Instant reaction: The season is over — and so is this era

This felt like a slightly better version of the Green Bay game.

Both teams took turns to mix between sloppy and dynamic. The delay to Tuesday — and with players missing through Covid — likely took its toll.

Yet just as the Seahawks started the second half with an impressive touchdown drive to lead by seven, they failed to trouble the scoreboard after. The defense gave up some big plays. The house of cards collapsed.

Here’s the thing. When the good moments actually happened, they felt… surprising.

This is where the Seahawks are now.

A three-sack performance from Carlos Dunlap — and a four-sack performance overall by the team — felt astonishing mainly because we haven’t seen it coming in any shape or form.

That scoring drive to start the third quarter? It’s an understatement to say it was unexpected, given how lightweight Seattle’s offense has been.

Jordyn Brooks stopped a screen pass. I almost cracked open a bottle of champagne.

It just goes to show how limited our expectations are now.

There are no moral victories at 5-9. And frankly, anyone who twists this performance into a positive, with the tiny remaining hope for the season on the line, is reaching.

To me, reality bit watching this.

The offense is a disaster zone and has been all year. Shane Waldron hasn’t worked as an offensive coordinator. What do they do well? Where’s the consistency or the creativity? Why can’t they feature key players, star players, in the way the Rams did tonight with Cooper Kupp? Even when other players are absent, the whole thing doesn’t collapse for LA.

The defense just puts you through a range of emotions every week. At times they are so painfully frustrating to watch. Long third downs conversions. Massive, never-ending drives conceded with ease. Hot-knife-through-butter scoring drives. Yards galore. But then they’ll battle back — get stops, make the occasional big play. It’s hard to know what to make of the unit.

Combined you get a bad team. A losing team. One that is boring to watch and hasn’t mustered any excitement short of the two surprising wins against San Francisco.

The Seahawks were playing the role of a second-class team today, trying to stick and battle with a superior foe. A Rams team, it has to be said, that felt in a generous mood. Neither quarterback played well. Yet for all of Matt Stafford’s slop being equal to Russell Wilson’s, Stafford still managed to make enough plays to be a difference.

Today felt like a big step back for Wilson, after it appeared he was moving beyond his finger injury. He was off. He had bad under-throws. This was a decidedly poor performance that suggests he’s still not close to 100%.

And there were just so many avoidable errors. Freddie Swain forcing a five-yard penalty late in the fourth quarter, faking he was getting a direct snap. Alton Robinson gifting the Rams a field goal by running into the kicker.

The refs had a hopeless game too. Absolutely terrible. In particular the non-call pass interference late in the game. It wasn’t the only glaring error. That one more or less ended it as a contest though, especially after Deejay Dallas responded by kicking the football away and getting flagged.

I’m not sure I feel robbed though. Do you? The bad calls annoyed me. But I feel very little angst about it all. I guess that’s what 5-9 does to you. The Seahawks scored one touchdown and basically had one and a half good drives all game. They were 3-11 on third down. They had 214 total yards.

You don’t deserve to win with that offensive output.

The loss ends any slim hope of the playoffs — and anyone who studied the NFC standings and the tiebreaker scenarios, more or less knew the season was over anyway.

And once again attention turns to what’s next.

Albert Breer casually mentioned on social media that he thinks Wilson will be traded to the Giants in the off-season. That might be where the good money lies currently.

The Giants are a mess. The owner is getting pelters from the fans. They had a PR disaster at the weekend, trying to sell loyalty to fans in the form of a free medium soda (but read the small-print). They are terrible on the field too.

A big trade would create waves in New York and curry some favour. The Giants also have the stock to make a move — they currently own the #5 and #6 picks.

I’ll say what I’ve said for a while though. You might be angry at Wilson, who clearly still isn’t anywhere close to his best (understandably, in my opinion, given the injury he suffered). If you think Teddy Bridgewater is more competitive in this game, or one of the rookies in this upcoming draft class, I’ve got bad news for you.

Whatever happens with Wilson — and I’m close to resigned on what will happen — this franchise can’t just plod on with the status quo. Major change is required.

It’s time for new leadership, new ideas, new voices and new people making the personnel decisions — especially if a big trade is executed.

And with the window to negotiate with new coaches set to open shortly, unless the Seahawks are planning a big splash for an employed coach or want to speak to someone currently unemployed — they should be preparing to make their moves now that the season is over.

What we’ve seen this season has been on the cards. It’s been predictable.

It’s time for a new era.

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  1. Paul Cook

    We got cheated out of that game by the refs. No one will knock me off that spot. I rarely, rarely, RARELY say that the refs cost a team a game, but tonight they did. That was a disgusting display of officiating and an embarrassment to the NFL. That was as close to a fix as I’ve seen. It happened throughout the game at different spots, but was so glaring late in the game it completely turned me off to the league.

    • TheOtherJordan

      When fans of other teams are coming onto Seahawk sites to say the fix is in, you know that the officiating was HORRIBLE.

      • David Ashton

        Refs were egregious. I don’t think we are a good team this year but was an arbitrary outcome. Boring to watch.

    • BobbyK

      I’m with you. Generally, every NFL game has good and bad calls. They even out. Sometimes they slightly benefit a team, but the losing team still had plenty chances to overcome something. I generally hate the argument that the refs cost people a game. People say that too often.

      But this game definitely had the look of a “fix”. Nobody can convince me otherwise.

      Yes – the Seahawks suck and didn’t deserve to win this, but there’s no way the Rams did without their version of the 12th Man tonight. That being said, this was the biggest BS of a game since Super Bowl XL where the refs clearly had an agenda to make sure a team won.

      • Positrac

        So why would anyone ever bet money after watching this? It kinda killed my fanhood like when you find out Santa is not real or hookers dont come every time.

    • Alaska Norm

      Agreed. Not the only reason we lost another one but the biggest.

    • Rob Staton

      The refs were crap

      But they didn’t ‘cost’ or ‘cheat’ Seattle out of a game

      The Seahawks were bad

      • Paul Cook

        It can be both. The Seahawks could have played better and won, and the refs could have cost them the game. It was both.

        • Rob Staton

          It wasn’t both.

          They in no way ‘cost the Seahawks the game’.

          Look at the offensive numbers. That cost the Seahawks the game. Not a blown DPI call. If that’s given as a first down, there’s every chance the offense simply gives the ball back shortly after anyway. They were hot garbage.

          Nobody cost anyone anything. There were some horrendous, joke calls. But the Seahawks lost because they were shite.

          • Paul Cook

            Well Dave Wyman just agreed with me.

            • Rob Staton

              That doesn’t make you or Dave, who I think is awesome, correct.

              The refs didn’t cost the Seahawks anything.

              Christ — they were 17-10 down and should’ve had a PI call at midfield. On a night when they had 214 TOTAL yards, we’re going to say that penalty ‘cost them the game’? The odds were stacked against them scoring on that drive, extended or not!

              Let it go

            • Troy

              Even if they call PI on that play, what are the chances they finish the drive and score a TD? After all, they had 1 good drive all game. We’ll never know, but I have little confidence in this offense and assume nothing.

              • Rob Staton


                The offense stunk.

                But a missed PI call at midfield while trailing by seven ‘cost them the game’????

                Nope. It was merely a terrible call. The Seahawks’ offensive performance ‘cost’ them the game, not one missed flag.

                • Hoggs41

                  This game felt just like the Steelers Super Bowl. Yeah the refs were turd but so were we. If Im the Seahawks Im calling up Doug Peterson to test the waters.

                • David Ashton

                  Agree to disagree Rob. And that’s fine.

                  Result was arbitrary in terms of outcome because of all the bad calls.

                  • Rob Staton

                    No, I don’t agree to disagree.

                    Anyone who thinks the Seahawks lost ‘because of the refs’ is simply wrong.

                    Look at the offense. That is the reason. It’s inarguable.

                    The main bad call prevented the Seahawks from getting a first down at midfield. Great. Did it directly take points off the board? No.

                    Not sure why people are struggling with this.

                  • Luis Guilherme

                    There were lots and lots of bad calls. The Swain “fake handoff” was not a penalty. He was allowed to move. The penalty was a false start on Penny, who moved his knee slightly, without moving his feet. There was a PI in the 1st quarter that was actually a hold (not super mad about that, but it’s still more than 10 yards advantage).

                    The main bad call was the non-existing hold on Cupp with the Rams pinned at their own 10 on 3rd and long and a tied game.

                    Once this was called, the defense lost all their morale, and allowed the Rams to drive all the way to get the lead. The offense was bad, but they also didn’t have many opportunities. And then the defense gave them another one, just to the refs to gift the Rams a 1st down.

                    The non-call of the PI on Dallas was the cherry on top. THAT alone didn’t cost us the game, but all together, the Refs probably had more EPA than the Rams.

                  • Luis Guilherme

                    Just checked RBSDM. Total EPA lost to **blatant** bad calls: at least 6 (probably more. I’m making the bad calls have an EPA of 0 if they were called correctly, but probably would be more).

              • Olyhawksfan

                If they scored they would have tied. They still would have had to stop the Rams and then put together another scoring drive to win. Not likely.

          • Gary

            Rob, I feel like you’re overlooking the fact that the Seahawks offensive numbers would very likely have been better were it not for some of those calls. I’m thinking particularly of the phantom defensive holding call on Bless Austin after we’d stopped them and forced a punt. Instead of getting the ball back in great field position, we surrendered a time-consuming drive the length of the field for the game-winning touchdown. And there were numerous other examples that either ended our drives or extended theirs. I agree with you that our offence was hot garbage and I’m ready to fire Shane Waldron along with Positive Pete. But I agree with Paul Cook that it was both.

            • Rob Staton


              The offense doesn’t suddenly start working if that Bless Austin flag doesn’t happen.

              The offense was horrendous. If people want to pin that, or the game, on the refs — it’s wrong. The refs were crap, the Seahawks also being crap is the key to the loss.

              • BruceN

                No one is arguing the offense laid an egg. But with out that fantom PI call Rams had to punt the ball to the Hawks (instead of scoring to go up 17-10). So score tied at 10-10 and the Hawks had the ball in good field position.

                I agree with you that Hawks had no business winning this game with that awful offensive performance. But as poorly as the Rams played, without those two big calls (one gifting them a TD and the other stopping the final drive) who knows what would’ve happened.

                • Rob Staton

                  “Who knows” doesn’t equate to “cost us the game”

                  • Roy Batty

                    People get so worked up over a few blown calls that they fail to see the obvious: Wilson played like crap, and looked like a backup QB.

                    How many balls were under-thrown? How many times did he ignore the open field in front of him for easy scramble yardage, preferring to hold onto the ball way, way too long, waiting for a deep route to materialize? Then comes the sack.

                    It is clear that Wilson needs Lockett, more than ever, for his scrambling routine to succeed. Without Lockett, he really doesn’t have much talent during scrambles to connect with, including DK, who is obviously at his wits end with Wilson.

                    Just an ugly game by #3.

                  • BruceN

                    I didn’t say it cost us the game. But the two calls did impact the game. Undeniable.

                  • bmseattle

                    I would say that whatever small chance the Seahawks had of winning, was made substantially less by those two calls.

                    • Rob Staton

                      But you’re admitting a slim chance was made slimmer.

                      That’s not costing you the game. We were crap. The refs blew a big call. The writing was on the wall by that point anyway, with our 180 yards total offense with four mins to go.

                  • bmseattle

                    Oh yes, I agree with you.
                    I actually think calls like that (or missed calls) effect fans *worse* in game like this where the team plays like crap.
                    The “what could have been” moments are more glaring when there are only one or two of them.

                    • Rob Staton

                      I suspect you might be right. Personally, I wasn’t really bothered. I couldn’t believe the DPI wasn’t called, stunned even. But it had less impact on my mood than when I accidentally boiled the kettle twice two days ago. To me it felt like nothing was at stake and I couldn’t feel bitter about a loss, having played that badly on offense.

                  • bmseattle

                    To me, our chances of winning go up more if Russ connects on the deep shot to Metcalf, than if either of the two bad ref calls go the other way.

                  • bmseattle

                    …and yes…I totally get the lack of engagement at this point.
                    No reason to get all worked up over this particular game/moment, when the state of the franchise is in turmoil, and the future is a huge questionmark.

      • Ukhawk



    • IHeartTacoma

      Worse than the refs was the ridiculous ‘cheer now’ PA announcer. Jaysus, nonstop, load, and annoying.

      Hey, as an old Sonics fan I am always convinced the fix is in for an LA team. But really, this game came down to two plays. One, about-to-be-flattened Matthew Stafford throws to a spot before Kupp is there, touchdown ensues. Two, Russell Wilson can’t get it to Metcalf who has Ramsey beat for a touchdown. Ballgame, better QB wins again.

      And Kupp…. from Yakima to tearing up the NFL. What a story.

      • Ralphy

        It cost us, the fans. It prevented us from seeing an exciting drive that had the chance to tie it. The Hawks are awful and they cost themselves the game. I felt cheated as a fan to not get the excitement of a potential game tying drive.

      • Sean Gross

        Exactly. Those 2 plays had far more impact on the game. The Seahawks got beat on both. I’d add another – the offsides on Alton Robinson early in the game. That directly led to 3 ponts for the Rams.

        The Seahawks did many many things to lose this game. They were not good. A good Rams team played kinda poorly and still outclassed the Hawks. Yep, the refs made a few calls the unfairly benefited the Rams. But probably did not make much of a difference. And frankly, the way forward is to be a good enough team that a couple bad calls don’t make the difference.

  2. Big Mike

    Bridgewater Rob? Hell man, I read here tonight from a poster that Geno would be better.

    • Matthew

      Stafford is the kind of guy that would be a punchline here, but swap him tonight for Wilson and we probably win. Wilson is ineffective, I wish I was wrong. How can this not be obvious?

      • pdway

        he was good the past two games…. but no, you’re not totally wrong.

        using his feet was a key part of his game in year’s past. there’s just about none of that anymore. I don’t know where to go without him though, so I’m hoping the good games this year are more reflective of where he is, than that bad ones. That’s the best i’ve got.

        • 12th chuck

          mentioned that to my wife during the first half, instead of running, tries to force the ball way downfield to unfavorable results.

      • Scot04

        Even with Stafford you still lose iny opinion. Russ had a couple missed throws yes. 1 for a touchdown. However Stafford threw an interception he should never have thrown. We were in the game because their offense was out of sync. Saying If Wilson hits Metcalf for that TD is great, but Rams fans could easily say they win by more if Stafford doesn’t thrown the INT.
        we’re just not a good team.

        • Matthew

          I’d love to have a game where I’m complaining about winning by more. It remains. Stafford was the better QB today, and that doesn’t sit well.

    • Rowdy

      That was me and I stand by that. Wilson was that bad. All the crap Adam’s gets on here, and rightfully so, Wilson’s is in the same category for me. Shit Jared Goff has been about as good as wilson this year. Having a qb that will at least throw a checkdown would be an upgrade at this point. But like wilson said, he doesn’t want to throw checkdowns because he wants plays that win. Put all the blame on the coaches if you want but wilson has been just as bad if not worse.

      • Peter

        Uhhhhhh……Wilson is the same as adams?

        He cost a third round a 100 years ago. Jamal has done nothing. Is worth nothing in a trade. And will set the team back for multiple years.

        Wilson sucked this year. Has trade value. And didn’t set the team back one way or the other.

        The coaches meaning pete who built this crap team have way more negative effect then wilson.

        • Rowdy

          Not trading wilson cost us 3 1st
          Cost 35 mil a year for the for the same play the lions are getting out of Goff
          The only trade value he has right now is because he’s a qb and a team will over pay
          Publicly bashes his team right before free agency basically saying he doesn’t want to be here has set this team back to
          Saying he wouldn’t check down because he doesn’t think you can win that way is a big indicator that the biggest problem with the offense is more on him then the coaches (long developing plays and predictably)
          Honestly, you can say PC and JS biggest mistake is not trading him to draft Josh Allen years ago.

          • Rob Staton

            That’s nowhere near their worst mistake.

            Not building properly around a legit franchise QB was their biggest mistake, making terrible decisions in the personnel department and squandering resource

            • Roy Batty

              Why do people believe they would magically become some kind of offensive juggernaut with Allen? Would they have pulled a good offensive line out of nowhere to protect him? Would they have made better decisions in drafting talent for Allen to utilize? Would they have acquired big FA talent all of a sudden?

              Pure fantasy.

              Adding some new, young, shiny star to your roster won’t cover up the mismanagement of this team for the better part of 6 years. The rot runs deep.

  3. Matthew

    Change is definitely needed, but neither is going to garner much success, and moving toward Wilson may be the worst, ultimately. You can only blame so much on his finger. He’s been over looking, and over/under throwing receivers for too long. The defense is doing enough, even the running game. One guy, the highest paid guy, isn’t doing enough.

    • Troy

      He has some frustrating weaknesses. He doesn’t anticipate throws or coverages. He rarely scrambles anymore. He takes frustrating, drive killing sacks. But he has delivered some magical games. I am only in the keep Wilson camp if they build a strong running game for him (because he obviously needs it). If it’s “let Russ Cook”, then trade him.

      • Matthew

        That’s what I don’t get. Jettison Pete, to build a running game for Russ?? Lmao. Not drafting Chubb and and Taylor aside, isn’t this the page Pete is on?? When can we look to Russ not executing as the most glaring factor for a loss? It certainly felt like tonight was Russ missing critical throws, and a deep DEEP second, bad officiating. I’ve been on the fence, but gradually leaning toward Russ is done, and isn’t the guy to build around the last couple games. Anybody who thinks otherwise is looking beyond what’s been show the past few games. Russ has made some plays, but, undeniably the way to go? Hmph…

        • Ralphy

          I feel like Im going to post this every week, but don’t forget that GB started 4 – 7 -1 in 2018. Rodgers looked done. He wasn’t.

          • Matthew

            It’s been more than season unfortunately.

            • Peter

              This season has sucked. 100%. But it hasn’t been more than this season. The bad half of last year he was 6-2. 25 tds to 8 ints. Back to back 5 td games.

              I 100% get why you think and may be right he is cooked or cooking. But it hasn’t been more thsn this season.

              • Sean

                Yes. Russell has been very good for a very long time. Some poor games after an injury on a team that has problems all over is NOT enough proof to conclude that he is washed up. If he looks like this through most of next year, then maybe there’s something to talk about.

                Pete (and maybe John), on the other hand, has been a disaster every year for 5 years or so. That is enough evidence to conclude that he is not likely to suddenly start being a better coach and personnel guy.

  4. 12th chuck

    too many holes for 2 first round picks to fix, with no qb, aging overpriced mlb, and of course the peacock and his contract. If we can’t dump peacock, the Diggs is probably gone as well (which is a shame, one of the few constant players on d)

    • CHaquesFan

      We ragged on Adams for making business decisions but I felt like I saw a lot of that from everyone throughout the game

      • DT

        Somewhat predictable with so many players with expiring contacts.
        Like Diggs…. we chose not to pay him, now maybe he’s thinking about making sure he can get a new deal from somewhere.

  5. DT

    Russ definitely struggled on a few throws.
    One of those late sack he had Penny on a check down right away, was looking at him, and chose not to throw it. That’s far too common unfortunately.
    A realistic assessment of whether or not russ can fully heal is now needed. If he’s lost his touch on deep balls then we are really in trouble.

    • Matthew

      I think the real question is why are we expecting anything BUT that from Wilson? He’s 33. We’ve been complain Hanoi truth is for almost a decade. ITV’s not his strength. I’m done expecting anything else from him, he is what he is. There’s nothing that will make him better. 3 OC that are still in the game, and legendary HC, and this is who he is. Let’s stop expecting him to be anything else, IMO.

  6. pdway

    I’ll add this – Adams injury has been eye-opening in that we have not missed him one iota. I’m now in the camp of cut our losses, trade him for whatever the market will bear – use his money on other players.

    • BobbyK

      Worst trade in franchise history. At least since I became a fan in ’83.

      • Matthew

        Branch for a first is the only other contender for me. If Adam’s can’t be unloaded for a first, then that’s no doubt the worst TRADE. Kinda special to have a trade that makes Percy feel like complete success, and Graham feel quaint.

    • Matthew

      Disaster acquisition that takes away from the excellent move of trading for Diggs. Trade Adam’s and give the money to Diggs. Thanks

      • Roy Batty

        What money are you magically coming up with if they trade Adams? His dead cap next year is over twice what they paid him THIS year. As soon as he hit season ending IR he got his $12+ million clause guaranteed, adding to his already large guaranteed money dead cap hit.

        Diggs won’t be a team friendly contract, either. It will cost them. He has been a pick machine two years in a row. That doesn’t come cheap. Their opportunity to get a reasonable deal done went out the window the day they chose to move money around to please him, instead of extending him.

        They can’t pay everyone with how badly they have mismanaged their trades, draft picks and extensions. Unless they offer him a top deal, Diggs is gone. They, most likely, aren’t going to offer anywhere near a top deal.

        • pdway

          that’s true even if we trade Adams?

  7. Kevin Mullen

    RW & JAdams to NYG for Peppers, DLawrence, #5, #6, and #37.

    • 12th chuck


      • Scot04

        We would have to take a lesser package if we add Adams. We’re definitely not getting a better one.

    • GoHawksDani

      That would be an awesome trade.
      I’d say: RW, Bobby, Adams for the same return would be awesome too

    • SeaTown

      Who’s making that deal? JS? If JS is making the Wilson deal, the hawks get fleeced.

  8. Mike

    I still can’t believe tre flowers was allowed to start as many games as he did. The practice squad corners they have nw are bad but tre flowers was a different animal

  9. Roger Davis

    We was robbed. Put it in perspective… we’re broke drunks lying in our own vomit and a guy comes by and steals our last quarter. We was robbed, the fix was in, ratta ratta ratta… but the season was a disaster.

    The dynasty is well and truly over. The future will be change. Followed by more change. We’re entering a rebuilding few years. Hopefully, our new leadership will be able to stem the bleeding after only a season or two. Hopefully.

    Today a lot of guys played hard, and I liked much of want I saw in their effort. The Seahawks will be back. Let’s get behind the new crew and enjoy every small step along the way. We twelve may be bowed – BUT – to paraphrase the Terminator – “We’ll be back!”

    I’m 75 and have been through rebuilding eras with many teams in many sports – lets back the team so when we get back to being competitive we’ll have grown with the new dynasty.

    The future begins now!

    • Denver Hawker

      I like you- please comment more often.

      • Rokas

        Yes, Roger, make you present felt more!

  10. Submanjoe

    I just want someone to come in and seize control of this mess of a team and get it organized and coherent. The offense doesn’t make sense. Rob your statements regarding the defense I’m in lockstep with.
    And frankly, it’d be a shame for them to trade Russ. And I’ll throw it out there, if Pete stays and Russ goes and this team doesn’t look good next year, Pete’s legacy here wii take a major hit. He’ll be the guy who lost a franchise QB.

  11. Troy

    One word perfectly describes this team, predictable.

    We know who they are, they come out and do the same thing game after game.

    Horrible time of possession, horrible 3rd downs both ways, a QB who has not played up to his standard for almost the whole season, coaching that doesn’t have answers and just tries the same thing over and over again hoping for a different result.

    This team needs a new GM, needs a new coach, and I hope they start the process now.

    You are right Rob, this era is dead. Realistically it was dead when the LOB went away, we have been grasping at straws ever since.

  12. Denver Hawker

    It’s pretty clear this team was missing its difference maker. Circumstances prevented the top playmaker from being on the field this week. Protocols be damned, without Jamal Adams, the offense doesn’t work.

    • Peter

      Ok. That’s pretty good.

  13. Silly Billy

    On lighter note… did anyone hear the Rams PA announcer in the background?

    On every 3rd down, he’d say “3..2…1…. SCREAM!” right as the Hawks get to the line and the crowd would then all yell at once. What a silly and stereotypically L.A. thing to see… giving fans a cadence to generate noise.

    • Matthew

      Amazingly it’s a step up from the “Ram Rules” days in St.Louis. Makes losing to them even more insufferable.

    • Rob Staton

      That PA announcer was unbearable

  14. Rob Staton

    Carroll is 3-8 against McVay now

    • line_hawk

      But Carroll is 8-2 against Shanahan and Shanahan is 6-3 against Mcvay. Go figure.

  15. lil’stink

    I fear that Wilson’s struggles aren’t just related to his injury. It seems as though he finally been “figured out”. Defenses don’t have to respect his legs anymore, so they focus on the one other thing he’s been good at his entire career: the deep ball.

    What we have left is a QB that has never consistently shown the skill set to pick apart opposing teams from the pocket. I actually thought he was improving on several of these skills back in 2019 under Schotty. But now? We have a QB with poor pocket presence, poor timing, difficulty seeing the entire field, etc. Wilson has been so good for so long but I don’t think his game was meant to age well in this league. Perhaps a new coach/coordinator can revive his play.

    For as good as Wilson has been he has never been elite for an entire season. You can’t just plug him into any scheme and expect him to be successful, especially at this point in his career. The team made a mistake by not trading him this past offseason. Not sure they can afford to make that same mistake again.

    I definitely agree about the Giants being a likely landing spot for him. Yeah, they’re a mess, but I doubt Wilson’s ego lets him use his no trade clause when New York is the destination.

    Our front office and coaching staff have been mediocre at best during the last several years. A complete overhaul might be needed; I just have no faith in the shills at Vulcan to do a good job. Let’s not forget that Bert Kolde’s main qualification for having his job was that he was Paul Allen’s friend in college.

    All in all a potential mess looms for 2022. But the good thing is that fortunes can change quickly in this league, but you have to lay the groundwork for that to happen.

  16. Gross MaToast

    First of all, that Rams’ PA guy must be shackled, chained and escorted from the stadium to, preferably, somewhere in Siberia where he can call reindeer races.

    Second, does it matter who the QB is as long as this regime is in charge? I’m serious. We’ve seen a year and a half of this and it looks startlingly the same whether RW or Geno is taking snaps – inept garbage. Granted RW ain’t RW right now, but does it matter if RW IS RW as long as this regime is in charge?

    Now that they’re officially eliminated from playoff contention, Pete should announce that he’s stepping down at the end of the season. Let Seattle show some appreciation for him while he’s here. Nobody currently on staff should be coming back. As long as he doesn’t announce, worry grows.

    It’s far from certain that change is coming. Pete’s probably a 3/5 favorite to be HC next year, with Dan Quinn next at 7/1. If that happens, the true lasting damage will be the draft picks Pete makes with whatever haul RW brings. It will be a delightful melange of wtf – an absolute disaster that crashes this franchise for a decade. Whoever is in charge of the Seahawks cannot allow that to happen. (I’m ordering my ‘Trubisky’ Seahawk jersey tomorrow as a reverse jinx. We need a volunteer to buy a Jameis Seahawks jersey and maybe a Goff.)

    And RW will be miserable in NY with the team they currently have. He’s better off in NO, Denver or imagine him with the Vikings. NY doesn’t seem like a great landing spot, except for commercial possibilities. Ok, I heard myself, nevermind.

    Regardless, the Pete era has crashed and is no more. Bringing him back is a zombie move. Jody has to choose change or irrelevance. I hope she’s prepared.

    • Rob Staton

      Now that they’re officially eliminated from playoff contention, Pete should announce that he’s stepping down at the end of the season. Let Seattle show some appreciation for him while he’s here.


      And if he won’t do it — he should be invited to do it by ownership

      • Gross MaToast

        I wonder if the “completely normal” meeting Jody had with Pete and JS back in October was something along these lines. A double announcement during the Salk interview tomorrow would be encouraging.

        • Matthew

          You guys. First losing season in almost a decade. A season where for the first time Wilson misses significant time. Pete isn’t stepping down now that the chances of playoffs are gone, and isn’t going to be invited to do so by ownership in the off season. He’ll finish the season as best as they can, as will Wilson. There’s nothin for the line now but optics and legacy. Both will finish’s this season as gracefully as possible, together.

          • Gross MaToast

            You might be right – nothing happens until January, if at all. That’s most likely.

            The argument, however, is that a competently run franchise would have realized long ago that change was necessary. The status quo cannot continue – poor drafts, poor free agent signings, disastrous trades, holding no consistent vision about how this team should be built and play – and trusting Pete and JS with another offseason, particularly an offseason where RW is traded for a haul of picks and players, would be foolish.

            As for “first losing season in almost a decade,” no one can argue that this team is a Super Bowl contender. They haven’t been a true threat for at least five or six seasons. No one can argue that this roster is suddenly going to catch fire – especially after losing the best QB in team history. KNJr and Shane Waldron aren’t going to have Eureka! moments where they suddenly get it.

            This era is dead and I don’t want to watch another season of ZombiePeteBall. Pete gracefully announcing that he’s stepping down would be the beginning of the Great Rebuild.

            • Matthew

              It would be insanely out of character. If they’d just got blown out out 42-0, and the team had quit on him, sure, best to step aside now, but after a tonight? Would be crazy. I get it though.

          • Rob Staton

            1. I’m so glad Matthew has a direct line to Jody Allen and Pete Carroll so he can tell us exactly what will or won’t happen

            2. Anyone who thinks ‘first losing season in a decade’ is a good starting counter to all of the arguments made is immediately onto a loser

    • Denver Hawker

      Denver’s picks looking better by the week. The fan base and radio are pretty clear the QB position is holding them back.

      I’ve heard George Paton is not one to give up picks though and trusts his drafting ability. Last year showed that. His experience in Minn has some to believe he’d prefer to go after Cousins than splurge for Wilson or Rodgers (if even available).

      Wilson may find himself in a rock in a hard place of Carroll is still around and only interested teams are not just a QB away.

      • Rob Staton

        Denver will be all in on Rodgers IMO

        But I would expect they’ll have Wilson as plan B

        • Denver Hawker

          Rodgers is clear and away a preferred target- I question his trade availability. I think GB will attempt to smooth things over. The time to make a trade for him was last year.

          Wilson is definitely preffered target #2. I just don’t have any evidence the GM will bet the farm for him, believing he can do just as well for less.

          • All I see is 12s

            Man, I live here in Denver too. These people are absolutely desperate for a quarterback. One would think they would sell out damn near anything to get someone Russells caliber. However, when I throw out my preferred hypothetical trade of 3 rd 1’s +Williams and Quinn, they balk only when it comes to Williams… my point is, that in a football crazy town like this where they have to compete against the Chiefs and now the chargers, they’re damn near willing to do anything to get a legit guy in with the receivers and they have and the defense of the way it is

    • pdway

      “Bringing him back is a zombie move”

      that’s a really good/succinct way to phrase it.

  17. Mick

    As bad as our D has been this year, and last year, you can’t win if you keep scoring 20 points or less. It doesn’t come to execution (though our Oline and RBs are terrible), it comes to lacking a plan. The only RB I’ve seen literally run through defenders is Marshawn. We can’t expect Penny or Collins or even Carson to do the same. The passing game is predictable and slow and we don’t have simple solutions for getting 3-4 yards. Waldron is a terrible bust, we might have even been better with Schotty. Pete is responsible for the way our season looked like and he should be held accountable. I wish he has the decency to call it off himself so the fans celebrate him like he deserves. But even if he goes, I’m afraid Russ will go too and then we’ll end up as the new Jaguars.

  18. Hawkdawg

    What about the phantom holding call on Austin, 3rd down deep in Rams territory? That was also a stinker.

    Still, it’s hard to talk about cause and effect here, without mentioning other causes, such as the Hawks’ putrid offensive performance in the first half. Another game in which they have 27 yards halfway through the second quarter.

    Russ was off again, too. Not sure what is up with that. Not just accuracy, but decisiveness. Patting the ball for what seemed like an eternity and not throwing it. Even out of bounds. Just not throwing it.

  19. JJ


    I don’t know if you have a connection to Davis Hsu, but I would love to see you guys talk hawks for an hour.

    • Ok

      Sure, but I just like listening to Rob talk Hawks.
      For me, my dream ‘Rob talks with ( ) for an hour is’: Chris Simms. The end.

      • Peter

        Simms. A real talk about the Hawks with Huard. Or Heaps.

        • Rob Staton

          That would be awesome. I feel fortunate to have been invited on Jake’s show a few times. I would love to chat with Simms or Huard too.

          • Roy Batty

            Simms fresh take on the state of the Hawks is always fantastic.

            No BS, just succinct and to the point. No affiliations to hold him back.

  20. BoiseSeahawk

    I just hope Russ can string together a few good games on his way out to avoid any questions coming up about his value declining.

  21. Tomas

    I was wrong, expecting the Hawks to get blown out. They played tough, and we’re unlucky. Having said that, I agree with every word Rob wrote above.

  22. Tomas

    * were unlucky

  23. Donovan

    RW last 20 games

    10-10 record
    26 touchdowns (avg 20 TD over 16 games)
    Team scoring 21 points game

    Man, things really went south after great start to 2020 season in which Russ for MVP talk was very real. How the offense ranked in 2nd half of 2020 season, and has never really righted itself, is an untold story in Hawks’ downfall.

    • Donovan

      * tanked, not ranked

  24. TitzMcWeeeee

    Here’s to _________ (?) handing off to the Barkley 22 times a game next year.
    Depends on the coach but I’ll go with Jimmy the pimp.

    • UkAlex6674

      *22 times a game for the 6 games he is fit

  25. Spencer

    Brain dump:

    1) I don’t think the Seahawks should have (and probably would have) won that game. But that call was unapologetically horrendous. (Seem familiar? See NFC championship game 2018.) Lose? Yeah, sure, we have found ways to lose all year. But the Rams DID NOT WIN that game. Being robbed like that, even in a garbage year, is crap. I don’t believe in conspiracy theories but all the shiz that LA has been handed is starting to make me wonder if the NFL really is making a concerted effort to ‘win’ the LA market.

    2) I haven’t heard anything about Doug Pederson. I’m not as plugged in as many here so I want to hear others’ thoughts. What I know is that the guy won a Super Bowl with Carson Wentz and Nick freaking Foles. Then it seemed like that ship was going down, in hindsight probably because of this Wentz-shaped hole in the boat but they blamed him. And Philly fans are the worst anyway. Thoughts on his potential here? Or other options? (I know Rob has pointed out Peyton and YES PLEASE but who else?)

    3) The defense just held the Rams to 17 points. They’re fine. Not bad. Not good. They’re fine. Bobby is not a $20m player…but he’s not bad…so how much is he worth? $10m? Say he wants to stay a Hawk and is willing to tear up the contract, how much would you offer him?
    I wish I could throw out a hypothetical situation about moving Jamal Adams, but there’s so much dead money there, so why bother. That deal has become worse and worse like no other deal I’m aware of. For that deal alone, Pete (I’m assuming he was the driving force behind it) needs to go.

    • Big Mike

      I’ve been beating the Pederson drum for quite some time now for the reasons you mentioned. Dude got a raw deal in Philly. He’s a local guy too which is cool.

      As myself and others (BobbyK) have been saying for some time now, the Adams deal is the worst in the history of the franchise. Sadly you’re right in that we’re stuck with his strutting, 60 something ranked ass for at least one more year barring a new regime just cutting him and eating the hit.

    • Peter

      The thing with the LA market is: THEY DON’T CARE!!!!!

      I totally could see execs at the NFL offices thinking it matters. But the good folks of LA could care less about pro football.

      Basketball is king. And I suspect USC will be as well very soon. 40 years of moving teams in and around LA has made fans there move on and tune out.

  26. GoHawksDani

    Team sucked, but refs were terrible. I’m not usually calling them on their sh.t, but the bs PI/holding on #36, the PI no call probably take away at least 3 from us and give the Rams 10 points.

    Waldron 99% awful 1% better than OCs before. He can do good things but usually once in every 3-4 games (and only for one play)

    Penny and Dallas weren’t total awful, that’s kind of a positive for me. Dunlap finally played well. Brooks had nice moments too. Our “CBs” weren’t always, utterly and totally beat, which can be a positive regarding how little exp they have. Diggs is awesome, he is likely the best defensive player on this team. Helps with the run, decent in close coverage, really good deep.

    I hope PCJS and SW and KNJ goes. I want a complete sweep…and to be honest, if the price is right, I won’t be mad if RW goes too. I just hope the GM will be someone who can make smart decisions.
    I think if a team has good roster, good trenches, solid skill players and a mediocre QB, it has better chance than a team that has ton of leaks mediocre roster and a good QB.

    Give me a good RB, good OL, good DL and at least solid CBs with good coordinators and I rather watch that team without Wilson than this. Obviously, it’s easier said than done to get to that level…

    But it would be fun (for me) to watch a team which is almost always making positive plays in the running game (even if it’s just for 2-3 yards), overall can run well (4,5+ yards/run), has a sturdy RB who can take 25-30-35 attempts/game. Has an OL that doesn’t make many mistakes, and usually doesn’t allow more than 1-2 sacks/game. Has WRs and TEs who can block well on the LoS and in space too, and who are sure-handed (don’t need huge speedsters who can get you 30-40 yards in a play, but if they can get open regularly on mid or shorter routes, that’s great). A team that can deliver 2-3-4 sacks regularly and doesn’t need to blitz too much. CBs who can get a couple of INTs per season at least…
    Coordinators who can make changes in-game. Who can play screen well, creative with the runs, can scheme receivers open, can manufacture pressure but not with blitzing, but pre-snap motion, and twists on the DL. Who doesn’t play this soft usually.

    Maybe that would be a loosing team too, or a boring one, but if I have that and a decent game manager QB who might not make magic, who might not throw 30-40-50 yard passes, or run well, but can move decently in the pocket, has the statue to be able to dump shorter passes in the pocket too, and pretty accurate on short, or intermediate throws…then I’m happy with the situation.

    Watched KC vs LAC…and while Herbert has ton of potential and probably better than a game manager QB, he didn’t play well, but the Chargers as a team played pretty well, so even when their QB struggled a bit, they hang in there with KC because how overall good their roster is.

    I’m NOT against RW, but if he stays, or leaves, I’d really like a better overall roster.
    A star passrusher, like Bosa or Donald or Mack.
    Better CBs (I can live with 2 DJ Reeds, but backups need to be decent too)
    Better defensive coordinator (tired of DTs covering TEs or LBs covering WRs)
    Better center and probably guard (I want more push inside), wouldn’t mind better OTs too, but that might be too much
    Better RB, who can run through a whole game and can break tackles, push at the LoS
    Better TE and TE scheme (Everett is super boom or bust, rest are shadows)
    Better offensive coordinator!

    If these can happen in 1-2 year with Russ staying, then I’m more than happy. If we can get all this only with Russ leaving, and get a QB with less magic, less pretty deep ball, a bit less precise, but smart and one who doesn’t make big mistakes and maybe a bit better short-medium thrower then I’m happy too

    • Peter

      Though you are not far from the mark with things you want….

      I could see a world with Tyrod Taylor and a much better supporting cast. The problem is how does that get you to the promise land?

      Off the top of my head I think of Foles and Flacco who were fairly mediocre but got very hot in the playoffs so it’s not impossible.

      But generally i am with you. The style of play has been so boring. So predictable. And not effective.

  27. DancingBuddha

    fans keep warning about how it will look if the team lets WIlson go and we have mediocre QB play- well, I’d argue we already have it. We’ve had it since week 10 of last season. This is not just finger related,not even close,. We’ve been paying top 5 money for mediocre QB play for a year, so we might as well not pay that much and use it to invest elsewhere because what WIlson has given this team over more than a season has been unacceptable at that price tag. All year the defense has been holding teams to under their average, to somewhere in the 13-21 range and all season the offense has cost the team. I’m more than happy to get a fresh start at QB , some picks and use the space . Of the 3 under fire right now whose future is uncertain, a legitimate case can be made that since last year for over a year, the real underperformer has been Russ. I’m at the point where I’m OK if he goes. I don’t see how what we’ve been enduring at QB the last year-plus is so much better an option than getting mediocre play elsewhere for far less cost.

    • Peter

      Maybe you’re right. Might be fun to find out if five years of near busts in the draft and bad FA are the problem or Russel.

      The team did have cheap QB’s over a decade ago and they weren’t good then but I’m sure it would be different this time.

      I’m all for trading russ if pc/js go.

      Otherwise pc already showed what he can do without russ. Which was nothing of note.

  28. L80

    I was hoping for the season to be over today as far as the playoffs are concerned so very needed changes canat least become more than thoughts. The disasterous decisions for years have finally risen to the top this year..

    Playing the ridiculous zone all game without the players to do it properly is so redundant that it feels like a slap in the face to fans that have had to endure years of watching teams march up and down the field.

    Nothing ever changes with regime in spite of multiple OC’s. One could argue injuries, but this is where a lot of the poor drafting raises it’s ugly head. The regimes expiration date is years old and the milk is spoiled.

    THROW IT O U T !!!!!

  29. bk matty

    Giant fans arent particularly keen on getting Russell Wilson, not sure its a great move for them with the fanbase.

    • Peter

      New York post this morning had a pretty good write up of four possible scenarios for the Giant’s and getting Wilson was one of them.

  30. SpennyDunks

    What got into Dunlap this game? Didn’t get a chance to watch.

  31. Joshua Smith

    Maybe I’m zeroing in on select plays but I keep noticing Wilson choosing to throw the ball deep when he has open WRs underneath. Not just this game but previous ones as well. This time, there was a 3rd and 4. Swain was open on a slant that would have kept the drive alive and Russ chucked it to Eskridge (who almost made a great catch…almost)
    Off the top of my head I remember a few weeks ago he did the same thing. Lockett was open in the middle if the field and Wilson threw deep to a double covered DK. That’s not coaching, that’s Russ choosing to throw deep. Like I said. I don’t rewatch the game all 22 but I’m wondering if we give Wilson too much credit on the field. Or just turn a blind eye because he’s the best QB we’ve ever had.?
    Maybe i just happen to notice specific plays but last night was bad again. I’m certain they’ll be excuses but why not take the open slant on 3rd down? Get the 8+ yards and a new set of downs.

  32. Peter


    If you like Gomorrah and it is awesome. Check out if you csn get it in the UK “zero zero zero.” Same creative team. I think it is going to be a single limited series. Pretty tremendous three arc show.

    • Rob Staton

      I’ll check it out

  33. Forrest

    Some great points on the chat! The article below captures some of our thoughts. As others pointed out, I’m concerned Wilson is declining, Pete will hang on too long and impede our efforts to find a quality replacement this season/offseason, Seattle is losing value as a free agent destination, we’re going to watch DK explode somewhere else in a year, Russ’ trade value is dropping every week and somehow the Seahawks will even squander this opportunity to get value in a trade.

  34. Call Me AL

    Seahawks Average Drive 2021:
    Start – Own 28.5 (NFL Rank 17th), Time – 2:17 (NFL Rank 32nd), Plays – 5.08 (NFL Rank 32nd), Yards 27.7 (NFL Rank 29th), Points – 1.82 (NFL Rank 22nd).

    Average Time of Possession – 25.02 (NFL Rank 32nd)
    Third Down Conversion Percentage – 33.96% (NFL Rank 30th)
    1st Downs – 236 (NFL Rank 31st)
    Total Offensive Yards – 4247 (NFL Rank 30th)
    Points For – 282 (NFL Rank 24th)
    Percentage of Drives ending in an Offensive Score – 30.3% (NFL Rank 28th)
    Sacks Given Up – 45 (NFL Rank 28th)
    Turn Overs – 11 (NFL Rank 2nd)

    Seahawks Defense Average Drive 2021:
    Start 25.0 (NFL Rank 1st), Time – 3:11 (NFL Rank 31st), Plays 6.7 (NFL Rank 32nd), Yards 35.3 (NFL Rank 29th), Points 1.83 (NFL Rank 8th).

    Average Time of Possession – 34.98 (NFL Rank 32nd)
    Third Down Conversion Percentage – 36.81% (NFL Rank 7th)
    1st Downs Allowed – 334 (NFL Rank 32nd)
    Total Yards Allowed – 5466 (NFL Rank 31st)
    Points Allowed – 282 (NFL Rank 4th)
    Percentage of Drives ending in an Offensive Score -34.5% (NFL Rank 22nd)
    Sacks – 29
    Turn Overs – 14 (NFL Rank 26th)
    1st Downs Allowed – 334 (NFL Rank 32nd)

    I’ve been trying to find something, anything that this team does well that you can build upon for the future and frankly I’m at a loss. This team just doesn’t do anything consistently well. The only thing they can manage to do consistently as a team is play poorly.

    • Forrest

      Take a close look at the stats, there is a glowing bright spot – they have a really good…PUNTER!

  35. Erik

    I can’t figure it out. What changed? Why was the current regime so good at drafting in the early years and so bad for every year after that? I used to say in “John/Pete I trust”.

    • TomLPDX

      Hubris from the front office is my first thought.

  36. cha

    RW was 1 for 10 on deep throws last night.

    He was sacked 3 times and hit 6 times.

    They only ran the ball 19 times.

    They lost the TOP game by 10 minutes.

    This is literally the definition of insanity. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

  37. cha

    WaPo with the obituary

  38. cha

    PFF Offense

    RW oof 33.6

    • cha

      PFF Defense

      • Rob Staton

        Wagner scores a 37.0

        But I’m an arsehole for questioning his effort

        • cha

          But he’s got huge, sharp…

          He can leap about…

          Look at the tackles!

          • bmseattle

            I know it’s not as big of a story as Russ and the offense… but what is this defense going to look like next year (assuming Wagner is gone).
            Do they resign Diggs?
            What about their cornerbacks?
            Other than Brooks, who is at LB?

            Man, we really need more draft picks.

            • pdway

              I think between Reed/Jones/Brown – you have decent NFL-level CB starters. Not stars, but not weak spots either.

              LB likely Brooks and a draft pick of FA signee.

              for me, got to re-sign Diggs, he’s been their defensive MVP this year, and seems like a leader back there (who is still playing at a high level).

        • Spencer

          I don’t think it’s effort, I think it’s worse. I think he just can’t do it anymore, at least not at the level we expect. I think he hit that wall really hard and really fast. But how much WOULD you pay to keep him?

        • Sea Mode

          bUt HE’s A pRO boWLeR!

      • bmseattle


        • Roy Batty

          Brooks made him look old. The kid had a great game, aside from being tasked with having to defend the best receiver in the league.

          • pdway

            clocked that play too….was like wtf…..

  39. Ashish

    Yesterday game was ruined by bad calls. With zeo percent chance to get in play off, they can let Russ heal and should fire PC and make OC temporary head coach

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