Pete Carroll’s Seahawks were exposed by the Rams

Pete Carroll was out-coached again by Sean McVay

I drove home at 2am. I made a cup of tea. And I watched the game.

In the immediate aftermath of the Seahawks’ opening day embarrassment at the hands of the Rams, it felt almost a blessing that I’d barely seen any of the thrashing.

I needed to sit through it before going to bed.

That performance was a shambles. It was indicative of a team totally unprepared to start the season.

How can they look that bad on opening day? I know other teams also looked terrible. That’s no justification or excuse, though, for what the Seahawks churned out.

No pass rush. No ability to adapt and change the game from the sidelines when things went south. An offense that is loaded with weapons and yet stalled to a complete stop in the second half — producing three meaningful yards in two quarters of football.

To say Pete Carroll was out-coached by Sean McVay doesn’t even come close to truly encapsulating what happened.

How many years are we going to put up with this? Year after year the defense is a total mess to start the season. It’s become so obvious we’ve been able to say, annually, ‘we’ll be here next year saying the same things’. Here we go again.

12-18 on third and fourth down. 426 yards, easily gobbled up. No sacks. Not even any consistent pressure at any point in the game. Unable to get off the field to the point the Rams had 40 minutes in time of possession. The Seahawks are consistently so easy to play against on defense and it’s been going on for too long.

They seem to have added a bunch of 3-4 personnel over the last two off-seasons with the intention of shifting schemes. Yet they’ve not addressed the interior D-line sufficiently to actually execute the 3-4 properly, so they’ve gone back to four man fronts and the end result is a mess.

Everything looks small, hesitant, soft, obvious and it’s not good enough. It’s indicative of a team not really knowing what it’s doing, with a distinct lack of difference makers to make up for any semblance of schematic brilliance.

They’ve pumped too much resource into this unit for it to look this utterly clueless, lost and ineffective.

It speaks to a Head Coach who, sadly, appears to have lost the plot at this point. His schemes became dated and predictable years ago and he’s been desperately trying to figure out a pivot for a few seasons now. None have been forthcoming and we’re left with annual talk of ‘needing to fix things’ on the fly. The Seahawks are hopeless on defense. Whether it’s running or throwing, you can get after this group. Nothing is changing in that regard. The Seahawks are a repeat offender as a bad defensive football team.

Carroll should’ve handed the keys to a proven coach who can sort things out years ago. Instead, he’s appointed two defensive coordinators from within his sphere. There was never a serious justification for appointing Ken Norton Jr and there’s even less justification for promoting Clint Hurtt.

At least Norton Jr could argue he had little to work with, as the Seahawks relied on Benson Mayowa and Bruce Irvin for a pass rush and consistently failed to address a key area of the team. Hurtt has no such excuse. Yet really, this is Carroll’s issue. He is in charge, he hasn’t been willing to make an appointment to get this right, he continues to struggle to piece together a functioning defense and the results are an unmitigated disaster. Hurtt and Norton Jr simply don’t have the authority, the capability or the prowess to cook up tactical masterplans to cover warts. Thus, we get what we’ve seen for years. Bad defense.

Then there’s the offense. It’s loaded with talent, we don’t need to pretend otherwise. For it to only achieve three meaningful yards in an entire half of football yesterday is staggering. It’s impossible to overestimate how bad that is.

It’s not unusual for the Seahawks to completely grind to a halt in a second half. Heck, we saw it in week one last year — the Broncos simply couldn’t capitalise. It shouldn’t happen as often as it does. Not with the personnel on offense. Again, it speaks to a coaching and execution failure.

What we saw yesterday isn’t acceptable in any way, shape or form. Yes, the Rams have Aaron Donald. Yes, Seattle’s two offensive tackles got hurt. The Rams, if we’re being honest, also have virtually 10 other no-name defenders on their defensive roster and play without highly drafted, coveted offensive tackles themselves. They still put up 426 yards.

It’s one thing for the defense to start horrendously (again). It’s quite another for the offense to do the same.

Then we can go into the embarrassing, childish nonsense we saw from some of the players when things escalated, or the fact that the players resorted to saying ‘the Rams wanted it more’ and ‘played harder’ in post-game press gatherings. Really? You can’t get up fully for an opening day battle with a divisional foe?

This was a multi-faceted shambles and Carroll, as the man at the top, is responsibe.

I’ve long believed he has become bigger than the franchise. He has an almost untouchable power brought about by an ownership situation that remains very much in a holding pattern, combined with a sympathetic and loyal fan base.

I think Jody Allen will sell the team within the next 18 months, mainly because that was always Paul Allen’s intention. One of her first acts in charge was to extend Carroll’s contract to a timeframe that matches when a sale could realistically occur. The team cannot be sold until May 2024 and Carroll’s contract runs through 2025.

Thus, major franchise change was never likely on the cards behind the scenes. I can’t say for certain but it’s always been my hunch that Carroll and John Schneider were positioned to run football operations. I’m not convinced there’s much accountability because the ownership structure currently exists to get the team into a position where it will be sold. That can’t happen for another nine months at the absolute earliest and in reality, it’s probably 18-24 months away. I don’t think there’s much jeopardy behind the scenes for the men running the show. At least not until a sale is completed.

Within Seattle’s fan-base, many have only ever known life with Carroll. The idea of moving on is terrifying to some. Whenever the prospect of change is brought up you’ll often hear people reference how things could go badly wrong. It’s the classic ‘careful what you wish for’ approach to avoiding any kind of change.

Forget the Eagles, who fired Doug Pederson shortly after things collapsed after winning a Super Bowl, only to come roaring back in double-quick time to return to the top of the NFC. The ‘careful what you wish for’ attitude instead only focuses on a worst case scenario, such as a repeat of Jim Mora replacing Mike Holmgren.

The reality is that Holmgren’s race was run and Mora was simply an ill-judged replacement. They put it right with Carroll. With hindsight, it was right to move on from Holmgren and arguably the Mora experience was worth living through to get to Carroll. Fearing change in 2008 would’ve never brought Carroll to Seattle. We’d never have the LOB, the Super Bowl, the glory days.

Imagine that.

You can’t be scared of the next era of Seahawks football. Carroll isn’t the Seahawks. He’s just a coach. A very successful and much-loved coach, admittedly. Yet like Holmgren, increasingly it feels like the time is coming to try something new.

We can’t keep seeing the defense play like this. We can’t cling to the LOB years, which are now a decade ago, or the way Seattle could rely on Russell Wilson to get +10 wins when the LOB era ended.

Neither can we over-egg what last year was. They started hot, fuelled by the Wilson saga and an exciting week one win against the Broncos. They started 6-3 and have gone 3-7 since, starting with a beat-down in Germany against Tampa Bay and continuing into yesterday.

Their nine wins a year ago came against a hapless Denver, two almost losses to a broken Rams (minus Aaron Donald), two against a mess of a Cardinals outfit, they beat Detroit when they were still bad and beat-up, they beat a rotten Jets team. Their two quality wins were against the Giants and Chargers — two clubs that were inconsistent and hardly powerhouses.

They were the benefactors of a hot start and a bad schedule. Now, it appears they’ll get neither and reality will bite.

Teams who make a serious playoff push don’t lose in the way Seattle did on Sunday. There’s ample time for the Seahawks to right a few wrongs and put some wins on the board. I’ve no doubt they will do. Even at their most shallow in terms of depth and quality, the Seahawks won seven games in 2010. When they collapsed in 2021, they still ended strongly enough to get to 7-10. I don’t think they’ll win fewer than six or seven games this year, even after witnessing the horror show yesterday.

To me though, I think that will just prolong the agony. I no longer believe Pete Carroll is capable of coaching this team to glory. I don’t think he has the schematic ideas for the defense, I don’t think he’ll take a proper back-seat and appoint star coordinators to allow them to instil their ideas without interference. I don’t think, after 13 years, the Seahawks can get back to the top under his leadership. There’s still energy within the franchise because that’ll never go away under Carroll. Yet beneath the surface, things feel stale.

This isn’t an overreaction to one game. I’ve voiced these concerns for some time. This felt like an apt moment to return to the subject, given the Rams’ embarrassment was a stark reminder of the issues this team has faced in recent years.

Neither am I accusing Carroll of being useless. I have immense respect for Carroll. Most people do. I think they should build a statue of him at Lumen Field the minute he moves on. Yet I don’t think blind faith or avoiding uncomfortable conversations does anyone any benefit. It’s possible to appreciate everything Carroll has achieved in Seattle while also feeling, after 13 years, perhaps it’s time for something different.

When you have a whole off-season to prepare and deliver that performance in week one, in all facets of the game, at home, against a division rival in the state the Rams are currently in, you can’t shirk discussing whether this era of Seahawks football has run its course.

My fear is they’ll win enough games — seven, for example — to be a bad team that isn’t quite bad enough to initiate change. They’ll keep things ticking along for another year with an accommodating media and fanbase terrified to contemplate something different.

That performance on Sunday was unacceptable. It highlighted what has been wrong for a long time and if/when the good times roll this season, these same issues won’t ever be that far away. The minute the Seahawks play meaningful football games, they’ll be found out.

I want more than this. I want to believe this team can get back to the top again, not bask in the glow of potential playoff qualification and ‘competing’ when in reality, they’re a mile away from the NFL’s best, haven’t touched a NFC Championship game for nearly a decade and don’t — on this evidence — appear to be getting any closer.

At the moment, Carroll’s better at comical social media videos based around his throwing motion, talking about philosophy on podcasts and pumping up the hype. That all feels fun and positive, right up until the point his team shows to be badly coached, badly organised, ill-disciplined and, frankly, an embarrassment.

If you missed our post-game live stream, check it out here:


  1. UkAlex6674

    Repost from previous thread:

    We are 3-7 in our last 10 games including the playoff loss.

    That’s trending completely the wrong way.

    All those saying ‘relax it’s just week one we can turn it around’ need a reality check.

    There are only 17 games to play in a regular season. It’s not acceptable to have the mind-set it’s OK to drop one or two because it’s early on.

    I don’t see the Cowboys or 9ers having week one blues 🤔

    • Ben

      3-7 is the number to remember. Simply not good enough. Too many excuses and not enough desire to change. Other teams are evolving, and we’re stuck in the past.

    • Paul McMillan

      The Hawks have not had a top 10 defense since 2016. Thats 7 years ago when they still had LOB. Pete is a defensive minded coach. It’s unacceptable the defense has been good for that long. Theyve had plenty of time to improve it but it’s still the same thing.

      There’s no more Russ and LOB to scapegoat. It’s just Pete now

  2. Dave Stacey

    I follow Arsenal in ‘soccer’ in the late 90s early 200s Arsene Wenger has created a legendary football team littered with stars. They would dual with Man United for league and cup titles. Culminating in producing a team that won the EPL undefeated and were proclaimed the Invincibles. two seasons later they made a champions league final unluckily losing to Barcelona.
    Over the next 12 years there was a steady decline in Arsenal FC. They went away from having an aggressive spine to becoming a finesse spine, splash signings were ill judged big name divas (Ozil) . Sure, Occasionally they would beat Man United at home, make a run in the champions league or domestic FA cup – but in reality they were poles apart from the goliaths in the EPL over that time. Man United, Chelsea, liverpool and City. (Sound familiar?)

    All Arsenal Fans and neutrals hoped that Wenger would win one more title and could ride off into the unset. It became apparent this wasn’t going to happen and that Wenger had run his course. Eventually the fans were dramatically and aggressively divided. There were banners in the stadium ‘Wenger out’, boos etc etc…
    Eventually an ageing Arsene Wenger was forced to resign as the gradual decline continued.
    It became so tiresome, boring and hopeless to watch.

    I believe the exact same thing is happening with the Seattle Seahawks the parallels are almost unbelievable.

    I hope they can turn it around and play like the Lions. But when so much resources are pumped into players like Adams and Diggs and Pete carries on being Pete employing his buddies as coaches and allow the team to behave like a glorified circus I just don’t believe it can happen.
    I almost wonder if it would be better if the team fell to a 4-13 season, as perhaps that will force change.

    • Group Captain Mandrake

      Fellow Arsenal fan here. I would agree with everything you said, but with one addition. When Arsenal built Emirates Stadium, it really did limit how much money they could spend, so Arsene Wenger came to rely on younger unproven players. Occasionally you get an Aaron Ramsey or Jack Wilshire (when he wasn’t injured) but you normally get a Yaya Sanogo. The Seahawks don’t even have that excuse to use. The way this team is run is becoming a disgrace.

      • Dave Stacey

        Spot on I was going to add the caveat that Pete’s Seahawks don’t have the very fair monetary excuses that Wenger’s Arsenal had of:
        a) having to fund a new stadium (I’d have rather stayed at Highbury tbh!) and being forced to sell best players to rivals
        b) The EPL is not salary capped

        None the less it was bloody frustrating to watch and this is getting much the same.

        At least Arsenal are trending well though!

        • Group Captain Mandrake

          That salary cap makes a huge difference. I wish European soccer could figure out a way to implement it. It’s a great story when a team like Leicester wins the league, but it’s usually the same old teams or the new upstarts with Saudi ownership. As much fun as it is to watch Arsenal getting back to the top, they can simply outspend most of the teams in the league.

          • Dave Stacey

            Hear Hear! I’m often arguing with my friends about how European Football needs a salary cap.
            So frustrating for teams like Brighton who develop all these good players and just have them pinched and have no realistic change of competing for a title

    • Morgan

      You see the problem with Arsenal is they’re always trying to walk it in.

  3. Edgar

    I can’t believe what I watched. No words

  4. Mick

    Hard truths Rob but they need to be said. I’m really disappointed, I fail to understand that we got all these players and they’re all not good. It can only mean that we aren’t using them right.

    I’m looking forward for the wave of trolls who will say that Rob wished for this to happen, that Carter played so well while Devon didn’t play at all and that we are all haters here.

  5. LouCityHawk

    After taking a night to sleep on what I viewed as the worst loss in my Seahawks memory (which goes back to the early 1980s) I’m still disgusted by the loss.

    This was bad from top to bottom. My only caveat in joining in calls for heads to roll (and frankly, I’d strip the team down to the studs) is that I’ve long said the first two weeks are mulligans in the NFL, teams have stormed out of the gates looking like world beaters, then fallen off the map, teams have also looked pathetic then gone on to contend for the Super Bowl.

    What concerns me is hearing PC say they need to look at tape, or Wagner saying they need to learn. This wasn’t a game you learn from. You were beaten in every single phase of it. If this is who you are then you are not good enough.

    • Big Mike

      this was an organizational failure from top to bottom

      I believe it was you that said this yesterday. 100% spot on.

      • BK26

        Complacency. No fear in their jobs. Getting fat in easy times. It’s extremely embarrassing for Pete and Bobby (the two field leaders) to look this way. There is no alpha mentality. No mind set of wanting to just destroy the opponent.

        And they are who the young guys are learning from. Them and DK and Quandre…

        • LouCityHawk

          Wagner looked so old and slow.

          Made me long for Cody Barton.

          • BK26

            This depresses me…more so because I understand it….

          • pdway

            so slow. the lack of D tackles has rightfully been pointed out – but the failure to put together even a competent LB unit is another big miss.

        • Big Mike

          Complacency. No fear in their jobs. Getting fat in easy times.

          Absolute power corrupts absolutely

    • Malanch

      “This wasn’t a game you learn from.”

      Well, unless learning that you aren’t who you thought you were counts.

      • laphroaig

        Which can be a valuable lesson.

    • McZ

      You won’t go to a SB with a backup QB, who is 3-7 in his last ten games and was thoroughly outplayed by a seventh round rookie in his single playoff appearance.

      It’s one thing when the fanbase talks themselves into the Geno hype. If the FO is falling for the hype, pulling out a major investment on top of multiple trade and FA desasters, then there has to be responsibility.

  6. DC1234

    I expected the seahawks run defense to be garbage this year, but what happened to their pass rush? Stafford is not a mobile qb. He had all day. Their secondary was terrible. I feel like they can just ignore Wolen most of the game and expose Tre Brown and Bryant.

    Pete Carroll is known to be able to coach the secondary. Why were they so bad? Brown, Bryant and Jackson all had a ton of preseason snaps. Its not like they were rusty.

    Am I a bad fan if Im rooting for a 3-5 win team this year? I really dont see many wins this year based on how strong their opponents are.

    They have a four game stretch of niners, cowboys, niners, eagles. Before that they have Browns, Ravens and Commanders. All run dominant teams.

    • LouCityHawk

      If the team that showed up Sunday is the team that shows up every week, 0-17 is not out of the question.

      • DC1234

        If they start the “easier” part of their schedule 2-4 or 1-5, its gonna be a brutal season.

      • geoff u

        This looked like the exact same team that got obliterated in the second half of the playoffs. Defense turned into a turnstyle and the offence couldn’t do anything, except this time it was at home against an inferior opponent. So nothing’s changed all offseason and it sure likes like a continuation of our 3-6 ending to last season.

    • Chris

      Is Pete really “known to be able to coach the secondary?” I mean sure, that’s his rep. But how good were the Jets when he was there? Was USC known as DBU? Were the Niners great when he was there DC? I think PC was extremely lucky to have three HoF backs in Seattle. Sure he gets some credit for developing them, but I believe most of the credit goes to the players themselves. Since the LOB has left, his ability to be a DB “Whisperer” has shown to be a sham.

      • Peter

        I’ve long wondered about this. Listened on the radio and with six DB’s on the field Atwell or Nacua couldn’t be stopped. No Cooper kupp and I don’t think the rams were particularly good they just kept at it for almost 40 minutes of game time while we let them convert a million third downs.

      • DC1234

        I agree and disagree.

        I disagree in that Pete had a lot to do with the secondary during the LOB days. He drafted Earl over Taylor Maze. Found all pros in the later rounds (Sherm, Kam). Great contributing players (Browner,Maxwell, Lane, Thurmand). Would Sherman and Kam thrive if they were drafted by another team, idk.

        I agree in that his track record after the LOB is not good. His 2016-2018 class, only produces Shaq Griffin. Right now, Wolen is great. But he needs to prove it this year as well.

      • Chris

        It’s hard to say. Their pass rush has often been horrible last few years. That game Stafford could’ve done some hamstring stretches after every drop back and still had time to throw. And Tre Brown looks like me trying to tackle … Is open middle field secondaries fault or scheme?

    • Ben

      The schedule looks tough going forward. I don’t think rooting for a low win total is wrong, since it’s really rooting for their record to reveal who they are. Being stuck in the 7 to 9 win category is the worst. Too much room for excuses and not enough for meaningful change.

    • McZ

      The Rams didn’t ignore Woolen. They torched him to the ground, by big plays from Nacua. He was bad. Really bad.

      I watched the KJ Wright thing on YT. Don’t panic, it’s only 0-1, Devon Witherspoon is coming. Having watched lots of Illini football since April, we are in for a really nasty surprise. The guy cannot cover. He is a pure slot missile, and those you draft in 5th round.

      Plus, fwiw, Gonzales was a beast against the Eagles.

  7. SeaTown

    Spot on as always Rob! I don’t post a whole lot here, I usually just read but yeasterday was the tipping point for me and Carroll. Unfortunately, what this teams really needs to do:

    Crater–not go 7-10, 8-9 or 9-8. I’m talking 3-14, 4-13. Then if you are lucky to grab a top 5 pick again, let’s pass on the safe 5 foot nothing injured cornerback types. I know the Jalen Carter thing has been beaten to death, and I don’t disagee with anything Rob has said about why the Hawks shouldn’t have drafted him (and quite frankly around the clowns on this team maybe his horrible character really comes to the forefront ) but saw this on Twitter yesterday about his week 1 performance:
    – 1 sack
    – 7 QB pressures
    – An absurd 32 % pass rush win rate
    Most pressures by any DT week 1, most pressures by any rookie DT in a game in over 5 years.

    I know why the Hawks passed. I don’t disagree. But does playing it safe ever really work?

    Maybe a 3-14 season finally pushes Carroll to the point wherre he truly has had enough. I have rooted for this team since the 70s. Up until this point Tom Flores and Dennis Erickson were the only two coaches I desperately wanted to see get fired. I know Carroll won’t get fired, but I desperately want him to step down soon rather than later. I’m tired of his act. I’m tired of the confused look on his face in game and at the podium after his team has been embaarrassed and he acts like he had no idea it was coming. Yesterday was a start reminder of the Bills game a few years ago when Allen threw all over the Hawks and Carroll said,” I really thought they were going to run more.” The man no longer has the answers. The game is clearly passing him by and he refuses to adapt by bringing in people who can really run the show. Instead, we get cronies like Ken Norton and Clint Hurtt.

    Did anyone see the Cowboy game last night? Did you see Dan Quinn and that pass rush terrorize the Giants? That made watching Hurtt and his band of cream puffs even more painful. Instead of terrorizing an immobile Matthew Stafford, they waltzed around with that poor o-line and let Staffoprd pick the so-called LOB part 2 to shreds. Disgraceful and it all falls at the feet of Carroll.

    People made fun of Jonathan Gannon for his speech the other day; they made fun of Nick Siriani for his opening press conference in Philly. I would rather have guys like that who may not be as “cool” and “charasimatic” as Caroll, but who can actually coach and understand the game today. Because of fantasy football, I watched the Cardinals. That defense played their hearts out. Yes, they lost but they really have no talent and quite frankly they could have won. We all know what Siriani has done in Philly. Give me the socially awkward coach and who can, you know, actually coach, over the cool grand pa in Seattle who gets outcoached each week and has no real answers and then gets asked by the media about the ovation for Bwashed Bopbby Wagner. This really is infuriating.

    Carroll must go!

    • LouCityHawk

      Nice post, agree on most of what you wrote.

      Flores and Erickson were bad. I almost quit on this team during the Mora era, I’m glad I didn’t comment on anything back then, because people would think I’m weirder than I am.

      This team was Mora bad yesterday.

      I feel like a broken record pining for Quinn as a head coach, maybe he learned his lessons from his time in ATL? But his defense is beautiful, better than what Belli is turning out.

      Or maybe Ken Dorsey, his meltdowns and all, is the answer.

      Ben Johnson with the Lions would be a great addition to the NFCW.

      An underrated part of Rob’s post is that no change is likely until a new owner comes aboard, and a coach is likely to want to avoid that seat until they know who the owner is they will be working for. Trapping fans in a sort of purgatory.

      • SeaTown

        Spot on Lou! We are in purgatory. Win 7-9 games, keep Carroll, keep JS, mediocrity wins. So frustarting.

  8. LouCityHawk

    Also, props to Rob for talking about the real issues that should be discussed after this loss.

    Certain fans seem to be laser focused on little details, ignoring that this was a team beaten at every level, humiliated, by opponents who should have had no business making it close.

    People are howling about the DK penalty, as if that mattered.

    Carter truthers are acting like his presence would have turned the whole game around. Because clearly it would have?

    DLine obsessers are trying to excuse the LB/secondary play because “there was no pass rush”, ignoring that Stafford usually was able to deftly deliver the ball to wide open players that racked up YAC.

    Geno defenders are decrying the lack of Lockett and the two tackles…as if Stafford was playing behind an all time great line.

    We should have played starters in the preseason…like the Rams did(?)

    As a fan, I’ve never been more tempted to pay my tab and leave early than I was watching this game. I can accept a talent deficiency, I can accept young coaches making costly mistakes, I can accept a whole lot of things. What makes me sick to watch is apathetic, unprepared, and outmaneuvered players, and a coaching staff devoid of any answers or adjustments.

    Is it an aberration? Or is it the norm? Those are the questions to be asked. And if it is the norm, would some quick cuts and firings turn things around? If not, then it requires a complete turnover.

    • London Seahawk

      Geno did not look good before the tackles went out, let alone after.

      Deejay Dallas getting all those reps ahead of Charbonnet is another thing that is bonkers to me.

      A lot of galaxy brain nonsense.

    • BK26

      Here’s the deal that really only Rob and people here have said (and is finally starting to hit other people and fans): it is all of it. What was good? What has been good? No pass rush, bad coaching, bad scheming, bad players for the scheme, players past their prime, debilitating contracts, head cases that are hurting the team.

      We got beaten completely. And have been getting beaten for quite a while. Time to be embarrassed and do something about it. Get people who are pissed off for greatness.

    • CHaquesFan

      The rams didn’t play their starters in preseason either it’s a big issue with the seahawks and their training staff

  9. London Seahawk

    Man, stocks in that pass rush specialist Brandon Jordan sure fell off a cliff.
    What’s he been teaching them??
    Rams O-line one of the worst in the league…

    I want to see a huge bounce back with Goff on his arse regularly next weekend or I will happily join the Carroll out crowd.
    I’ll give them one week grace to bounce back but that’s the extent of my patience.

  10. Edfar

    Just lose every game. I want a great QB

  11. Sea Mode

    Heard that on broadcast as well:

    • LouCityHawk

      Yup, after I heard that I thought the coaches should have shut Geno down and put in Lock.

      Geno looked so deflated on the bench, old, beaten….

      • AlaskaHawk

        Geno hasn’t played a single game snap. Maybe the coaches could have prepared him better. Too much worrying about Geno’s health when we don’t even know if he should be starting.

        • LouCityHawk

          Stafford didn’t play a preseason snap either.

          To clarify, I wanted Geno pulled for the same reason Burrow was. Protect him and his psyche, let Lock absorb the hits and all.

        • Rob Staton

          Geno played in the second pre season game

          • LouCityHawk

            Forgot that.

            Another excuse goes up in smoke.

            But why scrounge around to excuse the inexcusable?

      • STTBM

        With the shit show gameplan and playcalling, anyone would have been deflated. This wasn’t Genos fault, though he was overly cautious. This coaching staff is simply inept, and not good enough for the NFL, from top to bottom.

        Geno obviously had reservations about the gameplan, and knows full well no adjustments will be forthcoming in-game. His demeanor tells us everything we need to know about our coaching staff: they suck.

    • Ben

      That was tough to watch. Man is scared out of his mind. Sure hope it’s not a harbinger of things to come. The defeated look on Tyler Lockett’s face was concerning as well.

  12. Sea Mode

    vs. “we just need to clean up a few things.”

    Paul Dehner Jr.

    Zac Taylor on his message to team: “This isn’t the team that we are going to be. We all understand that.”

    • LouCityHawk


      Burrow had a great quote as well. Accountability, and a flat out statement that they are not that bad.

  13. AlaskaHawk

    It was a difficult game to watch. It’s no surprise that Geno Smith looked awful since he had zero game time due to coaching fear that he will get injured in the presesason. But what is the rest of the teams excuses? They played preseason, they were supposed to be prepared.

    And the injuries again. Why so many injuries? Both tackles out? It’s crazy. Tough game to watch with no immediate fixes in sight.

    • McZ

      Geno played in preseason.

      We have to get real here:
      – He is a backup QB
      – PFF preseason ranking for the Seahawks OL was #30.

  14. Tezza

    Gonna just embrace what we are a terrible team, I’m hoping for a 3-5 win year so we get high pick maybe get Caleb and b maybe Carroll finally goes. Time to rip off the band aid.

    • AlaskaHawk

      Agreed about ripping the bandage off and accepting a terrible season to get better drafting. But Carroll will half ass the team through another year, the only question being whether they will make the playoffs now that they are the third worst team in the Division. Or perhaps the only question is whether the Seahawks are third or fourth worst team in our Division?

  15. TheOtherJordan

    It’s going to be really interesting to watch the next 12 months and the ownership situation. Can’t wait to see who Bezos picks as the next head coach and GM.

    • LouCityHawk

      I know Bezos is the odds on favorite.

      I wonder if Allen isn’t trying to muck that up though, will he want to embrace the #magentacurse at Seahawks Field.

  16. Peter

    You said it last year and you said it on the reaction show but OUR team has become the Seattle Pete Carol’s. The media in Seattle has become an absolute jokeshow. I don’t care about Bobby’s ovation. I want some answers to a few things:

    1. You can’t have your scheme figured out when you don’t even know how to build your scheme. When is the last time we had great safety play? Right before Earl broke his leg? When’s the last time we had impactful LB play? 2017 maybe. Corners ,plural, to be feared? When’s the last time we could stop the run and rush the passer at the sane time? That one year when Reed and Clark were good….that’s closer to a decade ago than I’d like to be reminded of.

    2. Why are we forever trotting out old players as bandaids?

    3. How does it happen every year the team says they are going to do x,y,z and gets nowhere close? Example, getting worked by the niners and deciding not beefing up the dline was the move.

    4. Why are we completely unable to showcase a part of offense? Lockett rules, DK should rule, k9 can go, where are the TE sets? Last year the comments were filled with folks saying ” it’s a breath of fresh air,” about the changes….nah it’s an elevator full of farts.

    5. If Geno needs every piece ticking like a rolex or it doesn’t go…..there’s your answer if he’s the future.

    • LouCityHawk


      1. When Dan Quinn was there, and when the players developed on his watch got hurt, old, retired, etc…

      2. Because the team has failed to consistently draft and develop players for years, and due to cap management has been fleeced to sign replacement level veterans to minimum contracts.

      3. They stripped it down, did it look worse or better than last year? I can’t tell yet. But they did invest.

      4. That offense was offensive yesterday.

      5. That Stafford went out yesterday and looked like a MVP candidate with a patchwork line, and couple of ‘who Dey’ receivers, tells you everything you need to know about the excuse makers.

  17. Hawkhomer1

    I have been a defender of Pete the entire time. He looked old and clueless yesterday. Every dog has his day and his day is past. Just not looking forward to suffering through 2 more years until ownership changes to get the change we deserve.

    I want to believe that we have more talent on this team than we are seeing. That it is just coaching. Rob, do you think the talent cupboard is bare?

    Finally, I sure am glad to see the incentive laden contract for Geno because he won’t finish this year as the starter. Just my 2.

  18. STTBM

    Losing Sean Desai is a big deal. Last years secondary performed well, and we added talent like Love this year…and instantly without Desai our secondary plays more off-ball conservative and looks like a clown show.

    Carrol will never learn. Keep the old cronies, let the young up and comers leave…

    PS it’s not working…

  19. Big Mike

    Rob said:

    My fear is they’ll win enough games — seven, for example — to be a bad team that isn’t quite bad enough to initiate change. They’ll keep things ticking along for another year with an accommodating media and fanbase terrified to contemplate something different.

    Sorry Rob, but she wouldn’t make a change if they went 4-13. My opinion of course but Trailblazers’ evidence points to that.

    • LouCityHawk

      If this is what it is, this will be what it will be until the new ownership comes in.

  20. PJ in Seattle

    That was as bad a Seahawks game as I’ve witnessed since the dark days of the mid-90’s. Fans streaming out of the stadium in the 4th qtr because it was obvious that we were NOT even going to be able to make it close. Boos raining down and the funk of disappointment filling the stadium as the collective fanbase began to grasp that we were being absolutely blown off the field by a rebuilding team with holes all over their roster. Anyone care to think about what Dallas or SF would have done to that team we saw on the field yesterday?

    It’s coaching – 100%. There’s too much talent on this team on both sides of the ball to justify the embarrasment that took place yesterday. I don’t know where we go from here, but my worst fear is not that we end up the 2022 Broncos, but that we scratch our way to 7 or 8 wins and another visit to the purgatory of middling draft position with just enough flashes to give Pete and his whole staff another opportunity to leverage that hope into yet another year of doing the same damn thing we’ve been doing for years.

  21. Big Mike

    Justb an reminder: we have people that come here that literally are this ridiculous………..

    Seahawkward says:
    September 10, 2023 at 4:23 pm
    This is exactly what you were praying for with that agent article. Hope you’re happy.

    Seahawkward says:
    September 10, 2023 at 4:58 pm
    GENO ARTICLE. Rob willed this game into existence. I’m not saying his overall desires ar wrong. But this game is exactly what he wanted. Don’t let him tell you otherwise for a second.

    By the way Rob, if you are capable of willing things into existence, might I suggest going for winning lottery numbers.

    • Group Captain Mandrake

      Of all things football-related, if Rob was able to will anything in to existence, I’m pretty sure it would be multiple SB titles in a row for Seattle. That was the weirdest post I’ve seen in quite a while.

  22. Julian L

    I think we’ll really see where the team is after the Carolina game on 24 September, but if the next two games go badly, I could really see that game against the Arizona Cardinals on the 6th January being a total tank fest to see who gets the number 1 overall pick! Think about that.

  23. ShowMeYourHawk

    This first week of football really saw some “projected” playoff teams play like utter shite.

    I’m not convinced that Cinci or KC will be left out of the dance at the end but the Seahawks, NYG and Pittsburgh looked BAD and we’re the only one of those teams that played a squad that likely has no chance at the postseason.

  24. WEG

    I’m generally impressed with RS, but the whole tone here is simply pointless. If all this wasn’t at all apparent before the game is it truly apparent now? The truth is we don’t yet know how good the Seahawks are going to be this year.

    And obviously seeing Stafford carve them up through the air was disappointing, we were expecting more of a pass rush and we were especially expecting better pass coverage, or at least I was.

    The truth is we don’t yet know how good the Rams are going to be this year, either. Every year teams surprise the hell out of us (or just have the odd good game).

    I mean because RS generally makes good points I’m sure there are some in there but I can’t even see them because I’m not going to wade through the pointless huffing and puffing.

    “Then there’s the offense. It’s loaded with talent, we don’t need to pretend otherwise. For it to only achieve three meaningful yards in an entire half of football yesterday is staggering. It’s impossible to overestimate how bad that is.”

    First thing to do is understand the situation the offense was in. They went FG, TD, FG, FG (doink) in the first half and started their 7th drive at 9:45 of the 4th quarter, down 24-13 (and both starting OT’s?).

    Compare to Philadelphia’s offense which went FG, TD (start NE 26), P, P, P, P started their 7th (meaningful, ignoring one at end of first half) drive with 13:43 left in the 3rd quarter. They then went FG, FG, FG, F, D.

    Anyway, no, three consecutive 3-and-out (or 3-and-out-ish) drives while the game is still in reach (or 4 if you want to count the one with the Metcalf penalty on 2nd and 2 that started at 4:57 of the 4th down 27 – 13) is not a “staggering” performance, that sort of thing is not uncommon.

    Philadelphia had its four straight 3-and-outs and I doubt if the smartest Eagles analyst is employing this sort of over-the-top language to describe that happenstance today.

    Fine, you can probably lawyer up and cherry pick your way to some sort of argument that the Eagles O was way better yesterday than the Seahawks O, have at it. No doubt the NE D is ten times better than the Rams D. Whatever.

    It was a handful of bad plays (on the O’s part) and it absolute is possible “to overestimate how bad that is,” RS was doing it as he wrote it.

    • Rob Staton

      What were you saying about pointless huffing and puffing?

    • Olyhawksfan

      Pointless huffing and puffing? Did you watch the same game? We got smoked! I think it’s okay to “huff and puff”, or whatever you want to call it.

      I’m tired of watching the same movie. We can’t stop them, and our offense gets shut down.

    • geoff u

      The team at the start of this year looked exactly like the team at the end of last year when we went 3-6. As it stands right now, we are a 5-6 win football team, and that’s pretty bad.

  25. The Wheedle

    Points Against:

    2012: 245 (15.3/g) 1st of 32
    2013: 231 (14.4/g) 1st of 32
    2014: 254 (15.9/g) 1st of 32
    2015: 277 (17.3/g) 1st of 32
    2016: 292 (18.3/g) 3rd of 32

    January, 2017.
    Rocky Seto retires.

    2017: 332 (20.8/g) 13th of 32
    2018: 347 (21.7/g) 11th of 32
    2019: 398 (24.9/g) 22nd of 32
    2020: 371 (23.2/g) 15th of 32
    2021: 366 (21.5/g) 11th of 32
    2022: 401 (23.6/g) 25th of 32


    • Rob Staton

      Think it’s more a case of

      LOB era ends

      Then crappy defense

  26. Ben

    I think Geno is a fine player and his contract was fine enough, but when we look back at the the 2023 offseason- Daniel Jones and Geno Smith didn’t have the market they wanted for a reason. Week 1 spoke clearly enough on that. And as usual it’s probably not worth paying a JAG Vet at QB, no matter how scary the alternative is.

    On defense, it seemed like the middle of the defense was too soft, not fast enough, and got exposed early- from DT, to LB, to safety. Couple that with some classic “nearly there” pass rush and Stafford looked a few years younger.

    And a continuing bummer, is that every year I think we’ll have roster and cap flexibility, and every year they charge the credit card for overpaid middling talent.

    I hope they don’t do anything too rash that doesn’t involve offloading highly paid vets.

    • LouCityHawk

      I’m waiting for the people who really know CB/S play to watch the all 22 to chime in, but the DLine and Edge play was not the sole cause of the problem.

      Stafford was hitting white open players on 3-5 second reads, the highest may have been 7 when he was looking for a bigger play.

      A pass rusher can only ‘win’ and make it to the QB so fast.

      Too many fans seem to be overlooking what I’ve been pounding on, the team still can’t cover crossing routes, except yesterday they couldn’t cover anything.

      • Ben

        No disagreements there. Didn’t seem like anyone played well.

        Just felt like it started with runs up the middle and lots of crossers over the middle. And then snowballed from there once we showed we couldn’t stop it.

      • geoff u

        Average time to throw by a QB is 2.5-3 seconds. 5-7 seconds would be an insane amount of time. Every so often Russell Wilson might hit 7+ seconds while scrambling like mad. But I suspect you aren’t being all that accurate with your counting of the seconds? I certainly hope so.

      • Group Captain Mandrake

        If Stafford was getting 3-5 and 7 second reads, that is in no way on the DBs. Not that they played great yesterday – no one did – but that is on the D-line and coaches. The linemen couldn’t get there, and the coaches couldn’t or wouldn’t scheme ways to put pressure on Stafford.

  27. Denver Hawker

    It is exceptionally rare to have a truly dominant defense in today’s NFL. Requires DPOY talent, All-Pro supporting cast, and a coach to adjust in-game. Days of scheming to “bend don’t break” or “neutralize the best player” are gone.

    Seems like the Hawks have been dead set on sticking with the “eliminate explosive plays, keep it underneath” defense that will get nickel and dimed all day long by modern offensive schemes. No surprise the Rams are built to exploit this look, get the ball out quickly to avoid any pass rush, and dominate time of possession.

    This roster and coach were never going to be a Top 10 defense. Seattle’s success this year depends on having a Top 10 offense and that begins and ends with Geno.

    62% completion rate will not get it done. With the starters, his 75% first half completion rate looked very much like first half 2022 Geno. Losing both starting tackles turned him into second half 2022 Geno. With protection, he’s an accurate, efficient passer, and keeps the offense on time. When the pocket breaks down, he is not among the elite QBs to improvise and make a play, which causes the whole offense to come to a halt.

    If Cross and Lucas can’t stay healthy this year, I’m afraid it’s going to be a long season of games just like yesterday. As crazy as it sounds, I think the defense is correctable. The offense however has a single point of failure risk to it that is terrifying.

    • Peter

      Single hinge point is where we’ve been for too long. We road the last qb til we couldn’t. If Geno is just good, not last year, but just solidly good but unexceptional this team might be cooked.

    • geoff u

      Even though there aren’t dominate defenses anymore, teams are still ranked 1-32 relative to each other, and we are consistently on the back end of that ranking. So relative to other defenses, ours is still pretty bad.

      • Denver Hawker

        I don’t disagree- this defense was never going to scare anyone on paper. Call out was that any success this year depends on the offense being Top 10 and that success looks surprising fragile.

  28. WEG

    To be honest my #1 feeling of disappointment yesterday was “damn damn damn why couldn’t that weird play at the end of last season not happen and we get the 4th pick and get Richardson.” I suspect we’ll be feeling that for years.

    Thank you Rob! If I hadn’t been reading this blog, watching Richardson the next few years would have been much less painful.

    • Big Mike

      damn damn damn why couldn’t that weird play at the end of last season not happen and we get the 4th pick and get Richardson

      You mean when the colts purposely threw a game to get a better draft position don’t you?

      • Cambs

        The Colts are such a dislikable and dishonorable franchise, there can’t possibly be an organization less deserving of having such a bright young star.

        And yet, and yet, and yet. They zeroed in on Richardson as the guy they wanted as the face of their franchise, and they set up the whole organization (getting Steichen — not screwing around with “a redshirt year”) to max him out.

        Can’t help but think that the young man’s career is being better served where he’s at than caddying for Geno on this sinking ship.

        Ah well. We’ll always have the pro day selfie tour of other teams’ rookie QBs.

    • Basey

      Well this may be good for us, if this is a sign if things to come we may have a shot for Caleb

  29. Dubb

    Great article. Also, help me understand how you give TE Fant a $6.85M fifth year option to be a rotational TE. Either he is your starter that plays 75% of the TE snaps or you let him become a free agent and spend the money on a DL or other position. I was expecting more Fant and less Dissly/Parkinson.

    • Peter

      If you ever figure out the Fant situation let me know the teams that were gearing up to pay Dissly top dollar and then explain to me why we then made it basically impossible to release one of the more expensive defensive players in the league in 2024 (!!!) Let alone the end of this year when he has been a non factor for going on two plus years.

      • SeaTown

        Yet JS gets a pass year age yet year despite running the financials into the ground.

      • SeaTown

        Yet JS gets a pass year after year despite running the financials into the ground.

        • Big Mike

          He shouldn’t but I’ll ask how much of that is Carroll telling him I want this, that and the other thing? (e.g. Adams, Diggs, Dissly, etc.)
          Likely a shared failure but of course we’ll never know.

          • Peter

            Maybe it’s Pete on the adams restructure. But I’m with SeaTown. Someone with the books is getting a pass year over year for contract/ cap mismanagement.

          • Chris

            This is Pete’s team. He has final say in all things. So he has complete responsibility for drafting, contracts, free agent signings etc. If he’s delegated this to JS, and let JS do what he wants, then he needs to replace JS (since this would mean JS is incompetent). But I don’t think that’s the case, I think Pete gets what he wants, and JS cashes his paychecks.

            • Peter

              But last year I was told that JS is getting more control? Which is it? I highly doubt Pete is writing contracts.

              • Peter

                Btw I’m not saying you, Chris. I’m saying that the draft in ’22 was considered great ipso facto John. This year we ate flat and the draft class is still “who knows,” so that’s Pete?

                I dint know maybe it’s time for both to be doing things elsewhere.

                • SeaTown

                  Tha’s what I’ve never fully understood, Peter. We were told that JS has more control over the draft last year and this year as well. Is that true? Who knows? But if PC still pulls all the shots, why would JS stay? Remember a few years ago there were rumors that the Lions were interested in signing JS? Why would JS not want to go to another team where he can be the man in charge of all the levers? Why stay here and be a PC flunky and jump at his every command? Obviously they work well together and there is some give and take, but to mismanage this cap as badly as they have, my gosh someone needs to be held accountable.

                  • Chris

                    Could be that he likes the money, and is comfortable. Could be he’s waiting out the ownership transition in the hopes he’ll have more authority (assuming he’s retained). Could be that he’s just not as good as his PR makes him out to be.

  30. Troy D

    Soon as they took the lead in the 2nd half I knew. I actually turned it off in frustration. I have missed games over the years but I never have turned it off and not checked. I knew Geno had no answer once he gets hit in the mouth.

    The defense made Puka Nacua look star ready. Im trying to be excited about anything I saw. I cant.

    Carroll should have been sacked half a decade ago. So we will wait.Unfortunately Carroll will scrape 6 or 7 wins.

    Anyways. KKnowing what I saw it would be very Pete Carroll to win against Detroit. Or maybe our Levy’s time is ending (old Bills coach). It is inevitable.

    We will know more next week. Really really bad feeling about this.

  31. SeaTown

    Another condemnation of Carroll. Look at what Mike McDaniel and Tua did to the chargers. In 2022 the Chargers D destroyed Tua and McDaniel to the tune of this stat line:

    McDaniel had a whole offseason to prepare for the rematch. The result:

    That’s what coaching and preparation looks like.

    • SeaTown

      If Carroll were coaching Tua and the dolphins they would have had a repeat of 2022 and everyone would be questioning what the F they did all off season.

    • Big Mike

      Great example of great coaching

      • king.

        I will always think of McDaniel as the one that got away. Seattle had the chance to hire him in 2021, if memory serves correctly, when Shanahan promoted him to OC to protect him being sniped by other teams. Yet if Seattle had seen the writing that had already been on the wall for a minute or two, they could have swooped in and made possibly the brightest young mind in football the HC.

        It might have been a tiny bit premature, but he would have grown into it. It would have changed the trajectory of the franchise completely.

        • Mr drucker in hooterville

          Hello Ben Johnson

  32. Tommiboi

    Such a spot on article. The state of this franchise is a mess and I worry they will keep on with Pete for a few more years. The reason there is no change is because Seattle is a sports city with zero standards. Bad in all sports for so long, that everyone is happy making the playoffs each year and losing in the first round or winning one single SB leaves them satisficed for lie. Would Pete still have a job if he were in NY, NE, Philly? NO way. The local media drools and bows down to Pete at every opportunity, never asking a tough question, only softballs. Overall, PATHETIC.

  33. Zxvo3

    I’m willing for this season to be an entire let down, but only if it causes change in that Carroll retires. That way a new coaching staff can come in with bright ideas for this young and talented team. We could also get another player at the top of the draft, whether that’s a QB or literally any other position.

    • SeaTown

      Sadly there’s no new staff on the horizon. Allen will not cut him loose until the team is sold. As Lou said above, we are in purgatory.

  34. Peter

    Why ownership matters:

    For the newer fans, in 2005 Seattle rolled almost everyone en route to the superbowl with the #1 offense and league MVP at running back. The following three seasons Seattle made the playoffs and then fell to earth with a 4-12 record. Legend Mike Holmgren with a certifiable coaching tree retired/both parties said it was time to go. There was no “next year,” or holding onto the fumes of what once was.

    Jim Mora Jr. Was named coach and after one year was dropped.

    Carrol is a legend but it’s very hard for me to think Paul Allen would have let this go on for so long. I actually don’t think he would have kept Russel but I do think he would have parted ways with Wilson AND Carrol by now.

    • BK26

      Paul Allen was the best owner in sports. Knew what it took to be a success, made it all himself. Didn’t put up with anything. If it wasn’t working then it needed to be fixed. Accountability.

      And a great human being. There are teams currently that I won’t root for just because of their ownerships.

      To say we were lucky is an understatement.

      • Peter

        Gonna be weird when it’s Bezos and people find out he probably barely cares and it’s just an investment for him.

        • BK26

          Or a tax write-off like the Lord of the Rings show….

          • Peter

            Got to make money the old fashioned way….smoke and mirrors.

  35. Big Mike

    A little nugget from yesterday…
    The Seahawks managed that pathetic offensive output against the defense that has 8 of 11 starters in their first or second year all of whom were drafted in the sixth round or later.

    • Peter

      Rough is putting ot mildly.

  36. Happy Hawk

    I was at the game. Rob is spot on the word is predictable! Good coach like McVay can beat predictable anytime. They ran the same down and across the middle everytime. We have zillions of dollars wrapped up in our safety and we can’t cover middle/deep? Hire “Prime” Sanders to coach and draft his kid to play QB.

    • Mr drucker in hooterville

      McVay taught his players how to taunt Metcalf into a penalty. It will continue.

  37. Blitzy the Clown

    Ain’t nobody whooping us at the crib. I don’t know what kind of man would let someone come in his house an whoop him. I don’t know where y’all come from. But where I come from, ain’t nobody coming in your house, ain’t nobody coming in your street, ain’t nobody coming to your block, ain’t nobody coming to your crib, that’s gonna whoop you. Understood? You know why?

    It’s personal

    I want THIS

    • Happy Hawk


    • Rob Staton

      Me too

    • Madmark

      The truth hurts!

  38. RealDangerRuss

    Meanwhile, Jalen Carter kicked ass in his first game. We could have had him. We’ll likely never have the same opportunity again.

    I think it’s fair to question Pete’s defensive scheme AND his philosophy when it comes to drafting players.

    Looks like he and John screwed up again.

    • BK26

      This has been talked about ad nauseum. Wasn’t going to happen. He went to the one team that could eat that risk if it didn’t work out. And the one team that was going to help him succeed the most.

      He wouldn’t have helped move the needle yesterday.

      • Peter

        For the Carter truthers:

        Can he cover the middle of the field? Can he throw more than 130 or so yards in a game?

        Do we win if we take his pressures and add them to Seattle’s total? Do we lose by only one score then?

        Hey. Why didn’t the Lions take him? Their defense was worse than ours last year and all they did was beat the Champs in their house.

        Heck maybe Carter should have been the pick like Humphries, Chubb, tj watt and or Buddha baker and a boat load of others…..we’ll never know.

        • RealDangerRuss

          His tape doesn’t lie, Peter.

          If you want to argue that a player like Carter doesn’t help coverage in the backfield, good luck. Everyone knows a good pass rush helps the corners and safeties.

          • Peter

            Explain it me then. How does Carter on a nonstacked dline that got almost zero pressure change yesterday? Like historically pathetic pressure.

            I checked Philly’s box score. Turns out other players on their team contributed. Do we have fletcher cox and “thanos,” Davis?

            No one has ever said his tape doesn’t lie. But Carter truthers are out to lunch if they think one sack and more pressures than the entirety of our whole team combined does anything to put it into a win column.

            If yesterday we lost by a late field goal or heck one touchdown, let’s discuss. We got worked because every part of the defense that mattered yesterday sucked.

            • Peter

              Additionally with Carter. Maybe he should have been the pick? Maybe he wins DROY. But for Seattle he would be the first piece in a multi year build. Like Rob wrote about a ton of times it takes years to get philly’s or the niners’ Dline.

        • Chris

          Not really fair. The comparison is Carter vs. Witherspoon, not whether Carter can win entire games by himself. Witherspoon certainly can’t do any of the things you listed from his sofa either. This won’t be decided for at least a few years, regardless.

    • Mr drucker in hooterville

      Stop it. Seattle wasn’t taking Carter for legitimate reasons.

    • McZ

      Jalen Carter was always going to the Eagles. One way or another.

      I fear, the real lesson here is that you need absolute elite talent for the young guys to learn from. That’s why I wanted Calais Campbell, when he was available.

  39. Blitzy the Clown

    Aside from the albatross of our DL, the much-hyped Seahawks defensive backfield allowed 2 different Rams WRs to rack up 119 receiving yards each.

    It’s one thing to expect a meager pass rush and anemic run defense. But to also not be able to limit catches, or even worse, yards after catches, is just unacceptable.

    • pdway

      for me, that was the single most demoralizing part of the game – watching the Rams complete easy pass after easy pass, w WR’s just always open. Stafford was never pressured, and the receivers were never blanketed – he made a few A+ throws, but mostly it seemed like easy pitch and catch. And the fact that it wasn’t Tyreek/Waddle lever WR’s doing the catching, just made it all even more depressing.

  40. Blitzy the Clown

    Another thing while watching some of the replay I noticed is that with a few exceptions, the 3 or 4 DTs/DEs who line up on the LOS all seem to be doing their own thing. You see precious little scheme strategy in most of the snaps. It almost looks like 4 guys freelancing out there, as opposed to a single cohesive unit.

    I understand anything can happen after the snap, and that each play can be quite chaotic. But outside of a few obvious examples where a couple of them were running a stunt or something, it looks totally unstructured.

    I saw several plays where Reed intentionally shot up a gap to the opposite side of Jones, while Jones went the other direction in a wide rush (or a spin move) to get to the QB, only to leave an I-5 sized lane in between.

    Just seemed so ad lib.

    • Brodie

      That’s our “Pitchfork Defense” Four DL run straight ahead and the back 7 corral whatever comes through, while ‘keeping it in front of them’.

      Though notoriously susceptible to almost any counter-attack, the pitchfork was popularized by the medieval peasant class as an approach to trying to fight things they did not understand.

      Clint Hurtt likely believes McVay’s offense is some form of Witchcraft and thus used the only tool in his belt. We are likely stuck with the pitchfork, until we get Jamal back and then can try the silver bullet as well.

      • Sea Mode


  41. Ben

    This is 100% down to coaching. Way too much talent on this team for a showing like that.

    • pdway

      I’m in general w you on the sentiment – but I also think that lets the players too easily off the hook. That was not the best receiving corps in the league – and yes sometimes they were open due to scheme, but other times they just beat one-on-one coverage way too easily. And yes, some complexity in the pass rush scheme would be nice, but pass rush often comes down to one guy beating another guy – and I saw nothing from any of our rushers all day.

      • Ben

        Yes. Very few players with a good game. They seemed so lost, though. A “respectable” loss I could understand, but that seemed like the wheels fell off. I’m taking it from a viewpoint of being a soccer coach. If my team fails so tremendously, I feel like I failed my players. Wish Pete would take more responsibility and hold players accountable.

  42. pdway

    The hawks deserve every word of this article. Among other things to note here – the first half, while not great, was at least decent. And then – one coaching staff made some adjustments, and the other is incapable of doing so, either at halftime or in-game.

    I don’t really know what to do w a game like this – waited so long for the NFL season to start, so much hopeful optimism for the year – and then just an embarrassment of a performance. It just sucks.

  43. Gross MaToast

    This is a brave piece that will – and already has – rankled a few true blue believers in Win Forever. Thank you.

    Pete Carroll is, arguably, outside of Jerry Jones, the most powerful man within an organization in the NFL. Between a completely hands-off ownership and the lack of a real GM, he answers to no one. It’s quite clear that his job is to keep the plane aloft until the franchise is sold and it looks as if it’s going to be a close call on the ‘aloft’ part.

    Pete doesn’t hire ‘real’ coordinators because he can’t. No one from outside his orbit will hitch their wagon to a coach who is quite obviously at the end of his run. It is what it is and what it will be until the team is sold. What was the demand for Ken Norton Jr after he was fired? How many NFL teams were waiting to scoop up that bastion of scheming brilliance? The same will be true for both coordinators now when their run is over.

    One of the more disheartening photos I can recall from last draft season was one of Pete, JS, and Shane Norton Jr watching Anthony Richardson’s pro day. Looking at it, I realized that I don’t want any of those guys involved in selecting the next QB. Just trot Geno out there until you’re gone.

    And Shane Norton Jr is to OCs what I am to Brazilian super models.

    Pete and JS have not shown the ability to piece together an effective, complete roster in what must be approaching a decade now. The wild thing is that it’s typically the defense that comes up short. Mr Defense forgets to put together a pass rush or a run defense then allocates some ungodly sum for…you know what, I’m not going to get into that…we’re all aware of it.

    I predicted 5-12 for this team last week. The Rams at home was one of the wins. Pete will make up for this loss with some unexpected win toward the end of the season and proclaim that everything is good now and that this was the way he thought they would look all season – that no one would want to play them now and it’s too bad they just missed the playoffs, but wait ’til next year. He can’t wait to get out there and get after it. We’ve seen it all before. I think that’s the problem; we’ve seen it all before and realize there is no ‘next year’ – there are just unending repetitions of the same year, over and over.

    Also, T’Vondre Sweat, DT, Texas – 6’4″, 360 lbs, #93. Bama doubled him all night on Saturday and couldn’t move the dude. I think he could sneak into Rd. 1 next year.

    • Peter

      Sweat sounds good on paper. But does he have that elusive “just needs to clean some stuff up,” quality Seattle looks for?

      • Gross MaToast

        After a training camp with Pete and Hurtt, he could develop enough of those intangibles to be one of the guys.

    • LouCityHawk

      What is a Win Forever?

      • Big Mike

        A Pete Carroll fantasy similar to the one that he holds thinking Jamal Adams is going to be an effective player again.

      • Chris

        It’s when you win a superbowl and then ensure lifelong employment forever.

    • Big Mike

      Great post Gross. You hit many nails on the head. This is what we are going to get until the team is sold. As you put it, “….unending repetitions of the same year, over and over”.

  44. icb12

    Well. I’m Glad I went out chasing birds with the boy and dog. Late start, rain, and cold, and I almost said screw it, lets stay and watch football instead.

    By all accounts, I had way more fun. This new seahawks viewing experience sounds miserable.

    • Peter

      Sounds nice….I don’t watch much anymore. Big on listening on the radio and watching later if anything was interesting. Its not been a full out Sunday experience for sometime now. The names change but it’s always the same.

      Last year and next weekend I’m doing a thing I would have never thought of for most of this current century. Taking a big trip with the missus where I’ll completely miss the game(s). Already dreaming about getting up early next week and getting a coffee while watching Rob’s reaction podcast.

    • Big Mike

      Beautiful, warm (like 78 degrees), sunny day here and I passed up a great motorcycling day to watch that shit. Be assured, that will NOT happen again under the Carroll regime, ever.

      • Peter

        Thought about that for a few of us. Hate being this way. Kind of miss Sundays being about snacks, and bs-ing about the games.

        Yesterday when Reed blocked the kick I thought “here it is folks, it’s on.” Not for yesterday but the whole season…..feel me twice ( or a bunch if times) shame on me.

        • Peter

          *fool me twice*

  45. cha

    Pete Carroll was just asked why the defense didn’t play well, and communication was such an issue?

    He said – I’m not kidding – that the crowd noise at CenturyLink was a problem. That they’ve practiced the noise at practice but it’s different live.

    • Peter

      This checks out all the way around. The fans are too loud and the defense can’t communicate. Strange how that wasn’t a problem when this was the number one defense and was almost impossible for the traveling team to play in.

      I wasn’t there but on broadcast it sounds nice and quiet to me as the rams sucked the funny out of the room during the second half.

      • Troy

        Communication issues. Need better run fits. Blah, Blah, Blah. New year, same old excuses for a shitty defensive scheme and gameplan.

    • SeaTown

      Yea if anyone is looking to puke, just go and listen to the sham of an interview PC did with Brock and Salk. Brock attempted one tough question about why no one on the Oline took up for Geno after Donald cheap shotted him and Carroll basically refused to answer. Salk threw soft ball after soft ball including the perfunctory “how special was that ovation for Bobby?” question. My god the Seattle media is atrocious.

    • Ben

      Reminds me of Mora passing blame. Carroll needs to take responsibility. He’s the leader. Poor leadership casts blame.

      • Malanch

        THIS. Exactly.

        The game yesterday is being discussed by some as a bellwether event, which is exactly what the Olindo Mare game was. Nothing more needed to be seen after that one to know the head coach was absolutely the wrong guy for the job, and what more needs to be seen now?

    • Andrew M

      Didn’t seem to be a problem for the Rams defense.

      • Peter

        Great point.

      • Malanch

        Visiting defenses don’t typically face crowd noise, so that’s tangential. The point is that crowd noise should never have been mentioned in response to that question. Explanation becomes excuse. The LOB dealt with home game communication difficulty throughout their heyday, and any Seahawks defense should be similarly prepared. Crowd noise in Seattle isn’t some unforeseen 2023 phenomenon that caught the staff unawares.

    • Big Mike

      That is an absolutely pathetic excuse. Why do I think none of his media lapdogs challenged him on it?
      Beides, he knows he can say anything with no fear of media retribution and no fear of losing his job.

      Absolute power corrupts absolutely

      • Kyle R

        For sure “The Emperor has no Clothes” situation.

    • Olyhawksfan

      The sun was in there eyes a lot too. And I think a bird flew down and disrupted their concentration. Also, a lot of cute girls in the stands. I mean come on folks, they’re only human.

    • Dave Stacey

      Pete has a point (*rolls eyes)
      Home record with fans in the stadium 2019 onwards is 12-14
      How is that acceptable?

      Seahawks home records:
      2023 : 0 – 1
      2022: 5 – 4
      2021: 3 – 5
      Empty stadium 2020 : 7 -2 incl playoff loss to Rams
      2019 : 4 – 4

      • Dave Stacey

        This includes embarrassing losses to a string of poor QBs

        Marcus Mariota, Sam Darnold, Jameis Winston, Colt McCoy, Nick Foles, Teddy Bridgewater …

    • Kyle R

      Play another game or two like this and he’ll get his wish of a lot quieter Lumen Field.

    • Chris

      That’s equivalent to stating the crowd noise was a larger hindrance to his defense than it was a hindrance to the Ram’s offense. If true, that can only be seen as a symptom of being hugely outcouched, as we all know crowd noise should normally be a much bigger detriment to an offense.

  46. Silly Billy

    The irony of today was that the run defense wasn’t terrible.
    2.6yd/carry, and a notable amount of TFL’s. Run D created a lot of 3rd and longs…

    ….. which were easily converted in the passing game. This game felt like the 2018 Wright/Wagner/Kendrick 4-3 defense.

    You’d think with 5 DB’s consistently out there, we’d have someone who can cover the middle of the field.

    • MattG

      I can’t bear to rewatch, but it makes me wonder if it was a scheme thing. Were the linebackers playing close to compensate for the expected weakness of the D line and leaving the middle of the field open? People complain about Bobby looking slow, which may be true, but yesterday I mainly recall seeing him at the LoS getting after runners.

  47. Denver Hawker

    As much as I can lament the Richardson snipe by the tanking Colts, missing on Benton by a few picks may be just as painful:

    • Hand of God

      I think he was a likely target at 52 honestly, given some post draft comments by Schneider (about some surprises in the draft, following a question about DTs). I fully agree, he would have been a valuable addition

  48. NL

    Looks like Rob was extremely wrong about Jalen Carter. Lead the Eagles in QB pressure and a game sealing sack. Looked like a man among boys out there. Wish we had picked him.

    • Rob Staton

      I spent the draft season explaining why the Seahawks wouldn’t take Jalen Carter. I was proven 100% right.

      Appreciate the opportunity to point that out again. It’s one of the things I’m most proud of, given how much rubbish other people talked about on the subject.

      • Chris

        “No Rob, you were wrong. The Seahawks actually DID draft Jalen Carter.”
        – this guy apparently

    • Palatypus

      You hear that ticking sound?

      That’s Jalen Carter.

      • Peter

        I can’t tell if I like this Carter stuff the same, less, or more than the Russ stuff last year.

        I do like these commentors acting like honorary members of the scoobie gang out here trying to prove that Rob Staton was in FACT John Schneider all along making draft day decisions.

        It’s pretty suspicious to me that we never see Rob and John in the same room…. just sayin’….

    • Denver Hawker

      Carter’s talent was never brought to question here- what was he or anyone wrong about?

      He’s exactly the disruptive force many thought he’d be at 50% snap count.

      The Seahawks and several other teams passed over character issues that are indisputable and those can bite you in the ass any moment. Not worth the risk given the state of the Hawks roster. Philly was a perfect destination for him given the maturity of their line.

      Carter is that crazy hot ex who despite appearances is still crazy and you’d be miserable with long-term.

    • Ashish

      NL just hold on before you announce the result. It’s just 1 game. Character is the problem, and one can’t hide.

    • Nolyon

      Hey man,

      Read the blog again. Carter was at the top of Rob’s board early on. Talent was never in question.

      He simply said the Seahawks WOULDN’T take him because of the character concerns.

    • 805Hawk

      My God! Stop! Rob is in the business of evaluating and projecting who the Seahawks will take, not saying who they should take. He correctly predicted what the Seahawks would do based off their past experiences and tendencies. Just stop with this nonsense.

    • Scot04

      Rob also said if they did pick him he would write an article on how he was wrong; & the positive possibilities of Carter as an addition.
      However, he was correct & we passed. Hawks went with the higher Character player instead.
      Rob never said Carter wasn’t talented, quite the opposite.
      So if you read everything Rob wrote on Carter, you wouldn’t have even bothered with a post saying he was wrong.

    • Pack of k9s

      Haha ya! He could have been tired by the end of the first half instead of sitting in a stacked rotation where he isn’t relied upon at all against one of the worst offensive lines in the league.

      Do me a favor and STFU

    • Kyle R

      He also has half his college team there to babysit him as well. Not to mention he could bomb out and the Eagles still on miss a beat on defense.

    • Malanch

      “Rob was extremely wrong about Jalen Carter.” –NL

      How so? Rob—and plenty of others—acknowledged Carter’s generational talent from the beginning but held the line with the man’s mentality/character making him a long-term mismatch for the Seahawks. How is Rob (are we) “extremely wrong”?

      So … Carter’s mentality/character suddenly one-eightied in the past few months, and now he actually is a long-term match? You’ve determined this with what information, the stats from one NFL game? A generational talent demonstrating impact ability over the short run—which should surprise zero people—doesn’t indicate anything about a necessary shift of mentality/character having taken place.

      NL, you stand here fully de-pantsed with naught but a wee frightened blue acorn to show us, so you might want to go through the archives here and share an excerpt to strengthen your case. Or just do better next time.

    • Chris

      You got that after the 1st game of their careers? Guess Aaron Rodgers was a bust.

      Rob, you really should post polls sometimes to have folks vote between the stupidest comments.

      • Rob Staton

        It doesn’t even matter that it’s one game

        It’s a completely false portrayal of what I predicted and talked about during draft season, which was all about this team not taking Carter, which is exactly what happened

        • Chris

          Very true, criticizing you for correctly predicting the Seahawks would pass on Carter is completely asinine. It was bold, clear, completely against what was being spread around in the media, and turned out to be completely correct. But to be totally fair you had Carter rated lower than Witherspoon, so I was just pointing out the idea to this guy that it’s way too early to make pick comparisons after one game. I’d also point out to the guy that EVERY person scouting a draft will make predictions that turn out to be hugely incorrect (and his own certainty is itself a clear knock on his intelligence), but were still completely reasonable to make given the available evidence, but any form of nuance seems like it would be lost on him so I didn’t bother.

          • Rob Staton

            I did not have Carter as a talent rated lower than Witherspoon

            Nobody did

            • Chris

              Was referring to big board placement, not talent alone, obviously.

              • Rob Staton

                I don’t do a ‘big board’ and I never had Wetherspoon higher than Carter on anything. Not really sure what you’re talking about here

  49. cha

    MSD just typed this:

    the question for the #Seahawks is whether their defense has a new Achilles’ heel.

    Basically, when it comes to Seattle’s defense recently, there’s always something drastically wrong. Players are shuffled in and out. The scheme shifts. Coaches are hired and fired. Still, there’s almost always something.


    These are not new issues for the Seahawks. After a Week 3 loss in 2021, Flowers lamented Seattle’s inability to guard digs and in-breaking routes. Benching Flowers didn’t solve the issue, as Sean McVay and the Rams illustrated that same season, repeatedly beating Seattle’s defense with the same concept. Last year’s playoff loss to the 49ers featured some of those same issues, receivers running free in the middle of the field.

    He is almost….there…something…not…quite…connecting…

    • Denver Hawker

      This is water..

      • cha

        An inch deep and he’s drowning.

    • Silly Billy

      the best defense to dig/breaking routes is a pass rush.

      • Peter

        If true and probably is then why are we paying for six DB looks?

        • Big Mike

          I would guess since Carroll was a DB and a DB coach he has a focus on that area.

          • Big Mike

            focus on = obsession with?

  50. Mr Lerf

    Rob, How about using some down time this off season to scout coaches?

    • Malanch

      Rob seems quite sanguine about Coach Prime’s magic factor so far, just to indicate the kind of wistful wandering the Seahawk’s present situation can provoke.

      … But you know: After Sanders takes out Oregon at Autzen in a couple weeks, it’ll be clear that his squad’s presumed lack of depth has been greatly exaggerated—meaning he should give USC a run for its money and be a legit threat to win the Pac-12 in year one. In year two, I expect the entire Big XII will be on notice from the jump; if Colorado manages to make a run at that conference title, too, the NFL might just come calling—right as Pete’s contract is running out. Bigtime college recruiting would seem to be the arena where Sanders’ charisma can leverage its greatest advantage, but maybe that’s all wrong, too.

  51. Madmark

    I’m not sure what Defensive scheme we really want play. They don’t have the defensive lineman to play it. Whatever it is! The nickel backs looked like they had a hard time tackling the RB and TE or keeping up with faster WR running across the middle. I definitely don’t think a 20 million dollar Jamal Adam is going to lead this defense to the promise land. I think Rob got it right. Pete Carrol is perfect for pumping up the hype. That’s all fun and positive right up until the point that his team shows to be badly coached, badly organized, I’ll discipline, and frankly an embarrassment. This assessment is dead on from what I saw yesterday. After this year I think it will be time move on in a new era of modern NFL football.

    • Chris

      They’ve got the personnel for a 6-1 defense.

  52. Henry Taylor

    The more I think about this game the worse it gets. The defense was god awful in new, and yet completely familiar, ways. Anemic pass rush, atrocious coverage and some of the weakest third down defense you’ll see.

    But perhaps more concerning is this much vaunted offense. The WRs were just about a non-factor and we abandoned the run game that was working too early. God help us if our tackles miss any time.

    With the way our schedule is looking if we lose to the Lions we could be in for a 2023 season as shockingly bad as 2022 was surprisingly good. Looking forward to some QB draft content.

  53. 805Hawk

    I sincerely think that last year was a disaster. It just delayed the entire process of freshening up this team. Throughout the 2022 season, I couldn’t help but think after each win that the repercussions of a playoff berth would be a false sense of accomplishment by ownership, PC, and the fans at large and the feeling that we were on the verge of a championship team would be prevalent. It is essentially delayed the inevitable. This organization is stale, stuck in mediocrity, and there is no end in sight unless we get a truly abysmal record. Even then, I’m not sure it will matter.

  54. Rob Staton

    Hate to say this but I thought Bobby Wagner looked exactly like he did last time he played in Seattle. Hesitant. Doing the opposite of flying to the ball carrier.

    I already know I’m going to hate this signing

    • Peter

      But he’s on pace to demolish the single season combined tackles record.

      Last time Bobby was here the line was bad. Lines not good so no one should have thought bringing baby back was going to be a game changer.

      • Rob Staton

        Even so

        Last year he played with his hair on fire

        Yesterday was exactly like 2021. He is so f-ing hesitant. He’s watching everything and slow to react. He is not running at the ball carrier to make a play. I couldn’t believe it on tape how much this was like 2021

        • Big Mike

          Yes but how awesome was that reception he got from the crowd Rob? Priorities man, priorities.

          • Rob Staton


            You’re joking but so many other people are saying that and meaning it

            Maybe we can start Matt Hasselbeck next week and give him a nice ovation too

          • cha

            Honestly, has there EVER been a ceremony for a returning player that boisterous and involved?

            The PR people who put that together are geniuses. Perfectly tapped into the pulse of Seahawks fans.

            Why win games now? Why not celebrate a team that was great 10 years ago?

            • Big Mike

              Why win games now? Why not celebrate a team that was great 10 years ago?

              Any guesses why Seattle fans are like this? I mean I see Mariners’ fans still celebrating the 116 win season like it was some accomplishment rather than the total let down it was since they didn’t even get to the World Series let alone win it.

              • cha

                They’ve been hamstrung by years and years of poor professional sports franchises. A glimmer of success and they cling to it like mother’s apron strings.

                All summer there were Seahawks fans expressing outrage at the latest nonsense power rankings, position group rankings and Quarterback rankings, claiming East Coast bias. As if a ranking list in June means anything at all.

        • Peter

          Jokes aside this is a manifestation of systemic issues. Bobby was not good. Team unceremoniously cuts him, he’s ripping pissed goes to hated division rival and lights it up. For “reasons,” ( which are basically why we have crap coordinators and other problems we bring him back.

          I’ll say it. The only time Bobby should have come back is to join the ring of honor or as a coach. This never ending desire for locker room leadership and to get the band back together is embarrassing.

          Why does he need to play on fire? No one else is? There’s no Dawgs on this team? There’s zero swag. I worry that a few games like this and Reed might start slowing it down. All off season they and we have been drinking the kool-aid.

          -best corner back room in the league!!!…..pass
          -loaded at OLB….where?
          -best trio of WR’s….really….are we sure it’s not the Rams when Kupp gets right.
          -Bobby’s back baybee!!…yep. he sure is.

          There’s a huge dishonesty being done. Do I think they’ll get right in a few games? Sure why not. They always do. Will getting to the low teens on defense mean anything from there on out. Probably not.

          • Big Mike

            Do I think they’ll get right in a few games? Sure why not. They always do.

            I’m not so sure this time my friend. Schedule is not real conducive to that. I see 5 or 6 wins.

      • Malanch

        Ever notice how tackle stats only include the quantity of tackles, not the quality? They don’t indicate the amount of yards, first downs, and possession time allowed. Posting some lofty tackle quantity doesn’t impress the knowledgeable football observer, because a defense is (quite obviously) guaranteed to produce some high-volume tacklers when it stays on the field for 78 friggin’ plays. As far as measuring a player’s actual game impact is concerned, some other metric is needed. Tackle quantity alone is useless (especially for LBs and DBs).

        • Peter

          Pretty dubious of PFF but this seems like their wheelhouse. Tfl plus stop with no gain minus extra yards. Tackle that still results in new set of downs.

          • Malanch

            Yeah, I don’t doubt there are some advanced analytics out there for tackling, but basic box score stats only show tackle quantity—useless for diagnostics (or argumentation). I don’t know why yardage allowed isn’t included at the least. Imagine if running back or wide receiver stats excluded yardage.

    • Hawkster

      Didn’t see the game (had a long drive) watched the highlights, focused entirely on Wagner and thought it was dreadful. Lining up 5 deep, dropping back another 7 at the snap, eyes fixed on the QB, seems oblivious to what is going on around him. It looks like a 15 yds deep QB-spy like he was on contain Kaepernick duty or something.
      May as well be Barton, it looked the same. On a goal line play I thought he was kept clean, but it just didn’t happen, sure it was off-tackle, but he just wasn’t anywhere close to making a play.
      Nobody appears to know what they are doing. Just a hot mess.
      Yea, I got all that from a dozen plays on a highlight reel, thinking I need to see the whole game, but not from the comments.

      That midseason 49ers-Cowboys-49ers-Eagles stretch is going to be some tough sledding.

      • Big Mike

        Success in that stretch would be 1-3. That’s how far this franchise has fallen.

    • pdway

      watch the replay of him trying to move laterally to catch Stafford on that one scramble. it’s painful. he’s just way too slow for the role now.

    • Sea Mode

      Well at least he will be key to improved communication on defense… oh wait, the crowd makes noise. Never mind, silly me.

  55. Hebegbs

    The most damning thing out of all the mess that was yesterday’s game was Geno and DK admitting the Rams wanted it more, played harder.

    First game, in your house, division rival. WTF? Unbelievable. Same old story.

    • Rob Staton



    • Malanch

      I wouldn’t mind seeing the 12s send a message to this complacent team at the next home game. Just forget the opponent entirely and go right after the Seahawks. Remind them who pays the bills, and that such devoted support is not to be taken for granted. Make it a house of horrors for every Hawk who shows up unprepared to execute at an appropriately professional level. That team should be terrified of underperforming in front of the most ruthless fans on planet earth …

      … Oh—whoa! I drifted off there for a bit. My bad. I’m back now. Gross, I drooled on myself while I was out.

    • Sea Mode

      Almost as if complacency trickles down from the top. What a concept…

  56. Rob Staton

    Everyone associated with this franchise is skirting around the issues

    • Big Mike

      And have been for the last several years and will continue to do so until a new owner makes a clean sweep of the franchise from GM to HC and staff to a lot of the players.

    • Ben

      Spot on. They either can’t or are unwilling to see obvious problems. For the past several years, the team has been disjointed. There’s no real direction. I’m always surprised at how they manage to max the cap and still have glaring issues.
      Desperately need fresh voices in the front office.

  57. cha

    Pete told us what the problem is this morning.

    He’s so pumped up and jacked up, he’s not facing the honest truth about things.

    He literally said that. And it’s what we’ve been talking about for years.

    Nary a negative word will be tolerated inside or outside this building.

    Well Pete just said “My expectations are pretty high. I’m trying to elevate to point it enhances our play. But also have to manage them. We have to be realistic, get to the point and reset.”

    That’s all anybody has asked for – just be realistic.

    The defense has been horrible starting out every single year. You change system and fail to provide a single key linchpin player that will make your system work. “Well I’m pumped and jacked. Also, NT’s don’t grow on trees and we’re still competing.”

    • cha

      Post got clipped from some reason.

      But to finish it.

      That’s not realistic. That’s some kind of fairy-godmother wishing a defense into existence level thinking.

      And it permeates nearly everything they do.

      • Big Mike

        We’re close
        Just need a few tweaks
        In a few weeks, no one will want to play us

    • Rob Staton

      This is such a good point to raise

  58. Romeo A57

    I expected this team to win maybe 5 games last year and was pleasantly surprised that the ended up in the playoffs. I anticipated this year’s team to sneak into the wildcard. This looked like a 5-12 team yesterday. Getting zero pressure on Stafford was demoralizing. We knew the DL was suspect but the pass rush was dreadful. Every time I heard people picking the Seahawks to win the NFC West, I laughed at them. Did anyone actually see the 49ers beat up the Seahawks 3 times last year.

    I hate to say it but the best this for this team is to go 5-12 or worse. PC probably wouldn’t come back and they can start over with a new direction. I will take the slings and arrows for this, but this team needs to lose badly this season in order to get some needed changes

    • 805Hawk

      I’m not afraid to say it. I wish it would have happened last year. The organization and the fans could have woken up a year earlier. Think about what would have happened if we lost to Denver in the opener last year and went on to a 5 or 6 win season. The entire dynamic changes and maybe we are closer to a complete reset organization wide. Now we all wait for change while we crawl closer to our deathbed. I’m 51. I figure I have maybe 30 Seahawks seasons left. Let’s get on with it!

  59. L80

    Smith had Bobo wide open down the middle on the flea flicker for an easy TD but he runs to the sideline and throws an incompletion.

  60. cha

    Jason Peters is coming to Seattle for a visit.

    • Hawks4life

      Nice a 41 year old tackle, hope this doesn’t mean Cross or Lucas injury is more serious. What a start to the 2024 season lmfao

      • pdway

        sh-t, I thought you were joking and being exaggerative…..he actually is 41 years old!

    • Rob Staton

      Waste of money

      Just start Forsythe

      • cha

        Remember when they brought Snacks Harrison in?

        And when he practice-squadded for 6 weeks?

        And how every week the press conferences were asking about him instead of all the other issues the team had?

        And when the Seahawks actually decided to try out Stephen Sullivan at DE instead of activating him?

        And when Snacks came in he didn’t do much of anything? And how they unceremoniously parted ways after leaving him off a game-day roster?

        That’s about how I feel about spending any time talking to Jason Peters.

    • Dubb


    • Ben

      No more bandaids. Scraping and clawing for mediocrity.

  61. JimQ

    After watching the game & sleeping on it, I have 2 questions.
    1. If PC is indeed untouchable, what about firing Hurt and hiring —-> anybody else? The defense couldn’t be worse than what we had to suffer through in this game. Incompetent coaching is very obvious. “Fresh eyes” are needed. Half of the posters on this site could have outcoached Hurt.
    2. What if there is a management plan to “tank” the season, leaving the Seahawks with the #1 pick? Might that make a sale of the team more attractive? Combined with an opportunity to hire your own coaches and fill out a roster that is only partially complete? At the very least that perhaps may be their plan B or C.

    • Malanch

      “what about firing Hurt and hiring —-> anybody else?”

      And this would change what, exactly? Other than a name plate on a door?

      • JimQ

        This game was so BAD defensively that almost anybody else could have done better than coach Hurt. We have had the opportunity to see Hurt’s coaching, or lack thereof, ever since he was appointed as DC. He’s failed to provide his players with the coaching & techniques needed to be effective. Half or more of the players can’t even wrap up a tackle or take on blockers. The defensive players (especially DB’s) are, and have been, “lost boys” that don’t know where they should be and regularly fail to execute their assignments. The middle of the field is always WIDE OPEN and will be attacked all year long. Unfortunately, the offense in this game seemed to have had similar difficulties. This loss was almost exclusively due to VERY crappy coaching on both sides of the ball. IT”S GOING TO BE A -LONG- SEASON (3-14?) unless SOMETHING (anything?) changes DRASTICLY & FAST. -IMO.

  62. Mr Magic

    If Lucas cant go why not move Brown over, start Oluwatimi at C and Forsyth at T. Hopefully Cross can go.

    • Malanch

      Because Forsyth, Brown, Oluwatimi, Haynes, Curhan.


  63. Edgar

    You draft Carter. I said it a million times

    • Rob Staton

      This is already really boring

      If people can’t acknowledge why they didn’t take Carter, then you’re being ignorant

    • Chris

      Write Shneider and Carrol then, not Rob for correctly forecasting their actions.

  64. Edgar

    This team got cute… take the best player……he was our biggest hole!

    • Rob Staton

      That is not what happened in the slightest

  65. 805Hawk

    Rob, can you start blocking anyone that brings up Carter? It’s just annoying and misguided at this point.

    • Peter

      Exactly. It’s a weird flex, victory lap. Without acknowledging Rob’s terrific reporting. Or how very, very different Philly’s make up is to ours.

      • Denver Hawker

        I haven’t seen any corner of Seahawks internet fandom where this pro-Carter line is a majority. I see it regularly dismissed on FG and entertained at best as a thought experiment that glosses over any negative Carter attributes elsewhere.

        • Andrew M

          KJR and 710 both went out of their way to bring it up today. 710 is one thing, Mike Salk likes to “ask questions,” like What If… But the afternoon show on KJR went a little ballistic today trying to guild this lilly that will forever be the Witherspoon/Carter draft choice. Dumb argument from the get go, let it go, and let this fan base move on.

          • Chris

            Whether we should’ve drafted Witherspoon or Carter isn’t a dumb argument. The dumb argument is to suggest picking Carter was ever an actual possibility.

      • Big Mike

        Or the 7 other teams that passed on the guy along with Seattle.

        • Peter

          Correct. Don’t think the Texans, Detroit, others could have used that guy…..

  66. Ed Muri

    I think you’re being EXTREMELY optimistic to think they’ll win 7 games. They are awful. The defense can’t get any pressure or stop the run. Backups on a playoff team would play better than our starting D-Line. I think they win 4-5 games tops. Just enough to not be able to draft a QB of the future. Geno is a nice story but unless we have our SB defense we’ll never compete for championships with him IMO. After that game I’m already hoping they lose every game so we have #1 pick. Overreaction? Perhaps….but they were that bad!

    • Rob Staton

      Well it wasn’t a prediction to be fair

  67. Ben

    Rob, just a shout-out for your hard work and dedication. I’ve been following since 2010 if I remember correctly.
    For each negative voice on here, there are hundreds more that really enjoy what you’re doing.
    Thank you

    • Rob Staton

      Appreciate that Ben 👍🏻

  68. Big Mike

    And you were told over and over ad nauseum why the Seahawks and 7 other teams didn’t take him. And as has been stated here numerous times, he doesn’t make that abysmal play by the offense better yesterday and he doesn’t cover the middle of the field behind LBs. Here’s a suggestion: STFU

  69. Palatypus

    Don’t Panic!

    The Vogons come in peace.

  70. Big Mike

    Detroit favored by 5 1/2 over the Hawks. Seems like a thin spread for a team at home, with 3 extra days rest that just beat the defending champs on the road against a team that utterly shit the bed vs. a rebuilding team that put a 20 point beatdown on said bed shitting team.
    What does Vegas see here that I don’t?

    • Denver Hawker

      They don’t yet- just take the money Big Mike. You can even out the fan ethics later in the season when Vegas over corrects

      • Big Mike

        Is extremely tempting

        • Peter

          I like the lions but until they do anything I think vegas might be slow on the uptick.

          5.5 seems nice. I’d do it now I think. Jason Peters as LT ? Curhan? That defense? Even if they stiffen up and Geno plays better I think 7 points does it.

    • Romeo A57

      I lost money betting on the Seahawks yesterday. I will try to get it back by betting on the Lions next Sunday.

    • Malanch

      Five and a half is around the appropriate spread. First, you gotta leave room for a garbage time cover. Second, the Lions are catching a humbled Hawk team freshly denuded of delusion, looking to save its season. Third … they are the Lions. Bobby Layne was awhile ago now.

  71. Big Mike

    Rodgers hurt while being sacked in his first series as QB of the Jets. Being carted to the locker room from the blue tent.

    • geoff u

      First play is a long run, then pass pass pass pass pass…Rodgers hurt. This game couldn’t be more Jets if they tried.

  72. BobbyK

    You either have a good QB or you don’t. We don’t.

    That being said it would have taken a lot more than Patrick Mahomes yesterday.

    This is not a good team. There’s some good players, but even the Lions had a couple good/great players the year they went 0-16 (Megatron/Suh).

    They’ll win a few games. Everybody does. I just hope they can pick high enough to get a QB to restart the franchise properly. Bringing Bobby Wagner back (and I love him) doesn’t reset anything.

    Jason Peters is a bandaid. Let Forsyth play and see what you’ve got. It’s not like the bandaid is going to turn the needle for this to be a Super Bowl contender.

  73. STTBM

    Bobbyk, Forsythe has no business being in the NFL. Maybe not even the CFL. It’s obvious Seattle is finally realizing this by giving a 41 year old a tryout. They got nothing.

    It’s a moot point with this coaching staff. They are utterly lost. Desai was the only bright spot, and he’s gone….no surprise it’s an instant disaster now…

  74. Justaguy

    Excuse me if this has already been addressed. Imagine if this year’s team was only one piece away from the Super Bowl and Chris Jones was actually available for a first round pick and change.
    Make me wait decades since the last sniff. Always Cooperate! Fire Pete we said…

  75. Palatypus

    Nathaniel Hackett: “Great, I’ve got another quarterback named Wilson.”

  76. Big Mike

    Josh Allen continues to try to do too much and continues to hurt his team because of it. 3 picks tonight when the situation calls for game mgmt since Rodgers is out for the Jets.

    • Big Mike

      And now he fumbles at his own 25 with 5 mins to go.

    • cha

      He needs Brad Goodman.

      He suffers from Indecivsieness, Decisiveness, and Uncontrollable Falling Down.

      • ShowMeYourHawk


    • Palatypus


  77. Big Mike

    Watching the Jets D tonight after the Seahawks D yesterday is like going from watching the JV team to the varsity.

    • Hawks4life


    • Scot04

      Yep, I watched and both Woods & Jefferson looked good.
      Definitely would like to see us go back to the old 4-3.
      The 3-4 Hybrid just doesn’t work.

      • Peter

        But we’d need four or at least three down linemen and Chenna as the edge. They’ve jackknifed this by not going with either system.

  78. Hawk Mock

    Hawks – zero pressure
    Seahawks castoffs – 3 sacks against Josh Allen

    I’m sensing maybe it isn’t the players here? I mean they’re all in the NFL and they’re all capable of doing something if put in the right situations. It would be nice to have an innovative coordinator with no leash or micromanaging by grandpa Pete.

    • 12th chuck

      beat me to it. Lot of ex seahawks playing pretty good tonight. Must be coaching.

      • Peter

        I’ve said it before. Pete’s system isn’t figured out. Pete might be though. Robert Saleh with our cast-offs getting it done.

  79. ShowMeYourHawk

    So…. Josh Allen? Yeesh.

    • 12th chuck

      Allen starting to give some Dave Krieg vibes

      • Peter

        I remain convinced that a trade back when with Russ to Cleveland and us drafting Allen if we had continued to draft in ’18 and ’19 as poor as we did then would have been horrible.

        Kreig? Maybe.

        Dudes turning into big Ben who was not career wise that good. He had the rings and got one very early. But Allen’s almost 2:1 td to int ratio on our team when we had much cleaner qb play (2018-2020, again in 2022) and couldn’t get it done would be brutal to watch.

        • Peter

          And before any starts I know big Ben played 100 years and put up a ton of yards and completions. Good for him. If he had been our qb we’d be melting down at most of his play.

          • James

            Yeah man he was 9 for 21, 131 Yards, 0-TD, 2-INT in their Superbowl victory against us…

            Imagine that being your QB in the Superbowl.

            • Peter

              Any fan will take the ring anyway they get it. I will say if that had been our qb that day the final score wouldn’t have been as “close,” as it was.

  80. Denver Hawker

    The NFL is wild man

  81. cha

    That’s exactly why the NFL is so entertaining.

    Jets are primed for a top season, they immediately lose their all-world QB, the defense rallies and they win it on a play by a guy who was struggling to make the roster returning a punt for a TD.


    • Blitzy the Clown

      I am envious of the Jets roster. And their coaching staff.

      Lots of dudes who are what we used to refer to as ‘Seahawky’

      • Peter

        There’s maybe no roster more ‘seahawky’ than theirs.

      • Scot04

        I was thinking how much I was hoping the Seahawks might trade for Quinnen Williams.
        Then we traded for Adams a couple weeks later, sigh…..

  82. Ground_Hawk

    I was feeling good about Seattle going into the 2nd half but was ultimately left feeling uninspired, as what we saw yesterday was just a continuation from the 2nd half of last years season.

    Teams can just dunk on Seattle’s pass game like…well, let’s not go there, because it’s just sad and there’s nothing cute about what we saw. Just yuck

  83. Palatypus

    It’s a copycat league, and Buffalo had a fumble on a play where the receiver was in motion behind the center during the snap – just like the Seahawks.

    Maybe, not do that anymore?

  84. Sea Mode

    If Seahawks players think the Rams scrubs played hard, wait until they get a taste of Dan Campbell’s Lions next week, with a lot more ascending roster talent to boot.

    Remember how even Goff can look all-pro if we don’t pressure him.

    I smell an absolute smackdown coming, and it ain’t gonna be pretty…

    • swedenhawk

      Under Carroll, the Seahawks have consistently (maddeningly) played down to their opponent’s level. I anticipate a better showing against Detroit, but I’m also expecting a loss.

  85. James

    Wild… Aaron Rodgers goes down and the Jets can still win a football game. Imagine that.

  86. KnoxHawk

    So sick of vanilla zone defense, just man up and see what happens

  87. AL

    Lest we forget, the Seahawks are Pete Carrolls team, period. In addition to being head coach he is also vice president of football operations.

    He has the final say on all personnel decisions, coaches, draft picks, free-agent signings and trades. Ownership has been content with the status quo and is on cruise control until the team is sold and provides very little oversight, allowing Pete to run the team as he see’s fit. He only answers to himself.

    Could you imagine going to work everyday with this kind of control over a NFL football team and getting paid eleven million a year to do it?

    Ya, Pete’s not going anywhere soon. So my advice to all of you is, if you want to watch good NFL football, watch a different team.

    Thats what I did, I got NFL Sunday Ticket baby!! And the 49er’s, a really solid well coached team, what a pleasure to watch 🙂

    • Rob Staton

      I refuse to accept that he is untouchable. There’s truth in the suggestion that he’s extremely powerful. But there are ways and means — and let’s not forget he is about to turn 72. He might have had enough soon himself.

  88. TRu WAZZU Coug

    I actually drove from Utah up to the WAZZU game on Saturday and the Seahawks game on Sunday. WAZZU shocked everyone by beating Wisconsin. One of the biggest takeaways I had from that game was how much the team wanted to win. Then I went to the Seahawks game and saw the opposite. I grew up in WA, and hadn’t been to a Seahawks game since they played in the Kingdome. Walking away from the Hawks game the thought in my mind was that the players and coaches should be apologizing to the fans. The opposite of WAZZU, the team didn’t seem to care enough.

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