The day after the night before

It’s time for a change in the defensive leadership

If you missed last night’s instant reaction article and podcast, I’d recommend checking it out. A lot of what I discuss here is a follow on from that.

In the aftermath of Seattle’s loss to Minnesota I suggested changes were necessary.

Ken Norton Jr has endured a difficult run as defensive coordinator. He was once fired mid-season with the Oakland Raiders. As difficult as it’ll be for Pete Carroll, history should repeat.

It might not change a great deal for this season but there has to be consequences when a performance level is consistently bad.

Just as Carroll used ‘the bench is an ally’ to warn his team last week about their performance levels, the same standard needs to be set for the coaches.

Norton Jr is clearly a principled and likeable man who deserves to be cherished for his time in Seattle. Nobody could blame him for returning to run Carroll’s defense in 2018. His interactions on the sideline with Bobby Wagner, K.J. Wright, Marshawn Lynch and others during the Super Bowl runs are memorable.

His own attitude and toughness was brought to life on the field by the likes of Lynch and Kam Chancellor. You could sense it.

But he’s a bad defensive coordinator.

Carroll himself has never been a particularly strong ‘details and adjustments’ coach. Right now, he needs someone of that description alongside him. The only way to rescue this season is to find a way to make this defense function.

No more easy completions for the quarterback. No lack of pressure. No total inability to slow anyone down. No more allowing opponents to dictate to you as they march up and down the field, while the Seahawks passively take their punishment.

The fans are starting to turn. As someone who has been critical of the Seahawks for some time, I’ve never seen it like this. Usually there’s a real pushback when Carroll’s future is discussed. Yet numerous podcasts, streams, articles and tweets are saying the same thing. It’s time for a change.

Sometimes you’ve got to act to give yourself a shot. Just as the Ravens did in 2012 — firing struggling offensive coordinator Cam Cameron and replacing him with Jim Caldwell.

The Ravens were 9-4 at the time of that decision. It was surprising to many. The change was made anyway and a few weeks later Baltimore had a Super Bowl Championship and Joe Flacco was the MVP of the playoffs.

You could also argue such a move would be simply shuffling the deckchairs on a sinking Titanic. To be honest, that’s probably right. I don’t think this team is close to being a contender. Even if they sort the defense out somewhat — there are still other issues to rectify. For example, why does the offense grind to a halt every week after half-time? Why are the Seahawks so easily out-gunned in the game of adjustments? Are they good enough in the trenches? And how on earth do you fix the cornerback problem specifically?

Yet inaction eventually takes the form of complacency. Norton Jr was fortunate to survive long enough last season to benefit from Seattle’s powderpuff schedule. As people rushed to celebrate an improved performance, his job security regained full strength — undeservedly.

He should’ve gone along with Brian Schottenheimer after the Rams playoff debacle.

Carroll’s unwillingness to take a back seat and establish a role for himself as a figurehead kept Norton Jr in a job. Control is a big thing for Carroll. It’s why, even after week one, we had the absurd quote in response to a question about what Shane Waldron had brought to the offense:

“He’s open-minded to do things that we’ve done in the past”

I think there was an opportunity for Carroll to become Seattle’s answer to Nick Saban. Appoint high-profile, established coordinators and let them handle things. You act as the great overseer and maximise your qualities as a leader, motivator and culture builder.

Instead, Carroll prefers to end his stint in Seattle as he started. Doing things his way.

And let’s be clear — nobody should begrudge him for doing that. Provided he’s willing to fall on his sword now that it isn’t working.

Likewise, nobody can blame Carroll for wanting one last hurrah after the 2017 season. Clearly he contemplated retirement (otherwise Jay Glazer wouldn’t have mentioned it). After consideration, he decided he did want to build another team.

Calls for his departure after that year were premature, even knowing what we know now. Having built one of the all-time great NFL teams from 2010, Carroll had every right to look after the reset. He deserved a crack at this if that’s what he wanted.

Yet here we are, nearly four years on. A treasure trove of picks and cap space has been spent. Most of the roster has changed. They’ve traded away key players and traded for big names.

It hasn’t worked. It isn’t working. And it takes elite-level blind faith to think it will work next year.

I am convinced that Carroll will be reflective on this and honest with himself. If what we’ve seen so far continues, I believe he will retire at the end of the season.

Do that and he’ll remain a much loved Seattle legend. People will excuse the latter years and remember fondly the fact he delivered the first ever Super Bowl title to the city. It should’ve been two and it’s a shame they never avenged that trauma. That’s life. It isn’t ideal.

If he stays, he knows what the consequences are.

More drama with Russell Wilson. Potentially being remembered as the man who traded Wilson, the best quarterback in franchise history. The next reset would be even more painful because it would include finding a replacement quarterback.

Rather than return to contention, such a scenario could see the Seahawks collapse into being a really bad team. Carroll’s legacy would be tarnished.

He’ll be well aware of all this. And if he was considering retirement in 2017 due to similar thoughts, you better believe he’ll be thinking about it later this year if things don’t improve.

Carroll’s already giving off a ‘why the heck am I still doing this?’ vibe with his body language.

You could argue he’s just signed a five-year contract. Wasn’t that a signal of intent to carry on coaching?

Perhaps. Yet remember when he signed that deal. It was announced prior to the Buffalo game. That was before the team’s mid-season collapse. It was before the horrendous playoff loss to LA. It was before the Wilson-trade saga.

A lot has happened since then.

He possibly signed that deal believing his team were on the precipice of another great run.

And in 2017, when Glazer hinted at Carroll’s retirement, he was only a year removed from signing an extension.

We’ll see what Carroll decides.

I do think change is extremely necessary though. It’s much harder to replace a quarterback than a great coach. Just ask New England.

The 2022 quarterback draft class is awful. I can’t see Aaron Rodgers in Seattle. I’m not sure anyone knows what’s happening with Deshaun Watson’s league status and there’s increased talk that he’ll be dealt before the trade deadline anyway.

Pair Wilson with an offensive minded Head Coach and let’s see what happens. My choice remains Carolina offensive coordinator Joe Brady. He’s a Sean Payton disciple and Wilson has long wanted to work in that system. He’s getting a song out of Sam Darnold. He basically won LSU a National Championship.

Throw in an experienced defensive coordinator to run the defense and that would generate excitement for next year. Fans need that. The energy around this team is fading.

That in itself should be a talking point. It’s not acceptable for ownership to simply hand things off to Carroll and John Schneider and hide in the background.

If Carroll is unwilling to retire, it shouldn’t be assumed that he just carries on until he wants. There has to be some accountability from the top and it’s unclear, currently, if that structure exists. It has to at least be debated whether Carroll is ‘too’ powerful in the organisation.

In the short term, a bit of pressure also needs to be applied to Seattle’s media. They’ve had a good run over the last 11 seasons. Times have been good. Carroll is a fun person to interview. They’ve not had to rock the boat much.

Now is the time, however, to ask some probing and difficult questions. That starts with Mike Salk on 710 ESPN in the 1-to-1 interview this morning and goes into the group press conference later.

(ED — No probing or even mildly challenging questions were asked in the 710 ESPN interview with Mike Salk. Disappointing.)

(ED #2 — None of the questions below were asked but kudos to Gregg Bell for asking a couple of probing questions on the cornerbacks in the general press conference.)

— Does Carroll have to consider big changes, including to his staff, in light of what he’s seen so far?

— Does Carroll regret not doing more to address the cornerback position in the off-season?

— If Carroll isn’t talking to Richard Sherman as he claims, why not? What’s there to lose at this stage? Especially if the likes of Tampa Bay and Carolina were touching base with him?

— Why not make a push for CJ Henderson, who is seemingly being dealt to Carolina for a pittance?

— What has happened to the team identity?

— Will Carroll admit that it’s not a good look that they’re still working out how to best utilise Jamal Adams after all they’ve invested in him?

— Why do they keep investing in tight ends yet seem to really struggle to make them a consistent feature when the game kicks off?

— Has the team made enough progress since the 2018 reset?

— What has Jody Allen and/or Chuck Arnold said to him after the latest defeat?

This is just off the top of my head. I’m sure there are other questions that could be asked. None of these are unfair.

Just as the team needs to be seen to be acting to fix their problems, the media has to be seen to be asking questions of the person ultimately responsible for the football operations in Seattle.

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  1. Denver Hawker

    It’s a bit strange to be watching this storyline in real-time after you’ve predicted it for awhile now. Most of us here aren’t surprised by the on-field performance, which leaves the general fan base reactions as perhaps the most entertaining aspect of Seahawks world at the moment.

    I’m more intrigued to see what happens with staff movement this year than what happens on the field. I’ll be more disappointed if the staff remains at the end of the season than if the Hawks finish with a losing record.

    • Rob Staton

      I think it’s quite interesting how a number of other people on other sites and platforms, who’ve been a bit full of it for the last 18 months, suddenly are now saying what we’ve been saying for a while.

      • Austin Slater

        Rob you deserve some credit for moving with this story as it’s evolved and being objective. I remember you getting on me years ago for saying Pete was washed so people who say you were never a Pete guy are flat out wrong. You adapted your stance as evidence mounted and many are unwilling to do that.

        Pete’s media interview and his interview with Salk were flat out depressing

  2. Matt

    Rob – Outstanding, prescient…you name it. You have been on the ball with this for quite some time now.

    Pete Carroll, in 2021, brings nothing of value as a Head Coach. People constantly bring up team culture…what team culture? Blaming the scheme? Complaining that fans just want you to be Richard Sherman?

    Where is this vaunted culture?

    The reality is that it hasn’t existed since 2016. This team fell apart in 2017 and has never recovered any of the magic that made it special. I remember watching this team in 2011 and 2012 – and despite early losses and hiccups; it was so abundantly obvious that this team had something special brewing and it didn’t take a Ph.D in football to see that. Despite the early inconsistencies – the attitude, culture, and most importantly, talent, was evident.

    Success was an inevitability. I truly felt that.

    Now? Failure and coming up short feels inevitable.

    You mentioned it on the stream, but I find myself not liking the players on this team, for the most part. It’s important I make this distinction – I don’t dislike them; I simply don’t like them like I did in the previous years. Despite their (old guard) personal warts, there was a warrior mentality that was fun. It oozed off the tv screen.

    Now? False bravado. A sense of “oh this makes me look good.” It’s the illusion of being tough, not actually being tough. I didn’t need Red Bryant to tell me via a 3 part Instagram story, that he was a tough, selfless teammate who did the dirty work that didn’t bring him fame. He just did it.
    I’ve gone from anticipation and pure emotions about this team to a state of just kind of laughing at it. It’s comical because it was so predictable. I’m not mad. I’m not even disappointed. I kind of just…don’t care.

    What we are watching is managed decline. We have enough talent and Pete Carroll has enough savvy as a leader and a coach to be able to make that decline much less dramatic – but I ask, is this a good thing? The football life is so short that I find myself wanting the car to crash so that we can just move on to something new while we still have a great QB at our disposal.

    I don’t know…I genuinely feel bad for guys like Russ, Bobby, and Tyler. They strike me as genuinely good men. And yes, Russ has been a little squeakier than usual, but it’s tame. And I know deep down, these guys are probably demoralized as to what they are seeing and feeling. Losing, when you are used to winning and playing for big things – it just kills you.

    I would never pretend to know more about football than Pete Carroll, but as someone who played competitively through college; I feel very “qualified” to comment on culture and team. This team…doesn’t have it. Pete no longer has the golden touch. We are not building towards anything. The water isn’t starting to bubble which we know leads to the boil. It’s just sitting on the stove top…idle.

    My hope is that Pete hangs it up after this year. I don’t want to feel animosity towards him, but admittedly, that’s starting to happen. What made him great is ultimately going to be his downfall. I guess it’s poetic…like a Greek tragedy, in a sense.

    Thanks for all you do, Rob. I know exactly where you’re coming from. None of us are rooting for demise, but we see it, feel it…and unfortunately, it’s only going to change when things get much worse.

    • Denver Hawker

      Pete is familiar with the poetry here- the 30 for 30 Trojan War is pretty interesting on the rise and fall of USC. The loss to Texas mirrors the SB loss in the story, with it ending when he jumps ship before the sanctions come down and leave the team in purgatory led by his mediocre assistants.

    • Rob Staton

      Thanks Matt, I appreciate you saying that and also the thoughts you’ve shared

    • Big Mike

      “I’m not mad. I’m not even disappointed. I kind of just…don’t care.”

      Man that’s when you know things have really turned, when longtime fans just don’t give a crap anymore. I’m one of those as well. There are many more and it is a real stain on the franchise.

      Great post Matt.

      • Call Me AL


      • Chris

        I actually just forgot to watch the 2nd game altogether. Completely slipped my mind. I didn’t care after I realized it either.

        My wife and family were both shocked when they heard I missed the game. Can’t remember the last time I didn’t watch a regular season game. Probably over 20 years during Grad school.

        • Roy Batty

          I took our puppy out for an extended walk at 1:10 yesterday.

          My wife asked, “Doesn’t the game start soon.”

          I said, “Yup”, and kept on walking.

      • LooseSasquatch

        This is so true, and it’s where I’ve been at for a couple years. My kids are getting older and ready to watch games and 4-5 year ago, I’d have rearranged heaven and earth to watch the games live and soak it all in. Now even when the games are on I’m on my phone or playing with my kids and more often than not I change to a different game because I know what’s going to happen in ours… I just don’t care anymore

    • NickW

      Man, the last year’ish has been really hard for me. Last year I shut off a game for the first time and walked away. First time I have ever in my life done that. I nearly did it again yesterday. It does make me mad. I care too much, but I have been contemplating walking away until Pete’s gone. Which I guess is a form of not caring, but not caring because you care too much and you can see exactly where this is heading and you don’t see anything good in the future… I have been a fan since I was a little kid (roughly nearly 40 years), and I don’t mind losing because you played your best and the other team was just better. This product is just trash, and not competitive. It feels like they are just completely disoriented and have no clue what they are doing. That comes down to coaching…. Im ready for this ride to be done, and to move on to the future while we still have some good pieces left. I miss the swagger that started early in the Pete era. You had hope. You believed that anything could happen. Beast quake is a perfect example. I don’t see any swagger to make me think anything like that can happen now. Everything from the team just feels empty.

      • Rob Staton


        It’s the worst thing that can happen among any fan base, in any sport

        The Seahawks are seriously flirting with it right now. Many fans are starting to tune out. It starts with not listening to the press conferences, not being excited about the games, not having the same vinegar for a Sunday.

        It stretches further than that into ticket sales and merchandise sales eventually

        Complacency within an organisation is dangerous

    • SeattleLifer

      Great post, my only disagreement is that I am mad, and for many of the same reasons you brought up. The ‘managed decline’ under Pete and John – for me that’s certainly what it was but how it ultimately plays out is/was a wasting of a great team and a HOF qb and that’s what makes me mad. This team should have been run better in so many ways. Resources were squandered, personnel decisions were often poor, coaching suspect, and all along without vision and foresight. To me having to endure all of the above while the teams erodes and a talent at qb like Russ is squandered – it all makes me upset to say the least.

  3. GawksAtHawks

    I’m thinking that if the season continues as is and the Seahawks miss the playoffs. Pete will retire to save face and his legacy but it won’t matter. If Wilson can find a team he is interested in playing for that is interested in trading for him he’ll be gone. Doesn’t matter is Pete is gone and they hire someone Wilson wants to play for. At that point the hawks will be rebuilding and not have much to rebuild with as far as cap space and draft picks go.

    • Rob Staton

      Not sure about that.

      A knockout hire — a top offensive mind — and Wilson will stay IMO

      • Palatypus

        Eric Bienemy?

  4. Mick

    Rob do you have a favorite for KNJ’s job?

    • Rob Staton

      I don’t. Not even sure who’s available. I think at this stage you just have to do something to not appear inactive or complacent

      • Roy Batty

        And quell the apparent player mutiny brewing. Flowers and Reed’s comments are so telling.

  5. DON

    It seems quite telling when both Tre Flowers and DJ Reed mention that they are “confused” about what to do in certain schemes. It shows up on the field when you see guys way out of position with many yards of cushion between the defensive backs and the receivers. Now maybe both of them are bus trucking and making excuses for their poor performances but to my eyes it seemed obvious out there that guys were not in the proper places.

  6. Pran

    Given the talent and Pete at the helm, Do you think a good DC will accept the opportunity. Look at what they did with OC with some good talent on the offensive side. Change of DC is welcome respite for fans but nothing else may change.

    • Rob Staton

      Well whoever it was would be currently unemployed so…

  7. cha

    The defense stands dead last in total yards allowed after three games (30th in Run D, 27th in Pass D).

    50% of opponent drives have ended in a score.

    If you like advanced stats, the Seahawks are 30th in the NFL in Expected Points contributed by the defense.

    They’re 27th in both air yards before catch and yards conceded after the catch. Translation: they can’t stop the short passing game or the deeper passing game.

    And there isn’t a run of Colt McCoys, Drew Haskins and Chris Beathards to give them a breather this time.

    • Paul Cook

      The stats are always nice to have, to confirm what you thought you saw and believed performance-wise.

      But I can honestly say that I didn’t need them. What more did I need to see these last two games other than you can’t stop the run, can’t stop the pass, can’t pressure the QB, can’t get off the field on 3rd down, can’t get a fair shake on time of possession. It looked like the Titan and Viking offense could do anything they wanted to us the last 6-7 quarters or so. I had zero faith we could stop them. Our D looked like it did at the start of last season.

      I’ve said all along that this team is going to go as far as our offense can carry us this year. But we had to be at least an average defense to truly compete at a high level.

  8. Lawrie

    To me, this started just before Paul Allen passed away.
    Probably as the cancer came back and the prognosis became bleak.
    Pete solidified his power in the organization.
    When you read Flower’s saying after this game, that the defence was confused and not on same page
    Then the collapse of the offence especially after watching how easily they moved the ball when using short to intermediate passes, think about last week when they got the ball back with 48 seconds left in the half and how they were able to get down field and score.
    Is it interference from Pete or is it RW wanting to be the hero with the deep ball, like in the OT loss
    I have watched the team since 1979 and the only other time I have seen it this bad was Jim M time witch lead Pete taking over.
    Although this time is way more frustrating offensively because there isn’t an obvious reason for a team to be so different in each half, unless they are just that bad witch I don’t believe

    • jeff

      The narrative about Wilson and his refusal to use the short game is poppycock. In the second half and overtime of the last two games, Wilson has passed 30 times. Only 6 of them were deep balls. Wilson has actually fully embraced the short passing game, but that doesn’t mean he is never going to go deep again.

      The consistent blaming of the offense and nitpicking of Wilson whenever the defense plays abysmally is a time honored tradition that a certain section of Seattle fans indulge in as a form of denial that something is truly wrong on the defensive side of the ball.

  9. GerryG

    SF is a toss up, but this D is so bad and Shanahan can out scheme Norton in his sleep.

    LA Rams is guaranteed whipping.

    2-3 could be possible, but 1-4 is a distinct reality.

  10. cha

    PC show with Mike Salk on 710

    [q]What happened? “Team quietly doing well noone realized how well they were doing. We didn’t change that. Day of 3rd downs, we couldn’t do it. Second half, they got only 3 FG but the drives kept offense off the field. Didn’t work out right. They had a big day. Really frustrating for our guys. Gotta get through this and get going. Fortunately, it doesn’t matter how you start. Gotta finish this and get going.”

    [q] Third downs? “Both ways. So often case of how game goes. Yesterday 9 of 14 way too much. They functioned, we didn’t.”

    [q] Philosophy on 3rd down? “Trying to be aggressive, put attack on them. Didnt’ feel like that yesterday. Want to make them function under duress. Wasn’t enough of those. Primarily comes down to making it hard on QB.”

    [q] How ??? “First pressuring QB. Make it hard for him to function. Can do it a number of ways. Obvious you think blitz. He did a great job. Also have to go to mixing coverage and rush. Didn’t cause enough problems. If he can keep going, Cousins off incredible start. Sucks we weren’t able to do something about it.”

    [q] Role of LB in pass coverage? “Good Q rarely talked about. Goes along with calls, zone or man. Most teams primarily zone and mix man. LBs drop into zone and get ball to dump off. Have to be in right spots. Minimize the check down. If you do ok, you’re fine. If they’re making 7 or 8 yards a snap, have to adjust. Game we played last couple weeks. CBs 3 deep zone and 2 deep zone. 3 deep, outside area, 2 deep flat play more aggressively. Have to function. All gets amplified when rush passer well. Zones get larger when QB holds ball.”

    [q] Players mention scheme Q after the game? “First off referring to frustration. Criticism of zone, they’re going to try to understand. Trying to stay on top of guys, not allow big plays – did most part – but frustrating when they get plays under zone. WE really miss Andre Curtis. He’s the guy. Wasn’t able to travel. He’s the guy who settles everything down and keeps it on track. He wasn’t there and it was obvious. We weren’t the right voice to settle them down. We’ll take care of that.”

    [q] Play of CBs? Jones? “Get guys adapted, gauge how ready for game action they are. Avoid big mistakes. Nice job practicing nice FB player. Chances this week.”

    [q] Outside help for D? Atkins or Sherm? “John never quiet. Convo’s all around the league. Takes two to tango. Always looking.”

    [q] DK flat yesterday about TD? “Decision last week at halftime, ‘I’m done with whatever.’ Poised, composed, just focus on great FB. Excellent game, that’s what you saw. Not distracted.”

    [q] You like DK? “I really do. Extraordinary person. More than an athlete, great person. Show you.”

    [q] Let’s talk more about DK. Any more gushing you’d like to do? “gush gush gush”

    [q] Russ play? “Really solid. Nice job. Great stadium. Really choreographed, loud from get go. Impressed first 3-4 drives Russ function. Unfortunately didn’t see it continue. I thought he did a really good job.”

    [q] Sustaining offensive success? How teams able to minimize? “5 plays one drive, 5 plays another. Amplifies execution has to be there. Ball goes back to other team and they’re holding it. Each play so crucial. Pulling your hair out. Just how it happens when you’re frustrated. They didn’t do anything different. Gotta get off the field. Doubly hard.”

    [q] What kind of team is this? “Really deeply understand in some regards. But in game day, being comfortable and showing it and making it obvious, so much room to do that. So much progress to make. There’s all kinds of opps. Can’t help but get better. Too much character, heart, leadership. End sequence knocking the heck out of them get to it.”

    [q] What identity of this team? “Tough D, do thing on special teams. Attack wherever we want to go to make it happen. Got to play better on 3rd down on both sides. Get back to offense, see us rolling. Lot of firepower to unveil. Playmaking on defense. Make it show.”

    [q] 4th and 7 from 43 down 10, punt, identity? “Don’t make that gave up the game. Confidence we can handle our situations and get back to it. 4th and 7 not easy. Percentages not in your favor. Don’t make it handing the ball to them, game over.”

    [q] Playmakers on D help them? “We’re working at it. Make sure when opps there, come through make plays. Also, cut them loose and make plays. Continue to work and free them up to make plays. Cody in QB’s mug, Jordyn comes through. But has to work with coverage. Tweak to max out opps.”

    [q] Jamal Adams game changing plays? “Yeah. We’ve had 3 games not gotten the fb. Comes from pass disruption. Not happened for us. Have to continue to focus at it. Those plays that happen in the midst of pass rush. Darrell Taylor great play yesterday. Had opps, free a number of times. Opp gotta be right in the QB’s mug on a keeper and chased the tailback. Get better.”

    [q] Where come from? “Walkthrough mode is teaching mode. Practice speed up the tempo. Another level at gametime. Manufacture lifelike as can in practice session.”

    [q] When to stay the course and when to alter? “Input from people around you, but eventually gets to gut. I like a lot of info, flooded with stuff. With enough info, I’ll make the right choice. Understand you’ll get to a point you have to call it. Input crucial.”

    [q] Philosophy adapted from college to NFL and new NFL changing challenge? “Constant challenge. Constantly adapting. Not, left behind. That goes to input and interaction and observations and assessments and then going. Job all about. So many different areas you can factor in on. Head coaches flooded with choices and options in so many areas.”

    [q] Injuries – Hyder? “I don’t know yet.”
    [q] Injuries – Dee Eskridge? “Counting on him coming back.”
    [q] Injuries – Carson? “Yeah ok, cramping.”
    [q] Injuries – Lockett? “Didn’t hear I think he’s ok.”
    [q] Injuries – Brooks? “Cramped up calves.”
    [q] Injuries – Penny? “questionable can’t call.”
    [q] Injuries – Jones? “Got sick early, stomach blew up at halftime.”

    [q] Niners? Extra urgency? “Championship feel. I don’t know about extra urgency, but we’ll get after it.”

    • Big Mike

      “Not how you start, it’s how you finish”.
      Very tired Pete.

      • Rob Staton

        I’m listening to this now.

        And I nearly turned it off after that.

        Same old tired answers

        • Denver Hawker

          It’s plausible though for an early season loss- that’s the issue. If they win by 10 next week, then it’s “see!”, And it all resets for another couple weeks of losses. It’ll be the same script at 2-4. Media gives him so much leash, wanting to believe this stuff so badly instead of facing the truth of what we all witnessed.

        • GerryG


          awful interview

        • Daniel

          How you finish is irrelevant if you are matheatically eliminated from the playoffs due to a crappy start!

          • BobbyK

            I’m not sure how he can be 70-years old and not understand that. They got down 35-0 to Carolina in the playoffs that year and he still spews the same crap about how it’s not about how you start. BS! Sometimes it is. Tell that to the 1986 Seahawks. They finished the hottest and best team in the NFL but didn’t make the playoffs because they had been eliminated. And if it is about how you finish – what about these embarrassing playoffs losses every year now in recent memory where the Hawks don’t even put up a fight before getting embarassed/eliminated.

    • Pran

      With regards to Tre Flower, Pete is out of his head. Your house is burning and you have a trained fireman (Jones) in your backyard but you are happy to see the house burndown by Tre rather than take Jones help. Pete still thinks he has LOB era players out on the field. I have to question his mental ability to process the situation.

    • Denver Hawker

      Gush gush gush- haha.

      Pete absolutely owns the media. Glad to see a few are starting to turn on him though.

    • RugbyLock

      “What identity of this team? “Tough D, do thing on special teams”

      I almost spit up my coffee when I read this… Nothing at all tough about this D…

  11. GoHawksDani

    I don’t think changes are expected. I think changes are inevitable.
    Unless some major changes happen in-season (maybe the rise of 1-2 CB or trading for at least one, a new DC gets hired, Waldron figures out our PC let him dictate more of the offense, and Russ gets his sh.t together), this team will miss the playoffs.

    I’m guessing currently:
    @ 49ers: L
    vs Rams: L
    @ Steelers: W
    vs Saints: L
    vs Jaguars: W
    @ Packers: L
    vs Cardinals: L/W
    @ Redskins: W
    vs 49ers: L
    @ Texans: W
    @ Rams: L
    vs Bears: W
    vs Lions: W
    @ Cardinals: L/W

    But this is an optimistic-realistic guess. This could go either + or – 2 games for the win column and they can easily drop both Cards games (currently I think they’ll split with them depending the season. If last game counts for them and not for us, we’ll lose that. If counts for us, not for them, we’ll likely win. If it’s important both for us, I think they’ll win, if for neither of us, we’ll see, but likely we’d win).

    That means 8-9 for the season. With the NFCW that won’t mean either NFCW champion nor WC.
    If they get their sh.t together we might win a couple more (vs Packers and one of the 9ers games maybe, and maaaybe both Cards games), so best case scenario 11-6. That might mean a WC spot, but that’s the ceiling currently. But I’m guessing missing the PO.

    If 1-and-done rocked the boat that much last offseason, after a full offseason and season, missing the PO MUST rock more. I think RW will demand a trade. Maybe through the media, maybe standing out and saying now, but it will get worse than last offseason.

    What could happen?
    A, Russ gets traded after his request and PCJS go into a full 3-4 year rebuild mode
    B, Pete retires (before or after the RW trade request). Probably most of the FO gets changed
    C, Nothing much happens, maybe a new DC and similar stuff like last offseason just louder. This would likely crumble the team next season mid-way at least

    I’m not sure we’re at the point where C is an option. Like one more awfulness like this and Seattle probably rise up and starts to riot

    As for A or B, I think it would be somewhat similar. If PC retires, new FO will be in town and they’d need somewhat of a rebuild because this roster is just not good enough. Probably can be less shaky and with some luck, SEA could be a contender after 1-2 years. But changes to the roster is a must.

    As for A…it would likely suck and would be a big pain. Especially seeing PCJS piss off the draft picks we get for Russ.
    If it’s A and Russ goes, it would be better to get rid of the FO also.
    But…if Russ must leave the org in the upcoming couple of years, this might be the ideal time (if the Hawks willing to suck for 2-3 seasons at least).
    As the QB class is so weak, QB needy teams might willing to pony up more for an SB winning, elite QB at good age and solid background.

    If an SS (and R4) can cost 2xR1, 1xR3 and a starting player, a top5 QB should at least cost like 3xR1, 2xR2, 2xR3 and two really good players (maybe an OT/OC and a CB?).

    I’m not PRO-trade RW, but I’d rather watch Rome burn, suck for a couple of years, but have some minor hope than watch this slow-dance to death for one more season

    • Scot04

      Even if we trade Russ, I can’t see us getting the compensation your talking about. You can’t compare Adams compensation with what we should get for Russ.
      Simple fact is we overpaid for Adams by alot. Plus other teams also can see limitations on Russ’s game.
      I agree with Rob, Russ needs atleast one season here with an offensive minded head coach.
      Trading Russ is by far the worst scenario i can see. Unfortunately i have 0 faith in PC & Co. So I have 0 idea what to expect anymore.
      They really need to fire Norton and sit a few players to make a statement. Doing so can’t make us look any worse.

  12. Rick

    They just missed their best opportunity to reset the team.
    Wilson has one less year on his contract now so the compensation for him wont be as high this summer.
    They should have kept Schottenheimer gotten rid of Norton in the summer.
    They should have traded Wilson. Had Chicago acquire Darnold and add Darnold to the Bears package that Schneider thought was good enough.
    They should have traded Adams even for a first round pick.
    They should have traded Wagner.
    Time to open up up lots of cap space and start a rebuild.
    Three strong teams in your division and you are on the decline. Thats the sign to rebuild so you are on the upswing when they are starting their declines.
    Wasted opportunity. A franchise altering wasted opportunity.

    • Chris

      They should’ve traded Adams for a hamburger and fries. I’m not even kidding.

      And if they couldn’t get anyone to cough up the hamburger and fries, they should’ve let him walk. Used the money in a much more efficient way.

  13. Tony

    Best scenario in my opinion for pete.

    Pete steps aside after season and into role of football operations. He runs the whole show and hires a new coach. Jody still trusts him and atleast the guy in charge of the team is into winning. Culture from top down remains good, and new regime takes over. Pete is still hawk savior and can still be around football and in charge of decisions. Only hope that he doesn’t puppet master his way thru everything and gets overly involved.

    • Cysco

      Please no.

      He’s the core reason why this team is in such a terrible situation right now. Not only is the team terrible, but thanks to the disaster of a trade we don’t even have a first round pick next year to benefit from the terrible play.

      There is every chance this team finishes as a bottom-10 team. That top-10 draft pick will go to the Jets. If this were any well run team in the league and the person in charge sacrificed that much for a player that barely makes an impact, their head would roll.

      Don’t kid yourself. Pete is the currently the head coach and the lead decision maker on personnel. He has failed miserably at both.

      • Tony

        Best scenario FOR Pete. Prob not Best scenario for hawks.

        Now if he backed off completely and let a new regime run the personnel decisions, then I can get behind it. But if he goes full Jerry Jones, then it’ll be the same disaster most likely.

        • Cysco

          Oh for sure!

          Honestly, Pete is in a dream scenario for someone in his situation. He’s got total control and an ownership group that is detached from the team and has given him all decision making. I’m afraid we’re in for some serious dark days as Hawks fans until new ownership takes over. Pretty depressing if I’m being honest.

    • Big Mike

      Only if and I do mean only if he has ZERO say in personnel decisions including and especially the draft.

  14. GoHawks5151

    Lost in some of the Offensive issues is that Waldron is a first time play caller. He does some great things and really does deserve to be able to figure out his issues in the second half. Sadly everything around him really muddies up the situation. For what it’s worth I think he will progress nicely if given the chance.

    The D needs to be cobbled together in the best way it can for this year. Next year they need to go to a 3-4 and maximize Jamal, even if it comes at the expense if Bobby… Big change ahead

  15. Henry Taylor

    The Seahawks are starring at a 1-5 start.

    It’s actually shocking to think about. The problems have been clear to see for a while yes, but with Pete and Russ, this team has always found a way to avoid that kind of collapse. I suppose there’s only so long you can avoid paying for the kind of mistakes theyve made, but I guess I’ve just been conditioned to just believe itll work itself out. Maybe this is our version of McCarthy’s last season in Green Bay, where the wheels finally, perhaps mercifully, come off.

    Even now, I still think its possible they right the ship and win the next 2. But if they don’t, the rest of the season will just be a team going through the motions. With nothing to play for, except trying to avoid giving the Jets the kind of draft pick the Texans have given to the Browns and Dolphins in recent years.

  16. Scot04

    CJ Henderson & a 5th for a 3rd and backup TE. I’m sure we could have done that.
    Former Seahawks’ VP of football operations Scott Fitterer seems to be doing a pretty nice job in Carolina.
    I wonder what his thoughts were on the Adams trade.

    • GoHawks5151

      Deals like this always make you think though. Maybe it’s not performance. Could be health issues. Could be off field issues. I don’t think Seattle can afford another miss and loss of picks

      • Scot04

        Your point of they can’t afford to. Just emphasizes how bad that Adams trade really was. So sad…. i have no idea what they were thinking

  17. Kyle R

    It seems to me the lack of adaptation to players strengths that they bring in is astoundly bad. (I.E. Graham, Harbin, Adams). Drafting of players and use of draft capital with trades both back in draft and for players is piss poor, and finally I find the lack of players development missing for a good 4-5 years. Is this due to poor second level coaches and the attrition of our past good ones? Yes guys like Baldwin, Sherman, and Kam had talent, but they were also developed and taught in the system and that doesn’t feel like it’s being done anymore.

  18. GerryG

    Just a quick reminder of the good bad and ugly. It’s a really bad sign when highlights include Ifedi, Flowers, Griffin, because hey they started for basically 4 years!

    One home run – Chris Carson
    One Grand Slam – DK

    Look at how many S are on the list, and yet we traded the house for Jamal

    OL Germain Ifedi, Texas A&M. Round 1, Pick 31. …
    RB C.J. Prosise, Notre Dame. Round 3, Pick 90. …
    OL Rees Odhiambo, Boise State. Round 3, Pick 97. …
    RB Alex Collins, Arkansas. Round 5, Pick 171. …
    WR Kenny Lawler, Cal. Round 7, Pick 243. …
    RB Zac Brooks, Clemson.

    DT Malik McDowell
    C Ethan Pocic
    CB Shaq Griffin
    S Lano Hill
    DT Naz Jones
    WR Amara Darboh
    S Tedric Tompson
    S Mike Tyson
    T Justin Senior
    WR David Moore
    RB Chris Carson


    RB Rashaad Penny
    DE Rasheem Green
    TE Will Dissly
    LB Shaquem Griffin
    CB Tre Flowers
    P Michael Dickson
    OT Jamarco Jones
    DE Jacob Martin
    QB Alex McGough


    DE L.J. Collier
    S Marquise Blair
    WR DK Metcalf
    LB Cody Barton
    WR Gary Jennings
    OG Phil Haynes
    S Ugo Amadi
    LB Ben Burr-Kirven
    RB Travis Homer
    DT Demarcus Christmas
    WR John Ursua

    2020 draft looks pretty decent actually and I think we all remember it well enough. Brooks I think would be fine if he wasnt playing on dumpster fire D with awful coaching.

  19. Rob Staton

    I’ve listened to the 710 ESPN interview.

    Come on.

    That was one of the most milquetoast interviews I’ve ever heard.

    Poor — questions and answers.

  20. cha

    PFF Defense

    • Rob Staton

      Jamal Adams — 63.6

      Right in his Seattle range again

      What a diabolical trade this has been

      • Rob Staton

        Also, Jordyn Brooks isn’t particularly good is he?

        At least what he’s showing this year is utter rubbish

        • McZ

          Jordyn Brooks is the typical case of a player drafted two rounds early. Never puts in the effort, always a bit sloppy.

          Every hit we landed in the last four years were players drafted exactly at or slightly below their rating.

          That said, I desperately want the 2020 version of Lewis back.

      • Big Mike

        Adams 63.6
        also some other numbers over 3 games……..
        0 splash plays
        0 QB hurries
        0 QB hits
        0 QB sacks

        • Rob Staton

          Two firsts
          A third
          $17.5m a year

          • Big Boi

            Well, he IS the only safety in the league that is in the top 20 for total tackles, so we have that. Of course, part of that is because he’s played 2 more snaps in the box than as a safety. Allowed 6 receptions on 7 targets. Sheesh. I’m surprised he scored as well as he did.

            But what a steal for John Reid! I mean, only a 7th round pick and he’s the highest rated CB on the team.

        • GerryG

          But the energy!

          • RugbyLock

            And the Style and swagger! Yeah, baby!

    • cha

      PFF Offense

      • GoHawksDani

        Not sure what Russ says about that OL grade lol. Bottom players are all OL guys. Apart from Duane there’s no OL above 55 and the right side is below 50

    • Mick

      Taylor and Alton should get majority of snaps. And Al Woods is better than Nkemdiche. I also liked his video, he seems like a very chill guy.

    • J.P.

      With Taylor and Robinson coming on, would it not be wise to just go back to rushing 4 and just dropping everybody into coverage? The LOB is gone, but the current shit they’re doing is not working and these players seemed confused.

      It reminds me of Earl. He was elite in Seattle, then he went to the Ravens where they asked him to do a lot of things and I think it was genuinely too much for him.

    • GoHawksDani

      It’s a sh.tstorm, no nicer word to describe it. BUT, if we wanna be optimistic…Darrell Taylor and Alton Robinson might develop into something. Especially Robinson. He had some nice plays last year too and seems at least decent in both run and pass defense. With correct coaching he could be a solid starter or at least a good rotational piece.

      BUT, wth is up with Ford? He’s not doing too well this year.
      And what a horrible set of CBs…laughable. On the bright side, I just learned we have a John Reid on our roster…and he’s our best CB with 62…which is not a very good grade if Flowers have 59. And for Reed and Amadi, it’s especially bad that they graded below Flowers

  21. Rob Staton

    Six weeks ago

  22. Leo

    In the halcyon days when the Seahawks got into a rut like this, you knew that Marshawn would be getting 25 carries the next week. Heck, when they had bad first halves, they usually saved the game by riding the Beast for a few series. Then Russ would come through with some scrambles/deep balls in the fourth to seal the deal.

    But if we try that now with that Carson, you know there’s a 75% chance he leaves injured. And would Russ even execute that game plan anymore? This team has no idea what it is anymore. And that’s why a Russ-blessed head coach is the logical next step. At least we know when the team struggles, the HC and QB will be on the same page on how to get back on track. I will always be partial to the Pete/Beast Mode/LoB style rather than the Reid/Mahomes airshow, but at least the team would have some semblance of identity again.

    • J.P.

      I think Pete if he wanted to go for another five years, should’ve unloaded everybody and rebooted with Sam Darnold when he had the chance. I don’t think Pete ever planned on coaching much longer.

      I think a new voice is needed at the top, even if it’s saying the same damn stuff. Sometimes life is like that and you’re dealing with human beings here. It’s starting to feel too much like the LOB vs RW3 stuff. Feels a bit toxic. I think whoever comes in needs to put the foot down. I don’t want to turn into this thing where Wilson is still ruling over the team like whatever the hell is going on in GB. It’s only okay when Tom Brady does it because he’s proven himself to be a great leader of men and tone setter.

      All that really remains is whether you want to rebuild with Wilson or not. I see both sides to it.

      One one hand, there’s no guarantee we’ll find another top 10 QB, they don’t grow on trees. Even Jerry had to pay Dak even though he acted as if though he really didn’t want to do it.

      On the other hand, I think there’s the possibility WIlson’s limitations are just too much for him to overcome and have great playoff success deep in the playoffs, especially with his declining athleticism that has taken away his ground game that defense were terrified of back then in short yardage. I could easily see him succeeding in the regular season playing the way he does, he’ll be a HOFer, great stats, lots of wins, but he’ll keep getting bounced in the playoffs early as if PC was still here.

    • GoHawksDani

      Only issue that Russ is nowhere near Mahomes. Mahomes is elite and Russ can throw nice deep balls and accurate passes. He cannot read defenses, he cannot run anymore, he cannot throw to the middle and refuse to throw short-medium passes. Mahomes is in the air what is Jackson is on the ground. The side passes, no look passes, etc makes it interesting to watch. Russ throws a nice deep ball and over the shoulder balls. RW wouldn’t work in a system like that. Or it would really hard to scheme for him, unless he learns to throw to the middle

  23. Pran

    flat out sucks that we traded house for Adams. this season may get us a top 10 pick but we don’t have that.
    can we trade Pete and JS to Jets for our pick back?

  24. Robert Green

    I said it before the season began. The Seahawks will be hard pressed to win more than 8 games this season and I was blown out of the water. IMHO the Hawks need to rebuild and that takes draft capital that they don’t have. So while Russell passes over the top of the hill there will be poor performances for a long time into the future. I’m down on the team that I’ve followed for a long time and it’s sickening…

  25. DancingBuddha

    I feel like I owe you(or the blog) an apology. I’ve disagreed with several points you’ve made regarding the defense and the coaching of it over the last year, and while I’ve tried to push back respectfully when i have, becauseI usually tend to give benefit of the doubt to professional coaches. which is to say my theory has been that the issues were technically schematic rather than qualitative and could be fixed at that level but if its come to players openly saying things that give the lie to that belief, or at least implying that at some level there’s a buy-in problem in executing it, we clearly have a man-management issue here, whether one chooses to believe it to be in choosing a field general(DC) who both trains and motivates, or your own in using formations that are not good enough. I cannot in good conscience not admit that basically what seems perfectly clear is you were right and I was wrong and good on you for being both able to see it and willing to say it at a time when it was a bit up an upstream paddle. So hand up in acknowledgement of all that.

  26. DancingBuddha

    If anyone is like myself desperately seeking a ray of hope or at least a silver lining because hope seems far off at the moment, Darrell Taylor and Alton Robinson both getting great defensive grades hopefully bodes well if we can ever get another 6 or 7 guys who are also playing well at the same time on this defense

  27. cha

    Okay. I guess.

    Ian Rapoport
    The #Chiefs are signing Josh Gordon to their practice squad, with the goal of elevating him at some point when he gets up to speed.

    • Rob Staton

      Sounds like the Seahawks wanted him back, too

      • GerryG

        Russ was all “nah dude, you cant come here, this D will drive you to drink”

  28. Big Mike

    For those of you calling for the Seahawks to bring Sherman in I have a question for you, if you’re Sherman would you want to come into this mess?

    • GerryG


    • GoHawks5151

      Yes. Proximity to his wife and kids as they try and figure stuff out. Also $$$$

      • pdway

        Of course Sherm would sign here. He alluded to wanting to do it numerous times over the off-season.

        This loss sucked, this team has issues, but we are not exactly a hapless laughingstock.

        I loathed yesterday’s game as much as anyone, but doesn’t mean we’ve become the worst franchise around.

        • Rob Staton

          That’s a bit hyperbolic though isn’t it?

          I haven’t seen anyone suggest ‘worst franchise around’

          But the issues surrounding this team warrant acknowledgement and serious discussion, which is what we’re doing

          • pdway

            was responding to the theme in this thread that no one is willing to come here anymore – – because it’s a “mess” and a ‘boneyard’ – – – I thought those characterizations were hyperbolic.

            I continue to think that in terms of general league reputation, we’re viewed as one of the better franchises. As ugly as sunday was, we’ve still been something of a cornerstone NFL franchise the past 10 years.

            • Roy Batty

              Yet, who are the notable big name players wanting to play in Seattle? Not one has walked into the VMAC of his own volition. Anyone of any note was traded for, and those notes aren’t exactly being played properly, anyway.

              This mantra that players love the culture are hallow words when no one has made any effort to specifically come play for the Hawks. This isn’t a big market team with multiple titles. The fans are passionate, but that isn’t enticing enough to a veteran looking for a ring, staring at a Seattle team that routinely craps the bed in the first round of the playoffs.

              The only culture any really good player sees at this point is stagnation. A live DJ at practice and a pretty lakeshore setting at the practice facility is not going to entice anyone with realistic value.

            • GerryG

              Not saying this team is dumpster fire that nobody wants to play for. Buuuut, if I’m Sherm I may not have much gas left in the tank, this could be his last shot at another SB. I’m not coming to play for a team with a bad defense, a puppet D-Coordinator, and a head coach who seems to have let the game pass him by a little.

              I’m biding my time a little, training, and signing with a front runner. Seattle was not SB contender to start the year, and thus far they don’t even look like a playoff team.

    • McZ

      This franchise is a career boneyard. Atkins knew it, so does Sherm.

      • 12th chuck

        so did Gordon

        • CD

          So did Marshawn, Bennett, Clowney. No one believes in the rah rah stuff, haven’t since 2012. The SB guys played for themselves, not Pete. They were hungry, angry, out to prove a point. There isn’t enough talent, hunger, nor bad asses on D for them to go anywhere. Its actually pretty easy to see why, and I think fairly easy to fix (over 3-4 years).

  29. TJ

    Great analysis Rob. As painful as articles like these are to read, you are 100% spot on. I mentioned this in a previous thread, but it feels like the Seahawks are descending into another dark period. I hope I am wrong, but things just feel broken.

    I’m also concerned that PC is going to leave this team in shambles and without the ability to quickly rebuild once he does leave thanks to ill-advised trades of important assets due to such a win-now, short-term focus.

  30. SeattleLifer

    Pete brought up a key point in the presser, maybe one we haven’t been leaning into quite enough. 3rd downs. How bad has this Hawks team been through these ‘reset’ years on third downs? I don’t have the numbers but memory tells me pretty darn bad(unless we were playing one of many games against trash teams/backup qb’s).

    What does poor 3rd down play on offense and defense primarily point towards? Poor blocking on the o-line and poor pressure from the d-line. (and maybe a little dose of Trey Flowers sprinkled in for good measure, a player I have never ever liked from day one onward). But hey we spend a lot on areas like LB, S and (backup cough cough)TE.

    • Rob Staton

      What does poor 3rd down play on offense and defense primarily point towards? Poor blocking on the o-line and poor pressure from the d-line.


    • neil

      So far this year the Hawks are 26th in 3rd down conversions on offense. On defense, I read an article that stated the Hawks remain in pre snap alignment 92 % of the time while the Rams and Chargers rotate out of their pre snap look over 60% of the time. Just further validation their is no creativity. The Hawks have been using that stupid ” prevent defense” for years now. That is why the middle of the field is almost always wide open.

      • Roy Batty

        The defensive zone schemes are my personal favorite. Watching Wagner back into his zone, plant his feet in concrete, and helplessly stare at a pass to a lone, wide open receiver not 10 feet away is priceless.

        • SeattleLifer

          The linebacker crew certainly has played their part in gifting so many easy completions/third downs to offenses(not to mention needing to do more against the run). Wagner is a HOF middle lb and one of the best Seahawks to ever put a uniform on but he is a middle lb and add his age on to being a middle LB and he’s naturally going to struggle a bit in pass pro, then a guy coming off a major injury who is supposed to be a DE playing as a rookie moved out of position to linebacker – and he’s supposed to be able to cover in the nfl?? Lastly Brooks who to beat a dead horse couldn’t crack the starting lineup for a good while last year as a first round pick(along with being demoted for a spell) because of his poor awareness/pass coverage – who this year is still struggling in that area and strangely was even benched by Pete(albeit for a penalty but it makes you wonder if part of it wasted Pete being frustrated with his play as a whole).

          This LB group is not covering the underneath in front of the CB’s worth a darn, it’s far too easy for opposing offensive coordinators and their QB’s to carve us up and puts even more pressure on our already piss poor CB crew(along with a meh pass rush, and a safety in Adam’s who basically throws everybody around him/the defensive scheme off all too regularly). So yeah the linebackers are playing their negative part on a defense that lacks talent all over, has poor coaching and is flat out broken at the moment.

  31. LouieLouie

    I called for the replacement of Ken Norton a while back on this site and was severely chastised for it. I actually changed my mind the last half of the 20 season, but his replacement seems like a no-brainer now. The problem with this Seahawks team is the defense. They have the talent to be halfway decent, but are aimless in the 2nd half. Norton seems incapable of making adjustments and is unable to respond to the other team’s adjustments.

    The offense has a new coordinator. The starters had no playing time in the preseason so the new offense will take at least until week 8 for the playbook to be fully implemented. I expect the offense to be pretty good by the end of the year (too late to make the playoffs?).

    • Rob Staton

      I called for the replacement of Ken Norton a while back on this site and was severely chastised for it.

      No you weren’t.

      In 2019 you made this comment:

      “I’m not so sure that he (and the defensive coaching staff including Carroll) shouldn’t shoulder some (or even the lion’s share) of the blame.”

      And we had a debate on Norton Jr’s contribution and Carroll’s contribution to the defensive effort.

      Nobody was ‘chastised’.

      • dan

        Rob your article and everyone’s comments are missing out a key point that was brought up by Pete in the 710 interview this morning. In their next game vs 49ers seahawks are going to “get after it.”

        15-2 here we come!

        • Rob Staton

          *Rushes to delete article*

          *Books day off work for post-Super Bowl hangover*

          • GerryG

            *Picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue*

            • Big Mike

              “It’s not how you start, it’s how you finish”. He said that too. Party time upcoming!!

              • pdway

                someone somewhere on here referred to Carroll’s conferences as ‘lipstick on a pig’, and now I can’t stop thinking back to that perfectly executed phrase when I hear his rote press conference replies.

  32. AlaskaHawk

    In some ways I don’t think this season start is much different from last season’s start. The defense stunk it up the first half of last year, same as this year. The key difference is last years offense scored a lot more often than now, but then they faded in the last half of the season.

    So I guess it’s a repeat of that poor defensive effort mixed in with a skunky offense.

    Speaking of defense, how many people think that one of the reasons the Seahawks went to the superbowl in 2013 and 2014 was due to defensive coordinator Dan Quinn?? He also helped Atlanta get to the Superbowl in 2016.

    • Rob Staton

      The Falcons got to the SB in 2016 because Kyle Shanahan turned Matt Ryan into the NFL MVP

      Seattle had a legendary defense in 2013 and 2014 so it’s difficult to gauge Quinn’s impact

    • BobbyK

      No to Quinn having a huge influence. Legendary talent has more to do with it.

    • GoHawksDani

      But how does some mid-later round picks and a bunch of smaller trades become so effective? Pure luck? Or someone on the coaching staff? I mean apart form ET there weren’t many early 1st rounders on that defense if I recall correctly. There were some late picks too and cheaper trades?
      How is it possible that we drafted a TON of players high in the first 2 or 3 rounds and some expensive trade(s) are this bad? Pure luck or KNJ? Or positional coaches?

  33. Poli

    Are there any theories why the offense is getting shut out in the 2nd half again this season?

    It used to be the opposite at one point when they used to do little in the first half then Russ worked his magic late in games to pull off the win.

    What gives?

    • pdway

      to me that’s the big conundrum so far.

      seems like we go from everything working to nothing working – and it’s hard to explain.

      only logical one I can think of is that the other team is making adjustments that are working – and we are not responding in kind.

    • pdway

      verification of the trend – -

      Hawks are #1 in the league in 1st half points; and last in the league in 2nd half scoring….

  34. cha

    I rag on Gregg Bell as much as anyone, but kudos for bulldogging Pete on what in the world is going on with the cornerbacks.

    • Rob Staton

      The only probing questions of the day, so kudos to Gregg

      • Mick

        I liked Nico Moreno’s q whether the D’s bad performance was matter of concept or execution.

  35. Big Mike

    Question for Robbie:
    So you were showing off that jet black head of hair on the pod but no one to my knowledge asked about it. I am asking:
    what the hell was that Robbie?

    • Robbie

      Haha what? No I had my hat off just out of pure frustration. That’s my natural hair color, dark hair red beard. Dark Irish!

      • Big Mike

        Ok, I could have sworn it was jet black at the beginning. My bad. Carry on then.

        • Roy Batty

          It was funny because it looked to me as if you had tossed your hat in frustration at some point in the game and forgot you hadn’t put it back on until well into the podcast.

  36. Frank

    Unless real change happens throughout the season to change the direction it does seem like it’s the end of an era. Blame Wilson, or Carroll, or Norton, or Flowers but ultimately there is no part functioning at such high level that it seems like the next team reset should be shaped around them.
    The Seahawks if I’m not mistaken are still the number one dvoa team in the league, mostly because it’s a flawed stat, and Wilson has never actually been better than just a top 10-15 guy. He doesn’t have any MVP votes, because he isn’t actually that good if you look beyond the carefully crafted stats. Wilson doesn’t pass the eye test if you watch more than highlights, Carroll and Norton are just plain bad at x and o at this point of the league’s development, and Snyder albeit possibly handcuffed bye Carroll still hasn’t shown enough to feel he’s a lock to engineer the next gen Hawks. Major, and I mean MAJOR problem is that it isn’t an attractive job, Wilson is a bit of a pain, and a talented player but ultimately I don’t think guys really want to coach Wilson. Fire Norton, well hell yes super necessary but who wants to take credit for this defense or think it has the parts to shape into a contender mid season without an offseason of installation or any input on roster? Well, fine we just fire Carroll and see who we can get to coach the team, and oh yeah the fans expect 10 wins and a trip to the playoffs, you don’t have a first round pick, the QB can’t move the chains other than bombs for touchdowns in the first half, the running back is made of glass, and you have a average SS making nearly 20m a year, and absolutely no talent at CB.
    Wilson and Carroll are both washed, a full reset is best. Time to start amassing the resources to lure a great coach here, a couple first round picks, some extra cap space. I won’t feel any more hopeful if Carroll moves on without Wilson and Addams being converted to draft capital and cap space. Play the next year out, and firesale this roster. Have a bad year, enter the 2023 draft with four first round picks, a boatload of cap space and you’ll be able to get a great coach and have given them the tools to succeed. The time for half measures are over, take the hit, set the team up but this isn’t a one year fix where you just get Wilson a new coach and things are great, think aggressive of what you could do if you think of this as a two year transition out of the PC era.

  37. Mac

    I just keep coming away wondering, what is it that Pete brings to this team?
    For players we generally judge them against replacement level but we can’t do that with coaches, ultimately, it’s hard to be certain that the defense would be worse without PC and KNJ.
    For a defensive guru, the defense sure is a mess and needs elite talent to bail out the lack of scheme.
    I would love it if we hire Joe Brady but I think some lucky team will get to him first.

  38. BK Matty

    how bout Marvin Lewis as DC?


    an absolute credit to you Rob for shaking the trees…I do feel that the reporter’s journalists are sooo passive here in Seattle it compounds the problem. Petes Mantra of always compete is dying on the vine as he seems to abandon his core belief. Norton is simply not working the talent on this defense is not amazing but certainly not as bad as they are playing. This sounds crazy but I want them to sign Sherman …

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