Last weeks reaction post started with the words: ‘this could be a long season‘.
It is going to be a long season. Unfortunately.
This was supposed to be a year where the offense stepped up to the plate. They were going to carry the team with a younger defense in transition.
The O-line was supposed to be better. Russell Wilson was going to prove his quality once and for all. They were going to get back to running the ball.
In reality, the offense looks pitiful.
Where do you start?
The Bears showed zero respect to Wilson and the passing game. They regularly attacked with seven, swarming an overmatched offensive line. In that situation Wilson needed to get the ball out quickly. If anything it was an opportunity for the quarterback to attack. Exploit Chicago’s aggressive nature.
He couldn’t do it. Or he can’t. Time and time again he dwelled in the pocket, took a sack, tried to create. No dice. Drive after drive stalled. They had no answer. No solution.
Wilson has struggled badly in the first two weeks. He was jittery again, indecisive. Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Matt Ryan, Tom Brady, Philip Rivers. Keep rushing seven against those guys and they’ll exploit it. Wilson, so far, is failing to show he can operate conventionally with the mass responsibility now on his shoulders.
A week after failing to establish the run, they decided to be more pro-active this week in that regard. The first drive was loaded with runs. But the incompetence of the passing game essentially ended any opportunity to stick with it. Every time they tried to mix in a pass, disaster struck.
Last week they had 64 rushing yards. This week they had 74 rushing yards.
Fix the run? This isn’t it.
Even so, the running game itself seems muddled. The committee approach currently is uninspiring. And this quote from Pete Carroll after the game was baffling:
Asked Pete Carroll why lead RB Chris Carson disappeared from the run game then the #Seahawks offense completely in the second half tonight. Coach said: pic.twitter.com/w2sPOI7KaP
— Gregg Bell (@gbellseattle) September 18, 2018
Carson didn’t have a carry in the second half.
(EDIT — It’s since emerged Carson played two snaps on special teams. Why did Pete Carroll lie about that?)
The offense is a mess. It’s hard to imagine how they’re going to get out of this rut. The hope has to be that it’s just growing pains. This is a new staff, a tweaked unit with a lot of new personnel.
But this is where they’ve invested and placed their faith. Trading for Duane Brown and paying him, a first round pick on a running back, changing the offensive coordinator and offensive line coach.
Rather than get better, in many ways things are worse. There’s very little cause for optimism.
It’s strange. Seahawks fans have enjoyed a terrific run in the Carroll era. It’s weird to see such a poor product now. So often in this league you don’t see the cliff-face coming. It looks like it might’ve arrived for Carroll’s team.
The Seahawks deserve to be 0-2. This isn’t 2015 where you felt they had the talent to come back. Already, the key to the season appears to be finding some pieces you can roll with beyond 2018. The performance of the defense — punching above its weight — might offer some hope there. Minus Bobby Wagner and K.J. Wright, the unit did its best against the Bears. The 24-17 scoreline flattered Seattle.
Yet there still isn’t that core group emerging like we saw in 2011. Carroll surely is hoping that season will be emulated. Rough start, finding their groove later on. Taking momentum forward.
This feels different. There’s no blossoming LOB or Marshawn Lynch. The players on offense they should be relying on are playing poorly.
It’s not good. And neither are the Seahawks.
You can now support Seahawks Draft Blog via Patreon by clicking the tab below.
Thoughts on…
1. Benching Russell Wilson for a game?
2. Carson and stamina issues?
3. Is 2018 Pete’s swan song?
All I’ll say is, looks like 7-9 at max for this squad. Hawks are quickly headed towards a top 10 pick in the 2019 draft. Too bad they’ll likely move down because this rebuild has no resources to rebuild with.
1. Why would they do that!?!
2. I have no idea what’s going on with Carson but the fact is he’s never been a bell cow in his career
3. Maybe
There’s not a chance this is Pete Carroll’s swan song. Why would he have started a rebuild — and it is a rebuild — he didn’t intend to see through? This isn’t USC, where an invitation to the NFL awaited for him to cap off his legacy. This IS his legacy, or at least how people will judge him against the power of the LOB; was he a great coach, or did he have generational players?
Fellas, this has been excruciating to watch. It’s a continuation of last year’s utter ineptitude.
And yet, this team over the years has often played ugly, ugly ball, and found a way to either win by a score or lose by a score y the end of the game. Yes, this is different.
But it is going to be a long season. There will be development, and it starts with Schottenheimer pushing Russell Wilson to adapt. If he doesn’t, then Russell is not really the future. If he does, then we WILL have something similar to 2011 emerge at some point this season.
Of course I think the playoffs are out of the question. This season can still be a success though.
PC has been careful to only choose backup quarterbacks who are so bad or inexperienced that the situation would be even worse if they came in. Really!!!! I’m not sure how a team can end up with quarterbacks that they have. I do like McGough but he is on the practice squad.
The backup quarterbacks are not the problem.
Well at least Will Dissley looks like he could be the next Travis Kelce. He didn’t feature tonight like he did vs DEN, but his one catch was a nice gain.
Has anyone seen Mingo? I’m being facetious of course. It’s just that he’s been all but invisible through two games so far. Kendricks on the other hand made an impact. The LB corps has a chance to become the strength of the defense when Wagner and KJ return.
Also liking the development of ‘quille Griffin. He and McDougal are nice surprises in the secondary. I’ll repeat myself, they never should have let Sheldon Richardson leave. The center of the DL is soft. The pass rush is so anemic because he get no push up the middle to flush QBs into our DEs. And that soft center shows in the run defense, which has been pretty bad through two games.
It’s like Pete just gave up coaching the basics. No focus, no intensity, stupid mistakes/penalties. Maybe it’s as you say, growing pains with a new offensive coordinator, newish OL, etc. But that excuse he gave about Carson not playing much…who does he think he’s kidding. Carson didn’t look gassed. And he’s clearly the superior RB at this point.
Whatever. I’m becoming acclimated to disappointment.
What “newish OL”? Only Fluker was added, and Fluker is injured, like he can be expected half of the season. Brwon on a downward trajectory, Pocic on the wron spot, Britt injured without depth, Ifedi unteachable. No surprises here.
Speaking about our RBs, Carson plus and a Rashaad Penny who seems to have added a lot of weight… how many teams in the NFL are still playing a one-dimensional, vintage power-rushing scheme? We tend to make every player into Marshawn II, this will never work. And Schottenheimer lacks the balls to tell his boss.
I’m a huge fan of Jordan Howard (drafted 60 spots behind Prosise) and his sophisticated view and patient running style. You will never see something like that under a PC-coached team. The same goes for having a complementary runner with a lighter frame, or a OL capable of executing a really convincing run blocking scheme. Haven’t seen all that since 2014.
Plus, and I maybe mistaken, but one timeout was taken with wilson being in disagreement with Schott and Carroll. Two throws later there was his game-wrecking pick. They want him to play their way, and it’s not working. This is not coaching, this is not strategy, this is complete chaos. Like 2017, points come in, when Russ begins to play to his own instinctive book.
I still think, we shouldn’t be disappointed. There are 10, if not 14 teams better in the NFC. Nothing wrong with that; that’s how it’s destined to be. This is a year of transition.
What is outright worrying are our meagre options coming off-season.
Couldn’t agree more with your last point about the timeout and the pick. Look, I am not a Russell apologist, he needs to be better. He did not look comfortable, he is holding the ball too long and he is making poor reads. But the coaching staff is not doing him ANY favors. Too many of Schotty’s plays look predictable. You could see the pick coming a mile away as soon as Russ turned. I get the line isn’t protecting him, but there are better ways to throw the defense’s timing off than one step drop and throw. Let him make reads, he’s a veteran signal caller. I was all on board for wanting to turn Russ into more of a pocket passer, but if it is going to make him a worse quarterback, then don’t force it. They need to play to his strengths and they aren’t.
I think Mingo was fine. Not the greatest pass rusher, but he does his job at SAM against the run, which typically your SAM doesn’t make tackles, holds the edge and forces it back inside.
A couple points to think about. Why isn’t Poona Ford playing? The man can eat up two offensive linemen. I’m very disappointed in them not playing him.
Penny looks slow to me = and not slow in a forceful way = just slow. Is there a chance that the Seahawks could run that sweep/shuttle pass run play that the Bears were using? Lockett might work for the sweep, Penny isn’t forceful enough to run in the middle, it is hard to imagine the Seahawks making such an effective play. The running backs need to create some yardage, either from quickness or broken tackles. Will Penny improve by end of September? He looked a little better last night. What about Carson and Davis? Where are the quick forceful running backs?
Wilson = will never reach his full potential as long as they keep picking run first coaches. This is obvious now. I was really hoping the coaching change would include a modern passing coach similar to a couple dozen offenses currently being run. All the new cool plays are on other teams.
So defensively I thought they did okay. But offensively it stunk. No running game and limited success at passing. How many years will the Seahawks offense sleep walk thru the first half?? It’s been going on since the 2013.
That game made me want to puke. Our offense is unwatchable. Here we are again watching Carroll make excuses for not running just after he said last week the need to run again. Apparently he told Schotty to throw down field in the 3rd quarter. How can you when the D is pinning their ears back and the QB has no time? What game is he watching? Establish the run to set up play action. What game was he watching? He needs to let Schotty call the plays, maybe it wasnt Bevells fault after all.
It feels like Carroll has just lost the feel for the game. And Ive feared this for a couple years, but it looks like playing behind a terrible OL has ruined RW. He also looks like hes lost alot of his speed.
So what do they do with so many needs and so few draft picks next year? Honestly after the Cowboys game Id trade Earl just because you need to picks to restock. I know people were talking about trading RW for three 1sts, if somebody blows your socks off do you do it? I cant imagine paying him $30M+ next year.
I was at least encouraged by the defense and loved the 3 safety look. Our D has 5 turnovers in 2 games. Didnt think that was going to happen or that late 3rd down stop. They at least have some fight in them.
I’m not willing to start blaming Russell Wilson, but I am ready to blame the curse of Ciara
“come on man” Wilson starred at the receiver on the pick six the entire route. Check the replay. I saw a lot of that in the pre season as well. Five years, and Wilson seemingly has not learned to “look off” the defense. As for Carroll, he is panicking, trying to prove Penny was worth the first pick.
I thought it looked like Wilson might have thrown to a spot that Penny was supposed to be, but Penny ran it wrong.
Agreed, just watched the 4th qtr again and noticed that right away.
I’m also going to say, we don’t look very good, but Seattle was in position to win both games. We’ve been killed by decent defenses not offenses. It doesn’t help that Seattle can’t get things going on offense. For all the issues we have, no pass rush, we’ve been in both games. Still, I am not liking what I am seeing and unless the pass protection improves I see more of a 5-11 season. Yeah, we have Wilson who in years past gave us the opportunity to win every game but without key players (Baldwin on offense and key D players with lingering injuries) Seattle could be in for a long season. Especially if the youngsters don’t step-up enough and the running game never blossoms.
That throw was late and telegraphed. Yes Penny could have come back and fought for the ball, but why was he out there to begin with?
Penny is a rookie, Wilson is not. Just not what I expected from a 7 year quarterback.
This. When you’re having so much trouble with the pass rush and are historically not a great/well practiced team why would you go to the empty backfield approach; especially once you’ve finally started hitting a stride with your offense by establishing at least the threat of the run. The playcalling in this game was atrocious until Russ seemed to take it into his own hands, go up tempo and start creating with a mixed pass/run offense. Russ was jittery and holding on to the ball too long but I defer to that earlier article on here about Pete’s offensive philosophy, I think Pete was looking for the explosive shot downfield and we went how many drives with three long developing pass plays and then punting… It’s clear that Pete and his coaching staff can coach up a decent defense despite all the losses but his offensive philosophy is costing this team winnable games.
Given Brian Schottenheimer’s track record, though, there was no real reason to expect any positives on offense this year.
The best offense he ever coordinated was 12th in DVOA (2006 Jets, his first year as coordinator). There was only one other time he (barely) reached the top half of the league (2010 Jets, at 16th).
The best passing offense he ever coordinated was 11th in the league (2006 Jets again), and that was the only time he was in the top half of the league.
He’s been getting worse over time, too. His last four years as coordinator (2011 with Jets and then 2012-14 with Rams) were 21st, 21st, 22nd, 25th (and 20th, 17th, 21st, 26th in passing).
Bevell, for comparison, went (MIN) 31st, 16th, 25th, 8th, 27th, (SEA) 22nd, 4th, 7th, 5th, 1st, 16th, 14th. So his bad last couple of years that he got fired for would instantly be the 2nd/3rd best years in Schottenheimer’s career.
More of a problem than overall performance is that he’s a retread’s retread with a prehistoric view of the NFL that reinforces Pete’s worst strategic tendencies. Changing OCs was an opportunity to get a modern offensive mind in there and give him complete control of the offense; instead we went with a yes man who would go along with the notion that somehow we could win in 2018 by going back to the 1970s…
I gave up on the offense this season as soon as the Schottenheimer hire was announced.
I’m sick of the stale state of the offense. I wanted a fresh oc like Scott Frost who could learn from Pete, bring in new plays for Rus but most importantly have an heir for when Pete hangs it up. The nepotism is ridiculous! All our staff are either usc retreads, family, family of people who’s parents gave our coaches jobs. I know it happens everywhere but jeeze.
We have a strong possibility of getting a top 5 pick in the draft, Pete leaving and having nothing resembling a proper interim head coach.
For all the arrogance, bad drafting, bad personnel moves. This is the ending the Seahawks might deserve.
We are barely in a brighter spot than the cardinals, and they are terrible.
Well, typical I get to see them for the first time ever when they play at Wembley and they are the worst in years! But still love them, will be awesome anyway.
Only one thing to say about the game – RW is one tough mofo.
If your going to be stupid you better be tough, he appears to have both in spades
If it comes down to staff or Wilson, I’m picking Wilson. PC (barring a turnaround) has overstayed his welcome, but throwing Wilson out as well? This team will never have another Wilson just like it won’t ever have another Beast Mode. I think 3 firsts is a pipedream, and even if a deal like that came up, what would the new regime have left to work with? Even with his flaws, he is what the new regime should build around.
Getting rid of both just seems irrational, and keeping PC in power while trading Wilson just seems ludicrous at this point. Getting rid of the front office makes sense though. If this season continues this way I am all for a new coach, coordinators, and GM, but not giving up on Wilson because he has flaws and only has a few years left of otherworldly play before he becomes a Big Ben or Eli (good, but propped up by talent around them).
Even with his flaws, Wilson can still bring a team back from the brink; he’s playing sloppy and scared, but he’s also the only reason this team is remotely competitive on offense. He needs two things imo: Passable O-Line play, and a quicker pace (less huddle) offense. O-Line will take a year or two to fix (3/5 right now are pretty good, maybe Fluker will be 4/5), but as soon as next year they can bring in a young offense minded HC or OC (or both) to cater to Wilson’s strengths. Defense needs at least one solid draft to pick up the right pieces. Starting anew has it’s appeal, but what PC accomplished was a once in a lifetime event. Better to keep the best remaining pieces than not.
I’ll be taking a long break to move and do university, so I won’t be watching games or posting here as much, but I’ll drop in when I can. Go Hawks!!
Respectfully disagree, Forrest. So much of what makes Wilson special is his legs and escapability. You even admit that Wilson doesn’t have many years left before he turns into Eli or Ben. But his height will be an issue if he can’t move to get through all his reads. I’m even beginning to wonder if he’s holding onto the ball too long because he can get a clear view of his target.
Three first round picks (if offered) would do much more for a new regime than 2-3 years of Wilson. By the time they add enough pieces to compete again, Wilson is already theee years older/slower and absorbing a big chunk of your cap – thanks in part to his baseball agent. You need picks and cap space to build anew
If Wilson struggles to the point where Seattle would rather deal him, they aren’t going to get 3 first round picks. They will be lucky to get a first and some change.
For sure there is a difficulty with timing when to trade a player. Ultimately I think there should be a team that would view a change of scenery as exactly what Wilson needs.
I think a team would actually give us 3 first rounders for Wilson. I’m just not sure we would take it.
He can excel as a pocket passer though, we’ve seen it. 4-5 seasons of great Wilson play is plenty of time to win a couple of Superbowls, even with a one of two year rebuild. I’m just saying if there is a regime change, throwing away the only thing keeping your offense competitive is absolutely counterproductive.
Think of it this way: If Wilson stinks this year (which he has at times, but not at others), then who will offer even a first for him? At that point it’s not worth throwing away an established pro who can still win games. Alternatively, Wilson could carry the team like he did last year (quite possible despite the lackluster start), and then he’s back to being worth multiple firsts, but then why trade your game winner when you’re trying to rebuild? Why gamble on finding the next big thing when you have a perfectly suitable piece to build a team around (that honestly dosn’t need a complete overhaul like most teams)?
Most of this teams current issues are with coaching and lack of experience. I saw plays where Wilson was visibly frustrated with the play call or clock management last night, which never happens, he’s upset with the coaches. That alone should be sending out red flags. The by the book robot is upset with the play calls? He’s either being told to execute a plan that simply can’t work, or is being given mixed messages that don’t allow him to excel or find a groove (what I think). Again, he’s the only reason this team isn’t getting blown out.
I’d argue that (surprisingly) the defense was the only reason we didn’t get blown out. Two picks, limited Bears to sub-80yards etc.
I think where we differ in opinion the most is the time it will take to rebuild. Consider that Carroll has at maximum another season in him bringing us to 2020. When a new regime takes over you will have a QB that is now 31 and slowing down. If you go back and watch most games from this year and last, Wilson consistently doesn’t see open receivers. He relies on getting out of the pocket (most times) to get a clearer view of the field and his receivers.
I don’t disagree that the play calling is stubborn and wrong. They’re trying to play their brand of football with pieces that don’t have enough juice. Which is why I argue by the time you do have enough pieces Wilson will be taking a BIG chunk out of your cap space, AND is a slower version of himself. He ain’t getting any faster.
I know it is hard to find a franchise QB, but it just doesn’t make much sense to lock up so much cap space with a player who isn’t built to succeed into their late 30’s like Rivers, or (Peyton) Manning, or Brady. He can do many of the things those guys can, he has a lot of incredible abilities. BUT the height is a factor just like Shaquem missing his hand is a factor – just means that have to work harder to succeed. Unfortunately for Wilson father time will diminish his ability and force him to throw from the pocket – see 2016 season vs Dolphins when Suh rolled over his ankle.
I would rather capitalize on his value today to get greater value for him. If you wait, it may go from 3 1st rounders to just a 2nd and a 3rd. A decision will need to be made sooner rather than later. Rebuild and give the new regime the assets to do it.
Someone put up those 17 points, and it wasn’t the defence. The offense for some reason clicks when it’s in hurry up mode. If it was Hundley instead of Wilson I don’t think they would have scored more than a FG.
I think PC is out by the end of the season (if things continue this way). With him goes his friends and compatriots. If PC stays, then yeah maybe trading Russ would be good, but I think Allen is watching closely. 6-10 and I think PC is guaranteed out.
I think Wilson has several pieces moving forward: Dissly, Lockett, Baldwin, one of Carson or Penny (Penny is apparently losing weight, and didn’t look terrible last night), and maybe Brown/Reynolds. The O-Line is the only offensive unit that needs major work (right side).
Brady and Phillips (and others) had systems built around them to make them more comfortable. That’s what Russ needs. He needs a stable O-Line and innovative play book on offense. For the time being he can make almost any WR/TE look good, but a stud WR down the line wouldn’t hurt. Dissly looks pretty good so far.
Agree to disagree.
Forrest. It was the defense that put the offense within striking distance. Yes, hurry up mode seems to produce better results but one could argue that is true for any offense. It is a boom or bust way of attacking the defense that opens you up to more mistakes, more picks (we saw this happen in the 4th quarter – Wilson throws a pick-six and the game). That is why Pete and Russ resort to it only in the 4th quarter.
I wouldn’t say Russell having pieces around him would make all the difference. We went out and traded for Percy Harvin and Jimmy Graham to give Wilson some explosive weapons.. it didn’t work.
Brady sure didn’t have an offense built around him. Bilichick (aside from gronk) has kept his offensive pieces revolving in and out of the pats program. Brady is a pocket passer, Wilson (while he can) is not by his style of play.
We can leave it here to agree to disagree. I appreciate your point of view.
I would also argue here that a two year rebuild is extremely optimistic. Look at how long it has taken the 49ers, and they aren’t even done rebuilding!
It depends on the faculty, decisions in signings and picks, choosing the correct philosophy etc etc and is very hard to put it all together to make a respectable football team. A lot of luck is needed also. My guess is it would take 3-5 years, maybe even longer if you decide to keep the current regime and Wilson for extended time.
The other issue with keeping Wilson is his salary. How can they rebuild a team when they are paying him 25-30 million per year?
That money could pay for two excellent players, three good players, or 5-6 average players. Just for reference I place Sweezy and Ifedi in the barely below average category.
Quickest path to a rebuild is to ditch Wilson, who has already peaked. He is physically slower, and more hesitant. I don’t know how he scrambled for a first down last night, I cringed while I watched him lumber down the field. He will always be shorter than others around him, and that does affect his passing game, especially with quick slants in the middle and screens. Lets be realistic, there are only two successful quarterbacks that are short, Wilson and Brees. It is an anomaly that need not remain unfixed. He has overcome a lot, but his physical limitations are catching up to him.
Franchise tag is a possible move.
+1
more than just a long season to come, where is the hope for a future championship team?
I cannot see the future core to come out of this. Russell is regressing. He has a problem where he can become effective in the 4th quarter, but he has this irrational belief in himself that is leading to 4th qtr turnovers. He looks scared for the first 3 quarters, then wants to play hero ball.
Russell always talks about the separation is in the preparation, but he does not look like he is prepared for 3 quarters. I think he spends too much time crafting his image and lifestyle and not focusing on his job. He is not elite, he is not making the team better around him. He was not better than Trubisky tonight, and that is the 3rd best qb drafted last year.
I see some improvement in the o line and even Ifedi is not terrible. He looked ok considering he was going up against Mack. They are not great, but I think the oline is better than last year, it is just that Russell isn’t.
Receivers don’t seem to get any separation, and I don’t see any imagination on offence, unless we look at the opposition.
on defense, the line gets no pressure, and there is no creativity to generate pressure. Clark looks like the only one with above average talent, but he is not a difference maker. Everyone else is JAG.
And Robinson was open all night long
Pete won in college with superior talent.
Pete won the Super Bowl with a team filled with superior talent.
This team? Yikes. They cannot out scheme teams and they don’t have the talent to keep up.
even Dickson looked human tonight
Even when you add Doug, Bobby and KJ, a lot of these problems remain.
as far as Pete saving Carson for special teams, I hope he is lying to us.
Cliff Avril recently said the way to win is to have a QB on a rookie contract and load up on talent. But he added that every GM will then pay the QB because they don’t want to get fired.
I am a “never panic” guy, but I am struggling to see a bright future for the Hawks over the next few years based on what we are seeing so far. This is a 6 win team, unless Russell pulls his head out of his ass and starts playing like he did in 2015. I am not sure he can anymore.
In 2017, Russell more than often needed three quarters too add points. He starts to add points, when he himself is in control of the game and the calls. Which happened to be 4th quarter, when both OC and HC run out on their wisdoms.
Not this year.
Two throws prior to the game-wrecking pick, the Seahawks took a timeout after having a succession of quick first downs. Error #1: you never break the flow of your offense if it is marching, Error #2: you don’t force a play that hasn’t worked all night to the #2 instinctive QB of the league, pissing him off in the process.
Plus, what about our pass catchers struggling in the quick passing game?
The OL currently is #31 in the league, and on a downward trajectory. Only Cards are worse. More to come. They are such bad, that commentators have stopped mentioning them, as if it is a natural thing to assume. The sky is blue, god is good, the Seahawks O-Line is awful.
They should fire Schottenheimer, and Carroll should be on thin ice.
4th quarter Russell Wilson last year was him shredding prevent defenses. Stat padding. I really only think he had 2 quality games against a good opponent last year – Philly and Houston.
“more than just a long season to come, where is the hope for a future championship team?”
This is an extremely valid question, Hawk Eye.
The offense was indeed painful to watch. The usual “moan, get rid f the ball already, moan” makes me sick.
However, there are a few points to remember:
1. Offenses usually start the season behind the defenses. That is double true with a new coaching staff and missing your no. 1 weapon.
2. Denver was a top 3 defense (YPG) and he no. 1 defense in yards per carry. Chicago was a top 10 defense in YPG without an offense and without Mack. Those are not exactly pushover defenses especially at home.
3. Other than Tyler Lockett, all the weapons around RW are either brand new or almost new. (Yes, Carson played 2 games and Vannett played sparingly). It takes more time for trust to and synergy to sink in.
4. Moving on to predict a top 5 draft pick may be a bit premature.
However, until this offense displays some sort of a fluent quick passing game, they are going to be hard to watch.
Also, is it just me or Penny looked better in that 2nd half and Dissly looks legit?
I think they will go on to win more than enough games to not pick in the top-5.
But a losing record is very realistic.
Good night, another “I don’t even know where to start” type game.
– Lets start with some good, Lockett made a beautiful catch and Dissly looks like a great get so far. Given the struggles around them, these are 2 bright spots this season for me.
– Shottenheimer may just be the worst OC the Hawks have ever had. The play calling is….baffling is probably the nicest word I can use. Zero originality or scheming to force open plays. Its like he’s still got his dad’s play card from 1992 and refuses to give it up or use anything different as a “tribute to Dad.” 3rd and 10 pinned near the goal line, and they call a time out to avoid delay of game and subsequent 2-3 yd penalty. Play call following? Screen, that loses 2 yds. I am completely baffled how Pete thought he was the answer. Jeez, if anything Shottenheimer has had a NEGATIVE effect on Wilson.
– All off season Pete talked about establishing the run. We are gonna run the ball. Control the clock. He made excuses last week why they didn’t/coudn’t. I look up stats mid way through the rd quarter last night and Hawks had 8 called runs. Has there been an explanation for why Carson didn’t get a touch after half? 4 yds a carry in the first half….
– Defense played admirably well given how terrible the offense performed. 17 points with bad field position and little break isn’t bad for a team with zero ability to pressure without blitzing. Helluva effort by Griffin on the picks. Thomas, Griffin, and McDouglad make up a fantastic core of a secondary. Its too bad they can’t get any help from their brothers up front.
– I don’t know what the answer is on the OLine, but I don’t think it is currently in house in Seattle. Whether it is a scheme/coach problem, personnel issue, philosophy….or even all of it. I don’t think they answer to fixing the now 4 year old Elephant in the room is currently employed by the Seahawks. I realize the 2 best pass rushers in all of football in back to back weeks is a tough ask, but Miller and Mack weren’t the only two to cause problems.
– Of course Dickson had a 10 yd punt. The guy drop kicked a kickoff and pinned it inside the 5, and is averaging over 50 ys a punt despite the 10 yd boomer. Can’t have the lone unblemished piece on the team be the friggin Punter, after all.
– I can genuinely say I don’t know what the direction of this team is. Pete seems to be going completely opposite from everything he says, then gives excuses.
Defensively there are gaping holes up front, and injuries in the LB leave arguably the weakest front 7 in the NFL. Wagner and Wright have never been more valuable to the team…but they need to be on the field. The Secondary shows a TON of talent, but “PTBN” at one Corner and constantly being on the field means they are gonna give up plays.
Offense looks broken with no real fix in house. Sure, not having Baldwin on the field hurts, but he wont fix the most glaring issues. Play calling and design is horrendous. OLine play from one end to the other is a wreck. Four rushers routinely is too much for the five.
Living out of area I don’t get to watch a lot of Hawks games. So, when they are on national TV, I sacrifice sleep and stay up to watch. Last night I turned the game off and went to bed at 24-10. It was the first time in 5 years I felt like the Hawks had no chance to turn the corner and pull a 4th quarter comeback.
Who the hell has their “starting RB” play kickoff coverage?
Absolutely baffling.
And then Pete backs off his fatigue explanation by saying he wanted to see Penny. It sounds like BS.
Hope there is a method to Pete’s madness. He is giving pre season opportunities to Penny now.. he knows what he has in Carson. If nothing else, he is treating these games just like pre season to evaluate the team and definitely not playing to win.
And apparently Carson only played 2 or so ST snaps. Not nearly enough to have him “gassed”
Yeah from every angle this is crap. Doesn’t make any sense. penny has looked horrible in many ways, Carson has looked great when given a the chance.
The same guy who leaves Khalil Mack unblocked more than once.
The same guy that had guys like Earl Thomas, Richard Sherman, and Doug Baldwin as core special teams players. this isn’t news. Plus, there’s no way in he-double hockey sticks Carson was “gassed” from two special teams snaps, that’s total BS.
Can I ask a really silly question?
Why, when you’ve got lineman who struggle to pass block, do you not just go downhill like a run block and bury their best d linemen?
I just watched wilson got caught near the end zone by Mack pushing Ifedi back into him.
Mack had just been chipped by the tight end, was a bit vulnerable, if Ifedi just charges he could’ve put him on his back, but he stood there and tried to absorb the pressure, it makes no sense to me.
Am I mad?
If you go after Mack he will make you look silly.
In pass block one lineman advancing while the rest slide back creates a free hole in the line. A looping DT, blitzing LB or even a good spin from the DE would give a free pass to the QB.
Not to mention the potential ineligible receiver down field problem.
“Not to mention the potential ineligible receiver down field problem.”
As long as he engages the defender within 1 yard of the line of scrimmage, he could’ve blocked him into Lake Michigan without being penalized.
The more agile defender can easily side step the blocker. Miller did it quite easily last week several times, with Ifedi and Tre Madden falling on their faces.
Yeah but ifedi can maul better than anything and running at a pass rush is one of the few ways to neutralize him. The Seahawks were running the ball well to start the game. There is little reason for them not to have spent the first qtr running directly at Mack and wearing him down. Why they abandoned this strategy that was actually working early on is very hard to understand d.
I saw this too. I’m no OL coach, and I know linemen anchor to absorb the rush… but with Ifedi, for as big and strong as he’s supposed to be, there was no anchor. He would just get pushed back, and he doesn’t seem to have heavy hands either. I wanted to see him meet Mack at SOME point in the rush and punch or drive him a little. I don’t know how someone is supposed to slow his (or anyone’s) momentum if they don’t get their hands into them and go at him a little when appropriate.
With Ifedi it’s just an automatic retreat into the QB’s lap, if they haven’t made it around the corner by then.
Okay Rob, last week I reiterated my original expectations were 1 and 4 over the first 5 games figuring the offense would need some time to jell. Being correct sucks, but in this case I see I should revise that prediction. I’m now at 0 and 5 after seeing how Dallas has “figured it out” while our guys are pretty much playing the role of stumble bums. The announcers tossed out the stat that the Seahawks have gone 31 straight without scoring a touchdown on first possession. And that seems to be indicative of much that’s wrong. Despite the change in coaches, and supposedly game planning, the results are all too familiar. Fangio had his front line coached up to perfectly disrupt Wilson. Watch how many times his deepish drops get caught in a pincer movement. Many will blame the OL, and while they’re not top 10 hardly any line can stand up to quality rushers in that too often repeated scenario. Russ had some decent pockets that would support a 3-4 step drop and a quick out……………..for whatever reason he doesn’t seem able. Blocking was suspect considering the opponent, particularly Mack. A handful of times I saw Vanett give Mack a “tap” on the chest and then release to the flat while Ifedi was taking on others……….dumb.
Enough with the offense, but to close it out, they’re not showing any progress, not just within this season but from last as well……enough with the excuses. The defense, on the other hand, showed some growth, especially in the absence of some key anchors. Granted, the Bears offense isn’t the biggest challenge, but they did what they needed to do to keep the game close……..only offense errors blew the score up. I still don’t have confidence in Norton, but I may be wrong there.
Yep, it’s gonna be a long season………….and painful for the dedicated.
Why did they even bother changing all the coaches when the Hawks (let me re-phrase that) PETE run the same exact offense that Bevell did, Pete said he instructed Shotty to take shots almost the entire 3rd quarter.
I never thought I would say this but I think Seattle seriously needs to move on from Pete, otherwise it’s not only going to be a long year, It’ll be much longer than that
AirCarroll – turning 2nd and six to 3rd and 12 for the first three quarters.
The first three quarters it was;
First down – positive rush
Second down – negative pass play
Third and long – sack/pressure
Punt
It wasn’t until the fourth quarter they did running plays back to back. They marched right down the field with this nice mix and capped off with the beautiful catch by Lockett for a TD. Why did it take until the fourth quarter???
I felt sorry for our oline the first three quarters. So predictable the defense just assumed pass and got after the qb.
Moving forward…..
Offense – I’m fine with our oline and running backs. If we can get 3 first rounds for Russell I would do it (and I don’t say that lightly, I’ve loved watching him). But there is no way I commit that much cap space and salary to him. He is no Rodgers/Brady/Brees anymore.
Defense – I actually like the pieces we have in the secondary. To me Clark is average. If we can get a high round pick for him do it.
We should then have a ton of cap space and draft stock. Draft the hell out of this upcoming Dline class and a QB if there’s one worthy. If no QB to draft sign a game managing free agent.
Now you have a crazy young flying around defense, game managing/running offense with a field changing punter.
Sorry for the long post.
I don’t think Clark has hit the level that he’s probably going to get paid, but he’s currently on pace for a 16 sack season…..He’s been quite stout against the run, gets some TFL. I’d say he’s easily our best DL and worth keeping him around as long as it’s not a ridiculous #.
The day after and I feel the same way as late last night… there seems to be no hope anymore. Aside from our punter and Earl Thomas (and they don’t seem to want him), I see nobody on this active roster (Wagner was inactive last night) who inspires me to thinking they will make a future Pro Bowl. No top-tier talent. I don’t care about a potential good player here or there because even the ’92 team had Chris Warren, Terry Wooden, and Robert Blackmon. Those were good, young players that I liked. Every team has a few of those. This team simply looks lost with no future to look forward to. I don’t mean to sound down, but I need to see progress that I don’t think I’ll see. Sure, they will win a few games this year – but any aspirations for potential greatness don’t exist right now.
I agree to an extent, but I would omit Quill, McDougald and Dissly from guys who aren’t playing at a pro bowl level right now.
I was bracing for a year where Seattle would struggle, but I didn’t think they would be this bad.
This is all very reminiscent of Pete’s USC Trojan fall from grace. I could very well see this as Pete’s last year coaching the Seahawks.
Looking at the schedule, the only games I would pick Seattle to win are against the AZ Cardinals. Ultimately I think this team ends up between 4-12 and 6-10.
With that being said these would be the moves that I would make
1) Trade Earl for the Cowboys 2nd rd pick – Let Tedric play and see what you have with him
2) Cut the guys you signed in free agency – This gives you back two comp picks in the 4th, one in the 5th and one in the 7th
This allows the team to go in to next years draft with picks in the 1st, 2nd, three in the 4th, two in the 5th and 7th.
If you don’t want to pay Russell $35 mil I can see a trade (Maybe to the Giants?) for a couple of 1st rd picks. I don’t think you’ll fetch 3, but maybe you can.
We know that Schneider had interest in Mahomes and Josh Allen in the draft. I can see Schneider being very interested in Drew Locke.
This season and offseason are going to be very pivotal for the direction of this team. And it could be a very busy year for this blog as well!
I was with you up until Lock. Exhibit A as to why:
https://draftcobern.wordpress.com/2018/04/30/2019-nfl-draft-qb-data/
But everything else makes sense to me. This team will not compete and we have to go full rebuild and we need picks and cap space to do that. If we go QB this draft I would say Herbert.
I would also add that I think Pete is done, fresh blood is needed. An innovator on offense – I would love if they shake the trees with Lincoln Riley.
For the link, what measurements are used to score?
What are the scores with the last two classes?
Detail on methodology is in other posts. Basically its ypa, comp % and td/int weighted against competition. I think the important takeaway is there are established thresholds – ie no all pro qb has failed to hit below a 77.32 score in college. Mayfield and Darnold scored really high (in the 90s), Rosen was in the mid 80s. Josh Allen was horrific. Watson and Mahomes scored well in the prior class (mid 80s).
Grotesque. That stuff from Carroll is insane. Is there a single other coach in the league who’d have their lead RB on ST coverage duty instead of actually running the ball? Not even one of those ones where you can go ohhh that crazy Pete, you know he loves him some teams… Baffling is overly generous.
The three (and a half) big issues I have right now are that:
1) Long term rosters issues and trends have been managed extremely poorly. Failure to build linebacking depth. Failure to find a kicker. Failure to build WR depth. Failure to develop a pass rush. Failure to recover any value from ageing vets (Sherman, Bennett etc.)
2) Inability to address the same match-day issues we’ve been seeing for over a year now. The brutal failures to convert on third down. Little to no effort to establish the run game. Nothing that even comes close to resembling a dynamic offence. The obvious O-line stuff. Wilson’s failure to progress his game in the last two seasons, and now a seemingly pretty clear step back. Nothing has changed, nothing is being done about it. Related, and this is my half, Carroll’s nepotism and cronyism would be getting a serious side-eye in any half respectable industry. I find it very hard to believe this is the best coaching staff the team could put together. Look at what Tampa are doing under Todd Monken, he’s managing to look an 80-year-old Fitzmagic look like Pat Mahomes.
3) I have no idea who the team is and who they’re trying to be. There are no building blocks being put in place for sustained future success. The best player on the team through the first two weeks, and its not particularly close, is the punter – probably their best draft pick in the last four or five seasons. I think a top-five pick is absolutely on the cards this year, things are looking extremely grim early.
Feels like we have entered the Jeff Fisher zone Ishmael. That is how bad it is.
My first thought watching the first half was that this team didn’t seem to have the intensity that I am used to seeing from the Seahawks (Defense and Offense). I thought the defense came around quicker feeding off some of the big plays. The offensive players looked lost and rudderless. Ie without a leader. They needed Russell to lead them but he was too busy inside his own head with his ineffectiveness.
No doubt this will be a long season with the first 6 or so games needed to get this offense on the right track. But, that will likely be too late to earn a playoff spot.
We talk about not wanting to pay Aaron Rodgers money to Wilson, but we should consider that Wilson may not want to re-sign with us when his contract is up. I’m sure he dreams of playing for a coach/OC that can properly use a dynamic QB. If I were in his shoes, I’d much rather play for someone like Sean Payton or Andy Reid. We can use the franchise tag to hold onto him, but as with Earl, I think that’d be a mistake.
Someone (Maybe even Seattle) will hire the Defillipo guy from Gus Peterson’s coaching tree. He has the vikings offense rolling and Cook and Murray haven’t got it going yet. Matt Nagy is from the tree too. I was a little jealous watching Chicago’s last scoring drive. Lockett is no less capable than Gabriel. Marshall no less of a possession guy than Robinson. Dissly continues to surprise. The O-lines are both not great. And Russ is better than Trubisky. But the motions, the matchups and creativity gave them a huge edge. We are still playing like we are the superior athletes but we aren’t anymore. Currently we are that guy walking around the gym in wind breaker pants and a cut-off hoodie who used to be fit. I’m just looking for growth from the young guys right now.
I can’t help but think the same thing…why the hell would RW want to stay here?
as good as the andy reid tree for offense is, why does nobody talk about the saints o and sean peyton coaches. same kind of skill set as well
Why would Russell want to re-sign with us when we clearly can’t use a dynamic QB effectively? If I were him, I’d want to play on a team that a)protected me, and b) used my talents to win.
Rob, what are your thoughts on Khalil Tate? Probably is a 2020 draft candidate, but man he’d look good in a Seahawks jersey
Carson begged out of the game after his first two carries. I’ve seen him do that a few times, and I can imagine it irking Pete.
My guess…the whole Carson drama was Pete sending him a message.
If Carson wants to play, he needs to suck it up and not pull himself after two or three carries.
I agree. I’ve seen him do it too.
I seem to remember Doug talking about this last training camp that Carson has tremendous talent but he would take himself out during practices to the point that Doug told him no he’s not coming out
Found the piece that i mentioned above –
http://www.espn.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/126887/seahawks-rb-chris-carson-gets-a-lesson-from-doug-baldwin
Great job finding that article. I remember reading that last year.
I dont think its difficult to read between the lines and observe that this is still a potential issue for Carson.
And it is totally something that would get under Pete’s skin.
Rob keeps mentioning that Carson has never been a full time, lead back, and its an important point to consider.
You have to want to do it, first, and so.far we’ve yet to see.signs that Carson is cut out for lead back duty, either physically or mentally.
Last night really seemed like the culmination on Pete trying to hang on to an aging roster last year to make one final albeit unlikely SB push and a coach who has not adapted to the changes in the NFL.
The NFL is a passing league now and every rule is put in place to promote passing, points and wide open offense. They want 60-75 points a game. As a result the positions that matter most are clearly QB, Pass Rusher, OL and WR. That is why this past off season these are the positions who got paid !!!
Sadly these are the positions where the Hawks now have little to any talent to build around. I don’t see any true young star building block on the OL. Locket is a nice receiver but not a #1. Clark is a solid but not elite pass rusher and Green has flashed potential. At QB Russ looks like he has really regressed and if he plays this way I don’t see anyway they can pay him the contract he is going to want.
I have no problem if the Hawks had a down rebuild year but sadly I just don’t see their plan or any light at the end of the tunnel. We have very little draft capital and there seems to be no direction. We let guys like Richardson, Bennett, Sherm etc all move on with basically no compensation.
I was semi optimistic this off season that the team could get back to its core beliefs as a running team with solid young defense but that seems like Petes fantasy land after week #2 and I think a complete start over might be the best plan of attack for Paul Allen at this point. Hard to say after the championship team Pete and JS brought us Hawks fans but the had cold truth is this team is bad right now and I don’t see a plan.
The sad part is that if someone like Tom Brady had our receivers then he could make a passing team out of them. Lockett, Dissley, Vannett, there is enough talent there to have a successful team.
That is a valid point. Brady and Rogers can make WR and an OL look good Brees and Rivers are not far behind.
They still win with inferior talent and this justifies the enormous contacts. IMO they are the only two QBs who are worth 30mil or 20% of the teams cap space. No other QBs can win with less talent and the cap hit makes winning the SB next to impossible.
That is why the Hawks can’t pay Russ the $30 mil he will want. He cannot be elite without a quality supporting cast and that is not possible when he take 20% + of the cap.
Where to begin…it has been only 2 games, but I think the picture is starting to crystalize with this franchise. Here is a summary of my thoughts:
a) The talent on this team is lacking. Big time. I don’t see Core 2.0 being built. I see some decent talent surrounded by wholly replaceable bodies. It was very easy to see something special brewing, leading up to 2013. You had the talent and leadership…just in its infancy. It was tangible. This is nothing like it was in those years – and the sad thing is you have an all-world FS, MLB, and QB (well at least you did).
b) Why does everything look so difficult on offense? I’m not going to blame the QB, OL, or the players on this point. The scheme flat out sucks. The Seahawks are literally the only team that I consistently watch where there are hardly ever any easy completions, spacing, you name it. It’s a congested mess built on low margin of error. The opposing defense has to have a breakdown for any easy pass/run. We dictate nothing on that side of the ball.
c) Russell Wilson…torn on this one. VERY disappointing start, but refer to my previous point. He’s being handed a 1981 Datsun and being asked to race Le Mans. He looks like he has PTSD. He’s not seeing anything (not that there are a plethora of open options), but it’s clear he is not processing anything right now.
d) OL…we are now onto a new OL coach…and I’m seeing similar problems. Missed assignments, stupid mistakes, etc. I’m putting this directly on PC/JS. This goes back to talent acquisition and scheme choices…mainly scheme in my opinion.
e) Defense…great effort. They don’t have a ton of talent but they played hard. Unfortunately when Earl leaves and Bobby/KJ age – we are in for a brutal few years. Admittedly, Shaquill Griffin has surprised me. I thought he was wholly average last year (not a bad thing), but he seems to be taking his game to another level.
f) Pete Carroll – I think I’m done with his reign. Grateful for the run, but he looks like a man who is emotionally out of this thing, which is great for 99% of coaches, but not PC. His culture is built on harnessing positive emotions. He is unrecognizable now. I don’t think we have to worry about firing him because he looks like a guy who might just bail after this year. The NFL is changing and Pete refuses to on offense. In no way am I on the “don’t run” train, but concepts are changing and it seems everybody else is willing to change, except PC. Sad end to a fun era.
g) John Schneider – Poor decisions for the better part of 5 years are why we are here. Short sighted moves (Harvin, Graham, Richardson trade), poor drafts, poor 3rd contracts have truly derailed this team. Nobody expects him to replicate the 2012 draft (that’d be crazy) but he has utterly wasted high draft picks in recent years.
I’m ready to move on and start fresh here (with coaching/GM). I don’t want to get rid of RW: it’s too hard to find QBs and he has proven he is a good one. I’d like to see new coaches brought in that will be innovative with his talent. He’s a unique talent. That requires a unique scheme. You don’t take a power hitter and try to make him a great bunter. RW is what he is. You either build to his strengths or you deal him for great draft capital and find a guy who fits what you want to do.
At this point – I think a 5 win season is very likely and to be honest; we should all be rooting for that. Purgatory in the NFL is 7-9 wins. You don’t have a chance to drastically improve your team in the draft and it’s harder to make difficult decisions when “you just missed the playoffs by a few games.” The NFL is changing. Offenses are innovating. I see our offense stalling on the side of the road.
This team doesn’t have “it.” Losing teams can definitely have “it.” I saw it pre-2012. I see none of that now.
I was just thinking, do you remember the play last night where two of our receivers were essentially running the exact same route on what I believe was a bootleg. How does that happen in a regular season game? That’s either bad coaching or bad players. I think within the context of what else we saw, it’s bad coaching.
Perhaps over reaction but I don’t think so Hawks rebuild plan for 2019-2020
-As soon as Fluker comes back insert Fant at RT and completely overhaul the right side of the OL to see if it makes any difference because it is absolutely horrendous and Ifedi is clearly not an NFL OT.
– Trade Earl ASAP for a 2nd round pick if possible
– Move on from Pete and JS this offseason. Bring in a quality personnel guy to run the show and exciting young innovative mind as HC.
– This off season trade Russ for at 2019, 1st and 3rd + a 2020 1st . Then Sign Tyrod Taylor to a 2 yr deal as a stop gap QB
-2019 Draft With our (2) 1st round picks in this draft take the best edge rusher (Bosa, Ferrell or Burns ideally) and the best interior DL (ideally Oliver, Raekon Davis or Wilkins). The rest of the draft focus on BPA regardless of position and start trying to rebuild the roster with talent.
– Resign Clark and Wagner on the defensive side of the ball. Love KJ but lets get younger and faster on Defense.
-Use the cap saving from the Russ trade to sign a true #1 WR and the best OL man on the free agent market.
-2020 Draft do whatever it take to positon yourself to take the QB from Alabama Tua Tagovailova. I think he is the next star QB in the NFL and love how he excelled when the light shone brightest. He would be walking into a team with a loaded defense and some nice pieces on offense.
Love this
I always thought that John would trade Earl to Dallas following the Cowboys game here. Dwanye Brown was traded to us right after the Texans played here. They do not want to see a pissed Earl on the other side of the field!
Thanks for not being a cheerleader. I really hate when “hardcore” fans say you’re a fairweather fan, or a bandwagon fan if you have the courage to say anything bad about anyone…
I think Carroll is a big issue. He was one of the best coming to the Hawks with such a young vibe and perspective and a lot of insider info about college guys and schemes.
But he just cannot lose his old ways. He cannot improve or change. I get it….stick with what you know, and stay with what’s worked for you. But in the last years, without a specific group of people, this scheme is not working. Especially when the other teams are got used to it and exploit the tendencies.
I think Pete is a great guy, an amazing person and WAS an exceptional coach. But he is no more that leader. And not because the guys don’t listen to him. Because he cannot lead to victory. The last couple of year’s wins came from exceptional individual efforts. Not from the FO, not from great schemes.
So I think his time will soon end here.
Not sure about Schneider. He had amazing picks and moves, and really awful ones. Selling all of our quality picks for one-year rentals were a mistake. The Graham experiment was a mistake. We got a ton of dead money in the recent years. He selected a couple of busts and underperformers in the early rounds. But he also got some gems in the 3rd-7th rounds. So I’m torn on him. I think he’s ok, and I wouldn’t sack him.
Russ doesn’t deserve 30 mil/year type of deal. He’s really good and can make magic, but he is a one-trick pony. Like a “character actor”, he can only scramble, pirouette, save plays, throw some nice bombs. But he struggles without scrambling, without creating something from nothing. He has big issues with quick, short passes, with climbing the pocket, with going through his reads. He’s a top10 QB, but not sure if he’s a top3 or top5 one.
Tbh if I’d be Schneider, I’d try to sell him for two 1st a second and a third maybe. Keep the money, get some quality picks. Be ready for a top10 pick this year, and build really strong fronts. Get 1-2 great pass rushers and an RG and RT from a trade or draft or FA. Build a DL that can wreak havoc. Build an OL that could be really good in the run game, opening up huge lanes and let our nr 1 runner (Penny or Carson) to rush through these gaps. If we could get 5-5,5/runs and even convert on 3rd & 1 or 2s. If the OL would be also good/OK in pass-pro, with a game manager QB we could win games I think.
On the other side we have McDougald, Shaq Griffin, maybe Clark, the young Green, and Flowers, maybe T2. With a good strong DL we could be OK on defense and after a couple of years, we could be dominant.
Football is won in the trenches by the big guys. A solid OL and a brutal DL can mask a lot of other issues.
And I’m not saying this because of this 2 games or because of the preseason. But we slowly getting worse and worse in stopping the run, and the passrush almost disappeared. We always had issues on the OL and Russ won’t be that agile in the long run to bail them out.
We cannot re-tool. If we only cosmetic a bit, this won’t be a long season. We’ll have a long decade of mediocre plays and seasons. If the FO will only incrementally change the team, we won’t have to suffer because of 2-14 and 4-12 seasons, but maybe it’ll be 6-8 years of 6-10 and 8-8.
What would you take?
2-14, 4-12, 7-9, 12-4, 13-3 and an SB win
OR
6-10, 5-11, 7-9, 8-8, 10-6 without playoff or at least deep playoff run
Rip off the band-aid and let our young talent have a chance of being great and to play in a championship caliber team by hitting that big red reset button.
All the cheerleaders can say I’m not even a 12th and that I’m a bandwagon fan, but who is a 12th if not the guy who would stay even if it is a 4-12 season for the right reason? If I’m staying with the team even if they’d suck how would I be a bandwagon fan?
Sorry, had to get out of my system…seems like all Seahawks fan facebook groups full of “there ya go a nice participation trophy” enablers who want to kick you out (no kidding saw a post like that) if you criticize Russ or Pete (obviously it’s fine to bash the OL or Ifedi :D)
So thanks again to not only bring the good stuff and the “rah-rah”, but also the cold, hard, objective truth about our beloved team!
Go Hawks!
Like Hawk Eye said above:
“I am a “never panic” guy, but I am struggling to see a bright future for the Hawks over the next few years based on what we are seeing so far.”
I’m in the same boat. In fact, I think we’re on the verge of an era of poor-mediocre football. You simply can not pay Wilson this next off season. Not only will it eat up a huge chunk of your salary cap, but it will also define the personnel strategy for the foreseeable future. This whole retooling on the fly and patch working together a roster is not going to work. A complete re-working of the roster is in order and it makes no sense to have the most expensive QB in the league on a complete rebuild team.
I have no idea if Wilson has any trade value, but I’d be inclined to explore it. Realistically, what team out there would give up the multiple first round pics it would take to get him?
I think several creative offensive coordinators out there stuck in QB purgatory would die to get their hands on RW. Everybody knows how good he can be when played to his strengths.
Said it in another thread, saying in various texting threads w/friends, repeating it here…
I think a ‘bottoming out’ is best in the long-term interest of this organization. 7-9 feels like spinning the wheels. If they go 7-9, there’s the built-in ‘excuses’ already mentioned not to blow it up.
I’m not saying I agree with Sherm & co., but the evidence is now strong enough to me that Pete’s time has come and gone.
I will never actively root against my teams, but in terms of best for the long term, 4-12 with no way to avoid sweeping changes is how this franchise can best win a Super Bowl in the next 5 years.
This ain’t a 7 win team my man. No worries there.
I may be the sole person to think this = but I thought Ifedi played okay considering he has been up against two potential hall of famers. He isn’t perfect, but it could have been a lot worse. Many of the 7 man defensive rushes were unstoppable with breakdowns on both sides and the middle all at once.
If anything I blame the Seahawks for not having the quick plays that would get them yardage. The teams most effective at rushing Wilson- teams like Arizona and LA Rams, have rushed with 5-7 players off the line for years. When will the Seahawks design some counter plays? Coaching and play design = still suffering.
Ifedi got worked. He’s not good. Time to move on.
Ifedi is going to get a lot of flack because he is an easy target, but he did okay considering he was pretty much left on an island to deal with Mack apart from an occasional chip block by the tight end. The interior OL got its butt kicked, though: Wilson had guys right in his face most of the game.
Nope. I thought he handled his role well also. Especially considering who he was lined up against.
Broadcasters even mentioned Russell had all day to throw on many occasions but was holding onto the ball. Some blame can go to the receivers and play calling too in those instances. But I was watching the game and the oline thinking “how long does russ need them to hold the line for??”
Ifedi deserves the credit but maybe not full trust yet.
Now I know this was the bears but I feel like calisto looked good. The defense was in general better they responded to last weeks poor showing vs a poor QB. The pass coverage improved. Again I don’t think Trubisky is or will be a good QB but I liked seeing the defense show up and give the offense the opportunity.
I would ask this, what coach does Pete bring in that is going to fix the offense? Who can help Russ get younger and quicker? Who can help Russ be taller and get over his need to run from a clean pocket?
I feel like they are not using the lateral part of the field well on offense. No jet sweep no fake reverse. Even our motion is just poorly ran and useless.
The team is sparse of long term talent and recent drafts have help little to restock our team. There must be a rebuild and that is sad but I look forward to the other side.
The defense is slow and can’t get off a block to save their life. Seattle went from the most undersized team in the league when we were making/winning SB’s to the heaviest team this year. Coincidental?
I agree. Calitro was second only to McDougled in tackles and assists.
First time poster long time reader…Since 2010, thanks Rob.
Finally retired!! YEESSSSS. 38 years old and done with the rat race. Ok enough of me.
What a debacle. I feel like screaming at PC/JS right now for the ‘let’s make a last run’ mentality the last few years. “Win forever” ….right? I’m usually not a half-glass empty kind of fan but brothers this looks dismal right now.
I thought like Rob did that we will probable be about an 8-8 team but at least be more fun to watch while we rebuild the next few years. Now after looking at our schedule I can’t fathom winning more than 6 games.
We didn’t have 3 of our best 6 players on the field though(Baldwin/Wagner/Wright) so I still have some hope. How about Griffin last night? Nice.
Anyway, nice to finally join the blog if you’ll have me Rob. And this blog is the best in the biz.
Go Hawks
If you’ve retired at 38 can you share the secret of how you managed that achievements with me 😂
I’ll wager a guess: 20+ years of military service?
I’m not really a fan of the classic line “the receivers are getting no separation”.
NFL secondaries are filled with elite athletes who can run and turn on a dime. You want your receivers to get open, and get separation? You probably need to make the DBs jobs extremely difficult by confusing them and making them consider multiple options and route combinations. Make them defend RBs and TEs that come from everywhere in the formation.
I’m no offensive game plan expert, but there is nothing challenging from a scheme stand point to defend Seattle. There is also nothing physically threatening in terms of the OL, and the best RB for whatever reason is barely playing.
Russell looked like he didnt want to scramble most of last night, like he was forcing staying in the pocket (not that there was anywhere to scramble to). But if the scheme doesnt give him anywhere to throw to…where does he go? Every team we play has great safety valve/dump off options and quick routes to deal with pressure. That said, I am in no ways defending Russ. He should be the best player on the field at this point, and he isnt anywhere close to it.
If you can get draft picks for him and ET take them. The team has barely any draft capital next spring, and no core to build around, so having a QB doesnt even matter right now. They need about 5 first round picks in the next two years, plus great drafting in rounds 2-7 to rebuild this thing.
What is going on with the disinformation this year? Is PC scrambling to cover some bizarre stuff going on in the organization?
-Carson runs 2 special teams plays and yet PC says he was “gassed” as the reason he didn’t play the second half. “Also wanted to see what Penny could do”…I think wanting to feature Penny and get Prosise some touches is a reasonable, if odd decision to bench Carson. But to flat out lie like that when you KNOW official snap counts will be public?
-This continued insistence that the Hawks are a running team when the run/pass mix shows otherwise is baffling. If you honestly believe you are a run-first team, and you really are abandoning that strategy at a moments’ notice, you’re being outcoached. If you are just saying you are a run-first team and you really do want to pass more, what strategic advantage do you gain from the misinformation?
-Cutting Tom Johnson for Luani and then not using Luani for a single snap in the next game? Eating $2m of salary on a guy you talked up all of camp? And now Johnson just got picked back up by the Vikings.
These things point to something that doesn’t smell good behind closed doors.
How about when he said last week that there was no considerable difference from ET being in there to Tedric Thompson?
And the vikings signed Tom Johnson out from under us … LOL, fitting.
Tom Johnson will cost the Seahawks just over $1.8m towards the salary cap over the next two years, since he was cut after Week 1 rather than before.
$1.8m for 39 snaps and one tackle. WOW!
There have been a lot of questionable moves by the GM and Carroll.
Unbelievable…
A few thoughts.
1. Nice effort by the no name defense. If there is a single positive take away, I thought this game showed Carroll can still coach up a defensive effort. I have all the faith that, by the end of the year, Seattle fans will feel pretty decent about the state of the defense, like any other year in the PC era.
2. The offense is a total joke right now. People are coming out ripping on RW, but from my vantage point on my coach, I saw some interesting play calling by Nagy and Helfrich with the Bears, and I saw nothing from Seattle that made me think they were going to play to any of the strengths of the QB and personnel. My current hot take is that this has everything to do with Pete Carroll and Russell Wilson becoming increasingly a bad match.
After the mass coaching exodus last winter, there was a lot of talk Seattle was going to pursue John Delifippo to pair with RW. When he turned down coming out to Seattle, there was some twitter rumbling that the reason he turned down the invite was that he had gotten word that he wouldn’t have autonomy to call plays. So, what does Seattle do? Pursue another innovative offensive coach to pair with arguably the most creative QB in the league? Nope, they hire Schotty. It’s almost like Carroll doubled down on his conservative vision for his offense, which is fine if they had a game manager who can see over his OL, but they don’t.
Somewhere, Darrell Bevel has got to be laughing his butt off.
3. It feels like we are likely heading towards an inevitable crossroad where Paul Allen may have to decide between a 67 year old HC, and a 30 year old QB at the end of this season, and I think it is anyone’s guess where he goes. If Carroll says he wants to coach another 4 to 5 years, and gives a compelling case that they are building something up again defensively, can see them dealing RW. If Allen see an old HC who is looking past his prime, I think RW stays, and they hire a HC who will be innovative offensively.
I give about a 35% chance that the team adjusts mid season and they give us hope that the marriage between PC/BS and RW is a strong one moving forward, and a 65% chance that change is coming, and in that change, if things are really, really bad, I can realistically see Paul Allen deciding to just blow the whole thing up.
4. IMO, if the team ends up dealing RW it was NOT be for three first round picks. They will be extremely lucky to get a first and some change. They might have to settle for a couple day two picks, or a day two pick and some chump change if they really want to move on. If they are ready to deal him, it will likely be that he had a down year. If RW is a pro-bowler at the end of the season, I seriously doubt Paul Allen will sign off on trading him. If he struggles, it will be a buyers market.
5. If RW is dealt, and does well for his new team, and Seattle continues to struggle, that could be catastrophic for the franchise. Be careful what you ask for.
6. Build it back up with Pete Carroll Scenario
Carroll does enough with the young defense to convince Paul Allen to keep him around for four more seasons. Seattle trades RW to New England for their first and third round picks, and then signs Tyrod Taylor and Demarcus Lawrence in free agency.
2019 NFL Draft
4: R1P4
DL ED OLIVER
Carroll finally gets the inside pass rusher he has coveted for years.
28: R1P28
G BEAU BENZSCHAWEL
WISCONSIN
Further adding to the offensive line to play the smash mouth brand Carroll wants.
67: R3P3
S TAYLOR RAPP
WASHINGTON
Earl walks and Carroll can’t resist adding Rapp
99: R3P35
WR KELVIN HARMON
NC STATE
Seattle continues to chase a big receiver in the draft.
106: R4P4
OT KALEB MCGARY
WASHINGTON
More offensive line with the 5th year option on Ifedi not picked up.
144: R5P4
CB JAMAL PETERS
MISSISSIPPI STATE
Big long corner added.
2019 Outlook. Taylor proves a better fit for what PC/BS want to do in an athletic game manager, and Seattle shows signs of becoming a play off contender.
The marriage between BB and RW in New England is terrific, and the Patriots get back to dominance in the AFC. In the Super Bowl, Russell throws the game winning TD on Richard Sherman, and NE beats SF 33 to 31.
I would say trade JS & PC along with Russ for extra draft capital. Imaging what Russ can do in a McVay type offense
Coaching in general and play calling in particular have been atrocious through the first two weeks of the season. Pete’s post-game comments on Carson and subsequent correction looked like he was trying to make an excuse and got burned for it. And I’m sorry, but if you get away from the run in a one-score game when you’re quarterback is under siege every time he drops back to pass with more than 5 yards to go, that’s inexcusable. Ditch the RB-by-committee approach: pick a guy and stick with him throughout the game (reevaluate on a week-to-week basis if needs by, but give SOMEBODY enough carries to see if he can get into a rhythm.)
Was very impressed with our makeshift defense: despite being held together by spit and duct tape they only allowed 17 points and gave us a chance to win. Kudos especially to Shaquill Griffin for two BIG second quarter INTs when Chicago could have easily steamrolled us out of the building before halftime. I give that unit an A for playing so well despite being out of their weight class.
Offense gets a D. Coaching staff gets a solid F.
I was hoping for a season like 2011. But we NEED to start seeing improvement next Sunday at home. And yeah, it’s time to start wondering if this team needs to move on from Pete Carroll.
This is ONE reason why I’m more worried about the coaching than Wilson. Pick six was apparently two plays after the timeout (can’t personally verify).
https://mobile.twitter.com/benbbaldwin/status/1042082643901378561
Killed momentum, made Wilson visibly pissed, pies poor clock management, and to me personally indicates that Wilson isn’t being allowed to “run” the offense.
All the mistakes aren’t on the coaches, but I do think he’s being told the EXACT plays to run (not allowing for QB called adjustments), and also being told to limit his scrambles (hold onto the ball for the big play to open up). I think they let him run the two minute offense and both historically and this season the offense has looked great in 2-5 minute situations. Hmmmmm!
If that’s the case that he can’t even check out of calls, that’s absolutely ridiculous. RW did seem to be upset after that timeout.
Or, alternatively, Ben Baldwin is reading far too much into that video clip.
Carroll said they weren’t lined up properly so he called the timeout. Wilson was pissed because he thought he could fix it.
So yeah. Way to go seahawks twitter.
Who is Ben Baldwin? Kidding (not really), but seriously I didn’t even read the tweet all the way through at first (just wanted the video originally), and I only follow you, FG, and the Official Seahawks pages, so I don’t dip into the twitter nonsense.
Honestly, this stood out to me last night during the game. It wasn’t even Russell’s face, it was the throwing of the arms by both him and the RB. The coaches and players don’t seem to be on the same page at all. Either way, terrible clock management. Another issue that has plagued this team for years.
At this point, are we really believing anything Pete Carroll says? You know, like Carson was too gassed from the 2 special teams snaps he played to play in the 4th quarter? Or that their priority was to fix the run game? Is that why they called 14 consecutive pass plays in the 3rd quarter of a one score game?
Anyway, it’s plain as day Russell audibled, and then Pete called TO with 10 seconds on the play clock. Kind of like the earlier TO called to save a 2 yard delay of game penalty. Piss poor clock management. Piss poor offensive game plan. Piss poor play calling. Not only that, the plays were coming in so damn slow, the offense was just getting to the line with under 10 seconds on the play clock. That doesn’t give Russell any time to read the defense, and if necessary, audible out of the crap play that Schott just called. In the 4th quarter, the plays started coming in quicker; they even ran the ball something like 11 times, it’s funny how the offense started to move when that happened.
It’s pretty obvious that Pete doesn’t want Russell checking out of plays – even if that means losing winnable games. It’s obvious he’s trying to send a message to the team – even his franchise QB – that he is to run the plays that are called and things are going to be done “his way”. The guy needs to stop micromanaging the offense, because the only way his way works is with a stonewall defense, and ANY offense would work under those circumstances.
In a league where the successful offenses actually devise schemes that are comfortable and friendly to their QBs, Seattle has found a way to do the other teams DC’s job for them, and make their OWN QB uncomfortable. That’s what happens when you try to run a vertical passing attack with long developing routes against beast pass rushes. It’s literally bass-ackwards of what smart football coaches do; just frustrating to watch.
I agree. I didn’t think Ifedi was that poor last night. Even the play people keep mentioning where dissly chipped and Ifedi was pushed back…Russ still had plenty of time to get the ball out. Your point about the Cards/Rams etc…any casual surf through my posts the last few years would confirm my absolute perplexity/disdain for a lack of counter plays to combat the pass rush. It’s like they are caught off guard every single time those DLs pin their ears back, even though they do it over and over.
This was supposed to be in reply to AlaskaHawks Ifedi comment
If you watch the replay Russ went to throw the ball looks like to penny the rb and drops/double clutches the ball. So a 4 yard gain turns into oh man Ifedi blew it again.
I want to be honest I was on the Ifedi replacement train last year but really this has been a decent season made out of the two games and great pass rushers he has faced.
Consider me shocked that a PC has become stale and boring. Shocked that he says one thing and does another? Nope. Didn’t want to be be right about this. But you could see it last year.
This offense will not work in the modern NFL. Mitch Trubisky averages 5 YPA, but the difference is all the different formations and looks that HC Matt Nagy hits ya with. That’s what Seattle needs. A young, innovative play caller. Not a guy who’s best days are behind him.
Russell Wilson? Where to start. So can good, get so bad. How is that possible? However, this ain’t his fault. They ask him to do more with less than. perhaps any QB in the league. Quit wasting his career and build a god damn functional offense!
Why is Pete obsessed with Eddie Lacey? That’s who’ve they’ve drafted or at least turned Rashaad Penny into. The big, plodding back is outta style. With the athletes on defense now you better make be able to make guys miss.
This is without a doubt a top 10, perhaps too 7 or so type team. A pass rusher would help, but is it the answer? Ehhhh. Let’s finally get the O-line right and get some weapons on offense at receiver. Building around Russ is the way to go. Unless everyone wants to be Cleveland, but hey draft picks are fun right?
As always, well put Volume 12.
I thought the exact same thing Vol but the only question is how do you build a quality group around him if he is taking up 20% + of cap space?
I agree a young innovative play caller will help but Russ just looks lost right now almost like he has PTSD.
He does. He’s seeing ghosts.
Drafting well for one thing. Getting young, cost controlled talent. Restructuring his deal.
Do people really wanna see a rookie QB paired with Schottenheimer?
I agree that the Seahawks need an innovative pass first coach. Someone who can bring modern plays into this offense.
It was obvious last year that the Seahawks were going to run the ball whether they were successful or not. They weren’t!
This year it seems like more of a deception, we intend to run the ball but not right this moment. In fact it may only be a run 1 out of 3 times or 1 out of 4.
Regarding Penny, yes he seems very slow compared to the modern runners who turn sideways to jump between to tacklers. I’m wondering if he is still recovering from injury – I want to see how he looks in October.
Runwise, there is no reason they can’t be better. They have plenty of healthy backs, an offensive line that is at least average, and we all agree that Wilson isn’t passing that well. What’s stopping them?
The Seahawks don’t need a ‘pass first’ coach. Not in the slightest.
They just need to make logical decisions and play to the strengths of the roster. Whoever is in charge.
Doesn’t have to be pass 1st or run 1st. Innovative, yes.
The other point about not being Cleveland is: coaching, coaching, and general managers. You got to make the right draft picks, train them, and provide plays that are successful. I think at the end of the day = the coaches are more important than the players.
I have felt, ever since the second superbowl appearance and loss of defensive coordinator Quinn, that the Seahawks have been on a slow slide downhill in both personnel and in play design/calling. Frankly I wanted Bevell or Cable fired after the second superbowl. Mostly to make a statement that things will not continue the same way. Now that I have seen who Pete chooses to replace them – I realize that it would have just hastened the final lurch down to the bottom.
So here we sit, and it seems like the defense is once again greater than the offense. Even though the defense has thrown together three rookies and other newish players, and are missing two of their key linebackers.
Add weapons to offense? Well sure, but the weapons never seem to come together the way the defense does. Lack or pride, lack of leadership? Perhaps they just need a taller leader? Or one who gets the ball out on target more often. He does have a beautiful touch pass downfield.
We will be a 3-5 win team this year and have a top 6 draft pick. Mark my words.
That’s optimistic. I see maybe 2 wins on this schedule.
Remember when Jon Gruden traded Khalil Mack for 2 completely unknown, unsure 1st round picks? Still can’t get over it.
I know it is crazy and for a team moving to a new market in Vegas it makes even less sense. You would think they would want the star appeal as well.
Mack seems like a good team guy and is ridiculously good and take that Bears defense from average to elite overnight.
Wilson, outside of a 5-game stretch three years ago, has never shown the ability to operate within a conventional offense.
He can operate in a conventional offense if we run the ball more. That’s the type of offense that best suits him, an offensive that is built off the running game. However, the past two seasons the running game was absolutely putrid. This year from what I’ve seen it’s much improved. The problem is they don’t do enough of it, they abandon it even when the game is such that you can still do it. At no point prior to the pick six last night did I feel like the Hawks had to just get pass happy to get back into the game. They could keep running a balanced attack and get back into the game. All that being said, I have to shoulder a lot of this on Russ. Again he holds onto the ball too long and of the six sacks, four were totally on him. I believe the time has come to bench Russ for a game, but Pete doesn’t have the guts to do it. Russ must be held accountable.
This is why he needs O-line help. He relies on that, a running game as you said, and a good defense. He’s not a high volume type of passer.
You can find RBs anywhere, O-lineman? Not so much. The defense is fairly young and will need time and more pieces to become a stellar unit. In the meantime, build around what you do have.
All that being said, Russ absolutely needs to be better and deserves a lion’s share of the criticism, but asking him to be something he’s not is head scratching to say the least.
Sorry, but if you’re facing a defense that is willing to consistently rush seven because they don’t think you’ll exploit it — and they have success after success after success — good luck finding an O-line to stop that.
You need to call plays and/or execute to exploit that level of aggressiveness. Seattle did the complete opposite.
Blame the OL all you want. You’re not blocking seven with five very often.
Last night was on Carroll, Schotty and Russ.
No. I’m not blaming the O-line for last night. I’m blaming the fact that Seattle refuses to hide Russell’s weaknesses and play to his strengths.
But that’s the very problem, instead of making him into a more complete player that can’t be exploited, they’ve rode his magic playmaking into the ground. Sooner or later everyone knows he’s going to spin back and to the left. He would be better served by being taught how to play the chess game and use his X-Factor when there isn’t a better option.
Because he’s not a conventional, drop back rhythm passer.
So many here befuddled by Pete’s use of Carson on special teams and Penney in the 2nd half. I’ll be redundant and restate my opinion. Pete is scared, he knows now he made a big mistake taking Penny first. He was just hoping the kid would do something to bail him out.
Wilson isn’t as bad or great as either side wants to make him out to be at this point. Yes he has his strengths and then his weaknesses. If compared to Brees, Wilson hasn’t fixed the flaws in his game such as pocket presence. He is still feeling ghosts that aren’t there and struggles mightily to step up unless its to run. But that also is attributed to his height and not having clear visibility. These weaknesses can be helped by the system he’s in but right now I don’t see a compliment of him in the one we are trying to run.
If we are calling fire right now and that’s a big if, we need to trade Bobby, and anyone older we can. Its not popular. But as solid of a player Bobby has been for us he isn’t the type to take over a game.
Outside of drastic moves our D isn’t playing as bad as many expected. Holding the Bear’s solid run game down is something to be happy with. On a night with both Bobby and K.J out.
As bad as our offense has looked, we could be just as easily 3-0. Next week we have a chance again. The Cowboys O is suffering very much the way ours has been. Suddenly As NFL coaches have caught on the what Dak can do and cant the offensive line is horrible. Interesting.
Ready for the next chapter in Seahawks football to begin.
That pick 6 was purely Wilson. And who designed a play with a running back on the sideline? Isn’t he supposed to be blocking rushers and slipping into the middle for an outlet pass?
I don’t see the point in benching Russell, but also not sure that he is capable of taking a team all the way anymore. I see him as more of a Jay Cutler or a Smith. Serviceable, maybe get you to the playoffs, but not capable of reaching the superbowl. Father time and bad blocking has not been kind to his body.
Actually, and apparently, we ran the same look against Denver the prior week. They knew what was coming. Chicago’s CB who got the pick six even responded on Twitter to the person who pointed it out – ‘lol you found the play!’ Schotty!
The sad reality is that the Pete Carroll era is done. He and JS have drafted poorly and made even worse trades over the past few years. Those poor picks and trades are coming home to roost. Instead Carroll seemed to place blame on the Cable and Bevell and fired them. Now I’m not saying they shouldn’t have been fired, but after watching this dumpster fire of an offense for 2 games it’s clear they were not the problem. So now we are stick with terrible Brian Schottenheimer who cannot and will not fix this offense. We have a terrible o line and still do not have a starting caliber RB. At this point, Paul Allen needs to step in and clean house. I know it won’t happen in season nor should it, but after the season it might be time to say good bye once and for all to PC/JS. It was a great run but it’s clearly over.
Just for some perspective: As bad as things seem today, yesterday’s offensive performance would have resulted in: 2017, tying the Redskins and the Packers; 2016, wins against the Bucs, Cards, and Rams; 2015, tying and the Rams and, again, the Packers. Also: In 2017 the Hawks had 6 actual wins where 17 points would have won the game; in 2016–4; in 2015–9; in 2014–8; 2013–8.
I’m not arguing that the Hawks are fine. They clearly are not. Rather, that things have always been up and down, hot and cold, with this offense. Even both SB runs were damn-near things.
I think that is what is so confusing about this team, this QB, this coach: the second you think they stink, they put together a good run. Then, when you’re starting to feel confident, it blows up in your face. Only to–most times–still turn around and make the playoffs.
So for better or for worse, we should probably wait at least another 6-8 games before we fire Pete or trade Russ. Just sayin.
As bad as the Seahawks looked yesterday, I still think people are overreacting. And I still believe this is probably a 7-9/8-8 team. We just lost two away games in a row by one score. Not completely unheard of, especially early in the season. I’m pretty critical of Russell Wilson, but trading him? You’re out of your mind if you think that’s a good move.
This team is kind of a mess, but I fully expect the offense to put up some great performances followed by more duds. And I expect the defense to be surprisingly good throughout the season despite lacking depth/talent.
I really don’t expect a whole lot to change as long as PC is in charge. But we are far from the worst team in the league and I expect to see this team win some surprise games at home this year against better opponents.
Our best bet is to either hope we improve our team enough to keep riding the PC/JS train and get us back in the playoffs. Or look for new blood in the coaching department shake things up. But do NOT let Wilson walk. That will be a bad move. Do ya’ll not remember Rick Mirer? Dan McGwire? Kitna? Friesz?
Despite his flaws, Wilson is still the best QB we’ve had in 42 years. Man alive, we have been spoiled over the last 7 years.
Its interesting that other coaches around the league like Sean Payton, Andy Ried, Mike McCarthy and Mike Tomlin to name a few can have down years. But the perennial powerhouse that was the Seahawks before Pete and John arrived have a few down years and it’s time to get a new staff and to clean house etc…
Interesting how fast people forget the crap years before we were feared. No one is saying they get a pass of any kind. But this is their team perhaps give them a chance to right the ship like the other smart franchises do.
Just a little perspective fellas.
It’s a fair point to an extent. Although you could just as easily argue McCarthy should’ve got more than one ring out of the Rodgers era, Payton has never been back to the dance and they’re having a bad start, Reid has never won a SB and his teams regularly bottle it in the post-season and Tomlin has got away with quite a lot of sloppiness because the Steelers are loyal to the point of it possibly being an issue. So maybe some of the down years warranted a change in some cases.
Those are all good to great coaches, though, Rob. I think it speaks to the parity of the NFL more than the mediocrity of coaches who have not won multiple Super Bowls. This is a different era than the 1970’s, 89’s or 90’s. You’ve pointed out many times the only team to crack the code is the Patriots, and past them the Seahawks have been the model franchise in recent memory with just one super bowl win.
It’s easy to see the apocalypse in these two games, I get it. But it’s still two games. The body of work tells me things will get better.
Waiting for Sep to start football and your team looks all lost. I know now how Browns, Jets fans feel. Pretty much everyone has a great point in this blog, wonder what would take Pete and Russ to understand and fix pass rush problem.
Rob, I agree it’s not on O’line, Russ is not just holding the ball but getting close to O’line moving forward and now he is surrounded by 6’5 300 pounds human wall with 5’11 height himself. Is it hard to figure why he can’t throw the ball? Moving forward probably trying to avoid negative play but current method is never going to work. Russ wants to hold the ball to make a play GREAT but how many times he succeed and how many times he get’s negative play? Stop being a hero.
I would not think twice to trade Russ if some one offers 2 first round and some 2nd or 3rd. Get rid of Pete his age is catching up. It would be devastating if Russ get more money than A-Rod, he don’t deserve the money. Same opponent (Bears) A-Rod won with one leg after being down by 20 point. Russ or a decent QB would have won both the games.
Yep
Will say it once and for all. Do not trade Russell Wilson. No matter how many picks you get and how high they are, it is very unlikely he will be reproduced. How many potential hall of fame QBs have we seen in the last 20 years. In fairness to (Big Ben/Eli/Rivers) they are not imo the same caliber as Russ. We can be elite again it might just take some time/coaching decisions. We have been spoiled the last few years. Quarterbacks can struggle and teams can struggle, try being the Browns or the Bills.
I don’t recall this level of angst and frustration about the Hawks since Pete took over.
I don’t think Pete or JS is getting fired and Russell is not getting traded
UNTIL
the season is over.
No idea what it will take for those things to happen, but if there are 10 more games like the first 2, good chance at least 2 of those 3 things happen.
I love Pete, and have embraced some of his philosophies in business and life. Do what you believe in even when others don’t. But I am not sure what Pete believes right now and not sure Pete does either.
until then, hawks twitter will be en fuego.
I can take 2 losses, but like everyone is pointing out, there are just so many bad signs to point to, the whole team seems lost.
Turning this around may be harder than keeping the Titanic afloat after it hit the iceberg. Anyone know how that turned out?
oh, and be prepared to hear from lots of fans from 49’rs, Rams, etc and watch them want to throw gas on the fire. Now we know how the 49r fans have felt since Harbaugh’s last season……
So Earl Thomas is held out of practice for “personal reasons” on Friday and Pete Carroll was non-committal when asked if Thomas would play on Sunday.
Could there be a post-game trade in the works?
Seems that way