Pete Carroll faces a huge season in Seattle after a disappointing few months
It was the last domino to fall. The one thing that could’ve potentially saved the day.
Signing Jadeveon Clowney wouldn’t have cured all of Seattle’s ills on the defensive line. Yet it would’ve at least provided a player with some X-factor.
A player capable of winning you a game, just as he did in San Francisco or against the Eagles in the playoffs.
The Seahawks could’ve boasted a star at every level of their defense — Clowney, Bobby Wagner and Jamal Adams.
His addition would’ve at least meant keeping the one player worth a darn on your D-line from a year ago. While people like to focus on his lack of sacks in 2019 — it’s often forgotten he had 18.5 in his previous two years in Houston and had a pressure percentage rate last year similar to Joey Bosa and Aaron Donald.
Instead, he’s joining the Tennessee Titans while the Seahawks apparently merely ‘monitored the situation’ from afar.
Now they will move on and no doubt add a Clay Matthews and maybe whoever’s left at defensive tackle. They will hope that a rag-tag cast of older players, career backups and unproven prospects can prevent a wasted season.
This was never about Clowney. He was simply the only player left to hope for. If they weren’t going to sign him, they should’ve added other players to dramatically improve their D-line. They emphatically failed to do this.
The reality is this is a defense that relies on rushing with four. That means, for all the investment at linebacker and safety, they’re going to be relying on Benson Mayowa and Rasheem Green.
It gives me no pleasure to say the Seahawks’ off-season has been a mess. People will talk themselves into believing it isn’t. That’s fine. It’s not my intention to ruin any week-before-the-season excitement. If you want to operate in that airspace, that’s fine. You might want to skip the rest of this article.
If you’re still with me and are willing to be open minded as to why I’ve come to the conclusion I have, I’m going to run through the gamut of errors that have delivered a missed opportunity to take a big step forward.
1. They spent nearly $60m and didn’t improve
When the new league year began there was optimism and excitement among Seahawks fans. For the first time in years they had cap space to spend and a bevvy of draft picks waiting to be used.
Instead they splurged nearly $60m and somehow barely improved their roster.
Their biggest outlay for 2020 was re-signing Jarran Reed — an understandable move. Bringing in Greg Olsen can also be justified, even if it came at a high price ($6.9m).
After that things got weird.
It was implausible to give Bruce Irvin a 32% pay rise from his salary in Carolina, especially given his age, desire to return to Seattle and seemingly lukewarm market. Equally, what did Cedric Ogbuehi show in his 155 total snaps for the Jaguars last season to warrant a pay increase from $895,000 to $2.237m?
Why did they pay Jacob Hollister $3.259m as a restricted free agent having already committed $6.9m to Olsen prior to drafting two tight ends?
Why did they identify B.J. Finney as a hot target to play center, only to witness a player who was a career backup in Pittsburgh settle into the exact same role in Seattle at a cost of $8m for two seasons?
Why did they invest $11.796m in David Moore, Branden Jackson, Joey Hunt, Cedric Ogbuehi and Jacob Hollister while also turning their nose up at the D-line options available on the market? Then, having blown $4.2m on Jackson and Hunt during the significant portion of free agency, they cut both players much later in the year because they were ‘too expensive’.
Today they reworked David Moore’s contract to reduce his $2.1m cap hit. Again, would it have been the worst decision in the world to risk losing Moore by letting him test free agency with a view to getting him back at a cheaper price? Between Moore, Jackson and Hunt they used $6.3 in cap space in March — about as much as Dante Fowler and Robert Quinn’s 2020 cap hits.
Why is Jack Conklin’s reasonable cap hit of $8m in 2020 less attractive than using $7m on B.J. Finney and Brandon Shell? If you include Mike Iupati’s $2.5m and Chance Warmack’s $887,500 — can you honestly say the ‘depth’ of Finney, Shell, Iupati and Warmack was preferable than investing in a player who many consider to be a top right tackle?
After all the spending the only position that you could argue had seen a reasonable upgrade was tight end. Everywhere else — the team was either worse (swapping Clowney for Mayowa) or the status quo had remained.
Here are the stats from hell for Seattle’s defense in 2019:
— The Seahawks finished with 28 sacks, second fewest in the league behind only Miami (23)
— Their sack percentage was 4.5% — third worst overall
— The Seahawks produced a sack or quarterback hit on just 14.4% of opponents’ pass plays — worst in the NFL
— They had only 126 pressures, sixth fewest in the league behind Detroit (125), Oakland (117), Houston (117), Atlanta (115) and Miami (96)
— Seattle’s pressure percentage was the fourth worst in the league (19.3%) behind Detroit (18.9%), Houston (18.1%) and Miami (16.7%)
— Seattle hit the quarterback 68 times — fourth fewest
— They had 52 TFL’s — fourth fewest
— They gave up 55 explosive running plays on defense, seventh most in the NFL
— Their explosive run play percentage (14%) was the third worst overall behind only Carolina (16%) and Cleveland (15%)
— They gave up 4.9 YPC — fourth most overall
— They had 131 missed tackles during the regular season — fourth most.
Yet after spending between $50-60m the only significant change to Seattle’s defense was the trade for Quinton Dunbar (and within weeks his future was going to be plunged into doubt).
Meanwhile the Ravens traded a fifth round pick for Calais Campbell — the player John Schneider and Pete Carroll have often referenced they’ve been searching for. The Falcons signed Dante Fowler for $6.6m this year, $19m next year and there’s an out after 2021. The Bears signed Robert Quinn for $6.1m this year, $14.7m next year and they have an out after 2021. Everson Griffen penned a $6m deal with the Cowboys recently and Yannick Ngakoue was willing to take a $5m pay cut to join Minnesota.
I’ve noted many times that I think Seattle’s entire off-season was adversely effected by Jadeveon Clowney’s impromptu hold-out. I explained why here. You could somewhat justify the above if there was a happy ending with Clowney. Now that it isn’t possible — their free agent spending looks even worse.
2. They’re getting minimal impact from their top-two picks
The Seahawks put themselves under pressure by failing to properly address the defense in free agency. The 2020 draft was rich in talent at receiver and the offensive line — yet Seattle instead were left to focus on different areas to fill needs.
Despite their less than secure long term future at offensive tackle and center and the clear need to keep adding weapons around their best player and quarterback, the Seahawks drafted a linebacker and a pass rusher with their top two picks.
The Jordyn Brooks addition was baffling from minute one. The Seahawks were already paying Bobby Wagner and K.J. Wright around $25m to play in 2020. They were also a year removed from trading up in round three to select Cody Barton. With Wagner receiving a long, hefty contract extension — the only question mark was the long term replacement for Wright.
Was it really worth spending a first round pick on a WILL of the future though?
Brooks deserves time to show what he can do. If he’s capable of mimicking Wright’s storied career, it’ll be far from a wasted selection. He’s tough, physical and athletic.
It’s just really hard to justify a team with so many clear needs using a first round pick on a player they knew wouldn’t contribute much in year one, especially at a non-premium position.
I don’t like to play the ‘look what you could’ve won’ game in the draft. You can tie yourself in knots doing that. However, given they were willing to use a third round pick to trade up in round two, would the Seahawks have been better off moving up four spots in round one to secure Cesar Ruiz? Wouldn’t that have been a secure investment for the long term, preventing the current weird situation at center with Ethan Pocic the default starter until Justin Britt is healthy enough to return?
I’ve interviewed Ruiz. I’ve studied his tape in depth. He could’ve solidified the position for years to come and, in my opinion, potentially started as a rookie (which they’re clearly comfortable with given Damien Lewis is slated to start at right guard).
Instead they chose to add a WILL of the future and then trade up in round two for an edge rusher because they’d failed to address that position properly in free agency.
The only problem is, this was a terrible draft for speedy rushers. They latched onto Darrell Taylor because he’s their type of player. He’s an exciting, quick, balanced rusher with ideal size for the LEO. Yet he carried major injury red flags. It wasn’t a minor issue. It was a huge concern with him going into the draft.
The Seahawks traded a third round pick in order to move up and get him. Low and behold — the injury that hampered him throughout the 2019 season and kept him out of the Senior Bowl and combine is still a problem.
Who knows when he’ll be available?
The end result is a team not getting any immediate impact from their top two picks. You might argue it’ll be difficult for any rookie to perform at a decent level given the way Coronavirus has impacted the league. It’s a fair point. Yet even without a global pandemic, the Seahawks would’ve been faced with the same situation. Taylor’s injury and Brooks’ backup status would’ve remained regardless.
It meant that after their spending splurge in free agency and their draft class — they’d still not made any significant improvements to the team aside from the tight end position.
3. They didn’t fix the pass rush
We all knew they had to do something. So did the Seahawks:
People have tried to talk themselves into what eventually unfolded. I refer back to cha’s brilliant post in the comments section summing up 12’s during the off-season:
Hawks Fans 5 Stages of Grief For the Pass Rush
DENIAL
“PC knows there won’t be a season in 2020 because of COVID.”
“PC and JS know what they’re doing. They’ve won a Super Bowl. Have YOU ever been a coach or GM?”
“Hawks are saving cap space because future years could be bad.”ANGER
“Stop talking about the pass rush! That’s all you talk about!”BARGAINING
“A better back 7 will improve the pass rush.”
“We got Jamal Adams and he’s a pass rusher.”
“Our reformed OL is a bigger problem.”
“Maybe Benson Mayowa can do a Chris Clemons.”DEPRESSION
“What’s the point of playing the season? We know how it’s going to go – It’s going to be 9-7 or 10-6 and a milquetoast playoff loss.”ACCEPTANCE
“Let’s enjoy RW while we can and marvel at special talents like DK Metcalf and Jamal Adams.”
Let’s just break down exactly what the Seahawks did to address their self-confessed #1 off-season priority:
— Lost Jadeveon Clowney, Al Woods and Quinton Jefferson
— Signed Benson Mayowa
— Drafted a player in round two (injured) and a player in round five
— Failed to make any serious additions at defensive tackle
— Added Bruce Irvin to play SAM linebacker and rush on passing downs
— Quickly rushed in Damontre Moore the week before the season starts
The top pass rushing defensive end on the team is Mayowa — a player who only had 302 snaps for Oakland last season and was gradually phased out of the defense. Despite having what some have called ‘his best season’ — he was practically surplus to requirements by the end of the year and the Raiders made no attempt to retain him. He has been a career backup and replacement level player throughout and had one sack in 2017 and four sacks in 2018.
If you’d said in February that he would be leading Seattle’s pass rush in 2020, nobody would’ve believed you.
He will be backed up by one of Alton Robinson — a fifth round rookie — or Damontre Moore, who was signed off his couch this week.
On the other side of the line will be perennial underachiever Rasheem Green. His four sack season in 2019 has taken on almost a mythical status because he accidentally led the Seahawks in sacks. The reality is he’s a player with all the physical tools and a distinct lack of fire and nouse. Now, he’s your starting five-technique.
Backing him up is L.J. Collier who deserves an opportunity to take a step forward in 2020 after a horrible rookie season that was impacted by an ankle injury. That said, he has everything to prove. He’s not only fighting to contribute more than one or two snaps a game this year — he needs to justify the fact the team used a first round pick on him a year ago.
Then we come onto defensive tackle where Jarran Reed and Poona Ford are the presumptive starters. Astonishingly, the only other DT on the roster is Bryan Mone. Demarcus Christmas, P.J. Johnson and undrafted rookie Cedrick Lattimore were all cut today. They will surely add another — but who? There’s hardly a long list of attractive options out there.
Rather than fix the pass rush, the Seahawks have cobbled together a unit that could be the worst positional group in the league.
You don’t need JJ Watt and Von Miller flanking Aaron Donald to play defense but you do need players who can consistently create pressure and impact quarterbacks. Forget sacks. If Mayowa plays 600-700 snaps in 2020 he will get some sacks purely through circumstance and opportunity. It’s no different than a bad striker in soccer playing 40 games and finishing with 7-8 goals.
The key is being able to consistently trouble the passer from the edge and the interior. The Seahawks didn’t have a great pass rush in 2018 but they got by thanks to the talent of Frank Clark because he was adept at winning 1v1 and combined elite explosive traits with supreme agility.
Seattle has none of that now. It’s no good being handled at the line for three quarters then picking up a coverage sack in garbage time with the game lost. By now nobody should need to be told about the impact of pressure on a QB. Just watch Russell Wilson against Arizona in week 16 last year.
When you can’t create pressure, even Matt Schaub is capable of passing for 460 yards — as he did against Seattle in 2019.
It’s not just the pass rush either. For some time now the Seahawks have done a terrible job handling the perimeter run game. They will hope the addition of Adams and Irvin plus the development of Marquise Blair will have a positive impact here. Yet you also need to be able to keep your second level defenders clean. If the D-line is being cut through with ease, they will simply end up being blocked out of plays and you’ll see the same kind of problems against misdirection, sweeps and stretch runs.
4. Desperation sets in
Jamal Adams is a fantastic player. One of the best in the NFL. I recall watching the Jets vs Giants game last year and being wowed by his constant impact.
Fans were desperate for something to get excited about and the Adams trade provided the shot in the arm they needed.
I also believe, firmly, that any analysis of the trade deserves proper scrutiny. However good Adams may be, serious questions need to be asked.
I propose the Seahawks were desperate. The only significant move they made to improve a struggling defense was to bring in Quinton Dunbar. At the time of the trade it was unclear whether he was facing a jail sentence for armed robbery. Now that he’s been cleared, there’s still no clarity on whether he faces a suspension.
Take away Dunbar and the 2020 defense was basically the same as a year ago minus Jadeveon Clowney.
Read that statement and acknowledge it. Because it’s a cast iron fact. You can’t seriously analyse this trade without acknowledging that one month before the season began, the only significant difference from 12 months ago was the removal of Clowney.
My hunch is the Seahawks knew they had to do something. Adams was available on the trade market and was a really good defensive player. They saw an opportunity.
Yet because they were desperate and because they had to do something — they were also shopping in a sellers market. This was their only shot to make a big splash. They couldn’t miss out because there were no alternatives other than possibly Yannick Ngakoue — and he would’ve cost $12m in cap space. It was practically Adams or else.
Thus, they ended up giving up a kings ransom to make sure this happened. They traded the Jets a bounty that nobody could predict. Two firsts, a third and a player for Adams and a fourth.
About a month before the trade was finalised, Tony Pauline reported that the Jets were interested in a player-for-player swap with the Cowboys that included La’el Collins. With Dallas losing pieces on their O-line recently, they were reluctant to make the deal.
Aside from that, several reports touted a first rounder and another pick. The Seahawks blew everyone else out of the water. That for me was a signal that they knew they had to get this. They couldn’t leave it to chance. They couldn’t be outbid.
Because they were desperate.
They’ve since claimed this was in the pipeline for weeks. Come on. If they wanted Jamal Adams badly and he was a priority off-season target, this deal would’ve been done in March. The Jets would’ve taken this trade any day, any time. The Seahawks only spent a second round pick on Marquise Blair a year ago.
For me, this wasn’t part of any vision. It was a reactionary move because they’d failed to do much of anything to improve the defense despite spending nearly $60m and a host of draft picks.
And look — that doesn’t mean it’s a bad trade. If Adams justifies the massive price tag, nobody will complain. Let’s be real though. They’ve mortgaged the future of the franchise on a safety to cover for a poor off-season — and they’re going to hope that the worst D-line in the league according to PFF isn’t going to expose the massive investment in not just Adams but also the linebacker position.
5. What now for Russell Wilson?
This has been a different off-season for Wilson. He’s been more outspoken for sure. He called on the team to sign superstars at the Pro-Bowl. He liked tweets about big name skill players in the draft. He had a very public workout with Antonio Brown.
People he’s very close with in the media have been very critical of the Seahawks. Colin Cowherd, a confidant of Wilson’s, casually compared his situation to Patrick Mahomes. The Chiefs QB has the offense tailored to him, he has input in their draft picks and they’ve supported him with weapons galore, pass protection and a complementary defense.
Wilson wants to win so badly he named his newborn son after the word. Yet in the last five years the Seahawks have only won their division once. Forget Super Bowls. They can’t even win the NFC West.
He’s seen the ‘Let Russ Cook’ stuff because he’s a social media addict. He’ll know as well as anyone the strong and weak areas of the roster.
Would anyone blame him for feeling like he’s taken for granted? He doesn’t have Mahomes’ weapons, offensive freedom and too often he needs to drag the team back from a massive deficit because they’ve started slowly or they’re ill-equipped to deal with an opponent from the first whistle.
I’m not for a second implying that Wilson is on the brink of demanding a trade or doesn’t see his future in Seattle. I do think, however, that this time will come unless the Seahawks match the ambitions of their star player.
He’s a supremely driven and competitive individual. If he doesn’t think he can win multiple titles in Seattle, he’ll find a place where he can. It’s no different to Lebron James leaving Cleveland (twice). Lebron’s legacy as an all-time great is cemented because of his three titles. He’s in Los Angeles now to try and win more.
Wilson can’t expect to be considered one of the all-time greats with one Super Bowl ring — as many as Joe Flacco, Nick Foles and Trent Dilfer. As things stand, he’ll be remembered as much for that pass against New England as he will for anything else in his career.
At the moment the Seahawks are treading water. They’ve been in a reset for three years and without the hugely expensive Jamal Adams trade, wouldn’t have added any stars. They consistently finish second in the NFC West and make a hasty exit in the playoffs. And none of it’s because of the quarterback.
A lot of people aren’t going to enjoy reading these words and I’m already anticipating the backlash. However, I’m telling you, the Seahawks are facing a problem in the future if they cannot match the ambitions of their quarterback and provide him with an environment to achieve his career goals.
We’re already seeing this float into the media:
You don’t see the same things being said of other quarterbacks. Do you ever wonder why?
The Seahawks can’t afford another off-season like this one. The only problem is — they’ve plundered their resources in terms of draft picks until 2023 and the NFL economy is coming to terms with Covid-19.
Regulars to this blog will know I take no pleasure in writing any of this. Floating visitors will assume I’m being negative for the sake of it or attempting a hot take for ‘clicks’ (without realising I make no money from ad revenue).
I’m just being honest. I’d prefer to be proven wrong. I don’t think I am. This, for me, is simply the harsh reality of the poorest off-season in the Carroll era.
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It’s probably getting close to the endgame for Carroll and Schneider- neither seems willing to change what issues plague them, and more concerning, they don’t seem to care.
Schneider essentially said in the interview after the Jamal Adams trade that the issues with drafting in the 1st round weren’t fixable, so might as well get a great player via trade. Excuse me?
What is the direction of the organization? Is it to win championships? Or is it to be okay with 10-6 and beating some crappy wildcard team? I have an extremely hard time believing this group is on the path back to greatness.
‘It’s probably getting close to the endgame for Carroll and Schneider’
The Seahawks don’t even have a proper ownership structure.
Therefore Pete and John are in this job until they choose not to be, or a new owner buys the team (which is seemingly not in the pipeline).
Paul Allen did a good job holding them to account. I think he was more hands on than people realised. I think they miss that in the worst way possible. IMO.
I mean, Jody Allen can hire/fire whoever she wants. Although Cowherd implied on his show awhile back that she had little/no interest in running the team.
She isn’t firing Pete Carroll and John Schneider.
You can take that to the bank.
So now that this is over, will you move to writing about something else?
No Ted.
I will write about the pass rush and the D-line as long as it’s the most important topic.
If you want fluff pieces, nonsense and non-serious articles — there are plenty of other places providing that crap.
Here we talk about things that matter.
Rob is spot on with saying the pass rush is in no better place than it was last year. He’s also right in questioning a lot of the small moves that ate up SIXTY MILLION US DOLLARS in cap space and yet, not significantly better.
For what it’s worth, I prefer Adams over Clowney. But am left hoping and wishing that our DL can prove the critics wrong.
Keep giving us the truth Rob. Not many other sources on the internet are doing the same nowadays. I may not like it, but it is reality. Go Hawks.
Thank you Ty.
A lot of fans don’t want to hear it. Which is fine. But it needed to be said.
Rob I got to heavily disagree on the off season. While the pass rush looks iffy, that is just one part of building a better football team. He who would defend everything defends nothing.
Last year the defense was poor at pass rush, no question. But there were arguably bigger problems. The LB’s had to cover for the lack of speed at DE, dismal safety play (until Diggs showed and improved FS) absolute shite at nickel, disappearance of Reed and Collier, and poor tackling throughout the back 7 (Bobby excluded of course). As a result they couldnt stop the run, and couldnt contain the pass.
Since then they have absolutely solidified the secondary into one of the best units in football, and if Brooks is what he looks like could have a top ten or better LB corp. They have added speed off the edge in Irvin and Brooks and they believe (and likely have reasons that we can only speculate about) that Reed will come back to form. As for Collier, who knows what up with that. He cant get worse. But Mayowa can fill in for that and both he and Irvin dis show some decent pass rush skills last year. But Irvin playing SAM in this scheme is an upgrade over Kendricks and he obviously still has what he had before.
The DL sucked last year and obviously probably wont be a strength this year but Irvin is a damn good SAM and knows his assignments and can hold the strong side edge and get some pop when rushing just like Mayowa. He aint Clowney but nobody is. But a big part of the problem was simply poor tackling due to players being out of position which resulted in giving up the explosive plays. Brooks and Adams and Blair will fix that up right quick.
What they did do was build a team for COVID with lots of depth pretty much everywhere except maybe center and DT. That seems a calculated risk. If 5 or 6 players get infected before a game they have enough depth to still be in the game.
As good as Clowney was, and often he was phenomenal, he was hurt a lot and even with him, they still coudn’t make the stops in the back 7. His ability to disrupt didnt equate to stops because of poor tackling and guys out of position
Pass rush is just one part of the equation in building a really good defense. What they did choose was to build from the back to the front with the resources they had and getting Adams is a game changer and with Diggs for a full season, and Blair looking like he might be a stud at nickel there is a huge upgrade in the back. Adams seems less like Kam and more like what Kenny Easley or even Polamalu brought in that he is all over the place. He reads the play instinctively from the start and is aggressive getting in on it. My sense is that they are going to give him more of a free hand to line up and make plays, which yes includes blitzing because he is that good at it.
The offense last year was not the problem except for injuries to the OL and RBs and the lack of a even one blocking TE. They have remedied that with major depth at TE and the addition of a speedy ball catching back in Dallas is something they have not had something they have nor really utilized. There ability to run nasty 2 TE sets this year is going to be something to watch.
Center is the potential weak spot and that may or may not work itself out and if not Britt is still there healing up if necessary. Or simply,like every team, they have a weakness.
Finally, if we can remember, when the pass rush came together in the LOB years it was not by bringing in a bunch of big name free agents it was something they pieced together with s bunch of essential journeymen on 1 year prove it deals. But it was the last piece they put together.
Really, if Reed gets back to form and is fit, we have reason to believe their pass rush will come together to be good enough.
“While the pass rush looks iffy, that is just one part of building a better football team. He who would defend everything defends nothing.”
I’m sorry Matty but when a team says multiple times at the start of the off-season that fixing the pass rush is the priority, then fail to do so, a counter of ‘you can’t be good everywhere’ simply isn’t up to scratch.
“Last year the defense was poor at pass rush, no question. But there were arguably bigger problems.”
The team themselves said fixing the pass rush was the main priority. John Schneider literally quoted the pass rush as the main reason why they ranked so poorly defensively. So if you think there were bigger problems, Schneider and Carroll didn’t agree with you.
“The LB’s had to cover for the lack of speed at DE, dismal safety play (until Diggs showed and improved FS) absolute shite at nickel, disappearance of Reed and Collier, and poor tackling throughout the back 7 (Bobby excluded of course). As a result they couldnt stop the run, and couldnt contain the pass.”
Part of the issue was also that the entire second level of the defense was exposed by the horrendous D-line. How else can we explain Bobby Wagner’s PFF grade going from the 90’s to the 70’s? All of the linebackers were given a thankless task playing behind that D-line in 2019.
But yes — there were other issues such as the nickel. Nobody would argue the ‘only’ problem was the D-line. It was the main problem though and it hasn’t been fixed.
“The DL sucked last year and obviously probably wont be a strength this year”
I thought you said you heavily disagreed?
“What they did do was build a team for COVID with lots of depth pretty much everywhere except maybe center and DT.”
No they didn’t. There’s nothing to support this. Firstly, we KNOW they made a big offer to Clowney, which was rejected. This isn’t a surprise because Carroll called keeping Clowney ‘the priority’. So they were trying to sign him, just on their own terms (which is fine). When it became clear he wouldn’t accept their offer, many of the other DE’s had gone off the board and they found themselves in a situation that was unpredictable and concerning. Thus, they signed Mayowa for $3m. They didn’t choose to build a ‘covid line’. You yourself have admitted they haven’t built any depth at DT. You can’t just assert they acted a certain way because of covid with no evidence to back that up and hope it sticks.
As I’ve said before — I think they put all of their eggs in the Clowney basket — so much so that they were willing to miss out on Everson Griffen a few weeks ago. And ultimately they just didn’t get it done. There’s plenty of evidence for this — such as still having about $10m to spend in cap space, just sitting there unused, plus their unwillingness to sign anyone else. They’ll probably sign Clay Matthews now Clowney has gone — because they no longer have a reason to save money.
“As good as Clowney was, and often he was phenomenal, he was hurt a lot and even with him, they still coudn’t make the stops in the back 7. His ability to disrupt didnt equate to stops because of poor tackling and guys out of position.”
I’ve never argued against this. The point for me hasn’t been ‘sign Clowney or else’. It was ‘fix the pass rush’. And if they weren’t going to land Clowney they should’ve signed other players and just moved on. Had they added Dante Fowler and Everson Griffen then signed a good, veteran defensive tackle or traded for Calais Campbell — it would’ve been job done. My issue is purely with the inadequate nature of their repair (especially given hown much they actually spent in FA).
“Pass rush is just one part of the equation in building a really good defense.”
It’s a very important part of the equation though.
“What they did choose was to build from the back to the front with the resources they had and getting Adams is a game changer and with Diggs for a full season, and Blair looking like he might be a stud at nickel there is a huge upgrade in the back.”
A lot of people have interpreted that they ‘chose to build from the back to front’. No they didn’t. They simply traded for Jamal Adams a month before the season, months after failing to fix the pass rush which they stated was the priority. I’m pretty sure if the New York Jets were shopping an elite pass rusher at a similar age, they would’ve made that move too. It just so happened that Adams was available and they acted.
“Finally, if we can remember, when the pass rush came together in the LOB years it was not by bringing in a bunch of big name free agents”
They literally signed Michael Bennett and Cliff Avril — two huge name free agents — and paired them with Chris Clemons who was on big money. Come on.
I hate to be brutal Matt but this isn’t a strong counter to any of the points made.
Head Coach watchlist for upcoming offseason
1. Eric Bellamy- OC for KC Chiefs
2. Greg Roman- OC for BAL Ravens
3. Urban Meyer- Former College Coach for OSU and Florida
4. Robert Selah- DC for SF 49ers
Lol
looks like 1yr 12M to Tennessee
Josina Anderson reporting nothing is done yet…
Spot on. And worse. If the Hawks suffer any serious injuries and say finish with an ugly record the Jets will benefit. What a disastrous offseason.
I just hope people read the article.
Don’t just jump into the comments section and start shouting about what a hater I am and that I’ve never GM’d a team or that Jamal Adams and stuff.
You’re speaking my words for me Rob. I thought they would sign one of Fowler or Quinn right out of the gate, lock up Reed, then offer Clowney a Frank Clark level contract. Clowney is better than Clark.
The draft was a disaster. Brooks, ok, whatever, looks like a super athlete. But giving up the #100 pick to move up and take Taylor baffled me. He was not healthy, no one was going to take him between #48 and #59. They should have stayed at #59 and taken the best DT available, made the trade down to pick up Lewis, then taken Taylor at #100. My bet is he would have been there.
db
I gave you a lot of crap, Rob…but you were right. They royally screwed this one up. It’s unbelievable they risked so much on Clowney saying yes.
I disagree that they wasted their first pick. Brooks is the future and he was gonna be taken by another team. We need someone fast to stop Kyler Murray/the 49er’s run game. I would not be surprised if they traded Bobby Wagner next year and rolled with Cody and Brooks.
At this point, what can be done about the pass rush? Dare i suggest that we pull Michael Bennett out of retirement? That we take another shot with Ziggy in the hopes that his shoulder has healed and he returns to his former level of play? Perhaps Dion Jordan as well? I don’t want Clay Matthews.
I appreciate you saying that.
I don’t think they wasted their first pick by the way. I just think using a top pick on a WILL of the future is a questionable use of resources.
Bennett’s goose was cooked before and there’s no way back for him in Seattle. Ziggy played semi-retired last year. He’ll be fully retired in 2020.
It’s going to be Clay Matthews.
Having to cheer for clay matthews for me will be the cherry on top of a big fat shit sundae.
Appreciate your writing as always though Rob! Thank you for giving some perspective now more than ever
“Having to cheer for clay matthews for me will be the cherry on top of a big fat shit sundae.”
It’ll be the most unpopular signing in the Carroll era.
Mayowa’s last 8 games in 2019 were abominable. 1.5 sacks, 5 tackles, 1 TFL, 1 FF, 4 QB hits.
He had 4 games where he didn’t record any counting stats. None.
Matt Ryan going to have a field day next week.
Mayowa startet as the #2 pass rusher to Clelin Ferrell. He was still a distant second in the DE pecking order, because Maxx Crosby, a fourth round rookie who managed to apply constant pressure and accumulate lots of sacks and hits, became #1. Mayowa was out when Clelin Ferrell finally began get his act together.
Possibly that is the hope with Collier, Taylor and Robinson.
But then, they are hoping on a guy who was picked R1 which other teams had as a R3 pick. Taylor had injury red flags, and if you’re searching for a serviceable 5T in R2 you can directly make a starter, that’s what Epenesa will do at Buffalo. Robinson had a very bad season at Syracuse.
My problem is not them betting large on rookies. My problem are the rookies they pick. It has come to a point where I think, my grandma could assemble a better team by taking NFL.coms rating and just picking the best player available.
And no, this is not a case of hindsight 20/20, it’s what is darn obvious to everybody living outside the Seahawks bubble.
There is no, absolutely no excuse for needing help at DL and OL for consecutive seasons, and pass on guys like TJ Watt and Ryan Ramczyk.
They have indeed whiffed hard on the defensive line since they picked Frank Clark and Jarran Reed long ago. I get the sinking feeling that Taylor is not going to do much of anything this year with his injury, but maybe Robinson will step up and be the man. The fifth round has.always been kind.
Rob, I’m a long time reader and a fan of your work. You make a lot of fair points in this article, like you did throughout the offseason. Nevertheles, you seem absolutely certain that the team cannot improve, that players cannot player better in this system. You remind me of John Morgan from Field Gulls in 2010, when Carroll traded Tapp for Chris Clemons. We know how that ended up. What I’m trying to say, and sorry for the typos, english is not my first language, can’t you imagine any scenario where the d-line gels, Adams is a transcedent DB, offense continues to improve and we do better in 2020? That sounds like a fair shot to me.
“Nevertheless, you seem absolutely certain that the team cannot improve, that players cannot player better in this system.”
I am not certain of this, nor am I implying it.
I simply don’t think the players are good enough. I don’t think even a reasonable improvement from the likes of Green, Collier and others will be enough. You can’t ‘get by’ on the defensive line. You actually need some quality. You need to be able to provide consistent pressure. The Seahawks just aren’t going to be able to do that with this cast of characters.
That doesn’t mean they’re going to go 4-12 and lose a bunch of games. What it will mean is they lose the games that matter — against strong NFC West opponents and eventually in the playoffs. It’s entirely predictable.
“You remind me of John Morgan from Field Gulls in 2010, when Carroll traded Tapp for Chris Clemons. We know how that ended up.”
So because ten years ago the Seahawks added a no-name pass rusher and he ended up being terrific, I now stand accused of being unfair on the team for not assuming history will suddenly repeat?
Come on. For every Chris Clemons there’s an O’Brien Schofield, a Barkevious Mingo, a Ziggy Ansah, a Cassius Marsh or any number of players who don’t do what Clemons did. It’s not inappropriate for me to speak in these terms just because a decade ago Clemons existed.
And let’s be right here — Clemons alone was not enough. He was never enough. So even if one player plays to that standard, they will still be lacking.
“What I’m trying to say, and sorry for the typos, english is not my first language, can’t you imagine any scenario where the d-line gels, Adams is a transcedent DB, offense continues to improve and we do better in 2020?”
Maybe you need to consider a scenario where all of the relevant points I’ve made are fair? That maybe a crap D-line is, actually, simply a crap D-line?
I don’t need to add a disclaimer at the bottom that maybe they’ll just be jolly good after all.
And here’s another cost of desperation.
Next year’s top priority? Fix the pass rush?
No.
It’s extend Jamal Adams. Because every day, week, and month that goes by without signing him to an extension, the price goes up.
He’s your first round pick in 2021
Your third round pick in 2021
Your first round pick in 2022
2020 is his last bargain basement season.
They have to sign him. NOW.
Maybe it’s my tinfoil headgear, but did Clowney fire his agent maybe because his old agent insisted they honor the promise to let Seattle match other offers?
https://mobile.twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1302385927155744769?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
Wonderful article, Rob. This was the news we have all been waiting for. Cannot believe we let Clowney go. Even if they didn’t want him back, then why did they not sign someone else beyond Irvin and Mayowa? Matthews coming here is desperate—and almost surely to backfire. The guy’s a loose cannon.
As for Russ, I agree. i think he’s going to have wandering eyes. The only way to stop that from happening is to win. Win, and all of those thoughts will stop being a media talking point. But god, if Seattle starts off the year 1-3, 2-4…get ready for the rumors. It will be brutal.
What?
Haha just saw this. 4th quarter!
JOSINA
Deliver us from evil
Feel like JC is doing all he can to drum up a bidding war to get closer to his original asking price after misjudging his market. I think he also set sitting out training camp as a high priority even if it cost him some cash.
Is it possible that Bus Cook wanted to distance himself and his reputation from how JC is going about this?
Josina must be laughing her head off at scooping ESPN
Was this a final troll towards the Seattle fanbase by Mr. Clowney?
I’m interested in what Tennessee offer is. It’s as if John and Pete had no desire to resign. They wanted the proverbial cheap deal. This front office throwing high draft picks out the window. I wish someone in the press would question Pete or John and ask how they feel about addressing their offseason priority a pass rush and are they concerned they only have 3 DT’s on the roster. So confusing and disheartening. I’m with you Rob, I really want to be wrong but I’m not seeing it or feeling it.
I think this years defensive line outperforms last years defensive line. Ansah was awful. Clowney was average but made some splash play Here and there while he was injured all season from not having an offseason last year. I wouldn’t be surprised that Clowney gets injured again Playing for the titans. I’m very optimistic having a much improved secondary, an elite linebacker Corps, and a young defensive line group. I think they are better now then what last years group yielded.
Take off the beer goggles lol
Bit premature maybe?
https://twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1302385927155744769
Meh.
I highly doubt someone as reliable as Dianna Russini reported what she did on a whim.
Excellent write up Rob. I appreciate the unfiltered honesty of this offseason. Sadly I couldn’t agree more with basically everything in it; and that’s pretty disheartening to admit to. Definitely not the offseason I was expecting. Regardless of if we signed Clowney, I expected more.
Thank you Scot.
I appreciate anyone who is willing to read the whole thing because I know a lot of fans won’t want to hear it.
I even respect those who disagree or don’t want to consider the points — but accept the validity and the detail within my arguments.
What I can’t accept is people just shouting at me that I’m wrong because they are true fans.
100% spot on. Thank you for continuing to be honest with your assessments, even in the face criticism from people who call you negative or insinuate they are more of a fan than you because they’re more optimistic.
They had a chance to try to keep the window open for a championship. It’s shut, at least for this year. The OL is average and we’ll soon need to replace the LT. The DL is what it is. We’re facing a decision with Carson and Griffin. We’re going to have to PAY Jamal Adams. There aren’t many good young players on inexpensive contracts. We have a lack of draft capital in the near term.
The positives—Russell, WRs, the LBs, the secondary, the culture.
At this point, as cliche as it is, I think we do have to let Russ cook just to be in position to try to win games. Play the entire game like it’s the 4th quarter. Hand him the keys because he’s earned it.
Thank you Mike. Appreciate you.
I won’t say I agree with you Rob, because that would be like telling Eric Clapton that he’s a pretty good guitar player.
Still … the Seahawks finished 8th in offensive DVOA last year, despite finishing the season with Travis Homer and Marshawn Lynch as their running backs, and Jacob Hollister and Luke Willson as their tight ends. No disrespect intended to any of those gentlemen, but they’re not the sort of players who keep defensive coordinators awake at nights. With better luck on injuries, a strong second year from D.K. and a better (not good – but better) offensive line, they could crack the top 5 this year.
On defence, the Seahawks last year were 29th in missed tackles. To me, that’s a bigger problem than the lack of sacks and it certainly isn’t typical of Pete Carrol teams. I don’t know if it it’s an issue that can be fixed by coaching but it was surely an area of focus for Carroll & Co. during this training camp.
And then there’s the PFF argument about coverage being more important than pressure. IIRC, you’re not a fan of this hypothesis but even if you don’t buy it, the secondary is almost certainly much stronger than it was last year. With better tacking and better coverage, the defence could be significantly better than last year.
Or maybe this is the year it all falls apart and they finish 6-10. But if you can’t be optimistic the first week of September, when can you be?
I appreciate this reply.
What I would say is this — I do not think the Seahawks will go 6-10 and collapse.
Russell Wilson is too good for that.
But I do think this D-line will cost them big games during the regular season, cost them a shot at the NFC West and assuming they make the post-season, will lead to another premature exit.
And that, to me, isn’t good enough.
Rob – I’m not sure if you’re still sifting through replies, but I want to correct an error in my original comment. The Seahawks were not 8th in offensive DVOA last year but 5th (they were 8th in overall DVOA), so it’s at least possible that they could crack the top 3 three offensively with plausible improvements in health, receiving and offensive line.
To amuse myself, I regressed last year’s defensive DVOA on (a) sacks and (b) missed tackles. The results imply that registering sacks at the league average last year would have reduced (improved) the Seahawk’s defensive DVOA by about 9 percentage points, putting them slightly better than average. Reducing missed tackles to the league average would have reduced their defensive DVOA by about 7 percentage points, putting them … slightly better than average.
I think DVOA is fantastic and an excellent piece of analytics.
But I think we’re oversimplifying things by saying fewer missed tackles here and there and they would’ve been fine or even a serious contender.
The defense was hot garbage, couldn’t do anything against the passer, relied on one player (who isn’t here any more), was terrible against the run and there’s no doubt at all that it was a significant issue.
Just look at the horrendous list of stats I put in this article.
It’s going to be really difficult to overturn those stats with this awful looking D-line.
And going from #5 to #3 on offense won’t cover for it either.
A wildcard win looking optimistic
The D-line and lack of pressure will put them consistently behind in games again. It is a frustrating game to spectate.
Are we going to sign a Jonathan Bullard or Margus Hunt? Cmon, it’s so maddening to watch this franchise just get by, just squeak enough games to make the playoffs, just enough to get a wild card, just enough to draft around the mid twenties, just enough to keep mild fans hopeful, just enough, just enough. What is stopping JCPC from making the moves needed to be a top 4 team? Is it pride, ego, timing, circumstances? Why is it the same every year that we are misaligned to the strengths of a draft class and can’t take advantage of it. To your point of Caesar Ruiz.
Why is it acceptable that the top draft picks are essentially red shirted? What other franchise does that?
I am frustrated.
Pete will eschew the scheme and talent that allowed Mayowa and Irvin to get the sacks they did last season and project those numbers as THE improvement in the defenses largest need. And some fans agree.
Pete will sign off in a couple of years from now with the draft capital having been depleted via trades and the franchise heading towards the bottom of the division with an aging Russ. Convince me otherwise.
This guy Clowney like a bad girlfriend would you just tear my heart already or make me the happiest idiot. Make a decision! Get to steppin
Agreed! Make a decision already, so ready to be done with this!!
You’ve obviously had this article ready to roll and pulled the trigger as soon as Clowney to the Titans was announced. I share your disappointment but I can’t help feel that you are being OTT here. Is Clowney really that good? I agree with a lot of what you said but I just don’t think that Clowney is the elite player you make him out to be.
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love for him to have stayed and can’t believe we didn’t pay him the money Tennessee did. But I do think you overrate him and it’s obvious that Pete and John, and the rest of the NFL just don’t rate him as highly as you do.
It’s a blow, and we’ve had these blows before, but it’s nowhere near as cataclysmic as you are making it out to be here.
You’re a straight shooter and I love your passion, but I think you are wildly overreacting here.
“Is Clowney really that good?”
As the article states — it’s not about Clowney.
It was never about Clowney.
He was simply the only remaining option that could realistically make a difference.
They had to fix the D-line… not ‘sign Clowney’.
They failed to do either. That’s the point. And as the article suggests, the whole process of the off-season warrants a serious challenge.
“I think you are wildly overreacting here.”
You’re welcome to think that. I think you’re speaking as a fan there who doesn’t like the uncomfortable truth. Because everything in this article, even if you disagree, is steeped in logic, perspective and detail. Nothing is unfair. I actually think it’s a very modest but necessary review.
It’s very difficult to argue with Rob’s premise of the Seahawks failing to accomplish their own stated goal of improving the DL this off-season.
At the beginning of the off-season when Pete was commenting on the importance of “fixing” the DL and the important of JC’s role in that, it’s hard to imagine he was really thinking, “well, we’ll just sign a couple of Seahawk retreads in Irvin and Mayowa and roll with our current group.”
As a fan, I’m hoping for a miracle on the DL this year, but unfortunately, the front office also seems to be pinning their hopes on a miraculous improvement of their current guys (Green, Collier especially) and that’s simply not good enough to expect to compete for a Super Bowl.
To be fair, even in the tweets Rob included, neither Pete nor John EVER said that improving the defensive line was their priority. Maybe it’s semantics, but what they SAID was that the priority was to improve the pass rush.
And, whether we agree or not, they might think they did that.
I do think that’s semantics, but I hear you. To rephrase: at the beginning of the off-season when Pete/John were commenting on the importance of improving the pass rush, I would be absolutely stunned if their vision was subtracting Clowney and adding Mayowa/Irvin – especially considering the amount of money and draft capital available.
RS we still have to wait to see how the new DE players from off-season additions to draft players gel and work with improvements to LB speed (Brooks; Wagner more healthy), and secondary additions in Dunbar and Adams and in a way Blair at slot CB. Jarran Reed will definitely do better and make everyone better. Rasheem Green is another player that plays better than his reputation and Collier has been healthy for his second NFL offseason although abbreviated. Seattle, imo, are SB contenders. Also, the offense is loaded and the OL is a lot better due to GI’s not being there to penalize the offense.
No we don’t.
We can pass judgement on what they did now.
Anyone suggesting otherwise is just trying to stifle criticism and debate.
Great write up Rob I think you summed up the off season perfectly.
I wish just one Seahawks beat reporter would ask PC / JS why they refuse to pay an elite pass rusher a long term deal at Market. First Clark and now Clowney could have been signed long term but they passed on both and now have Benson and Green at DE.
I share that wish.
A challenging line of questioning is long overdue.
Gregg Bell just tweeted the Hawks blew their top priority and that the pass rush badly needs him.
https://twitter.com/gbellseattle/status/1302390969615044608
https://twitter.com/gbellseattle/status/1302380258029522944
Gee Gregg, you’ve got regular access to PC, you think that was worth a question???
It’ll be fascinating to see what is asked on Monday.
Also tweeted that Alton Robinson has been their best DL in camp.
https://twitter.com/gbellseattle/status/1302379352617672704
I think the light is finally coming on.
Which, for me, is more a review of Mayowa, Green, Collier and co than it is of Alton Robinson.
Well, if anyone has the balls to ask that hard question, it will be Gregg. Still doubt he asks it though.
My assumption is/has long been that Pete and John don’t prioritize either line and prefer to spend the bulk of their cap dollars at the other positions on both offense and defense.
(Duane Brown being one of the few exceptions over the last decade.)
The off season didn’t go great and it probably didn’t go as they planned. Its now time to move on to week 1 and the regular season and start rooting for our boys.
Its also being reported that Clowney has not made a decision. Im guessing he still goes to the Titans but Clowney himself said no deal done yet.
Find me one person who won’t be rooting for the team in Atlanta and we can crown them the first of his or her kind.
We’ll all be doing that.
It doesn’t prevent us from talking about the off-season.
Great write-up Rob.
It’s not about Clowney. It’s about every top end pash rusher they didn’t sign, despite having cap space to do so. What’s more they even cut their ‘depth’. Bad plan, bad execution.
The most alarming thing for me is the way they spent the money in free agency.
So much was wasted on not a lot.
And the inability to fix their priority needs ended up impacting their draft and now future drafts due to the Adams trade.
A mess.
The overcompensating for miscues is brutal. McDowell, Richardson, now Clowney. I know each one has an reason but it starts to seem like they are always chasing after themselves.
Offseason priorities with Adams, Carson, Griffin, and perhaps Dunbar will be tough. Diggs will want something too if he has a good season. So long-term solution for LT and no draft capital left to acquire. Pash rush is now just one of many problems to address.
Its not easy though to pay a QB and be consistently good without hitting on picks and finding diamond in the rough FAs. This organization used to be good at that, but haven’t hit lately.
“The overcompensating for miscues is brutal.”
Jamal Adams is the latest one.
Let’s not gloss over there are 3 DTs on the roster. They are counting on waiver claims and cuts to fix what I think is the weakest DT rotation I’ve ever seen. Ford and Reed are pretty solid, possibly become a strength if 2018 Reed comes back, but that’s it. That’s all they have.
The situation at defensive tackle is a disgrace.
A complete and utter disgrace.
Wonder if they’re planning on using guys like LJ and Green etc to rotate inside more often than we assume?
Rob thanks for everything.
I appreciate all your work and thoughtful articles. But this year, with the lockdown and all of us chewing our arms off in inactivity, foregoing your typical downtime and continually giving thoughts and perspective on what might be the most baffling offseason in a long time is much appreciated. As is providing a “safe space” to discuss matters and share the latest info.
Thank you, I appreciate this a lot. And I hope you know how much your contribution is massively appreciated within this community.
I don’t think people realise how much I’d much rather be posting positive articles. But this blog will always be about discussing topics that matter.
No shirking. No hiding. No glossing over.
If you read something on here — positive or negative — you know I mean it. You know I’ve invested a lot of time forming my view and you know I’ll always back up those opinions with detail.
It won’t always be popular. It won’t always be favourable. I won’t always be right.
But it’ll be what we need to discuss.
I’ve been dreading this article because I knew it was going to come and had to written. Thank you for speaking the truth of the off-season, at least for me. Such a big disappointment considering the capital they had to really make an impact on the roster this year. I hope Russ hangs in there with us and sees a light at the end of the tunnel.
Thank you Tom.
I’m glad people understand why it had to be written and where I’m coming from.
While it would have been nice to not see the same refrains again and again throughout the offseason, that’s about what they haven’t done, not what you’ve written. I’m sure you’d have been just as thrilled to say, “guys, they fixed it!” As we would have been to read it.
As always, Rob, thank you
I would’ve loved nothing more than for the Seahawks to have a tour de force off-season.
I think we all would have preferred that. Didn’t happen though.
Josina getting played.
Great summation of the offseason. Like you and many here before me, I feel the front office had a good (at least stated) plan of attack (address pass rush & OL) but in the end failed to deliver. I will disagree with some of those here who post that they have lost confidence in Pete and John. I understand that they have not delivered on their stated plan. But given their history, I believe they know that and are not satisfied themselves as are many of us. I feel like they can do better in the future and it’s too early to mutiny. I think they misjudged Clowney and given the reports of what he might be singing for ($12M/1 yr), maybe Clowney is the real problem here if he didn’t want to come back to us. I keep seeing reports the Hawks had offered anywhere from $12-15M for a 1 year deal. If we ere so close to the other offers why didn’t he go for the Hawks? It seemed by all reports he liked being a Seahawk and his teammates wanted him back. So I feel like there is missing information on why he didn’t come back or why the Seahawks didn’t go the extra mile for him. Like Rob stated in a post in the previous thread, none of this makes sense.
So I am frustrated as much as anyone. But, and there is always a “but”, I remain hopeful that PC/JC come up with some surprise move (like Clowney last year out of nowhere) or someone already on the team steps up and surprises, some trade out of the Twilight zone, whatever. The odds are long I know so I’m doubtful it could happen. But given the state of the world, I’m personally tired of bad (though truthful) news and am longing for some good things to happen. I’m not afraid of the truth and appreciate your honest appraisal Rob. I don’t doubt your analysis so am hoping for some miracle. Not rationale I know! :). Thanks for your blog, long time reader and sometimes Patreon contributor!
Thank you. I completely respect anyone who understands where I’m coming from, accepts the points are valid and merely disagrees or chooses to think more optimistically.
My aim isn’t to convert everyone to my opinion. It’s simply to lay out my view with as much detail as possible and hope that people will read it and embrace its validity.
Thanks for sticking to your guns, Rob. I don’t agree with everything but you make your case well.
Re: Clowney, rumoured to have signed with the Titans for 12 mil in a one year deal, I am now convinced that he didn’t want to come back here unless it was a multi year deal at something like 20+ a year. Which Seattle didn’t want to give him.
I can’t imagine that Schneider didn’t offer 12+ per year.
Another possibility is that one or both parties got their nose out of joint early on in the negotiations. I think the market spoke, and no team stepped up to offer JC a multi year deal @18-21 mil per annum.
And to all those who kept saying “sign him, just sign him” … we didn’t know, and still don’t know, most of what went on to prevent his return to the Pacific NW.
“Thanks for sticking to your guns, Rob. I don’t agree with everything but you make your case well.”
Thank you. I respect that.
“And to all those who kept saying “sign him, just sign him” … we didn’t know, and still don’t know, most of what went on to prevent his return to the Pacific NW.”
My point in response to this would be — if there was an issue, why the heck didn’t they move on sooner? They could’ve had Everson Griffen for $6m a matter of weeks ago. If there was a problem putting them off, they should’ve drawn a line under it and moved on. They didn’t. And that’s not good enough if you then miss out.
Personally, I don’t mind them passing on EG. Would he have been better than what Seattle ended up with (so far)? Absolutely. But the D-line would still be pretty awful (on paper) even with EG. He was available for MOST of offseason. Same as Clowney. But Clowney was widely considered the #1 available free agent from the start and EG never was close to that.
If I’m going to point fingers at the front office for anything, it’s not going to be for missing out on Clowney – I think they had concerns about his health (especially his knee) and weren’t willing to overpay; if they could get him for “their” price / on “their” terms, great. If not, so be it. And I’m not going to get upset about them passing on EG or not trading for YN. No, if I’m going to use hindsight and lament ANYTHING related to the D-line and this offseason, it’s going to be that they let both Jefferson and Woods leave and that they didn’t pursue players like Fowler and Quinn at the BEGINNING of free agency. Once that ship had sailed, it was pretty clear that it was “Clowney or bust” and, sadly, it ended up being BUST.
C’est la vie.
Now let’s see what they do between now and next Sunday. The waiver wire didn’t look very promising but …. maybe they can still pull a rabbit out of the hat.
Aside from the fact that Clowney himself has said a deal has not been signed ( apparently if you believe Josina) Theoethically we can still sign him for what ever that is worth at this point. Are any of the following cuts worth looking at:
Mario Edwards
Nate Orchard
Margus Hunt
Jonathon Bullard
Jalen Jelks
Joe Jackson
Jesse Lemonier
Dion Jordan
Chad Thomas
Bryan Cox
Reportedly, Clowney has also told the Titans he’s signing with them and has been texting his new team mates to say how excited he is.
So maybe Josina just doesn’t have that good a relationship with Clowney.
As appears to be “typical Clowney”, he was apparently texting his new teammates with the Titans and saying how excited he was to be joining them while ALSO letting the Saints make another attempt at changing his mind.
https://twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1302482977482584064
Per Josina Anderson at 10:45PM PST:
Jadeveon Clowney just informed me he just let the #Saints know he’s now chosen the #Titans. New Orleans made a last ditch push through the overnight to improve its deal & lure him away, but “it came down to familiarity over economics.” Added “packing now to head there in morning”
Mario Edwards and Nate Orchard out of all of those. Maybe work something out to get Vic Beasley if possible.
No need to apologize for speaking the truth, Rob. A number of us have been in agreement with you through the offseason as one puzzling decision after another was made. There is far too much blind faith out into this organization and they do need to be held to account. This upcoming season may be harsh to watch as the terrible defensive line is going to hurt them all season long. What’s worse is iv they do end up with the bad season some of us are expecting, that first round draft sent to the Jets is going to become more and more valuable. With the number of players on one year contracts or heading into free agency is combined with the small Number of draft choices, this rebuild may take quite awhile. Based on the past few years and in particular this last offseason, you really do have to question if John and Pete are really the right choices to lead this rebuild.
“they do need to be held to account”
This is 100% true.
Every leading sports team needs to be held account.
That doesn’t mean asking ridiculously aggressive questions at a press conference.
But it does mean doing a bit of digging. Asking a challenging question or two. Trying to get some answers and not being easily fobbed off.
The media owe it to the fans to ask some strong questions about the approach to addressing their self-confessed biggest need.
I agree with asking strong questions and following up. It feels like many of the writers covering this team ask some tentative questions which are easily brushed off by Pete speak or answered with variations of “we’ll have to see” or “we’re always competing” and the writers let it go at that. Is there really any actual accountability for these poor decisions?
Rob, spot on. I was willing to wait all off season to see what the Hawks do to fix the pass rush and fix the D line in general. Was trying to give them some time to prove it. Now we are here, they have done jack S.
What they have done to date is pathetic at best. I truly believe we are going into the 2020 season with the worst D line overall in the entire NFL
To me this is the worst offseason of the JS/PC era by far. They stated this was the year to fix the most glaring weakness to anybody paying attention-the pass rush. The Adams trade is just now even more of a head scratcher. Great player-but you give up 2 future #1’s (so what if they are basically 2’s) which shows you want to win NOW. How do you win now with this D line?
Beyond disappointed.
“I truly believe we are going into the 2020 season with the worst D line overall in the entire NFL”
Strongly agree.
Rob
I too strongly agree.
I remember Cliff Avril going down and our team, in command and in control, being picked apart by the Patriots because we lost that millisecond faster rusher.
The 2020 Dline, is much further removed from greatness than a millisecond. All the talent, money and draft resources lined up behind the Dline will be swept away, unable to shine, as they’ll be dealing with a center, guards and tackles way further down field that a competent Dline would allow.
It is what it is. A wasted off-season. The clock on Dangerruss’ patience meter takes one click towards midnight. Midnight can prove to be a very cold time…
“The clock on Dangerruss’ patience meter takes one click towards midnight.”
This is a key point that most fans won’t recognise.
So does ESPN … and PFF … etc.
Outstanding !!! Thank you for some one seeing and telling the truth and facts !!! PC & JS need to wake up and smell the flower !!! Or is it time for change a great run but always looking like a lucky wildcard team !!! It hurts to watch this show on the TV . It does look like the management and staff still haven’t gotten over the SB loss and trying to fling the thier old ways & new blood is needed or ideas .I know he’s a players coach but time has caught up to thier ways udfa and late rd draft picks don’t pan out all the time !!!! So thanks Pete and trader John for your service here’s a couple of watchs for your time !!! Go Hawks .
Rob, Thanks for all of the work, it is always looked forward to and appreciated.
So, after we choke down this dogs breakfast off an off-season, and look for signs of life on D what do you see?, and what will you look for? Not looking for fluff but specifics. I will have my eye on Irvin at DL, and how they use blitzers and more man to man on passing situations. Also how increased team speed can impact the outside run game. I don’t expect an elite D, but one that was top half and showing improvement, that could be enough to let an elite offense make a run to a title game.
I think the defensive line will fail to create any kind of consistent pressure or adequately defend the run. I think it’s realistic that it’ll be even worse than last season. Thus, I think the second level defenders will be less impactful because they will be exposed.
Players like Jamal Adams will make some plays because he’s too good not to. Yet ultimately the defense overall will be a liability and it’ll be up to Russell Wilson to try and save the day.
That’s what I expect. I don’t think you will see major scheme changes on defense. I think they will be privately massively concerned about the D-line. And I hate to say it but I foresee some games like the Rams road game from 2019 where things escalate quickly and they can’t wrestle it back.
I can still see those db’s trailing crossing routes by three yards, that game was brutal.
Good read but not a fun one. Sadly I agree with you darn near completely. I’ve spent a lot of time defending Carroll and Schneider in the past, but I just can’t defend this off/pre season.
Thank you Scott
I hope G Bell come hard and question Pete on why they let their top priority get away. Why they refuse to pay top tier money to Defensive ends. I would keep asking every week unless they winning or manufacturing wins.
I wouldn’t get your hopes up on anyone asking those questions.
I suspect Carroll will be asked if they were in for Clowney until the end. He’ll say they couldn’t make it work. Everyone will move on.
I would immediately ask you guys traded a third round pick and Jacob Martin just to let him walk. How do you feel about that? I only ask because the fans are frustrated.
Bell wouldn’t be the one to do it. The Seahawks press core certainly doesn’t challenge the team much. Maybe their concerned over losing their access. But they all seem to ask the same sort of questions and back down whenever Pete gives them a cross look. I thought Joe fan might be coming from a different place but then again he used to be an intern. So… honestly, the only one who might be willing to take them head I would be Jim Moore. He has a reputation for not being afraid to burn a bridge or two in Seattle sports i.e. Richard Sherman or even Gary Payton. He’s old and doesn’t give a rip.
But will never get a proper explanation for the Clowney debacle why or why we were going to pay a premium for Jimmy Graham and then change his playing style, or why it was necessary to sacrifice pass rushers and golden Tate to bring in that arsehole Percy Harvin etc.
That is a sunk cost. The question of if you resign Clowney was independent of any resources you used to acquire him.
I have been following your blog for years and I don’t post anything anywhere to be honest, but you are absolutely right and this article just proves what a disaster this offseason has been you could of had both Adams band Clowney if you really wanted it. Thanks for what you do.
Thank you, appreciate it.
Just wait until next season when John Schneider think Adams is too expensive and can’t pull the trigger.
Right! And they won’t pay DK what he deserves and he walks…
They don’t “have to” pay Adams next offseason; he’s under contract for 2 more years. Will they pay him next offseason? Probably. But at worst, he’s a 2-year rental instead of a 1-year rental.
If they’re smart once they get a few games in and see how Adams fits, they’ll commence negotiations on an extension this fall.
A two year rental that cost 2 first round draft picks. That’s a pretty bad worst case.
The six receivers on their initial 53 are Tyler Lockett, DK Metcalf, David Moore, Phillip Dorsett, John Ursua and Freddie Swain.
Gordon is on the football exempt list awaiting reinstatement.
This Swain kid must have done something good to keep him around…
I’ve seen Swain mentioned multiple times for his work on special teams. No doubt that is the reason.
Good article. I’ve been one of those “Fire Pete and John” folks for a while. I keep waiting for the floor to fall out from beneath our feet. It seems that you think that the team will stay somewhat competive, losing to good teams but maybe making the playoffs, but that they aren’t going to stink. How long do you think they can keep that up? Do you think that as long as we have Russ we will be an OK team (even as the rest of the roster crumbles)? I’ve been expecting a huge collapse the last couple of years and have been wrong. Am I still wrong with expecting a 4-12 season any time now?
They won’t collapse as long as Wilson is the QB.
But for me their destiny this year is just more of the same. Playoffs, potentially, then a swift exit.
Thanks not just for the article but the entire year’s worth of content. It has been such a strange time for all of us. Unrest in many areas of life. I, like many others have continued to click and refresh this site so many times it’s embarrassing. The discussions are always well researched, fair and honest. I truly am disturbed about all the backlash you get. The volume of content and time investment alone should give you enough cred to any fan. Thanks for all you do. I’ve been coming here since 2011 and don’t plan on stopping. Bless your family and their patience as well.
I wish the off-season went a different way. I really wanted Clowney back. I am not sure what PCJS are thinking. Some of their actions seem like they think they are not true contenders. One year stop gaps, penny pinching and hoarding cap space. A topic for another time. Atlanta game prep is here. Can’t wait to see guys like Adams, Olsen, Lewis and Blair. See if young guys step up. The O and D lines will be areas to watch. This seems like the final sigh on exhausting process. Let’s play some ball.
Thank you. It really means a lot to read those words.
I mean, Jody Allen can hire/fire whoever she wants. Although Cowherd implied on his show awhile back that she had little/no interest in running the team. ~ colin
There is no way she fires these two, unless they tank for 3 years. They created a golden goose. The Seahawks make a ton of money. If and/or when she wants to sell, they increase the value of the team each season / year after year. Now it is worth easily 2 Billion (or more).
Cowherd might be in with a few players, but I seriously doubt he goes out and talks with his pal Jody Allen, about how she wants to run the franchise, over dinner and drinks. Maybe this is how RW see it (his opinion relayed to Cowherd), but I doubt the validity of her not wanting to be involved.
Without coronavirus I think the team would’ve been sold within 18 months.
Now? I’m not so sure.
But there’s not a long term structure in place. Eventually the team will be sold. Until then, Jody Allen isn’t going to be firing the best the coach the franchise has ever had and appointing a new person to oversee a new era.
That is what I have been saying for sometime, they are signing cheap FA on a short term deal and have new ownership paying for all those extensions. Money drops from the sky and pocket as much as possible while you could.
Off to bed. See you all tomorrow.
Rob, I appreciate all the hard work you put in on SDB and enjoy all your articles even when I don’t 100% agree with them. I agree that this DL is less than spectacular I do believe the the improvements with the secondary and LB’s will help hide some of the deficiencies up front. I also believe the improvements on the offensive side of the ball will also make their job easier. This offseason has been a challenge to say the least. I guess we will find real soon if this DL is as bad as you are predicting. Again I always appreciate all the content you have delivered for us.
It’s not less than spectacular.
It’s an absolute disaster.
People keep saying the second level defenders will mask the warts. How? They’ll be exposed! They’re going to have 300lbs linemen in their chops because this DL won’t be able to do jack.
Do people seriously think they’re going to blanket cover for five, six, seven, eight seconds in order for Rasheem Green to take his merry time to get to the QB?
Come on.
I appreciate that you appreciate the content. But I think we need to face the stark reality here.
Again I get the frustration with how they handled this offseason. We all agree the DL is some level of bad but until they get out on the field we will not know the level of ineptitude. They might be the worst DL in the history of the NFL or they might be bad but manageable. Believe me I’m not diluting myself. I’m just not ready to speak in absolutes without even seeing a preseason game.
I concur with your assessment of the possible change in how the team operates since Paul Allen died. It seems rudderless with the president and the owner, without the strong guidance and support of Allen. Many of us have worked in companies or organization and have seen what happens when ownership and/or management changes. Even competent people lower in the chain can lose perspective and will to act in the most efficacious way for the organization. A body needs a head…
9-7 here we come. I know rob has taken a lot of grief about the pass rush commentary but it’s the second most important role behind the qb and the Seahawks have flat out failed. Of course we will all root for the best but the front office has botched this. Go hawks…
100% agree.
You never know, there may be a few twists and turns still with Clowney, but assuming he signs elsewhere, I think it’s safe to say this was PCJS’s worst offseason in 10 years here, based on process. I was harsh on the 2018 offseason and deservedly so, but at least you could kind of understand on a human level why they were hormonal that offseason. This time they had a short putt to put Seattle into legit SB contention and missed it badly.
Sometimes you have bad processes the produce good results. It doesn’t happen often, but it’s something I’m hoping for. Maybe Mayowa is a steal, maybe Alton Robinson is a steal, maybe Taylor gets on the field at some point and Collier develops. Of those, I’m only mildly bullish on Robinson though.
On the optimistic side, the failures of this offseason make it even more likely that Norton will be upgraded at DC next offseason. And generally, the signings are short term and will be gotten out of quickly. If Seattle has Dan Quinn or someone similarly capable at DC next year and finally realizes they have to actually do something on the DL, next year could certainly be the year we were hoping the 2020 offseason would be.
Why lay this at Norton’s feet. This is Pete’s defense and Norton is doing his best to adhere to that. Bringing back DQ won’t change that, or any other DC for that matter.
You need to horses to run the race. The LB and DBs are improved, so he might be able to squeeze more out the the unit this year. The only horses missing are bonified superstar DL players or at least 2 really really really good DEs.
I’m not laying this all on Norton. But Norton looked has looked outside his depth at DC in both Oakland and Seattle. It’s I think the biggest area for upgrade on the entire team, including personnel. I don’t think a DC change would fix everything but it’s the biggest move that needs to be made in my opinion.
Does anyone think Jeff Bezos would buy the Seahawks?
I’m looking for a single “rich” owner, not a collective.
Gawd I hope not!
Spending tens of millions on after-thought players who very likely won’t be here in two years is Bavasian on its own. But to do that while also missing out on Clowney, Griffen, and Yannick at better than expected market value is honestly a bit of a nightmare I didn’t think was possible in March. This offseason is forcing me to re-evaluate the general competency of the FO. My only hope is they have information that we don’t have on the top end pass rushers they failed to acquire. Otherwise, this offseason looks really, really bad.
I’m going with your gut feeling on that one Kip. Trust your gut.
On the plus side, Datone Jones is available 🤪
Hey Kip, been a long time!
I listened to the first ~25 minutes of the Hawkblogger pod. FWIW all those guys were wtf, this is a completely inexcusable failure, the DL is awful. So, it’s not just Rob. I think anyone that can look at this objectively sees it as a failure. The pass rush is not fixed. The DL is not fixed.
And it’s time for questions to be asked by the people able to ask them.
We’ll see if that happens on Monday.
I disagree. But certainly respect your well-supported opinion.
“muh value”
I’m tired of this crap. The deal to get Adams was a great move, and I’ll defend the cost of it, but attempting to be overly clever by maxing out your cap space with “value” signings This whole offseason felt more like the FO was going full Billy Bean and signing players based on spreadsheet calculations. That might work in baseball, but not here.
I have to agree with previous posts in this thread that JSPC need someone at the top to hold them to account. Yes, when they first took over, they were brilliant and led to the SeaHawks first SB win. What then?
Times change! Their strategy worked brilliantly for several years when it came to choosing the right players in the draft and FA. Times change. The rest of the league has changed. The NFC West has changed. PCJS don’t seem to have changed though. They created a SB winning roster several years ago. Now what?
There are two things Seahawks fans don’t want to consider that I think are true.
1. They need a proper ownership structure pronto
2. Russell Wilson isn’t going to accept this forever
Hasn’t JS been riding on PC coaching skills for a long time.
JS has never been that great in the drafts or trades (hard to get it right)
I don’t disagree with either of those points but will make a counterpoint on #2.
Russell is currently signed through 2023. The team could easily choose to franchise tag him for two seasons after that (through 2025), maybe three (through 2026) if they’re feeling spiteful (or desperate). Thus, he isn’t going anywhere anytime soon … unless Seattle decides to move him (or let him walk) – not the other way around.
And I think Russ values his image too much (and is probably actually the “good guy” that he plays on TV) so I doubt he’d every truly “rock the boat” – so to speak – by holding out, skipping camp, etc.
Granted, none of the above means that he’s going to “accept this”; it’s just offered as a counterpoint because at the end of the day, it really doesn’t matter if Russ “accepts” it or not; league rules favor the owners.
Contract?
It won’t make any difference if the relationship breaks down.
https://twitter.com/ParkerLewisJR/status/1301683597129084929
“Me trying to talk myself into a Seahawks defense that doesn’t have Clowney”
I would think Brooks wouldve been available much later as well, he was between 80-100 on most draft boards. It will be interesting to follow his creer & that of the much higher ranked Patrick Queen, who was selected 1 pick later by the Ravens.
But I disagree with Robs comment of trading up for Ruiz, nobody expected the Saints to take him.
No way we wouldve last that long. There were talks about Brooks possibly being a fit for BAL. Harbaugh is a coach that cherishes consistency and Brooks > Queen in that dept. I do agree looking at their careers will tell the tale.
What can you do when you want someone, but they don’t want you? Clowney seems to have a reputation of being great at times and below average at other times. Who knows his thought process? Give Carrol and js credit… they I believe offered Clowney the most money, but he obviously wanted to play elsewhere. He reminds me of Joey Galloway…just did not want to play here. If Russ wants to keep playing games through the media… whatever… that’s petty…and I have a hard time believing Russ would stoop that low. I would think he could talk to Pete and John without the passive aggressive cowherd bullshit. I’ll choose big balls pete over Russel anytime anywhere. A hall of fame safety is not a bad consolation prize for losing clowney and two first round picks. Yes I agree that they did not improve their pass rush…yet I give them credit for having a vision that is not train wrecked on fixing one problem. They are gonna take a tilt the game player when the opportunity arises…see Clowney last year.
“Give Carrol and js credit… they I believe offered Clowney the most money, but he obviously wanted to play elsewhere.”
No, no, no, no, no.
I’m not giving them any credit. If that’s true they should’ve moved on and signed someone else. Everson Griffen was available for $6m FFS.
” If Russ wants to keep playing games through the media… whatever”
Yeah we don’t need him.
“I would think he could talk to Pete and John without the passive aggressive cowherd bullshit.”
What if they’re not listening?
“I’ll choose big balls pete over Russel anytime anywhere”
You shouldn’t have to choose.
“A hall of fame safety is not a bad consolation prize for losing clowney and two first round picks.”
It will be when he’s ineffective because the D-line can’t do anything to impact games and it leaves him exposed.
“Yes I agree that they did not improve their pass rush”
You think???
“yet I give them credit for having a vision that is not train wrecked on fixing one problem.”
Carroll and Schneider: ‘We need to fix the pass rush’
Carroll and Schneider: Don’t fix pass rush
You: Great job guys
“They are gonna take a tilt the game player when the opportunity arises…see Clowney last year.”
They just let a tilt the game player join the Titans.
“I’ll choose big balls pete over Russel anytime anywhere.”
Three quarters of “big balls Pete” give us two scores down on a regular basis. One quarter of “let Russ cook” off the playbook is required to be the saving grace in almost any game last season.
I cannot bear that rubbish anymore. PC is in complete control of this roster, he can pick to his scheme and he made a dogs dinner. We are buried in a pile of crap picks.
Possibly JDC really didn’t want to play here. There has to be a reason. Word is, he went to JS office for thanking the franchise. I would have expected him to thank the HC. IMO, he knew very well that PCs scheme is not an optimal fit to his capabilities and posed a threath to his value. Is it possible, that he made proposals that fell on deaf ears?
P.S.
A hall of fame safety won’t give you a championship. You need quality lines, at least average. Ask the Jets.
Just got off work. So did Clowney sign with the Titans or not? If he did/does I’m not surprised. There’s no way, absolutely no way in hell the Hawks FO can even begin to think of this offseason as a success. They treaded water at best. When will the sports media hold them to account?
Without SDB I would have to endure almost constant borderline propaganda from the Hawks FO, and the Hawks accounts on social media. I’d also have to endure the almost total fluff and rose colored glasses from the local radio and the insane life sucking Seahawks Twitter.
Thanks Rob!
My pleasure
Hi Rob – As an overly optimistic fan, I can only hope that the DLINE gels with Reed leading the way and gets some help from LBs and DBs off the edge. If the DLINE can be more productive than last year (which is not a big ask considering last year’s performance), the secondary is significantly improved with Dunbar, Blair, and Adams running more nickel, and somehow we get more speed at LB to improve run D off of the edge (hoping that Brooks and Irvin can play a part in this), can the defense not be markedly improved from last year? Match all of that optimism with perhaps Russel’s best weapons ever, and can you not see the Hawks winning the NFC west this year? One thing I havent mentioned is the OLINE. I think this is actually a bigger liability than the DLINE at this point…
There’s no way the OL is more of an issue.
Look — this DL situation is terrifying. I can not believe what they’ve done this year.
Nobody should be talking this into a positive.
It’s a true indictment of the quality of the DL situation, when an OL with no settlement at C and a questionmark at RT is not worse.
At least, we can party up every single pressure, while OLs die in silence.
A guy that caught my eye that was cut was Charger FB/TE Bobby Holly.
They stated that he was not the style of FB they were looking for, looking for a modern guy who can block, rush and catch passes. This sounds like a guy who wants to go hit people…… EXACTLY what Seattle needs at FB. 5’11” 240+….. yes please.
Clowney to Titans confirmed by Josina Anderson on Twitter. Hawks will have to scrape the bottom of the barrel now…
https://youtu.be/_asNhzXq72w
There’s a high probability that you are right. That said, I’m a bit higher on Mayowa and Irvin than you are. For pure sacks and pressure, they are for my money a better duo than we had last year. They really did need to find one more legitimately talented pass rushers though; failure to do so means you are entirely dependent on one of your young guys maturing into a quality starter. It’s never good to rely on unproven talent for something so critical.
But now here is the qualifier; you’re right and my kind of affirming it is true specifically IF they try to rush four. Now unfortunately that is a pretty likely if; we have never seen a Pete Carroll-coached Seahawks’ defense that has ever done anything but rush four the majority of the time. Even in the face of being clearly flawed and behind the times, Pete has a tendency to be extremely stubborn. Even in so far as it is objectively detrimental.
With that said, Seattle has all the fixings for a team that disguises blitzes and is willing to take more risks. Ball control and keeping the ball in front of you on defense simply doesn’t fit the assembled talent. What we have is a generational quarterback that hasn’t been allowed to air it out the way you would hope. If roster moves are any indication, Wilson will be slinging it a lot more this year. Which means if the offense can finally change, then maybe the defense can as well.
Brooks, Blair, and most especially Adams are all well suited for blitzing. And Irvin is essentially a DE who will play a lot of LB. If it wasn’t for my knowing Pete Carroll and his tendency to do it his way, I would think this team was built around scoring a lot with Wilson. Basically build an elite secondary that can actually cover in the short range, and then bring the heat. You’ll give up more big plays, but you also make more of them and get the ball back to Wilson sooner.
This is a relatively tested and viable way to structure a team. And this also would depend on your secondary not becoming burnt toast. In other words you will have to pay to keep it together. So fast and assignment-sound budget DL on the outside makes strategic sense. Can’t pay everyone. You’re basically not going to be relying on a star player to consistently win their matchups and create pressure on their own. If this actually ends up being the plan, then that mixed with bringing in midlevel veterans in a disrupted offseasons because of COVID, and I’m overall kind of happy.
Again, this is a big if; this is Pete Carroll we’re talking about. I’ll have to see it with my own eyes to believe institutional change for the sake of maximizing Russell is actually occurring. At this stage it is highly likely that we will just sit in base and get picked apart; and will have only really solved the issue with the stretch runs. But I also see roster potential for a not-Pete-Carroll approach that I think a lot of fans desperately want to see. Air it out and manufacture pressure until young guys develop; I don’t hate the idea. What I am afraid of is stubborn mismanagement of who is actually on the roster.
“For pure sacks and pressure, they are for my money a better duo than we had last year.”
Ziggy Ansah was semi-retired last year so this is no achievement for starters. Secondly, Mayowa was ranked #40 in pass rushing grade by PFF last year — far below Clowney. He played on 300 snaps because he was phased out by the Raiders and they made no attempt to retain him.
“IF they try to rush four”
This is the scheme I’m afraid. It’s as much a reality as saying, ‘Pete would like to run the ball well’.
“Seattle has all the fixings for a team that disguises blitzes and is willing to take more risks.”
Let’s be very clear here. If you need to rely on blitzing for pressure, you are screwed. Especially when you don’t have a scheme set up to do it like Tampa Bay, New York or Baltimore.
“You’ll give up more big plays, but you also make more of them and get the ball back to Wilson sooner.”
This is the complete opposite of Pete’s defensive philosophy.
“This is a relatively tested and viable way to structure a team.”
Not for Pete.
“Can’t pay everyone.”
They spent nearly $60m in free agency.
“What I am afraid of is stubborn mismanagement of who is actually on the roster.”
It’s not stubborn. They’ve just done a really bad job.
Hey man, if you’re right you’re right. I’m personally of the opinion that you are. Experience tells me that they won’t adapt the system to the personnel. But at some point you have to wonder why the coach can’t schematically utilize the team the highly proficient GM has assembled. I can see the strategy in the roster construction. But on the field you would actually have to cater to the types of talent that you have. Yeah, this team is built like Greg William’s is the DC; and maybe something along that line is the answer. But something has to give, and I’m going to guess that isn’t going to be the one who was the architect of the team that Wilson will spend his prime years chasing a ring on. We need an aggressive defense to match with maximizing Wilson. We’re built that way, but this is probably Carroll’s season to prove he can coach what Schneider gives him. Oh, and the bar is really low, so having a better pass rush than last year is almost a given. I expect improvement based alone off what they have done. Whether we’re still a bottom-seven pass rushing team or not will depend on whether we use aggression or sit back in a soft zone all game.
Experience tells me that they won’t adapt the system to the personnel.
They did exactly that last season. They didn’t have a nickel (at least not one they were comfortable using) so they ran their base defense 68% of the time – by far the highest rate in the league; second place was Arizona at 38%. Pete being Pete, claimed that it was because “we really love our linebackers and want to keep them on the field as much as we can.” 12s everywhere threw things at their TVs.
This year, as of this moment, the D-line is last year’s nickel – they don’t have one that they’re comfortable using. Will be really, REALLY interesting to see how they “adapt” – can they play all 6 of their linebackers 70% of the time? If so, we already know what Pete will say: “We really love our linebackers and want to keep them on the field as much as we can.”
Running the SAM more than the nickel isn’t adapting their system. It’s running a system they run more frequently.
Using that to validate your suggestion about using 6 linebackers at once is, frankly, ridiculous.
It was actually sarcasm 😉
Josina implies here that the Seahawks were trying to sign Clowney last night, then says there’s ‘more to how they were trying to get him back’.
https://twitter.com/JosinaAnderson/status/1302494418214293504
This to me is worrying for two reasons.
1. It shows they were trying to get him, that they probably were banking on trying to recruit him back. They hadn’t moved on. They just didn’t get it done.
2. That there’s something that happened here that pissed Clowney off.
What a mess.
I think Clowney might blame Hawks for his lukewarm market. And he’d be pretty stupid to sign a one year deal anything under 20m with the Hawks. He’d be the only good DE on the roster so he’d get ton of double/triple teams which could mean few sacks few pressures. He needs to go to a team that’ll help him pad his statsheet and create market for him
I posited on another site that there would probably be another “twist” to the Clowney saga before all was said and done. The COVID-19 protocol takes 3 days now that training camp has ended (it was 4 previously). Clowney may be flying to Tennessee in the morning but he won’t be able to enter their facilities to take his physical until Wednesday at the earliest. And until he passes his physical, he’s not officially a Titan.
I’m not holding my breath on the idea of him changing his mind and coming back to Seattle, but I will point out that Earl Thomas had an agreement with Kansas City 2 years ago before getting on a plane to Baltimore instead.
If there’s anything about Clowney that has become clear in the past several months, it’s that he’s going to play every card he can right up until the very last second. It would not surprise me a bit if he were texting with other teams while he was in the car on the way to the Titan’s facility to sign his contract. Or if he stopped at the bathroom to check his texts one last time before actually signing it.
He’s gone.
He’s not coming here.
Stage one: denial
Honestly, to me this feels more like Josina just trying to grasp on to any last straws of insider clout that she can by replying to a Seahawks media member who mentioned her as the source who broke the news instead of Dianna. And the cryptic part of it just says to me: “I don’t really have anything more to report, but you should be interested in me anyways.”
I think SEA, TEN, NO were all at $12m last night, then TEN improved their offer “up to $15m” (we’ll see what kind of incentives he has to meet to actually get it) and Clowney took it. The Hawks probably didn’t match.
I think you’re right.
It’s also terrible from Josina. “I know something but will be vague about it and bye!”
You’re not 14 Josina.
I think a large part of her currency is tapping into that self-centered self-promoting side of some players. Wouldn’t surprise me if there’s a chunk of players out there that feel the Rapsheets and Schefters tend to tow the company line a little too much and vibe with Josina.
Funnily enough ESPN moved on and nobody has jumped in
They made their bed and now they have to sleep in it now. As I have posted previously, after shoving all of our chips in by trading for Adams to haggle with him for $1-$2M was short sided, arrogant and foolish. I would be pissed if I were Clowney. I don’t blame him a bit. He gave the Hawks every chance and if at the 12th hour we were trying to get cute (restructure contracts and BTW why are paying a #3 TE $3M+ a year) he gave them the ET type salute.
Rob, I hear you and we share your frustration. I would like to hear what we can do going forward. And please don’t just say we’re screwed. Let’s look at what options we have. God help us, Clay can’t be a serious option B. We need more bodies at Tackle.
I think it’s Clay.
That’s plan Z
I will choke if they give him anywhere from $5-$6M. Wouldn’t be surprised after overpaying every vet we signed this year (Irvin, Olsen, Mayowa, Cedric). We overpaid the B level players and tried to squeeze our top priority to save $2M. Fun times. Always competing…
Wow, so I decided to sleep off this news and see how I feel about it in the morning. If it’s truly $12m the Seahawks absolutely failed in there attempts to sign him, and in their overall offseason. I remember back in February and March how positive and excited we all were about an offseason primed with picks and cap space to aggressively reshape this roster and instead we got months of sitting around googling Clowney’s name to see if there were any developments on the last available impact player at their stated offseason priority. This article lays out the full picture of their failures, and its clearly not good enough.
Wilson is going to need to play out of his mind for this to be a championship season, and even then they’ll probably still come undone against the top teams.
My glass half full take is as such: the Seahawks are a massively unbalanced roster with some elite players and some massive holes, those elite players will at least be fun as hell to watch this year and with Russ on the team (and Pete’s never say die culture that he still deserves credit for imo) they’ll be some miraculous highs along the way. Maybe there are some gems that emerge to give us more of a starting position next year, but I’m not expecting Alton Robinson to save a league worst pass rush this year. I’m just in a place to enjoy what’s to come and get ready to talk about how they need to fix the pass rush again next year
Mario Edwards, the only slightly enticing option of the Dlineman cut yesterday, is signing with the Bears.
Everson Griffin, 6 mil
SMDH
What a front office debacle as far as defensive pass rush! It all started with Malik McDowell. Threw away a 2nd on a Sheldon Richardson 1 year rental. 3rd rounder and Jacob Martin on a year rental. These are personnel that could be on this team still providing towards our pass rush. I have always been the one who says JS/PC will figure it out. They have done a lot for the Seahawks and provided a decade of winning football for its fans that most teams dont get we got a Superbowl(Im grateful for the memory) but equally so i can say cost us a Superbowl and other Superbowl’s by poor decision making. Russel Wilson IMO has probably covered up more of their bad decisions. The lack of wanting to spend on superior talent for the offensive and defensive line (Except with wasted draft capital). Always looking to make the deal in those areas. We couldn’t beat 12 million? I know we dont have the big picture but as fans we never will. Which is why as a fan, I get the luxury to react to what I do see which is they blew more draft capitol on a player and let him walk away! Always compete! Here is my first flaming ball of anger and vitriol into their court. Prove me wrong by winning a Superbowl! Im out…so disappointed.
I’d really like it if we could extend Adams sooner rather than later.
Not only do I have post trade stress disorder from losing a 2nd and a 3rd for 1 year rentals in recent years, we now have about $10m in cap space that we’re doing nothing with, might as well up his cap hit now to save some money down the line. But then I’m sure Jamal will be perfectly happy to play this out until the cards are all stacked in his favour, although given the way Seattle sets a price for a player and refuses to budge on it, he might find himself playing on that 5th year option and heading to free agency.
The team NEEDS to use the remaining cap space to bring in some D-linemen. Barring that, they should save the $$ and roll it over to next season when the cap is expected to DROP as much as $23M ($175M is the “floor”). Extending Adams now serves very little purpose, IMO.
It seems obvious that they are banking on the young guys they have making a step up. I think it’s appropriate to be seriously skeptical about that plan, but here is hoping for the best! I do think Reed is probably a decent bet for a rebound year. Green maturing into at least an average starter is certainly possible as he has flashed. Projecting collier to do much of anything takes some serious rose colored glasses, but we don’t know what the coaches are seeing in practice everyday. I also think this may be the year the hawks deviate from the rush 4 script and start getting seriously creative with blitz packages to bring some needed pressure.
I think your take is completely justified, but I also see how this could work out better than expected.
I’ve been a hawks fan for almost 30 years at this point and PC/JS are the best coach/gm team we have ever had, I’m going to give them the benefit of the doubt that they do have a plan better then hoping Mayowa and Irvine magically turn into players they have never been their entire careers.
I love this blog and appreciate all the well thought out articles and comments especially with the absence of sports for months. That said, it has been so focused on big name pass rush coming from the DL I think it has ignored the overall improvement of the team. The Jets had a terrible DL and were 11th in DVOA. The JAGS who had a bunch of DL that many, including me, wanted but couldn’t stop the run and were near the bottom of the league. I am surprised we didn’t add to the DL during training camp and am disappointed that Taylor still can’t even practice, but the sky is not falling. It will be up to PC to be more creative on D and utilize the assets we have (we could have the best secondary and/or LB core in the league) and the offense to reach its potential (I think it will be in the top 3). Can’t wait to find out if they do.
No it hasn’t.
I wish people would stop passing comment on what ‘this blog’ has done.
We’ve talked about the defining issue of the off season.
THATS IT.
+1
Josina embarrassed herself yesterday.
We shouldn’t trust her anything including her report about seahawks last minute push…
Non of serious insiders mention anything but monitoring in last few days…
if.her report is true, that type of approach would be more than embarrassing for Pete and John…they are to serious for that…
I agree with both points!
Then trade for Calais and sign Everson Griffen.
What a mess.
Couldn’t they have just traded or released Hollister for that extra 3 million? Or not signed all that trash in free agency…
Literally anything if they wanted to.
What’s strange to me is that PC/JS seem kind of bi-polar: they go all out with guns blazing and overkill when they really want to get some things done, and then they seem resigned to sit back and lowball other times despite admitting that it’s a need.
I’m sure that extra $3m for a 3rd string TE will be much more critical to our success this season than a top pass rusher would have been…
And all that amazing “depth and competition” on the OL will be much better than just going out and signing Conklin. And they said outright that they secured their top 3 targets for the OL, so this is all on them now.
I guess sometimes they just need to realize that not every deal is going to be the heist of the century. Sometimes you just pay a good player a fair value instead of getting a “bargain” on 3 mediocre players. Or am I missing something here?
Worst DL in league and by a wide margin. The secondary will need to create a ton of turn overs and Russ will have to score 30+ per game for this team to have a shot at the playoffs.
How did we get in this mess? It was hard to make this many screws ups at one position group and some bad luck.
-Awful McDowell pick
-McDowell bone head move career ending Injury
-Desperate Sheldon Richardson trade to try and replace McDowell
-Fluke injury to Cliff
-Debacle with Michael Bennett
-Failure to draft and develop a prospect since Frank Clark
-Not signing Clark a home grown top 5 pass rusher to a long term deal
-Drafting LJ Collier in Rd #1 of what most consider the best DE draft in years
-Not signing Clowney, Quinn or Fowler this off season when you had tons of # to spend.
-Failing to aquire Calais Campbell when a 4th could have gotten it done.
In fact the only really good moves they have made with the DL was drafting Reed and signing Poona as a UDFA.
Anyways at least we should see tons of shoot outs and lots of points scored this season.
Think about the last three top DL picks. McDowell played 0 snaps. Collier played maybe 150 snaps year1. Taylor won’t play a single snap for 6 weeks, which puts the remainder of the season in serious jeopardy. That’s astounding.
Now let’s look at some later round draft picks. Naz Jones made a strong debut, then faded into obscurity and never played. Demarcus Christmas never played a snap. Jacob Martin was a litttle under sized but had some good moves/speed and showed promise of being a good rotational piece, but is gone after one season. Rasheed Green, did nothing his rookie year, and showed a few flashes year 2.
Out of that entire list, only TWO guys will contribute this year. The other 5 barely contributed anything ever and already gone. That’s all since 2017.
Yep, poor drafting is why they’re in the position they’re in now and poor drafting may be the eventual reason Russ leaves.
really disappointed. even w all the smoke, i still had this gut feeling that we were going to get it done and bring him back.
for me – ifs not just the position of need point that has been made well here by many. Im also big on overall talent level, and like Adams, we just dont usually get a whiff of talent at Clowney’s level. Playmaker athletes like him go at the top of drafts. And we had him, you could tell he had a good experience w the team last year – losing him over this level of money makes no sense to me.
and what also shouldnt be lost in this – i really enjoyed watching him play – effort and freak athleticism and speed. what a drag.
The 49ers and Rams are going to have a field day against our D.
Went to bed last night hoping some how, some way, the Hawks would sway Clowney. Nope.
Can’t wait to see the accumulation of bandaids JS and PC trot out on the D line this year. 4th level waiver wire pick ups. They have no draft collateral to make any moves either.
What a travesty of an off-season. The Jamal Adams trade just makes it worse now. Why make that deal to play behind this patchwork of a D line? It makes zero sense.
What is the over under on sacks for the Hawks this year? 15 +\- sounds about right for a good betting line.
Welcome to Seattle Clay Mathews…
While I’m not saying that they will do it or that they should do it, Seattle DOES still have draft capital they can leverage to make a move for a d-lineman if they really, REALLY want to / feel like they “need” to. Specifically, they have a 2nd round pick in 2021 (which would have gotten them Yannick Ngakoue if they’d been willing to pull that trigger) and a 4th round pick in 2021 (which might have gotten them Calais Campbell if he were still available). They also have a 5th rounder – which was enough to get Diggs last season and Dunbar this off-season. And two 7th round picks which … yeah, they wouldn’t get any “quality” d-linemen for a 7th round pick.
The lack of accountability bothers me.
Part of that is the media for rarely being willing to challenge.
Yet Schneider does about three interviews a year. Howie Roseman did one yesterday on all the decisions he made. He was challenged on things like releasing Sidney Jones and he argued his case.
Where’s our version of that?
PC has veered off in his press conf answers more than once to praise JS without being asked.
A bit too “thou doth protest too much” for my taste.
+1
And I think that JS would actually lay it out to an extent if given the proper opportunity, whereas PC will continue to “compete” forever. I’m so glad that the Seahawks “monitored” all the pass rushers’ situations this off-season…
and I can’t wait to hear from Pete how “excited we are to finally bring in Clay Matthews, something we’ve been wanting to make happen for a long time and just never worked out that way…” 🤣
https://twitter.com/CableThanos_/status/1302487630290903043
Zackly
Monday’s press conference.
Will be extremely revealing.
In what questions are actually asked.
#TellTheTruthMonday
Probably going to be a lot of soft questions like…
– How do you feel going into Week 1?
– What does Atlanta bring to the table?
– What’s the change in mentality now that it’s game week?
I would be very surprised we got a question questioning the defensive line and Clowney. I would also be surprised that if we did get a question about their failure to address it that Pete would even care to answer it thoughtfully and honestly.
I have lost almost all trust in Pete Carroll and John Schneider to run this team. How they handled this offseason has been nothing short of a failure. They mismanaged their cap by too much bargain shopping. They also stated their top need and did not bring in enough talent to address it, by a long shot. They panicked and gave up a ton to get Adams.
My record prediction is 9-7 with an outside chance at a wild card.
Pete Carroll and John Schneider are on the hot seat going into 2021.
“Can you talk for 10 minutes about what Shaquem has meant to your team and how hard it was to cut him?”
“What kind of COVID protocols will you have for your trip to Atlanta?”
“Which of the two lousy centers will start Sunday?”
[Art Thiel] “What kind of protest do you have planned for Sunday and can you comment more about race relations in this country?”
“Do you think RW is going to have a good season?”
👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻
It’s funny because it’s true
Spot on cha!!! 😂😂😂
It always sounds like media members are there trying to be buddies with PC and JS instead of doing a good job.
Disappointing indeed. Also so much for the comp pick folks were betting on when the trade was made last year. Just tells you that you can’t go into a deal thinking you’ll get it back.
Honestly, I think they thought they would get him back no matter what. He is the one they wanted. They felt no one would make the impact he did. Many of us even said that signing Fowler or Quinn would just be a compliment to him. They were confident he liked the team and had relationships hear. They were confident he wanted to come back. They were confident they could get him for their price. I think they thought it was business and it turned personal. Does he blame them for the cold market? Was he mad they didn’t show him top dollar? Does he blame them for the lack of stats?is he just exhausted with him after a year-long negotiation? In the end the master recruiters bet on themselves to get it done either way at a price they deemed fair and didn’t come away with the player who I think wasn’t sold on returning anyways.
I honestly wonder if it was that delay of game on the 1 yard line in game 17 that killed the mood. or was it John’s penny-pinching? or maybe Clowney just wasn’t enamored with living in South Alaska?
whatever it was it sure seems the ‘Hawks misjudged the situation and are now left holding the bag (of poo)…
Improving our Dline has been a major focus for the last few offseasons. It has progressively got worse. How can this happen? Fault lies squarely at the feet of the front office.
Which means squarely at the feet of Pete Carroll. He is in charge and all decisions are ultimately his. Jihn is niot a puppet and has some autonomy but in the end he runs the decisions by Pete for approval or veto. In the press conference that introduced Pete a decade ago, it was made clear this is HIS baby. That hasn’t changed.
This whole situation has been inexcusably mismanaged, and the FO’s ill-conceived gamble has resulted in spectacular failure with consequences that will echo across at least the season. They didn’t even bother to hedge their bet, and their other offseason moves have been truly mind boggling at times. I’m doing my best to squint but I can’t see any sign of a cohesive vision. We’ve scored a hat trick of own-goals and likely hamstrung our season before it’s even begun. It’s maddening.
I agree this article is necessary. I was hopeful we could pull Clowney off at the last moment. Hope we can do something today now that we know for sure. Would love to see Bennett back, but I kind of doubt he stayed in game shape. Thoughts on anything else?
Bennett is done.
And he was done in Seattle two and a half years ago.
Have we tried calling Dwight Freeney?
Go get O’Brien Schofield.
Bring him home.
https://youtu.be/7erl9k01C2M
I look at the offseason differently.
1. The seahawks under Carrol, Schneider and with RW see themselves as a dynasty. They think as a dynasty.
1a. Necessary for a dynasty is that you have a great coach, a great quarterback, a great general manager, a specific and effective way of playing the game, a culture that fits the way of playing. The seahawks have developed all of this.
2. They do not think that they have a short window. They think their (next) window is the 2020-2030.
3. There are three different phases to a dynasty under the changed salary rules with regard to drafted players. The first phase is when a qb is just drafted and therefore cheap. The second is when he is in his prime. The third when his body begins to slow, but his mind gets even faster.
4. Between phase 1 and 2 a rebuild is necessary. That is because in phase 1 a lot of extra money can be spend on the rest of the team. Between phase 2 and 3 a fundamental rebuild will not be necessary.
5. We are in year three of this rebuild. It is amazing that the seahawks reached the playoffs in the first two years of it. Last year we were inches away from winning the division and possibly reaching the superbowl. That is amazing. (Interestingly enough these overperformances have lead to the istrange idea that we are in a we-have-to-win-now situation. Carrol would say “we are in a win-now mindset every year”. And he is right. But in terms of the rebuild this team will be at a new peak in 21…and hopefully stay there for three four years.)
6. It is easy to underestimate the ambition with which C and S are rebuilding. They are trying to build a team that is a better version of the 2013,14,15 team. The offense will be better because Wilson is so much better. But they are also trying to get him more weapons. More suprisingly however i think they are also trying to build a defense on the level of 2013. Carrol wants to create a second great defense. He is not aiming for average. He wants the best defense of the NFL again.
7. If i look at the offseason through the lense of the rebuilding of the offense they have achieved a lot.
7a. The offensive line was facing a huge problem. Britt was hurt, ifedi not good enough, fluker and lupati band-aids. Duane Brown was the only good player left. They had to bring in a lot of new players. Veterans if possible, or very good rookies. Without spending to much money. They did exactly that. We could have a good line later on this year, we will probably have an average line from the beginning -and that is good enough. We are watching solari slowly building a line according to his specifications. This will continue.
7b. The receiver corps is the best wilson has ever had -it is good, deep and extremely cheap. It is one of the best of the whole nfl. The duo of locket and metcalf is the second best in the nfl? Behind evans and godwin? A trio of l,m and gordon…the best?
7c. The tight end corps is the best wilson ever had. Olsen and Dissley will be a fearsome duo. They are also the backup for each other. Hollister has shown that he can be very good as a pass catching tight end. Is it one of the better tight end groups in the nfl? Top five?
7d. The running back group is very good. The addition of hide and dallas to carson, penny and homer makes for a diverse, deep and punishing group. Its difficult to say it is better then earlier versions because of marshawn….but is it one of the best of the nfl? Yes.
8. There is a theme here. Depth. Groups that have become the best. Remember, last season we did not win the division and then lost in the playoffs mainly because almost every running back was injured, locket was a decoy and dissley was missing.
9. If i look at the defense through the lense of rebuilding the picture is more complex, but also much better then people think. And remember, i believe pete is trying to create a second great defense.
9a. Within the pete carrol system safeties are the key to the backfield. They have been drafting safeties all through the rebuild. Given how late they draft there is a real problem. They need at least one great safety all pro, hall of fame. They are not going to be able to draft that. So i think they have been drafting depth, hoping for more. Blair is the result of that. He is a very good safety, able to play three positions. But to get the really great safety they want, they always needed to do that through a trade. I therefore do not look at the trade for adams at all as a desperation move. I think they have been targeting him for a long time. I think it started with the trade for diggs. Diggs is a very good safety in his own right. But the duo of diggs and adams has the chance to be amzing. And i do not think it is a coincidence that these two are friends from way back. Adams wanted to come to seattle. I think there were three reasons for that: the culture, the winning and diggs. That also means that i do not think they overpaid. This type of defense playmaker, potential hall of famer, will cost two late first rounders. And his value in seattle is bigger then anywhere else. The seahawks now have what is possibly the best safety duo in the nfl.
9b. Corners can be developed within the seahawks system. There is a reason why the seahawks draft them relatively late. Sherm was exceptional. But the system does not need exceptional. Is there a chance we will find, develop exceptional again? Yes. But they saw an opportunity to trade cheaply for a real talent. So they went for dunbar. We have now possibly the best secondary of the nfl.
9c. The seahawks are replacing the last part of the legion of boom defense. They are replacing k.j. and bobby. They need to. And because of the underestimation of the value of linebackers across the nfl it is possible to do that through the draft. For two drafts now they have invested in the position. Barton and brooks are the result so far. They are doing it in such a way that the new linebackers can learn from the greats that are already here. Could it be that these two already are the replacement? It could be. It also could be that they will draft some more. Do we have at the moment one of the best linebacker groups of the NFL? I think so.
9d.The seahawks declared fixing the pass rush their priority. Did they do enough? I do not think so. Could it be that this will derail this season? It could be. I completely agree with rob that they hoped to get clowney back. And they did not get it done. But i look at the process differently. The seahawks will not pay top dollar for a passrusher. They never have. In this second phase of their dynasty -because of the higher percentage of qb pay- its even more unlikely that they will then in the first phase. What they are looking for is pass rushers they can develop. That can be through the draft if rushers fall for some reason or through inefficiencies in the free trade market. I will not say they need luck, but they need time. They need a series of seasons to get this right. Would they have brought Clowney back if he had agreed to a 12 million contract early? I suspect they would. That they did not do it here at the end can have a couple of different reasons. It can be that the relationship soured. It can be that they value cap more at the moment that at the beginning. It can be that they have more confidence then we have in what they have -and maybe its a combination. We will know more after a third of the season.
9e. Dt is unfinished. They like reed, ford and mone, but they obviously need another player. I am actually happy that they got rid of all the others. They were mediocre, oractice squad material. I think they will still bring somebody in. Doesnt Schneider always do that?
10. I also think that cap soace for next year and the soecificity of the NFC west team have played into the decisions of this offseason -but that is for another post.
11. In conclusion: they are rebuillding with ambition. They are not finished yet. They want to build a better team then 13/14/15. Pete wants to build a second great defense….and they actually did in many ways a remarkable job this offseason. An offseason that actually started with the trade for diggs. We have the best qb. We have top five position groups in rb, receiver, tight ends, in safeties, the secondary, linebackers. Can they get to a good enough oline? Can they get to a good enough d-line? Lets see. If they get to that a superbowl appearance is possible. If not -a playoff run. Ill be happy with both. And i will guarantee that they will be even better next season.
I guarantee Russell Wilson does not fit into your words in this way.
Or that they think they have 10 years to play with. Pete is 69 this month.
You’ve written a lot there but very little of it seems to be backed up with anything. A lot of hopeful assertions and excuses.
With resoect Rob, i think RW would be the first to say that he sees his window open for the next ten years.
Not with a team where he can’t win championships.
RW: “I want superstars”
Seahawks: Well, we’ve convinced Gregg Olsen not to retire…
I want superstars: jamal adams.
See point #4 in the piece
Even if that holds true, then they lost a superstar and got a new one.
But, for reality’s sake…
Are you sure, they are prepared Jamal Adams the 20m he desires?
They “ambitiously” spent close to $60m in cap space on backups and retreads.
They “remarkably” failed to address their primary need on the defense, which is the DL and which makes the whole pot stir on defense.
Sorry, but how many off-seasons have you been saying this since 2015…? Respectfully, I have to say it: your points are backed up with a lot of “hope”, while the points in Rob’s article are backed up with stats and logic.
Sea Mode,
Since 2015? I read here since 2014? I write only rarely. The idea that it becomes easier to understand the often baffling seahawk decisions if you look at them as in a dynasty mindset i developed about a year ago. So i can guarantee you that i have not been “saying this every offseason since 2015”.
I think they understand ambitious differently. More long term, more in terms of what they think the team needs to win. Not paying clowney, but trading for adams fits that long term ambition. Fixing the oline on the cheap and creating depth in the skill positions does too.
I am always hopefull…… but what i try here is something else. I think they had not one but several goals for this offseason. All of them fitting within the ambition to build a superbowl winning team again. I do not think that we were only a passrusher away from that last year. I do not think they thought that either.
Especially if you are selling the crap as a long-term rebuild effort, this becomes even less defensible.
– Our LB group hinges on two star players on their last contract; the rest is one veteran with everything to prove and backup material
– We have two capable WRs; from #3 on, we are on shaky ground
– the top shelf duo of the RB group is injury prone; the rest are unproven rookies and sophomores
– the secondary is top notch, no debate. Will we pay Griffen a CBs premium, how about Jamal Adams?
– what top TE do we actually have? Plz, don’t say Greg Olsen.
– they just gave away the two top draft picks they need to rebuild OL and DL, or to maneuver in the draft
– as Rob said, the head coach is 69 with a contract until end of 2021
Probably just wanted to feel…well… wanted? (ofc, money talks louder)
https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1302641841171501058
Anywho.. no worries, guys and gals: we just got a video from the Seahawks about which player has the dirtiest locker. Sure hope they spend time asking Pete about it tomorrow.
Don’t be sad or mad folks. We just claimed DE D’ Andre Walker released by the Titans.
TAKE THAT TENNESSEE! WE’LL SEE YOU IN THE SUPER BOWL!
We claimed D’Andre Walker.
https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1302645480220962816
Also, none of our cuts were claimed.
Also, also, an interesting note:
It’s great that so many unexpected cuts happened like people were saying so they can go and get some great options to bolster the line such as a player who was injured all of last season.
It’s also a relief that they don’t only have three DT’s on the roster.
🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
Maybe Alton Robinson should have left that extra weight on…
https://seahawksdraftblog.com/cfb-week-5-dandre-walker-is-definitely-legit
Heyo, one of our guys!
Indeed.
I can’t muster much excitement for his addition though. If he’s here in week six, he’ll have done well.
I’m pretty excited about him. I don’t have high hopes for him per se, but he’s one guy we’ve got that I really liked and didn’t cost a ton.
I’ve truly disliked almost every move they’ve made from the draft through FA. I like Lewis, I really do. That’s the closest thing to a ‘hit’ that I think they had, and G was not a priority. I love Jamal, but not the price tag.
I moved to ‘acceptance’ about a week or two ago, so this Clowney news was more of a formality in my eyes. I don’t like it. I don’t understand it. I have accepted that this is our DL, and apart from adding a DT, it is what it is.
I wouldn’t get your hopes up with Walker.
They’re basically doing what they’ve done many times before. Adding a guy, having a look at him, seeing where his health is at.
He might be here a matter of days.
He was a blog favourite back in the day. So that’s something.
Ya, I was just perusing some old 2018,19 articles and comments from this site. Walker definitely received a lot of love. Many commenters mocked him in the 3rd as a steal. Obviously injuries can make even the greatest worthless. Here’s hoping he’s healthy or close enough to health that he may bring some of that BAMF to our D line.
Your spot on Rob. Lots of poor choices this year. I see some improvements at the safety position and future linebackers. I hope the newly drafted defensive guys will contribute, but they probably won’t be significant this year. One good thing about picking Brooks is that he can fill in if a linebacker gets hurt.
Offensively I’m pretty happy with the wide receiver and tight end group. Dare I say that they have the potential to be great? The Offensive line continues to be a work in progress, it would have been really great to have Conklin holding down that RT position.
Wilson will be great as usual. But with the defense lacking they really need to turn the offense loose starting from the first minute. They can’t afford to be conservative and end up playing from behind in the fourth quarter.
Oh sweet, sweet poetic justice
Can’t believe we “stole” him from right under their noses! Bunch of “clowns”…
*off to cry in the corner*
That one got me chuckling. Good one Sea
Prince Rob, I didn’t expect you to post my response. You are a typicalBritish chicken shit colonialist. Only want to hear your perspective. You want little minions that only want to lick your balls and say what you want. Hide as journalist, but can’t defend yourself. Change your blog name to “I can only complain about the defensive line”.
I decided to clear this post to let the community see the kind of stuff I’ve had to put up with for the last few months because I’ve dared to criticise the Seahawks and also expose Chucky as a racist.
I delete messages like this all the time. Receive emails like this. And see stuff like this posted on other sites about this place.
This is what you get for challenging the team.
British Colonist??? What the heck??? I didn’t know this was 1820 or 1920 and not 2020.
Seeing a like this is so disappointing. People who post stuff like that really need psychological help and are everything that is wrong with today’s online / social media society. Keep trying to take the high road Rob it is what makes this blog special.
You wouldn’t believe some of the stuff I’ve deleted.
It’s been a real eye opener this year.
Completely unacceptable! Hit the showers Chucky!!
So he’s racist on top of it? Gee, “color” me shocked.
There are those that appreciate it, Rob. I have YouTube channel and have dealt with similar for daring to challenge John & Pete’s approach. What’s true is true, and what’s right is right. The defensive line is in shambles. The pass rush still league worst, and they’ve taken no steps to improve against the run that allowed 4.9YPC. For those really not understanding why this defensive line issue needs to be discussed, I don’t think you’re giving the proper weight to how this will play out. Take off the rose colored glasses for reality.
Thanks for being honest, Rob.
Thank you. I appreciate it.
That’s all I’ve tried to be. Honest. It’s inconvenient for some but it is what it is.
Are Minions even tall enough to lick Rob’s balls?
BIG yawn…
I’ll never understand what adult takes time out of their day to write this. If you don’t like the weather, stay inside. 1) why some many Hawks fans feel the need to dictate what you write about?, 2) why the flaccid insults?
Sorry it’s come to this Rob. I saw some comments on FG that were of the usual sort desiring to keep their head in the sand about the teams issues. Now the marching tune is “we’ll just have to see how it plays out”.
I get pings on here when Field Gulls list my articles in their links piece.
I went and had a look at what was being said today.
Apparently I’m a narcissist for writing ‘Let’s be honest’ in the title, have a really narrow perspective, “built an entire civilization on the Seahawks drafting Courtney Upshaw in the first round” (eh?) and “won’t dare offer a differing POV without first stroking his ego”.
I find it quite funny really. When people can’t debate they’ll often resort to insults. As Socrates said, “When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”
Check!
Rob, just keep being you.
One key element to debating is being able to listen.
I like to read/listen to your debate Rob as I much prefer journalist to be ‘off the fence’ with their observations
Thank you Matty.
I’ll always try to avoid that fence. And I’ll tell you what I really think — positive or negative.
Denial. Check.
Anger. Check.
https://youtu.be/Ti8xeyaSwCI
Rob-
Thanks for all you do. I hope the positive feedback outweighs this kind of BS. I’ll never understand why people have to go that low when the conversation is about football. Looking forward to the season and the articles to come…
The positive feedback has never been more appreciated Kenny. Thank you.
Reminds me of when they low balled Sheldon Richardson.
Well this season will essentially switch from let russ cook to wtf were you thinking ignoring the DL?! PCJS have now hitched themselves to this issue. They better hope their scouting and player development bails them out. Cause this could sink them. Imagine the pitchforks circling if the team falls to .500 or worse. Those questions about the DL will surface the moment they lose a game because of it. The benefit of the doubt I understand right now. But the results from the young guys will be monitored for sure.
Its crazy to think right now, but the fucking mariners seem like the more functional ran team in Seattle lol. They have a clear plan and full commitment to it. Seahawks seem more haphazard last few years.
As discussed above with the Seattle media, giving Pete and the team in general an easy ride at these press conferences. Rob as a sports journalist yourself, you probably have had to deal with Sheffield United or Wednesday or Eagles or the other clubs in the area. Covering the clubs and attending the press conferences. How much responsibility is there on the journalist in this situation for avoiding these difficult questions? Or is there some legitimate fear that being perceived as “too difficult” or “too negative” will impact your career? And the sort of interviews or access you receive from the club?
I am just speculating here, but is there a possibility, that if a certain reporter makes Pete uncomfortable with his questions, they would not be allowed into the press conferences? Or they would not be visited by Pete or John for interviews or phone ins?
My local football (soccer) team over in the UK is Bolton Wanderers and there was at times a bad relationship between the ownership and the local paper, which in a one sport town can have major impacts on the journalists who are tasked to cover the club, so I can imagine there many reporters who are simply going along to get along with the Seahawks as an organisation and aim to keep on good terms with the Front Office and Pete.
I am frustrated with the press conferences because as said above, there are just too many softball questions, but I just would like to know more about why the journalists are avoiding these topics. Which seem so maddeningly obvious to the fans.
“How much responsibility is there on the journalist in this situation for avoiding these difficult questions? Or is there some legitimate fear that being perceived as “too difficult” or “too negative” will impact your career? And the sort of interviews or access you receive from the club?”
I can tell you that it’s completely at the discretion of the journalist. A team is never going to ‘ban’ someone or limit your access for asking a challenging question. It purely comes down to whether you want to ask questions that need to be asked, or whether you want to avoid that and have an easy life.
“I am just speculating here, but is there a possibility, that if a certain reporter makes Pete uncomfortable with his questions, they would not be allowed into the press conferences? Or they would not be visited by Pete or John for interviews or phone ins?”
I highly doubt this would happen. It would be incredible.
A journalist would quite easily be allowed to ask the questions that need asking. For example, anyone asking the following:
“Pete, you stated at the start of the off-season that improving the pass rush was your top priority. Do you really think you’ve done enough to fix that issue?”
Is unlikely to be banned. It’s a fair and challenging question. I would imagine there would be follow ups. It is a bit harder in an open press conference. When I was doing regular radio interviews before switching to TV I had as long as I wanted, 1-on-1, to ask a line of questions on a topic and approach it from numerous angles. You can’t do that on zoom when you get one question and maybe a follow-up. But there are enough journalists there to collectively do some digging and get some answers on the D-line. And Pete should (and would, IMO) be ready and prepared to answer those questions.
“My local football (soccer) team over in the UK is Bolton Wanderers and there was at times a bad relationship between the ownership and the local paper, which in a one sport town can have major impacts on the journalists who are tasked to cover the club, so I can imagine there many reporters who are simply going along to get along with the Seahawks as an organisation and aim to keep on good terms with the Front Office and Pete.”
This does happen, admittedly. But it’s rarely due to questions asked in a press conference and often more down to the overall reporting. I’ve had press officers come up to me after and question why I asked questions in the way I did. I’ve never had a fall out with the manager despite asking several about their jobs — but some of my colleagues have had run ins. I’ve worked at places where access was denied but there were reasons for that beyond a timely challenging press conference. I doubt this would happen if Pete Carroll is challenged about the pass rush.
“I am frustrated with the press conferences because as said above, there are just too many softball questions, but I just would like to know more about why the journalists are avoiding these topics. Which seem so maddeningly obvious to the fans.”
Without a doubt it’s time for a more challenging line of questioning when it comes to the D-line. Let’s see what happens on Monday.
Hey Rob,
I have no idea about the relationship between the journalist and the organisation, so it is interesting to hear your opinion as someone with experience of it. Also the nature of the Press Conference and the need to use Zoom is also having an impact. So thank you for answering my question.
Knowing all of this now, I think it is definitely more about having an easy life, keeping everyone happy and looking busy, by asking for the dozenth time, about how Jamal Adams will impact the secondary? Or how does having a great leader like Bobby Wagnar impact the team?
This being such big news and now there is no prospect of Clowney arriving to save Seattle, there are overwhelming grounds to ask these questions and press for better answers to those questions. So I hope, there is some new information on Monday. I know Pete and John can be quite forthcoming (as much as they can be) when they talk about situations in the past, so I hope now it is over, we can get a bit more of a realistic take on the pass rush and whether they erred in betting too much and for too long on Clowney.
Thank you
The thing is — nobody needs to ask anything aggressively. You can challenge and dig for information without seeming like you’re ‘out to get’ the coach. So I hope the reporters who are invited to the press conference ask the relevant questions regarding the pass rush. Has enough been done? What exactly was the situation with Clowney, given they called him a priority early in the season? Why didn’t they pursue other targets, such as Everson Griffen, if the price was too high for Clowney? None of this is particularly naughty or daring. So let’s see what happens.
Feels like the Seattle media is really focused on the “culture” of PC and the Seahawks, to the exclusion of the nuts and bolts of team building and the season.
There definitely should be room for that. PC is one of the most charismatic coaches and voices in the NFL. Building a SB team from the Jim Mora disaster with undervalued and underappreciated pieces is a phenomenal accomplishment. It’s possible (hot take alert) that just keeping the organization afloat in the wake of the SB49 disaster is nearly as big an accomplishment. Lesser teams would’ve sunk into the sea.
That said, not asking about the roster and stated priorities is unacceptable. I can’t believe no one has even asked something along the lines of ‘you’ve developed gems out of lumps of coal in the past, you haven’t added any superstars on the DL, who do you see really making a difference and shining this season?’ That gets to the heart of the matter, while sprinkling some PC magic into the equation and getting him thinking positively rather than defensively (pun intended).
De’Andrea Walker, gotta be pumped about that.
https://seahawksdraftblog.com/cfb-week-5-dandre-walker-is-definitely-legit
https://seahawksdraftblog.com/thanksgiving-day-mock-draft
I really liked him at Georgia.
Do I think he’s going to go from injured for a year, being cut by Tennessee to saving Seattle’s D-line?
No, I don’t.
That’s the problem, of course, that we are left hoping guys like this can step up and play beyond what they have shown before. That could certainly happen, but it’s the being in the position of needing that to happen that is so unfortunate where this operation is concerned. Heck, even if some combo of Irvin, Mayowa, Green, Robinson, Walker, Taylor, etc turn out to be good, they would have been that much better with the addition of a Clowney/Griffen/Ngakoue/etc
Thanks for pointing these previous articles out, Darnell. Looks like a good early-down rotational player for us and good depth piece.
Again — I would caution against any talk of this yet.
They’ll bring him in for a look. He might not be here very long. Or he could end up on the PS. Let’s hope he sticks but he’s on trial.
Few things I’d like to point out.
1. We don’t know of the Seahawks failed their offseason test.
2. We’ve seen pressure percentage boasted here a lot as an attempt to validate Clowney as being on the level of Bosa and Donald. Those guys had massive amounts of sacks and TFLs. Clowney did not. If you’re going to use them in this light, I think you have to substantiate why/how Clowney “pressured” the quarterback so frequently without actually touching him (he only had 7 TFL as well). It’s an empty stat. (take a gander at the Seahawks team pressure percentage). It also ignores a cardinal rule of statistics in not falling victim to outliers. Clowney garnered 10 pressures in 1 game against a tackle returning after missing 2 months … that’s 1/3 his season total. Subtract that game by multiplying his pressure rate by 2/3, suddenly not so pretty. Do the same with Bosa and Donald and they’re still elite players.
3. We’ve seen the graphic of how much PC/JS wanted to fix the pass rush and value Clowney. The problem is these tweets were from February. Mayowa and Irvin signed in April. I think the burden of evidence suggests they balked at Clowney’s price a while ago and those two were their Plan B. Every report suggests that the Seahawks have been monitoring the situation since, which seems entirely accurate at this point, without being heavily invested in it. Someone may not like the route they chose, but I don’t think there is any evidence suggesting they didn’t choose it a while ago. Instead, let’s drop the conspiracy theories that they wagered their whole offseason on signing Clowney, or frantically signed Adam’s to cover up their faux pas.
4. I think the final conclusion to the Clowney saga is indicative of how much the Seahawks valued him. If these reports are correct that he’s essentially signing 12mil on a 1 year deal then it’s telling what the NFL thought of Clowney “elite defensive end”. If that was beyond the upper limit of what the Seahawks were willing to offer, then the Seahawks basically valued him at or below Reed and well below Adams. This site has fixated on players before and I think we have to remember PC/JS play to their own tune. Flash back to the end of last season and it was being pushed that 20mil per year on a multi year contract was the reality for Clowney. Every GM in the NFL would have, and did, laugh at that number. When you cling to the opinion that more informed people don’t know what they’re doing, you usually end up looking bad. I’ll admit they don’t look stellar on the Dline on paper, but they’ve found quality players where we didn’t many times in the past.
Maybe I am still in the denial phase of the seahawks failing the offseason. But who knows, maybe you’re in the denial stage of admitting they didn’t need Clowney as bad you did. Time will tell. Thanks for the coverage.
“1. We don’t know of the Seahawks failed their offseason test.”
They said the priority was to fix the pass rush. They failed.
“We’ve seen pressure percentage boasted here a lot as an attempt to validate Clowney as being on the level of Bosa and Donald.”
Nobody ‘boasted’ anything. Some of us, myself included, pointed out — correctly — that his pressure percentage was the same as Joey Bosa’s and marginally superior to Aaron Donald. There’s nothing wrong with that.
“Those guys had massive amounts of sacks and TFLs. Clowney did not.”
Joey Bosa and Aaron Donald also weren’t running one-man shows being double teamed at the rate Clowney was.
“I think you have to substantiate why/how Clowney “pressured” the quarterback so frequently without actually touching him (he only had 7 TFL as well).”
We have done. Clowney was one of the most double-teamed players in the league last season. It’s just a fact that it’s a lot harder to get home when you have more attention because nobody, unsurprisingly, felt threatened by a semi-retired Ziggy Ansah on the other side.
“Clowney garnered 10 pressures in 1 game against a tackle returning after missing 2 months.”
50% of Benson Mayowa’s sacks last year came in weeks one and two before he was phased out. 50% of Bruce Irvin’s sacks came in two games last year too. You can do this for anyone.
“We’ve seen the graphic of how much PC/JS wanted to fix the pass rush and value Clowney. The problem is these tweets were from February. Mayowa and Irvin signed in April. I think the burden of evidence suggests they balked at Clowney’s price a while ago and those two were their Plan B”
Then Plan B wasn’t good enough.
Yet the fact they protected nearly $10m in cap space and were still trying to sign him last night per reports, suggests they were holding out hopes of bringing him back and simply couldn’t get it done.
“Someone may not like the route they chose, but I don’t think there is any evidence suggesting they didn’t choose it a while ago”
It doesn’t matter.
We can still criticise what they did.
“Instead, let’s drop the conspiracy theories that they wagered their whole offseason on signing Clowney, or frantically signed Adam’s to cover up their faux pas.”
It’s not a conspiracy theory. It’s just a theory. You do yourself no favours trying to undermine legitimate points using such language.
“I’ll admit they don’t look stellar on the Dline on paper”
No shit.
“Maybe I am still in the denial phase”
Maybe.
“who knows, maybe you’re in the denial stage of admitting they didn’t need Clowney as bad you did.”
I’ve said this a million times already so one more time won’t hurt. It was never about Clowney. We talked about him so much because he was the only one left. If they’d gone in a different direction and fixed the D-line, I wouldn’t have cared. It would’ve been job done. Anyone who thinks this was about Clowney is wrong. It’s about gambling the 2020 season on Mayowa, Green, Moore and Collier — plus astonishing depth at DT — not wasting another season. That’s it.
“No shit.”
Hahahaha
1. They had a bottom 5 pass rush in 2019, stated it as a priority to fix it, let Clowney, Jefferson and Woods leave and signed a guy who played 300 snaps and wasn’t asked to come back and a guy who will only spend 1/3 of his snaps rushing the passer. They ignored the DT position aside from extending Reed. That’s failure.
2. You’re coming at the argument from a strange place. Most of the references to Clowney’s pressure percentage were rebutting the silly claim that ‘he’s not very good – only 3 sacks!’ It should be noted that 1) He played hurt at times and 2) He doesn’t have half the supporting cast that Bosa and Donald have, and still managed pressure percentages in their range.
3. Again, this whole offseason didn’t hinge on signing Clowney. He was just the last, best hope to even have a middling pass rush since all the other options were taken.
4. “this site has fixated on players.” See point 3. If the Hawks had traded for Calais Campbell and signed Everson Griffen, at least we could say they saw a glaring need and made an honest attempt to fix it.
“If the Hawks had traded for Calais Campbell and signed Everson Griffen”
I would’ve praised it as a success.
You are right about Clowney, JS dropped the ball on this one. Daniel McCullers might be considered at DT, if not Dareus. Otherwise, on to Atlanta.
Five bucks says more questions will be asked tomorrow about cutting Shaquem and getting him back on the PS than on the state of the pass rush.
No bet.
There was a small but extremely vocal fanbase that were tearing the Hawks to shreds yesterday for cutting him. Haven’t checked what they have to say about the 31 other teams passing on him.
I noticed that.
I feel like I’ve learned a lot about the 12th man this year that I otherwise wasn’t aware of.
Touche! But, to be fair, 31 teams also passed on Leonard Fournette and Adrian Peterson, and all but 17 other players that were released recently. I think it probably speaks more to the current environment than to the interest in particular players.
I ain’t throwin’ 5 bucks down the drain on that bet…
Rob,
Here’s hoping you can enjoy this season despite being so disappointed with the results of the off-season. I will say this- regardless of your opinion about whether or not they made good moves, the Seahawks are trying to win a super bowl and not sparing any effort or expense. I know you’re not local so you may not be aware of teams like the Sonics or the Mariners who took fans for granted and operated on the cheap in order to line the owners’ pockets.
As far as Jadeveon Clowney goes, you’re right about him being a player that can win you a couple games. The problem is that he can also lose you a game or two if you over-invest in him because he’s so inconsistent and injury prone. I think it was a coup that they could bring in a couple solid stalwarts that knew the system in a year in which it will be hard to learn. Don’t forget that despite all our struggles last year, we would have won the division with a healthy running back. It looks to me like the front office learned their lesson and focused on depth this year which is what we had when we won the super bowl.
Go Seahawks!
“Here’s hoping you can enjoy this season despite being so disappointed with the results of the off-season.”
I always enjoy the season Castille. I know people might be inclined to think I will be sat at home, grinding my teeth every week. But I can honestly say you’ll struggle to find a bigger Seahawks fan than me. How else can I justify things like writing this blog, for free, in my spare time (at the expense of family time) as practically a second full time job? Or the numerous times I’ve travelled 1000’s of miles back to Seattle to watch the team (and I always pick the worst weather days and have seen more losses than wins). I never miss a game, despite many starting at 1am in England. I’ve stayed up to 4-5am, written an instant reaction piece, jumped straight in the shower and gone to work on no sleep in order to avoid missing a game. The day of the Super Bowl vs New England — I had a breakfast sports bulletin shift on the radio that started an hour after the game finished. That was a hard day. Two days later, I made my wife watch the final drive so I could have a moan about it with tears running down my cheeks.
A huge portion of my life is built around the Seahawks. I will be living and breathing every run, pass, tackle and kick in Atlanta. Just as I always do.
But that doesn’t mean I won’t write honestly, critically and reasonably about the team.
“I know you’re not local so you may not be aware of teams like the Sonics or the Mariners who took fans for granted and operated on the cheap in order to line the owners’ pockets.”
Trust me, I’m well aware of situations like this. I won’t bore you with why.
“As far as Jadeveon Clowney goes, you’re right about him being a player that can win you a couple games. The problem is that he can also lose you a game or two if you over-invest in him because he’s so inconsistent and injury prone.”
Let’s be right here — he’s not ‘losing’ you a game if he’s injured. And he never played badly enough to ‘lose’ Seattle a game. Neither is a $12m contract an over investment.
“I think it was a coup that they could bring in a couple solid stalwarts that knew the system in a year in which it will be hard to learn.”
Benson Mayowa and Bruce Irvin is not a coup.
“Don’t forget that despite all our struggles last year, we would have won the division with a healthy running back.”
In part because Clowney helped them win in Santa Clara. But let’s also accept that there was a lot more to last season than not having a healthy running back vs the Niners in week 17.
“It looks to me like the front office learned their lesson and focused on depth this year which is what we had when we won the super bowl.”
They also had massive talent on the D-line, not a bunch of replacement level players and backups.
I knew the not being “local” and the always favorite fallback ” guy with a British accent” would not go over well. Smh. As an American and a Seahawks fan I want you to know that I completely enjoy/hate your honest view on all matters college prospects and how that effects all things Seahawks. What must not be understated is the love of Seahawks you have and the time you sacrifice to provide us a forum to express ourselves whether we like what is printed or not. As owner of this blog you have the right to provide services to whomever you choose. Nothing you dont already know. This offseason has een particularly hard outside of sports as we all know. We come to escape and read about developments with our team and to your credit you kept it honest. It has been a hard read, but let’s be clear, it’s from the honest heart and how you see it and you let people know it. Bravo. Keep up it up. I sincerely hope Rob is wrong and we dont waste another of RW play because of poor defensive line play. If defensive line performs beyond expectations or JS/PC come up with another “coup” . I will bet my whole house Rob will be first to admit it. Rob appreciate you and the labor of love you provide. I wish I could provide more in the way of support but I’m working on it. Good day and good job 👏👏👏
Thank you, I really appreciate those words.
Since there is not much left available I would like to see the Hawks make 3 moves.
Sign Clay Matthews as a rotational pass rusher
Sign Marcel Darius and determine if he has anything in the tank.
Sign Sidney Jones to develop into a slot CB where I still think he could excel if he can get and stay healthy. Worth a flier.
You’re going to get your wish with Matthews I think.
After addition of Walker I am not sure they will sign Mathews.
Walker is basically coming in for a workout.
He might not last the week.
I can’t freaking stand the thought of Matthews in a Hawks uni but really there is no other option at this point. As for Darius, I don’t know enough to have an opinion. Was a helluva player a few years back. Definitely need another DT. Do people think Darius is a better option than Mebane?
Rob,
Thanks for all you do. It’s been awesome to read your breakdowns and analysis. I have two questions for you:
1. Given the talent that the Seahawks have and some of the players (Matthews for one), could you see any modifications to the defensive scheme to better fit our talent?
2. Are there any players you want the Seahawks to target that have been released following cut down day?
Thanks again for all you do my friend.
1. I don’t see any major changes to the defensive scheme. Pete has been doing his thing for decades. He turns 69 this month. His defensive coordinator is basically one of his disciples. Any changes will be relatively modest and within the existing framework of the scheme IMO.
2. Nobody stands out I’m afraid.
“Benson Mayowa and Bruce Irvin is not a coup.”
Don’t forget that the same could have been said of Chris Clemons, Cliff Avril, and Michael Bennett when we signed them. They were all cast-offs that revitalized their career here. Outside of those guys, our 2013 roster carried Mebane, Clinton McDonald and Red Bryant. Not exactly A list guys (as great as ‘bane was).
“Let’s be right here — he’s not ‘losing’ you a game if he’s injured. And he never played badly enough to ‘lose’ Seattle a game. Neither is a $12m contract an over investment.”
True enough, but in team sports you groom guys for particular roles and then everyone relies on them to carry out their responsibilities. As great as Clowney was at times last year, he was also non-existent for great stretches of time even when he was playing. I’d rather have someone who burns less bright but is more consistent. Streaky players are more valuable in football than other sports because they can help you out of tough spots like the one you mentioned in Santa Clara, but it’s always a gamble to carry those guys especially if you have to pay them very much (hard cap).
Come on Castille.
Cliff Avril & Michael Bennett were top NFL pass rushers when they were signed. Everyone was ecstatic when they pulled that off. It was unbelievable. Their additions were the two moves that had people truly believing the Super Bowl was coming to Seattle.
You can’t compare that to signing Benson Mayowa and Bruce Irvin.
I think there was question about pass rush at last presser. Pete mentioned again 16sacks from Mayowa and Irvin.
And…
Imo its really wrong way to look at, and I am shocked Pete is looking it that way, but for the 3rd or 4th time he mentioned that number of last year sacks when speaking about Mayowa and Irvin.
It really is the wrong way to look at it.
Rob,
Been reading your articles for a long time. This is the most pessimistic one I’ve ever read by you. Someone had mentioned in another blog that your “head will explode” by the Seahawks not signing Clowney”. From the way I read it, that’s what it sounds like. It will be interesting to see if your thoughts in this article come out to play as you expect or if you’ll be eating your words. This is certainly an article I will reference throughout this season and the next.
I think it’s pretty weak that people have read a fair, thorough, detailed breakdown of the Seahawks off-season and think the only way to counter it is to make subtle digs and imply that my ‘head has exploded’.
Nope. I just analysed the off-season. I will go on to analyse the season.
And I will continue to analyse, as I’ve done for 12 years.
I’m not always right but my opinions are always carefully thought out. It takes a long time to craft a 3736 word article.
Maybe it’s inconvenient for you to read things that aren’t overly complimentary about the team? I can’t do anything about that I’m afraid.
And by all means ‘reference the article’ throughout this season. You better believe I bloody will.
Keep doing your thing, Rob. This site is by far the best analysis of Seahawks football out there.
Obviously we as fans want to get pumped up and optimistic with the season about to start, but the utterly insane way the DL situation was handled this offseason has to be discussed especially with the last shot at some improvement (Clowney) no officially off the table.
And for the love of God, what is the front office plan for some run-stuffing depth at DL? Behind Reed and Ford there is ONLY Mone. Seems like they banked on an attractive DL cut option, but so far crickets…
Thanks AlaskaSouth, really appreciate you saying so.
Just be clear, I wasn’t trying to paint you as an outsider. I honestly didn’t know how closely you’ve followed our other local teams. I love your work and have followed your blog for years. I also appreciate the respectful disagreement.
I’ve been turning this over in my head all day because it is a distinct possibility that we will once again have a below average d line this year and it appears to be a calculated move from the front office. I’m sure few will disagree that we’ve improved our secondary and I wonder if that emphasis isn’t a function of our division. The NFC West offenses have become more reliant on quick passes and the outside run which clearly put more pressure on the secondary to perform well in press coverage. The vertical passing game has become a bit of a dinosaur in the modern nfl and I wonder if John and Pete have decided to spend their limited resources in a way that acknowledges that reality.
For what it’s worth, Rob, the editor of that “other” blog today posted an article titled “Seahawks’ quest to improve pass rush severely underwhelms”, wedding all the points you’ve made over and over. (And more than one refer came to your defense.)
Personally, I think this is the best Seahawks blog going, and it’s not even close. I’m sorry you’ve taken so much grief this off-season. I can’t imagine what drives people to write comments like the one you posted up-thread.
Thanks Robert 👍🏻
Nice to see this…really cheer for him…go Rashad…
https://twitter.com/pennyhendrixx/status/1302678211222843393?s=19
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1302688128843554817?s=19
Just wow…
Pretty amazing, actually. Surprised they didn’t pull it off.
In the mean time… the Seahawks were monitoring…
Rob
We are living during a space/time of unthinkable football calamity for our beloved Hawks. The time has come when we will be turning our efforts to analyzing what is actually happening on the field during games. We will analyze what occurs and then project our findings on what might happen against our next opponent given their strengths and weakness. Oh joy. Football!
History has shown Carroll wants to play: a 4-3 defensive front with 3-4 personnel. Ergo Clowney, the perfect fit for that chore. The perfect fit for that scheme.
Our 2020 defense will not be without weapons. Personally, given the personnel, I would “scheme” a lot of man on man coverage and throw in either safety or line backer blitzes. I fear however that Pete will waste the spectacular physical talents of Adams, Diggs, Dunbar, Griffin (and Blair when in a nickel D).
Those D backs combined with a line backing rotation of: Wagner, Wright, Barton, Brooks and B-Kirven should give up a very solid, perhaps even better than very solid, back 7. In my, non-expert, humble opinion, I see our back 7 as an almost perfect back 7 in a 3 – 4 scheme.
In a 4-3 defense our 4 is not up the task of stopping the run. Also, (IM(H)O) our 4 is not up to rushing the passer.
I suspect Pete will waste our spectacular back 7 by sitting them in a zone space and waiting for a QB, under little pressure, to pick the zone apart. It appears we may be doomed.
IF we are going to meet our Waterloo on the football fields of 2020, I say, go down with a “defensive scheme” that showcases the unique individual physical and mental talents we do possess. We may well still lose, the weaknesses outweighing the strengths. So be it.
Were I, Adams, Diggs, Griffin Dunbar, Wagner, Wright, Barton, Brooks and Blair, I would not want to sit in a zone, waiting to die. I would want to be given the chance to do what I know I do well and then, when (if) I’ve been defeated, at least I will have left my all on the field, between the stripes. Death? Perhaps, eventually if comes calling for us all, but, will they be “losers and suckers” – Never.
I’ll tell you something I think.
They’re going to end up playing Bruce Irvin a lot more than he should be. Possibly even as a starting LEO down the line.
Because he’ll be the only one capable of doing much of anything.
Either that or they’ll sign Clay Matthews.
OG gonna need CPR
Tre was better in man than in zone as well last year…he will be on the field as well at times. I agree we need more man coverage this year.
I don’t disagree with any of the points you made Rob. We needed to address the D-Line, and we failed to do so. We’ve been missing on many of the draft choices over the years and rolling the dice on oft-injured players.
I don’t want to point out that the Shaquem Griffin pick was a waste as a lot of people seem to really like it at the time and I was one of the few dissenting voices at the time of the draft saying he didn’t have a position and didn’t fit on our team. Well, here we are, only a wasted 5th round pick, but indicative of another swing and miss.
Hopefully we can make a trade or sign someone’s cast off.
Thanks for the hard work Rob!
Everyone: bring in more rush!
Seahawks:
Pete & John high five, “well, that’s taken care of!”
The fact that we missed out on Clowney is absolutely rubbish. This season is quite irritating really.
So Stephens let go to make room for Walker.
PC/JS have gained a ton of my trust over the years – – if not as technicians, then at least as talent evaluators and motivators. Agree w a comment earlier – averting a full-on collapse after the 2nd SB was a pretty big accomplishment given the way those things normally play out.
And I think if you take the fine tooth comb to most team’s every pick over the last 5 years, you’ll find plenty of hits and misses – for every missed pick, JS has found a Lockett, or a Wagner, or Carson, etc. Yes, we have an elite QB, but we’ve put enough around him to become one of the cornerstone contender-type franchises of the last decade.
So . . .wtf on this one? I can’t get around the fact that if they put all their eggs in this basket, they HAD to bring home the basket. I honestly don’t think JS is an incompetent GM there’s too much evidence on the other side of that equation. And so I’m trying to figure out why they’ve dropped the ball here so blatantly? Because if the answer is that Clowney’s health issues are more than we realize, that makes sense to me, but why not make a move for one of the other available pass rushers?
All along, I really thought we were gonna bring him back – and were just waiting (maddeningly) for the dust to fully settle on his market value. In the end, we look boneheaded and underprepared. It’s very frustrating to see.
[also – it’s 116 degrees here in LA today, so the coming apocalypse may spare as all the ’20 season anyway.]
I think that’s the key point. It’s staggering what they’ve done (or not done). Nobody saw this coming. The level of ineptitude in fixing this issue has caught everyone off guard.
It’s not about PCJS being ‘the worst’. It’s simply about how badly they went about addressing a situation they themselves called the off-season priority.
Resigned Griffen to practice squad, now ….Walker another linebacker? What gives with all the linebackers!?
Defensive tackles at least?
Walker considered a DE
LB/DE…we seem to be stocking up this year.
Saw Joe Fans article on NBC sports. Pretty much said everything Robs been saying here. They’re taking a big risk in how they addressed their offseason and will be asked many questions if things go badly.
Lol I still don’t get why they haven’t been being asked serious questions already. Seems like most all our local writers agree our D-line sucks; but still none will ask the questions. They probably realize Carroll will just say we’re always competing. We put together a great group on the D-line and feel combined they will give us the pressure we need. A good mix of youth and veterans. Carroll will never admit things didn’t go as planned. Still would be nice to see questions asked on Monday.
Ditto. Praying for some New York/Philly media muscle type questions.
While it may be temporarily satisfying to hear the tough questions asked, ultimately the satisfaction would be short lived.
Even if Pete fessed up to completely mismanaging the off season (which he wont), the admission won’t change the fact that we are in for a potentially frustrating season, with little reason to expect this team to drastically improve over the next couple of years.
This off season was so important to the long term health of the franchise, and they had the resources to really set things in a positive motion.
Now it’s a lot of hoping and praying that things unfold perfectly.
People still need to be held account though.
It might only provide temporary satisfaction but fans still deserve to hear what they have to say.
Keep dreaming.
The last time anyone showed some balls in Seattle media was when a) Mariners almost moved out of town / build the stadium and b) When the Sonics got sold and they smelled a rat trying to move them out of town. The reporters on the Sonics beat were ruthless. Ultimately, they were right in their assessments that the Sonics would be moved within 3 years. (The last Sonic superstar is KD in my book)
I’m not old enough to remember the Ken Bering roll the Seahawks out of town in the dead of the night reporting to comment, but I recall it was tense for months. Public pressure and league pressure kept them in town and forced him to sell.
This is absolutely stunning they let him get away for a maximum 1-year $15 million contract. What incompetence. They’re lucky they drafted Russell Wilson in 2012 or they wouldn’t have jobs with many of their drafts since then. And good job on getting Adams. Anyone could have had him for a kings ransom (pair of 1s and a 3) but other teams don’t mortgage their futures like that. I guess when you have the oldest coach in the NFL it’s more about now and not having a long-term vision… which makes not signing Clowney for THIS year all the more mind-boggling. This ranks up there with trading for Percy Harvin and taking Malik McDowell when they could have had TJ Watt before trading down.
Read out of line message earlier want to say thank you for keeping your cool. Though you I understand you are mad on how off season went. There are some very bad messages but we love your honest opinion and everyone on the blog express their thoughts which we welcome here. Hypothetically let us Green and LJ shine we will celebrate but we call it ♠️ as ♠️ spade.
Appreciate your patience 🙏.
Rob, I love this website. This is the only Seahawks fan site I read. I am not sure of the exact year, but I haven’t missed a single article, mock draft or player profile since 2010.
I love PC too. I think he is my favorite Seahawk of this era, player or non-player. Sadly, I think it is hubris on his part that has led us to where we are today. It happens to everyone, I just wish and hope that he is self-aware and corrects the course before long, or we are in for a few years of barely treading water, or worse. I am generally optimistic by nature, so I think he will.
I don’t really have a point. Just wanted to say thanks to you for the content for the last 10 years. And to say that, we are where we are — now we got to just focus on Atlanta and the rest of the season. To me, this debacle of an offseason is now in the books. Go Seahawks!
Thank you kza — for the kind words and for being here for a decade. It always surprised me that anyone cared what a bloke from Britain had to say about any of this but I’m glad that some do because I’ve thoroughly enjoyed writing for this community.
Rob, thanks for everything. We may not agree on things, which is actually OK in the modern world. What I love is that you can write an article and get such passionate responses from fans. Some positive and some negative. Field Gulls and Twitter are poison, so this is a much better spot to check on the Hawks imo. Keep up the good work!
Thank you charlie.
The early reports where that Seattle offered 15M/year on a 3 year deal….. then 4 months of crickets… until Clowney agreed to a 12M (with 3 M bonuses) for a 15M / 1 year deal.
Add in that Clowney again fired his agent. (This needs to be dug into sometime later)
JS had the market pegged right for him, he just wasn’t ready to believe it until the 1 minute before midnight. Imagine the uproar if the Seahawks had paid 21M for the guy, which is a 6M overpay?
I’m frankly glad this whole thing is finally done. It was probably one of the worst parts of the COVID thing, reading about COVID then almost every day reading something about Clowney on every sports blog or site. At least we know what we got, no more guessing.
Will point out that we wouldn’t have known it was a $6M “overpay” if we’d signed Clowney for $21M at the outset of free agency. And, frankly, I’d have been okay if we gave him $21M for one year compared to where we are now.
Honestly, if we could have kept Clowney, Jefferson, and Woods while also making the other moves we made (signing Irvin and Mayowa – preferably on “better” terms; and trading for Adams and Dunbar), I think we’d all be wondering if Seattle could have the #1 defense in the league.
I smell the Browns in this one
“METAIRIE, La. — The New Orleans Saints certainly didn’t give up on free-agent defensive end Jadeveon Clowney without a fight before he ultimately chose the Tennessee Titans on Saturday.
A source confirmed that the Saints explored the idea of a unique sign-and-trade deal with an unspecified team to help them fit Clowney’s salary under the cap, as the NFL Network first reported. However, the NFL said such a deal would not be allowed.”
WOWZA
Here is what Folrio reported earlier today:
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/09/06/saints-tried-sign-and-trade-deal-for-clowney-offered-a-pick-for-other-team-to-take-cap-hit/
Florio, sorry about that.
Other reports are that it would have been a pick AND a player. Speculation is that Cleveland – I mean, Team X – would have gotten a 2nd round pick + DT Sheldon Rankins for the $5M they gave Clowney upfront on the “sign and trade” deal. If true, the “net” cost to the Saints would have only been $2.31M (the $10M they’d be paying Clowney minus Rankins’ $7.69M salary) + the pick (and the player). Would have been a heckuva move by the Saints … and pissed off every other team in the league. No shit the NFL would have nixed that. It’s bad enough they let the Saints do the “automatically voided years” crap to circumvent the cap.
Now it starts to make more sense how the Saints could even possibly try to pull it off. There was no way I could figure out how to get them under the cap and fit him in without massive pay changes to vets on the team. So long story short, they tried to pull a fast one……. over the cap saves the day.
(They current have around 1.5M under the cap in 2020)
Not even sure if utter and complete disappointment adequately describes my feelings about the off-season. I am usually a glass half full person and like to give the benefit of the doubt whenever possible, but like many others have expressed, it just seems like a complete failure of plan and execution if their real top priority was to fix the DL. With 60 million to spend, I was excited for them to come out and retain Reed while also getting 2 impact guys(1 of which didn’t need to be Clowney necessarily, just get guys) right off the bat for 40 million plus and then to fill out the roster with bargains in the 2nd and 3rd waves of free agency. To come out and start signing below avg guys for above market deals and piddle their money away before tackling their major need is just a huge head scratcher that I wish they would explain. I get that Calais maybe got sent to the Ravens as a friendly gesture by Jax and Fowler possibly only ever wanted to go to ATL, but there were plenty of others they could have targeted after Clowney gave the first inclination he may have other ideas about how the process was going to play out for him. And if Clowney was the target they really wanted, swallow your smartest guy in the room pride over getting his market value across the league right, up the offer and get it done! Cute little mind-f… games should be left between kids, quit effing the fan base
All of this
Don’t know if it was said above but the Titans waived the tag for Clowney next year. Second year in a row for him. I wonder if that was a point of contention at all? Still not a great excuse but I would hate to relive this next year
Well, since he is no longer a Seahawk and our problem, I don’t f’ing care! 😉
I want to see him wreck some fools in the AFC. At least give the Colts a run for their money. If the Titans defense can stay healthy, they could be very dangerous in the playoffs. Not a team you want to face… if you are the Ravens, Colts/Texans or Chiefs. Clowney, Beasley, Landry and Correa are not a bad top 4 LBs to have on the roster. Got some decent depth and experience.
I’m with you. Really hoped to retain him, but now that he’s gone, I’m ready to move on.
Rob, I’m a bit late to the party here, but I want to get my 2 cents worth in on that nasty example of tooling you shared yesterday.
I truly had no idea you have had to put up with troglodytes such as that, though knowing the internet and the current state of agitation in the U.S., I shouldn’t have been surprised.
I am sorry to hear that such has been the case. I want you to know that you have done a yeoman’s job through the trials and tribulations, football-related and otherwise, that this weirdest year of my reasonably long life has presented us all with.
I am pretty confident that the overwhelming majority of my brother 12’s feel as I do.
So, thank you so much for your insight balance, and willingness ro tell the truth, not only on Tell The Truth Monday’s, but every day. Even when those truths are uncomfortable.
Cheers, my Hawk brother across the pond. You Are the man!
Thanks Bankhawk, thank you so much.
Remember the days when the Seahawks were pretty good/great everywhere except for the OL? They tried going cheap and failed. Letting Okung walk, trading Unger, etc. That’s how we ended with Brady Sowell starting at an important position (LT). Well, the new Sowell is Benson Mayowa! Choosing to go cheap on the DL (like they did with the OL back then) will work like it did with Sowell and Co. Gear up for 10-6 and a first round play-off loss!
Bradley
Good luck Clowney, you were in news more this off-season than from on-field play so far. there is that… Seattle definitely would have offered that 12+3 what ever on one year or multi year deal, JC definitely was looking forward to next off-season. Hate to say this..Seattle is no longer a preferred destination in FA.
Titans had a chance to win their division without Clowney or another upgrade. Seahawks not so much, they needed to upgrade D-line.
If money similar I understand him moving on.
Like Seattle he’s familiar with system.
NFC as a whole tougher.
D-line in Tennessee much better vrs Seattle pre-Clowney.
In this case i just think Seattle blew it. Not necessarily for Clowney. Just blew it in regards to upgrading their D-line and Pass Rush period.
I still think players view Seattle as a good destination.
Seahawks just need to be willing to pay up for impact players.
It’s not like they didn’t start the offseason with enough money. 60M on what seems like a little downgrade. I agree with Rob; i think that’s why they overpaid for Adams.
Oooofff people are acting like this is a team devoid of talent.
Yeah it sucks that Clowney decided to get the money Seattle originally offered him somewhere else (of course he signed with Tennessee, i said it a while ago. Old position coach, goes back to the 3-4 and rush the passer with Harold Landry on the other side so he can pad his sack total and hopefully get his $20 mil payout.)
This team still has Russ, it has a stable of running backs, the best WR group since Doug, Golden and Kearse, 2 1/2 tight ends. Top 3 DB group from top to bottom, Top 5 LB duo and Jordyn Brooks, Jarran Reed returning to 2018 form, another year of Poona Plus pass rushing from Irvin, Mayowa, Jamal Adams and others.
This team will go at least 10-6, more likely 11-5. San Fran will also go 11-5 and it will be a toss up who wins the division.
“Oooofff people are acting like this is a team devoid of talent.”
No, people are reacting like it’s a team with possibly the worst D-line in the league. Which is fair.
“This team will go at least 10-6”
Which isn’t progress — despite spending between $50-60m, having used a full draft class and then traded their life savings for a safety.
Brady Henderson
ESPN
LB Shaquem Griffin and quarterback Danny Etling are among the 14 players the Seahawks have signed to their practice squad, according to the NFL’s transaction wire. That leaves Seattle with two spots to fill. All 14 players were waived by Seattle on Saturday. The other 12 are: TE Stephen Sullivan, TE Tyler Mabry, WR Aaron Fuller, WR Penny Hart, WR Cody Thompson, WR Lance Lenoir, OT Tommy Champion, OT Chad Wheeler, CB Gavin Heslop, CB Jayson Stanley, DB Ryan Neal and DT Cedrick Lattimore.
2 spots, maybe Britt and Griffin, not sure how many vets they already have on the PS.
Never been less into football in my life w/ everything that’s gone on this year. Who is on the PS?
I kind of hope the NFL keeps the extended PS. It gives a place to develop some young talent across the board. The NFL really needs a developmental league, but if they can’t swing it, PS is the next best option.
I feel for ya Vol12, the CFB season will be wacky as hell to cover and try to decipher who is good, bad or worth taking ANYWHERE in the draft. You have some guys playing early (normal), some playing late (Big10/Pac12) and some sitting out….. total crap shoot in 2021 draft.
It’s fine. Russ had a truck backup to everyone’s door w/ a lifetime supply of miracle water
Rob,
I want to thank you for speaking out for what you believe needs to be heard. In addition, I am impressed by your attempt to be fair to all parties. I see now that Clowney was never going to Seattle. He was hurt in this season with Seattle. Why should he come back when the DL is even worse than last year? As you pointed out Seattle needs more playmakers and a better supporting cast. I believe this will be a down year but I am hopeful that out of the losing and domination by other teams that PC/JS will be move in a new and hopefully a better direction. Your point about Paul Allen’s contribution is right on the money in my opinion. Again thank you for sharing your passion, your insight and how to be a real fan of the Seattle Seahawks.
Thanks James 👍🏻
Rob,
I love your website. Thank you for all the hours you put into it.
Question: How would the Seahawks have to finish season for you to consider it to be a successful season?
My answer is if they get to the NFC Championship Game win or lose, they have exceeded my expectations and had a great year.
It depends.
With this roster I think ‘playoffs’ is a reasonable expectation.
But that’s basing it on a review of the roster. Going into the off-season, with $60m to spend, a haul of picks and then knowing they traded the farm for Jamal Adams, I would’ve hoped for much more than merely ‘playoffs’ as a realistic aim.
There hss bern something wrong with their draft choices for years. I cringe
When they take a LB lets say in the first round thats rated to go in the 4th or 5th when a 1st rounder from Alabama is sitting right there and then the next team grabs them up gratefully. I really have just shook my head 4 years. because those choices often don’t work out, especially at RB. You dont hear much excitement about Rashad Penny, another choice that didnt make sense when so many faster running backs were on the board. I wish they made better choices. What do u think?
Just a stubborn insistence on certain things and an overall lack of accountability.
In spite of the disappointment this offseason, I am officially excited for the season to start. Let the talking be done on the field.
I think this may prove to be a pivotal season for PCJS, one in which Pete Carroll may be forced to adapt his philosophy to fully utilise Russell Wilson. If we are chasing games as a result of our poor defensive play Wilson needs to step up to the mark and more importantly he has to be allowed to step up to the mark.
For me personally, the off-season has been sub-par from an additions stand point. This year I wanted the hawks to take the step from “competing” to dominating and I don’t believe the current squad is any closer to doing so than in the last few seasons. Jamal Adams is a fantastic pick up, price aside, however, it is painfully obvious that we needed support mostly on the DLine. While it is entirely possible that the guys we have improve from last season, I don’t believe they are enough to get us where we want to be.
Final point, would just like to thank Rob again for his immense efforts in keeping this place interesting and informative. Massive respect for the the time you put in Rob.
Yeah a kudos from me for all your time spent as well Rob. Don’t always agree with you but as the song in the 60s said “wouldn’t be a real drag if we were all the same”.My sympathies for having to put up with some of the shit thrown your way as well. And all because your opinion is different than theirs. Sadly that is a reflection of the greater world around us.
Go Hawks!
Thanks Mike
Thank you EP, it’s really appreciated.
Rob, what do you think PC/JS will take away from this mess? (Besides an early round playoff exit, that is.) Sheldon Richardson, Frank Clark, and now Clowney — all guys the front office seemingly didn’t want to pay. Surely they’ll reconsider how they value defensive lineman in the future?
If it goes as badly as I think, they usually respond aggressively to those kind of situations. But I thought they would do that this year and they didn’t.
Their brains are warped after how easy it was to obtain and retain Bennet and Avril. That’s all I can come up with. They refuse to commit to quality linemen on both sides of the ball period. And doing nothing this year and trading away a bunch of picks gets them off the hook for future commitments.
Just the insane ramblings of a fan who is already sick of 2020, but let’s see what happens with Reed in the future.
So Brady Henderson is reporting the hawks had 15 million on the table for Clowney months ago- how much can this be believed and if so, what gives?
My guess, and it’s purely that, is Clowney overplayed his hand thinking he could get more and once the Hawks spent on others they reduced their offer out of necessity (salary cap). Meanwhile no one else stepped up any higher and as the season came upon him he took the best he could which was Tennessee. Possible the Hawks were willing to still match but he was unhappy with them for one or more of the reasons that have been discussed here.
With the Clowney situation put to bed, it may be time to take a closer look at the other EDGE guys on the roster. With Taylor’s injury, the remaining “hope” may just have to be……
EDGE-Alton Robinson, Syracuse, 6-26/264, 32-3/8″-Arms, 9-1/4″-hands, I read he may have put on 10-15 lbs. upon his arrival at camp, IF muscle was added, it may help his consistency.
4.69/40, 35-1/2″-Vert, 119″-Broad, 7.32-3-cone, 4.32-20yd shuttle, 25-reps.
#4 in 2019 EDGE SPARQ score with pSPARQ of 127.3, z-score 0.6, NFL% 71.7
Career stats: 35-games, 115-tkls, 71-solo, 32.0-TFL, 19.0-Sacks, 5-PD, 2-FR, 5 FF
Obviously a 5-th round pick isn’t a guy you would normally expect to show up big, especially in their rookie season, but stranger things have happened and at least there is a very small amount of “hope” that he’ll show up and perform well this year or at least provide some decent rotational pass rush help and add some potential for his future years.
We can all sit here and ‘hope’ for things. The debate needs to be about what they’ve done, what we actually know. Which is they failed to adequately address their biggest need.
If Alton Robinson has a great season, which I doubt personally, then that will be a pleasant surprise.
Until it happens we should focus on holding the team to account.
Seahawks game less than a week away! Let’s go!!!
Offseason is now in the rearview, can only focus on what lies ahead. Pumped!
Not so bold predictions:
-DK emerges as the clear WR1
-Low bar, but Damien Lewis becomes clearly the best OL they’ve drafted
-Dunbar underwhelms (too much of a truncated offseason for him)
-Defense takes a big step forward
-Offensive playcalling still infuriates
https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-most-impressive-rookies-training-camp-2020-nfl-season
I just got o-lineman football wood.
Record Prediction for Seahawks
1. Loss @ Atlanta
2. Win against New England
3. Win against Dallas
4. Win @ Miami
5. Win against Minnesota
6. Loss @ Arizona
7. Loss against San Francisco
8. Win @ Buffalo
9. Loss @ Los Angeles Rams
10. Win against Arizona
11. Win @ Philadelphia
12. Win against New York Giants
13. Win against New York Jets
14. Win @ Washington
15. Loss against Los Angeles Rams
16. Loss @ San Francisco
8-8 record, just miss playoffs, Jets will receive pick 16-18 in first round and pick 80-82 in the third round for Jamal Adams trade.
Correction
8. Loss @ Buffalo
11. Loss @ Philadelphia
So 1-5 in the NFC West. I’d say 3-3 but I’ve been told I’m delusional.
hate to say it, but 8-8 very possible with current roster. I think Wilson keeps that as a floor.
Could be 9-7 if or 10-6 if some teams have the injury bug, which is definitely possible this season.
10-6
I can easily see 2 wins for Seattle vs Rams. Split with the 49ers.. so you already have 3-1.
Will they blow both games vs the Cardinals in the question? Let’s say they split, then they went 4-2 and land on 11-5, which is pretty much where I have them pegged.
The Dallas game will give them all they can handle and then some. This might be the single most important game of the season, except if the final game vs the 49ers is for all the marbles.
The Buffalo game on the road will also be tough, not an easy win at all.
Only the 1 seed gets a bye, so unless the Saints royally mess up, they likely will be the 1 seed. I can’t see Seattle going 13-3 or 14-2, even “theoretically” with Clowney. Definitely not now.
I just can’t see that.
The Pete & Russ combo never falls below 9-7. Throw in the uncertainty surrounding everything covid related and I think it’s a recipe for the most seasoned QB-HC combos to have the most success.
On paper this also looks the deepest roster they’ve had in some time, with guys littered throughout the NFL top 100. The QB is one the three best players in the league, the RB group is as deep as it’s been, the WR/TE group as deep as it’s been since 2013, best secondary they’ve had since the LOB, deepest LBer group they’ve had.
Obvious concerns in the trenches. But this team went 11-5 last season, and I think we tend to forget that that was with Joey Hunt, Travis Homer and Jacob Hollister ending up as starters; and with minimal appearances from Dissly, Diggs and Blair.
Also for consideration, Seattle was very good in one score games last year and history tells you those teams regress the following year. I suppose you could argue that’s what good teams do, but RW was 37-37-1 in such games previously (sorry the stat may be off as I don’t have it in front of me but I know it’s close). I’m hoping for 16-0 but 9-7 is what I think…
Penei Sewell opts to turn pro
https://twitter.com/peneisewell58/status/1303025312142209024
What else is the kid gonna do? Pac 12 ain’t playin’ this fall even if the Big 10 changes their mind.
Seahawks make offer to Britt he chooses to test market. Now in Green Bay. Seattle obviously not happy at center if they made offer. Guessing he’ll take similar offer somewhere other than Seattle.
Seems like Great fit in Green Bay
What the hell are Pete and John doing?
They have nearly $10m to spend.
Domt have a clue what they’re thinking; but would love to see that money go into 2 big DT’s
Is it possible they feel he won’t be physically ready for like half the season?
Just spitballin’ here.
Maybe Griff and/or Adams extension? Lol.. just a guess, as this makes no sense!
One a side note; you win Rob. I always felt JC was coming back, so my fear was more to do with the OL signings. Now….I’m speechless.
To start a new conversation on another DE; who’s out there that is unhappy with their current team or vice versa. Not that I would do it, but DK seems our only valuable trade option given age and contract; what could DK get us? Once again, don’t think I’d want to do it; just for conversation.
You can’t trade DK.
And I can’t think of any possible DE’s at this stage.
Agree and agree; just looking for something to think about is all.
If you intention is to piss off RW, that would do it.
Once again…I’m just throwing the idea out, and wouldn’t agree with it. In the end, he is the only guy on our roster that would have massive trade value; the rest are meh, and not on a entry level contract. Think Russ ain’t pissed to see no action on Dline this offseason too? I’ve never been a “Russ is gonna leave” person, but I am starting to buy it now. The FO has done nothing to instil confidence.
Great teams like the LOB were mainly built with many core players on rookie contacts. You can’t trade DK unless you’re getting back three #1 picks in the next three drafts and all that teams’ second round picks, too. The only team who would make that trade for DK is probably the team that already has DK and they don’t have any good picks left anymore. Although if Russell gets hurt in Atlanta and misses the year – they will probably have the 33rd pick in next years draft. That’s a pretty decent pick, I guess (sarcasm).
FWIW, Peter King picks the Seahawks to win the NFCW. HIs rationale is RW>Garoppolo.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/09/07/roger-goodell-super-bowl-prediction-nfl-fmia-peter-king/
And Dallas is the #1 seed in the NFC. Bwa ha haha.
ZERO chance of that. Any credibility his prediction of Seattle winning the West or any other prediction went out the window with that.
Dallas’ roster is loaded this year and they’re no longer being coached by the clapper, so I wouldn’t bet against it.
Their offensive line has also been on the decline for several years and they lost their best often take Weinman in Travis Frederick. They also have no back and on their defense and a middle of the pack quarterback Darian plus Jerry Jones will stick his nose in everything like he always does and any chance they have of being good he’ll screw up. Sorry not mine
“often take Weinmann”
That’s a keeper!
We apologize for the fault in the post. Those responsible have been sacked.
Mynd you, møøse bites Kan be pretti nasti…
Freaking voice to text…………………..sigh
I don’t know man. I have a pretty healthy respect for Dallas’ roster and QB.
The results don’t seem to speak to how well they’ve done with their first round picks.
New podcast on the way.
Nick Bellore back because, as we’ve said a million times, they value special teams.
Phil Haynes on IR. He’s flirting with being too injury prone to make a career of this.
Haynes to IR and Bellore re-signed.
Rob, what kind of article will you write if the Seahawks get to the Super Bowl this year?
Clearly I’ll write one about how horrible it is.
What do you bloody think??
These silly gotcha questions are just…silly. Good grief, some people are acting like if you question or are unhappy with a decision Pete or John make it means you’re not actually pulling for them to succeed. I’m extremely disappointed with how they handled what they declared to be their #1 priority, that doesn’t mean that I won’t be pulling for them all season and enjoying every win.
Probably a well-though out objective piece on how Russell Wilson and the strength of the offensive weapons and a great back 7 on defense overcame a flawed offseason of addressing the trenches.
Unreal and pathetic
Don’t want to speak for you, but pretty sure if the Seahawks average 4 sacks a game and they win the Super Bowl on the performance of the surprise performances on the DL, Rob would be overjoyed to be wrong. Some people just don’t get it.
I would be delighted to be wrong.
One sure way to feel better about the Seahawk’s horrendous off season is do what I am doing. I am renouncing the Seahawks, the NFL, and pretty much all pro sports.
I had already made my decision before Pete Carroll opened his mouth to prove once and for all how ignorant he is. He is one of the white people that needs to be coached up and educated about the actual history of our great country. Our country made a big mistake with slavery. But we fought a civil war to end the blight of slavery 159 years ago. Over 600,000 Americans died in that war. By far the greatest death toll of any war the USA has fought.. PC said rich white guys put together a system of slavery and we never left it. I guess his millionaire players are enslaved. Since Pete is so overwhelmed with white guilt, he is one rich white guy that should relinquish his multi million dollar position to a black coach. Pete is making sure all of his players are registered to vote. Hmm, I wonder how he expects them to vote? Of course Democrat. If white guy Pete knew his history he would know that the Democratic party is the historic party of racism. Anyone whom is not aware of that either is ignorant of history, or they are deliberately denying history. I am sick and tired of sanctimonious woke liberals telling me and other humans that were born Caucasian by no fault of their own, that we are racist. I am sick and tired of our Country being declared systemically racist because of a handful of tragic events resulting in the death of a few black criminals. I am waiting for the “mostly peaceful” riots for the white criminals that died at the hands of the cops. That is a much bigger number by the way. I am certainly not going to tune in to the NFL to see spoiled entitled millionaires kneeling to disrespect our flag and our great Country. I am not going to tune in to listen to the “black national anthem.” There is one national anthem for our Country that represents one nation of all races. That is the only anthem that should be played. I am not going to tune in to see racial justice slogans on the field or on helmets or jersey’s.
The problem with too many people is that they are too “woke” to wake up. People of all races calling you a racist is in itself RACIST!
I have been a die hard Seahawks and NFL fan for decades. I am done. For me it is a choice between my team or my Country. I will choose my Country every time. It is cathartic to be rid of the frequent anguish that has come with being a Seahawk fan.
I will say again, can we please keep this a football forum?