Thoughts as the Seahawks workout Ballage, Kirk & Allen

Ten days before the 2017 draft, the Seahawks worked out Malik McDowell and Obi Melifonwu. They took McDowell with their first pick.

This doesn’t mean the Seahawks are definitely going to draft one (or more) or Christian Kirk, Kalen Ballage and Kyle Allen. It’s interesting though.

They didn’t just workout Allen in Arizona either. He then made his way to Seattle for an official visit…

There’s suddenly a buzz around Allen. A former five-star recruit, his career at Texas A&M collapsed when he and others stopped seeing eye-to-eye with Kevin Sumlin. He transferred to Houston where he was benched after six games.

College career over.

He’s always had physical talent. It just hasn’t been unwrapped. He’s someone we’ll need to look at over the next few days. Clearly the Seahawks have seen something in him. He could be a late rounder or priority UDFA competing to be this years backup.

Today I wanted to focus on Kirk and Ballage.

Firstly, it shouldn’t be a major surprise if the Seahawks take both. Kirk fits the ‘all football’ style they’re looking for. He’s athletic, fits their profile at receiver and is a big play specialist. He offers special teams value and could be a compliment to Tyler Lockett or a future replacement (Lockett’s contract expires at the end of the season).

In terms of physical profile and personality, he’s the kind of player they’re looking to add. He’s probably one of the ‘safer’ prospects in the draft (if such a thing exists).

Equally Ballage fits their profile at running back. He’s 6-1 and 228lbs. He jumped a 37 inch vertical at his pro-day. He also had a 10-2 broad jump at the combine, a 4.46 forty and a 6.91 three cone.

If draft grades were based on looking the part, Ballage would be top-five.

He also had a terrific Senior Bowl. In the catching drills he looked like a natural receiver. He excelled all week in practise and during the game he delivered some of the hard running he’s occasionally flashed in college. He had a great week.

Ballage is also expected to be available at the end of day two or even day three. So theoretically, targeting him would allow the Seahawks to take a player like Christian Kirk with their first pick and still address the running back need.

If they want both players, they should be able to find a way to make it happen.

It’d be a logical plan. If the Seahawks are going to use an offense similar to ‘Air Coryell’ next season, Kirk’s ability to stretch the field would be a huge positive. He’s also adept at disappearing at the second level and becoming ‘invisible’. In the scramble drill this is vital and Kirk made plenty of big plays finding space and providing a target when the initial play broke down.

We discussed Kirk as a player in more detail here.

Ballage fits their profile at running back. We’ve often talked about Seattle having a body type at the position. Ballage ticks every box — height, weight, explosive traits. He’s also a pass-catching weapon and he plays, at times, with real aggression.

He’s always had massive potential. In September 2016 I wrote this piece highlighting him as a player to monitor:

Physicality, effectiveness, speed, size. This guy is intriguing.

His character and personality is even more impressive… Character is big for the Seahawks. So is difference making physical qualities. If Ballage continues to produce, he could be a name to keep an eye on.

Ballage made this play during the 2016 season:

Watch him on the right day and he looks terrific.

Sadly, that’s the point I want to come on to now.

Seattle’s current group of running backs don’t lack potential or upside. Chris Carson and C.J. Prosise are both fantastic athletes and had some flashes in college.

The problem with both is they just haven’t been reliable.

Carson played four games in 2017 before getting injured. In 2016 while playing for Oklahoma State he had only 82 carries. In 2015 he was a bit-part player.

Prosise has had two injury plagued seasons as a pro. Some of his injuries haven’t been overly serious leading to questions about his ability to tough it out. Is he ever going to make it through a regular season? It’s hard to have any confidence there.

Two players with major promise but for one reason or another, just haven’t been able to pair consistent production with good health.

Ballage, to be frank, would provide more of the same. Major athletic promise and a player with everything you want in a running back physically. Yet his production has been so inconsistent. I’ve watched him live in person and on TV. More often than not you’re left wanting more.

He was never the feature back at Arizona State. He was always destined for big things but never actually delivered.

His college career was underwhelming.

There are other runners in this strong RB draft that have been able to produce consistently. It doesn’t guarantee they’ll come into the league, stay healthy and become Seattle’s feature runner. At least they’ve shown they’re capable of doing it.

Ballage might succeed where Prosise and Carson (so far) haven’t. It’d also be wrong to accuse Prosise and Carson of being bad players. They’re not. When available they’ve flashed. Availability and consistency, though, is where they’ve been lacking.

Will Kirk and Ballage help the Seahawks turn back into a run-first, dominant, aggressive offense? Will they help ‘fix the run’?

The jury’s out there. Although it’s very possible they wouldn’t be relying on Ballage to be the answer at running back. They took three running backs in 2016. They could take multiple backs this year. The class is good enough to justify it.

They also have a number of different needs to fill and a limited number of picks to get the job done.

Both Kirk and Ballage have potential and talent. The Seahawks are not afraid to draft for potential and trust their coaches to get the best out of a player.

Yet this would feel like a continuation of the way they’ve done things for a while now. You couldn’t accuse the Seahawks of focusing too much on a hard-nosed, physical approach on offense. The Jimmy Graham trade, the addition of smaller, quicker receivers. The over-reliance on Russell Wilson and the collapse of the running game.

For two years they’ve been finesse. And as good as Kirk and Ballage could eventually be, we’re talking about a stretch-the-field deep threat and an athlete playing running back whose best characteristic might be his ability in the passing game.

A year ago we talked about Malik McDowell with trepidation. He was visiting Seattle, he had talent. You could see him becoming a Seahawk even if personally I didn’t expect it and doubted it. I was wrong, they took him and it didn’t work.

There aren’t any character concerns with Kirk and Ballage. They’re the complete opposite to McDowell in that regard. We’ll see if this information is anything more than interest. It’s worth taking seriously though if both Pete Carroll and John Schneider were present at the workout session.

They’ve also met or are meeting with Ronald Jones II, Josh Sweat, Maurice Hurst, Leighton Vander Esch, Justin Reid, Dallas Goedert and others. It’s possible both Carroll and Schneider were present at those meetings too.

We need to keep Kirk, Ballage and Allen in our minds though. They could easily be an early round, mid round and late round pickup in two weeks.

You can now support Seahawks Draft Blog via Patreon by clicking the tab below.

Become a Patron!


  1. j

    Keep coming back to Darrell Williams at RB. Improved his time to 4.65 at pro-day and really impressed in the drills. Think he could be a Spencer Ware type late – maybe as a second drafted running back.

    • Hoff


  2. GerryG


    Is Ballage a hedge in case the top dogs go early? Or if they have another player/need they may need to address before RB?

    I agree with your assessment Rob, I dont want a RB that wasnt a proven commodity every game.

    • Rob Staton

      Could be a hedge. Could be the guy Carroll has his eye on. Might think he has the upside potential and attitude to turn into a star. He also fits their size profile.

      But yeah, he looks like the next Prosise, Carson. Has all the potential in the world but when’s it ever going to come together?

      Sometimes you just want someone who’s shown they run hard, consistently produce and make explosive plays. Week after week.

      • HawksBill

        It looked like ASU used a 3-headed running attack that included the QB. This could explain the lower than average production. And more tread left on the tires is always good for a RB.

        • drewdawg11

          That’s because he wasn’t the best player, just the most physically gifted. He would have a breakout game against a terrible defense like Texas Tech, then vanish in conference play for weeks. He’s not the most instinctive runner. Also on Allen: I had a chance to watch him play twice in his senior year when I moved to AZ. He was actually teammates with Mark Andrews, the TE at Oklahoma. They were a talented team, but Allen seemed to be lacking something. When they faced a tougher squad, he was mortal. He went to TAMU and played as a true frosh, he left after being passed up. At Houston… there is a pattern here of him never living up to the hype. He was’s number 1 QB in his class, and he didn’t look the part when I watched him. I don’t see the point of taking guys who never cut it before becoming a pro. Kirk is a really interesting player, but for me, we would have to acquire more picks to justify taking him.

      • Jason

        Rob, you could also say the next Michael in addition to Prosise and Carson. It seems like they continue looking for magic in a bottle, but ignore the red flags we keep seeing in these prospects.

        • Rob Staton

          Very true re: Michael

      • Drew

        Where do you see Ballage going, 4th, 5th? I wouldn’t mind him in the 5th if we get one of the top backs early.

        • Rob Staton

          4th I think

      • GerryG

        “Has all the potential in the world but when’s it ever going to come together?”

        This has been a recurring theme among many of the players drafted over the years.

    • j

      Or maybe they aren’t as interested in the top RB (rightly or wrongly) as we believe. I think it is a real possibility we don’t draft RB until the mid rounds and they have other needs (pass rush, TE, WR) prioritized.

      • FuzzyLogic

        Very true

  3. Comfect

    I wonder if Ballage is a target for a 2016-like multiple RB draft. I know you gesture to this in your post, Rob, but he kind of feels like Prosise in that he’s likely good in the passing game but more flashy than consistent–but if they also took a Nick Chubb or a Ronald Jones II he could be a very interesting complement, just as Prosise seems to have been drafted to be.

  4. House

    Seahawks just signed CB Dontae Johnson. Started 16 games for SF last season

    • Drew

      Not a bad pickup as I assume its for cheap. I wanted them to draft him, he’s got the size they look for.

    • 80SLargent

      He mostly fits the profile Carroll looks for, but 31.5″ arms at his combine. He’s not bad if you want a CB who makes every QB look like Tom Brady. Hopefully he didn’t cost that much and maybe Carroll can coach him up.

      • Jason

        He can also play safety.

        • 80SLargent

          Where are you getting that? He’s never played safety in the NFL. There’s nothing that says he played safety in college. While Carroll seems to love “conversion projects”, it’s 100% guaranteed they didn’t sign Johnson to play safety.

    • Trevor

      Wonder if this means maxi won’t be back? Sounds like they made a take or leave it offer then moved to plan B.

      • Mark Souza


        • Greg Haugsven

          Im sure he got that take it or leave it offer. Im willing to bet he will resign at some point in time.

          • 80SLargent

            I sure hope so, because at this point, I’d rather have Neiko Thorpe start than Dontae Johnson. Johnson makes Cary Williams look like Deion Sanders. As one can tell, I’m not super crazy about the Johnson signing. If he’s any more than a camp body along the lines of Stanley Jean-Baptiste or Mohammed Seisay, then they’re in deep ****.

            • Tecmo Bowl

              Dang Largent youre not a Dontae Johnson fan! Haha. Would way rather have Maxi back, but it looks like we’re going another direction. Johnson ain’t Cary Williams bad…we’ve yet to see the contract #’s. He did start 16 games last year in basically the same defensive system. We’ll get a CB in the draft. Holton Hill is visiting today. Like him a lot!

              • 80SLargent

                Last season, both Football Outsiders and Pro Football Focus had Johnson as one of the very worst CBs in the entire NFL. It’s a virtual guarantee that 49ers fans everywhere are laughing their hindparts off at this. If this is our answer to cutting Sherman, then color me not impressed.
                At least Cary Williams was at one point a solid starter on a Super Bowl winning Baltimore Ravens team. Johnson has never been remotely close to being an effective starter. The only saving grace for signing Johnson is, it’s a certainty they didn’t drop 3 years and $18M on him like they did with Williams.
                I’d be pretty comfortable with re-signing Maxwell and drafting CB, basically anything that doesn’t involve Johnson as one of Seattle’s starting CBs. Like I said, camp body with some athletic upside on a hopefully veteran minimum deal.

                • Kenny Sloth

                  Good thing we’re not the 49ers and have one of the best secondary coaches of all time to work with him huh

                  Let them laugh. Pay Jimmy and Richard. Keep drafting DL.

                  Hire a guy out the booth to run your franchise.

                  We got our methodology

                  Don’t need to compare ourselves to cellar dwellers. Not sure who from the 9ers wouldn’t look better on the seahawks. That was a rotten team for most of the year

  5. HawksBill

    I wonder if the new rule penalizing players from lowering their head at contact will help out the taller, upright running RB’s like Ballage.

    Not taking as many helmet shots to the knees and ribs might help production if not avoiding bad injuries.

    • Lewis

      I’m waiting for them to start penalizing RBs for lowering their heads. Then we will know they are serious. RBs in the open field (outside tackles I think) were specifically excluded from the crown of the helmet rule before, but there is no exception with the new rule, which applies to any player, anywhere on the field.

  6. Josh Emmett

    Lots of possibilities! Check out 3sigma athlete for the pro day results for the non combine prospects. They have recently been added. Always fun because those top testers tend to end up as the undrafted players, the Seahawks always seem to get their fair share of them

  7. Nick

    I understand your trepidation around Ballage, Rob. However, this could be them looking at a 225+ back that will be available later in the draft…if they don’t get “that” type earlier. It could be similar to them looking at Ito Smith.

    For example: they could go Chubb & Smith.

    But let’s say they go for RoJo. They then they probably want a bigger back like Ballage.

    • drewdawg11

      Drafting a bigger back only helps you if said back actually PLAYS like a bigger back. He’s too much finesse to be a big back in the NFL.

      • Nick

        Agreed, but they might just not like Bo Scarborough all that much. Apart from him, no real big back that is going to be drafted in that area.

        • drewdawg11

          Then that just means that you don’t draft one for the sake of drafting one, I believe. I think in a limited role he would be fine. I just wonder if our limited draft capital could be spent elsewhere. I watched Ballage and wondered why he couldn’t play at a higher level, but it is obvious he’s talented.

          • peter

            Agreed with your points. You are not the bigger back if RoJo plays bigger than you.

            • drewdawg11


            • Lewis

              Just watched a couple of games and I don’t think RoJo plays bigger than him. He looks pretty good to me, but he has a tendency to dance too much, which may be what you are referring to. When he is more decisive he looks plenty big to me.

  8. Simo

    Anyone know much about Kyle Allen? Is he a possible option for our backup QB spot? Seventh rounder or perhaps an UDFA?

  9. Michigan 12th

    This could also just be JS/PC testing to see what the difference is in a Chubb vs. a Ballage. Is there enough there to work with Ballage and take later than to take Chubb early. Can they afford to pass up Chubb knowing they can draft Ballage later and not lose out on coachable talent, so they can draft another position first. I suspect that’s what they did here. The front office knows what the top runners our, everyone does, they are just seeing how much of a drop talent wise is there with say a Ballage. I’m surprised they have not done the same thing with Freeman or Penny, but maybe they already know what they would get with them as well.

    • Michigan 12th

      “are” not our. I should read these things before I post.

    • Hoff

      If people are underwhelmed by the way Ballage doesn’t use his physicality consistently, they’ll be angry if Freeman is the pick. I’m a die-hard Duck and I was amazed at how easily he went to the ground and didn’t finish his runs. There were times when he looked like he was avoiding contact at the cost of gaining extra yards.

      • Michigan 12th

        Yeah I like the Ducks a lot as well and always felt the same way about Freeman. I have thought for a while that LaMichael James was the better back in college, but he did not do to much in the pros. I miss the Ducks being serious contenders. Is Mario Cristoball really he next head coach at Oregon? I really hope not.

        • Tecmo Bowl

          The 49ers ruined LaMichael James.

          • Ben Rives

            Ricardo Lockett ruined LaMicheal James. Water boy style. Damn near took his head off.

      • DCD2

        Ditto Hoff.

        He’s a lot like Shaun Alexander in that regard. He’s not going to seek out contact and will often make “business decisions” in regards to the extra yardage. Part of that style is also why he had such a long career with only a couple of missed games in 4 years.

        I will say, he seems to get after it at the goal line. I love Royce, but I don’t think he’s necessarily a great fit for us at the moment. He’ll usually get what’s blocked, but doesn’t make much on his own. Based on our recent line play, we might need a different type of RB. If I had more faith in our line, I’d be perfectly happy with him.

        If we did go with Wynn/Hernandez as our 1st pick, and missed out on the top 5 RB’s, he’d be a good fallback. Brown/Wynn/Britt/Fluker/Ifedi could probably block for 4 yards on average and I’d trust Royce to get it.

        • DC

          That’s a line I want to see play together though I’m not getting my hopes up. To Shaun’s credit, when the man could sniff the endzone there weren’t many players who could stop him. Walt & Hutch didn’t hurt.

          It’s possible the Hawks are taking a longer view on the RB position than many fans are. Will they go rbbc this season and wait on a ‘feature’ back until 2019?

  10. Trevor

    I am surprised the Hawks have not been linked via official visit or meeting to any of the Georgia guys (Wynn, Michel, Carter, Chubb, Wimms). Some great prospects in that group who seem to fit our scheme and needs.

    Could it be because the new OC Schotenhiemer was coach there with this group so they have all the insight they need on the players?

    • Darnell

      It does seem that when the Hawks have visits that they are often with guys who have health and/or “redflag” concerns (Malik, Frank and Bobby had visits, health in Bobby’s case) and that there is genuine interest there.

      But when they have their sights on prospects who are clean as a whistle, they don’t go with a visit (Lockett, Pocic, Ifedi didn’t visit). We have no way of knowing for sure, but hiding their interest in Lockett and Russ may have been crucial.

      Which could be why there has been nothing reported on Wynn, Hernandez

      • peter

        Exactly. Michel, CHubb, Wynn…..a team is going to get something good with those three plus the current intel they have. Ballage? you have to talk to him in person to figure out why he didn’t dominate more often

        • Sea Mode


    • Nick


  11. Trevor

    Kirk really does look like a Hawks WR I have to admit. Could be our new Golden Tate whom is the few players the hawks have let walk whom I think we truly missed (Unger too).

    • Nick

      I’d take Kirk, but only in the 40s. Earlier than that and I feel like we won’t get enough ammo for the rest of the draft.

    • Nick

      Also, I wonder if they like Penny’s value. He would give them a lot of versatility. For example, let’s say through trading back they get picks 40 and 63. Totally plausible.

      They could go something like: Goedhurt, Penny or Kirk, Penny.

      So you get an upgrade at a skill position on offense, and a potential three down back.

      • Nick

        God, tho, I don’t love Penny.

        • Kenny Sloth


      • Tecmo Bowl

        Very plausible situation. Trade back twice get a pass catcher. Could make a small move up for a RB with pick 63+ extra ammo from the 2nd trade back-guessing a late 3rd/ early 4th. This hits on the tiers of players-top of TE/WR and back end of the 2nd tier of RB. I’d be very happy with Kirk and Kerryon/Michel/Penny.

  12. Trevor

    Ballage looks amazing and ticks every box except consistent production. Seems like a great athlete who is is just not an instinctive RB. Reminds me a ton of Christine Michel except with better attitude.

    • KingRajesh

      Walter Football has a decent scouting report on Ballage:

      His player comp was DeMarco Murray. “I reached out to team sources, and they said Murray was a good comparison for Ballage. The two have a similar running style with a surprising skill set of quickness in a bigger back with receiving ability. Murray was a third-round pick in the 2011 NFL Draft, and Ballage could also be a third-rounder. If Ballage pans out, he could be a back similar to Murray.”

      I don’t think you need a violent runner to get back to running the ball (Lynch/Guice-type), I think we could do a lot worse than a DeMarco Murray-type.

    • TTownHawk

      He’s a fantastic athlete, but he runs very upright and looks sort of stiff at times. He lacks lateral quickness and is vision is highly suspect. There are times when his tape does pop though, like Rob said it is just very inconsistent. He reminds me a lot of Latavius Murray actually, a bigger back who is a ridiculous athlete, but doesn’t play like a natural RB. I would assume they think they can coach him up if they’re truly interested. I would like the pick, so long as it is a day 3 selection. Any higher and I think it is a reach.

  13. Mark Souza

    Just thinking outside the box (take cover), is it possible the team could take a look at putting Prosise out at WR where he played most of his college career? It might provide a big bodied, physical presence we’ve been looking for at receiver, and getting him outside, away from the pounding he takes inside might help him stay healthy for more than a game a season.

    • Darnell

      Envisioning like a Harvin gadget type of role?

      I could see that, but man, CJ’s body just might not be meant for contact in the NFL. Which is too bad really, because dude has been electric every time he’s been on the field.

      The Hawks definitely nailed the talent, character and mental aptitude evaluation on Prosise; it’s just been really unfortunate so far. I think it should be McKissic’s job to lose until CJ shows are reliable run of health.

    • Logan Lynch

      I’ve argued against this before, so I’ll make it short. It’s a possibility, but most of his production and value comes from the fact that LBs or S have to match up against him out of the backfield. Prosise is either too fast for them or bigger than them. They also have to worry about the possibility of him taking a handoff. If you put him out at WR to start, that takes away his advantage.

      • Mark Souza

        I don’t think so. He’s not taller than most DB’s, but outweighs most of them by 30 lbs. Envision him as a Anquan Boldin type, but faster (Boldin ran 4.71, Prosise 4.48). A nightmare for DBs to bring down with the ball in his hands. And he could finally avoid hits by 300 pounders and deal with people his size or smaller.

        He could be used a bit in the Harvin role with jet sweeps, bubble screens, or lined up in the backfield in a position to take a hand-off, or go in motion. And like Boldin, victimize DBs with his strength using subtle push-offs to create separation. That’s how I’d use him.

        • Logan Lynch

          Possibly, but if he was such a good WR prospect why did Notre Dame move him to RB? Just playing devil’s advocate as I really like Prosise.

          • Mark Souza

            My guess, and that’s all it is, is when a WR is asked to switch to RB and becomes the starter, it’s because the Notre Dame was hurting at RB, either because of injury, or a recruiting gap, or a little of both – much like what happened in Green Bay with Ty Montgomery.

            • Logan Lynch

              Fair enough. I think it’s good discussion. One thing we can agree on is that if Prosise can stay healthy he could be a great addition to this offense.

    • Michigan 12th

      I see why you have this conversation, but how does moving him outside help with all his hamstring injuries? Those are not from being hit inside.

      • Mark Souza

        His hamstring issue (singular) wasn’t chronic, just the one. But to be fair, with Prosise, it’s always something; hip flexor, broken hand, broken scaplula, ankle injury, re-aggravating the same ankle injury, hamstring pull….

        In my opinion, this is a last chance for Prosise. He’s too much of a china doll. It’s put up or shut up time. I think if he misses time in camp this year, he won’t make it out of camp.

    • Kendo

      Perhaps they will look to move C.J. to WR. The more I think about Ballage I wonder if he is being looked at as a third down back with potential to develop into more. The team has been looking at some RBs that seem to offer appeal catching out of the backfield or running outside the tackles. It seems like what influenced CJ’s success when he was on the field was that he had the size and explosiveness to carry between the tackles or split out wide. Either way they found the best matchup. With McKissic the play call seemed far too predictable to receive out of the backfield or run outside the tackles. Ballage seems able to be a threat between and now outside the tackles it could free up C.J. for other duties. Plus if he isn’t the main RB for early carries it limits his impact if he turns out to mimic his college production.

  14. KingRajesh

    People saying that we need to trade Russell Wilson because “no team under the current CBA has won it all paying a QB top dollar” honestly angers me to see it thrown around so much. It’s such a garbage-tier “fact” in truth.

    It’s not like Cam Newton (on a mega deal) or Matt Ryan (on a mega deal) weren’t right there to win it all, but their team let down around them. It’s not like QBs like Aaron Rodgers and Big Ben (on mega deals) haven’t been a few plays away from a shot to win it either, but their team let down in the conference championship.

    It’s hard as hell to win a super bowl, even if you get there. If one thing goes wrong, you lose. We of all teams should know that.

    QBs like Kyle Allen, Quinton Flowers, and JT Barrett should be the type of QBs we should be looking to get late in the draft or as UDFAs to try and develop and flip for picks.

    • Hawksince77

      Funny you should bring up Cam Newton and Big Ben as examples of mega-million QBs and SBs. In the case of Big Ben, he won his only SB championship on his rookie contract. Cam Newton appeared in a SB the same year he was given a massive extension, and the team hasn’t been the same since. Rogers has won one SB in his career, despite being perhaps the best QB that ever played the game. Ryan has appeared in one in his entire career. With he exception of Brady, no team has maintained a consistent championship status in the modern era with a mega-paid QB. The Seahawks being a perfect example. Two SB appearances with a cheap QB. Ask Baltimore if Flacco is worth what they are paying. And let’s see how Cousins works out with the Vikings. Paying the going rate for elite QBs, even mediocre ones, puts significant restraints on the rest of the roster. Does an elite QB compensate? That’s the question.

      • GerryG

        Ben only won one SB huh?

        News to me.

        Second one in his 5th year, so probably was on his second contract? I dont remember him going to the end of his contract without an extension.

        • Hawksince77

          Yeah, I mis-wrote my notes. Ben in 2005 and 2008. Rodgers only won one SB, was who I meant.

          It doesn’t really matter. The issue is far more complex and there are many ways to win a championship. The major point is that PC’s way to win championships is to field an elite (in the case of 2013 and 2014 perhaps historically elite) defense and effectively run the ball. Doing so does not require an elite QB. Obviously the better the QB the better the team. Getting a starting level QB in the 3rd round (let alone one potentially elite) is something that is unlikely to happen again any time soon. Certainly nothing that can be planned upon. Trading RW to Cleveland this year for their top 4 or 5 picks, including their 1 and 4, means that you could potentially draft another starting quality QB, potentially an elite one, relatively cheap and under club control for the next five years. Doing so would also allow you to draft potentially elite DE, DT, safety, LB, RB, OG, etc.

          The alternative is to keep RW for the next two years under his current contract, and attempt to extend him at the cost of a top 5 (or more expensive) rate for QBs. Doing so would continue to limit what the team could spend on the rest of the team.

          So the question is: does allocating such a high percentage (20-25%?) of your total cap space to one player allow you to build a championship team? Since RW has been paid, the Seahawks have been obviously descending. They were strapped this year in their cap, and have had to make various modest deals to fill out their roster. Who thinks they will compete next year for a championship, or even make the playoffs? Obviously too soon to tell, but what do we think will change in the coming seasons to change that?

          • KingRajesh

            “So the question is: does allocating such a high percentage (20-25%?) of your total cap space to one player allow you to build a championship team?”

            You honestly have no idea of what you are talking about. No team has ever allocated more than 17.8% of the cap to a QB, and that was Aaron Rodgers in 2013.

            Russell’s 2015 extension (4 year, 87.5m) came out to $21.875m APY. The salary cap in 2015 was $143.28m, meaning that Wilson essentially took up 15.2% of the cap in 2015. That % has significantly plummeted as the cap has increased.

            If we assume he’ll get 15.2% of the cap for next year, which has been estimated at $188-190m, that puts his APY at around $28-29m, which is around what Kirk Cousins and Jimmy G got this year – already a bargain. Even if we have to pay Russell Wilson $30-31m next year, that would only be an increase of .8% of the cap over Russell’s last contract (up to 16%), which is a modest pay increase for a significant increase in responsibility.

            • Hawksince77

              Here is the relevant quote from the second article above:

              I’m not suggesting that it’s impossible to build a Super Bowl-caliber team around a highly paid quarterback. Teams have done it. It’s just really hard. That quarterback just has to be very, very good and the front office still has to get lucky in the draft and free agency. Aaron Rodgers is the most talented quarterback I’ve ever seen, yet he hasn’t made it back to a Super Bowl since signing his mega deal. Drew Brees is a top-five quarterback all-time in my book, and he hasn’t been close since cracking the $20-million-per-year barrier. Same goes for Russell Wilson.

            • Hawksince77

              Why? What is wrong with this post? Did I break some kind of site rule?

              Please let me know so I don’t do so in the future.

          • MSL

            So then where is the evidence that a franchise can stay competitive long term by continually flipping proven QBs for new cheap ones? Please name one.

            • Hawksince77

              The case is actually the opposite and that is what makes this situation unique. Nobody does that. They pay their superstar a bundle and then (with the exception of Brady) fail to contend for a championship.

              As someone points out below, the only team in the modern age to sustain championship success is New England. Obviously Brady has a lot to do with that, and that is likely the more relevant model. If you can obtain a Brady, and manage a team like Belichek, you can expect to play in multiple SBs.

              Everyone else, not so much.

            • RealRhino2

              Lotta work do to do on definitions there. What does it mean to be “competitive”? “Long term”? “Continually”?

              Nobody does that “continually,” but plenty of teams have remained competitive (or became even more so) after moving on from a proven QB to a new, cheap one. New England, for one, moving from Bledsoe to Brady. Green Bay moving from Favre to Rodgers. San Diego moving from Brees to Rivers. Indy moving from Manning to Luck (until his injury). Cincy moving from Palmer to Dalton. Happens all the time.

              I’d say the real garbage “fact” is that unless you keep paying market value for your QB, your team ends up in “QB hell” like the Browns. The Browns are as much an outlier as the Patriots.

              I think too many teams settle for mediocrity by believing they have to pay their QB.

      • KingRajesh

        “With he exception of Brady, no team has maintained a consistent championship status in the modern era with a mega-paid QB.”

        It’s REALLY hard to win a Super Bowl. There’s so much luck that goes into it. Even in 2013, if Sherman jumps a bit earlier or a bit later, we don’t go to XLVIII.

        A better stat is to look at how often teams with top QBs on big contracts make the playoffs (spoiler alert: it’s much higher than teams with lesser QBs) – because that’s all you can really ask for. Whether or not you win the Super Bowl after that all depends on how lucky your team is.

        • Hawksince77

          The precise percentage isn’t the point (thus the ? in the parenthetical). The question is how allocating such a high percentage to one player effects the rest of the roster, in terms of building a championship team. Arguments have been made that paying market rates for these elite QBs makes that difficult. If I can find the post, I will provide a link.

          Here is one relevant discussion:

          Okay, here is the prime source that includes the relevant historical data. Bottom line, no correlation between how much a team pays for a QB and winning the SB. Also, the average Cap hit for the starting QBs was 6.9%. If you click on the link, note the 2013 stat on the second chart.

          Bottom line: paying a shitload for a QB doesn’t correlate to winning championship. Here is how the guy in the link above summarized:

          I’m not suggesting that it’s impossible to build a Super Bowl-caliber team around a highly paid quarterback. Teams have done it. It’s just really hard. That quarterback just has to be very, very good and the front office still has to get lucky in the draft and free agency. Aaron Rodgers is the most talented quarterback I’ve ever seen, yet he hasn’t made it back to a Super Bowl since signing his mega deal. Drew Brees is a top-five quarterback all-time in my book, and he hasn’t been close since cracking the $20-million-per-year barrier. Same goes for Russell Wilson.

        • Michigan 12th

          What about the Colts and Peyton Manning? Yes they only won one, but they were a threat every year, and he never even restructured his contract like Brady did.

          • Hawksince77

            That’s a really good question. Without looking deeper, I seem to recall that the Colts made the playoffs every year, or nearly every year, but only made it to one SB. Is that right? I guess I could look it up.

            Anyway, the data provided in the link to my post that us ‘awaiting moderation’ makes the basic argument based on how much QBs are paid, the percentage of cap they use, and the relative success of those teams. Once that post goes live (assuming it does) that will provide the statistical substance to the argument.

            Regardless, I am not advocating trading RW. I doubt the possibility lies within any Seahawk management minds. It’s more of a cautionary tale concerning the practice of paying a QB so much money, and the insight that teams in the era since the rookie wage scale can greatly benefit by drafting a good QB (Wentz, Wilson, perhaps Deshaun Watson) and build a championship team around them while they are on their rookie contract. The data will show how often this has actually taken place. Teams like the Eagles and Rams seem to be taking advantage of that situation, much like the Seahawks did.

            Hopefully we are not in for so many years of basic mediocrity, making the playoffs now and again, but rarely much beyond, not unlike Rodgers/Brees, for instance.

            • GerryG

              Two SBs lost to Brees in 09

      • Comfect

        “With he exception of Brady, no team has maintained a consistent championship status in the modern era with a mega-paid QB.”

        What’s your definition here? Because if it’s “making the Super Bowl every year” we could just say “with the exception of New England, no team has maintained a consistent championship status in the modern era” period.

        • Hawksince77

          Yep, New England is it. Pretty amazing.

    • GerryG

      Also, it’s not like Brady is on a rookie deal, his cap # is still pretty big even though it’s not the top.

      • Hawksince77

        Just looked it up. Brady is 18th from the top (Baltimore is the highest) with Seattle 17th. So there are only 14 teams that pay their QB less than New England. That’s impressive, and certainly something that contributes to their continuous success.

        • Mark Souza

          QB salary is the key? Then let’s dump Wilson for what we can get for him and bring in Nathan Peterman for our next Super Bowl run.

          • Hawksince77

            Yes, QB salary is the key point. Did you read the article from the link I posted above (the USA Today)? Here is the relevant summary:

            “I’m not suggesting that it’s impossible to build a Super Bowl-caliber team around a highly paid quarterback. Teams have done it. It’s just really hard. That quarterback just has to be very, very good and the front office still has to get lucky in the draft and free agency. Aaron Rodgers is the most talented quarterback I’ve ever seen, yet he hasn’t made it back to a Super Bowl since signing his mega deal. Drew Brees is a top-five quarterback all-time in my book, and he hasn’t been close since cracking the $20-million-per-year barrier. Same goes for Russell Wilson.”

            And yes, what makes this situation potentially unique is the possibility (if it is a possibility) to ‘dump’ RW for Cleveland’s first 4 or 5 picks, the top two being 1 overall, and 4 overall, allowing the Seahawks to draft whatever QB from this draft class they wanted, assuming they even like any of them so much. Doing so would give them a top QB (not a fifth rounder as you suggest) relatively cheap for the next five years. That would allow them to spend their money where PC has demonstrated he wants to spend it: on defense. Fielding an elite defense with a good running game (PC’s strategy for winning championships) does not require paying an elite QB.

            Again, this situation is unique. How often does a team like the Colts get to draft Manning number one overall, and then a generation later, take Luck number one overall. Or someone like Rodgers falling late into the first round before Green Bay drafts him while still starting Farve. Or, finding a brilliant QB in the third round, or perhaps the greatest QB in history in the 6th. This is potentially one of those unique situations.

    • cha

      This happens every few years. A team changes the formula slightly and has success and the rest of the NFL media assumes the only way to have success is to copy their model. Meanwhile the next few champs are busy forging their own path to success.

    • EP

      It’s more of a case that a good QB is what leads you to Super Bowl victory irrespective of his cap number. Wentz was the best in the league last year and he will get a huge contract at some point. You don’t find great QBs that easily. The only anomaly over the last 15 odd years is the Ravens winning it. The Mannings, Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Rothlisberger, Wilson are all amazing QBs, it’s no coincidence that the guys who are arguably the best in the league are in fact the guys who have won it. Fair enough Foles filled in at the end but they were never getting to the super bowl if he played all season. A great quarter back is the surest fire way to ensure you are in about it come the end of the season. If they’re pretty good, pay them. I don’t want to be the Browns.

      • Hawksince77

        I found the article I was looking for, but my post with the link is ‘awaiting moderation.’ Anyway, it had lots of good data, and summarizes as follows:

        I’m not suggesting that it’s impossible to build a Super Bowl-caliber team around a highly paid quarterback. Teams have done it. It’s just really hard. That quarterback just has to be very, very good and the front office still has to get lucky in the draft and free agency. Aaron Rodgers is the most talented quarterback I’ve ever seen, yet he hasn’t made it back to a Super Bowl since signing his mega deal. Drew Brees is a top-five quarterback all-time in my book, and he hasn’t been close since cracking the $20-million-per-year barrier. Same goes for Russell Wilson.

      • Hawksince77

        Except that Rodgers, Wilson, Rothlisberger and Brees have not won SBs after gaining big contracts (according to the article that should post here shortly). Brady has, of course, and the article addresses the Mannings. In Peyton’s case, his second SB win was achieved despite his play, not because of it.

        But after taking a quick look at Peyton Manning’s career, he, along with Brady, have to be considered in the top five of QBs that have ever played the game. I also found this which I found interesting:

        Following the Super Bowl win, Manning agreed to restructure his contract to save the Colts $8.2 million in salary cap space.

        • Hawksince77

          That quote was from 2006, after winning his first SB.

  15. Tecmo Bowl

    Side note- Todd Mcshay really gets in depth with his scouting. Today on NFL Live he picked as sleepers: Penny, Chark and Zo Carter. Sleepers. Smh

    • TTownHawk

      Goodness. Chark exploded during predraft, lighting up the senior bowl and combine. He and Carter are both consistently mocked in round 2.

    • Volume12

      UCF WR Tre’Quan Smith should’ve been on there.

  16. FresnoHawk

    We’re drafting multiple backs in this draft! Which 2? When?

  17. Volume12

    Just gonna clear my throat.

    Doesn’t mean they’ll draft them at all, but pretty rare that a team will send it’s GM & HC for private workouts.

  18. Nick

    Pauline says: “the receivers could be in for a surprise on draft day as many will slide further than expected.”

    Wonder if they’re thinking Kirk will be there late into the 2nd round.

    • McZ

      Valuewise, he is a late R2, early R3 prospect. This wouldn’t be a bargain, it would be realistic draft spot.

  19. Volume12

    Give me USC’s Rasheem Green. What a stud!

    20 years old, basically played on a 2 man D-line bookended by OLB’s, can rush from the interior, and has so much natural playmaking ability and raw athleticism a team can get their hands on him and turn this cat into whatever they see fit.

    • TTownHawk

      He’s a beast, but definitely very raw. Though at 20 years old, that’s okay. The potential is off the charts. He needs to get his pad level down, a lot of time it looks like he gets stood up. I think with proper coaching he could be a great player though. Would be an ideal replacement for Bennett, maybe not as quick but similar body type with that ability to be an inside/out rusher.

      • Volume12

        Yes. He definitely needs to learn how to play with leverage. It has an effect on his balance.

        • Del tre

          What round do you think he goes in?

          • TTownHawk

            I’ve wondered this as well. I think Rd2 feels right, but it wouldn’t surprise me if he slips into the top half of Rd3

  20. Volume12

    Hmmm. I’m not sure what to make of Utah EDGE Kylie Fitts. Great athletic profile, uses his hands well, some really good traits, but inconsistent. Then again, he was battling injuries these past couple seasons and he might’ve been playing out of position in Utah’s scheme, but he’s a weird one to get a grasp on.

  21. Volume12

    Todd Gurley said attending Wrestlemania was one of the best things of his life. Where’s the lie?

    He just confirmed his legend status with me. lol

    • SoCal12

      I’m still bummed Daniel Bryan didn’t wear his Seahawks colored gear at Mania. Probably didn’t want to alienate the NOLA fans, but man that would’ve been epic.

  22. Tyler Jorgensen

    I think Kirk is going to go early. Maybe 1st round. The more I read, the more I see references to route running ability that others just don’t have. I am hoping we can trade down once and pick him. I would love a great RB as much as anyone, but I see a HUGE deficit in our receiving corps, one that is an injury from being a total torpedo to the season.

    First, even his rookie year pre-injury, Lockett hasn’t performed to the level he is needed at this upcoming season. Second, he’s injury prone. Third, there’s almost nothing tangible behind him other than hopes or wishes. Fourth, what if Baldwin goes down? We literally have Lockett, a guy who has never been the same post injury with a career high 664 yards as our “number 1.”

    We NEED Kirk. Badly. He’s going to step in and start in this league, and be an immediate presence. There are few WR’s that can do that, but I see him as one that can. He’s a future All Pro, and I’d even grab him at 18 if you’re worried he’s going to be gone.

    There isn’t a position group on the team that needs a legitimate talent infusion more.

    • Mark Souza

      One injury in 3 seasons doesn’t make you injury prone.

      • Tyler Jorgensen

        One injury that he hasn’t fully recovered from in three seasons seems significant enough to note. If you want to argue semantics, fine. He’s not injury prone. He has had an extremely severe injury that he’s never looked the same after. And I’m not talking about the return game. I’m talking about his receiving game.

        He’s among the worst WR2’s in the league right now. I like him, but that’s the current reality of our WR corps. We need an infusion of talent.

    • Sea Mode

      Future All Pro? Take him at 18?

      Wow, that’s a strong take. Kudos to you though for sticking with your evaluation if that’s what you really see.

      • Mark Souza

        Of course he could break his leg and never be the same.

        • Tyler Jorgensen

          True. Like my fear of Tyler Lockett, who I LOVED when we drafted but I’ve cooled drastically on as a WR.

    • McZ

      This would be an act of desperation.

      Patience. Let’s see, how Darboh develops, if Lockett steps up, how McEvoy works out if he gets more snaps as a half-TE slot receiver.

      Tre’Quan Smith n R3-4, Allen Lazard in R4-5 or Marcel Ateman or Auden Tate R6-7… If we pick any of them to their actual draft value, we should be grateful.

      RB, DE and OL are our needs.

      • McZ

        Have to add, Kirk is a R2 talent, at best.

        • FuzzyLogic

          I completely disagree. Bottom of 1st….top of 2nd talent. Dude is gonna beast it out in the NFL.

    • Del tre

      If a receiver going down can sink your season, wide receiver depth isn’t the biggest problem on your roster.

    • Edgar

      I can’t see enough upside to pulling the trigger on a receiver @ 18 with Russell Wilson @ QB. Even during Bowl 49 he was able to use marginal NFL talent to move the ball effectively. I’d much rather see a RB or OG as first and even first and second pick where ever that is to start our draft.
      I see a lot of people upset over the possible lack of comp picks coming from these offseason moves. I think freeing cap space is enough of a reward when it comes down to the nuts and bolts. Schneider can’t make collecting 4th-7th round additional picks a priority when he has Russell and Bobby in their prime. If it were that important, there wouldn’t be any point to keeping those two on the team.

      • Tyler Jorgensen

        Did we really move the ball effectively? Or did we get “lucky” in chunks? How much more effective could we be with a couple legitimate WR talents? Remember how easily we moved in in 48, WITH Golden Tate and Baldwin?

        I think Kirk could be a step up from Golden, and close to Dougie. Two of them would be a matchup nightmare for other teams.

        • Edgar

          On paper yes, but a running game would fix more offensive issues than a Doug Baldwin equal (dream outcome) drafting a WR high.

  23. SomethingWithHawk

    Rob, my biggest fear right now is the increasing possibility of barkley going to the 49ers. Cant sleep anymore haha, just hope it wont happen..
    How likely do you think this scenario is?

    • Rob Staton

      Very unlikely unless they trade up

    • McZ

      And if it’s not Barkley, it’s Ward, James, Edmunds or someone else, who will make their defense a tough nut to crack.

  24. Cameron

    Holy hell, have you seen the measurables on Simeon Thomas (CB from Louisiana), Rob??

    Per tweet from Aaron Wilson:
    6’3.5” with 35” arms (!!)
    11’3” broad (!!)
    39” vert
    4.47 40-dash

    Sounds like a Seahawks CB prospect if I ever heard of one! Of course, haven’t seen any film on him to have any idea of his instincts or playmaking ability.

    • Trevor

      I guess he did not play much because of acedemic issues but you are right he has off the charts size and athletic profile. Sounds like the ideal udfa or round 7 CB for Pete to redshirt and develop.

      • Mark Souza

        What about skills?

        • Kenny Sloth

          Traits? What do you mean?

        • Mark Souza

          Has he shown he can cover tight and match a receiver move for move, tackle, track the ball, recognize plays – skills. Running fast and jumping high and far are great, only if you also happen to have the skill set for the position. Have you seen any video or watched him play? Is he a shutdown corner? If he’s not a shutdown corner in college, he has no shot of being one in the pros.

    • UKHawkDavid

      Aaron Wilson also reporting that the Seahawks visited him today (extent of the visit unclear).

    • Rob Staton

      Would love to see some tape

      • Kenny Sloth

        Rob he lost two years in college due to academic intelligibility FULL SEASONS.
        That would make me want to meet with him

        Can’t find tape cuz he doesnt always play every down. You’re not drafting hom for his tape

        Talks like a mature man though

        “I like to play man coverage, i like to put my hands on people” “gives you a chance to expose somebody to the rest of the world”

        “When you get to the nfl thats what they payin you to do. To lock down that man/ side of the field” and that quote is from 2015

        • Mark Souza

          Could be worth a shot as an UDFA.

    • D-OZ

      That’s the player I lost my note’s on last year. I have been trying to remember his name and the school but couldn’t. He is a good one. CB who hits like Bam Bam. I have been searching small school’s in the south for a some time now looking for him. I brought him up last year. Good find…

      • D-OZ

        There was some on u-tube last year. I think it was entitled The Hardest hitting DB in CFB…

  25. Hoff

    If people are underwhelmed by the way Ballage doesn’t use his physicality consistently, they’ll be angry if Freeman is the pick. I’m a die-hard Duck and I was amazed at how easily he went to the ground and didn’t finish his runs. There were times when he looked like he was avoiding contact at the cost of gaining extra yards.

    • Kenny Sloth

      I think he has a case of the ‘too goods’

      He’s always been too good for the level around him. In high school, in college. He has a vision and fleetness of foot that few can combine as lethally. It’s like the pass rusher thats so strong he never learns to swim or rip because he can just dump the OL with a bullrush.

      Freeman I feel has the potential to be a bruising physical bellcow but there’s little evidence of that physicality and we can’t keep drafting on upside.

      I also feel his learning curve will be harsh coming out of Oregon.

  26. Sea Mode

    A couple interesting notes from Pauline:

    1. Looks like Callaway is a definite no-no.

    Several people have confided in me that additional and new red flags have popped up on former Florida receiver Antonio Callaway since the combine.

    2. Giants and Bears looking to trade down:

    Several people I’ve spoken with speculated that the New York Giants and Buffalo Bills likely have a blueprint in place for a trade that would allow the Bills to move up to the second spot in the draft. They also believe that the trade won’t happen until very late in the process, if it happens at all, as the Giants want to field further offers.

    The belief is that the Chicago Bears will be in prime position to trade down from the eighth spot regardless of whether the top four quarterbacks are off the board. The Bears would like to recoup some of the selections they gave away one year ago after moving up to select quarterback Mitchell Trubisky.

    • Rob Staton

      I interviewed Tony a couple of hours ago. Audio to be posted tomorrow.

      • Tecmo Bowl

        Excellent looking forward to it!

      • Trevor


        Not sure how but this blog just gets better every year. Don’t know how you do it but is impressive.

      • Josh Emmett


      • Kenny Sloth

        It’s tomorrow somewhere 😌

      • Patrick Toler


  27. Kenny Sloth

    Rob, outside of the top 8 backs, who would you feel comfortable placing the future of the run game on from this draft?

    Is there a pair of tailbacks that intrigue you to the point of not needing a runner early?

    Say Scarborough and Wadley or maybe just Ballage in the room?

    • Kenny Sloth

      Hey guys

      We regularly talk about athletic profile, but something that is neglected is the degree of intelligence and free thought all of our picks have exhibited. Sherman, Baldwin, and Thomas are great minds for the game and we definitely wanted to take advantage of that.

      Who are the smartest players in the draft that you know of?

      I’m looking for good grades, or multisport athletes, guys graduating early or getting their MD or something.

      Anything that shows they are above and beyond the basic NFL players thought level

      • Sea Mode

        DJ visits ASH every time he’s in town, popping into basketball practice, peeking his head into the school’s main office and dropping by his former math teacher’s classroom.

        The latter even puzzles his mother. Shirley Chark wonders aloud: What 19- or 20-year-old boy returns to his high school to meet with his math teacher?

        The one who, in 13 years in the education system here, never missed a day of school.

        DJ finished with a 3.9 grade-point average, Urbina said. He claimed all three major senior individual honors, too: Prom King, Mr. ASH and Most Outstanding Athlete.

        • Kenny Sloth

          Wow. Chark is quite nice to my eye. I’d love him working with Doug

      • SheHawk

        Agreed. + Russell is the smartest about in nfl

    • Rob Staton

      I think all of the backs outside of the top eight are complimentary types.

  28. UKHawkDavid

    Off topic: I live in Southern California and am visiting Seattle mid-August… of course the Seahawks are playing in Los Angeles the week I’m in Seattle! It all could have worked out so perfectly. Oh well – anyone recommend the stadium tour of the Clink?!

    • DCD2

      Not sure if you like the “other” Futbol, but the Sounders are playing that weekend (I think). Do the walk through Pioneer Square with all of the diehards. It’s a fun experience and then you can go to the game and experience it in a sense. I’d do that over the tour if you were going to pick one. Even if you’re not a big soccer fan. I haven’t done the tour, but I’d venture that you’d have more fun doing the former.

    • CharlieTheUnicorn

      Take the tour of the underground
      Take the tour of Safeco Field and
      Take the Tour of the Whiskey Bars in Ballard

      • D-OZ

        The Smoke Shop in Ballard. You might run into Sig Hanson. LOL … He is a frequent flyer there.

      • UKHawkDavid

        Ah yes, the underground! That’s the resounding memory I have of visiting Seattle as a 9 year old – excellent shout. And thank you DCD2 for the tip about the Sounders, I’ll be researching further. Go Seattle! Go Hawks!

  29. Dylanlep

    Dont do it Pete! DJ Moore and Royce Freeman would be so much better.

  30. Justin

    I’m still convinced the Seahawks go receiver early that can either be a tight end, wideout or both. Schott is an Air Coryell disciple who uses the run to set up shots downfield the Seahawks need a vertical stretching wideout or a tight end that can run seam routes and designed concepts to get linebackers in one on one spaces, he was pretty successful in using Dustin Keller and Jared Cook in similar situations. This will be a vertical-based offense with almost no vertical based talents. This is also a really strong draft for vertical receivers, Miller, Smith, Kirk, Washington all make sense.

    For the run game, I believe they want to go with Carson for inside, power runs. I think the Pete Carroll still believes in him and a one-cut downhill runner that will explode the through holes and punish defenses. He’s good for 15 carries a game. Where they lack is good running backs that can handle outside runs another important concept in Schott’s philosophies. Some of better loose-hipped, elusive, pass-catching backs will be found later, I like Ballage, Ito Smith, and Akrum Wadley all guy who have visited with Seattle. Ballage is probably the safest bet for mitigating risks on Carson not working out. Another name that’s interesting is Jayln Samuels.

    If Seattle wants to be competitive this year, and focus on the run they definitely need to fix some issues in the passing game too because they still have too many holes on the defense to totally rely on the run like they used to.

    • Trevor

      Great post and well thought out!

      • Sean-O

        It certainly makes sense to address WR and/or TE sooner than later. This is the last year of Lockett’s deal & TE wise the group of Dickson, Vannett & Swoopes doesn’t have a ton of big play ability in the passing game in my opinion.

    • purpleneer

      I sure hope the passing game is more focused on using the whole field (namely the intermediate stuff) and moving the chains reliably. Being so eager to try deep shots has been a problem that contributes to short drives and puts so much pressure on the D. Deep shots can never be reliable, especially when you aren’t picky about your spots.
      I also think Jaron Brown will do well downfield and with the way receivers have had more of a development curve, I wouldn’t be surprised if both Johnson from the Bennett trade and Darboh will be more ready than a rookie to provide somewhat of a complete game. You don’t have to be a specialist to be good on deep routes.

  31. Sea Mode

    I think the guy really on their radar of those three is Christian Kirk.

    Kirk isn’t the biggest (5103, 201) or the quickest, but is pretty fast and his strength (20 bench) seems to be his best physical trait. He’s a Golden Tate clone:

    Tate: 5102, 199, 30 1/2 arm, 9 1/4 hand, 4.42 40yd, 10’0″ broad, 35.0 vert, 7.12 3C, 4.34 SS, 17 bench
    Kirk: 5103, 201, 30 3/8 arm, 9 7/8 hand, 4.45 40yd, 09’7″ broad, 35.5 vert, 7.09 3C, 4.45 SS, 20 bench

    Might he also be available like Tate was in late R2 (pick 60 overall)?

    I also didn’t realize he is a month younger (21.5 yrs) even than DJ Chark, the other WR I like for the Hawks if they instead want a speedy deep threat to replace PRich. Nice.

    Trade down into early R2 to pick up a late R2/early R3, and go Chubb then Kirk? That would spark the offense for sure and bring some toughness, competitive fire, and reliability to that side of the ball. I could get behind that plan and roll with the pass rush we have until next year.

    I was looking at the other strong WRs as well, and although he doesn’t have the speed the Seahawks want at WR (mid 4.5s at pro day, although apparently still not fully reconditioned after injury), dang this is a nice grab by Memphis’ Anthony Miller (5111, 201, 22 bench, 39 vert):

    Not trying to make the direct comp, but just looking at his body type, running style and some of the contested catches he makes, I can’t help but think of Antonio Brown.

    Pauline reported he had a good number of double catches at his pro day workout (this shows up in the tape above as well), but he also make some very impressive strong-handed catches as well through defenders and plenty of effortless catches of balls thrown behind him.

    He has a bit of an injury history too, having missed all of his redshirt freshman year with a shoulder injury, and now is coming of a Jones fracture, but it seems nothing of lasting concern. Extremely productive over the past two years, albeit in an inferior conference. Was a walk on who received no offers. Huge chip on his shoulder and hard worker. I’m thinking he goes in R3 somewhere.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Whats his production like?

      Richardson was like getting QB numbers in college

      • Sea Mode

        More than Richardson even. Two years of insane production instead of just one.

        2016: 13 games, 95 rec, 1434 yds, 15.1 ypc, 14 TD
        2017: 13 games, 96 rec, 1462 yds, 15.2 ypc, 18 TD

        • Kenny Sloth

          Check out DJ Chark with the 20+ yards per catch

          Guess you gotta make every one count down there huh

    • Tecmo Bowl

      Great post Sea Mode! Think Kirk is going top 50. Anthony Miller is seahawky for sure. DJ Chark is very intriguing with that 4.34 speed at 6’3″. Showed up huge in the Senior Bowl. His tape is tough to watch with terrible QB play. When is LSU going to get a decent QB?

    • Lewis

      Looks good. I like how shifty he seems with the ball in his hands.

    • H

      Id be really really happy with Miller in the third. For my money he’s the best wr in the class

      • Sea Mode

        That’s the thing: he very well might end up the best, but he could also be limited to the slot by bigger, faster CBs at the next level.

        Will he be the next underrated Antonio Brown or just one of so many who “could be the next AB but weren’t”. And what draft capital are teams ready to spend to find out?

        • peter

          Brown was really underrated though. I’ll not sure Miller is underated. I like his game a lot as much as I like kirks. Different styles but I enjoy both their play.

  32. Kurtis

    Longest arms on a cornerback that I’ve heard of.

  33. Kenny Sloth

    Mike Boone RB Cincinatti jumped an 11’07 broad and rocketed up to 3rd in the sparq rankings

    Between Barkley at 1 and Chubb at 5 (in sparq)

    • Kenny Sloth

      Chubb is seventh

      Scarborough is fifth
      Ballage is fourth

      Trenton Cannon from Virginia State with a 1.4 10 yard split is second

    • Kenny Sloth

      Gesicki, Ian Thomas, Tyler Conklin are 1,2,3 at TE for Sparq

      Thomas in 91% of nfl TEs

      • Kenny Sloth

        Jaylen Samuels #4 in TEs

        • CharlieTheUnicorn

          But we know Samuels is a FB more than a TE due to his overall size.

          • Kenny Sloth

            He catch way better than he block tbh

            • Sea Mode

              Wait, he blocks? 😉

              • Kenny Sloth

                Dmitri Flowers is OG Mike Rob for me

    • Kenny Sloth

      His teammate Korey Cunningham had an exceptional workout as well

      He now sits behind only Kolton Miller in the sparq rankings this year.

      • Kenny Sloth

        Cunningham was a 1 year starter for UC at LT

        He was a former TE recruit coming out and chose UC over Ole Miss and Auburn

    • Kenny Sloth

      9 CBs in top 90th percentile for sparq scores

      • Kenny Sloth

        And 12 safeties on the top 82% of their position, sparqly speaking

  34. CharlieTheUnicorn

    Chad Reuter on mentioned this guy as a sleeper.

    Chase Edmonds, RB, Fordham: Only leg injuries prevented Edmonds from breaking all kinds of FCS records in 2017. He’s not the biggest back, but he’s quick, tough and a reliable receiver. If he can stay healthy, he’ll have a long NFL career.

    Doesn’t this sound a bit like a certain player on the Seattle roster already… Prosise.

    • HawksBill

      40 Yard Dash 4.55s 54
      Vertical Jump 34″ 44
      Broad Jump 122″ 78
      3-Cone Drill 6.79s 89
      20 Yard Shuttle 4.07s 93
      60 Yard Shuttle 11.63s 51
      Bench Press 19 reps 49

      • HawksBill

        I like his numbers. The last number is percentile for position.

        • Del tre

          Plus he has proven himself as a pass catcher.
          At the very least he looks like an uber talented 3rd down back with 1st and 2nd down ability.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Chase Edmunds

      In 44 games and 938 carries he has 5862 yards and 67 touchdowns (5th and 4th all time in fbs) would’ve been more except he played less and less games each year.

      6.2 yards per attempt, and had 62 tds in his first three seasons before his injury hampered 2017 that still saw him named second team honors all conference.

      Some injuries. MASSIVE production and a laundry list of awards

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        Where do we think he will go… round wise…. 5/6th due to injury concerns?

        • Kenny Sloth

          In any other class I’d be tempted to take him a lot higher.

          But I would wait a looong time for him tbh late 5th has gotta be his ceiling this year but not cuz the injuries were serious or anything.

          It’s more his size that worries you. Much bigger boys in LA than Fordham

    • D-OZ

      Edmonds had 65 TD’s going into his Sr. season….

  35. CharlieTheUnicorn

    Seahawks Sign Cornerback Dontae Johnson

    This is further evidence that a top 3 round pick on a CB is unlikely.
    John Clayton mentioned Maxwell may still be brought back into the fold as well.

  36. Coleslaw

    Rob this is off topic but how big is disc golf across the pond?

    • Rob Staton

      I had to google it so that might answer your question 🙂

      • Coleslaw

        Lol, I had to know, I didn’t think it would be big over there but it’s huge in Germany, growing like crazy in the U.S.

  37. HawksBill

    Josh Adams, Notre Dame has very similar numbers to Ballage:

    Measurable Measurement %tile
    Height 6′ 1⅝” 95
    Weight 213 lbs 46
    Wingspan 79¼” 94
    Arm Length 33¾” 99
    Hand Size 9¼” 48
    10 Yard Split 1.59s* 55
    20 Yard Split 2.58s* 53
    40 Yard Dash 4.51s* 66
    Vertical Jump 34″* 44
    Broad Jump 122″* 78
    3-Cone Drill 6.78s* 93
    Bench Press 18 reps 39

    * Measurement from source other than the NFL Combine.

    In 2017 finished among the nation’s leaders with 1,430 yards and scoring nine times on 206 carries (13 receptions, 101 yards). Not a lot of wiggle but get him into the secondary and he can really move for his size.
    Mocked in the 6-7 round.

    • Ed

      Running style like Eric Dickerson

    • Tecmo Bowl

      Looks a lot like Carson-similar build, running style.

      • DCD2

        Yep, a lot of good RB’s this year. I was surprised he came out early. 7 yards per carry is nothing to scoff at and ND played: USC, LSU, Georgia, Mich St, NCSt, Miami, Stanford, etc.

        I was really excited about him early on, but no one wanted to join me on the hype train. Still think he could be a good late round pick.

        • HawksBill

          We have a lot of 5th round picks………..

    • RealRhino2

      I didn’t really like him on film. As you said, not a lot of wiggle, and I thought not much burst. A little too Eddie Lacy for me: when the train got rolling it was hard to stop, but took too long to get rolling.

      • HawksBill

        Hard to get an all-pro in the late rounds, I would just like to see some RB depth that isn’t on and off the injured reserve.

        I wouldn’t completely discount Adam’s production, against top competition as well.

  38. A, Chris

    I certainly won’t step up to defend CJs history, but aren’t we leaning a little to heavy on the “when healthy” argument? No disrespect, but we can hardly blame Chris for getting rolled up and over on like that.

    • Rad_man

      Yes. This. Carson was leading the NFL in broken tackles before his injury. He’s not a prospect fans should be bailing on and seeking to back bench with a high draftee.

      • icb12

        I don’t think anyone is “bailing” on Chris Carson.

        It’s simply a fact that he hasn’t proven anything.

        He led the league in Broken tackles for 49 carries. So what?
        He had 82 carries in 2016 season and a 131 in 2015. Nothing earth shattering.

        It’s all well and good to be happy and optimistic about his return. But Relying on him to change your fortunes in the run game just doesn’t make any sense.

  39. C-Dog

    Ole Miss DT Brealand Speaks is a top 30 visit for the Hawks. Interesting player, IMO. Plays with an edge, and was moved all over their line. Definitely feels like they are continuing to search for inside pass rush.

  40. StevieD

    Physical specimen that didn’t pan out elsewhere? That’s our guy.

    Seahawks love to think that the guys who washed elsewhere will hit paydirt if only they’re in the right music blasting, positive vibing, no problem with back talking environment. Trouble is that they don’t.

    It’d be nice just to take the guys that don’t drop and aren’t undervalued by everyone else in the league.

    It’s becoming clearer and clearer that the Hawks aren’t the only ones with a pov that can be successful.

    It’s also clear that in lieu of McCloughan or some other resource, our scouting ability is sub-par.

    Anyone notice that the Browns are suddenly getting smarter with player choices? Watch the Browns in this draft as they somehow hit paydirt and we somehow get lots of players with big questions marks and everyone else had rated a couple of rounds lower than when we’ll select them.

    Sick of sucking at the draft.

    • RealRhino2

      Honestly, in response to your last section, no. I think the Browns have made some pretty poor choices, honestly. Unless it’s just a money/cap thing where they wanted to stagger their payments a bit more, no sense to me in some cases to pay decent money for just decent vets so you can pretend to be getting a little better next year.

      Got rid of Danny Shelton, who is a good interior player. So spent a 1st, got a 3rd back (minus a 5th). Unquestionably makes them worse, even if he’s primarily just a run-stuffer. I would rather have Deshone Kizer than Tyrod Taylor straight up. One has a possible future, one doesn’t. We saw Goff without a loser coach, think Kizer could have a similar transformation. They gave up a 3rd for a guy the Bills wanted to cut. Paid too much for Hyde. Took on a massive salary for a possession receiver.

      Did they get better? Yes. Overall, some useful players, but a lot of money and draft capital to get momentarily better.

      • Rob Staton

        That had to be the first step for them though. They have one win in two years. Any kind of better was enough and there’s no question they’re better now.

  41. hughmungusfan

    Just pick up (RB) Rojo Scarborough out of the University of Southern Alabama. Easy pick.

    • hughmungusfan

      Also am I the only one who has been pronouncing Derrius Guice like “Juice” as in Juice Box? I was severely disappointed when I heard someone pronounce it different from me and am no longer interested in the Hawks drafting him if my pronunciation is wrong. Juice just sounds way better, just imagine the marketing potential…

      • Hawktalker#1

        Listen to some broadcasters. Not much Juice going on . . .

      • Dingbatman

        OJ may have tarnished that brand a bit…

      • Kenny Sloth

        Yeah maybe

        It’s pronounced like vice ,,afaik

      • CharlieTheUnicorn

        Guice Box Hero

      • Drew

        I’m talking to the juice box guy!

      • MyChestIsBeastMode

        I’ve been pronouncing it “Gweese”. Not as intriguing as rhyming with juice, but I was still disappointed when I heard the true pronunciation “Guice like vice”.

  42. Coleslaw

    I think Dontae Johnson is a cheap hedge and competition for Thorpe and Elliot. I like his run support and that he started 16 games last year so young, I think it’s a pretty good signing. Still hope we add a project in the draft.

    • Drew

      He was the leading tackler on the 49ers D last year. Quite impressive for a corner.

  43. Awsi Dooger

    Daniel Jeremiah had a spotlight on Mark Walton tonight, during Path to the Draft. He was asked about this year’s Alvin Kamara.

    No kidding. For all the talk about running backs on this blog this year, the lack of attention toward Mark Walton is ultra nutso. It’s like everyone is determined to be wrong.

    I wouldn’t tout a Canes player simply to tout a Canes player. Last year Adrian Colbert and Stacy Coley were underrated. This year the tag fits Mark Walton. Likewise Chris Herndon is a smart versatile tight end who can also play H back. Both of them were injured during 2017 and will be drafted later than their talent level warrants.

    Otherwise, I have no idea how Courtland Sutton and Christian Kirk slid down the list of wide receivers, compared to where they were beginning the season and in midseason. Not smart. Always take advantage of over scrutiny late in the process. Different type of player. Kirk is more dependable while Sutton can be a big play dynamo if he would only learn to raise his arms and hands to high point the ball. Instead he has a very odd tendency to leap to the moon while keeping his hands at waist level as the ball arrives.

    • RealRhino2

      Walton is 202 lbs, so too small. Ran a 4.6 at that weight and generally tested out as a pretty bad athlete all the way around. Gets caught from behind, 31″ VJ, wasn’t used in the passing game, bounced runs outside too much, largely disappeared against good opponents while beating up the likes of Bethune-Cookman.

      He does have good contact balance, though, and has a good jump cut. But he’s definitely not for us.

    • Sea Mode

      Chris Herndon is still my guy! Glad he continues to fly a bit under the radar.

      The point about Sutton not high-pointing applies perfectly to DJ Chark as well. The strange thing is that both of them do actually have really good hands, they just formed bad habits. How coachable this is at this point is up for debate. I really don’t know.

  44. Saxon

    Wow! I really like it when Rob questions the existing paradigm. For years he’s been projecting players to the Hawks based on how he thinks PCJS evaluate them and the baseline positional measurables they require in an athlete. He’s done a great job creating a metric that hints at whom Seatitle might prioritize, even correctly predicting some players the team wound up drafting.

    However, this is the first article I can recall Rob questioning whether the team’s draft philosophy might need an update. I agree that Kirk and Ballage offer “more of the same”.Kirk reminds me of Golden Tate and Ballage’s resume reads like Christine Michael.

    This is a weak draft for WR and I hope we prioritize other positions, but if take one it had better be DJ Moore. Only he would instantly upgrade our plodding offense.

  45. Millhouse-serbia

    Holton Hill and Andrew Brown are VMAC visitor.

    • D-OZ

      Right on!!!!

    • peter


      • clbradley17

        Great news! Holton Hill has great size/speed/skills combo that we look for in a CB, and Brown looked great rushing the passer at the Senior Bowl practices.

        “Brown lined up as an under-tackle in the 4-3 front down in Mobile, and was able to show his disruption when playing as a three-technique in the one-gap scheme. Brown flashed his explosive first step, exceptional inside move, his variety of pass rush moves, and violent hands all week in one-on-one’s and even in the team portion of practices. Not only did Brown do an excellent job of rushing the passer in Mobile, but he also was a very solid player against the run. Brown showed the ability to be physical at the point of attack and showed no problems shedding blocks, holding up against double teams, and staying disciplined when rushing upfield in practices.

        What makes Andrew Brown such an intriguing prospect is how good his get off is, and how technically refined his hands are as an interior defender. I thought those were the most impressive aspects of Brown’s game when evaluating him down in Mobile, along with his ability to win with speed and strength. Even in an extremely deep defensive tackle class, Andrew Brown has the best first step out of everyone I have evaluated so far.”

  46. H

    “ASU RB Kallen Ballage scores rugby scrum td”
    That TD in no way resembles a scrum. If anything that is a maul.
    Learn your Rugby people!!!

    • Rob Staton

      This is very true and an important correction.

    • Old but Slow

      I saw it as more of a folk dance.

    • Georgia Hawk

      Thank you! I thought I might have been the only one to cringe when I saw it.

  47. RealRhino2

    First, I know we aren’t trading Russ. Second, I’m not even advocating trading Russ, though I’d be open to it under certain — and not crazy — circumstances. Third, this isn’t necessarily Seahawks draft-related, but it’s interesting and I don’t know of a better place to find a group of serious and knowledgeable football people for discussion.

    That out of the way, I think it’s at least worth considering whether this axiom that you have to pay a good QB to maintain a good team is likely true. I looked at every team in the NFL that has a QB that got paid market value/big money and how their team has fared thereafter. The following teams, IMO, paid because you “have to”, and their teams have been average or below ever since: Miami, Baltimore, Cincy, Indy, Chargers, Dallas*, Washington, NYG, Detroit.

    Teams where it “worked out”: Pittsburgh, Green Bay, New Orleans, New England**

    On the fence: Carolina, Atlanta, Seattle


    You can quibble with some of these. **Frankly, I don’t think NE should be in the “win” column because they have NOT been paying Brady market rate all these years. And Miami and Indy have had their QB get hurt, but that’s part of the risk of putting so much into one position. The Giants won a SB, but Eli wasn’t getting huge money as a percentage of the cap like we are seeing recently, they were a 9-7 team that got lucky, and outside of that year they otherwise made the playoffs just once in seven years.

    Carolina, it’s too early to tell if it’s a win or not. One good year, one really bad year since Cam started getting big money. Atlanta was bad for three years before being good these last two, so who knows? And Russ has taken a step back the past two years, and the team has taken that step along with him, with a bleak outlook for next year, too. And an even bigger payday looming.

    My quick take would be that if your QB is a future HOFer, just keep paying him. Otherwise? Note those “didn’t work out” teams probably did better than they would have w/o paying the QB *on average*, but I still think they could have maximized their chances at the brass ring by trading that QB for a haul of picks, struggling for a year or two, then going right back at it with a good, young, cheap QB.

    • H

      Russ has taken a step back the last two years?
      He had a year of playing very injured and a year of being an mvp candidate with basically no help from his team.

      • Michigan 12th

        This is the first year Russ has not made it to at least the divisional round in the playoffs. He accounted for more than 85% of Seattle’s total offense last year. I just don’t understand what people want form Russ. Give him an OLine and see what he can do. The man has been absolutely brilliant for us, and we are talking about trading him because teams don’t win with a high paid QB. This is ridiculous. The Seahawks just came short last year because of a lot of key injuries and most of that is because of Russel Wilson.

        Yes teams can get lucky and win with a rookie QB, but how many have? The raiders haven’t done anything with Carr. The Colts haven’t done anything with Luck. Miami didn’t win anything with Tannehill. The Jets haven’t won with any of their rookie QB’s. The Bills no wins, they have had lots of rookie QB’s come in, and no wins. The Browns haven’t done anything. What are you basing this opinion off of? This argument is based off of teams that have gotten lucky and struck lightening in a bottle. What did RG3 do for Washington? Only one playoff appearance. Please quit thinking that QB’S like Russel Wilson come around often, and you find a good roster fit around them. The Seahawks will be competitive for the years to come as long as Russel is back there and JS/PC are here. Do you have the same confidence in the Browns? The Colts? The Cowboys? The Raiders? The Jets? The Bills? The Dolphins? The Ravens? The Bears? The Bucs?

        Why did the Redskins go after a quality league starter? Because they know how hard it is to find a quality QB in the draft. Do you think the Jags will have sustained success like we have seen? I sure don’t. The Rams, nope they will fall out pretty quick. Winning superbowls takes a lot of work, and a lot of luck. Don’t let the Patriots fool you, we will probably never see anything like them ever again.

        • peter


          Great post and made me think this….

          Russel Wilson being successful warmth and cheap is his own worst validation for winning with a cheap qb.

          People bring up Eli and Ben but they both won with great defenses once and then one once after they were getting paid handsomely. FLacco and foles I wouldn’t say we’re cheap but certainly cost effective but brees and Peyton were both making big boy money when they one. and then there’s brady. First he’s made a ton of cash and though he’s not one of the highest paid qbs the team does something else as a whole that can’t be viewed separately to success. they convince a lot of talent to pay there for a season on fair contracts and they get rid of a lot of talent for value to keep reloading.

      • lil'stink

        No help from his team?

        I’d say the defense had a big part in 8 of our 9 wins this year. And in the one game we won when the defense gave up a bunch of points, they still had 3 picks including a pick six.

      • SheHawk

        +1000 Hawk OL protection degraded during that timeframe. Russ was improvising to make things happen Once he gets better protection and a run game, he’ll be back to late ’15 form. Think back to the Steelers shoot out win! Or Texans last year. As long as RW3 on field we have chance to win.

        No trade – get him some protection, new “hungry” weapons ++ draft the other Griffin =fixed offense and fixed defensive locker room “attitude” – back to contending for SB in no time!

        • Thy Hawk is Howling

          Awesome post SheHawk!

          I feel ya!

    • peter

      How much was Eli or Ben getting on their second rings as percent of cap.

      Listen I think it’s fair to discuss percentage of cap vs success.

      I think if we are going to do that we should start discussing the likelihood that a coaching staff goes back to win a second championship after nine years. Or that your window to win is the first four years of a new regime.

      It’s whining hopeful this year. Sure Wilson is making a ton of money but since the regime isn’t going anywhere at least there might be new ideas and pc strength is motivating young players. I’m looking towards a lot of great camp battles and hopefully even things like ballage (maybe?) Getting an honest shake at cutting prosise. I think for the team to be good going forward the team, and fans, need to stop talking about potential as a concept and start looking at potential as a tangible thing that a player is bringing it simply they arent.

      • RealRhino2

        Eli is the big modern outlier, sort of. But not really. He was at 11.7% of the cap. But most of the other big names people cite as a counterargument weren’t really getting paid like people think. Big Ben was at just 6.8%. Drew Brees was 8.3%. Rodgers was just 6%.

        To put dollars to those numbers, with the 2018 cap, Brees’s 8.3% would be $15 million per year. HALF of what people are talking about paying Russ. Big Ben would be about $12 million, and Rodgers about $11 million.

        Even Eli’s whopping 11.7% of the cap works out to just $20 million per year in 2018 cap dollars, a whopping $8 MILLION short of what Kirk Cousins just got.

  48. drewdawg11

    Russ took a step back while putting up career numbers without having a running game? Interesting take. I would say that the team around him took a step back. Special teams went from elite to mediocre at best. The defense declined a bit. The running game disappeared. What more do you want from him?

    • peter

      It’s a pointless double edges sword. If he throws 26 tds and 9 picks the defense and running game are winning the games and he needs to ‘show more,’ to be considered elite.

      If he’s 99% of the teams total offense he ‘needs to take what the defense gives him. ‘. Of course not factoring that calling a first half of running plays that go nowhere and having a defense that led or almost led allowing the other team to convert on third and long…….probably makes you press more and probably precludes you, if your trying to win that is, from taking what the defense gives you.

      I decided that I’m not getting upset by the armchair coaches who think Russel Wilson isn’t seeing the field. Until the team moves back to middle of the road for run offense, until there are more than two proven wr’s (not good or great mind you, just proven) until there’s a te that is good for more than 1.5 tds and 24 catches a year…..I’m not feeling the “Wilson needs to improve,” talk. That’s not even getting into the terrible run game or the defense wanting to blame the offense last year even while the wheels were falling off.

      • Mark Souza

        Russell had a 5 or 6 game stretch in 2015 where he had turned a corner and become elite. It started with the Pittsburgh game. Up until then, Russ wouldn’t throw the ball until he saw clear separation between his receiver and defender. I don’t know if that’s the way he always played, or because the coaching staff pounded ball security into his head and avoiding turnovers. The result was he held the ball too long and often the play would break down.

        Playing Pittsburgh, he was finally anticipating separation. Most times, the best separation a receiver will see is coming out of a break. Shortly after the break, DB’s are behind and react and reattach themselves to the receiver again. To take advantage of that, a quarterback has to anticipate the separation and deliver the ball at or before the break. Wilson didn’t used to do that. At the end of 2015, he did, and the passing game clicked along on all cylinders. I was so excited for New Russ to debut in 2016. It didn’t happen. He stopped anticipating the break and went back to his old motis operandi.

        Russell may be the best in the league at extending plays and creating something after a play breaks down. But frequently the reason the play broke down and he’s forced to create is because he held the ball too long and failed to deliver it when it should of been thrown. Yes, Russell and the team will be much better with a potent run game. But we would be exponentially better if Russ got back to anticipating routes and getting the ball out on time the way he did at the end of 2015.

        • peter

          fair but still have to have recievers and tes that he can rely on and they must get back on schedule so every pass isnt a deep strike attempt to.catch up to the game.

    • lil'stink

      “What more do you want from him?”

      Some consistency would be nice. Hopefully a run game gives him that. But he really did look like a lower tier QB for large stretches of games last year. And I still contend that his stats last year were somewhat fools gold. The games against Tennessee and JAX are perfect examples, go back and watch them again if you can. Large stretches of really poor QB play followed by shredding prevent defenses late in the game to put up big numbers but not win the game.

      Yeah, Wilson needs more help from the running game. But there are lots of areas he needs to improve on.

  49. CharlieTheUnicorn

    The Browns

    They have actually been making pretty decent moves imo. If players did not fit, they have let them go. They do have to spend a certain amount of money each year / salary floor. So, over paying for a few guys is not that big of deal. Better to over pay a few smaller parts than over pay for a QB (Kirk Cousins).

    Is the head coach the right guy for the job? I’m not sure / TBD.
    Should they draft Allen or Darnold? This one I go back and forth on…..
    Darnold being the blue collar “type” to some extent and Allen being the Wentz 2.0 or Rothlesburger 2.0 type of player. Perhaps the safe pick is the right one, since they just need solid QB play for more than 4 games a year.

    The reason why I mention the Browns on here, they control 2 premium draft picks and are primed to drastically upset the draft apple cart if they draft 2 position players with #1 and #4 (for example DE Chubb and RB Barkley) causing a cascade of players to slide down the draft and also still be available for Seattle at #18, which we had always assumed would be LONG gone by their pick. I can honestly say, I’ve heard almost no one mention this scenario. Would it be the right move, probably not… but it is the Browns.

    • Georgia Hawk

      Makes a lot of sense for the Browns to trade up with the Hawks for #18. They’ll need a Joe Thomas replacement now and the QB rush will push a top 15 player down to that range. Grab your franchise QB at #1, Barkley at #4 and a blocker for both at #18. In fact it makes so much sense that it probably wont happen.

      • Rad_man

        If there’s a Joe Thomas replacement at 18 the Seahawks should take him and consider the entire draft an epic win.

        • Rob Staton

          Yeah, and while they’re there maybe they can draft the next Deion Sanders to fill the hole at cornerback and maybe find another Beast Mode to fix the run… 😂

  50. Millhouse-serbia

    Bama S Ronnie Harrison visiting the Seahawks.

    • Sean-O

      Justin Reid & Harrison both scheduled? For a team that has lots of safeties on the roster currently, they’re sure exploring all of their options.

      • peter

        Makes me worried that pc is not feeling it with hills development. Mentioned many times before but he would praise chancellor when he was an understudy to milloy but he says really nothing about Delano hill.

        • Logan Lynch

          Maybe reading too much into it, but Hill seemed really laid back and soft spoken whenever I heard him on interviews last year. Maybe he’s not one of those “dawgs” that Bennett was talking about. Chancellor is soft-spoken in the media a bit, but you can tell he’s a badass. I didn’t get that vibe from Hill.

          Same for Darboh actually. I really want to have high hopes for him too, but this nagging feeling is telling me David Moore will turn out better. No idea why, just a hunch.

          • Mark Souza

            I have it on good authority (not really) that they’re going to move one of those safeties to running back, and another RT. If only we can find a safety to play the LEO.

            • Logan Lynch

              We need a new K and possibly P. Have one of the extra safeties do both and save a roster spot!

      • Rob Staton

        Have you got a source for the Ronnie Harrison visit? Can’t find anything online.

        • Logan Lynch

          Only source I’ve seen on this is he who shall not be named on Twitter. Hint: the Seahawks front office watches his profile.

          • Rob Staton

            That’s the only thing I can see too.

            But who are we to doubt the oracle? 🍆

            • Logan Lynch

              Careful, he probably knows you’re talking about him right now…

              Honestly, sometimes I root for the players he doesn’t like just because I want to see the reaction. Then again, I’m a terrible person.

    • Millhouse-serbia

      I really don’t understand this visit. He is SS and late 1st early 2nd round pick.

      • peter

        You don’t understand it, or you don’t want to understand it…..joking. Seattle scares me with some of the visits and work outs.

        A couple of early safeties, kalen ballage who realistically is a fifth round pick at best that you hope does anything.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Makes sense.

      Maybe they want to see more workout from him. I can only find his jumps

  51. Largent80

    Regarding Prosise. I think one almost has to assume that he won’t stay healthy, so the Hawks must check out guys like Ballage who will be available later.

    It’s pretty frustrating to think all of Seattles RB’s are injured more than healthy. I’m just hoping they get an RB that can break tackles, because that is the mauling style that makes the offense work.

  52. Millhouse-serbia

    @ rapaport

    The #Seahawks briefly considered free agent S Eric Reid this offseason. … Today they are hosting his brother #Stanford S Justin Reid on a visit, I’m told.

  53. Kenny Sloth

    Anybody see Ronnie Harrison in this little sideline fight?

    He’s very raw and takes bad angles a lot. Has huge upside as a hitter. Wish I had his full combine.

    He feels like an extremely seahawky pick

  54. Scott Mc

    The problem is Kirk does NOT fit the current Seahawks WR profile. Every JS/PC WR except for Kenny Lawler (who has already been questioned as the strangest JS/PC pick in their history) hit a 10′ broad jump; Kirk had a 9’7″. Every JS/PC WR except Kris Durham hit a less-than 4.39 20-yard shuttle; Kirk had a 4.45. Finally, every JS/PC WR except Golden Tate hit a less-than 7.04 3-cone (and most are under 6.9); Kirk hit a 7.09.

    • Rob Staton

      Vertical and forty might be more important. Long speed and catching radius

      • Kenny Sloth

        What were some ideals for the safety spots

        I seem to remember that being a very diverse group in terms of size and athleticism

        • Rob Staton

          Hard to single anything out. They’ve drafted fast and slow free safety’s, athletic and hard hitting strong safety’s. Real mix.

          • Kenny Sloth

            Also we met with Tony Brown and he got a big ole mouth on him

      • SheHawk

        New OC can’t read too much into older “profiles” Is there a link to where the updated list of visits are. Its the single most telling piece of insight left leading up to draft day ( other than trades )

        • Rob Staton

          A new OC but the same HC and GM — and ultimately this is Pete’s show.

    • Sea Mode

      Lawler was a late R7 pick. I wouldn’t worry too much about them bending their rules for him.

      On Tate and Kirk, they are guys who play faster than they test on the field, and they win with strength more often than pure quickness anyway.

      Personally, I think our WR corps is better off anyway with someone who offers a different profile than the others, rather than just a bunch of similar guys.

  55. Greg Haugsven

    two weeks from today gentlemen, the draft is getting closer.

    • clbradley17

      Look forward to us trading back, back, back and out of the 1st again, having 5 or 6 picks on day 2, including the probable 2 additional day 2 picks for an ET trade and another from picking up an extra 4th from one of our trades back with our 1st, then combining it with another pick to go back up getting someone we like in round 2 or 3 like JS did for Jarran Reed 2 years ago.

      News of workouts starting as soon as conditioning early next week, per Brady Henderson of ESPN: “The dates for the Seahawks’ offseason workout program are set. It begins April 16. OTAs are May 21-22, May 24, May 29-30, June 1, June 4-7. Minicamp is June 12-14. The Seahawks will also have a rookie minicamp either the first or second weekend after the draft.”

  56. Kenny Sloth

    Tony Brown from Bama is really good and is gonna be great value because of his schools depth.

    Current 3-5th round projections sound like a steal

    • Kenny Sloth

      Choice interview and apparent s*** talker extraordinaire

    • Sea Mode

      Love him. He’s been a R5 lock in my mocks for a while now.

  57. FuzzyLogic

    Maurice Hurst ~ Why is nobody talking about this guy as a top 10 player? Best and maybe only legit inside pass rusher in the draft and he can basically replace Bennett with better upside. If we trade back to like 25 or something and Hurst is still there I would be hard pressed not to believe the Hawks would run to the podium.

    • Rob Staton

      He’s good but he’s not a top-10. One gap defender, not going to hold up against the run at his size. Might be a pass rush specialist. He’s very good at what he does but teams will target him in the run game. Will be at his best in a heavy rotation, working passing situations. Limits his value. Some teams will like him a lot more than others.

      • FuzzyLogic

        Yeah….like us.

        • Rob Staton

          Well maybe. It’s possible. But you’ve also got to weigh up how early you want to take a player who has the same snap count as Jordan Hill and might be a weakness in tight games that become a battle in the trenches.

  58. Kenny Sloth

    Updated Seahawks visits

    No ronnie harrison confirmation yet this morning

    Kyle Allen^, QB, Houston (WOR, PRI)
    Abdullah Anderson, DT, Bucknell (WOR)
    Kalen Ballage, RB, Arizona State (WOR)
    Andrew Brown, DT/3-4DE, Virginia (PRI)
    Tony Brown, CB, Alabama (PRO)
    Will Dissly, TE, Washington (COM)
    Leighton Vander Esch, ILB, Boise State (PRI)
    Poona Ford, DT, Texas (PRI)
    Dallas Goedert^, TE, South Dakota State (WOR, PRI)
    Shaquem Griffin, OLB, Central Florida (COM)
    Derrius Guice, RB, LSU (PRO)
    Khalid Hill, FB, Michigan (PRI)
    Manase Hungalu, ILB, Oregon State (WOR)
    Natrell Jamerson, S, Wisconsin (PRO)
    Christian Kirk, WR, Texas A&M (WOR)
    Keith Kirkwood, WR, Temple (PRI)
    Cole Madison, OT, Washington State (PRI)
    Kolton Miller, OT, UCLA (PRO)
    Ryan Nall, FB, Oregon State (COM)
    Nick Nelson, CB, Wisconsin (PRO)
    Foye Oluokun, OLB, Yale (PRI)
    Dante Pettis, WR, Washington (PRO)
    Justin Reid, S, Stanford (PRI)
    Josh Sweat^, DE/3-4OLB, Florida State (PRO, PRI)
    Simeon Thomas, CB, La.-Lafayette (PRI)
    Akrum Wadley, RB, Iowa (SR
    Zaire Franklin, LB, Syracuse
    Maurice Hurst, DT, Michigan

    • FuzzyLogic

      As I was going down the list I noticed a few players the seahawks met with twice instead of once:

      Kyle Allen^, QB, Houston (WOR, PRI)

      Dallas Goedert^, TE, South Dakota State (WOR, PRI)

      Josh Sweat^, DE/3-4OLB, Florida State (PRO, PRI)

      Maybe we should look a little closer at these guys.

      • Kenny Sloth

        Be my guest!

        Maybe even look back at who else they met with multiple times to see if it happened.

        • FuzzyLogic

          You would think the ‘Private’ workouts would take precedence too.

          Andrew Brown, DT/3-4DE, Virginia

          Leighton Vander Esch, ILB, Boise State

          Poona Ford, DT

          Khalid Hill, FB

          Keith Kirkwood, WR

          Cole Madison, OT

          Foye Oluokun, OLB

          Justin Reid, S

          Simeon Thomas, CB

          These guys I’m not sure of: Do you know Kenny?

          Akrum Wadley, RB, Iowa (SR

          Zaire Franklin, LB, Syracuse

          Maurice Hurst, DT, Michigan

          • Greg Haugsven

            Dorrance Armstrong and Jacob Pugh as well.

          • clbradley17

            Amazes me the small amount of private visits we’ve had when we’re allowed 30. Only 2 weeks to go, and we’ve only had 12. Check out the list of visits etc. for all teams on this page, the Eagles, Giants, Bucs, on and on, look like they’ve had 2-4 times as many as the Seahawks, but those include Combine or Senior Bowl meetings, pro day workouts, etc.


            • Kenny Sloth

              We only know of*

    • C-Dog

      Breeland Speaks, DT, Ole Miss

  59. RWIII

    Hopefully John Schneider can trade down from 18 in the N.F.L. draft. But if for some reason he can’t. I would hope he can take either a defensive end or an offensive tackle. The Hawks usually don’t pick this high (18) in the draft. So they might not get an opportunity to take some one this high again. Yes the Hawks have Duane Brown. But for how long. Plus they are unsure at right tackle. On the other hand you can ALWAYS use another pass rusher. So either OT/DE.

    • FuzzyLogic

      IF it was the case that we didn’t have a trade partner that made sense…like somebody trying to low-ball us and we decide to stay pat instead I would consider these guys if they fell to us:

      ~ Calvin Ridley

      ~ Maurice Hurst

      ~ Marcus Davenport

      ~ Kolten Miller

      ~ Harold Landry

      ~ Rojo

      ~ Isaiah Wynn

      ~ LVE

      I think all of these guys are studs and will probably be there at 18 or close to it.

  60. RWIII

    Mason Rudolph. What is the downside of Mason Rudolph. Who ever gets him is going to get a steal. I know the Mel Kipers and the Todd McShay’s of the world throw the term “steal” all the time. But Mason Rudolph is a steal. Here is some of this highlights.

    Folks this guy threw for over 4900 yards. Rudolph had 37 TDs and 9 picks. His completion percentage was 65%. Whoever gets Rudolph IS going to get a STEAL.

    • FuzzyLogic

      I’ve liked Rudolph for awhile now and don’t understand how he’s not in the 1st round talk anymore. Maybe I’m missing something but I personally would put him right behind Rosen and Darnald.

    • Rob Staton

      He also plays in an offense notorious for doubling the field and creating massive production. This offense helped Brandon Weeden become a first round pick despite being in his late 20’s.

      • Trevor

        The QBs that come from a scheme like that are so hard to evaluate. But Pat Mahomes, Case Keenum and others have come from a system like that too.

        I still think Rudolph goes to the Pats at #31 if they miss on Jackson and Mayfield.

      • AndrewP

        TBF; Cleveland’s stupidity helped the most with this

  61. RWIII

    I forgot 1 stat on Ruloph. His average yards per ATTEMPT was 10.0. His completion percentage is legit. He wasn’t just dinking and dunking to get a good completion percentage.

    • FuzzyLogic

      Agreed. I think he’s legit and will be a steal for anyone in the 2nd-3rd round range. Patriots?

    • Trevor

      I liked him all year too and think he goes Rd #1 later to NE.

  62. Rad_man

    If PC and JS still want an athletic freak, unique trait, special athlete, Ballage is their guy. He power cleans 343 pounds, bench presses 360 and squat 513.

    He’s 230 lbs and hit 23.3 mph in practice. That’s faster than Fournette ever did. In fact it’s faster than everyone in the NFL except Tyreke Hill.

    And Chris Carson squats 600 lbs, was knocked for not running with power, and taught himself to do so. Football outsiders loves Carson’s broken tackle and elusiveness rating- best or among the best in the NFL.

    The Lynch years are an outlier for Pete, who has always had a RB by committee approach. A group of Carson, Ballage, Prosise, and Mike Davis/JD strikes me as something Pete and John would quite enjoy.

    I also believe the ground game improved dramatically the day they changed coaching staff.

    • Rob Staton

      You could easily be right about that group of RB’s. Might be a group Pete feels he can work with.

      To me it just looks like a bunch of runners who promise much and, so far, have delivered little.

      Get the toughest, most aggressive, productive players you can get for your running game. That would be my mantra.

      You’re not setting the tone with a bunch of athletes.

      • Trevor

        I am with you Rob I would like to see more guys with production instead of promise.

        That being said I have thought for quite a while that RB is further down on the list of priorities for PC / JS than people here on the blog seem to think.

        I think they will draft a guy like Ballage on day #3, add a couple of UDFA at RB then go to camp and let the competition play out. Pete will probably see how the changes to scheme and the OL work out and let this group of RBs try to prove themselves then if it does not workout RB early RB early next year.

        Remember Pete is on the record as saying Carson was his guy and his pick last year. I think he is going to give him every chance the be the guy. Whether or not that is a wise decision I am unsure to be honest.

        • TTownHawk

          I think he would like to have him be the guy, but you can’t count on a player with 4 career games to be the guy. And I think Pete knows that. I think the only reason they may not draft an RB until day 3 is because of their lack of draft capital, so if they can’t trade down they may not have a choice. But I think acquiring an RB is definitely a priority, they’ve consistently emphasized the need to repair the run game this offseason. Your current RB situation isn’t going to cut it, zero depth behind Carson so they need to bring in some competition.

        • Tecmo Bowl

          ” I have thought for quite a while that RB is further down on the list of priorities for PC / JS than people here on the blog seem to think.” Trevor

          You could be right. Judging from the lack of connection-visits, workouts etc.- it appears that RB is more of a day 3 priority. Have to admit a backfield of Carson, Ballage, Prosise, Davis is well rounded and plenty talented. None of those players are the type you can hang your hat on though. Falls under – “availability is the best ability”. I have a hard time believing that JS/PC would view drafting Ballage as THE fix to the run game. Would love to see Ballage, after getting one of the top 7 RB’s, take Mr. Glass’s roster spot.

          • TTownHawk

            +1. I would like to see us trade down, take an RB on day 2, then Ballage if he is still on the board in the 5th (which he should be). We have something like 3 or 4 5th rounders, that would be great value. Or another RB later in the draft if not Ballage. I am still really high on John Kelly, though they haven’t been linked to him at all :/

            • Rad_man

              All that said Carson led the entire league in broken tackles per carry before he got hurt and has more nfl carries than anyone in the draft. I get that some of these dudes produced in college but we shouldn’t pretend they’re proven nfl backs either.

              I’m of the opinion Carson has the talent to be a star in the league. Pete graded him as a second round talent. Ride that horse. He’s good.

              • Rob Staton

                Nobody would deny Carson has talent

                That’s not the issue

                It’s availability

      • Lewis

        I think a fair counter argument to what Rad_Man is suggesting is that when you don’t have “the guy” you go with multiple guys, and vice-versa. So did PC use a committee because he wanted to or because it was necessary?

        Me? I like a good ol’ two-headed monster with a bruiser and a change of pace.

        • Drew

          a la Reggie Bush and Lendale White

  63. FuzzyLogic

    “Going back through to 2010, John Schneider and Pete Carroll’s first year running Seahawks’ drafts, the pre-draft VMAC visits list has been an important one to study. Last season, we tracked 26 of the 30 allowed official VMAC visits, using sources and twitter, and of those players, seven (Mark Glowinski, Terry Poole, Frank Clark, Josh Shirley, Tory Slater, Kristjan Sokoli, and Justin Hamilton) ended up in Seattle at one point or another.”

    I found some private workout lists of previous years and these guys were on them.

    ~ G. Ifedi

    ~ R. Ohdiambo

    ~ G. Fant

    2017 Visits (Private)

    ~ Shaquill Griffin

    ~ Malik McDowell


    ~ Chris Harper

    ~ Mike Davis

    ~ Kristjan Sokoli

    ~ Frank Clark


    ~ Paul Richardson

    ~ Cassius Marsh

    ~ Brock Coyle


    ~jeremy Lane

    ~ Deshawn Shead

    ~ Korey Toomer

    ~ Bobby Wagner

    • FuzzyLogic

      I would say there’s a pretty good chance of us taking AT LEAST 2 players on the 2018 list.

      • Kenny Sloth

        Its worth noting that they literally said that every couple years they use their workouts as smokescreens

        They totally change methodology to be unpredictable on purpose so

        Take these with a granary of salt

  64. FuzzyLogic

    So here is the ‘Private’ workout list:

    Andrew Brown, DT/3-4DE, Virginia
    Leighton Vander Esch, ILB, Boise State
    Poona Ford, DT
    Khalid Hill, FB
    Keith Kirkwood, WR
    Cole Madison, OT
    Kyle Allen^, QB
    Dallas Goedert^, TE
    Josh Sweat^, DE/3-4OLB, Florida State
    Foye Oluokun, OLB
    Justin Reid, S
    Simeon Thomas, CB
    Akrum Wadley, RB, Iowa (SR
    Zaire Franklin, LB, Syracuse
    Maurice Hurst, DT, Michigan
    Dorance Armstrong
    Jacob Pugh

    • FuzzyLogic

      I think Kirk is supposed to be on there too.

      • FuzzyLogic

        One thing strikes me right away from this list is there is no RB on it.

        • FuzzyLogic

          Oh wait. Wadley.

        • Trevor

          I think the lack of pre draft RB interest is one of 3 things

          -Huge smoke screen and they plan to go RB early
          -They already know the RBs they want to target
          -They are more content with the current RB group than people on the blog here believe and will not address the position till Day #3

          • Logan Lynch

            I like how points 1 and 3 are the exact opposite and if they draft a mid round RB you can say that was the one they wanted and use point 2. No matter what you’re right…that’s how to make a prediction bruh!

            I think they’re going to get a pass catching back for sure. Even though Russ doesn’t check down, I think Schotty is going to send his WR deep and open up the short part of the field for RBs or short routes. We’ve seen it work on other teams. Hell, that was the only way to beat the SEA defense a few years ago. SD always did it to perfection.

            • FuzzyLogic

              My thoughts exactly. I made this list awhile back with notes on all the good small backs in this draft pegged to go 3rd round or later.

              Mark Walton Miami 5’10” 202

              Good Vision. Excellent Cut back ability. Football speed better than expected.
              Decent catching ability. Legit.

              Ito Smith Southern Miss 5’9″ 195

              Good hands. Elusive. Willing blocker. Decent patience. Decent kich return abilities. Plays small.

              Nyheim Hines NC State 5’8″ 198

              Quick burst. Plays fast and tough. Good punt returner. Good player.

              Akrum Wadley Iowa 5’10” 194

              Excellent get off. Shifty. Good balance. Excellent football player. Incredible in open space. My favorite small RB so far. Should be a 3rd round pick.

              Justin Jackson Northwestern 6’0″ 199

              North/South runner but has good cut back. Patient. Plays bigger than he is.
              Hits the hole fast when he sees it. Gritty with good head on his shoulders. Very Seahawky. Well built for under 200lbs. Tough dude.

              Roc Thomas Jacksonville St 5’10” 198

              High-hip-glider with excellent football speed in space. Would be a nice Prosise replacement if need be. Not my favourite type of RB.

              Justin Crawford West Virginia 5’11” 199

              Runs hard. Quick feet. Runs with excellent center of gravity. Elusive with excellent vision. Would love to see the Hawks pick this up.

              • Lewis

                You are missing my favorite, Martez Carter.

            • Trevor

              I was not trying to make a prediction in any way at all. My point was I have no clue what way they they are going at RB. Wow

              • Volume12

                Point 3 is underrated Trev. Been saying it.

                Don’t create a logjam.

              • Logan Lynch

                My comment was meant to be a joke, I apologize if you took it as an insult. None of us really know what they’ll do at the end of the day.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Where did you see Pugh and Armstrong

  65. 12th chuck

    Anyone else relieved we didn’t draft Foster last year? As it goes, we could’ve done much worse when it comes to Malik draft pick, could’ve been a serious trouble maker, or taking a roster spot with limited production

    • FuzzyLogic

      I remember after the draft last year talking to 49er fan and he thanked me for the Seahawks letting him slide to them.

      • TTownHawk

        You should call him up today and say “you’re welcome”

      • Volume12

        That didnt age well did it? Dude was getting outplayed by Ray Ray Armstrong anyways.

    • Volume12

      I still think Cam Robinson was their guy and they point blanked missed on him.

      • TTownHawk

        I wanted them to draft him or Ramczyk SO BADLY. Man that one stings. If they do, I don’t think they make the Richardson or Brown trades and we still have all of our picks. Well, maybe the Richardson one, but I think they go after a different 3 tech if they pass on MM. Man, that whole situation hurts.

    • 503Hawk

      Did you guys see the list of felonies he is charged with? Even if the courts show some leniency, I would suspect he will miss some time due to suspension. For his sake, I hope he learns from it.

  66. Robert Las Vegas

    Rob what do you think the possibility of Cleveland drafting Barkley one and Chubb at 4 and if Jackson is still on the board at 18 .trading with Seattle for That you see this as a possibility. Or do see Cleveland drafting a QB at one

  67. Mexican Hawk

    To me the most interesting (not most important) thing of this Kaepernick situation is that the team has used Ian Rapoport to spread their side of story. We all know they use him and JLC, but that can provide insight to Earl situation and how that might evolve.

    As per Kaepernick I think they did take a misstep as with how it might be perceived on the internet and in real life. It was just a shout out to hey how are going go about it, they should have postponed with a fixed later date so as to not create this scenario.

    Hawks have been organization that has given more leeway in this regard. National pundits should take whole picture into consideration. Pete will pull thru for this issue and clear things up.

    I have always wanted them to sign Kap. We’ll see

    • Tecmo Bowl

      Think this whole story with Kap can be summed up with JS repeating ‘all football’ 10 times. They don’t want all the drama outside of the playing field. PC flat out said the off field stuff with Bennett had a negative impact on the Titans loss.

      I’m for signing Kap too. He’d be a stellar backup QB. Can understand it if we pass on all the drama though.

    • Volume12

      Stupid. Seattle just outright admitted they postpone it because of he won’t stop kneeling. They ain’t even trying to hide it.

      More terrible publicity for a team that’s ‘changing.’ Pete is the master of blowing smoke up your a**.

      • Tecmo Bowl

        Not sure how its terrible publicity for the Hawks. Most jobs have stipulations in order to gain/keep employment. The Hawks are making it clear they don’t want added drama. They aren’t the only team to have that stance. They are the only team that is willing to give Kap a chance. Personally i don’t have a problem at all with players kneeling. The struggle is very real. Unforetunetly the drama is too. The goal is to win games and the drama gets in the way.

      • Mishima

        Agree / 100%

        Wonder how this affects a Brown extension…

        Straight bush league.

        • 503Hawk

          I think I missed a noteworthy news item. Would someone show a link to the story.

      • sdcoug

        And? The Seahawks are a business. If they think a player (or a player’s actions) might disappoint or alienate a large portion of their paying customers, of course they would think twice about creating that scenario. Business 101.

        • Hawk Eye

          I doubt signing Kap makes the hawks lose any money. For every person who protests by not renewing his season tickets, someone else will take them.
          This is about winning and losing football games, not a business decision. And if they end up signing him and Russ gets hurt, Kap plays ok, fans can live with it. The Eagles have a few prominent guys protesting and they won the SB. I don’t hear about their fans saying to get rid of them.
          Winning is good business, losing is bad business.

          • sdcoug

            For-profit organizations, football or otherwise, try to minimize drama, unnecessary distractions, and perceived negative brand-association. And they are certainly cognizant of their customers’ temperament. It doesn’t matter what you believe politically, the fact of the matter is many people do not appreciate his form of protest, or his police-pig socks, or stylizing Castro t-shirts. And frankly, your point of season-tickets is baseless. Profit comes in many forms: interest in the team, viewership, merchandise sales, etc. You’re right, winning is part of the equation. One consideration of several. And I’m sure they have weighed internally the value of paying a polarizing back-up QB whom will likely never see the field (and is an average skill set to boot), vs. a whole lot of drama and backlash (right or wrong) for a team that has taken aggressive steps to minimize both. If you think Kaep is the difference between winning and losing, I don’t know what to tell you

            • Hawk Eye

              ask Philly is having a decent back up QB can help you win.
              don’t know what to tell you….

              • Hawk Eye

                “if” not is
                need edit button

                • Thy Hawk is Howling

                  Robbie said he was planning on upgrading this Dinasour of a program later this year and we will finally have our Edit Button!

                  Go Upgrade

              • sdcoug

                Go look at the stats. Compare Kaep’s last year of significant playing time (11 games started). Now look at Austin Davis’s last year of significant playing time (8 games).

                Kaep: 2,240 yds, 59.2 comp %, 6.8 yds/attempt, 16 TD – 4 Int, 468 rushing, 9 fumbles
                Davis: 2,001 yds, 63.4 comp %, 7.0 yds/attempt, 12 TD – 9 Int, 36 rushimg, 5 fumbles

                In 3 less games, Davis only threw for 200 less yds and 4 less TDs. His completion % and avg/completion are both higher. He has a few more Ints and much less rushing yds. But are you seeing a major difference? I’m not. This doesn’t even account for the fact SF was a much tougher defense at the time, which surely benefited Kaep. Davis is also 2 yrs younger.

                Now, would anyone ever say Austin Davis is a great QB? Or the difference between the Seahawks winning and losing? No, you say? Yet his numbers are pretty darn comparable to Kaeps, and at least Davis played football the last two years.

                This isn’t an advocacy of Davis. It’s reality-check on believing Kaep is something different.

                • Kenny Sloth

                  16/4 vs 12/9

                  If you think those state lines are comparable I don’t know what to tell you

                  • sdcoug

                    So you read the part about Davis playing 3 games less? Not too different. This is a backup QB we’re talking about.

                    Btw – Kenny, I’m not the first to mention this here: you constantly attack people with your sanctimonious responses. It’s not necessary.

            • Mishima

              Sounds like “shut up and dribble” to me.

              Because it’s a race/labor issue, Title 7 / Civil Rights Act Of ’64 applies and affords protections to the players.

              Disregarding this critical component of the protests is why you ‘don’t know what to tell [us].’


              • sdcoug

                Really? Come off it. Either you’re calling the Seahawks racist or you’re calling me racist. Either way, you’re wrong and entirely out-of-line.

                • Kenny Sloth

                  YEAH STAY IN LINE MISHIMA

                  SHUT UP AND SCOUT

                  • sdcoug

                    You can truly be an ass

                  • Kenny Sloth

                    I don’t know what to tell you

                • Mishima

                  Not calling you or the Seahawks racist.

                  Only differentiating between this issue and your lazy comparison to traditional businesses.


              • AlaskaHawk

                And this is why the whole issue is a distraction.

    • Mac

      I wouldn’t sign Kap. Nobody who hangs out with anti-semites like Louis Farrakhan and Linda sarsour. It’d be like signing an offensive linemen who praises Richard Spencer.
      I’d be extremely disappointed in a Kap signing.

      • Hawk Eye

        Semites are Arabs and Jews, so if you don’t want to sign anyone that is friends with someone that does not like one of those 2 groups, we might not get a 53 man roster

  68. Jason

    Observation of the day…I find it interesting that we are not seeing a lot of OL in the private workouts or visits. Only one on the list above is Cole Madison and he could just be a local visit.

    • FuzzyLogic

      I noticed that as well.

      • Jason

        Maybe Rob is right. They might feel that they have spent enough draft capital on the line.

  69. Sea Mode

    Here is last year’s workout/meeting/visit tracker and eventual draft slot I put together right after last year’s draft. Was just looking over it yesterday to try and draw some conclusions.

    1. The vast majority of the players, especially VMAC visitors, are ones with some kind of question mark hanging over them, be it on or off the field. They keep the clean prospects they know they like under wraps (cf. Pocic).

    2. The amount of visits are more or less proportionate to the rounds they have the most picks. Lots of R2+R3 guys last year. If you sort the table by the overall column, it is easy to see who was still available to the Hawks at certain draft slots, like pick 90, for example.

    3. Most visits of our mid-round picks we only came to know about after the draft when it was revealed in their conference call. The Hawks are better than we think at keeping the guys they really like under wraps.

    • Volume12

      Yes. That’s what the visits are for. Guys that are clean? No reason to bring them in. Your comfortable with them. It’s lying season after all. Stay away from who you want. don’t put best on them.

      Lastly, stick to the Ted Thompson m.o. Use the majority of your visits on UDFAs. It’s recruiting all over again.

      • Volume12


  70. Trevor

    Hawks really bungled that whole Kapernick mess. All they had to do was bring him in then work him out and discuss things. Then if they don’t like what he has to say they don’t sign him like they have with lots of other free agents.

    I don’t think it is as much about activism as it is about pcjs wanting to bring the focus back to football rather than everything else. The last thing you need is a backup QB who is a distraction. For any reason.

    Seems like Kaps lawyers are probably making this a much bigger story than it is being that he is in the middle of a lawsuit against the NFL.

    All NFL players should look at Doug Baldwin and how he handles his business off the field and the true impact he is having with regard to actual change in policy etc. imo that is what social activism truly is. Actually doing something to bring about change and help society. Not sure kneeling does that but I guess it starts conversation.

    • SoCal12

      Well to be fair they still might meet with him in the future, and if this was just one of those polite ‘we’ll call you’ turn-downs I don’t see why bringing him in would’ve changed things. Honestly though I just think this whole things a big nothing burger and don’t see why it should reflect badly on either party.

    • Volume12

      But, but they asked nicely if he’d stop. And then turned it into, we wanted to see what he was gonna do next as if that would get them applauded of something.

      • SoCal12

        Honestly I don’t think any of us were actually there and know what went on. I don’t think it’s fair to just speculate on intent and then definitively call them out on what you ‘think’ happened.

        • Volume12

          ‘The Seahawks did postpone a tentatively scheduled workout with Kap, as Adam Schefter reported. It was not because he declined to stop kneeling, tho. The team asked for his plan moving forward on how to handle everything and there was not a firm plan’ -Ian Rappoport

          • SoCal12

            Yeah that’s second hand tweet on what happened. It also doesn’t say anything about ‘asking nicely if he’d stop’ or turning it into something else. Which is something that you speculated went on, but very well might not have been what went on.

            • Volume12

              So they didn’t ask him if he’d stop? They demanded or something? That elephant in the room wasn’t adressed?

              No it’s not like an NFL team to save face.

              • SoCal12

                I don’t know that’s the point. They might have asked him what’s going on with your protest and he said he won’t stop what he’s doing now. Or they might not have, and asked directly, nicely or otherwise, that he stop or they won’t meet with him.

                I’m not going to pretend like I know for sure what went on though, and then judge them for it. And this is coming from someone who thinks Kaep should be in the league as backup at least by the way. I’m just not a fan of snap judgements without all the facts.

  71. Frank

    Seems simple to me, Seahawks want players that are “all football”. Clearly the organization has a product to sell, football. People will pay to see football, no one is paying to watch people protest. I have no problem with the statement the players where making, but should be done on their own time to not be a distraction to the team, and a disappointment to the people paying the bills( the fans). Make your social statement on Twitter, do TV and Radio interviews to draw attention to your cause, but do your damb job, stand up and be counted with your team, and help the people creating the right for you to be millionaires and play the damb game, without the need to draw attention away from the team and game during the game. Still hope they sign Cap, and Ried, but show up, shut up, and do your job if you want a paycheck.

    • Hawk Eye

      i get your point, but the government is making a political statement by playing the anthem before the game and doing flyovers with military jets, etc. Pretty sure the players protesting see that and make their own statement.
      If you want to get politics out of sports, stop playing the anthem and stop the other political acts. Which I would be fine with, actually happy. But I think it is too late

      • Frank

        It’s not that I disagree, but the government is paying quite a lot for that advertising. The fans also pay a tremendous amount of money either thru ticket sales, merchandise, and watching advertisements. The players are putting their bodies on the line, but are rewarded quite well monetarily, and there purpose in this business venture is as an entertainer. I’m definitely not saying they shouldn’t use their platform as athletes to push for social justice and change, but don’t do it in the 2 hours once a week we are paying you to be an entertainer. At that point they are hurting the product that pays for their livelihood and the only reason they have a platform at all. If you don’t respect the game or your team enough to do your job during business hours and nothing else till after you take off the company uniform, then you probably don’t deserve employment in that industry.

        • Hawk Eye

          a lot more complicated than that, and teams have to be careful about alienating some of their players also.

          when the government “advertises” it is called propaganda, rarely to your actual benefit.
          beware then they give you “bread and circuses” and avoid issues

          need to get back to football now

  72. AlaskaHawk

    Any chatter about St. Brown with Notre Dame? Big receiver at 6-5, seems as speedy as everyone else. Projected 2-3 round.

  73. Volume12

    Yes! Kemoko Turay is a VMAC visitor.

    • SoCal12

      I really like him as an EDGE prospect in the 2-4 rounds. Would like to pick him, Eijiofer, or Green as the DE prospect for this draft.

    • Kenny Sloth

      Yessssss so good

  74. RWIII

    Kemoko Turay had a 1.62 in the 10 yard dash.

    Frank Clark had a 1.69 in the 10 yard dash.

    Cliff Avril had a 1.51.

    No doubt Turay is a possibility.

    • Rob Staton

      Clark also carried an extra 30lbs so not a great conparison.

      Turay’s split isn’t bad but it’s not elite. I like him but he’s a R3 for me.

      • RWIII

        I agree. Turay is a 3rd rounder. What is interesting is that his weight is all over the place.

© 2024 Seahawks Draft Blog

Theme by Anders NorenUp ↑