Offensive line building & value over need

Just a few quick thoughts today. I have a couple of long travelling days ahead but wanted to share a short post.

With two weeks to go one important thing to remember is — what kind of team do the Seahawks want to be?

We know the answer. We know they want to run the ball at a high level. We know they want to use it to connect the defense and special teams together. It’s something they haven’t managed to do consistently for a long time.

Much to the chagrin of many fans, they may be about to actually reduce their spending on the offensive line. By passing the torch to Shane Waldron and Andy Dickerson, they could be relying on scheme over talent. The Rams for a long time have plugged linemen in without any real fanfare. Their one big investment was Andrew Whitworth — a player in his late 30’s.

The Seahawks can still bring back Duane Brown to be their Whitworth. They’ve already signed former Rams center Austin Blythe. It won’t be a stunning turn of events if they simply find cheap fits rather than make big additions in the draft.

It’s worth mentally preparing yourself for that — if you’re someone hoping for some key trench additions in a fortnight.

On the other hand, there’s another side to consider.

When Pete Carroll and John Schneider arrived in Seattle they set about building an offensive line then delivering a heart-and-soul running back in Marshawn Lynch. Their first big decision was to draft Russell Okung. In 2011 their first two picks were James Carpenter and John Moffitt. They also added Robert Gallery as a big-name free agent having inherited Max Unger at center.

They had the most expensive O-line in the league by the time they won the Super Bowl.

Will they feel they can just transplant the Rams’ blocking scheme and voila — have a great O-line? That feels a bit risky and leaving yourself open to criticism.

It’s plausible they lend a bit from both perspectives. Shift to the Rams scheme while also being prepared to inves up front.

We’ll find out soon enough what they intend to do.

I do like the idea of attempting to build a top-level O-line. As noted a lot by now — this isn’t the draft to go searching for a left tackle early. Evan Neal and Ikem Ekwonu are both better suited to guard. Charles Cross has become quite the overrated player. Trevor Penning has impressive physical potential but needs so much technical refinement he probably has to be eased in at right guard or right tackle. Abraham Lucas is excellent but there’s little point moving him from the right side.

I don’t want to beat a dead horse but if you want to run the ball well — the two best run-blocking linemen I’ve watched so far are probably Zion Johnson and Taylor Linderbaum.

Both have weaknesses against the pass. With Johnson he gets too amped to attack and can be caught with his positioning. There are snaps on tape and at the Senior Bowl where he was beaten by quickness or power. Linderbaum meanwhile is just so lacking in size/length that there will be occasions where he’s driven off the line and gets bull-rushed into the backfield.

However, they both do a very good job using technical skill to turn opponents to create running lanes. They can bully and harass. They love to get to the second level and reach up to turn good runs into big runs. Both are incredibly explosive, athletic and tested brilliantly.

Putting them in the interior with Damien Lewis could create the best guard/center group in the NFL within a year or two. That would pave the way for better results in the running game, greater consistency and you can play your brand of football.

I want the Seahawks to establish some form of identity. I also want them to select players in this draft with the potential to be among the best at their positions. I think Johnson and Linderbaum fit that bill.

Dallas had a lot of success drafting Zack Martin in the mid-first round and Travis Frederick in the late-first. Nobody quibbled about those two moves when they saw the results. Yes — the Cowboys also had Tyron Smith. I’m not sure having only, say, Duane Brown instead of Smith is reason enough to avoid this kind of approach.

I don’t think the Seahawks will trade down from #9 then double-dip on the interior O-line. I do think it could produce the results they want though.

Instead I fear they’re going to do what they’ve sadly become known for in the draft and that’s filling holes to produce a complete roster. I wonder if they’re more likely to select Penning to play right tackle, re-sign Brown and square-off that if nothing else Penning can simply stay on the right side. I think they will draft a linebacker and a running back fairly early. They will add another pass rusher and possibly a quarterback.

Thus, the holes will be filled.

I’d prefer them to embrace the nature of the rebuild and either take a player with major potential (Derek Stingley Jr) or trade down and start building a structure. Assuming of course the top pass rushers don’t make it to #9 (and they almost certainly won’t).

Johnson and Linderbaum are safe picks with the upside to elevate your line and running game into the top-10. They have the agility and quickness to play in the Rams’ blocking scheme and the explosive athleticism to justify early-round investment.

The first two days of the draft will be interesting to learn about Seattle’s mindset. If they’re intent on filling holes we might see:

R1 — Trevor Penning
R2 — Quarterback
R2 — Linebacker
R3 — Running back
R4 — Pass rusher

I’d rather concentrate on setting the table for 2023. Add players who can take you to where you want to go. Show the restraint and patience of 2010/11 where the foundations were built by investing in the offensive line and drafting a fantastic defensive back in Earl Thomas.

My preference would be to try and draft an exciting defensive talent with your first pick, then just add for value and quality on day two. Forget which is the most important need. Use the draft to add talent.

If they don’t believe a great player is available at #9 — trading down is justifiable in this draft, given the depth available. In that scenario, I’d happily embrace an interior O-line double to kick things off.

But the focus should remain on value and talent — not just ‘which boxes do we need to tick off’?

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  1. 80 Hawk


    With the reports of Geno resigning today, do you think that rules out a QB like Corral in the 2nd round and makes a pick of Coen or Eleby more likely in the 4th/5th?

    • Rob Staton

      I don’t think it rules anything out

  2. bmseattle

    With every passing day I’m getting less excited/optimistic about the draft, and more worried/pessimistic.
    The hope is that Pete/John try to mimic their early success, but the fear is that they try to build on their recent mediocrity and try to patch things up.

    Some of their free agency moves have me believing the latter is more likely than the former.

  3. SeattleLifer

    We are left hoping they have learned from past mistakes. If free agency up to this point says anything – it is that they have not and will go forward into the draft in their usual and accustomed ways.

    I am hopeful that with the healthy draft stock they possess coupled with this being a deep draft that even in spite of themselves they will still come away with a good haul.

  4. Sandman

    Prefer to stay at top and draft BPA (cb, edge, ol) but a BAMF focus of adding Penning, Pierce, Clemmons sounds enticing. Rob, who are your top BAMFs this year slotted in Hawk pick range? Enjoy your family vacation, Staton family!

    • Peter

      Not rob but BAMF’s:

      Mr. Clemons
      Cam taylor-britt
      Dameon pierce
      Cam Jurgens

      Sometimes Penning if you can stomach the penalties

  5. Peter

    I’m starting to think it’s not RB in round two. It’s WR. They just don’t prioritize the runningback the way a team who says they want to would.

    Penny, Christine Michael, is that it for top Running backs? A bunch of shots in the dark. And the best trade in Seahawks history for Lynch which was a flier level pick.

    However. Pete or john can not stop themselves with WR’s, a trade for harvin, second rounders in tate, richardson, metcalf, eskridge. I just don’t know if Pete can stop himself taking Christian Watson.

    • SpennyDunks

      Penny was a first, Michael was a second. Not to mention they drafted Penny while they already had Carson. Not sure if those are shots in the dark.

      • Peter

        Penny a first. Michael a second.

        I meant a bunch of shots other than that.

        Ware, turbin, dallas, homer, mckissick, even carson.

        How have they not spent as big on RB as WR in the last decade?

        You can see from the names listed they clearly are willing to spend draft stock on WR’s but almost no high stock on RB.

        • UkAlex6674

          Agree with you there Peter. For a run heavy team they dont seem to have invested much in the position from a high end perspective. Lots of RBs drafted but mainly for smaller roles as opposed to lead back.

          • Peter

            You’d think in all this time there would be a few more high picks. Per example they drafted Eskridge high while the WR’s are a strength but it’s strange they don’t have that mentality while Carson is starting to pick up injuries and before the end of last season Penny had shown anything.

            I don’t know it’s just odd. For this team.

            • Tyler Jorgensen

              First, RB is devalued in the draft compared to WR, so adjust about a half to a round difference. A 1st round WR is worth a 2nd round RB. A third round WR is worth a 4th round RB.

              Second, they have invested zero 1st rounders at WR, yet they’ve invested one at RB. Christine Michael was the 62nd overall pick. Let’s draw the line there in the 2nd. (And remember, if you account for positional value, that’s more like an early 2nd rounder in the top 40 or so.)

              WR’s they’ve taken earlier than 62nd?
              Golden Tate (60th)
              Paul Richardson (45th)
              Dwayne Eskridge (barely, at 56th)

              That’s it. That’s the list.
              DK Metcalf and Tyler Lockett? 64th and 69th.

              If you were to use the Rich Hill draft value chart, not going deeper than the 70th overall pick, you have 291 at RB and 468 at WR. So at first glance, they spend more draft resources on WR.

              But if you think about it a little more, you also play two WR on every play, and around 70% of the time, you play three. You basically never play two RB’s on the same play, so you’re going to need more WR’s than RB’s in general, which means you are likely going to draft more.

              468/2=234. So even splitting WR into two slots (and ignoring the high percentage of 3WR sets) you’re still spending more draft resource at RB than WR. I’m not going to do the math on the later rounds, because those picks aren’t worth nearly as much comparatively. (For example, the Penny pick was worth 216 alone. The Richardson pick, 131. The difference between them is worth about the 61st pick overall.)

              I don’t think we’ve invested enough into WR, personally. We’ve been hanging on

              • Tyler Jorgensen

                *We’v been hanging on to the assumption that we have invested into the position, but there have been few times during the entirety of the Pete Carroll era where we’ve had a WR3 that has been even average, other than that an above average starter compared to the rest of the league.

                I’d say we’ve lagged far behind in that regard, and not having a great QB is only going to magnify how below average we’ve been with regard to investment at the position. Especially as Tyler Lockett ages out (he’s going to be 30 next year) and if we decide to trade DK for picks.

  6. Ashish

    I agree 100%, I want to see Hawks investing in OLine and DLine in first 2 day. Very happy to see Hawks move on Pocic and will happy to see them signing Johnson and good center.
    Most important thing they are not expected to win this year which give them liberty to build team for future. Very important draft coming up will learn what PC and JS thought process.

    • Justaguy

      I want to see the Hawks invest heavily on the defense this year. That is where the talent is in this draft. Build a proper defense and let the other side of the ball come to you.

  7. Mr. Drucker in hooterville

    It’s ironic that they won the Super Bowl with the most expensive OL in the league and now seem to think they can win with the cheapest.

  8. samprassultanofswat

    If the Seahawk go:
    R1 — Trevor Penning
    R2 — Quarterback
    R2 — Linebacker
    R3 — Running back
    R4 — Pass rusher
    I will be sick to my stomach. I have checked out the players they have drafted since Scot McCloughan left the organization. It is not very good. They have had a few hits. In fact it is when they traded up where Schneider has done his best works. Players the Hawks traded up to get were Tyler Lockett, Jarran Reed, D.K. Metcalf, and Darrell Taylor. But some of these pick have been head scrathers. to put it nicely.

  9. Dan W

    Don’t worry everyone–we got Geno back!!

  10. KennyBadger

    Have mercy Rob, please don’t pile on the day where geno smith was re-signed. Whatever the guaranteed money is for him, if it’s more than a few cigarette butts then the hopes of a Rebuild are quickly dashed. Please post something more optimistic upon your safe return…

  11. GoHawks5151

    A couple people have said this off-season: PCJS are better builders than maintainers. Im still pretty optimistic. I think most of their actions this off-season have proved they know this is going to be a multi year process. If they trade DK (Dont do it!) that would really show their hand. I know there is evidence that they just fill holes in the roster lately but with Russ and Bobby gone I think they will be mindful of impact players and guys with leadership qualities that can be pillars going forward. I’m wishing on Stingley, Linderbaum and Tindall after a modest trade back

    • Mike McD

      Yes. JS and PC are back to what they do best. Stingley seems like a great fit for PC whose best quality as a coach is maximizing/coaching/improving players. Many players come to the hawks and play their best, few players leave the Hawks and play better.

      If the Hawks do trade down, love the idea of betting some stalwarts in the middle of the line. Set the town for the rebuild or as PC calls it: getting more competitive across the board.

      Hawks are in a great position, excited to see what happens.

  12. Zorn is King

    That seam of excellent ball players between 10-50 is incredibly rich. I’d trade down for opportunities to get OT, Edge, CB, RB…skip on QB… it’s a distraction…lock is better than these guys. Lucas or Smith, at OT. Gordon at CB. Mafe or the Oklahoma edge…definitely trade down.

  13. Zorn is King

    That seam of excellent ball players between 10-50 is incredibly rich. I’d trade down for opportunities to get OT, Edge, CB, RB…skip on QB… it’s a distraction…lock is better than these guys. Lucas or Smith, at OT. Gordon at CB. Mafe or the Oklahoma edge…definitely trade down.

  14. AlaskaHawk

    They don’t need to draft a quarterback this year because Geno Smith is back, so they already have three. Yeah!!!!

  15. JJ

    I play fantasy football with my father-in-law and his friends. They all pretty much fill out the starting roster and then add to the bench. At that point I have 4rbs and 4wrs and my team is stacked. I have won 3 out of 5 years. The way you talk about the hawks just filling needs makes me think they take the old man route of roster building.

  16. RIP Sonics

    PFN mock… If this was actually realistic of how the draft could play out I would be stoked. Really doubt Lucas or Paschal fall this far especially. Would like Lucas or Rasheed Walker later over Penning based on the drop off in talent at edge and corner in the draft.
    9.Ahmad Gardner
    CB Cincinnati
    40.Tyler Linderbaum
    OC Iowa
    61 (trade down comp). Abraham Lucas
    OT Washington State
    72.Nik Bonitto
    EDGE Oklahoma
    91(trade down comp)..Channing Tindall
    LB Georgia
    93 (trade down comp). Dameon Pierce
    RB Florida
    109.Wan’Dale Robinson
    WR Kentucky
    133 (trade down comp). Micheal Clemons
    EDGE Texas A&M
    172 (trade down comp).Tariq Castro-Fields
    CB Penn State
    187 (trade down comp). Josh Paschal
    EDGE Kentucky
    229. Jeremiah Moon
    LB Florida

    • Sean-O

      PFN Mock as well. I ended up trading down from #9 to #19 & some other deal. I gained an extra 2nd & was able to move up in another round. I ended up with four picks in the top 50. In my opinion, not a real sexy draft but good, core players that could/should be long-time starters.

      19. Devin Lloyd – LB
      40. Tyler Linderbaum – C
      41. Boyd Mafe – Edge
      49. Abraham Lucas – OT
      79. Cam Taylor-Britt – CB
      152. Dameon Pearce – RB
      153. Josh Pascal – Edge
      229. Cade York – K

      We can debate if the players at 40, maybe 41, 79, 152 & 153 would be there but there were other comparable players at those spots. Again, my point is that four picks in the top 50 would really set this roster up for future success.

      • Trevor

        That would be a solid draft.

  17. Bankhawk

    I’d like to be optimistic here and entertain the possibility that we come out of this with something like the Zion/T Linderbaum scenario you floated Rob, or just that we snag a premium edge rusher or CB at #9, but to paraphrase The Eagles re the chances of that; “Cause I get stressful queasy feelin’, and I know you might let me down”! 🙆‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤦‍♂️

    • Big Mike

      Nice Eagles lyric rework
      LOVE that band

  18. Denver Hawker

    Now why they gotta do Nakobe Dean like that:

    • Peter

      Matt corral might eant to keep a low profile there as well.

  19. Hoggs41

    I just want them to select quality players with those first three picks and not reach. If the picks happen to match up with holes Im good with that. Personally Id hope they can get a tackle with one of the first three but I dont really are which pick.

    • Roy Batty

      I really want to go one year without saying, “Who?” after their first pick.

  20. Sean

    The Geno Smith signing today just makes me want to puke. An incredibly mediocre QB who got popped for a DUI less than 24 hours after the final game. I have no faith in this front office to get things turned around and navigate their way through this rebuild.

    • EC

      What’s your thoughts on Eastern Washington QB Eric Barriere?

    • 805Hawk

      I feel the same way. The dude is below mediocre, got popped with the DUI, and gets a huge raise. We’re we outbidding someone? Why the hell more than triple his salary? The only bright side is if he gets Pete fired.

    • 12th chuck

      just when you thought that pc/js turned the corner on the old ways of wasting all the f/a money and signing sub par players, they go and do this. Now I am almost certain that they will find a way to blow this draft and or most of the picks. It is absolutly amazing we have won as many games as we have since 2014

      • Buf

        I mean, the dissly signing to me was the real head scratcher this offseason. He barely contributes as a catcher. Just using the backup OT as a jumbo TE would cover 95% of his on-field contributions last year. He was the backup TE, and we have Parkinson behind him too. Now we have Fant, so unless its a clear run or a two TE set, he’s gonna be sitting on the bench making the same salary as Geno, a potential starting QB.

        Backup blocking-only TE should not make the same as the backup (or maybe starting) QB.

  21. samprassultanofswat

    It is bad enough that the Hawks signed Smith. But 7mil? As John McEnroe would: YOU CANNOT BE SERIOUS. Does anyone know if his salary guaranteed?

    • Hawkdawg

      It’s a $4 million base with incentives. Dunno how much of that $4 million is guaranteed yet.

      It’s not $7 million, any more than Wagner’s Ram contract was $50 million.

  22. MarkSouza

    The NFL is such a pass happy league that a top 10 rushing attack is a pretty low bar. I hope they are shooting much higher.

  23. God of Thunder

    Something crucial … and thus I’m gonna go on about this for a while. Next year’s QB cohort. What are they like? (Keeping in mind — obviouslyl — that there’s still the all important last year year to come.

    Who will be draft ready? Who will declare early?

    The quality of the next batch of QBs will be v important.

  24. Billy Hoyle

    I am a long time reader, but first time commenter. Born and raised through some of the best and worst sports eras (SEA 90’s with Griffey, A-Rod, GP and Kemp, but also WSU Paul Wulff and losing the Sonics). Like most I prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

    Rob, I read just about everything you publish and I’m a huge fan. Trying to retire early so I can focus all of my energy to providing valuable commentary to your already extremely successful blog. While I think there’s been a tremendous amount of research poured into the opinions of what JS/PC are going to do in the draft, we can all probably agree we have no idea what they are thinking or prepared to shockingly pull of in this year’s draft. Here’s my best attempt at giving us several trade back scenarios where we can add BAMF’s and contributors to hopefully jump start what is going to be an even more exciting 2023 offseason.

    7th rounder
    *hopefully a cool name like Smoke Monday who ironically brings the heat.

    Micheal Clemons
    Texas A&M

    Sterling Weatherford
    Miami (OH)

    Kevin Austin Jr.
    Notre Dame

    Dameon Pierce

    Cam Taylor-Britt

    Jalen Tolbert
    South Alabama

    Tyler Smith

    Leo Chenal

    Abraham Lucas
    Washington State

    Boye Mafe

    Plug as many as the holes in the raft as we can this year and hopefully board a yacht in the next 12-24 months!

    • Peter

      I like this. John giving us all heartburn on draft with with probably two trade downs in the first round to get all the way down to 29.

      The only one i’m not sure of is kevin austin jr. My gut feels like he is going higher in the draft than that.

  25. Billy Hoyle

    For what it’s worth I think Corral is a gamer. In a run heavy offense, with a legit mauler line, some deep threats, and a competent running game he might have a legit shot at giving us a jump start. The players rally around him and he can make all the necessary throws. Big fan!

    • Peter

      The conundrum though… get corral there’s a very good chance they aren’t doing much to fix that oline.

      You’re not wrong about Corral.


      Zion Johnson + linderbaum + move lewis back to RG and a couple extra mid round picks?


      Only one linemen + corral and him still getting worked over by the likes of the Rams?

      I just worry with this Corral/Ridder talk and even for Lock coming to seattle feels like a recipe to be a league leader in sacks taken. None of these guys from what I’ve seen have the young Wilson escapability.

      • Derek

        I like Corral and would prefer him more than any of the other QBs but there are some legitimate concerns with his game. If you haven’t watched Samuel Gold’s short film study, I found it to be insightful. The challenges with the deep ball and inexperience with any pro style offense concern me. Possible that all could be coached up, though.

        Samuel Gold’s film study on Matt Corral:

  26. Jeremy

    I can see it now, Rob. The Seahawks stick and pick at 9 and they take Devin Lloyd at 9. Then there will be leaks abound about how “teams were so desperate to trade up to get him” and “the Jets would have taken him at 10 if Seattle didn’t pick him at 9.”

    • Rob Staton

      If they take Lloyd they will be able to move down first

  27. MattyB

    This draft is so unpredictable when it comes to Seattle, which makes it exciting and with SDB breakdown I now have a few names to look out for.

    Do we believe all the teams above Seattle are sensible enough to take the predicted pick?

    Surely one of the Jets, Giants, Falcons and Texans are going to mess up on a pick!!!

    Allowing one the preferred big names to drop into our lap…any chance this happens

    • Big Mike

      Absolutely there’s a chance, and like you said, a good one.
      There’s also just as good a chance that Petey and Johnny pass on a “preferred” player and reach for someone that has a mid-second round grade saying “we had to come out of this draft with him” and “team X was gonna take him 2 spots later” and yadda, yadda, yadda.

      Al, I can say is, prepared to be disappointed because I believe Petey thinks they can actually win so they’ll be busy trying to plug holes rather than drafting BPA. Plus there’ll likely be several attempts to prove they’re smarter than everyone else and so there’ll be more reaching and more of the same type of comments afterward.

      Prove me wrong Carroll. I’ll happily chow crow if I am.

      • AL

        I think your spot on Mike, if you listen to what Pete has said throughout the offseason and the moves they have made, it doesn’t suggest a rebuild. It suggests win now. If thats the plan, and I think it is, then the next logical step for Pete is to plug holes in the draft.

        A lot of people would like to see a complete rebuild, myself incuded. But what what we may not be considering is whats an acceptable season and seasons moving forward as far as Pete’s concerned.

        Maybe he’s not willing to endure 2-3 bad seasons as part of a rebuild at this point in his career. With his ego and legacy in mind, maybe the thought of a quick turn-around and a shot at making the playoffs is more enticing and makes more sense to him at this point.

        Think about it, Pete made no secret about wanting Geno Smith back and overpaid him to sign. He may think that with the right supporting cast that Geno can get him a wild card. Or better yet, maybe Drew lock out plays Geno and maybe he’s the guy.

        As Rob has pointed out, there is a very good chance that Pete plugs holes in the draft and doesn’t draft the BPA or build toward the future.

        • Rob Staton

          They signed Geno because he knows the system

          That’s all it really is

          About going into the team activities this off season and camp with someone knowing what they’ve got to do to give everyone else a chance to impress

          • AL

            That does make sense, although I hate to give Pete that much credit.

            So they have Geno and Drew, do you think they could still take a flier on Baker Mayfield while also possibly adding a QB in R2?

  28. Henry Taylor

    In defence of the Seahawks, their last 2 first picks have been a 3rd WR (rather than the much needed OL help) and a 3rd LB rather than the pass rusher they needed that year.

    Now there’s plenty to criticise about those decisions, but it is evidence to show they are willing to take the top player on their board early rather than fill the most obvious need.

    So I could very much see them taking Stingley or Zion in the first and then filling the pressing needs like OT, LB, QB in rounds 2 and 3.

    • Peter

      There’s a handful of ways to build a team. Just because you’re sticking to your guns and taking your highest rated player instead of need isn’t really something to crow about if like now the oline has open holes, you recently drafted and signed young LB’s and there are upgrades needed there, and while you can’t plan for concussions a third WR is rated higher than one of the highest graded centers to come out in years.

      No one wants reaches. Maybe eskridge is awesome. But this is years of dreadful oline and pass rush play. Not a one off but about half the time this FO has been here. At some point you either start considering team needs when drafting or whomever is in charge of the board needs to be better at building it.

  29. GoHawksDani

    Scenarios I’d be happy about:
    Drafting a good CB early (R1-R2)
    Drafting Michael Clemons in R3-4
    Drafting Pierce in R3-4
    Drafting Corral in R2-3 (maybe he could be a starter or at least a really quality backup)
    Drafting 1 or 2 LB(s) (Brooks is solid, in 3-4 Taylor can play LB but I wouldn’t hand the starting role to Barton and we don’t have anyone else on the roster. Lloyd, Tindall, Chenal, Walker, Bonitto could be options in R1-2)
    Drafting OL in mid-rounds (R2-4 but mostly R3-4. We need starters and depth but I think even with Johnson and Linderbaum our offense will likely suck. It’d be a good pick for the future but also a pretty boring pick. And with almost all of our R1-R2 ammo spent on those guys our defense might suck too)

    I wouldn’t be happy about:
    Drafting a QB in the top15
    Drafting an OT in the top15
    Drafting a WR in R1-3
    Drafting a safety in R1-3 (unless they move on from Adams)
    Drafting 3 OL at #9, #40, #41
    Not drafting an RB in the first 4 rounds
    Not drafting a CB in the first 4 rounds

    • Peter

      Why would you not be happy drafting oline early?

      There’s way more defensive talent from rounds 2-5 then oline talent.

      If they cut the crap and skip Corral and Ridder they could lock up three Oline spots with talented guys on rookie contracts for years while drafting guys like Bonito, Clemons, taylor-britt, perhaps a much better LB, mafe seems to be stalling in the second.

      Then the oline since a decade ago might be good and start being consistent for a change either make Lock’s life easy or get ready for a new QB.

      Plus pete wants to run. Aside from very few intriguing names like Jurgens, Strange, Tom the oline talent regardless of spot drops off a cliff rather quickly.

      Zion, linderbaum, penning (in a pinch), lucas, jurgens, strange, tom, eze…..that’s it for me. Eight guys. I could rattle of easily double that on defense that I think upgrade tge roster. And that’s not talking the first rounders.

      • GoHawksDani

        I don’t trust our defense.
        We have Taylor, Brooks and Diggs who are pretty much a proven decent players.
        But, with 3 guys I think this could be a decent or good group.
        On the offense we have Lockett and DK. But if our QB is highly inconsistent their production will likely drop. Even if we draft 3 good OL we still won’t have a QB and I don’t trust Penny or Carson.
        If our defense is bad, we’ll likely eat 27-30-35 points per game. Even with a great OL, I doubt a good running game and Lock/Geno could negate the effect of that.
        If we could put a defense on the field that could keep opponents to score more than 21 I could see a decent/good running game keeping up with that with a good offensive scheme.
        And I don’t feel Penning, Cross or even Linderbaum are locks as good starters in year 1. Johnson might be but that’s just one guy.

        Maybe just personal preference but I feel a trio of Stingley, Bonitto, Tindall (and Clemons later as a +1) would make the games more watchable and enjoyable than Johnson, Linderbaum and Lucas (even though these 3 feels more value in vacuum). Might be just that I’m a defense-first guy 🙂 and the truth is that I wouldn’t hate the trio of Johnson, Jurgens (I like him more than Linderbaum), Lucas doesn’t sound that bad. But #9 Cross, #30 (after trading up) Linderbaum and somebody other than Abe Lucas just feels wrong to me

  30. Isaac

    How would you feel about signing laremy tunsil next year when he hits free agency?

  31. L80

    I think the very good news is that there are several sets of new eyes within the coaching ranks in Seattle. And we know that at least one (Desai) was told he will have major input on pesonnel decisions.

    We also know JS is going to have a LOT more final say in each choice. Whether these thisng all turn out to be good or not remains to be seen.

  32. UkAlex6674

    Rob, you move up the table in the Huddle Report each year. Is this the year we get to see you get the top spot?!

    • Denver Hawker

      If they scored mocks submit after the combine or even in December, he’d crush it and it wouldn’t be close.

      It seems like most years Rob is early to spot guys that the rest of the draft industry coelesceses around this time of year. The big media types also get all the insider tips to make their last mock better.

      • Peter

        Still. A top ten ranking considering some if the names on that list is pretty great.

        • Big Mike

          Yes it is. Damned impressive for a guy that didn’t even grow up with the sport.

  33. Mr drucker in hooterville

    I now believe a move down to the teens is inevitable. BAL at 14 and adding a R3-type scenario.
    I can live with it as long as they stay in the first 15. It seems too PCJS to not happen.

    I also want them to trade DK for picks.

    • Big Mike

      A move down after crying about never having a top 10 pick just a couple of months ago. Yep sounds about right. How very PCJS of them.

      On top of that, it’s quite likely no one in the Downey soft Seattle media asks about it either.

      • Derek

        I think the only times they had a pick in the teens ended up being Earl and Bruce.. better than their track record in the 20s, that’s for sure.

    • J

      There’s a cliff after the first seven players IMO.

      Ikem, the four DL and the two corners. One corner if the Stingley medicals don’t check out.

      If all those guys are gone, they should trade down. Not a big difference between who would be available in the teens and at nine.

      • Big Mike

        And that’s fair.

  34. CR

    I like the idea of trading all the way down to #22 so we can pick up 2 2nd rounders. Then select Abe Lucas and trade up at 30 for Linderbaum. Then in the 2nd get a LB, CB, EDGE and G to round out the O-line.

    • Isaac

      I don’t know if this is realistic but I definitely want to collect more picks in the second round. There are so many players I want. We should trade down if jermain Johnson or one of the tackles isn’t available. There’s 10 guys I want in the second round. Linderbaum has become a must pick along with a linebacker. We need to restock the core.

      • CR

        Totally agree. I love the LB and CB options that could be available in day 2. Dream Scenario for me would be either 9 for 29, 30 and 94 from the Chiefs, or 22/28, 53, 59 from Packers.

        • Derek


          Who are the corners you like on day 2? I like the fieriness of Marcus Jones even though he’s tiny. Zyon McCollum could be a steal with his athleticism but huge lottery ticket based on level of competition. Cam Taylor-Britt is a blog favorite.

          • CR

            Not sure they all end up actually going on Day 2 but my favorites would be Dax Hill, Demarri Mathis, Cam Taylor Britt, Jalyn Armor Davis and Martin Emerson.

  35. Olyhawksfan

    If Pete wants to fill holes that’s fine. But please for the love of God if a stud falls to us at 9 just take him! Hopefully John has asserted himself a little more this year and will make the right call. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

  36. Mick

    Thought for today: why commit 4 mil to a backup QB (no chance he’s our first guy) when you don’t have a starter at LT?

    • Derek

      This was the priority clearly.

      My blood pressure went down after I thought about this move knowing they needed someone with experience in the system but my fear is that Pete plans for him to be the day 1 starter.

      • UkAlex6674

        I’m not so sure. I think Geno is absolute bottom line starting QB. Lock is better but just in case or injury strikes there is someone who knows the system. Rather than 2 QB who don’t get it.

      • Big Mike

        The quote I read from Pete was that Geno goes in to camp as the #1 because of experience in the system. That was followed by his stats and how they compared favorably to Wilson. I got the distinct impression that whoever Petey was talking to was fed all that crap so they can justify Geno.


    I think we are glossing over the real need at RunningBack
    I want a defensive player at 9 (stingy, Sauce ,Thib or Johnson .
    then Walker out of Mich State at 41

    • Big Mike

      I’d be onboard with that.

      • Big Mike

        And a RB no later than round 3. The Hawks have DJ Dallas and Travis Homer to fill the later round/nothing special/mostly play ST role.

        • Derek

          My issue with Homer and Dallas is you’ve seen what you have with both of them and nothing stands out, i.e. they’re unlikely to step in and be a workhorse if your #1 goes down, and I like Dallas a lot. Looking back at how many injuries we have at the RB year after year, we need an influx of talent and if that comes at the expense of Homer or Dallas I’m good with that because the young player is on a cheap contract and perhaps has a higher ceiling.

          • Big Mike

            Ditto Derek

    • Derek

      I agree they have a real need at RB. I would actually draft two this year, I think there’s a lot of depth on all-purpose backs, power backs, and 3rd down/gadget backs.

      I would try to land one of the all-purpose backs and then add on either a power-back and/or 3rd down back later on in the draft.

      Favorite all-purpose backs:
      1. Breece Hall
      2. Dameon Pierce
      3. Kenneth Walker
      4. ZaQuandre White
      5. Zamir White
      6. Pierre Strong Jr

      Favorite Power backs:
      1. Brian Robinson Jr
      2. Tyler Allgeier
      3. Hassan Haskins

      Favorite 3rd down backs:
      1. James Cook
      2. Max Borghi
      3. Tyler Badie
      4. Kyren Williams

      • Mr. Drucker in hooterville

        Zander Horvath, Purdue, is to me a MUST Seahawk as a battering ram FB who also can catch and block.

        • WallaSean

          I love this guy too, a third down back lightens the load on our previously fragile RB’s, a legit blocking FB helps get us tough yards when the o line struggles to establish the run. Would also like to see an OT in the George Fant role again.

    • Jerry

      I hope the Seahawks don’t think in terms of ‘real need’.

      Although they continually say otherwise, this team is rebuilding. Any team that loses Russell Wilson, Bobby Wagner, Carlos Dunlap, DJ Reed, Duane Brown, Brandon Shell, etc….isn’t really trying to compete. The nonsense coming from the front office is just words. Their actions indicate a rebuild.

      Since we’re rebuilding, 2022 is about developing talent and building a long-term foundation. You are right that we have terrible depth at RB…but who cares? We have issues at almost all positions.

      The luxury of rebuilding is that the team can largely ignore short-term needs and focus on the big picture: building the foundation of the next good team. That next good team won’t crystalize until 2023 or (more realistically) 2024.

      RB is not a premium position. All else equal, the Hawks should focus on premium positions. They need to add passrushers. They need to solidify the OL and DL. If a good RB falls in the draft, great. But I think RB is pretty low on the list of priorities for this team. The roster is a hot mess. They should invest valuable commodities – draft capital – on premium positions. They can figure out RB later.

      • Rob Staton

        But if you’re building a team where run success and consistency in the run game is vital, then it can be a premium position.

        Seattle has tried plugging in RB’s and it has been an utter disaster

        • Big Mike


    • J

      Walker is a crap pass blocker and receiver and that just opens up so much for the opposing defense.

      When they know he isn’t a threat in the passing game and can’t stop a blitzing LB it just gets so much easier.

  38. Hoggs41

    I continue to think about what a draft could look like trading DK. If you could get 10 and 38 from the Jets I vote yes. For arguments sake you could trade down from 10 to 17 and get the Chargers pick at 79. Then trade up from 38 to 30. Possibly trade back from 41 to 50 to recoup the 4th rounder from trading up. You could then have these picks. 9,17,30,40,50,72,79 in the first two days. Imagibe the foundation you could build.

    40…Ebiketie/Sam Williams/Mafe

    • Rob Staton

      Jurgens won’t last to 79

      I wouldn’t go near the QB’s in R1

      • Kelly Smith

        If you value a qb as an early 2nd rounder why not move up to the late 1st for that 5th year option?

        • Hoggs41

          Thats my point Kelly. Not to say one of those guys is worth of a first but its all about the 5th year option.

  39. Scot04

    Was curious your thoughts on EJ Perry as a 7th round flyer. Obviously alot of things to work on, but seems to have alot of the tools Seattle likes.

    • Rob Staton

      Watched him. Thought ‘meh’

  40. Rob Staton

    Another tweet that makes absolutely no sense from Josina:

    • Derek

      Yikes, when she has nothing to report she sure can serve up a word salad. Nothing like throwing in an asterisk to add even more confusion for your audience.

    • Sean

      She wants to be viewed as an “insider’ but she is not. Stick with Schefter and Rapoport. Josina is out of the loop and just trying to still be relevant with a bunch of nothingburger tweets at this point.

      • Sean-O

        I disagree. She’s been the first to break plenty of news. She deals directly with the players versus agents, etc. I believe she had the Gilmore news first this morning. I think back in the day, she broke the news when Kam ended his holdout after he missed a couple of games.

        • Sean

          Yep, back in the day she had better sources. Not the case anymore.

        • Rob Staton

          Yeah, having said a lot of pro-Kam nonsense to curry favour initially.

          She speaks to players and has sources. That is very true. The whole point of my initial comment was to highlight another tweet that just leaves you thinking… “I don’t know what you are trying to say.” That is common with Josina. As is the ‘I just heard something big but can’t say’ nonsense and the never ending, ‘just been on the phone with…’ self promotion.

  41. All I see is 12s

    So now Rapsheet thinks that Baker will land in Carolina. This makes more sense to me. I don’t think the Seahawks want another short qb. It also confirms that I don’t think they are really interested in Malik Willis. As Rob says, he has the same deficiencies as Wilson, only worse.
    I think now they are set to find the qb they always wanted. TALL, smart, big arm, can run. It explains why they want to give Lock a shot as he fits the prototype. If it works, great. If not the solution is in the following years draft.

    • Rob Staton

      It’s nothing to do with height and everything to do with Cleveland being run by imbeciles and Mayfield being unable to just be quiet for five minutes. The ‘wants to go to Colts’ and podcast shambles has hurt him big time. I don’t blame Seattle for losing interest.

      The media are obsessed with putting a QB at six for the Panthers but as noted so many times, this isn’t the draft for it or the situation in Carolina for it. They will go OL or trade down.

  42. RobH

    I recently read where almost all of the teams ahead of us are wanting to trade back. I think if you look at it realistically there are no guys discussed that are lock players to be perennial all-pros. Would you rather have Aidan Hutchinson than Jermaine Johnson? I have watched the tape on both and I don’t see a huge difference in output. I think we will be literally stuck making a selection at 9. This creates quite the conundrum because I think this class as a whole has flaws. My fear is this is shades of the 2013 class. The best player to come out of that class is probably DeAndre Hopkins at 27.

    It won’t surprise me to see JS make a “reach” and I would go with Tyler Linderbaum. Does he have faults. Yep. Mostly his size, but there happens to be this guy down south who is the best Defensive lineman in the NFL who is undersized. Aaron Donald, according to himself, is only slightly taller than 6’1″ and weighs in at 250. Linderbaum can be the QB of the line for the next decade and really solidify our interior. Just my 2.

    • Rob Staton

      I think 9 might be the range where teams do want to trade up.

      One, to get ahead of the Jets.

      Two, if none of the CB’s are taken in the top eight.

      Could be a good offer too.

      • RobH

        First, thanks for all you have done for years Rob. This is the most entertaining offseason in quite a while.

        Second, I wouldn’t mind the trade up but for a CB in my opinion. I think this edge class is too deep and while the top 4 are better than the rest it is not by as much as some make it seem. IMHO.

    • Ashish

      Hawks should be ready to pick at #9, very good chance other team don’t give them better trade down offer. Take best player available who is good irrespective of the need. Will anyone complain taking DeAndre Hopkins at #9 as per your example in 2013?

      Like many pointed, there is good chance someone mess up in top 8 picks which is very much possible. I want someone (except Hawks) getting smart to take QB in top 8 which will make teams like Steelers nervous. Hawks makes me very nervous with their picks so very interesting draft on the cards. I hope we can cash in – Rob has given lot of hopes with his scouting report.

    • SeattleLifer

      My fear is along the lines of what you’ve said- that there will n’t be much of a market for trade downs at 9 but Schneider will want to trade down so badly that the people not deal we can get has a fairly poor return.

      • SeattleLifer

        Um yeah spell check…

        The only deal we could get in return would be fairly poor.

  43. samprassultanofswat

    As a coach. Pete Carroll is one of the best in the NFL. But when it comes to personnel. Let John Schneider pick the players.

    Pete Carroll said that Geno Smith is a great locker room guy. Really. Then why did he get into a fight in the locker room when he was a NY Jet?

    I totally agree with what Mike Salk said about the signing of Geno Smith. Salk said I just don’t get it. I just don’t get it. Smith’s contracts sounds like it is for 3mil with incentives to push it to 7mil. Brock Huard said that Smith should have been signed for the minimum. Agree 100%.

  44. LetLockCook

    Geno Smith was sucker punched because he didn’t pay for a teammates airfare or something. Not saying Geno is the model of adult maturity but his Seahawk teammates seem to have a decent amount of love for him. I also think this signing makes sense if you believe the team could be somewhat competitive next year and I would bet Pete believes that.

    • Gross MaToast

      I’d like to know what the guarantee is, because that’s what Geno really signed for. If it’s $3m, then it’s incredibly stupid. In my most humble opinion.

      I bet that after Geno fails to win the starting gig in August, he’s offered the opportunity to sign as a backup for a renegotiated vet minimum deal, or thereabouts.

      If not, I’ll re-take to my fainting couch with a snifter of absinthe and rue the day once more.

      • cha

        Mike Florio told Peter King today that he texted a source to get the guaranteed $ on Geno’s contract. I would suspect he’ll post something this afternoon or tomorrow.

        Don’t go dancing with the Green Fairy just yet Gross.

        • cha

          Peter King also called the Geno Smith contract ‘one of the oddest contracts this year’

    • Group Captain Mandrake

      I’m not a huge fan of Gene, but I don’t mind them resigning him for competition (heaven help us if he’s the best arm they have in camp). The problem is that they are outbidding themselves. Was there any other team that was willing to pay Geno up to $7M for the year? Were there any other teams even willing to pay him at all? It’s just a waste of cap space.

    • Blitzy the Clown

      Here’s my 2¢ on Geno Smith, and it includes something I think most are overlooking.

      Geno was resigned for one purpose, as the only QB on the team with NFL game time experience in this team’s system: he’s meant to instantly and significantly enhance the competition at QB in training camp and preseason (presumably so the best QB of the bunch – Lock – can rise to the occasion through survival of the fittest).

      And if Geno happens to be the one on top at the end, well that’s just gravy because it’ll mean he’s playing better than Lock and Eason.

      Some will whine about $3-4m (still not 100% sure what his base/guarantee are, and let’s leave out the performance incentives because if he earns them, he earns them).

      This is what I think some are missing: the human factor. The psychological factor. If the team needs Geno to set the pace at QB in TC, then Geno needs to believe he’s capable of being the team’s #1 QB. Which means, the Seahawks need to pay Geno as though they also believe he can be the top gun.

      What’s the practical difference between, say $1.5m, and $3-4m for one more year of Smith? Especially if it lights a fire under him and pushes Lock to go further.

      • Sean

        If Geno is starting in week 1 because he was the best quarterback in camp/preseason, we have a big problem on our hands. The guy is a fringe backup, not one of the best backups in the NFL as some in the local media have proclaimed. Having him start any games is a giant setback, other than that it likely increases the possibility of losing games and gaining better draft position for 2023.

  45. Adam

    Rob, what do you think of Brandon Smith, the LB out of Penn State? He seems to definitely have the traits, measurables, and attack mentality that the Seahawks look for?

    • Rob Staton

      Wasn’t blown away with his tape

  46. Mike McD

    “I’d prefer them to embrace the nature of the rebuild and either take a player with major potential (Derek Stingley Jr) or trade down and start building a structure. Assuming of course the top pass rushers don’t make it to #9 (and they almost certainly won’t).” <- Hell yes

    I believe this is exactly the three options the Seahawks will do. I do not believe they will reach. I think they are good with Curham at RT and will resign Brown at LT. Also, lets not forget that the Seahawks have 2 firsts and 2 seconds next year in the draft and a ton of dead cap money comes off the books (Wilson) to sign FAs to fill needs in 2023.

    I also think there is still a chance DK is traded just before or near the draft to a team like the Jets.

    The Seahawks are in great position right now and I think that JS/PC are going to execute at high level to setup for success in 2023/2024 season (right when the rams will be declining).

    • Rob Staton

      The Metcalf trade talk has died

      I don’t think teams are going to offer something to tempt Seattle

  47. Mark

    Pressures bucketed by seconds post-snap (2021 only), per @PFF:- 47% in the 2.1-2.5 range for Aidan is pretty insane – Arnold Ebiketie >>>- Jermaine Johnson 🤐— Austin Gayle (@PFF_AustinGayle) April 15, 2022

    • Mark

      Sorry don’t know how to upload twitter screenshots

  48. Robert Las Vegas

    Don’t know if you caught this but the moving the chains guys choose Trevor Penning for the Seahawks are trading down with the Vikings and picking up pick up number 77. I don’t know about anybody else I just want this draft to happen today.

  49. Ashish

    Peter Schrager – I remember him from 2012 draft he criticized hawks picks. Rob, others are catching up with your prospects identified in Jan/Feb. Agree with “Robert Las Vegas” can’t wait for the draft.

    • Rob Staton

      Schrager and Matt Miller among the most vocal critics of Seattle’s 2012 class

  50. Sean

    From Jason La Canfora (I question how connected he is within league circles)

    “If both of the top quarterbacks are gone by the time the Seahawks pick at 9, several execs told me they believe the odds of a trade down are very high. The Vikings are clearly in the market for a top corner, and jumping up to 9 would likely allow then to secure one of the top two (Gardner or Derek Stingley, Jr), and Seattle at 12 could very likely still land one of the top pass rushers on the board plus keep securing much needed additional draft capital (even after the Russell Wilson trade). It’s a potential draft scenario to keep an eye on …”

    The part about landing a top rusher at 12? Who does he speak of? Reports like this just make me shake my head.

    • Rob Staton

      There’s only one person I pay attention to for league inside draft info at this time of year


    • cha

      I’d like to know how JLC comes by that information. It’s oddly structured.

      Does he literally poll executives asking ‘what do the Seahawks do at 9 if the top 2 QBs are off the board?’

      Seems strangely specific.

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