The #Seahawks focus on defensive playmakers in this seven-round mock draft from @robstaton https://t.co/BNx0Ih88HV pic.twitter.com/jXMDfkbJ1d
— Field Gulls (@FieldGulls) March 29, 2017
If you missed it yesterday, I wrote a seven round Seahawks mock draft for Field Gulls. You’ll find a link in the tweet above.
I wanted to run through some of the thought process on here today so check it out, let me know what you think and then read on…
Breaking down the seven round mock
Increasingly it feels like it’s coming down to two options with Seattle’s first pick:
1. Take one of the few highly rated offensive linemen available
2. Draft a defensive back
Offensive linemen
Who’s in contention?
Garett Bolles and Forrest Lamp. The two likely first round talents who beat TEF (explained here if you’re unaware) and could usurp the defensive backs at #26.
Bolles is a tenacious, fierce and athletic blocker well suited to Seattle’s ZBS and their desire to be physical in the running game. He’d be an immediate starter at tackle.
Lamp was the most explosive O-liner at the combine and will likely move inside to play guard or center. He could start at guard and provide insurance at center if the Seahawks are unable to sign Justin Britt to a new contract.
How likely are they to be available?
Not likely.
Lamp is being tipped to go in the top-20 by Daniel Jeremiah and Tony Pauline estimates a place in the 20’s. With such a dearth of explosive, talented offensive linemen in the league, someone will likely take him before #26.
Bolles was the best left tackle in college football in 2016 and should go in the top-15. His absolute floor is likely Denver at #20.
Anyone else?
Would Cam Robinson and Ryan Ramcyzk be considered? Possibly. Robinson’s combine and lack of explosion would make him something of a recent anomaly. Ramcyzk’s torn labrum injury and on-off-on football career might be a tie-breaker.
Defensive backs
Who’s in contention?
It really depends what the Seahawks want to prioritise.
How badly do they want an outside cornerback? There are some really good, long, athletic corner’s in this draft. Deshawn Shead’s injury has left a big void that’ll need to be filled.
However, the Seahawks teach a technique that is difficult to master. The only rookie corner to start in the Carroll era is Richard Sherman and that was only due to an injury to Marcus Trufant. Will they want immediate impact with their top pick or are they playing the long game?
Do they want to upgrade the slot? Pete Carroll was lukewarm when discussing Jeremy Lane’s 2016 performance. Lane was virtually a full time starter last season, playing 71% of the defensive snaps. Drafting a dynamic slot corner could also allow the Seahawks to shift Lane to compete outside as one of their more experienced performers.
They could also look to add a ‘Buffalo’ or ‘big nickel’. The position is explained in more detail here. It’s commonplace for teams to use an extra safety instead of a nickel corner or SAM these days, affording superior match-ups against tight ends while not giving up as much in the running game.
Pete Carroll yesterday noted that recent signing Bradley McDougald could act as a ‘big nickel’ in Seattle.
Outside cornerbacks
Marlon Humphrey, Kevin King and Gareon Conley are all athletic enough and talented enough to go in the top-20. If there’s an early rush on cornerbacks, it’s likely none of the three will be there for Seattle. If teams wait on the position knowing there will be depth in round two, it’s possible at least one of the three will make it to #26.
Obi Melifonwu could be viewed as an outside cornerback project given his physical profile, speed and short area agility. It’s also possible Quincy Wilson and Cordrea Tankersley could be considered but they are more frequently projected to round two at this stage.
Slot cornerbacks
Is 32 inch arms still important? Is height and length still crucial? Or are they looking for a twitched up, sudden athlete capable of being a playmaker (irrespective of size/length)?
Adoree’ Jackson leaps off the screen as a possible Pete Carroll pick. Not only does he express natural, sudden athleticism (former 5-star recruit) — he also had fantastic production in 2016 (16 passes defended was among the best in the country, five interceptions and 11 PBU’s). He has has a bright, sparky personality and was a team captain at USC. You can imagine the Seahawks having a package of offensive plays for Jackson and he legitimately has the potential to be one of the very best all-time kick returners in the NFL.
He’s Percy Harvin on defense. A true threat to score any time the ball’s in his hands.
Alternatively Chidobe Awuzie and Budda Baker are physical and athletic. They’re not as twitched up as Jackson but they’re capable of making plays beyond the LOS. Fabian Moreau was another possibility but appears less likely considering his recent torn pec injury.
Buffalo/big nickel
Melifonwu is a possibility here as well as outside corner. He’s similar in weight to Deion Jones in Atlanta but longer and a better athlete. His sure-tackling, willingness to deliver the occasional jarring hit and coverage skills make him a strong candidate for this role, even if he ends up outside or at strong safety for the long haul.
Texas A&M’s Justin Evans is 6-0 and 200lbs, incredibly explosive and would’ve had a sensational combine but for a late injury. His tackling is a bit boom or bust (literally) but his cover skills as a dynamic slot with hitting capability keeps him on the radar. He performed well at his pro-day today:
A&M Safety Justin Evans
4.45
VJ: 41.5
BJ: 10’9″Made some 💰today.
— Kevin Weidl (@KwEspn) March 30, 2017
Why are other positions unlikely at #26?
The Seahawks have consistently attacked their stated needs early in the draft. Carroll listed cornerback, linebacker and O-line as the priority positions at his end of season press conference.
Having signed several free agent linebackers and considering the likelihood Seattle retains a 4-2-5 type of formation, they’re probably looking for young depth for the MIKE and WILL and not necessarily an every down starter (unless a player like Haason Reddick somehow lasts until #26).
Is a SAM linebacker out of the question? Possibly, yes. Especially considering what John Schneider said at the owner’s meeting this week:
“When you look at the SAM linebacker position, it’s really hard to say you’re going to take a huge risk on somebody or step out on a limb for somebody because the reps are… it’s 15 to 17… or something like that, is the average. So that’s why you see that position in our defense, it’s just a nickel league now.”
T.J. Watt and Tyus Bower still have some versatility and value but might not be a high priority considering Schneider’s words above.
Receiver and tight end could be possible targets in rounds 2-3 depending on who’s available. It seems unlikely Seattle would go down that road with their first pick.
It’s also a severely weak draft for interior defensive linemen with barely any good options. The value is at nose tackle on day three.
What about round two?
John Schneider highlighted the strength of the draft was DB’s and TE’s. Either could be in play here.
For example, if the Seahawks take a dynamic slot corner first will they go back for an outside corner at #58? What safety/big nickel options remain available?
Cordrea Tankersley and Quincy Wilson could be very intriguing if they last deep into the second frame. Shaq Griffin is another possibility. Ahkello Witherspoon has the talent to warrant going in this range but his tackling form is off-putting.
Tight end options could include Evan Engram and Bucky Hodges but it’s unlikely Engram will last beyond the top-40. Zay Jones has the type of attitude and athleticism they’ve liked at receiver in the past and could be someone to monitor. Chris Godwin is another receiver option.
While it’s unlikely Tyus Bowser and T.J. Watt last to Seattle’s pick in round two, if the Seahawks make a similar move to last year (trade down in round one, trade up in round two) they could be on the radar. Ditto Zach Cunningham.
And the offensive line has to remain a possibility. Keep an eye on Nico Siragusa, Isaac Asiata and Taylor Moton.
With three picks in round three, who could be on the radar?
This could be the range where the Seahawks start thinking linebacker if they didn’t take one with their first two picks. Vince Biegel, Alex Anzalone, Duke Riley, Ben Gedeon, Elijah Lee and Jordan Evans tested well enough in terms of short area agility (the importance of which is explained here) to be possible candidates for Seattle.
This could be where they take a tight end, especially with Jimmy Graham and Luke Willson out of contract in 2018. Iowa’s George Kittle has the explosive traits, blocking skills and overall athleticism to be on their radar. Jake Butt could be a ‘redshirt’ candidate while Gerald Everett and Jonnu Smith could also be options.
It’ll be interesting to see which offensive linemen remain available. Does Asiata, for example, make it to the late third round? And would they consider someone like Adam Bisnowaty given the comparisons to Ricky Wagner and his wrestling background?
This could be a good range for receivers including Jehu Chesson, Malachi Dupre, Taywan Taylor, Quincy Adeboyejo, Robert Davis or Josh Reynolds.
If they haven’t added any depth at safety by this point, Washington State’s Shalom Luani continues to look like an appealing option. This could also be the range where Rasul Douglas, Rayshawn Jenkins, Shaq Griffin, Montae Nicholson and Marquez White are considered.
What about day three?
The Seahawks currently only have picks in rounds six and seven, so a trade down at some point appears likely to bridge the gap between rounds three and six.
Keep an eye on the players Seattle invites to the VMAC, especially the high upside athletes. The Seahawks sometimes use the late rounds to get a step ahead in the UDFA market, backing themselves to recruit well when the draft is over. So positional preference comes in to play here.
For example, they’d already drafted two running backs a year ago when they took Zac Brooks in round seven. Perhaps fearing they wouldn’t be able to convince him to sign as a free agent, they took him in round seven.
Can we please come away from this draft with King, A.Jackson, LB, Asiata, Kittle, Luani, WR & someone with potential?
That would be a huge haul. High level CB2 competition, a likely NCB starter, a quality OG who could win a OG job, our TE4, a backup S/big nickel, a WR to add to competition and depth.
That is ideal IMO.
——————
I wonder, we have two backup safety spots on the 53 man roster right? In the past it has been Terrell and McCray. So we could have Bradley McDougald (FS, SS & big nickel) and Luani (backup FS, SS & big nickel) on the 53. That’s good.
The interesting thing is at WR it could be tough to crack into the 53 man roster. Which means any WR’s we acquire will likely get cut and we’ll be hoping they are not poached when cut for roster cut downs during the preseason. It sure seems like we will carry 4 TE’s again (good, I like that) so that means five WR’s again. Here are our starting five from ’16, whom I project to be our starting five for ’17:
WR1: Doug
WR2: Tyler
WR3: PRich
WR4: Kearse
WR5: McEvoy
We’ll see how it goes with Kearse and Tanner, clearly the two guys with the least security on the 53. I fear Kearse unless two WR’s ball their brains out during camp and the preseason which forces the FO to cut Kearse to make room. That basically leaves McEvoy. We’ll see how well he has developed but he is such an ideal project (height, hands, body control, speed, brains, versatility, etc) that it’s hard to imagine us cutting him, especially for a rookie. So that means the WR’s we draft or get in UDFA will be cut and have to pass through waivers to get onto our PS (aka not be that impressive in the preseason games).
We have a need at WR with Kearse likely a cap causality in ’18 & PRich is a UFA in ’18. Besides Lawler I don’t imagine any of our depth WR’s on the roster to become starters. We’re thin, but the starting five for ’17 seem pretty locked in.
Hey, Nathan. I like the thoughts. IMO you are going to have to take your pick of either King or Adoree (if they even make it to 26). Both R1 locks.
I think the question is: which of these positions is it easier to find a good player later? And I tend to say outside CB. No other player offers what Adoree does on special teams and even offense, but many others (some perhaps already on the roster) could reasonably step in at outside CB. Even if they do decide to break the trend due to an insanely deep CB class this year, their history of not drafting a CB before day 3 has to tell us something.
As for WR, I could see Lawler taking Kearse’s spot next year if we don’t find anyone else.
The reason I chose both (though it’s true, highly unlikely Adoree lasts until our R2 pick) is because I just read a highly respected mock that had him being taken in the mid-2nd round.
He’ll never last to our original second round pick, but if he drops into the middle of the round I think trading up in the 2nd would be a no-brainer.
Ok, I totally respect that. (while I pretty strongly disagree, of course).
I don’t think Pauline is known to exaggerate when he calls someone a “first round lock”, which he did a while back. And with what Rob has recently pointed out about Adoree, I can totally see why. If he gets past the 20’s, I think the Falcons would be thrilled to get him and that is his absolute floor. They have no major needs, would get a huge bump in the return game, and it would fit right in with the theme they started last year of speed on defense.
Sea Mode-I was thinking the along the same lines. I love the playmaking sizzle of Jackson at 26. King may or may not slip into the 2nd, but I doubt he could make it to our spot without a trade up. If Jackson isnt thêre at 26, Im still enticed by the athleticism and amazing versatility Melifonwu could bring.
Nathan, I really like the drift of your holding off on O-line and taking Asiata in what I see as some really good day-two value. Real toughness thêre. I confess Id feel some real disappointment ì they took Ramcyzk or Robinson at 26.
I think the only way to get both King and Jackson would be to trade away picks to move way up in round 2. That’s assuming either of them even make it to the first pick, which they may not. But it this somehow happened I would lose my mind. That would be a phenomenal draft class.
The only way you get King & Jackson is you trade Sherman.
There are a few other ways . . .
Whats the deal on McCray why dont they wanna resign him? Are they just waiting to bring him back for cheap when nobody else calls him to sign him? Do they not want him back now that they have signed McDougal? I think having McCray and McDougal will provide serviceable depth in the secondary.
Could be the tension with Sherm and McCrays mistakes have resulted in Seattle moving on.
Well, just stop and think about it for a minute. We signed McDougal who Pete is high on, praising his play, his versatility (FS, SS & big nickel) and then there is the deep class of safeties in this years draft. If we are only going to carry two backup safeties (as usual) then it will be Mcdougal and the rookie we drafted. There’s no space for McCray.
My only question is did McDougal play special teams? If so, how good at it was he? I liked McCray and I feel like he has potential to be a starter on a team that needs help at safety, but his best attribute was his play on special teams. That will likely be missed.
Thats why I want us to bring him back and he was better than Steven Terrel and we carried more than 2 backup safties last year
There are too many player’s in the first three round’s that can beat out McCray and the Hawks are well aware of that.
Nathan, IMO McEvoy didnt do enough to be anything more than a bubble player. A guy like Godwin, or even Chesson, would be serious competition for him. Kearse struggled last year, and Lockett is coming off a serious injury, so dont be surprised to see Seattle either take one in the third or trade down and take one with their usual fourth rounder.
Rob, really nice coverage of possible targets and draft scenarios. I appreciate all the work you put in, thank you for the blog and for taking the time to address multiple possibilities.
Personally, I like Asiata and hope we take him in the third, but Siragusa is interesting as well–to say nothing of Moton. Really interested to see what they do regarding TE! Do you really think they might take a TE in the second round?!
You know you can just reply to me by hitting reply, right? Just making sure you know.
>Nathan, IMO McEvoy didnt do enough to be anything more than a bubble player.
Well, yeah. He was a brand new project in ’16. He was a QB to WR convert and considering his lack of experience at WR he showed up quite nicely. He has all the natural abilities and talents to succeed, but of course he isn’t going to be handed a roster spot. He’ll have to earn it. Will he show up to camp and ball out of his mind, becoming the white Terrell Pryor? I wouldn’t bet on it but personally but I do think he will have taken steps forward in his development, which along with his ceiling/potential the FO will be forced to give him a roster spot.
>A guy like Godwin, or even Chesson, would be serious competition for him.
Sure, but they would be rookies. Wide outs who contribute their rookie year are rare. What makes Godwin or Chesson more likely to contribute than say R2 pick Paul Richardson his rookie year?
I’m not saying we won’t draft a WR or that we shouldn’t per-se…but unless Tanner shows up looking the same, aka he hasn’t developed, I just don’t really see our starting five changing. Unless we drafted a WR in the first two rounds which I hope we really don’t do.
Yes, I am aware. Not sure why I didnt probably just in a hurry.
…to answer you question, Because Paul Richardson wasnt as good as Seattle thought he was. Plus he was tiny, which Godwin and Chesson surely arent. Richardson didnt show the knack for contested catches in the NFL as he did in college until the Detroit game this year–three years into his career. Dont think you’ll see that with Chesson or Godwin. Those guys are a LOT more physical than Richardson will ever be.
And rookie WR’s DO contribute, especially big strong fast ones as opposed to tiny little guys.
Just as I had little faith that Chris Matthews had a spot locked down after his breakout SB performance, so too do I question thinking McEvoy is anything more than a guy with a shot in camp next year. He’s simply not done enough to count on, and I dont see Seattle passing on a guy like Godwin or Chesson if they are there at a spot Seattle likes.
Remember, Carrol loves big fast physical WR’s and has been looking for one since Big Mike Williams. If they get a chance to add one to the mix for a reasonable Draft cost, they wont hesitate.
But I get where you are coming from. No worries…
The Hawks aren’t afraid to cut tie’s with any player regardless of contract or salary. The best man win’s. That they have proven. It’s all about the competition man…
Can you provide some names of big names or guys with big contracts they have cut because they were beat out by better performers? Just interested as I don’t have any personal history to help me support you position. Thx
you mean like Percy Harvin?
McEvoy is one of those players everyone really wants to like, but he’s unable to beat out anyone for a position. Part of that may be Kearse’s contract.
With Pete/John running the show, I can see where they would take TE in the 2nd. I wouldn’t necessarily like it, but they are nothing if not unconventional!
Would that be an admission of Vannett just being a wasted pick?
Well, I’ve only heard good things from practice about Vannett and his “great” hands. Hasn’t translated to the field yet.
If Pete/John pursue a TE, it would be more of a contingency for Jimmuh leaving after next season.
Given the current roster construction at the offensive skill positions, it makes me wonder if we would value a player with more natural positional flexibility. Christian McCaffrey or Evan Engram would be natural fits if we only keep 5 WR. Don’t get me wrong, Hodges would be an ideal blocking TE, and I like many on the boards would want us to double or triple dip on the secondary, but this may be something to consider.
Is your name a nod to Mike Leach’s Air Raid?
Yes Sir! I went to graduate school there from 2002-2003
With all the insanity regarding Sherman, how amazing would it be if this was all leading to an awesome April Fools day joke?
No?
Just saying…
I like tgat theory!
Breaking – seahawks trade Sherman for 4 1st round picks to the raiders. O and Marshawn.
Considering that the Seahawks are willing to trade Richard Sherman a team like Dallas would be an ideal option if it were to happen.
The Cowboys need help in the secondary and it would be the perfect environment for Sherman’s brash attitude.
With the possibility of picking up 2 players, a combination of Obi Melifonwu, Kevin King, Adoree’ Jackson or Justin Evans in the 1st round, the deal could be great long term.
All the worries about the issues it may cause in the secondary are totally legitmate, but there’s also no guarantee the oline will be ready next year either. I’d be willing to place more faith in those DB’s being competent than I do of whoever ends up at tackle next season.
No way Dallas can afford to take on his contract with their current cap situation.
Wonderful write up Rob.
I have one point to make: we have all assumed (thus far) that because there is so much talent in this DB class that these players are going to be drafted asap.
But what if the opposite is true (as Rob alluded to in this piece)? Danny Kelly did a mock draft the other day where he put 3-4 OL in the top 20, if I recall correctly. His argument was: teams saw the terribly inflated market value for OL this offseason, so they know how important it is get an average OL at a cheap price for 4-5 years.
IF this actually happens, and OL is drafted heavily in the first round, it certainly will push other talent down. At that point, I wouldn’t be surprised to see us either trade back or go for the best TE available. If Njoku falls to #26 or they really like Engram, SEA could very well love that—knowing that even if they draft TE in the 1st, they’ve got a lot of DBs to choose from in Rd 2-3.
Anyways, what do you all think of that? In the first round, will teams gravitate towards scarce positions in this draft like OL and QB?
I think if a lot of talent at CB gets pushed down, for sure it’s very possible they’ll move down unless a guy they really want is there at #26 and they don’t want to risk it.
I don’t think they will go TE early though. It would be a first-time departure from Carroll’s stated needs with an early pick. Plus they have Jimmy Graham, Luke Willson and Nick Vannett. They’re struggling how to get the best use out of Graham, let alone adding a first rounder to the mix too. And the depth at TE should allow them to get a good one later on.
Speaking of CB talent getting pushed down, Brent Sobleski of Bleacher Report mentioned CB Brandon Wilson, Houston who reportedly ran a 4.36 40 and skyed 41″ for his vertical. I can’t find anything about his arm length. Any knowledge about this player Rob?
The Seahawks apparently worked him out at RB at his pro day.
He is a convert from RB originally
I scouted him a bunch as a CB last year because I thought he would come out early
Im not sure what his tape looked like this season, but he definitely didn’t jump out on the Houston tape!
He’s definitely fast. Probably easier to teach him at RB than at CB in our scheme
5’11 / 200 lbs roughly. This is about right in line with their preferred RB size/weight.
Yeah I remember thinking for us he was a little short for corner…….
Sarcasm?
Great, bordering on exceptional mock draft Rob, my only slight concern is that Biegel is more likely to be drafted behind Asiata & Moton & possibly Saragusa. IMO, Asiata & Biegel should switch places in draft position. I like virtually every one of your picks, and a small trade down seems very possible.
IMO, The most overlooked of your picks, may be TE-Kettle, who is reported to be an outstanding blocker (+ his excellent workout #’s). As an in-line TE, he very well could be the savior of RW’s life & future effectiveness. I’d just tell him, your #1 job is to keep RW clean every play. maybe we’ll throw the ball your way occasionally if you are lucky. In past years, blocking TE’s have had significant success in helping the below average OL’s we’ve had. If Kittle is indeed a quality blocking TE as advertised, he could be a big help to the young OL in both the run & pass game and that would be very valuable, not to mention RW’s continued health being super valuable as well.
In any event, keep up the excellent work Rob, you are the “boss”. The NFL network needs you on their payroll for draft commentary, it would make a lot of their draft “coverage” much more bearable as well as informative to us fans. From my observations, NFL network talks about the same 10-15 players over and over and ignore or hardly mention almost everyone else. Not to mention they talk/yell over each other so much, a calm English voice would provide much needed change & respite.
“From my observations, NFL network talks about the same 10-15 players over and over and ignore or hardly mention almost everyone else”
You can double the number to 20-30 but your point is excellent. I’ve made it on other sites for several years. We talk about players with high/low ceiling and high/low floor. That aspect should be aimed at networks and shows. Path to the Draft is only a fraction of its birthright, due to that fixation on perhaps two dozen players. And nothing changes year to year other than the names.
NFL Network in general is one of the worst specialized networks in operation. Replay after replay in prime slots instead of original content. Notice on Path to the Draft there is laughable amount of filler on each episode. When they come back from a commercial break instead of moving immediately to the next topic they waste 2-3 minutes with standard fare video clips from the prior season. Absolute garbage. If it’s Steeler focus day they have to show play after play from Roethlisberger and Bell and Brown, as if we’ve forgotten who plays for that team.
Then this year they find a new low with fantasy emphasis late in every emphasis. Insulting. The only worthwhile addition is the woman who appears perhaps once per week to do the player comparisons. She is excellent and should be utilized every episode.
Rob would quickly become a star on a program like that. For one thing, we’d actually hear meaningful analysis on players who might be drafted in — horrors — the mid to later rounds.
I appreciate those kind words, Jim. Would be a dream come true to do this full time but if not, this place will do for me 🙂
Im a big Kettle fan as well, would love him to be one of are 3rd picks.
Although for the life of me I can not figure out why since we don’t even use Graham properly
Kittle= Hella value in the 4th. IMO.
Kettle, Opps….
Some say Nick Vannett was the top blocking TE in his class…
I’d prefer a dual-threat TE or receiving TE, and perhaps Kittle can do both well
Why does everyone want to draft a blocking TE in the third round? We drafted a blocking TE in the third round last year.
That would be funny, maybe not so much if you’re Richard Sherman…
I’ve been on the blog for about a week now and one thing i do notice is the civility here is pretty good. I’m not saying there aren’t any trolls but so far I haven’t seen any. That’s one advantage to having a site monitor like this, not so much childish name calling and bickering.
Yes, Rob, er, uh I mean Mr. Staton appears to take great pride in the cordial behavior with those who participate. This is by far the most well researched and thoughtful Seahawks site.
Here Here!
Yes, the bickering and namecalling killed the Trib blog I loved, it had gotten out of control. Glad that isnt allowed here.
I only remember Georgia and the annoying guy who always said something like, “yep, yep.” Other than that, I thought it was the best because we could ask Sando, Eric, etc. to ask the players things and they would if the Qs were good. That was the best “insider” experience there was. I remember that blog was killed off when they went to people having to comment with Facebook.
A big reason they went with Facebook was they were sick of the nastiness from folks hiding behind screen names. There a couple real jerks, including the guy that was always making nasty comments about how my family must be miserable and other super personal snide comments. We had a Troll or two impersonating Georgia and me on live chats saying some pretty whack stuff and attributing it to us as well.
Don’t miss the passive aggressive insults but do miss a lot of the regulars who liked to debate and think out loud.
Yeah. I pretty much quit the chats because of people impersonating others (like me). That was a definite turn-off.
Player chats were easily my favorite part. The incessant ads and login issues were what killed it for me.
Brock Huard (who I have great respect for) likes Ryan Ramyczk. In fact he even mentioned trading up for him. No way would I trade up for Ramyczk. Not only that but Ramyczk has health issues.
Agree with you in that I also wouldn’t trade up for any of the OL in this draft. If he falls to us at 26 I would seriously consider it, as he would probably be a very good RT prospect for us as more of a people mover than Bolles, but as you said, with the health concerns (as well as the limited D1 experience), I wouldn’t force the issue.
I’m actually feeling much better about our whole OL situation. Really question just how much better than any of our current starters any of these tackle prospects would be. Fant is just as athletic as Bolles, the same age, and probably a little better at getting push in the run game. So why would we draft Bolles, again? I think Ramczyk is better than Gilliam, but not sure he’s better than Ifedi as a RT prospect, once you take into account health, etc. So why would we draft Ramczyk, again? Don’t get me wrong, Bolles and Ramczyk are probably both better, but to me not *enough* better to be worth R1 and shelving those other guys. Some guards, OTOH, probably are.
I agree, don’t move up for OL in first or second round. Also, I’m not sure Ramczyk is a good fit for Seahawks. I saw some analysis/comments on another site that mentioned his on/off history with football. We don’t want another OL who doesn’t really love to play the game (Moffit, anyone?). When the going gets tough he will not be up to the task. I’m sure Cable and JS are really on top of evaluating mental toughness, attitude and commitment to the grind.
Rd 1 needs to be a real difference maker, and special, as we’ve discussed here. Bolles may be that, but I’m not convinced any others are.
BTW: Thanks for the Mock draft. Tons of good information.
Damn i type slow
I feel like Malachi Dupre would be highway robbery to get him in R3. I’d love a R3 WR, something to upgrade the WR that gets 1 on 1 coverage(usually Kearse).
I day dream alot about the draft and every time we take Dupree in the 3rd
Dang…
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/03/30/scot-mccloughan-speaks-through-michael-robinson/
“He knew the players loved him, and he started feeling the hate from Bruce Allen right around, well, he’s been feeling it, but when they didn’t let him speak [to reporters] at the Senior Bowl, he said to him that was his last straw, and he knew that he was on his way out,” Robinson said Thursday on The Wes McElroy Show, via the Richmond Times-Dispatch. “He said it was after a draft meeting, after the combine, Bruce called him up to his office and was just like, ‘Nobody likes you in this building. Nobody wants you here.’ And Scot was like, ‘Well, I guess I’m out of here.’”
McCloughan also told Robinson he doesn’t have “an issue right now drinking,” and that “I haven’t touched a drink in a while.”
What an absolutely disgraceful organisation they are. I hope they have a terrible draft and implode before sliding back to another decade of mediocrity.
Poor fanbase….
There’s always the Ravens, DC?
Bruce Allen runs off the first decent GM and talen-judge they’ve had just when the team starts to get good. Cannot hardly belive Snyder hasnt fired that nasty troll…
Skins are the new Raiders under Davis. Beyond screwed up…
Allen is a Putz!!!
Read somewhere earlier today an opinion that Tyus Bowser could even possibly slip into the end of R1. He’s apparently looking that good in workouts.
And Daniel Jeremiah posted this yesterday: https://twitter.com/MoveTheSticks/status/847314677545619456
Seems unlikely, but hardly impossible.
It’s a joke to think that Kenny King would last until pick 58. Or Tyus Bowser lasting until the third round.
I don’t know. I think scout and draft analysis perspective might be that King is the odd man out on a loaded secondary. With Jones and Baker it felt like no one really mentioned King all season long, to me.
I think Bowser could last until the late third. He’s got no momentum this off season for whatever reason. He’s got good production and great testing numbers but it feels as if no one can identify his position. He needs more skills to be a pure edge rusher and probably more weight. And he needs to get better diagnosing plays if he’s going to be a full time LB.
I think the first round will be littered with surprises this year. Purely because there are going to be about 40 players with similar grades. Teams will make their preferences based on so many minor details. It’ll make this draft so hard to predict.
Actually, Im thinking that will make it one heck of a lot fun this year-I like the sound of it! Looking forward to this as much as any year I can remember.
+1
Rob completely agree!
Source on that Bowser bit?
I wasn’t crazy about the little tape I watched
Sorry, I can’t remember where. Looked through a lot of stuff today… 🙂
Anyway, I agree on Bowser: his tape is underwhelming. But that’s because he’s at DE, whereas a team that would take him late R1/early R2 would be buying into his potential as a LB in space. And he very well could become special there in a a couple year’s time.
Rob is right on, it all depends on what teams like and it only takes one to make him their pick.
Yeah you did!!!
Props to you man for sharing all of these pro day numbers.
It would be cool if Rob had a Pro Day Weekly Rewind type thing during draft season
Just for another perspective, Tony Pauline has Bowser with a 6th round grade as an OLB.
I think 6th round is too low he’s not quite jamie Collins for testing but he’s certainly no slouch. i reference Collins because he was coming from an even smaller production so transition to NFL had to be a bigger concern and he went in the second round.
I think late 3rd is Bowser’s floor. I think there are a good deal of teams that are going to look at the raw player, see the pre-injury production, and think tey can work with that.
Folk’s Emory Hunt came up with a very credible/realistic draft. (You will not see Kenny King lasting until pick 58 in this draft. Or Tyus Boswer lasting into the 3rd round. )
Rd 1) Obi Melifonwu
Rd 2) Julien Davenport: 6’7 OT 317 Bucknell.
Rd 3) Brendan Langley: 6’2 CB 195 Lamar
Rd 3) Keionta Davis: 6’3 275 Edge rusher Chattanooga.
Rd 3) Ejuan Price: 5’11 Ejuan Price 5’11 235 linebacker/Edge Rusher Pitt
Rd 6) Jared Katz: 6’2 200 CB Columbia
Rd 7) Tyler Conduit: 5’11 LB New Haven
http://footballgameplan.com/fbgps-building-through-the-nfl-draft-seattle-seahawks/
Folks: CHECK these guys out. I think you will like them. I have been searching for Edge Rushers/CBs in the 3rd round. I like these guys. I like these players alot.
F no to Davenport anywhere near that high
That dudes reading shit from August with that
Back to back pass rushers and another cb and linebacker??
Not what I’d call credible/realistic
With the talent available in certain pockets of this draft I’d be really underwhelmed by this.
Yea that draft does nothing for me, I don’t mind a couple of small school guys but not the whole draft.
I like Price as UDFA…
During the SR. Bowl I was hot on Davis. I started acquiring as much tape on him as possible. I don’t trust a player who show’s in the main event and cannot dominate at a lower level. That does not show love for the game nor competitiveness.
BTWE: Ejuan Price: Price’s playing style is very similiar to James Harrison.
Check out his strength’s
STRENGTHS Quick-twitch athlete with elite playmaking production over last two seasons. Stutter steps and head fakes in rush approach causes uncertainty for tackles. Able to juke inside and bounce back out to create an edge opening as rusher. Built low to ground and plays strong through redirect blocks to trim the edge. Flashes explosive spin counter that can create wins. Absolute bulldog when he smells a sack opportunity. Stout and strong. Big burst to close out quarterbacks. Disruptive in gaps against the run. Sudden stunts inside are often too quick for tackles to counter. Willing to take chances to make plays in backfield.
Worth remembering that James Harrison is about as clean as a Mogadishu sewer. Price is an interesting guy to look at though, will have to take a look at him. Not sure if the Hawks will like him taking chances though, they’re so big on scheme discipline.
I absolutely hate the way his motor can run so cold, especially when the play is going away from him. Zero hustle is not something I think the Seahawks would tolerate, regardless of the level of talent.
What is your thought on a different approach like since the DB depth will be so good this year, why not wait until the 3rd for a CB and S depth. With the first 2 picks we could look at OL/DL/LB players while the rest of the league is taking the top off the DB depth.
The problem will probably be:
— The top O-liners will go early
— If you draft a linebacker that early, how are you getting them on the field for a high % of snaps?
— Ditto a D-liner given they have Bennett, Clark and Avril and it’s not a good interior DL class
On top of that, while there is depth the best players at #26 will quite possibly be DB’s. So you’d almost be fighting the board for the sake of depth later on.
That’s not to say they wouldn’t go O-line at #26 if the right player fell. If Bolles or Lamp somehow slip through the cracks that could be a distinct possibility. I think it’s unlikely though.
What they might do is take a DB at #26, not take one in round two and go back to CB and S in round three. Something like DB-OL-LB-CB-S for example with their first five picks. Although I suspect they’ll take a TE in rounds 2-3 and/or a receiver looking at the options out there.
If they move down, as proposed in the 7-round mock, and get eight picks they could do:
DB-OL-LB-TE-CB-WR-S-DL
Thank you for all your hard work Rob!!! Very nice mock. You knocked it out of the park Mate….
Nice professional, informative and kind response.
Rob love your analysis but I gotta believe we draft 9 plus players! Don’t forget kickers & QB’s.
As you know we like to trade back.
Just add another pick to the list.
The good stuff is at the top, buddy
Then you’re playing strength on strength
The OL basically SUCKS all throughout. He’s projecting a pocket of OL we may like in the early-mid third.
The CBs will be pretty good until the end of the second with some options late
Outside of Luani, I don’t like many late safeties either
The LBs have a pocket just before our first round native and at the top of the second. I like a lot of mid and late options at both LB and edge rusher.
I want Jarrad Davis, Obi Melifonwu, Justin Evans with our first in that order
Kenny
Do you have any concern watching tape of Evans being very hit and miss in his down by down play? He has enough hits to make a powerful and fun highlight reel, but I was deflated by the number of wiffs, missed tackles, and what appeared to be a lack of a nose for the ball more often than not. Great ” best of” tape, but game tape seemed to tell a different story . . . . Thoughts?
I didn’t really notice missed tackles like that.
Coachable?
I think it’s coachable. As long as the desire is there to lay the wood. I seem to recall and it still happens now and again that Earl Thomas used to fly around looking to destroy people and honestly it didn’t always work. Though Seattle’s scheme seemed to minimize the damage caused by whiffs. And now Earl is Earl and has moments of position defining success. The “karate chop,” against St louis to stop a sure TD. If he lays the wood in mid flight there the St louis player surely gets a TD.
I think Evan’s game is pretty good now, and could be great. And you have to love those Pro-day numbers for him. I know the concern is him being a “Taylor Mays.” That I couldn’t say for sure. I think you could only know something like that if you could talk to the players.
The LSU tape is probably your best bet for that, there’s some very ordinary work in there.
I’d agree with that order. I know people can’t really see it with Davis but if Seattle looks to add some big dudes on the DL for the point of attack then I wonder if they are looking to play 4-2-5 a little less then we expect?
My though process goes: If you add a true NT or NT like player but you are in 4-2-5 then who rushes as you move the pocket? no one. But if you add a NT unless you are signaling more CB blitz or maybe blitzing with a big nickel/ Buffalo. Which I’m fine with if it works and you can get a player with wheels like Obi.
But overall, traditionally big bodied dudes seems like 4-3 alignment where you can rush with LB’s and edge players.
Oh and Jarrad Davis has got to be my favorite defensive player in the draft…..so there’s that!
The big guys generally come off the field in Seattle for third down/passing downs.
They stay on for early downs because Seattle wants to play gap control and take away the run. Making an opponent one-dimensional and being opportunistic when you’ve achieved that appears to be Seattle’s mantra.
Alright Kenny (Vol, Rob, whoever else), I threw together some Google Docs as mentioned in the last thread. I was only able to put together DTs and WRs to start since those are the positions I looked into and commented on recently. Actually, most of my notes there are just copy/paste of my comments posted here. I don’t mean for this initiative to replace our comments here, but rather to gather into one place what usually remains spread out throughout different threads and build off each other’s thoughts as we near the draft.
The other positions are just blank templates for the moment, but feel free to start throwing some names in there and get them going. Remember, the idea is more prospects you like for the Hawks in a range we think they are more likely to go that way, not a complete rundown of all prospects at the position.
I put some instructions at the top of each page as a suggestion, but ideas are welcome as to how to go about it. The WR page is how I thought they might start out, and the Nose Tackle/Big DT page is getting closer to what the finished format could look like. I even added some pictures just to give an idea of body type.
Anyway, I figured we could just get started and see as we go what ends up working best and being most enjoyable for us all.
LINK: SDB Community Scouting
P.S. Don’t worry too much about formatting either. Just get your color right so we know who’s talking and we’ll take care of making it look pretty later if we decide to. I’m kind of a “formatting OCD” anyways, so I’ll probably be touching it up as we go. 🙂
Excellent. I’ve got it bookmarked and will add some stuff tonight.
We should link a bunch of Rob and others’ pieces relevant to preferences and paragons at positions
I also want to have a conversation about ” significant upgrade at a position of need” theory and what it means to the seahawks draft this year.
We know they use this philosophy, but what do they really think needs upgrading?
Certain depth positions? Special Teamers?
Is this how they order their board? Impact vs Upgrade?
In other words: Do they draw up their board saying “This is where we take our starters, this is where we start taking small role starters, then backups, then special teams etc.”?
Obviously not so black and white like that.
For instance I don’t know that John Schneider would ever draft a Kicker
How does Schneider rate QBs? He’s drafted one and he’s a potential HOFer (knock the shit out of some wood) and apparently one of the greatest steals in history.
Why have we never taken a Corner before the fourth?
Is it the low impact they are presumed to have as rookies?
Has the need not been there with our steady production line following Browner and Sherman?
One thing is for sure. They’re not going to take anyone “Basic” with a high pick.
Adoree Jackson, Melifonwu, Kevin King, Justin Evans, Jarrad Davis all of them rare athletes and characters. Nothing basic about them
If we stay at 26 one of those will be the pick
Whoa, read my mind on “significant upgrade at a position of need”. Just posted about that below without having seen your comment!
And yes, I think you should add your CB piece as well, maybe cutting out a few.
Sweet, Kenny! Any one of those at 26 would split me with an ear-to-ear grin.
Magmatizer posted in yesterday’s blog Rob but hopefully you get a chance to revisit Demarcus Walker soon. I know that he had been losing draft momentum since the Senior Bowl but his pro-day results have finally come in and they are quite encouraging.
Height: 6’3″
Weight: 280 lbs
Arms: 34 6/8″
Hands: 10 3/8″
40-yd: 4.76
Bench Press: 20 reps
Broad Jump: 9′ 7″
Does he re-enter your considerations for the second round?
4.76 is moving for 280. Was there a 10 yard split on that. I still like Walker at 2 myself.
Couldn’t find any mention of the 10-yard split unfortunately. Would have loved to have seen that 1.5x split.
Some of the quotes from Walker after his performance on his pro-day:
“I made about $8 million today,” Walker told a friend.
“I just had to show them that I can move,” Walker said of his mobility. “Their biggest question was, ‘We want to see him move’ with their own eyes.
“I came in here with a chip on my shoulder. I was ready to work.”
“When I finished off the workout I said, ‘Sorry for the wait,’ because that’s what they were waiting on,” Walker said. “They’ve been waiting on me to move, so sorry for the wait.”
“My film is awesome,” Walker said. “My numbers, no one’s better from D-tackle to D-end. They just wanted me to come out and show it to them. That was my only thing. I had to come out here at pro day to show them.”
“It’s just something I love,” Walker said. “I just love pushing myself, showing people, and proving people wrong. That’s my thing. So I came out here and just did it.”
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/florida-state-seminoles/chopping-block/os-sp-florida-state-demarcus-walker-pro-day-20170328-story.html
Wow love that chippiness
His stock among the national media has fallen like a rock.
Probably rubs some the wrong way but not this team.
I want him in the third though
Possibly. Always been a fan but it’s been a really strange off season for Walker.
Rob, these thought process articles are always my absolute favorites. Thanks.
The recent press conferences and free agency helped tremendously to project where they might be headed:
– Missing out on Lang, which means they covered enough other bases to maybe draft a guard early if the value is there (Lamp).
– Signing Lacy, RB seems unlikely unless they fall in love with a late-round guy. (Carson)
– Signing “best LB competition in years”, no need to fight the strength of the draft and reach in R1-R2.
– Signing McDougald, a backup for both Safety spots and possibility at Buffalo, means you could go CB first. (Obi, King, Adoree with Lane moving outside)
What I am mulling over now and think could add to the discussion i this:
We know the Hawks grade prospects against their own roster, not for the league. So what is the biggest improvements we could draft over our current roster? Put into names, if they were available, which combo would represent the biggest upgrade, considering what you might be able to get later on? You only get to pick one from each round and one from each || column ||:
– R1: Lamp over Glowinski/Aboushi || Adoree/Obi over Lane || Obi/King over CB2 || C. Davis over Kearse
– R2: Moton/Siragusa over Gilliam || Evans/Maye over Lane || Tank over CB2 || Engram/Godwin over JK
– R3: Asiata over Glowinski/Aboushi || ??? over Lane || Rasul/Griffin over CB2 || Z. Jones/Arboh over JK
– R4+: Bisnowaty/TEF project over RG/RT || Luani over Lane || Lane/Desir over CB2 || Chesson over JK
Too low for Evans imo but I’m not positive
Forrest Lamp
Marcus Maye
Rasul Douglas
Chesson
I think Kittle and Luani will be around later than the blog thinks
But do we not also hedge for contract year players?
Should TE and SS not be considered need positions
What about DE depth? DT?
How do they rate/compare Fant, Gilliam, and Joeckle?
A lot of people have kittle at their #4 TE available his ceiling will be middle of round 4
He is a stud
I haven’t seen that anywhere.
Howard, Engram, Njoku, Hodges, Butt, easily ahead of him. Lots of other names.
Not convinced he’s unavailable in the fifth. Ditto Luani
No-one was even talking about him before Vol brought him up.
Check the NFL network guys almost all of em have him in their top 5
If I remember right they have Butt ranked out of the top 5 due to the injury
PFF has Kittle at #4
From 9 days ago.
He must track pro days.
Shaheen #3 for me.
I think Butt (heh heh) is the perfect selection for us as he is a prototypical TE and we don’t need one right away. We can redshirt him. Our lineup is set for now, but we WILL need reinforcements next year.
I really enjoy your posts Sea Mode, and thank you for this one. With all the national mocks going, it’s easy to forget how the Seahawks set-up their board and look at roster mirroring rather than just ‘need 1, need 2’.
Based on your options, I go:
1. Obi/King over CB2
2. Engram/Godwin over JK
3. Asiata over Glowinski/Aboushi
4. Luani over Lane
Slight proviso: I’d use the words ‘compete with” instead of “over”! Cheers!
Glad to see you add Awuzie to the slot CB consideration. Purely speculating but I see him drafted after Baker & Jackson and the possibility of adding another 3rd in a trade down scenario is enticing in this particular draft. It’s the most exciting group of prospects that I can remember in rounds 1-3. Makes you wish for about 10 picks in those top 3 rounds.
My favorite WR no one talks about: Josh Reynolds – Texas A&M
Production: 2,778 yds in 3 years. Led SEC as senior with 1,039 yds. Tied conf. lead w 12 TDs
Grit: put up 842-13td as a soph a a torn labrum in his shoulder
Special Teams: downed 3 punts inside the 10 yd line
Big play: as a senior, 11 0f 61 catches were more than 30yds
Senior Bowl: 5-96-1 (Hawks like senior bowl performers)
Reynolds: 6’3″, 195 Kearse 6’1″, 209
Reynolds: 4.52 (40) Kearse 4.58 (40)
Reynolds: 37″ (vert) Kearse: 34″ (vert)
Reynolds: 10-4 (broad). Kearse: 9-11 (broad)
“We’ve had some record-breaking dudes (Mike Evans), but Josh, talent-wise, might be the best. He might be the best I’ve ever coached.” – David Beaty ( former a&m assistant)
I like Reynolds. Sleeper pick…
I like him a lot.
I’d take him in round 3.
This entire wr class is filled with underrated gems.
Im not sure there is any other player I would want us to draft at #90 than Sidney Jones however its a pipe dream that he will last that long, I am feeling very high on Justin Evans if he last to #58 that would be ideal! But sadly that too is very unlikely Tank or Quincy at #58 would be lovely and Marcus Maye at #90 would be satisfying for me.
Also throw in S Grffin and Ahk Witherspoon at #90 as viable options
Does anyone know the measurables on that big CB from FSU cant think of his name
Also anyone know the measurables on Houston’s CB Howard Wilson?
This guy?
Marquez White, CB, Florida State
Height: 5-11. Weight: 184. Arm: 32.13. Hand: 9.88.
40 Time: 4.59.
Disclaimer: dunno if pro day reflected
He has 10 inch mitts, biggest of a CB at the combine.
Allowed only one touchdown in two years of starting in a loaded secondary.
Actually, the Seahawks did not want to start Sherman at CB as a rookie. They started old and broken down Trufant and then started Thurmond at CB… only after WTIII got hurt for the remainder of the season were they forced to start Sherman. They really wanted to stay away from a rookie starting at CB.
Chad Reuter’s five-round mock:
Seattle’s Pick vs Notable players still available (in draft order)
1. Kevin King – Obi Melifonwu, Garret Bolles, Jarrad Davis, Adoree Jackson, Tyus Bowser
2. Taylor Moton – Demarcus Walker, Marlon Humphrey(!), Justin Evans, Chris Godwin
3. Jordan Legget – Ahkello Witherspoon
3. Carroll Phillips
3. Nico Siragusa – Rasul Douglas, Josh Reynolds, Antonio Garcia, Alex Anzalone, Isaac Asiata, Vince Biegel, Joe Mathis, Malachi Dupree, Dalvin Tomlinson
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000796324/article/reuter-5round-mock-draft-surprise-qb-lands-in-round-1
Liked this a lot when I saw it. Don’t think Moton will be there at 58 but I like it all
That would be an outstanding draft to me – love King, Moton (as a guard), and Siragusa (also as guard, bookend guards?). Not big on the first two third rounders. Would definitely take Spoon over Leggett. I see Tawan Taylor is available at the Phillips pick (or Kittle), would swap that as well. Not necessarily balanced so probably not realistic but to me that’s two starting cbs, two starting guards, a potential starting wr (in three wr sets).
Definitely like the thought of going with Moton in the second if he is there.
Excellent post, Rob. +1 for the Godwin mention. We’re set as if the draft was tomorrow. What are we going to do the next 3+ weeks?
Ha right
Just watched this 7 round mock for the Hawks on YouTube. Looked like a solid mock. Any thoughts y’all?
https://youtu.be/YfCJuRX29n4
I hate that mock
Meh
Hard to look at some drafts now that don’t do a good job thinking through Seahawk requirements, needs and drafting history the way Robs mock and some of our other more informed mocks here have done.
Guys : Poll question. Which is a bigger need for Seattle. Tight-End or Wide Receiver.?
I’d say WR simply because Kearse is still on the roster and PRich still needs to prove he can stay healthy.
Wide Receiver for me. Kearse might be gone, Lockett broke his leg but most likely will be back to normal and PRICH is most likely gone. It’s not thin now but could be in 1 year. I think we resign Graham at some point
I think PRich is going to have a breakout year.
I’d have to think they resign Graham as well. He seems to fit very well with Wilson, is for all the goofy “cut Jimmy! trade Jimmy!,” chatter online (mostly other sites) is actually extremely productive. I think he’ll have a monster year this year with a full year to rebound from a brutal injury.
Based on talent easy to say he will have a monster year, then you throw in beavell factor and you get meh. Who knows maybe he finally spent some of his off season watching N.O or N.E game film and get’s it figured out.
I think our QB is as much to blame as the OC when it comes to Graham’s production.
I think our practice squad WRs can play a little. Not sure if it’s a bigger need but I’d rather grab a TE outta this deep class with Willson and graham both up next year
+1
WR. We need 4 or so, we have 1 elite slot guy, Lockett off injury, and Richardson who has yet to geet/stay on the field for a season. TE we have Graham and Willson.
That said we should draft a TE and 1-2 receivers. Corey Davis at 26, Chris Godwin in 2nd~3rd, guys like R. Davis and I. Zamora late. I’m not a big fan of Hodges despite his athleticism. Howard and Njoku are excellent 3-down types. Engram is a great receiving option who isn’t a terrible blocker; has improved that area, who likely goes by mid round 2. I like Kittle and a few others after the big 3.
I love Engram and think he would be a nice compliment to a guy like Vannett. How big of a shocker if we trade down into the 2nd and Engram is our first pick? It won’t happen, but it would be cool if it did.
I reread a Keith Myers article from February about Pierre Desir. When you compare him to the corners in the draft he sounds really enticing. Quoting Myers “He’s tall (6-1) with long arms giving him the length Seattle loves. He’s also a great overall athlete, posting a 133 inch broad jump, a 6.86 three cone, and an 11.6 second 60-yard shuttle at the NFL Combine in 2014. Thrown in good hands, smooth hips and a great work ethic, and there’s very little not to like.” He’s also had a good amount of time on the practice squad to learn the Seahawk kick-step technique.
When you look at the corners they’ve quietly acquired and the possible hybrids such as McDougald and McDonald (yes that’s correct) they may not be as destined to take a DB in round one as we’ve assumed. In fact starters and primary depth for the three positions targeted, DB, LB, OL may all be on the roster already. They really are in prime position to take somebody that drops or a difference maker like Adoree Jackson or trade down for 4th and 5th round picks. TE is even possible if one of the top three guys drops and if a pass rusher falls into their hands that’s always a consideration for this team. This is a fun lead up to the draft and training camp should be great too.
LB and OL perhaps, CB less likely.
Pass rusher in the first really makes sense, one of the top guys will be there for us and could even be there after a trade down if the board falls right. Add in some secondary picks later on (Tankersley, Luani) and the defense gets a real spark
But we already have Avril, Bennett, and Clark. That’s a position of strength for the next couple years at least.
Where are our weakest positions that would be the most significant upgrades? OL, CB. I think that’s the way to go early.
Take a high-ceiling pass rusher project on Day 3, or grab a rotational guy like Demarcus Walker if he happens to fall to our picks in R3, but early on I think we have to nail either OL or CB for sure, if not both.
We can get our starting corner in the 2nd round, and OL in the 3rd. Bennett and Avril are aging and out of contract soon. Frank’s all we got besides them. Marsh is ok but I would be upset if we’re ever to start other than injury.
As the great Pete Carroll once said, “you can never have enough pass rushers.”
I’d agree but I can’t think of any pass rushers with the team’s native pick in the first that you can count on to automatically kill it at the next level.
I know there’s a lot of love on this site for TJ Watt but if I can be honest you’re looking at a player’s potential more than production. One year of high production, in a system that is actually pretty different than Seattle’s….more of a 3-4, more Blitzing concepts as opposed to rushing 4 linemen, could make it hard for Seattle to go pass rusher at 26. And I think Watt is the best prospect at that spot.
I also agree that “father time,” is a real thing to consider with Avril and Bennett and Seattle would do well for itself to draft one or two Pass rushers or have One drafted and bring in a tweener LB or two for Sam duties and/or have some UDFA’s battle it out for a pass rushing presence.
And it looks to me that it’s less and less likely that Seattle can nail any position besides DB early with such a scarcity of OL talent to draft from.
Obviously if Bolles, Lamp, and for me Asiata are available I’d love the team to pull the trigger, otherwise I think just make one Unit as strong as strong can be. And for me that is the DB’s.
You can never have too many pass rushers, Cassius marsh is on our roster taking snaps and achieving nothing. So by your statement we dont need to replace him – ie you arent interested in real competition and you would rather see the defense decline.
Its this simple When age is a factor you are getting better or you are getting older, slower, more injury prone, stagnant.
Im at a point where I think that Demarcus walker in the 2nd might be a steal after his proday.
1Adoree
2Demarcus Walker
Marsh gets a bad rap by some fans. As essentially the 4th or 5th wheel in a pass rush he is perfectly acceptable.
Personally I when someone says acceptable it seems as if you are settling, which seems like the mentality we have had as we have declined from the best team in the NFL to an above average Team.
Out of our pass rushers
Bennett Avril Clark marsh…. we still have a void left by Clemons / Irvin. Avril and bennett are aging and we need to develop talent to replace them. I see Demarcus Walker as the future Bennett, he is similar in that tweener mode and seems very violent with the hand usage, and already accustomed to lining up all over the formation. WE can start him as a relief rotational player and have the accomplished rushers train him up. Actually having talent working in the rotation instead of JAGs (MArsh/OBS/Robinson).
Can you see where im coming from Rob?
I want all of our picks to hit but I think Marsh is on the bubble and deservedly so, nothing to show in his entire career sack wise – Just a awesome Gif from the penalty call last year.
Clark joined after Clemons had departed. Irvin hasn’t been replaced but the Seahawks used their SAM about 20% of the time last year. So his role, in theory, doesn’t exist any more.
+1
Sidney Jones would be the most acceptable player for Seattle to draft that might not see the field in 2017. Imagine having Sidney Jones learning the kick-step while completing his healing process. Imagine Sidney Jones becoming available for the playoffs as a slot defender. Sweet.
Stop all that overly optimistic and hopeful thinking about such a great player like Sidney.
I find it disgusting . . . 😉
Jones as a redshirt would be awesome, despite arm length.
Rob or anybody…does Asiata have any Center potential? Haven’t heard that anywhere, but was curious nonetheless. Thx
Yup. Before he got hurt at the SR bowl he was taking reps at C.
Sure
VMAC visitor alert!
Texas A&M DE Daeshon Hall
Seattle loves them some A&M prospects
Explosive. 35″ arms too. Tons of upside.
Thought he was the best player going through the drills day 1 of the SR bowl. Keep in mind, Seattle also loves to draft from the SR bowl as well.
Your comment has me thinking: how many Juniors have the Hawks drafted in the PCJS era vs. Seniors?
We know they sometimes appreciate the older, more mature guys (age, married, etc.). So I’m wondering if they don’t put a pretty good plus on guys who have stuck to it and gone through the full college program and earned their degree.
Taking Seniors might also make it easier to know what kind of leader you are getting, since they are usually set up to be the leaders in their college program. So you can better evaluate how they are likely to respond when presented with a leadership opportunity.
Not many. Its usually SR’s. Last year for example, out of 10 picks, 3 were JR’s. A lot of it is also probably due to the fact that you have a bigger pool of talent to select from with the seniors as well.
I think we can expect a couple Jr’s this year, but my money is on most of their selections being upper class men.
2014 & 2015 I don’t think one of their draft picks was a junior from either class.
What is his range because I love the guys game
Same here, aside from stiffing UW to go to A&M ☹️. Late 2nd-3 maybe? Excited that he’s a V-Macker. A future of Clark & Hall helps me sleep at night.
Seahawks attended Manitoba’s pro day. There was 1 guy there and he lit it up!
OL Geoff Gray- 6’5, 315 lbs., 34″ arms- 31″ vert, 25 reps on the BP, 9’6″ broad jump, and a 10 yd split of 1.87! That is lightning fast for a dude that big. Wow!
👀
Saw some nice tape of Gray. Dominating IHOP kinda guy. Lots of pancakes.
Nice catch! That’s fast and explosive.
3.07 TEF
96.71 wTEF
(don’t have my TEF calculator sheet with me, so I hope I didn’t mess that up by hand)
He rode a goddamn unicycle after his workout.
Probably one of their O-line targets is he ends up as an UDFA, but he has plenty of draftable traits.
I’m sure PC loves that. Tom Cable on the other hand seems pretty against Unicycle enthusiasts to me!
From the sound of it, that’s the kind of guy I could see Seattle using a 7th-round pick on if they are not absolutely certain they can bring him in as an undrafted FA.
Watched some clips of Ejuan Price over at DB, and liked what I saw. An edge rusher who is a handful and a 3 down player. It is not unusual these days to see players without knee pads, and with the knee fully exposed. But, Bermuda shorts? His pants come down to mid-thigh in both games.
Robert Davis WR Georgia State, blew the doors off SPARQ (2.3).
6’3″ 220. What round will he go? I’ve not heard much about him previously. I was surprised to find out he was related to Thomas Davis of Carolina Panther fame.
Priority UDFA? Maybe in the 7th. He’s a great specimen but the one tape I watched he didn’t effect anything positively. A body catcher. Didn’t extend his hands to snatch the ball out of the air. Finally at the size/speed he is at the level of competition he played at you’d like to see him dominate the defense.
One caveat to the above is that his QB looked horrible. So Maybe he’s a late round pick and Seattle grooms him for a year.
1. Taco Charlton (Our future DEs would already be good friends)
2. Cordrea Tankersley
3. Nico Siragusa
3. Vince Biegel
4. Shalom Luani
5. George Kittle
6. Jehu Chesson
7. Adam Bisnowaty
What you get with every pick in this draft is solid competition at their respective positions.
I’m assuming we trade a 3rd round pick for a 4 and 5
Thats a nice draft. I’d be surprised and happy if Chesson and Bisnowaty fall that far. Kinda doubt Tankersley is there at the bottom of the second though; he’s too good to last past the beginning of the second…
Taco won’t be there in the 1st. Take King there. Also no 5th, and Kittle won’t last either. Not bad guesses otherwise. I like snagging that OL Gray from Manatoba too, if possible.
King is now rated #3 CB.
Not enough DBs for my taste, but I like all of the players, that’s great.
Now that their are more former Seahawks coaches who are head coaches and teams that are trying to implement our style of defense (saints, falcons, raiders). We are competing for the players that fit our d. When a couple years back we were the only kid on the block. My fear is our guys are going to be gone when we pick. If there was a year to jump up in round two this would be it. Trade down in round one. Then up in round 2.
Brian Baldinger of the NFL Network just ranked Ryan Ramczyk ad his number one ranked tackle in this draft. So now that is two votes (Brock Huard, Brian Baldinger) for Ramczyk.
Much prefer Bolles personally.
Former NFL OG Ross Tucker said Bolles was his number one tackle. Loved his tenacity. So that’s two votes each 😉
I think it depends on what flavor you want.
In this case I am going with Rob/Ross Tucker. But I do like a lot of what I am hearing about Ramczyk. My concern with Ramczyk is that he is having surgery.
I don’t really get the Ramczyk buzz. You’re still looking at a player with not a ton of experience at the FBS level like Bolles, who is still recovering from injury. So you don’t know what you get athletically.
Ramczyk does come from Wisconsin so they run a pro-style which is great. But Seattle doesn’t and has a scrambling “flying dutchmen,” at QB sometimes so I would look to Bolles all things relative and hope other teams are turned off y Bolles’ age so Seattle can draft him and mess up Rob’s hard work over the last two months!
Fantastic breakdown of your mock draft Rob! And the podcast with you and Kenny was excellent as well. Made me want to find the play you described of USC’s Jackson chasing down the RB late in a game they were losing 31-3. Found this 3:30 min. video on YouTube of some of his highlights of that game against Alabama, starting off with that play.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=najw1StwGQc
He has a similar play at 2:35 in the clip from the 1st qtr. of the game, chasing down a RB when he starts out across the field and at least 20 yards back, also saving a TD. What closing speed on this guy! Shows his coverage skills at 1:30 batting down a pass, and a great tackle of a RB as soon as it’s handed off at 1:50, along with a couple good returns, mainly the last one right before it ends.
Derek Barnett with a 37″ vertical leap this morning, up from 31″ from the combine. His testing today should crush his combine numbers, where he was vomiting his guts out with a virus. It’s admirable that he even competed at the combine, given the illness. I really like this player.
Well so much for that… Tennessee just issued a correction, stating that he repeated his combine performance of 31.” His 40 timed at only 4.80-4.90.
Disappointing… oh well, another name checked off the list of potential targets.
And now Adam Schefter is reporting that Barnett is gutting it out through a strained hammy today. Poor guy can’t catch a break.
Seahawks CB Richard Sherman was asked about the trade rumors that recently surfaced that teams have contacted Seattle about his availability.
“I wouldn’t want to leave this city and my guys, but I understand it’s a business and organizational philosophies change,” Sherman told Gee Scott of 710 ESPN.
This is gold…
https://twitter.com/TonyZ19/status/847535217011286016
John Schneider at the Texas Tech pro day apparently.
For who?
Possibly Tyler Scalzi. They have a long CB too.
I think you’ve got the right guy. Found this on him:
“Nicknamed ‘Tarzan’ by two scouts I spoke too about Scalzi, he doesn’t just look the part..but plays like it too. Throughout the years at Tech, he was utilized in a variety of ways. Be it defensively at linebacker, offensively at Tight-End, Fullback, H-Back, or on special teams, where he played all cores. He has the skill set for all these roles, and more importantly, the guts to do it all.”
@AaronWilson_NFL
Cowboys showing interest in Texas Tech tight end Tyler Scalzi (37 reps today, 36 vertical, 10-6 broad jump)
7:52 AM – 31 Mar 2017
Listed at 6-4, 238 those are great numbers.
I feel like there’s 6 different options realistically @26, and the evidence says the Hawks likely trade down. If we came away with some mixture of these players I would be over the moon:
CB King
CB Jackson
CB Melifonwu
LB Watt
TE Kittle
WR Robert Davis
OL Asiata
OL Bisnowaty (who has fallen waaaay off and might be a 5-6 round robbery)
LB Biegel
LB Davis
I feel like there’s at a minimum 3 pro bowl caliber players in that list, and specifically with Watt, I feel like he is still developing and has such a nose for the ball. WR Davis, while performing against weaker opponents showed a gigantic catch radius and ability to win 50/50 balls with his errant QB. I feel like he is a potential star in the making if given an opportunity to learn the NFL game.
If we end up with more than two of these players I might pass out from sheer joy.
Agreed. Although at least 1,if not 2 of them would need to be DBs. LB is almost a luxury.
Check out what my guy NT Glen Antoine Idaho is doing @337 lbs.
https://twitter.com/BigG_Antoine/status/847531174750806021
That’s explosive.
We know how much the Hawks love their Texas A&M OL. Will they make it 3 this year, pairing this guy up with Ifedi to form a monster right side of the line? This guy sounds like a total Cable guy, all the size and strength they want on the right side, and a serious Seahawks target in R2-R3.
OL Jermaine Eluemunor (6-3 7/8, 334, 33.25 arm, 9.5 hand)
3.05 TEF
101.7 wTEF
28.5 vert
8’7″ broad
34 bench (at combine, didn’t do anything else there due to a tweaked hamstring)
4.85 SS (slipped, said he was shooting for 4.7s or 4.6s)
7.63 3C
“I was told by a scout who was there that Eluemunor’s workout was exceptional.” -Brandt
Liked his Pro Day interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t62_mMoxG3g
Patriots and Eagles worked him out at RT and RG. Lists quite a few other workouts/visits coming up.
Says the knock on him is inexperience, 1 year starter at A&M. But teams like his power and his mentality.
“He’s just strong as a bull,” [Texas A&M OL Coach Jim] Turner said. “You could drive over him with a pickup truck. He’d probably just get up and brush it off and get back in the huddle.”
Turner is aware that Eluemunor’s lack of experience will be a concern for NFL scouts, but Turner believes Eluemunor can use it to his advantage.
“I told him, ‘You need to highlight that for the scouts. Don’t hide that.'” Turner said. “They’re looking for an investment. They’re trying to spend their money correctly. When people realize he’s only played, and started, one year in major college football, and to play the way he did and to develop. … If you watch the [season-opening] UCLA game to the final game, his development is through the roof. That’s just him playing. That’s just getting the snaps that he needed to get.”
I’ve gotta look at that tape, but it sounds like something the Hawks would totally buy into.
Oh, and he’s British. What could be better, right Rob? 😉
Bring on the Brits!
Holy cow, we need to profile this guy, like, SOON!
Wrestling:
Morris Knolls isn’t considered a powerhouse in football, but the Golden Eagles do have one of the best wrestling programs in the state. Eluemunor played offensive line for the football team, growing to 6-foot-5 and 300 pounds, and also posted a 30-7 record in wrestling as a senior and reached the state finals.
“He had a lot of scholarship offers in wrestling,” his father said. “He had a lot of people calling me.”
Adversity:
“Eluemunor received some devastating news following his sophomore season, as he and his father were forced to move back to England for economic reasons.
After a few frustrating months, he begged to move back to the United States and was given another opportunity under the condition he graduate from college and take football as far as possible.”
“Determined to keep playing football, Eluemunor marketed himself to college programs, sending hundreds of emails to coaches around the country before landing at Lackawanna. Eluemunor continued to develop during his two years at the junior college and was offered scholarships by several major programs.”
http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2017/story/_/id/18760459/how-texas-jermaine-eluemunor-crossed-ocean-england-nfl-draft
Robs talked about him with the uk seahawkers
You’re not drafting a finished product
They’re onto us…
@RapSheet
#Clemson CB Cordrea Tankersley had a private workout with the #Cowboys this week. Also taking a top 30 visit there on Monday. 🤔🤔🤔
7:51 AM – 31 Mar 2017
Would be a good pick for them in the late first.
Tank schooled Evans in the Virginia Tech game. Tank won on a contested ball for a interception. Didn’t see much fight for the ball out of Evans…
Schooled Evan Ingram.
Rob, some pretty good info here if you want to mix it up with trades in your next mock:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2700859-matt-millers-scouting-notebook-top-5-coming-into-focus-new-big-board-more
Daniel Jeremiah polled some NFL execs post Combine about which prospect was this off-season’s biggest riser. 2 of 5 said it’s Kevin King.
One exec: “Kevin King’s height, length and ball skills show up on tape, but he was even better at the combine. He owned that event. It’s hard to find corners with that combination of length and movement ability.”
Another exec: “Kevin King is going to go in the first round. He killed it at the combine and his pro day was unbelievably impressive.”
The other 3? Reddick, Cafferty and Engram.
Brock is just not high on Kevin King as a first rounder. That’s the third interview I’ve heard him say that. He’s a dawg and just can’t hide his lack of enthusiasm for him.
I should say, he’s a dawg and you’d think he’d have more favoritism to him, but he really doesn’t get behind King as a seahawk first round pick. Second round, yes, but not first round.
?????????
If you turn out good, I don’t care what round one was drafted in. Or should have been drafted in.
Though I agree with most of you all in your assessments, we may have missed a major opening with Boykin messing up. A mobile QB may be in our draft future. Ideally, all works out or a competent vet is available late. Any prospects in a late round or in Canadian FL?
Here’s another guy JS might have his eye on at Texas Tech Pro Day. Let’s see how he tests:
WR/KR/PR Devin Lauderdale, 5-10, 185
I’ve been thinking recently about how we don’t really have anyone developing behind/backing up Baldwin (5096, 189) in the slot (Lockett is more an outside receiver) and it might be nice to grab one on day 3/UDFA.
Came on as a Sophomore and put up 31/589/7 averaging 19.0 YPC,
as a Junior 43/639/4 averaging 14.9 YPC
then was suspended 6 months after the 2015 season (academics) and then only played in 7 games as a senior (31/307/2 averaging 9.9 YPC).
“For an athlete not to do anything for six months takes a toll on you,” [Offensive coordinator Eric] Morris said. “To his credit, he’s been phenomenal since he’s been back. He busted his tail this summer to get himself back into shape. His body looks probably better than it ever has, so hopefully this’ll be a blessing in disguise as far as him going through some adversity and learning some stuff and coming back with a different mindset.”
4-star recruit, vocal leader in the locker room. And check out the devastating blocks/hits and gritty YAC in these highlights. That’s ADB style: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMyneatsdW0
I think he’s there to watch QB Patrick Mahomes.
Nah scratch that, it is for that H-back. So far, based on their pro days this is what they’re after. Not a traditional TE.
Looking for a more talented Cooper Helfet?
Why? Just to see which of the other teams shows the most interest and might be willing to trade up into R1 to get him?
That, and could be a # of other reasons.
Also DT Ondre Pipkins was there too. Former 5 star recruit.
I hope Mahomes falls to us. Getting a qb on a rookie deal and a 5th year option would be great. I wonder if the Browns would give up the #1 overall pick for Russell.
Wtf?
Hawks showing a lot of interest in Mahomes. If he was there @26 I would just make the pick and not look back. It’s a QB driven league.
Wtf????
Wtf wtf
Most likely looking at him to determine if we can squeeze more draft capital out of a trade partner.
While I wish against it, I think that 4.45 40yd for Justin Evans has been pretty much overturned. Might just depend on which scout is feeding them the info, but both Gil Brandt and Daniel Jeremiah reported:
Safety Justin Evans (5-11 5/8, 195) ran the 40 in 4.57 and 4.64 seconds.
That’s a significant difference, and would also mean he could only play SS/Buffalo and not FS. Let’s see if A&M decide to release any official times.
That’s a small for a 4-2-5. Because he doesn’t have the deep speed to be your field safety and he’s not big enough to up close to the LOS as a ‘force’ defender.
That’s the thing about the 4-2-5. You can still use run Cover 3 as your coverage, but there’s 2 defenders in between the CBs and off the DEs backside. Those are your ‘force’ defenders.
One reason I suspect they like Michigan St S Montae Nicholson more than just a visit? He comes from this defense.
* Force, dogs, same thing different terminology.
His tape ain’t the best, but his personality probably fits this team more than over half thee safeties.
Agree on all points
Disappointing revision on those numbers
I like Josh Jones as an alternative
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=123766&draftyear=2017&genpos=ss
While I put the likelihood of Sherman being traded at 10%, I thought the article below by Bucky Brooks was telling about Sherman’s game in 2016. Could 2016 Sherman be similar to 2014 Revis? A generational talent at CB who is beginning to decline. Might explain part of why the trade talk is heating up.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000796741/article/cleveland-browns-dont-need-qb-richard-sherman-trade-talk
Hopefully all of this talk returns that chip onto Sherman’s shoulder.
This is becoming click-bait.
They’re going to trade him, but they were prepared to possibly lose a draft pick over him?
If a team picking in the top 15 gives us their 2017 and 2018 first for Sherm, I’d trade him in a heartbeat. I don’t think it’s clickbait but I also think it won’t happen. It’s similar to the trade talk about Kam last year or Bennett the year before. That being said, everyone has a price so this shouldn’t be considered a non story. Sherm had a down year by most estimates. Could it have been age? The knee injury? If it’s the former then 2016 Sherm was 2014 Revis with the addition of on the field blow ups at players and coaches, and off the field issues with the local media. If it’s the latter then a healthy Sherm should stay be back to Pro Bowl and First Team All Pro status once again this season.
I don’t think it’s click-bait. This is a story. Seattle had a chance to kill the talk dead this week and chose not to.
That said, it still appears unlikely they’ll trade him. Probably because they won’t get anywhere near the value his talent warrants.
He’s not happy about it to say the least
“Organizational philosophies change” seems to be a subtle jab
Sherman is still Vital for this defense. If Seattle is set up for it I could see a trade next off season but unless they want to significantly weaken the team it ain’t happening in 2017.
If he’s going to be a major distraction and undermine the coaches then you might be weakening the team by keeping him around.
There’s a reason they haven’t quashed this.
You’re finally there Rob. I was one of the lone loons. That’s the point, PC and JS didn’t laugh it off and squash it. Will it motivate him if he isn’t traded, I hope so. I would trade him for a late 1 for the following:
1. Contract expires 2019, so his trade value is probably it’s highest and give $11 million space
2. Age
3. Losing a step
4. Can be a distraction
I’ve been right there with ya. Remove the sentimentality. While still really good, Richard Sherman hasn’t been “Richard Sherman” for two years.
To me, it is all about attitude and that is something only Pete and John can assess. We are all on the outside speculating. If Sherman truly is a distraction and malcontent to too much of a degree for their liking, then I think you have to trade him right? If you can get a first. So I guess it is about attitude AND trade compensation then lol.
But if the attitude isnt right and you can get a first, then Im there with you Ed.
I like Sherman a lot, don’t love him a lot though. My opinion being (no man is bigger than the team he play’s for) Sherman is starting to rub me the wrong way. If the trade value was there, I would do it.
Agree
I think one first round pick would be the best return we could get for Sherman, at least with such a deep draft. And it wouldn’t be a 1st rounder in the top 20. Oakland (if they have the cap room) would be the best fit IMO. Maybe GB or Dallas, but you don’t really want to trade him inside your conference.
They should be able to get a first and a fourth easily.
It’s a bit speculative, but NOS would seem to be the most likely trade partner. They’re clearly trying to emulate the SEA defense, especially the backfield, and they want to get better NOW. They also have 2 R1 picks and 2 R3 picks.
#11 seems too steep a price for Sherman, but #32 is a bit low. Could see something like Sherm + 58 for 32 + 42.
So 26, 32, 42, plus three thirds. King, Jackson, Watt/Bowser or something like that would be awesome for that first trio of picks.
Its not like they were going to have a choice of losing a draft pick, that had nothing to do with us and everything about the league, once we got caught.
Rob i think we should look closer at the other 6’3 corners in this class because they haeks have a history of going for guys with similiar profiles that will be available in the third round. Witherspoon and Douglas are both good corners with potential to be great. I’ve watched a lot of tape on King, Witherspoon and Douglas and I’d like to make a simple chart to indicate, from what i have seen on tape, who i think is best in a few areas
coverage
Witherspoon>King>Douglas
Not a huge knock on King, he got cut up by USC’s receivers both Witherspoon and King gave up similiar catches to Robinson that were just amazing football plays. Honestly i just see Witherspoon sticking to his man better and staying over the top despite pressing his reveiver, something i don’t see from King. Douglas being at 3 is not insult he makes up for it in other areas that might be more valuable ti the Hawks since all 3 guys might need to sit at least 8 or 9 games.
Ball Skills
Douglas>King> Witherspoon
Indisputable Douglas has the best ball skills. Even in one of his worse games (Oklahoma) he had an interception. He has the best feel for jumping routes and going at the ball, the numbers show it, the tape shows it. King is a close second and if he had as impressive numbers as Douglas i would probably put him at #1 and honestly that one handed interception really tempted me to. Witherspoon is better than both at breaking up passes but not great at catching his interceptions he had several drops but is easily the least formidable in this area.
Press
Witherspoon>King >Douglas
Witherspoon presses considerably more and was able to give the speedster John Ross a lot of trouble. Witherspoon was able to force his release and decide his routes. King struggled at times in press and seems to let his man behind him, his athleticism seems to save him, in my opinion he is still quite far behind Witherspoon in this area. Douglas looks like someone the hawks would be starting from scratch with.
Wr Screen Coverage
Witherspoon>King>Douglas
I see Witherspoon pushing his man back more than the other two. He just tends to give the pass catcher less space to run. King gets pushed back at times against the screen and Douglas bites pretty hard. None of them are ideal and will all take some work in this department.
Tackling and run support
King>Douglas>>Witherspoon
Witherspoon has some of the most wretched tackling technique I’ve ever seen. King and Douglas however show a willingness to tackle and come flying in for support. The tackle King made on Bo in the semifinal says enough about his ‘want to’. Douglas is great at tackling too but Kings willingness really sets him apart.
I’m not trying to knock any of these prospects but each comes at a price, if we are going to let the rookie corner sit, rather than start day 1, why would we plan on taking King? He comes at the cost of a 1st rounder while the other two both have similiar measurables. Each of these corners has something that sets them apart from the other and King is the most well rounded. I think the Hawks are set on Adoree or Obi in round 1 personally, both have the potential to instantly start because they are going to be put into a unique roll. One reason i think the Hawks are really hoping for Melifonwu is that he gives the Hawks a 3 down base defense that should be more formidable against the run than our current Nickel set. While drafting Adoree gets us an all star athlete and is by no means a bad pick i think Melifonwu gives us better run stopping ability. This year is great because if they miss out on a guy theres probably someone with a similiar athletic profile the Hawks are targeting. I just have trouble thinking that in a year where we could see Douglas fall to the fifth we don’t get at least 1 of the corners who is of a similiar profile to Sherman. Go hawks!
+1 – Nice job Del. This is what I was pointing out earlier in the thread but you were so much more detailed! I think they can get help for the LOB later in the draft and as Rob has pointed out, get PLAYMAKERS in RD 1 and even 2. That’s why he’s mocking Jackson in RD one I think.
I mean i prefer we go defense early still but RCB may come dissapointingly late for some people. Like i said i think the Hawks are looking for a 3 down base defense that they can call cover 3 play after play with. Continuity is inportant for the defense on this team too, players need to know what others are going to do wothout communication and not switching between nickel and base is a way to combat that. The defense has an opportunity to be really special next year and im excited because we could do it with late round draft picks thanks to the depth of this draft
Also as i said, i really enjoy Jackson and think he will be a great player but i do have my theory on them looking for a base set to run. Thanks for the kind words I’m glad you agree with the sentiment! It took a lot of tape watching for me to feel comfortable enough to know each of the players and im sure a trained eye could do a much better job than me
Really nice breakdown, Del tre! Agree with the assessments in different areas, so I’ll go right to the conclusion.
Considering the draft price and the fact that they will likely have to sit and learn, you ask:
“why would we plan on taking King? He comes at the cost of a 1st rounder while the other two both have similiar measurables.”
1. While size/length measurables are similar, King is an athletic freak. This sets him clearly apart from Douglas.
2. Witherspoon is also a great athlete, but not a total freak like King in short area agility. (3.89 vs. 4.13 SS, 6.56 vs 6.93 3C). What sets them apart mostly, though, is tackling. Witherspoon’s problem appears to be not just technique, but willingess to tackle. This is a deal-breaker for me, and I suspect it will be for the Hawks as well.
3. Of the areas you evaluate, which can be coached and which can not? Press technique, which you noted King struggled in at times, is exactly what the Hawks can teach best. Pair that up with King’s freaky athleticism, and you could potentially end up with a special player well worth the R1 investment. Think Sherman but with better athleticism. You mention that King’s athleticism was saving him at times (true); how good will he be once he is coached up to get into better position and can use that athleticism to excel instead of just recover?
(4. I agree with you though, we might go a different route in R1 and consider Douglas in R3. Brooks and Jeremiah are mocking him to Seattle and others as high as R2, so I highly doubt he can be had as late as R5.)
There has been a lot of talk about Witherspoon’s tackling or whether he was a little soft. When Sherman first came into the League that is exactly how I felt about him. It has only been over the last two or three year’s that I have noticed Sherman has Bulked up and has become a stronger tackler. I am sure Witherspoon can do the same.
I haven’t noticed Sherman bulk up at all. I’ve always thought (still do) he was a slender player who has good tackling form. He’s an effective tackler and think he has been for a long time.
All I can say is, some things go unnoticed.
Sherman was not a the same tackler when he cane into the league as he is now. that is the point I’m making here when it comes to Witherspoon…..
For those Robert Davis fans (like me):
Combine Rock Star Robert Davis Can Play Link: http://rotoviz.com/2017/03/131845/?hvid=4QUbGj
Didn’t realize there was a pay wall for me (they give first 3 free articles)
Diff article, free http://www.southernpigskin.com/sun-belt/robert-davis-proven-ready/
Another player to check out. Chris Odom 6′ 4″ /256 12.5 sacks/17.5 tfl. Arkansas St. Super sleeper. UDFA.
I really think a real sledge hammer at the FB position is essential in any dominate running game. What is our current roster look like at FB and what’s up with the Malcolm Johnson kid? Is he the Sledge hammer we need at that spot?
Delano Hill, Michigan safety would seem like a good mid-round pick. Good size and sure tackler with decent speed and seems to cover well.
I wonder if Jabrill Peppers could be a Candidate in big nickel role?
Do we not talk about him enougb because he’s out of our range?
Or too much of a twenner and lack of coverage skill?
Ignore me if you have comment on this too many times before.
(Rob I Read your blog everyday, really appreciate your work,
12man form Taiwan)
I think Peppers lasting to #26 is the biggest thing. He’d be a great addition, but he’ll most likely be Top-15/20
I think a penetrator next to Reed is needed rather than a nose. Isn’t Reed more of a stout run player?
Two things though:
1 — there aren’t many penetrators in this draft
2 — Seattle’s scheme is, frankly, based on gap control at DT
But what do we do if an early round penetrator falls to us? I’m speculating we take him.
Carroll seems to be happy with current OL roster & the presence of Tom Cable should mean we get to splurge on other positions.
I have no problem with either of those two points. I think we have had to make due, and it’s one reason why we move Clark and or Bennett inside in certain rush packages. 3-techs who can rush – heck, interior linemen who can rush, don’t grow on trees. It’s very rare you get a Gerald McCoy or Aaron Donald. However, if you can find someone who can get rush up the middle next to Reed, even rotationally, I think we could use it. We don’t rely on this, but I believe our defense would be better, particularly on run/pass types of downs, and to keep Bennett and Avril fresh, if need be.
Are there some DTs more dynamic than Reed (or Rubin) you think the team might look at drafting? What does Q. Jefferson due for us in that regard?
I think we may still re-sign McDaniel. I absolutely love Rubin.
I can’t think of an early round penetrator worth having.
Can you see Malik Mcdowell falling to the 20’s?
Yes I see him dropping into R2 — and I don’t think Seattle will touch him.
It’s a bad class for interior DL’s.