This feels like a make or break off-season for Pete Carroll & John Schneider
One of the confounding things about the Seahawks is their complete clarity on what they want to be and the confusing way they go about constructing their team.
Last off-season was a classic example, when the primary desire to ‘fix the pass rush’ was inadequately addressed.
It goes further than that though. The Seahawks have needed a franchise runner since Marshawn Lynch moved on. They desperately want to run the ball well.
Due to the regression in value at the position, they’ve been well placed to tap into a rich pool of talent over the years. Many of the leagues top current running backs were right there for them in the draft, ready to provide great value.
Derrick Henry, Nick Chubb, Dalvin Cook, Jonathan Taylor, Alvin Kamara…
Yet the one they’ve taken early, the one they drafted in the first round, is Rashaad Penny. Of all the names they’ve passed on, he was the person they pulled the trigger on. A one-year starter at San Diego State who hasn’t once looked like a feature runner, even when healthy.
They’re also so inconsistent. They overpay some players and lowball others.
They’ll conservatively address some key positions (often the D-line and O-line) then spend two first round picks, a third rounder and a veteran player on a safety.
In 2020 they spent $25m of their cap on two linebackers, then drafted a third with their first round pick.
So will the Seahawks finally this year just do what they need to do? Set a priority and go for it? Do what appears to be the obvious thing?
Here’s my outline of a plan…
1. Prioritise the offensive line
It’s fair to say they want to run an offense similar to the Cleveland Browns. Physical up front, prolific running, point guard quarterback and explosive plays.
One of the big reasons why the Browns can do this is because they’ve invested in their O-line.
They brought in Jack Conklin at right tackle (there’s a thought). They paid decent money to Joel Bitonio and J.C. Tretter. They spent a high pick on Jedrick Wills.
They are big, tough, physical and brilliant. They are the first team in PFF’s history to grade #1 in pass and run blocking.
Seattle’s approach to the offensive line has been wildly inconsistent. Pete Carroll’s first draft pick in Seattle was Russell Okung, taken #6 overall. Their first round pick in 2011 was also an offensive lineman (James Carpenter).
When they won the Super Bowl in 2013 they had the most expensive line in the NFL.
Then they went in the opposite direction as they tried to save money in order to pay a cluster of star players at other positions. Okung was eventually replaced by the likes of Bradley Sowell and George Fant. Players like Drew Nowak and Lemuel Jeanpierre took turns to replace Max Unger.
They had to make a saving somewhere and the approach was understandable even if it didn’t work.
But when they started to re-invest in the line, they squandered money on Luke Joeckel and J’Marcus Webb. They failed to develop Germain Ifedi, who cost a first round pick.
The arrival of Mike Solari steadied the ship — as did the Duane Brown trade (one of John Schneider’s best deals). The line play has improved without ever being dominant.
It’s time to try and achieve ‘dominant’.
That means adding real quality, experience, size and toughness.
Brown has one more year left on his contract (and they’ll be praying he continues into 2022, given they don’t have a first round pick for two years). Damien Lewis had a positive first year and Brandon Shell tied down the right hand side of the line before his ankle injury.
The stop-gap signings at guard of Mike Iupati, D.J. Fluker and J.R. Sweezy were fine for the time and Jordan Simmons is OK as a backup.
However, Brandon Scherff and Joe Thuney are reaching free agency. Both will command a lot of interest. They are quality players — the type that would fit in perfectly next to Brown and make Seattle’s O-line a real plus point on the roster.
Scherff was PFF’s #4 ranked guard this year (86.3) behind only Zack Martin, Quenton Nelson and Wyatt Teller.
He’s listed as PFF’s #9 best free agent for 2021 with a projected salary of $15m a year:
One of the most dependable guards in the league, Scherff has never posted a PFF grade below 72.5 in his six-year NFL career. Over the last three seasons, Scherff ranks among the league’s best guards in nearly every key metric, including a 97th percentile ranking on true pass sets and 90th percentile ranking in percentage of positively graded plays. Both numbers are among the most important when projecting interior offensive linemen from year to year. In the run game, Scherff can do it all, showing the power at the point of attack and the quickness to make any block in space. He’s also one of the most polished pass protectors in the league
Joe Thuney was ranked 10th (74.2) by PFF and is their #14 overall free agent, estimated to earn $14.25m a year:
Thuney has yet to miss a game in his five-year career while showing continual improvement. He transitioned smoothly from college offensive tackle to left guard, showing well in New England’s versatile run scheme. In pass protection, Thuney struggled with power players early in his career, but he’s improved every season and his 88.0 pass-blocking grade ranked third among guards in 2019. Thuney ranks in the 83rd percentile in overall pass-blocking grade since entering the league, though that drops to the 70th percentile when isolated to true pass sets, showing that there has been some protection for him in the New England scheme. Regardless, Thuney has developed into one of the best guards in the game and should fit in well in any system.
Other cheaper options include Trai Turner and Gabe Jackson (expected to be cut by the Chargers and Raiders respectively).
But the Seahawks need quality — and quality costs money.
At center, they stumbled into Ethan Pocic starting after free agent addition B.J. Finney underwhelmed. Pocic received a 59.8 PFF grade for the reason — ranked 26th among centers. He played at a below average level and there’s an opportunity to upgrade at the position.
Alex Mack is 35-years-old now but for years he’s been a quality starting center. Imagine a Brown-Scherff-Mack-Lewis-Shell combo. That’d go some way to creating the kind of platform needed to run Seattle’s desired offense. New England’s David Andrews and Green Bay’s Corey Linsley are alternative options.
It won’t be cheap but look — if you want to run this offense, that’s where you need to invest. If it means having to find cheaper solutions at cornerback and not being able to re-sign K.J. Wright — so be it. If they need to create funds, get it done.
The Seahawks need to prioritise where they’re spending their money.
They also need to keep adding talent and competition via the draft.
Notre Dame’s Aaron Banks would be a great option at left guard and could be available in round two. Alex Leatherwood — who recently accepted an invite to the Senior Bowl — is very capable of being a superb left guard and could switch back to left tackle down the line. Some think he’s a first round lock, others see him in round three. It’ll be interesting to see where he lands.
Ohio State duo Josh Myers and Wyatt Davis will, unfortunately, likely be long gone by Seattle’s picks. Oklahoma center Creed Humphrey could be in range — he plays with great physicality, violent hands and he finishes blocks. He’s adept at reaching up to the second level and passing off blocks too.
Why not invest in an experienced center like Mack and then monitor the stock of Alabama center Landon Dickerson? If he drops due to injury issues, he could be worth a shot as a long-term heir apparent.
Either way — the key to progress will largely depend on their ability to play far better on both sides of the line. If they want to do what the Rams did in the Wildcard round, they need to pump their resources here, not elsewhere.
2. Draft a lead runner
Chris Carson has the talent to be a top five running back. Unfortunately, he just can’t stay healthy.
The Seahawks can’t afford to pay him starter money to manage his snaps. The only way he can return is as part of a two-headed monster — where he’s at best an equal partner. Kareem Hunt is much more durable and he’s on $6m a year in Cleveland in a similar role. Carson, if he returns, shouldn’t expect that.
If he does come back, you still need someone to carry the bulk of the load.
There are options in the draft where you could address the needs on the O-line and at running back. Yet with only one pick in the first three rounds, you’re going to need to combine free agency and the draft to get everything done.
To me, that means proven quality and experience up front and freshness and talent at running back. More Duane Brown and Carson instead of Germain Ifedi and Eddie Lacy.
There aren’t a ton of running backs who look like they ‘fit’ what Seattle needs and they’re not going to be in range for the two big name runners (Najee Harris, Travis Etienne).
That doesn’t matter because North Carolina’s Javonte Williams is exactly what they need, in a range where he could be available.
PFF gave him a 95.9 rushing grade — the highest of the 2020 season and the best they’ve ever recorded at the running back position.
He ranked #1 in the NCAA for broken tackle rate (46.5%).
Williams is an easy assessment from a Seahawks perspective. He has the exact style they crave and the talent and toughness to lead this offense.
You don’t need to be an expert to see him rip through tackles, finish runs, run over defenders and provide options in the passing game to know this is a highly talented player who Carroll will love.
Williams and Carson (at the right price) running behind a line with a couple of big name additions would give the Seahawks a chance to achieve the offense they crave.
If Carson moves on, they should try and bring back Mike Davis. He was superb filling in during his last spell in Seattle. He did an excellent job carrying the load for the Panthers in Christian McCaffrey’s absence. Davis is a great option to be RB2.
Last year there were a whole bunch of quality running backs available from pick #32 to #66. We spent considerable time discussing all of the names — knowing full well Carson’s contract was expiring (not to mention he was coming off a serious hip injury).
The Seahawks passed on the lot — saying no to Clyde Edwards-Helaire, Jonathan Taylor, D’Andre Swift, J.K. Dobbins, Cam Akers, Antonio Gibson and AJ Dillon.
Think of all the other players they’ve passed on over the years too — Nick Chubb, Derrick Henry, Alvin Kamara.
It’s quite incredible, really, that for a team who values the position so much — they’ve missed on so many good runners only to spend their high picks at the position on Rashaad Penny and Christine Michael.
They’ve put themselves in a bind as a consequence because there’s absolutely no way they can ‘get by’ with Carlos Hyde types again in 2021, then needing to roll out Alex Collins and Bo Scaraborough off the street because they don’t trust Deejay Dallas and Travis Homer to carry the load.
If any team needs talent and depth at this position it’s Seattle. So they need to get a quality lead back this off-season.
3. Add someone who can help you convert third downs
Pete Carroll rightly identified third downs as a problem in 2020. The Seahawks didn’t get anywhere near enough production out of their tight ends (especially for the price they were paying) and they badly lacked a dynamic third receiver.
One of these areas needs to be addressed. It’s hard because the draft could provide solutions at the skill positions and the O-line. With only one pick in the first couple of days, however, they are painfully limited.
That’s why I think they need to make some difficult decisions this off-season, rather than kid themselves that a few cheap additions will be enough. I’ll come onto that in a moment.
If they had their first round pick they might’ve had a shot at Jaylen Waddle — who could last due to his ankle injury. Failing that, Elijah Moore and Tutu Atwell are both dynamic players perfectly suited to the slot.
I’m not sure Tylan Wallace or Chris Olave will run fast enough for the Seahawks (4.4 threshold) but they have move-the-chains ability.
There are a handful of appealing tight ends. I think Pat Freiermuth is a top-40 pick with the potential to be one of the NFL’s most dynamic TE’s. His size, mobility, body control to contort and make difficult grabs and the way he glides into holes in coverage make him a player to seriously covet. Tony Pauline currently grades him in the late 50’s on his big board. If he’s there, I think you have to consider him. Whether the Seahawks do or not will depend on his agility testing and what else they get done in free agency.
Brevin Jordan has great athleticism and pass-catching ability. He can be a mismatch weapon and red zone dynamo. Ole Miss’ Kenny Yeboah also had an impressive season and is a seam-busting big target.
The problem is the Seahawks have never truly worked out how to get the best out of a tight end in the Carroll era. Whoever comes in as the new coordinator should be challenged to change that.
If only they had the picks to be able to come out of this draft selecting from the likes of Leatherwood, Banks, Freiermuth, Williams, Waddle, Moore, and others.
In terms of free agents, Hunter Henry will likely be costly and the Seahawks can’t afford to squander another $10m like they did with Greg Olsen and Jacob Hollister.
At receiver there are intriguing names but it seems improbable they’ll be in Seattle’s price range. Will Fuller stands out but should get handsomely paid. JuJu Smith-Schuster will also have a strong market. Allen Robinson will get paid too.
Sammy Watkins and Curtis Samuel could be more affordable but will still warrant a reasonable price tag.
John Ross might be the best combination of speed, price range and upside. He’d be a nice reclamation project if they need to use their resources elsewhere.
4. Have uncomfortable conversations about where you’re investing your money
The Seahawks don’t have a lot of cap space. Over the Cap says they have about $6.3m in effective cap space. That would rise if the cap doesn’t drop as low as their estimated $176m.
The entire NFL is going through a financial crunch. While the Seahawks aren’t $99m in the red like the Saints, they’re going to have to adjust and work within a new Covid-impacted economy.
For what it’s worth, I think the NFL needs a contingency plan for the next two years. Half the league is facing a cap crisis and unless they want the veteran market to collapse, they’ll have to act.
Even so, the Seahawks are already paying Russell Wilson $35m a year and Bobby Wagner $18m a year. Realistically, it’s going to cost between $18-20m a year to extend Jamal Adams.
Personally, I don’t think you can afford to pay those three players $70-75m of your cap space. If it was Patrick Mahomes, Aaron Donald and Myles Garrett — it’d be a different story.
The Seahawks need to be honest with themselves and ask some difficult questions:
— Is Jamal Adams worth extending?
Nobody is saying Adams is a bad player. This is purely about value. You could argue no safety is worth $18-20m a year. But the fact is Adams was ranked as PFF’s 45th best safety in 2020. His coverage grade was a miserable 52.5. The Seahawks had to blitz him 98 times in 12 games to manufacture production to justify the deal.
People often mention the sacks to promote Adams’ play. Watch this clip from Hugh Millen. It explains why the sack numbers are such a red herring:
I’ve never been a fan of this trade and I don’t think a huge new contract, negotiated with the player having all the leverage, is the best investment for the Seahawks long term. For me, they would be better off trading him and trying to get some draft stock back — then exploring the market for free agents Keanu Neal, Malik Hooker and Marcus Maye. Failing that, they should just start Marquise Blair (who Carroll raves about and who they already spent a second round pick on).
The alternative is you pay him a mega-deal this off-season.
A lot of people think he’ll be happy to play on the fifth year of his rookie contract in 2021. My answer to that is — I have some magic beans to sell you. Hold-out city will be the next stop with no new contract.
Pay him or trade him. They have the same choice the Jets had last year.
The Rams just whipped the Seahawks on both sides of the line because their O-line played better and their D-line could rush consistently with four. Seattle would be better off using that $18-20m a year on the trenches. Personally, I’d rather pay Leonard Williams than Jamal Adams. I’d rather pay Brandon Scherff and bring in Keanu Neal for $20m combined. And you’d have your draft stock.
If they’re hell bent on keeping Adams (I fear that they are) — then they need to consider savings elsewhere. There’s no room for pride here though. They made the trade and took a shot — that’s absolutely fine. Sometimes you need to know when to fold and cut your losses. They should trade Jamal Adams.
— Is Bobby Wagner still worth the money?
He was named an All-pro this season and he was still Seattle’s highest graded defender according to PFF. Wagner remains a quality middle linebacker. He isn’t worth $18m a year though.
Here are the leading linebacker contracts in the NFL:
Bobby Wagner — $18m
C.J. Mosley — $17m
Zach Cunningham — $14.5m
Myles Jack — $14.25m
Deion Jones — $14.25m
Shaq Thompson — $13.6m
Corey Littleton — $11.75m
Jaylon Smith — $11.4m
There’s a reasonable chance the Jets will dispense of Mosley. They’d get out of that contract tomorrow if they could. Wagner is currently earning millions more than the other highly paid players at his position.
He reset the market and seems to have created a ceiling for the position too.
Wagner’s qualities remain his athleticism, instinct and knowledge. There weren’t many times when he laid anyone out with a booming hit in 2020 though. Neither did he produce a high number of sacks or turnovers.
For $18m a year it’s not unfair to expect more. That’s game-winner money. Wagner is more of a quality, steady, reliable leader these days.
The only real option for the Seahawks is to extend his contract — but that will only push the problem further down the line. Unfortunately I think they’re more or less stuck for now, carrying his mega-deal. Yet at least you know he’s going to be consistent and will be available. That’s why, given the choice, they’re probably better off biting the bullet on Adams if they need to move someone.
Plus, Adams is more likely to have a trade market due to his age.
— Can you justify Russell Wilson’s contract?
For me, it comes down to this. If you want Russell Wilson to be the focal point of your entire team — then you can easily justify his salary. But you should also be investing all of your resources in a quality O-line and a wide variety of weapons.
You need to appoint an offensive coordinator whose vision chimes with Wilson’s and then you should let them both get on with it. You should be seeking your own version of the Reid/Mahomes partnership.
The thing is, the Seahawks don’t appear to be doing that. They appear to be set on Pete Carroll determining what the offense is and appointing a coordinator who will do whatever Carroll wants.
We’ve seen a decade of football under this regime with three different coordinators. The offense has never been particularly creative or unique. It was at its best when Marshawn Lynch, a legendary player, was leading the way. Demanding attention, dictating to opponents. Creating opportunities.
Since he moved on, they’ve only ever played in fits and starts. They’ve often relied on Wilson magic rather than intricate game-planning. When’s the last time the Seahawks out-schemed a division rival?
Listening to Carroll and Wilson’s end-of-season press conferences, it’s clear they are in no way philosophically aligned.
Neither have they been particularly successful since Wilson moved away from his rookie contract. They’ve won plenty of games but they’ve been playoff also-rans for the last six years.
Now is the time to commit to Wilson being the focal point, or consider a change of direction. Not next year — they need to make that call right now.
You’re just about to appoint a new coordinator. This is the make or break moment. Are you going to get the man who connects everyone together — coach, quarterback, schemer — or are you going to ignore Wilson’s wants and wishes and force him to play in an offense he seemingly doesn’t believe in?
The quarterback mentioned how significant this appointment was for the future of the franchise. He was being deadly serious.
If you don’t want to bring in someone with that connecting ability — there’s little point keeping a disillusioned $35m quarterback. You might as well invest that money elsewhere and go in a different direction.
Reportedly plenty of folk in Miami aren’t convinced by Tua Tagovailoa. The Dolphins are ready to compete but are missing a quality, proven quarterback.
Trading him to Miami could appeal to both parties. It’s a big market. They’re not a basket case. They have the draft stock. You could net #3 and #18 plus something in 2022.
There are some rookie quarterbacks in this class with talent who might be able to run what is essentially a not altogether complex offensive vision. You’ve got Zach Wilson and Justin Fields early, then the likes of Davis Mills, Mac Jones and Kellen Mond later.
Alternatively, you go out and trade for Marcus Mariota or sign Alex Smith.
You eat the cap hit in 2021 and structure your new contracts with lower year-one hits. You invest that $35m in your O-line and defense. You have a much cheaper, point-guard quarterback and you beat teams up in the running game and with your defense.
If the Seahawks are going to have a $35m a year quarterback, they should be building around him and bringing in an offensive coordinator specifically to get the best of Wilson for the next few years. The target should be a similar impact to what we’re seeing with Matt LaFleur and Aaron Rodgers.
The best solution is to find common ground with the quarterback, get everyone on the same page and build something. If that means Carroll taking a step back, he should do it.
If they’re going to appoint a Pete Carroll ‘yes-man’ offensive coordinator, they need to ask whether that $35m is best spent on one player to continue getting the same results year after year, or whether it’s better spread across other areas of the roster.
Of the three options I think trading Jamal Adams for whatever they can get — even if it’s a discount of one first round pick and maybe a mid-rounder in 2022 — would be wise. They cannot afford to pay him $18-20m a year and plug their holes with $2m one-year bargain bin signings.
5. Be honest regarding your own players
There’s no doubt that Shaquill Griffin is well liked by the Seahawks. He’s also a reasonable player — but nothing more.
In March 2017, prior to Seattle’s reset, Michael Lombardi touted the possibility of Richard Sherman departing a year before he was cut:
“I think Seattle really thought twice about paying Richard Sherman. They felt they had to when they won the Super Bowl. Now their cap’s kind of a mess and they need to fix it so I think the reason they need to fix it is because they put all that money in the corner position in a defense where, we feel you can draft players that fit that scheme. Seattle did it, they’ve done it over and over again.
“…the scheme in Seattle allows you to find corners especially size/speed corners of which there’s a bundle of them in this draft that can play deep third of the defense, they’ll tackle and they can play within the scheme.”
It speaks to where the Seahawks once were — believing they could drop cornerbacks into their system and draft to develop. For years that was the case, until they hit a wall.
Yet the recent success stories of D.J. Reed and Jeremy Lane suggest all is not completely lost. They’ve also turned Ugo Amadi into a useful nickel.
Griffin is the kind of player who was perfectly adequate starting as a third round rookie on a cheap contract. He’s also not the kind of player who deserves a big salary going forward to be a core member of the team.
Griffin’s PFF grade in 2019 was a 77.0 with a 76.0 coverage grade. He slid to 64.1 and 63.6 respectively in 2020. He just hasn’t ever really developed into a consistently above average player.
Reed’s emergence is a god send really. Moving on from Griffin a few weeks ago likely would’ve meant needing to find two new cornerbacks. Now, they can sit on Reed’s $920,000 for 2021 and see where they are in 12 months.
With Griffin, they have to be willing to let the market dictate his future. If someone is willing to pay him millions — you have to let him walk. The Seahawks need be as strict with Griffin as they have been with other free agents in recent years.
In terms of a replacement, I wrote in November that it’s time to bring back Richard Sherman. That deal likely won’t be cheap either. However, Sherman is simply a better player. He knows the scheme. He would provide toughness and quality to the secondary. Reuniting with him would give everyone a needed lift.
They could then try to develop a replacement behind him. And who better to teach the intricacies of the scheme and the position than Sherm?
Admittedly, they’d need to free up resources for this. That’s why they have to make some tough decisions.
Being ruthless with their own free agents needs to stretch further than Griffin, too. A year ago they wasted so much money on average restricted free agents. It was a complete waste to commit $4.2m to Branden Jackson and Joey Hunt, only to cut the pair to save money weeks later. It wasn’t necessary to pay Greg Olsen $7m and then commit $3.2m to Jacob Hollister.
It’s time to let some of these depth players hit the market. If you can get them for a veteran minimum, great. They are not worth $2-3m on RFA contracts though.
If they want to create great depth and competition — use the draft and don’t toss away your draft picks with a short-term mindset.
Sadly, they also need to be realistic on K.J. Wright. He’s a legendary Seahawk who deserves to be remembered among the all-time greats — he had a superb 2020 season. Yet he’s already making noises to Josina Anderson that he expects a good contract to match his efforts.
The simple fact is the Seahawks used a first round pick on a linebacker a year ago and they’re already paying Bobby Wagner $18m a year. They can ill-afford to pay Wright anything close to his $10m 2020 salary if they want to fill other holes.
Concluding thoughts
I think this piece highlights how far away the Seahawks truly are and how little resource they have left. A 12-4 record looks good on paper — but the Seahawks only beat two playoff teams in 2020 (7-9 Washington and the LA Rams, who then dumped them out of the post season). If you’re willing to be honest about the situation, the Seahawks are a long way off the Packers, Bills, Chiefs and Saints teams this year.
It’s also concerning to hear a lot of contentment about this season rather than some honesty about where they are. That’s before we even get into the fact that this team simply isn’t creative enough schematically — and hasn’t been for years under Carroll’s leadership. They don’t game plan properly game-to-game and sticking with a ‘we are who we are’ mentality means they become predictable as the season goes on.
An aggressive off-season is required — with tough decisions made on who to keep, who to sacrifice and the ways to create more flexibility in terms of picks and salary.
They should be asking internally whether they’re better off paying Jamal Adams $18-20m a year and having no first round pick in 2021 or 2022 — or are they better off cutting their losses and paying Keanu Neal (arguably a better scheme fit) $5m (his projected salary by PFF) to start as a free agent.
They need to determine that they are better off making a significant addition to the offensive line rather than trying to fill holes with a rookie or another B.J. Finney type.
It’s been eight years since the Seahawks under Carroll and Schneider had a fantastic off-season. They’ve become a mix of overly conservative and overly aggressive — when making the seemingly obvious moves over the years would’ve produced better results.
There shouldn’t be any Darrell Taylor or Jamal Adams-esque desperation trades. They shouldn’t be entering a bidding war for a 35-year-old tight end who is considering retirement. They shouldn’t be penny pinching on the O-line rather than making firm investments in players with proven quality, such as Jack Conklin.
The last off-season was a mess frankly — leading to a predictable outcome. The 2021 off-season will be an indicator on whether they learnt from that experience — or whether they are doomed to continue making the same mistakes.
You want to believe in this team to address their issues and take a step forward. Unfortunately, there have just been too many Eddie Lacy’s, Luke Joeckel’s, Rashaad Penny’s and L.J. Collier’s, botched attempts to fix the pass rush and squandering of resources to have much confidence that 2021 will be any different.
The Seahawks have become a team that makes up the numbers in the post-season — with one victory in four years. There’s a growing apathy among a section of fans and a diminishing belief that they can return to serious contention for a Super Bowl.
This is a franchise that has sought to excite and get people dreaming in the Carroll era. That fire is dying, currently. For the first time in a long time, there’s a serious discussion about whether the right people are running the team.
They need to reignite things with an off-season that simply makes sense. An off-season that is pro-active to fix the issues in the trenches. An off-season that reconnects the quarterback and the coaching staff on the offensive vision — and justifies the massive investment in Russell Wilson. An off-season that avoids waste.
You can quickly get things back on track. Just ask the Packers. But you have to make things happen, make tough decisions and go for it.
Over to you, Carroll and Schneider…
Please check out my interview with NC State’s Alim McNeill if you get a chance:
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Brilliant stuff as always Rob! Agree that they need to make some hard choices this off-season. I for one do NOT want them to sign Adam’s to a new contract.
I just don’t see how this team moves forward with Adams on $18-20m a year.
It’s so obvious that trading Adams is the smartest move.
There has always been a narrative (an exaggerated one, I think), that the Seahawks are quick to admit their errors
and cut their losses with players that don’t work out.
This is the ultimate opportunity to prove that narrative true.
How they handle the Adams situation will determine my faith in this regime going forward.
Like you, Rob, I fear they (Pete), will stubbornly try to keep him.
Yes, trade Adams. What teams does he fit? Who is he most valuable to? I prefer the AFC, but will settle for not the NFC West.
Any of the Belichick tree coaches.
Baltimore.
Tampa Bay.
Miami?
Yep — Belichick tree
The Adams/Wagner/Wilson trio is not going to be at $70m+ until the 2022 cap year, which is also the last year of the Wagner deal. Any Adams extension isn’t adding another $10m+ to his 2021 cap number.
I think they’ll almost certainly extend Adams, and then kick big decision on Adams v Wagner into the 2022 offseason.
I never said it would add $10m this year.
Wagner is still on the books in 2022 and if anyone thinks Carroll is kicking him to the curb, you’re in for a shock.
Great great article! Agree. Such an honest objective article. Minus bringing back sherman. Big big NO on that one. Big blemish on an almost perfect vision. Expensive $ on a 33 (next season) corner who could poison locker room all over again with big injury concerns. Would he even want to come back? Anyone but sherman please. Everything else seemed just so spot on. One other thing but forgot. That NC back williams ooooeee! Hawks back all day!
The injury issues are a fair concern.
Sherman won’t poison anything though. Trust me. This is a coming together, just like Marshawn.
Agree with so much of what you wrote but your recommendation to sign Sherman is perplexing. As much as I love Sherm, how in the world would it be wise to pay him? As you said, he won’t be cheap. He’s old and can’t keep up with faster players (and everyone is faster than him now).
They should move Bobby and get whatever they can for him. Time for Brooks to step up.
Personally I think Sherman is still a quality player and I like the thought of him finishing on a high in Seattle.
I hope Pete and John call it like it is…. You cant have all your money tied up in the backend of each side of the ball and expect great results..
I dont care how good of a safety you have.. If your D line, backers, and corners are subpar.. especially the dline.. its all for nothing..
If you cant put a group on offense on the field.. it doesnt matter who your QB is..
Aaron Rodgers might have been frustrated when they drafted a QB in the first round then a RB… but look at the packers now.. Favorites over Tom brady’s Bucs….
Invested in FA pass rushers.. good oline that runs the ball with 3 effective RBs.. and a Superstar at WR. capable TE and other pass catchers that produced one of Rodgers best seasons..
Everything Pete wants to do.. the packers are doing it right now…
I take it that with an Adams trade, you keep Amadi at nickel and move Blair back to SS? Because Carroll was raving about Blair at nickel before he got hurt…
And if they let KJ walk, does Brooks move to SAM? Because he was hitting his groove at WLB in the last few games. Either way, what LB gets plugged in?
Sherman has been hurt a lot recently. Do you think he’s a decent gamble to last a season now?
My own guess is that they re-sign Adams, simply because of his “juice” and ability to flash in the pass rush. Pete is a cagey guy, but I don’t think his gushing about Adams has been artificial. I’d love to have him on the team at the right price, but the price range you are talking about here–in view of the cap, the Hawks’ room under it, and what they need–is too high.
I agree that they can’t dump a whole bunch into Carson, which is a shame, because he would be an almost ideal bell cow back if he could stay healthy.
Sure, why not? Amadi deserves playing time and they didn’t draft Blair to be a nickel.
Or alternatively sign Malik Hooker or Keanu Neal.
No, you find an alternative solution at SAM. If there’s a position we can ‘get by’ at — it’s SAM linebacker.
Yes, for the right price.
You mean his ability to be lined up in favourable situations to get free runs to the QB while blitzing ten times a game to get one sack?
Completely agree — and that’s the problem. He is going to cost too much.
Completely agree again — it’s a shame. But ultimately you can’t be babying your bell cow for 16 weeks to get him to the playoffs.
I am SOLD on that N.C. Williams Kat. Want that dude to pair with Carson. Or even hyde.
Awesome article. Some hope, routes forward. I’m still bummed out because I feel like Coach Carroll wants to just run it back, so more of the same, except slightly less good, as there are now few resources, and players have gotten older and less healthy. I just do not see this team moving on From Adams. I don’t see how the team gets better with Wagner, Wilson, Adams on the same roster.
Your point about paying Leonard Williams is right on: he plays on the line! The lines of this Seahawks team are not great! They need to be.
Yet the recent success stories of D.J. Reed and Jeremy Lane suggest all is not completely lost.
Ryan Neal?
Was more talking about CB rather than safety
Now that you’ve laid out the logical approach this team should take, they will go in the opposite direction. After last year’s debacle, I just don’t believe in them anymore and they will continue to make the same old arrogant decisions and mistakes. I’m ready for the same old same old and will be an apathetic fan regardless of what happens.
Nice article, covered most open points.
Positives
They got good ST players and coach now. We don’t know reason behind getting new coach but it worked.
Offense
Get rid of Olsen and Hollister and save 10 mil
Cody Parkinson hope he do better next year
DK needs some coaching on behavior and reduce drops
Defense
DJ Reed, Ugo, Brooks all played well
Blair has to prove but like the idea moving to SS and trade Adams
I believe old ST coach resigned for personal reasons. It was next man up. Dont quote me on that:)
No, the old ST coach Brian Schneider is back with the team now.
Great article Rob. I got quite a laugh out of this part:
“When they won the Super Bowl in 2013 they had the most expensive line in the NFL.
Then they went in the opposite direction as they tried to save money in order to pay a cluster of star players at other positions. Okung was eventually replaced by the likes of Bradley Sowell and George Fant. Players like Drew Nowak and Lemuel Jeanpierre took turns to replace Max Unger.”
So true, and as you know I been complaining about the offensive line and the yearly loss of 2-3 players for a long time now. It shows, this line will fold under any real pressure.
I’ve also thought that Brooks was drafted to replace a linebacker, because KJ seemed like he was declining last year. This was to be Brooks one year training period, but with Irvin going down Brooks became a starter. If they hadn’t drafted Brooks, and Wright isn’t exended, then the Seahawks would be faced with two open linebacker spots next year. That would have been tough to draft for.
I do like Williams as a running back. It confounds me that they can carry 5-6 running backs that are all injured or underperforming. Carson is good when he is healthy, but he can’t carry the running back load. They need a young rookie with fire in his eyes and a desire to be great.
I think Wilson deserves an offensive makeover. We look back and see a few guys like Lewis and Metcalf that they have drafted. But it really isn’t a whole lot considering the many years of decline. Most of the resources have been sucked up by the annual search for a defensive line. Sucked away from the offensive line and players. Give Wilson what he deserves. Give him some better offensive players. And a coach that can draw up a variety of effective offensive plays.
//It confounds me that they can carry 5-6 running backs that are all injured or underperforming.//
My feeling is that this is a direct result of failing to put together a quality OLine. My suspicion is that it wouldn’t have made a jot of difference who they drafted at running back (I wanted them to pick Henry & then I wanted them to pick Chubb) because the ‘hawks running backs are being continually either hit in the backfield or gang-tackled at the LOS. And not just their current group but all the various configurations of RBs that they’ve put in place since the Superb Owl win.
There was a brief moment of hope for the running game when when DJ Fluker was on the team but that soon faded. Now their Running Back room looks more like Emergency Ward 10 because being tackled going backards is not conducive to good health.
I don’t know if they are available at all, but I would love to see some stats on how often the ‘hawks RBs are hit at or behind the LOS compared to the league average.
Maybe. Sure would’ve been good to test that theory with Derrick Henry, Nick Chubb, Jonathan Taylor etc though.
One of? Or all three at the same time?
😀
But yes. Joking aside, I absolutely agree.
Even when the Seahawks had Lynch and a better line, he was still stopped behind the line alot. Sometimes over multiple downs where they couldn’t gain a yard.
What I see in the modern running game is runners moving in two directions. Which one will get the ball? Or will the quarterback keep it?
Another thing I see is the ability to run a variety of plays from the same set.
And another thing is the use of tight ends for more than blocking.
They need a modern offensive coordinator, and perhaps a different quarterback coach.
That’s the NFL, Alaska.
I doesn’t help that we draft heavy legged guys and pick up old vets with heavy legs as well. Where’s the pulling of guys to change things up and create lanes to one side of the line/out off the edge. Not much of it cause our guys typically aren’t good at it.
And to me the worst part of it all is we tend to sacrifice pass blocking with the guys we get in free agency/the draft, but to what end when they can’t even run block really well?! If you’re going to sell out to big thumpers to run the ball well then should’nt they have at least a top 5 type running game is they so heavily prioritize run guys over pass blockers? More to it but I’m so sick of their overarching o-line philosophies. Again points to outdated and in-creative stuff that just doesn’t cut it against any team with decent to great d-lines.
100% this. We don’t mention it, but not extending KJ turned out to be one of the hugest mistakes of last offseason. Extend him, and you have a good player for cheap this year with an option for next, plus you’d have had an extra 10 mill or so to spend last offseason. Any maybe you take another area of need in the draft last year.
By not extending, they were basically conceding that they were making a huge downpayment in order to move on from KJ after 2020. Doesn’t look so good in retrospect.
Good point. Woulda been nice. Although I do like the brooks pick.
Rob, I agree with you 100%, experience at OL (I love the idea of bringing Thuney), young guns at RB, cut costs where needed even if we have to let one of our star LBs go, figure out Adams, let Griffin go. The problem is TE: we already have Colby there but we didn’t use him enough last year. Drafting another TE is no guarantee it will work better. The alternatives via free agency are not great. Then there’s the big question with Wilson, and I think it will be decided when we get the new OC.
One other way to go would be to make a crazy move at RB. Do you think it would be doable to get Aaron Jones?
I don’t know to be honest. They don’t have much money. The Packers drafted a R2 running back in 2020 so they might move on. I’m not sure what Jones would get on the open market. Runners who reach the market generally don’t get massive money. The ones getting paid are the ones who stick.
terrific article.
the thing that really worries is Carroll’s comments about believing they were in a really good position to challenge this year, there doesn’t seem to be any acknowledgement of the team’s faults and the mistakes made by coaches.
I just don’t have any confidence they’ll do what needs to be done this off-season.
there doesn’t seem to be any desire to really evaluate where they’ve been going for the last few years, just a bloody-minded desire to follow the same.path.
Agreed /\
there seems to be a real air of complacency and denial, rather than any willingness to take a long hard look and shake things up.
I’m afraid I agree. They need to disprove this theory with their actions this off-season. Can’t see it happening, unfortunately.
One of my jobs is delivering food afternoons till late at night, and always listen to your and other podcasts, some Seahawks and a variety. In the most recent Man to Man podcast, Mike Duggar said he asked Pete who he trusts to talk to around there, and first he lists his kids Brennon and Nate who coach for him, then ex-QBcoach Carl Smith, then JS. Tells you a lot.
And possibly it’s no coincidence that RW started with bad habits not coached and developed out of him by QB coach Smith, and that Watson seems to have developed some and gotten worse since Smith got to the Texans in 2019. I’ve heard excellent analysis by former players OL Walter Jones and Ray Roberts, DL Cliff Avril and others on podcasts in the last few years. Seems like PC could trust them and several others like Kam to talk to about what went wrong in the previous game and what could work better, rather than just his kids and JS.
Great points.
To be fair to Smith, I thought he sucked as well and Schotty helped Wilson develop better habits, but Watson just had his best year and was excellent. Who knows how much that goes to Smith
Hopefully they read your blog 🙂
Man, if they would only listen to you…I think the most important thing is to really commit to one style, for example the running game behind a great OLine, like you said, and then really invest in that position group. No more „getting by“ with cheap signings.
The weird thing is — they started in 2010 doing exactly what I’m writing about here. Their first two R1 picks went on offensive linemen. They acquired Marshawn. They signed Robert Gallery. They spent big money on a really good, complete tight end. They invested decent money in Breno, they paid Max Unger.
And they achieved what they wanted.
So why have they never gone back to that???
Excellent article and great stuff all week as usual, pinpointing not only what needs to be done, but the flaws in PC’s controlling personality affecting everything. I love the concept of going out and getting some better OL, but how can we afford it? We only have very few $ for the 2021 season, maybe 7-8 mil. after draft picks and other set asides for injury, etc.. I can see us trading Adams, that was WAY too much to pay, but trading Russ would cost $39 mil. this year, 7 mil. more than keeping him. That alone would take up all our remaining money, and we still need to sign a lot more players unless the practice squad futures contract players are Sunday ready, and still leaves us about a dozen short of the 53 even if they are.
Really hoping RB Williams is there with our late 2nd or a higher pick if we trade Adams, have seen him in some mocks as right there with Harris but after Etienne, late 1st to upper 2nd rd.. If we don’t trade for more picks with a player(s), got the feeling JS is going to trade down 2-3 times like in the McDowell year to late 2nd to early 3rd, picking up another 3rd and at least a couple extra picks on day 3 to get to at least 6-7 total. Hopefully he plans ahead unlike the last 2 years and trades a little down with a day 3 pick to get additional 7ths from a team with several. That way we don’t trade our 2022 6th to get back into the 7th, but it will probably happen again.
Another option not quite as good as Williams but could possibly be drafted in the late 2nd to 3rd is Miss.St. RB Kylin Hill. Started to play this year, but in Mike Leach’s pass all the time offense, he opted out after 3 games. They only ran him 15 times in 3 games, but passed to him 23 times for a 10 yd. avg. and a TD. Last year he had 1350 yards for a 5.6 avg, and seems to have great character as he got the state to change it’s flag, is 5’11 but slightly light at 210.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2Dnegw4wdo&t=1s&ab_channel=JLPProductions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IkuJsesGXs&ab_channel=JustBombsProductions
Keep an eye on the Senior Bowl for RBs, WRs, OL, DBs etc., so many very good players in the NFL played great there. Little known RB James Robinson of Illinois was the best RB in the game last year, was drafted in the 6th by the Jaguars, and went on to be a 1000+ yd. runner with a 4.5 avg., also had 49 rec. for a 7 yd. avg.. We all know WRs McLaurin and Samuel were the best by far WRs a couple years ago there. And S Jeremy Chinn played great all week last year, Carolina took him in the 2nd and he had an outstanding rookie season for them. Just over a week and the practices begin. We should have an OC to be there with PC, JS and others scouting all week.
This response is point on. Then they traded Unger for Graham, so Russ now had more responsibilities at the line and was sacked more. He seems skittish. Sacks must go down with better oline players, and Russ has to get rid of the ball quicker.
Your not talking about Jimmy G as a complete TE are you? I dont remember who it was exactly in 10 otherwise. Jimmy G was is a terrible lazy unwilling blocker though. Although I have a feeling you may mean someone I am not remembering.
Probably thinking Zach Miller.
I clearly was
Very nice article. Because they are paying Rusell Wilson 35mil. In those years he was on a rookie contract. Any team who win superbowl with the exception of PATRIOTS has a rookie QB and good o line d line and defense. Its time to repeat the 2012-2013 formula like you mentioned and dedicate resources on everthing else and get a good QB in deafr and know you have 3 year windows to brush him to win/teach superbowl. Know why Patriots were su successful because goat Tom Brady used to take pay cut nothing against Russell Wilson but he is not going to take any pay cut. As an organization you have to see do you want to reach superbowl ir win regular games with good record to keep your jobd as coaches. That exactly Pete Carroll is doing. Cheers Rohit
Great Stuff Rob as always.
The Hawks could trade Adam’s for a 1st and change likely then release Diggs. That would save them $20 mil +.
Then sign Keanu Neal at SS and Malik Hooker at FS. That would cast about 10-12 mil. So you save about $10 mil to use on the OL and pick up a 1st round pick you desperately need. Plus if healthy I think Hooker and Neal at the perfect Safety duo for Pete’s scheme.
Sign me up.
I’m willing to give Diggs the benefit of the doubt though. I think the way they forced themselves to use Adams in 2020 made life practically impossible for Diggs. I would be up for keeping him.
But I simply do not believe Jamal Adams is worth $18-20m if you can get Neal for far less and bolster other areas of your team.
He’s not worth $18-20m and he wasn’t worth two firsts, a third and Bradley McDougald.
The Jamal Adams we saw was not the Jamal Adams we saw with New York. My fear is that we trade him away, he recovers from his injuries and shows to be the legit superstar we’ve seen in the past. If PC insists on blitzing him 10 times a game though, we may never see that here regardless.
I’ll happily take that risk.
I would be fine with diggs sticking around as well. He made the pro bowl so something was possible. When they made the Adams trade I lost it saying they just ruined there future for next 3-4 yrs. (maybe a bit dramatic):) I still dont like it though. Reading this really cemented some of my worst fears as well. Its just to much$. I rationalized the trade at the time thinking- if you are going to trade for an all pro who can have a serious impact on the game why not pick an all pro from one of the lowest position groups. That way you get a guy who can make an impact play multiple positions but only have to pay 14-15 million. (only smh). This talk of 18 million plus makes me sick to my stomach. Trade him!
Who are the Hawks best players right now?: Wilson, Adams, Wagner, KJ Wright, Carson and Griffen which we are advocating we dump/trade/cut. Many are suggesting (and I agree) the 24 pending unrestricted free agents should/will not be resigned. This is a major roster deconstruction. Lockett and Metcalf are a great duo but would be nullified with a rookie qb or a reclaimed veteran qb…see Jacksonville, Chicago, LV, Miami, Jets, Patriots, Denver, Indy and a host of others….so we might as well get full value for them now before their stats erode behind the new rebuilt roster. Most teams going thru a major re-build like this would have also dumped their coach and gm’s ..the Hawks extended both? The Packers got back to the title game but did it with their HOF Qb at the helm. I feel it will be a long time before we see 12-4 again. Think we will be getting a lot of higher draft picks in the years ahead due to our w/l record. Frustrated but getting my head around the end of the most productive era in Seahawks football history. It was a good ride. Thanks for another great article Rob!
I would be fine with diggs sticking around as well. He made the pro bowl so something was possible. When they made the Adams trade I lost it saying they just ruined there future for next 3-4 yrs. (maybe a bit dramatic):) I still dont like it though. Reading this really cemented some of my worst fears as well. Its just to much$. I rationalized the trade at the time thinking- if you are going to trade for an all pro who can have a serious impact on the game why not pick an all pro from one of the lowest position groups. That way you get a guy who can make an impact play multiple positions but only have to pay 14-15 million. (only smh). This talk of 18 million plus makes me sick to my stomach. Trade him!
The Hawks will be fine! Pete will always put out a competitive team capable of playoffs. I believe thats why they re-signed him. I dont know he will ever win another SB without some serious self exploration or whatever. He gotta change give up some control….. Russell isnt going anywhere just yet.
I totally agree the Seahawks should be targeting a high quality interior offensive lineman in FA. In reality they will probably resign pocic and start someone like chance warmack/ Jordan Simmons at left guard lol.
With Jamal adams Pete and John are way too stubborn to trade him unless they get similar draft value. I get the feeling teams are more aware of the holes in jamals game now than they were last offseason. (Not many people were talking about his coverage struggles last offseason)
Who would people rather have: Adams, 2nd tier G and Pocic; or Scherff, Linsley, Keanu Neal and a couple extra picks for Adams? Sign me up for the latter in a heartbeat. Go get Leonard Williams, Javonte Williams and another weapon for Wilson at either TE or receiver in the mold of ADB and I’d be happy.
Rob, have you had any chance to watch Master Teague out of OSU? He fits the physical profile Seattle targets, his high school combine was phenomenal but he had a few injuries in college.
I have. He’s explosive and has the size but in terms of his running style, it wasn’t particularly physical.
This plan would make me so happy. Pay the O Line, RBs are a dime a dozen. If you have a line like Cleveland, Buffalo, GB, SF, or LA, you can find cheap RB’s to pick up yards. Those teams have.
I think cheap RB’s are the way forward (which means drafting them) but they are not a dime a dozen. We’re seeing that in Seattle.
The thing about the running backs drives me nuts! So many that fit the style of play and they go for C Mike and Penny. Henry? Kamara? Chubb? No, we’re good.
If Pete is all about identity, stick with the identity.
Also seem to think Raiders w Mariota would be a viable trade partner for RW. Not what I’d want, but it would make sense for Pete’s “vision.”
Rant over
Thanks Rob, your offseason planning articles are always spot on. With both Carroll and Schneider extended this year, I’m afraid that business as usual will be the norm. This team seldom does what they should and ends up overthinking their moves, show reluctance at signing top tier free agents, preferring quantity over quality and making puzzling draft choices. There are times I think Carroll has too much voice for this organization in both player selection as well as the play calls. His “stubbornness” at sticking with “his guys” and “his way of playing” end up in poor section making with the rest of the team and organization having to pay the price. Here’s what I expect may happen:
1. Jamal Adams repeats the Clowney story line from last year. Adams sticks with wanting a big contract while the Seahawks lowball him and hopes he signs. No trade happens and relations get worse between the two.
2. Not being able to trade Adams causes the Hawks to look elsewhere for draft choices. A lack of viable trade options ends up forcing them to trade Tyler Lockett and if possible, Penny (more for cap relief and some lower round pick(s). Wagner contract is reworked for more cap space.
3. Hawks keep Wright and Griffin at higher than they should prices and fill in minor pieces on the defense since Norton has things “fixed”.
4. Hollis tee is resigned as TE2 along with Parkinson being TE3. Hawks avoid high price FA and sign more low price depth OL pieces. New offensive coordinator and Pete keep team at low risk plays and relations become strained with Wilson.
5. Schneider does a flurry of moves in lower rounds to build up number of draft picks and at the end of the draft trades away another 6th round pick from next year for a final 7th round selection this year that won’t make the team and is released.
They won’t trade Tyler Lockett.
I guarantee that.
Sadly the rest makes sense.
Another great article on a tough subject. As usual. Thanks Rob.
I agree with the suggestions and the trade of Adams. I also think it is worth considering trading all three of our best players. Just building off Robs arguments I would add that Bobbie already peaked and we have his replacement. Keep KJ if he is reasonable.
It would be tough on us fans to trade Russ. Something that made it easier to consider was listening to Greg Cosell on KJR with Ian. He answered the question why the offense faltered in the second half with it was “all on Russ” in different words.
We are still left with the problem of the Seahawk FO. Boat loads of pick over the next few years could result in more carnage. I will also back a “Rob to the Seahawks” if these concerns could be fixed….even if we lost the lost our favorite web site.
Thanks.
And while I’d love to help the Seahawks out, I’m pretty sure they’re not thinking the answer to their problems is a random bloke from Rotherham 🙂
It’s all in the packaging. Your the Wizard of Rotherham. With keen eyed draft analysis that has never failed. Payment by Mastercard or Patron.
As always thanks for the savvy analysis.
It certainly will be an interesting off season.
If they take a leap on Jamal and extend him, which it feels like they will, then I hope they modify their thinking too (doesnt seem like its in Pete’s wheelhouse tho). Namely:
Switch to a 3-4 and take Jamal out of a safety role.
Pete’s LEO d isn’t a true 4-3, so not a huge leap.
They seem unwilling to invest in the line (trading Clark, ceiling on Clowney)
Jamal is poor in coverage, but good around the LOS. Let him react to the play, blitz, drop into coverage if needed but then get a true safety back there.
2 of their biggest sacks this year came rushing 3 with no blitz (4th down sack on Murray and a late sack vs the rams)….perhaps due to coverage.
Just like with Russ- if you go all in on a player then it would be nice to build a system that emphasizes the strengths.
As to trading Russ, wonder if the rumors around Watson help or hurt the Hawks- Houston is asking a lot, but Watson is younger….if the hawks are even considering this direction.
I have been having similar thoughts. Wondering if the best way to utilize Adam’s is make him a linebacker in a 3-4. We have some depth at Safety with Blair coming back. Let Ugo stay at nickel. Otherwise it feels like the Adam’s trade was a “solution” to a problem we didn’t have. When was the last time before this year we blitzed a safety 98 times in 12 games? His coverage skills rank low on comparison to other safeties. We also have some depth at LB, unless they have decided Barton and BBK are not worthy as rotational players or insurance. Of course that doesn’t solve the Adam’s $$ issue. They painted themselves into a corner there. Would rather spend some of that on OL.
But he isn’t a linebacker.
I know he plays with linebacker tendencies and people have criticised him because where he shows limitations — they are the same limitations you’d expect from a LB in coverage.
But he’s simply not big enough to play up at the line and not laterally quick enough. He’s a heat-seeking missile. His best role is running downfield, attacking. Reading and reacting. See ball carrier, hunt ball carrier.
His best role, without a doubt, is in the blitzing, creative, aggressive, hybrid schemes we see from the Belichick tree and other teams such as Tampa Bay & Baltimore.
You learn/realize some things when you watch the final 8 teams left in the season — the first thing I was thinking watching those games yesterday – pretty solid O-line play across the board. Watching Josh Allen in a clean pocket, or Aaron Jones and Cam Akers w running lanes — and you start thinking, is it possible that the biggest reason for the offense’s (and RW’s) regression in the 2nd half of the year, the regression in our O-line play?
All of which is to say, I agree – if we do nothing else this off-season other than fortify the O-line and add talent at RB – I think our team look a lot better next year.
Unfortunately, it feels like we’re a bit stuck on the Adams front – I’m actually a fan of the guy, I think his hustle/sprit adds something that’s been lacking on this defense, but I can’t justify a salary at $18M per, if that’s what it’s going to take. To me, that’s what you pay top-line pass rushers and shutdown CB’s, and nobody else. But for the Hawks to trade him after one season after all they gave up – he would have had to be a total disaster, and he wasn’t that. I agree that the sack numbers are misleading, but those two plays he made in the goal line stand against the Rams were star plays – he’s not an imposter, just probably not worth the trade haul we paid. I get the argument for a trade, just don’t see it happening.
Wasn’t it just one play? But either way — I’ll back myself to find a safety who can hussle to the ball. If I’m paying $18m a year I want a true gamechanger.
I think we just have to admit that there have been a lot of missteps with the team building over the last 6 years and you hit all the details spot on, Rob. Really a poor strategy balanced by some smart but isolated moves. The offensive line encapsulates this perfectly. Misses in the draft, poor free agent investment, almost saved by the trade for Duane Brown who has stabilised the line a lot on his own. I totally disagree with the direction Pete wants to take the team on offense but I 100% agree that IF we’re going this way, they need to properly invest in making in running the ball as well as we can, like the Titans or Browns. We’ve been scraping by for too long by spreading out the cap and picks with bad or mediocre players.
Great work, per usual.
The irony in all of this is PC’s unadulterated conviction in doing things a certain way combined with his spaghetti spine with making the tough calls/personnel moves to actually enact it.
It’s extremely odd – which makes me believe that his conviction is probably not actual belief but rather, “this is all I know;” which would explain is reluctance to move on from players that don’t fit his style.
I listened to several podcasts over the last few days talking about the Seahawks (from both fans and national folks) and it’s pretty ubiquitous that PC is not exactly held in high regard with his “football mind.”
We’ve reached the tipping point as a franchise, and if anyone doesn’t recognize it, they’re got their heads in the sand.
Personally, my once cultish fanhood is dying, and I’m afraid the only way to re-stoke the fire is for Pete to change offensively, which I don’t believe is gonna happen.
If we trade RW to run the ball more, I’ll end my fandom. I don’t want to watch us lose in the first round (if that) with a mediocre QB and a mediocre game plan just to play “Pete’s Way.” I don’t want to watch football games with baseball scores. I don’t want to watch the play clock always go down to 1 or 0. I don’t want to watch us punt on 4th and inches to trust a defense that then gives up 3 first downs, 6 minutes, and we start 20 yards back from where we had it on 4th and 1. I don’t want to see another &#(*&$#@_) red flag challenge that I know IMMEDIATELY will not be overturned, esprit de corps or not.
And most importantly, I don’t want to watch us trade our ONLY franchise QB in history, to do what a 70 year old thinks is the best way to win, when his framework is 20 years behind the league.
I see this so clearly, I predict this. If Pete doesn’t hire an OC that is innovative, he will end up being run out of town before the end of his contract. First, we know it will fracture any remaining relationship with RW. We also know it will likely negatively affect DK, who will be likely leave a couple years later for better more prolific pastures if we don’t keep Russ happy. Pete’s still getting love from the SB years. We’re getting further and further from those halcyon days, and the wrong choices magnify his mistakes to the point where even the most ardent of fans can’t ignore them. Unfortunately, most older coaching legends see a significant decline before they either walk away or are forced out. See Ground Chuck, Chuck Noll, Tom Landry, Bobby Bowden, and many others. It happens as things evolve, but they do not. Pete is facing his own moment of reckoning.
If he trades RW and Russ blooms under a different system while you watch 3 yards and a cloud of dust (I say you, because I won’t watch it anymore), Pete will be digging his own grave, and it will be marked with a couple 7-9’s/8-8’s if the bottom DOESN’T fall out (and I suspect it will.)
Pete’s only path to success is to change and trust someone from outside his smaller and smaller and less and less talented circle, and Pete’s shown a complete inability to change and trust from outside.
In other words, I think we’re doomed. I think Pete is gonna ruin his own legacy with his own stubbornness (and the history of poor draft/trade decisions as outlined by Rob.)
It will be disappointing if it goes that way, but I don’t see it happening any other way, unfortunately.
Pete’s history as a meddler in the offense is honestly baffling as a constant reoccurrence.
– Pete forced Norm Chow out of USC (oversaw the Palmer/Lienart-Bush offenses) for Lane Kiffin/Sarkisian, when the credit was for the offense was often given to Chow. Pete got his wish of offensive control his last years there and we know what he did/how he left it..
– Intervened at the end of SB 49 when all seahawks fans know conservate Bevell or boy scout Wilson would’ve ran it/not call an audible. We saw how that ended and lingered in the ’15/16 seasons
– Schotty essentially cleans up the offense post sb 49 while adapting pete’s vision to today’s style of nfl, while elevating russell’s game year-by-year. Now fires schotty as a scapegoat for a horrible 2020 offseason vision and an obvious meddling after the bill loss (which was a loss on carroll in my opinion for not adapting from their intial run-stopping game plan)
are the seahawks content to see how this slowly burns away the remaining years of contention? unless we start a new run i believe this is pete’s last contract. Owner Jody Allen seems to want to keep things going with PCJS getting extended. I’d just like to remind anyone reading that is was Paul Allen that intervened to shake up the coaching staff when Bevell/Cable exited. My fear is that the seahawks top brass are too content in giving Carroll too much autonomy (his final say over the roster, coaching staff) as they did with Holmgren at the end of his tenure.
We’ve been looking for a Left Guard since Steve Hutchinson! this is insane on PCJS to not have fielded a top-10 Offensive Line in 10+ years.
As hopeful as I am for a re-tooling of the roster this off-season, the cap/draft-captial constraints make it tough-to-unlikely. I forsee ’21 as the season the camel breaks its back and real truths will be revealed.
Rob, you astutely pointed Pete’s reluctance to condemn the season as a failure, which smells more like pride/arrogance than optimism in my opinion. Carroll’s getting up there in age, we have to be honest that he’s closer to Tom Coughlin than to Sean Mcvvay at this point. Change will come from around him, before himself.
Thank you Rob for always presenting all sides of the coin. A true 12!
Outstanding albeit painful post
Stone Age Carroll football would be totally legit if they signed both Sherff and Mack and drafted a Javonte Williams type young buck.
But for Pete to continually try to run his brand of ball with guys who simply are not suited to do it makes no sense.
Let’s take Ethan Pocic for example. Here’s a technician who isn’t physical and a player who will never “impose his will” on any NFL DT. And this is who Pete has anchoring his “wanna be” physical OL? WTF?!?
If you want to do something – you need the horses to do it. If you want have CBs play man to man defense – you can do it if you have Mike Haynes and Lester Hayes. You can’t do it if you have Kelly Jennings and Kelly Herndon. Any scheme can be good if you have the right people. Pete knows what he wants to do – so frickin’ do it!
If you want to be the physical team that imposes its will on other teams, you should have an OL and RB situation where you can run the ball on 3rd and 3 and convert a high percentage of times (just think of effective play action would be in those situations as well). We’ve seen these situations throughout the years of supposedly “Pete ball” where they’ll spread everyone out and Wilson is throwing in those situations because we know full well the defense is more manly and physical than what the Seahawks have had, which makes no sense to allow this if you’re Pete – because Pete supposedly is “committed” to being the bully up front (or so he says).
I strongly believe the Seahawks could/should invest a quality pick on a DT. I hate their DT depth. But this is probably one of those situations where you can do/fix everything and the DT depth should probably be compromised to achieve the stated goal:
Get a good/great LG and C.
Get a young RB early.
Adding an offense that is physical and can control the clock would reduce the need for back-up DTs to be on the field.
And can anyone imagine the impact of deep threats like DK and Lockett if teams were forced to try stopping the run against the Seahawks?
I would love to see the Seahawks stop trying to be the smartest guys in the room during the draft and just pick the best available talent. They seem to love reaching for hidden gems at positions of need, maybe believing that they know something, or see something, that everyone else missed.
Hard to tell, sometimes you draft by need, sometimes the contract situation forces you to go for a position, like in the case of Brooks. And sometimes it worked, even Metcalf was somewhat of a reach when they picked him.
Metcalf most definitely wasn’t a reach.
He plummeted to the send of round two and they made their move.
Value-wise, no doubt, but it could have turned bad injury-wise, so I’d call it a risky move.
Agree with Rob. Metcalf was not a reach, and in fact is an example of picking best available talent. I also don’t see the Brooks pick as over-drafting to fill a need. They added a talented player who could become a key contributor for years (although full disclosure, I didn’t like or understand the Brooks pick when it was made).
What’s clear in this Browns-Chiefs game is that there is creativity to stress the defense. Not a lot of “hey let’s bang our head into the wall for 45 minutes.”
A series of poor decisions related to personnel acquisition has put the team in debt. They racked up the credit cards, mortgaged the farm, and now it’s time to pay up.
There’s no easy way out from here either:
– Trade Adams to recover lost picks- I bought a shiny sports car I couldn’t afford and will take a bath on the depreciation.
– Trade Wilson- divorce my spouse because they’re too good for my dead-beat ass, seriously.
– Restructure Wagner, Lockett, etc.- asking for deferral from the money I borrowed from my BEST friends in order to save my marriage.
Sometimes I just wish they’d just own the fact they failed. They went all in in to show progress; this team was never going to win a super bowl. The shiny car, the happy spouse- all a front. They just tried to save face and cover up the mess. That’s as shortsighted as it gets.
Nice analogy. I don’t disagree. It certainly seemed they were far too leaning into 2020, and now that we’re out of the season early, it has to be looked at as a failure with a bit of a mess to clean up as well.
If we were going to trade Wilson, say to Miami as suggested by Rob, then you have to think about trading DK. I don’t think DK would want to stick around if Russ is gone. DK wants the ball, a lot. We saw that during the Rams game (on that botched screen pass), and if Pete wants to run the ball and have a point quarterback, many of DK’s talents would go to waste. He needs to be in a high volume passing game. I don’t know the draft haul you could get for him, but I imagine it would be pretty nice.
I don’t know why people think DK’s talents will be going to waste with a point guard.
They still need someone to throw to.
If they had a QB who can just throw a quick slant, DK might find he’s suddenly getting a whole load more catches and targets.
A couple of thoughts here: Wilson & DK are reported to be very close, like a big brother. Wilson spoke on his podcast about wanting to be like Montana and Rice. Coming off a season in which both DK and Lockett surpassed 1,000 yards, I don’t think DK wants to go back in the bottle and run quick slants all the time. Jerry Rice in his prime (1990-1997) averaged 100 catches and 1,430 yards. I don’t think DK gets that with quick slants coming from Alex Smith or Marcus Mariota. And I think if Wilson is traded, he is not going to be happy about it, at all.
Tyreek Hill had 1200 yards with Alex Smith at quarterback.
When I say he can catch a lot on slants — that doesn’t mean I think they have to throw endless slants. The fact is, right now, Metcalf’s production mostly comes on big plays. Imagine if they were able to generate some easy receptions for him too — making the most of his athleticism after the catch? There’s a thought…
Look no further than the routes that Stefon Diggs and Tyreek Hill make their money off of!
Respectfully, I think you need to think about this a bit further. Have a look at NFL NextGen Stats for Tyreek and for Stefon Diggs. Here’s the statistics I’m looking at — TAY (Target Air Yards), which measures how far down field a player is when the ball is thrown (i.e., how far the ball travels downfield to the receiver) and TAY% (this stat represents the percentage of the team’s deep balls the player accounts for).
Stefon Diggs: TAY = 10.2 yards, TAY% = 33.42%
Tyreek Hill: TAY = 13.2 yards, TAY% = 35.59%
That means these guys are, on AVERAGE, more than 10 yards down field when they receive the ball. That, to me, is not short slants, now is it??
A slant doesn’t have to be ‘short’
Perhaps I’m keying in too much on ‘short’ or as you said ‘quick slant’ 🙂
I’m just scared of seeing a Case Keenum, rhythm passer signing. I’d be happy to see someone with Wilson’s arm strength (even another Wilson, in the form of a Zach Wilson). Otherwise, I think that you won’t get as much of value out of DK on the field as you would if you traded him to someone who could use his whole game.
I don’t think they would go for a Case Keenum type.
But he’s more of a journeyman than a point guard. For me a point guard is quite a vague term really. Wilson was a great point guard once.
See my comment / question below regarding Tyreek/Stefon and the TAY statistic. I think, really, my only point here is that, if we trade Russ and bring in a ‘point quarterback’, we are arguably reducing the value that DK brings to the team (since Russ is generally one of the best deep ball passers in the league and DK is one of the best go-route runners). You’re hobbling DK’s value by removing Russ, and the return you could get from a team that could utilize DK’s full skillset could put the Seahawks back on track to execute Pete’s vision.
I think about this in the way that Billy Beane constructed his baseball rosters in Moneyball. The traditional leadoff man until then was a fast guy that could steal bases. Beane went with slow Scott Hatteberg because he did one thing extremely well–he got on base. I think DK could be an all world receiver, but right now his best asset is his spead and separation of go-routes. But what defense is going to care about that if the quarterback is throwing the ducks we saw from Drew Brees yesterday (nothing more than 20 yards)?
In a perfect world, I would want to see Russ do what Aaron Rodgers (or Tom Brady) does. Give them the keys and let them assess a defense at the LOS and make their own playcalling decision, not have Pete and Schotty (or whatever OC) squabble as the clock is running down and cause an awful delay of game, forcing a punt in a playoff game. That was nonsense.
I still don’t get your point.
Just because another QB might not be as good with the deep ball doesn’t mean literally no other QB can throw a deep ball.
And a receiver with Metcalf’s skill set could and should be unstoppable on slants and crossers as he showed against the Niners.
**He showed against the Niners practice squad… just have a peek at that injury list (no Sherman, no Ward, no Witherspoon, no Tartt, and that’s just the DBs I can think of). He was incredible in that game, but in fairness, he SHOULD have won those matchups.
My point is (1) you trade Wilson, you’ve upset DK–he may want to leave just because of that (see, e.g., all reports about his and Wilson’s relationship); (2) I don’t think that the QB’s in free agency (e.g., Mariota or Alex Smith) would get max value out of DK; (3) the return you get from trading Wilson and DK would be quite substantial, enough to completely counter the picks lost on the Adams trade. You have that complete team overhaul, should Pete want to go with Pete ball. Otherwise, as you were saying (and I hope should be the case), let’s see what this offense could look like if Pete did a Nick Saban and gives up the reins to the offense.
My point is: How do we optimize the value of our roster to either go with Pete ball, or run with a new-blood OC? If we do the former, I think that with a Russ trade then you could arguably max your value in a makeover by also trading DK.
Jake, I’m talking about the one play where he took a slant about 50 yards to the house.
That was nothing to do with the opponent, and everything to do with DK.
It depends who you replace Wilson with. If he keeps producing and then gets paid, he won’t care whether Wilson is there or not.
It doesn’t have to be free agency. But for what it’s worth, you’d probably have said the same about Ryan Tannehill. And how’s AJ Brown getting on? And how much is Kirk Cousins limiting Justin Jefferson?
Trading Wilson alone achieves that. Or better yet — trade Jamal Adams.
Thanks for your input, Rob. I appreciate your thoughts. I think that, personally, I like the thought experiment of what a team might look like if there was a Russ trade (say, to the Dolphins) and the Seahawks were to pick up a young QB. From there, add in a DK trade and you could essentially build the 2005 Steelers team that beat the Seahawks in the SB.
Dominant offensive line (multiple pro bowlers), dominant defense (multiple pro bowlers), young game manager quarterback with a dominant running game (willie parker, jerome bettis). That Steelers team’s receivers had Hines Ward and Randel El (neither put up 1000 yards). Hard working unit.
It will never happen, but to me I dislike the idea of having someone that doesn’t have an arm like Josh Allen or Aaron Rodgers on a team with DK. The inability to take the top off a defense–just not having that threat–takes so much away from the underneath routes.
I just don’t see why you’ve attached the two, really.
You don’t automatically have to trade a physical phenom at receiver who’s only scratching the surface of his potential just because you don’t have Russell Wilson, Aaron Rodgers or Josh Allen.
Let’s say they trade Wilson to Miami and end up with Zach Wilson or Justin Fields. I can’t think of a better thing than either of those two having DK Metcalf to throw to.
Let’s say they trade for Marcus Mariota. He doesn’t have a Josh Allen arm but neither is he a noodle-armed weakling.
A Wilson trade alone would give you every shot to create a dominant running game with a top O-line and an improved D.
Great stuff!
Sure is a pleasure to watch an offense that knows who they are and what they want to do. Let’s see what the Browns can do to answer. So far, KC just looks unstoppable.
Guarantee Russell Wilson is watching this…
And the Packers yesterday…
And he is not going to be backing down. That showdown with PC is coming over the next OC.
Agreed, Rob.
Thus far we’ve seen the “build around the run” teams getting dropped early and often.
Tennessee first, then Baltimore, now Cleveland. Bottom line, the best QB’s are still in the playoffs right now, and the teams that rely on running more heavily are gone.
I don’t know man. Green Bay have been running early and often all year.
It’s not about running and passing for me. It’s about scheming and game-planning — attacking an opponents weakness, minimising their strengths. Being adaptable and flexible and creative.
The Seahawks don’t do any of that. And you end up with a game like the Wildcard round where LA looked like they knew everything Seattle was going to call.
I think thats right. Its not about run-first or pass-first on the best offenses, its about creativity. variety, and adjustments.
Personnel matters too of course, but we are and have been, lacking in the above for years.
Use what is successful. Which requires you to be good at both passing and running. Look at Buffalo Bills starting with 19 passes and 1 run because their opponent shutdown Derrick Henry and the running game last week.
Oh, I know GB runs well. As does New Orleans.
And I’m not saying to ignore the run entirely. I’m far more in the camp that we have been far too predictable, and far too basic, for far too long. I’m all about keeping the other team off balance as much as possible, regardless of whether that means we pass more or run more.
I mean that the teams that LIVE by the run, Tennessee and Baltimore and Cleveland, that are “tough defense and run-first focused” teams, get dumped early when facing teams that are that AND have superior passing/QB play, all things being equal.
I think it might just be that Mahomes and Andy Reid are that good. And let’s not forget — when the Chiefs beat the Bills in the regular season, they ran the ball 46 times and threw just 26 times. So they adapt, change and scheme to their opponents.
Tennessee lost to run-heavy Baltimore this year. They also won two playoff games last year on an improbable run to the AFC Championship game.
The Browns hammered the Steelers and gave the Chiefs a heck of a game. Could’ve won.
So I don’t think it’s right to say they were dumped out of the playoffs.
To me the Seahawks’ problem has nothing to do with pass/run and everything to do with bad personnel decisions and a complete dearth of creativity, sufficient game-planning and scheming.
RE: The running game.
My old High school coach (nearly 60 years ago) had a unique take on the running game, his game plans were to call a lot of running plays that went outside during the first half of the game & starting with the 1-st or 2-nd possession of the second half – most carries were off tackle, up the middle runs. His contention was that by running wide early, that forced the defensive linemen and LBs to move laterally on a lot of plays and that would tire them out quicker than fighting in a phone booth. It seemed to work pretty well.
My question is: what do NFL teams do when they have much smaller RB’s than the Seahawks preference for 5-10/220 guys, and how does that effect their rushing performances? Perhaps by play calling & scheming? So, I guess I’m saying that the Seahawks running game MAY need better and more -diverse- running play selection to avoid having the other team knowing what your going to do (90+% runs up the gut.)
I guess, that was the philosophy session between Schottenheimer and PC.
PC: Well, we play this and that offense, and y’know, we will be the bully, and they’ll know what is coming upon them, and we’ll execute, no matter what!
Schotty: But that’s ridiculous in 2021, vs top defenses.
PC: Better eat this!
Schotty: Ummm, no?!
Brilliant summary, Rob. It must have taken a lifetime to compile that stuff.
Completeley agree, IOL and RB it is.
As I’ve followed Northwestern closer this season, I think Rashawn Slater could very well fall into late R2. But if it’s Aaron Banks, I would be okay. Add one of them and a quality C, we should be good to go. A possible way could be adding Mack (who will be replaced by Matt Hennessy), and draft his replacement in Alec Lindstrom, BC late on day two.
On RB, I fear, Javonta Williams will go in top 40. Pauline currently has him at #139, I expect that to move up quickly. A late round target could be Chris Rodriguez Jr, UK, 785yds on 118 attempts, 11 TDs. 5’11”, 224pds.
WR… I think, Ben Skworonek from ND will go undrafted. As a UDFA, I think we could take a chance here. He filled the role left open by Chase Claypool and did admirably.
A better option – if we retain that 4th rounder – could be Dyami Brown, NC.
TE was heavily drafted by the Seahawks in 2020. Maybe Colby Parkinson can step up and be that 3rd down threat? A player I would love them to draft is Tommy Tremble from ND, who just declared.
It was super-easy, barely an inconvenience…
Realistically what could the Hawks get in return for Adam’s and Wagner? I am guessing a 1st and change for Adam’s and 2nd for Bobby.
I think you’ll struggle to get much for Wagner.
Adams I think you can get a 2021 first rounder and a 2022 mid rounder.
I truly believe there is no chance Adams gets traded simply because Carroll will not admit he was wrong for doing that trade. If we were to cut Wagner how much is the dead cap hit just curious
Unfortunately, I think you’re right.
$9.6m if cut before June 1st or traded
$13.4m if cut post-June 1st
Not sure how many of you are watching the Chiefs/Browns but a quick reminder…
Adrian Clayborn ran a 4.13 short shuttle at 281lbs.
Quick comparison — Devin Duvernay ran a 4.20 at 200lbs last year.
That Wagner salary in incredible. If he was released, how much would that save? I only ask because a couple times when Wagner has been hurt in his career, it was always KJ who slid inside. Not quite Bobby, but would be much cheaper I would think. If they did that next year, I wonder how much that would save. It sickens me to think of the Hawks without Wagner but we go to the playoffs every year and every year its an early exit. I’ve seen this story before and I’m sick of it. It’s like Groundhog’s Day.
$9.6m if cut before June 1st or traded
$13.4m if cut post-June 1st
Wagner and Adams are here to stay…Thats Pete!
Jamal Adam’s tweet sent 4:31 P.M. 16 Jan 2020
Jamal Adams
@Prez
See y’all in Cabo! @RamsNFL & make sure y’all bring your own damn cigars
too! #Prez
Not shown attached: Dancing Airport Runway Worker gif
he (and other hawks) are punching back at rams players who must have said something about ‘enjoy Cabo’ when they beat the hawks last week. should help keep that rivalry tuned up for a while….
I wish we’d just STFU.
The Rams kicked our arse last week.
Actually it was a series of tweets starting with Ramsey stating that the Seahawk players would be in Mexico while the Rams were playing in the Div Championship. Adams was responding to that. This adds to the rivalry as far as I’m concerned, and yes, it is juvenile.
As far as I’m concerned the Rams earned the right to deliver some crow.
We earned the right to STFU.
I want players with fire in their belly. when was the last time that happened? Doug? Sherm?
To me, fire in your belly doesn’t mean tweeting to your opponents, a week after they kicked your arse.
Sherman getting in Brady’s face after the Pats win in 2012? I’m down with that.
Toasting the Rams loss in Green Bay a week after they tore us a new one?
Pipe down, Jamal.
Like I said.
I’ll take what I get. We don’t have a BAMF at this point. Bobby ain’t it! KJ ain’t it. Russ certainly ain’t it. Carlos Dunlap is just so happy to be out of cincy that he can only see his future one step at a time (I hope we resign him to a multiyear deal to spread his final costs over 3 years).
Fine — but a BAMF isn’t defined by what you say on twitter.
Especially after getting hammered.
Nope, never said it was. It is on the field….and we need those players with that attitude.
Especially when this team beat only two playoff teams this past season.
1. Football Team – they had a losing record!
2. Sure, they beat the Rams, but who cares when your season record against them was 1-2.
Do those two wins even count? This team got lucky with its cupcake schedule and still couldn’t even get the much needed bye.
Ok, Browns. Time to get back into this game. You’re close but KC is kicking your butt.
Ok, never mind. Honey Badger just changed the narrative.
KC isn’t perfect. But the Browns need to play better than this and get a few lucky bounces. Everything is going KC’s way. With Mahomes foot owie I almost expected him to sit out the second half. I don’t think it would make any difference to the end of this game….
No, not perfect, but sticking to their game plan. Cleveland isn’t dead just yet, though. Still think the Browns are a good team.
Nick Chubb.
…should be in Seattle
But he’s not. and neither is TJ Wattt or CEH or anyone else we wanted (I wanted Akers last draft).
Well they bloody well should be.
Yes they should. And the reason why I no longer believe in Pete/John.
Bitonio was another guy that we talked about.
Should’ve taken him.
We talked about him a LOT.
That was the year the Seahawks traded down out of the first round and picked Richardson. His best year being 2017 with 703 yards and 6 touchdowns. Interestingly 2014 was also the year Clowney went first pick.
Oh no. Mahomes doesn’t look good.
22-10 KC, they really only need one more field goal to win. It’s not a good sign that they are starting to run the ball effectively. On the other hand, they may sit Mahomes now that he is banged up.
Looks like a concussion. Let’s hope he is able to be back next week(assuming they win today).
Does anyone here, that’s watched some of the playoffs, think the Hawks are ‘close’? I do not. The defense isn’t good, and the offense is bad. The team is not ascending, lack of resources for the future, lots of money owed (or about to be paid to questionable choices).
Sorry to be negative. And that’s just the roster construction. I cannot imagine a scenario where Russell goes out and we drive for a field goal. I’ve been medium enticed by the idea of trading Russ and rebuilding to fit the coach’s plan. I’m starting to have some pretty severe doubts about that.
Nope. Not close.
Winning the Super Bowl No. Getting to it, yes. I believe the Packers will still be better than us next year but who else? Saints are about to be done. Bucs might be about even with us. 49ers and Rams have QB issues. Cardinals arent ready yet. NFC East is a no. Bears and Vikings Im just not sure about. Its not just about evaluating us its about evaluating the other teams as well.
The Rams had a major QB issue last week and kicked our arse.
One playoff win in four years.
We’re not as good as we think.
Either are the other teams in the NFC.
But that’s not a reason to say the Seahawks are capable of getting to a Super Bowl!
Because guess what — every time the Seahawks play one of those teams (Dallas, LA etc) they lose in the playoffs!
This is purely wishful thinking. The Hawks as currently constructed have proven they can lose to any one of the teams you listed. 12 – 4 was smoke and mirrors. Why do so many people believe this team is close to a Super Bowl, when we are fortunate to have a single playoff win in four years?
A playoff win vs Josh McCown behind a complete second string OL, with not a single WR starter and a backup RB. And still, it was close.
12-4 was indeed smoke and mirrors. As BobbyK has mentioned on several threads, they beat exactly 2 playoff teams, Washington who finished 7-9 and that game they had a guy at QB who was cut 2 weeks later, and the Rams who beat Seattle twice and avenged their one loss to the Seahawks 2 weeks later by drubbing Seattle in their stadium with a QB that was severely limited (that’s called being thoroughly outcoached Pete).
But hey Jamal, after giving up 165 yds rushing to a team you knew going in had to run to win, feel free to give them shit because they lost the next week. Loser.
Yeah that is rich. Right up there with Johnny Manziel trolling the Browns for losing to KC. Yeah Johnny, tell us all about your playoff games when starting QB with same. Better to have people think you are an idiot than prove them right.
I’m sad watching the Browns.
Built exactly how the Seahawks are supposed to be built.
This Browns team reminds me of the 2012 Seahawks. Watch out! They just scored as well. They are playing with their hearts. My opinion of the Browns team this year has gone up by a magnitude.
I was getting the same feeling. Failed in 2nd round… heart breaking loss. They have weapons, just need more confidence as a team, that they can win. Hunt/Chubb really showed up. Mayfield made consistent high caliber throws all game, really played under control and looked like a QB1. The play where the guy fumbled into the end-zone, that was a tremendous throw and catch….. luck got em.
That weird touchback at the end of the 2nd quarter has played a big part in the score. Nice to see the Browns fighting for the ball.
Very lucky with the injury that Mahomes got, he would have never thrown that interception.
IMO, Sorensen was hitting Higgins helmet to helmet. I would have challenged that.
Right. But instead we’ve got expensive idiots popping off on the Rams on social media from the golf course.
Adams is a fucking loser.
Hmmm so Henne and Wilson were both playing the same at the end of the season? Nice long throw straight to the Browns safety. Not sure why KC quit running the ball and running out the clock. I guess you could call that a coaching failure as it was predictable that Henne wouldn’t be accurate.
Okay Henne came through for them with his short passes and scrambling ability. Good job!
Great play calling, very tough to beat the Chiefs when they are coached like that.
Chiefs with Henne are playing better than Hawks with Russ…sad
Very good and informative article. Will for sure be a very interesting off season. The OLine will be an intetesting one for me as I truly believe Russ would get sacked 40 times with 5 all pros blocking. Could there becsome good LG oprions that getcreleased that would be better value than Scherf? Another interesting question is can you afford to pay Metcalf/Lockett $35m+ to be ground and pound? Would we consider trading Wagner and putting Brooks in the middle and extend Wright? I think Griffin is a goner. Would love Javonte Williams to go along with Carson. Another option could be Gus Edwards if Ravens dont tender him. Alot of these questions come down to final cap number. I disagree we are far behing in the NFC, the Saints are in cap hell and Brees will most likely retire. Packers will most likely lose Jones but I would still put them ahead of us but Im jot really scared of any other team in the NFC.
Andy Reid is a baaaad man
He now has the title of “man with largest testicles on planet earth”
The Seahawks should throw money at Mike Kafka and try and hit a home run with the OC.
But they won’t even try.
Rob, that’s “not who we are” and it’s definitely “not who we want to be.” 😉
Sorry I misspelt Dave Canales
Going to need a wheelbarrow to carry his nuts out the stadium.
So weird what happens when your team/coaches play to win…not “to keep it close.”
I just find myself hating PC the more I watch other teams.
how jealous is everyone watching these offence’s in the playoffs?
Watching other teams play has had this effect on me for years!
So the status quo has gotten you one playoff win in three years. How could anyone argue with a straight face that drastic changes aren’t needed?
There are very few options that actually improve the team other than trading Adams. You paid too much draft capital for him. It’s a sunk cost. The worst thing they can do is compound the problem by giving him a record setting safety contract.
Four years
And as mentioned above, that win was against a backup QB in Josh McCown, an o-line that was severely depleted and a WR corps that was totally depleted. At least we know they blasted that severely limited team by the monsterous blowout score of 17-9.
Incredibly good quality journalism, as ever Rob. Thank you for doing what you do! This site is my most visited site on the internet, and for good reason.
Thank you, that means a lot
I love this article. And the comments. A refreshing dose of honestly that I think is the only thing able to save the Seahawks at this point. It amazes me that we lowly fans can see it so clearly, but PC refuses to. Do we really think the players don’t see it too? And feel it? (DK outburst, Russ speaking about as bluntly as he ever will)
Basically, our future hinges on RW and JS combining forces and twisting PC’s arm to consider change in order to set off the series of changes needed to turn it around. And I have zero, absolutely zero faith that PC will do so.
He’ll point to 12-4, he’ll point to injuries, to his stats about the turnover margin. He’s already laid blame on the OC that had Russ and the offense on a record-breaking, MVP pace through the first 6 games of the season and absolutely dragged PC’s negative record-breaking, shambles of a defense through the first half of the season.
Unfortunately, I see no world in which PC swallows his pride and the sunken cost and lets go of his “heart and soul” player, Jamal Adams. Gosh, I hope I’m wrong.
He’ll probably overpay to keep Chris Carson, his beloved 7th round find. And does he really have the heart to move on from KJ, Bobby’s best buddy, and who are Norton’s guys?
I could keep going on and on, but what for? I was already un-invested as a fan this entire season, because it was obvious we were pretenders all along gifted the easiest slate of NFCE and backup QB matchups probably in years.
JS should be given full powers as a proper GM. PC’s philosophy can still win and even compete for titles, but he needs to be protected from himself at this point and surrounded by people who will challenge him and expand/adapt his vision.
The OC hire will be the first domino to fall and IMO tell us everything we need to know about whether we can hope for anything at all next season and in the rest of the PC tenure. And I’m bracing myself for the worst.
100% correct.
And when Russell Wilson said the appointment was ‘super significant’ — he was letting everyone know he understands this too.
I get the feeling that Russ has about the same amount of confidence in Pete hiring the right guy that we do.
Got a feeling you’re right.p
I have a sneaking suspicion a lot of more veteran types probably don’t have much faith.
Nice trick play design there. Winston ftw… lol
I have to say that I have very little faith in PC constructing an effective, SB worthy offense. I’ve been frustrated with our offense since about 2014-2015. It worked when we had Marshawn near the top of his game, and a younger more elusive RW who could consistently and effectively extend plays.
Those days are over. How many years have we had to endure slow starts? It became a bad joke. How often do I have to continue to watch other teams game plan and scheme better than us?
We’ve just gotten stale and predictable and easier to defend over time.
for whatever its worth, saints just went down again, probably brees last year. No nfc teams outside of greenbay have been back to nfc championship game for quite some time. saints looking at cap hell next year
This offseason is the most critical offseason in Seattle in a long time, a lot because last year’s offseason was wasted. Jamal adams is James harden and if Seattle can get a first rounder back then they need to move him. PC and JS need to restore our faith…
“Jamal Adams is James Harden”.
FANTASTIC analogy!!
I think you made some great points in this article. Investing in OL is probably most important and I agree 100% with that. If they want to keep Russ and pay him money they allready gave him then let him lead this team. I couldnt agree more with what you said what they should do with him. (give keys of this team into his hands or trade him this off season).
About Adams situation… It is really debatable what is better for this team, to trade him and sign Neal (who is probably better fit) or pay him big money. I dont know what i would do if i am GM… But i have zero doubt what will Pete and John do… They will sign him and give him 16-18mil apy…
The only thing i think you were wrong is that they wont be able to make SB team because they will pay Russ, Bobby and Jamal 75mil… It is because they wont pay them that money on same year… Adams will play for 10mil next year maybe even less(not on this contract but first year of new one) and in 2022 Bobbys dead cap is only 3.5mil…So when Adams hits 18mil cap hit Bobby should be of the books…
And yes i completely agree about KJ and Shaquill…
If shaquill is willing to play on 5mil apy then ok, otherwise good buy…
Once again really great article…
Maybe I’m totally off on this, but I think JS would move on from Adams if given the choice. It just seems to me that PC is calling the shots at this point and John is just executing them. It’s hard for me to see JS being willing to part with all those picks for Adams without a (proverbial) gun to his head.
I wouldn’t assume Bobby Wagner will be off the books in 2022, or that he’ll take a pay cut in an extension.
One position that should and will be priority in this year draft, and absolutely no one talking about is FS…
Diggs is FA after 2021, he will be 29 and will ask for around 10mil…
And no way you can pay two safeties 25-30mil…
Of course, Blair as FS change that, but i am not sure Pete sees him as single high in cover 3..
I mean, 29 is not really that old. They could easily do a 3-year deal that is back-loaded and then have the option to move on in the final year of the deal.
Maybe they find a guy they like in the late rounds as a backup to develop, but I don’t see it as a pressing need at all.
He will be 29 years and 8 months old at the beginning of 2022 season. Yes i agree you could do 2,3 years contract, but dont see how cap hit for 2022 and 2023 can be lower than 10mil. I mean if you back load deal to lower cap hit in first year and then cut him after two years that means he wont get that 10mil at all. Imo he will want that money, he will want 20mil guaranteed for 3y . And i think you cant pay two safeties that amount.
What do you think, whats the money he would accept to play in 2022 and 2023?
I mean, he signed a 3yr/$18m extension with Detroit with $9.5m guaranteed in the middle of his prime at 25 years old. Sure, the salary cap has inflated, so that will go up to maybe $8-9m/year, but I’m not sure I see some huge jump in his play that will give him leverage to ask for $10m+ at age 29.
Is he a top-10 safety?
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/contracts/safety/
I think we just play it out next year and see how it goes. Jamal Adams is the contract we need to be worried about, not Diggs IMO.
Remember the good old days, when we thought Russell Wilson was better than Aaron Rodgers, and we laughed at Bruce Arians?
I still laugh at BA, but he gets the last laugh. They are in the NFC Championship
I remember last time he was in the championship game though…
Outstanding article Rob. Agree with nearly everything you said, especially as it concerns Adams but really everything was spot on. The only thing I’m not on board with would be resigning Sherm. It’s not because I don’t feel he isn’t capable of playing well still, it’s more a matter of injury likelihood. I just don’t see him staying healthy for a full season any longer. But it’s certainly not something I’m adamant about tho. If they brought him back I’d be fine with it. The more important points like getting better on the online, RB and trading Adams are what matter.
My guess is that’s it for Drew Brees. It’s too bad that such a stellar QB will probably not get that 2nd SB win like Peyton Manning was able to eke out. You need two of them in a way. Rodgers needs that 2nd badly too.
Do you realize that Tom Brady has more playoff wins in his first season with the Buccaneers then the Seahawks! How pathetic is that.
Sorry in the last 4 years
Great article.
Although it’s clear that the absolute worst path forward for the Seahawks is a doubling down and trotting the same tired scheme and personnel out for 2021, it’s all but assured that this is precisely what Pete will do. There may be some new pieces similar to the old pieces, but it will be the same. Any offseason that began without the letting go of KNJ is all the evidence necessary. The new OC doesn’t matter because Pete will dictate the offense. It’s glum, but true.
What if they offered the Dolphins RW and their entire draft for Tua and the Dolphins’ draft? What if they offered RW to the Jets for #2, #23 and Darnold? They’re obviously not anti-trading Russell, per the reports of the attempt to swap him to the Browns a couple of years ago, so why not now? Pete won a Super Bowl with a minimum wage Boyscout – he seems to have no need for a modern QB. Load up on draft picks and restart the franchise.
I don’t mind Pete Ball – but it requires a very specific set of players on the offense and a great defense. The Seahawks have not drafted toward this plan, nor have the free agents they’ve signed been capable of playing it. If that’s the game, the organization has to be aligned to play that style. Having a QB who is now interested in “cooking” and being “the greatest,” whatever that means, is not ideal for Pete Ball. Recycling older running backs, already with injury histories, seems a poor decision. The line – my god. If you’re going to be a Neanderthal, be the king of Neanderthals. You be you.
The worst thing is, even if the Hawks were able to trade RW and Adams for a ton of picks, I have no doubt that Pete would fail to pick the obvious difference maker, choosing instead to trade down and down, accumulating more and then spending them on more of what we’ve seen over the past few years. Yes, maybe they will trip across a DK, but with plenty of Taylors and Collins and Pennys tossed in.
We’ve got five more years of Pete, no idea how many more RW years, but the franchise seems to have had no one at the wheel since the passing of Paul Allen. The coming years certainly don’t feel as if they’re building toward anything. Check our neighbors down the road:
“We’re in a situation that we’re in evaluation mode,” McVay said when asked if there was a scenario where Goff would not be on the roster in 2021. “We’re moving forward, we’re looking forward, and I can’t answer any of those questions until I take a step back and evaluate everything that is in the best interest of the Rams.”
What’s in the best interest of this organization? Sorely not more of the same, but that’s where we’re headed.
I’m just here to say what a legendary username you have chosen.
(oh, and as a side note, seeing all the beating Russ has taken over the years, I wouldn’t feel very comfortable putting Tua behind our OL for the long haul)
Rob, that looks to be an epic post but I have a bunch of errands to run and will sit down to read it the very second I get back in the door.
One comment on today’s games: I want, want, want a 1-2 punch like Rojo and Fournette!
5200 words… you’ll need a window in your schedule!
Wow the truth hurts with you fans. You are have blinders on and again it’s so pathetic
My friend, I think that if you’ve been reading and paying attention to this blog then you would be familiar with the pessimism that Rob and many of his readers have for this organization moving forward. Further, while you may be trying to get a reaction from people by posting the way you are, I don’t think the community here are going to give you the reaction you’re looking for. May be best to just move along.
he is a troll, just ignore them
Based on Rob article, one question for all…
Would you rather
1. Trade Bobby for 2nd or 3rd round pick (not sure what we could get for him), save 10mil for 2021 and clear space for 2022, pay LG (Scherff with that money) and play Brooks and Barton as Mike and Will next season…
2. Keep Bobby even for 2022 with paying Adams big money…
I am just not sure how big of a drop off would it be with Brooks and Cody, but i am like 60-40% for boosting OL option…
Based on Rob article, one question for all…
Would you rather
1. Trade Bobby for 2nd or 3rd round pick (not sure what we could get for him), save 10mil for 2021 and clear space for 2022, pay LG (Scherff with that money) and play Brooks and Barton as Mike and Will next season…
2. Keep Bobby even for 2022 with paying Adams big money…
I am just not sure how big of a drop off would it be with Brooks and Cody, but i am like 60-40% for boosting OL option…
For a 2nd I’d trade Bobby in a heartbeat. Get a cheaper vet or draft an LB in R3-R4 and let Brooks-Barton-BBK-rookie/vet fight for will and mike (and sam).
Currently this team has ridiculously low resources. No money at all, like basically nothing and no picks.
Even with trading Bobby I’m not sure if the team can pay a top shelf LG. We don’t have a CB1, no RB1, not much depth for DT, we’d need another solid DE like Dunlap, if we trade Wagner the minimum is that we need competition, they just cannot give the position to Barton this easy. WR3 is a questionmark, no LG, no C.
And even with trading Bobby, this team would only have around 15-16m. With draft we can fix some of those holes, but still 16m is crazy low with this many holes.
You won’t get a second
A Brooks/Barton/BBK LB trio is disgustingly gross. Barton & BBK are special teams players only and have no business starting.
And when i mentioned Cody. What is really strange for me is that he is great tackler on special team, one of the hardest hitting players on that unit, and when he plays LB he looks so soft
I think it’s his bad angles that make him look soft. About Wagner, I wouldn’t let both him and KJ leave now.
What will happen in my opinion?
Not much. They don’t have picks, they don’t have money and they don’t have many player that could demand good trade capital and we wouldn’t miss them.
I think Carroll is delusional or something, and he thinks that this roster is good. Offense was great first half, the issue (to PC) was that Schotty was not able to adapt better. The defense got better second half so everything is fine there.
I don’t think he’s in love with Griffin, but he might be available cheap (he’s not a good starter CB, and the financial situation of the NFL is bad currently. He also knows the system, so he’s likely more valuable for use than others). I think we’ll keep him around 10-12m APY with limited hit in first year and an easy out after the 2nd or 3rd year.
I think because of the CAP of many teams and since he’s not a bellcow they’ll keep Carson for a reasonable price, around 6-7m APY with limited hit in first year and lower base salary high incentives
Not sure about KJ, but they might keep him also.
I think they’ll extend Adams, and try to limit CAP hit for next year
Create some CAP by extending or restructuring (whichever makes sense) Bobby, Russ, Lockett
I think they’ll be almost completely silent in FA. Maybe make a trade for a player but only for a R5 or R6 pick, and trade some of our players for R4-R7 picks, but only 1-2 total. They might sign some vet or cheap guy, but only a couple.
For the draft I highly doubt they can go BPA, they need to fill some holes and create some depth at certain positions.
I think they’ll go LG or C early, and will draft a CB mid-late (R4-R5), they won’t get an RB maybe only in R7 or UDFA, probably get a DT in R5-6 and maybe a TE in the R4-7 range.
Not my preferred offseason, but I just can’t see Carroll blowing up this roster in the last years of his career.
The offseason after this one might have to be very different, because I just can’t see how Carroll could help Russ with his philosophy and so limited resources. So I think next year might be pretty similar, but likely with worse result (9-7, or 10-6 max and wild card spot, and early exit), Russ will flip totally and demand a trade, and with better financial situation to be parted, the Hawks will grant it to him.
That is my forecast and I really hope I’m going to be wrong
If we pay griffen anything more then 7-8 tops then ill have no hope for the hawks. On his best days he is an average CB. His floor is one of the worst CBs in the NFL. I would be more then happy to use that on a OG or with a 3rd down weapon.
This article is striking in its excellence Rob. So well written and so on point considering the breadth and scope of it all. Sadly(as a perceptive fan)it points out so many flaws both of this regime in Pete and John; and of the quality of the team’s players on the field. Given how we’ve seen things handled up to this point along with what we know is in hand(including lacking draft capitol) – it should take a person an enormous amount of optimism to even try to get excited about the Seahawks near to mid term future.
https://twitter.com/JuMosq/status/1350958964326981642?s=19
Look at this… Dead cap if traded and cut arent the same(its huuuuge diference)…
Can someone explain this and tell is it the same with Russ too…
I have checked it for Russ on OTC and its the same for cut or trade. Obviously something different in Watson contract.
Guaranteed salary.
Russ has none any more, Watson just signed his deal so he has a lot.
Cut = Houston is still on the hook for that salary.
Traded = new team pays that salary.
Seahawks never guarantee past the first year where most teams go into year 2 and 3. Our cut/trade numbers will always be the same.
Rob, your off-season plan just broke the PFN Simulator…
68.
Javonte Williams
RB North Carolina
122.
Dayo Odeyingbo
EDGE Vanderbilt
130.
Ambry Thomas
CB Michigan
131.
Walker Little
OT Stanford
154.
Aaron Banks
OG Notre Dame
187.
Jaret Patterson
RB Buffalo
Here’s how I think the Hawks FA will go this year:
KJ – Seahawks would love to keep him, but not at his 2020 cap number ($10M). He won’t want a pay cut, and will sign elsewhere for $10M.
Olsen – Retires
Irvin – Retires
Hollister – Seahawks love him for some reason that I just can’t see. He’ll be resigned for $5M
Mayowa – Signs elsewhere, $3-5m.
Hyde – Resigned for $3M
Iupati – Retires
Ogbuehi – Resigned for $3m
Dunbar – Signs elsewhere for $5M
G Smith – Resigned for vet minimum
Thorpe – Resigned for vet minimum
Pocic – Signs elsewhere for $10M
Nick Bellore – Resigned for vet minimum
B Jackson – Signs elsewhere for $2M
Dorsett – Resigned for vet minimum
Gordon – Rehab
Damarious Randall – not signed anywhere
Damontre Moore – Signs elsewhere for $2M
David Moore – Resigned for $1.5M
Shaquill G – Signs elsewhere for $11M
Delano Hill – Resigned for $1M
Kyle Fuller – Signs elsewhere for minimum
Shaquem G – unsigned
Jordan Simmons – Resigned for league minimum
Bryan Mone – Resigned
Ryan Neal – Resigned
Jayson Stanley – Who?
Chris Carson – Signs elsewhere for $7M
Poona Ford – They’ll try to resign him for 4 years, and if not, make a 1st round tender
Linden Stephens – League minimum
Adams will be an interesting one. The dont usually do extensions until after the draft. If they are going to trade him they obviously need to do it before the draft. By late April we should know if he is part of the future or not.
I’m sure Positive Pete is thinking we are rebuilding this team from the LOB era. Just look at our record the last 4 years…
2017 (9-7 out of the playoffs)
2018 (10-6 2nd place in division, back in playoffs, WC loss)
2019 (11-5 2nd place division, Divisional playoff loss)
2020 (12-4 1st place division, WC playoff loss)
We’ve improved our regular season record each of the last 4 years. We’ve improved our playoff performance each year excepting this year. I’m sure he’s thinking this year’s playoff performance was just a one-off aberration from this upward trajectory that a few strategic moves can correct.
On the surface, it seems perfectly reasonable to make such an assessment and proclamation. But when you see what we’ve seen, when you dig deeper into the weeds as Rob and others around here have done, a different picture starts coming clearly into focus.
I liken it to the coyote vs. the roadrunner cartoon. I liken it to those times when the coyote in his chase of the roadrunner finds himself over the cliff and his feet still frantically moving, suspended in mid-air for a brief moment until he suddenly looks down and realizes there is no solid ground beneath him, and he crashes back down to the earth.
It’s hard not to think that next season the franchise and state of the team will be over that cliff and suddenly realize there is no solid ground beneath it.
It appears PC is more in love with the win increases over the past 4 years as a marker of team improvement (irrespective of strength of schedule or 2nd or 3rd team QB’s the team has faced over those years) and oblivious to the actual poor performances of the team in the playoffs with only 1 win against an injury-plagued Eagles team with a concussed starting QB.
😂😂😂😂
Just make the announcement Pete
Yes Pete, just please make the announcement so we can watch the only true franchise QB the Seahawks have ever had begin the process of the divorce from you. Won’t that be fun to watch play out……….
We know it’s coming though 🤦♂️
Well on the positive side, all good coaches of the 9ers are going to Jets…
Not Shanny though unfortunately
And Shanny kept the brightest star on his staff in McDaniel.
Ooooof. This is gonna be such a kick in junk, it’ll just be the first domino to fall. Afterwards we will get to see too many of ‘our guys’ resigned, basically running it back. Watson is going to get himself to Miami, which would have been the ideal Wilson trade partner. To be clear, although I’ve never been a big fan of Russell, between he and Pete, Pete has to go. As Rob has noted, no Paul Allen is painful. Let’s say Mahomes can’t go against the Bills, I think the Bills would win, but there is a part of me that thinks the Chiefs, with Henne, can beat the Bills. Hawks with a top 10 qb would not be able to beat the Bills. And that is coaching. Sorry to be so negative. I am more despondent about the current state of affairs, then I was after 2014.
At least Canales has the advantage over Schotty in that he hasnt already been a bad coordinator elsewhere.
Our passing game sucked big time in 2nd half and we are promoting passing game coordinator as OC asking to go Run heavy with a 35m QB. good strategy there Pete.
Pete Carroll…genius
How long until we get the Florio or Cowherd report that Russell Wilson has expressed a preference for his chosen OC?
wilson is talented. Coach Carol wants to run more. Build a wall to protect Wilson and that wall should open holes for runners. 2 problems, 1 solution.
Looks like Watson is almost done and Texans getting ready to trade. Watson for Wilson, not sure if Russ would agree though with the state Texans are in.
But Watson is even more expensive than Wilson.
If the Hawks trade for Watson, they’d still have no picks or cap space.
If Wilson leaves, I’d prefer a rookie QB.
Sure you have to develop him, but the Hawks then have more cap space the upcoming years + some extra picks.
In the end it would be a gamble anyway. If you hit with your pick it’s nice, if you don’t hit you’re kinda doomed.
Conference Championship Weekend
Two best QBs in the NFL (KC/GB), greatest QB ever, and up-start superstar QB. No crap QBs allowed in the final four this year.
Does Wilson think he’s with those guys? Is Wilson with those guys? Would Wilson get back into the elite status with signing Sherff and drafting Williams? I think he could/would.
If you put Wilson in Mahomes’ place, with a super strong play calling, weapons all over the place, solid D, does he take them to the Super Bowl? I think he does.
Reid wanted RW so I’m sure he would succeed. It would look different, but that’s kind of the point – good coaches adjust to their personnel.
So I have no doubt that KC would still be a strong SB contender with RW – obviously not as dominant, but I don’t think they take a massive step back.
I mean heck…look what Reid did with Henne to finish the game? That was depressing to watch because PC would never dream of doing that with RW, let alone CHad Henne.
“good coaches adjust to their personnel”
Yes, yes they do. And they also adjust to changes in the game like Nick Saban has done at Alabama. He hated the up tempo offenses when it first came to the forefront and what did he do? Instead of fighting it and staying with the 1980s power game he was running, he adapted in both his personnel choices (recruiting)and his approach and his offenses are now modern, uptempo and dominating.
What is Pete Carroll doing with what is increasingly uptempo, passing oriented rules in the NFL?
.
.
.
you already know the answer to that question.
I’m very torn between eternally grateful for PC tenure while desperately hoping he gets canned tomorrow. It’s very odd.
I went to Super Bowl 48 – just incredible. One of the most amazing experiences of my life (entertainment/leisure wise). But man…do I just think he is a terrible coach whom the game has passed by, now.
Oh I’ll always be grateful for 48, no doubt. And I’ll be just as ungrateful for 49 and what has transpired since.
Does Wilson think he’s with those guys? Is Wilson with those guys? Would Wilson get back into the elite status with signing Sherff and drafting Williams? I think he could/would.
My opinion…
Yes he does. No he isn’t. No he wouldn’t- not if that was the only change.
Could the Saints be in play as a trade Partners for RW?? If Brees retires of course. They have a fairly creative, offensively minded coach. They have 5 playoff wins in 11 seasons since they won it all.. they need to do something different. What they have isn’t working. I don’t know if they have the draft capital to pull it off, but picks plus a couple defenders to help their cap problem?? Plus a history of trading with Seattle.
They can keep Winston as a backup as far as I’m concerned.
Would RW want to play there with Kamara and Thomas? Could we get Cam Jordan and then stick it in the steelers face by swapping a pick for JJ Watt- it sounds like he’s out? Flip another pick for Mariota?
Just spitballing insane ideas here.
Been saying for at least the last several years that Russ would be someone that I think Sean Payton would be interested in and that I believe he’d thrive with Payton. The Saints already have a short QB and thus their o-line has been built to create not only time for the QB but lanes to see the middle of the field through. Payton already has an abundance of short to intermediate pass plays in the offense cuz that’s all Brees could throw the last few years (it was no coincidence that the only deep ball they threw yesterday was by Winston). With RW, Payton could add back the deep passing game he’s had to shelve the last few years. Plus, he’d get a QB with plenty more mobility than Drew had. To me, it would be an excellent marriage.
Brees didn’t really lose his arm strength until this year with the injury. In the past, Brees could throw deep, it just wasn’t a rocket. This is the frst year where his arm strength became a liability. Almost all QBs go through that. Montana had a sufficient deep ball before his 2nd injury. With the Chiefs, his arm strength was shot. Peyton’s tanked after his last injury with the Colts and got even worse over time (the same Peyton who had a rocket arm in the 00s). Brady is the only QB who has avoided that decline, but I suspect it’s bc the Patriots OL always kept him upright and he releases the ball quickly.
Be careful wishing to be like the Browns – means decades of futility, dozens of bad quarterbacks, and yes you get a lot of high draft picks to build your roster but that is not what the consistent winners in the nfl do – they develop and keep a core unit and build around them to stay competitive each year. Seems to be successful you follow some simple fundamentals:
1. Don’t sign aging vets to their last contract – let someone else do that
2. Draft well – The cheapest way to add talent and churn roster
3. Pay a premium for scouting – udfa impact players are on on every roster and contributing
4. Hire good coaches and develop your players
5. Have consistent upper management – HC, GM, Owner etc. Teams with upper management turnover are always chasing the pack and searching for stability.
Not sure what the Hawks will do but I am not a fan of tanking. The NFC West may have K Murray ( Ariz) as the only returning starting QB in the group.
You’re not serious are you?
No one is suggesting the Seahawks tank for years to build up high draft picks.
Agreed…most of us are suggesting the opposite – we have a trade asset in RW and Jamal Adams that can allow us to get a quick rebuild without having to actually tank.
And if Pete wants to play a certain way – then why the hell not be aggressive to get the personnel you need to win in such a way?
I mean if you replace RW and Jamal Adams with Zach Wilson, 1st round OL, Najee Harris/Javonte Williams, and another 3rd WR/TE (pick 55) – while freeing up money to sign a Scherff, Hooker or Neal…I mean that looks like a legitimate “Pete Ball” team that never has to lose 12 games to get the picks/money they need to make it work.
“Derrick Henry, Nick Chubb, Dalvin Cook, Jonathan Taylor, Alvin Kamara…
Yet the one they’ve taken early, the one they drafted in the first round, is Rashaad Penny. Of all the names they’ve passed on, he was the person they pulled the trigger on. A one-year starter at San Diego State who hasn’t once looked like a feature runner, even when healthy.”
You know what’s really, really fricking scary about this statement (which is totally true)? Penny was a first rounder…the other guys were not. What a failure of epic proportions.
If I could only ask PC/JS one question where I’d get a true answer, no punches pulled – “what the hell did you see in Rashad Penny?” would be VERY high on the list. Not the first thing…but continually perplexed by that pick. I’m battling hindsight on this…but I would have been pissed had they picked him in Round 3, let alone 1.
I won’t beat an already ailing horse (I’m no vet, but that things dead). Perhaps PC/JS don’t listen to other scouts, that’s okay. Maybe they do everything in-house and prefer their own evaluations. However, nobody was saying wonderful things about Penny. How do they have such a different evaluation, to grade him a R1 RB?
His best production was always in the return game (we dont let him do that), and his run game production = If he can’t get a clean path to the second level he doesn’t really do much else. He can catch a short pass, and run Marshawn’s outside zone or outside counters from yesteryear.
Then the Senior Bowl happened. Penny had a couple outside runs (we sucked at that), and he caught a couple nice passes from the backfield (we sucked at that). There’s your reason. As simple as Pete can make it. He saw a square hole, so he put in a rectangle..which is still technically a square..
Fair points
I will add this but don’t get my defense confused, I’m not going to die on the “defend penny hill”
I remember when we did select Penny there were reports that a team reached out immediately after and wanted to trade for him. I believe it was the Lions or Jets, I can’t remember since it was a couple of years ago now. So I think there were some teams who did view Penny as a serious round 1 talent and obviously we fell into that too.
Does he fit the Seahawks running style? No, absolutely not. I just think there was some hype behind Penny for some weird reason or another.
That assumes they were telling the truth about that. I think it was a defense mechanism knowing the draft pick would get public backlash. I think it was BS – that was a good RB draft with a lot of options.
We’ll never know the true story until JS/PC releases their tell all draft nights book titled “Reaches”
Aren’t there always “rumors” that some other team(s) wanted the guy we pick with our top selection?
The 2 1st rounders that comes to mind for me are James Carpenter and Jordyn Brooks. Not sure if I trust the Carpenter one. Carpenter is also a while back, so my memory is fuzzy on it. Definitely trust the Brooks one (Bengal insiders on Bengal forums swore he would be the first pick of the 2nd round).
The cynic in me wonders if the Seahawks dropped in the names of Lynn and Pederson to the media to make it seem like an exhaustive search.
When in reality, it was always going to be someone like Dave Canales.
Prove me wrong, please, PCJS
Everything with this team has been predictable…so I’d say your cynicism is valid.
I wish they would prove you wrong but I seriously doubt they will. Heck, at least bring someone in from outside of the organization.
I don’t see Pete getting Pederson because he isn’t willing to not be the best coach on his staff.
Now they have talked to Adam gase and plan to talk to Kafka
Just like the cynic in Matt thinks they planted the story about other teams wanting Penny directly after Seattle drafted him. Why do I think you’re both right? Oh, it’s the cynic in me though it could just be psychological conditioning.
Pete is slowly becoming the Instagram Influencer who rents a Ferrari and gives business advice. I just think he is utterly full of it.
“For a limited time, I’m giving you my book for FREE. That’s a $60 value.”
“Swear to God we interviewed a bunch of dynamic OC candidates.”
Same ish.
“We interviewed literally like 20 guys, but we just felt at the end of the day Dave was the perfect fit for what we are trying to do here. I am so jacked up for Dave installing my…oops I mean his offense”.
Dear God that reads like the actual quote he will inevitably give. Laugh, cry…ugh.
Yep, laugh and cry
Or maybe they truly want to get an OC that will be able to harness all of Russ’s potential, in addition to have the experience to challenge Pete sometimes. Bringing in an OC (with ast HC role too) that used to be a HC could cross off two requirements. We conveniently forget Pete’s ramble in the season ending presser about wanting more people on the team that can call him out.
My more optimistic than pessimistic take is that they are actually going through the paces here, and I would bet Russ is included. In Russ’s presser, he mentioned being in meetings all day on monday. Within a day, JS is extended and Shotty is shown the door. I dont think any of these are coincidences.
1. Pete didn’t say that. He was asked who kept in check, he said his son and tater, then — because neither is with the team any more – casually said it was something he would look into. He hardly made a point of bringing that to the table.
2. You’re right. Maybe they will appoint a non yes-man. I am open to being pleasantly surprised. I also think it will be Dave Caneles, Nate Carroll or someone similar.
As per CHAs summary (thx Curtis), I think he did:
[Michael shawn] Accountability in the building for you? “Good Q. Always gauged loyalty in people tell you what you need to hear when you might not want to hear. Really miss Brennan. He and Nate big factors, will tell me things other guys won’t. Gonna miss him. John and I go nose to nose on all our stuff. He gets rec’s from the personnel side and keeps banging away at it. I need more help, I need to be coached up like other guys do too. Over the years I’ve lost guys, Carl smith would tell me anything. I’ve lost a few guys like that. It’s something I’m looking at.”
In listening & reading the above, and seeing the names given, I truly believe that they (JS, RW, and PC) are trying to get the right guy and a strong voice to be the Offensive face of the team. Don’t get me wrong, I am sure the scheme will still lean on a strong run game, but I don’t feel it will be just another yes man to PC. I just think that Shotty never challenged PC; just did what he said..now he is no longer with the team right after “its something I’m lookin at”.
In terms of drafting, your well positioned writings and logic got me thinking that a RB will be the call in RND 2; just makes too much sense….with a FA OG to round out the upgrade.
I listened to it and I can tell you — those words tell one story. Listening told another. He most definitely was not speaking with any conviction. He was caught off guard by the question and just basically waffled.
My question for all of you is the following: 1) How can we get this article in front of PC just so that he can at least read it?? I am sure there are some innovative thinkers and folks with some connections here on Twitter etc or can someone reach out to Joe Frann/Bob Condotta/Collin H or others that have an outlet to PC. Vulcan Group connections? Folks Rob interviewed like Baldy? Let’s try to make a change and make an attempt and at least we can say that we tried.
Not sure about Gase but Kafka sounds like a great idea to me.
ditto and ditto
Unlikely Kafka is the guy though.
I would lose my mind if they hired Adam Gase. This has to be a joke!
I hope they throw a ton of money at Kafka and make it too good to turn down.
Will they?
Almost certainly not
And here’s a question that needs to be asked.
Who is leaking out all of these names?
Are other teams not talking to anyone? Why is every Seahawks interview or talk being revealed?
I just have this really awful feeling this is all just a media game to create the impression of a thorough, extensive search. Just so they can justify the underwhelming appointment they eventually make.
You mean the one they’ve already decided on I presume
Pete had hired his OC within 3 days each of the past 2 times there was an OC change. Dave Canales just TURNED DOWN the Vanderbilt OC job…COME ON DOWN NEW YES-MAN *price is right voice*
This team is so screwed.
“You’re the next contestant on Pete Carroll’s revolving OC position”
I don’t buy they were serious about speaking with Gase. One reason, Jets were pretty awful offensively and two, the thought of Adams and Gase reuniting just doesn’t add up. Kafka would be an interesting option but I also doubt he would agree to be PC’s rubber stamp. As stated by others and Rob, they are creating an appearance of a thorough search while they have their true target in mind.
Yes I was just reading that Gase last 6 years of Jets offences ranked 21 to 32. That’s bad. I really don’t want him.
Assuming Houston isn’t really in the market for a 32 year old quarterback, because they’re in a rebuild at at this point, here’s some next-level rosterbation. Obviously it’s kind of massive and depends on the falling of many a chip, but in my opinion Watson is as good as Wilson, if not better in some ways (factoring in age, especially so), and quarterbacks like that don’t come easy. If the Seahawks are set in their ways, they should pull this trigger.
Russell to Miami for high picks
high picks to Houston for Watson
I get that Watson is nearly as expensive as Wilson, but to me a critical issue facing this team is whether or not Russell wants to run Pete’s offense for the rest of his career. Maybe Watson, used to scrambling for his frickin’ life, might be OK with that? I don’t really know much about Watson.
Might be worth it just to make sure Watson doesn’t go to San Fran, which scares the shit out of me.
I don’t think Watson would take kindly to PC’s philosophy, hence many of us saying get a rookie QB. It makes most sense from so many angles.
even Rams. They are more open to such trades.
If Watson gets traded, it’ll set an interesting precedent for Russ. I’d presume their trade value is comparable. It’ll also show that a player like him can request a trade and get moved. On the flip side, depending on the haul, Hawks might think consider the trade more than previously considered.
The one thing that differs between the two QB’s is the trade clause. Yes Wilson can agree to a trade he deems worthy, but if the Hawks gutted the his new team with picks he may not feel like going. If they were to trade him, Wilson may get involved and dictate what his new team is dishing out. No sense for him to go to a team with no draft capital. He may as well wait it out until FA at that point.
I don’t follow.
Watson and Wilson both have No Trade clauses in their contracts.
You’re totally right, my bad. I assumed Wilson only had a no trade clause.
Before this Watson issue, it’s nearly unfathomable for a team trade a franchise level QB in their prime. It doesn’t happen, it’s a prerequisite for a SB winning team.
I don’t think there are teams that are just a Russell Wilson away from winning a Super Bowl, Dolphins have pieces, but all other teams need work.
I do believe both sides would like to make it work this year, same with Jamal. But gets interesting with another year of mediocrity.
Jets are putting together s pretty good coaching staff. Some quality names mentioned.
Jets should trade for Watson.
They have draft capital to get the deal done.
Watson would be a superstar in NY.
If they’re not sold on Zach Wilson – they should go for it.
Rob, what are your thoughts on Greg Newsome II? Listed at 6’1″ and 190 pounds and he is an alpha type of personality. Of course he needs to have the 32 inch arms, but he looks long and he plays the left cornerback spot for a very good Northwestern team. Currently he is projected as a day 2 pick. Thoughts?
I haven’t really studied him but I know Tony P likes him
Seahawks talking with Adam Gase. Lol you can’t make this up.
Just read about it, at least Adams will be traded again :).
I keep seeing this and I sincerely hope it doesn’t happen.
I don’t know man, if it meant trading Adams………..
Seems like that would be a given…and since we know Pete loves Jamal, it ain’t gonna happen!
I just don’t understand Pete’s vision with Diggs-Blair-Adams-Neal Blair the SS? then you spend 2 1’s+ for a specialty role? Does Jamal take a hybrid LB position with KJ possible leaving?
Neal is an exclusive-rights free agent that’ll be kept for ’21, but looked like a starter in my opinon during Adams’ absence.
I like Diggs more as a bridge-FS rather a player we extend/build around, but given our cap/draft capital i think a short jarran reed type deal would do both sides a favor in getting him compensated/another shot at FA while also giving us ability to draft or sign another/release him once the front loaded deal has little/no dead money.
I’ll be pissed if Neal is just on special teams if Adams’ repeats the same play in ’21. If we’re not sold on Adams by this time next year i’d move forward with extending Diggs/placing high-round tender on Neal while letting Blair prove it in his final year of his contract with eyes on drafting a Saftey in ’23 if Blair isn’t extension-worthy.
I didn’t think Blair at Nickel would work out (we still don’t know, but they sounded confident about that move)…this may sound crazy, but it wouldn’t shock me if they tried him out at outside CB.
That, is yet another, in a long line of atrocious picks. The fact that people gloss over the fact that the team traded for BOTH Diggs and Adams after he was drafted (not saying you made that argument)…huge indictment. It’s just stunning how much high end capital this team has just pissed away over the years.
Diggs was very, very good this year and easily our best DB. Almost no posts/deep middle throws completed against us all year and he ended with 5 INT, easily leading the team. I’d keep him over Jamal if I had to choose between the two.
We talk a lot about what they should do, but what do you guys think the Seahawks will do in regards to lack of draft capital?
Last year was the least amount of picks they have made at 8. If history tells us anything they are going to make a trade to get some picks. I think Schneider loves drafting lots of guys and being able to move around in the mid rounds.
I think they will appoint an underwhelming OC.
I think they will try and re-sign as many players as possible and there won’t be any significant changes.
I think they will bring back Sherman and people will be so distracted by that, it’ll take up all of the off-season discussion.
I think they will trade down from #56 and spend six picks — after the inevitable ‘trade back into round seven for a guy who won’t make the team’.
Unfortunately I think Rob is completely correct here. Slow motion crash.
It will be fun when they trade down and pick up an extra demarcus Christmas and deejay Dallas like player.
The Seahawks draft just like they do free agency, quantity over quality.
I’ve said it tons of times…John is incredible at turning that $100 Bill into four $20s and a $5. “But I got 5 bills in place of this 1!”
This is a good analogy. It’s just weird that they go for quantity in FA and the draft, but will trade first round picks for Jamal, jimmy graham, and Percy.
Like do they know they can get high level players without trading valuable picks?
They seem to have come to the conclusion that they needed ‘high picks’ to acquire elite talent. Thus the Adams trade.
But then look at the players they could’ve had, but passed on, that we all talked about in depth.
Chubb, Watt, Hopkins, Henry, Thomas…
I would be genuinely excited if Pederson or Kafka were installed as the new OC. Lukewarm towards Lynn and Steichen, and would be rather disappointed with Gase or Canales.
Pederson should be the head coach.
This may be seen as heresy, but I’d be all for this. Hopefully we can get him as OC and promise him the HC job after Pete retires.
If the Hawks somehow succeeded in getting Pederson as an OC, I would hope he eventually becomes the HC as well. Unfortunately, he is unlikely to come on board in that role, and even if he did I think it’s unlikely he’s still here at the end of Pete’s tenure.
Pederson did an awful job with Philly the last two years and its become overwhelmingly apparent that Reich was the brains behind that superbowl win.
For all Pete’s faults, he deserves a ton more credit that suggesting Doug Pederson would be anything close.
He didn’t do a good job this year, admittedly.
But increasingly the turd in the punch bowl appears to be Carson Wentz.
I’d be totally fine with Pederson. It would show Pete isn’t just after a yes-man.
https://twitter.com/robertmays/status/1351240126442172419
I’m going to watch the tape, eventually, but I bet in three games against the Rams, the OL never blocked up a stunt this well. The QB also never moved like that to extend the play within the pocket, but that’s a separate issue.
Packers OL:
LT: Billy Turner (3rd round pick) [usually David Bakhtiari, 4th round pick]
LG: Elgton Jenkins (2nd round pick)
C: Corey Linsley (5th round pick)
RG: Lucas Patrick (undrafted)
RT: Rick Wagner (5th round pick) [normally Turner is their RT]
Their normal LG is Lane Taylor (undrafted) who was lost for the season.
How confident I am Pete/John can improve the running game this off-season with a quality LG and young RB.
https://ca-times.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/a2a1179/2147483647/strip/true/crop/2048×1152+0+0/resize/840×473!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F82%2F86%2Ff0d7a5cde5a329300119576de757%2Fsd-1547675814-uncnnbm6m4-snap-image
Please don’t let him be our OC!
And another…
Now Brandon Marshall is tossing out a Russell Wilson trade suggestion.
7:50 into this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On-7qsvRKaM&feature=emb_logo
And Nick Wright implies Marshall, the ex-Seahawk, knows more than he’s letting on.
This is really starting to feel a bit inevitable, at this point.
Yes… it’s one thing when these trade rumors are leading up to contract negotiations.
This feels completely different.
There’s a whole lot of smoke…and RW is at the age where you can’t mess around – that’s always what I’ve hung my hat on with this whole scenario.
Maybe? I mean besides the name is this not just another guy they cut mid season? Their relationship is speculative. Just because Russ threw him the ball doesn’t mean they are tight though.
Huh? I don’t think anybody is making the argument that Brandon and Russell are best friends; but Brandon is absolutely connected in the league. Seems like an odd thing to just throw out there, doesn’t it? And you’re starting to see this type of talk all over the place, now.
I mean…besides Deshaun and Russell – name another high end QB that’s had trade rumors over the last 5+ years? The Deshaun trade rumors are about as 100% as you can get – nobody doubts the validity of that one. So maybe the RW stuff isn’t so far fetched?
when the Pack picked Love, there were definitely Aaron Rodgers trade rumors going around. If you do a ‘Rodgers trade rumors’ search, tons of articles pop up. Until Russell comes out and demands a trade, it’s night-and-day different in my opinion to what’s going on w Deshaun.
I know many here are super frustrated w the treading water feeling right now – but trading a franchise QB still in his prime – is a really desperate move. Hard for me to imagine a team coming off a 12-4 season doing that.
Hopefully (and I know I’m an optimist) – we flip the switch w a OC hire that changes things. I still think if Russell is playing at his usual level, we have a team that can compete w any of the NFC clubs next year.
Here’s a question to PC historians, has he ever made a DC or OC hire that came out of nowhere, or was a big surprise? Would we put Schotty in that category?
That’s the thing. Russ would have to request a trade, which is another facet of his no-trade clause. Watson hasn’t taken that step yet and I think he is waiting to see who they hire as their coach.
I don’t see Rodgers-Wilson as being remotely the same thing. Rodgers is 37 and the Packers drafted a QB, much like they did with Rodgers-Favre. That was a reactionary “trade Rodgers”
situation. There was no talk before that.
There is no heir apparent in Seattle and RW is 32.
I suppose your thesis of a disastrous off-season would hold water if they hadn’t finished 12-4. The draft is a crap-shoot. The man who selected Penny over Chubb is the same man who picked Wagner and Metcalf in the 2nd, Wilson in the 3rd, Sherman and Chancellor in the 5th.
Why hasn’t a NFL team offered you a front office job? 🙄
You can be pleased with the end-of-season record while also acknowledging that the moves they made leading into the year were not congruent with the stated off-season objectives they had. It could be argued that a similar clash of thought process vs. execution is the reason the Hawks are at home right now.
They had their hits for sure but I liken it to the old rock bands that are still living off their hits but haven’t written or performed any hits in 20 plus years. Living ofc the old stuff is ok, but sure would prefer they came up with a way to stay relevant and keep providing us with new hits, schemes, adjustments, etc.
I for one think if we had Rob, Cha, Vol12, Seamode and maybe a commenter that knows the cap really well making decisions the last 5 years – the roster would be in a lot better place.
I think we found Pete’s burner account.
In all seriousness, Dan – these types of posts are pathetic. Why don’t you rebut Rob’s arguments instead of going ad-hominem? There’s actually a pretty great conversation going on here that many of us are happy to engage in – so I’m not sure what the whole goal is with White Knighting for PC/JS – two grown men who are millionaires.
They really don’t need some random sticking up for them on a blog.
And I do find it funny that you reference 1 acquisition that happened recently, while the others occurred 9 years ago.
Dang Dan….12-4, against a weak schedule, never playing closed circle football, getting bounced (predictably) in the first round: that is an ugly season, for this organization, at this point. You are able to fan how you want, but I could not disagree more strongly with you.
As far as Russ wanting out, I hope he speaks up soon, at this point I hope he stays, and that the other side of the argument goes.
A poster above made some great pointe re Penny, specifically that for him to be valuable he needs to be used on returns. Now is the time.
Carson, although a lovely story and ideal running style (also love his calm way of dropping the ball upon entering the end zone, similar to Barry), needs to not be resigned. We will overpay if he’s resigned. Too injured to be used often.
Travis Homer is a useful special teams player, and he can pass block, but he’s too small to be run the way Pete likes to. Deejay can’t pass block. How? How was that not known? Dallas looked like he had some shake, but they’d rather run Collins and Bo, off of the street, instead of using their 4th rounder. That’s a vicious indictment.
An indictment of the running scheme is Mike Davis being able to run in Carolina. The 9ers being able to run with fill in the blank. GB running effectively, with whomever, against the rams.
All of this leads back to this really weird obsession of Pete’s with style points. It’s not enough to win/score, it needs to be done in a certain way. And that is so lame.
A word of advice Dan — comments like ‘Why hasn’t a NFL team offered you a front office job?’ might cut it on other forums. On here we don’t debate opinions like that. Attempts to undermine to avoid debating the issues raised might be the en vogue thing these days from people unwilling to consider uncomfortable talking points. But that doesn’t excuse such an unlettered remark.
What does 12-4 prove? They beat two playoff teams. One was the 7-9 Washington Football Team, in the post-season by default thanks to the wretched NFC East. The other was the Rams, who hammered the Seahawks in the wildcard round.
The 12-4 record included eight games against the NFC East and the AFC East — an extremely favourable schedule.
They also had the luxury of facing the Falcons — who were bad — and Minnesota — who were wildly inconsistent and more or less dominated the game aside from one drive and a mad five minutes after half time.
And ultimately whether they won 9, 10, 11 or 12 games — they lost embarrassingly in the wildcard round to a division rival.
The Seahawks had a poor off-season as I’ve detailed many times in great detail, explaining my thought process and backing up my opinions. I predicted 10-6 — and if I’d known the Niners were going to collapse with injuries and the Cowboys/Vikings were going to be as bad as they were, I would’ve predicted a better mark. I expect a bit more than ’12-4′ as a retort for the concerns I raised which were valid, even if you disagree.
No, it isn’t.
The draft, when done properly, is the pathway to success. The early Carroll-era Seahawks are testament to that.
The mistakes Seattle has made recently in the draft were easily avoidable.
This is a strawman argument. It’d be a decent counter to someone suggesting the Seahawks haven’t drafted anyone good ever. But as you and I both know, I haven’t written that.
https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1351296651584016384
NFL Combine changes. Looks like they are allowing individual pro days but no concerted gathering of the NFL in Indy.
It’s basically cancelled.
Which is a massive shame — and it means public information this year will be seriously limited.
Not going to start a COVID debate – but isn’t this like the ideal situation that should alleviate concerns with the virus? I mean…medical checks, controlled environment, etc.
I don’t know…this seems like it’s way easier than playing a game. Can’t believe they aren’t holding it – a real shame.
I’m not sure why they couldn’t just test everyone in advance and limit the numbers of reps from each team.
You could easily separate all the players in a huge empty stadium, even for drills.
So I must admit, I am a little confused by the need to make this call now.
Maybe it’s just the aesthetics?
Has to be aesthetics – because it doesn’t make sense otherwise. I mean, again, wouldn’t you think holding a game is significantly more difficult than holding workouts? The positions are already segregated.
I don’t know…this just sucks and feels like there’s no actual reason outside of “good publicity” with a group who probably doesn’t watch football, anyways.
Weird.
All forecasts of the C-19 infection rate and deaths in the USA are pointed way up. There was a recent report from the CDC that there could be 500k deaths in the USA by the end of February. Realistically, I doubt they could conduct a combine without C-19 issues propping up. The amount of travel (team employees, draftable players) involved in a high risk environment would be irresponsible.
Hopefully the SB 55 goes off without a hitch, fingers crossed.
But wouldn’t the alternative that is being offered – to have individual pro days, be even more risky?
Pro-days are additional to the combine.
Pro-days are not sanctioned by the NFL, the combine is sanctioned by them.
They can control what they can control. The NFL wants to minimize litigation exposure if a C-19 outbreak occurs at the combine. Imagine the nightmare (and expense) if something happened. NFL CYA
Charlie, don’t know if you read the memo from the NFL or not but it looks like they will coordinate some of this and by including it in the memo kind of sanctions it.
With all due respect, how is the combine a “high risk environment?”
Controlled. Medical checks. A younger demographic that isn’t remotely in the same risk category as older folks who are far more affected by this. Rigorously scheduled. In an empty stadium.
Players could literally quarantine for 10-14 days post combine for extra precaution.
I mean…a trip to the grocery store is way, way more risky than this. I don’t know – they can just control so much of the event that I just don’t see it as high risk. To each his own though. I am by no means a virologist.
The Chiefs 3-point favorites against the Bills.
Money is coming in on the Bills hot and heavy however.
Might shrink this line to under 2.5 by kickoff.
The Packers are early 3.5-point favorites over the Bucs.
More money on the Packers than Bucs so far.
Very interesting.
So scratch Mike Kafka off the list:
https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/1351320728927350792
JLC said Pederson and now Kafka are out — the two most appealing candidates.
I figured he was a long shot from the beginning. If Eric Bienemi does get a HC job, Kafka would be next in line as Chiefs OC. That would be a dream job for an up and coming potential HC.
JLC on Kafka/Seattle just now on KJR…
“It’s not happening”
He’s also spelling out the issues here. Coaches won’t want to be caught between a quarterback who wants to do one thing and a Head Coach who wants to do something else.
La Canfora basically saying they’ll end up with a yes-man.
Yeah, looking that way. Dave Canales or, wait for it…Austin Davis!
Or Nate Carroll
Cha-Ching! We have a winner!
This is so clearly, obviously “Pete’s team”…. at least until 2025.
All the signs pointing to more of the same – indeed, a doubling-down on the footballing and recruitment philosophy that has gotten the team to this point.
A 12-4 record earned on a weak schedule sure papers over a lot of cracks. Unfortunately, I doubt whether anyone (non-playing) in the organisation is not drinking the Kool Aid at this point. Probably one of the reasons why Schotty is no longer in the building.
This is all Seahawks PR crap. How “sought out” Canales is, casually turning down other jobs so we can be “grateful to be able to keep him on board” when PC promotes him…
Actually, if Canales was smart, he would have taken that college OC job, gotten out from under Pete and try to establish his own style and reputation. But maybe he isn’t that smart…
I don’t blame any man for not wanting to coordinate Vanderbilt’s offense.
Fixed it for you… 😉
Haha! I love that editorial “fix” Sea Mode! Right on!
I fear you’re right.
I’d love to know what Pete is thinking right now. Let’s assume they’ve talked to a bunch of guys and the interest is lukewarm or non-existent.
What does that tell him? Is he surprised? Disappointed? Concerned?
Does it spur any self-reflection?
Because if he ends up having to appoint Dave Canales, after all these talks, what does that say?
Are we already getting to a slightly desperate stage if they’re talking to Adam Gase?
I can’t help but feel Pete needs to see just how unappealing he’s made an opportunity to work with Wilson/Metcalf/Lockett/Brown.
Usual caveat — if they make a great appointment, I will happily write a long article saying I was wrong and praising the move.
Great questions. Man, an interview with JS sure would be great right now… Did he ever even give one after his extension was announced? Isn’t that, well, usually an expected thing when you get a huge new deal until 2027 or whenever it is…?
And I sure hope we get that long article, which I’ll gladly join in heaping blame on myself in the comments!
Schneider hasn’t done a proper press conference or non-team employee interview since just after the draft — as far as I’m aware.
ugh. .. i so hope you have to write that long article Rob.
because if you all end up being proven right, and we do hire Canales, a guy under the guy we just fired for not being good enough – – – that will be a huge disappointment, and validation of the yes-man theory, and a really hard one to stomach.
I’m pulling for a guy out of college, preferably SEC background (but power 5 will do) that can reconnect to the modern athlete (helpful with draft prospects) and college player/packages of “modern” offenses to bring life to the passing and rushing attack. Think of it as being similar to how the RPO took over the NFL in just a few years.
Like everyone else I hope you have to write that article. Pete has torpedoed this job a fair bit but this is also what you get when you fire an OC suddenly. You are at the mercy of the market. All the offensive coaching talent available like Daboll and Smith are looking at HC not OC jobs. Second tier young guys like McDaniels and Lafleur are following their friends up the latter. No reason to leave. Pederson doesn’t want to be an OC and Kafka is insurance if Beinemi leaves to Houston. Timing has a part to play and retreads or one of Pete’s boys seems likely.
I’d love to know the thoughts of the person that is providing advice & guidance to Jody Allen…
That sort of self reflection on the coach’s part may possibly be initiated by an engaged owner. But I doubt if that gonna happen here.
I know it can’t and won’t happen, but a thought popped into my head as I watched a bit of the games this weekend: I would even mind Tony Romo as OC at this point…
Tony is very comfortable in his current job.
They wouldn’t be able to / or want to outpay his TV deal.
I’ve never thought he wanted to go into coaching either, he has never mentioned that as a dream of his (or not).
Tony is currently living the dream!
He’s on $10m a year to work two days a week for CBS.
Did anybody even read my “can’t and won’t happen” preface…! 😂
off that specific topic — – but how good was Romo’s call in that KC/Cleveland game this weekend?
Along w his knowledge, his enthusiasm is such a breath of fresh air on those telecasts, he’s my favorite by far these days.
Tony is one of my favorites.
I love Russell Wilson but (a) I think he’s starting to eye the door a bit more deliberately than he has in the past; and (b) IF Seattle could trade him for a pair of first round picks – ONE of which was high enough to bet us Justin Fields – and IF Seattle spent the MILLIONS they saved between the rookie contract and RW3’s contract and invested it on the O-line . . .
To me, given the offense Pete CLEARLY wants to run / intends to run, the combination of Fields + a Top-5 O-line for the next 4 season is GREATER than 4 more years of RW3 with a middling to poor O-line.
*get us, not bet us
I’m not sold on Fields. I will study him more if/when needed.
Hey Rob,
What do you think of Kylin Hill from Mississippi State as a later round back?
I need to study him more
I was just about to ask this, and I think he’d be a great backup option if we cant get Javonte Williams. He’s an exciting runner who has nice hands and explosiveness.
WOW! This guy plays in fast forward compared to everyone else on the field. Just look at the burst when he plants his foot and turns up field. Sudden, crisp routes, catches with hands away from body, a couple nice high points. Looks like exactly what we were talking about looking for in a #3, with potential to maybe become even more down the road.
D’Wayne “Dee” Eskridge | 2020 Highlights
https://youtu.be/T4hxASGk6RA
That shake and acceleration at 8:18. Whew!
5’9, 190, so good size for the slot. Averaged over 20yds/catch each of the past 3 seasons. Also played CB in 2019, broke his collarbone after 4 games. This year as a 5th-year senior had 768yds/8TD in 6 games. At that pace for a full 12-game season… That’s the level of domination you want to see at a lower level of competition.
Ran a 4.33 laser in 2018 according to Draft Diamonds. (but I wouldn’t really doubt his speed anyways after seeing those highlights)
One to add to the list and look at more closely for sure.
Physically looks bigger and stronger than his measurables would suggests. Looks like a player wit bulk, which is a great sign for a fast runner.
Off-topic (??)
What about turning in Artie Burns in as a FA reclamation project? 33.25in arms!
Absolutely brilliant article, Rob!
The most important point that you made was the need for Seattle to be honest with themselves – take a good hard look at the state of the roster, coaching & salary cap situation and make the hard, honest choices.
As others have said, Carroll is a major hurdle to any overhaul of either the roster or the footballing (& recruitment) philosophy of the organisation. He’s becoming more conservative with every season, more convinced that his approach is the only way, increasingly blind to his weaknesses. As a consequence, his team is too predictable and too easy to scheme against – we rely on individual moments from a small number of players rather than the ‘system’. It’s unsustainable and will eventually take its toll.
I’m worried that Schneider may be suffering from a similar delusion…. they have reached for questionable talent in multiple drafts and since the majority have not panned out as they’d hoped, the Seahawks are becoming reliant on importing aging players who are no longer wanted by other teams. An honest evaluation of Schneider’s performance as GM is also needed – but this may be difficult since we don’t really know where Schneider’s responsibility ends and Carroll’s starts when it comes to recruitment and roster building.
1. Need Carroll to hire two new coordinators and to provide appropriate ‘freedom’ to the new OC to develop and run his preferred scheme.
2. Re-work Wilson’s contract – need to get that cap hit down to a more manageable number – is this possible or likely?
3. Re-work Wagner’s contract – if not possible, then seriously need to consider cutting him (and eating a $7.5m hit this season, saving $10m in 2021 and $20m in 2022)
4. Re-work Dunlap’s and Lockett’s contracts – both in final year, might be easier to achieve with Dunlap. Consider trading Lockett if can’t re-work.
5. Adams… a major challenge (and a major mistake). Honestly, don’t see anyone handing over a 1st rounder (especially not a top 20 pick) for him… and don’t see anyone paying him $17m+ per season. Can they reach an agreement on a multi-year contract at $15m per annum? If not, then they have to be prepared to trade him at a significant loss.
6. Carson… I love the way he plays – when healthy, he is a 1,500+ yd rusher. Can he stay healthy? $5m per annum with another $3m on Hyde or Penny (after next season) isn’t a bad situation, with the potential to be very, very good.
7. Invest properly on both lines. If these playoff games have shown us anything, it’s that the game is still won & lost in the trenches, regardless of whether the play-calling is pass-heavy or run-heavy. Dominate the line of scrimmage, doesn’t matter who your running back or safeties are, you will be extremely hard to beat against any opponent. It was the philosophy of the ’85 Bears and it’s still guaranteed to work, especially when you have a QB like Wilson (much, much more than a game manager).
Sadly, I have very little confidence of anything changing under Pete & John unless there is a significant and obvious decline in competitiveness and W-L record.
Until then, we are stuck with the tried & tested approach until we run into the inevitable brick wall – by which time it will be a total rebuild challenge for the next guy!
Rob, I’ve been off the computer for a bit but wow this article was a genuine pleasure to read — next level writing. You’re the best sports writer in this town and you’re not even in town.
Thanks Paul
It’s terrible that we only have one pick in the first sixty. Too much talent. Rob, you said that Jacksonville wouldn’t answer the phone for the #1 pick. What about #2 or #3? I was gushing looking at MIA’s picks in your latest mock draft. #3, 18,36 and 50. Wow. I’m starting to think we should negotiate a deal with both Russ and Jamal to MIA and see if they’ll give us those picks plus something more in 2022? Apologize if I’m way off on value charts, but I can see us getting the following in that scenario:
#3 Penei Sewell, T – your future LT
#18 Najee Harris or Javonte Williams RB
#36 Talanoa Hufanga, S – replacement for Adams and Blair is back too
#50 Defensive stud or possible QB if you like him at this spot
#56 Ben Cleveland – G – another mauler for the line
If Pete and Russ can’t co-exist going forward, I’d rather cut the cord now and move on. Adams is awesome, but he’s too spendy for us. Any thoughts on what those two might net us?