ minds.

    It is not the wins or losses or the banners in the stadium. It is what he did for the whole city. The way he made them feel.

    • Jabroni-DC

      Well said Cha. That entire championship run will always be treasured.

      Every mediocre year that passes by with no clear vision of how to contend for a championship will eventually sour the well. For some, like me, that took place years ago. As I wrote above, I would love to see Pete ride off into the sunset of his own free will as that Iconic Champion. Not as the guy who stayed too long & tarnished his own legacy.

    • Big Mike

      Great post cha and I think you’ve nailed the psychology of the Seattle sports fan. However, the very next season when there was a chance at true NFL elite status/maybe even a mini dynasty, he (with help from Darrell Bevell) makes the most inexplicable playcall perhaps in the history of the sport and the lockeroom fractures and the franchise is never the same thereafter. And that’s where we sit now.

      • 12th chuck

        I still think they cheated, Theu were caught before and after that game

    • TomLPDX

      What a great post, Cha! Well done.

      Mike, we’ll never know until the book is written what actually happened in SB49.

    • Trevor

      One of the best posts I have read since following this amazing SDB Rob has created. You nailed it!

    • Peter

      The casual fan.

      I think you pretty much nailed it. I can remember pretty distintly following 2005 when the wheels were starting to fall off that team the times and the p.i. ( two newspapers folks) when the “bargaining,” stage started to emerge from fans and writers. Ideas that I see to this day.

      The hand wringing, the what about-isms, the excuse making of how we will be back next year better than ever.

      Just like then, exactly so, perhaps I’m more of a pragmatist I see a team slowly falling apart. I see a team where the three phases rarely sync up.

      Good draft this year. Great, I don’t know. Was it great, great. Or does it feel great because it wasn’t the 2017 draft. And 2018. And 2019. And etc.?

      I still can not square for the life of me the fans primarily on other places who sort of act like the squandering of a legacy, one of the rarest things in the modern nfl, and the complete mess of team building as something that has almost occurred by either accident or perhaps by “some other,” front office and this time, no..seriously, really, this time the team will really build a strong roster.

      I honestly hope I’m wrong in all this. For my cynicism I miss having the baddest defense in all the league. A running back who trucked people. An exciting qb who could magic up a miracle when need be.

      Right now this team is the post 2005 team again. Rudderless. Directionless. Not feared by anyone. And perhaps worst of all and this is maybe the fourth year in a row of this…legitimately boring as a whole.

    • JP

      No, it’s mostly the wins, though the Super Bowl ring helps.

      I think a bulk of the reasoning for not moving on from Pete Carroll has to do with a lot of fears certain fans have. The fears are rooted in this idea that Pete has won so many games, why move on from that? That we’re exposing ourselves to losing when we have Pete who has won 10 games a year every year.

      The real problem here is that Russell Wilson covered Pete’s ass for years, and even Pete somewhat admit this last season. Had Russell Wilson not been drafted, the opinion of Pete Carroll would be so different right now given the last half decade trying to rebuild after the LOB, hell he would likely already be gone is my guess.

      If Pete strings together a few more losing seasons, opinions should start to change. It’s what is required for many fans to open their eyes.

      • Rob Staton

        I hope we don’t have to wait for a few losing seasons

    • McZ

      You’re absolutely right. And exactly this reasoning that puts legacy over results is the reason why this city hasn’t seen more championships.

      It also utterly ignores the fact, why the 2013 gang was so great. The players were underdogs pissed for greatness, playing for a middling HC of uncertain record on a crap franchise, with a QB who is too short. Above all, Pete Carroll
      himself was wanting to win it all, at any cost.

      You basically cannot recreate the environment this group was finding, this style of against all odds brotherhood. Coming from that town in South Alaska, bashed or ignored by national media, you need a core who wants to put themselves on that darn map. The 2022 Mariners are btw a good example for that.

      But the Seahawks are still glorified as a “dark horse”, even in year 5 of the defensive drought. And PC is still creating surprising results that bolster this view. It’s still leading to nowhere. There is no advancement. They are stepping sideways. Even if they have another good draft, they won’t be in any position to succeed. They are content with what they are.

      I have basically scratched the lame Ducks… sorry, Seahawks from my view list. I’m genuinely uninterested.

  28. Jabroni-DC

    I officially disapprove of the NFL watering itself down with a 17 game schedule & 7 playoff teams per conference. Other than the occasional weak division winner the playoff teams should be good, not mediocre.

  29. Hawk Finn

    So am I reading the draft projections right? We currently sit at #s 3 & 13, with a legitimate shot at 2 in the top 7?

    • Jabroni-DC

      If Denver wins tomorrow it looks like that pick would be #7 & our native pick is #13. Seattle playing the hapless Jets & Rams for the last 2 games sure seem like winnable contests.

      My Christmas mock has the likely targets off the board at #7 so Seattle trades down & focuses on the trenches early.

      #14 Broderick Jones OT Georgia (convert to OG)
      #28 Mazi Smith NT Michigan
      #36 Calijah Kancey DE Pittsburgh
      #46 John Michael Schmitz OC Minnesota
      #52 Jalin Hyatt WR Tennessee
      #67 Owen Pappoe LB Auburn
      #80 Zach Charbonnet RB UCLA
      #89 Christopher Smith S Georgia
      #115 Jaren Hall QB BYU

      • Rob Staton

        They play the Chiefs and Chargers to end the season. They won’t pick 7th

        • Troy

          I hope you are right, Rob. I worry that Denver beats the Rams and the Chargers (with nothing to play for) to finish 2-1 and slotting our pick from Denver in the 7-8 range.

          • Rob Staton

            Even then it would need several others to lose out

  30. Big Mike

    Merry Christmas (or if you prefer, Happy Christmas) to everyone that makes this a very awesome place from Rob to cha to Robbie to Adam to all those who participate. You all make this by far the best Hawks site there is, so good that I don’t even bother going elsewhere for Hawks news/talk/opinions.

    • bv eburg

      Merry Christmas Big Mike. And same to Rob and all others of the SDB community.

    • TomLPDX

      Merry Christmas Big Mike and all the SDB gang!

    • Adam Nathan

      Thanks a lot Mike-absolutely loved becoming more of a part of the community on the show in the last year, and always really enjoy your comments. Happy Christmas to you all

      • Peter

        Cheers to you. It’s been great getting the new booth addition post game and really being able to dive into your podcast with Stuart (sp?)

        The podcast with the raiders fan/nme writer….so good.

        • Adam Nathan

          Thanks Peter, Danny is a real broadcasting hero of mine, so it was great to have him on. Appreciate the kind words

        • Malc from PO

          That was a fantastic episode. Danny is an amazing raconteur and thinker and Adam and Stu got the best out of him. Thank you, Rob, for connecting great folks like Adam and Robbie on the regular!

      • cha

        Love your contributions to the instant reaction streams, Adam. Always insightful.

        It’s a treat when you are on.

        • Adam Nathan

          Thanks Cha-being on and having so many people watching and commenting has changed how I watch a lot of the games, so as long as I’m adding something to your viewing experience, I’m happy-Rob makes it very easy for the rest of us too

          • Blitzy the Clown

            I’ll second cha here

            Taking nothing away from Rob or Robbie, I really enjoy your commentary Adam. As well as your demeanor. You remind me of someone I’d be best friends with irl.

            • Adam Nathan

              Ha, thanks man-pleased you enjoy the shows. Happy Christmas to you and yours

    • Blitzy the Clown

      Merry Christmas my friend

  31. Roy Batty

    Texans fans have got to be pulling their hair out. They have the Jags and Colts left to play, while the Bears have the Lions and Vikings.

    The #1 could very easily slip right through their fingers.

    • Cambs

      … and the Jaguars have nothing to play for against Houston; no matter the outcome Jacksonville’s playoff fate will be decided head to head against Tennessee in week 18. There’s a path even to 4-12-1 there.

    • 805Hawk

      I’m not sure it will matter. Houston will take a QB and the Bears will be targeting one of the defenders.

  32. Rob Staton

    Merry Christmas to all!

    • ShowMeYourHawk

      Right back at you, Rob!

      Happy Xmas to you and yours!

      • Trevor

        Merry Christmas to you and your family Rob! Thanks again for all the great work you do with this blog and community of Hawks / Draft fans.

    • Blitzy the Clown

      A very merry Christmas to you!

    • Peter

      Merry Christmas to you and yours good sir!!

    • Buff

      Merry Christmas

    • GoHawks5151

      Merry Christmas SDB!

    • Sea Mode

      Merry Christmas!

    • pdway

      Merry Christmas to you and all of the tribe here at SDB!

    • Glor

      Merry Christmas to you and yours! Thank you for everything you do!

  33. Mr Magic

    I cant get over how badly our LBs are. We have so many areas of need on that defensive roster. That being said, we win our final 2 games and there is a strong chance we make the playoffs.

    • Peter

      If the team was coming in hot I’d be all for it.

      I’m generally with Adam on the livestream that winning is the goal and losing begets losing.

      However. Limping in by beating a hapless Jets and a downtrodden Rams while getting punched in the face by the niners and losing to the goofing around Chiefs…I don’t know. Does getting bounced in the wild card build momentum?

  34. Blitzy the Clown

    Imo, irrespective of scheme, Seattle need to add 2 DTs, 2 LBs and 1 S before this defense can be competitive from a personnel standpoint.

    Unfortunately, they also desperately need to add an IOL, a WR and RB. And then there’s the big question mark at QB.

    With so many immediate needs, even a fat draft card like ours just isn’t enough to restock the roster. Free agency will be crucial to make up the difference. Unfortunately, Schneider will be hamstrung by a thin cap margin, and our expectations for him hampered by his past free agency periods.

    I want him to go after Da’Ron Payne hard and solve half of the DL problem before the draft. Payne will probably command a $14-16m apy contract, but give it to the man. Just structure it to fit this year’s cap constraint, which is not a problem in 2024 and beyond.

    Atlernatively, Greg Gaines is a decent option for about half the apy.

    There are others: Rankins (meh), Onyemata ($$), Cox ($$$), Hargrave ($$$$$). I guess Tomlinson would fall somewhere between Rankins and Cox. But none of them offer what Payne does — either at all or at a reasonable cost. Just go get him.

    I’d like them to do the same at LB and get Rashaan Evans or Bobby Okereke. Evans would be my preference and cost between $4-6m apy, but Okereke is decent and about half as much (kinda like what Gaines is to Payne).

    There is a way to add these players in FA and manage the cap. They instantly upgrade the defense in its two weakest positions and sets them up to add the final pieces in the draft.

    I’ve also been thinking that because of so many needs, maybe it would be better to resign Penny rather than spend a high pick on a RB. And I really love some of the prospects in this class. Might be even more so if they take a QB in this draft.

    Merry Christmas SDB!

    • Ukhawk

      Like Payne but wondering if we wait a year ?

      5+ dominant DL players are free agents and a host of quality others – Q Williams, Wilkins, Kinlaw, Simmons, Jones, Lawrence, Bosa, Young, Jordan, Sweat, Burns and the lust goes on

      That said, the Commamders must be constrained in paying too many of their DL

      • Rob Staton

        I doubt the top names on that list ever reach FA

    • Rokas

      Very likely that Commanders gonna tag and trade Payne. 18 mil is the bottom range, let’s not fool ourselves with 14 mil per year. Dude has been balling all year, perfect age, health and draft pedigree.

  35. Rob4q

    Merry Christmas SDB!

  36. Palatypus

    Baker Mayfield versus Russell Wilson.


  37. JimQ

    Tape breakdowns of EDGE-Anderson and DL-Carter, Interesting & well worth a watch, although I don’t know anything about this young “analyst” on YouTube, his breakdowns, supported by all-22 tape seem to be reasonably well done & I tend to agree with many of his assessments, both positive & negative.

    ALSO: “Merry Christmas” (& “Happy New Year”) to all.

  38. Romeo A57

    Let’s go Baker and the Rams!

    • KD

      Looking promising so far

  39. Palatypus

    Bobby Wagner picks off Russell Wilson.

    Yeah, I just don’t know how to feel about that.

    • 206

      Short term memory, it feels good!! 17-0

    • TomLPDX

      I do! Go Bobby!

  40. Palatypus

    “I do see Denver getting back in this game.” – Tony Romo

    • KD

      I can see that happening if LA sputters on offense

      • Palatypus

        They just said they scored 17 points in under four minutes.

        • Roy Batty

          Russ and his turnovers.

          They have no running game and Russ is waaaay off target on a lot of throws. The Rams Dline without Donald has been harassing him all day.

          Very, very ugly game for the Broncos.

  41. TomLPDX

    I thought the Denver D was supposed to be tops in the league…not today. GO RAMS!

  42. Big Mike

    Rams puttin’ it on the Donkeys so far. Love it!

    So why am I starting to get this feeling that Seattle will be playing for a playoff spot in week 18 and the Rams will beat the Hawks and make sure that doesn’t happen?

    • Rob Staton

      Think the Packers win out to snatch it

      • Palatypus

        ^ This.

      • Big Mike

        And that is entirely possible for sure

    • Roy Batty

      Hackett needs to bench Russ. It’s really ugly.

  43. Robbie

    Merry Christmas all!!!!!! Sad I couldn’t do the instant reaction yesterday. Hope today finds you all well and enjoying the holidays. I just had some spiced rum / egg nog shenanigans that was delicious and delightful. Here’s to to a Rams win today!!!

    • Palatypus

      Seafood gumbo and home brewed beer here.

  44. Old but Slow

    Wow, Mayfield is better than Mahomes!


  45. Whit21

    Is it baker Mayfield or shawn mkvay? Cuz baker looking better than geno at this point.. never thought geno was gonna be the guy and now his limitations and defenses scheming making him look like the guy we thought he was.. kinda wish the hawks didnt go on that win streak with the defense looking suspect..

    Because then we might have gotten to see what drew lock would do.. which i thought the offense and his playmaking ability would probably have looked as good as geno was at a certain point this year..

    Tell me im wrong..

    • Big Mike

      It’s McVay though Baker has talent. McVay is a brilliant offensive football coach and he still has his backups playing very hard despite being 4-10. Remember, as Rob mentioned yesterday, his backups almost beat our starters a few weeks back.

      • Palatypus

        Watch them draft Michael Penix Jr. and make it work.

        • Whit21

          Pennix is returning to UW next season

      • Whit21

        The run game nearly beat the hawks.. they made a few throws.. but it was the run scheme that did the seahawks in.. and what is the most repetitive thing anyone will say about the run.. it opens up the play action and throwing downs..

        Fact is geno doesnt handle pressure well.. it slowly inches back.. doesnt step up when he needs to..

        If you could go back in time and the hawks were not in the playoff hunt a month ago.. id still want to see lock for a minute because what does it hurt? If ur not 7-8.. they would have an even better draft pick and it would be easy to let drew lock walk..

        • Big Mike

          It’s fine if you think Geno i just a guy, tho I see him a bit above that. However, when you say he doesn’t handle pressure well, my comeback would be that very few or no QBs do. For years it’s been well known that the best way to disrupt the GOAT, Tom Brady has been pressure, particularly up the middle. Geno was better earlier this year when the o-line was better. It always starts up front in football, both offensively and defensively.

          • Whit21

            Thats how you beat ALL non mobile QBs.. pressure up the middle.. brady steps up and releases fast.. thats not saying anything.. if Geno handled pressure better.. he wouldnt have been a career backup..

        • BK26

          Lock isn’t any kind of future. He was a throw in on the trade. He couldn’t beat a shadow out in Denver. If he is any consideration for what the team does in the future, then whoever is running the shown has failed. Geno is the perfect bridge for a year or two for a young first round pick. People need to quit thinking the team needs to get cute and cheap at quarterback. I want the position set for years and we have the ammo to do it this year.

          Lock with any pressure makes Geno look like Brady in comparison.

          • Whit21

            Youre out of your mind.. look at new coaching and the WRs in denver with russ. Lock outplayed geno for the most part and didnt get to make the start he was supposed to get.. geno surpised everyone at one point and i think it was evident.. with the offense in year 2 and when the olind being fairly healthy and healthy running backs.. you might have gotten the same production from lock that you had with geno… thata why i said you can turn back time and switch.. if you had the same production from lock that you have with geno.. how would you even want to pay geno next year.. people wanted to resign geno a month ago when things were going well.. but its clear he isnt the guy even tho he played well..

            Geno is a mirage.. it would have been better to try the guy you actually traded for.. amd he wasnt just a trade peice.. he was in their plans becausw they didnt even sign geno til after the draft

            Regardless.. theyre not a playoff team.. the geno fever has broke.. defense cant play well when the offense does.. offense doesnt play well when the defense does… all theyre doing is battling at being a .500 team.. thats why i said it would have been better to try Drew Lock…

            • cha

              Please refrain from telling someone they are out of their mind if they express an opinion different than yours.

            • BK26

              Outplayed…in preseason? When it matters? Why would Lock suddenly produce when he never had in his career? The team was trying to win and Geno won the starting job so they saw him as the best option. Of course hindsight, if you start Lock then you would be most likely picking top 7 or 8 but Pete will always try to win. Geno won the starting job so it’s clear to the team he is the guy. And they didn’t trade for Lock, they traded for the picks and Denver didn’t need him. Was Seattle going to turn down an extra player?

              All Lock would have done is make the team have a worse season and a higher native pick. Maybe that hurts moral and stunts the rookies’ growth. No matter what, Geno is a Pro Bowl quarterback that no one is arguing against. He isn’t the answer but he’ll be the bridge. He won’t be expensive and he hasn’t played well enough to be signed long term (with out outs built in the contract). They will maintain this level with him, maybe be a little better, hopefully not any worse. Then a newly drafted quarterback can come in.

              • BK26

                Actually I’ll say this: hopefully I’m not coming off like I’m wrong and you’re right. We’ve all got opinions and we are entitled to them. It’s a weird situation with the team and a lot of what ifs and different paths to take in the future.

                This is the best Seahawks community and I want it to stay that way. Hopefully my comment didn’t come off too harsh.

                • Whit21

                  I would just say to your comment.. as much as you bash lock.. everyone was bashing geno.. he was a 37 td to 34 int qb coming into this season.. my comment was asking… would lock have produced to the same level or maybe less if he got the start?

                  Who knows.. but i think he might have.. but the hawks played bad teams and lost to other bad teams but were still 6-3.. i said earlier what if?

                  I dont think geno is a guy and when they were 6-3… ppl wanted the hawks to resign him.. bit honestly.. when it got deeper in the season, he looks like a backup again.. ill say it again, if you can turn back time.. and go with lock. And still be in a losing season.. why wouldnt you look at the younger more talented guy ..

  46. Palatypus

    This Monday Night Football flashback has been brought to you by Massengill.

    Because nothing says “douche” like Dandy Don Meredith.

    • Roy Batty

      Meredith had one of the funniest moments in sports announcing history.

      The camera focuses in on a hot blond woman in the stands. She then proceeds to picks her nose. The guys in the booth were speechless until Meredith said, “She’s digging’ for nuggets.”

      My dad couldn’t stop laughing.

      • Palatypus

        Wasn’t he always drunk?

        • Roy Batty

          Probably drank a lot while sitting next to a future liberator of heads from torsos.

          They also smoked in the booth.

          A very different era.

  47. Roy Batty

    Broncos D is phoning it in. The tackling is listless, along with the angles and pursuit.

    They do this the next two weeks and the Texans stay as hungry as they’ve played the last two weeks, it might be Chicago #1, Seattle #2.

    This has been a very, very weird year.

    • Roy Batty

      Wanna know how bad it is for the Broncos D?

      Broncos have 46 tackles. Rams have 19.

      That is staggeringly bad football.

      • Glor

        And this is why they might not win another game. No spirit left

        • Roy Batty

          The Chargers will be playing for playoff seeding, and the Chiefs two weeks from now might be playing for the #1 seed.

          Denver is doomed.

          • Palatypus

            You know, when the NFL pitched this game to CBS for Christmas they probably told them it was going to be a Super Bowl preview.

            • God of Thunder

              What is sad for these two teams — but satisfying to me, among others — is that you are absolutely dead right😂

  48. Bmseattle

    And we’d still miss put on Carter in that scenario.😐

  49. Trevor

    This Denver loss was predictable given how the Rams have always owned Russ even when he was playing at an elite level but this type of beat down certainly wasn’t.

    Rob I think when you are considering Hawks off season options that they will be picking at #3 or better and likely have two picks in the top 12 / four in the top 45.

  50. Roy Batty

    Hackett is now officially, publicly done with Russ.

    His interview at the half consisted of blaming Russ for the bad game. Every answer was, “We can’t turn the ball over.” Nothing else. Just that.

    And appropriately so.

    • Palatypus

      And then he threw another interception.

    • Roy Batty

      Did Russ put money on the Rams?

      He just threw an arm punt into the end zone into double coverage for a pick. One of the dumbest passes I’ve seen all year.

      He needs to be benched.

    • Trevor

      Hackett has looked awful as a HC this year but he had no chance with how bad Russ has been this year.

  51. Peppapig

    What’s happened to Russ?

    • God of Thunder

      It’s a Romo derived insight, but that doesn’t make it wrong: Russ is trying too hard. He’s so far behind in this game, and in the season, and he’s trying to make up for stuff with big plays.

      Plus he’s hanging onto the ball too long. We’ve seen that movie before.

    • Robbie

      Got too big for his britches. Not seeing the field well, he will blame Hackett or whomever else.

      • Peter

        Damn dude…pretty grinch like.

        Russ is a ton of annoying things but I have literally never seen him blame anything on anyone.

        • Roy Batty

          So he wasn’t throwing his Oline under the bus with his comment about him being tired of getting hit?

          He was just as culpable as his Oline for many of those sacks.

          Then you throw in all the behind the scenes BS of him wanting to keep a squeaky clean image while using his agent and others to throw shade.

          Nah, Russ is very deserving of all that has transpired. He now knows what it is to be held fully accountable. And, honestly, he’s lucky he’s playing for a first time HC. An established coach would have benched him and not minced words about his performance. Which is what Hackett finally did at half time when being interviewed.

          • Peter


            Two more games…can not wait.

        • Robbie

          Oh probably, maybe I was just referring to getting that he wants MVPs and blamed Pete for “holding” him back. Generic statement on my end.

          • Peter

            You’re not wrong entirely.

            Again my tune has changed i used to love the guy. Dude is a goofus. Team three is the worst. Mark Rodgers is an ass hat.

    • Roy Batty

      He wanted to be The Man in Denver, a town that is totally and completely consumed with all things Broncos. A town that has a sports media group who are not afraid to critique their newly minted golden child.

      Wishing for the glory and immortality playing in such an environment typically does not go the way you want. Too many legends to be compared to. It usually ends in disappointment.

      • Peter

        Thankfully we can keep on winning with Pete in a town that doesn’t ask anything of anyone other than to try our hardest.

  52. Hughz

    Barring a meltdown from the chiefs or chargers, it looks like the hawks will secure a top 3 pick today.

    • Roy Batty

      The Texans play the Colts and Jags, and they have a tie.

      #2 is not out of the question.

    • Big Mike

      Just remember, the Chargers are the Chargers.

  53. Matt

    It’s heartbreaking yet poetic that RW and Pete Carroll could go out in a similar fashion. I actually feel bad for RW. He’s completely done. His lack of QB ability is just shocking. He can’t process the game, at all.

    • Peter

      I’m kind of here for it.

      Russ made his bed.

      And so did Pete.

      So far the only winner is the allen family trust who didn’t have to put that money in escrow.

      In two more weeks it’s gonna be very nice to not hear about russ any more and see of that third overall pick actually matters or if Pete’s smoke and mirrors finally runs out.

      • Big Mike

        Praying for the latter. It’s past time

        • Peter

          Always want to win but fully sick of the reasons why it’s not happening.

          “Just gotta clean some stuff up” the follow up to “always compete.”

          • Big Mike

            “Gotta get better”
            Really Pete? I mean continuing to suck must be an option too, right?

            • Peter

              When he says “we’ll look at the tape,” after the last game…

              I’ll be put at lake union setting up the ramp and the plastic sharks for him to jump over

              • Hoggs41

                Its crazy how many throws he isnt making when you see the all 22.

  54. Gaux Hawks


  55. Palatypus

    “I do see Denver getting back in this game.” – Tony Romo

    DEN 6 LAR 41 11:03 4th QTR

  56. Jabroni-DC

    Looks like my Christmas wish is coming true. Hot damn!

    • Rob Staton

      Well you had Denver picking 7th overall earlier

      • Jabroni-DC

        Good thing I didn’t place a bet

  57. Romeo A57

    I didn’t expect the Rams to run the ball effectively against Denver and put up 51 points today. With the way the Seahawks are playing now, this Week 18 matchup is looking a little scary.

    • Rob Staton

      Well, it’s scary if you care about the outcome 😂

      • Hoggs41

        Agreed. The last two games just really dont matter. If they get in the playoffs, cool. If they dont thats fine to. The Carter/Anderson and Richardson combo is looking a little better now if that is something people are rooting for.

        • Rob Staton

          I don’t want to qualify for the playoffs

          I think the idea it will be a great experience for this team is overblown. Especially if they are just getting hammered by the Niners

          We aren’t good enough for the post season, we are already on a big losing run. Give me the 12th pick instead

          • David


  58. Palatypus

    Which was worse?

    A) Star Wars Christmas Special
    B) A Russell Wilson Christmas

    • Mike714

      At least the Star Wars Christmas Special introduced Boba Fett

    • Romeo A57

      B. Is more of a horror story than a Christmas story.

  59. Romeo A57

    Fair point. I am actually hoping the Seahawks lose the last two games to improve draft stock, Carroll retires and for world peace.

  60. cha

    Seahawks sitting at #3, #12 and #34

    I don’t think fans understand how rare it is to have three high picks and four in the first two rounds. We might not see it again for the next 20 seasons.

    And to add to it the Seahawks have some good pieces on the roster already.

    Opportunities like this do not come along very often.

    Seahawks must take advantage. They are duty-bound to do their best.

    • Gaux Hawks

      …and we have front row seats at SDB ; )

    • Peter

      The potential is exciting for sure.

      #34….I dunno Seattle has picked around there enough for me to see it xan go a lot of ways.

      3 and 12 however. The nearest comp was picking okung, a potential cornerstone style player, along with all time great Earl Thomas.

      They do that. Then they might be talking.

      • Seattle Person

        I think this #34 is a little bit different I hope. In the past they have gotten cute with these picks. I hope they just continue to add really talented dudes that excel at their native position.

        • Peter

          I hope so.

          It’s a pretty dreary list. Brooks, collier, McDowell, penny, ifedi.

          They got mafe and walker with high ish seconds so hopefully they are turning it around.

    • Jabroni-DC

      Last time we had the #3 pick we selected Shawn ‘toast’ Springs.

      • Peter

        As Rob always says it’s about balance.

        As unpleasant as it is you can get Shawn springs in a draft with walter jones.

        If 3 sucks but 12 or so is great I’m good.

        It’s when three sucks, 12 is injured, and 34 just needs another year when things go south.

      • Ryan Purcell

        Shawn Springs. 13 year pro. All rookie team. All pro. But not good enough I guess for some folks. Crimmeny.

        • TJ

          Agreed. He wasn’t a bad player by any stretch. He was a no-brainer pick when they chose him but is remembered negatively because he didn’t come close to his potential or to people’s lofty expectations. He was projected to be an all-pro caliber CB.

    • Palatypus

      In 2001 we took Koren Robinson 9th overall and Steve Hutchinson 17th.

      In 2000 we took Shaun Alexander 19th overall and Chris McIntosh 22nd.

      In 1997 we took Shawn Springs 3rd overall and Walter Jones 6th.

      In 1984 and 1987 we had the addition of supplemental 1st round picks that cost us a pick the next year. In 1984 that was Gordon Hudson (S) and Terry Taylor. In 1987 it was Brian Bosworth (S) and Tony Woods.

  61. Trevor

    I know everyone says Russ has to be the Denver QB next year because of the contract and $ but I truly think the Waltons who are new ownership will bite the bullet and move on from Russ / Hacket / Patton and start a complete rebuild with a new GM, coach and QB.

    Why would they continue on with this fiasco and delay the inevitable. The $150 mil guarenteed $ is nothing to them.

    • Peter

      Trevor what’s the move for a rebuild? There’s no draft stock. And all this is a sunk cost.

      I know there would be someone to take on the challenge.

      Russ needs to retire. He’s playing like someone with a brain injury.

      As much as Hackett is done with wilson. Guess what he sucks. And has enjoyed a good deal of cover with Wilson’s mishaps.

      I don’t know. Who cares. In two weeks it’ll be full on draft mode. Here’s hoping that three overall pick is a game changer.

    • Rob Staton

      Because they can’t just forfeit the entire 2023 season. They need to actually have a roster. It’s a $107m dead cap hit

      • Trevor

        Rob the dead money is $39 million with post June designation. If the Broncos new ownership wants to move on and start fresh that is more than doable. It also could put them in line to be bad next year and draft the QB if the future like Caleb Williams in 2024.

        • Peter

          It would certainly be interesting.

          Is Caleb Williams going to be good in the pro game?

          Hurts is good for now because he’s a dynamic dual threat. Mayfield I mean good for him for salvaging his career, sort of. Murray? I guess when he’s legitimately good someone can let me know.

        • cha

          The post-June doesn’t make the dead cap go away, it just splits it up. You still need to pay the butcher’s bill.

          They’d have a $68 million dead cap on the 2024 team.

        • Rob Staton

          And $68m the following year!

          And that $38m dead hit would put them $22m over the cap for 2023.

          Good luck selling to your next Head Coach a disaster zone roster and no money to field a club, no picks and no QB.

          They have to try and make this work.

          Their best selling point is fix this, not come and lose a bunch of games and ruin your reputation

    • Palatypus

      I was just watching a segment on the news about how people are discovering how businesses are changing their return policies this year on the day after Christmas.

      I think the Russell Wilson/Nathaniel Hackett joke writes itself here.

  62. Rob Staton

    New mock draft coming later today

    • SpennyDunks

      Was just going to ask when the next one id.

      Ready to move my caring from the season to the draft. Especially with two juicy top 15 picks.

    • Peter

      Very excited.

      Just read a draft w/o updated draft order and the site had us taking CJ Stroud number three.

      I’d really prefer someone else take the chance on getting the first Ohio state qb this century, and almost ever, that turns out good in the pros.

      This was Walter Football.

      At least Walter himself had us taking Jalen Carter and then Tyree Wilson. Not my favorite for pick 12-14 but at least the thought process acknowledges a major weakness.

    • David Ashton

      Nothing better on a sleepy boxing day. Look forward to it

    • Palatypus

      I tried to do one of these last night on PFN and became really puzzled by what the Bears might do.


      • ShowMeYourHawk

        No way the Bears go QB. Fields is uneven but the superstar potential is there. If they keep the pick above ours, they’re taking Carter. They could decide to trade down from #2 to one of the other QB hungry teams in the top 5 and decide to take the first WR off the board but that seems unlikely.

  63. cha

    Quandre Diggs Saturday after the game said there were many simple things they can fix to get better.

    You keep using that word. I don’t think it means what you think it means.

    • bmseattle

      by that word, do you mean “pro bowl”?

      • cha


        It’s not simple if you’re at week 15 and you still can’t do the most basic things.

        • Bmseattle

          Yeah, i was just joking about the value (or lack thereof, with Diggs), of being named to the pro bowl.

    • 805Hawk

      LOL! Princess Bride quotes never get old.

  64. Denver Hawker

    Hackett fired according to Pelissero

    • Hoggs41

      Dont like it, teams usually play good immediately after a firing.

      • Rob Staton

        They play the Chiefs and Chargers

        Not worried

    • Group Captain Mandrake

      Breaking news on espn. Hopefully the broncos truly pack it in for the year.

  65. cha

    Pete Carroll Show w Brock & Salk

    [q] Saturday – what happened? “Didn’t get started on offense. Number of third and tens we could convert. Dismal start. Defense held up for us. Second half started running, looked as good as we have in the last month. This was a day we coulda got em, coulda beat these guys. Hung on the football had a shot. Feels like we’re not complementing our play well enough. Play on both sides. Good team, lost a chance to get one on the road.”

    [q] Why no complementary football? “Trouble running FB in first half. Got nothing in first half. Naked bootleg and got nothing, now we’re third and 10. Raggedy getting plays run. Used timeouts. Little bit on sidelines, little bit on field. Enough to keep score in their favor.”

    [q] KC environment? “Good Q. Weather lots of hype. Tried to play it down. The weather was nothing, crowd was just normal, didn’t factor in. Our guys handled it. One of our accomplishments, have to go bad weather, not a problem. Accomplishment in that sense.”

    [q] Key to defensive game plan? “KC quick with FB. Ball control early downs, knows explosions about to happen. Our guys knew they had to play every play. Use perimeter stuff well. They’re not a great running team. Just complement it. We had to hold it together. Third down wins terrific for us. Felt like we had some control of the game.”

    [q] Defensive front filled voids of Woods, Mone, etc? “Poona held up well, Shelby nice job against guys. In general in right spots, fit well. Running game didn’t fool us. One screen got by us. Plays get away from you sometimes. Fill ins did well.”

    [q] Geno play? “Solid but hard situations. Third downs not clean. Had to make our move with running game or early down passing. Geno did well. Third down not well. Not quite as overpowering as we need to be against a team like that.”

    [q] What like without Tyler? “Third down hard. Go to guy and great player. Makes things happen. Exact right distance you need, hard to replace. Weren’t able to overcome his absence.”

    [q] Run game when it works, why? “Not one scheme or one way. Variety of things in game plan. Second half great adjustments. Spacing wasn’t clean. Then it took off. We challenged them at halftime. Didn’t happen in opening drive but then it did open up. Sometimes just that urgency to step to right place. Blocking schemes beautiful and Ken took advantage.”

    [q] Walker keep navigating patience and decisiveness? “Telling you just how he was coached, I got right in his mug and told him. Go straight forward. So much talent there. Hit line first then decide. Trust spacing will show. You saw he got after it. Hit plays, did exactly and took adv of guys up front.”

    [q] Geno turnovers, concerned? “No I think he’s battling. Need to play around him well. Not making bad throws. INT, hoping middle high safety couldn’t get at ball. Fudged, they outplayed us on that play. Didn’t finish route – not sure if guy got grabbed there – one play in the game. Really hard position to play. Third down numbers top 10 for season, didn’t get done yesterday. Wanted third and medium at worst. Weren’t able to control early down play. Geno would have been a lot better if we did.”

    [q] Brock Purdy, Baker Mayfield guys come in, supporting cast for QB important? “Exactly on it. I feel like consistent winning is balance and commitment to run and pass. I think that’s what you’re seeing. Purdy terrific FB team runs and #1 defense in NFL, can you run with that? Yeah. Panthers good ex too. Running like crazy. Committed to it too. Entire group factors into QB play. All years here that’s been design. Trying to capture it again. 5000 yards are outliers. Fans want it, I get it. Not what we’re watching, and you’re seeing great illustration of it. Baker two days great game. That’s sean putting that together. Scheme, coaching fitting together.”

    [q] Nathaniel Hackett fired? “Tough situation, tough all year.”

    [q] Pro Bowlers, Diggs, Myers, Woolen, Smith – Woolen? “Fun to watch. Exciting, underdog type thing. Part so fun is tremendous potential for future. Chance to be fantastic player. A lot to do this time forward. Work habits, studying the game forward. Spectacular to watch.”

    [q] Diggs Pro Bowl, honest, blunt after games, etc? “Great FB player. Throwback in a sense. Tough demands of himself. Guys love him. Great interview. Crying on the turf last year. Bounce back remarkable statement.”

    [q] Geno Pro Bowl, great story, plays Jets this week, revenge? “I don’t know any more than I do, I was there for a while too, they sent me packing. LOL. Factor to be dealt with. We’ll commiserate and go have fun playing.”

    [q] Injury updates? “Haven’t seen Lockett yet. Don’t know. Al’s better has a chance left him here to rehab. Same with Neal. Abe Lucas imaging done. Patellar thing earlier in the year bothered him, popped up again. Joey Blount got banged. Imaging too. Not surgical oriented right now. Dissly too. Contusion on knee.”

    [q] Sense of optimism forward? “Clear thought on team. Next opp to kick butt. People say why thinking like that? Well we are. Two opps with games at home. Chance to do something to make this storyline something positive we can feel good about.”

    [q] How mindest? Lost five of six? “Totally attitude and mentality. How you decide to be. Choose this way or that way. We’re gonna make something happen. Everyone feels like that. Not the youth necessarily, makeup of leadership. Great week here, and play for everything next weekend. Rams came alive. Jets fighting for everything too.”

    • Gross MaToast

      Was this from today or any other loss since 2017?

      Pete’s Post-Loss Press Conference Formula:

      A. Describe an unprepared, poorly-coached team.
      B. Goals, describe what we want to be, but haven’t been for a long, long time.
      C. Fired up, can’t wait to go play and kick butt. Unclear on how the kicking of butt will unfold, other than by players choosing to do so.

      This should come in handy for the next couple of weeks.

      • Gross MaToast

        Also, describe injuries in medical terms not heard since the Battle of Antietam.

  66. GoHawks5151

    I remember feeling uneasy as Seattle started getting it going late and eventually scored. They Defense also started finding some stops. These are the moments Pete will cling to falsely or otherwise. It’s nice to see them keep fighting but it keeps Pete from confronting the real issues. Staring wistfully at SF and the brand of ball they are playing, thinking we are close doesn’t help

    • Matt


      And while the defense played pretty well; I can’t help but wonder what those two atrocious drops by #84 would’ve done to change the game. Chiefs were in striking distance both times – so not only took potential points off the board, but also just destroys any money or rhythm the offense was getting in.

  67. cha

    Program note to get you unnecessarily hyped for next weekend:

    Houston plays Jacksonville.

    The Texans are 15-2 against the Jags in their last 17, and are riding a winning streak of 9 consecutive games against the Jags.

    Chicago goes to Detroit.

    The Bears have won 4 in a row in Detroit.

    • cha

      The post clipped the last note for some reason.

      Denver has not beaten Kansas City in their last 14 tries.

  68. Zack

    Pete is not moving on. A guy with his motor never retires. He’s grooming one of the defensive coaches, likely Desai, to take over as HC as Pete moves to full time head of Football Ops at some point in the future.

    The moves the team has made in coaching don’t make any sense in a retirement scenario, as well as Desai choosing to come to Seattle, without some prior agreement on succession.

    The talk of Pete retiring, although interesting for if/then conversation, is pointless if we are talking reality.

    Interesting that the Saints and Rams are both in shambles after leveraging everything for the win now window. Will be a real indicator of the future of team building ethos of the league if McVay moves on after this year, leaving total wreckage in his wake, like Payton did when that team fell apart under the same team build theory.

    • Peter

      Pete can want whomever he wants to be the next coach.

      When the team is sold that decision won’t be his.

    • cha

      i don’t agree with a single thing you wrote in this post.

      • zack

        How so? Curious to know.

        • cha

          I think the talk of Pete retiring is real. I think Glazer is one of the most trustworthy in the business, so I believe when he reported it in 2017.

          I also think Pete leaving the Seahawks of his own accord is a possibility. I think that interview he gave about coaching USC was a big ‘come get me, I’m available’ moment.

          As for this:

          Interesting that the Saints and Rams are both in shambles after leveraging everything for the win now window. Will be a real indicator of the future of team building ethos

          The Saints really started screwing with the salary cap in 2017. Yearly win totals since then: 11, 13, 13, 12, and 9. They were a dumb no-call from going to the SB and won playoff games in several other years.

          There isn’t a team in the league that wouldn’t make that deal in exchange for some cap trouble.

          The Rams just won a Super Bowl. Any team that loses their quarterback, half their OL, their all-world WR and all-universe DT the year after a championship is going to have problems.

          The bills are going to come due for them, but a Super Bowl in their own stadium will long outlive some cap work.

          Maybe the best team in the NFL right now (Philly) is playing with $68m in dead cap this year. And they will have at least $38m in dead cap next year.

          I won’t make the argument that every team should be racking up massive debt as the only way to win a championship. But it is a viable strategy. And one that has proved fruitful in the recent past, and is getting big results in 2022. Hard to see it changing anytime soon.

    • BK26

      Whew glad we know he’s staying for sure. That’s a load off of my plate. No more speculation needed!

    • Rob Staton

      I’m so bored of people telling us what’s definitely happening or not happening.

      You haven’t got a clue.

      Just like all those people who insisted Wilson wasn’t going anywhere.

      • Zack

        Rob, I do hope the paradigm here includes the fact that no one here can see the future. I can pepper my comments with “I thinks”, “IMO’s”, etc, but I think we all can default to a little more brevity than that. Given the amount of airtime the Carroll to retirement narrative is getting on twitter, sports blogs and sports radio, it sure feels like people are talking themselves into Carroll somehow throwing in the towel right now and deciding to walk away. Let’s go percentages if we are hypothesizing. If you were in a betting pool, what are the odds to you now that Carroll walks?

        • Rob Staton

          Zack, hardly anyone is talking about it.

          A few tweets and a couple of videos I’ve done? That’s it.

          People in the NFL are talking about it. That’s a fact but it doesn’t mean it’s going to happen. Neither should it be outright dismissed as you did there.

          Let’s leave it at that and move on. But in future, let’s also avoid telling people what definitely is or isn’t happening. Because we all remember how many people did that over the Wilson trade stuff.

          • Zack

            Thanks for the time Rob.

            You’re definitely not the only one talking about it at all. I’m not going to link other bloggers, and tweeters and such – from what I gather that’s not cool to do. Although, they may be having the conversation b/c you are.

            • Rob Staton

              Didn’t say I was the only one talking about it. There are others tweeting about it and I’m sure a few other places have touched on it.

              Let’s be real though, 99% of the Seahawksphere is either not talking about it or blowing it off like you did

              Let’s just move on from telling people what’s definitely not happening and crack on with discussing topics when necessary

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