Instant reaction: Seahawks tie, go to 4-1-1

Well, have you ever seen anything like that?

On the one hand it’s a good result for Seattle because:

a.) Arizona had the ball at the one yard line and missed a chip shot field goal.

b.) David Johnson probably scored a touchdown just before it. The ball looked like it crossed the plane on replay but Bruce Arians had his offense rush to the line before a replay official could call in to take a look at it.

On the other hand, Steven/Stephen Hauschka had a chance to steal a win and take a commanding lead in the NFC West with his own chip shot and did his best impression of Blair Walsh.

And thus, the game gets the scoreline it deserves. 6-6. A tie.

Isn’t this a weird feeling? Denied the euphoria of the game-winning kick, it’s instead replaced with disappointment, relief and maybe a tiny pinch of happiness.

After all, Seattle is still in control of the NFC West and maybe the NFC. Minnesota (5-1) didn’t look quite as formidable in their loss to Philly, the Falcons have slumped to 4-3 and Dallas play in a NFC East that generally eats itself alive.

I’m not quite sure why Seattle didn’t run the clock down to about two seconds, call a time-out and kick as overtime expired. Hauschka almost appeared a little rushed in the end and the miss gave Arizona a chance to throw two more passes (including a hail mary).

Onto the defense. What a performance.

On a night where the offense had nine straight punts to start and needed a blocked punt to help end the run — this was an all-time great performance from an all-time great defense.

Cliff Avril’s sacks. Deshawn Shead’s coverage. The impact of the linebackers. Earl Thomas. They were just the highlights — truly this was a cumulative performance to banish the memory of last weeks nightmare third quarter against Atlanta.

To put in this level of performance with almost no rest for the best part of four hours isn’t just admirable — it’s miraculous. And for that reason they deserved to avoid being on the losing team.

The offense on the other hand was uglier than a bears backside until overtime.

Even a couple of decent drives would’ve been enough — but they had no answer in a performance reminiscent of the 2013 Rams game. The O-line couldn’t handle two excellent edge rushers (Quinn/Long — Golden/Jones) and a dominating interior presence (Donald — Campbell). For Paul McQuistan and Michael Bowie, see Bradley Sowell and Garry Gilliam.

Sadly there was no Golden Tate taunting his way to a big game-winning touchdown.

The good news is an offensive clunker like this hasn’t usually lingered into multiple weeks. After that Rams game in 2013 Seattle scored 27, 33, 41 and 34 in the following four weeks.

The offensive line will get a lot of focus, in particular the two tackle slots. Bradley Sowell left the game with a MCL injury and ended the night in tears. Sowell has thrown himself into being a Seahawk and it was a moment of raw emotion from a guy that hasn’t done too badly overall — he just ran into a buzzsaw tonight.

There will be clamour in Seattle all week for the Seahawks to trade for Joe Thomas before the deadline. PFT reported earlier that he could be available for a second round pick.

The Thomas topic probably warrants a post of its own but really it comes down to this:

— How prepared are you to spend a second rounder on a soon-to-be 32-year-old ahead of what looks like an absolutely loaded draft?

–As good as Thomas is, can he pick up the offense quickly mid-season? This offense isn’t like anything they’ve run in Cleveland, ever.

— As he nears the twilight of his career, how many years can he play in Seattle’s ultra-physical offense that has led to injuries aplenty on the O-line?

— How much faith do they have in George Fant? He struggled a bit today but they’ve talked very positively about his development so far.

— They will have cap room in 2017 but there’s hardly any remaining in 2016. This wouldn’t just take a lot of manoeuvring it might prevent you from rewarding the likes of Michael Bennett or Kam Chancellor next year.

I think the discussion — and boy is it coming, on social media and talk radio — might be a bit of a red herring. They would have to be so creative with the cap space and could risk more dysfunction with their existing stars who are looking to get a pay rise next year. Do they want that?

For what it’s worth, the 49ers are reportedly also willing to deal Joe Staley. Unfortunately his salary is similar to Thomas’ in 2016 and the 49ers want a first rounder. He is also 32.


  1. Volume12

    Craziest game ever.

    Could not agree more about our defense. They deserved the win. More than Arizona who played great. They weren’t left on the field, hung out to dry.

    ET, BWagz, Cliff, Shead, Clark, KJ. Incredible performances.

    Elliott and Thorpe look like the real deal at the gunner positions. Studs.

    God. The OT’s are so bad. It was tough to watch Sowell cry under that towel. Like him or not.

    Seattle still up 2 games and Arizona ends the year with 5 outta 6 on the road. Ouch!

    Praying Rawls returns to form, because other than OT, we need a RB so damn bad. Take pressure off a hurt RW. Who looked more banged up tonight than he has all season.

    Jimmy Graham has become a blocker. What a move. Dude is a monster with a chip on his shoulder now.

  2. Elliottatk

    I don’t even know what to feel right now…

    • LordSnow

      Feel relieved. Because there’s a big difference between two games ahead of your chief rival vs 1/2 game ahead and them finishing on the road.

  3. Volume12

    Good point about Thomas affecting Bennett and Kam. If that’s the case, no thanks.

    Look, I never wanted to trade for Thomas. Would a been ideal to let Fant get a run and then make a decision, but what are ya gonna do?

    • cha

      Well I can’t speak for anyone else but my gut reaction is to cry over spilled milk.

      Gilliam has been a true disappointment this year. From going to presumptive LT starter Week one, to losing the LT job to a street free agent, to needing to be in a dogfight to keep his starting RT job, to being very inconsistent with his play.

      How much of the issues would be resolved if he’d developed to at least just an average LT?

    • C-Dog

      I think go with Fant, and see what we got. I’ve heard that the coaches felt he was further along coming out of camp than Gilliam when he was a rookie. He’s been active ahead of Odhiambo. Trading a second round pick for an expensive 32 vet reeks of a panic move.

  4. Kenny Sloth

    What do you think of adding Matt Malik if the price is right?

    Would a franchise tag be too steep for one of Hauschka, Bennett, or Kam

    • Volume12

      Who’s Matt Malik bro bro? ? Kidding. Just giving ya a hard time.

      • Kenny Sloth

        Kalil* haha i recently cracked my phone screen so I’ve missed lots of typos

  5. Michael (CLT)

    Win now. I am a terrible GM.


    Frank Clark played lights out and people are overlooking what Wilson did on back to back drives behind that terrible line performance.

    Good write up Rob.

  7. Volume12

    I will say this. You wanna beat this Seattle team? Better play 60 minutes of hard fought, good football. Not 45, not 50 or 57, 60.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Not 72 either it seems

  8. peter

    Chubb, fournette, someone. cmike sr is to me an explosive turbin. Which while not a bad thing is definitely not going to win you many games.

    Also nothing against Sowell…but let the building begin. Lets see how good cable really is. I think fant, glo, Britt, ifedi can be f-Ing great. Still on the fence about Gilliam, but all in all stoked to see the line develop.

    • LordSnow

      The lateral cutting from cmike is his best asset and is nothing like turbin.

      • peter

        Okay but the falling down and easy tackling are too similar by far. Look Cmike is good, cmike isn’t an identity piece.

        • LordSnow

          I’m not saying he’s what I want…but he does run hard. He’s just more finesse than power

  9. POB

    I think they kick early in case there’s a bad snap they can re-try on the next play. Leaving time on the clock isn’t really an issue b/c you assume there’s a 98% likelihood Hauschka makes the kick and the game ends.

    • STTBM

      Do you get the ball back if you try a FG and fail? I dont think so. I think if you set up for a FG, unless you catch your own block and get upfield for a first down, its a turnover on downs…

      • Group captain mandrake

        If you don’t actually kick the ball (i.e., run it or just cover it up on a bad snap) you keep the ball. If you kick it you do not.

        • Nolan

          Your post made me think the gangster move would have been to fake that field goal. If the plays not there just tell John Ryan to take a knee

  10. Tien

    It was so disappointing to see Hauschka shank that ball but we never should have had a chance to steal that game in the first place. The Cardinals had so many chances to put us away but our incredible Defense & Special Teams made plays all night to keep us in the game. Other than getting turnovers, our defense played as well as it could have, given all the three & outs by the offense that left our D out there. Up to this game, I was really optimistic about the progress of our OL this year but even before Sowell got hurt, both he & Gilliam were either getting holding penalties or were just abused by Jones & Golden. And now, with Fant having to fill in for Gilliam, I don’t know how our offense will be able to function in the next few weeks. One game at a time I guess…

  11. Adog

    I thought they rushed Haushka at the end. It’s always a wierd feeling to watch the Hawks play there as a fan…since the super bowl loss is on a non-stop loop from Davis and Collinsworth. Fant started out slow, but seemed to steady the offense once he got his footing. To me the biggest mistake on offense was complete disregard of developing a run game. Any offensive line and I mean any will struggle against a defense that has no concern for a run game. This team is built to run ball…not throw it 40 plus times.

    • Volume12

      C-Mike ain’t the guy. Tonight proved it. Nice no.2 and COP back. Never picks up his knees when he runs.

      • Darth 12er

        Vol, totally agree. He does not punish or ware anybody down. He is not a Seahawk back. Plus, why does it always seem like he’s diving forward when he runs?? How about we mortgage the next 2 drafts for Fournette. Mr. Kenneth Arthur might not like it, but Rob is right. The more I watch this guy, the more I want him to be a Hawk…at any cost!

      • EranUngar

        C-mike is a one trick pony – super burst.

        He gets the ball and goes light speed towards the designed gap. If it’s there he gets through and his only yards after contact come from speed. If the gap is not there the play is dead. He never sees alternatives and at his speed i’m not sure he could exploit them even if he did see them.

        Between this OL that can not be counted on to create the designed gap constantly and C-Mike’s capabilities, we do not have a reliable run game and PC/TC/Bevell know it. Just go back and see the first two three and out drives of the game – not a single run play in them. This is the game plan we came with and it speaks volumes.

        After having Okung at LT for years we came up with a theory that we actually need a strong inside OL and that tackles are not that crucial. We are learning now how sub par tackles can kill an offense. With the time RW has in the pocket we can’t get explosive plays developing because the ball has to out before the receivers can get downfield.

        For years this offense was based on a smash mouth running game with a RB that carries defenders on his back for extra yards and explosives plays downfield. We now have neither of those (when facing a top rushing DL).

        And yet, we are 4-1-1.

        Rob mentioned some of the 2013 games – RAMS, TB, Titans even the Houston game. Being able to win (or not lose) ugly over a long up and down season is what separates the 12 wins teams from the 8 wins teams. Next week the offense will do just fine against NO. The whole defense should have Wednesday off.

        And, it’s just a thought but…did we resign the wrong CB before the season???

        • Aaron

          Part of the sub par OT theory was based on a mobile Wilson. You know, that one guy who rushes for 500-800 yards per season. He needs that escape ability when the edges of the pocket break.

          • EranUngar

            Well, some might say that when you base a theory like that on a mobile QB that “needs that escape ability when the edges of the pocket break”, you need to factor in the risk involved that someday someone will step on his heel or horse collar him down while rolling on his knee.

            When you live by the sword you die by the sword and all that…

            My view is that NFL defenses will zero in on your weakest link and hammer it till it breaks down. I do not know which option is better (interior OL or tackles) but i do know that you should should never feel its ok to have weak links, inside or out.

            • george

              Also age and injuries had to be factored. age catches up with speed and elusiveness quickly.

        • Rob Staton

          Lane had a rough day but he’ll come good.

          • EranUngar

            I’m sure he will. It’s more about how solid Shead plays. He is quietly becoming that solid opposite to Sherman CB we always wanted.

            • Tien

              You made some good points up there Eran. I’m not sure the FO decided that having good tackles is not crucial. My guess is that given that our OL pretty much needed rebuilding, the FO probably figured that they’d have a better chance of improving the interior quickly than at the tackle spot. We weren’t going to pick high enough to get the blue chip tackles and unless we were willing to give up high draft picks for good but aging LTs We didn’t have many options in the offseason, especially after Okung decided to leave, so they did the best they could. I agree that next week against NO, even our terrible OL shouldn’t have that much trouble functioning. We’ll just have to rely on our D & Special Teams to keep us in games so that our offense can get off a few decent drives to win games.

  12. Volume12

    This says everything about Haushcka.

    Arian’s: In his wanna be Tony Sparano, LL Cool J wearing a*” Kangol hat voice: Your paid to make those kicks.

    Carroll: We love him. That’s our guy.

    Don’t make a mistake or Bruce might cut ya. Jeezuz. Kickers miss kicks. It happens. Part of the game.

    • LordSnow

      PC does have a decency about him that transcends the intensity of bad moments

    • lil'stink

      Imagine how Jim Mora would have handled it.

      • LordSnow

        What was with the “L” he kept flashing at his post game comments? Really childish.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      This is not the first or second kick the Cardinals kicker has missed. Will he get cut, probably not… but he is on notice now.. any more flub ups… burnt toast.

    • Rob Staton

      It was a tremendous reminder that Pete Carroll just gets it.

      The day PC arrived in Seattle was a blessing people hugely take for granted.

      • STTBM

        Amen. He’s no Bellicheat, but he’s the best Coach we’ve ever had. I hope he coaches us till he’s 90…

  13. rowdy

    Any have a link to Bruce arians comments after the game

  14. lil'stink

    I really thought Baldwin was going to find a way to get into the endzone on that last catch. The epitome of the bend but don’t break defense. 3 great, amazing special teams plays only to be undermined by a fourth one at the end. Pete should let the defense stay at they hotel tonight and hang out at the pool tomorrow before coming home.

    As someone who isn’t particularly fond of Bruce Arians, I hope he comes under widespread scrutiny for how he handled the end of the game.

    With Sowell’s apparent injury coming just hours after the Joe Thomas trade demand rumors, well, hmmm. Still not sure I love the idea with JT’s contract, especially if it hampers our ability to extend guys like Graham and Bennett. Not sure I want to start down that slippery slope that leads to a bad cap situation like the Saints have. But Gilliam might be the biggest disappointment on the entire team so far this year, and our other tackle left the game on a cart. But if you can work it out to somehow limit your financial exposure the idea of parting with a second round pick for a guy like Joe Thomas seems like a no brainer (although the price probably just went up a bit for Seattle as far as Cleveland’s GM is concerned).

    • CD

      Arians also got emotional in the 1st half and wasted a TO on the blocked field goal, just to prove a point that he was pissed. With that TO they are able to kick a field goal at the end of the 1st half. Also got emotional and went for it on 4th down and didn’t make it. Mistakes all over the place for him. He is lucky they didn’t lose, if so I bet the players would be whispering how he blew the game.

      He is only around due to their record(s)/decent roster, I’m guessing when they have a rough year or two (like in a year or two without Fitz, Palmer, and 2nd round pick this year), he will be out and spend the rest of his days as an assistant.

      They had a lot to prove today after being blown out the last 2 years at home, they wanted to start fast and all they came up with was 6 points at home. I’ll take it but boy if Hauschka makes it, the Cards would have been crushed, lots of finger pointing, probably done.

    • Rob Staton

      “I really thought Baldwin was going to find a way to get into the endzone on that last catch.”

      Same — for a split second it looked like he was going in.

  15. CharlieTheUnicorn

    — How prepared are you to spend a second rounder on a soon-to-be 32-year-old ahead of what looks like an absolutely loaded draft?

    As we see every year in the NFL. You have to strike while the iron is hot…. the team is a top 5 team, with legitimate SB aspirations…. you can’t waste a season or two waiting for the “next guy” to make his way on the roster. Seattle can absolutely win the NFC and has a very good chance to win a SB. For a “paultry” 2nd round (unproven) pick… I think it is a fair price to pay for a LT that would be a massive upgrade at LT… not to mention fill a possible season long need with the MCL injury to Sowell.

    • DC

      You also have to fit $9M+ into your salary cap.

    • Ukhawk

      Think about it this way….Chubb & a great FA signing or Thomas….

      • Trevor

        How many great OL signings have we made? I take Thomas all day long in that scenario.

    • Nathan

      His base salary is 8.3 million, and he’s earned a chunk of it, it would be 4-5 mil on the cap for this year.

    • Trevor

      I agree completely Charlie! I have been a huge proponent of a trade for Thomas since last year.

      We have a historically great defense in its prime and have a legit 2-3 year window for Super Bowls. The OL cost us one last year against Carolina and will this year as well as if we play a team like Min, Ariz, Phil in the playoffs out OL will not have a chance with Gilliam and Fant at OT. It will be exactly like we saw last year with Den vs Car in the SB.

      I am a huge draft addict but I want SBs more and if we had Thomas last year and this year and next year our odds go up dramatically.

      Why waste an all time great defense with an OL that just cannot compete. It is amplifies this year as Russel is obviously limited mobility wise.

    • Rob Staton

      It’s a line of thought for sure Charlie. I will note though — that Seattle has a chance every year because of a paltry third round pick they spent on a certain RW. And good drafting will enable Seattle to keep this core group together longer. They have to make savings somewhere.

      • sdcoug

        A 2nd is an easy price to pay for a HOF left tackle, at least for me. It no doubt allows a few more throws to get off over the course of the year, and likely helps a run game trying to find its footing. As said, we have a real chance and Thomas only helps, this year and next. With a late 1st still in hand, we likely trade back to pick up extra picks anyway (helping mitigate the lost 2nd).

        • Rob Staton

          Possibly so — but those R2-3 picks can be like gold dust too. Bobby Wagner was a 2, Russell Wilson a 3.

          • sdcoug

            Right, but Joe Thomas in the 2nd, even for two years (or possibly even a short extension thereafter) is also a good get at that spot

  16. cha

    I really want to see the All-22’s from this game. So many times in the first half RW pumped and changed his mind, then had to scramble a little, then either got sacked or had to throw it away. What did he see that caused him to change his mind so much? The second half & OT he was much more decisive and that worked better for the offense vs this defense.

    • SeventirsHawksFan

      This also continually hung his o line out to dry and led to holding calls. I thought RW played an atrocious game. He needed to know he only had 1.5 seconds and the pump fake and take extra steps was killing drive after drive. Throw the damn ball away. So many of the holding calls were on RW not being situationally aware of what his line could handle.

      • Tien

        There were definitely times when Russ held the ball too long but I also plenty of plays when as soon as the ball was snapped, our tackles were either being faked out or just thrown aside and Russ had to scramble for his life.

  17. Greg Haugsven

    Not sure if id trade for Thomas, on one hand you do have to think about this season as well not just the future. His MRI could tell us more. Not sure what your talking about loaded draft, the Left Tackle situation in the draft isn’t good. Your definition ately right about the cap space, it would be tight but maybe doable since we only have to pay half his salray. I wouldn’t be worried about him pick g up the offense, he’s an all-pro. I would do it for a Seco d but not a first.

    • Greg Haugsven

      Sorry about the hooked on phonics, I’m typing this on my phone

    • Rob Staton

      It’s looking like a poor draft at LT Greg but it is also looking like a fantastic draft at several other positions.

  18. Rad man

    Wilson’s immobility has really exposed the run blocking. This team cannot run the ball well without the read option threat or a borderline HOF RB. This is a real problem. And they look acceptable pass blocking against a team with no speed on the line, but again get exposed vs anything decently good on the edge.

  19. DC

    What drove me nuts about this game were all the first half penalties called against us. Got me livid. I’ll take a tie after all of that.
    No one should be shocked anymore that when we play a team with a great D line our offense gets stuffed, especially with RW gimpy. Luckily we play New Orleans next to help us forget.

    • AlaskaHawk

      A few of the holding calls were borderline in my opinion. They weren’t really impeding the rusher at all. I guess it was called on both teams?

      A few penalties were boneheaded: moving the pile, hands to the face after a play was over, etc.

  20. Steele

    This team was fortunate to slink out with a tie. They should have lost.

    The offense is horrendous. The o-line, a sieve. The Cards front line will be an ongoing problem. They will need a stud RB in the offseason, because CMike sure isn’t it. A whopping four first downs in three quarters? You don’t win with that. Started to wake up in OT, only when the Cards D got tired.

    “Oh but the defense was great”? No, actually. The D gave up significant yardage to the Cards. David Johnson was going all night, receivers were open all night, dink-dunk underneath routes wide open. The pass rush did NOT get to Palmer nearly enough. He had plenty of time. Ridiculous that they spent so much time in Seattle territory and didn’t come away with a lot of points. This was as much the Cards’ problem as much as the Hawks making plays in the red zone. The bottom line is, why were the Cards allowed to get that deep? Better teams would have scored multiple TDs, bye bye.

    Bending and not breaking, and bending and being lucky, is not the same as being great. Courageous performance by the D, barely holding the line because the O was so inept. THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE.

    Wagner’s kick blocking saved the night.

    If Hausch had nailed the winning chip shot, it would have been one more miraculous and undeserved W. As is it, they were still fortunate.

    Time to really get serious. Sowell will not do. Didn’t think so in the offseason, and it’s pretty obvious to everyone now. No excuses that he was up against a buzzsaw. This line MUST be able to keep out ALL buzzsaws, because that is what it will take to be champs.

    Joe Thomas? Joe Staley? Anyone? Gotta think about it. It’s as much about individual talent (which Sowell lacks) as much as knowing the system.

    • cha

      “Oh but the defense was great”? No, actually.

      yes actually. They played more minutes than any defense in NFL history and gave up only 6 points.

      • C-Dog

        That was one tremendous defensive effort, especially considering how much time they spent on the field.

    • Kelly

      Tell me any other team that does not get blown out with how lopsided that boxscore was tonight. It is a monumental feat that this Defense put together tonight. 6 points after being on the field constantly. The only sequence of events I was mad at besides the no timeout on a rushed kick was the previous scoring drive. We had the ball on a 3rd and 4 on the 22 i think? Then we end up with a throw away out of the endzone of which the announcers even say idk what JG was doing. 3rd and 4 to try and keep a drive alive and our best play is a throw away.

      • Comfect

        I’m not sure that the play was a throw-away. I think what the announcers were getting at was that Graham seemed to be on the wrong page with Wilson–it was a shot to the corner of the endzone but he cut it inside. Don’t know who was wrong, but the throw was inbounds, so I think it was meant to be a jump ball, not a throw-away.

    • DavidM2

      Dear Steel,

      All I can say is thank God our FO doesn’t have knee-jerk reactions like this. This was a divisional defensive slugfest. If Fant pans out we are a RT away from a formidable line. It takes time for players to develop for example look at Justin Britt.

      Saying the D didn’t play well tonight is like saying an MLB pitcher pitched a terrible game because the other team got 10 hits when they guy still threw a shutout.

      Making stopgap moves for the likes of a Joe Thomas would be a detriment to the team with a draft as loaded as 2017. There is so much talent coming out that talented prospects will fall and the Hawks don’t want to miss out on those opportunities future to plug a hole with a player that is in the twighlight of his career who may or may not pan out.

      • DavidM2

        *those future opportunities to plug a hole (phone typing)

    • Rob Staton

      No, actually, the defense WAS great Steele.

      This is a classic example of the impossibly high standards set by this team. An off-day for the offense is a crisis, the defense plays lights out and only give up six points and they’re ‘lucky’.

      That was one of the best defensive performances we will ever see.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Like most things in life, it’s a simple matter of perspective. It’s easy to look at the outcome and say “what a frustrating tie. All SEA had to do was make a chip shot FG in OT and they win a tough road game.”

      But it’s just as easy to say “what a tremendous tie! To think they came out of that game without a loss after ARI had them dead-to-rights with a 1st and goal from the 5, then a 2nd and goal from the 1, and not only deny a TD, but prevent a FG!”

      The Seahawks defense was beyond amazing last night. Did ARI move the ball at times? Yes. Did they complete some passes, especially when the Seahawks pass rush failed to get to Palmer? Sure. But did ARI capitalize on that? Did they make the most of their overwhelming time of possession advantage? Not in the least.

      ARI ran 90 plays of offense vs SEA. That’s insane. They held the ball for more than 46 minutes, the 9th highest amount for a regular season game in the history of the NFL. Their offense is ranked 5th in the League in total offensive yards. David Johnson is the #2 RB in the League to this point of the season (total rushing yds) and he’s tied for #1 in TDs with 8. He may have finished last night with 113 yards rushing, but it took him 33 carries and more than 46 minutes to amass that total. And he didn’t score. And then there is that red zone/goal line stand by SEA, keeping ARI from scoring – first with a tremendous effort from KMcCray to keep JJ Nelson from ending the game, then with back to back stops against David Johnson from the 5 and 1 yard lines respectively. Overall, it was a defensive performance for the ages.

      The SEA OL was horrendous. But credit a stingy and strong ARI defense. That unit is #2 in the NFL in yards allowed per game, 5th in points allowed. They have two of the better EDGE rushers in Golden and Jones, one of the better DLers in Calais, and guys like Bucannon, Peterson and Mathieu in the back 7. And there are other factors affecting the SEA OL besides personnel issues. It’s quite obvious Wilson isn’t close to 100%. It’s also quite obvious that while CMike is a decent RB2, he’s not a bell cow. At least not the kind SEA usually roll with. I’m as frustrated as anyone with the lack of progress/regression of Gilliam, and I’ve never been fond of Sowell. But did any of us really think that SEA see him as their long term solution at LT? Or is/was he more of a placeholder while guys like Fant and Odhiambo come on line?

      I wouldn’t advocate trading for either Thomas or Staley. Aside from cap space issues, the loss of a R2 pick (for Thomas at least; it’s reported SF want a R1 for Staley) is too high a price to pay with the depth of talent at other positions of need in this year’s draft. Also, both of those LTs are nearing the end of their careers, with maybe another season beyond the current one at their respective levels of play. Yes, SEA are in a Super Bowl window. But one position on the OL won’t make or break their chances of getting another Lombardi trophy. There are too many other factors that ultimately determine which team makes it all the way – stuff like injuries (not just on SEA, but other teams as well), surprise/breakout players (think Thomas Rawls from last year), scheduling, and even dumb luck. As baseball HOFer Lefty Gomez used to say, “I’d rather be lucky than good.”

      I’m pretty happy with where SEA sit at this point in the season. I’m excited and optimistic about where they go from here, especially with guys like BamBam, Rawls and QJeff returning from injuries. Hopeful that RW can get back some of his mobility, but even still it’s a great thing to watch him develop more and more chemistry with Graham.

      • Tien

        Couldn’t have said it better myself, Eric! And I agree with you. As frustrating as it is seeing our OL be the weak link again, I’d rather keep our picks and see the young guys on the OL develop. 4-1-1 isn’t bad given the injuries on this team and we’re still as dangerous as any team that has a legit chance at the SB. And the Defense & Special Teams played magnificently last night!!

        • East Side Stevie

          WTF STEELE? I think I’ll have whatever it is steele is smoking

          Good lord…. he really just said the defense was not good? typical fanboy overactive statement

          somebody get the bum out of here

  21. Darth 12er

    Boy, what a night. Between this game and the Walking Dead I don’t think I will ever get to sleep. Tough break for Hausch…feel for him. I was on record saying this will be a career year for Kam. He has disappointed, and I’m not so sure I want to see him stick around with a raise. Maybe it’s time to draft a replacement. Also, on Thomas. He would have to agree to renogotiate his contract.

  22. JC

    Johnson appeared out of bounds with the ball when he reached near the goalline

    • Rob Staton

      It was very, very close.

      • Tien

        Live, I was pretty sure he didn’t get in but after seeing the replay, I could have seen it called the other way.

  23. Dumbquestions

    1. Don’t care about qualifiers – the defense was heroic. That performance will grow in memory. They would not yield. It was breathtaking. It was Arizona’s home court. Instead of asking whethther they got lucky, ask whether they played well enough to win.
    2. Rad man above makes a good point: RW’s injury exposes the OL weakness – but it also magnifies it disproportionately.
    3. Given 2) above, trade for Thomas feels like an overreaction, unless you think it means losing the season.
    4. To play Thomas against draft implies they’ll take another lineman, except they never do it.


  24. Kenny Sloth

    Spencer Ware getting the call out as unsung hero for Chiefs.

    Says he sets the tone week in and week out.


    • STTBM

      Ware looks really special nowadays. Too bad he didnt show jack in his time in Seattle. He looked utterly Vanilla here. It took awhile for him to figure it out in KC too. You can bet Seattle wishes they had kept him, but there was little sign he had much to offer his rookie year.

      Coleman totally outplayed him, and if he hadnt gotten in trouble would still be our hybrid RB/FB that Ware couldnt be. Ware still cant block, big as he is. He’s like Christian Okoye for the Millennial Generation…a big tough TB….

  25. Jeremy

    Great game for special teams. In addition to the blocked kicks, kick coverage was stuffing the returns for little to no gain. The O line was horrendous. Alternating getting bullrushed with drive killing holding penalties and the complete lack of ability to confidently convert 3rd and short. It doesn’t matter if you stay “on schedule” if you can’t close it out. Sowell was beaten for what was almost a shoulder injury to Wilson. This line is going to get him seriously hurt. The team is only as strong as the weakest link.

    • Phil

      Jeremy – I agree. Until we get a better LT, we are risking further injury to RW and that could have devastating effects for the future, not just for this year. JT gets my vote …..

      • AlaskaHawk

        LT and RT based on the comments here. I am hoping that Fant pans out. It is his time to shine!

  26. bankhawk

    Did anyone else think Swearinger stood out more than Honey Badger for the Cards on D? At this rate, Cliff Avril is going to end up with a nice little village somewhere in Haiti named after him. And I gotta say, Tanner McEvoy is some pure roster value-just making his presence felt all over the place. Luv some Swiss Army Man there! Not so much into giving up our precious high rounders for JT, Im thinking. But if PC/JS deem it wise, so be it. Just kinda doubting they go down that road. On to Naw Leans-trick or treat, anyone?

  27. C-Dog

    Tremendous defensive effort tonight. I’ve never seen a defense spend that much time on the field and only give up 6 points. D Johnson got his yards but they weren’t easy. I said this after the Rams game when a lot of folks were panicking; this defense is going to keep us in every game this year.

    Won’t go into all the whoas of the offense. Yes, RW isn’t 100%. Yes, C Mike doesn’t appear to be a great answer at RB. Yes, our tackles got punked. Graham dropped a very catchable ball early in the game that could have kept the drive alive. Penalties were a killer. Can’t do things like this against a great defense on their home turf, and expect great results, but these things are correctable.

    A win would have sweet, but really, Seattle was fortunate to walk out of this game with a tie. I look for them to bounce back big next week against the Saints.

    Don’t think we need to trade of an expensive aging vet, I’m willing to roll with Fant.

  28. SeventirsHawksFan

    After tonight, I’m completely onboard with a Joe Thomas trade. And there are multiple players I’d be fine with them cutting to fit him under the cap. We have a $22 million per year investment in RW to protect. And the offense needs to be able to at least function well enough to put 2 touchdown drives together.

    Some combination of Webb, Kearse, Sowell and Luke Willson could be cut / IR’d to make room and we’d be fine.

  29. Trevor

    Rob I think you are right the Joe Thomas trade talk will be non-stop and IMO it should be. We should have traded for him last year and our OL cost us against both the Vikings and Car in the playoffs.

    The defense is an historically great unit and to waste another year in an obvious Super Bowl window with Fant and Gilliam at OT should not be an option. The rest of this team is just too good. Russel is obviously limited mobility wise and cannot make up for the incompetence of the OL and OTs in particular.

    The 2nd round pick should not issue if you want to give this team a chance to win the Super Bowl the next 3 years. Joe Thomas is the best OT of his generation and one of the 5 best of all time.

    Joe Thomas
    -Never Missed a game with injury. Read that again. Never
    -Made pro bowl every year he has been in league
    -Have been the all pro LT every year except his rookie season

    If we can get him for second round pick make the trade now!!!!!

    2017 Draft
    Rd #1 Pass Rusher Demarcus Walker DE/ DT FSU
    Rd#2 Joe Thomas (one of the best LT in the history of the game)
    Rd#3 Mixon RB (Ultra Talented RB with background that needs to be checked out.)

    People will say what about Joe Thomas salary and the cap? It can easily be fit in this year as it is pro-rated. Make the following moves to keep our core happy.

    -Cut Jamarcus Webb
    -Resign / Extend Kam
    -Resign / Extend Bennett

    I don’t see how anyone can argue that next years 2nd round pick is going to help us win an SB the next 2-3 years more than Joe Thomas. Lets not waste this incredible defense while we have it.

    • Rob Staton

      It’s certainly a sound argument you make Trevor, if they can afford to do it and extend Kam/Bennett which I’m not convinced they’d be able to do.

      I’m not opposed to the trade but I also think there’s a reason why nobody has traded for Thomas considering he’s so good (and it probably has to do with the asking price) and while Thomas has stayed healthy and done a great job in that regard — this offense is a different animal. I’d be wary of making a deal for a 32-year-old and getting exactly what you paid for — an ageing OT at the end of his career. Especially with a draft coming up that looks so intriguing.

      • Trevor

        Rob I am with you completely on this years draft it looks loaded. But is there anyone there int he 2nd round that you think could have a bigger impact than Joe Thomas to help us win an SB this year and the next two?

        I am very doubtful. We all loved this years draft class and think they have big upside but who is really making an impact in year #1. For that matter whom have we drafted the last 4 years outside of Lockett who has had a real impact in year #1 or 2

        • Rob Staton

          I do think there are players who could have a bigger impact to be honest. The value at #55-65 next year might be similar to the value at #25-35. The Seahawks played eight games with Paul McQuistan at LT in their Super Bowl year so I’m not overly convinced trading for a 32-year-old tackle is necessary.

          • Trevor

            I appreciate the insight and I am pumped if this years class is that loaded I need to catch up in my research as I am behind this year. So looking forward to draft season again this year. Your coverage and the blog just get better every year.

            I agree about Mcquistan and the SB year but three things to keep in mind. 1) Mcquistan did not start in the playoffs. 2)Russell could still run and scramble then 3)We had Beast Mode at RB and this was a rush first not pass first offense.

            Do you really think this OL can stand up to any team with a pass rushin the playoffs ie. Phil, Ariz, Minn. I just don’t see it and I think the rest of the team is good enough for an SB run.

            • Rob Staton

              I think they showed vs NYJ they can perform. And Atlanta too. I think people underestimated slightly how good Jones/Golden/Campbell are. It’s a formidable EDGE/DL. And Russell was only sacked once and SEA had many more hits of Palmer than Wilson took.

              • Trevor

                You are right Rob about the Jets but they have an interior pass rush not off the Edge. Unlie previous years where we we weak up the middle, this year Britt, Glowinski and Ifedi seem pretty stout up the middle but the OTs are turnstiles. You can’t even pick a side to help on with a back chipping or TE because they have both been equally bad. At least with Thomas you can solidify one side of the OL then use or back or TE to help Gilliam.

                This is one we will just have to agree to disagree on. I just do not see how this team can win the SB with Fant and Gilliam as our Tackles with an immobile Wilson at QB. All the negative plays (holding, false starts, sacks) mean that drives cannot be sustained. This will eventually catch up to our defense in the form of fatigue and injuries as well.

                I just hate to think a truly legitimate SB run could be lost for the cost of a 2nd round pick .

                • Rob Staton

                  “I just hate to think a truly legitimate SB run could be lost for the cost of a 2nd round pick”

                  I appreciate and respect your take. I think ultimately where we differ is — I don’t think the difference between winning and not winning a SB is trading for a LT. I think they’ll manage this situation.

                  • Trevor

                    I hope you are right. They do seem to normally figure out a way.

                  • C-Dog

                    Great discussion Trevor and Rob. While I definitely lean more on the direction of Rob on this one, Trevor, you make a pretty enticing case to trade for Thomas.

                    For me, when I see proposals like this, they echo too much back to the Ruskell days when they were shelling out for 30 something vets. I would much rather reward the players who are battling like this and develop through the draft. The more quality you can get on the roster on rookie contracts the better.

              • Trevor

                All this being said I agree with you about one thing. I don’t think we will be trading for Joe Thomas or for that fact anyone will.

                He is the one positive thing about the Browns franchise (except perhaps Pryor’s emergence) and the fans love him. For the Browns to trade him I think will take more than the 2nd which is being reported.

                • SeventirsHawksFan

                  A team like Cleveland should jump at the chance to get a second for Thomas. They are in full blown rebuild mode. They need young talent. Not a twilight years left tackle.

                  I think the FO will wait to see how the next few games go before making a decision about a trade though.

                  • Rob Staton

                    The trade deadline is the 1st November.

          • EranUngar

            The McQuistan argument is mentioned a lot. There are 2 things to say about it –

            As bad as he was, he was a savy vet with great understanding of the line play and…

            He played with Zach Miller on his side on the majority of the snaps.

  30. Trevor

    What an amazing group of characters and players we have on defense. The fight they show ever game / every play is something to be admired. The pride and unity they have is something to be relished by all Hawks fans. I coach youth sports and all you ever want kids to learn is to have fun, play hard and play as a team. No group of players in professional sports exemplifies this more than the Hawks D and Russ

    • Volume12

      Couldn’t agree more. I’ll say it again. PC is the type of guy you’d put your life on the line for. Seattle’s best asset.

      It’s one reason why they’ll pass on a superior prospect and take the guy with the unique, gritty personality.

  31. LordSnow

    Just can’t see the cards coming back from this. Both Tyrann Mathieu and Arians threw their own guys under the bus. This could unravel for them quickly.

    This tie could be more of a “win” than people think.

    • Trevor

      You are very right. Loved the difference between Pete and Ariens when discussing kickers. Love the positive attitude Pete always has and it shows in the teams never give up attitude.

      Did you see Pete at the end of the 1st half running off going to see every defensive player. That was classic.

  32. Trevor

    Also if Cliff Avril does not make the pro bowl this year there should be an investigation! That is a bad bad man off the edge. Seems like Dwight Freeney in that he will be a productive pass rusher well into his 30s.

    • vrtkolman

      I laughed when they showed his PFF ranking during the game intros. #44, hahaha what a joke that is.

      • STTBM

        PFF is weird. Sometimes they make sense, other times you just have to shake your head…

        • Volume12

          PFF only factors in the results of the play. They don’t factor in or grade the intricacies or the difficulties of assoignments.

          Collinsworth can take his PFF and shove it. He pissed me off yesterday talking about the Seahawks tackling technique. As if it was dangerous or put opposing players in harm.

          • Rob Staton

            PFF thinks Sherman is the 41st best corner in the NFL.

            Enough said.

            • STTBM

              Touche, lol!

              Sherm has struggled a bit this year, but he’s hardly slipped that much.

              Its obvious they are wrong so often on Zone coverage responsibilities as well. Plus, Sherm is smart enough to freelance occasionally and often jumps another DB’s assignment to make a tackle, or try to. And then PFF blames him for the reception…

              Kind of like that play last night where Sherm was passing his WR off in the zone, and Lane was too shallow, so the pass was completed. Not really SHerms fault, but most called him out for it…

              • Rad man

                people love to cite PFF when it suits, and disparage when it doesnt

                • Rob Staton

                  If they have something interesting to say, such as suggesting someone is playing well, I’m happy to give said player a once over. This was the case with Kyler Fackrell a year ago and the tape matched their judgement. Yet giving ‘instant grades’ out is an asinine exercise and the suggestion that Sherman is only the 41st best performing corner in the NFL is total rubbish.

                  • CharlieTheUnicorn

                    PFF had some funny grades for guys on the NBC telecast.

                    My view on them hasn’t changed…. when they dissed Aaron Rodgers after he threw 5 or 6 TDs and said we was average… I knew it was a joke.

    • Volume12

      Avril and others are why I can’t figure out how some fans think they need to be replaced because of age.

      Pass rushers don’t decline with age. RBs do. LBs typically do. Not players that win on technique.

    • James P

      Favourite guy in a Seahawks jersey this year, he’s playing like a beast.

  33. Trevor

    I have never wanted a player coming out of college as I want Fournette for the Hawks. I loved Zeke and think he is a more complete back but Fournette just screams Seahawk and everything PC / JS want out offense to be (tough and explosive).

    I know there is zero chance and that sucks but one can dream. I would almost be willing to pull a Ditka for him and let JS focus on signing the top 5 UDFA who would all want to be Hawks since our draft class was Fournette.

    • STTBM

      Even Fournette wouldnt get much with this line. We’ve got to fix this line, and adding TALENT is the only way to do it. You can get by with a couple scrubs on the line, but not at both tackle positions.

      Its like having Larry Fitz three years ago, but Stanton at QB. Does you no good.

      And Micheals is a good, tough back with ridiculous quickness. He just lacks that final gear to bust a 15 yarder into a 60 yarder. Cant have everything…

  34. STTBM

    Poor Bradley Sowell. He played better each week until struggling the last couple. He was beet red in the face and giving his all last night, but was playing his worst game thus far and getting beaten like a Red-Headed Stepchild…and then the knee injury. I saw him pull the towel over his face, and watched his shoulders shake with sobs, and I was sure–just as he apparently was–that his season was over and his knee blown. I felt so bad for a player who has given his all each and every play, and until yesterday looked good enough to help us to a Championship.

    Thank goodness, it appears his knee is only partially torn (sprain) or stretched, and he might make it back before the end of the season.

    Im rooting hard for the guy to heal quickly.

    • Rob Staton

      Agreed — it was distressing to see his reaction. He has given his all for this team limitations or not.

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        You want 10 of these guys on the team, than the one superstar diva (example OBJ).
        You may not have the flash, but you will win (or tie) in the end.

    • Trevor

      He is a great character guy and someone you pull for an like to see in the locker room! I hope the injury is not as serious as it appeared.

      • STTBM

        MCL sprain. Those can vary. It could cost him a month or two, or just slow him down. Either way, he’s gonna miss some games and we’re up a creek at the LT position.

        • Volume12

          That was tough to watch. Never wanna see any player like that.

  35. STTBM

    The Good, as I saw it: 1) The Defense. A few mistakes in communication, but a masterful, gutsy performance for the Ages. I cannot believe they held strong despite 90 plays….2) Special Teams. Fantastic trick plays (McEvoy on the block despite being held, Wagners blocked FG, the incredible punt and kick return tackles for no gain…We dont win without those plays. Seattle’s Special Teams deserves ST Player of the week for the NFC for the whole unit. 3) The offense. Well, Jimmy Graham and Doug Baldwin and Jermaine Kearse. Graham was invisible most of the game, and probably very sore from various injuries, but he showed up when it mattered most and took yet ANOTHER nasty shot to his knee and kept on tickin’…Doug was Doug. Kearse made some great clutch plays, but more importantly, he kept his composure when the Refs called Offensive PI on him when there was handsy on both sides and no push-off whatsoever. A horrid call, but Kearse stayed calm and that proved huge later on.

    The bad. Oh, where to begin. Ive been saying for years our offensive line wasnt that great at run blocking, that Lynch and Wilson masked their flaws and without those two running our line would show up below average in run blocking, average at best. Last night was just the latest example: without the threat of Wilson running and Wilson scrambling on pass plays, defenses are looking to stop our run game, and our line cannot block 4 guys with 5 or 6 of our own. They flat stink.

    Blaming Michaels is stupid. He has nowhere to run, and gets something from nothing all the time. Given the slightest crease, he makes good yards and came close to breaking a couple big gains despite not much help from the line. He wasnt missing holes, he wasnt impatient, he was simply getting hit before he gained a yard.

    Contrast that with Arizona, which double teamed Rubin/Siliga or Bennet at the point of attack and pushed our D-line 2-4 yards on every play. Those guys played badass and schemed badass, while Seattle looked overmatched and lost.

    With Sowell out, Fant looks utterly unprepared to play. His hand use was pathetic, and he seemed panicked and hopeless out there at first. He did improve, but the guy doesnt belong on an NFL roster right now, he should be on the PS. Im hoping they try Gilliam or Webb there this week in practice, they CANT be worse than Fant, who has no clue. Losing our LT, bad as he was, could derail this team.

    Aside from the general struggles to move the ball, a guy like Fant could get Wilson killed. Im not talking a season ending injury, Im talking the kind of injury that ruins careers. RW is so beat up, I cant see him playing well next week even with perfect pass pro, and he cannot keep taking shots to his legs. They are just too beat up.

    • vrtkolman

      It’s very terrifying. I would almost prefer Webb at LT, almost… Webb could be just as bad and at least Fant can improve. The options are dire and I’m sure JS won’t be able to sleep for a while as he contemplates how he could fit a Joe Thomas and Joe Staley in.

      • STTBM

        At least Webb has some experience, and can use his hands appropriately. I cant remember watching a LT look as lost as Fant did his first couple series last night. I was stunning.

    • DLep

      ‘Contrast that with Arizona, which double teamed Rubin/Siliga or Bennet at the point of attack and pushed our D-line 2-4 yards on every play. Those guys played badass and schemed badass, while Seattle looked overmatched and lost.’

      Have to disagree with you there. They held the league leading rusher to just over three yards a carry on 30 plus carries. Hardly overmatched Id say.

      • STTBM

        Johnson didnt break too many tackles, but he had plenty of 3-4 yard runs where the line got push past 2 yards, something our line never seemed to do. Seattle’s D DID manage to stuff him a bunch of times, but all too often it was Earl and McCray, or even Sherm, Lane or Shead making the tackle and coming down hard. Seattle had to put 8 plus in the box to stop them.

        Overall, it looked like the vast majority of the time Seattle’s front four were getting handled, blown off the line. And AZ schemed to have a second guy knock Bennett from the side when he was engaged with a blocker, it was nasty but effective. They also managed to stand Rubin up with a double team and move him three yards backwards and sideways…

        That was a hard-fought game, but Johnson had far more free yards than Michaels per play.

        • David

          I agree that though David Johnson and CMike had similar yards per carry, they were in a completely different manner. DJ got his yards either from an immediate push from their line in the middle for 2-3 before the LBs cleaned him up or on the stretch play where he gets the edge before Shead or Sherman cleans him up. CMike was getting none of the push that DJ was getting from the line and he was either stopped for nothing or slipped a hole for 5 or 6. I would say CMike’s running from that perspective was more impressive especially on his best run of the night on what I believe was a counter play to the right.

    • AlaskaHawk

      My gut reaction is that Fant was an improvement. It seemed like he was blocking adequately for pass protection. Was the defense getting past him? Of course Fant was also fresh whereas Sowell was worn out by the time he got injured.

      • STTBM

        Yes, the D was blowing past Fant as if he were a statue with pigeon crap all over him. Seattle was countering with REALLY quick passes and rolling RW away from him.

        He seemed to do better in OT though.

  36. STTBM

    Ive been against trading for Thomas pretty much from the get-go. But with the injury to Sowell, the struggles of Gilliam at RT, and the disappointing play at RG in previous games from Webb–to say nothing of how raw and unprepared Fant looked last night–Seattle has to do SOMETHING.

    Even Cable cannot make water into wine, a sows ear into a silk purse, in less than a week. He has no one on this team ready to handle LT at a competent level–even with a TE or RB to help chip.

    I dont care that the upcoming Draft may be loaded–it isnt loaded at T. And the Draft wont help us this year, and this year is huge, we’re wasting this defense and precious years from RW and Baldwin and Grahams career with this hodge-podge of a line.

    JS and PC have not done all that well with our first round picks (Trading them away and drafting Okung, Carp, and Irvin), and our first round pick should be a low one–especially IF we trade for Thomas. Our Second would then be nearly a third round pick. Not too much to play for a guy who could give us a few years of solid to great play at LT.

    JS and PC have the trade ammo and the knack for moving around in the draft and finding gems late; they just need to focus and do a great job scouting and they can make up for losing a second round pick plus for Thomas.

    And the Trump card (not a Donald reference), Russel Wilson’s short and long-term health; we cannot afford to let him get blindsided by a DE, not even once. And that will happen multiple times a game if we dont get Thomas. It could cost us not only the season, but more if Wilson is hurt badly enough.

    End the insanity; trade whatever it takes for Thomas and get him studying and playing so by the Playoffs he knows our offense inside and out.

  37. DC

    I despise trading high draft picks away but in this situation I would consider it under this condition; the second round pick we send to Cleveland is for the 2018 draft. I agree that the O line is too weak a link at this point with the rest of the team playing so well. Give us Joe Thomas for our 2018 2nd rounder and you’ve got a deal. They already have a ton of ammo in 2017 so it would not hurt them to spread it out a little.

    Cleveland Browns 2017 NFL Draft picks

    First round: (2) Own pick and the Eagles’ pick.

    Second round: (2) Own pick and the Titans’ pick.

    Third round: (1) Own pick.

    Fourth round: (3) Three *compensatory picks due to free agent losses in 2016.

    Fifth round: (3) Own pick, the Patriots’ pick and a *compensatory pick due to free agent loss in 2016.

    Sixth round: (1) Own pick.

    Seventh round: (1) The Colts’ pick.

  38. DLep

    Asked how the Cardinals were able to constantly pressure Russell Wilson throughout the game, Mathieu said: “Well we’ve never had two edge rushers like Chandler (Jones) and Markus (Golden). Let’s call it what it is – their offensive line is not that good. So, we felt like we could get pressure on them, which we did a bunch of times tonight.”

    I know, obvious statement is obvious and I hate to part w a pick with such a talented draft class coming, but this tackle situation is almost untenable at this point and it would be a shame to squander a season (w such a talented roster everywhere else) because we are so bad at a single position.

    • STTBM

      I agree. Either Cable works some magic and suddenly our line gets amazingly better without Sowell (Not happening), or we trade for a guy like Thomas and pay the price, just like Minnesota did. Despite the poor game from Bradford, Minny did what they had to do and so far its looked like a solid deal all the way around.

      Think about it. The surety–not risk–of RW getting hammered into the turf from behind due to bad LT play and missing time and maybe the season, or trading a low second round pick plus something to the Browns for Joe Thomas.

      Its a no-brainer to me. You have to do it. Hell, trade them Paul Richardson plus the second. The guy is getting one pass per game, he’s just taking up space.

    • C-Dog

      It’s a compelling case, for sure.

      Say Seattle trades their 2d for Thomas, and for whatever reason, the season still falls short of expectations, and he only ends up playing in Seattle for 2 seasons, and that 2d round pick becomes a flat out stud for Cleveland for the next 4 years. With a deep draft, that’s what you risk.

      I won’t be disappointed if Seattle makes this type of trade, but given how they value draft picks, and the age of Thomas, I don’t really see it happening.

      • STTBM

        On the other hand, if you go with Gilliam at one tackle spot, and some combo of Fant/Webb/Odhiambo at the other, the odds of a serious injury to Wilson increase exponentially.

        That too is a huge risk. There is risk either way. So my strategy would be to take a risk on getting better and lessen the risk to RW by trading for Thomas, then keep coaching up Fant/Odhiambo/Webb/Gilliam and hope that in a year or two or three, we find someone who can supplant Thomas.

        We traded away a couple high picks that became really good players and got little in return. (Harvin). This isnt as big of a risk; Thomas is way better than anyone we have on the team, and the risk of injury to RW is off the charts right now.

  39. george

    Yes the running game sucked, and the 22 qbr by RW didn’t help, but that was caused in part by the damn penalties. Penalties. the biggest drive killers and cause of losing games. 10 for 90 yards. it is something Carroll has never been able to reduce. The Hawks are at the top of the penalty list year in and year out. It has to do with his distain for authoritarianism. It has cost us a lot of games over the years. Yhe Patriots are usually among the least penalized teams in the league. If it were up to me , starting on your second false start or holding penalty each game, it would cost you 5,000. for charity each additional time. But hey that is just me!!

    • STTBM

      Several of those penalties were bogus, and came, rather conveniently for AZ, right after a big play by Seattle. Just like in the Rams game.

      That said, Sherm got away with A LOT of holding/PI/etc and so did Lane, and I saw a couple facemask penalties we committed (and one AZ did on RW) that werent called either. AZ was also holding Bennett all the damned time, but it was never called. Par for the course, the NFL obviously has amended the rules on holding where its legal to hold Bennett lol!

      The only bad penalties for Seattle were the Personal Foul on Lane. He deserved that flag and it shoudlnt have happened. Im not blaming Carrol for the penalties, the team played mostly clean and half their penalties were iffy calls at best. (Like I said, they DID get away with a BUNCH of holding of WR’s).

      • AlaskaHawk

        I agree with your post. A couple of those holding calls were marginal, defender already past the tackle, they might be a little grabby but they didn’t haul them to the ground.

        • STTBM

          Yes, and AZ O-line was MUGGING several guys on every play. It was blatant! But no calls till late in the game.

          Dont know whats going on with the refs. Wasnt as concerning as the Rams game, but still not a good look for them.

          The thing that keeps me from crying Conspiracy over last night is the all the holding and handsies Sherm and company got away with. It was bad. Id be pissed if I was Arians as well…

      • vrtkolman

        Not yelling conspiracy or anything, but those “timely” holding penalties also occurred last year against Arizona – which was primarily why we were down 20-0.

        • 503Hawk

          Yah but… Much of the holding was because of match-ups: Sowell & Fant for the most part left an island against Jones, and Gilliam struggling against their other speed rusher.

          As much as I like C Mike, he goes down pretty easy. Might be in part to the forward lean style he has.

  40. STTBM

    The big rub for Seattle isnt the Draft pick for Thomas, its the cap space. He’s not cheap. Perhaps he’d take a bit of a cut to come here, but I doubt it.

    Rob, I understand your arguments and until Sowell looked bad last night and then got hurt, our opinions meshed regarding not trading for a LT. However, Paul McQuistan was a much better player that year than anyone we have on the team right now. We’re not going to get McQuistan level of play out of Fant/Webb/Gilliam/Odhimabo. Even IF Cable is the linemen whisperer, he cant make up for Fant/Gilliams inexperience and lack of skill, or the lack of talent with Webb during this season.

    Seattle would have to trade someone with a decent salary to afford Thomas. And who could we do that with? Kearse? Not sure its even possible, but I think Seattle has to look into it.

    • sdcoug

      Is Webb’s money guaranteed next year?

      • STTBM

        Not all of it. I cant remember if part of the signing bonus was spread out to next year or taken all this year. I think Seattle set it up so they can cut his butt with no penalty after this year.

      • DavidM2

        No, just this year.

  41. C-Dog

    Simulated Mock after the Battle in the Desert, assuming Seattle doesn’t trade for Joe Thomas.

    27: R1P27

    59: R2P27

    91: R3P27

    135: R4P33

    205: R6P26

    214: R6P35

    224: R7P6

    If Chubb’s knee checks out and he SPARQs at the combine, I can see Seattle taking him R1 if he is still there.

    Not a great draft for tackle, but there are some nice guard prospects there. Could we see Seattle shift Ifedi to tackle in 2017, and grab another solid interior OL high? Dorian Johnson is a nice looking player, pulls and seals. Something I’m strongly considering in my mind.

    I like Seattle to address SAM at some point, and I love Azeem Victor. If they couple dipped on Huskies and took Joe Mathis later in the draft, I think I’d do cartwheels.

    I like Ryan Glasgow as another solid athletic rotational interior DL. I’ve been curious of Pirsig, and Volume 12 is pretty impressed with his character, toughness and physicality, if Ifedi has the athleticism for eventually playing LT, love to get another mauler on the right side a la Breno.

    Everett is a H-back/TE prospect.

    Seattle doesn’t draft WR, DB, but maybe unearths a UDFA gem or two.

  42. sdcoug

    Anyone else a bit baffled by the 3rd and 4 end zone shot to Graham?

    The issue I have is not that they clearly weren’t on the same page, but why we weren’t specifically trying for the 4 yds and a 1st down. My Lord, have Graham sit at 5 and hit him, whatever, just get the yards. Pick up the 1st and now you have 3 shots at the end zone, not one.

    • STTBM

      The D put Graham in single coverage. RW Then threw a jump ball for him, which I personally have been begging them to do all year. Graham just didnt get the memo…

      If you have a 6′-7″ guy like Graham out wide inside the 20 and they single cover him with anyone shorter than Everson Walls, you throw him the ball…

      • sdcoug

        I understand. But I just feel securing those 3 extra chances are more critical there. Only my opinion

        • STTBM

          Hindsight is 20/20. Had Graham run the right route, he would have had a great chance to make the play over the much smaller DB and we could have won the game right there. I was hollering at my TV for them to throw it to Graham in the End Zone right before that play…

        • STTBM

          They made the same aggressive decision in OT by throwing the 30 yards Go/Fly Route to Kearse on third and four. Same thing–AZ showed blitz, RW saw single coverage on Kearse, they silent audibled to the deep jump ball…and it worked.

          • HI Hawk

            I would love to see more Kearse on the outside against inferior CBs. He’s never open, but he is very physical and seems more capable than the much bigger Graham on the deep 50/50 ball.

            • David

              He also seems to be called – rightfully or not – for OPI on 1 out of every 2 catches on the outside this year.

  43. Volume12

    Rob, did you say you watched the Auburn vs Arkansas game? If so, was wondering if you noticed LB Tre Williams and RG Braden Smith?

    Smith is one of the better looking RGs I’ve seen. Built like Ifedi. Chiseled, great length, UOH is superb, athletic, really good functional strength, and great base in pass protection. Gets off the LOS quickly.

    Williams is one of the most physical LBs in the country. Jumps off the screen. Athletic, strong, great pursuit speed and angles. Smart, heady football player. Blows guys up in the run game and quickly discards/gets off his blocks.

    • Rob Staton

      I watched the Auburn D snaps but
      focused only on Lawson

  44. Mylegacy

    EVERY YEAR: EVERY YEAR: I, at last once, write this sentence: “This is not a championship team quality OL.” Ditto for 2016.

    Every year, Tom seems to use glue stick, paper mache paste or old gum to morph an ugly OL into one that might/could/perhapsmay get us to the line and over. This year is no exception.

    However, there are two future massive building blocks on it now. Ifedi and Fant.

    Fant is not ready. But Fant could be a monster for us in two or three years (perhaps sooner). I would rather just miss the SB with Fant learning and developing than just miss it with Sowell trying, with out success, to overcome his physical shortcomings.

    BUT – IF – Fant can become the man I truly believe he can be, but just a bit earlier than I think he’ll be ready, then we may well truly power our way into the SB. We’ve bet on Cable turning water into wine every year – I say lets give Fant a real shot at it now and give Cable the opportunity to turn wine into champagne!

    If I was Cable I’d tell DaBoss to let me try and turn this monster loose now.

    • Volume12

      I only see 4-5 teams in the entire league with a chance to win a title.

      Seattle, Minnesota, Dallas, New England, and maybe Denver or Pittsburgh?

      • Trevor

        Agree completely Vol.

    • DavidM2

      Is DaBoss by any chance related to Debarge?

  45. Volume12

    PC said the run game will improve with Rawls who will be back for the Monday nighter against Buffalo.

    Says a certain LT coming in is not likely. ‘Hard to find those guys in this market.’

    • STTBM

      Rawls looked slow and lost before his injury, back when the line was actually run blocking once in awhile. I dont see him being an improvement over Micheals at all, rather the reverse. However, Michaels isnt used to being a bell-cow back and could be banged up and suffering from overwork. I know, ideally he would be able to handle his average workload, but the fact is he may be worn out. Having ANY back to split carries might help him get back to the explosive back we havent seen since the Niners game.

    • Mike B'hamster

      Interesting comment from PC…We all have opinions, but JS/PC make the decisions. Vol, where did you see or hear that quote? I’d like to consider the context. It’s not actually “Hard to find those guys…”, as both Joe Thomas and Joe Staley are now publicly acknowledged as being on the trading block, so does “…in this market” mean or imply that the price or the cost is too high?

      • Mike B'hamster

        Monday morning Brock & Salk 710 espn… PC: Focusing on Fant for now…JS doing the research on other options, viability. Article by Brady Henderson on line 710 espn.

  46. line_hawk

    This was again a pathetic performance by the offence. This has been happening consistently every few games now. 3 games (Maimi, Rams, Cards) out of 6, the offence is putrid. I don’t think Joe Thomas is magically going to fix this mess. I see two major factors:

    1) The drafting of Oline has been underwhelming over the last few seasons. I was reading somewhere the other day that they have spent the fifth highest draft capital on Oline since 2010. I was surprised at this stat but at this point, it just seems like their drafting is suspect. Whatever they are doing is not working. Not sure if there is a quick way to fix this.

    2) Which brings me to the second point. Play calling. The run game is a mess. The QB cannot run. The defense is consistently blitzing. The Oline cannot block anyone. What did Seattle do to adjust? Nada. No, quick routes. No deep lobs. (The one time they went after Cooper in overtime worked like a charm.) No, jump balls to Graham. No Alex Collins just to try something else. Just the same old crap. Don’t understand how Bevell can keep calling these stinkers every few games and not expect criticism.

    Looking at the entire season, it seems like they beat up on some bad defenses and got overwhelmed by good ones. Not a good sign if you want to win a superbowl. This is no 2013 team; that team had a much better offense. On the other hand, I am very encouraged by the defensive line. They played an excellent game. Over the last two seasons, the dline has been a quite inconsistent on the road. So, I am hoping that with a good rotation of lineman this year, they can continue this form in most games.

    • Rob Staton

      The offense is not putrid.

      • line_hawk

        They gained 130 yards in regular time (fewest of any team this year per espn). The fact that the defense played lights out does not absolve the stinker that the offense put. They scored the same number of points as a Ryan Fitzpatrick led team had 6 days earlier. Seems like they didn’t learn anything from the Miami and Rams game. Same story, different night.

        • Trevor

          The offense has struggled with pressure off the edge this year because Russ can’t run and they have not made great adjustments yet. This is still a quality offense once they iron out a few things IMO. They definitely need to start chipping a lot more with Rbs and TEs.

          • sdcoug

            I think that’s his point. No adjustments to mitigate your weaknesses and it is a reoccurring problem. The Cleveland Browns would have put up more points than us last night. A major responsibility of the O-Coord is to find a rhythm, a way to pick up yards, a way to sequence plays to help your players succeed. I don’t think adjustments are a string point, at least against certain teams. A quick-tempo offense moved us down the field like butter the last two drives. The LAST two drives. As usual, it only comes at the end

        • Rob Staton

          The offense had a rough night but they are not generally putrid.

          • george

            The offe nse isn’t putrid the o line is. If these guys can’t impede their man for at least 2 seconds, the team is in big trouble.

            • Rob Staton

              O-line talk is overrated for me. They played poorly last night but did so against three of the best DL/EDGE types in the NFC. They played well vs Atlanta, NYJ and San Fran.

              • HI Hawk

                You’re exactly right Rob. Also, let’s not forget that Arizona’s O-line is well regarded and they looked even worse. I think a few more TE chips and a more (OT-like) decisive Wilson would have made the offense look significantly better and alleviated the pressure on Sowell/Fant/Gilliam.

                At the end of the day, the OTs aren’t great, but that was known at kickoff, they are not the reason the offense failed though. The execution by Wilson was a bit off, he wasn’t decisive and he wasn’t as accurate as he usually is. The playcalls were ok, I would have liked more running calls and to use the TEs and backs to chip the ends before going into their routes – but execution and penalties stifled the offense more than anything.

    • STTBM

      1) Thats a good point, though I disagree somewhat. Glowinsky has mostly looked alright, though he struggled the past two games. Ifedi isnt playing as well as expected, but he will improve. Our tackles are not good, and with Sowell out, we are really scraping the bottom of the barrel. But Odhiambo has talent and upside, so does Glowinsky. Our young C might be ok someday, and Britt has finally found his home at C; he’s playing pretty well.

      2) Not sure how much they can adjust as far as O-line blocking in the run game. At some point, you gotta block your man. Our much larger line isnt doing that very consistently. Seattle did adjust their playcalling, but nothing clicked until overtime. They threw a jump ball to Graham, and Graham ran the wrong route…

      And Collins came in for one play, and as usual got no yards on his carry. He’s slow as a toad and not skookum enough to be trusted to pass block.

      But yeah, they seem to be refusing to admit to themselves just how physically limited Wilson is.

      The offense is fine, except the line is iffy. Until yesterday they were pass protecting at an average to above average level. Its the run game that is broken. But I do think Bevell and Cable have to put their heads together and figure something out….and soon.

      • line_hawk

        1) I disagree. For the last few years, its been all potential. On the field, the players have mightily struggled. Just in the last couple of years, Gilliam, Bowie, Sokoli, Poole, Novak were hyped as future stars. Most have washed out. Glowinski, Ifedi, Odhiambo are still unknowns but there is no reason to be high on them *yet* other than the fact that they were drafted high.

        2) One wrong route by Graham and one Collins carry is not enough trying. I mean why come back to the stuff that clearly wasn’t working. Why didn’t they provide more help to the tackles? Or max protect and take downfield shots every now and then?

        Also, I think they need to give Collins more carries especially when Michael is ineffective. Micheal for all his hype is averaging 67 yards a game, not bad but hardly groundbreaking. Micheal looks like a finesse back and seems to drop to the ground on first touch. Collins was known for hard running in college, its time to see what he has got.

        • STTBM

          Collins has played sparingly in most games this year. And he’s run the ball about as well as Dan Doornink would in retirement. He usually gets zero yards. I believe his longest carry is three yards…

          On the contrary, its more practical and logical to expect good things from Glowinsky and Ifedi in the future than to expect failure because both were very good players in college and have the size and athleticism. Plus, they’ve done well in preseason. Sokoli always was a longshot, Poole was terrible from the get-go, and Nowak was simply a Cable thing. There was no sane reason to think Nowak would do well, nor Poole.

          Why didnt they do what the Falcons did in the second half last week–5 step drops with max protect and air it out? Probably because we dont have Julio Jones, Lockett is slowed from his knee injury, and they were determined to not get RW hit. If they thought they could get it done, they would have tried it.

      • george

        We passed on Cody Whitehair., who has received some pretty good reviews for the Bears.

        • Volume12

          Ifedi was way better last night than he was a week ago. He’s not a technician. Not what they drafted him for. Give him time. He has traits you can’t coach PR teach. Technique can be.

          • HawkFan907

            Give Ifedi time. I say stand pat with what you have and let them gel. Ifedi was the right pick, but I’m not so sure about Odhiambo. This year I want them to take an established guard in the middle rounds and kick Ifedi out to tackle and work with that.

        • Rob Staton

          I’ve not focused on him to judge — but Whitehair was one of the least explosive testers pre-draft with T-Rex arms. If he succeeds he will be one of the few that does with his limitations.

  47. Madmark

    I’m just going to tell you how much I’ve grownup in the last few years with these Seahawks. I’m not going to panic over this game in Arizona or the one in L.A. Both games were going to be tough division battles fought early in their houses. They always have been. I will also go on record that the NFC West division has 3 of the toughest defenses in this league. We could have won but by all the stats we should have lost and yet we are ahead in the division with a 4-1-1 record. If you said that Seattle would 4-1-1 after 6 games and in the lead of there division at the start of the year. I’d say I’m good with that.
    We are 1-1-1 in the division and who wins it will come down to the last 3 games where we play S.F. at there place and we get Arizona and L.A. here at home and I like that scenario. Does the offense need work? You beat they do but they know that and I believe they will do what they can to address the problem. A healthy R.W. would go a long way in addressing that need. Who knows maybe this lights a fire for the offense cause they know that they by all rights lost that game. On to N.O. were I expect a good bounce back opponent to play as we move in to a more difficult part of our schedule.

    • Madmark

      I also believe Russell Wilson will get healthier and Carson Palmer will be more battered up when we meet again.

  48. icb12

    What are the chances we see Ifedi kick to Tackle, and Odhiambo inside?

    • Mylegacy

      Good question.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Odhiambo is a high character Pig Bailey

      • STTBM

        Wow. Thats pretty harsh. Not sure anyone can say what we have in Odhiambo, except he’s not ready to play.

        Ifedi is struggling with the mental side/technique of RG, kinda iffy to move him to T when he’s never even practiced there.

      • DLep

        not ideal for a third round pick

      • Mr. Offseason

        Would a more stout RT improve the fun game? Maybe kicking Ifedi out would help do that. I just think the running game has to improve – does Ifedi provide a better edge on the right side if Odhiambo can pull his weight at RG?

        • Mr. Offseason

          Run game* 🙂

    • icb12

      I don’t disagree.

      But what other real options do they have?

      Impractical trade?
      Odhiambo at Tackle?

      I think we may see- Gilliam, Glo, Britt, Odhiambo, Ifedi.

      Gilliam at least has practiced at LT. Keep Ifedi on the right side. You could possibly see Glo and Odhiambo switch sides in this instance as well.

      Other option- Insert Joey Hunt, Move Britt to G. Ifedi to Tackle. Odhiambo odd man out.
      Other option v2- Insert Joey Hunt, Move Britt to T. Least desirable IMO.

      • Madmark

        I just have to say this. No, please do not remove Britt from center. The inside 3 guys we don’t need to move any of them. We just need for a tackle to step up. I’m sure they are looking at trades for backup players also like when we got a Breno and McQuiston, keep the fame of Cable.

      • STTBM

        Seattle will likely only add one player to the mix. To add two would be to throw the whole thing out of whack, too much risk, too little chance of success. I think either they just see what Fant can do at LT (or Webb), or they move Gilliam to LT and start Webb at RT.

        Simplest thing is to just let Fant start at LT, and if he cant hack it, put Webb in.

        Never thought I’d be jealous of a T from Cleveland…

      • Mr. Offseason

        I understand why people are concerned with Odhiambo at LT. But why is Fant the better choice, who had like a cup of coffee in college football??

  49. vrtkolman

    I think there are some overreactions with the offense. The offensive line has issues but we knew going into this season it wasn’t going to be good. Russell isn’t getting sacked 5+ times a game like he was last year. The running game isn’t going right now, but Russell has no mobility and Rawls hasn’t played nearly at all yet. Lockett is obviously hurt and thus can’t get over the top of defenses like he did last year. We are moving the ball and putting up points on bad defenses and struggling against the good ones (Arizona #3 in DVOA, Rams we always can’t score on, Miami is underrated and shutdown the Pittsburgh offense with Big Ben). I would expect to put up 28+ on a very bad Saints defense next week. There is definitely room for improvement and like usual, they will get it going in the 2nd half like they usually do.

    On another note, has Wagner and Wright supplanted Keuchly/Thomas Davis as the best 4-3 linebacker duo in football? I don’t think anyone is playing as well as they are. Wright in particular might be the best 4-3 outside linebacker in the game.

    • Volume12

      It really boils down to RW. Not healthy, not able to scramble, not able to move around in the pocket, no play action or bootlegs which can set up the running game.

      And then there’s the fact that this coaching staff preaches ball control and not turning it over that RW won’t harsdly ever throw into tight windows or over the middle of the field. He’s playing very indecisively right now and seems to not be trusting his eyes. Other times he’s almost trying to force the ball to certain guys.

      Just not having a great year. But, I still wouldn’t want any other QB and he’ll get going as the season progresses.

      • STTBM

        Tyler Lockett’s injury has really hurt this offense. He was unstoppable, un-coverable until his knee got hurt. Wilsons injuries have also hurt. But the bottom line is the line has to be able to block–and they are 330 lb guys who cant seem to run block!

        Volume, I saw the same thing; Wilson starting to throw, then hesitating, giving the DB time to break on the WR, then throwing it anyway….off target. All game. He wasnt sharp, seemed to be second-guessing everything, and wont throw it over the middle often enough. He wasnt accurate at all until OT.

      • vrtkolman

        I agree with you about Wilson. I recall him doing this in the first Arizona game last year as well. These divisional games man, the Rams and Cardinals know how to play us.

  50. Kenny Sloth

    Eh I hate this offense. Fire Bevell trade Wilson and Baldwin. I wanna draft Deshone Kizer lol

    • Kenny Sloth

      Deshaun Watson is like a taller Russell Wilson.

  51. icb12

    I think we need more Alex Collins.

    I admire the new CMike. Appreciate that he has turned his game around for the most part.
    Appreciate what he brings to the table.

    But whats the point of RBBC if you don’t use your committee?
    Mix CMike and Collins equally, Spiller on 3rd.

    I feel like the Hawks are holding Collins back… for what reason? Development? No trust? Unsure- but I think it’s time to see what he can do with touches.
    Give AC the rock. And let CMikes insane burst be your change of pace. The speed difference is real. But it works best when you go from slow to suddenly fast rather than fast to suddenly slow.


    • vrtkolman

      Ehh, I’d rather give Prosise more carries than Collins.

    • STTBM

      Collins best run has been for less than 4 yards. He’s slow. No reason to trust a rookie when there’s nowhere for him to run anyway. At least Micheals can get a yard or two when there is nothing…

      Not sure deliberately starting your slower, less with-it back is the way to victory…

      Micheal has slowed down the past three weeks. Maybe he’s not used to the pounding of being an every-down back, maybe he’s got some nagging injuries, but seriously, its pretty hard to run well when the O-line is getting you hit before you cross the line of scrimmage.

      Even Lynch would be averaging less than 4 ypc with this line.

      • icb12

        He’s got 9 carries…

        I’m not saying he’s going to be great. I’m saying mix it up. Give him some more carries.

        Lets see what he can do. Letting AC tote the rock is only going to help CMike IMO.

        • Volume12

          Collins looks bigger to me than he was in college. That and he needs time to figure out the ZBS. Took Lynch a whole year, C-Mike 2, Ware 2 years?

          • C-Dog

            Great points. Lynch was slow to get going. Way too early to lay the verdict down on Collins or Prosise.

            • HawkFan907

              Which college programs run a ZBS? It would at least cut down on a transition period for a rookie. This years crop is so deep I say find a good one with experience that can make an immediate impact. Collins has shown a complete lack of vision. It has to be hard to judge for scouts but vision is huge.

              • C-Dog

                Oregon famously does it.

                • David

                  Freeman please. If not Fournette, Freeman.

      • george

        I certainly thought Pope would have been the better choice over Collins.

        • David

          Same. They released their best and most explosive back in the preseason to keep Collins. Ugh. Maybe they thought that Collins would be basically a redshirt but with Rawls and Prosise not playing at all this year, they could really use Pope to spell Cmike right about now.

  52. icb12

    I also want to say– Man.. What a freaking game.

    I see the internet alive with comments indicating it was a bad game, bad for ratings, too low scoring, uninteresting, nobody wants to watch bad kicking, blah blah blah.

    That was a GAME. A freaking battle. I loved it. The defense reaching down and grabbing a handful time and time and time again. It was a game that went down to the very last seconds of OT and I can’t believe the world at large doesn’t appreciate that for what it was. Yeah yeah, no win, tie is lame.. who cares. I’m usually pretty even keeled, don’t yell at the screen much.. but last night, edge of the seat the whole time.

    • Volume12

      Time for the NFL to go to College OT rules. Maybe put the ball at the 50 instead?

      • Rob Staton

        In light of this tie it is incredible that they don’t have a better OT setup. Just put them at the 40 and if you score a TD you have to go for two. Simple.

        • HI Hawk

          Ties are still pretty rare, I much prefer the NFL’s rule of “more football” over the contrived advantage-offense college rules. Defense is part of football, forcing a punt is part of football.

          • Mr. Offseason

            I like the current OT setup. The addition of the “field goal on first possession doesn’t win” really improved it, so that the team getting the ball first doesn’t have it so easy. I think in the NFL you should have to go all the way down the field to score; I wouldn’t like the college rules at all.

            I wouldn’t be opposed to there being a tiebreaker after one OT, but I’m hardly concerned about it. There’s a tie once every two or three years in the NFL. It happened to be us on Sunday, but it may very well not happen to this franchise for another decade or more. Not worried about it.

            Ties happen constantly in soccer (futbol), and they are a welcome aspect of the sport. I can accept a tie for my team once every four decades.

            Especially since we were so fortunate not to lose the damn game.

            • Volume12

              Ties shouldn’t be a part of any sport.

              The end goal? You play to WIN the game.

              • Kenny Sloth

                I prefer the tournament soccer rules for extra time. Really tests a team depth. I’d love an Oklahoma offense overtime where you get a couple goal line chances in sudden death. It would really increase the value of the running game in a pass-happy league

                • GeoffU

                  Seems too fluky. May as well toss a coin and go home.

                  • Kenny Sloth

                    For sure, i meant like a penalty shootout. I just love LB v RB in the B Gap

  53. Mac

    I would prefer the Hawks to come out with a trade deal for someone like shown Coleman. Trade a first round for a high second and swap 3rdsor 4ths. I really like that kid. He has grit but he is older than what you’d like.

    • Rik

      Cleveland can’t trade Coleman – they’ve lost too many offensive linemen to free agency and injuries as it is. I don’t see them trading Thomas for that very reason. They’ve been killed by injuries. They’re on their 7th QB in 6 games.

  54. Aaron

    Carroll on George Fant. “…(Fant) settled in pretty good. He’s strong, he’s quick, he gets it, he’s really competitive. He’s gonna be a terrific – he is a terrific prospect. Let’s see if we can bring him to life right now.”

    Count me in the camp for no OT trades. At least not for right now. I think the team should see what we have to work with between Fant/Webb @ LT. With the news that Sowell’s injury is a an unknown severity of MCL sprain; Maybe we should ‘R-E-L-A-X’. Our next 5 games are: @Saints, Bills, @Patriots, Eagles, @Buccaneers. Not exactly the murderers row of edge talents/defenses. Lets weather the storm and let Sowell come back healthy for another superbowl push!

    • C-Dog

      He also mentioned in today’s presser that they have Webb available and mentioned Gilliam having played LT some. it will be interesting to see what they do. It has been interesting that Fant has been active over Webb and Odhiambo.

  55. Donovan

    Amazing game and effort by the Hawks. A memorable experience.

    2 thoughts:

    1. Is long snapper an issue? While there weren’t any miscues in this game, there have been in prior weeks. And I wonder if that uncertainty is playing into Hauschka’s head a bit. (I know I’m more nervous watching than in the past.)

    2. The ability of a running game to “shorten the game” and run time off the clock is underrated. Something the Hawks have excelled st in recent years, but not this one.

    • 503Hawk

      I thought the bigger issue w/ Hauschka’s attempt was that the play seemed rushed. Why not run the clock down and call a time out and then kick?!!!

      • HI Hawk

        I thought so in real time too. It’s a bit weird because it’s almost like icing your own kicker, so I was torn in the moment – but it looked rushed. Call the timeout, let Pete punch Hauschka in the chest a few times to pump him up – then let him win it. He’s usually money under pressure, so the added pressure of “letting him think about it” wouldn’t likely phase him.

  56. Vista

    What are the current thoughts on Saquon Barkley from Penn St?

    • icb12


      Big. Fast. Elusive. Solid power. Stats and production back it up. Big fan.
      I think he’s a sophomore though?

      • Vista

        He is a sophomore this year. I just got around to watching the Penn St v. Ohio game today. Really enjoyed watching him in particular.

      • Volume12

        He is

        Him and LSU’s Derrious Guice look like the top 2 backs for next year in another really good looking RB class.

    • Rob Staton

      Wasn’t blown away with Barkely when I watched him last week.

  57. Volume12

    I saw something about our sack leaders. Avril with 6.5, Clark with 4.5, MosesBread with 3.0, and Cash Marsh & KJ with 2.0.

    Then someone says ‘some might say Bennett is underperforming.’ Who? People that don’t watch the games? Stats don’t tell the whole story. Disruption=production. And Bennett is one of the 5 most disruptive D-lineman in the game. He’s impossible to scout game planning wise, because he lines up at 4 different spots.

    • C-Dog

      Michael Bennett has been a flat out beast, and is a huge factor for OLs playing us to contend with. IMO, he makes the whole thing go up front, and Avril, Clark, others benefit.

      • STTBM

        Exactly. Bennett may be the most disruptive D-lineman in the game this year, with Watt out. I’d take him over Suh or anyone. And AZ CLEARLY gameplanned especially for Bennett; did you notice all the times a second guy came and and whacked Bennett when he wasnt looking and was engaged with a blocker? Bennett was the main focus of their gameplan, and that opened things up for Avril, Marsh, and Clark.

        Bennett had a huge impact just drawing attention, let alone anything he did in the game.

        • David

          Cards gameplanning to double Bennett is one of the reasons why Avril and Clark combined for 4 sacks.

    • vrtkolman

      Those sack numbers are crazy and I had no idea Clark already has 4.5.

  58. Volume12

    QJeff going on IR? He needs surgery.

    • C-Dog

      Doesn’t look good for him; he hurt his knee in practice. Feels like IR and a redshirt year for him is a good possibility.

    • vrtkolman

      Our draft class has had the worst injury luck.

  59. Vista

    According to Jacques Doucet, Leonard Fournette’s top speed in the game against Ole Miss was 22.9 mph. A comparison with someone from this past draft was Will Fuller who had a top speed of 21.6 mph last year.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      The little dude has wheels. There is some ludicrous rumors that he might go #1 in the draft.
      As Rob would say….. total RUBBISH.

      • Rob Staton

        Fournette going #1 could happen IMO.

        • Trevor

          I agree completely Rob IMO there are only two options if you have the #1 pick Myles Garrett or Fournette. They are generational talents in a loaded draft class. I know teams with QB needs will reach but to pass on one of these guys would be a mistake.

  60. george

    I applaud the stamina and effort of our defensive unit, but if you can’t put up more than 6 points you really do not deserve to win.

    • Volume12

      So then Arizona didn’t either right?

      • CHawk Talker Eric

        Hence the tie

        • STTBM


          • george

            The point was the missed field goal was the appropriate end.

  61. Donald

    Therold Simon who was cut from the Hawks this season, is now a DB playing on the Cards. I wonder how much better the Cards defense was because of insider information that he gave to the coaching staff.

    • C-Dog

      Probably no more intel than we would have gotten from Bradley Sowell. I think these two teams know each other pretty darn well.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Something I feel we’ve been missing the most is our explosive potential on offense.

      We have elite underneath and RZ weapons in Doug and Jimmy, but with Lockett a step slow and Richardson not reaching his potential we have lacked the threat to take the top off the defense. Kearse especially has been weak in the deep ball department.

      Our lack of consistent protection coupled with the limited running backs we are carrying has totally changed our ability to set up deep developing route concepts. Russell’s injuries have made it nigh impossible to salvage plays that are dead from the rush.

      Russell looks like Phillip Rivers these days

      • STTBM

        Its the line. Period. They arent run blocking for squat, and they cant pass pro against really good defenses. And Wilson is clearly affected by his injuries, not just in his mobility but in his throwing mechanics as well. He’s missing throws he usually nails and just looks erratic as hell.

        The line will improve. Question is, will it improve soon enough and to a degree that lets this offense soar?

        I am no Richardson fan, but I do think if we had a line that could run block decently and pass pro the same, he could be a legit deep threat while Lockett is recovering. But dont quote me on that lol!

  62. Kenny Sloth

    Something I feel we’ve been missing the most is our explosive potential on offense.

    We have elite underneath and RZ weapons in Doug and Jimmy, but with Lockett a step slow and Richardson not reaching his potential we have lacked the threat to take the top off the defense. Kearse especially has been weak in the deep ball department.

    Our lack of consistent protection coupled with the limited running backs we are carrying has totally changed our ability to set up deep developing route concepts. Russell’s injuries have made it nigh impossible to salvage plays that are dead from the rush.

    Russell looks like Phillip Rivers these days

    • vrtkolman

      It’s hard to throw down field without the threat of a running game.

    • AlaskaHawk

      Seahawks have plenty of speedsters that can get down field if RW has time in the pocket. Baldwin is the star, but there are 3-4 more like Lockett that are capable of having huge games.

      What they are lacking is big receivers like Graham that can be targeted on quick routes or for jump balls in the end zone. This season as I watch RW pass to Graham, it is the first time I have ever seen the Seahawks consistently throw to a tight end. It gives me hope that if they develop or add another 250 pound target, they will have a variety of receiving weapons.

  63. CHawk Talker Eric

    Anyone watching MNF missing Okung? Seriously, has Sowell been that much worse? Was Fant last night?

    It’s been stated by others like Rob, V12, STTBM and Trevor, but I hope Sowell’s injury isn’t serious and he’s able to play soon. Even if the coaches start Fant over him. Hate to see a guy give it his all, be “all in” in the Seahawks vernacular – and not be able to compete. In this context, it’s utterly irrelevant if he’s not the best player.

    Also, HOU roster so stacked it seems they should be better than what they are. Then again they are 4-1 going into tonight so maybe they are that good.

    • vrtkolman

      Houston’s roster is good, but their quarterback is so bad that it almost negates everything.

    • STTBM

      Of course we miss Okung. But he got injured in Denver, which shows you what would have happened had he stayed here; he would have been hurt worse, and sooner.

      No player out hurt is better than one that is healthy.

      I’ll take Sowell and/or Fant over Okung this year. At least with those guys there is hope for improvement and relatively consistent health. With Okung, you know he’s sub-Pro Bowl talent who is often injured and cant hold up in our system.

      He’s a lot like Unger; a guy who couldnt hack our system physically but who could be a star in a less physical offense.

    • cha

      I don’t have any stats on this but it feels like Okung has been flagged for holding a lot this year.

      That on top of his injury problems, yeah. Don’t miss him all that much.

  64. no frickin' clue

    I will trade a 5th round pick for the rights to Mr. Miyagi so he can do that thunder-clap thing with his hands and heal RW’s tender ankles. We could get by with horrible pass protection the last few years with Russ’ Houdini impersonations, not to mention the added benefit of forcing teams to keep a LB to spy on Russ instead of channeling everyone at the RB on running plays. We have no threat of run from #3 anymore; that 1st series of the game clinched that. He simply cannot elude the rush as well as he used to, so the downside of not having a stronger O-line becomes more apparent.

    I think the solution is to do more 2-TE sets with the TEs helping out on the edges. It likely means fewer explosive plays but what would you rather have? Empty backfield that leads to holding calls and 1st and 20’s, or a few more 2nd and 5’s?

    Maybe I’m being too pessimistic in my implication that other DLs can replicate what the Cards did. But to beat the best teams in the playoffs, we can’t afford to keep going 3-and-out like this. The defense will get worn out/injured if this keeps up.

  65. Kyle

    What do we have to do to get js and pc to draft fournette?!!! I know our tackles suck. But this guy is a difference maker. You won’t see games like this with him in it. Not gonna happen, same blocking same everything and he still will move the chains. Draft this man! He would open everything up for us and it wouldn’t be fair. Don’t think about, be about it and draft him.

    Also, what a game. Our defense is full of bad bad dudes! Love it. Game of the year for me so far because of our defensive performance. Just old school and loved it.

    • GeoffU

      Agree on Fournette, but you do realize what you’d have to give up to get him right? And that’s assuming the team picking there wouldn’t rather just have him for themselves.

      • Kyle

        We would be mortgaging the farm and next years for him. I would be okay with to honestly. I feel like if we resign players on our defense and develop the guys we got we will be okay with it. We can be highly productive in the UDFA sections especially with a draft of only fournette. It would make seattle, like it really needs to make it appealing, but even more appealing to these kids looking for a shot. We have a great crew of guys that we can resign and tag while grabbing some athletic freaks in UDFA that need some coaching. Im all in on the trade what we need to for fournette! I get goosebumps thinking about him and russ and the read option with jimmy and baldwin outside and tyler going deep. The possibilities and the things the defensive coordinators would have to worry about would be killer. literally it probably could give them a heart attack because of how hard it would be to game plan for all of them.

  66. Hughz

    Anyone else think our guys looked slower on that field?

    • Volume12

      It’s that turf. PC mentioned it. Saying they’ve had difficulties with it. The kicks even more so.

      This team will fly around on the turf in NO.

    • Rob Staton

      The turf in Arizona is horrible.

  67. taxspecialist

    “We. Are. Not. Going. To. Trade. Joe. Thomas.” — Hue Jackson

    • RealRhino2

      Just like they said about Josh Gordon. Wasted opportunity.

  68. Ed

    Still not a Bevell fan. No ingenuity. But I digress.

    If Cleveland is only asking for a 2nd for Thomas, send the 2nd. Then trade back from end of 1st for another 2nd and you get 2 seconds and arguably the best LT in the game under contract for 2 more years. Rework for more guarantee money for Avril, Chancellor and Bennett, let all FA go and save $6 million.


    • sdcoug

      I’m with you Ed, on all counts. You can also save some bucks cutting Webb

    • STTBM

      Bevell is occasionally brilliant. Most recently in the Atlanta and Jets games. He seemed to be doing his best to try different things in the AZ game, but nothing worked. Not really his fault our line blocked no one and RW was erratic…

      The guy drives me nuts too, but I thought he did a good job. Some days your guys just dont get it done.

      • HI Hawk

        An obvious gaffe to me was that he underutilized the running game and the TEs to help on the edges in the passing game. It may have been just as ineffective as the spread passing attack he was trying to use, but Michael is capable of making big runs – especially if we catch them in a blitz.

        • AlaskaHawk

          I haven’t rewatched the game, but my memory is that the Seahawks tried a few runs in the beginning and didn’t get much yardage. Plus the holding calls made it first and 20 way too often. Lets face it, their defensive line overwhelmed the Seahawks offensive line. There really isn’t a lot of room for runs until the passing attack opens up the field.

          • Volume12

            Re-watching the game, brutal TBH, I think they wanted to run it, but 2 things happened.

            1- They kept finding themselves in 3rd & long situations.
            2- due to being in that down and distance often, they couldn’t convert 3rd downs and the running game was never able to get going and find a rhythm.

            Some of the 3rd down failures were dropped balls, and RW not having enough time to put any touch on the ball and therefore over throwing guys.

            • cha

              And a couple of key 3rd down conversions called back for penalties too.

              • Volume12

                Yes, and the penalties. A few of which were very ticky-tack.

  69. Volume12

    Anyone else hope they find a way to keep Kelcie on the field with Bam Bam coming back?

    Always thought McCray was a decent backup, but he showed me that something extra last night. His effort was phenomenal.

    • Sea Mode


      Sure, he has been put on the spot by a couple major miscommunications, but it’s not like we can pretend that hasn’t happened to Kam as well.

      Kelcie tackles extremely well and has speed in coverage that Kam doesn’t have unless he is 110% healthy. I was just rewatching highlights from 2013/14 NFCCG vs. 49ers and that’s the last time I remember Kam really flying (to drag down Kaepernick).

      I’m certainly not saying trade Kam or bench him, he adds so much value lining the defense up, playing in the box, and intimidation/big play factor, but Kelcie is balling recently too.

      One of the top-rated gunners in the league as well on a small contract (717k/apy), just great value in exchange for a R5 pick! He is a free agent this year too, makes me wonder what they think they might have in Tyvis Powell or whether McCray will get a bigger deal.

      In answer to your question, a possibility we discussed before (although I seem to remember Rob not really going for it) would be to put Kam at SAM, having him play the run and cover TE’s/RB’s. Not ideal, but it would get them both on the field…

      • Sea Mode

        Ok, I also remember him flying around in SB48. The hit on D. Thomas and the pass breakup on Welker that he himself holds as the proudest highlight of his career, among several other plays… =)

    • STTBM

      Yes, I think going forward Seattle tries to get him on the field more often. Chancellor is a liability at times in the passing game, especially against really fast WR’s. I think Seattle looks at matchups a bit more closely–playing McCray more against teams with fast slot WR’s and Chancellor more vs running teams and teams with bigger WR’s.

      But Kam is more than just his stats, so he will play a lot and start if he can play.

  70. Volume12

    Hawkfan907, you asked which teams in CFB run zone blocking? Lots of teams do, but all coaches might teach their backs to read their keys differently.

    Heads up. You’re gonna get sick of seeing the word ‘bang.’ But there’s 3 runs in a ZBS.

    So, for example. On outside zone runs, move the 1st read to the end man on the LOS on play side for the bounce outside or ‘bang.’ The 2nd read shoulod be ther next man on the DL for the cutback or ‘bang.’

    On IZ, Inside zone, 1st read should be 1st DL on play side on DL for the bang play or bounce to the outside. 2nd read should be 1st DL on backside of the C for the cutback/bang.

    The landmark for IZ’s is inside leg of the tackle, but out of a pistol or RO formation, aim at the outside leg of the guard. This is what tends to set-up that bang or cutback.

    See what I mean? That’s just the tip of the iceberg.

    • Volume12

      *not 3 runs. 3 terms.

      • Volume12

        Bounce (outside), Bang (the inside leg of the OT), and Bend (backside or more commonly the weak side).

        Bang and hence are interchangeable on outside zones, because bang is just hitting the open lane, which tends to be to the… ‘Outside.’

        • Kenny Sloth

          At the pro level running backs are usually expected to at least have some perception of what those three types of reads would look like against all different fronts and be able to react in any circumstance. They should generally have at least an idea of which read, primary, secondary, or the cutback. You can’t just read your man’s ass to find a lane. You have to be knowledgable of both your offense and the defense you’re playing against.

          • Volume12

            That’s my point. Your not just reading ‘your man’s a**.’ That’s a landmark not as key. The ZBS is nuanced. Your making multiple reads and it has to be done quickly. Some guys just have a natural feel for it. Others need to adjust and if you’ve never played in it, the verbiage is completely different than what you’ve been taught the whole time.

            • HawkFan907

              Vol, thanks for the info man, I really appreciate it. I get that lots of schools run ZBS, so tape is a good indicator of “vision” correct? So many backs come into the league and struggle with vision, despite their talent. Trent Richardson and Knowshon Moreno to name a couple. I really think that is an underrated aspect in the process of drafting RBs. Obviously the scouts know much more than I do, but it has got to be hard to judge right? I mean so many teams have swung for the fence and missed because these guys cannot pickup the concept. Remember how good Monte Ball was in college? That lack of vision killed him! Marshawn was so good because he was patient enough to allow the holes to open up for him. Have you noticed any backs out there in this class that display this kind of patience and vision? There are athletic freaks, and then there are patient runners. In a ZBS a patient runner is what is needed and what we could really use right now.

              • Volume12

                Vision is huge. Absolutely. Marshsawn was extremely patient and he squared his shoulders to the LOS, could point his foot toward the sideline showing he had the loose hips/flexibility to make guys miss. He was a rare cat. The last of a dying breed.

                Now, great question BTW. There’s so many backs this year that would fit. As for the best at those particular things? It’s really subjective, but…

                Stanford’s Christian McCaffrey is incredibly patient.

                Florida St’s Dalvin Cook and Oklahoma’s Joe Mixon have the best blend of vision, patience, and cutback ability for me at least.

                Also, as with any prospect Seattle will draft, who’s the Alpha male?

  71. vrtkolman

    Watching the condensed version of the game again, and I have to give a huge shout out to Frank Clark. He had a stellar game. Avril had the big numbers, but Clark was nearly as disruptive and he had a much tougher matchup against Veldheer. Avril got to feast on the Cardinals version of Garry Gilliam.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      The 3 horseman…. Clark, Bennett and Avril all were disruptive and had good to great games.
      The DTs also contained and limited the rushing attack when it mattered (goal line / 4th and 1).
      DL, LB and CB played a very tight game …. championship quality defense.

  72. Jim

    Hi Rob,

    My apologies as I did not read every comment (many of which are great) but I haven’t noticed any where if someone did an analysis on why we were able to move the ball so much better in OT than in regulation – was it play calling, their defensive effort what? I didn’t see us play D differently in OT so why was Wilson able to hit Kearse and Baldwin better/


    • Kenny Sloth

      Russ took the safety wheels off at the end. I was holding my breath because he really was moving much faster than he had allowed himself at any time in the last several games.

    • AlaskaHawk

      I think it is due to several things:
      One is that the offense was in more of a rhythm. It was pretty much 3 and out all through the regular game period. It wasn’t enough time to develop a rhythm. And Seahawks are notoriously slow starting. So if you are slow starting and you don’t have more then 3 plays at a time, the team just never gets started.

      Second is that the Arizona defense was slowly tiring. Not as much as our defense which was on the field 3/4 of the game, but they were a little more tired.

      Lastly the refs weren’t calling as many of the ticky tacky holding calls as before.

  73. Mr. Offseason

    If you’re going to do a trade, and it’s next to impossible, my choice would be Breno Giacomini. Plug him back in at right tackle and move Gilliam to LT. The Jets would be among the candidates to make a trade like this given that its leaning toward a rebuild year for them.

    • Kenny Sloth

      His contract is probably more than you want to spend right now. Carry over as much cap as we can.

      The thing we have to admit is this line (after we plug in a left tackle) can only get better. Through this season and beyond.

      Trading for a stop gap veteran just before this loaded draft doesn’t scream ‘win forever’, y’know?

      • Miles

        I know — a trade is likely very unwise, especially if it takes away significant cap space. It is hard to envision a scenario where this line improves this year without adding to it. I know last year the line has gotten better. But one difference makes this year a stark contrast — our running game is lethargic. We’ve always utilized a great running game to be so successful. Can we be successful without that running game? I think it’s unlikely and although a trade will probably not help, we have got to improve in that aspect of our offense. How can we make that happen?

        • Kenny Sloth

          I’ve said a few times that I’d love to bring in Matt Kalil for a workout. He’s coming off of an injury and could settle for a prove-it deal to make a run at a ring.

          Wouldn’t that be funny if he won one before his brother. Like Eli/Peyton haha

  74. Kenny Sloth

    Assessing our needs for the 2017 draft and free agency in preparation for training camp; feel free to chime in.

    1 QB Veteran FA or UDFA
    1 RB, (2/3 if CMike (Spiller, too?) walks) possibly as early as the second.
    1/2 FB to battle for a spot if they can make their mark, imo.
    1/2 Receivers probably wouldn’t be selected before the 4th and then udfa

    TE is a weird one. I’m pretty confident Like Willson will look to cash in as much as he can, but he’s had some pretty quiet seasons since Jimmy Graham started flying around the Sound. I think Rob is right on with an Evan Engram pick. It’s a very safe luxury pick in my opinion. Perfect for a championship contender. One or two years down the road he could begin to look like strong leverage against an exuberant overpay on a JG extension. If Willson leaves I’d say we definitely try someone out, if not, it doesn’t make much sense to pick one up, really.

    OL, similarly could go several ways. Even if they keep Gilliam, Webb, Sowell we at least need some depth and competition. I could see a day 2 pick and a fifth or later. Could see a veteran addition. If Matt Kalil comes in on a prove-it deal, I’m calling dream team. 3 additions along the line

    • Kenny Sloth

      2 DTs to push Jarran Reed and the redshirted QJeff. Rubin and McDaniel are still balling out so I see no reason to not keep them on hand through camp.

      2 DEs one could perhaps be an early round pick. If it is, expect them to be an inside/out rusher. Maybe if a talented player falls slightly in the first (all the way to the 32nd pick…) we would scoop them up. Could add another with talent but red flags later on.

      1/2 LBs to add special teams depth and perhaps push for a starting role.

      1 Safety to add to the production line.

      Could go early with corner in a top heavy class. I think we’ll see 1/2

    • Kenny Sloth

      I personally wouldn’t mind seeing a P/K being brought in to learn from our veteran duo. I’ve had a few come across my radar but college kickers rarely stand out.

      I could see a return specialist at one of the skill spot additions to spell Tyler when he is hurt or needed on pffense

    • Dumas

      CJ Spiller just cut

  75. Volume12

    Hope this DL Malliciah Goodman Seattle signed can help out, because he is a freak! Over 36″ arms!? 6’4, 275-280 lbs. 1.67 10 yd split.

    QJeff looking like he gets the red-shirt year.

    • Aaron

      Really disappointed about Q.Jeff. I had some impossibly high hopes. 🙁
      Next man up!

      • Kenny Sloth

        I wasn’t too excited by Jefferson. He’s kind of a lunch pail guy. Had two kids already when he was drafted.

        • Volume12

          Yeah, nice 4th guy or so to have in the rotation. If he gives us anything more than that great, but if not he’s a 5th rounder and can be a Greg Scruggs, early in his career, type of player.

          I think the guy they wanted there was DL Ronald Blair.

          • Kenny Sloth

            Definitely I had a third round grade on him and several saw him as a first round sleeper at some points during the process

            Imagine if we had Kyler Fackrell and RBIII instead of Vannett/Odhiambo and QJeff. As much potential or upside as those players have shown, those guys would be contributors for me, both.

  76. Kenny Sloth

    “@GermainX1: Yalls work is usually trash, but this is really a dumpster fire @PFF”

    Ranked Sowell, Gilliam, and I’d do the 2nd 3rd and 9th worst players, respectively, in the entire NFL this week.

    Ifedi also called out a writer for saying he wouldn’t go in the first. Made him eat that tweet, literally.

    • Volume12

      Josh Norris @ Rotoworld I believe.

      There’s gotta be a reason why, but it’s interesting how much Ifedi plays on his toes when he makes contact.

      • Kenny Sloth

        Extra lever? Just knows how to explode. It’s like Kam turning himself into a missile I’d think. He almost jumps.

        Aside from the negated (brand new) clearing the pile penalty that was seen to be initiated by the Cardinal player, GI has played pretty clean ball. I don’t remember any

  77. Kenny Sloth

    Rob and Kenneth are live taking questions over at

    • Aaron

      Hey Kenny,
      Just tried to make an account to post a question over at fieldgulls… Can’t post for 3 days. Was wondering if you’d make a straw post for me.
      Would like to ask Rob/Kenneth to highlight a favorite 2016 UDFA Seahawk. I was just about to make a thread about McEvoy/Elliott.

      QB Trevone Boykin, TCU, 6-0, 213
      FB/DT Brandin Bryant, Florida Atlantic, 6-2, 289
      CB DeAndre Elliott, Colorado State, 6-1, 189
      T George Fant, Western Kentucky, 6-5, 296
      DE Christian French, Oregon, 6-5, 249
      DT Lars Koht, Florida International, 6-5, 279
      LB Steve Longa, Rutgers, 6-0, 241
      RB Tre Madden, USC, 6-0, 223
      T Lene Maiava, Arizona, 6-4, 314
      WR Tanner McEvoy, Wisconsin, 6-6, 230
      DE Montese Overton, East Carolina, 6-1, 226
      DE David Perkins, Illinois State, 6-2, 233
      SS Tyvis Powell, Ohio State, 6-3, 211

      • Kenny Sloth

        Ah!! I missed ya! Good news is it sounds like they’ll be trying again next week. I was lucky I got off early and was making the rounds when I noticed it haha

        Thanks for the heads up, ROB! Lol jk

        • Aaron

          Np my man. I thought your second question was mine just modified a little. Now I’m trying to watch the world series game 1 with a few beers (Sad about the M’s, Lets go believeland!). I’ll see if I can gather my thoughts and make a decent post about one of my favs here in a few minutes.

      • Kenny Sloth

        Obviously McCevoy has been the biggest contributor, but I sure am glad we got George Fant, I thought he’d get drafted and we wouldn’t have a chance at him.

  78. East Side Stevie

    Heres a look at our newest roster addition back in his high school days:

  79. CharlieTheUnicorn

    The word on the street is Fant gets the start this week vs the Saints.

    Maybe this is a tryout, if he flops, they pull the trigger on a trade.
    Where the heck is Odhiambo and Webb and the rest of the guys….. that you go to a raw rookie LT…

    • C-Dog

      I think they’ve had Fant active every game over Odhiambo, and they had Webb inactive against the Vardinals. This could be telling how they view Fant vs how the fans view him.

    • MoondustV

      Wait till the saints Game? Idk there is enough time to finish any trade.

      • Volume12

        The most disappointing thing? Sowell was never supposed to be our starter at LT. Gilliam was. They thought they had one in him.

  80. dylanlep

    ‘Joe Staley will be traded before the deadline. Giants, Seahawks, Pats in play. But BEST fit is Giants. What’s the comp is the question!’

    That’s what is being reported by NFL draft bites, whatever it’s worth

    • Kenny Sloth

      Is that word for word what they said? If not it’s likely purely speculative

      • dylanlep

        It’s the exact text from their tweet

    • vrtkolman

      The Seahawks are “in play” for every single trade or free agent rumor out there it seems. It would be Baalke’s worst move yet if he trades him to their hated rivals.

  81. Trevor

    I have resigned myself to the fact that there is no way we will get Joe Thomas but if anyone doubts whether he is worth a 2nd round pick please read this great artlicle from a Browns site. He truly has had a legendary career and it is so unfortunate he never really got his due because he is on the Browns.

    My favorite Joe Thomas fact that tells me he woudl fit right in on the Hawks and click instantly with Russ.

    Since he has been drafted he has play for 10 years and never missed one snap!!!!!! Think about that for a moment he has never missed a snap. Not one in 10 years. That is 9262 snaps. To not miss one is Cal Ripken like. This despite having 3 torn MCLs and 2 high ankle sprains.

    If the Browns won’t trade him I totally get it but please JS if we can get him for a 2nd rounder make the call! I don’t care how loaded this draft class is. Joe Thomas increases our chances of winning the next 3 Super Bowls more than any other player in the NFL or college football.

    If you doubt that read the article. It is a pretty compelling case.

    • Trevor

      Also to those who say the trade would go against PC/ JS ” win forever” think (Harvin, Graham trades). You can argue if they we good trades but it showed PC /JS realize that in order to win forever you have to win now.

  82. Trevor

    Why Does Tom Cable Get a Free Pass? Genius? I think not!

    I spent a ton of time the last couple of days watching OL tape and thinking how the Hawks can patch up this OL looking back to last year when they turned things around etc. It is just so hard to compare because Russ not being able to run changes everything. Pressure off the edge was never an issue for him it was pressure up the middle he struggled with.

    This isn’t just a one-game (or one-season) issue. Since 2011, when Tom Cable came on board, the Seahawks have spent fewer and fewer salary-cap dollars on their offensive line and trusted more and more in Cable’s well documented belief that he can take any lineman and make him into ZBS star. That may have been the case when you could cut block and chop at will like human bowling balls but not anymore. Since he arrived the results have been iffy at best, and with Beast Mode out of the picture and Wilson less than optimally mobile, more pressure is put on Cable’s teach the OL to actually pass protect and they / he are clearly not up to the task.

    In all the teams and OLs Cable has coached they have always been near the bottom of the league in Pass Pro. What does this tell you. Is he really the genius everyone makes him out to be? Fans are so quick to throw Bevel under the bus. What about Cable?

    Britt looks like a keeper at center. Glowinski and Ifedi are young players with big time potential. Sowell is a hard nosed journeyman better suited as a backup and Gilliam is still an athletic project.

    Who has Cable developed into a star on the OL? Look at Okung the other night on MNF his technique is still awful and he is still getting the same holding calls that killed us for years.

    I think the failure of the OL year after year is not a result of lack of asset allocation (draft and cap $). It is quite simply, is a repeated failure in coaching and evaluation. For that, Cable should be held primarily responsible.

    If you want to really fix the OL pray Cable finds a HC gig this off season and hire the best OL coach in the game Bill Callahan. He will be in the final year of the a 3 year deal with Redskins and Paul Allen should get the check book out. Look at what he did with the Raiders, Cowboys and now Wash. He develops great OL players and would be the best way to fix the OL IMO.

    • Trevor

      Also I always hear about how Cables’s scheme is so hard on players physically and causes more of them to get hurt. So not only is the coaching method not working with regards to pass pro and now run blocking but it causes more injuries and probably makes it harder to recruit veterans as a result.

      Can someone tell me what the benefits to his scheme are? Please don’t quite the #1 rush offense. Because when you have Russ running for 500 + yds and Beast Mode that is not the feat it appears to be.

  83. Trevor

    Just saw a quote where Walter Jones came out yesterday and said the Hawks need to trade for a new LT. I guess if there is anyone who would know it would be the Legend himself.

    Can you imagine this team the last 4 year with Walt and Hutch manning the left side. Talk about fantasy land!

  84. Trevor

    Still can’t believe Mcray played 108 snaps on Sunday. That is crazy! He played well too after 104 snaps he still ran down Nelson for the game saving tackle in OT . Props to him for bouncing back after Sherm threw him under the bus. Obviously another big heart guy.

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