I’ll start this piece by apologising to those who are tired of the Russell Wilson talk. I will say though — this is the defining story of Seattle’s off-season. It’s going to be the big old elephant in the room until it’s resolved one way or another. I’m ready for a conclusion as much as anyone but with five days until Wilson’s self-imposed contract deadline expires, how can we pretend like it’s not the big talking point? Everything — the draft plan, the direction of the franchise, the players we look at — is determined by what they do with Wilson.
I don’t think the Seahawks will trade Russell Wilson in 2019. Next year? It’s a lot more likely if a long-term extension isn’t agreed.
It’s quite simple why a deal is highly unlikely this year.
Firstly, the Seahawks will want to exhaust the possibility of keeping Wilson. Trading him now is just giving up. Seattle’s main motivation, surely, is to keep their franchise quarterback. They have to let the process play out before conceding defeat.
Secondly, they don’t have an alternative option on the roster. If they feel a divorce from Wilson is highly possible in the future — they should try and draft a quarterback they like first. It might not be possible. If it is — you make the call. You have to. That way you’re not totally unprepared for the future. And if you get a deal done with Wilson the worst case scenario is you’re simply left with a cheap, young backup who might have some trade value down the line.
So no. I’m not buying into the prospect of an earth-shaking trade. That doesn’t mean it isn’t being considered though. There’s a reason why it’s being talked about in NFL circles (and it clearly is). There’s a reason why the Seahawks have been looking at quarterbacks in recent years. There’s a reason why we’ve spent a lot longer discussing players like Kyler Murray and Will Grier during this draft cycle.
We’ve been anticipating this huge stand-off for many weeks now. Wilson’s camp have been extremely aggressive. The Seahawks have dabbled in a bit of ‘negotiation via media’ too. Both sides need to compromise and neither appears willing to currently. Wilson seems fully prepared to use the franchise tag if the Seahawks won’t pay him what he wants. If that happens the team has two choices. Pay him the money he’s asking for — even if it cripples the salary cap — or move him.
With Wilson setting his own deadline for April 15th, it accelerates the process somewhat. If he tells the Seahawks, bluntly, in five days time — ‘I am now playing on the tag until you pay me what I want’ — you might as well see what’s out there via trade. If you’re going to do that in a year anyway, why delay things? It doesn’t mean you deal him necessarily. It just means you see what’s on offer.
That’s my read on the situation. That’s why I think it’s being talked about. I don’t think Wilson will be dealt in 2019. I think potential suitors, such as the Giants or Dolphins, will want to get through this draft and build. In a year they will be able to make a call on whether they want to go all-in on a superstar quarterback.
New York will be a much better team in 12 months if they use #6, #17 and #37 this year to build their team up with young talent before inserting Wilson. The Dolphins need everything — so there’s little point paying Wilson $100m guaranteed now and then not having any draft picks to support him.
Next year both teams would be prime candidates for a trade. There would be others.
If someone did make a fantastic offer next week — say three first round picks and more — they’d have to consider it. Or they’d have to at least turn to Wilson and put to him whether he wants this to happen. Are you prepared to move on or will you compromise on a deal to stay?
I want to run through some thoughts on what I think the Seahawks will consider doing for the two scenarios — keeping Wilson and trading Wilson.
If Russell Wilson stays in 2019 (without a new contract)
1. They should aim to draft a quarterback as a priority. I know the team has needs at various positions. If they’re in that situation of needing to find ‘the next guy’ — you have to start drafting quarterbacks. You keep looking until you find the one. It all depends on whether the players you like (and they’ll find at least one they like within this class) are available.
2. I still think there’s a very good chance Will Grier will be a target. I won’t repeat everything again but he was by far the best downfield thrower in college football for the last two seasons. He’s a perfect fit for what they want to do (run the ball and take shots). He has mechanical flaws that impact his velocity and he takes too many sacks. Those are fixable issues. What he does well — the downfield accuracy, the ability to hang in the pocket and make big plays, to elevate a team like he did at WVU — is impressive.
3. You back yourself as a coaching/scouting staff to fill your other holes. They will trade down and accumulate more picks. If they can trade down and select a quarterback — it doesn’t mean they can’t find impact players in rounds 3-7. Let’s remember — Frank Clark (late R2), Tyler Lockett (R3), Chris Carson (R7), Tre Flowers (R5), Poona Ford (UDFA) and Jarran Reed (R2) weren’t high picks. And the best defense in team history was built on day three prospects by this GM and Head Coach.
If Russell Wilson is traded in 2019
1. Speak immediately to Indianapolis about Jacoby Brissett. Can you get him for a 2020 second rounder or less? That way you’re adding a player with starting experience, some talent and he’s familiar with Brian Schottenheimer. You would need a hedge for the draft and some competition at QB.
2. Assuming they get at least two extra picks in round one, they need to make up for the loss of a franchise quarterback by building up their defense. If they pick in the top-10 I think Rashan Gary would be their target. He perfectly fits what they look for in an athlete, versatility, scheme discipline and a former #1 recruit. Book-ending Gary with Frank Clark with Jarran Reed in the middle would be a tantalising prospect.
3. If they picked again in the teens they should double-down on defense. Do you add Byron Murphy to cover the nickel spot? Do you see what remains of the defensive tackle class? If you’re trading Wilson it’s to try and create another great defense. They would need to add young, legit first round talent.
4. They could use their native #21 overall to make sure they get the quarterback they like (eg Will Grier) or they could trade down as they currently plan to try and do. They’d need to come away with a QB at some point but the flexibility would be there to build up their defense. Any prospective trade would need to provide the Seahawks with a fuller draft board on days two and three. That would be an ideal opportunity to look at the tight ends and receivers.
Again — this is all just a lot of thinking out loud based around a major talking point involving the Seahawks. If you’re fed up with the Wilson stuff — I’m sorry. But everything around the team is connected to the decision they make with Wilson. If they are destined to part ways — it impacts the 2019 draft significantly.
New VMAC visit confirmed
Idaho linebacker Kaden Elliss will take an official-30 visit to Seattle next week. According to reports he ran a 6.49 three-cone. We now know twelve of Seattle’s confirmed visits:
Parris Campbell (WR)
L.J. Collier (DE)
Dre Greenlaw (LB)
Juan Thornhill (DB)
Darnell Savage (DB)
Darwin Thompson (RB)
Rashan Gary (DE)
Corrion Ballard (DB)
Jace Sternberger (TE)
Derrek Thomas (CB)
N’Keal Harry (WR)
Kaden Elliss (LB)
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Thanks for this. This subject is painful right now. I’d like to sign Russ to a long deal is possible but if he must go I would rather have multiple firsts in the 2020 and 2021 drafts anyways. I like Grier and understand the fit, but if you end up having to use a late first this year on him, than why not wait til next year? There are more appealing options if you can pick early in the next few drafts. If you had the ammo to move up, wouldn’t you prefer the chance to draft Trevor Lawrence in 2 years? Or Tua next year? Got to build up the other needs around QB for now.
But is there any guarantee you’ll be picking early enough for those quarterbacks in future years?
Are you going to have the #1 pick?
And is Tua even that good? Or Herbert?
People keep saying next year is better at QB. Maybe so. But I need more evidence of that.
Grier has some flaws but he’s pretty ideal for Seattle’s offense.
Good points. I’m probably higher than some on Tua, but the prize would be Lawrence. Playing the guessing game, you have to figure if Russ is traded for 3 firsts, that along with our native picks is enough to get into a conversation for #1 based on the RG3 type model. The argument can be made that the price has gone down in the past few years. A lot can happen to both the team and potential draft picks but if you are going to spend a pick in the first round why not shoot for a bigger talent? It sucks you have to spend the capital gained by replacing what you have lost but at least you gain the 5 years of control and cap space.
If you want Lawrence you need the #1 pick in 2021
I get your point, but I’m not sure that’s what they will actually do. They waited three years to draft a QB the first time around cause they didn’t like the options, so I don’t think they’d rush to find someone in the first two rounds because they have a need. I have no clue what their grade on Grier or Finley or any of the other guys are, so they still could pull the trigger, but I’d rather wait to pick a guy the staff is in love with.
One of the first things they did was trade a third round pick and swap picks in round two to acquire Charlie Whitehurst (and the swap was an early R2 for a late R2). They then signed Tarvaris Jackson after a long NFL lockout, paid Matt Flynn millions and drafted Russell Wilson.
They might’ve waited to draft a QB but they were very aggressive to try and find an answer at the position.
They could easily really like Grier. He’s a fit for their offense.
Further, they were interested in Mahomes, linked to Brissett, scouted top QBs last year, etc.
They’re not sleeping.
Definitely.
Two things are for sure: One we have not done a good job finding a back-up QB for sometime now. I remember a post not to long ago about drafting young guys and grooming them for future picks (like Green Bay and New England) did many years ago. (Aaron Brooks, Matt Hasslebeck / Tom Brady and Garrapolo). Seattle, has yet to do that nor have they had much success drafting WR’s. For every Tyler Lockett and Golden Tate; we have at least 4 or more guys regardless of where drafted that just don’t pan out. (Amara Darboh, Chis Harper and Chris Dunham). You could also argue for or against Paul Richardson but he’s gone and had 1 fairly good season.
Sure but what you’re essentially arguing here is that not every pick has panned out. Welcome to the NFL draft. It’s that way for every team. The Seahawks under PCJS have done better than most other clubs since 2010. There isn’t a team in the league who’s had more hits than misses.
Rob, for these two positions we have not done very well. We had a conversation years ago about Seattle going after larger receivers. We have not done a good job addressing this since the days of Sidney Rice. I just don’t think it has been a priority which may also be a reason Russell gets sacked so often. His receivers cannot get off the line quick enough. I give the Seahawks credit for finding Doug Baldwin(free-agent) and other players in the latter rounds. Even if we are a running based team we should try to at least hit on a few receivers more often.
I’m not worried about it. Seattle’s offense has never been about mass-production at receiver — even when they had Rice, Baldwin, Tate, Kearse and Zach Miller. They’ve not hit on every receiver but nobody does. Baldwin and Lockett were two exceptional additions. Tate was very good. Kearse will always be remembered for his contribution. They will keep adding receivers and I’m sure they will find some options for the team.
With the uncertainty of Baldwin, we need to find someone to make up for those touchdowns and yards. I just don’t know if that guy is currently on the roster. I am glad you have more confidence then I do for our receivers. Here is to a RW contract and a successful draft via trade downs. Cheers.
What’s your take on Jalen Hurts? I’m rather fascinated by the idea of taking him next year even if Russell does stay. Develop him as a backup and Plan B and if Russell decides he wants to be here for his career, you can trade him off for capital.
Never been a fan. Not sure why he gets talked about as much as he does. Weird college career.
A certain QB that Pete said is a starter is still out there, and a fit. I neither love or hate Kap, but if he were to sign here I would be more worried. It definitely is being talked about as far as Wilson being traded. And I would bet that Mayock has talked to JS. They are truly a team with the right trade capital in these next 2 drafts. It would need to be a butt load of picks, in order to happen at all. Franchise qb in his prime and all. What would that look like, or has even been explored. No clue here. I could see 2 1st rounders and a 2nd this year, and a 1st and a conditional 3rd round pick next year. I know that’s a ton, but as said. He is a top end talent in his prime. We have seen teams use a boat load to get a qb in the draft, so it would have to be steep compensation. Not even saying this will happen, just throwing out a thought i had. Raiders become instantly relevant, Seahawks get adequately compensated.
And of course other dominoes would have to fall too, making it more unlikely. Like Giants trading 17th overall to the raiders for Carr.
Kaepernick isn’t coming to the Seahawks. Won’t even be a consideration. He had a chance to come here.
I don’t disagree with that at all. Just was saying that’s the type of thing that would need to happen, for those dominoes to fall, and why I think a trade is highly unlikely. And bring up another one of the trade partners. A lot of crap has to happen, for a trade of a franchise qb. I don’t think it is possible in my mind, but these are the kind of discussions being had. 25th can’t come soon enough for me.
They definitely have the right trade capital for anything to happen. Hate that any of this is being entertained at all. But to much swirling around, to ignore it.
My question is…would Seattle have the same trade leverage next offseason as they do right now? Wilson could end up dictating his future just by saying he will only play for team A and or B during a souring 2019 season.
Have you considered that the Wilson deadline of April 15 was directed toward the other teams who might be interested in him? Basically saying that you better trade for me now because I’m going to be busy with the Seahawks after the 15th?
It serves double duty with the Seahawks but this very public declaration leads me to believe it is actually directed somewhere besides Seattle.
The deadline is 100% the Wilson camp trying to gain clarity from the team on where they stand. ‘If you appreciate me let’s get this done now.’
The chances of a Wilson deal getting done by April 15th are slim and none, and Slim just rode out of town.
Longer term, I’m not sure but I think that Wilson will be re-signed. Here are a couple of reasons why.
1. The Hawks have a history of keeping core players, sometimes to a fault, and none is more important than the franchise QB.
2. Most super bowl winning teams feature an outstanding QB. Admittedly, many of them have been named
Brady.
Hopefully they won’t financially hamstring the team to where they are unable to build a contending team around the QB. To me, that’s the decision point. At what point is it better for team not to concentrate too many dollars in one person?
Love it or hate it, tired of it or not…
This is potentially one of the most FASCINATING storylines we have seen in years. Which is saying something ’cause we have had some drama!
I still think there could be some value in taking advantage of RW’s eventual NFL team ownership desires.
If the Seahawks could include as part of his compensation package, some form of allowing him a small % of team ownership (and/or options for future % purchases after he retires from the NFL), that might tip the scales of negotiation in the direction of a long term deal that makes RW both rich and a minority team owner as well.
The NFL might prohibit that or something, so very unlikely, but this sounds like at least, a different approach to their negotiations.
JimQ – I have had similar thoughts. What if Jody Allen offered Russ a share of the Trailblazers?
Rob I have to be honest when you first brought up the idea of the Hawks draft Grier months ago I was thinking whatttttt! No way.
My only exposure to him was the Senior Bowl and to be honest he was not good.
Then after you proposed the idea I started to really try and watch some time and read whatever I could find about him.
Long story short I am sold. If the Hawks don’t extend Russ by the 15th he should and likely will be in play with thier first pick. He is exactly the type of QB that style wise could slide right into the Hawks system. Also said to be a great leader and incredibly hard worker. He has some mechanical issues but that is one are where Brian Shchotenhiemer excels.
It would suck having to use a pick on a QB early if they do sign Russ later but I don’t see how they have any choice and Grier is the best option in this draft after Kyler Murray.
I just hope he is not gone before 21.
Most are already well past the thought of keeping the current #21 pick given the need to use it to trade down and get more picks this year. I still think the need to trade down is significant and doubt there is ANY situation that will cause the Hawks to actually dismiss trading the pick and actually use it.
I’ve started looking at Grier too, since there’s been so much talk here and other ‘hawks sites, and I’m sold. His recognition and decision-making seems NFL-ready. His throwing mechanics aren’t the best, however, so Schottenheimer and whoever the QB coach is (I forget) will have some work to do.
A lot of people think the Patriots are interested too. If we trade down into the second, do you think Grier will get past them?
I’m okay with Grier. He should be given a chance to make the team. I don’t think the Seahawks will use their first pick on him.
Next year will be a lot better, more quarterbacks rated for the first round and more draft picks for the Seahawks to play with. 🙂
You’ve said this about five times Alaska and every time I ask you to explain why the quarterbacks are better next year you never answer.
My concern about trading down is that there may be a bunch of teams trying to do the same thing. It’s unlikely that we are the only team that sees only 10 or 15 legit first rounders in this draft. I hope I’m wrong.
Apparently, Austin Sefarian Jenekins chose NE over SEA. We look to be courting a pass-catching TE. Watch this space. Who else outside of Strernberger should we be looking at?
Pass catching TE, I like the athleticism of the SDSU TE. Kahale Warring. Have not seen much of his blocking highlights. https://www.nfl.com/prospects/kahale-warring?id=32195741-5275-2700-ebaf-ccabda046f86
I thought a lot about the turnout for the West Virginia Pro Day workouts. I’m absolutely sure the were there to see Will Grier but I think they were looking at a WR they’ve been looking for forever.
David Sills V WR WV
Once I looked this guy up and dug deeper more I just have this guy. In the 2 years that he’s played with Will Grier he had 125rec- 1966yds- 33TDs those are crazy numbers but really hooked me was some of the strengths has and the first one was.
He’s a TD machine.
Cleaver creating catch separation through hand fighting. Not like that doesn’t happen in the NFL.
Scoured a TD every 3.7 catches.
Then I dug up on his games and watch this guys was made to run the play action.
I have him for our 84 or124 trying to get a feel. Lets just say I’m actually concerned by the WRs so I might even doubel up using pick 159 for John Ursua WR Hawaii for slot position ran in the run and shoot offense. As a junior 16tds- 1,343 yds- 89 receptions
those are just some thoughts on the offensive side of the team.
I like Sills a lot, too. But he ran in the 4.5s…Seattle rarely goes for WRs with that speed.
What’s interesting about Sills is that (at the age of 13!) he was Lane Kiffin’s pet project for QB at USC. So I’m betting Pete has probably been following Sills trajectory for a while. I can see the Seahawks taking a flier on him in the late rounds, but I feel like we’d still take an earlier WR than that as well.
I saw him too in looking at games for Grier and Jennings. I kind of ruled him out via his 40 (4.57) time, but his tape looked good. Getting separation was a knock on him though.
That said, he’s probably a 4th rounder with a lot to work with.
It is getting tired talking about RW but your right, its the biggest story. I also have a feeling that this story wont go away even after the 15th. One other question is how would we get Rashan Gary if we decide to trade Wilson in 2020? Also Brissett will be a free agent next year so we wouldnt need to trade for him.
That was a typo it meant to say 2019
I don’t foresee a trade to the Giants this year for the reasons stated above. If it did happen, though, I’d love to be a fly on the wall in Golden Tate’s house when he gets the news….
Contract Details out for Cassius Marsh and Nate Orchard.
Cassius Marsh:
Signing Bonus…$600k (only guaranteed money)
Base Salary…$850k
Per Game Roster Bonuses…$400k ($25k per game active)
Total $1.85 Million
Nate Orchard:
Signing Bonus…$0
Base Salary…$805k
Per Game Roster Bonuses…$0
Cap Hit…$645k (this contract qualifies as an MSB contract which allows a veteran to get the minimum while the team gets cap relief)
When you add the $1.85 million with $645k you get $2,495,000 between the two
You then remove the $570k per player that they bump out of the top 51 you get $1.14 million
You subtract $1.14 million from $2.495 million you add two pass rushers for only $1.355 million of cap space, not to bad.
Rob,
This is the most important question for Seahawk fans, so yes, keep on it. 🙂
I think you touched on the key development that makes these discussions other than speculation:
“With Wilson setting his own deadline for April 15th, it accelerates the process somewhat. If he tells the Seahawks, bluntly, in five days time — ‘I am now playing on the tag until you pay me what I want’ — you might as well see what’s out there via trade. If you’re going to do that in a year anyway, why delay things? It doesn’t mean you deal him necessarily. It just means you see what’s on offer.”
This is the only reason to issue the 4/15 deadline. RW has given fair warning. If they believe it (that he will only play on the tag after the 15th) then they have to seriously consider a trade.
Additional factors to consider include (in no particular order):
1 – We assume that RW wants to maximize his career earnings. He wants to be an owner some day. That takes big bucks. Unlike the rest of us, so many tens of millions won’t be enough.
2 – PC’s approach to winning championships is straightforward: win the turnover battle, stop the run, rush the passer, run the ball. This formula doesn’t require a future HOF QB to win. In fact, paying a QB an astronomical salary inhibits PC’s ability to acquire and retain stud defensive players (recall the imbalance between the offense and defense in the SB years).
3 – #2 plays to the current opportunity of trading RW. PC is almost alone in his approach to the game. Most teams want to start with an elite QB, and build around him. They believe (and they are right) that a great QB raises the performance of the entire team.
4 – Per #3, that means that there will be other teams that value RW more than PC/JS, creating an opportunity for a trade.
5 – Relative to #4, Seattle will never pay RW what he is able to demand. PC/JS won’t overpay (to there credit). If you go back to #1, that means that RW will never sign a long-term extension with the Seahawks.
6 – PC/JS have an opportunity (that comes with significant risk) to re-write their current legacy. If they retain RW (say, for the next three years, two on the tag) and knock around 8-10 wins each year, and fail to reach another championship, they will be remembered as lucking into RW in the 3rd round, Sherman/Kam in the 5th/4th, trading for Lynch for nearly nothing, and making the worst call in SB history.
7 – On the other hand, if they trade RW now, use their draft capital effectively to rebuild into an elite defense, draft a QB (Grier) that can effectively operate a run-first offense, and make legitimate championship runs in 2020 and 2021, they will cement their legacy as Coach/GM who did it twice, absent drafting fortuity.
8 – Why 2019 and not later? For one, this is a historic defensive draft. Couldn’t have come at a better time. Also, RW is worth more now. Why? Because he plays on a cheap ($17m) contract for 2019, which means a team can trade for him with guaranteed three years of club control, even absent a long term extension. Finally, he is healthy and at the top of his game. (And if you want to downplay the injury concern, consider Kam, Cliff, or more appropriately, Joe Theisman.)
9 – If RW traded now, the draft capital can be used to obtain Grier, say. (If RW is not traded, they may feel compelled to draft Grier anyway, probably using their top pick. Doing so would cost precious draft capital they otherwise don’t have.)
10 – Trading RW now would make it easier to retain their defensive studs, Clark, Reed, Wagner. Why? Because they would have the additional cap space, and the use of their lone tag in 2020, if necessary. (It would otherwise have to be used on RW, in this scenario.)
So that summarizes the logic of the situation. Challenges to trading RW now include:
1 – acquiring a good QB. Lots of risk here. Seahawk fans have been (rightly) scarred by the years and years of searching and failing. An issue not to be lightly considered.
2 – getting enough compensation in return. JS wouldn’t (rightly) trade ET for a box of peanuts, and he won’t trade RW (we hope) for less than a monster load of draft capital and/or players. How he handled the ET thing last year may play into his negotiating favor. (And the scenarios that La Confora [sp?] brought up were ridiculous. In one case, NYG end up with two first round picks, and Seattle only one, the top one. Trading RW straight across for Murray would be a disaster, IMO. My dream scenario would be Oakland trading Carr to NYG for 17, then sending all four of their firsts to Seattle, plus their second, for RW. That’s what RW is worth, if not more, IMO.)
3 – finding a trading partner willing to fork over the draft capital, and commit to paying RW the mega-contract he will demand.
It’s quite possible, despite the compelling logic of the situation, that a potential trade can’t overcome those barriers.
Additional comments (these don’t add to the logic of the situation, only speak to the public discourse):
1 – when the media begins to openly speculate on such things, that typically means there is something to it.
2 – the link to the NYG adds to the possibility
Final comment:
We shouldn’t set our hearts on Kyler Murray. He is not the second coming of RW. Few players have the character, the work ethic, the football intelligence and the toughness to match RW. My prediction is that Murray flashes, and then fails. Even if Arizona passes on Murray (unlikely), and Seattle has a high pick after trading RW, I suspect they pass. Grier is probably a much better long term option for the team.
“2 – PC’s approach to winning championships is straightforward: win the turnover battle, stop the run, rush the passer, run the ball. This formula doesn’t require a future HOF QB to win. In fact, paying a QB an astronomical salary inhibits PC’s ability to acquire and retain stud defensive players (recall the imbalance between the offense and defense in the SB years).”
How does signing a worse QB make this offense, and – by extension – the team better?
As John Clayton would say. The sooner the Hawks get a deal done with Russell Wilson the better. The longer there is no deal the higher the price it will be to resign him.
Russell Wilson trade ideas.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/dont-hold-your-breath-on-a-russell-wilson-extension-but-ponder-these-3-team-trades-in-the-meantime/
Not sure which one I like more. Option 2 you get more this year but you lose out on Murray. Option 1 you get Murray.
Option 2 you could just pay Frank and select Rashan Gary at #4 and go for Grier later and maybe trade for Brissett?
Man, you missed last thread…
I saw it now…lol
Rob, in the very unlikely chance that Russell gets traded would you be upset? I’ll admit I’d be saddened by it and it’d probably take me awhile to get over it. However, the excitement from having a lot of picks would probably help.
I’d also be saddened. But I’d be looking forward to the next step.
Sad, yes, but significantly more interesting, the upcoming draft.
My Russell Wilson is not signed or Traded Mock
Hawks Trade #21 to KC for #28 and #93 and 216
Hawks Trade #28 to Indy for #34, #90 and #242
R2 (#34) — Will Grier (QB W Vir.) Hawks need to plan for life without Russ if they can’t sign him before his self imposed deadline. I am not a huge fan but he does appear to be good fit for the Hawks offence and I think the issues he has with footwork can be fixed. Sucks using a pick on a QB but I dont see a ton of alternatives.
R3 (#85) — Trysten Hill (DT, UCF) He could week be long gone but with such a deep DL class teams may be willing to pass on him if they have any concerns about what happened last year at UCF. The Hawks catch a break here getting an elite talent in Rd #3 and he could become a Tyler Locket type steal.
R3 (#90) — Marvell Tell (S, USC) Fantastic agility testing and length makes him an appealing hybrid DB. I prefer Darnell Savage but he will be long at this point
R3 (#93) – Garry Jennings (WR, W Vir) Jennings has all the traits the Hawks look for in a WR. He will come and and compete for WR3 day #1. I prefer Terry Mclaurin and thought he might be an option here but not anymore.
R4 (#125) — Trevon Wesco (TE, W Vir) Hawks get a hard nosed TE or FB with upside in the passing game. Another really versatile player who can help in both the pass and run game
R5 (#160) — Kaden Ellis (LB, Idaho) Seems to have the measurable #s the Hawks look for and was ultra productive. Also has good bloodlines. He can come in and excel on special teams providing depth at the L spot.
R6 (#216) — Derrek Thomas (CB, Baylor)
A converted receiver, Thomas looked like a Seahawks corner at the combine.
R7 (#242)Darwin Thompson (RB, Utah St) The add explosive depth at the RB position with a guy who I think is really underrated.
It really is unfortunate the Hawks have such uncertainty at the Q spot and limited draft capital because there is great depth in this draft and they may not get any stars but could add solid players all over the roster.
Nice. I’m on board if we feel forced to go Grier early. Very afraid of one of the teams in the back half of R1 taking him though. (notice, they are most of the smart teams…)
Yeah I agree he could go as early as #15 to Wash and then the Pats and Chargers are also possibilities. They may have to stay at 21 if they really want him which would really suck.
I’d swap Grier with Murphy then Tell with Collier!
This is a typical Seahawks draft: I won’t get excited at first, because Grier might not have impact at all if RW is signed, Hill has some question marks, Tell won’t play his original position so might need 1-2 years, Jennings has some upside but has some real flaws too. Wesco is a jack of all trades, master of none, rest of the guys most likely depth players or camp bodies with some exceptions. BUT…they have drafts like this always, and I’m like “mehh, not impressed”, then a Clark or Lockett comes out from the bunch and I’m like “wow, OK, nice draft” 😀 so yeah, I feel this draft can be close to truth.
I mocked Tell, Jennings, Wesco, Hill, Thomas to them. And I poor some rain on them above, but I actually really like Wesco, intrigued about Hill. Still feel like Tell and Jennings are backups most likely. I don’t mind Grier at all, but if we pick him I’d rather trade RW and infuse a ton of young talent into the roster.
I wouldn’t even mind the team being awful for 2-3 years (like 4-12 like awful) if it would mean that they can be great after that. I’m more afraid of being mediocre
I like a lot of what you said (Players) but I am calling it here again; Green Bay and Seattle will make a trade as GB may want to add another WR ahead of Baltimore. Of note: they drafted 3 last year.
I had said in another post that I didn’t think the Seahawks would use their first pick on Grier. But you have presented a pretty good board with Grier. The only real difference if they didn’t pick Grier would be a better quality DT or DE at #34. I think Grier will still be around at #85 but that would be rolling the dice on him. Sort of like what they did with Wilson.
What do you guys think about the University of Washington and how they are preparing players for the NFL? Good, bad, middle of the road? It feels like their HC is starting to develop and continuing to develop some good talent….. unlike in the overall dark era of 1990s Huskies past.
Can’t be anything other than impressed – when Coach Petersen says he is building his program to prepare players not only for football or the NFL, but for life after, you believe him. I’m not sure there’s a lot of coaches I would trust to mean that if they said it, but Coach seems like one of the good ones. I look forward to the next 15+ years of him leading the program.
Also think UW will the new DB-University in short order. Jimmy Lake is just an outstanding evaluator and coach of talent. I think he’s said in pressers before that he will only recruit and offer a DB if he thinks the kid has NFL-level talent. Maybe they won’t all be athletic freaks, but you know they’re going to come into the league with such a high floor due to their grasp on playing fundamental football and practice experience at all positions in the defensive backfield.
What Petersen is doing with 2/3-star talent is remarkable. BBK was a complete diamond in the rough and the coaching staff developed him into an All-American. He churns our unheralded guys like Trey Adams, Kaleb McGary, Kevin King, Sidney Jones, etc. into first/second round picks.
UW’s recruiting is beginning to level up to compete with the national powers for the best talent on the West Coast. As they get higher level talents with better physical attributes, I only expect the number and quality of draftees to increase under Petersen and Co.
Like it or not it is the story that will not shut up. I’m convinced that a majority of the action in sports media on this is driven by “leaks” from Russ’s agent. He’s a difficult one to work with and will keep stirring the pot to keep his guy in the “relevant news” market. He knows our media is an echo chamber like mechanism that will reverberate and amplify any tidbit he tosses out. JS probably shakes his head each day as he does what he has to do. There was an article earlier this week about how Ozzie Newsome is still involved with player acquisitions for the Ravens and that his very good relationship with Earl’s agent is what led to that marriage (though it seems they bid against themselves…….however, they were committed too). I doubt that JS is that chummy with Mark Rogers.
For the fans who still think that Russ wants to be in NY so “obviously” the Giants are the target, it ain’t gonna happen. First, Russ isn’t Gettleman’s kind of guy. Second, Russ probably wouldn’t want to be on that poor of a team talent wise. Barkley aside, and maybe a couple other players, they’re at least two to three years away from having a quality qb make all the difference. I doubt Russ wants that dead period while in his prime. The same idea applies to a number of other needy teams, all of whom would have their rebuilds stunted by the loss of draft capital that would be spent on a Russ acquisition. He simply wouldn’t agree to terms ahead of those kinds of trades thus quashing the deal. There is one that just might do it, though I wouldn’t bet on it, just tossing it our for off season fodder. You think NY is the goal? How about the Jets? They’ve amassed some talent, have an offensive minded HC, albeit somewhat tainted, and might be attractive as a trade off. You say, “But what about Darnold?” He’s part of the trade package along with some high draft capital. Seattle gets a relatively cheap prospect with some upside potential and some draft choices to strengthen defense. The Jets accelerate their growth curve, and Russ gets the Big Apple. Win win all around, strike up the band, roll out the barrel. Crazy? Ah………..maybe a little.
Not
The Giants could easily be a final destination. Maybe not this year, but next year is a possibility.
Rob, agree that the Giants become more palatable next year, especially if they draft well this, to Russ, but I’m still skeptical of Gettleman’s preferences. Perhaps a successful Shurmer will have sufficient influence.
Dani, your sensibilities may be correct, but nobody expected the Mack trade before it happened, and practically nobody expected the OBJ trade until……….. GMs sometimes have an urgency that is not always publicly perceived, particularly the one’s with owners who possess an itchy trigger finger. Again, I don’t think the Jets are likely, just intriguing.
Russ and Co. are just trying to shake the bushes for a boffo deal right now, wondering if there’s some desperate team that will roll over for them. They know JS won’t cave easily, and his hole card is a tag next year that gives him match it or two firsts as a payoff, or a fixed price season with Russ. Anybody out there willing to give more now?…………………..only if they’re some level of desperate to take advantage of a short term window of opportunity..
I don’t see any reason why Gettleman wouldn’t want Wilson. He’s a franchise QB and the Giants need one of those.
I’m thinking in terms of preference, not absolutes. Gettleman seems to prefer taller qbs, Shurmur got good performance out of Keenum so could be more flexible.
Why would the Jets give up 1-2 first round picks and a pretty solid young QB with cheap contract for Russ? I can’t see that at all. If a team with a really talented QB would come into the picture….maybe Saints? Brees is also short, and not sure how much has he left in the tank. NO has ton of talent on both sides. Maybe they feel they have the championship window open for the next 3-5 years. If Brees would retire next year they could maybe trade for RW
If he were to go to the East Coast, I would probably say the Redskins. They need a QB, even with the recent acquisitions and DC is only 4hrs from NY, so if the other rumors are true (Ciara not happy with Seattle Music Scene for here career, she’s closer. In addition Russell is from the Virginia area. I highly doubt this scenario but Snyder has thrown away many drafts just to make headlines.
The Redskins are on the hook for two more years to Alex Smith. They can’t cut him until 2021. For that reason, the Redskins are not a viable trade partner. Not unless they want to have $60m tied up to their quarterback.
They need a young, cheaper QB to get them through the next couple of years. That’s why Josh Rosen or a rookie in this draft makes sense.
I fully expect to get killed for saying this – but shouldn’t Rashan Gary have performed a little better considering his elite athletic ability? He hardly produced in his 3 years at Michigan despite playing on a loaded defense. I understand his pedigree, but I am pretty scared of projecting a guy to produce far better than he did in college, despite being physically superior to everybody he played against.
Am I alone on this? Don’t get me wrong – I love the attributes. He is a freak of nature, but if I’m picking in the top 10 – wouldn’t you guys like to see more production?
At #21, I’m sprinting to the podium…but top 10…I’d be very hesitant taking that gamble.
Disruptive not productive…
Watch the tape, watch the way opposing teams run away from his side, or throw quick passes or double team him. Watch for the handful of genuine pass rush oppurtunities he has in a game and watch him dominate them. He’s also probably the best run defender of the ends in this class and as easy a scheme fit for our defence as you’ll find.
We’ve been over this a few times but he had a very clearly defined role in Michigan’s defense that didn’t lend itself to major production.
+12
As a big 10 and Michigan fan who watched a lot of Gary expecting big things, I share the concern, even with Rob’s comment noted.
For me he is a high risk/high reward kind of guy who might be a stud in the NFL or a complete bust.
On the MIchigan D, Bush and Winovich were the leaders. I really like both players but am luke warm about Gary.
Just give Russell what he wants and move on to signing other players.
This is literally one of the most ridiculous media driven stories I’ve seen since the last Russell Wilson contract discussions started. Last time it was a little bit murkier with so many other talents on the team helping to inflate the Wilson hype train but that ship and shipmates have sailed.
He’s a generational talent (even with some flaws) and is really just hitting his prime by QB standards. Going into one franchise tag with him Russell while the potential for other QB signings to reset the market is franchise lunacy. Look at what Lawrence just did to Clark’s contract???
Give him the $193 mil over 5 years with (125 mil guaranteed) he deserves and keep it moving. Go $140 mil over 4 years with (100 mil guaranteed) if he wants another chance to reset the market a year earlier. Both scenarios work for both parties. You don’t negotiate with your franchise QB or threaten him with highly drafted QB’s either. That’s ludacris and literally forces him to free agency. If this is a game of chicken Russell has the 18 wheeler and Seattle has a Vespa.
Imagine Green Bay drafting Goff with there first pick behind Rogers or the Colts drafting a 2nd RD QB behind Manning? You just don’t do it. The Garopolo draft pick behind Brady promptly got him shipped out of town years later and almost split the franchise apart. It’s franchise suicide and if Seattle is pontificating this idea of trading or not signing Wilson “now” to a long term deal then the front office may need to be re-examined.
Rob, I get your high on Wil Grier, San Diego was big on Rivers when they had Brees and that actually still worked out. Drafting Grier, where he will be likely drafted, sends the wrong message to the team and Wilson. You don’t do it. Draft a player that helps Wilson win and cut out the BS posturing. The only leverage Seattle has is giving in to the deadline or having something in place by the deadline that can be tweaked over the summer. I would not ignore his deadline.
Blank check then? That business in their right mind would agree to that?
Green Bay drafted Rodgers in the first even though they had Brett Farve
An aging Farve and Rogers was thought to be the 1st pick in the draft not Alex Smith. The 1st pick in the draft fell to them in the 20’s and GB had already had a history of drafting QB’s for trade value….See our own Matt Hasselbeck, Flynn…before then Warner, Brunell..Kyler Murray falls to Seattle at 21 they should “consider” taking him too…Nevertheless, A-Rod would not have been drafted if Farve was 29, more than likely. ..but that just doesn’t happen..that sends a bad signal…ask Alex Smith when KC traded up for Mahomes.
I don’t see the eagerness of some to move on from Wilson or penny pinch the best QB in franchise history drafted by Seattle. Seattle got a bargain for his services for the first 4 years. I’m sure Wilson wants what he deserves but is very conscious of the team construct and that winning cements his legacy and continues to get him the “highest paid” QB tag for future negotiations.
Russ holds all the cards here and Seattle needs to fold and move on to the next hand, or contract that is. Hopefully Reed.
There is no eagerness to move on from Wilson.
We’re talking seriously about the situation. Not assuming everything is hunky dory.
No, giving Wilson everything he wants is not a good idea. At all.
1. This isn’t a media driven story. It’s a thing, Duceyq, and Seahawks fans need to realise that ASAP.
2. You can’t just give Wilson ‘whatever he wants’. Both parties need to compromise. If it was as simple as you’re suggesting it’d be done by now. Do you think the Seahawks don’t want this done and sorted? There’s a reason why it isn’t.
3. At no point in their tenure’s did it look very real that Rodgers would leave Green Bay or Manning Indianapolis (until the neck injury). Totally different situations.
4. No — this is not about ‘Rob being high on Will Grier’. This is about Rob acknowledging a situation, a dilemma, and writing about what might happen.
I’m sorry Rob, it’s not a “thing” yet. It’s a “negotiation” and Seahawk fans should feel good that both sides are engaged in one.
At least it’s being worked on and the posturing hasn’t officially started (I don’t consider the deadline as posturing). Drafting a QB while Wilson is still under contract for 2019 and can be tagged for two more years (2021) after that would be posturing and not the kind that aids a negotiation.
Everyone here and elsewhere need to pump the breaks. No different then you’re recommendations in the Clark situation. Seattle has time to get a deal done. But for Seattle to get the best deal possible, earlier is better. That was my point before. “Giving him what he wants now” could be much different “later” if other teams pay lesser QB’s premium dollar in the meantime. It’s a pay scale and a marker is already set for Seattle to meet and they shouldn’t get too cute by half again, just like they’ve done with Clark.
Hey Rob, we all know you love Grier here ; ). Nevertheless, I don’t recommend your hedge. If I have disagreement with my wife, girlfriend, anyfriend, I don’t go on a date with another woman to solve the disagreement. Especially if I didn’t sign a prenup. That’s a move I save until after the separation or divorce. That’s a premature move that moves the momentum to the inevitable we’ as a couple should be trying to avoid. Sorry, I know too much about divorce.
Regarding your points about Rogers and Manning ever leaving their respective franchises, this is true, Why? Because their franchises didn’t blink at giving them whatever they wanted when it came to contract time. My point is, Seattle needs to follow the same protocol.
But to that point, what has Wilson done to make people feel he might leave (3 years from now)? This is a Colin Cowherd story gone mad. That’s the “media” driven aspect I’m referring too. They’re in the first month of negotiations, he wants a contract done by the 15th so this doesn’t hover over the off-season and become a distraction. Nothing about that says Peace, I’m out Seattle! Deuces!
I just want levity brought to this discussion and am only acknowledging what Seattle needs to do in treating their “Wilson” like “Rogers” and “Manning” during their prime.
It is a thing Duceyq. A consequence of the negotiation not going according to plan is Wilson being traded. It doesn’t mean it’ll happen but we have to embrace it’s a possibility. Which is why Schefter, an esteemed journalist, and people like Jack del Rio are talking about it.
Nobody needs to pump the breaks. We’re offering realism, perspective, educated opinions and we’re discussing a real situation without burying our heads in the sand. We don’t do overreactions. We don’t ignore anything just because it’s negative. And we won’t change.
I’ve consistently said there’s time to get a deal done and that I don’t think Wilson will be traded before this draft. It doesn’t mean I’m not going to consider other possibilities. I don’t assume I’m right.
The girlfriend analogy doesn’t work here. If you start seeing another woman but you end up keeping your wife you don’t get to have a ‘backup’ living in the house, training to be a potential replacement. In football you can. If the worst case scenario is Wilson stays and signs a new deal there’s nothing wrong with having a cheap QB you can develop as a backup with potential trade value.
Just because Green Bay and Indy acted a certain way doesn’t mean Seattle will or should. Manning didn’t go on Jimmy Fallon or have Colin Cowherd talk about a trade to the Giants.
If they don’t get a deal done when will he be traded? He’s still under team control until 2021. It’s in Seattles best interest to sign him to a long term deal now so it doesn’t explode the cap.
Shefter and Shreger talking about this means? It means it’s the off-season and as soon as the Antonio Brown saga ended they needed another story. There’s nothing they’ve said that isn’t pure speculation surrounding the situation. No different then “us” going through possible scenarios here. Wilson is one of the faces of the NFL and “rumors” surrounding him keeps viewers glued.
Russell has been on plenty of talk shows before and yes, it could’ve been a negotiation tactic, but he did go on to say he wants to be a Seahawk. What is controversial about that? Regarding Cowherd (who is wrong and speculates often), we have no evidence Russell gave him that “story”…even “if”, smart move if negotiations hadn’t started by that point and that move quickened Seattle’s pace.
Sorry Rob, being married and back up girlfriend searching still applies here. Preparing for a long marriage is very different then preparing for a divorce while married. There incongruent and likely leads to different outcomes. Preparing for the latter gets you there. Sending the “message” that we have your “potential” replacement here and you’ll be either training him or sharing QB meetings with him undermines Russell’s role as a leader and creates factions among the team. That’s a losing proposition, especially at this point of the negotiation. Especially when Seattle still has 3 years of club control.
No team has ever traded their Franchise QB in his “prime” (w/o serious injury involved). Never!
Speculating it is sensationalizing “fan talk” that has reached the media in my humble opinion. It’s a fun story. The facts and evidence though have not lead us there yet. If going on Fallon and saying he wants to be the highest paid QB ever while being a Seahawk is trade worthy then we have reached the deep depths of conspiracy theories, when both scenarios are likely to happen. Area 64, watch out!
Clark being traded is way more likely to happen than Russ. I can literally guarantee Russ signs and Clark is traded by or during the draft. I still expect the Colts, Jets, and Raiders are the teams to expect. Late 1st for some or early 2nd + for some.
Nevertheless, drafting a back up QB with potential in rounds 4 or after would be normal and not threatening to a situation that could spiral out of control fast. But with so few picks, Seattle shouldn’t even be near that fire.
I’m sure Seattle is doing its do diligence to get the cap number in a place the team can still be flexible, and that takes some back in forth. The overall probably isn’t in question hear.
I didn’t say if a deal doesn’t get done he’ll be traded. I said a consequence of the deal not going according to plan is he will be traded. That’s a distinct possibility, even if he plays on two franchise tags.
I really hate to have to say this but it’s not even worth my time continuing this discussion. You’re not listening to anything I say. I’m not repeating myself.
And the marriage analogy is still rubbish.
Likewise, time to move on.
“I can literally guarantee Russ signs and Clark is traded by or during the draft.”
Noted
I can literally guarantee he can literally guarantee nada about the Seahawks.
I listened loud and clear. I’m not sure anything I said registered.
Stay away from Jacoby Brissett. Acquiring him would be about the most unSeahawky move I could imagine. Brissett would succumb to all those certain sacks that Russell Wilson avoids, and Brissett would create sacks and traffic problems that even a normal quarterback can elude.
Brissett’s 20 yard shuttle time was 4.53. That is awful. A Canes blogger did a study recent on high school test scores and how they translate to future success. One of them was a 20 yard shuttle time of 4.47 and below. Only 1-2 quarterback prospects per year flunks that number at the combine, but Brissett was one of them. Compare to Russell Wilson at 4.09. Tom Brady had a notoriously inept combine but his one decent tally was 4.38 in the shuttle, demonstrating sufficient foot quickness.
Dwayne Haskins doesn’t dare run the shuttle or any similar drill. He knows he’s a klutz and the scores would be shockingly poor. Far preferable to stay away and allow time and subjectivity and distractions to work in your favor.
I’m sorry… but the day I’m judging a quarterback on their short shuttle time is the day the forward pass is taken out of the game.
Parris Campbell (WR)
L.J. Collier (DE)
Dre Greenlaw (LB)
Juan Thornhill (DB)
Darnell Savage (DB)
Darwin Thompson (RB)
Rashan Gary (DE)
Corrion Ballard (DB)
Jace Sternberger (TE)
Derrek Thomas (CB)
N’Keal Harry (WR)
Kaden Elliss (LB)
I’ll take that draft. LOL
Wasn’t it reported that Simmons was also visiting?
If we’re going to draft a QB 2020 is the year. Regarding Frank Clarke, I understand the odds are overwhelming that we will trade down. However, if a first tier lineman that could ease the pain of losing Clarke were to fall wouldn’t they have to pull the trigger? Think Jeffery Simmons.
Who says we are loosing Clark? If Simmons is there after we trade down I’d probably take just in case we lose Reed, or better, keep him and have a very good d line for years to come.
Why is 2020 the year?
People need to back this up with some names, otherwise you’re just guessing because you know who Tua is.
Jalen Hurts, Justin Herbert, Jacob Eason, Jake Fromm, KJ Costello, Steven Montez, those are all fascinating names to me.
If that’s the list people are clinging to for next year being better, I rest my case. There’s no evidence.
I know you don’t seem to be high on next years class, but to be fair, you didn’t like many of this years (including Murray) until you really dig into their tape. It was then that you made the revelation about Murray before anyone else did.
And you also have been on here and praised a few of these guys as fits for the hawks (Montez for example).
Regarding Hurts, he has had an unusual college career, but one where he has won 2 national titles and I believe his sophomore year he only threw 1 int (May be wrong, going off memory). He doesn’t have the greatest mechanics, but we will see how that changes this year at OK. He’s a great athlete, instinctual from what I watched, conservative with the ball (something PC likes) and most of all to me He’s a winner and a leader. After he took the getting bench for Tua in the title game with class and poise, I am a big fan now and wish the best for him.
For all these QBs, it’s going to matter what they do this year, just as any other position it matters. We could have another breakout player like Murray or Haskins come along too. Or all these guys could turn into Stidham types and have a poor year. But as far as talent, I think it’s a lot deeper and very promising. Tua may not even be one of the top QB if he decides to declare next year (which I am predicting is going to be the case and he decides to come out with Lawrence in 2021 instead as the number 2 qb).
You’re arguing my point for me.
I analyse players, review them, then make a judgement.
I don’t throw out opinions on a class like ‘next years QB class is better’ without actually watching them play. And let’s be right here — most people making that assertion have not studied the 2020 QB class.
I mean someone has just listed Jacob Eason as a reason why the 2020 class is better. On what evidence!?!?
Well if your point is that you haven’t done research or analyzed next years class so you can’t have an opinion, then yes that makes your point. But you have had opinions on some of the QBs (first thatbcome to mind are that youbliked montez, and disliked Hurts) and you have only ever asked for people to “back it up” with names of QBs that make them believe next year has more talent. There is a list of players that could possibly have more talent. Eason is a pretty good prospect, but as I stated. Who knows on any of these guys at the moment, including Tua. And to also be right- most people on here don’t do much studying except for prospects you bring up, and even then, we all trust your evaluation because we believe in you, but I don’t think that should preclude them from being able to have an opinion on players that they have watched play, but maybe haven’t studied extensively. Or preclude them from having a varying opinion from yours on a prospect.
For me at least, I’m not saying next year is “better”, but instead provides more talented prospects at QB. And think it’s unfair for you to chastise people for having that opinion. Or chastise people for bringing up prospects such as hurts or Eason. One of my favorite things about this blog has been the varying opinions that make one think about possible ideas and look into players. As you have said, that’s the point in talking about RW or Clark leaving. so why can’t we also have the opinion that another class provides better talent? And just like this year was said to have great d-line talent, a popular opinion (not just on here) is that next years qb class provides a lot of talented prospects.
This is not to say Grier isn’t a fit for us, but as you have also mentioned, not many others seem like a fit. So if none others are a fit, and we are unable to get Grier or he goes higher than projected, then next years class *might* have some promising talent that could fit with the hawks.
And this is with all due respect Rob, as I love what you do here, and what you have built. And appreciate every bit of it and the conversations. We all value your opinion and your take on every matter with regards to the Seahawks and the draft and the NFL in general.
It’s as simple as this bigten — if you’re going to assert next years quarterback class is better than this one you need to back it up.
I’ve seen it appear on here a few times now but I’m yet to see any evidence for it.
Feel free to hold that opinion but a list of names citing players like Jacob Eason isn’t evidence.
Erick Trickel of 247Sports agrees with you Rob. My argument is that 2020 has a bigger upside and unless Murray were to fall the Hawks will have a better chance at a high pick if Clarke or Wilson get traded. When Eason and Stanley have big years people will add them to the first round list. I’ll also be surprised if Trevor Lawrence does’t end up declaring after winning his second NCAA championship in two years. I expect four or five quarterbacks to be taken in the first round next year.
https://247sports.com/nfl/denver-broncos/Article/Answering-whether-2020-quarterback-class-better-than-2019-129740426/
“I realize I played with some great guys, and Bobby was definitely one of them,” (Earl) Thomas said. “I really didn’t realize how great he was playing with him because we were scrambling trying to be the best we could be, and you don’t sit back and understand like, this guy is the best middle linebacker in the league. Now that I’ve kind of stepped away from the team and had time to reflect on it, I’m very grateful just for the time that we had.”
“I want my jersey hung in the rafters one day….”
“I’ll sign a ceremonial contract when my playing days are done……”
There is the ET we should always love and remember. Truly one of a kind and a generational safety who happened to play in Seattle for 8 years.
This is good to hear. I would only like him to apologize for the middle finger and I’d forget everything bad
Oh for heaven’s sake…
He’d just broken his leg, and knew there was a very real chance he was going to lose tens of millions of dollars. Acting as though one gesture made in a moment of extreme physical and emotional pain is some horrible sin he needs to publicly grovel for forgiveness for is just absurd.
Not “public”, not to us, but to PC. It’s a business, I don’t think Pete is angry with him for signing with the Ravens for more money. I understand he was emotional and it was mostly in the heat of the moment. That’s why it would be nice for him to say: “Sorry Pete, I was angry with you and overreacted a bit”. It would be a nice gesture and it could help with the tension surronded the whole saga
While I completely agree seahawks should take QB early if there is no deal before draft, I have little doubt it will happen because of next:
1. Number of private workouts with top QBs- Zero
2. Number of top 30 visits – Zero
3. Number of top QB’s pro days that JS was at – Zero
So JS and Seahawks didn’t do any homework (that contains 3 things written above), on this year QB class…
and of course there is always chance they want to hide their interest in some player(like with Pocic and Penny)…
LOL. Just because they may not have done the things on your list doesn’t mean they haven’t done their homework. To be honest, that is an overly critical assumption and statement. If you’re a Seahawks fan, you should know better.
I think Millhouse made that point in his last sentence in his defense.
I was thinking the same thing Millhouse. If they are considering a QB early they really are Doing a good job of hiding that interest to the rest of the league. They may also be doing it to avoid the media circus they would have if they were bringing some top QBs in for a visit.
Can’t remember were they linked at all to Wilson when they drafted him?
+1.
The drama that would cause would be insane. And it would also cause other teams to see that. Then Grier would be picked to early, or whoever they are targeting as teams would see the Seahawks interest.
I clearly said they didnt do homework that includes those 3 things…not they didn’t do homework at all…and I cant remember QB who was selected by team who didnt do any of those 3…maybe you can remember who was that?
Rob very interesting article I kinda believe that Russell will play for the Seahawks next year but the year after not sure why because Eli Manning is on his Last year of his contact and Phillip Rivers has one year left on his contact and Miami has been clearing out a ton of cap space for next year .and who knows about Derek Carr the Raiders still have Chicago first round pick next year . could it be a distraction .it might not but it could
And as I allread vsaid, you never know with JS, and it is possible that he will hide his interest and draft QB that didnt conected with Seahawks in media even once before draft…
Rob, do you see Jacoby Brissett only as a one year rent, while they find QB for the future via draft, or he could be long term solution? (of course this are all speculation if they trade Russ).
I don’t know. But if they did trade Wilson this year (and I don’t think they will) they’d need to add some bodies and competition to the QB room.
If Wilson goes in a year instead and Philip Rivers remains unsigned I’d prefer to go down that route.
My only concern with this “will they, won’t they situation” that it puts the team in a tough position.
Rob, what do you think about these scenarios?
Hawks has intel, that NE really likes Grier, they’d likely pick him at 32.
Hawks traded back with KC to #29.
1, They receive another trade offer (maybe other team wants to jump before NE to take Grier) to move back ~10 spots and receive additionally a 3rd, 4th, 5th. Would you take the trade or take Grier?
2, A good player slips for some reason (nothing serious, maybe other teams have different interests or something)…for example Dexter Lawrence, Clelin Ferrell, Christian Wilkins, Parris Campbell or maybe Bryon Murphy. Would you take any of these guys instead of Grier even if you think there is no other suitable QB in this year’s draft for the Hawks?
My concern is they’ll have to compromise and pick a maybe less talented player because of potential need. They might sign Wilson later and then they wouldn’t have an impact player (impact means impact on the field, not with negotiations) with their first pick AND they’d miss out on a great trade or on a potential blue chip talent.
If they fear a divorce with Wilson is inevitable then the QB need trumps everything. If you find one you like you take them.
Little off topic
One question for all (I will try to ask this Nagy at twitter)…
What do you think, if some team knows that they will draft for ex WR , Edge or OT in first 2 rounds, do they do scouting of all other positions (for players with first round grades for whome they are sure they wont last long enough for their 3rd round picks) the same way as for this 3 positions?
Sure. I’d say you’ve got to be prepared for all possible scenarios. Maybe you get an unexpected trade offer, maybe a player you thought would go earlier falls to you later on.
You might focus on those other positions with your “30” visits, but you will still go through the full process IMO on all players that you have on your board.
The information acquired on players’ backgrounds/character/etc. is also valuable later on if they become available in trade or FA.
I have just listened Charley Casserly on path to the draft and he said some really nice things about Grier…he thinks he has exelent execution in RPO, smooth motion, ball came out quick, he likes him athleticly, and good arm strenght…
I know it’s just one game, but I was watching Trevon Wesco vs. Kansas 2018 and Grier… 😬
Trevon Wesco (West Virginia TE #88) Vs. Kansas 2018
https://youtu.be/PHQouKGbi34
Hope that was his worst showing.
That’s the scary part with Grier he has looked really bad at times. Then other times he looks amazing. Hope it is a mechanical issue and can be fixed. Seems to have issues with his footwork and upper body not being in sync at times it is weird. Being the son of a coach you have to think he has had mechanics drilled into his head since he was a kid.
I like his upside but he is certainly not without risks and far from being a lock IMO.
You also have to wonder how he’ll transition from the high volume WV passing offense to the more refined Seahawks system. That’s the amazing thing about RW…how efficient and productive he is with the relatively limited attempts he gets.
I don’t think Grier has ever looked ‘really bad’. He took too many sacks at Iowa State. He hasn’t had horrible games though.
Excellent content each day Rob, and the podcasts with Brandan are great too, have listened to every one. Found a couple good PFF articles about or containing Seahawks interests in the last few days too. Good analysis on WR N’keal Harry, lots of attributes, just inconsistent separation – https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=aEaz8rPziDA
They had a very good article Tuesday – The importance of Doug Baldwin to the Seahawks offense. “His 99.0 receiving grade from the slot leads all wide receivers since 2011. In the three games that Baldwin missed, Russell Wilson finished with an overall grade of just 63.7 and a passing grade of 59.1. In all the games which Baldwin started, Wilson proceeded to record an overall grade of 91.0. Simply put, there is a certain comfort level between Wilson and Baldwin that helps drive the Seattle offense. The Seahawks will hope that Baldwin moves past the injuries of last year and continues to produce for them as he has since landing in Seattle, but they would also be wise to look towards Baldwin insurance in the upcoming draft.”
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-the-importance-of-doug-baldwin-to-the-seahawks-offense
Monday they had an article on 2018 pass-blocking efficiency for all 32 teams, and after being in the mid to high 20s for the previous few years, the Seahawks finally made it into the teens. “After averaging over 200 pressures allowed per season from 2014 to 2017, the 2018 Seahawks allowed just 132 from their 502 passing plays.”
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-by-pass-blocking-efficiency
Also on Monday they put out an article: Top 250 Big Board for the 2019 NFL Draft – https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/draft-pffs-top-250-big-board-for-the-2019-nfl-draft
Wouldn’t Kaden Elliss be a local visit, not an “official 30”?
Pelissero saying “next week” makes me think probably April 15th?
Or is he too good of a prospect to “insult” by grouping him with the locals?
http://sports.mynorthwest.com/category/podcast_player/?a=0a7ed679-aa83-4242-ae4f-aa2b0160538d&sid=1014&n=Bob%2C+Groz+and+Tom
Jake Heaps on the show linked above. “The only holdup in the Russell Wilson contract negotiation is guaranteed money. The $35 million per year is NOT the issue.”
If this is true, its infuriating. The Seahawks aren’t going to cut Russell Wilson even if he has a bad year. Why faff about with the guaranteed money? Paul Allen’s trust can afford to put a big chunk of cash in escrow for him.
The Steelers do the same thing as the Seahawks – only guaranteeing the first year of the contract with rolling guarantees for other years for every contract except for the QB. The Front Office can make exceptions.
If another player wants the same treatment, just point to the position they play and say “You’re not the QB.” If they want to be a diva about it after that, ship them out.
You could just as easily argue — if they’re not going to cut Russell Wilson, why is he so caught up on a second year guarantee?
Wilson gets his money whatever the scenario.
If the Seahawks uphold their structure, it’s much easier to negotiate with other players if the most important player on the roster worked under their rules.
“why is he so caught up on a second year guarantee?”
I think this is pretty easy – its respect. The Falcons gave Matt Ryan all that guaranteed money because he’s the guy. The Packers gave Rodgers a ton of guaranteed money because he’s the guy.
If you’re the guy, your money is guaranteed.
More and more, I think that this saga came about because of poor leadership from the front office – Pete and John haven’t come out and made it public that Wilson is the guy like other franchises have.
Remember when Jim Irsay came out and said: “Whether it’s going to be the highest and all those sort of thing we’ll see how that goes… I see Andrew here, God willing, for a really long time and this won’t be his last contract. With him at 26 years old, it’s going to be ringing the bell in terms of nine figures and that sort of thing.”
Where is that sort of commitment from the Seahawks?
You’re asking why the Seahawks aren’t willing to make an exception on the way they structure every contract. Why aren’t you also asking why ‘respect’ is preventing Wilson from making the deal, considering there’s no danger of him being cut after one year?
‘Respect’ is just pride and ego. A consistent contract structure actually matters.
I suspect it’s a lot more complicated than suggested there. Otherwise it’d get done.
I heard that Wilson is asking for an escalator clause that would annually raise his salary in ratio to the cap increase.
I’m confused. Below average tester all around, just ok production…
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/nyqwan-murray
4.63 40yd…?
Watch his tape – really solid hands, great awareness of his position on the field coming out of the slot and being able to find the open bubble of space, i thought his speed looked okay, absolutely fearless going over the middle to make a catch, just overall looked like the guy who when FSU needed to move the chains they went to him. Not everyone can be a 3-sigma athlete. Doubt he gets drafted but he looks like a decent guy to bring in nonetheless.
Yeah, I saw he has good hands, really low drop rate (3.6%). Could definitely be someone they look at later on I guess.
A few thoughts on this topic:
– Russ is the best option to win a Super Bowl over the next few years- which is always the goal. Any QB drafted is a lottery ticket- even Murray. Russ thrived in the competition and won the starting job. What competition will there be if we trade Russ? Lynch? Trading him can only set the team back at this point. The only rationale I can see for a trade is if the FO does not believe they can win a SB next year and needs more supporting cast.
– Grier will be drafted no later than pick 32- if not NE, then someone will trade up for the highly valuable QB 5th year option like last year. This is too rich for my taste for Seattle. There are other pressing needs to compete for a Super Bowl.
– Drafting Grier will only push Russ further out the door. I understand it provides leverage in negotiations, but so does a QB in Round 5. Russ is obviously wanting to know that he’s in the long-term plans. No better way to say “you’re not” than using their best draft capital on a QB instead of improving the team at DL/Nickel/Pass-catcher.
– I’m not buying the April 15th deadline- I get we’re supposed to, but it’s unrealistic. If being signed long-term before off-season workouts begin is his real top priority, then he can’t and won’t get his contract demands met. He’ll need to compromise. The trade rumors don’t benefit him either as there are no QB-needy, playoff ready teams with sufficient draft capital. If he’s traded, he’ll get his money, but play for a dog the next couple years. I don’t know him personally, but I’m guessing that’s not what he wants. Seattle gives him the best chance to win a SB in his prime years.
– Based on these points, I predict the deadline will pass, the Hawks will draft a QB no earlier than Rd 5, and ultimately get a deal done during the summer.
Could be right. I just don’t see Grier going in the 1st.
1. It’s not just about leverage. Drafting a quarterback protects you from being in a position where you have to trade Wilson and not having any viable fallback.
2. If you draft a quarterback in round five they’ll have a job on making the roster let alone providing any leverage or insurance.
3. Whether they draft a QB or not remains to be seen. If there’s a serious chance Wilson departs in the next 12 months they have to consider it a lot earlier than round five.
So the next question to consider is if Grier is off the board too early, who are the other QBs to draft earlier than Rd 5 that fit the scheme? I still don’t see this lot being a viable fallback in the chance Russ is traded, hence the Grier consideration.
The downside of drafting Grier early and still signing Russ isn’t a great short-term gain either as you miss on critical starting DL/Nickel/WR talent.
There are a few interesting QB later in this draft for sure…
http://draftanalyst.com/jordan-taamu
https://www.nfl.com/prospects/easton-stick?id=32195354-4942-0937-5f54-4fc08152f18e
https://www.nfl.com/prospects/tyree-jackson?id=32194a41-4361-1082-9c52-07385a4368c9
http://draftanalyst.com/clayton-thorson