How can you play so poorly for three quarters and still win? Get your safety to head the ball to a teammate to change the game.
There have been some bizarre wins in the Pete Carroll era plus some strange and unique ways to claim victory. This was a new one.
The end result is the Seahawks dodged a major bullet to take advantage of San Francisco’s improbable third straight defeat and claim first place in the NFC West. They avoid having to go to Baltimore staring at the prospect of a 4-4 record going into the challenging part of a tough schedule.
There aren’t that many positives apart from that — but that in itself is the main thing. That’s what makes this such a confusing game to assess because, well, they won.
Somehow.
Even so, I want to discuss some real issues with the team.
The offense has too much talent to play the streaky brand of football we’ve seen so far. The second half against the Rams. The second half against the Bengals. The first half against Carolina. This entire game after the initial two drives.
The offense has a habit of grinding to a complete halt, with no idea how to utilise an assortment of weapons to kick things into gear. There are too many good skill players on this team to be this inept for long stretches.
They’ve ploughed resource into the offense to make this a formidable unit. What they’ve got instead is an offense that can look great and horrible in equal measure.
They scored 17 points in the first quarter and were shut-out after that until the final minute. Until the end, it felt like the Rams in week one all over again.
It all felt so avoidable too.
Curtis Allen outlined the importance of running the ball in his game preview, pleading with the Seahawks to playing to their strengths while limiting Cleveland’s on defense:
The Colts last week decided they would rather play to their strengths and planned accordingly. They only asked Gardner Minshew to throw the ball 27 times (against a whopping 40 runs). They gained 168 yards and had three touchdowns on the ground.
A 23/40 pass/run day for the Seahawks would be just what the doctor ordered. Split those 40 runs between Ken Walker, Zach Charbonnet and Deejay Dallas and keep Garrett in check as he chases runners rather than the quarterback.
When Geno Smith threw his second interception, it was his 26th throw. At this point, Ken Walker had six carries. Zach Charbonnet had three.
In the fourth quarter Charbonnet drove them over half-way and a drive was finally on. What then? A false start, Geno throws a bad incompletion and then took a sack.
They ended up throwing the ball 37 times in total, with Walker and Charbonnet combining for just 13 runs. How did this happen? Those 13 runs produced 119 yards. That’s 9.2 yards per play. Why didn’t they lean on the run and play off that today?
They did the opposite of what worked for Indianapolis last week. Even if it wasn’t Myles Garrett wrecking the game until the end, the offense completely stopped functioning and it didn’t necessarily have to be this way.
People will point at the Browns defense. This same defense gave up 38 points to the Colts last week, the same Colts who just got pummelled by the Saints and Jaguars either side of that game. They’re good but let’s not mistake them for the ’85 Bears or the Legion of Boom.
For whatever reason, Seattle’s play-calling seems muddled and their plans all over the place. The tight ends are unstoppable one game and then anonymous the next. The running game hasn’t been fluid, consistent or felt like their identity at any point this year (despite the claims that they want it to be). They don’t seem to know how to properly feature their star receivers in a way other teams do.
None of this reflects well on Shane Waldron, who has too many weapons to see his offense switch between so many extremes. He should be under pressure. This offense should be performing far better and far more consistent than it is.
Geno Smith, meanwhile, looks like the player many of us initially expected in the summer of 2022 when they made him the starter. He has physical tools, nobody can deny that. Thus, he has some impressive moments. He can make really nice throws — including his first touchdown today. However, throughout his career he has played too often like we’re seeing currently and it’s why he’s never stuck as a long-term starter.
Last year he had fantastic turnover fortune with regard to turnover-worthy plays. This year, the luck is running out a bit. He has six interceptions compared to nine touchdowns. Even today, he could’ve easily had a pick-six on a miscommunication with Jaxson Smith-Njigba (dropped by the defender) and he nearly chucked away the game at the end with an poorly executed end-zone throw to D.K. Metcalf.
He’s not playing well enough. You can’t have an 9/6 touchdown/interception ratio in 2023 and be given a pass. While he’s far from the only one to blame for the offense being so streaky and lurching between extremes, he’s also the quarterback. The main man. The one who will always take on extra scrutiny.
He and Waldron have to be better. Otherwise it’s only fair to question whether Seattle’s roster chock full of offensive talent is in the right hands. Increasingly the only conclusion you can come to with Geno is that he’s an adequate bridge quarterback and nothing else. That doesn’t mean he should be benched. It doesn’t mean Drew Lock is better. Yet it’s hard to watch him playing at this level and feel like he can lead Seattle to a Championship, justify a $31-41m salary next year or be anything more than a placeholder for whoever is next.
The Seahawks should be looking to draft a quarterback in 2024 and be aggressive about if needed to get the right guy. It’s time. It was probably time this year if we’re honest. It definitely will be next April.
Then there’s the defense. Kudos to them for sticking in there with no help from the offense. The Browns are well coached and found answers in a way Seattle barely ever does on offense. The defense still made the key plays at the end to give the team a chance to win and they were able to snatch this one away. The offense owes the defense a debt of gratitude.
Even so, they also struggled at times to make an impact. Playing hapless teams like the Giants, Panthers, Cardinals and a stuttering Bengals maybe created a bit of a false dawn. A Browns team with a backup quarterback and no Nick Chubb had their way with the defense for large stretches here.
The unit contains talented players for sure and has a lot of potential. Boye Mafe collecting sacks is a major positive. They have youth, depth and extreme talent at corner. The linebackers are playing well. Two safeties combined to make a game-changing play at the end. There’s a lot to like.
I still think, based on this showing, they are clearly missing a blue-chipper up front and/or the creative schematic chops to change games.
I don’t think the thing to do would be to splurge tomorrow ahead of the deadline. I hope their approach is restrained and opportunistic (but probably more restrained).
I think we need to embrace this team for what it is. It’s young and talented. It can be exciting but also very streaky and frustrating. Questions haven’t been answered about the coordinators yet and the quarterback isn’t playing well enough currently to cement his place as the unquestioned starter. Another good draft class is required and keeping stock to possibly be aggressive in the QB market is worth considering.
Even so, first place is first place. Time to enjoy it — that and the fact the 49ers have lost three in a row.
Cheers 🍻
Wonder if they held KW out due to the calf injury flaring up during the game? He didn’t practice Wed. and Thursday, but had 8 carries for 66 yards, over 8 yards a carry before they pulled him.
Well, at least they didn’t ruin the experience of the cool throwback uniforms… I’ll take it!
We’ve been making fun of Jamal Adams catching balls with the helmet, but boy for once that helmet delivered. Game ball to JA helmet!
It was as if the hawks did everything they could to lose the game after the second quarter, but the last 2 minutes of the 4th saved them. Geno with another 3-4 turn over worth throws. Give me an athletic qb from college who is accurate and doesn’t turn the ball over and I would be ecstatic.
I’m happy that Geno redeemed himself and actually threw a redzone TD but at this point I’m done with him too. Depending on where we draft in the early rounds, I wonder who could be QBs that would appeal to John Schneider. But I’m not liking this next years class of QBs
Jj McCarthy
Spender Rattler
Bo Nix
Michael Penix jr
Could be possibilities.
Two of those guys are probably not NFL quarterbacks. And another might not last 5 years from injuries.
Like Will Levis in Round 3?
Will Levis’ 3 of 4 TDs looked like college TDs.. still need to see when he faces better secondaries..
Better defense than most of what we’ve seen.
When’s the last time Geno threw for 4 TDs in a game against any defense in his career, some presumably pretty terrible?
Never.
Geno should not be a barometer.. theres even a clip of onr of the tds to hopkins was OPI.. if you look at the long throws, he just chucked it.. good deep ball throws but they were wide open throws, where the wr had plenty of room to adjusts.. nowhere near the throws RW made for the hawks in stride.. i only say that because we have all seen RW throws..
Even rob has said that geno throws a good deep ball.. that doesn’t make a great QB..
See Genos play for the last…. 10 games hes play for the hawks..
Geno is essentially classic Russ, without the mobility. Home run ball preferred, hesitant to throw over the middle and takes sacks at the worst time. But, also will maddeningly keep you in a game in the last five minutes, regardless of outcome.
How does he miss the deep shot to Bobo every week. It looks like the play is designed to roll out and hit the long ball. That should be the first progression, but he either doesn’t see it or doesn’t throw it.
At least Geno gives the impression of being aware when he has screwed up. His expression and body language after the winning score cried out “well, at least I dug us out of the hole that I created” rather than joy at the win
Great point! Wish the same was true for DK.
Man the penalty situation for this team is brutal, 2 key stops and a would be 3rd and long just handed away on utterly stupid and borderline questionable calls. Then on Genos Int at the half Garret is a full hand over the line and the line judge totally misses it. Felt like we shoulda lost but also coulda also won a lot easier if not for the ticky tack stuff.
How does Diggs miss the open field tackle at the 5 yard line every week?
Why does he lollygag around in the backfield play after play? Seriously go back and watch his half effort to get into position and waiting for the RB to get through the hole and come to him. The dude is making WAY too much money simply to stand around in space. Step up and hit the RB! Run to the ball after there’s a catch! He reminds me of Robinson Cano “running” to first.
Everyone has a specialty.
The one against Dobbs last week was actually on Woolen shoulder hitting him.. if you watched the camera behind the O line you see it clear as day that Riq pushed him right while he was almost full speed and got by Diggs..
It’s extremely frustrating to have three corners you rate backed up by three safeties you don’t rate. Makes for a weird combo to take in where if I was a team with half a brain I’d screen pass infinitely on the Hawks until Seattle does something different.
💯 I’d run clear outs and isolate RBs on Wagner in coverage and throw to whoever Jamal Adams was covering. Then I’d sit in-breaking routes into coverage holes any time we played zone coverage and run screens that forced Diggs to make open field tackles.
You still need clint hurt to call a defense that gives him the free rein to do that.. but diggs os still the deep saftey option.. you cant run cover 3 then..
I would need to see what defense they run to see how they’re beat on screens.. but watching the games they dont have enough linbackers to cover and its big nickel that gets beat by linemen running downfield to block..
Seahawks announce Bill Nye to raise the 12 flag at Lumen.
https://www.fieldgulls.com/2023/10/29/23927685/seattle-seahawks-announce-bill-nye-to-raise-the-12-flag-at-lumen-week-8-throwback-cleveland-browns
#why?
Between his extremely popular science show and his involvement in Almost Live!, he was very “1990s Seattle.”
Will he wear a throwback lab coat?
OK I literally LOL’d. Good one man
I never much cared for Nye’s acting, but then again I don’t generally think much of those Hollywood types.
Thrilled to get a tough win, but frustrated with every facet, from coaching to players to playcalling…to the massively terrible refereeing.
Glad Geno pulled one out, but I want a new QB ASAP. I’d rather ride and die with Lock, personally, though only injury would make that happen, and I won’t wish that on anyone. So go Geno….hurray?!
I guess a positive that in a 3 week span, hawks lose the game more than Bengals won. Bengals beat 9ers and Browns beat 9ers. Hawks pull off a win somehow against Browns.
Offenae going hot and cold a lot.
Quick passing game/screens still killing the hawks. They have more undersized d linemen that are quicker than thet are stronger is forcing them to over pressure to get pressure and linebackers are unable to mask the issues from the dline on screen passes..
Why can nobody give DK catchable balls? I feel that was Russell’s problem too and geno is continuing the trend of not giving him a chance.. should be easier to get DK the ball than it is to Tyler, but he consistently gets good passes to Lockett.. dont know what to make of that..
Lastly.. the only good ball that has gone off of Jamal Adams head for a turnover. All the other were just embarassing..
The defense stepped up. Overall, thought they played pretty well. Kept the explosive plays down and didn’t wear-out even though they were on the field for over 60 plays and 13 more minutes than the Browns defense.
We keep seeing glimmers of the offense we have been promised. One game, excellent TE usage, another game a good/great rushing attack, then another game where we see the rookie WRs deliver the goods. The OL has been holding up, considering everything, but the Seahawks have not yet played their best game on offense.
Take the win and buck up for next week.
One simple tweek on offense I’d like to make is to start off the game with Zach Charbonnet & later, when the defense is worn a bit, send the dose of Walker III. Just a hunch that it will spark the running game and thus a much more balanced & consistent offense.
Start with the Freight Train & mix in the Bullet Train.
What a win.
Guarantee you next week we go into Baltimore aiming to run the ball 20 plus times.
I assume that we ‘featured’ Dee Eskridge today so that we can prove he’s healthy & hope for a late round pick for him at the trade deadline? It’s the only thing I can think of for why he was in there.
Agreed. I’m hoping for that nice 2026 6th round pick back
DK must have gotten a talking to by PC or someone.. Felt like they were trying to pester DK a little and he didn’t even respond. Good to see so far.
When watching the game today, I focused a lot on the Charles Cross-Myles Garrett match up, and Cross did not disappoint. It was great to watch Cross hold his own against a game wrecker like Garrett.
What you don’t notice is sometimes more important than what we bitch about.
I absolutely agree Palatypus. I think Cross leveled up today considering the tear Garrett has been on the past few weeks. I thought Bradford showed up today as well, another gem in regards to the Seahawks draft this year. I wish Olu started at Center today, but it was good to see Brown back in the line up.
Now if you’ll excuse me, I need to finish watching Bloodsport.
O-line not being a problem…and not really being much of a problem for a few weeks now. We are running out of excuses for the offense.
Love Bloodsport. First saw it in the 90’s when staying home sick from school.
Witherspoon is awesome. Just rewatched that last interception. As the ball is in the air spoon sprints over to shove a WR out of the way and then turns to shove another after the interception is made.
Pretty excited about Woolen getting a bunch of picks. They are scared of spoon. He should’ve had 2 today and will keep gettchances.
Was fed up with that Geno pick on out. But a guy was offsides so he thought it was a free play. Explaining Pete’s anger.
5-2 I’ll take it.
Geno likely had no idea he was offsides. That’s pretty hard to see from under center. Pete, however, likely had a pretty good view of it.
I’m kind of blown away with how good the players from the last two drafts are.
Cross, Walker, Mafe, Lucas, Woolen, Spoon, JSN, even Hall looks good, Charbonnet, Bradford, Bobo as udfa, Jerrick on special teams.
Crazy to pull that many dudes in two classes.
Feels like they must’ve really shrunk their board pre-draft or something and known exactly who should be a Seahawk and who shouldn’t.
Or as has been rumored, John took over control of the draft for the most part.
That is the clearest and best explanation. No panic in any picks.
I’ll say it first: with some tongue in cheek, but…let’s get Russ back…;)
I can deal with us starting with a good first quarter then daring the other team to catch up on us and finishing the game up in the last minutes. Heck we could even win a Super Bowl this way. But we should stop using Geno and Wilson’s name in the same sentence.
“We should stop using Geno and Wilson’s name in the same sentence.” –Mick
When do you plan to stop? Should we wait for you to stop first, or go ahead and get a head start on that now?
Metcalf was more a decoy than a target in this game, with the defense focusing on D K, Lockett was eating their lunch. What a talent.
DK was targeted 14 times
Trade coming???
Might not be a great idea.
Geno reminds me a bit of Hasselbeck in that he’s an incredibly streaky kind of quarterback, but also of Tavaris Jackson in that he makes really dumb decisions a couple times per game, and you hope they don’t screw you out of a win. If they go into the playoffs (assuming they get there) without an identity as an offense we will get dumped in the first round again, doesn’t matter how good the defense gets. Charbonnet is a hammer every time he gets the ball. They should use him when they get an early lead and then turn to Walker for the lightning when the defenses are gassed. Dink and dunk doesn’t work when you’re sloppy, every 5 yard penalty is a total drive killer
the aim in sport is to win, and like last season The Hawks win while being constantly questioned.
5-2 and could have been 6-1 – thats a great start to the season.
Let’s not make out like the things discussed with this team are not valid talking points
This game is a great example. We all enjoy the win. We also need to discuss how poor they were for three quarters
Wins against a horrible Carolina team, a horrible Giants team, a Browns team with a backup QB, a horrible Cardinals team and a quite good Lions. Let’s see how things go with games against a stretch of better teams on the docket i.e. Ravens, 9ers twice, Eagles, Cowpukes plus games against decent stealers and Titans teams and of course, another loss to the Rams cuz McVay owns Carroll lock, stock and barrel.
The good news is the 9ers look eminently more beatable than they did 3 weeks back.
It’s a weird situation. This season was supposed to have a harder strength of schedule. Very strange happenings along the way thus far and we’re the beneficiary of “known knowns,”…Daniel Jones was a mirage/fraud. Carolina wasn’t good and who knows if they made themselves worse by taking Young instead if Stroud. Like you said Browns have been playing way above their weight with a crap QB.
Right now. I had Seattle at nine wins. Now. I can see them with wins against commanders, stealers, titans (?), AZ again, niners, other…getting up to 12 wins.
I remember WAY back in the 80’s, my friend and I would constantly comment about the LACK of screens (and draws) on offense AND the lack of the Seahawks ability to defend one.
This has been going on for DECADES, and it’s basic fundamental football based on execution.
You have to hand it to the Browns for exploiting this obvious weakness, and doing it with new looks that weren’t on tape. That’s giving them credit, but also at some point a staff needs to get players in positions to limit the damage caused.
They didn’t do it the entire game and Cleveland took full advantage. Lucky header and INT saved a sure loss.
Smith, after all these years still makes ill advised throws. His luck will run out with players dropping sure pick 6’s…..Seriously WTF Smith. I started calling hi Shith by the end of the 3rd quarter and told my friend,
I have ZERO confidense in this guy to get us to and win a SB.
Methinks however that the weird state of the NFL makes it possible. As you said in the stream Rob, SF looked unbeatable and now look at them.
I guess we gotta just say, great TEAM win and roll with the yin-yang of the ride.
I simply do not understand the lack of commitment to the run game overall in general and yesterday in particular. As Curtis pointed out the Colts (screw that franchise forever, or at least until Irsay sells) were very successful doing so last week against Cleveland. Plus Pete supposedly is a run oriented coach and more importantly, we lost TOP nearly 2:1 again yesterday. Running the ball with a modicum of success keeps your defense off the field and psychologically and physically wears down your opponent. Maybe most importantly, this team’s QB is very inconsistent so why not take the opportunities to throw picks out of his hands more often?.
My best guess on this, is that the passing game was open. You also don’t want to tell your starter that you don’t trust them to make what were very basic and routine completions.
That, and the Browns were essentially daring the Seahawks to throw.
I get the idea that you should still run at them, but I’m not faulting Waldron since the real problem was Geno’s execution.
I think it falls on both of their shoulders.
9 yards a pop. I know that’s not sustainable. But either is giving the running backs 13 carries.
This week I’m less interested in talking about Geno and more interested in shining a light on Waldron. Pete probably would not do this in season like the Ravens did years ago but Waldron is turning into JAG.
We’re playing the same but somehow worse offense right now than when the other guy was here. Except we have running backs, really good…I think…TE’s. And four (!!) Wr’s all of us rate to some degree.
The big advantage that I read to a near nauseating level last year was geno would throw over the middle, take what is given, use the TE’s. Where is any of that? Dee eskridge for the yard losing end around? This isn’t h.s. football.
I’ve got big doubts on Geno. But patient zero today is Waldron.
Right there with you Peter, and have been for awhile.
I could be off, but I believe the disconnect between the PC ground-n-pound offenses we’ve come to know and love and expect (partly because Carroll claims he’s still of that mindset), and the pass heavy reality we’re watching each week is…
Shane Waldron, of the Sean McVay coaching tree (read: Mike Shanahan)
I think the disconnect also speaks volumes about how much (or little) direct control Pete has over the offense
I could be wrong. But I’ll need a better explanation than this though to explain it.
Could be Blitzy.
In 2013-15 we were pretty much the leader in the league in run to pass ratio, roughly 55% run to 45% pass. Russ had a hand in that though because he ran a fair amount in the early days, roughly 6.5 times per game compared to Geno’s 3.75 over the last year and a half.
“I simply do not understand the lack of commitment to the run game” I agree 100%, especially considering the resources they have put into their personnel. 2nd round RB picks in each of the last 2 drafts, 2 RBs in this past draft. It doesn’t make sense.
Doesn’t make sense does it TJ. Pete says one thing and then on Sundays doesn’t follow through. I was a staunch supporter of 2 RB’s being picked this year including using one high pick. But if they aren’t going to commit to the running game why bother.
Yes the Oline has injury issues. But what settles down an offensive line more than getting to fire off and run block.
Overall, I thought this was an impressive win where multiple players elevated their games against a pretty damn good opponent, so I’ll give the fans who just want to sit back and enjoy the win the grace of saying “enjoy yourself”.
It is impossible to not come away from this game and be impressed with the Oline, WR group (minus DEsk), RBs and TEs. This group went against a top NFL defense that had dismantled some teams and came away looking up to the task, save one position. There seems to be a debate about whether Waldron deserves a share of the blame…at first watch I’d say probably not, as much focus has been on the horribly bad (and it was bad), numerous other sequences stalled because of poor decision-making and questionable accuracy. Running more may have helped, but you need to trust your QB, and your QB needs to make the right read and throws.
None of that is a call for benching, although the near pick 6 had me on the precipice of calling for it. It isn’t a call for Lock either. It is a restatement of what I’ve said from the beginning that Geno represents this teams floor and ceiling, they will go exactly as far as he will take them. There is no upgrade in season, other than coaching and hoping Geno finds a switch – we have to roll with what brought us.
The defense performed almost exactly how I thought it would save for Diggs going back into pre-Giants form. The Browns are a great running team, and they targeted and victimized Hall, Clark, & Taylor in descending order performance. Taylor just cannot be on the field unless it is the clearest of passing downs, and QB scrambling has been negated by time factors. Taylor is that bad. Clark looked overmatched. Hall (predictably) had a mixed bag, but frustratingly got fooled in the same QB keeper that got Taylor last week. Interestingly, when I’ve criticized the defense nobody really seems to mind, even the usual commenters who are quick to defend DT seem resigned that his play is bad.
I liked the offseason moves and even mixed it up with various bloggers in my thoughts that the run defense would be better. This defense has played better than anyone outside of the Seahawks Org, realistically expected. Hurtt’s fiery hot seat has cooled to a lukewarm temperature. If we weren’t paying $50 million for three safeties, most everyone would be pleasantly pleased with the defensive side of the ball.
So why the gap? I’ve seen ridiculous comments, and some laughable takes, on the defensive performance. People have all but called for DK’s public execution. On another site, I got called a hater for suggesting that the ball thrown at the dirt in front of a wide receiver feet was a bad throw.
I apologize for the length, so here’s the summation: I’ve had a lot of players in my life, who were my favorites, sometimes I’ve been lucky enough to have my favorite player play on my favorite team. Because they are my favorite player, I know them inside and out I know their tendencies, their strengths, their weaknesses, and their body language. It has never been my job to climb up on my horse in my white armor and ride off to defend that player. If anything, I enjoy talking about the player because they are my favorite.
Hand on heart.
I realized perusing other sites last night to get a pulse of fans’ thoughts…..
1. I still think every coach has a shelf life with a team. Has Pete rebuilt it? Probably. Was he the one the orchestrated it’s collapse? Also probably.
2. Selfishly though I think the reason I want a new coach is I’m over the sycophantic brain numbing tribalism in this fan base.
That it’s now somehow more important where you stand on your side than always reaching for greatness.
I don’t understand fans commenting that stats don’t matter. Newsflash. Sports that have a score attached to them are in their most basic form a statistic. Score A is higher than score B. It’s not that hard.
I’m not sure how it is abroad though I understand this attitude exists mostly everywhere. That there is no greater threat to your livelihood than someone who doesn’t agree with you. You’re not a “real,” fan if you don’t agree with X position.
I love stats. I also know that don’t “tell the full story.” Here’s a story…this team is basically the same whether DK is here or not. He can’t make stuff happen and the QB can’t throw to him. I thought it was a lack of targets but it’s not that. It’s an expensive mismatch of player and team.
Here’s another story: if you call people Geno haters, that they don’t “deserve,” him, that they are confirming their priors and you can not discuss whether a player should be making 31 million dollars, not mind you being cut or released….but just the softest of soft takes that maybe, just maybe 31 million is a teeny tiny too much for these results….I just think it comes off like regular, old fashioned, self induced brain fog. And I hate it.
All of these things, all of them.
It might be worse with other fan bases, but it is mind numbing. There is an increasing number of what I would call “middle of the road commenters” who are souring on Geno, and who also don’t want PC to be in charge of selecting our next QBotF. The polarization is real, and it seems to be focalized on one position. Is this RW hangover? It feels a bit more like a culture war.
What gets me to log off, is that so many of the ‘no criticism’ crowd act as gatekeepers – immediately questioning your fandom, or football IQ, or generally just resorting to name calling. 3 things they would never do in person.
Thank you LCH for your perspective…
I Love this site for insightful commentary and yet, at times I feel I need a break due to how intense the fan reactions are…
I do not want to tell anyone how to feel over their 5W/2L team that is currently leading the NFC West and is 2nd-seeded in the NFC. The Defense is showing up and numerous of the defenders are Really showing out. Our defense and the record are each as I would have hoped going into the season.
Because of a rash of injuries, the O-Line play is Far below what we were expecting and it truly has affected Geno’s play. Occasionally, Shane Waldren calls slow-building plays. The long-ball is so Fun, but the quick-game is more of what is needed until they get all their best Bigs back together.
KJ Wright has my respect and apparently, this Defense, Geno, and the PC/JS leadership have his. I am good with that.
Excited by most of the defense.
I’d argue that the oline is playing better than I thought. I assumed brown was a blythe. The interior is better than last year. Cross seems to be continuing his growth with some hiccups. RT is the only spot on the line that is worse. Bradford us an upgrade. And brown as well.
I wonder if every team has some version of this blog* being written up. The NFL is entirely made up of streaky teams who can beat anyone or lose to anyone any given week. In my opinion there is not enough talent, especially at QB, head coach and coordinator, with 32 teams vying for it to build a consistently good team. It makes for competitive, unpredictable, and close games that are good for a wide array of fans to keep tuning in but it’s maddening for those of us who follow a team hard, or enjoy well played football. Going even further than the article, the fact that this Browns defense was league leading is suggestive of defensive play across the league being in a pretty sorry state. Number 1 made a couple of good desperation TD saving tackles, Garrett got loose once, but they were very ordinary. In short: streaky and inconsistent is what every NFL team is, you don’t have to be very good to win a lot of games (a quarter plus three minutes is plenty of good play to beat most teams, as they aren’t going to muster even that), and the NFC and maybe even the Super Bowl are there for the taking this year. As for Geno, if he is the luckiest QB in the league, you just ride it until he isn’t any more. Against the Browns he was almost impossible to sack and that’s all the Browns had to try and beat us with. I agree, however, that it’s time to line up a good replacement in the draft because you can’t be left holding the bag like the Niners now that the next Joe Montana has morphed into a turnover machine.
*inferior version, obviously
This is probably right. If we are going to win and currently we are maybe it doesn’t matter.
This comes down to the off season. Is Geno going to lead us to a superbowl? Who knows. Maybe he does.
Now that the niners look mortal I think Seattle could actually win the West. The only real thing I’d want to see going forward is just some identity. I do think it’s going to be a problem if we are consistently feeling out the game for most of it.
Why? Because we beat them? Doesn’t that say more about your opinion of our team than theirs?
Any given Sunday isn’t just a movie title. It’s a thing. Because football is a sport played by humans. Imperfect humans who, on any given day can play like world beaters or take a world rocking beatdown.
What’s a fan to do?
Thank goodness for statistics, which help cut through the false noise of any given day. Cleveland have an excellent defense. One of the best in the entire League, anchored by the top player in the League.
Interesting observation though that Geno was sacked only once yesterday, despite several near takedowns. He’s not known for his scrambling in traffic, and yet at least twice yesterday he escaped a sack by scrambling in traffic.
Monday thought after yesterday.
Is Seattle in a position to make a run this year and if so should they make a medium sized trade for a defensive player?
Faults and successes with Geno to the side here. The defense is young and exciting however problems persist. Notably the screen game and how we fare against a real running team.
As of writing I think Seattle can win the west. To get to the promise land that would mean a second battle probably away against Philly. And if I’m being bold a superbowl against a second battle against perhaps the Ravens.
I’m torn as to whether I think Seattle should stand pat through tomorrow or go big.
My contention the last few years has been the offense is a big part of the problem for our defense.
3rd down conversion %
2021-23rd
2022- 20th
2023-23rd
Plays per game rank
2021-32nd
2022-22nd
2023-27th
A offense that is poor at converting 3rd downs is a team that doesn’t stay on the field. An offense that can’t stay on the field means the defense is on the field more.
This little imagination offense with a almost 60/40 pass/run split has shown to be consistently mediocre under Waldron.
Pretty good point. In the first quarter Seattle had a strong start including 3/3 on third down. Before the final drive that stat turned into 4/12. It was getting ugly out there.
Look at Philly. They have a manager at QB which is all Geno should be. Philly has a 50/50 run/pass split compared to our 40/60 run/pass split. Philly is 1st in 3rd down conversions, 2nd in TOP and and 3rd in plays per game. All stats that keep your defense off the field. Waldron needs to watch some Philly tape and pick learn a few things.
I did not know that about Philly but that explains a ton about how they are getting it done.
Over the last three years the teams in the top 5 of pass to run are a who’s who of poor football. The only exception is KC which usually ranks around 6th, but obviously they have Mahomes.
Conversely the teams closer to 50/50 tend to be the more consistent playoff teams with managers at QB. Teams like Philly, SF, Tenn, Balt.
Love your post with stats to back it up. I said the same thing above about TOP and how much a low amount hurts your D. Appreciate that you brought more than opinion to back it up. (at least my opinion is that of someone who’s been a football “freak” for 59 years)
Thanks Mike,
I’ve been watching for about 50 years. Dad and friends were original season ticket holders so started going season 1. Loved those AFC years in the dome.
The odd thing to me is Pete constantly states he wants to run the ball. They have drafted recently to do just that yet still the 60/40 split. As much as Bevell got stale it would be interesting to see what he would have done with the renewed resources spent on the oline and RB’s. Seattle-2013-15 under Bevell were in the 50/50 range.
Overall I’m pretty happy they maybe are learning how to pull out big wins in close tough games like this. If you are going to become a good team, you need to be able to win games against elite defenses.
Personally I’m tire of the Geno conversation because it seems settled. He’s a really good QB if he has elite protection. Otherwise he middle of the pack. It’s pretty obvious between the numbers and his age he’s the guy for this year, maybe next. That’s it.
Waldron to me is the bigger talking point, it’s tough having a different OL each game, but still. He seems pretty good to open games, when it’s scripted but is not good in-game once he gets past that. The lack of run commitment was baffling because 1) it was working 2) can only help against the pass rush and with play action 3) ZC clearly deserves more touches.
The defense was bad against the screen today, and gave yards to a top rushing attack, but still only gave up 20, and made plays. They also had some pretty poor penalty luck on numerous calls that could have got them off the field.
Shane Norton Jr. will never be an NFL OC again after his tenure with the Seahawks is done, but Cooking with Russ was comfortable with him, so here we are. I think the card he’s holding, you know – looking like he’s calling plays, is actually a menu from Waffle House, which explains a lot. Geno’s out there trying to run a western omelet.
On a personal note, I predicted a 5-12 season, so it looks like the winning is done for this season. Toastmadamus is never wrong.
Shane Norton Jr. is the worst country & western artist in the world..
With hits like, “She Said Run, So I Passed,” “You’re Bringing Six and I’m Blocking Five,” and, of course, “End Around and Out for the Year (Featuring Dee Eskridge)” you wonder how he missed.
The Eskridge Boys were pretty bad, too.
They’re big in Branson – kind of like U2 at the Sphere – great Christmas show where they just do the novelty hits, including that barking dog rendition of Jingle Bells…and you’ll never hear “Grandma Got Run Over By A Reindeer” the same again.
I think I may have caught them at Silver Dollar City, right before getting on Fire in the Hole and praying for death.
Good laughs to start the week guys!
Same, only for me it was after eating a short stack of silver dollar pancakes at the Denny’s in Roseberg, Oregon
Saw yesterday again on both sides, RB’s and end-around plays going out of bounds for a loss on the play. Does anyone know if there is a rule where only the QB can throw the ball out of bounds past the line of scrimmage to avoid the loss?
There still has to be a WR in the area. If it’s a pure designed run, the WR’s are probably blocking and the OL could be downfield.
Freelancing a play like that to a throw could get you grounding, OPI or illegal man downfield.
That #12 Seahawks throwback jersey that Jaime Erdahl is wearing this morning would look much better on Kay Adams.
Yes, but could she set the edge?
My worst nightmare is Cynthia Frelund wearing a Seahawks throwback pantsuit.
Playoffs? – Playoffs??
Very cool – despite any issues with our team, we are currently the second-seeded team now. 10 weeks early, but better to be here now than where we were expected to be (4th, 5th, or 6th)…
Defense
With 7+ new starters, nobody should have assumed this defense would be this good until like week 10 or so…then again, we are approaching week nine. Regardless, this D is ahead of any realistic expectation. Very impressive.
Geno’s issues
Of the players we have, number 7 is 2023’s best chance for this team to win. Drew Lock has talent and needs to locate his calm. His biggest challenge is his inability to locate his groove. I suspect if he were going into a run of several games of being ‘The Man’, he would begin to find an easier vibe. For now, his game resembles that of a quality rookie, so 2023 is not his year unless there is an injury to Geno (which is exactly why Lock is a Hawk).
DK
It seems to matter very much to our opponents as to what DK is doing. Very tight corner play with Safeties who are also paying attention. Those D-Coordinators know the game and seem to know what Shane Waldren’s intention is with regard to Metcalf.
Even if DK intends to dial down his edginess, I would never expect him to say so publicly. His comments do not – in any way – worry me. At all.
Waldren
Shane calls an uneven game. Exceptional at times and somewhat rudimentary as well. I can live with this but I wish he were to react to how his offensive line is playing. The last few weeks were really tough on his QB and playcalling did indeed play a part – not 100% – but even Patrick Mahomes succumbs to pressure. His play-caller typically is better at scheming a faster game when needed. Geno is actually quite good at the quick-read/quick-release game – we saw this late in the game.
As David Copperfield would say, ‘More please…’
Five and Two – First in the NFC West – Second-seeded in the NFC period. Perfect is better but this is Not bad.
Very well put. A lot of reasons to be pleasantly surprised, and some areas where we can and should demand better. Fun season so far, let’s keep it going!
This was one of those “buy the ticket, take the ride” sort of games.
The Hawks mostly lost the game in yards, first downs, 3rd down efficiency, T.O.P. (Destroyed), but a key turnover and clutch TD won the day. They beat the odds statistically and that’s fine and fun- no complaints here.
Can’t bank on many of these type of wins so worth savoring. Can certainly draw a few thru lines on the season – Mediocre Geno, frustrating 3rd down annd red zone playcalling, improved defense, solid year two developments and rookie performances. More to be excited about than frustrated.
I’ll reserve my fullest judgement when a mostly healthy Hawks team plays a hot Baltimore this week.
Anyone out there desperate for a LB?
I wonder if we could get a 6th or 7th for Devin Bush. He had 1 snap yesterday on defense after being a healthy scratch the last two games.
“gently used Sunday granny driver” special
I was thinking the same thing. The below guys could and should be available:
Devin Bush (Another healthy scratch)
Mike Jackson (Tre Brown has greatly improved)
Dee Eskridge (Best of luck to him, but hasn’t done anything for the Hawks)
I wouldn’t trade Jackson because depth.
Btw, do the rest of you know he’s the 2nd Michael Jackson to pay for the Seahawks?
Yeah but he doesn’t play saxophone (as far as I know).
How nice would it be to have Levis on the bench learning from Geno THIS year.
I’m not sure I ever heard the reason(s) of why the Seahawks passed multiple times to draft Levis. My perception is that they felt he was too confident to the point of being overconfident (like an Aaron Rodgers) and a potential bust as a result. I can’t believe it was because of his play, more likely the “mental” questions arose and scared them? Does anyone know what went down on draft day/pre-draft? I would feel much better about the team if Levis had taken the place of Lock as back-up, starter in training. Personally, I think they Seahawks would have benefited from a very confident QB, even with a few “personality quirks”.
Here come the excuses:
https://x.com/bcondotta/status/1719030970941333924?s=46&t=uv5_Cfk4hepYHPYUO6WNbQ
I’ve been told that certain talk radio personalities are grading Geno’s performance as excellent.
If Cleveland was excellent, I wonder what Detroit was? God level?
What?
Excellent?
Who said that???
“Geno Smith had a fantastic start, a terrible middle of the game, and a straight-up perfect finish. And in this league, how you finish games like this is how you are judged. In my view, Geno had an excellent game because he made the throws when he had to make them.
He had help, of course, from Jamal Adams, Tyler Lockett, Boye Mafe, Darrell Taylor, and a host of others who had excellent games. But these are the wins that are so crucial in determining not only how a team finishes a season, but how a quarterback is judged. When Geno finishes games like this, it reinforces the team’s decision to stick with him and is a big notch in his belt for the future.”
https://sports.mynorthwest.com/1768597/seattle-seahawks-instant-reaction-comeback-over-browns/
Bob’s lead story tagline was Geno Smith had an “uneven” day.
Softy more on point:
Seahawks will have to win games despite Geno, he is just not reliable any more even at his best.
It’s baffling they are not mixing in Drew little bit at least to throw defenses off. Drew played decent in one drive he played this season.
Level of stubbornness by Pete is simply non-comPETE!
That’s exactly what it was
Imagine typing that out and thinking “job done.”
This media is the worst.
Trade that should happen but won’t: Noah Fant to a TE needy team.
Rationale:
1-It banks $3.8m in cap room they can plow into next year when they’ll badly need it.
2-Fant has only been targeted a criminally insane 16x in 7 games. He’s on pace for his lowest-targeted season by a country mile. What are the Seahawks using him for??
3-Up until this year’s snoozefest, he was on pace to be just behind TJ Hockenson. Hockenson garnered a 4y $66m contract in August. The Seahawks have neither the cap flexiblity, or apparently the desire to use an asset that expensive.
4-The Vikings garnered a 2nd in 2023 and a 3rd in 2024 for Hockenson and a 4th in 2023 and a conditional 4th in 2024. For 10 games of work. They took that second and traded down to stock their roster with young picks. That is far better than the 2025 comp pick they may or may not get for Fant depending on who they sign in free agency.
Agreed but I’d add trade him only for picks
Let’s start accumulating some extra capital to make the move for a QB when the opportunity presents.
I agree with that Blitzy. At this point we have Dissly, Parkinson and we could pull up Mabry from the PS. If we aren’t going to use the TEs to catch, trade him away and bring up another blocking TE. With the use of the WRs and RBs, Fant was a solid throw in from the Russ trade, but we need to prep for the future. There’s no way we’re paying him Hockenson money (Dissly is being overpaid next season as well).
As you and cha have said, free up cap money to roll into next year and gain additional draft picks
Agree with both of you and cha too.
sign me up… who needs a TE ??
Love me another 2R24 !!
Maybe then Dissly would have more than 6 catches for 56 yards. I know he is a good blocker but c’mon with that contract.
Watching the game yesterday also got me thinking why they even need fant with Bobo on the field.. he plays like a smaller better Luke Willson. Why have Fant Dissly Parkinson and Bobo.. just run Bobo in place of fant and another Wr like DK if youre going jumbo.
Theres probably more flexibility without fant at this point.
With the Leonard Williams trade, I wonder if the Seahawks have a plan in place to swap Fant and get some stock back…
This is a remarkable statistic
Yeah. Something is brewing. Can’t get it until draft time but just wish there was another quality DT to keep everyone rested.
I might trade something decent for a QUALITY DT today but nobody likely to do so.
This aged gracefully. 😉
John Schneider heard your prayers, Leonard Williams traded to the Seahawks.
Ha! I am stoked.
For real?!?
They forgot to mention that was only for 9 snaps.
D’oh!
They have to actually run the ball in the second half to get grades on the other Olinemen.
Looks like ATL just raised the price of the DT trade market… : (
I hope it’s only outgoing players for picks (or a swap if the switch is right)
Vikings could use Geno, just saying.
I’d trade Geno for a fifth at this point, and ride with Lock.
Shhhhhh.. Rob is watching you.. 👀
Remember when Teddy Bridgewater had that horrific camp injury and the Vikings traded a first round pick for Sam Bradford?
I would trade Geno for the Vikings 2024 R1 pick
I remember. Bradford had no heart/guts. What a useless bum.
I’d rather have Geno than that
Vikins might just decide to tank. I bet that would go over like a lead ball In with their two young WRs and guys like Hunter…
Just for the record, there is only one statistic you need to know about Michael Pratt. And that is he spells his last name with four letters and two T’s.
Because you’ve been F#$*ing been told twice!
BTW, all priors have been confirmed…LOL
Carrol came out and told the TV sideline reporter Seattle needed to have balance, run the ball more in the second half. That’s what was reported, though they didn’t air it live, just recapped the conversation.
But Walker had no carries and only one catch, and Charbonnet had 5 carries and 1 catch all day. You can’t tell me Carrol will put up with that much longer. He’s going to clamp down, to the string of our offense.
I agree they should have run the ball more, but they have 4 legit WRs and three TEs…and the throws were there waiting for Geno to make them: he just sucked. He kept throwing to DK–but either ten feet over his head, or at his shoes. WTF?!
In game, I thought Walker must have aggravated an injury. But why not more Charbonnet? He was killing it!
They need to get closer to 50/50 pass/run, but they need to be consistently effective. Running into a brick wall repeatedly won’t improve anything. Running on every first down won’t help either. Somehow they have to get better on third downs, and figure out how to run on third and short. Long passes down the sideline on third and short are low-percentage, and should only be tried a handful of times per season. Seattles already used their allotment!
The only thing I can think of is they have PTSD from the last few years of not having any running backs available due to injury.
Walker was on the injury report and didn’t practice much this week, and ZC missed games with a hamstring worry.
//shrug
If Walker wasn’t hurting, nor Charbonnet, this has the feel of Schottys last year, when Carrol made him dial the offense back to the stone age to weeks, they fired him at seasons end.
I think Waldron better start running the ball more often, and find a way o improve consistency, or his seat will get red hot in a week or two.
Waldron offenses have been so streaky, but they have always struggled on third down. That big flaw needs improved…
Waldron does not have a feel for game…goes prescripted for the most part except the final drive(when trailing) and within the boundaries of Pete’s plan.
feels like a player swap is brewing…
So then, I see several stealers players and Mike Tomlin are whining about the officiating in yesterday’s game against the Jags. That’s rich considering your team was gifted a championship by shit officiating (following the pre-determined script) in XL*. News flash stealers, your franchise doesn’t EVER get to snivel about officiating because of that travesty. EVER.
I sure am glad we aren’t playing them this week cuz you can bet they’ll be getting a “makeup” game cuz you know, “legacy franchise”.
Oh, wait, that’s five.
Unrelated to the Hawks, but who else felt weirdly vindicated with that performance by Will Levis yesterday? I know it’s only one game, but man he was such a magnet for unwarranted hate leading up to the draft. The Twitter draftniks were out there in full force calling him a day 3 pick. I hope they give him a chance to build on this performance and knock it off with the Malik Willis desperation gadget junk plays. Levis isn’t without his flaws for sure but I feel like with the draft season dragging on for so long, people kind of forgot about how good his arm is.
WOW
Williams has an $18m salary this year. With 10 games to play, the Seahawks’ commitment is $10m unless they got the Giants to pay some of his salary in the trade (I really hope so.)
Holy shit!
“Significant portion”
*insert smiling/nodding Jack Nicholson gif
And there is the reason for the extra third. All makes sense now!
cha,
I was just about to text and say make the money makes sense. I look forward to seeing the future details of this because this seems like a big win for us.
Hawks made a huge trade!!
Wow!
https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1719059763781058858?t=0LSLz6FW9_h33FAnxSYtuQ&s=19
For a 2024 2nd and a 2025 5th!
This a great trade, love it!!
Wow that’s freaking fantastic!
Welcome to Hawktown Leonard Williams!
Dropping Leonard Williams into this defense tilts the field perceptibly for Seattle
What a coup!
A 2nd rounder next draft seems a bit of a hit, but considering we have our native 3rd and Denver’s 3rd it isn’t as big huge one.
What’s Williams’ contract situation cha?
See my string above
So he’s a 10 game rental then?
At worst. If he’s totally unreasonable in his contract demand.
But I have a feeling they’ll find a way to extend him. He’s a class above Sheldon Richardson for the same price.
Hope so cuz damned steep for a 10 game rental if that is indeed how it works out.
Your points about him better than Richardson and lack of comparable in draft are good ones for sure.
Agreed if he’s gone next year. FWIW I think Seattle had every intention of extending Richardson beyond 2017, but his impact on the team wasn’t worth the investment.
And those were more desperate times in the sense that it felt like Carroll and Schneider truly believed they were one piece away from the SB.
Given the general weakness of the NFC, I’m sure Carroll and Schneider truly believe they are currently one piece away from the SB. Heck, I was willing to believe they had a great chance before they signed Williams. I think they rightly see that there is no one to be afraid of in the NFC, they should take a chance now.
It is until you consider the alternative — there just isn’t the depth of talent in this draft class even to hope to get a player of Williams’ caliber.
The cost of the pick is good value in terms of how much he improves the roster. His cap hits are another matter entirely.
If we don’t extend him will we be able to get a compensatory pick back?
Very good question. Anyone know?
Yes. If the Seahawks don’t spend in the market.
Thank you and that’s big. If we can’t re-sign him and “don’t spend in the market” (and considering our cap situation that seems unlikely), we should get a 3rd compensatory. So we’d get 10 games of Williams for moving from likely later 2nd to later 3rd and a 5th. THAT is damned fine GMing John.
That later 3rd will be for 2025, if Williams even gets a very good contract elsewhere.
But it’s not that important of course.
Williams is ideal for 3-4.
Now if they just manage smother the opposing teams, run the ball with our shiny 2nd round picks, and punish with passes from PA, where Geno excels, me might be into something.
Oh OK. Still good imo. Of course I’m hopeful we re-sign him and it’s moot.
Exactly….the same argument was made with Sheldon Richardson and then once he left, considering other moves we were left with no compensation. I like the player and its a position of need…i hope they’ve had contract extension discussions with the player + agent before doing this…or we will have another Jamal Adams bloated extension in sight
Leonard Williams to The Hawks for 2 picks!!
Is he still good?
Yes, very good. This is huge.
With the strength of the young core of this team im %100 into trading up to a top 3 pick for a qb. With that though, whats this nonsense about Williams saying he wants points in whatever franchise drafts him? Is this a tactic to get a garbage team to not draft him, or trade the pick to a franchise he’d rather play for? Sorry if this has been discussed already.
Just saw the trade news. Spending a 2nd on Williams makes it less likely to trade up, but the NFC is open and I understand them being in to win this year.
They were not going to trade up for a QB anyway in my opinion. If they wanted to trade up they would have done it last year when they had the capital. Can’t believe we got a stud like Williams at a position which was in dire straits at the start of the year. Williams, Reed, and Jones rotating on the interior is formidable. Clark, Taylor, and Mafe on the edges make this D=line exceptional.
It could be. Williams knows. He’s the top commodity in this draft and he also knows that means the sorriest team or someone trading up will be able to pick him number one. This could be very much like Eli Manning, and telling the chargers that he refused to play for them even after they drafted him.
I don’t think Caleb Williams is coming to Seattle by any means, but I do think he is trying to plot where he doesn’t want to end up
I totally appreciate the kid wanting to go somewhere that will set his career and life up for success, but asling for points as a rookie is NUTS. You get your 4th ring you can start talking about owning a piece. The owners wod come unglued if anyone actually agreed to it.
Guys Florio (who KNOWS legal stuff) said it is absolutely not allowed to give any active player a piece of a team. It’s Kaleb’s dad blustering.
I am completely caught off guard. Never thought they’d do it. They’re making their move. I suppose they feel this is the closest they’ll get to talking the division and more.
Had to be done. As I posted above if the seahawks have plans on this year they needed this rotation to improve to keep reed, jones, edwards rested.
Oh, I don’t disagree that suitable reinforcements are/were needed. A 2nd and 5th is a lot to give up for an older rental, especially since it only cost NYG a 3rd and 5th to acquire Williams four years ago.
We’re nearly certainly going to have to move back out of the 1st round to reacquire draft capital, which we may have done anyways. Hoping this works because Richardson didn’t.
True. Richardson and Clowney. Maybe third times the charm?
I get the doubts.
Maybe this speaks to the lack of talent in this draft?
Blitzy theorized that above.
You might get a slow LB and an old sock with those picks in the 24′ draft.
So it’s 8 PM in England. You ain’t asleep yet are you Rob? Hell, you never sleep so you gotta be rolling in with reaction soon. 🙂
Rob called out on trading Leonard Williams yesterday as 2nd best option can’t wait to hear from him.
Williams was a monster a couple years ago. Not sure he’s worth a second and change….But if he plays well vs the run and adds a little pass rush, I don’t think anyone will complain too loudly. We needed D line help, and Williams is stout. This is bound to help Reed and Jones by taking pressure off them, not to mention our OLBs like Made. Could be a really good deal for both teams, and for Williams: he’s got a shot at the playoffs now.
I just hope its not a Adams style oversize contract when we extend him, or a one year rental like with Sheldon Richardson.
For now based on their cap situation, they won’t be able to afford extending the old good Bellore for their annual 3 mil, Williams will be a tad more expensive.
Apologies if this is a repeat, but Albert Breer is reporting Giants are paying his entire salary except the prorated minimum. About 600k impact on the Seahawks cap this year. That’s why it’s a 2nd rounder.
May not be the wisest long term move but it’s super fun!!!
https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1719066515318685944
Seems pretty obvious Pete and John think we can at least get to the NFCCG this year. I’m skeptical cuz of Geno but as Rokas said above:
John must be picking up on the lack of talent in this draft as you’ve talked about before – makes sense that he would ship out a pick if he feels there isn’t interior value in the draft
They’re still deep in the red for this offseason though, has to come with a Fant trade + maybe a Diggs one as well
I like the acquisition, love the player. I’m a little hesitant to love the deal because I want to draft a QB so badly and we need all the draft ammo we can get to move around for one. Now, we either take one in the first or we have to wait until the 3rd. The way Denver played yesterday doesn’t give me hope the their 3rd will be a really early 3rd. I think this means they will rework Geno’s deal to free cap space next year and roll with him. Again, love LW for the short term, but I’m very concerned about next year. Please. Say something to change my mind.
Maybe John has his eye on a guy he thinks everyone else will see as a 2nd or 3rd rounder and is very confident will be available late 1st?
I think you’re right to be concerned about next year and all the comparisons to Sheldon seem valid.
I’m going to enjoy this year and hope this trade works out more like the Duane Brown trade than anything else.
Things are breaking our way right now. We needed the Giants loss against the Jets for this possibility. I’m thinking that the play of the 49ers and Eagles over the last few weeks helped also. Finish an ugly victory over a high rated defense, find yourself in 1st place, It’s time to take your shot!! Great deal, vintage Schneider, this could work out nicely.
Win now mode. Not a fan. This feels like the Sheldon Richardson trade.
I doubt they go anywhere near a QB until round 4 next year. It’s Geno or bust.
Feels like it could be a drop back out of 20-32, recoup capital, target the QB (Rattler, Leonard etc) that they want outside of the first round. Drake and Caleb weren’t going to be alive for them.
JS/PC passed Levis by not once but twice. I know it’s been one game for Levis and I’m sure he’ll have his ups and downs. What they got in the 1st rounds though seem high quality so I can’t gripe about it, but Levis would have been nice to have and sit this year.
I agree that it’s possible they wait till the later rounds to draft a QB, but give Geno a few more games to ef things up and they might change their minds
Band-aid Pete strikes again. Maybe he should spend more time trying to prevent penalties rather than trading away future assets.
This is the exact type of move that is a failure if you don’t win the Super Bowl.
I feel like we decisively overpaid here. A 2nd rounder plus for one year on a 29 year old that we really shouldn’t be re-signing. I agree it fills a big need and could work out really well if it moves the Seahawks from a middling playoff team to a real contender, but I don’t see it as being likely to have that impact.
Giants basically payed to get the higher pick.
First thing I thought was Sheldon Richardson …
Sorry to be a downer, but a 2nd rounder for a 10 game rental is bad resource use. Whether we resign him is immaterial to whether this is a good trade or not (we could’ve signed him anyway as a free agent if it was decided that was the best use of our cap space). We’ll know pretty quick whether it was worthwhile though. For me, If the Seahawks don’t at least make it to the NFC championship this year then it was a wasted use of draft capital (even then, without a superbowl win I could see it being questionable).
The trade will never match the J.Adams level of immediately obvious complete buffoonery when it happened, but if I’m a betting man, I think it’s more likely that this will look like a waste of resources in retrospect.
Its an acknowledgment that Dremont Jones didnt work out and failed in draft in adding depth.
Atleast its not a trade with Jets. Can they not blow another 2nd rd pick by having an agreement in olave with Leonard now.
*in place with Leonard
curtis93969
If you’re in the Salinas area……Good Lord Hwy 68 between Monterey and Salinas is freaking MISERABLE!! (especially stop and go on a motorcycle…. no automatic transmission=really painful left wrist)
Nope. Randomly assigned by Elon.
1. Love Williams – he’ll be a huge help.
2. Hate the compensation.
3. For the love of God; stop with the “we’ll get a 3rd round comp for him” talk. It’s a hypothetical 2025 pick in which we have no control of half the formula.
💯. The comp pick talk I’m seeing on Twitter/X is just wishful thinking at best. When was the last time we got a comp pick?
I’m guilty of the wishful thinking too and said so above. The adrenaline rush of a big trade is my excuse and I’m sticking with that.
Seems very short term thinking…
https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2023-nfl-trade-deadline-tracker-grades-every-deal
That wasn’t geared towards you Big Mike. I’m referring to the usual suspects on Twitter who don’t dare take a stance that im any way questions dear leader.
*Most of them think it’s a guaranteed 3rd in 2024.
No offense taken. I have reservations on him being a 10+ game rental.
Does this trade happen if Keanu Benton isn’t drafted 4 picks ahead of us?
Expanding on my query above:
– Hawks like to add vets on D-line and they’ve been thin from the get go this season. Adding depth and quality should have been a priority earlier this year.
– They do seem to prefer trading picks for vets at this position so not as surprised by the move.
– I think they expected to get Benton or higher graded DT in the draft, and preserved/freed up cap space for such a mid-season move
Love the player, but hate to give up an R2 for a 10-game rental on a crap shoot season. If they make the SB, then obviously worth it, but short of that the trade seems reckless.
Fair points but will know more how this trade end up in few years. He is still 29 so another good 3 or 4 years left. If Geno plays well we have a chance to go deep in post season.
They won’t give Giants a second & a fifth if they don’t intent to extend Williams.
It’s a strong move, shows they really think they have a shot this year. Maybe John let Rob convince him this draft isn’t as deep, so why not spend a pick for a player. I like it.
These are referring to the previous restructures, they aren’t new ones, right?
Right.
They’re not screwed in 2024 but they have not much cap and just traded a really valuable nugget without any assurance Williams will sign a contract extension.
Based on the on-field eye test of SEA and the schedule coming this team easily finishes the season at 500 (9-8 or 8-9), so cant say Im thrilled pushing the chips in.
I keep waiting to hear that the Vikings have traded for Lock. Hey, it could happen!
Would much rather they trade for Smith.
You have to hope that Williams will be invigorated to play for a contender for the first time in his career
He’s in a contract year. He’ll be great.
Hype video.
https://youtu.be/eS0LlEUHJcA?si=7Fti2dRrhfoqc1dH
Hey guys. Don’t be so happy about trading for Leonard Williams.
I love the player. I have been a huge Big Cat fan since he was in college. High character, very talented and versatile. He makes Seattle better.
Look at the state of the of the NFC
True Contenders
1. Eagles. Made it to the Super Bowl last year, but their defense has regressed from last season and have a QB who has also struggled with turnovers.
2. Niners. Very talented team, don’t get me wrong. But who can look at how they are playing or the results that they are having rn and feel confident about the direction of that team.
3. Cowboys. We can complain about the losses that Seattle has had this season, but look at the 2 losses Dallas has had. A 2 score loss to one of the worst teams in football and then a blowout loss by 32 to San Fran.
4. Lions. Good team. I love Dan Campbell. They are not without their faults however. Plus Seattle has proven they can go on the road and beat this team.
Other possible plaoff teams
5. Vikings. Basically done know with the Jeffersson and Cousins injuries.
6. Rams. Playing divisonal teams is rough, but no Stafford, they lose their juice, Plus have a ton of ground to make up.
7. The NFC South. Bleh. Mostly mediocre.
Why can Seattle not be the top of that group? Particularly if they get homefield. We are not a perfect team, but really is there one in the league currently? I think perhaps we overstate our issues compared to those of other teams, which is natural.
We have a ton of talent on this team. We are 5-2. We control our destiny.
IMO there is not a single proven ‘franchise QB’ in the entire NFC. So yes, the door is open but the stars will certainly have to align for a big run.
Stay healthy my friends!
The teams underperformed and overdelivered simultaneously, so if things get on track, they could make some noise. It’s weird. Like they’ve been bad, but I also didn’t think they would look this bad. The NFC looks weak. Can we hang with the big dawgs? Probably not over a season, but we finally have enough talent to make a real postseason run I think.
Kinda hope they can make some trades on the edges as people have mentioned to recoup cap/capital and maybe make another small savvy pick up.
At least they recognized the need, hard to get someone to pay a full contract before the season.
“Williams has already been franchise-tagged twice in his career, which effectively makes him untaggable this upcoming offseason. This provides Williams with maximum leverage over the Seahawks on a new deal” (from PFF). This is the part of the deal that scares me, hopefully they have an agreement about the conditions for a contract extension agreed as part of the deal…otherwise we have zero leverage. This is Sheldon Richardson all over again.
Don’t get me wrong, i like the player and if we can secure an extension, i think the package was above average but considering the cost for 2023, acceptable. But we need to keep him around long term!
FWIW, according to this local television source (at the :40 mark) the Giants have an interest in Tulane quarterback Michael Pratt.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ludf2NHuB4A
Right now I would say that there is a 20% chance that Minnesota trades for Drew Locke. Any comments?
Happy Halloween everyone!
https://x.com/AlbertB55481266/status/1719110281161326831?s=20
World class hat and T-shirt combo!
Nicely done!