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For thoughts on the blockbuster trade sending Jimmy Graham to the Seahawks, click here
Who will they draft in round two?
It almost makes too much sense to target Colorado State offensive lineman Ty Sambrailo at #63. They could even make a small move back into the third round before pulling the trigger. He’s a big, athletic tackle convert with a fantastic personality. The Seahawks like interior linemen with tackle experience. He has some of the size James Carpenter offered (6-6, 311lbs) but he’s much more agile with quick feet. He’s an ideal fit for a zone blocking scheme that still values size and the power running game. He plays with an edge and gets to the second level. He’s someone you can work with and develop — he gives off a Seahawks vibe. He’s graded all over the place but you can imagine Seattle taking him a round early (as they tend to do) to get one of ‘their’ guys. Instant starter.
What are the alternatives?
If they can get Sambrailo later keep an eye on Henry Anderson (DT, Stanford). He’s long and athletic and would add to the interior defensive line rotation. Terrific tackler and works well against the run. The signing of Cary Williams takes away the need to force an early cornerback pick. Cameron Erving (C, Florida State) is unlikely to last into the late second round. They could look at receivers and the offense still lacks a dynamic deep threat. Phillip Dorsett (WR, Miami) could still be on the board, although it’s unlikely. Don’t rule out a bit of a reach to get a coveted prospect. Kansas State’s Tyler Lockett could be a surprise option if they think this is the only spot they can get him.
What about the middle rounds?
This is where the fun begins. The value at #31 wasn’t great. You’re looking at possibly 15-18 first round grades in the 2015 draft — if that. The value-gap between #31 and #63 won’t be that substantial. And there’s a ton of depth in the middle rounds at positions of need. Seattle has a cluster of picks here and it isn’t a coincidence. They’re projected to have their original third round pick, four picks in the fourth round (their own, New Orleans’ and a compensatory pick) and three in round five (their own plus two compensatory picks).
It’s a shame Percy Harvin was cut by the Jets taking away another fourth rounder. There’s a legitimate opportunity to collect 2-3 key contributors here, if not more.
One of the top priorities will be to add a kick return specialist. Bryan Walters, bless him, tried his best. But the Seahawks got pretty much nothing out of him apart from the odd fair catch and a few snaps on offense. They need someone who can take care of the kick returns and provide a role player on offense too. Tre McBride is one possibility in the third or fourth round. He’s extremely talented with great character, athleticism and catching technique. He returned kicks for William & Mary. Tyler Lockett is also incredibly ‘Seahawky’ — competitive, gritty, a film junkie. He had a sensational Senior Bowl. As noted earlier, you can imagine them taking him earlier than expected (round two?). They might target him specifically in the third or fourth round if he lasts. He’s a punt return specialist. These are the two options I would focus on. The big thing with both players — they can contribute to the offense and get downfield. Size is not an issue following the addition of Graham.
They could double down on receiver given the value this year. Darren Waller is a Vincent Jackson clone in terms of physical attributes and speed. He’s a million miles away from contributing in the NFL and needs one or maybe two years of development. That could scare off the Seahawks and others. If he’s on the board in the fourth or fifth round he could be worth a flier for the long term.
Center will be another target position following the Max Unger trade. I’ve done a quick scan on a couple of prospects having not paid much attention to this group (obviously). Hobart’s Ali Marpet was one of the stories of the Senior Bowl and he had a solid combine too. If you search Google images for ‘ideal zone blocking frame for a center’ you’ll find a picture of Marpet. He faces a major step up in competition level. Competitive individual, typical lineman. Not much tape to get at but he’s a project anyway.
B.J. Finney (C, Kansas State) is a four year starter, team captain and a former walk-on. Even more appealing is his wrestling background (see: Justin Britt). He’s a totally different player to Marpet (much less athletic) but just looks solid. On a first viewing he’s strong, doesn’t get pushed around, seems to jam defenders at the point and finish and he’s effective in the running game. Britt was a total wildcard a year ago and there’s no real consistency with Tom Cable’s O-line picks. Finney is more pro-ready than Marpet and could be trusted to start early. Just don’t expect anything spectacular.
There aren’t a ton of options at center and the value might not be there. If you can’t justify taking Marpet or Finney until rounds 4-5, by that point both might be off the board. It’s perhaps more likely they’ll add a veteran stopgap and let them compete with Patrick Lewis and/or Lemuel Jeanpierre. Replacing Carpenter is easier in this draft. We’ll have a broader look at the center class over the next couple of weeks.
You would expect the Seahawks to draft a cornerback at some point in rounds 4-5. Let’s see where Stanford’s Alex Carter falls. I’m not convinced he’ll go as early as some are projecting and he could be there in round four. Can you go receiver (McBride), receiver (Lockett), cornerback (Carter) center (Marpet/Finney) in rounds 3-4? That might be a tad optimistic but this is just a loose projection looking at the possible target positions. If you collect a haul like that, you could be looking at 3-4 role players or starters. Not bad for that range in the draft.
What about the three picks in round five?
This is a good place to target developmental offensive and defensive linemen. Here are some prospects to look at: Rob Crisp (T, NC State), Laurence Gibson (T, Virginia Tech), Rakeem Nunez-Roches (DT, Southern Miss), Zach Hodges (DE, Harvard), Derrick Lott (DT, Tenn-Chatt), Anthony Chickillo (DE, Miami), Mitch Morse (T, Missouri), Terry Poole (T, San Diego State).
Crisp and Gibson have the size, length and upside to stick at tackle, while you probably consider moving Morse and Poole inside to guard. The defensive linemen have an opportunity to fill out your D-line rotation. In the fifth you could also look at a safety (Kurtis Drummond? Josh Shaw?) or a cornerback project (a small school prospect or a convert like Nick Marshall). Davis Tull played end for Tenn-Chatt but is expected to move to the SAM at the next level — he has the athelticism to play linebacker in Seattle. There’s also the opportunity to consider drafting a running back in round five, given the relative depth of the class.
Conclusion
None of the names listed here are flashy household names. That’s not what this draft is about. We’re unlikely to see another selection like Christine Michael (first pick in 2013 after the Harvin trade). They have a genuine opportunity to fill in the gaps that need filling. A starter at guard, a kick returner, another receiver, a developmental corner. They can fill out the depth on both lines and possibly find a center.
It’s not going to be easy to find extra depth for the edge rush rotation. This could be the reason why they’re reportedly showing interest in prospects like Jabaal Sheard and Adrian Clayborn.
Michael was a bit of a luxury at the time for a team carrying a loaded roster. I’m not sure they’ll go for that type here. This time they have some needs that need addressing.
When you consider the entire draft, the thinking behind the Jimmy Graham trade becomes even clearer. You can find a starting guard in round two (Sambrailo) so why knock yourself out grabbing one at #31? You can find receivers in rounds 3-4. You had zero chance to draft a player as dominating as Graham to boost your offense. I would expect the likes of Jaelen Strong and Breshad Perriman to be there at #31. Neither will get close to Graham in terms of taking Seattle’s offense to the next level.
The one big concession you make is the new hole at center. They managed without Unger for 13 games in 2014 — you suspect they’ll find a way to cope again in 2015. The extra cap relief will also help you potentially bring in a veteran defensive lineman.
It’s been a while since the Seahawks had a rich middle of a draft — finding key contributors or even the odd superstar. The best value in this draft is in rounds 3-5. Seattle has seven picks in that range and it has to be by design. That’s one of several reasons they can use to justify the Graham trade.
This transforms how they look at the draft. You have holes at LG and C, depth issues at DB, and still in need of another WR. These are now positions I hope they focus on.
Oh, and Andre Johnson has a meeting in Seattle later… that’d be a cool pickup.
Getting AJ too would be amazing!
I wonder if jr sweezy is a candidate to switch to center? He seems like a natural too me. Thoughts Rob?? Keep up the great work!!
He’s never played it and he’s a convert to offense. You don’t ask that guy to learn to snap and also make all of the line calls.
Really hope we can land Sheard.
I actually think Alvin is going to be better than Carp was. Doesn’t take much so that’s probably too low of a bar if we actually want decent guard play. Still, it’s nice having that guy as our back-up at both tackle and guard positions so I hope we can get a good/better starter along the line.
Seems like I heard that Alvin has a bit of a weight problem. Not sure he’s really anything more than a journeyman player.
Seems like Carp has a weight problem too, unless he’s in a contract year.
it would also mean they value gilliam
I think our money might be better spent on OL, depending on what the team has forecast as far as their draft board/plans. Sheard would be a great get and I’ve long been a fan of his but I think he’ll command more money than people might expect and play less snaps than makes sense for this type of signing.
Not a fan of adding Andre Johnson at all.
So this means they now have a 2nd, 3rd, 3 4ths, 3 5ths, 2 6ths, and a 7th, correct?
I’m still a fan of Georgia Tech WR Darren Waller, but not now after adding Jimmy Graham. He’s completely redundant. He doesn’t offer anything more than WR Hardball Matthews if he’s a couple years away from contributing. I like WR Gresham Perryman, but have doubts he’ll last until the 2nd round.
Colorado St’s OL Ty Sambrailo is a perfect fit for the LG position on this team, and that’s who I think will be Seattle’s first pick. I agree that they’ll add that field tilting return man, and again, I completely love this guy and there may not be a better fit for what the Seahawks look for in a receiver than Nebraska’s Kenny Bell. Gritty, outspoken, versatile, best run blocker of this class, would make a great gunner, good deep speed, good route runner, and pretty dynamic.
Should say WR Breshad Perriman.
Why? Johnson isn’t getting big money, and he’s another downfield threat for a team that values throwing the ball deep.
I don’t think he is personally. He’s a guy that’s injured quite a bit, and doesn’t strike me as gritty at all. Doesn’t run block and seems to quit on plays,
a quote from Schnider on the cap situation
Schneider on how the trade impacts the salary cap: “In some respects it actually helps us. When you take out a first round draft choice like that, the cost of a first-round draft choice is close to 3.5 million. So if we were going to go out and sign a tight end in free agency, and have a huge signing bonus, big paragraph 5, a lot of guaranteed money, that would have hindered some of the things we would have been able to do. But right now we’re on course, we’re on budget and we feel like we have a lot to do, a lot of goals that we want to accomplish in the offseason. Like I said earlier a lot of tough decisions but real exciting times ahead.”
“Johnson isn’t getting big money, and he’s another downfield threat for a team that values throwing the ball deep.”
It remains to be seen how big of a contract AJ will command. I doubt he’ll be cheap. He’s not the deep threat he used to be either. I’d be excited if we got him as a short term upgrade for Kearse, but would rather we roll with our young guys and draft picks.
Great write up, Rob. We all went to bed wondering if the Hawks would create any buzz and here we are. I really want to see us really upgrade the special teams/return game. If you can get that young guard in the late second, make it happen. We still need to build depth and prepare for okung’do possible departure. Maybe Gilliam shows growth in year two.
Goes to question if they will extend Russ and/or Wagner this offseason, wonder where we at in terms of the cap.
Can we please get Wilfork in here too!!!!
We could prob. generate an extra 5+ mm in space by converting Jimmys roster bonus to a signing bonus (3+MM in savings) and restructuring Mebane. Can’t think Mebane has much leverage – as a 30 year old DT that is coming off an injury.
Lynch is the same, Graham and Unger/Miller balance out, so the only add would be 5mm for Williams.
That would put us in essentially the same position we were to start the offseason.
Why get rid of Mebane? This is the first time he’s missed a game since 2010 or 2011. He may be 30, but as we’ve seen with DT K-Will, age doesn’t seem to affect run blocker that much, because they don’t necessarily rely on athleticism to get the job done.
Not advocating for anything, just laying out options. We have the option to restructure if we wanted to. Not sure if we would want to, its up to PCJS.
Yeah…”first time” is key. Since is in the past. I don’t want to pay mebane for the past ur the present. Paying Legacy $$$ to a popular player can cause cap issues
But
I’m still looking forward to your Perriman/Strong write-up.
It might be condensed into a notes pieces now — obviously little chance either lands in Seattle now. The general gist is — Strong overrated by the combine numbers and I’m not sure he goes in R1, Perriman a very intriguing player with a lot of playmaking ability, just needs to prove to teams he can improve concentration.
It’s like we should never plan on actually drafting in the first round…when will we learn 🙂
The first round of the draft is exciting to everyone except a Seahawks fan. At least I won’t wait up for pick #31. Note to GM please don’t move back at end of second round, we just need a handful of starters, not 11 more camp bodies.
Anthony Chickillo would be a fantastic get in the 5th round by the way. The type of quick interior rusher who could also play 5-tech that this team is missing, unless that guy is Greg Scruggs, but it’s all about competition. Has the frame to carry another 7-10 pounds without losing that quickness whole adding strength. Love his motor and personality too.
I think he could/should slim down and rush the edge.
Chickillo is non stop all the time. Gotta love that! I agree with Rob that he’d look better coming off the edge. Teams doubled him consistently. That’s telling. He’s got the athleticism and motor that we go for. Definite mid round target.
I really like him too and he seems a bit like Casius Marsh. Versitle with a great motor. He had slimmed down for the Senior Bowl and looked great off the edge. Him and Hodges out of Harvard look like the 2 best mid round pass rush options and both seem very Seahawky.
Georgia Tech’s Shaq Mason and Miss St’s Dillon Day aren’t bad options at C in the mid to late rounds if they choose to go that way. Shaq might be Patrick Lewis’s clone, and Dillon Day looks like he came out of central casting to portray a rock star, but looks like a Seahawk more than anything. Both of these guys are tough as nails, great strength, and extremely gritty.
But, I think Grasu’s injury will drop him down some boards. He’s the type of guy team’s need at C. He’s a leader, highly intelligent, great football IQ, former wrestler, and nasty.
Interesting two prospects, and funny you should mention Mason is Lewis’ clone, Dillon Day’s draft profile on nfl.com compares him to Lewis. Love this quote from that draft profile: “Not always pretty, but gets guys blocked.”
Hmmm. That is interesting. Maybe because they both blocked for mobile QBs in Johnny Football and Dak Prescott? IDK.
Doesn’t Dillon Day look like he’d fit right in?
By the CHAWK, I like that little sit of yours you have going on. Always a fun/interesting read.
Should say site not sit.
Grasu is the center I like best, for all that Vol12 listed. Mason is an anchor inside. We will not have problems finding reinforcements, in the draft, at LG and C that can play adequately on day 1. Cable can coach up his guys to be effective enough to win the big game. It’s not like we’ve had much continuity the last few seasons dealing with injuries and replacing RT.
Grasu would be cool, Unger was a duck, and paid divedends for us. Is Dillion Day the guy that stomps on people? One of those ms st olineman was just filthy dirty.
Grasu has both a shoulder and ankle injury. He looks unlikely to be ready for months. You might take him if you can afford to stash him for some or all of a season.
Yes, we will be taking a couple OL’s in the draft. But the cupboard is hardly empty. With Alvin Bailey and Garry Gilliam playing well for us we could line up today and play an NFL game. What we need are a couple guys to develop into starters by the end of the year when someone gets hurt. Hroniss Grasu looks like a center in the Max Unger mold. He should be available at #61 and may last a little longer. We could also opt for a versatile lineman like DJ Humphries that can backup both tackle positions and move to OG when needed. With Bailey, Gilliam and Britt we may not need an OG.
Gilliam is not a G. Doesn’t have the body type. I like Gilliam, Bailey, either a rookie or Lewis as back-UPS while also adding a late round developmental tackle.
I thought Bailey played better on the left side, he has a real shot at LG.
Yeah if he doesn’t eat himself out of a job. I think how he shows up to camp will say a lot….he’s got a legitimate chance to start at guard in the nfl: does he come to camp in-shape and ready to compete or unconditioned and fat?
Bailey looks like a Macy Days Balloon!
This might be the time to move Britt inside to LG and let Bailey have the RT job. The team always looks for versatility in their lineman. They want them to start out attempting to play tackle. I doubt we look for a pure OG in the draft unless they plan for them to play center.
FYI: At the moment we are sitting on 2016 compensation picks in the 3rd (Maxwell) and 5th (Carpenter) rounds. Andre Johnson is due into town tonight for a visit at the VMAC.
I hope they don’t move Britt and there’s not been any suggestion of that. Replacing two starters is bad enough without asking Britt to learn a new role too.
I agree due to continuity concerns but I AM curious to see what Britt can do inside….seems a bit like Boone from SF – was a tackle in college but best at guard in nfl
My best case scenario for Gilliam is he shows up at camp with 20 pounds of new muscle and functional strength. He takes over the RT allowing Britt to move inside to LG, a better fit for his strength, short arms and slow feet. SPARQ freak Gilliam goes on to play out of his mind at RT and takes over LT next year with his long arms, nimble feet and new found strength. Likely? No. Possible? Yep!
Bailey was terrible in his handful of looks on the right side. He is much more of a natural player from the left side of the line and I think he would make a serviceable replacement for Okung at LT should we part with him. Bailey is at least Okung’s equal at pass blocking. Fat as he is, he is a natural glider and is an immovable object in the process. He did great filling in when Okung had his obligatory missed time last season.
D.J. Humphries will go in the first round I expect.
Off the top of my head, three teams started a rookie center for the majority of the season in 2014; the Pats started Bryan Stork, the Packers started Cory Linsley, and the Bengals started Russell Bodine. None of these guys were drafted higher than the fourth round, and all played well. Patrick Lewis closed out the season for the Seahawks. He was an UFA in 2013. I don’t even want to try and decipher what went on in San Diego. Four different centers, and I think two of them were rookies but I’m not entirely sure.
Obviously replacing one of the best centers in the league won’t be easy, but it’s good to know that the position is likely very deep in the draft. I’d expect someone to come in and compete with Lewis at least.
Good point Ross. All 3 of those teams listed did pretty well last year too. We are stocked with mid rounders to bolster our holes up front. We’ll be just fine.
Need to add two WR this year – ideally one in the draft and one in FA. The draft one would hopefully be an instant contributor, rather than a late-rounder as he would be our third guy. That’s why I see us going WR at 63, maybe even trading up into the mid second. Gets us access to that third wave of WR – Aghulor, Perryman, Dorsett, etc.
Ideally our WR look something like this: Baldwin, Andre Johnson, Brashad Perryman, competition between Norwood/Matthews, competition between Kearse and Lockette for the last spot.
This is with 4TE and 5 WR.
If we go with 3TE/6 WR that means ideally we would add three, one FA, one instant contributor in the draft, and one developmental guy late. Don’t think that happens though.
Richardo Lockette was released.
I though they tendered him and Shead yesterday?
Actually that was an error by one of the reporters. He was tendered and kept.
from seattletime a quote ftom carrol on the center position and bailey.
Carroll on the plan at center without Unger: “Well we’re going to figure it out as we go. We’ve got a number of guys—we had four guys play for us last year—so we do have some experience there within our system. We hope to just let the competition take over and show us who’s going to surface. We’ve got depth and we’ve got guys that we know can play. We played a lot of games with these guys last year, so, we’ll look forward to everybody contributing.”
Schneider on if the left guard job is now Alvin Bailey’s with James Carpenter moving on: “Our coaching staff always plans like ‘hey, if we were playing tomorrow this is who would play.’ And (if they were) Alvin Bailey would play there But we are going to continue all throughout this process. We have a long ways to go here, it’s early. And we are going to try to address every position as we move forward in any manner every day that waivers come out, every day we are talking to different agents and different teams. We are not going to stop. We are not going to stop approaching anything any different than we have since the first day that we walked into the building.’’
Well from reading PC’s quote there, my take on it is, looks like they’ll add a C in rounds 4-5 and let them compete with Lewis and possibly LJP.
And the gist I got from JS’s quote is maybe theysign another G in FA, but I still think the best value at the end of round 2 is on the O-line. And what happens if ‘Pig’ Bailey shows up overweight again at the start of training camp? We’ve seen they’re not afraid to cut a presumed starter if they don’t adhere to the off-season regimen. Looking at you Michael Bowie.
Pending any big FA signings, the LG position is probably Bailey’s to lose going into camp. But another name already on our roster that no one is mentioning, who I was really intrigued with last year as a UDFA rookie, is Nate Isles. Isles is even more of the gargantuan road-grader that Carp was supposed to be and was supposedly what we wanted at LG. He is a mountain of a man – 6-6, 350 – and showed a nasty streak in the few looks I saw of him at RG last training camp.
If we want to improve pass protection to go along with our recent moves to become a more prolific pass offense, then Bailey is hands down our best LG option short of signing a $5mil FA. If we want to continue with the road-grader model at LG never fully realized with Carp, I want to see long, hard look at Isles this summer.
EDIT: RG should read RT at the end of the first paragraph.
Absolutely
Interior DL is deep in the mid rounds too. Joey Mbu, Marcus Hardison and Nunez Roches would all be great Seahawks. And I think Lippet could be turned into a pro-bowl CB. So could Marshall. I can see the Seahawks targeting one or both of the tackles from Oklahoma. And I think the best move at WR would be to not draft one at all. There are going to be 5 or 6 WR rostermakers in UDFA, an the team that doesn’t draft any WR will be the destination of choice for those guys.
There also going to take around 3 guys later in the draft that weren’t even at the combine. Time to start looking at the pro day numbers and sleeper types.
I’d add DT Tyeler Davison to that group as well.
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/Tyeler-Davison?id=2552329
He’s got long arms, big hands, strength, solid build, above average athleticism, high motor, 3 down DT, former wrestler, started 3 years gaining conference accolades and has shown improvement each year. His shorter stature,just under 6’2″, as a DT is almost an advantage to gain natural leverage.
I like DT Tyleer Davison as well. He’s definitely on my radar.
Another guy is S. Carolina DT JT Surrat. He also has a similar build to Davison and other Seattle DTs, while able to dunk a basketball standing flat-footed at 300-305 lbs., and is also rumored to have a freakish wingspan.
I’m hoping that golden from Missouri slips to the fourth and the Seahawks are targeting him.
Adam Caplan：Free-agent G Shelley Smith, whom the Dolphins released today, is scheduled to visit the Seahawks on Wednesday.
Seems pretty bad by PFF evaluation, grade -10.7 in only 367 snaps, but MIA willing to pay him $3M a year.
He wasn’t that bad when he played for St.Louis.
2012: -4.4 in 360 snaps
2013: +7.2 in 371 snaps
2013 was decent but the snaps are pretty limited.
Got ya.
Rob, where do you think Chris Conley will be drafted? Do you think the Seahawks will be interested?
I was noticing that he has a tremendous wingspan of (81 inches which bigger than Darren Waller’s 80.5) which the front office seems to care about and we all know what kind of freak athleticism Conley has. Just wondering if you think he could be a fit and where in the draft do you see him going?
Doesn’t a guy who’s more accomplished and pro ready like WR Kenny Bell, have almost as high as a SPARQ score than Conley?
Conley was 1st, Bell was 5th…141 to 121…I’d take either, but as a star wars fan I’m rooting for Conley!
LOL. So pretty close. I just think that Bell has more grit and is ready to contribute sooner.
Conley and Bell would both be great round 4-5 picks, if they last that long, which could happen. I do agree with Vol12 that Bell would be able to contribute earlier, but has a lower upside. Still high just lower than Conley’s elite athleticism and length displays.
The plan seems clear.. 3-4 OL in draft. Early, middle and late.
If you are going to go young, might as well do it in a draft deep with a plethora of OL talent.
The second biggest need now has to be along the DL (rush LB)
Third biggest need appears to be WR, unless they pick up a FA.
I’d be stunned if they draft that many.
It’s a good draft. But figure DL/CB/LB will be taken somewhere. It’s doubtful we use 8 of 11 picks on the offense. We may not even end up with 11 picks.
From a numbers perspective:
Okung
Bailey
Sweezy
Britt
Lewis
Gilliam
That’s 6 of 9 OL roster spots. I see all of these making the squad. Assume another depth UFA signing. Probably looking at 2 OL picks, which is pretty normal for Seattle. I could see us still going 3 but a low possibility. I seriously doubt we’re talking day 2 picks unless someone inexplicably falls in R2.
I know this makes no sense considering how we draft CB’s, but I think we will somehow get Senquez Golson.
I think so much of the game is still won and lost in the trenches. We need to shore up our OL before anything else. I think if Erving falls it would be worth trading to move up and get him. Go for at least one talented, young guy that could potentially be a ‘core’ player. I don’t want to see 2 stop gaps on the OL next year. The game in St Louis, 2013? Never again.
Golson can ball. The problem is, he’s small. He fails that Seahawky 32 inch arm litmus test for sure. But damn he is instinctive and can make plays. He would be swallowed up by big WRs. He’d fit as a nickel against the Edelmans of the world.
Nice write up, Rob. Enjoyed it.
Another point on Lockett. His dad played in the NFL, and, well, I know it’s annoying, but I’m going to do it- I have spoken with Seahawks position coaches and they LOVE IT when a guy has NFL pedigree in their family. They feel it gives good insight into the job, the business, the culture. Of course, it matters that they have a good relationship to that pedigree. Lockett does. This might matter in their evaluation of him.
Myself, I’d really like the pick. He’s productive, he’s tough, he works hard, and he’s talented. He’s smallish. Small hands. But I think he will be a productive player in the NFL if he gets the chance.
Agreed. Listening to him on ESPN Seattle 710 a couple weeks back, he sounded, is that a word, like he’d be a great fit with this team.
I have to agree that Lockett sounded like a perfect fit with RW. Graham big and imposing, Lockett quick and underneath…
Brock really likes the guy a ton. Not surprised you heard him on 710. I guess Brock got rave reviews from Lockett’s coaches or something.
The odds are somewhat against it working out, imho, because I suspect he will go earlier than expected. But I’d really l like them to leave this draft with Lockett. And Waller.
You don’t think he’ll be there in the 3rd?
Brock did a few of his games last CFB season… so he loved what he saw in person on the field
The thing is I’m looking at our picks and because we are 31 in each round, they are basically all valued at a round later. Our round 2 pick is basically a top round 3 pick, etc…
do we trade up in round 2 or 3??
One can never tell. Although I think it’s safe to say we’ll stay put. Maybe even trade back.
Seattle is going to go about this draft kind of like they always do. Who is the ‘player they can’t leave the draft without?’ I have no idea.
But beyond that, they’ll have pockets of talent that they will target. Not individual players. Teams move up for specific players. Seattle avoids the single player targeting almost exclusively. Only having traded up once in Pete/John’s tenure. And that was the case of an outlier falling several rounds down in the draft unexpectedly.
If we were to trade up for Lockett, then the only way I’d see that happening is:
1. He’s the guy in the draft we can’t leave without. Dubious since that player usually is someone nobody suspects.
2. He falls a couple rounds in the draft. If he’s there in the middle of the 5th round, yeah I see us moving up to nab him.
He could likely be had in R3. Possibly early R4. The thing is, there are several guys like Lockett that could substitute for him, or lead other teams interested in those kinds of prospects away from Lockett. So it doesn’t seem there is a reason to rush to overdraft for him unless there is something else that makes him stand out.
Agholor in the 2nd or Lockett in the 3rd?
I don’t want to hear BS about how Agholor won’t make it to #63. Just humor me.
Agholor won’t make it to #63
🙂
He could. Not sure if we’re targeting WR, that he’d be that choice.
I’d think he falls into the mid/late 2nd round group. But there are a lot of players in that group. Competition pretty fierce.
I wouldn’t oppose a trade up to get Irving if he falls a little. He’s such a high upside guy to eventually be a center. If DGB falls into round two, (which is entirely possible), do the Hawks bite?
Of the two I would move up for Irving because we got two holes to fill. We got 4 tight ends so DGB is a luxury development player. Some people might say we can get a center in the fourth round, but wouldn’t it be nice to have a sure starter like Irvin that won’t be missing blocks or getting pan caked by the Defense.
Would depend on who is there left and if we even like him in any round.
Neither question can be predicted.
If it’s me, I’m going to wait until mid third. If still there, trade up.
I would not be surprised if we used pick 63 on Dline. Mebane and Tony going to gone next year, and with Graham in the fold going foward and Irvin option getting picked up we are going to up against the cap in 2016 with out a whole lot of money available to pick up FA Dline. If we can find a starter qaulity lineman on a rookie contract it puts us in a nice place.
Grady Jerret perfect 1/3 tech in a 43 defense nice replacement for Mebane.
Grady would be a perfect tilted nose in a 4-3 defense. Don’t think he fits in a 3-4. But, him and Rakeem Nunez-Roche don’t have 33′ inch arms, and Seattle has never drafted a DT with less than 33′ arms.
There was no CBs at the top of the draft or really in the mid rounds with 32′ inch arms and a good wingspan, so they go out and get a couple vet CBs that do have the arm length requirement. Don’t be surprised if they pass on DTs without those long arms.
One guy I really like later on is San Jose ST D-lineman Travis Raciti. Competitive, good motor, good length.
Irvin’s option got picked up? Where did you see that?
Interesting take. It’s worth considering, since DL and CB both seem to be a little lean this year.
From a value perspective, the prospect of taking a DL/CB pick here doesn’t jive. But Seattle is a team that like to address multiple positions. Waiting until mid/late day 3 may end up resulting in taking guys that may not be talented enough to warrant a roster spot.
Jarrett is a guy I like. I also like the idea of Cooper at 63. It’s not a given that either is available at 63, but would depend on how runs at positions play out. They could also be guys in consideration if we were to trade back half a round.
Jarrett isn’t a big prospect. Kind of doubt he’s a competitor for Mebane.
I keep imagining Tyler Lockett in Seahawks uniform. He can give you that Julian Edelman type of look when he’s on the field, and the key is he can return kicks. Maybe use that #109 pick we got from the Saints
I say take him in the 3rd. In the 4th go Harvard DE-LEO Zach Hodges, Oregon C Hroniss Gras or Auburn CB Nick Marshall, and Nebraska WR Kenny Bell.
I they could get that collection of players in that range it would be a great draft IMO.
Rob and others, just saw that Seattle’s D-line coaches worked out UCLA DE Owa ‘Diggy’ Odighizuwa for 20-30 minutes today at UCLA’s pro day, and put him through the ‘ringer.’ Am I the only one who is very intrigued by this? Does he last until Seattle’s 2nd round pick?
Maybe Owa slides down draft boards due to hip injury.
Top-50 for me.
Owa wasn’t that impressive to me when I watched him. He doesn’t have that get off you want to see our of a pass rusher. Maybe I didn’t see him enough.
Well, Seattle may think otherwise. He’s built, to use one of Rob’s phrases, like a ‘Greek God,’ and is an incredible athlete, with the back-story and upside/potential that seems to be Seattle’s 1st overall selection every year.
“He doesn’t have that get off you want to see our of a pass rusher.”
Owa’s quickness off the ball is what impresses me the most. He lacks in bend around the edge, which may have to do with his former hip problems. He’s an explosive athlete to be a very productive DE, but I’m not really sold on him. Doubt he lasts til #63 anyway.
IDK he might. Not everyone’s sold on him for the reasons you guys mentioned and he is coming off of 2 hip surgeries, but obviously as Rob has tried to point out to us on numerous occasions, Seattle isn’t afraid of guys with injury risks.
He’s not the best edge rusher, because UCLA asked Anthony Barr to get after the QB, and those mentioned injuries stunted his development. He has a great stride, gets his knees up high, huge hands, is relentless/gritty, and if I’m not mistaken, his stats are comparable to UVA’s Eli Harold.
Teams will miss out if they don’t pick this guy. He’s a raw version of Ziggy Ansah IMO.
Seattle also worked him out at the SAM LB spot. So obviously they see some versatility in him. I would absolutely love this pick.
Then take a Terry Poole type O-lineman in the 4th round to play LG.
I agree with Matt. From what I’ve seen, Owa is quick off the snap, usually the first player moving. He’s really good in traffic, with the ability to slip/squeeze between blockers into the backfield. But he sucks as an edge rusher. How do you use him? His hips won’t let him play LB – there’s no way he could drop into coverage – and he can’t edge rush well enough to play LEO. He’s just slightly too small to play 3T, which is unfortunate because his inside rush is tops. I guess if he could develop an edge rush he’d make a formidable LEO.
In the end,I’m ambivalent on him at 62. I doubt he’ll be there, but if he is it wouldn’t be a bad pick.
Really like Terry Poole in the 4th.
Also, been checking up on Dillon Day. Really like this kid as a possible Day 3 C prospect. He’s highly intelligent – something important for the position – with a nasty competitive, won’t be beat attitude. 4 year starter at the position in the SEC so he’s faced top competition.
Oh almost forgot the best part – his hair! Total Seahawk hair!
Glad I have someone else who likes C Dillon Day. Yes the hair and the two sleeves of tattoos.
As for ‘Diggy’ I think he’ll last until the late 2nd, and if he is Seattle’s ‘guy’ I could see them using one of their 3 5th round picks to move up and get him, if for example, he’s going to go 10-13 spots before Seattle picks.
I personally think he’d be a great LEO in a year or two. Just use him as a ‘go get the QB from 3 different spots’ type his rookie year.
I have reservations about Owa as a leo or edge rusher but at his size the first tine I saw his tape I thought “Bennett,” as an inside pass rusher to push Bennett back outside to me that’s his sweet spot. I dont know if his hips will even if healthy ever let him work outside except in Run situations but his acceleration and power off the snap to me seem like something Seattle can utilize
Peter – I agree that Owa looks like a better inside rusher than an edge rusher. With his build, I wonder if he can carry some extra weight and move inside? His strength at the LOS is what impresses me most. With some extra weight, I think he could be a good run stuffer.
Focus on what they can do, not what they can’t.
Great point. That’s always in the forefront of my mind when I look at or evaluate prospects.
Today has surpassed my greatest expectations of what it could be. Getting an elite red zone threat in Graham and finding a replacement for Maxwell, in Cary Williams is a banner day. These moves mean we don’t have to reach for these positions, that are thin this year, in the draft. We can expect more bolstering of the roster before the draft comes along. At this moment Oline, WR, DT and DE look like our biggest needs, with Oline being the most gaping hole. There is no need to panic or reach for any player, as we are ripe with mid round picks. We know rounds 3-6 are JS/PC’s bread and butter. There’s a number of players I’d be happy with us drafting within our range. Tyler Lockett is at the top of the list for me. I’ve been talking him up for quite some time on here because I think he fits our team to a T. Hard worker, chip on his shoulder, family history, shows passion, makes big plays in big moments, leader, put up big #’s, college graduate(I assume-4 year guy), finds soft spots in zones, the list goes on. Lockett has the best separation skills in the draft,(IMO), and would help day one on offense and radically improve our return game. I’d feel comfortable taking him at #63.
There is a rumor that DT Wilfork is in Seattle, visiting with the Seahawks. If he can be had for a modest deal, I’m all for it. Most likely would mean bye bye Williams, but he might retire anyhow.
Exactly. He’d be a great signing.
Sounds unlikely due to the likely cost.
Wilfork is ancient and immobile. Why would they go there? Wilfork would enjoy the experience, but the Hawks don’t need him. Better off with Mebane.
It depends on cost. I don’t think they’ll go anywhere near Wilfork. But Pot roast Knighton? Maybe. And then you have a difficult conversation to have with Mebane.
Im just clapping my hands for the best front office in the game right now. I think we are set! Adding Jimmy was an insane move. Now I think we have some leeway to go our own way in the draft. We have quality interior line players already. So we don’t have to reach to get a guy. Let the draft fall to us. I also think that we have more of an ability to take a shot on higher upside guys like Conley. We will draft a wr/kr/pr this draft in round 2 or 3. I think we take a shot on a guy that has flashed and has insane mesurables like Conley in round 4-5. I wouldn’t be opposed to moving up to grab someone like Erving in the second, but I want to keep the draft picks if I can. All in all, im stoked that Pete and John have huge balls and beat their own drum, (marshawn ain’t the only one). Go Hawks!
Rob, what do you think of BC’s C Andy Gallik? Comes from a great O-line coach in Steve Addazio who runs the ZBS, but this kid is a mauler in the run game who is flat-out nasty. Had his choice of most, if not all of the BIG 10 schools.
Just trying to give you some C prospects to check out/highlight for us, so we can discuss and debate.
CHAWK, check him out too my man. You might like him as well.
I like Gallik. I like his attitude and that nasty streak. Finishes his man all the way to the grass.
Should be there in the 4th.
He’s not very athletic. But would be a great selection imo
Not watched him yet. Not needed to until the Unger trade. Center is a priority watch now.
Yeah, probably have to add:
Max Garcia
Shaq Mason
Renee Dismukes
Hroniss Grasu
BJ Finney
to the list of guys to watch. Six guys projected late third to mid 5th round range. Lots of OC candidates not name Cam Erving in this class.
Nick Perry c as well
Gallik is a stud. Would be a great move. Addazio as his coach is great too. Nasty player who is also very intelligent. Sought out the coach he wanted to learn from (Addazio) showing a lot of initiative and drive. Would help a lot.
Hey V12 sorry for the delayed reply.
Could be the limited film, but Gallik seems better suited to a power running scheme than zbs. Like his attitude though.
I’m still very bullish on DD.
Check out Greg Mancz from Toledo. He needs some time in the weight room to gain strength, but he plays with…how to put it…awareness. Seems to have excellent vision and an unusual ability to redirect a defender’s momentum the wrong way. As a plus, he’s played every position on the OL so he has some versatility. Definitely a good Day 3/UDFA candidate.
I’ll check Mancz out for sure. From what little I know of him, I’d expect him to be drafted and not available in UDFA.
Rob, I was against the thomas signing but love this deal for the same reason I hated the thomas deal. Mainly cap space reasons. Losing ungers contract made all the difference for me. Reading what JS said about the 1st rd pick cap hit makes it look better considering that talent that would probably be there. And trading down for more picks seems like a waste unless they gain picks next year. The comp pick next year also is a big factor for me. I think they end up signing a o linemen because that becomes a major hole and I don’t see them going to the draft with kind of hole. Great work!
Didn’t Lockett have 8 3/8 hands? I know his tape looks good but you still think he goes in the 2nd 3rd?
Possibly — he’s sparky. Has something about him I think the Seahawks will like.
I like Lockett. Do I dare say that he reminds me of Harvin? I can see him running jet sweeps and bubble screens and returning punts. I can also see him playing an Edelman-like possession receiver role, running drag routes over the middle (although RW’s height seems to limit his ability to throw short interior routes).
Hey Rob, I was wondering whether we should be worried about the mental aspect of Graham right now. I was pretty excited (and shocked!) that we made this trade happen, but as the day has gone on, I been slightly worried about the lack of response between both camps. The only Seahawks player I’ve seen actively reach out was Doug Baldwin tweeting out. Additionally, Graham has been eerily quite about this huge news, only noting on his twitter bio that he was “Traded”. Not exactly someone that seems to be excited to play Seattle. Throw in the previous comments by some of the Seahawk’s defenders on Graham, and the team environment has the potential to be…awkward to say the least. I am really excited about the potential Graham brings to the table, but I’m worried that this could turn into a Harvin Situation 2.0. How worried should I be?
Someone on TV said that Sherm had tweeted a welcome to Graham. I haven’t heard about anything from Wilson, but I wonder if he’s at Spring Training with the Rangers? Maybe he’s too busy trying to learn to hit the curveball …
Pete Carroll mentioned yesterday that RW has reached out to JG to organise workouts ahead of the official workouts at the VMAC. I love that we have a leader like this at QB! Now if we could just get him signed up for the next 8 years or so…
Graham has an ego, and Seattle does not throw the ball nearly as much as the Saints do. His numbers will likely go down a lot, maybe close to the same in TD’s, but with far fewer catches and yardage. Recall that Zach’s numbers were fairly high before we got him, and not so much with us. A problem?
The Seahawks still throw the ball 20-30 times a game. He will get his targets and opportunities.
Also consider, that if 3rd down conversions improve significantly (2-3), that’s like 8-12 extra plays per game on average. You could bump up targets by 5-7 per game on the sheer basis of having more plays. Even if we don’t change a thing about our run/pass ratios.
Lynch was a better/more effective runner with Harvin. Even though Harvin’s direct impact was minimal. I would expect not only a better ability to pass for first downs. I would expect us to be much better at running for first downs. It will be much harder for teams to cheat on Lynch. Something that teams didn’t have to necessarily do once it was apparent that Harvin/Lynch weren’t as compatible threats together.
I did some rough calculations here on FG. The basic takeaway is that while he isn’t going to get the 140-150 targets he got in his highest-usage Saints seasons, you can book him for the ~100 targets we’ve generally given our #1 option, with good reason to believe it could even end up being 120+. And that’s without taking away from other passing targets or the run game…you can get there simply by turning some scrambles and sacks into pass attempts and by sustaining longer drives (so more total offensive plays to go around).
Maybe getting fewer targets will extend his career an extra year or two. Not a bad tradeoff, especially if you can win a few rings.
Not really.
Graham is going to be a player that defenses have to game plan for. But in NO, he was a dominant force with a roster that didn’t have a lot of great alternative options.
Seattle is a run first team. Every team has to account for Lynch first. Graham hasn’t played in an offense where the defenses have to focus so much effort stopping the run. Seattle led the NFL in explosive plays, and that’s thanks to the Lynch effect.
Graham may not have as many targets that is true. But the targets he does get should be similarly as effective, if not more so. Wilson is a QB that spreads the ball around. But top targets in this offense still get 70-90 targets. Graham, even if he doesn’t have the same production, should have an elevating effect for the guys we do have.
Ultimately, if Graham means 2 more third down conversions per game, that’s like 8 more plays per game on average. If he similarly turns 3 or 4 FG attempts in the red zone into TDs — that increases the scoring even more.
Graham is a player who can elevate both 3rd down conversions and TD rates in the end zone. Two elements to Seattle’s offense that were mediocre.
General note: I understand that some people may not see everything this FO does positively. However, the desperate level of negativity here by some is sad/pathetic considering we come off 2 consecutive SBs.
As for the KR/PR – One of the reasons I offered the Blackmon signing the day he was released by JAC was that he was a prolific KR/PR with GB and NYG in the past. He can serve as backup on that front as well.
As for the deals at hand –
Williams is actually a 4.7M one year deal with 1.2M dead money on 2016/2017 if we decide to let him go. Restructuring Graham’s “signing bonus” will actually make him a cap gain when you subtract Unger and Miller. We cam still go for one more quality player. I won’t mind an AJ at 4M or less. Somebody has to mentor the young tlent be example.
I’m sad to see Unger go, I’m sad to see Miller go. I won’t let it stop me from understanding how huge the Graham signing could be. Harvin was a huge swing and miss. Trading for Lynch/Clem was a swing and hit. Signing Bennett and Avril – ditto. Any comparison between the Graham signing and the Harvin signing is plain dumb.
Consider me very please with this off season so far.
P.S. – A personal huge YES on Chickillio. Don’t ask me why but he feels just right to drop some weight and become a scary LEO.
“General note: I understand that some people may not see everything this FO does positively. However, the desperate level of negativity here by some is sad/pathetic considering we come off 2 consecutive SBs.”
Honestly, I think this is borne of passion for Seahawks success. There’s nothing wrong with dissenting opinions. Quite obviously, there are a lot of fans, who are still stung from the Harvin deal. And this move strikes them as a similar deal.
All fans have wildly varying degrees of risk aversion. Just like GMs in the league. I personally don’t care that the deal didn’t work out. I’m grateful that we have a FO that not only will aggressively go for the championship move. But they aren’t so afraid to turn around and embarrassingly blow it up when it’s apparent it didn’t work out.
I’m also double grateful that the team is willing to immediately turn around and make the same kind of move. Because I don’t think the premise that making bold moves to get impact players is faulty. It’s merely risky. Seattle embraces risk. Whether it’s getting impact player additions, or keeping and playing developing rookies.
I love that about the team. Not fearing risk. Embracing it smartly. And having the stones to recover quickly — even as it invites doubt in their ability.
But I recognize that not all fans feel as I do. Doesn’t make either of us wrong. Just as I despise the idea of drafting Waller at all, I’m content if we do take him, because I concede I don’t know everything about these guys. Similarly, I like DGB, but there are others that will repeatedly argue against such a pick. Nothing is absolute. And I’ve been plenty wrong about my opinion in the past.
Interesting that in the new MMQB article, Peter King said that John Schneider only had 16 players with a 1st round grade. Essentially for Schneider he was trading a 2nd round pick + Max for Graham + 4th.
This tells me that if they would have not pulled off this trade, Schneider was trading down off of this pick.
The value in this draft is between rounds 3-5 and the Seahawks currently have 7 picks in that span. I expect Schneider to come away with 3-5 really solid picks out of this draft that have the chance to outplay their contract and there will be other picks who will be good depth guys.
Article says size not a concern when drafting a receiver, because we have Jimmy. Well, he is 28. May not be long until looking for size. If drafting receiver now, consider that.
Drafting Waller would be with any eye towards the future, too.
Waller would be nice as a size option. Would love for them to draft Smelter and redshirt him so he can be ready for 2016.
I really like Smelter a lot and think he would be an awesome redshirt development prospect in the 7th or as an UDFA. If he does not tear his ACL I think he would be the GTech receiver everyone would be focused on!
Agreed. Smelter’s footage is really electric. He’s a player whose tape reminds of McBride. Smelter’s physical measurables are attractive (6’2″, 226 32″ arms. 11″ hands). 11 inch hands. Dang things are like tentacles.
Catches the ball very very well. Good movement skills on tape. Honestly, if we were to go McBride, Lockett/Hardy for PR/Smelter in late day 3 — I’d consider that a huge haul. And coupled with continued development of Norwood and Richardson, a significant retooling of the WR corps. While being able to stash future talent on PUP/IR with Richardson and Smelter.
Lockett is a better looking punt returner. But Hardy is a MUCH better looking WR. Hardy has special qualities that leap off of the tape. His ability to get open is straight out of The Matrix. Dude is ALWAYS open. Great quickness who consistently beats press coverage almost immediately with use of feet/hands.
Both smaller guys. Lockett faster. But arms (30″) and hands (8 3/8″) are dwarfed by Hardy (32″) and (10″). Lockett is more prone to body catches, but tends to do so smartly, when situation warrants. If you’re wanting a PR who can factor into your base offense, Hardy would seem to be the pick.
I don’t think that WR Justin Hardy has the lower body explosion that Seattle seems to covet in their receivers. I’d be surprised if gets past the Chiefs in the 2nd or 3rd round.
Hardy’s numbers are very similar to Doug Baldwins except for 40 and broad jump where Baldwin beat him
Baldwin
4.47-4.49/40, 37″ Vert, 10’3″ Broad, 4.26 shuttle, 6.65 3-Cone and 6 reps of 225 lbs.
Hardy
4.56 40, 36.5 vert, 9’5 Broad, 4.21 shuttle, 6.63 3 Cone and 11 reps of 225
It’s interesting that Hardy had a pretty good vert but a below average broad. A year in the training room i think he can get more explosive.
If he’s there @ 3/4 I think he could be a steal but I don’t think he will make it out of the top half of the 3rd.
The thing about not having too many targets will not be an issue when he starts winning playoffs games and rocketing his TD numbers. Also, imagine if we manage to get Andre Johnson too. Along Marshawn, Graham and Andre we got three players that have mileage. To perfectly balance the volume of our offense between them and ones like Baldwin, Turbin, Michael, Richardson, and a possible draftee is a voucher to longevity for these guys. It’s a voucher to better legacy (rings) and health quality in their post-NFL life.
I think PCJS can something among these lines to Andre Johnson. And he would put Seahawks way over the top.
I think Seattle goes like this in the draft:
2 – OG
3 – WR
4 – DL
4 – C
4 – WR
5 – CB
5 – DL
5 – LB
6 – OG
7 – OT
I like the structure but am uncertain if four picks go to oline. We’re still looking at a situation wherein regardless of the thoughts about him are super positive Lewis wasn’t exactly a downgrade vs. Unger. I’m not counting the stat that came up in one primetime game. One it was contextually irrelevant and flawed in its metric as that Unger and who ever replaced him didn’t have a full season of games to see who really was the center with a higher yards per carry…its not dissimilar to projecting manning at 82 tds 7000 yards after his Philly game two seasons back….and secind and critically for the old patented “eye ball test,” Patrick Lewis in his second season didn’t seem to cost Seattle with unnecessary penalties like an injured unger/car/okung and personally I felt that his play was pretty good in his short stint. If Seattle needs an upgrade then so be it but I’m not sure if its that much of a deal to spend say a,second on Grasu who I like.
The team will need a LG either bailey or the draft so what you are really left with is either needing just one LG or a versatile backup if bailey is promoted or he remains the backup.
I’m not going to count out 4 oline men I just wouldn’t be stunned if they picked two and called it good. sambraillo and crisp?
I think the worst thing we could do is focus on position with the picks. At least as it pertains to accuracy.
Seattle will roll with the draft a bit. Because their selection patterns factor in a lot of different variables. We can’t merely go based on need. Seattle wants to have quality players throughout the draft. If there are attractive plan b options later, they’ll go that route even if that position is a higher need.
OG is a position that unless a really special player presents — they can address it satisfactorily in day 3. Lots of options in that range.
Depending on runs at positions, the draft can unfold in a lot of different ways. That makes a ‘by position’ prediction fraught with uncertainty.
Don’t overlook Nate Isles. 6-5, 348, country strong, quick feet. He played RT, OG and DT in college. He has an incredible 104 inch wing span. The Seahawks signed him and two other OL’s to future contracts off our practice squad. He looks a lot more svelte than Carpenter. If there is a weakness, he only put up 225 lbs 20 times before last years draft. His arms are so long this is difficult. He spent the last year in the Seahawks weight room working on his strength and learning from Tom Cable. I see him winning the LG position in the summer. I think his development is why we let Carpenter walk.
http://12thmanrising.com/2014/06/10/nate-isles-seahawks-rookie-profile-mammoth-intentions/
I think the Hawks grab TJ Yeldon in the 3rd. They seem to keep being under the radar interested there.
Seattle has done a great job this Free agency period. Taking care of corner and pass catcher positions really helped to focus their draft needs. Now they can really let the draft develop and pick their spots. Now that Center is a priority maybe hit up free agency again. I like Stefen Wisniewski at the right price. NFL bloodlines, productive, tough. Drafted to Raiders right as Tom Cable was on his way out of Oakland in 2011. Guessing Cable knows his skill set, possibly drafted on his evaluation. Would allow Schneider more freedom to get his guys at many positions
I hope this doesn’t put Tre McBride out of reach, really like him. Seems like the chances of him being in the 3rd are slim. Rewatched that soccer TD where he kicks the ball up to himself…man.
“I hope this doesn’t put Tre McBride out of reach, really like him. Seems like the chances of him being in the 3rd are slim.”
He does certainly have the feel of a player we would reach on doesn’t he?
Yeah, McBride really feels like a Seahawk. I’m getting more interested in Perryman too. I still think we need to add at least two guys; you look a top our Wr core, and we’ve basically got a slot receiver (Baldwin) , a number 3/4 guy (Kearse) and… a bunch of replacement level guys ‘developing’ .
As much as I’m not a fan of the Graham trade, at least it did give us at least one legit receiver.
Didn’t realize Waller missed the first two games last year for failing drug tests. Maybe he’s another WTIII. It’s not like guys like that get suspended for their first failed test. I guess he really is a pipe dream. Literally.
Might have to hop on the Lockett train and his unique abilities. Would be nice to get a good return specialist.
Didn’t know that either. He seems like it’d almost be a wasted pick. If he’s purely a project pick, why? Don’t they have a project who’s further along in their development with a better build IMO, in WR ‘Hardball’ Matthews? And now with Jimmy Graham, I’m not sold on the idea of them targeting a receiver with size. If one is there that they like, sure.
Right now, and I’m very fickle when it comes to prospects, because I don’t like attaching myself to one guy, it just leads to disappointment. Anyways, as of now, I’m pretty high on K-St’s Tyler Lockett and Nebraska’s WR Kenny Bell.
Lockett upgrades the return game obviously, is a film rat, great teammate, high character, versatile. Bell is just gritty, one of the better run blockers I’ve seen come out in a couple years, great speed, freak athlete, with a huge ‘Seahawky’/out-spoken personality. Also has the size Seattle isn’t worried of targeting.
Lockett would kill 3 birds with one stone. Hello to a good kick and punt returner and WR whose specialty is getting separation. He says he doesn’t drink or smoke and watches film like RW and ET. He may not have hand or arm length but it’s not like we don’t deviate from the master plan sometimes, too.
Waller is a lot more physically talented than Matthews.
I think I’d prefer Smelter anyway. Or perhaps Conley.
so a college kid smoked some grass? get a rope
If he continually does it in the NFL like WTIII, he will get suspended. Is that too hard to comprehend?
take it easy bobby, marsha doesn’t like that tone. college kids do stupid things, lets try not to overreact to smoking some pot. i understand the nfls rules im just not ready to completely write someone off just because of a failed drug test(s) in college. that sounds fair to me.
To be suspended it was multiple offenses to be fair.
That is NOT a true statement. In college, a coach can suspend a player @ anytime he feels a player has conducted in actions detrimental to the team… A coach catches word of a student smoking pot and its confirmed, he has the authority to suspend.
I love the trade for Graham. Prime player coming at a prime time on to a contending team. Getting rid of Unger is standard PCJS method of blowing things up to rebuild; it will just hasten the improvement on the OL and he was a free agent anyway. As well said earlier in the blog, essentially it was a 2nd for Graham and Unger for a 4th. No comp pick implications, no signing bonus.
What I love most is the 9 guys the Hawks now have tied down who are paid +$6M for the next 2-3 years or soon beyond. On offense, it is Lynch, Okung, Graham and on Defense its Thomas, Chancellor, Sherman, KJ, Bennett, Avril. Soon it will look even better with Wilson (-Lynch), Wagner (-Okung?) and possibly Irvin (-X?). For al the naysayers/negative comments on the blog, what other team has this much quality All-Pro calibre players on their +$6M roster locked up for the mid-term? This is still as close to a dynasty or being set-up to a least ‘win forever’ as you can get in today’s NFL.
I agree with Rob that Marpet and Finney look promising at center. Dismukes is rated very highly, some place him near the top (Erving is the top, and I would love for him to fall to the Hawks, miraculously). However, Dismukes gets pushed around, and we don’t want that. Grasu is injured, and would need to be red shirted. Gallik, Mason, and Day all look good.
If you check free agency on centers, it is ugly. The entire list is 30+ year olds and some mid 30 types. Only Stefan Wiesniewski is in his 20s, and would seem to be the only attractive pure center in FA. I am sure this lack of youth will dissuade JSPC from free agency for Unger’s replacement.
The fact that Max Unger was a potential CAP cut as reported by John Clayton means that we essentially traded #31 for Jimmy Graham and a 4th. I for one personally loved Unger, but with the odd injuries here and there, he was missing way too much time for the contract he was receiving. SEA was not going to find an offensive threat like Jimmy Graham @ #31 (Not a chance)… The fact that we ALSO got a 4th rd pick (where the FO has thrived at finding talent) made this MUCH smarter than the Harvin trade. I personally hated the Harvin trade when it happened (I would’ve rather drafted DeAndre Hopkins), but hindsight is 20/20, we won a Super Bowl with Harvin (only playing a few games anyway).
While I saw improvement in Carpenter’s game last season, losing him seemed inevitable. I think we had already had the mindset that it would be Bailey/Rookie playing LG. With a guy like Jake Fisher or Tyler Sambrailo, we firm up the LG position with our 2nd rd pick and/or Bailey. Having reliable depth (God knows we’ve needed it) is never a bad thing…
Andre Johnson a colt. in case anyone was curious.
Andre Johnson just became a Colt. According to Adam Schefter.
3 years $21MM
I am not as big a fan of Lockett as some of you. He is undersized, not blazing fast, looks like a cross between Baldwin and Harvin.
Dorsett, who should fall to around the same spot can do the same things, with more speed. Same with Devin Smith, who might be gone by then. I prefer Kenny Bell, who has similar if better measurables, and extra bit of height, and he is a great blocker. McBride, of course, looks like a solid fit. Smelter, Greenberry, Rannell Hall will be available in later rounds, and they don’t look any worse than Lockett, in my opinion.
I think the Hawks should avoid anyone who is like Baldwin or Kearse. If there is any resemblance, the prospect should have some superior skill that is better than what Baldwin or Kearse have. Otherwise, it’s redundant.
With Jimmy Graham on the roster we really do not need many more WR’s. Matthews, Norwood, Kearse, Baldwin, Lockette, McNeil, Walters and PRich. We need a PR/KR guy to compete with Walters. That is about all we have room for. Graham is going to be on the field a lot. We will see plenty of two TE sets leaving few minutes for the WR’s. Lockette and the new guy need to make their living on special teams.
Walters is a gonner. Free agent.
I’m pretty sure we could use upgrades if at,all possible at any position and regardless of graham. Kearse could be an upgrade. Walters and lockette could be upgraded. Norwood may or may not get on the field. Prich may need the year off. McNeil an arena guy…coukd be the Kurt Warner if WR’s bur I kind of doubt it. And I guy who never had a catch until the superbowl.
I’m not saying going buck wild in the draft but Graham is still technically a TE and the WR corp is still just as mediocre today as it was on Monday.
P-Rich may need a red-shirt year, Norwood is decent, but I could see him not even making this team, as much as I like Chris Matthews, he’s still raw. So that leaves us with Kearse, ADB, and Lockett who’s a depth/ST guy at receiver.
They’ll take a slot/return man, and another possession receiver with decent size. Something along those lines. A prospect to compete with Norwood and maybe eventually replace Kearse in a year or two. Whatever his deal wild be.
Not sold at all on the thought of Greenberry, ‘Speedy’ Hall, and Smelter being as good as Lockett is. Smelter looks slow and awkward, Greenberry has one of the worst drop rates percentages in CFB, is an awful blocker, and Hall’s a decent project, but he’s more of a gadget player.
Agreed. Should we not draft DL since we already have starters and backups? Should we not draft DBs cause we already have starters and backups? We could and should be trying to upgrade the Kearses and Locketts, etc on our roster. Those two in particular are on the roster cause we don’t yet have a better replacement. Not to mention WRs tend to take awhile to mature into the NFL game. Get em now and let them grow…not wait until there’s a gaping need (which there might already be)
I agree about planning for the future and lockette was,an assassin as a gunner nut last year it was kind of off. Kearse I know this hurts for the husky homers but I honestly think he’s just one of those guys every team has because he foes just enough to stick around. But any of the fourth round picks had worked or matthews/prich stepped up their game sooner he’d be an afterthought. As it is he just keeps hanging around.
As to volume12 are you comparing those 3 to Ricardo or Tyler? Because Tyler regardless of size I gave to think is better then those three but if you’re talking Ricardo I kind of think you may be right.
Lockett is better than those 3 and Ricardo. But Tyler Lockett and Ricardo are different receivers IMO and both bring something different to the table special team’s wise.
I actually like Ricardo Lockett quite a bit. He’s just a unique dude.
Too similar on the names! No doubt they are different recievers and Ricardos previous seasons of gunning skills are enough to stay on the roster, I just wonder if he’s losing a step and he hasn’t ever really put it together as a WR, which I wish would happen.
When free agency cools I can’t wait to parse later round oline men prospects, and in general try to re look at players and find new ones as that I assumed they would move down a bit in the first and they now have a ton of mid round leverage to pick with.
I like Dorsett too but I don’t think he will be there in the 60’s. I could be way off though. It’s hard to judge positional groups after the first 5 or so when it comes to where they will be drafted. I do agree with your Kearse/Baldwin assessment somewhat though.
I love Mcbride but the more I think about it Agholor is our best option at WR in the draft now. He would be a day 1 starter on the outside letting Baldwin move into the slot.
He is also one of the best Punt and Kick returners in the draft so he solves two needs.
He won’t be there at 63 but I think we could trade our 2nd and 4th to move up in a trade with Washington for their pick at 36 and get him there.
The other option would be to make the same trade and pick Cameron Erving as a Center / Guard and go with Mcbride or Lockette in the 3rd round depending which one is available.
That’s a jump of 30 spots — it’ll take much more than a 4th round pick unfortunately.
You are probably right. How many spots would a 4th rounder normally let us move up in the draft? My thought is both Erving and Agholor go between 30-45.
In order to make that kind of jump you might be looking at a 2016 second on top of it, or a collection of mid-round picks. I like both Agholor and Erving but ultimately the middle rounds are loaded. I think you sit back, pour a cold one and let the draft come to you. You’re going to get some good players in rounds 2-5.
As long as I never see Kearse as a starter at WR or Walters dropping back to feild punts I will be happy.
What so you think of the Knighton rumours? Does he really provide that much of an upgrade over Membane if he comes back healthy? How do you think he would fit with our D? He is a beast against the run it just seems like he is pricey when you look at what our roster already has.
He’s an extremely talented interior presence. He’s a year younger than Bane. I suspect they would consider it if there was an overall saving on cutting Mebane and acquiring Knighton. Every penny counts. But I think he’ll end up somewhere else. Seattle doesn’t have the cap room to be big players now.
I’m surprised him and del Rio aren’t being linked together yet again
Del Rio offered him $6 million, told him he’s only a 2 down player. Potroast walked. He wants $8 mill.
The Raiders signed Dan Williams instead. Good news for Seattle — they stole him away from Arizona.
Knighton in, McDaniel & Williams out??
I think Randy Starks is a more likely target, replacing Kevin Williams.
I like Starks as a fit for us. Felt excited when I saw him become available.
Rob so you think there is any chance we take a chance on Greg Hardy? I think the Domestic Violence stuff is disgusting but the charges are dropped and he is going to get a 2nd chance. Any chance the Hawks take a flier because he is an incredible talent? Or would it just be too hard a sell in the community and against organizational philosophy? I remember Pete Carrol has some pretty strong comments on the Ray Rice incident.
The thought of adding to this defense if he cleans up his act would be scary.
I think it’s unlikely for two reasons:
— the history just doesn’t sit well with me and probably won’t for a lot of teams
— the cost will not match the opportunity you are giving him
I think it’s more likely they sit out FA for a few days now and see what value they can get when the market cools. They have almost no cap room to do anything major, considering they’re likely to want to extend Wagner, Wilson and Sweezy this year.
The only ‘big’ move I foresee is a swap. Eg speak to Knighton and cut Mebane if you think that’s an upgrade. Unless of course they do something else huge eg trade a key player (unlikely).
I agree the History is a huge red flag.
What are your thoughts on the Mebane / Knighton swap? Seems like an expensive lateral move if Mebane comes back healthy. If the hamstring is going to cause problems then it makes a ton of sense.
I’ve put down a few thoughts on Mebane/Knighton in my other reply Trevor.
I am very concerned they will miss out on a FA pass rusher. They need a reliable presence. Missed on Cole. With Sheard going to the hated Patriots, who is left? The market is already tight:
Akeem Ayers- my favorite option. lots of position versatility, still very young
Michael Johnson-just cut, already getting interest (not from SEA)
Derrick Morgan- getting interest
Orakpo- hasn’t signed with anyone yet, probably too big a name to take less
Anthony Spencer- had injury problems but looked decent by year end
Mathias Kiwanuka- longtime Giant, had a knee injury
I have not heard anything about Schofield, who isn’t gone yet, but Hawks have not reached out to him either. They need an upgrade over him along the lines of Sheard. If not, he is better than nothing.
I think they should target a pass rusher in this draft, but how high? Eli Harold will be gone by 63. Will Preston Smith or Trey Flowers be available? I like Zach Hodges but by the time they get to rds 4 down, is there a starter type to be found? Lynden Trail, Ray Drew, Tony Washington, Max Valles…really scraping bottom here.
“I am very concerned they will miss out on a FA pass rusher”
I wouldn’t be. They have Avril, Bennett, Hill, Marsh, Mebane and a whole draft to come. They could use an addition in FA but if not, c’est la vie. They don’t have the free money to make a big splash.
I am looking in terms of weakside edge rusher, not interior. They need more than Avril and Irvin, who may be more natural on the other side. So it’s the Schofield role, only someone better. Hawks need to get back to the rotational depth of 2013.
Can rookies handle it?
Can low draft/UDFA rookies handle it?
From a pure football perspective, I would take Greg Hardy in a heartbeat. Then again, I’d also take Adrian Peterson and Ray Rice. Hard to accept that stuff, and Hardy still faces some court dates, doesn’t he?
I don’t think Seattle will ever get back to the rotational depth of 2013. It’s nearly impossible to achieve and they kind of managed it because they weren’t paying Sherman, Thomas, Wilson, Wagner and others much money. They could afford to keep a Clemons on major money alongside Avril and Bennett, while maintaining Mebane, Bryant, McDaniel and others.
There simply isn’t any money for someone like Greg Hardy. If they want to re-sign Wilson, Wagner and Sweezy this year they need around $8-9m in cap room for the year one extension. Right now that probably have just under that available. They are going to have to manipulate things just to bring in a veteran on either side. They won’t be able to pay Hardy even a reasonable amount.
Having three excellent edge rushers is an unusual luxury. Most teams don’t have two (Seattle does). For me the biggest issue is the interior. Without Hill there is no interior rush. Adding Starks at 31-year-old on a one year Kevin Williams deal is the best we can hope for IMO — and even then he probably gets a better offer. They’re probably going to have to draft two D-linemen.
Honestly I’m not sure it would be a bad thing for two rookie linemen to start at LG and C. Sure the line will struggle early in the season because of growing pains, but it was going to struggle regardless if we kept Carpenter and Unger or not. The upside here is if the young players improve during the course of the season and the offensive line becomes a strength rather than a liability right in time for the playoffs.
I look back last year and the Patriots and Packers had no problems starting rookie centers they took in the 4th/5th rounds, and they both ended up being very good.
Could be a lot of pressure to put on the middle of the line early on. Though willson’s scramble drill and graham to loosen pressure could work. I’m intrigued to see what the team thinks of Lewis at center. It’d be nice to only have to start on rookie on the line.
Damn… Sheard just signed with the Patriots
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/03/11/patriots-agree-with-jabaal-sheard-on-two-year-deal/
When they lost Revis I knew he would go to NE as they had the cap space and we didn’t. It’s too bad he would have been a great fit.
This is depressing. They lost their secondary, but now they have the bookend pass rushing tandem that they have wanted for years.
They got him for a relative bargain too 2 years 11 mil. He would have been a great fit as our LEO.
Sure, but we’re not exactly stuck with chopped liver at the position. Plus, could they keep Irvine when his current deal is up with Sheard on the team?
*Irvin
I think Irvin is up next offseason and would be a priority resigning. Maybe they should lock him up sooner.
The reason I think pass rusher is in short term, to cover Schofield’s spot, and if this player is really good, gives them some flexibility on Irvin. As Rob says, it’s a luxury to have three. The NY Giants had 3-4 at a time in their best seasons.
I have two issues I’d like to discuss.
1. Now that Andre Johnson is a no-go, how important is it to have a veteran mentor type? AJ has lost a step, but the mentor part would have been valuable to have. I think the Hawks receiving corps including Jimmy Graham, is young and immature. But when I look at the FA list, I see Reggie Wayne as the only guy who might be able to be that mentor. Kenny Britt has skills, would love to have him, but he is not a leader. What do you think?
2. We are tossing around a lot of draft prospects who are somewhat small, quick, and utilitarian, some even slot-oriented. As I asked above, don’t too many of them replicate Doug Baldwin? Agholor, for instance is a great route runner, and would be a great slot improvement over Doug who can get open and downfield, but I think they should draft a polished deep threat. Think a Randy Moss type. I think it is wrong to make too many assumptions about Jimmy Graham. He could be a bust for all we know. And he is an X-factor weapon, not specifically a WR.
Dwayne Bowe is a probable cut.
He is a shell of his former self. I’d rather see draft picks at this point. Dre was the only vet I wanted to see a hawk personally. Well and Fitz. To the draft, and Jimmy is 28.. so that is not considered young for NFL standards
His former self was an All-Pro. Lot of room for decline there.
1. Now that Andre Johnson is a no-go, how important is it to have a veteran mentor type?
I’m not sure it’s that important. Players like Doug Baldwin need to do some maturing for sure, but he’s not a total headcase. He’s an intelligent person who got a bit carried away at the end of last season. I think he will learn from that.
2. We are tossing around a lot of draft prospects who are somewhat small, quick, and utilitarian, some even slot-oriented. As I asked above, don’t too many of them replicate Doug Baldwin?
Lockett has a thick lower base and excellent leaping ability — he’s not too dissimilar to Golden Tate in that regard. I also think you sign him predominantly as a kick returner, at least initially. McBride for me would be an outside receiver, not slot. I would expect Agholor to be long gone by pick #63.
I love Lockette. There are quite a few guys we could have in mind that I’d be happy with. McBride, Perriman, and others.
Wow this blog has grown the past few years. 200 comments a section now. Bravo Rob! Almost too many posts to read now compared to a few years ago.;)
Thanks man — we have a fantastic community here.
While it is understandable that we could target a center in the draft, I would question any interest in Reese Dismukes from Auburn. His hands measure 8 7/8 inches. For a center? For me, it’s a red flag.
I also see reports that he is easily pushed back. Big red flag.