Ty Sambrailo looks like he could feature in a Robin Hood film, but is he on Seattle’s radar?
We’ll ramp up the draft stuff after Sunday — from tomorrow it’s Super Bowl talk. I’ve set up an interview with former Giants defensive end Osi Umenyiora. The audio should be on here at some point in the morning.
In the meantime, I wanted to bring this scenario to the table. That’s what this process is about, debating all eventualities.
Will the Seahawks go after another offensive lineman early? They have previous. Russell Okung at #6 in 2010. James Carpenter at #25 in 2011. John Moffitt was a third round pick in the same draft. Then Justin Britt in the second round last year.
Very few clubs have pumped this level of investment into the O-line. That’s often forgotten. It isn’t a cure-all solution — especially considering Seattle’s scheme and their desire to be the #1 scrambling team. The Seahawks also went big to sign Robert Gallery in 2011, re-signed Max Unger and paid Zach Miller — a great blocker — a top tight end salary.
Here’s the situation though. Miller might be a cap casualty. Carpenter is a free agent with no guarantee to return. Alvin Bailey has shown in flashes, but is he an every week starter? Is he perhaps better off as a versatile backup, capable of filling three or four different spots in a crisis?
If (and it’s a big ‘if’) they’re able to bring in a veteran receiver or tight end during free agency — while also retaining Marshawn Lynch — a case could be made for finding a replacement O-line starter in the first two rounds. Whether that means drafting a guard or drafting a tackle and then moving Britt inside.
With James Carpenter slated to hit the open market in two months and Russell Okung up for free agency in 2016, there’s been a long held belief the Seattle Seahawks will make offensive line a priority in April’s draft. Its been passed around the internet the team likes Colorado State’s Tyler Sambrailo, something I’ve known since October and was confirmed earlier this week. I’ve also been alerted Terry Poole of San Diego State is another tackle the team likes. Poole started slowly at Shrine practice in St Petersburg but by Thursday he was one of the better blockers on the field.
Pauline touted interest in Odell Beckham Jr and Aaron Donald a year ago — well before their stock exploded into the top-15. With hindsight it’s easy to see why Seattle would’ve been smitten with that pair — and it perhaps gives some chops to Pauline’s sources.
For me I’d like to see Sambrailo kick inside to guard. At the Senior Bowl he struggled a bit working the edge, even if he has the length and size to man the tackle spot. He has the tendency to be beaten inside and doesn’t always the make the most of his 80-inch wingspan to ward off rushers. Speed is a problem for him. But surprise surprise — he’s a really effective run blocker. He’d be a nice fit in the zone blocking scheme — he’s quick off the snap and gets a nice initial surge. He doesn’t always play with an edge.
You can emphasize some of the good points and minimize the negatives — limitations versus speed, not a great kick-slide — by moving him inside. In that sense he looks like a fit. The Seahawks seem to like these guys who can play tackle or have some experience as an edge blocker. I’ve seen him projected in the top-50 but I think that’s a stretch. He could, however, be a decent value pick at the end of round two.
Poole I don’t know much about other than he has tackle size at 6-5 and 305lbs. He might be considered more of a late round option — but people probably said the same about Britt a year ago.
There are some other intriguing options that could be available at the end of the first round. Personally I think La’el Collins belongs in the top-20 — and yet ESPN currently ranks him at #25 overall and he’s at #32 overall on Daniel Jeremiah’s big board. There’s your ideal guard-who-can-play-tackle. He’s not unlike the Pouncey brothers. That’s another reason why I can’t see him falling.
T.J. Clemmings’ stock is unclear after an indifferent Senior Bowl. Is he too raw to go in the top-25? Or is the potential too much for certain teams to pass? At what point does Jake Fisher become an interesting option? Or Daryl Williams at Oklahoma? Is there a chance the slightly overrated Brandon Scherff lasts deep into the first round? What about Andrus Peat and Ereck Flowers? Two players I’d expect to go in the top-15 but I’ve seen ranked all over the place.
The options on the offensive line might simply be more appealing at #31 or #32 compared to some of the other current needs (receiver, tight end, D-line). We know the team trusts Tom Cable to find ‘his guys’ and there’s a chance he’ll unearth another J.R. Sweezy rather than go down the whole first round route. But it’s a debate worth having. So we’ll have it today.
Maybe it’ll shift with the SB game, but I feel we do need OL. If we have 11 picks with the added compensatory picks total, then I’d love to see them take multiple OL!!! Like 3-4
Imagine 11 looking somewhat like:
1-2 WR – 1 fast and a PR/KR, 1 skilled and possibly bigger
1-2 TE – 1 Complete blocking/catching TE, 1 Large Catching TE/WR Tweener
1 RB – Maybe even a 1st round pick!
3 OL – Tackle and guard candidates – versatility useful
2-3 DL – Fill in the rotation…
1-2- DB – Again, find talent and fill in the rotation and depth!
1 LB – fill it out…
This many picks hopefully lands us another 2 WR and TE’s, and a RB…
I truly feel if we can stack the talent with rookies in the WR/TE/RB skill positions, that Russell Wilson with Baldwin/Willson/Kearse and Lynch for maybe another year, will be fierce! With so many picks, and a possible trade down, we can hopefully hit with Quality at least once at each position!
Then out of 3 OL—?!
That would create a chance for another Super Bowl run in 2015!
Paul, keep in mind that yes the team has 11 picks this year, but they aren’t likely to have 11 open roster spots for rookies in 2015. A good amount of the team is signed through next season and the the team will look to re-sign many of their free agents. I would guess that at most there will be 7-8 spots for rookies next season. (1WR, 2OL, 2DL, 2DB, maybe 1LB)
Unfortunately there are only so many spots allowed on the roster and Seattle’s is pretty stacked as it is, especially if Lynch/Carpenter/Miller come back.
We’ve been saying that for a long time though. And honestly, I’m not convinced that’s how Seattle ever really views their roster.
We could look simply at OL. That’s a corps that runs 9 to 10 deep. Right now, we expect to have only 5 guys that we could consider ‘safe’: Okung, Unger, Sweezy, Britt, Bailey. Carp isn’t under contract and may not stay. Everyone else is a potential to be upgraded. We have a lot of street UFAs on the roster after that. Gilliam is still a project. The rest of the OL depth is role playing vets.
The WR corps is essentially 4 deep (with us carrying 6 currently). There is certainly room to add talent here — both to compete for starting positions, as well as ST depth with Lockette and Walters. Potentially 3 open positions here.
DL. We keep around 9 on our roster. The depth at this position is very suspect. Bennett and Avril are playing far too many snaps than ideal. That’s due to lack of functional depth behind them. The depth we do have, is manned by fairly expensive veteran free agents (McDaniel/Williams). This is a unit that could use one cheaper run stuffer and another interior pass rusher. I can see 3 roster spots that could use an infusion of competition. Williams and Schofield may not remain after this year. So that number could balloon even more. And while Hill looks like he is going to be something, we probably need to assume he’s going to be either the next Bennett and succeed his position on the roster, or is 2 years away from being the next Maxwell. A player too expensive to keep.
DB. Seattle is going to get at least one. We get one every year. Lane is at the 2nd contract age. Shead and Johnson already are veteran depth. Seattle could use some talent at safety. Make no mistake, our defense changes drastically if Thomas or Chancellor are out with injury. Getting the next Thomas/Chancellor is important for nothing else than keeping the defense sound if beset by injury. At least 3 spots open for competition.
TE. Easily could use a third member. That’s assuming Miller stays. The last two years, we’ve needed TE help mid season.
RB. We’ve not brought in a talent we can be comfortable with once Lynch declines, retires or leaves after 2015. This is a core function. Seattle has this year or next to get our next bellcow carrier.
Ultimately, I can see 9 roster spots here just in these areas. That’s a lot more than we might otherwise assume. The reality is, in a development model we are drafting a couple years ahead of need. We may not need that many day 1 starters. But we do need a lot of year 2/3 starters. And that process starts this year.
WOW! It’s like your inside my head with this post Attyla. Very well put and there’s not a position you mentioned I would argue against.
They do need a couple O-lineman, a couple WRs, a TE, a couple D-lineman, either a HB early (if Lynch leaves) or one later (if Lynch stays), we always take a DB every year too.
As for the safety position, I’d expect Seattle to address that as a priority UDFA. As I mentioned below, lets’ wait and see what we have in Eric Pinkins.
The last one or two draft picks could go a couple of ways really. Maybe another LB, or a K, or even a FB if Tukuafu and Coleman don’t return, although I expect one or both to come back.
Fantastic post.
So we don’t have a chance for another Super Bowl run if we don’t add to the offensive line? This group, along with Russell Wilson, have one of the 10 highest rushing DVOA’s in history this season.
If the Hawks merely added 3 guys on the OL from rounds 3-7, I’d be happy. High rounds does not equate to guaranteed success.
Depends on whether we resign Carp and if Unger can stay healthy.
You don’t mean Seattle’s chance to be a juggernaut or dare I say the ‘D’ word for the next 5-10 years hinges on Big Carp and Unger do you?
I’m hoping you’re replying to another comment. You are right?
I was responding to this: “So we don’t have a chance for another Super Bowl run if we don’t add to the offensive line?”
Yes, I think it will be difficult to maintain the level of success SEA has had the past 2 seasons if they do not add OLers, especially if Carp leaves. Unger isn’t going anywhere, but with his injuries, and the lack of quality backup doesn’t fill me with confidence. Doesn’t matter so much which round they’re drafted, but SEA needs to add competition to that group.
Do I think SEA’s overall success hinges on those 2 players? Absolutely not and I think you know that.
Your right I do know that, that’s why I was asking.
I agree with you that Seattle desperately needs some depth and or competition on the O-line. If Carp leaves and we don’t address the LG position it could be a disaster, but I don’t think they’ll neglect that particular spot. It’s why I’m an advocate for going O-line in the 2nd or 3rd.
While I think there’s more incentive to draft a skill position in the 1st or with their 1st overall pick, if they do happen to draft an O-lineman in that spot, then so be it.
I think the Seahawks will be yearly contenders for the Super Bowl or at least making it deep into the playoffs. They have their core players and their culture set the rest is plug and play.
I still like an upgrade on O-line. I get it that we are a run first team and the team looks past an olineman’s deficiency when it comes to pass blocking, but Russell is soon to be a 100+ million dollar man. You have to protect him and not expect him to consistently make is Houdini moves.
Okung is our best pass blocker unfortunately he has a history of getting hurt so I don’t see him playing past his current contract. I would love for a way for us to get two tackles for the future. Jake Fisher being one of them. Thank you Rob for mentioning him in your post. I think he’s an underrated guy who at the very least could play RT and I think could man LT for a long time.
Britt, I would love to see him move inside to LG. His biggest issue is he has a real hard time with speed rushers or guys who can attack the corner. I get it that it’s only his first year in the pros, but I think he could be a top flight LG where he could use his wrestling background to better use.
“So we don’t have a chance for another Super Bowl run if we don’t add to the offensive line? This group, along with Russell Wilson, have one of the 10 highest rushing DVOA’s in history this season. ”
I don’t think that kind of hyperbole serves the discussion.
Not everyone that thinks the OL should be upgraded feels like the sky will fall if it doesn’t. Clearly there are fans who can’t see beyond PFF grades and a wistful/rose glasses nostalgia for the next Jones/Hutchinson pairing.
I certainly don’t disregard Seattle’s success with what we’ve fielded. My concerns are mainly bound by expected risk and how attrition has legitimately hurt this club in that corps.
Seattle, without question, is a more effective team with Unger on the field. Similarly, last year was a painful lesson on what losing Okung for large stretches of time meant for this team. This team functions better with good OL players and it’s easy to see because we have stark evidence of what it looks like when they are gone.
This is a roster built on competition. It’s curious that we’ve not really added any players to push Sweezy or Carpenter. They’ve enjoyed a competition free existence to this point. It seems to me, that their performance — while not a gross liability — hasn’t benefitted from the competitive crucible that has been typical of our other position groups. Britt is a raw/developing player. Is he going to expect a 4 year moratorium on real competition too?
I’m against using an early pick on OL because I’m afraid they’ll overdraft that pick like they’ve done in the past at OL. I’d rather them use earlier picks to help Russell from the outside or upgrade the the DL. Unless they’re truly getting good value, I’ve just seen some head scratchers on early OL picks. Value value value. Get the weapons for this offense so this squad has the ability to continuously bury and pull away from opponents.
WR, DL, TE, OT, WR, RB first 6 picks in some resemblance of this order.
I agree, oline seems to be historically a head scratcher, let’s find some SPARQ studs in the later rounds and coach em up even if we have to convert d line men or convert tightend to tackles
Last year you made a good case for SEA taking Joel Bitonio in R1, despite the fact that teams typically don’t draft OGs that high.
Would you make the same case for taking La’el Collins if he’s available?
Oh yeah, for sure.
Rob, and others,
How would you rate Collins compared to Warmack and Cooper when they came out a few years ago??
Hard to say… I think we all rated Cooper and Warmack very highly. The injury really hurt Cooper. Warmack plays on a terrible team. I think Collins has similar potential working inside. I’d compare him to the Pouncey’s.
Collins is really a different kind of guard than those two.
Cooper had a devastating injury. And I can’t be sure if his lack of success is due to lingering injury effects physically or just the natural lack of confidence athletes can incur due to trauma.
Warmack, I have to admit I wasn’t as high on as others. I felt he was a powerful guard, but I didn’t see the athleticism. I also didn’t see the consistency that others did. I felt he was a first round guy almost by default.
I will admit though, I’ve not followed Warmack closely. From what I’ve seen from Titans fans regarding him, they don’t seem to regard him very highly and view that pick as only slightly better than the Locker pick. Sort of like how Seattle fans seemed to regard Carpenter during his rookie campaign.
Collins, to me, is more than Warmack was in my estimation. More athletic than Warmack, less than Cooper. More aggressive and dominant on tape than Cooper. Not sure on the measurables, but his ability to play LT in college at a high level indicates to me a better OL prospect than either Cooper or Warmack — even if Collins moves inside.
I really am smitten by Collins. Mainly because it seems that he’s answered the bell in competitive play with such consistent and dominating fashion. I think he’s a better blend of athlete with a perfect demeanor for the OL at the pro level. If it comes down to performance — I like Collins’ tape better than either of those two.
I would have rated Cooper higher coming out simply because his athleticism was so freakishly rare for a guy that size. But that would have been more a nod to potential. Collins to me is a better prospect than either right out of the box. And his athleticism is still pretty optimal for the position.
Collins is a fantastic prospect, and IMO will be the first O-lineman off the board this year.
As for Jonathan Cooper, I’m not sold on Bruce Ariana aka Kangol being able to develop talent at a high rate.
I really want the team to get an impact player in RD1 this year and I just don’t think that OL late in RD1 is going to make a major impact. I fully expect them to retain Carpenter and I would expect them to retain Okung the following year.
We’re not going to get a sure thing OL player that would be any kind of upgrade over what we have already.
Use the mid round picks to grab a couple developmental/depth players and keep the band together next year.
Agree, Early round picks should always be impact players, best player available per need.
What if the BPA is an O-lineman?
Cysco – I’m all for keeping the band together, but with big contracts looming for RW, Wagner, Maxwell, etc., it’s hard for me to imagine how we will have the $$ to retain Carpenter, and — eventually — Okung.
I’m confident that PC and JS have a plan re: who is going to be re-signed and at what cost. The fallout of this is that some of our current guys are going to have to go, just because there is only so much money to go around. So, although I’m content with the level of play from our current OL, if — through the draft — we can get 90% of their current production for, say, 40% of their cost, we may have to say goodbye to some of the band.
I’m with you that I’d rather see us use our #1 pick to get an impact player (e.g., WR or TE), but if retaining Okung (or Carpenter) is not part of the PC/JS plan, then we certainly have to use the draft to find players to compete for these spots.
We need more pass rush depth in the middle and on the outside, due to injuries sustained this year, run stoppers to due to mebane, and we r lucky that Bennett and Avril are healthy this year, but what about next year, Kevin Williams may not b here next year, d line should always b a priority year after year, keep this awesome defense going, it’s our bread and butter including the running game, need a kick returner too!
I agree. Either D-line or the big reciever… might need RB depending on Lynch’s status. RB only if one of the top 2 falls to 32.
In fairness they’ve consistently found D-line guys without spending high picks. Avril & Bennett in FA, Clemons via trade, McDaniel in FA, Williams in FA, Hill in R3, Clinton McDonald off the waiver wire.
Agreed. Although the result has been, a collection of players that really dominate the cap spend for the team.
Additionally, the functional depth on this team is actually pretty thin. We are playing Avril and Bennett significantly more than we have in the past, and more than the team has indicated they wanted to.
Mebane’s loss hasn’t crippled the team. Which is a byproduct of having Williams slide over to the 1.
If anything, I think this would be a HUGE opportunity to upgrade the roster. Mebane and Williams command 7m+ in cap space. Obviously moving Williams over to the 1 indicates that we don’t have any depth behind Mebane at all. Williams was never brought here to play that position and had to learn on the fly.
This is a role that still needs to be filled. But with the devaluation of run stuffing DTs in general, it would make sense to maximize realized value with a late day 2/early day 3 pick, by getting a rookie to relieve the cap spend of the 2 deep at that position.
The fact that we’ve buffetted the DT rotation with expensive veteran UFAs would suggest to me a prime scenario to get cap healthy with a decent big DT. And picking one in R3/R4 could easily result in a player who gets significant snap count in his first year.
I agree that DT Landon Cohen, DT Demarcus Dobbs, DL David King, and even FB Will Tukuafu is not good depth at all and is easily one of the most glaring areas in need of an upgrade.
But, I’m with Rob in the sense that there’s some good depth, value picks, or even potential steals late in this draft class at the interior D-line position.
We do have DE Cassius Marsh coming back, who I think will back up ‘Black Santa.’ DT Jordan Hill coming back will back up DT Tony McD and even DT Mebane in a pinch. Who backs up DE-LEO Avril? We have to get another speed rushers, but if all we need is a big bodied guy to back-up or eventually replace Mebane in a year or two, why not take one later and let him develop?
I can also see Seattle taking a hybrid DE/DT later on as well, and if he pans out great, stash him on IR or red shirt him, put him on the PS, but if he doesn’t succeed you don’t waste any draft capital. Then that gives us the 9 bodies on the defensive line and the rotation we’ve been sorely lacking this year.
Carpenter is being paid $2.4M. He was paid like a first round tackle but has performed like a third round guard. He is listed as the 6th best OG in free agency. Somebody will probably give him $3M. I think that is way too much. We can replace him in the second to fourth round with a rookie that will not cost $3M total for four years. In the age of Russell Wilson’s contract every dollar will count.
Our backup centers also are vulnerable to being replaced. Lemuel Jeanpierre was passed on the depth chart by second year center Patrick Lewis. Both were pushed back. Our running game suffered when Max Unger was not in the lineup. Lewis may have potential but I think Jeanpierre has played his last Seahawk game. A center that can make all of the line calls and man handle the NT’s in this league is a hard commodity to find.
Bailey and Gilliam both have position versatility and can play OT or TE. They are keepers. OT Garrett Scott should also make a return next year to training camp. A couple of interior blockers will make the roster next year. Tre Jackson would make a nice replacement for Carpenter and Grasu or BJ Finney might make a good backup center.
Is this true about Garrett Scott? i thought he was done for good?
I’d love to see what Scott can do. I was a huge fan of that pick when we made it on draft day. Still hope he can recover and show his stuff.
OLine is a concern, should invest in somewhat early pick but day1? No thanks. I think we should keep focusing on either BPA and/or someone that can tilt the field, so to speak. Give me: Mario Edwards, Devin Smith, Jordan Phillps, Gerod Holliman.
Gerod Holliman would be a serious wild card. Before you guys kill me on this, I think having someone to backup either Thomas & Chancellor in case of injury, isn’t so bad. Plus, I think he could be fill in spot for CB should any of those guys goes down. Just has a knack for the ball, Seahawks ball.
Holliman’s tackling form really worries me. Think he gets overrated due to the picks.
I noticed that he doesn’t sell out on tackles, seems a little timid on contact. But you have to give him credit on his ball hawk skills, I can see him thriving in our Cover3.
Lets wait and see what Pinkins can give us. He has Kam Chancellor size and ET speed.
I agree, just on the hoof he looks like a football player. Hopefully he took the Tharold Simon route and shadowed Earl and Kam and picked up their habits of watching and cutting up tape.
I saw that Schneider talked about Chris Matthews and that they kept trying to get him back on the practice squad before bringing up to the 53. I am obsessed over a tall WR with some speed who is a playmaker. But maybe the Seahawks think they already have that guy on the roster.
I would love to see Funchess in the first or a guy like Deontay Greenberry in the 4th or so.
I gotta think that Schneider was blowing a little smoke with Chris Matthews because of the one play he made this year. Given how bad of shape the WR corp is in, he’s still seen basically zero playing time. That’s telling. If he had any chance of becoming a quality contributor, I would think he would have had his opportunity.
The hawks need a receiver to come in and make an impact on opening day next season. I’m not sure I’d bank on Chris Matthews being that guy.
It’s clear they like Matthews’ special teams value, but I doubt they see any long term role as a dynamic receiver. He’s 26 this year. It’d be a bit of a stretch to expect he’ll suddenly take the next step in 2015.
The shoulder injury that Earl Thomas had in the Packers game reminded me that we should also be thinking about a backup FS in the draft. Jeron Johnson and Deshawn Shead are both heading into free agency in 2015.
What about a mid-round prospect like Durrell Eskridge from Syracuse? I wouldn’t say he’s a heat-seeking missile like ET, but then again, ET is a rare talent. I do think Eskridge is rangy enough to play FS and has good size and speed.
As a Seahawk fan who lives in Syracuse, I would love them picking up Eskridge. He was a bright spot in an otherwise dismal season for the Orange. I think he would be a good backup as he has a lot of the same skill set as ET, just not at the same level.
Corey, since I’m assuming your a Syracuse fan or at least know the type of football players they have, would you say S Durrell Eskridge is comparable to Arizona Cardinal S Deone Bucannon?
If he is, that could be very interesting. After all, Seattle did show quite a bit of interest in Bucannon last year.
I know some people have mentioned possibly adding U-dub LB/S/HB Shaq Thompson as a defensive weapon or the ultimate chess piece, but maybe S Eskridge could be that and then some? Would appear to be a much more natural fit. If natural would describe that type of position. Or ‘unnatural?’
Possibly creating or carving out a new niche/role would appeal to a defensive master mind like PC.
Even if Bailey replaces Carp – we still need a swing tackle to replace Bailey. Or a guard capable of switching with Bailey with Bailey going to LT. With Okungs injury history, having a quality backup is vital.
I don’t think anyone who believes we need a better oline sees it as a cure all. but I believe it can help with the run game, red zone, scrambling and the pass game. help, just like a big receiver would help. or more inside pass rush would help. nothing in this game is a cure all. but you find your weak spots and fix them. go hawks
I take the point Mr P, but I don’t think the O-line has been an issue in the red zone or with the scrambling. Part of the issue is the way the line has been besieged because teams can gamble against out WR/TE’s and cover 1v1. Nearly all our losses in the last two years have been down to the same formula.
you make good points rob, and I do agree with the need for a big receiver. I just think a better line and more time for rw(especially if we lose lynch) is essential. no matter how much we don’t want it to the offense will change when lynch is gone, no not dramatically but it will, with rw taking on more. even if it meant 1 or 2 more seconds for rw, that can change a game. . as for the draft im all for bpa between ol dl te wr or rb(god forbid). I don’t want to reach again for subpar talent(carpenter) just to fill a need but if theres a stud olineman available id bet we take him.
as for most of the loss’s, id say the defense had a big part in those too. cant wait for sunday! go hawks
the only rb id take first is gurley if hes healthy that Wisconsin kid is too small.
Just like RW is too small to be a franchise qb? There is more to being a football player than pure size and that “Wisconsin kid” has all the intangibles to become a star in the league. Also, he’s 6’1″ 207 lbs (not exactly small) and only 21 years old.
take it easy my friend, didn’t say nothing about rw. and yes there is more to football then size. but IMO his frame is too small. u guys get riled up over some weird things
” …. that Wisconsin kid is too small.” Haven’t we heard this before?
LOL. So true.
I’m not sure how 6’0, 210 lbs., and a physique looking like it was sculpted from a Greek god is ‘too small.’
ROFL
its his frame very narrow. rw is stout. just some observations. didn’t say he couldn’t be productive. just don’t want him for the hawks take it easy all
In fact, 6’1″ 215 (if he is 215) is right around the edge of what most scouts like for BMI. Little lanky for a RB.
Rob, we have debated this topic a lot. Glad you did a piece on it. I would not be upset with an impact WR, but really think Oline needs youth and talent.
Not talking any position but OL, at 32 or maybe 40 if we trade back, who do you see that could fill either G or T position (assuming Collins is gone).
Erving/Sambrailo/Cummings/Flowers
I don’t think Clemmings or Flowers will be there but out of those four that’s who I’d prefer. I like Erving but there would be other people ahead of him at different positions.
I really like this kid. Colorado St OL Ty Sambrailo almost fits a Seahawks lineman to a ‘T.’ I know some think he’s just a JAG, but he’s an incredible athlete, and honestly how many of those are to be found when drafting O-lineman?
Could he be that raw, but incredible athlete with upside we seem to take every year? Wouldn’t shock me one bit to see him turn in an impressive combine.
Also seems to have a really good football IQ. That’s one thing Tom Cable almost always brings up when discussing current or future Seahawks.
He does need some of a weight and conditioning program, but again, that’s not a huge worry.
I know he can struggle with speed rushers, but who doesn’t in this league? Sambrailo would be a good fit in this locker room and in the ZBS scheme.
Might not always play with a mean streak, but it’s in there inside of him, and that’s one thing you can’t teach. The ‘competitive fire,’ so to speak.
As a 2nd round pick he’d be of great value and a really solid selection. Add him and possibly San Diego St OL Terry Poole in the mid to late rounds and you’ve essentially upgraded 3 spots on the O-line, with 2 selections. Sounds ideal to me.
My problem with sambrailo and this whole line of thought is as follows…
People want an upgrade at oline, correct? But where? I never hear what spot. So I assume its Carpenter who is actually pretty good at the run game and this year wasn’t a total liability in the passing game, but he may be gone because of contracts which does make sense….so we what, put yet another rookie picked later in the draft who’s natural position probably isn’t LG and watch their growing pains?
Or is it Britt a rookie like above who played out of position and had to learn on the go? Is that experiment over? Does he go inside to Carps spot? And then we have yet another year of hoping the Rt is not great at son things but terrible at others?
Or is it this abstract situation where we get rid of Okung who is already paid for next year and definitely deal with a rookie at that spot…
You get my drift this can go on for every spot on the line. Now if Cable/Carrol want to have a real competition at all the spots like they did for almost every other position I’m all for it may the best man win, but currently there is no positional competition. A guy gets drafted and basically they play unless injured. So to all of you Oline folks out there…where do you improve the oline? I’m not saying I don’t want an improvement I just don’t see where and how they do it.
Absolutely what I’m thinking. I always hear the same thing. We need a better OL! Ok, who are you replacing and with who? This is like those 7-9 teams who need a QB, but are not picking high enough to get the high end prospects. They need a QB, but they are also at the mercy of what/who is available.
It’s almost like many Seahawk fans think we continually pass on Walter Jones and Steve Hutchinson every year in the draft. I have yet to really see who we “actually” passed on at OL, who has become a difference maker in the NFL. Quite honestly, it should be very obvious to football fans now, that even the high end/safe OL prospects have had quite a miss rate the last few years. It’s been said, over and over again, but DLs are becoming way more athletic and defensive schemes are becoming more complex to take advantage of those athletes. Personally, I think OL is far more about continuity/system, then it is about individual talent. Give me a raw but good athlete and let’s fit him into the system and work him in over time.
It’s been mentioned before, but there seems to be a massive hard on for the DAL OL, without recognizing that they have a HOF TE and WR to stress a defense. I’d be sincerely curious to see how highly effective the DAL OL without Dez Bryant on the perimeter. My guess, is they’d be exactly like SEA. Strong in the run game, “struggle” in Pass Pro, especially with a mobile QB like Romo.
Overall, I think a good/balanced offense is able to consistently threaten as much of the field as possible. We do not do that (IMO) because we are lacking any sort of threat on the outside. I’m not saying our WRs are bad; I’m simply saying that they do not threaten a defense. I think Paul Richardson was a good step towards easing this problem but I don’t think we can count on him fully recovering or being available next year. For my money; I’d much rather see us go:
R1: TE Maxx Williams
R2: WR Phillip Dorsett
Reliable middle of the field pass catcher + an absolute deep/speed threat. Williams + Willson is a potentially great combo going forward. I just can’t count on Willson to be the consistent chain mover that I think we really need in the middle of the field. With those 2 draft picks; I think you will see defenses getting out of the box more to account for these types of talent. Just my opinion. Good work Rob.
Chicago has plenty of skill positions, but no line. When our WR need to make plays, they do. Do they drop some easy balls, yes. But so has Dez and Megatron. Kearse steps up with deep balls and Baldwin probably has the highest 3rd down catch percentage in the league. Why, because we don’t have an exciting offense or offensive coordinator. It’s not inventive. It’s almost like our defense, do what we do not matter what. I’m not saying a weapon wouldn’t be nice, but I wouldn’t stack up on offensive skill positions just because.
Replace Miller and now Richardson, yes. But it will be important to get some talent on the oline because Carpenter is gone and Okung and Unger contracts are up soon and we can’t assume they will be back. We are paying our defense, so somewhere has to be draft picks with small contracts and I believe those will be oline and skill positions.
First and second should be BPA at OL TE or WR
Ed — are we really pinning the problems in Chicago on the offensive line? I think Jay Cutler, terrible coaching and a rancid defense might be the main problem areas there…
By the way — according to Football Outsiders Dallas rank #17 in pass protection. Chicago rank #18. So if the line is really that bad, there’s a case for suggesting the talent at WR bails them out. They’re also ranking at #16 in the run game.
Cutler is a terrible decision maker. I 100% give that to you. But when you watch some of those games, he sometimes had 1.5 seconds before he had someone in his face. Should he take the sack, yes. Wilson does his spin move and runs around.
I don’t know the statistics for their rankings, so I can’t argue those numbers. And numbers can lie. I watch games. And when you watch, when Wilson has time he makes plays and so do our receivers. When he doesn’t, it’s much harder for him. Does he still make plays when he doesn’t, yes. Would it be nice to take 2 step drop and fire a slant to Dez, yes. But you give any QB more time and he and his receivers get better.
I’m not arguing the point that a Dez or someone like that would be great. But I also think our Oline is lacking health and talent and in 2 years for the sake of argument our entire line will have expired contracts (outside of Britt).
Rob, you say it yourself. That’s not and will never be our offense. We pound and make plays in the passing game when we need to. As “mediocre” Baldwin and Kearse are, they make plays when we need them to and capitalize when they get the chance. You have talked about that being what we need because Dez won’t come here because of the limited opportunities.
Would take Dez any day of the week, but I just think with our philosophy, with how are roster and contracts are set, we drastically need oline help.
BPA TE WR OL would work for me.
Sorry for the long response. Love the site and banter. Makes the offseason tolerable.
Go Hawks
Well, we did pass on Bitinio last year in favor of Britt. That appears to be a big mistake up to this point. I don’t see us drafting a TE in the first round when we still have Miller (assuming he’s healthy) left for one more year at an affordable price; I think we have more immediate needs.
I do like Dorsett, though. I know he doesn’t have the size but his speed and ability to take the top off a defense are desperately needed. My question about him is where he goes in the draft; a good combine means he will probably be gone when we draft in round 2. Do we take a guy like him in the first? Trade down a few spots and grab him early in the second? I haven’t seen any mocks with him going in the first but that could certainly change.
Not sure that’s accurate SEA passed on Bitonio in favor of Britt. Remember we picked up PRich by trading down from 32.
I guess you could say SEA passed on Bitonio for Britt and PRich.
We passed on Bitonio for Richardson. We never would have been able to get Bitonio at 64. And it wasn’t likely we’d get him at 40.
Walt and hutch…good pull! Honestly I think continuity at the line with draft picks made there for backups and starters is always key, but minus baldwins protestations the we corp is basically two average guys right now. And the Te situation is basically Willson who needs another year. Williams and Dorsett or in reverse would probably have those dudes at Walter football grading us a D but think that would be a tremendous combo.
Adding TEs Maxx Williams or Clive Walford and pairing one of them with TE Luke Willson is very appealing IMO. Of course we need help at WR, but I think both (TE & WR or 2) could be accomplished in this year’s draft.
When Unger was hurt our two backup centers got pushed around and the running game suffered. We can upgrade the middle of our line with B J Finney from K State. At 6-4, 325, he has the sand in his pants to manhandle the big NT’s. He should be available in round 4. I like Dismukes and Grasu also. They will probably cost a 2nd round pick which IMO is too much for a backup center. Finney may also play LG for us.
Tre Jackson would be my choice for a LG. He is a powerful, athletic blocker. Jackson will go in R2. We probably need to trade back from #32 for him.
In fairness, every team in the league suffers a drop in play when a Pro Bowl caliber player gets injured. I’d rather spend premium draft capital on someone who can contribute day 1 over spending the same capital on an insurance policy.
I have seen Unger pushed back at times as well. Unger is mobile and is incredibly smart. He is the leader of the offensive line. I don’t believe it is the athleticism that the Seahawks miss, it is the line calls that Unger makes. Sweezy, Carpenter and Britt were blocking the correct men. That did not always happen when he was out.
Colorado St OL Ty Sambrailo upgrades 4 spots on the O-line. LG, backup RT, backup RG and possibly a backup LT. The game is won in the trenches and at the POA aka point of attack.
Sure, Sambrailo may struggle in his kick slide, but where he really excels is at the POA. He’s a LT now, move him inside to left guard.
That was the Ron Wolf way and now JS appears to have adopted that strategy. Draft LTs and then worry where you put them, because they’re the most athletic of all the O-line positions. Almost every O-lineman Seattle has drafted has played LT at some point in their college career, with the exception of who, JR Sweeny and John Moffitt being the outliers?
Lots of love for Sambrailo in the board today. At the risk of incurring the ire of my fellow bloggers, he reminds me of the OL version of Shelton. Big, strong, flabby around the gut, flashes but then disappears.
He’s raw that’s for sure. Flabby as well, but it’s more in the upper body/chest, not his mid section. Nothing that a weight and conditioning program at the NFL level won’t fix. He isn’t 20-30 pounds over-weight, nor does he carry that much excessively.
DT Danny Shelton is no where near the type of athlete that Ty Sambrailo is IMO. I’d even venture to say that Sambrailo may be one of the more athletic offensive lineman, not only this year, but in the past few years as well.
I really like Sambrailo’s upside and potential, but he has that big almost flamboyant personality that would fit like a glove with Seattle. Let’s also not forget his versatility.
If you have not seen Lynch on Conan O’Brien last night, it is a must see immediately for all Hawk and Lynch fans.
We need to draft OL/DL help starting around round 3 or 4. The first two rounds we should focus on skill positions. I am on the side of drafting DGB and Gurley. I would move up in the second to draft one or the other, whichever would most likely be there later. But with the first two picks, grab Gurley and DGB. Take a swing on DGB and let ADB mentor him. Take a swing on Gurley and let him learn from the best RB, Lynch. Lynch would be the perfect person to lead gurley to greatness. Give lynch a year or two more with the team and have gurley sit under his wing. When I see Gurley I think of Luck and the colts. They moved on from manning with luck. Generational talent replaced generational talent. Only with us, we have it better. Generational talent, Lynch stays while grabbing another generational talent, gurley. Lynch can teach him how to be a beast even more so. If we can somehow get both of these guys on our team, we will be a contender for years to come. Our D is locked up, we are always going to be in contention with those boys back there. But if we can grab a potential top 5 WR with size and speed while also grabbing a beast RB to learn from lynch and take over when his time is done… Thats a bad mamajama team for years. I think Gurley we can get in round one with no moves up. If DGB is gone then i would look at Devin smith or nelson aghlor as a KR/PR WR combo and try to draft a taller WR in round 4 or 5 for some competition.
I am on the side that our DL is more set then most would think. This year we have been hurt bad by injuries. We have some really promising DL help waiting to come back and rock next year. I wouldnt mind a pass rusher or a hybrid DL that can rush and play the inside. But marsh looked good and hill, i mean, the dude was crushing it for us. Dont sleep on mebane either. All these things are good for us coming into next year.
I read earlier about someone worrying about a FS back up. I think eric pinkins is that guy. They touted him switching to corner, but even if he does, he has the SS/FS ability if need be. That is a huge plus for us. So even with maxwell leaving most likely and our back ups out of contract as well. Pinkins is a good cheap replacement that is developing and learning to handle all roles i believe.
I say give tom cable his guys in late rounds and let him go to work for the OL help. Drafting high OL is not the only solution. Our RUN game is beast. Part of that is Lynch, but a big part is Tom Cables teaching. We arent great at passing, but we also dont have any true number 1 WR threat to help out. So for what our team goes for, i think we have great guys. Get them a couple mid to late round prospects that are raw but have tons of athleticism and let tom coach them up.
For all my rambling im sorry, this is just how i see it. I think luck wilson is showing promise. Whether miller stays or goes doesnt really worry me to much. He is perfect for our system but i think if it comes down to cap situation, he might be gone.
I also really hope we sign Tukafou or however you spell our FBs name to a longer contract. He is a beast and super versatile. Thats the type of player we love. Get him on a three to four year deal, shouldn’t cost to much money, but is someone that I would love to see as a seahawk for years to come.
Rob thanks for putting so much thought into all your posts, I am on here everyday. It’s like an addiction. I would love to know your and SDB’s viewers thoughts on my points. Always a very insightful group of seahawk fans here.
This was a good read Kyle. Your right, Rob’s posts and the site is like an addiction huh?
Would love to see FB Will Tukuafu back as well. Great person, versatile, a true warrior. He’s so easy to root for.
TE Luke Willson for all his inconsistency is quickly becoming one of my favorite players on this team. When he does flash, they’re signs of becoming elite. If he continues to progress and stays healthy, he really could become one of the more unique/elite level TEs in the league. If TE Zach Miller does stay, it would be a smart move to pick up a 3rd TE and let him develop behind Miller. Personally I’m a huge fan of Miami TE Clive Walford. IMO he’s a more athletic version of Miller with a BeastMode type vibe to him. Him and Luke going forward would be quite the dynamic 1-2 punch at TE.
I agree about S Eric Pinkins. I mentioned above that he happens to have Bam Bam size and ET speed.
Seattle need’s some more speed on the edge defensively (DE-LEO). Grabbing a big bodied DT late in the draft seems like Seattle’s style. And again I too think they might target a hybrid D-lineman, although probably a SPARQY, high upside/raw type late on day 3.
HB Todd Gurley would be exciting, but if Lynch returns it becomes moot. There’s some great depth at the HB position this year. If Lynch does leave, targeting HB Melvin Gordon would be ideal. As for WR DGB, while he does have a rare skill set and is an exciting talent himself, his track record of off the field incidents worries me. Not a big fan myself.
Oh, and as for the O-line, Seattle should take one in the first 3 rounds and then as you said, let Tom Cable go get one of his guys in the mid to late rounds.
I’m not sure I buy the idea that Lynch can teach someone how to be ‘the next beast.’
Well he isn’t going to be the next beast mode. But he very well could be a beast. Watch the way he runs. He has the potential to be great and get the tough yards. Case and point about lynch being able to teach other rbs to be a beast. Turbin, when watching his early games he would always go down first contact and be falling backwards. Now watch him run, he is a ball of muscle always falling forward. He learned that from lynch. He even said so a while back in an interview. Gurley could be a huge get for us. Lynch could teach him to beast every opportunity he gets. It’s the way the man is man. Lynch is the real deal. There will never be another talent like him. But Gurley could be the next real deal for us. And he would definitely keep our identity intact as a smashmouth running team.
Maybe what Kyle is trying to say, and forgive me for putting words in your mouth here Kyle, is that Lynch seems to enjoy mentoring the 2 young backs we have on our roster, and may enjoy mentoring/taking a protégé under his wing. I personally believe he would.
We have extended and paid a lot of money on the defensive side – and probably rightly so – with the talk of Wagner and Maxi coming up. Russell will be paid as well.
But at some point, Marshawn isn’t going to be here – either by the contract expiring, cut, retired – and while we have led the league in explosive plays, at times the offense is stagnant.
Marshawn makes the line look better at time, but they have done really well in the running game. But Russell needs to get better at getting the ball out quickly and he’ll also need people to throw those passes too. PRich is not going to be ready by the start of the season, so we have to replace that speed somewhere.
Looking forward to the combine.
Here’s a good video of Poole vs UNC:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Terry+Poole
I posted somewhere else that he reminds me of I guy I loved in the 2014 draft, Billy Turner. He seems to play with a bit of a nasty streak but could stand to improve some fundamentals. There is a lot of pass blocking in this video and not much run blocking so I don’t have much of a feel for how he would fit in out ZBS run game. The pass blocking, though, looked mostly solid, but again there are some fundamentals that could improve. Like Turner last year, he gives good effort when punching but lunges at times and he plays upright too often requiring him to use his decent athleticism to get back in position when he gets out of it. I like his little nasty streak though, which is what I absolutely loved about Turner.
Thanks for the link.