Would the Seahawks trade for Jadeveon Clowney?

Back in May I wrote an article considering the possibility of a Jadeveon Clowney trade. This was before Seattle signed Ziggy Ansah.

In the last 24 hours multiple reports have suggested the Texans are ready to deal Clowney. It’s starting to feel inevitable he’ll move on before the start of the season.

Make no mistake — he’s a fantastic player.

In the last three years he’s accumulated 54 TFL’s. In 2017 his 21 TFL’s ranked #2 in the league and in 2016 he led the NFL with 17. Last year he had 16 but only ranked at #11.

In comparison, Frank Clark had only 11 TFL’s in 2018 and had 32 over the last three seasons.

This video from Brett Kollmann further highlights how effective Clowney has been in Houston:

So what are the chances of the Seahawks being one of the teams to show interest?

They pride themselves on being ‘in’ on every deal so if Clowney is being shopped, there’s a decent chance they’ve at least assessed their options. They currently have about $24m in available cap space this year and they have plenty next year too so that’s not a problem. They also possess a haul of 2020 draft picks including two second and third rounders.

The roster looks deep across the board with the only major question mark being the pass rush. The Seahawks aren’t a million miles away from being seriously competitive and Clowney has the kind of game-wrecking talent they lack on the defensive line (unless Ansah can rekindle his best form).

He’s also only 26-years-old. Any deal for Clowney could secure a player ready to enter his prime much in the way Cliff Avril and Michael Bennett did from 2013 onwards.

A pass rush of Clowney and Ansah complimented by L.J. Collier and Jacob Martin would potentially address Seattle’s greatest need and set them up for another Championship window.

So why wouldn’t they make the move?

There are a few reasons.

Firstly — the Texans appear determined to add a left tackle. They’ve been short at the position since trading Duane Brown. They need to protect Deshaun Watson. Any Clowney trade likely needs to provide an obvious solution to this problem.

With Trent Williams and the Redskins currently in a stand-off — a swap of players would make legitimate sense for all concerned. Both teams would address key needs and both would be removing a headache from their roster.

You don’t often see many player-for-player trades though. It’s also possible Washington and Houston will value their players differently. The Texans might need to trade Clowney first for picks and then offer some of the stock to Washington for Williams. Regardless, swapping Clowney for Williams could interest both teams.

Secondly — this will be a really difficult deal to pull off. The deadline has passed for Clowney to sign a long-term extension this year per the rules of the franchise tag. Any potential buyer will have to wait until the off-season and run the risk of losing him in free agency. For that reason, it’ll likely have a big impact on how teams value a trade. Yet the Texans equally aren’t going to want to give him away. Finding a fair level of compensation will be tricky for any team looking to part with picks.

It’s worth noting though that his salary will be between $19-21m if he’s franchised again in 2020. That’s about the going rate for a top pass rusher. The tag would provide security for a buying team in a trade and likely set the table for a long term extension. His contract status isn’t prohibitive in this instance — it’s just hard to make a deal for a player you’re only guaranteed to have for one or two seasons. When the Chiefs traded a 2019 first and a 2020 second rounder for Frank Clark — they immediately extended his contract to protect the investment. Does a buyer get a discount on Clowney because they can’t act? And are the Texans willing to accept anything less than the Clark trade compensation?

Thirdly — the Seahawks appear to be turning over a new leaf. They were very aggressive at the end of the LOB era. They traded for Brown at left tackle (a success) and for Sheldon Richardson (not so much) and lost serious draft stock for consecutive years. Now they’ve finally got a haul of picks waiting in 2020. The entire roster has been energised by a youth movement. Continuing to acquire young talent appears to be the approach rather than returning to bold veteran trades.

While there’s clearly an issue with the pass rush it also seems they’re willing to try and manage the situation. Carroll admitted, somewhat frankly, they were ‘looking for the blitzer’s’ against Denver. Finding ways to create pressure without relying on the rushers might be their aim. Whether it works or not remains to be seen — yet Seattle’s defense wasn’t a massive liability in 2018 with a similar problem. They relied on Frank Clark and Jarran Reed for pressures. Clark has gone but Reed will return after six weeks of the regular season. Ansah has provided a cheap solution to Clark, albeit on a temporary basis.

The Seahawks seemingly didn’t show any interest in Gerald McCoy or Mike Daniels after they were made available despite having the cap room to make a move. A big splash, weeks before the season, seems a bit more 2013-2017 than 2018-19.

Even so, there’s one more thing to consider. Listen to the audio below and fast-forward to 10:45…

Brock Huard says the defensive and offensive linemen went 1v1 at training camp yesterday. Usually this is a drill that suits the D-liners. Huard states there was only one clean win for the defense in the session (a concern).

He goes on to say Duane Brown dominated, that Jacob Martin had a rough outing, that Cassius Marsh had a couple of decent rushes and that Poona Ford and Jarran Reed bull-rushed competently. Overall it was poor from the pass rushers though and he ended the piece by emphasising Barkevious Mingo in particular had a ‘tough day’.

Gregg Bell at the TNT also wrote about Mingo here:

Mingo’s pass-rush drill Tuesday wasn’t much better than his subpar one Monday. Or his one from Sunday. Actually, it was worse.

On consecutive snaps, Mingo got thrown to the ground by an offensive lineman, starter and reserve alike.

The first time reserve guard Jordan Roos pushed down Mingo to the grass when the end tried to loop inside on a two-man stunt. The second face plant came when starting right tackle Germain Ifedi rode Mingo out wide, out wider than basically belly-flopped onto his back and pushed him prone into the turf.

You have to wonder if witnessing that drill might ignite interest in a potential deal for Clowney (or to bolster the pass rush in other ways).

It really comes down to their desire to build this thing slowly with draft picks and young players complimenting the star veterans on mega money — or whether they want to be aggressive to go after a Championship right now.

Some of their previous bold moves (Sheldon Richardson, Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin) didn’t come off. For that reason alone some will say ‘no thanks’ to another splash. Here’s one thing to remember though. You’re not going to find a 26-year-old freak of nature and former #1 overall pick in the late first round next year. And the Seahawks aren’t a million miles away from being a serious challenger in the NFC.

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  1. Coleslaw

    As long as we end the trade with 1 1st, 2nd and 3rd, and don’t trade George Fant, I dont care what it takes. 2nd and 3rd. 2nd and Delano and Jamarco. Just make it happen, Schneider!

    • Coleslaw

      I’d do 2 3rds and Jamarco Jones right now honestly.

      • Rob Staton

        That’s not going to get it done.

        • Thomas Wells

          What do you think it would take to get this trade done rob? I’m very concerned about this team’s ability to get after the passer.

          • Rob Staton

            I think a first round pick probably.

            • Thomas Wells

              Thanks for the reply! I pull the trigger on that if that gets it done. He’s not just a guaranteed upgrade to a weak spot this year. He’s a potential foundational piece of you can sign him to a long term need

              • Thomas Wells

                *Long term deal

                Which is not guaranteed but it’s a risk I’m willing to take

                • Glor

                  No way should we trade a first for a rental. No ability to do a long term deal=no thanks. Just like Richardson, give up a ton for absolutely nothing.

  2. Phil

    I’m interested – because I hate watching opposing QBs stand back survey the landscape until someone pops open.
    But I really doubt the team is interested. *Not even because of the draft compensation: Schneider can make draft pick gold out of oatmeal.
    I doubt the team wants to pay any defender Frank Clark cash for 2 reasons (these are only feelings from afar):
    1. Bobby gets the most – because Bobby is not only the best, but he is the leader. If someone is paid more than Bobby, then he loses some of his spotlight as the ideal goal for every defender. Bobby exemplifies what they want their players to aspire to – someone else getting paid more will detract from his shine as the team ideal.
    2. They feel that is too expensive to play a player at what they feel is a committee position.

    • Rob Staton

      I don’t think they’ll trade for Clowney but I don’t think Wagner’s salary will be responsible. I think they’re very prepared to pay the going rate — they have done for Wilson, Wagner, Lockett a year ago and their previous big names. They paid Percy the going rate. I think they’d be willing to pay a top pass rusher the going rate too.

      I think they’ve adjusted their approach though and while they’re ‘in’ on every deal — I think they’re going to focus on building through the draft and with calculated free agent moves rather than making the big splash.

      • Phil

        Don’t you think they’ve shown an effort to change their approach on what kind of leaders they are willing to pay?
        Why didn’t they pay Frank if they are willing to simply pay the “going rate”. I believe that they will pay the going rate for the right kind of players; but are being very selective going forward about who the top guys will be. Consider: Russell, Bobby, Tyler, Duane. These men are all the kind of guys you want the others to look up to in their respective position groups.

        On the other hand, I could definitely be wrong. Maybe they think top DEs are currently overpriced. Bobby plays every snap, while D-Line is a bit more of a committee.

        • Rob Staton

          I think the reason they weren’t prepared to pay Frank is because he was set to become one of the top 3-4 paid defensive players in the league and they didn’t think he personally justified the cost. That and the fact a team was willing to pay a decent price to replenish some of their lost picks.

          But I do think they’d be prepared to pay the going rate for a top pass rusher.

          • poweroflogic

            The Seahawks made it abundantly clear they wanted to pay Clark a crap ton of money, but they believed that the entire market for proven pass rushers like Clark went out of any sensible range. More to the point, the faulty premise of all this conjecture is that Clowney is even a very good NFL pass rusher, let alone a “top pass rusher”. He is not. He is a big injury risk, however. Some data from PFF:

            2018 Ansah 10.3
            2018 Clark 8.9 #6
            2018 Clowney 6.2 #63

            2017 Ansah 8.1 #23
            2017 Clark 7.6 #34
            2017 Clowney 7.3 #43

            2016 Clark 8.5 #13
            2016 Ansah 7.0 #41
            2016 Clowney 6.4 #57

            2015 Ansah 10.3 #15
            2015 Clark 6.2 #67
            2015 Clowney 5.8 #74

            2014 Ansah 9.4 #14

            Pressure% and the related PRP metric are better predictors of future pass rush success than sacks or TFLs, and have been referenced repeatedly by Carroll and Schneider in the past. Clowney’s pressure rate is pretty consistent and pretty mediocre.

            Clowney *is* good at penetrating on run plays and generating TFLs. He is NOT very good at rushing the passer, despite the benefits of lining up with one of the top 3 game wrecking rushers of the decade.

            To this extent, in function and performance, it might actually be someone more like Snacks Harrison that is the better comparator for Clowney than Clark or Ansah (I am only half-joking). It would seem the Texans and likely most other teams have concluded, on actual empirical evidence and film review rather than hopecasting from “athletic potential” and “draft status”, that Clowney is not a top pass rusher and is not worth the salary he is looking for.

            • Rob Staton

              I’ll take TFL’s over any of those stats.

              If you’re leading the league in TFL’s you’re having an impact.

              He also has freakish athleticism and passes the eye test as a game-wrecker.

              The Brett Kollmann video highlights his quality.

              • poweroflogic

                TFLs, at least rate of TFLs, is indeed an underappreciated stat and one that illustrates exactly *how* Clowney shines — in the run game. Clowney could even subjectively be called a wrecker of sorts — in the run game. That is why a comparison to fellow run-game-wreckers like Snack Harrison may be in order.

                However, the predominance of the pass game across the NFL, for better or worse, means a good run defender will generally not wreck a game for an opposing offense. And a defensive lineman limited to this impact certainly should not command the salary level Clowney is looking for. Unless he finds some sucker team out there hoping Clowney will still come into his own as a pass rusher ‘one day’.

                But on that score the evidence is in, and Clowney, when not injured, is VERY consistenly a middle of the pack pass rusher behind the likes of Clark and Ansah (when not injured). The Seahawks would have zero interest paying long term someone with this level of pass rushing performance, having just given up a more acccomplished pass rusher in that inflated salary range that Clowney is seeking. So a one year rental, at such an unjustified rate of pay and long term cost in terms of draft capital, would make little sense except as an incredibly ‘win now’ overpay (which admittedly we have seen occasionally).

                Truth is, if they are really worred about defensive end, due to Collier’s injury, Green’s inability to step up, and general inexperience and limited talent at the position, then they may as well gamble on Nick Perry instead for a fraction of the cost. Perry’s measured pass rush performance in the last few years has been comparable to Clowney’s and he is quite ‘solid’ (though not wrecking) in the run game. But I suspect they will stand pat.

                • Eburgz

                  Great points. I agree that if we were going to pay someone top end pass rusher money, we were better off paying the home grown, more productive pass rusher. One who has been durable and earned his stripes within the system and proved he can be the top dog. There is a reason top run stuffers don’t get the same money as top pass rushers so I’d argue frank is more deserving of top DE money than Clowney as the more productive pass rusher. Clowney plays opposite JJ Watt, in a totally different scheme, and he’s had knee and other injury problems.

                  Maybe Clowney’s monster game against the hawks is skewing perception but frank was every bit the game wrecker that Clowney is. Ask the raiders. All that said I’d be down to trade for him if we can trade for him using less draft capitol than we got for frank. So I’m in for a second rounder (2nd and 3rd tops) but no more.

                  It would be fun to think we got Clowney, Ansah and Colier for Frank but I’d rather have paid Frank than Clowney. I also kinda think the pass rusher market is over inflated and no one on the defense should make more than Wags. Just really worried teams are going to be throwing the ball all over the yard on us.

  3. Denver Hawker

    You make a nice case for a trade here and it feels like the missing puzzle piece. I’d be very concerned about this being a one-year rental at the expense of a top pick and OL depth (long-time weakness). Clowney will want top DE money next year and may even avoid signing a tag. However, they won’t get Clowney’s production with a back-end 1st rounder next year either.

    I say go for it!!

  4. charlietheunicorn

    Would previous injury concerns put the brakes on any splash move by any NFL?
    He has experienced multiple injuries and wasn’t available a ton his first few years in the league.
    He is also paired with JJ Watt who demands 2x teams constantly, so he could benefit from more 1 v1 opportunities on the Texans DL.

    Now, if you do pull the trigger and buy Clowney. You could have a very formable pass rush developing…. with nice depth in the 3/4/5 pass rush spots behind Ansah and Clowney. This would remind me of the glory days of stacking ultra athletic and talented players… then throw them at the OL wave after wave, without over utilizing any single player (like MB towards the end of his time in Seattle at around 90% of snaps). Keep everyone in the 65% range of snap utilization and hopefully fresh for a playoff push. All pressure would be taken off of Collier to produce year #1 and he can sit behind 2 historical good pass rushers and marinate.

    If you can procure him for a 1st round pick, imo would be a fair trade. Possibly throw in one other pick to sweeten the pot (a 2nd or 3rd) then I think you are cooking Crisco.

  5. New Guy


    It savages the teams long term goals and successful methodology of team building. They have a goal and a good plan for getting there and maintaining a long term position of strength. Let’s not blow the schedule up.

    Let’s be patient and build this team the right way – through the draft, attractiveness for undrafted free agents and player development.

    Ignore the eye-candy.


    • Rob Staton

      I’m all for building through the draft but who can they get next year who is anywhere close to Clowney’s ability?

      • New Guy

        I just don’t think this is the head office’s choice of year for a big gamble. It’s contraindicated by the memory of recent experience.

        To answer your question directly, it’s hard to see a better player. I grant you that. If it does happen in some fashion that isn’t too destructive to JS/PC’s plan for the future, then I would cheer it on.


  6. Coleslaw

    I think Seattle will wait until Houston’s demands drop to their range. Theres no way they aren’t interested. For a team that needs pass rush and run support, Clowney is simply the cream of the crop. As noted above hes a franchise cornerstone player, going into his prime. I do think Seattle remembers the Harvin and Graham trades, though, and will be picky. If they want him, they’ll do what they can to get him, that might mean sitting back for a couple days while the market dies.

  7. Greg MI Haugsven

    If they didnt want to pay Frank then there not going to pay Clowney either. I could see a situation where they trade for him then tag and trade him next year. Not sure I would want to give up a first though. Would be interesting if it did happen. I guess it depends on how much faith they have in there current pass rush.

    • Rob Staton

      Just because they didn’t pay Frank doesn’t necessarily mean they won’t pay another player at the same position.

      • Ghost Mutt

        Especially if you end up paying a 1st-rounder for Clowney. Trading Frank for Clowney and getting a 2nd rounder as part of the deal would be highway robbery.

      • Michael Matherne

        What’s the biggest money they’ve given to a DE?

        • Rob Staton

          Paid Clemons handsomely, plus Cliff and Bennett. Market has changed since then but they’ve paid out.

  8. cha

    The whole idea has to be predicated on – they’ll only get one year of Clowney at the tag cost, and lose him in 2020 and get a 2021 3rd round comp pick. There’s no guarantees beyond 2019. They can’t even TALK to him about a contract until after the season is over.

    What is that worth? That’s really hard to gauge.

    • Rob Staton

      The tag in 2020 offers some protection

      • cha

        Ah yes. Good point.

        • Glor

          Or he just holds out on you.

  9. Troy

    Very interesting article Rob, it is easy to see both sides to this. Bottom line tho is Pete knows his pass rush is lacking, so I have to assume they would be interested in a trade.

    Biggest sticking point to me is the fact you can’t sign him long term right away, I think that is what ultimately would put the breaks on a trade (don’t want to get Sheldon Richardson’ed again.)

    If we could get him for a 2 and 3 considering the contract situation I would bite on that. I’d go as high as a 1st and 3rd if we could get him long term, but since that isn’t possible 2nd would be highest I’d go since it could easily be 1-2 year rental.

    A bevy or picks is nice, but the ability to land a proven commodity for the prime of his career has to take precedence you would think.

  10. Tony

    A 2020 1st and 2021 3rd. If we split the picks, it makes a ton of sense. Depth is looking great, this potentially solidifies our biggest need. Clark trade saved our draft this year. Were stocked now and I see this different than the previous years. On top of that Clowney is a perfect target for Carroll.

  11. Phish

    I’ll be in the camp that says no thanks. For one theres uncertainty he wouldn’t get poached after one season. It’d bring back memories of Sheldon Richardson. It’d essentially be trading Clark for Clowney, a 2020 2nd, and a swap of 3rds.

    They’re also a lot further from contention than they are close. Build through the draft, and draft/develop well. It’s significantly worked better this way than the splashy veteran trades. Risking it could set the team backwards when they’re just catching up after the last gambles. Does t seem worth it.

    • King_Rajesh

      “They’re also a lot further from contention than they are close.”

      Preach. Why don’t people see this? This team MIGHT compete for a wild card off the back of Russell Wilson alone, but we don’t have the talent to really contend for the division when the Rams still have Goff on a rookie deal.

      I don’t think ~9 sacks and ~18 TFL (which you’d hope you’d get from Clowney this year) is the difference between 9 and 11-12 wins.

      • Rob Staton

        Why are you suggesting people are blind to reality with this team? I’ve written multiple articles in the last two weeks discussing how Seattle are an off-season away from being a serious contender. Most people agreed with the sentiment.

        But that doesn’t mean that they’re bad or that a serious upgrade to the pass rush won’t accelerate their ability to genuinely compete.

        • King_Rajesh

          It’s mostly people elsewhere that are blind to reality, but upgrading the pass rush this year is a fools errand – we’re not close to contending on paper this year even with Clowney. Maybe he gets us back to 10 wins but that’s not going to be enough to catch the Rams and get a home playoff game.

          Even more so – the 2020 offseason is going to need to be perfect, and I don’t think that trading for/signing Clowney fits into what we’ll need to do. Too much draft and money capital invested into one guy.

          If we want ~9 sacks, why pay Clowney 19m when we can pay Mario Addison 9-10m next year?

          If Clowney hit the open market I’d be interested but not in a trade.

          • Rob Staton

            It’s one to thing to say, not unfairly, that this team is probably one more off-season away from being a serious force. It’s quite another to keep saying they’re ‘not close’ to competing. They are close. They have a lot of the ingredients and are just lacking in one or two areas. You’re making it sound worse than it is.

  12. Sea Mode

    I can’t say I’m not interested. It does seem like a prime pass rusher is the missing piece we need to push us into legitimate contention.

    If they feel Clowney fits our team culture and his production is worth paying top dollar more than Frank, I’d dangle our extra R2 and R3 this year plus one of our surplus DB prospects and see if they bite. Yes, they are probably hoping for a R1 pick, but might not get that offer from anyone at this point because of his contract situation.

    That would still leave us with our full draft stock this year. Not sure how it fits into our salary cap puzzle moving forward, but I understand we have plenty of space moving into next year.

    The segment by Brock was telling. We just don’t have the DL talent right now. Maybe Ansah and Collier can change that a bit once they get back out there, but even then, it still doesn’t seem to fly with PC/JS “you can never have enough pass rushers” mantra.

    So yeah, I suspect they will be somewhat aggressively in on a potential deal.

  13. Henry Taylor

    It’s a tough question, I think the team has done a great job the last couple years of avoiding the flashy and building things up the smart way. As a result they’ve got a young, hungry squad with loads of competition at multiple spots and a very healthy amount of picks and cap space.

    But is a move a bad move just because the player is a big name? Of course not, not if there’s a good value out there to be had. And they really need some pass rush.

    In the end this comes to cost, if they’re comfortable with the price (picks and contract for Clowney because no one wants a repeat of the Sheldon Richardson debacle) then they should absolutely go for it, exactly what that price should be is a very difficult question.

    • Henry Taylor

      Fwiw, I think Pete could bring out the best in Clowney. Possibly unlock what it was that made him the 1st overall pick in the first place (not that what he has done for the Texans already isn’t fantastic). Plus, I think he’d be a far great fit as a movable piece along our 4 man front than he was in the Texans 3-4.

  14. GoHawksDani

    I’m not as high on Clowney as most. I like classic hand-in-the-dirt DE passrushers. BUT, I’d give up a second round pick for him in a heartbeat. I’d trade a 1st round pick for Clowney and a 4th. If his contract situation would be better I’d give up a 1st and 4th too. But Hawks might not pull the trigger because A, It’s also depends on the Texans and B, I feel iDL is in worse position. We have a fan-favorite but unproven Poona, and some questionable guys… Mitchell, Meder, Mone and Woods. And we also have some guys who were on the roster previosly but didn’t prove much like Jones, Jefferson, Jackson. Reed won’t be here til week 6. Outside talent is also lacking a bit, but I feel it has more potential. Inside push won’t really be there

  15. McZ

    The task is to replace and possibly improve on 43 sacks by a comittee of players. And lower the number of 51 sacks allowed.

    I think, the OL in its first suit and depth will surprise us this season. They are on track, even with Haynes and Iupati missing.

    On the DL side, we need to be patient over the next weeks. We are still missing Ansah and Collier. Green is still a project, Mingo is just in his third week reverting to DE.

    No need to panic.

    • cha

      “The task is to replace and possibly improve on 43 sacks by a comittee of players.”

      No. That task is to improve the defense as a whole.

      Sacks are a limited stat. It precludes pressures and TFL’s.

      Patriots only recorded 30 sacks last year but completely stymied the Rams in the SB.

      • McZ

        My point is, that there are many ways to replace production, be it TFL, pressures or sacks. The Pats are the prime example of doing this season after season after season. As are the Seahawks.

        Btw, Chase Winovich is having a great time over there.

      • Jamho3

        The question is always how much?

        In this case how much do we need to improve the defense and why? Then I think we can begin to weigh these solutions vs the hoped for outcomes.

  16. Naks8

    If a Clowney trade does happen, is it more a quarter/half way into the season like brown or how the earl trade was in place?

    • Jamho3


      Why do you think HOU might be shopping him now? For the biggest market available. More teams who feel good about their opportunities to win now.

      After 6 weeks when a team is looking at a rental for 10-11 games giving up capital to make the trade then having to play at least 10% of the cap to the guy to have in in 2020 there will be less teams involved and probs a worse return for HOU.

  17. Quinn

    The situation post-draft is so different now, having reloaded the roster with some pretty exciting rookies. I don’t see any hypocrisy in paying Clowney, after trading away Clark, because of the desperate need for draft capital we had when the Chiefs came calling.
    JS has certainly shown a willingness to dish his 1st rounder, arguably for more value than we’ve gotten for our original 1st round picks, when taken. I think Clowney would be a great fit and if we can get in done for a 1st then I’m all for it. (unless it includes any player or pick variables that rely on a player passing a Texans medical)

  18. Lewis

    Absolutely not looking to trade him, but I wonder what the league’s perception of George Fant as a potential starting LT is.

    • Henry Taylor

      I would doubt he’s valued especially highly by the league.

    • Jamho3

      When he played he got crushed. Rated bottom of the league, the guys that beat him out are probably out of the league currently. And last year he wasn’t a starter. Soon teams will have to pay full boat veteran wages for his services and he hasn’t proven to be a starter on a team that hasn’t been able to run the ball nor pass block for 3:4 seasons.

      I doubt he is highly valued at this point.


    Could a pair of 2020/2021 2nd’s do the trick?

    The Seahawks have shown the ability to consistently turn 1st round picks into value down the draft board. Replenishing draft stock, especially where we typically pick (usually in a big swath of 50 guys with 2nd/3rd round grades anyway), has been a yearly exercise for this team. They don’t anoint a top-32 pick with “1st round value” just because, it’s all about the player evaluations and exploiting value. Provided we can keep our 1st round picks, we should be able to trade back and still come out ahead for having a truly elite pass rusher.

    This is different from the Clark situation. If we didn’t have Russell Wilson dangling over our heads this offseason, Clark would have simply been franchised. With Bobby Wagner signed I see no direct competition for the tag, and guaranteed two years of Clowney for modest cap hits (relatively) is a steal. He’d likely be motivated to sign, anyway, with the team holding that leverage.

    The other thing is, we have so much draft capital I struggle to see how we can reasonably fit it all into the 2020 roster. As it stands depth is a strength in this team. Front-line starters? Perhaps not.

  20. cha

    I wonder if a conditional trade would appeal to Houston.

    2nd round pick that escalates to a 1st if the Hawks extend Clowney after the season. Something like that.

    Houston would probably want to drive the deadline like a month into FA so the Hawks can’t game them by waiting a day or two into FA to announce the signing. IIRC the Saints did something like that with Jonathan Vilma and the Jets were left with no upgrade.

  21. Matt

    So was this a misplay by the Texans? If you aren’t set on playing the season with Clowney shouldn’t you have traded him earlier, when you could presumably have received a better return? Or is it more that they got to camp and saw how bad their O-line is and this is one way to get a fix?

    I suppose that there’s a chance that the Texans feel that Clowney is too valuable to loose much value by waiting.

    • Rob Staton

      I think they were stuck. There were reports they were open to a trade. With Clark being dealt, quite rightly they could’ve asked for similar compensation. If nobody was willing to offer that — do you essentially give him away for less? Or do you try to work on a solution?

      Unfortunately that solution wasn’t forthcoming and now it seems the situation is beyond repair. They haven’t helped themselves by trying to tag him as a linebacker instead of a defensive end. So they’ve instigated this really.

      If he’s refusing to play this year or they just want to move on now, they’ve lost all leverage and are now hoping a bidding war emerges or a desperate team makes a play.

      • cha

        Some reports that the Front Office “restructuring” was partly due to Clowney’s status. The O’Brien camp didn’t want to sign Clowney to a big extension, the Gaine camp did. If true that would be a major contributing factor to this mess.

        Feels similar to how they goofed around with Mario Williams. #1 pick but maybe not the all-world-greatest-player-in-the-history-of-football type they were expecting so they let him leave town.

  22. kevin mullen

    Got to close that deal, getting Clowney now more a priority than ever, especially if Reed out for first 6 weeks. Plus, Ansah & Collier possibly not full speed til regular season? We can’t rush the passer with our secondary throughout the season.

    I’d propose sending Britt & Jones and picks to Houston if they can figure it out with Nick Martin there. Don’t have to resign Clowney this year, let him play it out as with Ansah, then decide between the two to keep.

    • Rob Staton

      Big, big, big ‘no’ to trading Justin Britt.

      • Lewis

        Agreed. Trading Britt is a spectacularly bad idea. You planning to replace him with Pocic? Hunt? Not happening.

        • charlietheunicorn

          The last time they traded a quality center for another player…. kind of messed up the OL and set the team back 1-2 years.

        • kevin mullen

          Pretty much, we haven’t seen Pocic at center a ton, he’s failed at Guard so far. Let’s see what he can do at Center.


        Why do people always think we should or could trade Britt? This has been going on since last year. Where is it coming from? He has little trade value, we don’t have a successor, and he’s probably worth more to us than another team.

        • Rob Staton

          Exactly. It’s a baffling suggestion.

    • Hawktalker#1

      Not trading Britt. Have no interest in restoring the days of having a crappy O-line.

  23. cha

    I wonder if the Hawks could convince Houston to take Mingo off our hands as part of a package in a deal for Clowney.

    The way I see it, Houston owes us a ‘take some salary on with a guy we were going to cut anyway’ from the Jeremy Lane fiasco LOL.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m not sure anyone will be interested in Mingo. And based on the reports over the last few days, he might be out of a job in Seattle soon.

      • Greg MI Haugsven

        If they did trade for Clowney you would think the next move would be releasing Mingo. Clowney is set to make $15.9 million this year and releasing Mingo would get you $4.2 which means you actually get Clowney for $11.7 million which is pretty damn reasonable.

        • Rob Staton

          Mingo might be off anyway. By all accounts his camp has been poor.

  24. King_Rajesh

    Not interested in the slightest.

    Trading for somebody like Clowney is a 2012 -> 2013 type move, except we have to give up draft capital to do it the year before when we can wait until next year when we should be contending.

    We have 60m+ in cap next year, and can sign 2-3 top tier pass rushers that hit the market if we so desire to put us over the top like signing Bennett and Avril did.

    If the team somehow goes 4-2 or 5-1 in the first 6 games, then by all means, trade for a pass rusher and go for it but I don’t see us doing better than 3-3 at best to start the year.

  25. Volume12

    I’m not saying no to the trade, rather a thought popped into my head.

    Has Seattle ever drafted or signed as a FA under PC/JS hybrid pass rushers? Not D-lineman who can play multiple techniques, but guys who rush from a 2 and 3 point stance. If someone can help me out because I can only think of hand in the dirt rushers. Mingo doesn’t count. He can’t rush head up. Off-ball LB through and through.

    Keep in mind. This ain’t me saying they’ve never wanted or targetd hat type before, nor do I think they’d say no to a Clowney type talent if he became available for the right deal because of that. They’d be fools of to.

    Brain food I guess.

    • Volume12

      * be fools not to

    • Kenny Sloth

      Bruce Irvin? Maybe I’m misunderstanding the criteria?

      • Volume12

        I definitely could’ve worded this better. This criteria is simple though.

        Under PC/JS I can’t think of one D-lineman they’ve drafted or signed who wasn’t a hand in the dirt, down lineman. Bruce falls under this.

  26. smitty1547

    I am from Houston, so next to Seattle I watch more Texan games and communicate with more Texan fans than anybody. Most fans to include me think he’s over rated and to injury prone. I would take a hard pass and go with the youth movement the are currently on.

  27. j

    The backdrop here is the Duane Brown trade. It sure looks like the Texans failed Jeremy Lane’s physical to get the extra pick. You have to question the relationship between the two teams.

    • TomLPDX

      There probably is no relationship since they don’t have a GM anymore.

  28. WALL UP

    Didn’t they let go their GM that made that deal?

    • WALL UP

      The recent trade for Duke Johnson indicates a little instability in the making the right moves, ie, the timing may be right for a favorable trade.

  29. icb12

    So to summarize:
    Pros: Obtaining a potential game wrecking player who is on the verge of entering his prime at the position that is currently of biggest need for the team to succeed.

    Cons: Deal might be hard to do, and only guaranteed to have said player for 2 years, and it might affect draft capital for future more negatively than they would prefer. Potential for drama next year if he refuses to play on the tag.

    Juice seems worth the squeeze to me.

    If Houston is truly going to be reasonable with their demands, I’d do it without any regrets. No risk, no reward, and they surely aren’t going to draft anyone with Clowney level talent next year. Or the year after for that matter.

    • TomLPDX

      Why does everyone think that Clowney is a game wrecker? I just don’t get it. He isn’t.

      • Rob Staton

        Because we’ve seen him wreck games.

        Watch the video.

        • TomLPDX

          I have watched the videos. He’s good, very good. But he spent a lot of time injured and he had JJ keeping people off him. Look Rob, I get he is a force on the D but is he worth the risk of only getting him for 1, maybe 2 years at a high price and be the star of a D?? I don’t think so. Just my opinion.

          • Hawktalker#1

            Risk versus reward. I think he’s worth it.

          • cha

            “But he spent a lot of time injured”

            He’s missed 3 games in 3 seasons. C’mon man.

            “and he had JJ keeping people off him.”

            You realize JJ was out for most of 2016 and 2017 right? About half of those highlights in the video #99 is nowhere to be found.

            And when Clowney shows he can beat double teams and take on the best LT’s in the league, it’s time to stop using his teammates as an excuse to water down his abilities.

            • Kenny Sloth

              Can’t we just draft someone in the 30’s who will take two years to develop and ultimately underperform and sign elsewhere

          • Jamho3

            Watt keeping people off of him? Meh.

            In SEA’s case it’s easy to imagine that in 2019 he’d have Ansah, Collier, Poona, and Reed, Wood and eventually in 2020 Green to help keep people off of him.

            Like that’s exactly how the game is played. Vetted talent begets production.

            Far as it being a good deal or bad that entirely depends on what the deal entails which we currently have no idea of…

            SO… it follows that it at least MAKES SENSE to explore it in depth.

  30. Chase Cash

    I feel like it would make more sense to wait it out. The Texans obviously want to get good value for Clowney but I don’t think the Texans will get as much as they want with the strings attached to him. The longer he’s on the market the lower the value they’ll take because they don’t want to outright lose him in the offseason. So we could wait it out and offer less, or if he does get scooped up it can also be beneficial to see how he does this season away from Jj Watt. If he stays healthy and has a productive year, we can win a bidding war with whoever else wants him, while also retaining the draft capital we have going into the 2020 draft. So either have a better chance of contending now while losing draft capital on an (imo) somewhat unproven pass rusher (playing next to jj watt whole career, injury concerns, risk of being a one year rental) now, pick up a proven Clowney next year without losing capital. If he doesn’t stay healthy or doesn’t produce no harm to us.

    • Chase Cash

      * or pick up

  31. Gohawks5151

    I’d like to know what “they will be reasonable” actually means. To me that means a 2nd and a late rounder due to the time of year and the souring situation with the team. Antonio Brown was traded for 3rd and a 5th just this spring in a similar team situation. Houston also just did what i consider a fair deal for Duke so i think they are realistic about the price.

    I would do this trade all day. I realize the slow build type of planning. It worked once already and you can see the difference after just one year. But trading a 2nd and a lottery ticket is worth a game wrecking, proven player at a premium position. For all the gripes about Clowney i think the most important part is that he is just hitting his prime despite all the production thus far. This defense lacks impact players. Bobby is world class but will his impact be lessened against an air raid type team? Mcdougald is good but do teams plan around him? Can Reed repeat his big year? Ansah has a track record but does he stay past 1 season? Never a bad idea to lock up a guy that will take up opponents practice time.

    • Chase Cash

      The thing is he is only locked up for a year, and the concerns are legitimate. I’m with you if we can get him for a low price I’m all for it but I don’t want to push our luck. Can he produce the same numbers without watt? Can he stay healthy? If the price is anywhere near a first rounder I’d pass for certain. Let another team grab him, he will prove if he can stay healthy and produce, and with our cap space we can outbid anyone else’s offer if we truly want him, while saving our draft capital to go after someone else or load up in the draft.

  32. Chase Cash

    The thing is he is only locked up for a year, and the concerns are legitimate. I’m with you if we can get him for a low price I’m all for it but I don’t want to push our luck. Can he produce the same numbers without watt? Can he stay healthy? If the price is anywhere near a first rounder I’d pass for certain. Let another team grab him, he will prove if he can stay healthy and produce, and with our cap space we can outbid anyone else’s offer if we truly want him, while saving our draft capital to go after someone else or load up in the draft.

    • Chase Cash

      Disregard this was for the thread above

  33. mishima

    Seahawks need pressure and disruption. Clowney isn’t that, esp. considering the cost.

    • Rob Staton

      He’s a potential game wrecker who’s been among the leaders in TFL’s for years.

      Not sure why anyone would suggest he’s not a disruptive force.

      • mishima

        Don’t get me wrong: He’s a beast, an asset to any team.

        But does he improve the pass rush/pressure enough to justify the cost in picks and money?

        With Goff, Garopollo, Murray in the West, we got to do something. I think we’ll pass on Clowney, pick up someone else + blitz more.

        • Coleslaw

          What do you think about Dante Fowler being a free agent next year?

        • Jamho3

          But Blitzing doesn’t really work that well… it’s more of a stop gap.

          And who else is there to pick up? DL are the 2nd most vetted positions in the game behind QBs DL’s are not always available and even then they’re expensive.

          • mishima

            Clowney isn’t a DL.

    • Hawktalker#1

      I disagree. He may not have all of what we would like, but there are not many options on the table right now. Our pass rush is going to be very weak and could end up hurting us this year. We have a ton of pics next year we have a ton of cap Space. Even if it’s only a one-year rental and we get a third round pick in return, I think it’s worth it, as long as the draft picks we give up are not too out of line.

      Am I thrilled at the prospect of paying what it takes to get him, no. Do I think it’s the best option currently available, yes.

      • mishima

        Why are we assuming Clowney improves the pass rush when even he admits he needs work (and is working with J. Peppers) in that area? Great athlete, but one dimensional with a limited arsenal. Potential to be great, but right now, elite run-defender, average pass rusher.

        Also, concerns with injuries and consistency. Take away his early monster game against Indy (4 TFL) and he finished with 12, ranking 30th.

        Clowney is a freak with unlimited potential, but doesn’t solve the pressuring the QB problem. Instead of trading picks just to franchise Clowney (short-term / shortsighted), they should look elsewhere for real pressure, wait on Ansah, Collier, Martin, Reed, next draft.

        • Ghost Mutt

          “They should look elsewhere for real pressure”.

          Where? It’s not like there’s this untapped reservoir of elite pass rushing talent we can dip into at this time of year. I completely get wanting to build through the draft, but I feel comfortable in saying our pass rush is worst in the league at this point.

          Trading for JC may not win us a Superbowl, but it’ll vastly strengthen the weakest area on the team so we can stay competitive. As other commenters have said, we’re highly unlikely to find anyone with close to Clowney’s profile in the draft.

    • Gohawk5151

      Sacks are are a volatile stat. A couple things to consider about him as well:

      The TFLs are there as us the position versatility. He is also 6’5″ and able to affect the pass lanes with length like Campbell.

      He played much of the past 3 seasons without JJ Watt. He was the focus of the offense and received the bulk of double teams (against SEA as well). He still produced during this time.

      It bears repeating, He is just entering his prime.

  34. James

    Although highly unlikely, if we’re able to hit a first round edge rusher next year, we would in my opinion have a choice of: Yetur Gross-Matos, Chase Young, Kenny Willekes, and A.J. Epenesa. You could make a case for Terrell Lewis as well, but he has the injury history that the Seahawks tend to avoid. You could of course argue for other names as well, Raekwon Davis could bounce back in 2019.

    However, with the exception for the occasional flash, I don’t see a lot of tape that looks as “game wrecking” as Clowney of 2013, or now.

    I wonder if going back to a base 4-3 would help get the best of out Clowney? I know they ran a few 4-3 looks out of 3-4 and he looked good.y. Additionally, a lot of the “laziness” and “lack of fire” criticism earlier in his career (no doubt linked to his immaturity at the time), may also benefit from a change of scenery. He’d be able to shake the 1st pick expectations that were heavily painted by the Houston fanbase.

    TFL. He gets em. He doesn’t need to be the penultimate pass rusher. He just needs to be better than Jarran Reed…who we won’t even see for six weeks.

    • Rob Staton

      I’m not sold on Epenesa.

  35. Tony

    The more I read about the situation, the more it makes sense. We are the best match in trade. Flush with picks, tons of cap space and a huge need at pass rush. What other teams are as perfect in that scenario. Redskins have less of need at pass rush as they’ve spent 3 yrs drafting pass rushers. In fact most teams have added pass rushers thru the draft or free agency. I just cant see a huge market for him. So if LT is they’re biggest need/want…maybe we can flip a backup lineman and a 2nd/5th for him. Given the extensions, only Reed left, we can tag clowney and work a new deal next year or collect a 3rd when walks. Or flip him a la Clark. Which would be hilarious.

  36. RWI

    Food for thought. Hypothetical. Let’s say the Seahawks do trade for Clowney. Let’s say that both Clowney/Ansah both have pretty good years. The Hawks still would only be able to keep one or the other. However, if trading for Clowney brought them another Super Bowl. It would be worth giving up a first round pick. But that is just speculation.

    If the Seahawks did trade for Clowney what does that say about Jacob Martin/Rasheem Green? According to Brock Huard. Jacob Martin did not do well going up against Duane Brown. But then there are not too many pass rusher that do well against Duane Brown.

    One other point I would like to make is: I would be curious to see just how well Martin/Green do the rest of the preseason.

  37. DC

    Ideally we’d keep all of our 2020 draft stock (doesn’t it feel good to be loaded?). Sign Clowney as a FA & draft another rusher with our 1st pick. Hope Collier pans out & they become our young ‘big 3’. I can easily wait a year for that.

    • Hawktalker#1

      With the status of our current Pass rush, IMO we cant just sit back, do nothing and wait another year.

  38. charlietheunicorn

    I think of the Seahawks problems, then read a report on NFL.com about…

    “Jimmy Garoppolo enjoyed a terrible, horrible, no good, very bad day at the office on Wednesday afternoon. During one stretch of practice, the San Francisco 49ers starting quarterback threw five consecutive interceptions to Richard Sherman, Ahkello Witherspoon, Jaquiski Tartt and Tarvarius Moore (twice), per NBC Sports Bay Area’s Matt Maiocco. ”

    …. and think, maybe Seattle doesn’t have it so bad after all.

    • smitty1547

      I wonder if Sherm threw the ball back at him and yelling that he sucked?

      • Hawkdawg

        Exactly my thought…

  39. Saxon

    Blanket coverage from Rob. He’s the Lester Hayes of sports reporting.

    I prefer to build a roster young and cheap. Clowney has the young part down, but not cheap. Signing him to a monster contract plus giving up draft capital? No thanks.

    Also, TFLs? If he’s supposed to supply pass rush why aren’t you mentioning that he’s not exactly elite at sacking the QB? He’s never hit double digit sacks. Consider some of the guys with half his athleticism that have been able to achieve that. I get that Carroll prizes pressures almost as much as sacks, but you better do both if your going to be worth picks/$$$.

    Additionally, he’s only played one full season. He gets nagging injuries that limit him.

    Not a fan. Hope we avoid.

  40. Coleslaw

    1 thing I haven’t seen brought up here is that Clowney has been in a 3-4, where hes best suited as a 4-3 DE like he was in college.

    He demands double teams, and paired with Reed would cause problems. Only 1 of them can get double teamed unless the O uses a TE to block. Every other DL would be getting 1v1 matchups. Blitzing would be more overwhelming to them. That’s just what pressure does and that’s what Clowney brings. He would significantly boost our run defense immediately, and provide a veteran presence.

    • cha

      Getting pressure without blitzing is a huge advantage, moreso with the Hawks overall defensive strategy. It’s like having an extra defender on the field.

      It keeps the LBs clean, clogs the middle of the field with defenders, allows the DBs to be aggressive at the LOS and forces the QB into bad decisions.

  41. Ukhawk

    Great, thought and debate provoking article, Rob! Nice to have be back after the summer.

    It strikes me as we are in (stealth) rebuilt mode, management may want to play the long game and see where we are later in the season once people are back and given a chance to perform.

    A Clowney acquisition might slow this down and remove future optionality for a team brimming with youth and possibilities.

    If Ansah, Collier, Green, Martin and Co progress maybe we don’t need Clowney but this needs opportunity and time which is fine for a team still developing. .

    The bigger question which will become clearer over time is what to with that extra cap room, what are the key positions we want to build around via free agency vs the draft. I could see a case not only for pass rush but maybe a No 1 receiver instead if one became available.

    What other positions or players could or should we look at with our war chest??

  42. Largent80

    I LIVE in Houston and have heard zero about any of this. The Texans are mum on it except to say they are disappointed he’s not in camp.

    Personally I wouldn’t do it. Another thing to remember is that he had microfracture surgery a few years back.

    • Greg MI Haugsven

      The better question is, how does someone survive the summer in Houston. I have been there and it was unbearable.

      • Largent80

        It’s called cold beer and A/C….Hahaha

  43. Henry Taylor

    I’ve been thinking about how much the Texans can realistically expect from Clowney…

    I’m not sure what leverage they have if the entire league knows they want to get rid of him, and that the player doesn’t seem to have any intention of playing for them this season(he’s still holding out even though the time for him to get a contract from any team has passed.)

    Last year the Seahawks were in a similar boat with Earl Thomas, everyone knew they could just wait for him to become a FA and the best offer the Seahawks could get was a 2nd.

    Obviously, they won’t just give him away, but are they really thinking a team is going to offer a 1st for a 1 year contract? Possibly so, but if that’s the case I could see this stretching into the season.

  44. jujus

    Seahawks have 20 mil in cap space this year, and 61 million next year.
    Below is the list of players that we lose to Free agency next year.

    The relevant ones being: Ansah, Reed, Kendricks –

    Personally I think 80 million can cover these 3 + Clowney.

    Ezekiel Ansah 43DE
    UFA 14.8% 31 $9,000,000 $6,000,000
    Mychal Kendricks 43OLB
    UFA 9.3% 30 $4,500,000 $0
    Barkevious Mingo 43OLB
    UFA 52.2% 30 $3,400,000 $3,200,000
    George Fant RT
    UFA 34.8% 28 $3,095,000 $0
    Mike Iupati LG
    UFA 50.7% 33 $2,750,000 $2,250,000
    Jaron Brown WR
    UFA 32.9% 30 $2,750,000 $2,750,000
    Al Woods 43DT
    UFA 35.7% 33 $2,250,000 $400,000
    Germain Ifedi RT
    UFA 92.5% 26 $2,066,277 $6,688,045
    Quinton Jefferson 43DE
    UFA 56.4% 27 $2,025,000 $0
    Cassius Marsh 43DE
    UFA 51.2% 28 $1,850,000 $600,000
    Akeem King S
    UFA 14.6% 28 $1,400,000 $400,000
    Jarran Reed 43DT
    UFA 78.1% 28 $1,222,409 $2,878,356
    Earl Mitchell 43DT
    UFA 33.9% 33 $1,020,000 $90,000
    Neiko Thorpe CB
    UFA 2.9% 30 $1,000,000 $100,000
    DeShawn Shead CB
    UFA 25.1% 31 $930,000 $0
    Geno Smith QB
    UFA 3.2% 30 $895,000 $25,000
    C.J. Prosise RB
    UFA 2.8% 26 $778,116 $692,464
    Nick Vannett TE
    UFA 49.6% 27 $764,220 $656,880
    Jamie Meder

    • cha

      Thanks jujus. Just curious, what are the percentages for? % of 2018 snaps?

      I think it’s safest to assume Kendricks isn’t on the 2020 Hawks, at least until we find out what his legal situation is. Barton or BBK should take his spot in 2020.

      • jujus

        Yes the % is for snaps. I took this from OTC.

        and we could easily pay Ifedi as well (which I think they might…)

  45. MyChestIsBeastMode

    If we were to get Clowney for only a 1st round pick (and eventually tag + plus sign long term) then we essentially trade Clark for Clowney + a 2nd rd pick. Sounds great to me.

    I liked Clark, but I’d rather pay Clowney the big money if given the choice. I don’t love trading first round picks, but I’d be hard pressed to name many other people deserving of a first ahead of Clowney that compares in terms of quality, filling team needs, and availability.

  46. cha

    Prosise and McKissic start practice working on conditioning, then join the offense for some scrimmaging today.

    C’mon guys, now’s the time to make your mark.

  47. Simo

    Such an interesting question…would the Hawks trade for Clowney or not? Although he’s not necessarily an accomplished sack master, he’s clearly a very disruptive player, with a definite ability to rush the passer as well. Since this is a clear weakness on the current roster, how else will we get an athlete like Clowney when we routinely draft in the lower half of R1? Now its possible Collier or another young player develops into a dynamic defensive force, but its probably more likely they don’t. Teams usually have to find that type of player very high in R1.

    Had heard reports that Yannick Ngakoue was unhappy with his contract situation in Jacksonville. Not sure if he reported to camp yet or not, but certainly there’s still some rub between player and team. Why not explore trade options with the Jags? He might be a better pure pass rusher than Clowney, one who may not cost as much to acquire.

  48. Greg MI Haugsven

    Im willing to be the Seahawks FO and Duane Brown have had some good conversations about Clowney lately.

    • jujus

      I believe the Seahawks Value player opinion highly when it comes to matter like this.

  49. RWI

    Folks: Every fan(including Seahawk fans) KNOWS their teams weaknesses. EVERY team has weaknesses(not just the Seahawks). The Seahawks number weakness is pass rush. But this is the dirty little secret. During the regular season New England was ranked 30th in team sacks. Yes! 30th! They were tied with the N.Y. Giants with 30 sacks. Only one team had fewer sacks. Oakland. So a team that was tied for 2nd last place in sacks WON the Super Bowl. Belichick in the Super Bowl against the Rams manufactured a pass rush. Belichick got 4 sacks in the Super Bowl. The Rams as a team had 41 sacks during the regular season. Only sacked Brady one time.

    I am NOT saying the that because the Seahawks Pass Rush is not their strength it’s no problem. However, what I am trying to say is that you can manufacture a pass rush. Especially considering the speed the Seahawks have in the secondary and at the linebacker position.

    • Jamho3

      RWI touche’ very good points. Thank you.

    • Volume12

      The Patriots are the exception. Not the norm.

      They also added Bennett, Shilique Calhoun, Jamie Collins, and drafted Winovich for a reason. What they had last year wasn’t gonna be good nor deep enough to do it again.

      • Jamho3

        Volume12 thank you!

      • RWI

        Volume: True. The Patroits added Calhousn, Bennett, Collins and Winovich. And if you have the cap space. Why not? However, the Patroits did win the Super Bowl last year w/o those players.

    • McZ

      Btw, Oakland played the Cards last night.

      Mr Murray had a rough workday encountering a real NFL defense, producing next to nought, and got stampeded into a safety. Discussions will start instantly.

      • cha

        It’s the preseason and there shouldn’t be too much weight put into it, but Good Lord!

        * the Cam Newton-in-the-Super-Bowl style dive into the end zone to avoid contact
        * 2 QB false starts. Kliff and Kyler, you guys realize this is the NFL and not CFB right?
        * the weird body language on the sideline during the ESPN interview

        He’ll be better in Game 3. No way it could be worse.

      • Volume12

        Im not the biggest Murray fan or supporter, but this rush to crown WR Preston Williams a HOFer because of a dominant pre-season performance or Murray is gonna struggle is ridiculous.

  50. Frank

    Ifedi’s 5th year contract wasn’t picked up, so I have to think they are planning on losing him or Fant one next year. Clowney would immediately improve the defensive pass rush, run defense, and pass defense. I’d hate to see the young guys, LJ and Green lose out on reps who are both resent high draft choices, but would nicely bandaid missing Reed for awhile. Id send Ifedi and a 3rd, or Fant and a 2nd but don’t think I could bring myself to send a 1st round pick for a potential 1 year player or 2 given the franchise tag. Of course if they could franchise tag Clowney and get a take like they did with Clark maybe a one year rental could work out and let the rookies develop.

    • jujus

      1. Texans need a LT and Ifedi Cant do that.
      2. This is the only negative of this trade imo. The higher team reps that would be missed by guys who need to develop Collier/green

      • cha

        Disagree with #2. Clowney would likely take most if not all of Reed’s snaps for 6 weeks. No hindrance to the young players there.

        As for the rest of the season, it’s a long season. There’s plenty of snaps to go around. It would actually prove advantageous because they could rotate guys can keep them fresh for the stretch run and playoffs while getting plenty of game action.

        If those guys don’t develop because slightly fewer snaps, that’s not a downside of Clowney being there – it’s the coaching not getting through or the guys themselves not putting in the effort.

        • mishima

          Confused. How does Clowney ‘take’ Reed’s snaps? Are you suggesting moving Clowney inside?!? Not like there’s a bowl of snaps to divvy up.

          Are we certain Clowney succeeds in a 4-3 defense? I think his athleticism only plays in space; moving him to the line might negate most of his value.

          Also / tangentially related: Trading for Clowney limits what they can do with Reed. Can only tag one.

          • Rob Staton

            Clowney is a great fit in a 4-3. Terrific run defender, can hold the point in that regard. Perfectly capable winning off the edge without needing to play wide.

            I don’t see any situation where they franchise Jarran Reed either. That would’ve cost them $15m in 2019. Cannot in any way imagine them committing that kind of money to Reed.

            • mishima

              Agree. I think he works in a 4-3, but better as a hybrid in a 3-4 playing in space. Either way, he makes defenses better.

              Clear: Not saying they would franchise Reed, but they might want that leverage. Would you trade Reed for Clowney, straight up? That I might consider.

          • cha

            Watch about the 3:00 mark of the video. Clowney can play inside.

          • Volume12

            Im certain Clowney is a better fit in a 4-3. Plays more to his strengths.

            • mishima

              Maybe. You/Rob have persuaded me to take another (better) look.

              • mishima

                I stand corrected. Was mistakenly basing my take on his early use as a standup OLB, instead his more recent success as an almost 5-tech. I wrote him off too early.

            • Frank

              I agree V12 on the 4-3 being where he’ll really shine. I wasn’t saying Clowney would take Reeds snap, just that with a rock solid DE against run and pass you could mask Reeds absence via scheme more effectively. Clowney could cover two gaps and let the Dt’s Poona and whoever manage single gaps.

              • Volume12

                Oh I know what ya meant and I agree about that aspect.

    • DC

      Russ has contractual veto power over any potential trade of his offensive linemen…

      Okay I made that up. Our OT depth looks solid for the 1st time in a looong time imho which is nice. Brown, Ifedi, Fant & Jones make a nice foursome. Considering that Ifedi & Fant are FAs after this season it is an enticing prospect to flip one of them in a Clowney deal.

      In a vacuum of health, Ansah, Clowney, Collier & Martin combined with some creative blitzing make for an intriguing bunch. Hmmm… I’m curious, even if it’s only for one year.

  51. All I see is 12s

    This was the Main topic on brick and Salk this morning. They seemed to think it could get fined for a second. Salk was all for it while Brock seemed to think it could potentially damage the positive culture they’ve reestablished. Both made excellent arguments.
    Still though, Imagine If they essentially traded Clark for LJ Ziggy and Clowney and it only cost 25 against the cap (rough estimate.)
    What do you guys think?

    • Rob Staton

      I listened to the show — Brock has since tweeted that Duane Brown is ‘one of Clowney’s biggest fans’.

      • All I see is 12s

        I saw that

        • All I see is 12s

          Sorry, didn’t mean to hit the send button. I meant to say I saw that and thought “who could possibly be a better scout of Clowney than his old teammate and scrimmage nemesis?” The idea of bringing him in for a second and having to cut someone like Mingo or Jackson is very intriguing.

  52. RWI

    In the “Just for the record dept.” Clowney’s best sack year is 9.5. Also in five seasons Clowney has played in all 16 games ONE TIME.

    • Rob Staton

      He’s also been among the league leaders for TFL’s in the last three seasons and has only missed three games in the last three seasons.

  53. WALL UP

    If JS does pull off a trade for Clowney, for a 3rd and players, this would culminate in one the greatest offseasons that the Seahawks have had in quite some time. It would be unbelievable! It would be remarkable how all the pieces seem to fall in place to build a formidable roster once again.

  54. Doug

    Rob, given that Houston is now looking for WR and (probably) RB help, do you think that increases the possibility for Seahawks? We seem to have a a smallish surplus of good young prospects at both positions in addition to the draft capital. CJ plus a second? Would love to see Clowney in Seattle.

    • Rob Staton

      No I don’t unfortunately. It’s going to take more than an often-injured running back like Prosise to interest Houston. And I don’t think they’re looking to trade Clowney for a package that includes a running back. Bill O’Brien has got his own way in Houston and is running the show. He needs pieces that will significantly help his offense right now. That means a starting left tackle because Houston’s O-line is a mess. It means adding another receiver who can contribute in a somewhat significant way to compliment Hopkins and Fuller.

      They need to move Clowney for a top player. If there’s draft compensation too — great. But I really don’t think a future second round pick and a guy who might struggle to play for them at RB is the kind of deal they are looking for.

      I think the Seahawks will have to look elsewhere and try and find a team with a veteran buried on a depth chart or who maybe doesn’t fit a certain scheme or a team who needs cap relief.

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