What’s going on with Stefen Wisniewski?

Stefen Wisniewski is still without a contract

It’s over a week since it was revealed Stefen Wisniewski was visiting with the Seahawks. Six days ago Pete Carroll called him a “legitimate starter in the league” and confirmed his interest in doing a deal.

Since then… silence.

There’s no news on any further visits taken by Wisniewski. He was linked to the Bears and Buccs. The Rams reportedly showed some interest in the early stages of free agency. Yet nothing has been reported since he visited Seattle.

He’s every NFL fans last remaining free agency hope. He’s a well known player and an offensive lineman. He’s also young. If you search for his name on Twitter you’ll see endless Tweets from fans pleading with their team to make a move. Yet curiously there’s nothing happening. We’re well beyond even the second phase of free agency now. Dwayne Bowe getting a gig is actually news. That’s where we’re at.

Carroll did admit it wouldn’t be a quick fix:

“It will be some time before this gets worked out. It’s recruiting and we’re battling. He’s a really solid football player and a smart kid. We’ll see where it goes.”

It’d be easier to understand the situation if we knew he was taking other visits. For all we know he might be. The silence instead suggests a position of ‘limbo’ for a player expected to generate a lot of interest.

So what’s going on?

He could be pricing himself out of a move. Rodney Hudson is getting $8.9m APY to replace Wisniewski in Oakland. His cap hit is $13m this year. He almost certainly expects to get a lower salary — but if teams are offering the league average for a center (around $3-4m) and he wants closer to $5-7m, that could be a stumbling block.

He also might not be as accomplished as many people think. Good offensive linemen usually get snapped up especially when they’re in their mid-20’s. Not only did Oakland decide to move on from Wisniewski, they spent major money to replace him. They’ve seemingly shown no interest in re-signing him to play guard. His market might not be any better than Dan Connolly’s (another player Seattle has show interest in). Teams have stayed away from other big names too — B.J. Raji, Michael Crabtree, Brandon Spikes.

Former NFL GM Bill Polian is running a free-agency tracker for ESPN. He gave Wisniewski a ‘C’ grade as he hit the open market — the same as mediocre receiver Dane Sanzenbacher, former Seahawks return man Leon Washington and plodding ex-Dolphins running back Daniel Thomas. Polian’s view could be representative of those in the league — he’s just an average player worthy of a very average salary.

Even Carroll’s language (“solid”, “smart”) is coach code for, “yeah he’s not bad”. The Seahawks have two big holes to fill on the offensive line and Wisniewski would fill one of them while offering a veteran presence. Are the Seahawks willing to make a long term financial commitment, however? And they might want him to come in and compete with Patrick Lewis and possibly a rookie.

I suspect we’re getting closer to a conclusion on this topic. Maybe we’ll hear something in the next few days? Can we read into Seattle’s sudden interest in Connolly or their talks with other free agents like Anthony Spencer, Ahtyba Rubin (signing today, according to Ian Rapoport) and Chris Canty (re-signed with the Ravens)? They don’t have the cap space to make multiple moves. It could be Wisniewski or a couple of low salaried defensive line additions instead.

Neither Rubin or Spencer are players to get particularly excited about but the D-line does require depth. The general strength of the center class could also move the Seahawks towards drafting a rookie and letting the competition play out between said player and Patrick Lewis.

Adding Wisniewski will seem like a smart move because he’d be a perceived immediate starter with experience at a good age. Yet there are several prospects in this draft class with the potential to be superior. I’ve spent a bit of time looking at the position since Max Unger was traded to the Saints. Here’s a few brief early thoughts:

Ali Marpet (Hobart)
Prototype size for the center position and just looks made for the role. It’s hard to judge him in terms of small-school tape at left tackle but you can’t help but be impressed with his combination of size and athleticism. Tony Pauline spoke very highly of him in yesterday’s podcast (see below).

B.J. Finney (Kansas State)
He has the wrestling background Tom Cable loves. He’s a very solid blocker working in a phone booth but doesn’t have great mobility or second level awareness. He is a tough, physical player with NFL size and a terrific initial punch. Nothing flashy but he’ll be an average or slightly above average starter at the next level.

Hroniss Grasu (Oregon)
He’s a battler with the light feet to pull across the line and deliver big-play blocks in the running game. You don’t see Finney’s power at the point of attack but he’s technically sound and more athletic. He’s considered a big-time leader and made for the ZBS. He might have to add a bit of extra weight to play center at the next level but there’s room to grow. Most importantly there’s real evidence he can get to the next level.

Shaq Mason (Georgia Tech)
I’ve only watched one piece of footage but he looks like a dynamo in the run game, driving blockers with ease and winning with consistent leverage. He looks very powerful and strong. It’s hard to judge an interior lineman playing in the triple-option — so often they’re incidental to the play call. He ran a sub-5.0 at his pro-day. If he’s athletic and powerful, he’s one to monitor.

Max Garcia (Florida)
He’s a tackle convert (Seattle seems to like that) and a big character guy. He stood out during the Senior Bowl drills — battling a visibly tiring Danny Shelton and holding his own. On tape he can be hit and miss but he does show a mean streak and some power. You see good hand placement and leverage. Is he mobile enough for the ZBS? Debatable.

I’m yet to watch Boston College’s Andy Gallik and there are potential tackle/guard converts littered throughout this class. For example, athletic tackle Mitch Morse is 6-5 and 305lbs — the exact same measurements as Max Unger. He has short arms (32 and 1/4 inches) so needs to shift inside. However, he benched 35 reps and showed good short-area quickness at the combine (4.50 short shuttle). It’s something to consider.

I discussed the center position, Ali Marpet, Mitch Morse and others with Draft Insider Tony Pauline yesterday. Here’s the podcast if you missed it:


  1. Turp

    Just the article I was hoping to see from you Rob. Thanks for the notes on possible centers.

    I am surprised by the lack of movement on Wis. I thought he looked better on tape than an average center (minus the times he had bad snaps on the ball). Apparently, by the lack of movement on him, he’s not as good as I thought.

    • arias

      I don’t think anything can be read on the lack of movement as an indictment of his skills because he hasn’t taken any other visits. I think Rob is reading the wrong tea leaves in thinking that shows teams aren’t interested in him. They were. Multiple teams were reported to have scheduled having him in for a visit, not just St Louis. The Bears, Cards, and Bucs were all reported to be high on him.

      He just seems reluctant to want to do the rounds in free agency, maybe because like Rob said, he thinks he’s worth more than his slightly better than average play would attest. But his hesitancy to sign with someone is going to cost him as he’ll learn that the interest will dry up as teams spend the dollars they allocated for a center elsewhere.

  2. RealRhino2

    1. I’m at least a little excited about Rubin. Go listen to what Mike Holmgren had to say about him a couple of days ago when he was on with Ian Furness. When Furness asked if the Hawks should try to sign him, Holmgren was emphatic that they should. He raved about him as a player.

    2. I’m hearing positive things about Gallik from a few media/draftnik types.

    3. Maybe Wisniewski is the A.J. Pierzynski of football?

    • Colin

      “3. Maybe Wisniewski is the A.J. Pierzynski of football?”

      What, he’s just an A*****e?

    • arias

      To be objective, Mike Holmgren also isn’t known as the best assessor of talent and has raved about many Browns players that turned out being duds.

      • Miles

        I get that Mike Holmgren isn’t the best GM. But think about this: he brought Matt Hasselbeck, Steve Hutchinson and Shaun Alexander to Seattle, all three the key players in the 2005 Superbowl run. So he has the ability to evaluate talent. Not to mention role players like Sean Locklear, Darrell Jackson and Bobby Engram who I think he also brought in. But correct me if I’m wrong.

        Rubin definitely feels like a Clinton McDonald-like signing to me.

        • arias

          Sure, but for every good move there was the corresponding counter move. Hutch was the most talented and dominant guard to come out of college FB in years, and Holmgren needed a guard. It was a no brainer. Then for Hutch there was the blown first round pick on tackle Chris McIntosh which was half the Galloway bounty because he couldn’t come to terms with him. The other half went to picking Shaun Alexander because of being too quick to dismiss Ahman Green and trading him away because he wasn’t his guy. For signing Bobby Engram there was the drafting of Koren Robinson. Sean Locklear, great, but why’d he have to ship off Pete Kendall? And Lamar King?

          As far as I’m concerned the greatness of the OL fell in his lap since he inherited Walter Jones and Hutch was a need position and best player available with fabulous tape and a long pedigree.

          Hass, ok, he had a good year or two. Holmgren’s supposed to be the QB guru. Too bad that of the three QBs Holmgren mentored, Hass is the only one that won’t enshrined in the HoF.

          • Miles

            I think you as well as I are too spoiled by the Schneider regime. No Holmgren wasn’t a great evaluator but how many great GMs are there in the NFL? He put the main pieces in place to take the team to a Superbowl, and that’s saying a lot about any talent evaluator. Granted, he’s a much better mentor/QB mind, but has a good resume in finding guys that can take your team to the promised land.

            By the way if we are just going to judge Hasselbeck on whether he makes the hall of fame, what the hell. He is the second-best QB in franchise history. That’s not good enough, man?

            • arias

              You’re probably right about being spoiled by Schneider. I just think Holmgren was a far better coach and his tutelage speaks to that. Being able to make anything out of Hass is truly an accomplishment, and there were some trying years.

              But as a head coach he just seemed so much less prepared, even though it was his 2nd coaching gig. He knew his domain, quarterbacks and the WCO. He had to outsource the foreign domain of defense to a great DC to have success, which is fine, many offensive minded coaches will do the same. But remember when Fritz died right before the season started? I do. Remember how incompetent his replacement in house was, Jim Lindt? I remember that too. That turned out being a disaster. Now, can you imagine that happening with Carroll without him having 3 capably competent minds waiting in the wings to replace him? I can’t.

              That was a tragic turn of really bad timing, but demonstrated how steep the drop off was in his staff and how ill prepared he was. He’s a super bowl winning coach though. He just unfortunately didn’t have a SB caliber QB while he was here, and I can’t blame him for that. He did the best he could even if he fell short.

          • Coug1990

            It really seems to me you are cherry picking here. Matt Flynn, Charlie Whitehurst, Tavaris Jackson, Percy Harvin, etc. Yeah, you can cherry pick any franchise and tear them apart.

            The Seahawks were not looking at a first round guard, except Hutch dropped enough to fall into their laps. Should we discount JS/PC drafting Thomas because they needed a safety and fell into their laps when everyone had him ticketed to the Eagles?

            McIntosh was injured. That is more bad luck, not bad drafting.

            Why did the Seahawks lose Maxwell? Clemons? Tate? Again, you are cherry picking to make a point.

            • arias

              Pointing out 1st round busts is cherry picking? Sorry but Holmgren’s track record of talent evaluation speaks for itself. His 1st round busts just underscores his track record over his entire body of work as a talent evaluator. He had four 1st round picks in Cleveland and picked Joe Haden and blew the other 3 on mediocre nose tackle Phil Taylor, bust Brandon Weeden, bust Trent Richardson. I’m just pointing out that the two firsts he got for Galloway were spent on a tackle that never played a down, and a running back he didn’t need but picked because of his poor ability to evaluate talent.

        • Colin

          He’s been a GM of two franchises, and both teams forced him out. He’s just not very good at talent evaluation. Fabulous Head Coach, mediocre GM.

          • Coug1990

            Pete Carroll must not be any good because two teams forced him out as well. The two franchises that forced him out were train wrecks at the time above him. Do you really put any stock in the decisions of Tim Ruskell? Do you put any stock in the decisions of Cleveland at any level?

            • arias

              FYI: Holmgren was stripped of his GM duties before Ruskell had anything to do with the franchise.

              Dismissing his poor track record in Cleveland because the franchise has been perpetually bad is just bad excuse making. He was brought there and paid big bucks to elevate them from being perpetually bad. Not follow in their footsteps. He failed and his decisions still haunt the franchise today.

  3. J2 MED

    It is surprising that really so little activity has been brought up with Wis…dunno if that could be interpreted as a good or bad thing for the Hawks. I just wonder if he has a slightly higher expectation for how he wants to get paid compared to his value to the teams interested in him.

  4. Sam Jaffe

    I think that Wis and the Seahawks have an agreement in place but they’ve mutually agreed to wait until after June 1 so that his salary doesn’t count against the comp pick haul they’ll be getting in 2016.

    If I’m wrong and he signs elsewhere, it’s still conceivable that the Seahawks go after Chris Myers–former Texans center that is well versed in ZBS. He’s older and thus cheaper, and might be a good vet to pit against Lewis in camp.

    • Rob Staton

      I can’t imagine a player agreeing to wait nearly three months to do a deal just so a team can avoid giving up a later round comp pick.

      • Greg haugsven

        I would agree…the only thing that makes sense here is that he wants more money than people are offering…he probably sees that $8.9 that Hudson got and wants $7+ himself…looks like the Seahawks and other teams are going to just wait him out.

        • Drew

          Reports have stated that he’s looking for $3-4M a year.

  5. Ukhawk

    Watch Gallick. I like his punch, pover and tenacity. Very clearly does not move as well or to the second level as Grasu

    • Volume 12

      Yup. He’s flat-out nasty. He can play in any scheme. BC Head Coach Steve Addazio is one of the best O-line teachers the CFB game has to offer.

      Not in any particular order, but I like Gallik, Grasu, and Garcia the best out of the C prospects.

      • Old but Slow

        Agree with that Vol 12, all of them can play. I have not looked at other centers yet, but I was a bit concerned about B J Finney consistently snapping the ball at about knee level. Good velocity, but is there not some concern about always lowering the QB’s eye level? Other than that, he also blocks and moves well. I was impressed with how often Gallick would pull out and lead on sweeps, pretty good feet. He didn’t always find someone to block, but a large body for the defense to avoid. I would not be disappointed if we ended up with any of those guys.

        • Old but Slow

          Also, although he seems to be rated highly, Dismukes has small hands, under 9 inches, as I mentioned in an earlier thread, and isn’t that a concern? The center handles the ball every snap, so it would seem to me that hand size would relate to ball security.

          • Volume 12

            Not a huge fan of Dismukes personally. Finney isn’t a bad option. He’s just one of those guys that has intangibles and a high football IQ. Nothing sexy about his game at all.

            I still would have to say that the above 3 are my favorite options at C. Throw Shaq Mason in there at a close 4th, and Miss St C Dillon Day at no. 5. Are those the best C prospects in the draft? No, but guys I think would fit Seattle’s scheme either as starters or back-ups.

  6. Trevor

    Great write up Rob and with this many options available who could be above average Centers in the league maybe that is what is creating the lack of interest for Wis. Center is certainly not considered a premium position at least $ wise so maybe teams figure lets just pick up a quality rookie instead of paying a slightly above average veteran any significant dollars.

    My thoughts are take Marpet (likely gone) or Grassu in the 3rd and have a C to grow with Wilson. Then take Poole or Morse with one of the 4th round picks and then Crisp or the kid out of V-tech with one of the 5th round picks as a tackle prospect.

    Add those 3 guys to Gilliam, Lewis and Bailey and we should have good completion in camp for the 2 open spots and good depth at all postions along the line.

    I think Gilliam is going to take big leap this year. Also any new on Garret Scott?

    • Volume 12

      They cut Scott the last I heard.

    • Rob Staton

      I believe Scott was released recently Trevor.

      • Trevor

        k I knew he had the medical issue but was curious if it was something he could get treated. Thanks for the update.

  7. Volume 12

    Whooo! I’m actually pretty excited over the DT Athyba Rubin signing. Ridiculous right? But I’ve always liked him, thought he was out of place as a 3-4 nose tackle, and will be much better as a tilted nose in a 4-3. Again, Seattle takes 3-4 personnel for a 4-3 defense.

    When have our FA signings or trades on the D-line not worked out? Chris Clemons, Cliff Avril, Michael Bennett, Tony McDaniel, Kevin Williams, Raheem Brock, Alan Brach, Jason Jones. They were all effective while playing here.

    Now this lets us focus on getting another LEO or edge rushers and a 5-tech/3-tech to compete with Greg Scruggs.

    Give me Buffalo DT/DE Kristjan ‘Moose’ Sokoli. This dude is a freak! He’s a ‘war room daddy,’ with a prototypical Seahawk personality.

    • Ho Lee Chit

      Athyba Rubin should be a good backup for Mebane. He isn’t going to put any pressure on the QB but what he does do is occupy two blockers. Once again Pete and John give a guy a chance to do what he does best. At 6-3, 325 he should be a load in the middle.

      • Steele1324

        Couldn’t a NT in the draft, someone like Joey Mbu, do that?

        • Volume 12

          Mbu has length and nothing else. There aren’t very many run-stuffing DTs in this draft with 33′ inch arms. They’ll all be gone before the 4th round.

          Smart teams shouldn’t draft a pure run-stuffer before the 3rd round.

          • arias

            Rubin had his most effective year in ’13 playing the 5 tech. I’d rather see him used there and have someone more effective at nose than have him on the inside. He’s about on par with Tony McDaniel on the inside. Effective against the run, totally ineffective generating any pressure on the pass.

      • Steele1324

        I guess the pale silver lining is that we take someone the Patriots were interested in. Although we’ll never make up for them taking Sheard. (NE sure does seem active this offseason, despite cap situation.)

        • Drew

          Releasing Revis and Browner created some room for them to work with.

      • Volume 12

        Absolutely. I really like this signing. Another big bodied run-stuffer.

        Just think, when they go with their ‘stop/play the run’ package, it could go something like- Tony McD at 5-tech, Mebane at 1-tech, a guy like Sokoli for instance at 3-tech, and Bennett at the LEO spot. And then Rubin can rotate in and out, or our rookie can.

        The ‘NASCAR’ package could be- Marsh at 5-tech, Jordan Hill at 1-tech, Bennett at 3-tech, and Avril at the LEO spot, with Bruce standing up and blitzing off the edge. And then they can rotate a rookie in.

        This signing gives them great depth and lets them do some ‘cool’ things. And Greg Scruggs and Jesse Williams are also still here, although IMO they’ll only keep one of them. Highly excited about the potential packages and potential rookies on the D-line now.

    • Trevor

      Just checked out Sokoli he is definitely a guy to look at for sure. Nice heads up on him Vol12

      • Volume 12

        Thanks man. Keep an eye on him. Seattle was at his pro day. He’s a true sleeper. I love this guy.

        • Volume 12

          34′ inch arms and some ridiculous measurables.

          • Trevor

            He had some nice production too and that length they love.

            • Volume 12

              Well, now I have somebody to discuss him with. Nice.

              By the way, Shaq Riddick keeps growing on me. There’s something about him. Freak athlete? Check. Huge ceiling/potential? Check. Great length? Check. Good fit as a rotational pass rusher? Check. Quick twitch? Check. Unique? Check. Great 10 yard split? Check. Shall I go on?

              • Steele1324

                See my comments below. I think Riddick is very raw, and on film, he is not dominant.

                • Volume 12

                  Where did I say he was dominant?

    • Attyla the Hawk

      Actually wondering if Sokoli wouldn’t be able to make the switch to OT.

      From what limited I could see on him, he didn’t look like a guy who will do much at the next level. Even his highlights look like plays he’d get eaten alive with in the pros. Good pursuit. But his highlights look like they are mostly taking advantage of mistakes by blockers.

      His athleticism and measurables are extremely good for an OT convert though. He does have nimble feet, and powerful hands. Probably makes more money as an OT than DL in the league.

      • Volume 12

        Potential, potential, potential.

  8. MoondustV

    What’s he waiting for? I really have no idea now. But SEA needs to restructure Mebane’s contract before sign Wis.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      With the latest DT signing, Mebane is a goner.

      • Volume 12

        Is he?

        • CharlieTheUnicorn

          Too much cabbage for run stuffing only DT…. 4 million max, he is around 5 million. Going to take a haircut or the BIG cut…. soon

          • Volume 12

            1 $mil is too much money for everything Mebane has done and is? His durability is also highly important. I’d be shocked to see him get cut over a million dollars.

            I’m hoping they don’t sign Wis. Patrick Lewis and rookie battling it out would be much better going forwards IMO.

            Kind of wish Seattle would quit shopping in FA now, unless it’s bringing back T-Jax or something along those lines.

          • arias

            Mebane was only a “run stuffing only DT” for the half season he played in ’14. If he regains anything close to what he was prior he’s far more than just a run stuffing specialist.

            In ’13 he generated big time pressure in the passing game with 33 total QB pressures and a pressure percentage of 10.0 which ranked 3rd behind only Gerald McCoy (11.1) and Ndamukong Suh’s (10.2). Even though he played a little less than half the total passing snaps those guys did, he generated pass pressure about as often as they did when he was on the field. That’s elite.

            • peter

              Arias, nice find.

      • Ho Lee Chit

        Not likely.

      • lil'stink

        We were never really able to replace Mebane last year. We need more depth at that position, and that’s what this signing is. Unless we draft a rookie who shines right off the bat I’d imagine Mebane is back next year.

        • arias

          I agree Mebane is coming back.

          But I’d argue a bigger hole was replacing Jordan Hill last year. There was no answer and probably won’t be any solutions in free agency.

  9. Volume 12

    Rob, hey buddy. Is there any way you could try and find the arm length for these 3 CBs? I think they’d make fantastic nickel/slot corners and could all probably be had with a 6th-7th round pick or as a priority UDFA.

    UNLV CB Tajh Hasson- 6’0, 198 lbs., 4.46 & 4.49 40 yard dash, 37 1/2′ inch vertical jump, 10’9′ foot broad jump, 4.35 short shuttle, 7.25 3 cone, 21 reps on the bench press, From LA, has that long, lanky build. Tons of upside.

    Marshall CB Darryl ‘Swag’ Roberts- 5’11, 182 lbs., 4.36 &4.39 40 yard dash, 39′ inch vertical jump, 11’1′ foot broad jump, 4.08 short shuttle, 6.66 3 cone, 23 reps on the bench press. From Florida, hits like Kam, again long, lanky build, gets his hands on everything.

    Boise St CB Cleshawn Page, 5’9, 179 lbs., 4.43 & 4.46 40 yard dash, 40′ inch vertical jump, 10’7′ foot broad jump, 4.00 short shuttle, 7.00 3 cone, not sure what he put up on the bench press. Another kid from LA, highly aggressive, at his size might not have the arm length.

    • Attyla the Hawk

      I absolutely love Roberts. I can see him in the 5th/6th.

      He is very lanky — but already is excellent at press and squeezing WRs to the sideline. Very ferocious tackler. Someone who would not merely fit in with the LOB. But add to it.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      Justin Cox, CB, Mississippi State Height: 6-1 Weight: 191. 40 Time: 4.36

      This guy looks good on paper / measurables. But it is hard to find info out about him.
      40 split was 1.53 at 10 yard / 4.07 20 yard shuttle.
      “Cox looks more like a traditional cornerback than a safety, possessing a lean, athletic frame. He possesses good flexibility and acceleration to handle coverage duties, though his straight-line speed is a question. ” ~ R. Rang

    • Drew

      I’m sorry, but I don’t see how a guy that is 182 lbs hit like Bam Bam Kam who is 230 lbs

      • Volume 12

        He lays the wood that’s for sure. Is he a bone cruncher? No, but he hits like a big safety.

  10. Steele1324

    How much money do they have left—to do anything? I don’t see how they also sign someone like Spencer. I hope they pass on Wiesniewski. The more I think about it, the less I like him.

    Rubin looks underwhelming, maybe not worth his contract, either.

    • Volume 12

      Why? When has Seattle ever signed a veteran D-lineman and they’ve not been a good pick-up?

      • Steele1324

        They also resigned D’Anthony Smith, who has never gotten to show what he can do. So they are stockpiling depth for sure (there are three DTs on the practice squad too). Are they going to mess with Mebane?

        As for Rubin, I have mixed feelings. Sure, they may have used him improperly in the 3-4 and he had an injury, but simply going by film, he did not look good in 2014 at all. Very much like Cary Williams, I pessmistically optimistic, and see how it goes.

        The question for us mockers is, does this let us cross some DT off of our boards?

        • Volume 12

          It’s all about competition. They need to fill out the roster for camp bodies.

          I’d cross DT off as a draft pick, Maybe as an UDFA. Look for a hybrid defensive lineman now.

          But you never know with this team.

          • Ho Lee Chit

            I could see them drafting a guy like Marcus Hardison in the middle rounds. Of course, if a high value target drops they would jump on the chance. It does appear they are setting themselves up for a nice draft of O Lineman to replace Unger. My favorite of the day is Marpet. Grasu would be my second choice. I think they will take two in the first 5 rounds.

            • Steele1324

              I like Hardison a lot.

          • arias

            Benson Mayowa never worked out as a free agent signing. Wasted a roster spot in 2013 on him too. He wasn’t a vet and maybe the experience with Mayowa has them shifting their thinking that they’d rather have a vet that can contribute something than a raw rookie like Mayowa that can’t.

            I don’t see why they’d cross DT off as a draft pick since Rubin’s only on a one year contract and they still have big time depth issues at the 3 tech.

            • peter

              I just looked through the Seahawks roster active and futures and I still think DT is a need. The way it stands for me is the two best are the ones coming back from injury. Mebane and HIll.

              Rubin’s on a short somewhat low cost prove it deal. Jesse WIlliams? really? minimal hope on my part that he even plays.

              Dobbs, Cohen, Staten? one to three of those guys could be an upgrade waiting to happen.

              With as many picks as Seattle has and if we break down needs absolute rock bottom needs as it stands…..

              LG. Nickel Corner (sorry burley if the team had confidence in you, you probably would have been playing in the superbowl) KR/PR.

              But building from that list we start to add Center in the mix. Corner for under Williams/ beats him or Simon out/ depth.

              I know there is Pinkins and Bailey, but lets all not pretend the bottom wouldn’t fall off if Kam and Earl missed significant time.

              Then we can look at a possible MLB unless we think Coyle is going to replace Wagner since he really couldn’t last year. A possible RB, because Turbin in the contract year/ CMike is flotsam or perhaps jetsam.

              There’s always the awesome WR corps which….well I’ll skip it for now because the problems are too numerous and it’s between players and the horrible scouting department in that regards.

              Someone to spell Avril and/or rush from the opposite side.

              A back up QB but to me that spells UDFA because any draft pick this year on that position is a waste. That player knock wood never see the field and any past the top two aren’t even going ot touch Wilson.

              So that’s a lot of options more concisely: 3 ol, 2 db’s, 2 dt’s 1-2 de’s, 1-2 Wr’s leaving two picks for something else and of course UDFA’s. For me the D line particularly the interior without Mebane/Hill drops of a cliff like a Wile E. Coyote in the road runner cartoons. I get number defense and all that, but that’s with bane and hill rotating, and wagner playing. Without that combo you can check the stats for yourself in the play off games. It gets into white knuckle time pretty quickly. Seattle has to find and develop DLine talent at some point. With all the top tier picks having been spent on the oline and still we need players for that department maybe it’s time to not spend top tier resources on the dline but…some resources besides third round guys from other regimes who are actually the best player on the line, and dudes with degenerative knee problems. Are in the case of Scruggs and Hill almost worse because the exact time they put it together is right when the IR spot calls them home.

              • arias

                Excellent analysis peter, totally agree on all fronts. Big depth issues at DT still even with Rubin signing and it’s not even close. No pass rush degrades secondary play by a lot.

                And great point about the secondary depth too. Is it realistic to expect Kam, Earl, and Simon to return to full health once the season starts? I’m not so sure. Lane obviously won’t be. Of them I might be most concerned about the long term health of Kam, who struggled with injury this past season and plays a style of physical defense that doesn’t bode well for his long term prospects to stay upright on the field. The tear in practice just prior to the SB just reinforces that potential fragility. With JJ gone they’ll have to try and find someone who they can groom in case he’s not near the player he was when his contract is done in ’16. I’m wondering how many games it’s realistic to expect he’ll play the next two years given his punishing playing style. I’m hoping most of them.

                • peter

                  I love Kam. He’s literally the best ss in the game right now. But every year I wonder when his next injury comes if its the injury that side lines him for an extended period if time. I know there are guys on the team even Shead, who I am led to believe can be a safety/corner but it still concerns me.

                  I nerded out with volume12 about this when I wanted paea/sheard but I think the LOB this year could use some help from the dline with kam/sherm/earl recovering that those three have given the dline over the last few years.

              • Volume 12

                I’d agree that an interior pass rushers is needed. Whether he’s a labeled a DT or not. Not sure about big depth issues though. They only play a 8-9 man rotation while carrying maybe 10 D-lineman? Should they really be high draft picks on a 7th or 8th man in the rotation at DT?

                Perhaps another Greg Scruggs type of D-lineman?

                • peter

                  Well point counterpoint here. How many oline do they carry? Seems like the numbers are comparable. I’m all for say a sambraillo, then marpet, then crisp in the 6th. That said with picks in the 4,5, etc to me your statement above was that d tackle was off the draft board. To me if you look at the bodies new and old. Its not a real pretty list, its just a list. McDaniels and a healthy Mebane, sure they’re pretty good. Past that? Smith, Staten, etc. I’m not saying carry ten, carry the amount they always carry just make sure they are,the best at it. And to me two pure DT’s say Hardison, your guy the big Russian 2 electric bugaloo out of buffalo…skoli(?), perhaps cooper/jarret if they change the arm measurement any of those could be an improvement on Cohen, Dobbs, Staten, the void where Williams played, etc.

                  • CHawk Talker Eric

                    Still a lot of time until draft day but I’m betting Marpet goes before Sambrailo.

                  • arias

                    I agree. There’s Cassius Marsh too, I have higher hopes for him than Staten, but I think there’s gotta be some additions made that will push those guys because we’ve got to expect injuries will take some toll too and there’s too much uncertainty already with guys trying to come back from injury.

                    Bennett – Stud, setting aside rumors he wants out for now.
                    Avril – Stud
                    McDaniel – Run stuffing specialist
                    Mebane – If he returns to full health, stud.
                    Hill – At least above average if healthy. Iffy injury history.
                    Rubin – Alleged to have struggled with injury last season. If healthy, average to above average run stuffer.
                    Marsh – Showed pass rush potential before injury. Can he not get injured this time while continuing to progress?
                    Williams – ? Has to show he can even get out of camp without an injury ?
                    Dobbs – Flashed potential against the run before injury. Showed nothing against the pass.
                    Cohen – Parking Valet invited to camp, can’t really expect too much until he shows something and plays more than a few snaps.
                    Staten – ? I’ve seen nothing yet to indicate he can play in the league.

                    That’s 11 and I really don’t see much there to provide pass rush depth behind Jordan Hill except hoping Marsh stays healthy and breaks out or Williams can overcome two ACL tears and handle his elevated playing weight on the field. I also question whether guys like Cohen and Staten are more than camp bodies at this point. Staten was the first cut out of the draftees last season so would have gotten the least practice time of them, but I don’t think they saw much that could help them in that season and he was a project to begin with coming from a small school. Can’t remember if it was IR to make more room but I remember they needed the roster space. I’d like to see one of their 4th rounders and at least a 5th go towards shoring that problem up. That’s way way too much injury uncertainty in the list above for me to be comfortable without some higher round picks going to shoring it up.

                  • Volume 12

                    A pure run-stuffing DT is probably off the board, but a 3-tech/5-tech I think is still in play. Just my opinion.

                    I agree that Cohen, Dobbs, and probably Staten aren’t much of anything, and one of Jesse Williams or Greg Scruggs will more than likely be cut.

                    But 4-5 run stuffer is enough in this day and age.

                    The D-line depending on how Seattle sees them and how they play out in camp could be…

                    RDE: Michael Bennett/Cassius Marsh/rookie (Sokoli, Hardison?)
                    1-tech-DT: Brandon Mebane/Athyba Rubin/Jordan Hill
                    3-tech DT: Tony McDaniel/Jordan Hill/Michael Bennett/rookie (Sokoli, Hardison?)
                    LDE: Cliff Avril/rookie LEO/Bruce Irvin

                    And that leaves either Jesse Williams, Greg Scruggs, D’Anthony Smith, UDFA, or camp body.

                  • arias

                    I think we’re good on the run stuffing DTs. Mebane, Mcdaniel, and Rubin all have a proven history of being able to stuff the run. That’s not what I’m concerned about when I’m thinking of depths. I”m talking about the need for pass rush from the DT spot, or at least being able to contain the pocket so our edge rushers can capably clean up.

                    Remember all the issues we were having last season prior to Hill stepping up and after he went down with injury? He was the only 3-tech we had the had any ability to contain the pocket to prevent opposing QBs from climbing the pocket to escape Bennett/Avril’s collapsing the pocket from the edges, and launching a completion. Remember how Philip Rivers did that to us all day long? Same thing happened in the playoffs. Cam Newton, Aaron Rodgers, and especially Brady kept stepping up in the pocket to escape the rush. When Hill finally caught on mid season that sparked the 2nd half winning streak if the QB tried to step up on the pocket they’d be doing so directly into Hill’s waiting arms.

                    We need a guy that can bring pressure from the 3, that’s what we lack in depth because the only proven guy we have right now is Hill and he’s definitely got an injury history.

                  • EranUngar

                    Perfectly said!!!

                    To make it short – Bennett and Avril are studs. Mebane if healthy and Hill if healthy at end of last year form are fine. The rest are just bodies.

                    We keep saying “run stuffers” on big bodies that do not seem to do a lot. Playing 1 gap with Wags and Kam behind you makes every big body a decent run stuffer.

                    It’s time we did find a difference maker for the DL in the draft after 5 years of drafts be this FO.

  11. CharlieTheUnicorn

    He wants 5 million, Hawks are offering 3 million… according to J. Clayton
    Simple as that…. business

  12. Steele1324

    Rob, please do take a look at Gallik. I think he offers equal toughness and more technique than Finney.

    • Rob Staton

      Will do. He’s up next.

  13. bobbyk

    It would be pretty sweet to sign Wiz. I hope it happens (and it’s reasonable).

    Glad to have some depth at DT. Browns fans seem to have liked the guy. Plus, he just finished a 4-year deal worth over $26 million. Usually, by that time, teams will ask players to take paycuts if they aren’t stars. They must have liked him to the tune of not wanting to risk losing him like that. Like Sheard, he just doesn’t simply seem to fit exactly what they wanted (read somewhere another should have started at NT with him perhaps being one of the DE).

  14. Trevor

    Rob have you done any work on Shaq Riddick? I really like him a lot and think he has incredible potential as a pass rusher. He is really raw but with this length and athleticism I am surprised he is not getting more buzz. He never even got invite to the combine. What am I missing?

    I think he would be a steal in the mid rounds. Use him strictly as a wide wide rusher in year #1 like Irvin was used or even Aldon Smith. As he fills out and builds strength could be something special.

    I would love to hear what you think and what I am missing on this guy for him to be getting so little love.

    • Steele1324

      Riddick is aggressive, but has long thin legs, not many moves, seems to get stuck in the traffic, doesn’t seem to reach the target.


      To me, he looks surprisingly similar to Danielle Hunter, who also does a lot of fighting around without busting through. Check the footage, and you could almost confuse the two guys.


      • Trevor

        Thanks for the input . Nice to get some other perspectives.

        He is definitely light but has the frame to add good weight. He is similar physically to Hunter but has more production than Hunter who has a 2-3 round grade. Did you check out his game against Baylor 3 sacks and 4 tackles for loss when Baylor when Baylor was unbeaten and ranked in the top 5.

    • Rob Staton

      When I’ve gone through these center’s I’ll spend a bit of time on him.

      • Trevor

        Thanks Rob

    • bobbyk

      I like this kid, too. It really does seem like we’re getting a bit lucky this year in terms of OL and WRs being a definite strength in this draft… and us happening to need OL and WR.

      • bobbyk

        Meant for this to be posted below with Shaq Mason.

  15. CC

    I’d love to see Shaq Mason drafted and let him work into a starting role. Power running team at GTECH so he understands blocking.

    • Steele1324

      The issue with Mason is that he is undersized.

      • Volume 12

        Isn’t he around the same size as C Patrick Lewis?

        • j

          It is more of a length issue – word is he has short arms. We like our OL to have long arms, but maybe that is something we will overlook at center.

          On tape he kicks butt in the run game. Might be the best interior run blocker in the draft.

          • bobbyk

            Britt has short arms. They are so short, turtles routinely turn the edge easily on him to harass our QB.

            • Attyla the Hawk

              ?? He measured 33.5 last year. That’s not that short.

              Kind of like saying a WR that runs 4.5 is slow. It’s NFL adequate. Britt is NFL adequate. And for a RT, that’s perfectly fine.

        • John_s

          Yep you are correct Lewis is 6’1 as well.

          Shaq’s lack of arm length isn’t as much of an issue at center where it’s more about firing off and getting under the guy and moving him which he excels at.

  16. Ross

    How much of a factor is age in draft prospects? Take Hroniss Grasu, for example. He’ll be 24 at the start of his first season. Could that count against him on draft day if he’s ‘competing’ with a guy who’s only 21? He’s my favourite center besides Cameron Erving, he’s got all the traits I want at the position on this team: leadership, agility, intelligence and experience in the ZBS. He’s Max Unger but five years younger and without a beard. They even went to the same college. I think he could start immediately.

    • Trevor

      He would definitely be a good pick up and I think could start day 1

    • Volume 12

      Well, they did take Kevin Norwood and Bruce Irvin who were older than the normal prospect. You’d have to ask Rob, but I’m sure there’s a few more.

      And it’s not like O-lineman don’t get better with age. Unlike other positions,

  17. James

    The preponderance of the evidence suggests that the Seahawks have an agreement in place with Wisniewski, but the team needed a few days to either re-negotiate Mebane or sign his replacement (Rubin & Smith). Disregard Pete’s “lukewarm” comments about Wisniewski, re “solid, smart;” Pete is not going to do anything to draw attention to a guy he is trying to stash for a week. Try as he might, Pete is too emotional to hide his true feelings, and if you heard the interview where he discussed Wisniewski, his excitement clearly came through. Wisniewski knows that his value is dropping daily, so the idea that he is ‘holding out’ for a $5/mil contract is not likely. He has effectively taken himself out of the market at the exact moment that his value would have peaked, therefore we can logically assume he has a deal already in place with Seattle. I think this gets wrapped up within the next 48 hours. As we all should know by now, as when he basically told us he was going to draft Bruce Irvin (“looking for the fastest pass rusher in the draft at R1”), Pete actually told us what he was going to do, “it will be some time before this gets worked out.” It has now been ‘some time’, and it is now ‘worked out’, so we can welcome Wisniewski any day now.

    • Steele1324

      I’m not sure how I feel about Wiesniewski, and come down on the average assessment. For cap reasons, I am almost hoping the deal doesn’t happen. I wonder if it is even necessary.

      Is Wiesniewski better than Grasu, Marpet or Gallik? That is the question.

      • Ho Lee Chit

        Heck, is Wisniewski better than Jared Wheeler? Wheeler is a versatile O Line that played four spots on the line for Miami. Center seems to be his best position. He is strong but not especially mobile.

    • peter

      Honestly I hope not. I’m kind of tired at the lack of a real competition at any oline spot. Say what you will but Wis is just a guy. My hope is if they draft 3 line men or 2 and Wiz they actually wit out a way for the best to start.

      And unlike the massive dice toss of paying Flynn a boat load and drafting Wilson the cap now is far to tight to fritter around with jags. Honestly oakland has money finally and could have signed him easily and passed. I am not as stoked on the oline draft talk but I understand the necessity. Carp, Unger, okungs future I get it. But if Seattle can get to the superbowl with Lewis then bring in a rookie to battle him not the Wiz for what reason?

      He’s not a proven nor known upgrade or other teams would be knocking on his door.

      Seattle needs to look to getting younger and more sold on the line and save cap space where they can.

      • Steele1324

        Wiesniewski is still pretty young. So the issues are $, and if he brings something they can’t get via a draft C.

        • peter

          I understand he’s pretty young but that still speaks to both our points a young center if an upgrade should/would garner more interest on the open market. I get when old or injured players take a while for the market to cool…but what’s going on with his market?

    • Bruce M.

      “Solid” is right up there with “battling” in Petespeak. Which isn’t very high.

      But it could be there’s a game within a game going on here, so we’ll see…

      • CC

        Good assessment of Pete speak!

  18. j

    I haven’t really followed his career, but as mentioned above, BJ Raji is still a FA. I remember him being a good run stuffing DT. Any interest there?

    • Steele1324

      Depends on his price.

    • Rob Staton

      Not after signing Rubin. I think if anything they need to find another interior pass rusher.

      • drewjov11

        I have never been a fan of Raji. Fat, oft-injured, no thanks.

        • bobbyk

          Raji was resigned by the Packers earlier this off-season.

          • j

            He’s still a FA, per every source I could find.

  19. Steele1324

    I would like to pick up the discussion from a previous page started by Jon O on Michigan’s Frank Clark, somone Jon says he knows personally. If you check film at YouTube (there are many), Clark is a beast, looks like a rd.1 type pass rusher (as good as any of the top names), but also very good in space.

    Clark is a draft version of a Greg Hardy situation, a bad domestic violence incident that ended his 2014 season early. I have heard nothing much about him, so this blemish is likely going to prevent him from being drafted. On a pure football basis, easily a rd. 2 or higher with major potential.

    Should the Hawks roll the dice on him? All of the same arguments pro and con about Hardy apply to Frank Clark.

    • Rik

      I guess the difference between Clark and Hardy is that Clark is still young and can (hopefully) be positively influenced by the veterans around him. I think the Seahawks would be a good spot for him, with solid citizens to lead him back onto the straight and narrow. I like his tape a lot. No question he’d be a big help on the d line.

    • dean

      I too like Frank Clark and David Irving from Iowa state watch the Iowa game(2013) 6’7 270 would like to see more film on him. And that’s a first rd pick his playing against Brandon Scherff domestic violence incident that ended his 2014 his pro day 3/24/2015 hope the hawks do there ‘due diligence’ on them ??

    • John_s

      After reading this and what allegedly happened. I don’t want him on the team just as much I didn’t want Hardy on the team.


      • Steele1324

        Yes. Very ugly situation—and a great football prospect.

  20. ontoic


    You seem like you’re “pumping the brake” on Wisnewski. If someone had to pin you down on a choice, would you pay “market value” for Wisnewski, or would you expect a “championship discount” because he’d be coming to a team that is immediately poised to compete for an NFL championship?

    I just haven’t taken the time to watch any video at this position, but I am really intrigued by the analysis of people who have more time and are smarter than me on this topic. Can we really acquire starter-level talent in the draft or in our stable of linemen?

    • Rob Staton

      I wouldn’t want to pay much more than $3-4m for Wisniewski. I think he’s a decent, pretty average starting center. He would fill the hole for 2015, perhaps you let him test FA again next year. The thing is I think you can find that level of talent in this draft on a R3-5 salary for the next four years. The Seahawks have to make savings somewhere and you could get a starting LG at #63 (Sambrailo?) and a starting C in round three or four (one of the names mentioned in this piece). So for me you’re making a good saving there and backing your highly rated OL coach to get this group working.

      • xo 1

        We’ll have to see where Wisniewski’s market ends up, but the slow play is reminiscent of past Seahawk signings. He has undoubtedly been given a salary figure that he doesn’t want to accept yet. I share the view that Wisniewski has a value to the team in that he offers certainty and depth. But that he isn’t the sort of difference maker you stretch for – the opportunity cost is too great. So far the bottom hasn’t fallen out for most players, but it may be reaching that point where players who wait too long face an even more bleak prospect to non-guaranteed scraps. I wonder as well if football is starting to be closer to baseball free agency, where players with a forfeited draft choice attached to them have a more difficult market.

        All of which is a windup to an observation that Robert Mayes of the Grantland NFL podcast made that Wisniewski is more highly thought of by the media than he is by teams.

        The question for the Hawks may be what is the value of not having to spend a mid-round pick on a center to merit signing Wisniewski to short-term, cheap deal. The hang up may be guaranteed money as much as APY. Seattle may not want to be committed to keeping him, even if they’d be OK paying him $3 million next year if he beats out Lewis.

  21. Clayton

    Isn’t it a rare occurrence for a rookie center to start from day 1 in the NFL? As good as Unger was from the very beginning, Chris Spencer started at center and Unger started at guard. I think the Wisniewski signing is a lot more important to Seattle than we think.

    • Rob Staton

      It’s not quite as rare these days. Green Bay for example started a rookie center in 2014 (Corey Linsley) — another team did as well (memory is blank). I wouldn’t say it’s ideal by any means but not a big deal if you bring in the right guy.

      • Coug1990

        How could you also forget NE and Bryan Stork. I read somewhere that there were four starting rookie centers this season. You are correct, it is not unusual anymore.

        • Steele1324

          And Stork was also injured much of the season, which means he was relied upon to start and anchor without much preparation. So it can be done.

      • ontoic

        Travis Frederick at Dallas? Is that who you were thinking about? They spent a (much maligned) first round pick on him; and it seems to me that they came out okay.

        • Rob Staton

          There’s another team who started a mid/late rounder last year as a rookie. My mind’s gone blank.

          EDIT — of course Coug1990 — Bryan Stork in New England. Thank you.

          • Coug1990

            Also, Russell Bodine of the Bengals started every game this season as a rookie center. He was their 4th round pick.

            I am not 100% sure on this, but I believe Weston Richburg, a 2nd round pick out of Colorado State, was the starting center for the Giants.

            • arias

              Richburg was the starting left guard. About the worst there was of the rookie starting guards, or in other words, one of the worst starting guards in the league.

              Bodine was pretty terrible as well.

              • Coug1990

                Thanks. I saw articles listing him as a center and also listing him as a guard. On the Giants website a few days ago, he was listed #1 at both C and LG.

                Still, three playoff teams started a rookie center including the Champs.

          • arias

            Jonotthan Harrison was forced to start 10 games at center for the Colts as a UDFA. He was terrible.

            • Volume 12

              That’s just it. As long as you find/bring in the right guy. And this class is a lot more talented then last year’s. No worries about finding a couple interior O-lineman in this class.

              • arias

                I really hope so.

                There were six starting rookie centers this past season that played over 50% of their team’s snaps. Linsley, Stork, Luke Bowanko at Jax, Bodine at Cincy, James Stone for Atlanta, and the aforementioned Harrison.

                Only Linsley was a stud and Stork came on after half the season with Brady but was still inconsistent. The rest stunk up the joint with Harrison about the worst and Stone and Bodine not far behind. Harrison and Stone were UDFAs, Bodine a 4th, Bowanko a 6th, Stork a 4th, and Linsley a 5th.

                That’s 1 in 6 of “finding the right guy” that Thompson got right in the 5th round or expect some big time challenges from the center position.

                • Coug1990

                  I think Stork will be fine. Remember that he did better as the season went along and NE was breaking in a new OL coach too. I know we all like to believe players are studs from day one, but most take time to develop.

                  • arias

                    Yeah from game 11 on he was MUCH better, but still not entirely consistent. He’d still have bad games. But I’m sure he’ll be fine over the long haul. He also has the benefit of playing in front of Brady who helps his linemen out a lot since him and Manning consistently have the quickest release times in the league.

                    But for Wilson, whose takes the longest time to throw of any quarterback every year he’s been in the league, it’s going to be MUCH more challenging for any rookie center. If they can find a Linsley-caliber center in maybe Marpet then great. But in very possible likelihood that they don’t then we have to expect there will be growing pains as a rookie will struggle to figure out NFL defenses while getting on the same page as his QB. I just hope it doesn’t cost us any games.

          • David Ess

            san fran started there rookie Center for 2 weeks i think before he got hurt. think he was the USC center. cant remember.

            only 39 more days!

  22. Trevor

    Seahawks worked out Trail today I guess. He certainly has unique size.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      Lynden Trail, 3-4OLB, Norfolk State (TE/DE) Height: 6-7. Weight: 269. 40 Time: 4.91.

      Very unique guy. He also has the ability to play inline TE. HE has had some character problems, but as a unique chess piece to have in your defense… he is a 4-6th round graded guy right now. But if he is cleaned up, he was low 2nd rounder-high 4th

      • Steele1324

        I think Trail is a very raw athlete who is a longer way from a finished product than most. Lanky, not very strong, gets stood up, doesn’t have much technique. His best attribute is quickness, but it doesn’t translate into much at the moment, and once he collides with a blocker, he’s nullified.

        The measurables are there, and perhaps they think they can make him into Jason Pierre-Paul. I think there are others who can provide more immediate impact.

        Rd. 5 at best. Above that is overdraft, in my opinion.

        • peter

          My concern is the explosive traits, 40 yd dash, vert, splits. None of them look all that explosive to me and I wonder what the teams thought on looking around those stats is since it’s such a barometer for most of their draft picks

          • Steele1324

            In Trail’s case, I agree. The athleticism doesn’t seem to translate into something special. Clearly he is a long way off. I would hesitate to overdraft guys like him, who wind up being perennial practice squad types and special teamers.

            • Volume 12

              That’s what’s nice about acquiring comp picks though. You can use them on unique project players. And that’s what Trail is.

              Could be used on the goal line as a TE in emergency or gadget packages. He can rush with his hand in the dirt, rush standing up, and it might be doubtful, but if he adds 4-5 pounds could even slide inside on occasion.

              He’s definitely not the athlete I thought he was going into the combine, but I do see the intrigue and potential.

              • peter

                I just checked jpp’s numbers he to had some off ones…not saying trail or Riddick are jpp, but trying to keep an open mind

                • arias

                  It’s also possible Trail is being brought in as an intentional red herring that the FO has no real intention of drafting.

        • OZ

          I concur.

    • Volume 12

      Interesting. He’s a definetely unique, physique wise.

  23. Stuart


    Can someone comment on Kevin Williams-is he out of the picture permanently?

    Is Ahtyba Rubin a superior replacement for Kevin Williams?

    How does Ahtyba Rubin compare with McDaniels?

    And lastly, does the signing of Rubin mean the end of the line for Mebane?

    • Ho Lee Chit

      Williams certainly is more celebrated having been a 1st round pick and making the All Rookie team. He started his career as a DE but has moved inside as he has gotten older. He did a great job replacing Mebane at NT which is not his natural position. I think everyone wants him back. So far, there is no word on whether he wants to play.
      Ahtyba Rubin is not the athlete Williams is. He is stickly a NT and he is not going to get many sacks.
      I doubt he has the position flexibility to move to the 3-Tech where McDaniels plays. Again, he is not mobile and athletic enough.
      I doubt Rubin replaces Mebane. He is more likely competition for guys like Jesse Williams D’Anthony Smith and Jimmy Staten. His signing may mean the end of the line for Kevin Williams but not Mebane.

      • Steele1324

        I agree.

      • arias

        Williams is more celebrated as a 1st round pick and All Rookie Team? Have you been smoking too much stuff Ho?

        If Kevin Williams is “celebrated” for anything it’s because he’s a 5 time first team All Pro as the most dominant pass rushing and run stuffing 3 tech of the first decade during his time in Minnesota. The pressure he generated up the middle was insane when he was in his prime. They didn’t always result in sacks for himself, but he racked up plenty of pressures inside generating havoc. He only played end for a short time his rookie season before moving him to tackle.

        It’s crazy you would even bring up “1st round pick” and “All Rookie Team” as even significant in light of his career accomplishments.

    • Rob Staton

      Schneider suggested at the end of the season they wanted to get a guy like Kevin Williams a ring — hinting that he might not return (or might retire).

      Rubin is more depth behind Mebane IMO. He’s that type of stout run defender. McDaniel has the length they like at the three on early downs. I wouldn’t expect the Rubin signing to impact Mebane.

  24. Stuart

    Thanks Ho Lee Chit. ☺

  25. redzone086

    Rob I know cb seems like it needs DEPTH but what about ss from liberty Jacob Haden as special teams depth and backup behind chancellor?

    • Rob Staton

      Not a player I know much about redzone. Any footage out there?

      • redzone086

        YouTube has a few videos and Waltefootball has his pro day stats.

        • redzone086

          Safety Jacob Hagen, who’s well thought of by scouts, turned in some impressive testing numbers. Measuring just under 6-3, Hagen posted a 36.5-inch vertical jump, touched 10-4 in the broad, completed 22 reps on the bench, then timed 4.53 in the 40.

          • OZ

            I saw that on Draft Scout.

    • Drew

      Hopefully Eric Pinkins will make the roster this year as the #4 safety. I think Shead replaces Jeron Johnson and is main backup for both Earl and Kam, and then PInkins would be our new special teams demon.

      • redzone086

        I’m pretty sure Ahead signed with the Raiders. We have Pinkins really as a back up. Not sure you want him to start for either Cam or Earl this next year. Depth will become important.

        • redzone086

          Shead signed with the Raiders. Sorry dang autocorrect ruins everything.

          • Jon

            Nope, Shead is exclusive RFA. He has only accumulated 2 seasons and no team can negotiate with him. Malcolm Smith is with the Raiders though.

  26. David M2

    Derek Largent put up some pretty nice numbers from his pro day at San Diego (insert Ron Burgundy joke here V-12) State.

    Here are is 40 time, Bench, Vert, Broad, 40yd, & 3 cone.
    LB Derek Largent 27 36.5 10-foot-5 4.53/4.56 7.18

    Not bad for a guy who’s 6’4″ and #240

    Also, you gotta love that last name.

    • Volume 12


      • OZ

        I saw that on Draft scout Too. Interesting players to monitor in the late rounds or free agents to bring in.

  27. vrtkolman

    The Rubin signing seems similiar to the Cary Williams signing, both were not good fits at all in their respective schemes/systems. What’s interesting is the Patriots did the same exact thing by signing Sheard and Fletcher.

  28. bigDhawk

    Got no problem with any of the centers you mentioned, Rob. A couple more I’d like to mention are Miss St C Dillon Day and Notre Dame C Matt Hegarty.

    Other have mentioned Day previously as a mauler at the C position and I agree. He looks like a genuine tough guy with the added bonus of blocking for a QB that plays the game similar to how Russell plays and a tackle-breaking, agile fireplug of a RB somewhat reminiscent of Beastmode, in whom the Seahawks have shown interest. Day comes from an offense that looks a lot like ours and would seem to be a great fit.

    Hegarty is a guy I’m surprised no one has mentioned. He plays on the same OL that produced Zach Martin last year. He has a thick, powerful lower body that anchors well, with above average quickness and ability to get to the second level. And he’s a ND kid so he has to have a high football IQ, right? He seems to play the position very intelligently from what I can tell. I like Hegarty as much as any of the centers on Robs list and I think he deserves equivalent consideration.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Has Hegarty declared? Last I heard he was looking to transfer to Florida St. to play a 5th year in college.

      • bigDhawk

        He’s a senior according to draftbreakdown. If he has another year of eligibility would he have to declare even as a senior?

  29. Steele1324

    Do you notice how Lance Zierlein at NFL.com basically hates almost everyone, and strongly biases to first rounders? If I were to go by Zierlein’s analyses, I would draft nobody.

  30. AlzadoKnows

    Raiders fan here.

    Wisniewski is ABSOLUTELY pricing himself out, and is probably going to have to accept a low-end one year deal (like Terrance Knighton did) if he keeps it up. He is better suited to play guard than center but doesn’t want to play for guard money. He’s durable, yes, but he’s not worth a top-ten contract at center.

    • Rob Staton

      Thanks for sharing those thoughts. Interesting take from a Raiders fan on this subject.

  31. Steele1324

    How about an all-experimental draft board? Shaq Thompson, Tony Lippett, Lynden Trail, Nick Marshall. Athletic, not sure what to do with them.

    • Matt

      I’m really intrigued with Lippett. His versatility and willingness to play both WR and CB could prove very valuable. Edelman was used at both positions early in his career. Lippett could handle those duties. We highly value versatility and id like him as early as round 4. His upside is at CB but could be a nice WR if used there.

      • Steele1324

        I like Lippett, too. I am not sure I wouldn’t be more intrigued for the Hawks to take him over other WRs, because he might have more creative potential. He seems like someone who can be developed into a high caliber playmaker at either position. I really see a possible Michael Irvin type of game from him at WR.

        Other WRs look like more finished products with ceilings. I love Tre McBride but I also feel that what you see with him is about what you get. Lippett, however, has not turned a corner yet.

        • OZ

          I like Lippitt at corner.

      • Drew

        Too slow for me…doesn’t have a much quickness and speed. He’d be interesting at CB, but does he have the drive and work ethic like Sherman to master his technique since he isn’t an explosive athlete?

  32. Matt


    Great article on Rubin. I’m more excited about his signing after reading this. His teammates love and highly respect him. High motor hard working run stuffing DT. Great addition! Rubin put up big numbers when he was in the 4-3.

  33. Volume 12

    Rob, is it just me or does Seattle seem like their looking at the guys with red-flags again? Lynden Trail, DGB, Nick Marshall, etc. I know just because they’ve worked guys out or interviewed them doesn’t mean they’ll necessarily draft them, but it does appear like they’ll be swinging for the fences again.

    After all, these kind of players are how they’ve built this team into a potential dynasty. And the locker room and culture here in Seattle is strong enough for them to take guys like this again. I like it. I’m on board with them taking guys who play angry, with a chip on their shoulder, and playing like they have something to prove/nothing to lose.

    Will every draft pick be along these lines? I highly doubt it, but if they do select the ‘red flag’ or ‘character concern’ prospects, sprinkled in with a bit of the emphasis they seemed to place on last year’s draftees, then I for one, think the haul from this class could be amazing.

    • Volume 12

      I also just saw that USC had offered Lynden Trail a scholarship when he was in High school, which would have been in 2009, because Trail red-shirted at Florida in 2010.

      Another guy PC wanted, but never had the opportunity to get, obviously, since he took the HC job here.

      Color me intrigued.

      • peter

        Well there’s that…pc has that bug with guys he never got to work with. Hey v12 where are you getting Seahawks meeting info?

        And thoughts on cam Thomas out of western Kentucky, CB. Length is the word I keep reading. Watched a cut up on breakdown…without a tape measure it looks obvious that his atm length will be legit. Knack for the ball, not an at tackler yet, but will go blow up a runner. Gets beat over top, but for the slot…hes my new nickel prospect.

      • OZ

        I don’t like Trail. Just my opinion…

        • Steele1324

          I’m not crazy about Trail, either. Almost like a street free agent athlete.

      • Rob Staton

        That’s very interesting. Could well be a Pete Carroll project.

    • Rob Staton

      I think there’s a lot of due diligence involved here. Getting to know these guys. They might decide that through all the work they can trust some of these players. It’s up to the players to prove they’re worthy.

      • Volume 12

        Well said.

    • Coug1990

      I believe a lot of this is the Seahawks are an “It” team now. Everything they do is reported. I read an article a few days about headlined the Seahawks, NE and another team (I forget which) were at Pro Day scouting a player. In the weeds of the article, it mentioned over 20 teams were there.

      So yes, the Seahawks are looking at players with red-flags. But, they are also looking at a lot of players without redflags.

      • Drew

        They could also actually be scouting another player thats at that pro day, and working him out to disquise who they’re interested in. Never know with the games Schneider plays!

        • Coug1990

          I read an article a few weeks back from a former GM that said they changed up how they approached things like this because they didn’t want to show a pattern.

          So, I agree. We really have no idea.

  34. Volume 12

    I forgot about CB Cam Thomas. He’s pretty ‘Seahawky.’ Good reminder there Peter. I think I remember something about his arms being 32′ inches or more, although I can’t say for sure where.

    I hope this is ok, E-mail me at hawks12man@outlook.com

    • OZ

      I like him. Late rounder.

      • Steele1324

        Cam Thomas is one of many rd7-UDFA corners worth exploring.

        Imoan Claiborne

        Julian Wilson (vs. Tyler Lockett here)

        Cam Thomas

        In these clips, Wilson and Thomas seem to give too much cushion. There is some workable material in each case, though.

        • peter

          I think the cushion issue scan be taught away when you feel comfortable and/or get used to Seattle’s system. Actually I think a lot of college corners give up to much cushion and I can never figure it out if it’s out of concern with being caught on a double move or if they are trying to bait WR’s and Qb’s every play?

  35. Christian

    Rob, If Jalen Collins dropped to around #40-45, would you try to trade up from #63 for him? At a guess would have to give up a 3rd and maybe swap the Harvin 4th round for a later pick.

    • OZ

      Third is too much. #3 is going to be a valuable asset.

    • Rob Staton

      I would consider it but I think it’s highly unlikely he gets out of the top-20.

      • Christian

        Yeah agreed, I would love to keep the 3rd rounder but it is one of Rob’s top choices in a position of need so was intrigued to know.

        Doing a mock draft vs other people again this year, Collins still there up and we’re up to #33. Waynes, Peters and Johnson have gone, in that order.

        • Rob Staton

          Collins is such a terrific player.

          • Christian

            Suppose it’d be something like Collins (at around #40) or Sambrailo & McBride (or similar, taking punts at #63 & #95)

  36. Ealafa

    Off topic

    I was just reading This.

    ESPN’s Terry Blount reports the Seahawks are “very close” to a contract extension for Russell Wilson.
    “From what I’ve been told they’re very close, they’re just trying to make sure every single thing is in place,” Blount said. “It’s going to be bigger and crazier and different from what any contract has ever been.” There’s been speculation Wilson could give the Seahawks a hometown discount if his deal is fully guaranteed. The Seahawks want Wilson to take less money in exchange for financial stability. Seattle currently has $14.2 million in salary-cap space.
    Source: ESPN 710 Seattle

    We knew it was coming

  37. Steele1324

    In addition to silence from Wiesniewski, we get silence from Anthony Spencer, who visited yesterday. No visits to other teams reported so far.

    Hawks did sign Clint Gresham to a 3 yr deal.

  38. Volume 12

    Regarding K-St WR Tyler Lockett.

    I was just reading an article that pointed out the hand size for him is almost, without checking, or is identical to NFL WR Torrey Smith. I found that somewhat interesting, because Smith has about 15-20 pounds and 3 inches of height on him. I know Torrey Smith wasn’t the best FA receiver this year, but he has made a nice career for himself as one of the better no. 2’s in the league, regardless of how big his hands are.

    • SunPathPaul

      True that V12… a measurement equals just that…a measurement. It will never show what’s in ones’ Heart!

      And Tyler seems to play with lots of heart!

  39. Volume 12

    Here’s another name to monitor. Seattle attended his pro day.

    I know just because Seattle is at some of these guys pro days doesn’t mean they’ll draft them, but they will take a couple of them. Just guys to monitor and it does shed some light on what type of prospect at their respective position they’re looking at.

    New Hampshire WR RJ Harris- 6’0, 201 lbs., 4.49-4.50 40 yard dash, 2014 CFB stats: 100 rec, 1500 yds., 15 TDs, average over 100 yards a game. This kid is versatile.


    • Steele1324

      If they go for RJ Harris, wouldn’t be disappointed. Looks like a playmaker, and available in UDFA. Good scouting can land many gems like this.

      • Old but Slow

        Boom! This kid has some talent. Catches with his hands, good body control, aggressive and some yards after the catch. Probably available as a free agent simply because of his small school situation, but he seemed a man among boys at that level. Worth a shot for sure.

  40. Volume 12

    Rob, I recently saw that Penn St S Adrian Amos killed his pro day, and probably boosted his stock. I think we’re both in agreement that Seattle could/should target a S in the mid rounds. So my question to you is, where do you think Amos, Kurtis Drummond, Josh Shaw go?

    Also, what’s your opinion of Fresno St S Derron Smith?

    • Drew

      Personally I don’t see us drafting a safety until the late rounds if at all. I think 2 out of Eric Pinkins, Dion Bailey and Steven Terrell will be on the roster next year, and whoever we draft or sign as a UDFA will be a practice squad player.

      • OZ

        I think they draft a safety. Nothing special about any of those three in my opinion.

        • Trevor

          Vol 12 I think we might even go for both a Strong and Free Safety in the draft as we don’t have much quality at backup. I personally was not impressed at all with Pinkins and unless Richards has worked magic with him I think he will have a tough time cracking the roster.

          Love all three guys you mentioned and because of the lack of quality Safety talent in the draft all 3 may go earlier than expected. My initial ranking was Amos (3rd) Drummond(5th) Shaw (6th) but they may even go earlier than that.

          I also like J Tartt as a potential backup to Cam and he will likely go in the (4th)

          Look forward to hearing Robs thoughts on the Safety position now that J Johnson is gone as our primary backup.

          • Trevor

            I should mention I do have high hopes for Bailey I thought he played well before getting hurt last year and liked him a lot coming out of USC

            • Steele1324

              I think Bailey has great potential. Check his film.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      I was surprised to learn Shaw’s arms are a short 30.75″.

      Other than that, he’s the superior athlete of the 3. Leaving out his hand timed 4.44s 40 (as explained below), he also put up 26 reps on BP, 130″ BJ and 37.5″ VJ.

      ABout hand timed sprints. I just read a study that investigated the difference between electronic vs. hand time measurements in the 40yd dash. The study concluded that hand timing is consistently between 0.15-0.2 faster than electric timing (and that’s with a professional NFL coach with 12 years experience hand timing sprints). I’ll post the link to that study if I can find it.

      At any rate, I’ve greatly discounted pro day sprint times. If you factor the 0.15-0.2 bias into Amos’ pro day 40 time, it looks a lot more like his 4.54 from the Combine.

      • CHawk Talker Eric

        What I meant to say about the group of 3 safeties you listed, Shaw is a late Day 3/UFDA steal.

        • Steele1324

          Isn’t Shaw the guy who lied? A character red flag.

          • CHawk Talker Eric

            Totally. It’s why he’s available at that point.

            I live in LA and saw a lot of coverage about that whole incident. Really stupid mistake on Shaw’s part. But it’s the kind of mistake you chalk up to being young and dumb. You can fault him for having a loud argument with his girlfriend (which never was physical according to both parties, but was loud enough for neighbors to call police), and you can fault him for jumping of a 2nd story balcony and nearly breaking both legs. But the really stupid part was lying about what happened, especially trying to make himself out as some sort of hero rescuing his nephew from drowning in the pool.

            He’s like a more athletic, slightly taller Jeron Johnson, though he probably could play either safety position.

  41. Trevor

    Penn St. Pro Day and our Penn St. Pipeline.

    Some interesting prospects at Penn St. Pro day and wondering if we might be going back to the well there again this year.

    D. Barnes (DE) Ran well and 31 rep on the bench. He was productive and might be someone they consider late to develop.

    A. Amos (S) improved on his combine #s and ran 4.38. Looks like an ideal backup for Earl as he has the speed to cover a lot of ground in center field.

    D. Smith (OT) Lost weight and seemed to be moving well. He is long and has ideal tackle size at 6-6 328lbs. He seemed a little slow on tape but has dropped almost 30 lbs. He is a true tackle and definitely someone worth a look if he drops into the late 3rd.

  42. Trevor


    Since this blog is on OL I thought I would throw something out there for your feedback.

    If we do sign Wisneiski as expected and he becomes out new Center. What about drafting a guy like either D. Smith out of Penn St. or D. Willams out of Oaklahoma with our 3rd round picks to play right tackle and move Britt inside to guard. Or go with Crisp in the 5th to develeop and have Bailey or Gilliam start at RT

    I know you mentioned before no wanting to switch positions for Britt but I don’t know that I ever see him being anything better than a slightly below average RT. He struggles so much in pass protection particularly with speed. That being said with his shorter arms and nastiness in the run game he might make an ideal left guard.

    Also what are your thoughts on Gilliam do you see him as a potential starter down the road or simply a back up.

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      I think it’s pretty unfair to conclude that Britt won’t ever be “anything better than a slightly below average RT” based on a rookie season. I’m no expert on the position around the League, but I don’t recall knowing of a rookie RT who killed it his first year. Maybe there’s a particular rookie RT (from any season) you’re comparing Britt to?

      Go back and watch the NFCCG – focus on Bailey at RT – and decide if you think he’s better than Britt.

      • Trevor

        I remember the NFCCG and Bailey was not great either but it was his first start of the year at that spot. I am not saying Bailey is the answer at RT just that he could hold down the spot till someone they draft gets their feet under them. I just think Britt looks much more like a natural Guard rather than tackle.

        Still wish Bowie would have come to camp in shape last year as I thought he was the best developmental guy out of the group.

      • AlaskaHawk

        I don’t think it is unfair, his performance on pass protection was poor in some games. It not only affects him but also Wilson’s health. We don’t want the defense to have unblocked shots at the QB from any position. Maybe he will get better. He still needs to prove he is a long term player at RT.

        • CHawk Talker Eric

          Every player in the League has some poor games. Britt’s came against pro-bowl DEs and OLBs like Calais Campbell, Robert Quinn and Aldon Smith.

          Zack Martin is probably as good a rookie RT as there’s been in the League since PC/Cable took over in SEA, so he makes a good benchmark against which to compare Britt.

          Matin was a mid-R1 pick
          Britt a late R2 pick

          Martin is 6’4″ 308# with 32.875″ arms and 9.5″ hands
          Britt is 6’6″ 325# with 33.5″ arms and 10.25″ hands

          Martin’s Combine #’s: 29 BP, 28″ VJ, 106″ BJ, 7.65s 3-cone, 4.59s 20yd
          Britt’s Combine #’s: 23 BP, 27.5″ VJ, 100″ BJ, 8.14s 3-cone, 4.69s 20yd

          Martin beats Britt in every category, as you’d expect from a R1/R2 prospect comparison. But the differences aren’t large, especially considering Britt is 2″ and 20lbs bigger than Martin.

          This whole thing about Britt’s arms being too short is really getting tired. A lot of Britt’s detractors wish Breno was still at the position, but forget that his arms are over an inch shorter than Britt’s. They also forget Breno was a revolving door his first 2 seasons with SEA. Britt played much better his rookie season than did Breno in either 2011 or 2012.

          While I don’t argue that it’s possible for SEA to improve at the RT position, to do so would come at great cost – a high draft pick and the opportunity cost of not drafting high at another position of need. Maybe you see things differently, but I think C is much more of a need than RT at this point.

          Finally, replacing Britt at RT would result in 3 OL positions being manned by 1st year players at the position, potentially as many as 2 of which could be rookies. Continuity of personnel is crucial for any OL squad, especially one that operates a zbs. I can just about guaranty that replacing Britt at RT by moving him inside to LG, starting a rookie at RT and most likely also at C, would lead to more unblocked shots at the QB from every position.

          • Trevor

            Your argument does not make any sense because Zach Martin never played a snap as at Right Tackle. He was pro-bowl Guard!!! Your argument only supports the idea of moving him to guard.

            Short arms do limit your ability at the Tackle position particularly in pass protection against speed rushers and that is the area Britt struggles thus the thinking about moving him to Guard because he is solid in the run game.

          • AlaskaHawk

            I’m not saying the Seahawks should replace him this year, unless one of their draft picks turns out to be better. What I’m saying is he hasn’t locked down his position. He may end up playing for 3-4 years on rookie contract and then be let go. Just like Carpenter had been let go, just like Breno was let go. The best thing Britt has going in his favor is a cheap rookie contract.

            • CHawk Talker Eric

              Breno was a cap casualty on a team that prides itself on being able to churn out quality OLers from mid-to-low draft picks. He also had the unfortunate luck of being a FA in a draft deep with OTs.

              Carp and Unger are also cap casualties, again because this draft is deep with interior OLers.

              It’s possible Britt follows the same pattern.

              Goes to show that OLers just aren’t that valued in a system like SEA, unless you’re a pro bowler.

              • AlaskaHawk

                Or that they aren’t performing well enough not to be replaced by a rookie! Seahawks problem at OL has been the best players are injury prone. Perhaps Okung will finally prove to be the exception. Sweezy and Britts best feature, cheap and not injured.

        • arias

          I was a big Britt basher for most of the season, but he really started turning things around and showing promise in pass protection at the end of the season and the playoffs. It’s uneven though because the games he shows promise as a pass blocker he’s atrocious as a run blocker and had a really hard time putting together a complete game. But the season finale against St Louis was probably his best game of the year. He held up well in a game where the rest of the line didn’t against that team’s ferocious front four. He only allowed one qb pressure all game instead of his customary 4, and it was only a hurry.

          Actually it’s a toss up as to his best game, did anyone notice how well he played in the Super Bowl? Probably not, because he didn’t make any mistakes. The guy was as invisible as you’d want your right tackle to be. He didn’t allow a single QB pressure all game long, his first game of the year he didn’t give one up.

          Yes, Britt was really terrible for a strong majority of the year, but at least he had the excuse of it being his rookie year and he did show progress.

  43. drewjov11

    Britt’s college film was uneven. He seemed stuff to me and not a good pass blocker. He’s actually improved, but you also have to factor the jump in competition. He gets another year for sure.

  44. Trevor

    Your argument does not make any sense because Zach Martin never played a snap as at Right Tackle. He was pro-bowl Guard!!! Your argument only supports the idea of moving him to guard.

    Short arms do limit your ability at the Tackle position particularly in pass protection against speed rushers and that is the area Britt struggles thus the thinking about moving him to Guard because he is solid in the run game.

    • Trevor

      This was addressed to CHawk and his comparison of Britt to Zach Martin

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      Guess that exposes my lack of enthusiasm for DAL. Don’t really know their roster, or why I thought Martin was a RT.

      At any rate, let me know of a rookie RT you wish SEA had instead of Britt.

      • Trevor

        No problem I hate the Cowboys too.

        To be honest I think we will be stuck with Britt at RT again this year. I just threw it out as an idea to move him to guard if we sign Wisnewski.

        As for tackle prospects for us if we wanted a RT to start the 5 best (Glowers, Peat, Collins, Humphries and Clemmings will all be long gone and Fischer most likely will be as well.

        I think 2 guys who we could get with our 2nd or 3rd round pick are D. Smith from Penn State or Willams out of Oklahoma.

        My preference would be R. Crisp out of NC St in the 5th. I think he is going to develop into a quality starting tackle in the league though he might take a little longer to develop. He is an incredibly talented natural pass protector with good feet and length. Check out his tape against Beasly from Clemson. He does have some injuries in his background so that would have to be checked out.

        • CHawk Talker Eric

          Sounds like we agree more than not.

          If SEA sign Wis I hope it’s to start at LG and backup C. Again, because I live in LA I see all Raiders games, which means I’ve watched enough Wis in the past 3 years to know his best position is G. He would be an improvement over Carp at the position. I do not think he would be an improvement over Lewis, or even a rookie C. He does have experience at the position so he can backup, which makes him a valuable signing.

          If they do sign Wis to start at LG, then they’ll likely target a C first (like Marpet or Grasu), then a T like Crisp.

          BTW, I’m really torn between Marpet and Grasu. Grasu seems more pro ready. A true Day 1 plug-and-play replacement for Unger. But Marpet’s ceiling is so high it’s hard to see.

          • Trevor

            I feel exactly the same way with Grasu and Marpet. With Grasu I think you have a solid guy for the next 5-7 years but with Marpet you could have a pro-bowler or bust. I think the difference is you would have to take Marpet in the 2nd but could get Grasu in the 3rd or early 4th,

          • Miles

            Interesting take on Wisniewski. Good to know this perception that he’s a better guard prospect. The only thing is, the Seahawks seem to be privy to road graders and athletic prospects at the guard spots. They’ve had James Carpenter, Paul McQuistan, Lemuel Jeanpierre, JR Sweezy and Alvin Bailey playing guard. I have a hard time seeing them going out to get Wisniewski for that spot because I don’t think he’s either type.

            Unless they can get Wis for $2m or less, I think they pass and go to the draft. They just don’t have money to sign a guard for decent money that’s not ideal to what they want to do.

        • arias

          The only rookie that started all 16 games at Right Tackle this past season besides Britt was Seantrel Henderson and he was FAR worse than Britt.

          The only other tackles that spent any time at right tackle was Cornelius Lucas who played 10 games there for Detroit as a UDFA. He was terrible and worse than Britt, but that was more expected seeing how he wasn’t drafted.

          And one of Rob’s favorites last year Ju’wuan James selected with the 19th pick by Miami started 9 games there before he was forced to play on the left side due to injuries on the line. From the right side he was a decent run blocker but was terrible against the pass too. On the left side he was god awful.

          • Trevor

            So it is ok that Britt was awful last year because the other rookies that started at RT were? Are you expecting him to be a lot better this year. I hope so as well and would love to hear your reasoning. I was really happy with his run blocking but he looked out of his league against speed rushers.

            Anyways I dont want to keep bashing him because he was a rookie thrown into the fire and survived. Kudos to him for that. I am just not as optimistic as most that he is our answer at RT.That is why I threw out the idea of him as a guard.

            • Miles

              I think the most important thing to remember about Britt is that he got stronger and better as the year went along. He was really a liability to start the year, but he showed improvement. As long as he can continue to show improvement, I personally feel good about him. There is no reason to think he can’t improve even more heading into next year.

              Tom Cable is the guy.

              • Coug1990

                I really do believe that the Seahawks judge offensive lineman differently than the fans do. If they did, Brenno never would have started more than a few games. Sweezy would have been cut as a rookie. Carpenter would have been released before this past season as a bust.

            • arias

              Please see my post above regarding Britt. He improved his pass blocking over the course of the season and had his best games as a pass blocker at the end of the year and was outstanding in the Super Bowl.

              I would like to hear your reasoning as to why that’s not relevant.

  45. CharlieTheUnicorn

    I think everyone needs to take a step back from the edge.
    What are the current holes on the Seahawks roster from outsiders (the NFL commoners)
    OG, C, DT, DE, more or less in this order

    What do I think the Seahawks view as a hole on the roster requiring additional depth or a starter (The NFL lords)
    OG, C, LB/LEO, S, CB, RB, WR; more or less in this order

    I think when you start looking at the depth on the team at various positions, you start to see where they will dip into the 2015 NFL draft pool. This is “the draft” that will determine how long the Seattle SB window stays open.

    • Jon

      I don’t know who is on a ledge Unicorn.

      I think WR is still at the top of the list. Perhaps along with Interior OL.
      I see the draft like this

      2nd WR, C, or G
      3rd WR, C, or G
      4th (from Saints) WR, C, or G

      Those three are all kind of given in any order

      4th DL
      4th (comp from Tate) WR
      5th DB
      5th (comp for Browner) DB
      5th (comp for Giac) OL
      6th (harvin) DL
      6th (comp for McDonald) LEO/LB
      7th DB

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        I think we, as a collective, keep forgetting that they will draft a QB this draft. They need to strengthen and get younger at the back-up QB spot.

  46. Volume 12

    Seahawks are bringing this guy into the VMAC. W. Georgia DT/DE Tory Slater- 6’5, 282 lb. Interesting that their looking at a hybrid D-lineman right? Falcons also bringing him in.

    He’s a former high Scholl wide receiver.

    Slater recorded 69 tackles, 16.5 for losses and 10 sacks last season.

    “Slater had 600 receiving yards and six touchdowns as a high school senior when he ran the 40-yard dash in 4.6 seconds and had a 15.0 personal best in the 110 meter hurdles.”

    • Volume 12

      35′ inch vertical jump, 10’3 foot broad jump, and put up 31 reps on the bench press. Just a flat-out athlete! Not a lot of technique to his game, but so what?

      I love guys like this. They’re raw, no bad habits,a dn you can mold them into your style of play and take advantage of what their strengths are.

      • Steele1324

        If they find enough of these sleepers, might they trade down and also go heavy in UDFA?

  47. Volume 12

    Rob, one guy’s pro day who I thought was impressive, and who I actually liked this year when watching them play was Cal WR Chris Harper. What are your thoughts on him?

    • Volume 12

      This kid had a 35′ vertical jump, 6.9 3 cone, which looking at the combine invites, would have put him in the top 10, and a ridiculous 12’0 foot broad jump! Holy ish! Also was clocked at 4.49-4.51, and is a crisp, fluid route runner.

      Dare I say he’s ‘Seahawky?’

      • Steele1324

        He is a “poor man’s DeSean Jackson” as one source describes him.

        • Volume 12

          I’a agree with that. Has a little ADB to his game as well. Brian on the new post just informed me that Seattle is bringing him into the VMAC for a visit.

  48. drewjov11

    I think that we shoukd draft someone to play tackle fairly early and here is why. Okung is probably the most likely candidate to walk. Tackles are harder to find and develop. Would you rather be replacing a guard or a tackle next season? If gilliam is the guy, ok. But, he was Undrafted and didn’t play any tackle this season. I know that okung isn’t a huge money talent, but don’t kid yourselves. He’s going to be paid. I don’t think you stay on top by overpaying slightly better than average players like super stars.

    • Volume 12

      Your right in that tackles are hard to find and develop. In that case, why do you think that Okung is the most likely to walk?

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        He will want 10M+ per year, no way Seattle pays him that. at least that is my guess.

        • Miles

          Okung is not the most durable player in the world so I don’t think he’s going to get $10m/yr. He will get good money but it will probably be in the $6-$7m range. And teams may only want to give him a short-term contract to show he can stay healthy.

          I agree, I think we need to find an LT and it should be high-priority. Maybe that’s something we can invest next year’s first rounder on. I’m not sure what the tackle class will be like next year, but LT is a position that usually requires your highest pick for sustained productivity. It’s a difficult position to be sure.

        • Volume 12

          Got cha. Just curious.

          Outside of say DJ Humphries, Ereck Flowers, Jake Fisher, who we stand no chance of getting to and Rob Crisp, Laurence Gibson, and possibly Cedric Ogbuehi, who are some good LTs in this class?

          • Trevor

            I think you take Crisp or Gibson in the 5-7 round range and let them develop along with Gilliam/ Bailey this year and then see if one of them steps up and is ready to replace Okung. If they do great you can let Okung walk. If not then you bite the bullet and re-sign Okung in the 8-10 mil range would be my guess.

            I think with Gilliam’s athleticism he really might have a shot if Cable really is the OL guru everyone claims.

            • Volume 12

              Agreed. But if Crisp or Gibson are hypothetically off the board, are there any other developmental LT prospects that are worth keeping an eye on?

        • CharlieTheUnicorn

          Guys, who were not as talented as Okung got nice money.. Hell Carpenter got 5-6M a year to play guard.. so 10M for Okung would not be crazy in the new NFL salary scheme (CAP going up 5-10M per year).

          • AlaskaHawk

            What about Bailey? Seems like he plays better on the left side.

  49. drewjov11

    You can’t keep everyone. Qb, rb, TE, LB’s, secondary all making bank. DL making a lot. The NEXT left tackle, if he pans out will get paid by us because some of these stars will be at the end of their mega-deals and we will move on or they will.

  50. Brandon

    Instead of getting a guy like Stefen Wisniewski, I think we should go with a guy who can develop in Cable’s system and grow with Russell. 2nd round I really like Hroniss Grasu at center. Not the biggest guy but excels in pass blocking, and we all know that we need it. People say that he needs to get stronger, but just let Cable work his magic and turn him into the next Unger (he went to Oregon too). In the 3rd round I would say a Dline or returner would be a good idea. The early 4th rounder we have (Saints trade) I think should be used to get Ali Marpet. Small school guy, but is very athletic. I think he can compete throughout the line and take the guard or RT spot. Especially when Okung probably leaves, I think that he and Alvin Bailey can become the right side of the line, no matter the spots. With the remaining 4th and 5th round selections, including the compensatory picks we will probably get, I think we should go after (not in this specific order) an OLB, CB, 2 Dline, and one more reciever. I like Darren Waller from Georgia Tech or Chris Conley from Georgia at WR. 6th round go after a saftey and a FB. I like Isaiah Johnson at saftey. On tape he reminds me of Bam Bam. 7th round go for another G or T. What do you guys think?

    • Volume 12

      Not bad. One receiver I’m really liking right now is Cal’s Chris Harper. His broad jump was on par, if not better than Chris Conley’s. I’d take this guy in the 3rd round. Reminds me of a mix between ADB and D-Jax.

      I like Ali Marpet, but I think he’ll be over-drafted by someone in the 2nd round. I’m with you in regards to Hroniss Grasu. Watching him he kind of says ‘Seahawk’ IMO.

      Unless Alabama FB Jalston Fowler is on the board late on day 3, I’d take a FB as an UDFA.

    • Old but Slow

      Probably should add a late QB to that list. Good chance Tarvaris is gone, and BJ is unproven and they seem to want to try him at other positions. The question for me is what type of QB do they target?

      If they go after a traditional style player, 6′ 4 or so, can he run the offense, or will they have to make everyone adjust? Or do they look for a Wilson clone, an athletic movement guy?

      • Volume 12

        Good question. An interesting QB prospect is Old Dominion’s Taylor Heincke. He’s an athletic movement guy like you said. I this k he ran a 4.55 40.

        My personal preference is still Alabama QB Blake Sims in the 7th or a priority UDFA.

        Someone else also mentioned QB Brandon Bridge, and Peter brought up E. Carolina QB Shane Carden too.

      • Brandon

        I’m maybe interested Nick Marshall. 6’1, can play QB or Corner. Hitting 2 birds with one stone?

        • Volume 12

          Nick Marshall is my favorite mid round CB prospect. Your right. You could kill 2 birds with one stone. Seems to me he wants to CB. Take him as that yearly developmental corner, and still take a QB later on.

          • Steele1324

            They could do worse than pick Lippett and Marshall, and figure out how to use them in camp. I think Lippett is strong in both WR and CB, better at WR. Marshall needs more time at CB, but imagine if they put him in the offense. Option plays, anyone?

  51. Trevor

    I agree with everyone that we need to take a couple of OL this draft at a minimum for depth and competition at all spots.

    But those people who think we are just going to draft a couple of guys and plug them in day #1 are dreaming IMO there is no way PC/ JS start the year with two rookies on the OL and a 2nd year guy like Britt who was far from a standout. We are going to be investing huge guaranteed $ in Wilson and they are not going to risk getting him killed no matter how good a scrambler they think he is.

    That is why Wisneiski is a critical signing IMO. He can play both guard and center and leaves us with so many or options on the line. If we get him we can still take 2-3 OL in the draft and then let them battle it out to figure out what the best 5 man unit is.

    • Steele1324

      But it is possible to start rookies at OL and do just fine. Depends on the individuals, and how well Cable manages them. As for Wiesniewski, we still don’t know if he is better than some of the prospects under consideration, or just okay. Even if they sign him, that still leaves them with a hole at one position, requiring a starter. And they still need depth.

  52. drewjov11

    You aren’t slated to start two rookies at all. As it stands, the odds-on favorites to start would be guys already on the roster. If a rookie excels then you cross that bridge when you get to it. Not grooming a tackle and a future center would be foolish.

  53. Volume 12

    I was just thinking about this. Is this the guy that JS was at Mizzou for?

    WR Bud Sasser- 6’3, 219 lbs., 4.50-4.52 40 yard dash, 78 5/8′ inch wingspan, 34 1/2′ inch vertical jump, 10′ foot broad jump.

    Rob, what’s your opinion of W. Virginia OG Quinton Spain? Seems like a road grader, Bruce Irvin, although he works out with most of the W. Virginia kids, has been really working out with Spain quite extensively.

    Also, this S from Minnesota Cedric Thompson is kind of freaky.

  54. Trevor

    Since we are discussing OL I know everyone likes to bash Okung but I say extend him now at the most cap friendly deal possible.

    I know he has had some injuries but most were flukey and when he is healthy he is a top 10 -15 LT in the league. I hear people saying just draft a mid round guy to develop and replace him but that is just not an easy thing to do. Just look at the Top20 Left Tackles in the NFL and the only guy out ofall of them who was a developmental guy and not drafted in round #1 or #2 is Jason Peters who was a UDFA. Still 1 out of 20 is not good odds.

    We have a quality Left Tackle why roll the dice on some developmental guys. Extend him now at the most cap friendly deal possible and I am sure it would have little impact on our cap # next year. I assure you if he stays healthy next year and gets to free agency then $10 mil per/yr is a starting point.

    He is sill young and along with Sweezy are good building blocks for the OL.

    • Volume 12

      I agree. I actually like Okung quite a bit. I’m not saying that those who are suggesting he might not be back, don’t like him, just pointing that out.

      I think they’ll re-sign him. He’s a character, something we know Seattle puts a premium on, one of the top 10-12 LTs, and he works in conjecture with RW.

      Seattle may think outside the box or approach/address things that are un-orthodox compared to the rest of the league, but would they really give RW the big money, and then break in a LT in a years time? Wouldn’t that be going backwards?

  55. drewjov11

    That’s all fine and well. But what if he doesn’t want to be so friendly in his demands? Left tackles don’t take sweetheart deals. They make huge money on the open market. If he were to do that, his agent would need to be questioned.

    • Trevor

      I am not saying it has to be a sweet heart deal he is going to get his $. I am saying just do it now to help with the cap # and don’t let him get to free agency or it could get a lot more expensive.

  56. Steele1324

    Raiders D-linemen C.J.Wilson visiting Hawks this week. Mainly a run stuffing 3-technique with rotational versatility, would provide depth.

    • Volume 12

      Camp body? Another guy for competition with Scruggs, Smith, and a rookie.

      • Steele1324

        They sure seem to be stockpiling depth at DT. And they just got Rubin. They already have a lot of options. Makes me wonder how much attention they’ll devote in the draft (the high rounds anyway).

        • Volume 12

          Personally, I never thought they would target interior D-lineman high in the draft.

  57. Steele1324


    Bruce Irvin has been mentioning his friend OG Quinton Spain in his twitter posts. Spain looks good. Another possibility in UDFA. Do JSPC pay attenton to connections with existing team members?

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