Jalen Ramsey requests a trade from Jacksonville

Jalen Ramsey is a stunning athlete. One of the best to enter the league in recent memory. He ran a 4.41 at the combine and jumped a 41.5 inch vertical. He’s 6-1 and 209lbs with 33.5 inch arms. That’s insane.

If you were going to create an ideal cornerback — this is what it would look like. Ramsey is the kind of physical talent you dream about. It’s no surprise he’s developed into one of the NFL’s top defenders. He had nine interceptions in his first three years in the league and has earned a reputation for being a true shutdown corner capable of shadowing the likes of DeAndre Hopkins.

So what’s the situation here?

Things have been a little uneasy between Ramsey and Jacksonville for some time. There were issues a year ago. He’s eligible to receive a contract extension as a three-year veteran and yet hasn’t been extended despite his impact as a pro. He’s signed through 2020 because the Jaguars exercised the fifth year option on his contract.

Then this happened on Sunday — a very public sideline dispute between coach Doug Marrone and Ramsey.

A new deal in Jacksonville seems unlikely and the Jaguars might be preparing to cut their losses and move on instead of ending up in a mess similar to the Texans with Jadeveon Clowney.

Any trade would have to include a first round pick. Ramsey is simply too talented to depart for anything less — regardless of any bad blood between player and coach. If you’re willing to pay a first round pick to acquire him, you’ll need a new contract to be agreed before anything is finalised.

The Texans made a huge mistake (likely because they don’t have a GM) when they dealt for Laremy Tunsil without a new deal being in place. It’s simple bargaining sense to turn to the player and say, ‘we’re willing to trade for you — so do you want to stay on your rookie salary in Miami or come to Houston and sign this big new contract?’. By not extending him immediately, the Texans have ceded all leverage in future negotiations. The Tunsil camp will say, ‘you’ve spent a kings ransom on our client — we know you’re not going to let him walk’.

Any trade for Ramsey would need to come with an agreement on an extension — unless you want to run the risk of losing him by 2021.

So could the Seahawks potentially show interest here?

A few days ago I wrote that I thought a deal for Minkah Fitzpatrick was unlikely and I sense the same can be said of a deal for Ramsey (I’m not down on trades by the way, having written several articles on the likelihood of a trade for Jadeveon Clowney).

I keep referring to these quotes from Michael Lombardi in 2017 when he was the first to tout a parting between the Seahawks and Richard Sherman:

“I think Seattle really thought twice about paying Richard Sherman. They felt they had to when they won the Super Bowl…”

“…the scheme in Seattle allows you to find corners especially size/speed corners of which there’s a bundle of them in this draft that can play deep third of the defense, they’ll tackle and they can play within the scheme.”

Lombardi is quite right about Seattle’s scheme. The Seahawks are currently starting a converted fifth round safety and a third round pick at cornerback. In the LOB years they fielded a fifth rounder and a player plucked from the CFL. They’ve had reasonable success with a sixth rounder (Byron Maxwell) and a fourth rounder (Walter Thurmond). They’ve also found nickel cornerbacks on the cheap.

Compare this to the safety position where the Seahawks have placed a lot more value. They drafted Earl Thomas at #14 in Pete Carroll’s first draft. They’ve since added Marquise Blair in round two and spent a third round pick on Delano Hill.

That doesn’t mean the Seahawks would never want to go after a player like Jalen Ramsey. Like every other team in the league, you’d love to have a player of that athletic caliber. Are they likely, however, to invest major draft stock and then pay a record-breaking cornerback contract to make this a reality? The common sense answer to that is ‘not likely’.

Tre Flowers and Shaquille Griffin, without any disrespect intended, are not close to Ramsey’s level. They have, however, been coached into Seattle’s scheme and provide value at two starting positions. They do what the scheme asks of them. If Lombardi’s right and the Seahawks second-guessed paying Sherman because of how they view the position in their scheme, it seems most likely they’ll continue to teach and develop their own prospects without feeling the need to splurge.

This tweet from Ian Rapoport is also worth considering…

The Seahawks very rarely asked Richard Sherman to play man-to-man and lock down a receiver. He did it on rare occasions (I seem to recall when Pittsburgh visited Seattle in 2015 he shadowed Antonio Brown). Ramsey would mostly be playing in zone covering one side of the field — the exact thing he’s supposedly expressing he’s opposed to.

He’s a terrific player and if a team acquires him they will rightly celebrate their addition. If the Seahawks made a bold move to get him — it’d be a huge get. Nobody can dispute his talent and ability. This is only about how likely it is for Seattle.

I suspect the Seahawks have played their hand in terms of trades for 2019. The Clowney addition on a possible one-year rental was too good to ignore and filled a vital need on the D-line (imagine how porous the line would currently look without Clowney).

The compensation was cheap in terms of picks and salary. They had an extra third rounder and they could get it back if Clowney leaves as a free agent in the off-season.

The trade didn’t really shift them off a path they’ve been on for some time. They’ve been gradually rebuilding their depth with a new younger core. They seemingly deliberately collected picks for 2020 and have a good looking haul for next year. While it’s very true that they’ll look for any opportunity to add talent via trade — I think the deal has to be right for them (like the Clowney trade). Otherwise, they’re going to continue to build through the draft.

Ramsey might just be too expensive — in terms of picks and salary.

Fitzpatrick is a different situation. I wrote about my reservations there a few days ago. Has he got a fixed position? I know plenty of people dismissed that suggestion because this video basically hailed him as the second coming of Earl Thomas. Yet I think it’s relevant to ask why neither Alabama or Miami played him as a full-time free safety if he’s tailor-made for the role. If he’s best suited to playing nickel, is that really worth a first round pick via trade? Did you watch Jamar Taylor on Sunday and think, ‘he needs to be replaced by a first round player pronto’?

I also think the investment in Marquise Blair, the trust they have in Bradley McDougald and their willingness to pay a cheap price for the nickel position all makes a deal unlikely.

I’m not ruling it out 100% or anything like that. I’m just offering a view on why I personally can’t see it happening.

If they trade for Ramsey or Fitzpatrick in the next few days I’ll be the first to hold my hands up and admit I was wrong. I will say this though — Ramsey is a legit, proven, elite defender. Fitzpatrick remains as much a mystery as he did entering the league.

Here’s a prediction (if both players are dealt)…

Jalen Ramsey to San Francisco, Minkah Fitzpatrick to Green Bay.

The Niners have cap space and a 2-0 start might encourage them to be bold.

The Packers reportedly targeted Fitzpatrick in the 2018 draft and were going to take him at #14 if he lasted (he was taken at #11). Plus the Packers just IR’d one of their safety’s.

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  1. SeaHusky

    I think PCJS will definitely be interested. But will Ramsey be interested? If reports are true he wants to play man coverage exclusively, he won’t want to come here just based on scheme. We offer a winning culture and most likely an extension (highly doubt we trade a 1st just to let him walk for a 3rd in two years). Is that enough? I don’t think we trade for him, but it’s definitely an enticing thought.

    • Rob Staton

      I think there’s a difference though between being interested and making a polite enquiry and being motivated to go all-in on a deal. As noted in the piece, Seattle’s scheme is set up that the one position they can plug-in and coach-up is cornerback. That doesn’t mean you ignore an opportunity to add an elite talent at the position. But it does make me question whether they’re going to actually go far down the line with this one. They’re always in on a potential deal — they keep stating that. We remember the ones they complete. We don’t often remember the ones they don’t.

  2. Denver Hawker

    One thing I like about the current team is the humility. In post-game notes you hear everyone distributing compliments and success to teammates. They have shed the guys who don’t put team first.

    Based on what he’s done with the Jags, I do t see Ramsey fitting the character mold of top paid players on the Hawks. Not saying he’s a bad guy, just a personality clash that could disrupt the cohesion that is building with the young core.

    Between the two options, I’m Fitzpatrick>Ramsey based on contract alone. Ramsey is undisputedly better, but if the thought process is to give up an R1, I’d rather have the years left on Fitzpatrick deal and opportunity to work him in with the rest of the developing core players.

    • Doug

      Agree–there is potential to develop a “diva” situation here similar to Sherman if you want to go after Ramsey, plus the draft capital and cap makes it a substantial investment given the need to re-sign other Seahawks RFAs.

      Fitzpatrick is attractive because of his potential to be moulded into the Seahawks’ system, his athleticism, and his very team-friendly cap cost.

      Of the two, Fitzpatrick makes the most sense.

      • Rob Staton

        I’ll keep saying it though — Fitzpatrick won’t make sense if, indeed, his best position is nickel (as Miami clearly believe and that’s the area Alabama used him more often than not).

        It only makes sense if you believe he’s a long term, dynamic, impact free safety. Because the price is a definite R1 minimum. And even then you have to square that off with the investment already made in Marquise Blair and Ugo Amadi in the last few months plus the fact they clearly like their other guys (especially Bradley McDougald).

        • Denver Hawker

          For the record, I personally don’t want either for an R1. I like Fitzpatrick more than Ramsey all things considered, but certainly not equal. He seems well suited for slot coverage which is maybe worth the R2 from KC at best.

          I don’t think either get traded to the Hawks. Too expensive asking price and not enough scheme fit to justify a trade when compounded over existing young players. Absent season ending injuries, I suspect they are done trading and will look to add upgrades to CB/FS and OL with early round picks.

  3. Rob Staton

    Just added a prediction to the article.

    Jalen Ramsey — San Francisco

    Minkah Fitzpatrick — Green Bay

    • BradHawk

      SF does not have a 2nd next year and they play zone.

      • Rob Staton

        Pete Carroll is fully committed to his scheme and he’s the boss.

        Kyle Shanahan is an offensive-minded coach not tied to a particular defensive scheme and he’s the big boss in San Fran.

        I bet if you offered Shanahan the chance to field Sherman and Ramsey and tweak the scheme he’d be all-in.

        • Eburgz

          No one knows what the trade market is like for these players. Why do we always assume that these top talents will return R1 picks? History has shown that isn’t always the case. Sometimes these organizations just want to cut their losses and take the best lowball offer. Marcus Peters, Antonio Brown and Clowney are some recent examples (although I understand each of those were different situations). We don’t really know what the situation is with these guys or how motivated these organizations are to deal them.

          You make great points about Seattle’s scheme and Ramsey won’t likely get to shadow top WR’s here so I doubt he’d want to play here.

          • Rob Staton

            Fitzpatrick just cost a R1.

  4. dcd2

    I tend to agree that within the confines of our current defensive scheme, and considering the cost to get him, it seems unlikely.

    Can you put him on an island with the opponents #1? Looking at the top contenders in the NFL (vegas odds):
    NE: A Brown
    Chiefs: T Hill
    Rams: Woods/Cooks
    Cowboys: A Cooper
    Saints: M Thomas
    Packers: D Adams

    Those are huge pieces to mitigate. I do wonder where he will end up though, as a trade seems inevitable.

    • BradHawk

      Raiders & Colts should go after him

  5. Zxvo3


    Seahawks in the mix for Minkah

    • Rob Staton

      That tweet also says Dallas are involved.

      Yet Armando Salguero already reported yesterday the Cowboys are out on Fitzpatrick.

      • Zxvo3

        I personally don’t think the Seahawks should get Minkah especially since they’ve spent a 2nd rounder on Blair as you said before. But if somehow they could get Minkah without paying a heavy price then obviously I would be fine with it

        • GoHawksDani

          I wouldn’t mind it. I think an awesome slot worth a late 1st round pick (maybe throw in MIA’s 4th/5th)
          And Taylor is unproven. But obviously it would worth much more as a FS trade.
          And I wouldn’t mind that either.
          This year Minkah could play FS McDougald SS. We could add in Blair in some big nickel scenario.
          Ease Blair into the game, teach him better tackling and things like that.
          We could maybe even trade Lano for a 4th/5th/6th round pick.
          Next year we could rotate the 3 guys based on opponents:
          Minkah+McDougald for passhappy opponents, who likes deep crossing and routes similar (both have good ball skills and pass defense)
          Minkah+Blair when we want a more traditional hard hitting SS and good coverage FS
          McDougald+Blair vs teams that utilize TEs a lot and likes to run

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      I’m willing to bet they won’t if the price is a R1 pick. Or, put another way, if they do, it’ll mean they see Fitzpatrick as a FS, and then you have to wonder about the logic of forcing him to play a position he really doesn’t want to.

      • BradHawk

        Why is Dallas looking at him when they have 2 young slots? If the guy wants to be a pro bowler he needs to go to Seattle, these kids are not stupid, I wouldn’t put it past these guys to make up excuses to get traded. Pairing him up with Blair would be something.

  6. Rob Staton

    I’d also like to pose a question…

    This isn’t targeted at people on here. It’s more the Twitter world. So many people are pining and desperate for the Seahawks to trade for Minkah Fitzpatrick.

    But why?

    Is it because of the Brett Kollmann video? Is it because of Jim Nagy’s glowing review?

    Have these people actually seen him play?

    Because to me I always thought he was a bit overrated at Alabama. Not a bad player by any means. Just not quite as good as some will have you believe. Good not great, if you will.

    • dcd2

      My guess would be the fact that we gave up a career high to Dalton at home last week. They see that and believe that if the scheme hasn’t changed, it must be a talent issue.

      That would be my guess anyway, but I do not pretend to speak for the twitterverse.

      • GoHawksDani

        But the scheme changed unfortunately (at least I’m not a big fan LBs covering great more receiver than “traditional TE” TEs or slot WRs)

        As for me…I think McDougald peaked. I like him a lot, but he doesn’t excite me. A good puzzle piece to the defense, but wouldn’t identify the defense with him (like could do with ET and Sherm and Kam)
        Lano excites me even less. I feel his peak is at OK/solid or the bottom of good. He won’t change games all by himself. And he runs pretty “hot” and cold. He had 1-2 good games but plenty mediocre and even some bad ones.
        T2 had too many chances, he’s not a starter.
        Blair can be good, but there’s a reason they didn’t start him. He needs to learn. And it’s not Minkah vs Blair. It’s more like Minkah vs McDougald. Or even so: 2 safeties vs big nickel. I’d like to keep 3 talented safeties use 2 as main starters but use a ton of big nickel with at least 2 good cover guys.

        As for Amadi or Taylor (if we talk nickel) they’re unproven.

        Not saying Hawks should trade for Minkah, but I think if the Hawks trade for him, it would elevate some parts of the team, because he has some skills and if the FO trades for him they’d have a plan for him.

        Don’t know a ton about the guy, but:
        1, He was targeted by multiple team in round 1, so he must have some skills and measurements
        2, He has NFL exp
        3, He’s really cheap

        Less impact than the Clowney trade and not sure about his current level (I think it’s much lower than his ceiling), but I like the potential.
        Trade, no trade, I’m fine either way 🙂

  7. Rob Staton

    One final note too — if the Seahawks DO trade for Minkah Fitzpatrick in the next few hours… I’m about to go to bed (it’s 1am here). So my ‘hold my hands up’ admission will have to wait until tomorrow 🙂

    • BradHawk

      We’re not going to beat out 5 teams for the guy unless we trade Reed or Ford

      • BobbyK

        Dolphins don’t care about a DT in a contract year (Reed). They’re playing for 2020, 2021, etc. with draft picks. They’re tearing this thing down and stockpiling picks for their future Dan Marino. Unlike Marino, this Dolphins organization seems hell bent on stockpiling enough picks so the QB won’t have to do it alone either.

        • BradHawk

          Well they gotta pay some players. Send Jefferson, Tedric, and Fant that should do it or Pocic, Jennings, McDougald. Schneider has iron balls, maybe the Ramsey thing ends up hurting Mikah’s trade value

  8. CHawk Talker Eric

    I’m not really down for a trade for either if the price is a R1 pick. Between the two, I’d prefer Ramsey because he’s by far the superior athlete/player.

    I’m intrigued by Fitzpatrick’s versatility, and I think he could flourish in SEA’s system. But (a) I’m not sure NCB is valuable enough (even for a R2 pick), and (b) I’m not sure Fitzpatrick is significantly better than Umadi/Taylor to justify the expenditure of draft capital.

  9. BradHawk

    Right now our safety’s are playing rusty, they didn’t practice much this summer.

    • Rob Staton

      Very true.

  10. Kevin Mullen

    Griffin, 1st & 5th for Ramsey.

    • Simo

      Nope, no thanks. Ramsey’s good but that’s way to much, even if you mean Shaquem Griffin.

  11. Greg Haugsven


    I wonder if they did acquire Fitzpatrick if they would use him at both Free Safety and Slot corner? Play FS on base downs then move him to the slot in nickel and have Hill or Thompson come into the game in nickel? Not conventional but this way you could keep Fitzpatrick on the field at all times.

    • Sean

      Has been reported that one of the biggest reasons Minkah wants out of Miami is that they keep moving him around. He wants to have a stable position.

      • Greg Haugsven

        He said he didnt like playing all the positions he plays which is like six. This would be just two. He may just only want one?

        • BradHawk

          The teams looking at him want him for different reasons plus a rookie really has no clue what he wants. He’s probably freaking out because he knows Miami could screw up his career. If my goal is hall of fame It’s gonna be awfully hard getting there in Miami. If he’s dreaming about HOF Seahawks will definitely go after him.

  12. Dale Roberts

    A guy I’d be willing to trade up to get is Grant Delpit, S, LSU, especially if he could be had in the middle of round one instead of the top ten. Delpit and Blair would be quite a force.

    • Ben Ft. Woth


      GEAUX TIGERS!!!!

    • Rob Staton

      Delpit will go top-6 if he stays healthy

  13. BobbyK

    Seahawks won’t trade a 1 for Fitzpatrick, but they could trade both their 2nd rounders for him IF the Dolphins returned their 3rd round pick (which will be the first pick in the 3rd round… and it’s possible the Seahawks pick from the Chiefs will be the last pick in the 2nd round). Food for thought that most likely will not happen.

    • mishima

      Wouldn’t Miami realize they’re essentially trading Fitz for a late 2nd?

      • BradHawk

        That’s why you offer players who have been groomed in a championship organization which is better than draft picks. It’s all smoking mirrors!

    • CHawk Talker Eric

      I don’t know about them myself, but Tony Pauline’s new crew ProFootballNetwork says “according to what sources have told Pro Football Network’s Co-Owner Matt Infante, the Seattle Seahawks are a real possibility to land Fitzpatrick”

      I’m in the camp who thinks SEA wouldn’t (and shouldn’t) spend a R1 pick for Fitzpatrick, partly because his best position isn’t worth a R1 pick to SEA, partly because the player himself isn’t worth a R1 compared to Umadi/Taylor.

      But the scenario you describe here, their two R2 picks for Fitzpatrick and MIA’s R3 (essentially the last pick in R2)? I can see some value in that trade.


      • BradHawk

        Miami has tons of draft capital in 2020 They should be open to 2021 picks.

      • BobbyK

        Personally, I hope it’s the Seahawks’ pick in the second round that is the last pick:)

        All I know is that their secondary isn’t very good and they could use another good player back there. Does that mean I want them to trade for Fitzpatrick? Depends on what they’d give up. Personally, I didn’t want Clowney if it meant trading a 1st rounder but you never know what’s going to happen. I can’t imagine the Dolphins will get any team to give them a pick that good. So – it’s possible something could get done.

        With a 2-0 start under their belt and a Brees-less Saints team at home this week – they could see this being a championship team with another good DB after they get a DL of Clowney, Ziggy, Reed, and Poona all on the field together.

  14. NHawk

    Hi Rob,

    I’ve been wondering why the Hawks aren’t plucking Obi Melifonwu off Pat’s practice squad (they waived him to fit AB on their 53). He was heavily covered here and other hawk sites during lead up to 2017 draft, was on Hawks visit list that year. To your point, which I agree with, Seattle has a type and scheme that is about coaching up big, long fast secondary players. I get everyone here showing excitement over Ramsey and Fitzpatrick – first round proven starting caliber talents. But Pete and JS have been turning bargains into secondary starters for their whole tenure here (btw I would add Deshawn Shea to that list, he was a solid starting corner for us for the equivalent of one season). Any insights into why they wouldn’t try to collect this guy? I know he’s got to go on the roster, so that’s a barrier. Appreciate your thoughts and I always enjoy your posts and this community’s dialogue.

    • Rob Staton

      Melifonwu is a great athlete but he hasn’t shown anything to warrant faith he can make it in the NFL unfortunately.

  15. charlietheunicorn

    I’m not sure Seattle would be interested in Ramsey.
    Not because of the talent or the on the field stuff. The off the field and locker-room stuff might be a reason to pause about acquiring him.

    SF could be a viable landing spot, they have money and need some impact playmakers on defense. Sherman better be careful what he wishes for, because Ramsey would be there to force him into retirement after the season.

    I’m having a hard time finding a legit contending team with cap space, that could trade for Ramsey and sign him to a longer term deal. Perhaps the Ravens would make some sense. They have decent cap space in 2020 and already revamped the majority of the defense in the last 2 season. I tend to think he will not be traded to a rival AFCS team at the minimum, even though the Colts make some sense as well..

  16. Saxon

    Reading a Rob Staton article is like computing the apothem of a decagon. He covers every angle.

    Ramsey is a luxury in our scheme. I’d rather spend our draft capital on OL, DL, TE, S. Unless this is more bargain shopping,like Clowney, then hard pass.

  17. Hoberk Unce

    Most likely Schneider is in on both trades just to be in on them and learn from how the other teams handle themselves. I don’t think Ramsey is a good scheme fit for our secondary, and I don’t think Fitzpatrick is significantly better than anyone we already have. So personally I don’t see either trade happening.

  18. Kenny Sloth

    Luke Falk in for Jets

  19. BradHawk

    We could put our 2021 picks in play for Fitz. We could easily swing 2020 2nd & 2021 2nd plus a player or 2.

  20. Paul Cook

    Who ARE our starting 5 DB’s best case scenario (rookies panning out) later in the year?

    • mishima

      End of the year?

      Flowers and Griffin at CB; McDougald at FS; Hill/Blair at SS.

      (Hill at big nickel; Amadi at slot CB).

      • Paul Cook

        That would have been my guess as well. Are we not satisfied with…

        FS McDougald
        SS Blair
        CB Griffen
        CB Flowers
        SLOT Amadi

        …isn’t that the question? Sure, you always want to be better (I prefer the OL). I get that. But do PCJS think these guys are the ticket? Who do they really see as the weak links going forward?

        • BradHawk

          Nope! Amadi did not win slot competition and McDougald is rusty.

          • CHawk Talker Eric

            McDougald isn’t rusty in the least. He’s playing as well as he ever has. He’s just not Kam Chancellor or Earl Thomas.

            But about Amadi wining the slot competition, I thought Jamar Taylor showed well against PIT. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him get more time. Also expect Nickerson to be back on the 53 once he learns the scheme. There’s plenty of competition yet to be had at nickel.

            • BradHawk

              I’m on board with the plan but McDougald is not playing as good as he has in the past, he’s coming off an injury & didn’t practice much this summer also Blair didn’t get much practice this summer which is crucial for a rookie. So I can picture Schneider going after Fitz especially when his salary is low and he’s peaking.

    • BobbyK

      In a perfect world, Blair would be able to take over, stay healthy, and make some plays.

  21. cha

    Minkah traded to Pittsburg for a first round pick per rapsheet

    • Sam L

      I don’t understand this move from Pittsburgh. What do they expect is going to happen this season? Now that Fitzpatrick has been traded and there’s no way the Seahawks are getting Ramsey we can at least know we are stuck with the guys we have whether that’s a good thing or bad thing only time will tell.

    • Milwaukee Hawk

      Interesting choice for Pittsburgh. With Big Ben out, that will likely be a pick in at least the top 15 if not top 10. Glad we steered clear on that one.

      • Coleslaw

        I dont think so. They clearly like Rudolph for good reason. Hes been there on the DL for a while. I think they have the QB they want, now they’re trying to build around him.

        I think Ben is done in Pittsburgh if not the NFL.

        • BradHawk

          I like Mason he’s a good QB

    • Awsi Dooger

      Good deal as a Dolphins fan. I didn’t think they’d get a first round pick for Minkah. To get a first rounder from a team that is already 0-2 and has lost its starting quarterback for the season almost seems like an impossible gift.

      This Dolphins regime certainly knows what it is doing in terms of trade value. Whether they’ll capitalize on those picks is another matter entirely. Many Dolphins fans don’t have full confidence in the acquired picks because it looks like Chris Grier will be making those picks. He has been in the organization for 20 years and not exactly a sterling record on talent evaluation.

      Minkah is hardly a consistent impact player. I think Seattle did well to avoid him, given the cost. I realize Seahawks fans didn’t get to see yesterday’s Miami/New England game. Late in the 4th quarter Minkah recovered a fumble. Play by play analyst Dan Fouts correctly summarized, “Recovered by Mnkah Fitzpatrick…and I think that’s the first time we’ve called hi name today.”

      • Sea Mode

        Great deal for you guys. About the best you could hope for, considering the situation.

    • Dale Roberts

      I know Minka has a lot of skills but can he play quarterback? LOL

  22. John_s

    I don’t think Seattle wants a Jalen type personality. They’ve cleaned house away from the Sherman and Earl personalities. Speaking of Earl, jalen is represented by Earls agent after how earl acted with the hold out (pre draft last year it sounded like the Seahawks and the agent had and understanding that Earl would not hold out) I doubt they want to work with him on a very expensive contract

    • Paul Cook

      I agree. Who wants some entitled, me first, ego maniac coming in and disrupting the team chemistry. This is RW’s team. Period. End of story.

  23. Paul Cook

    Good. We can stop thinking about that now.

  24. BobbyK

    That trade is historically so un-Steeler-like.

    They lose their starting QB. They haven’t won a game through 1/8 of the season. And now they trade a potential top-10 pick for Fitzpatrick?

    The only logical explanation is someone is worried they will be fired so they’re making this trade to keep their job (and screw over the long-term interest of the franchise… buy why care when they wouldn’t have been part of it had they not won soon anyway).

    If the Dolphins play this right – they are going to be sitting pretty come draft day next year. They’ll be able to get their franchise QB … AND… surround that guy with a talented team in the next few years.

    This is a fire sale and they’re going to suck. Probably go 0-16. But who cares? Either you win the Super Bowl or you don’t. They’re really setting themselves up nicely for future Super Bowls.

    • Paul Cook

      The only caveat is that complete tear downs and rebuilds through the draft are a very iffy proposition. The only one off the top of my head that worked in this way was the Cowboys of the early 90’s. It takes a lot of trust that you will draft the right players and develop them into a cohesive winning unit.


    • Sean

      I think they clearly view Mason Rudolph as the future at QB. In this scenario they don’t need to look for that high round quarterback. I think Minkah is going to be more or less equal to any non QB pick they will be in a position to make in next years draft. This is assuming they don’t pick in the top 3, which I don’t think they will. They probably think they will win like 6-8 games this year. Minkah will most likely be better than any player they draft in the 8-16 range, especially as a proven NFL player versus an unknown quantity.

    • Simo

      Whoa! I wouldn’t be putting the Dolphins in the super bowl anytime soon! Yeah, they have a bundle of first round picks now, but that’s not a guarantee for success.

      That said, I still like what the Dolphins are doing here. They were due for a serious rebuild, and this is the best way to get there. Although trading off all your top talent is a tough way to go as well.

  25. Aaron Bostrom

    Well said, Rob. Although adding a player of their caliber is intriguing, if the fit isn’t perfect, why spend an arm and a leg on it.

  26. charlietheunicorn

    You have to hand it to the Dolphins. They are going all in on the rebuild. They have a vision and a purpose and you can’t argue with their ability to swing NFL assets into future draft picks. They have at least 4 1st rounders right now and some other throw in picks.

    What I worry about is that if they are successful, you may have a rash of other teams follow their model. This will hurt balance in the NFL and make some the games truly dreadful to watch. I mean, part of the reason MLB is falling in ratings and viewership is that they have at least 1/3 of the teams with no legit shot at anything except 100 losses.

    • Donovan

      Well said. I hope the “tanking” model doesn’t take hold in football.

  27. Gaux Hawks

    …Saints starting MLB Anzalone placed on IR

    • Simo

      Wow, hadn’t heard this news! He’s a pretty good player and this definitely weakens their interior defense.

  28. CHawk Talker Eric

    Full Fitzpatrick trade details

    PIT –> MIA: 2020 R1+ R5 + R6
    MIA –> PIT: Fitzpatrick, 2020 R4 + R7

    On paper it’s not unreasonable for PIT, but when you factor their 0-2 start and loss of star QB for the season, the PIT 2020 R1 might be top 10-12 pick. Too much imo for a player like Fitz. On the flip, it’s a potentially great deal for MIA. They could (probably will) have 3 top 10 picks in the 2020 draft!

    I’m slightly disappointed SEA didn’t get him. He’d be an exciting addition to LOB 2.0. Also, the better the team does this season, the lower their R1 pick would be, meaning the higher the value they would’ve got for it now by trading for Fitz.

    But I don’t think he’s a transformational player playing a crucial position, no is he a R1 pick better than Umadi/Taylor. So I’m more relieved they didn’t do it.

    Jalen Ramsey otoh? He’s worth a R1 pick. I would trade their 2020 R1 pick for Ramsey. Sure he wants to play 1-on-1 not zone, but so what? He plays what he’s coached to play. Plus, maybe you let him shadow another team’s true #1 WR when appropriate. He’s an elite athlete with elite traits at a crucial position. Yes, I would trade a R1 for Ramsey.

    • BradHawk

      Our offer might have been the second best offer. He had to be a safety candidate because we’re playing more base D than any team in the league and our Safety’s have been giving it up.

      • Chawk Talker Eric

        All other things being equal, PIT offer is worth more from an 0-2 team that just lost its aging star QB for the season (after losing its star RB and WR in the offseason) than it would be from a 2-0 team led by a legit mvp candidate QB in his prime.

        Fitzpatrick makes some sense to SEA, both schematically and situationally/contractually. I would have been excited if they did it. But I wouldn’t expect him to make THE difference this season. FWIW I don’t think SEA are quite in legit contention for conference championship/Super Bowl. But nor do I think adding Fitzpatrick would’ve made them so.

        And if they really are legit conference champ contenders (which I certainly hope if not believe), then they already are so without him.

        Also fwiw I think Ramsey has the potential to make a significant difference. Elite athleticism with elite traits at a premium position. SEA could never hope to draft a DB of his caliber with any R1 pick they’re ever likely to have under PC.

    • Rob Staton

      They’ll have two high picks. The Texans pick wont be high.

    • Sea Mode

      Just to be precise (Prosise?), a couple of those picks appear to be a swap in 2021:

      Adam Schefter

      Trade summary

      Dolphins get:
      🏈2020 1st-round pick
      🏈2020 5th-round pick
      🏈2021 6th-round pick

      Steelers get:
      🏈DB Minkah Fitzpatrick
      🏈2020 4th-round pick
      🏈2021 6th-round pick

      12:47 PM · Sep 17, 2019

      Still think it’s an over-pay by the Steelers.

      • Rob Staton

        I agree it’s an overpay.

        If their 2020 pick ends up being top five (not altogether unrealistic all considering), Fitzpatrick has to warrant that value. He wasn’t even a top-five pick last year. This move has to be about them believing Fitzpatrick can help them compete for the playoffs, which seems incredibly aggressive and somewhat unrealistic. Watching the Steelers on Sunday, I’m not sure anyone could point to the nickel or safety position being the thing preventing them from making a real run. They looked like a team with a number of issues.

        It’s just the timing which is weird, right after Big Ben went down for the year. This should be a season for taking stock and seeing what they’ve got. Instead they’ve made the kind of move you’d expect a competing team to make. ‘The final piece’ so to speak.

        • Hawkin

          Couldn’t agree more

        • Simo

          Great take on this situation Rob, agree this is a very puzzling move for the Steelers. Wonder if its not reactionary, given the 0-2 start? Maybe felt like they needed to make a big move, any big move, to show the fans they aren’t giving up the season?

          I’m glad Pitt made this strong move though, especially if it saved our R1 pick!

          • Hawkin

            How does it save our R1 pick?

            • CHawk Talker Eric

              Because we didn’t trade it to MIA for Fitzpatrick

        • BradHawk

          Ben has a history of injuries Mason can light it up, wouldn’t be surprised if Mason is the next QB star in the NFL. They have a really good O Line but Pouncy was injured against us had Pouncy been healthy it would have been a different game. Pitt also has a great DL too

          • Rob Staton

            Let’s wait until we’ve seen Mason Rudolph start a NFL game because pondering whether he’s the next star QB.

  29. Troy

    Jalen is a huge talent and of course who wouldnt want to get more talent. The problem is the cost involved and the fact that like the article points out he doesnt want to play zone.

    The cost is probably too high to bear. I would assume it would cost more than the Hawks would pay.

    Our team is solid and maybe someone else is on the trade market to place into our secondary. If not, most are young and growth potential is certainly there.

    On Fitzpatrick…who I did want. The Steelers put up a ton for him. especially when they are in a position they could end up being 4-12 this year. I know their schedule is very friendly and they could probably pull out a 8-8 if Randolph is legit (I take little from the game against us considering now gameplans will be against him and he was still -5 if not -12 considering the fumble).

    Now if a OL becomes available. Im interested for sure 🙂

  30. Shaumye

    Wish we could convince Jalen to come play free safety lol, his skills would be more valuable to us there.

  31. GoHawksDani

    After the game vs PIT, I also think a trade is unlikely. Lano seems OK, McDougald seems good, Taylor was fine, Flowers and Griffin are OK…nothing spectacular, but not worth giving up too much resource to get a new guy.
    As for trades, I think Fitzpatrick is more likely. He’s less proven, ergo probably less compensation. I think if they could get him for a 2nd and 4th or a 1st and 4th (when they also receive MIA 3rd) they’d pull the trigger. He’s also pretty cheap for a couple more years. They could use him as nickel/big nickel.
    But MIA won’t give up for that price, no way. So yeah, I really doubt that trade.

    As for Ramsey, even less chance:
    1, They don’t want loud, Sherman-type guys in the locker room. Ramsey is even worse than Sherm regarding that aspect.
    2, They don’t have the CAP space to push in a big contract. Not this year, not next year if they wanna keep Reed, Clowney, and some other guys
    3, Ramsey trade would likely mean 1st and 3rd for Ramsey and 4th. Not because JAX has a real option of keeping him, but he’ll have plenty suitors.
    4, Our outside CBs are more set. Griffin and Flowers are nothing spectacular but they’re not a big liability either.

    I really hope you’re wrong Rob and Ramsey don’t come to the NFC west… either Cards or 49ers would get a big boost. They’re already stronger than expected and an addition like that could even mean 1 or 2 more losses to the Hawks

  32. Trevor

    Hard No on Ramsey for me. We just got rid of the drama (Sheen, Earl and Bennett) the players all talk about how great the chemistry is.

    Plus the secondary should look a whole lot better when you insert Ansah, Reed and Ford back into the lineup and the pass rush improves as expected.

    There will be mistakes because they are young but by mid season I bet Pete has turned the secondary into a a solid unit.

    • Sea Mode

      Great points, especially about the secondary improving once the pass rush gets up to full strength.

  33. Trevor

    People are ripping the Steeler for the Fitzpatrick trade because of the Ben injury. But they clearly liked him a lot and view him as a long term building block with 4 more years of cheap team control at a position where they needed a ton of help. The price was high but they clearly like the player and bunk he fits thier scheme long term.

  34. Rob Staton

    If Seattle bring any veterans in I hope they’re BAMF’s.

    We once had Kam, Browner, Sherman, Earl, Marshawn, Red Bryant, Chris Clemons, Michael Bennett. They were BAMF’s. At the moment we have talented players but a distinct lack of BAMF’s.

    Fitzpatrick is not a BAMF.

    • Sea Mode


      Not sure what names, if any, are out there that could become available by the trade deadline. Otherwise, let’s just keep building through the draft.

      I was on board for Fitzpatrick, but definitely not at the price the Steelers paid for him. R2 plus a player (Tedric) would have been my best offer for him.

      Ramsey is extremely talented, but IMO will simply cost too much both in terms of draft capital and new contract. And then there’s the attitude that some have mentioned which could become a distraction. It’s only “swag” or whatever up to a certain point and then it becomes unwanted drama and media attention.

      Our BAMF list for now I think consists of Carson, Reed, Wagner, Fluker on a few days, and Metcalf who will grow into it. Hopefully Blair will add to that once he gets up to speed. Maybe Al Woods a bit if he continues to show up with that intensity. But very few guys who opponents wake up game day morning and immediately think, “ah crap, I’ve gotta line up against that guy today.”

      • Rob Staton

        I actually wouldn’t classify even Bobby as a BAMF. Exceptional player and athlete. But not that nasty, edgy, slightly unhinged type that dictates a tone. I think we’re practically out of those currently. It was a major plus for the team previously to have so many alpha’s like Kam, Earl, Sherman, Browner, Bennett, Marshawn.

        • Sea Mode

          Ok, that’s fair.

          Forgetting about the price for the moment, do you think Ramsey would bring some of that? Or is he just a really talented player who talks trash?

          • Rob Staton

            I think he has BAMF characteristics mixed in with some entitlement. And unlike Sherman, he’s not subtle with the way he speaks in the media.

            I think he’s an outstanding talent but there’s baggage that comes with it. And I’m not sure once he becomes the highest paid corner in the league whether that’s a good combo. Especially at a position the Seahawks don’t really need to invest mega money in.

        • Logan Lynch

          I’ve mentioned it before, but I think SEA is looking for a different type of BAMF now. Less of the brash, in-your-face kind…like the difference between confidence and arrogance. They have very confident guys now like Bobby, Russ, Carson, Duane, etc. who may not say much outside the field, but will demoralize you in between the lines and then smile in your face after. Kam was more like this than others in the previous regime. This shift seems to be intentional. Find players who are Clark Kent off the field, but Superman on it.

          • Rob Staton

            I think every good team needs a couple of b******s. I do think we need to find them over the next year or so.

            Although I will say — Duane Brown is a definite BAMF.

            • Logan Lynch

              No argument from me. It would be nice to have one of those on the DL too. That seems to be a position that would really benefit from that.

        • icb12

          I think it’s safe to say (now) that Browner was a little more than “slightly unhinged”.

          I’m all for BAMFs. If we could avoid plucking them from the dirtbag-dregs of society-child abuser lineup that would be good.

          • Rob Staton

            Of course.

            Browner was a BAMF though… it’s a real shame about the other stuff.

        • BradHawk

          Our linebackers set the tone always knock the crap out of WR, TE’s, and RB’s. There is no harder hitting unit in the league.

          • Rob Staton

            I’m not knocking the linebackers.

            But being a good player doesn’t make you a BAMF.

      • mishima

        Add Blair, eventually/maybe Barton.

    • Simo

      How about Clowney and Ansah as BAMFers? Once JD gets fully acclimated, he can surely be a BAMF and one man wrecking crew. Ansah maybe not as much, but if he gets his 2017 form back, he’s also got wrecking ball potential.

      Maybe neither of these guys has the BAMF attitude or swagger you’re describing, but there’s certainly potential. We need one or two on the oline as well.

      • Rob Staton

        I think Ansah is a million miles away from BAMF status. Clowney is too nice. He’s a great athlete but he’s no Kam/Browner/Marshawn is he.

    • Gohawks5151

      This is isn’t talked about enough actually. Not to go too far the other way but you could make the argument they have NO BAMFs on this team. This is a young team that is being brought up by Russ on one side and Bobby on the other. They are tremendous leaders, athletes and competitors. But the do lack and the edge and wild card factor of past Seahawk and other championship teams.

      IMO Brown, Reed, and maybe Dissly are it. When Fluker and Ifedi have it rolling in the run game they look like they could be. The other stuff will hurt Ifedi’s perception as one though. Like has been said, I think Blair is a guy that can be a genuine BAMF. He has really only played 2 games and already has the big hitter rep in the secondary.

      Seattle could use more of these guys but it will be interesting to see who they bring in. They seem scared to death about team chemistry and not undermining who they see as leaders. But often times these type of guys have big personalities that teammates are drawn to. It will be interesting to see the person they eventually take a risk on. BTW Ramsey is a BAMF no question.

    • McZ

      This is why I want Evan Weaver, LB/Edge, Cal. He bamfed the Huskies into desperation.

    • MyChestIsBeastmode

      Michael Dickson. BOOM! Tricky Dickey for the win.

    • Matt

      There’s a young BAMF *allegedly* available. Jamal Adams. He is a big time BAMF – problem is, he doesn’t fit into this system.

      Otherwise – he’s a Seahawk everyday of the week and twice on Sunday.

  35. Paul Cook

    That’s interesting about the BAMF factor. Strangely enough, if I had to name our our biggest BAMF, it would be RW, No, he may not fit the more stereotypical version of it, but behind his little smile and unerringly politically correct and cliched way of speaking and presenting himself, he’s an assassin underneath. Make no mistake, RW is one bad-arse competitor.

    • Simo

      Great point P Cook, Russ is a sneaky, non-traditional BAMF!!

      • Paul Cook

        I thought it an interesting question posed by Rob. Is it important for a team to have that more stereotypically brash, in-your-face, somewhat rebelliously independent type of alpha BAMF? I mean, it is a very emotional, aggressive, and violent sport after all. There’s no doubt that Lynch, Sherman, Bennett, and Earl fit that part in varying degrees with our SP teams.

        But it’s also interesting to note that the two main cogs the Hawks FO kept during this reloading period were RW and Wags, who certainly are alpha dogs of no small degree, but are also of a different variety of BAMF, perhaps a more subtle version of it.

        RW is certainly the face of the franchise now from a player’s perspective, whereas it could be argued that Lynch was during our SP runs. Did the FO make a very conscious decision to change the culture of the team in this way?


    • Rob Staton

      I’ve got to be honest… I can’t think of anyone less ‘BAMF’ than Russell Wilson.

      The guy is a complete dweeb.

      • Paul Cook

        But that was my point. As someone mentioned before, he’s more of a “Clark Kent” version of BAMF. Yes, dweeb on the outside, assassin on the inside. In some ways, that could well be a more subtle and dangerous version of BAMF.

        Just a thought.

        • Rob Staton

          I think, for me, the definition of a BAMF is a player who plays with a violent edge. Someone who sets a physical tone. Marshawn, Kam, Browner. Those are the guys I think of when I think of a BAMF. Wilson is an exceptional player and competitor and legitimately one of the top QB’s in the game. But I can’t think of a player less BAMF than Russell.

          • Paul Cook

            No biggie. I just have a wider range as pertains to the term beyond the more stereotypical version of it. I think you can be just as much a killer on the field without having to let everyone know about it beyond what happens on the field.

            I grew up a Bears fan. There was no team/defense in NFL history that had a more swaggeringly arrogant BAMF factor than them. LOL

            • Rob Staton

              I wouldn’t call my definition ‘stereotypical’. You’re either a BAMF or you’re not. Let’s be right here. Wilson is a great competitor. But he also has A-Rod traits, he’s a bit goofy and awkward. I’m talking strictly about physical intensity on the field. I think you’re conflating being a BAMF with being a great competitor or a skillful, determined player. Nobody could ever place Russell in the same category as Marshawn or Kam.

              • Paul Cook

                We just have a different perspective. That’s all. I can respect that. I don’t care if RW is goofy or awkward as long as he’s a killer on the field.

              • Simo

                I think we all understand the concept of a BAMF, and what one is like. IMO Kam was the prototypical BAMF, with the enforcer mentality he brought to the game each and every week. You might catch the pass, or make a decent run, but you were surely going to pay for it!

                The challenge also appears to be channeling the attitude, aggressiveness, etc in the right way. When players like Marshawn, Earl, Sherm, Bennett become distractions, it clearly begins to offset, even erode their effectiveness as BAMF. At what point is the side show no longer worth it? Even Kam was a distraction during his holdout, but clearly not to the level of the others.

      • Aaron

        Russ is a dork, but he’s our dork. Do you think Reed, Poona, or Clowney are BAMFs? How about Britt and Fluker? Carson? I agree that we need a few BAMFs, and maybe we do in Amadi and Blair.

        • Rob Staton

          Clowney is a terrific athlete but not a BAMF. Reed is borderline. Britt is physical but he’s not a BAMF for me, ditto Fluker (he’s just big).

          A BAMF is a soul snatching, tone-setting absolute monster like Kam and Marshawn.

          • Aaron

            In that case, we don’t have a BAMF on this team. I think we need at least one on each side of the ball. I have thought about that for awhile. I’ve hoped we’d bring in or draft a guy who’s got a little crazy in him and sets the tone.

            • Rob Staton

              I think Duane Brown could qualify as a BAMF. Maybe.

              But struggling to think of another proper, established BAMF.

          • BradHawk

            Metcalf, Barton, Dissly, Blair, Dickson are BAMF. Not only is Dickson BAMF but he can crush BAMF’s souls.

            • Rob Staton

              They are not BAMF’s.

              Would anyone seriously look at Cody Barton and say…. he reminds me of Kam and Marshawn.

              • BradHawk

                I would he’s still learning how to control it that’s why he got the penalty game 1.

                • Rob Staton

                  We’ll have to agree to disagree then. Because if you think Cody Barton is a Marshawn & Kam type BAMF we’re watching different players.

              • BradHawk

                Metcalf is 100% BAMF and some! When he has the ball love how he attacks the DB, in Pittsburg he actually planted a DB into the turf.

    • GoHawksDani

      Carson is surely a BAMF running over people and always with the angry smiley on social media. He likes to hit

      • BradHawk

        He is and so is Penny. When Penny gets going he’s a load. Penny plays like Curtis Martin when he plays good.

      • BradHawk

        Against the Bengals Carson secured the win by blasting through defenders leaving a trail of defenders lying on the ground.

  36. ZB

    I was thinking about the BAMF concept and Rob is right, we don’t have any on the team anymore. I get that Ramsey has his personality issues but is that kinda what all BAMF players have? I’m not a huge fan off the field on Ramsey but when it’s game time he seems to boost his confidence on the rest of the defense. To put if bluntly….I wouldn’t be mad if we made the trade.

  37. dcd2

    Patriots seem to do fine without a BAMF every year. Maybe Bellichek fills the void.

    On another note in the Ramsey thread. What about Yannik? The Jags are 0-2, lost their QB for most of the year, have Ramsey asking out, and along that line Marrone seems to have lost control of that team a bit. They haven’t extended Yannik, despite his holdout and obvious talent. Maybe they entertain offers, as it seems unlikely they’ll be able to keep him.

    Taco Charleton from Dallas might be a less expensive idea. He has been inactive and recently said he wants out. Former 1st rounder, who admittedly hasn’t lived up to the hype, but would probably only cost a late round pick to acquire. Also interesting to note that SDB favorite Tristan Hill hasn’t been active for either of their games. With Moore coming back maybe Brown is expendable for Charleton, as Dallas lost Gallup for a few weeks?

    • Simo

      Great thoughts here dcd2! Although Yannick is an excellent player, still think our best course of action is to give our dline a bit more time to come together. Ansah hasn’t even played yet, same with Reed. Clowney is still getting his feet under him, he should continue to get better. DL should look very different soon, and hopefully the other guys (Jackson, Jefferson, Green, etc) will be the depth we need.

      As most have suggested, our biggest needs appear to be at FS and nickel corner, not to mention OL potentially. If there’s trades/upgrades to be had that will vastly improve these areas, we should be in the hunt.

      • dcd2

        I agree that with Ansah, Reed, Poona, Clowney our D Line should look better. I’d also say that you can never have too much D line. Half of that ‘ideal’ line is already hurt and was in week one. Depth for injuries aside, depth for rotation sake is as important. Being able to rotate in Collier and Ansah for Clowney and Yannik would be filthy.

        Anyway, I’m spittballing. It just seems that by midway through the season, a couple DL guys are hurt and a few more are banged up and it’s the fact that we can’t get any pass rush which is leading to QB’s standing in the pocket for 5 seconds before completing a 3rd and 14.

        I’ve always liked Yannick and the Jags ship seems to be sinking already. Was over there reading about Ramsay and realized how bad it’s gotten. He’ll probably cost too much, but it’s a fun thought. He’s 24 and has around 30 sacks and 10 forced fumbles coming into this year.

    • Rob Staton

      In fairness the Pats have Brady and Belichick. They could have 50 water balloons making up the roster and they’d still compete.

  38. Gohawks5151

    Possible BAMF right on cue. I’d give a first for Adams easy. A dude that can lead the secondary for the next 6 years.


    • Rob Staton

      He’s very good but he’s a 4.56 runner. Not a free safety for me.

      • Gohawks5151

        True. He is currently a SS at the Jets. But Mcdougald can play FS and Blair was getting reps there too. He can be a Kam-like tone setter and I don’t think you can question he is a BAMF.

        • Rob Staton

          It’s a non starter for me.

          I like Jamal Adams but trading a first round pick on a strong safety months after drafting one in round two makes little sense.

          • Sean

            I dont know if we should get so fixated on the 40 time when Jamal Adams has already proven it in the NFL. Ed Reed was maybe the greatest Free Safety ever and he ran a 4.57. Jamal Adams is a baller, no doubt he would be an amazing Free Safety.

            • Volume12

              Ed Reed was probably the most instinctual FS of all time which made up for his lack of speed. He also played in an era where every team wasn’t trying to spread you out and therefore didn’t have to cover as much ground as he would in today’s era.

              • Sean

                Yeah that makes sense. Although Eric Weddle only ran a 4.48, and he has been playing in the spread era. He has even been effective later in his career, when clearly he lost a step. But I get where you are coming from.

            • Rob Staton

              I never even saw him as a FS in college. It’s just not him. He’s a terrific SS.

          • Gohawks5151

            Wasn’t Blair listed as a FS though? Unless I’m mistaken, BM is in year 2 of a 3 year deal and will be 30 at the end of it so no one on this team has the SS position locked down long term. If speed is the issue, let Blair take the deep middle and let Adams play the strong. I’m not exactly championing the trade but I don’t see the fit being as bad as some have made it out to be. And with all the talk about BAMFs, when a young one pops loose that can set the tone on the back end and give you a leader at each level of the defense, you have to at least consider it

            • Rob Staton

              Blair is a SS. They’ve brought him in to be an enforcer type with his hitting.

              McDougald is 29 in November not 30. And even if he was 30, it’s not like he’s 36.

              It’s not happening dude.

              • Gohawks5151

                Again I’m not pushing hard to get him. I like having 5 picks in the first 3 rounds next year so I wouldn’t give up the picks easy. I was arguing his fit and place in the scheme. Bottom line if PCJS think he tilts the field they will be in on him and find a place. Also bottom line, I’m just a guy happy to talk about the Hawks and avoid work!

                Also 30 was too old to extend Earl… 😉

      • Eli

        Look up his pro day 40 time. Reported anywhere between 4.33 and 4.40.

        • Rob Staton

          Yeah… I’m always very suspicious when a guy runs 4.56 at the combine and then suddenly runs a 4.33. Pro-days. Where players magically become faster.

          • Eli

            Yeah, I mean, I don’t necessarily think he ran a 4.33 either but it can go both ways and I just try to be logical about it. Same thing happened with Earl (4.49 combine vs. 4.37 pro day).

            • Rob Staton

              In fairness Earl pulled a hamstring during the run at the combine.

  39. Paul Cook

    Does nobody consider Bobby Wagner a BAMF?

    • ZB

      I do.

      • Paul Cook

        I think most coaches and players would agree with you.

    • icb12

      Uh no.
      Bobby is too nice.
      Helluva leader, fantastic competitor, best linebacker in football with a chance to go down as the best of all time.

      But BAMF. No.

      • icb12

        To me it’s guys like Marshawn, Kam, Ronnie Lott, James Harrison, Rodney Harrison, Lawrence Taylor, Bruce Smith (90s Bills), jerome bettis, etc etc.

        Guys who make opponents fear for their well-being. Scary SOBs.

    • Rob Staton

      Bobby is a fantastic player. But being a fantastic player doesn’t necessarily make you a Kam/Marshawn type BAMF.

    • BradHawk

      Yes because he stops runners in their tracks. KJ is an absolute monster! Both KJ & Kendrick’s are laying wood big time.

  40. Volume12

    Jason Meyers?

    • Sea Mode

      No, but Michael Dickson absolutely yes!

      • Volume12

        In all seriousness, am hoping Marquise Blair can be that dude.

  41. Jopa726

    Rob, Have you demanded a trade from the BBC to Sky sports? Everybody doing it. Wow, is the NFL turning into the NBA? How do you think NFL Teams, who traditionally have had a iron grip on their players, react to this new environment? The Commissioner has been silent as star after star demand trades. For every action there is a reaction. Is a NFL Strike over guaranteed player contracts coming?

    Also, Miami is definitely losing for Tua. New England is rolling along and building the Death Star with Antonio Brown in the role of Dark Helmet. Crazy year and we’re only two weeks in.

    • dcd2

      Hard to argue with that.

      The AB fiasco was Pandora’s Box. The guy did literally everything the wrong way, reneged on a contract he signed just 2 years prior, acted like an absolute ass and ended up getting everything he wanted (more money on the Pats).

      Meanwhile in Dallas, Elliot with TWO years on his rookie deal goes to Cabo and misses the entirety of camp, while Dak who has only one year left on his deal, shows up to camp, does what he’s supposed to, is a good teammate etc. How does that play out? Zeke gets a his money with no repercussions, while Dak still waits.

      The moral of the story in today’s NFL seems to be: *Look out for yourself at the expense of all others. Don’t honor the contract you’ve signed, it’s fine. Act like a petulant child until you get your way.

      *This rule only applies to all-pro level talent


      I don’t think that we can get to the levels that the NBA has sunk to. The cap will always be there and the fact that every all-pro (and more importantly their agent’s) demands a new record deal each time they’re up won’t allow for too many all-stars to be on a team. In the NBA you can have 3-4 superstars and a bunch of guys on the minimum. That’s half the lineup. You can’t have 12 superstars making max money in the NFL.

  42. Paul Cook

    I think, on the defensive side of the ball, being a psycho hitter like Ronnie Lott and Jack Tatum, for example, has diminishing value in the new NFL. You can’t lead with your head anymore. You can’t hit someone in the helmet. You can’t hit someone when you’re out of their field of vision. You can’t hit someone low. You can’t hit someone with excessive force without getting a flag. And you can barely touch a QB now.

    I grew up a Bears fan, and the great mid 80’s Bears defensive team would be illegal now, for all intents and purposes. The game has changed significantly in this manner. The premium now is on those who can tackle cleanly.

  43. Tony

    Carson is our biggest BAMF. He runs to punish. Look at his TD and 4th down runs. He wont have the polarizing name that scares fans. But I really think opposing players know him well and dont love facing him.

    I will say that I do think the seahawks intentionally moved on from the brash types. That was a unique roster during the SB years. Without a doubt one of the most physically in your face teams, on par with the the classic bears, steelers, and ravens great teams. But that was lightning in a bottle. And we all knew it wouldnt last. But I believe the hawks intend to find the more bobby, rw mentalities. Great players that have a edge on the field. Guys that are more team all in mantra. If they land a ET or a sherm again, I bet they decidedly handle it differently.

    I’d rather have a cold blooded assassin like rw anyways. Michael Jordan was an assassin, he didnt scream and fire people up. Dude stepped on a court and no matter what, would do anything to win. RW is no Jordan or Brady. But his clutch is 2nd to none. When the 4th quarter hits or you’re down, he always steps up.

  44. Sea Mode

    Thank u, next

    Albert Breer

    Per rival clubs, the asking price for Jaguars CB Jalen Ramsey is two first-round picks.

    That’s a starting point. And added to what it’d cost to extend Ramsey, it’s a lot. But it’s not totally crazy, given what Seattle got for Frank Clark and Miami got for Laremy Tunsil.

    8:01 PM · Sep 17, 2019

    • Paul Cook

      LOL Moving on…

    • Matt

      Jacksonville is high. Ramsey is incredible – but who is dropping *at least* two 1sts on a malcontent and then having to pay him $20M/year?

      No gracias.

      • Paul Cook

        Bob Condotta’s Twitter feed has a link that says KC is hot on trail for him, as they are weak at CB and all in to win this year.

        We’ll see…

        • icb12

          The chiefs traded Marcus Peters for a 4th and a 2nd rounder… and now considering trading multiple high picks for Ramsey.
          Trade 1 talented headache for another and lose draft stock in the process.

          Such a weird franchise. Trade Peters then potentially trade for Ramsey. Cut hunt, but trade for Frank Clark and pay Tyreek Hill.

          • BradHawk

            Peter’s is notorious for rogue during the game

        • Sean

          I don’t get what KC is doing if they trade 2 1sts for him. Yes they are in win now mode, but if they don’t win they are setting themselves up for a horrible situation. Unlike a lot of other win now teams, they don’t have a timer on their QB. If it doesn’t work out, they are going to mess up Mahommes prime.

        • arias

          It’s a done deal. Jalen to the Chiefs.

  45. Sea Mode

    2019 Week 2: Seahawks at Steelers | Seahawks All Access

  46. BradHawk

    Lots of big nasty’s OL in next years draft.

    • Rob Staton

      Is there?

      Way too early to project that. At the moment the options look sparse.

      • BradHawk

        Have you looked? Even Pauline is raving about Kentucky having a G that could be had in the 4th. Have you seen the Louisville OT. Ohio state has a stud LT. I see many prospects in the 2020 draft it’s completely loaded possibly 2 Iowa OT’s, Oregon has a couple, ND Irish have a monster G, TCU has a RT with elite pass coverage skills.

        • Rob Staton

          Yes I’ve looked. I write a draft blog. Have done for 11 years.

          No it isn’t loaded.

          • BradHawk

            Yes it is! I’ve been reading your draft blog for 11 years you wanted us to draft the USC RB and tried to convince everyone he was a first round pick, Griffith’s year you pushed for 1st round CB’s that weren’t durable. I know when your right and when your wrong I demonstrated it last week when you insisted Big Ben was gonna be a problem and I said Ben was gonna get knocked out of the game, when Ben & his center we’re banged up. Today you implied the most physical team in the league (Seahawks) needs more BAMF players when the roster is loaded with BAMF. The other day you implied WR Ross a guy with 4.2 speed should not have torched our Defense when he did it again against the Niners.

  47. Paul Cook

    I’ll be quite interested in the OT and OG draft prospects this year. The only one I really know well is Trey Adams as a Husky fan. But even he scares me a little with his recent knee and back problems.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m happy to look at O-line prospects this year with a lack of clarity on the long term plans at a position or two.

      But I’ll keep stressing that this is a team that, for the last couple of years, has preferred to bring in veterans and not rely on unproven rookies on the OL. And I can’t really see that changing now.

      • Paul Cook

        You’re right (Iupati, Brown, Fluker). I’m just a little bummed that Ifedi hasn’t been equal to his draft weight in gold, and that Pocic hasn’t won a starting job yet (I read so much good stuff on him, hoped he’d be a stud…maybe he still will). I’d love for us to pick someone fairly high and have them really pan out, like it did with Okung, Jones, Hutchinson, Unger. It’s been awhile.

        I just want to protect our franchise QB as he ages.

        • Rob Staton

          Justin Britt has been well worth the second rounder they spent on him.

          And to be fair, Okung and Jones were both #6 overall picks. If you want a player like that, you need to be picking in the top-10 not the back end of round one.

          • Paul Cook

            I forgot that Britt was picked that high. If you had asked me, and I didn’t do Google refresh, I would have said 3rd round at highest.

            And you’re absolutely right. Okung and Jones were about as can’t miss as you get near the top of the board.

            Yeah, I would be surprised if they went OL in the first round, or dare I bother to mention, move up a bit in the first to get one that fell a bit more than expected.


            • Rob Staton

              I think it’s possible they’d take an OL early. There was a lot of buzz they loved Ryan Kelly in 2016. I think it’d have to be that type of player though — extremely mature, hard-nosed, good athlete, very consistent. Not someone who needs three years of work. Otherwise they’re going to go down the veteran route which, in fairness, has really helped them over the last two years.

        • CHawk Talker Eric

          I commented on the Instant Reaction post that Ifedi isn’t the boogeyman on the OL that most of us are making him out to be. At least he wasn’t vs PIT. Fluker was/has been the weak link thus far.

          I also opined that Ifedi is a better than League average RT — certainly among the better run blocking RTs — and that he is almost certainly better than any realistic/foreseeable alternative. He has elite size and (relative) athleticism. His problems arise when he’s asked to adjust on the fly. That’s correctable with coaching and experience. I think many who decry his performance now would be complaining even worse about whomever could replace him.

          I think Pocic has advanced tremendously from last year to now. I think he’s the 2nd best OG on the team, after Iupati (maybe even the 2nd best OL after Brown). I won’t be surprised if Pocic takes over for Fluker at RG at some point during this season.

          • McZ

            They will not pay 10m for Ifedi, and if he were above average (which is debatable), he would cash in a lot more than that.

            Adjusting on the fly is a mental problem, and it’s not his main problem. Still having no clean hands is. And yes, that is coachable. But the older a guy gets, the less you can iron out these problems. There is no sign of improvement.

            His run blocking got better when he got a massive guy next to him. It’s a diffence, if you have to scan a 120 or a 240 degree zone.

      • BradHawk

        TCU’s Lucas Niang will solve our pass protection problems.

        • Rob Staton

          Will he now

          • BradHawk

            At RT yes he will! Elite pass coverage skills returned to TCU because he did not receive a 1st round grade due to run blocking. Wirfs was the 1st OT to start as a freshman for Iowa in 20 years.

            • Rob Staton

              Tony Pauline reported over the weekend that Wirfs isn’t likely to declare.

              Niang has ‘elite’ pass blocking skills but didn’t get a R1 grade last year? Is it possible for an ‘elite’ pass blocker to receiver less than a R1 grade when there’s a dearth of ‘elite’ pass blockers in the NFL?

              • Scotty

                Yes it is possible if they are really bad at run blocking. No use for a one way player in the NFL, at least in the 1st round.

                • Rob Staton

                  The league is desperate for pass blocking tackles.

                  If a player is an ‘elite’ pass blocker (not a good pass blocker, an ELITE pass blocker) they’re going in round one.

                  • BradHawk

                    He said he’s trying to be the #1 tackle drafted when he wasn’t rated round 1 as an underclassman he decided to stay and prove everybody wrong. Gotta love his mentality because he could be a really good run blocker.

                  • BradHawk

                    Scouts say he’s elite that’s a fact!

                    • Rob Staton

                      Stop it now Brad.

            • WALL UP

              He would need time to adjust the speed of the league. Also, hand placement and feet movement will need improvement. He does possess the desired measures for the RT position though.

            • McZ

              Niang is an outlier. He is Ifedi 2.0, just too many technical problems to fix to become an instant starter.
              He is a player, who can learn behind a veteran, and become a really solid successor in his third season.

              IMO, this is kne of the deepest OL drafts for a decade. I think, Alex Leatherwood and Calvin Throckmorton are two talented guys, who could last until R2 or early R3.

              And still, I would sign a veteran for a year or two, because this is how OL development works.

              • Rob Staton

                Sorry but I see very little evidence of the deepest OL draft in a decade.

                In 2016, 15 linemen were taken in the first three rounds including nine in the first two rounds.

                This year 12 offensive linemen went in the top 50!

                At the moment there’s not those numbers contained with this draft eligible class.

                • McZ

                  Every year, OL players are picked out of despearation. Of the 2019 breed, only three are real seasoned NFL wood. This will be different in 2020.

                  We can agree to disagree here.

                  • Rob Staton

                    No we can’t.

                    If you’re going to say this is going to be the deepest O-line class in a decade you can’t then just say, ‘well I guess some players will emerge’ as evidence for that.

                    There’s not even enough evidence to argue it’s half as deep as this years crop let alone the best in a decade!

  48. Aaron

    Maybe PC and JS have changed their approach after some of our old BAMFs ended their careers in Seattle in, to put it mildly, less than a tactful way. Maybe they want guys who won’t feel entitled once they get that second deal, or players that won’t call out coaches and news reporters. Maybe they want a little less crazy and a little more steady eddy. None of those old BAMFs, besides Kam, ended their time in Seattle all that well…

    Kam – Neck injury ended career but he did hold out back in 2015.
    Sherm – Called out coaches and reporters, called the organization “the titanic,” talked trash but couldn’t back it up, went ballistic when we’d pass near the goal line.
    Earl – Held out, flipped off Hawks as he exited, told Cowboys to “come get me,” played conservatively for him in 2018 to avoid injury.
    Bennett – Constant political rhetoric, sense of entitlement, frequently hurting players of opposing teams when game wasn’t going our way.
    Marshawn – Got third contract when he was clearly on the downturn, wouldn’t travel with team, had a voluntary status towards practicing.


    • Rob Staton

      Maybe. But I don’t think BAMF has to mean bad character. I think despite the holdout, none of us can do anything but praise the way Kam handled his business.

  49. Sea Mode

    Sweet. Tony Romo will be calling the Seahawks vs. Saints.

  50. cha

    After only 2 weeks 2019 is turning into a war of attrition with QBs.

    Luck retired with injuries

    Big Ben out for the year

    Out for significant time:

    Banged up:

    (I suppose you could include Alex Smith if you wanted to pile on)

    That’s some serious talent drain

  51. Dale Roberts

    My BAMF Seahawk vote goes to Fluker. When he became a starter the running game took off and it’s not because he’s some kind of technician.

  52. Hawk fan 206

    Thoughts on the recently released Taco Charlton? Would he be a good fit and worth the risk?

    • Rob Staton

      Hard to get excited about a player who lasted only two years at the team that drafted him.

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