Pete Carroll just showed why Pete Carroll needs to go

Pete Carroll’s interview on Tuesday was… interesting

Pete Carroll’s interview on Seattle Sports radio on Tuesday was remarkable. As if the performance on the field and the shocking statistical analysis of the team wasn’t bad enough, now the coaches words are adding to the growing evidence that change is needed.

You can watch the whole interview here but I want to touch on two topics that were discussed.

Carroll suggested his team struggled against the run versus Pittsburgh because they were too focused on preventing explosive plays:

“I wanted to make sure that these guys did not have explosive pass plays in this game because they had just won the game the week before against Cincinnati, which was so different to how they’ve been playing, I wanted to make sure that was out of the game plan and I think maybe that was our first concern and it just got into our heads and we didn’t play right.”

This isn’t a huge surprise, given Carroll admitted they’d tried to do the same thing the prior week against the Titans. In both games they determined that stopping Ryan Tannehill and Mason Rudolph — two backups — was more important than trying to stop Tennessee and Pittsburgh running the ball.

This is despite Seattle having such a glaring weakness defending the run. It was inevitable both Mike Vrabel and Mike Tomlin would seek to exploit it. And they did, to the tune of 364 total rushing yards.

The Seahawks have allowed an average of 170 rushing yards over their past six games. Since week seven, no defense in the NFL has been worse at defending the run.

Any coach worth his salt was going to exploit this. Yet according to Carroll, the run defense was overlooked because they were so wholly focused on stopping explosive plays in passing games led by Tannehill and Rudolph.

What actually drove this approach specifically against Pittsburgh? According to Carroll, it’s the way the Steelers played against Cincinnati, even though he also admits this isn’t typically how Pittsburgh has had success on offense.

I went and had a look at what actually happened in that Bengals game. The Steelers had three big plays. A short pass to George Pickens, who with yards after the catch ran for an 86-yard touchdown. A 44-yard deep ball to Pickens before half-time which set up a field goal attempt. Then a 66-yarder for a touchdown after half-time.

That’s it.

Then I had a look at how the Bengals have typically faired with their pass defense. It’s the worst in the entire league for yards per attempt. They’re ranked 31st for air yards conceded. They’re last in the league for average depth of target when targeted as a defender. They’ve given up the fourth most passing yards in the NFL this season.

Explosive passing plays against the Bengals are a formality it seems. Yet because Pittsburgh had three big plays against arguably the worst defense in the league when it comes to explosive pass plays, Carroll tailored his defensive focus to stopping it.

Then Pittsburgh absolutely mullered them in the run game.

This is terrible planning. It’s barely believable.

If a first year coach was uttering stuff like this, people would be hysterical. Serious questions would be asked.

Why were they not committed to figuring out their own problem, which was run defense? Did the Seahawks not anticipate a Mike Tomlin-coached Steelers team would try to exploit Seattle’s own weakness, as they perhaps tried to do against Cincinnati the week before, and therefore would attack the run?

Would it not be a better bet to trust your pass rushers and defensive backs, many of which are highly paid and/or highly drafted, to limit Mason Rudolph and George Pickens, while focusing more on ensuring you don’t give up 202 rushing yards instead?

It’s not just an awful plan, it’s also a terrible explanation from the Head Coach on why they were so hopelessly bullied in the trenches. ‘Focusing on the pass’ doesn’t justify the missed tackles or the inability to play without a modicum of toughness. The idea that a team could just ‘take their eye off the ball’ when the run defense has been so utterly appalling for weeks — because you’re focusing on something else — isn’t an acceptable explanation and it’s a terrible excuse for playing soft.

It got worse in the interview when Carroll started talking about his own running game:

“(The running game element) has not been part of our team the way we would like it to be. Our average per rush, that’s not the point. It’s the style of the way you go about it. And we’ve not captured enough of the run game, to get that element as part of our makeup.”

“Najee (Harris) is 230lbs and he runs like it. He runs at you, he runs coming forward, he’s not going to be the flashy guy at all. He’s going to look for the opportunity to run through something, run through a tackle, bounce off a guy. That’s an element for them and to give you another example, the week before against the Titans and they’ve got that monster back there (Derrick Henry) that always brings that mentality. Those guys give you what you’re looking for. Our guys… Kenny (Walker) is a flashy, he’s going to make you miss, and he’s as quick as anyone can be. Explosive as anybody can be. And he runs physical too and Zach is more of the bigger back… but they’re still developing.”

Carroll went on to recall the Marshawn Lynch days and how that running style helped them run the ball with physicality, completing the ‘circle of toughness’.

So there you have it. The Seahawks spent two second round picks on running backs but despite the major, premium picks used on both — neither is capable (currently) of producing a running game because they lack the physicality of Lynch, Harris or Henry.

There are two major problems here:

1. If using high picks on running backs doesn’t guarantee production and the style you’re looking for, why are you investing in the position in that way?

2. Why is a successful run game, in Carroll’s mind, predicated on having a certain ‘type’ of running back? There are more ways to create a successful running game than ‘having Marshawn Lynch or Derrick Henry’. It’s blocking, scheming, planning.

This answer from Carroll makes a mockery of their draft philosophy, picks and the basic nature of their offensive scheming — that the running woes are simply put down to ‘no Marshawn these days’.

It also, once again, calls into question Seattle’s use of resources. Perhaps if the Seahawks want to be a tough, physical running side without going back in time and bringing young Marshawn Lynch into 2023, they should consider investing heavily in proven, tough, physical offensive linemen?

Even that, however, wouldn’t explain why they’ve used high picks on Ken Walker and Zach Charbonnet and now the Head Coach is bemoaning the fact neither can ‘set the tone’ like Najee Harris or Derrick Henry. This is the same Harris, for what it’s worth, who has been a big disappointment for two years in Pittsburgh.

How can anyone have confidence that Carroll is going to sort out the problems on this team with answers like this? Their game-planning is clearly woeful, as is their approach to identity and resource spend. The excuses and explanations are feeble. It sounds as shambolic as it looks on the field.

On top of this, a brilliant article by Mookie Alexander at Field Gulls highlights how horrendous statistically the Seahawks are defensively. They are dead last or in the bottom five for virtually every defensive category since the debacle in Baltimore in week nine.

Alexander’s article is a must read for all fans, so check out the whole piece, but here’s a snippet:

There is literally nothing of consequence that this defense has done at a respectable level for two months. It has never, ever been this bad. The defense has sabotaged the season far more than the inconsistencies of the offense, which, I must emphasize, is 11th overall in points per drive (per FTNFantasy). The other 10 teams ahead of them have either clinched playoff berths or are a win away from a playoff spot.

This is untenable for defensive coordinator Clint Hurtt, who in two seasons is statistically the worst DC of the Pete Carroll era. While it’s true that he didn’t get to inherit the Legion of Boom like Kris Richard, he’s also turned a bad defense into something close to rock-bottom. His promotion in itself was a curious choice when you consider the lackluster results along the defensive line when he was a position coach from 2017-2021. Only once in five seasons as DL coach did Seattle have a pressure rate in the top-half of the league. The run defense was at least good enough in 2020 and 2021 but that’s fallen apart over the two seasons he’s been DC.

With all of that said, this is ultimately a Pete Carroll problem.

I believe Carroll is a great defensive mind and that the Legion of Boom years didn’t spawn exclusively from amazing luck. He also produced plenty of NFL caliber players and All-Pro level talent at USC, too. That doesn’t mean you live up to your reputation in perpetuity. Monte Kiffin is the pioneer of the great Tampa 2 scheme, but almost two decades later he coached one of the worst defenses in NFL history.

Carroll has been trying for years to sort the defense out and he can’t. He just can’t do it. They’ve spent a fortune — picks and salary — trying to fix things. It hasn’t worked. It isn’t going to work if they go through a third reset in 2024 and 2025, right up until the end of his contract.

He’s gone through Kris Richard, Ken Norton and Clint Hurtt. All internal appointments, none have worked. Nobody can have any faith that the fourth time will be a charm.

We’re starting to hear things like ‘we weren’t properly prepared’ for the 49ers game on Thanksgiving, we’re seeing the woeful tackling, increasingly it looks like the players are just tuning out and going through the motions. So much for culture and competitive fire when we see performances like Sunday.

For all the talk of consistent success and being competitive — it isn’t true. The Seahawks have settled into being content with second or third place in the NFC West and trying to scrape into the playoffs in a horrible NFC. It’s no standard to aspire to, being slightly less worse than a bad Saints team or the Vikings without their quarterback.

Ask yourself this — based on all the evidence at hand, do you honestly see Carroll being able to usurp Sean McVay and Kyle Shanahan? Carroll is not capable of even that, let alone taking this team back to a Super Bowl. He shouldn’t be given the opportunity to launch a third reset, or make yet another coordinator change.

Nostalgia for the past isn’t enough of a counter and neither is ‘careful what you wish for’ rhetoric, which is just cowardly.

Who’d heard of McVay or Kevin Stefanski before they were appointed? You don’t need to hire a big name with years of glory on their résumé. Good coaches are out there, leading units that are performing way above expectation. Look at Bobby Slowik, Ben Johnson and Mike McDonald (and there are others). If you get the next appointment wrong, just move on and have another go.

The Seahawks have been here before. They moved on from Mike Holmgren, a Seattle legend, and it was uncomfortable making that decision yet also necessary. His replacement, Jim Mora, failed. But they had to go through that experience to get to Carroll. The rest is history.

This isn’t a time for being afraid or maintaining the status quo. Jody Allen, Bert Kolde and John Schneider — it’s time. This team needs the next era of Seahawks football.

I talked about these topics in more detail on today’s live stream with Jeff Simmons. Check it out below:


  1. Elmer

    IMO the running game has more to do with the OL than with the RB’s and certainly more than with “no Marshawn”. Early injuries to the OL have diminished its effectiveness and affected the season for the entire team. But what the hell do I know.

    • Brodie

      Jeff touched on this in the video. Cleveland has lost 3 tackles, their starting QB and Nick freaking Chubb and ranks 11th in rushing offense and 1st in time of possession.

      We’ve lost a few guys on the OL for some games and our RB1 for a couple. We rank 29th in rushing and dead last in time of possession.

      Pittsburgh and Tennessee have two of the poorer OL’s in the NFL and were able to run all over us. We’ve had ONE 100 yard performance from any RB all year.

      Injuries happen every year, but even when our line, RB’s etc are healthy, we still can’t run the ball and we can’t stop the worst teams in the league from running on us.

      Perhaps the biggest issue besides ineptitude is commitment. One of the few stats you can find where the Hawks rank top 5 in the league is percentage of passing plays (62%). The lowest pass percentages are Baltimore and SF (I know: leading games vs chasing points, but still)

      • Peter


        I’ve been told in no certain terms that Seattle is the only team that has had injuries this season.

        • Peter

          I do wonder how talking heads can bring up all the oline woes for Seattle as an excuse when the Cleveland browns featuring their fourth qb and a rash of oline injuries can have the 9th ranked scoring offense.

      • Ant

        Commitment is not the issue. We constantly run Kenneth Walker up the gut on 1st and 2nd and long like we have prime Marshawn. Often for no gain and 3 and out. We only abandon it when we fall behind but if we’re tied or ahead we stick to it like the bible.

        We executed the run well in the second quarter vs PIT, specifically on the series where we fed K9 for multiple first downs and a TD. But that was only possible because we fed DK earlier in the game, was throwing to all levels of the field, and the defense was selling out to stop the pass.

        More importantly, this only happened because we were down 10-7.

        Waldron calls games aggressively and effectively in shootouts where the defense can’t get a stop to save their lives, and the offense is forced to ball to keep them in the game. Like vs DAL, DET, and PIT. But what about when the defense plays well? We see the same conservative, lethargic, predictable Pete Carroll-style 3-and-out play calling that we’ve been too familiar with over the Bevell years.

        Notice the pattern here? Pete has instilled his philosophy and has his hands all over the offense.

        • Parallax

          I’m guessing — have long guessed — that Pete really limits what his coordinators can do. I love your analysis. Never thought of that before but I believe you’re right. Perhaps it’s why Waldron seems so all over the place in his play-calling style.

        • Ty the Guy

          Hawks rank 29th in rushing attempts per game.

          From 2012-2015, they ranked in the top 3.

          Since then, they’ve only been higher than 15th once (2019, 3rd.)

          IMO, there has been a lack of commitment to the running game, which has put additional strain on the defenses when we don’t sustain drives and work the clock.

        • Brodie

          Your argument tells me you have a point, but the numbers don’t really bear it out.

          We’re throwing the ball on 1st down 72% of the time. You can’t pin that all on game script. We haven’t even had a chance to fall behind in the first half.

          The caveat here is that we are one of the best teams in the NFL on 1st downs. EPA/play is second only to SF. All of that is coming from passing. Our rushing EPA is actually negative on first down. (spoiler – so is every team’s except SF).

          As for “when the defense plays well” – I’m not sure what games those are to be honest.

          The second Rams game maybe? Geno got knocked out and we still had a 2:1 pass/run ratio.

          The bizarro game against NYG? Still threw more than we ran, and won by 21.

          Cincy? 41:21 pass/run and Geno turned it over 3 times in the loss

          The Arizona game is the only one where we’ve run more than passed and we won by 10.

          From Pete’s POV, the singular biggest mistake of his life is passing when it was obvious he should be running. Yet, here we are as one of the most pass heavy teams in the NFL.

          None of this is the real issue though, is it? The offense isn’t the REAL problem. It could be better, but it could be worse. The defense can’t really be much worse and that is supposed to be what Pete is good at.

          • Ant

            It’s true and even through the eye test we can see that we turn away from the run for large chunks of the game. But with the personnel we have, running it inside to chew clock and punish the defence (what Pete keeps saying he wants to see) simply does not work. We try it and it does not work. How many times have we seen a designed inside run where K9 says nope and cuts back away from the pile of linemen being pushed deep into the backfield?

            Yes, they could and should call more outside zone runs and misdirections – with creative blocking schemes – and we do see it time to time and it works. But that’s not in Waldron’s strength or tendency to call run focused game plans and scheme run blocking as a pass focused OC. That’s also not what Pete wants to see. He wants to run it back to 2013 even with a top 10 offence with best passing numbers he has ever had.

            I predict Waldron gets fired at the end of season, to the delight of many fans here, and Pete installs a new OC running his favoured power run game. And I don’t see the offence improving in any way when it happens.

    • Jordie

      Put peak Marshawn next to Devon Achane of the dolphins.
      Same position – completely different ways of doing it…
      Decent OL play/scheme means anybody – even Mostert at 31 – can make big running plays.

      And look at what the Texans have done to Henry either side of the Seahawks game?
      A half decent DL in Houston, limited him to 51yards on 28 attempts in two game (game one was 9 yards!!). Henry had his fourth biggest average versus the seahawks at 4.63 yards per carry.

      I hate the fact that i expect the cardinals to beat the Seahawks on Sunday – almost definitely with James Connor going for 130yards+ and at least one TD.

      We have finished 3rd in a two horse race… and if the season was another 3-4 games in length or if kyler had been fit a week or two earlier then then we could be looking up at all the NFC west.

  2. cha

    Today he blamed the failures on the young players.

    “Not reacting as consistently as we’d like to…A lot of guys just came out of college the last couple of years…frustrating as heck…took a step back last week…”

    • BK26

      Woooooow this could get bad. Throw the only guys who have ever listened to your message under the bus.

      Someone might be feeling their ship getting a hole or two… Fingers crossed.

      • cha

        For the record, he said that last year too.

        I’m really concerned about Devon Witherspoon and Jaxon Smith-Njigba, because they’re holding this team back.

        • Rob Staton

          If only they played as hard as Quandre

          • cha

            The only “young player” that might be hurting the team is Woolen. And Pete benched him and then blamed it on an injury, and brought him right back in.

            Who else could it be? Bryant, who went on IR this year? Anthony Bradford and his grand total of 3-5 starts this year?

            The tackles, both of whom missed significant time?

            Jake Bobo? He’s only had 13 targets in the last 10 games.

        • BK26

          This is true. Just feels like he’s grasping for straws. Jamal going rogue, Diggs being a diva, Pete being frustrated and pissy. Someone said that last week no one was listening to Pete on the sideline. Then him blaming the only guys holding the team afloat?

          I think it’s falling apart around him.

          • Elmer

            He doesn’t have the skills for dealing with players whose heads are stuck where the sun don’t shine.

          • Jo

            For all that is holy let’s hope so I’m so over Pete and his clown show.

        • Sea Mode

          Now where’s that facepalm emoji…?

          Oh yeah: 🤦🏼‍♂️

    • Brodie

      Durn it all! Golly Shucks, Pete hit the nail on the head again.

      If only the other NFL teams had to deal with some guys on their rosters who ‘just came out of college the last couple of years”!

      As BK said… probably the only guys listening to Pete’s message and they get scapegoated. I can’t remember any time in Pete’s tenure where he’s cast so much blame.

    • 509 Chris

      One of the things almost all teams that end up in conference championship games have in common is getting a lot of mileage out of guys still on their rookie deals, including guys drafted after the first 2 rounds. Great coaches find a way to bring the talent out of those cheap players and scheme for the team they have. Seattle for the first time in a lot of years actually has guys on rookie deals who are producing and contributing but the head coach says they’re the problem? Seriously what the hell! This is Hitlers last days in the bunker kind of leadership.

        • 509 Chris

          Everything we think we know is actually just shaped from some past experience.

          • Charles

            Hi am Charles I am a recovering Pete apologist. Never tell me the odds, the facts are always unclear and always run it up the middle! I have really enjoyed the Pete Carroll era from beginning and even till now. The oracle said it best in The Matrix,”Everything that has a beginning has an end”. It is time for another voice. I would like to add that the talent of the Seahawks is great and just needs to have the correct structure in place to tap into their enormous abilities. Relationships matter as well as holding grown ass men accountable! Teach, develop and build! The 2010 49ers were very talented and underachieving until Jim Harbaugh took over. Harbaugh had mainly the same roster and took a team from Singletary at 6-10 in 2010 to a team that was 13-3 in 2011 losing in the conference championship. If the Seahawks keep the current coaching structure, similar results will occur! A business might not make change until the bottom line begins showing a reduction from prior years. The goal is to make money and to better than last year! A good litmus test might be accounted for in attendance. Looking at ESPN attendance tracker, the hawks are sold out every game this year for home games and they dip down to 99.5 capacity two times since the 2013 season.


            Yikes. I was hoping for a dip the last 2 years!!! Possible reason for not taking the reins from Pete? This Home game attendance does not pass the eye test however: from a business perspective it is not a very good look when season ticket holders are selling their tickets to other teams fans. Terrible towels at Lumen field are terrible and hopefully being discussed during the financials at the board meetings. The bottom line that can be gleaned is the fan base rather be doing something else with their time and money. The fan base is decreasing!!! How Will this affect future ticket sales, merchandise and advertising? The terrible towels could be the start of the end and that would be wonderful!!

            Change is good and here is to a new year!

            • Charles

              Sorry meant to be a new post.

        • 509 Chris

          Just wanted the teacher to know I’m doing the reading 🤣

    • McZ

      So much for “Pete, teacher of things”.
      This one is really driving me mad.

      True, Witherspoon (PPF grade 81.4) had a down game on Sunday. But Diggs (53.7) and Adams (54.9) as well as 60% of the defense never had an up game, and Bwagz is making lots business decisions (and wants to come back next season, Seahawks seem to be a nice retirement home franchise).

      Btw, the “true fans ™” always are able to topple any crap coming out of VMAC. Reacting to the game, they first pointed towards J-Rod hoisting the 12 flag, bringing in “Mariners spirit”.

      It’s like watching Titanic’s band play.

  3. Space Chief

    Pete reflecting on Marshawn reminds of the scene in LOTR: Return of the King, when after Denethor gets upset with his younger son Faramir, for not being like his older brother Boromir, sees a vision of Boromir.

    • Hawk Finn

      NO SPOILERS! /s

  4. Orcas Viking

    That loud clanging noise you hear when reading this article is the sledge hammer hitting the steel spike. Thank you Rob for cutting to pieces just a few of Pete’s bullsh.t and utterly feeble and pathetic attempts to explained away the issues we all see on the field. His interview was a joke and he should be embarrassed. Pete, go look at yourself in the mirror…it’s time to hang it up buddy.

    • JimQ

      I listened to a good part of PC’s interview & was wondering if maybe he’s got early-stage Astheimers or something. The exact same old BS answers and excuses are getting hard to swallow. He should be taking a lot more of the blame of the lousy performances of HIS team, if indeed the buck stops at the top. He has to realize that maybe, just maybe, he’s the problem and it’s time to retire. IIRC, PC’s wife retired a year or two ago. So, join her Pete.

  5. Pran

    FWIW, Seattle defense is paid top 5 and performs bottom 5. This alone is sufficient to fire Pete.

    • JimQ


      • Big Mike

        Sure is

  6. KennyBadger

    I about threw my iPhone into the garbage disposal after listening to that interview. Subjectively / watching the tape one can easily see how bad this defense is at tackling, pressuring the passer, scheme, you name it. Objectively / looking at the stats just confirms exactly what your eyes see. I’m not sure what’s more infuriating- Pete’s obliviousness or the lack of accountability to it from the front office and the local media. Pete may have spoiled Seahawks fans during the LOB era but now he’s the one who’s spoiled, and to the point of rot. Rob, you recently made reasonable points there could be a way forward with Pete still as HC – an interview like this makes it clear to me there is not.

    • Brodie

      Agree. I think Pete’s obliviousness is the more infuriating of the issues. To be so blind to everything and think that he’s close to the mountain top is endearing in an 8 year old. When it’s the coach of your NFL team and the delusion has carried on for years, infuriating is exactly right.

      If the front office allows Pete to run it back next year with his son or some other yes-man as DC, I think I may lose it. Pete’s not going to change his spots, but the rest of the front office doesn’t have to let him lead this team to the meat grinder again when it’s clear that he’s lost his way.

  7. AggieHawk

    Am I hallucinating or didn’t Pete also say something about looking forward to having Jamal Adams back healthy next year? (Possibly in the postgame interview, not this one.) The team is entering cap hell and Adams is one of the few clear cut cases of savings, and Pete wants him back? A guy who hasn’t made a difference in three years? I too am wondering if Pete is getting some old man dementia of some sort. He needs to resign and go out with a little goodwill.

    • Sea Mode

      Yup, him and Bobby.

      But I’m with Rob on this one: Jamal is gone (perhaps out of the league even), and anything Pete says on that now is just holding on to save face on the trade.

  8. Feindt

    Could not agree more.

    Marcus Whitman of That franchise guy dropped Seattle 5 spots and a tier in his power rankings, closing out the season at rank #17. His decription however was spot on and exactly what Rob and his colleagues have been criticising for a while now:
    „(…)they really cap of what has been a disappointing season.
    Remember, they traded for Leonard Williams thinking that was going to be a move that got them over the hump to compete with the Niners.
    Forget about that! – this is team is not even making the playoffs.
    (…) This team has as big of DC problem as any team outside of Green Bay. Clint Hurtt has done a really bad job with this unit and that ties back to Pete Carroll who is supposed to be a Defensive Mind and has not been able to get this defense right since the… LOB days, really.

    You also have them punting at midfield early in this game – Pete Carrolism

    And I am not going to put this loss on Geno Smith but he certainly did not help. Suddenly you have questions if he is the future there. He overall has had a good season and is a good QB but in this game he overthrows an Out-Route on a huge 3rd and 4 late that kills a drive as well as the strip-sack-fumble that is on partly on him.

    This loss is going to force the organizations to have some tough conversations about Pete Carroll cause this was one of the worst coaching efforts of the season -by any team- given expectations and the roster talent this team has.“

    Spot on mentioning most of the problems that have been discussed in the blog
    1) expectations (trading draft capital for a mid-season rental to compete with the best team in the NFC)
    2) Atrocious coaching by bottom tier DC ultimately coming back to an defensive minded HC who has struggled to find any solutions for the past 8 years.
    3) Coaching conservatism
    4) Is Geno the future?
    5) Do we need to see Pete Carroll for yet another season?

    Add in the use of resources and you have a long list of problems needing a fix this offseason!

  9. Palatypus

    I just want to say that listening to the insane redneck ramblings on the Paul Finebaum show, on ESPN radio Pensacola, really makes me appreciate all of you.

    Happy New Year!

    Senior Bowl in 30 days.

  10. bmseattle

    The “trying not to give up explosive plays” excuse is so utterly ridiculous, that I simply cannot believe it is true.
    It sounds like Pete is just throwing out a different excuse, every time he talks to the media, at this point.

    He’s a man who has no answers, so he is simply making them up as he goes.

    • Brodie

      It’s happened at least 10 times in the last few years too. Remember that Buffalo game a few years back when they were ranked top 3 in passing and almost dead last in rushing. They threw all over us, the game was over at half and Pete said something like – we didn’t expect them to pass as much as they did.

      I can’t decide if it’s better or worse than when we get blown out by the 9ers and he comes out and says – they didn’t do anything we weren’t expecting. Been practicing those exact situations all week – just didn’t execute.

      Damning in both regards.

    • slartibartfast42

      It’s not that he doesn’t have answers, it’s that his opponents have better answers than he does more often. I’m of the belief that Pete doesn’t really care what he says to the media because they’ll write whatever they want to write. I suspect a small facet of their game plan was to actually limit explosive plays, but somewhere in the planning and execution, it goes wrong at multiple levels. Based on comments from former players, I think his scheme relies on a lot of communication to diagnose and execute during the game, but somewhere in the preparation phase they’re not getting the players ready enough to execute the plan. Therein lies the “we didn’t expect” that nuggets he throws out–the McVays, Shanahans, and even Tomlins of the world are either studying the Hawks film better to know how to disguise their plays, or they’re doing a better job preparing their players to execute. I guess it boils down to being outcoached, but that’s a rare thing for coaches to say week to week; he’s just coming up with new euphemisms to communicate it to the media.

    • Chris

      In Pete’s defense, there aren’t many excuses left to give. They’re bound to get more and more creative and nonsensical at some point.

      • Brodie

        True. We’ve gone from – the dog ate my homework, to – I was abducted by aliens level of excuse making.

    • Sneekes

      Talking loads and saying nothing

  11. Big Mike

    Several posts here called Pete “oblivious” but with all due respect, is he? Or is just just a matter of thinking he’s untouchable and the hubris that goes with that? Serious question.

    • Big Mike

      In other words are these actually well thought out deflections and excuses?

      • Palatypus

        It depends on what your definition of is is.

        • Sea Mode


      • Brodie

        Maybe someone who’s read his book can share some thoughts on his psyche.

        For me, he just seems like an eternal optimist, who truly believes his own BS.

        It also feels like a reverse Neo. “He’s beginning to doubt.”

      • KennyBadger

        I do think they’re deflections and excuses, but I don’t think they’re well thought out. Why think things out though when you can get away with dismissing every challenge to your coaching. It’s almost like a willful ignorance in that if you acknowledge the buck stops with you, then you better be able to make the appropriate changes and I don’t think he knows how to do that.

    • slartibartfast42

      Pete is not “oblivious” to what’s going on with his team, and I do not think he’s making decisions because he thinks he’s untouchable–his body of work demonstrates a hall of fame level of success. The decisions he’s made from hiring Hurtt as DC to acquiring the players he has have led to one of the worst defenses in the league, which is as far away from his plans as he could have hoped. Obviously, he wants to win, and wants to win with his brand of football, but his brand of building and coaching a football team is going so poorly there’s not a lot to do at this stage of the season. Evidence is stacking up that he does not have the answers to fix this problem, but he’ll continue to try as long as he’s here, much to fans’ chagrin. A core tenet of his philosophy is to protect the team and not throw players under the bus (when he’s at that point, you know it’s desperate times), which means he’ll continue to give unsatisfactory answers to the press because it doesn’t help him solve the problems with his team.

  12. JoeV

    I can’t stand how he never takes accountability, and always covers for his players.
    The crime is that the public can see the truth, so his words become cheap and artificial.

    I’m on the fence with him leaving, but he seems tone deaf to his own flaws and those around him.

    • Sea Mode

      Yup, nobody holds him accountable. Been that way for years now.

  13. Gross MaToast

    The job that Pete’s been able to do despite the draft picks, the trades, the extensions, the lackluster coordinator hires, the lack of supervision from Nate and Tater, the, some say, “nuts” “outside the box” game planning, poor game management, inability to stop meddling, throwing the young guys under the bus, continued reliance on a team cancer to “get right” and come back better than ever next year, even though he hasn’t been any good since he got here, not having a guy who weighs 230 pounds to run the ball, mediocre career record when he doesn’t have a transcendent quarterback, and his failure to build a team that neither reflects his vision for a team, nor anyone else’s vision for a team, has been, some might suggest, above average – at worst, slightly below average – arguably, somewhat below average. I’ll defend Pete any day.

    • Peter

      A lot of great points here.

      Fans are out of their minds. If anything Vulcan should be looking into longevity research or a holograph with some stitched together AI for coaching cues from the only coach Seattle has had in any sport so that he can remain the coach until the sun burns out.

      Fire Pete? More like entomb him in whatever hansolo was frozen in and roll that out on the field before every kick off.

      Considering how hard it is to win games when you surrender more points than the other team I think Pete’s done a pretty amazing job.

      I know you’re big on placing blame and respect at tater and nate (nater?) But if this is what year 2 of a 3 year rebuild looks like imagine what year 8, 9, and 10 are going to look like?

      • Big Mike

        Man I love gallows humor
        You guys are awesome!

  14. Gifty

    Why don’t we try to lure Jim Harbaugh away? I think he’d be a great fit and get the most out of our talent. He’d be a motivated hire with a lot to prove in the nfl circles.

    • DK

      Pass, Harbaugh is a ticking time bomb in the NFL. He lost that Niners locker room really fast. He is the perfect college coach because his shtick wears thin on guys after 3 or 4 years.

      I’m good with passing on another college coach trying to show he can be a success in the NFL as well.

      • Gifty

        I don’t think it was the locker room as it was the beef with Baalke and co. I think it be a great hire. Even if it’s 4-5 years. This team has talent but it’s just being out coached.

  15. olyhawksfan

    I cannot believe he’s throwing the young guys under the bus like that. ‘Always protect the team’ was one of the only things he could still hang his hat on, now that’s gone too.

    How are K9 and Charb suppose to feel after hearing that? “we’d be a better football team if I had a different running style, or was bigger, or both? then why the F**K did you draft me?!”

  16. Old but Slow

    How many draft picks do we have this time? No 2d rounder?

    • cha

      And 2 thirds

  17. nfendall

    Bobby Wagner, Julian Love and Devin Witherspoon were voted into the Pro Bowl for the NFC. Wagner and Love being included is pretty wild. I know that this includes fan voting but it shows just how little people pay close attention to the Seahawks and how little talent there is in the NFC right now.

    • RomeoA57

      3/11ths of an atrocious defense make a Pro Bowl? A completely legitimate accomplishment.(sarcasm)

      Witherspoon may well be deserving of this acknowledgement. Look forward to see if he improves next year.

      Wager is getting a career achievement award. We can look forward to him not making much of a difference next year.

      Love has one outstanding game and makes the Pro Bowl? I am scratching my head and ass over that one.

      • geoff u

        I do find it absolutely hilarious that Love got in over Diggs and Adams, two all time best super all-pros ever, just ask them

        • Ant

          I find it more hilarious that he got in over Antoine Winfield Jr, who’s having a historic year in TB.

          Am I missing something here? How the f**k does the NFL see this and allow this to happen?

      • vanhawksfan

        Were any of those Pro Bowl voters watching Love’s first 3 games of the season?

  18. KSBlazer

    But I was just listening to 710 radio a couple of weeks ago and Wyman said. No one preps a team as well as Pete Carroll. He’s the best in the league. 😂

    • James Z

      I stopped listening to Wyman 5 years ago. It seems he forgot what his coaches said when he played: keep your head on a swivel. He looks straight ahead, stiff-necked…as in predictably a company man.

      • Whit21

        I stopped listening to 710 altogether.. theyre critical at small times and then raw raw almost all the time.. its a hard listen. KJR are more than types that get frustrated and mad.. makes for a better listen when ur already pessimistic and angry when your team sucks..

  19. Big Mike

    “Oh that Pete, he’s so dreamy”.

  20. king

    I do not want any of the below to happen, except potentially a team friendly deal to LW, but the tea leaves I am reading portend:

    Pete will be back with new uninspiring coordinators.

    Geno will be the starting quarterback and no serious resources will be used on the qbof.

    Bobby Wagner will be a starter.

    Adams and Diggs will still be on the team.

    Williams will be signed to a multi year deal.

    One of the previous predictions will be wrong, but no more than one.

    I understand that financially this seems impossible, but they will find a way.

    • Brodie

      I could see Pete back with a new DC with Geno, Adams and Diggs staying.

      I see no reason LW will want to spend the last years of his career underpaid, on a terrible defense with almost no shot at a ring. Even IF we could offer him a great deal, he’s going to explore the market.

      I think Bobby hangs up the cleats after this year.

      • Brodie

        LOL, should have clicked on Big Mike’s links before I prognosticated that Bobby would retire!

        • James Z

          Wagner in ’24…I know he wants to play another year, but please, please, please not with Seattle. I read another comment or 2 in previous postings about keeping him if agrees to sit out on 3rd down, but doubt he would agree to that due to ego.

    • Ground_Hawk

      Pete promoting his son to more than an offensive assistant is also a frightening possibility

    • Orcas Viking

      If Adams and Diggs are back next year in lieu of signing Williams, then JS should be fired or resign as well. The thought of next year having Pete, Adams, Diggs and no 2nd round pick or Williams is nauseating.

  21. Mr drucker in hooterville

    Whats Chris Peterson up to?

  22. BobbyK

    This is actually rather embarrassing. Does he know what he’s saying anymore?

    This is a team who has pretty well quit (during a playoff run, mind you).

    The comment about the RBs are one of the dumbest things he’s ever said. Who the heck drafted those guys so highly? Why would you if they aren’t what you want? You can’t make this stuff up.

    I never thought I’d hear the day an opposing coach was worried about stopping Mason Rudolph. Maybe we need to trade all of our picks we waste for Myles Garrett? At least we wouldn’t have to worry about Rudolph.

    Sadly, these comments (so stupid you actually can’t believe they’ve been said) are becoming more and more normal from his mouth.

    I used to think they were buffoons for trading for Jamal Adams or trading a 2nd and 5th to rent Leonard Williams, but now they’re words of stupidity are matching many of their actions from these past resets.

  23. Mick

    You still have a game to play this week, old fool. You don’t single out players before a game unless you plan to leave them on the bench. Walker has 9 freaking TDs this year with a beat up offensive line.

    And then you have Adams, Diggs, Wagner, Jones, Taylor, Clark, Evan Brown, even Tyler and Geno and the TEs underperforming, and of course it’s the young guys’ fault we play like we play. Great way of losing them.

  24. Palatypus

    Perhaps Pete Carroll needs a Press Secretary. Can we pry Kaley McCananey away from her current job because I, at least, because she is so hot I enjoy watching her lie to me.

    • James Z

      Pretty darn funny there, Palatypus! Kayleigh McEnany lies as easily as she breathes. Maybe she’ll be available come November…

  25. TurnAgainTide

    100% Rob, Pete just can’t remain the coach after this season. Hopefully he recognizes that it’s time to hang it up.

    • Sea Mode

      We can only hope…

  26. Ant

    I find his comments regarding RB very interesting. To say that they needed Marshawn just because he could bring the physicality and “set the tone”. Completely ignoring what made Marshawn so effective as a running back, his rare vision and ability to be patient and wait for running lanes to open.

    These seem like the same types of traits that make Kenneth Walker effective on the Seahawks despite not bringing the bruising physicality that Marshawn brought. K9, like Marshawn, often relies on his elite vision and patience to identify running lanes as they form. A godsend to an OL who gets frequently pushed back by defensive linemen due to a lack of resource spend. Having the likes of Marshawn and Kenneth Walker lets the franchise get away with not investing in run-grading offensive linemen because they can find success running away from them.

    Why on earth did they draft Charbonnet as the power back to be the new Marshawn and as a foil to K9? Compared to K9, Charbonnet looks like the more instinctive back who would hit the gap without hesitation. The problem is that to be successful it would need an OL who can move defenders and create openings at the point of attack. We often see him bulldoze his own linemen forward just to turn negative yardage into a 1 yard gain.

    From his comments this week, it seems like Pete drafted Charbonnet to be the new Marshawn. So he doesn’t have to spend high draft picks or FA signings on the OL because he didn’t have to back in the day with Marshawn. But other than being physical their style cannot be more different. A massive error in talent evaluation.

    Despite being better suited to utilize the depth in skill position talent to build on a pass-focused game utilizing creative concepts that Waldron brings (and we end up seeing offensive performances like at DAL and vs PIT Q2), Pete continues to endlessly harp to the media that he wants to run it back to the Marshawn days. Days when he could waste 1st round picks on the likes of James Carpenter and Rashaad Penny without JS getting in his ear. Run it like Marshawn despite not having the backs, OL, or offensive scheme to do so.

    All to watch Charbonnet and K9 not run like Marshawn and complain to the media why they aren’t running like Marshawn.

  27. Parallax

    I’m fascinated by Pete’s comment about running backs. We know he’s stubborn and set in his ways. We know he prefers a smashmouth style. But this is the first time I’ve seen the extent to which he’s committed to a very myopic vision. It also indicates that Schneider picked Walker. My guess, and it’s just a guess, but it rings true at least in my world, is that Pete probably said he wanted a running back but Jody or other bigwigs around her pulled away some of the control Carroll had in prior years. So he didn’t get to go after his guy. He loved Carson, and that was a good pick, given we got him in the 6th, but that style really suited Pete. Walker may frustrate him.

    Perhaps it was that frustration that caused him to ask for another running back this time, and Schneider obliged with someone with a style more to Pete’s liking, even though he’s not there yet in terms of effectiveness.

    Absolutely, we need to move on from Carroll. Honestly, even when he had a great record, and I thought ourselves lucky to have him and defended him in forums like this, I never thought he was a great tactician or, frankly, the sharpest knife in the drawer. I thought he had other qualities that made up for it. But everyone’s skills diminish with time and we become less flexible. I’m 60 and I see that in many ways I’m not as sharp as I once was. Pete’s almost 73. It’s time.

    • Waldo

      Definitely think Pete is frustrated with the young players not consistently playing the way he wants. Up until your post, I was thinking he is either A) frustrated with his assistant coaches for not getting the most out of the players (with the plan to make changes after the season) or B) realizing he will not be around anymore by the time they mature enough (e.g. Charbonnet, Hall, etc.)..the clock is ticking

      Now, adding option C) JS and Pete are not as synced up as they appear to be. Since PC is so far removed from the college game, he relies heavily on JS and the scouts. JS is putting high on their draft board pass-first and big-play friendly players (Cross, Lucas, Walker, JSN, etc) while Pete wants smashmouth players. On defense, getting more finesse players (Spoon, Mafe, Brown, etc) than physically imposing players like the LOB. Only solution is for Pete to push JS out, but too late in his career to start over wtih a new GM

      • Blitzy the Clown

        I must’ve been watching a different Spoon all season. Finesse is not how I’d describe his play in the least.

    • Eric

      This proves something I have been wondering about for a while…The PC/JS unity is turning into disunity. It seems like JS is drafting and going after a team that is built for “today’s football” while PC is still intent on “running it back” with Ground Chuck.

      If PC has the ability to replace players with like players (getting Derrick Henry to replace Marshawn) then okay…but he doesn’t. He gets all of these wildly athletic players, brings them in-house then says they aren’t the type of player he even wants. I bet the players are quitting on him left and right. I know as a former player, I didn’t want to play for a coach that didn’t want me and the rest of the team didn’t want to play for him when we were routinely outclassed because we were thrown under the bus.

      Sad to say it, but… Goodbye Pete…it’s time to retire.

      • Peter

        If John is drafting players for today’s game he must be watching a different one than the rest of us. Corners? Edge rushers? Wr’s?

        Been hearing that for a few years now. But it turns out you need good players everywhere. John and Pete have repeatedly shown they don’t know how to acquire them.

        I’m in favor generally of retaining John. On his own with no goofy Pete in the office, Dan Quinn as HC capacity. If that happens I’ll finally know if John’s been all too happy cashing checks for no reason. On 14 years there’s been enough GM openings that if “one of the most respected gms in the league,” really wanted to strike out and do his own thing he could have by now.

        People point to the last two drafts. Let’s first look at the preceding drafts:

        From 2017-2021 picks plus trades the FO selected the following players:

        1. Chris Carson. Good enough for a second contract. Retired. Not a building block.

        2. DK metcalf. Excellent value. Building block.

        3. Dickson. Punter. Great player. But a punter.

        4. Will Dissly. Solid. Second contract worthy. Top dollar worthy? No.

        That’s it. That’s the entire list of players selected that are unequivocally worthy of second contracts.

        Additional names:

        Brooks. A high tackling generally not impactful 1st round LB. Possible second contract.

        Lewis. Probably time to move on. Perhaps second contract because roster holes.

        Parkinson. A good unspectacular value player. Second contract perhaps.

        The last two drafts they made very good selections. What we don’t know is if those selections will materialize. Example:

        Cross. Right now he’s playing at an Okung level. Second contracts for LT’s are generally pretty expensive and he’s not showing any real growth.

        Boye Mafe….maybe the absolute best pick in the last two cycles. Need, effort, results, value. Perfect.

        Lucas. Blog favorite. Will move into best pick territory….if the knees hold up.

        Walker. Awesome player. Niggling injuries. Bluntly if they don’t fix the oline not sure he’ll be worth a second contract.

        Woolen. Question mark. Lingering injury? Bad role models? Flash in the pan?

        This year:

        Witherspoon. Great pick. A small cup of cold water though. Top five pick you should hit it out of the park.

        JSN. Good pick. Flashes. Was it the biggest need? Maybe if Lockett retires, regresses further.

        Hall….incomplete. Rob said it may take him awhile. This I’m putting a decision on pause.

        Charbonnet….???…is a second running back with a bad oline really the move? Like the player but he’s the fourth running back selected before any dlinemen that matter or before the oline was good.

        Young….currently JAG

        Bradford….does he need reps? Is he just a curhan/Forsythe?

        So I like a lot of the names. But I’m fairly unconvinced on the process. It’s great to play for the modern game as it were. If you don’t have a foundation to your house it’s pretty fruitless to start dreaming of the custom deck and swimming pool.

        • Peter

          Apologies for the length but an addendum:

          Bobo, young, melton….more WR’s and Kenny McIntosh the fifth RB drafted before an oline of note was built.

          I get you need special teams players but three of those names are not playing or not on the team anymore.

  28. geoff u

    So his excuse is we ran into the beast that is Najee Harris? Who has a 100 yard rushing game this season? The guy who otherwise can’t crack 4 ypc?

    No. It’s the defense, stupid. No names constantly and consistently run on us year after year after year.

    This has been inexcusable for years and each year is more inexcusable than the last.

  29. MMjohns195

    Not sure how many of you listen to B&S but on one of the podcasts i was listening to him talk about how there’s been some dysfunction in relation to the scouts / coaching staff. He pointed out a specific example of how the Scouting staff was exceptionally high on Chubb, that was who they wanted. The coaching staff, specifically Schottenheimer, overruled them and picked Penny. Schotty didn’t want to deal with chubb having coached him for a year at Georgia, so they took penny.

    In some respects i get it, you want players your coaches want to coach, but if you can’t all get inline then this happens. This is partially why i believe they shouldn’t get a QBOTF until they get a new regime.

    • Peter

      I’m neither pro nor con Schottenheimer or really anyone.

      Forget the 2017 draft.

      Electing to not draft the RB closest to Lynch who as one annoying commenter detailed ( me, btw) in that draft as the running back with the single best 13 game run against real teams in all of college football at the time because you didn’t want to “deal,” with a player who has never been a problem on or off the field….then that’s fire-able.

    • Brodie

      Whoa. I haven’t heard this, but that was truly one of the stranger picks I can remember watching live. Chubb made so much more sense.

      I remember John saying that someone tried to immediately trade for Penny during that first round. That they loved Penny’s medicals (oh irony).

      We all knew that John wasn’t making these decisions in a vacuum, but it does present a coordinator (coaches) vs scouts (GM) dynamic that shows where Pete sided and who ultimately makes the call on a pick the room is divided on. At least in those days.

      • Peter

        I’m going to push back on the scouts under the gm wing a bit.

        Two of the the top guys in the scouting department precede both John and Pete in tenure with the team.

        It’s pretty hard to say that scouting is John’s department. This is not meant as the wiseass joke it will seem…but Pete’s kid was part of the scouting staff in the time of the original “good drafting.”

        • Brodie

          Scouts are talent evaluators, just like John. What other wing would you put them under, if not their direct report – Schneider.

          • Peter

            I know they report to him. I also know by reading comments that people here think he’s developed the scouting department and is getting stymied by Pete.

            When as I said there are people here prior to either one and his own bio says he runs the roster and draft process.

            If he runs it then an OC with hardly a resume should not be trumping his decisions.

          • Peter

            Brodie, btw….I’m not trying to argue to be arguing. I’m just a little over both of them right now.

    • Sea Mode

      Wouldn’t want to deal with Nick Chubb?!?

      He’s a coach’s dream.

      I can understand the medical concerns coming out, although he had already come back and produced for two full years in college, but anything about his character has to be absolutely false. I watched his interviews. Heart and soul player. All ball.

  30. Big Mike

    Just a reminder: the Rams are in the playoffs after starting 2-5. Seahawks are most likely not in the playoffs after starting 5-2.
    But it’s not how you start, but how you finish, right Petey!?

    What would it be like if McVay came to Seattle to be the HC?

    • Tallyhawk

      Basically said this same thing to my dad the other day. Pete talks about how you finish and for the 2nd year in a row they have finished the season needing help after being well above .500 and in control of their own destiny. He also laments their ineffectiveness offensively on 3rd down as a reason they can’t establish the run or run as much as they want. Why doesn’t he talk about their inability to get off the field on 3rd down. This is also a huge reason they don’t get enough chances on offense. FFS it’s now a right of passage for opponents to have a 15 play 8 minute drive at least once if not more every game.

    • Rob Staton

      Great point

    • Blitzy the Clown

      Welcome to Pete Carroll’s Ames Room of pro football

    • cha

      Good one Big Mike.

      In a similar vein, this is the second consecutive year the team has started 6-3 and then stumbled down the stretch.

    • Sea Mode


  31. ShowMeYourHawk

    Pete’s comments about not having the proper RBs to adequately work the offense he’d like to essentially translate to me as “If I’m back as HC next season, we WILL be taking Braelon Allen with one of our 3rd round picks.”

  32. cha

    We talked a lot about the Seahawks using the press to send coded messages. Like in the ‘negotiations’ with Jadeveon Clowney in 2020 and the whole Russell Wilson saga.

    It feels like with all these word salads, bizarre excuses and insistences we’re not seeing what we’re seeing on the field, he is lobbying Jody Allen at times.

    Two seasons of “we have a really young team and that’s why we’re not playing well” when expensive veterans on the DL, Cody Barton at LB in his 4th year, the safeties and veteran retread centers tell a completely different story.

    The “devil you know is better than the devil you don’t” approach with Jamal Adams this year.

    The ‘Pete is such a great leader he takes the blame for all bad performances’ routine.

    And now a completely different tack…seemingly throwing their personnel choices at RB under the bus…I wonder if that was a slight swipe at John Schneider being given more draft control.

    Pete possibly had a mandate to do better or else. And he is trying to talk to Jody through the press as to why he isn’t doing better.

    • Big Mike

      And now a completely different tack…seemingly throwing their personnel choices at RB under the bus…I wonder if that was a slight swipe at John Schneider being given more draft control.

      I wouldn’t doubt it. His history of firing Coordinators coupled with now blaming payers tells me he’ll do anything to save his own skin and deflect any blame whatsoever. Makes me wonder if he’d throw his own mother under the bus were she alive.
      To me this stuff points to him fitting the label “slimy” quite well.

    • Big Mike

      Pete possibly had a mandate to do better or else. And he is trying to talk to Jody through the press as to why he isn’t doing better.

      You’re losing the fanbase Jody. I hope you can see that it’s not better and it can even be argued it’s worse. I hope you see through his bullshit and move on next week.

    • Rob Staton

      Someone should her send this article

    • Brodie

      Great points. Jody and the Court of Public Opinion.

      Also interesting that both John and Pete were much more ‘available’ in the media this year. Like they knew if this went to shit, one or both of them would be on the chopping block, so they had to step out of the comfort zone they’ve been in for so long and present their value-add in as public a way as possible.

  33. DK

    I just watched the 1st half of the interview and had to turn it off. The way Pete was talking sounded like any of us who don’t buy into everything he is saying, don’t know anything about football. Kind of feel like I need to take a shower after watching that interview.

    At one point Brock is sitting there cracking his knuckles or just fidgeting with his fingers and it made me think he wanted to call Pete out on all his BS, but knew he couldn’t.

    Pete Carroll did a great job of taking the Seahawks to a level of success we had all been dying for. But the game has passed him by. He wants to prove that his way is the best way no matter what and just having superior athletes, like he has at USC, is the way he can win.

    I’m all in for a change to the coaching staff, give Schneider a chance to build the roster based on what the new coach wants and let’s reset this thing for real this time.

    • Rob Staton

      It was painful and infuriating to listen to


    Joel Klatt was on Brock & Salk today (Thursday) and toward the end had a great story on Jim Harbaugh. It’s a great listen and well worth the time. After listening to it I really want him as the next Hawks coach.

  35. Simo

    I think it’s really unfortunate that Seattle has no full time owner. As we all know, Jodi Allen is just an acting owner, appointed only by the untimely death of her brother Paul. Acting owners usually do not have the team’s long-term interest as a high priority. She seems content to just ride things out until the team is sold and let Pete be someone else’s problem to deal with.

    Consequently, Pete appears to have unquestioned power, regardless of the team’s performance! There just isn’t anyone who holds him, and his staff, accountable for poor personnel decisions and repeated poor performance on the field. And “repeated” is a key word here, as we continue to see the same issues play out year after year!

    I hate the thought that we all may have to wait until 2025 (or whenever the team is sold) before we see the necessary changes this forum has been discussing for some time now.

    Maybe Rob can go on with Brock/Salk or Bumpus/Rost and express the views we talk about here? I’ve no doubt Rob can do it in a respectful manner while still highlighting the many concerns under Pete Carroll’s leadership!! Undoubtedly, your views will be met with resistance (vitriol perhaps) by some, but they need to be shared wider than just SDB!

    Thanks for all you and Curtis do Rob, always enjoyable reading your work!

  36. Ashish

    PC has lost even defending verbally. In fact his interview says it all, how poorly the team has been coached. I want them to lose against Arizona so we don’t get into playoffs and all issues go under the rug.

  37. Pran

    Pete is just like most of the players on LOB era defense who just could not agree that they are past their prime or cant let go off SB49.

    • UkAlex6674

      Most of Seahawkdom is just like most of the players on LOB era defense who just cant let go of SB49.

  38. Blitzy the Clown

    Does anyone know if Pete was involved in the selection of his GM? The announcement of his hire preceded Schneider’s by a week.

    Just trying to get a sense of the history of their power sharing dynamic.

    Let’s remember where Schneider comes from. He’s a scout. That’s what he did at first for Green Bay before becoming personnel director for a few teams, including Seattle. In fact, the year he served as our director of player personnel under Mike Holmgren/Ted Thompson, Seattle drafted RB Shaun Alexander, who also isn’t a Marshawn Lynch type runner.

    To the extent there’s disconnect between the types of prospects Seattle are drafting under Schneider, and how they’re being coached/utilized by Carroll, I want to see the former unburdened by the latter. And let’s maybe let Schneider have input on who they choose.

    • Peter

      Interesting nugget from wikipedia:

      In his role he oversees ALL aspects of the roster and draft process working collaboratively with Pete Carrol on football operations.

    • geoff u

      Pete selected the GM. He was given full control from the start.

  39. Tomas

    You’re spot-on, Rob. Though less blameworthy than Pete, I believe JS needs the heave-ho as well. Though Carroll apparently wields more power, John’s fingerprints are all over this mess. Like Pete, he’s coasting. Unfortunately, I see no reason to believe Jody will do anything. The team is once again in the playoff hunt, and Pete remains, to all appearances, vibrant and energetic. God help us, I sense she’s more likely to extend Pete than fire him.

    I’m convinced the Seahawks first pick will not be a QB, but rather a defensive player because Pete is once again humiliated by his “defense” – tough on his ego. The disastrous Adam’s acquisition occurred right after the Bills had torched the Hawks “defense,” a desperate move intended to quickly remove the egg from Pete’s face.

    So long as they don’t become the Orlando Seahawks, I’ll persevere, keep enjoying this blog, and hold on until bluer skies return.

  40. Adam P. Boyd

    Spot on, Rob. I can’t take any more of this garbage. Something needs to be done, and I don’t simply mean firing Clint Hurt and asking Tater for advice. Enough is enough.

  41. Palatypus

    I think there is a 3 missing on this kid’s jersey.

    • ShowMeYourHawk

      But… Woolen wears #27. Besides, the kid wasn’t hurt on the play.

      • Palatypus

        Speaking of being hurt. I’m seeing on Twitter that Jordan Travis has accepted an invitation to the Shrine Bowl. He can’t possibly be playing, can he? He had surgery on November 28, so that would be exactly two months.

        • Peter

          I’m tearing up over here.

        • cha

          Well technically it says “attend” the Shrine Bowl in the body of the tweet.

          • Palatypus

            I love how the game that nobody cares about is held in the Death Star in Las Vegas and the Senior Bowl is in a little tiny facility. Hancock Whitney Stadium is cool though.

            Probably, good for Jordan to talk to NFL scouts and not be overshadowed by Spencer Rattler and company.

            • BK26

              Probably saw what it did for Hooker last year. Smart of him.

  42. Rob Staton

    I’m going to change the WordPress theme today to a temporary alternative

    The current images and graphics have broken

    Let me know what you think of the change. It will be basic

    • Sea Mode

      Will do.

    • EveryoneSays

      As a Seahawk fan since January of 2014, I cannot accept change.

    • Parallax

      Not a fan of the change. Don’t think it provides a date for when you post a new thread. About a quarter of the screen is wasted. Feels clunky too.

      Would be great if there were a way to edit our comments. Also would be great if there were an option for notifications when someone replies. I don’t know if you’d want an option to upvote others but I think we all like getting those pats on the back. That said, I wouldn’t want a down-vote option, as it can lead to hurt feelings and even flame wars.

  43. Peter

    Weird times taking a spin around the hawks universe where we are forever stick between bargaining and acceptance.

    Now I’m seeing a lot of folks that say maybe Geno isn’t the best but he’s not the problem.

    Coupled with still a few talking about him as a bright spot of the year.

    Got to be blunt here. If Geno had thrown 10-12 more tds this year like he did last year I think there would be a very compelling argument for that viewpoint. 10 more tds at 70 extra points ( extra points included ) divided evenly over all games still means we get our butts whooped a few times but also pushes us over the rams once and barely over the bengals.

    10-6 today with a chance to beat AZ and be the 6th seed…it’s not amazing but its a small but noticeable improvement and you could feel. like we are going somewhere.

    There are 17 qbs plus kirk cousins that put up the same or more points in the air. And a good deal of them we wouldn’t want on this team.

    • Matt

      Great post but I want to rebut/add context on one piece for the Geno thing…even if he threw up a similar year to last; it still doesn’t change the fact he will be entering his 34 year old season.

      Geno really does serve as a microcosm if this team. Decent, not great. No real room for improvement but big potential for regression. Ultimately, not bad enough to warrant massive change although massive change is needed because we really are in purgatory, in almost every sense. We are the Nilla wafer at the Potluck. Nobody is grossed out by us, but nobody is eagerly awaiting to swoop us up from the party bowl. We are empty calories.

      • Peter

        The Nilla wafer….so good😀.

        I think age is a real concern. Already picked up a couple dings and that gets worse as we get older.

        I’m team new qb all the way.

        Be careful what you wish for and all that. It’s not really how I’m wired as a fan. He had a good year with a stable and generally unspectacular oline. Then he regressed. The variables necessary to make Geno great are so basic that they include every qb. Better oline, better running game, better oc. Thus where as some fans think “just pay him and get better everywhere else,” I think a lot of us think “or, save all that money if possible and give more chances to get better for the next qb as quick as possible.”

        • Parallax

          Call me nuts but I’m still frustrated the Lock never got much of a chance. I know his decision making hasn’t been historically good but that’s the kind of thing that can improve with experience and good coaching. He has all the physical tools to be elite. Why did Pete and John insist on his inclusion in the Wilson trade if they weren’t going to trust him? Much higher ceiling than Geno.

    • Palatypus

      Peter said,

      Now I’m seeing a lot of folks that say maybe Geno isn’t the best but he’s not the problem.

      That was Mina Kimes, almost word for word.

      • Peter

        Checks out. Most online hawks fans think if they like enough of her tweets they might get a special night out at daniels broiler or rays boathouse with her.

        • Palatypus

          She just had a baby with her husband.

          • Peter

            Sure. And I don’t think what I said is true, true.

            I do think there’s a lot of folks commenting online that hear their favorites and then spit it back out like it’s gospel.

            Also. Rays boathouse. Too romantic?

            • Palatypus


              • Peter

                Great minds!

                • Parallax

                  Sizzler? In and Out Burger?

  44. BSLBobby

    I listened to the Pete Carroll Show live and I was losing my mind. Not even basic follow up questions from Brock or Salk and they even offered him a few excuses in the questions they asked. What a bunch of ball washers.

    I didn’t even think of the Cincy matchup escaping Pete’s purview but if stopping the explosive pass plays of a 3rd string QB is your idiotic game plan, HOW DID YOU STILL GIVE UP 5 such plays??!!

    The other moment was talking about the inside kick and Pete’s reasoning that either going for the touchback or the onside, they still needed 3 stops so he just wanted the chance at possession….. SO THE CLOCK DIDN’T FACTOR INTO HIS DECISION AT ALL. You had two timeouts and pissed away a free stoppage at the 2 minute warning on the lowest probable play in the NFL.

    At least some folks on KJR are holding his feet to the fire, but there’s plenty of soft homers there too. Please Rob, keep up your radio spots. Someone needs to keep injecting facts and taking down these false narratives so easily swallowed by the city collectively stuck in 1995/2001 and 2013.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m up for any radio slot, any time 👍🏻

      • metal beard

        Rob, you were brought up multiple times today by Puck on KJR. He mentioned he was going to have you on late next week after the Husky aftermath had died down. Puck seems to be in on your thoughts on the team. It was fun to hear your points being brought up. Now if we can just get a segment with you and Millen to go really hardcore :p

        • Rob Staton

          That’s cool — I love going on the radio with those guys

  45. Dustin

    Nice new look to the site 👍

  46. Brett

    Looks really good 👍🏼👍🏼

  47. Big Mike

    Simms telling it like it is at 26:53
    The local media may be sycophants or at least tread lightly, but Simms sees it for exactly what it is.

    • Peter

      Heard that. Simms is basically laughing at us, our scheme, and our coach.

    • cha

      I find it really odd that Simms can smell what Pete is shoveling out a mile away, and in Seattle-land there’s this false flag strawman thing going around that ‘hey Geno isn’t so bad, let’s look at the defense here’ so badly they cannot focus on the points Rob made in the article.

      • Wilson502

        It’s a cultural issue within Seattle in general. You see this same attitude prevail with the Mariners, local media, and just the general attitude of the region. People here tend to be notoriously soft and passive. It’s one of the infuriating things about living in the PNW. At least people back east are up front and honest with you and are generally more assertive.

  48. Peter


    I think this looks nice and crisp.

    I use mobile mostly but it’s coming through very clean. My only wish is on my viewing it’s just a bit tricky to parse on first viewing if a comment is a standalone or a reply to an existing.

    • Big Mike

      Agree. If there’s any way to have to replies moved a bit to the right or some such it might be helpful. Otherwise looks fine on a PC too.

    • Rob Staton

      It’s a really basic wordpress design but it looks soooooo much better on a phone.

      The comments section on WP has always been terrible and I’m not sure this format is that good. I will see what options there are.

      The old look was horrendous and it needed updating (it was mentioned on the radio today) so I thought I would play around with things and find something, for now, that fits

      • Big Mike

        Definitely appreciate the effort as always.

      • cha

        Wait, you were on the radio today?

        • Rob Staton

          No — they mentioned the latest post and were very complimentary of everything we do… but mentioned the site design is awful 😂 and they are 100% correct. I am just about the worst person in the world to try and fix it but I had a go.

          • Peter

            Puck and Jim again? Will listen later even if you’re not on.

            • Rob Staton

              Yep — they gave a nice shout-out which is really appreciated

  49. cha

    Different look is fine. Clean.

    The HOT TOPICS being on the left is breaking my brain a little, but I’ll adjust.

    Looks good on mobile as well as desktop.

    I would miss the current comments aggregator.

    And you’d probably want your twitter/X handle on the bar on the left to make sure you’re known there/here.

    • Rob Staton

      I hate the new comments layout. The old one sucked too but was still better than this.

      Sadly this is just the style. Aaaaargh.

      But the blog looks good on a phone at least.

      • cha

        I do like the Previous and Next links at the bottom of each post.

    • BK26

      I agree on missing the newest comments section.

      Thought my computer was crashing at first or that the internet wasn’t working! Too used to looking at the old layout the entire day!

  50. JJ

    My 2 cents, but on the phone it works so much better. I don’t have to keep resizing to read.

    • Rob Staton

      It’s way better on the phone isn’t it?

      Not 100% sold on the desktop but that’s because it looks very generic IMO and the comments are harder to follow

      • geoff u

        Can only use my phone right now so can’t test the desktop, but it looks great so far!

      • Peter

        Phone rules. Seriously. I can finally see what I’m typing so now if I can’t spell I guess it’s on me….

  51. Peter

    I know everyone wants a like button. It I kind of like that you need to take a moment of your time to reply.

    However. Does anyone know if there’s a plug in where you can log in once and then never have to log in again?

    • Rob Staton

      However. Does anyone know if there’s a plug in where you can log in once and then never have to log in again?

      I’ve adjusted the settings and it might’ve fixed this?

      • Peter


        • Anonymous

          And the test

          • Peter

            So….you still need to enter your name.

            No biggie.

            I only care during server 404 season and when they traded wilson.

            • Palatypus

              Server 404 is the worst server at Hooters.

  52. Mr. Drucker in hooterville

    looks good on both. Phone better. I like it. Still wish there was an edit feature for my fatt fingrs.

  53. Palatypus

    This will make it a lot easier to give you guys updates at Senior Bowl practice.

    • BK26

      Not going to lie, you mentioning how close it’s getting yesterday got me more excited than anything the team has done in the last month.

      I’m glad the changes are going to help you when you’re there 👍

      • Palatypus

        Yeah, I’ve got some planning to do. Probably gonna buy a cheap camera at a pawn shop that I don’t care if it gets stolen and just leave it on a tripod at one end zone.

  54. ShowMeYourHawk

    Holy website, Batman! 😵‍💫

    It’ll take some getting used to but looking good!

  55. Group Captain Mandrake

    I like the basic look of the site on my laptop (haven’t tested it on my phone yet). I wish the section on the left in black was narrower – it takes up too much space on my browser window. As some other have said, it is hard to tell if comments are new or a reply to someone else, but zooming out helps that a little bit. It’s not ideal if you can’t read small text though. Let me know if you need help with the layout, Rob. UX/UI is a small part of what I do for my job.

  56. Samprassultanofswat

    To be honest I can’t stand to listen to Pete Carroll anymore. The only thing that isn’t B.S. is the injury report. Otherwise I am not interested in anything he has to say.

  57. Nathan Fendall

    New site looks great on the phone, but it will take some getting used to on desktop with the comments being a lot bigger than I would prefer. Overall it is a nice clean look though.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m trying to get an alternative situation sorted, which will address the comments issue

  58. Charles

    Hi am Charles I am a recovering Pete apologist. Never tell me the odds, the facts are always unclear and always run it up the middle! I have really enjoyed the Pete Carroll era from beginning and even till now. The oracle said it best in The Matrix,”Everything that has a beginning has an end”. It is time for another voice. I would like to add that the talent of the Seahawks is great and just needs to have the correct structure in place to tap into their enormous abilities. Relationships matter as well as holding grown ass men accountable! Teach, develop and build! The 2010 49ers were very talented and underachieving until Jim Harbaugh took over. Harbaugh had mainly the same roster and took a team from Singletary at 6-10 in 2010 to a team that was 13-3 in 2011 losing in the conference championship. If the Seahawks keep the current coaching structure, similar results will occur! A business might not make change until the bottom line begins showing a reduction from prior years. The goal is to make money and to better than last year! A good litmus test might be accounted for in attendance. Looking at ESPN attendance tracker, the hawks are sold out every game this year for home games and they dip down to 99.5 capacity two times since the 2013 season.

    Yikes. I was hoping for a dip the last 2 years!!! Possible reason for not taking the reins from Pete? This Home game attendance does not pass the eye test however: from a business perspective it is not a very good look when season ticket holders are selling their tickets to other teams fans. Terrible towels at Lumen field are terrible and hopefully being discussed during the financials at the board meetings. The bottom line that can be gleaned is the fan base rather be doing something else with their time and money. The fan base is decreasing!!! How Will this affect future ticket sales, merchandise and advertising? The terrible towels could be the start of the end and that would be wonderful!!

    Change is good and here is to a new year!

    • Cysco

      People still eat at Olive Garden. Doesn’t mean it’s good food.

  59. Charles

    Nice upgrade to the site! Not sure how it is done…. It would be wonderful to have a sorting option in the comments by date, user etc. Thank you for this wonderful blog and the ability to be part of thought out discussions.

  60. 12th chuck

    love the new site, thanks for all the effort and time you put into SDB

  61. Sultan

    Love the new look.

  62. bmseattle

    New site looks great.
    However, I hate that there isn’t a “recent comments” section, anymore.
    that was always the first place I’d go to, to see the latest comments.
    Now, comments get lost if they are in response to something that isn’t at the bottom of the comment section.

    • swedenhawk


  63. Palatypus

    Don’t know how I missed this, but Bo Nix has accepted a Senior Bowl invite.

    That makes four of the six quarterbacks Spencer Rattler, Bo Nix, Joe Milton III, and Michael Pratt.

    • BK26

      Man I forget about Milton. But then again, after the bowl game, so have Tennessee fans.

      Cheers to the guys who said that he would be better than Richardson last year too.

      • Palatypus

        I’m guessing Cam Ward will end up there after announcing he is entering the NFL Draft. I guess after D.J. Uiagalelei bolted for Florida State with the Travis Jordan vacancy, he will get an opportunity to show his skills. But Nagy might be waiting on Penix.

  64. Palatypus

    You know, the site looks fantastic, but I think it needs a new banner.

    • 509 Chris

      The Grahm trade wouldn’t sting so much if they’d have ever found a replacement for Unger. That line wasn’t anywhere near what the o line was in the 05 season but they got the job done and could never be accused of being soft up the middle.

  65. Luís Guilherme

    Love the new design, Rob, much lighter and better on the phone.

    I think you’re right on the first part, if you take what Pete said at face value. But one should never do that. Pete doesn’t lie outright, but he uses half truths quite a bit.

    My best effort translating it is:

    “Gosh, I’m old, but I still watch tape and know defense. The Steelers run game is very predictable and we could tell from the snap all the right run fits. And so we did. I wouldn’t expect those darned kids to put so little effort tackling and being carried for 4, 5 yards after initiating contact. See, we weren’t actually afraid of their pass game, and we schemed well against their run game. But if the kids won’t tackle, that becomes hard, you know? So I loaded the box in the second half, to save face a little, and then Pickens who’s a talented receiver won his one on ones more often than not”

    Of course Pete won’t say exactly that, and there was not much he could do (except load the box). I’m pretty sure that if Bellore was healthy, Bush would be benched for him. And if both Tre Brown and Witherspoon weren’t on a snap count, Woolen would have been benched again. And if there was any depth behind Love (who to his merit was surprised he was chosen as a pro bowler), he would have seen his snaps reduced.

    But it is what it is. I still think that Hurtt is a good assistant, but like KNJ before him, he felt victim to the Peter Principle.

    • Rob Staton

      The thing is Luis — you can only react to what Pete says publicly. We can all speculate on what his actual intentions are with his words but we can never truly know intentions. There’s as much chance Pete was simply being honest, as there is this was all some great cover for a bunch of players who let him down.

      And if this was all a cover, what a hopeless attempt at it. If he’d just come out and said — ‘we need to tackle better, everyone can see that was the issue, it’s something we are working urgently to fix’ — there’d be no complaints from anyone and it’s hardly throwing players under the bus.

      So even if he’s attempting to mask the truth, it’s a bloody useless attempt at that.

  66. Sultan

    Love the new site design. Comment section will take getting used to

  67. Old but Slow

    I like the new format. It is easier to read (I’m 80).

    As this is a draft blog…what is our draft position in the first if we win/lose with Arizona?

    • Luis Guilherme

      This site is good, straight to the point and accurate:

      Right now, we’re at #15. A win can take us to the playoffs if Green Bay loses and then it depends on when we lose (#19-#32).

      If we lose, the highest we can go is #13 (as we have a better strength of schedule than all 7-9 teams, so even if they win and we lose, they pick before us.

  68. 509 Chris

    I don’t like the new site at all. Mostly I cant scroll out as far and I feel like it takes me longer to read or find an older spot in the thread. Just my opinion, I hope you get whatever the issues are sorted out without too much fuss.

    I want to call out some of our own around here for a second. I despise blond optimism, but some folks have gone the opposite way to being unrealistically pessimistic. For example I’ve heard a few times people say they’re sure that Pete will go defense and pass on qb in the 1st round. There is no evidence whatsoever to support that. To say well they’ve never drafted a qb early in the past so they wont now is just flat wrong. People said pc doesn’t take corners early either and he took one at 5 last year.
    Speaking of Pete, to say we’re positive that he’ll be back next year also has no bearing other than thats how its gone in the past. Things are different now, and just because Jodi isn’t vocal in the media doesn’t mean she’s asleep at the wheel. There’s just as much subjective and circumstantial evidence out there to say she’ll ask him to step down as there is that she’ll give him another go. For all we know that decision has been made and they’re just waiting for the season to end to announce. Maybe she wanted to move him last year but her preferred candidate wasn’t ready to take the job, similar to rumors that P Allen wanted Carroll and settled for Mora until he was ready.

    Unless we are hearing things from sources who are actually close to the team (which we have when smoke went up about Carroll leaving) I think it’s best to stay open minded to different possibilities, both positive and negative. If you like wallowing in assured seahawks misery so be it. My opinion is worth what you payed for it.

  69. Rob Staton

    A quick update…

    As you can see — and some of you have been discussing — the site has a new look. This is a temporary fix, because the old theme was crashing and was hopelessly outdated.

    I am in the process of finding an alternative solution which will create an even better, newer look for the site — which will also produce a different comments section that makes it easier to reply/understand when a comment is new or a reply.

    Apologies for any inconvenience (but at least the site is now easier to read on a mobile device). I just ask for a bit of patience as we sort through the changes.

    • Mick

      Rob, this is a lot of work and trouble that you are in for. No need for apologies, take your time and if we live with Pete as head coach we can also live with a little more difficult way of reading articles and writing comments.

  70. Rob B (L80)

    I’m just curious of what Allen would think if we the fans barraged her with all of the things listed above. She can’t be turning a blind eye to this can she?

    Please let this year end now, one more meaningless loss in the “playoffs” is not how I want to end this year.

    Pittsburg running game?…#1 in the NFL in runs after contact.
    AZ. is #4….We’ve seen the ladies in Hawks uni’s running around tackling nobody, what do you think is going to happen here?….These players are playing for their careers and are acting like the opposition has Covid.

    PLEASE let it end Sunday and get the playoffs out of the way so HOPEFULLY the non existant owner can hopefully do the right thing.

    Just imagine Allen getting THOUSANDS of letters regarding this.

    • Cysco

      Jody isn’t getting letters from anyone. How would she. She’s completely anonymous to the fans. Heck, if you found her purse on a bench, I bet you couldn’t figure out how to return it to her.

      Our only hope is that there is a team of people that are monitoring public sentiment and reporting up to John and Jody. And even then, we need to hope that she is willing to do something despite the upcoming sale of the team.

      It’s a mess. The resolution of the whole team sale stuff can’t come soon enough. The entire franchise is in limbo right now and desperately needs a figurehead and decision maker at the helm. (Regardless of who it is. I’m looking at you Bezos)

  71. DK

    Just read a great article over on the athletic about how hiring a defensive coach this cycle might be the way to go.

    The jist was Offensive hires get at least another chance if they hire the wrong DC. On the flip side defensive hires pretty much are done if the make a poor OC hire.

    Dan Quinn was listed and the biggest take away I got from his write up was his willingness to get away from the Cover 3 he ran u see Pete Carroll and took with him to Atlanta.

    If Carroll is not retained, I am not opposed to bringing in a defensive head coach, Mike McDonald from Baltimore would be my top choice. But where does that coach look for an OC?

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